Conversations with Avant-garde Sages - The Wizard LLC

Conversations with Avant-garde Sages
seeing of it independent of awareness? And if we explore our
experience we find the answer to both those questions is, no. In
other words, the world as an object separate from awareness is
never experienced. So, that world, that imaginary, separate,
outside, distant world is an illusion. However, that doesn’t mean
that experience is an illusion. All of us now, we know that our
experience is real. We could be dreaming Now. We can’t be sure
that we’re not. But even if we’re dreaming, our dream is real.
There is something – there’s a reality to it. But if we look deeply
into that reality we don’t find a substance called matter or mind.
We find awareness. It’s like watching a movie and there’s a
landscape in the film, so it seems that we’re seeing trees and fields
and sky. But when we go up to it, to touch the field, to touch the
trees, to touch the sky, to find out what they’re made of, we touch
the screen, we don’t actually touch the grass. So it’s not that the
landscape was an illusion, there was a reality to it and the reality
to it is the screen. It’s an illusion; grass and trees and the sky. But
it’s real as the screen. So it’s the same with the world and with
people and with objects. As objects separate, other, distinct, and
made out of mind or matter; as such they are illusory, so illusory
in fact that they are never found. However, as experience itself
made only out of the intimacy of knowing or experiencing, as such
they are real. Their reality is this experiencing presence or
awareness, not matter.
TRIP: What I love about listening to you, reading your book, Selfinquiry,
the entire field of non-duality is that there are answers to
some of these vexing existential questions, ultimately it is a
Mystery but, you answer some amazing questions. Now, on your
website you say, and I want to read something that you say, I just
found this was extraordinary and I don’t really fully understand it
so I thought you might get into this more. You say, “Every
appearance is, at its origin, already that for which it is destined.
The meaning and purpose of appearances is in their absence. And
the meaning and purpose of life is already life itself.”
RUPERT: Yes. So this is said in response. I don’t remember
specifically. But in general it was said in response to one who is
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