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Interview with Donna Miller 265
were just a junior person, it was pretty much a freewheeling discussion, and
people didn’t stand on titles and ceremonies as much.
I had a sense it was the larger bureaucracies that had a more developed sense
of hierarchy. If you went to a meeting, the director wouldn’t say much if the
deputy minister was there and certainly the junior guy two years out wasn’t going
to say a whole lot of anything in the presence of his seniors. Federal law had a
much more structured form of doing things and there was also much more
division of labour – if you wrote a factum with the federal government different
parts would be assigned and everybody had to get together and improve the
components, whereas there was much more freedom of action at the provincial
level: does any of that match up with your experiences
DJM: Somewhat, yes. When I look back at my experience with both
governments they were both terrific experiences, but different. With the
provincial government I was essentially a middle manager, I was Director of
Constitutional Law, but that didn’t prevent my ability to meet ministers or even
premiers, or advise ministers and premiers. So you’re right – there isn’t much of a
hierarchy, at least there certainly wasn’t when I was involved. Federally, there is
more of a hierarchy. But of all of the departments in the government of Canada,
my experience is that Justice Canada is the least hierarchical. That is because, I
think, of the profession of law and also because of the kinds of deputies that
Justice Canada has had, for the most part, have been much more democratic, less
hierarchical, more egalitarian, more team-focused leaders, than what you might
generally find in other departments across the government of Canada. So, yes, the
workplace culture of the federal government was more formalistic than in
Manitoba, but necessarily so.
I do remember thinking at the time when I changed positions from Justice
Manitoba to Justice Canada, all I had to do was cross one side of Broadway to the
other, my office for Justice Manitoba being on the north side of the street with
Justice Canada offices on the south side. Physically it involved simply crossing the
street, but in terms of the mind-set and perspective on issues it was just a
monumental leap for me. Although I’d been involved in national issues for the
province – I had done Supreme Court litigation – to be involved directly with the
Federal government, somehow, it brought home to me the enormity of the
country, the issues and the divisions we contend with, the need to emphasize
process, so as to try to arrive at some form of consensus building. These are things
that I really don’t think I appreciated until I became involved directly with the
Government of Canada. As I say, for me it was a monumental leap when I moved
to the federal government.