Microsoft Office Outlook - Memo Style

Robert Yamashita 

From: summe004 [summe004@csusm.edu] 

Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 2:00 PM 

To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

Subject: journal one 

Attachments: journal 1.doc 

journal 1.doc (21 

KB) 

okay, here is my journal. I hope you all get it. 

Teresa 

p.s. have a great weekend!! 

1


From: lebla003 [lebla003@csusm.edu] 



Subject: Journal 1 

The class certainly did start off with a bang. A short glimpse into the class 

provided enough insight to see one inch past the mud. Wow! I'm so confused. I 

purchased the required books for the course, but I'm not sure how to find out 

what pages are assigned to read because the syllabus is rather difficult for 

at least me to understand. 

The books we will be reading seem real interesting. I'm especially 

looking forward to the book concerning the flu. The other books will also be 

interesting too. 

I don't have a lot to add this week, but I'll try to expand on future 

writings. 

2


From: karisanne@adelphia.net 

Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2004 4:14 PM 



Sagan mentioned astronomy and the NRC discussed the different types of sciences, including 

astronomy, so I have to take this opportunity, while my mind is focused on it, to bring up 

the theory of the Big Bang. I took an astronomy class and loved every minute of it. I 

don't doubt that there are planets and stars but I do disagree with the idea that it all 

came from a piece of dust and a big explosion. 

As a Christian teaching in a public school system, I will of course be faced with teaching 

this and other theories I don't believe. But why is it that this completely random 

thought that we came from dust is pushed so heavily and the idea that a higher being 

created it all is never mentioned? Why isn't there a medium ground where we can discuss 

all the "theories" including God? Is it so much easier to believe that we all came from 

dust? I beg to differ. 

Dr. Kent Hovind is a famous Christian scientist who travels the world disproving the Big 

Bang, evolution, and the age of the earth. I highly recommend both Christian and 

nonChristians to reflect on his teachings. Check out his website... 

http://www.drdino.com/ 

and contemplate how you got here. 

Maybe you believe in evolution, putting aside the idea of the Big Bang. Dr. Hovind asks 

if we came from apes why are there still apes roaming the earth today, wouldn't they have 

all evolved? and why aren't we observing the process of evolution right now? Do you 

really want to believe that you came from a monkey or that God created you and knew your 

name even before you were in the womb and knows the number of hairs on your head? Being 

related to a monkey does not make me feel special, but being a creation of the Creator 

Himself, means I am a precious jewel in God's eyes. 

3


From: Karla Garduno [gardu001@csusm.edu] 

Sent: Sunday, January 25, 2004 12:39 PM 


Subject: RE: Science journal entry 

here's is my response to the science journal. 

enjoy, 

karla 

4


From: Joey Benson [hobo_jojo@yahoo.com] 



Subject: Journal 

Hi everyone, 

I don’t think I’m ready for another semester, and am 

definitely not in school mode yet, hence this being 

written on the last possible day. Hearing a lot of 

negatives about this semester has given me 

reservations about jumping right in. I am curious to 

see how the semester unfolds. So far this looks like 

no other semester we have taken as a cohort. I look 

forward to the difference. I also look forward to the 

end when we are completed and are looking back at all 

the hard work and what we have accomplished. I don’t 

want the hard work, but I guess to have the feeling of 

satisfaction hard work must come first. So I look at 

this semester as just another hurdle we have to get 

over, and no amount of work will stop us from becoming 

teachers. I look back at the past year and a half and 

see how far we have come, that can be done again. 

Joey 

__________________________________ 

Do you Yahoo!? 

Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! 

http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ 

5


From: Robert Atchison [ratchison001@hotmail.com] 



Subject: creationism vs. eveloution (j #1) 

Dear classmates, 

Karis addressed an interesting topic in her first journal entry, evolution 

vs. creationism. Both of these theories are highly charged and interesting 

on many levels. Often times these two theories are seen as polar opposites, 

which in my opinion is very dangerous. I believe this in part because the 

holy word is taken as fact by millions around the world and science is also 

taken as fact by millions around the world. Thus by setting these two 

theories, both backed by what people believe to be packed with truth, one is 

setting themselves up for failure. 

I believe in science and I believe that I was created by an omni present 

being. This duality allows me to know that I could have evolved from an ape 

and that this was the creator’s choice/plan to do so. Karis “disagree[s] 

with the idea that it all came from a piece of dust and a big explosion”. 

But from my reading of the bible this was exactly the case, 

“In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. The earth was 

without form and an empty waste, and darkness was upon the face of the very 

great deep” (Genesis 1 &2). 

I could continue but you all can read it for yourself if you so choose. 

God created the earth in a Big Bang? I believe it, but many do not. God 

allowed us to evolve from apes? I believe this is possible too. This 

ideology is known as theistic evolution. Pope John Paul II wrote, 

“How do the conclusions reached by the various scientific disciplines 

coincide with those contained in the message of Revelation? And if, at first 

sight, there are apparent contradictions, in what direction do we look for 

their solution? We know, in fact, that truth cannot contradict truth (cf. 

Leo XIII, Encyclical Providentissimus Deus).” 

Thus if religion is seen as truth and science is seen as truth, one must 

find the middle ground and see how both sources are speaking to the same 

truths. 

The world is not always made of black and white, often times one finds a 

shade of grey. 

With a kind heart and respect, 

Robert Atchison 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Learn how to choose, serve, and enjoy wine at Wine @ MSN. 

http://wine.msn.com/ 

6





Subject: Re: creationism vs. eveloution (j #1) 

Robert, first off I want to thank you for your heartfelt and kind response. 

You bring up a very very good point that I had never thought of. The idea that people 

choose both theories rather than one over the other is important for me to recognize. I 

have always thought there was only one way. I read your response to my mom and she said 

that when we first became Christian, she believed in both God and evolution. But later 

came to believe solely in God as we got grounded in the Word. 

The first few lines of the Bible, in Genesis, says the earth was without form and void. 

Which is slightly different than your version and that's just it...each version says 

something slightly different which can be interpreted differently. I take this verse to 

mean that the earth had no characteristuics or living being until God made them, rather 

than it was formed from waste. 

I don't however think we came from apes...Genesis 2:7, 21-22 says And the Lord God formed 

man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man 

became a living being. And He took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh in its place. 

Then the rib which the Lord God had taken from man He made into a woman, and He brought 

her to the man. 

Man came from dust, that is certain. Woman came from man. 

I gotta tell you, the best debates and discussions I ever have are with people who use and 

listen to what the Bible says, recognizing it as a historical document. Which of course 

hinders me from witnessing/talking to atheists. And I have made some of the greatest and 

most interesting friends through this passion. 

Everyone tends to think I'm so closed minded and wrapped up into my own little Christian 

world that I don't want to talk to any nonChristians, but it's just the opposite... I am 

curious what others believe, willing to listen, and pleased to make new friends. How can 

I witness to others if I don't understand the religions and beliefs of the world? So for 

that, thank you Robert. 

> 

> From: "Robert Atchison" 

> Date: 2004/01/25 Sun PM 05:27:33 EST 

> To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

> Subject: creationism vs. eveloution (j #1) 

> 

> Dear classmates, 

> Karis addressed an interesting topic in her first journal entry, evolution 

> vs. creationism. Both of these theories are highly charged and interesting 

> on many levels. Often times these two theories are seen as polar opposites, 

> which in my opinion is very dangerous. I believe this in part because the 

> holy word is taken as fact by millions around the world and science is also 

> taken as fact by millions around the world. Thus by setting these two 

> theories, both backed by what people believe to be packed with truth, one is 

> setting themselves up for failure. 

> 

> I believe in science and I believe that I was created by an omni present 

> being. This duality allows me to know that I could have evolved from an ape 

> and that this was the creator’s choice/plan to do so. Karis “disagree[s] 

> with the idea that it all came from a piece of dust and a big explosion”. 

> But from my reading of the bible this was exactly the case, 

7

“In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. The earth was 

> without form and an empty waste, and darkness was upon the face of the very 

> great deep” (Genesis 1 &2). 

> 

> I could continue but you all can read it for yourself if you so choose. 

> 

> God created the earth in a Big Bang? I believe it, but many do not. God 

> allowed us to evolve from apes? I believe this is possible too. This 

> ideology is known as theistic evolution. Pope John Paul II wrote, 

> “How do the conclusions reached by the various scientific disciplines 

> coincide with those contained in the message of Revelation? And if, at first 

> sight, there are apparent contradictions, in what direction do we look for 

> their solution? We know, in fact, that truth cannot contradict truth (cf. 

> Leo XIII, Encyclical Providentissimus Deus).” 

> 

> Thus if religion is seen as truth and science is seen as truth, one must 

> find the middle ground and see how both sources are speaking to the same 

> truths. 

> 

> The world is not always made of black and white, often times one finds a 

> shade of grey. 

> 

> With a kind heart and respect, 

> Robert Atchison 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> Learn how to choose, serve, and enjoy wine at Wine @ MSN. 

> http://wine.msn.com/ 

> 

> 

8


From: gilar001 [gilar001@csusm.edu] 


To: ICP-F-request@csusm.edu 

Subject: subscribe 

*****Carrie Gilardone****** 

9


From: tille002 [tille002@csusm.edu] 




I hope this isn't considered late but I'm writing it anyway. 

I am kind of nervous about this semester and the various science classes as 

science is not my best subject. No one ever accused me of being the sharpest 

knife in the drawer. I think I will start sitting next to the smartest person 

in our cohort. Who might that be? 

I do like the fact that our professors work closely together. I imagine there 

will be some confusion, but not as much as there was in our first semester. I 

am hoping that the material we learn will be reinforced among all the classes 

without having too heavy a workload. 

I just want to let my classmates know that I am happy to see all of them again 

and I am going to try not to talk as much this semester. 

10






As we begin this new semester I am nervous and overwhelmed by all the reading 

that we have to do. I hope that I gain a lot from these courses that will 

apply to the classroom since some of our past experiences have been just the 

opposite. Also, I am glad that our teachers are going to work together I only 

hope they are all willing to work with us and explain things when we don't 

understand, as some of our teachers last semester were not willing. 

Furthermore, I am not sure which book NRC is, but I am pretty sure that it 

is one of the books that the bookstore did not have. However, I thought that 

the preface of Sagan's book was semi interesting. I thought it was an easy 

read. I only hope the rest of the book is too. I thought the last comment made 

by him in the last paragraph was interesting and this is that "I learned the 

most essential things not from my school teachers, not even from my university 

professors, but from my parents, who knew nothing at all about science, in 

that single far off year of 1939." I thought this was interesting because I 

think when people like Sagan have parents who are not educated and they 

themselves are fortunate enough to get an education that it makes one 

appreciate the information and the life they have growing up and while going 

to school. 


11


From: silco001 [silco001@csusm.edu] 



Subject: Journal #1 

Wow! The class brought up some major points. Teresa line from the text was the 

same line that caught my eye and made me stop and think for awhile. I feel 

that there are so many standards that we are expected to teach with in all the 

subjects. Science is just another set of standards that if taught in a fun 

and interesting way can bring a whole new learning experience to the 

classroom. The standards seem overwhelming to us as new teachers, but once we 

get our feet wet I think like everything else it will become second nature. 

With the standards I can see why teachers teach science the way they do 

(similar to following a recipe) becuase the it can be assured that they are 

learning the specific standard for that unit. However, how do you truly know 

that they learned it, or are the students really good at following directions? 

Why not have the student learn other similar reactions and then make 

predictions on their own experiement. I think that way would be so much more 

enriching. 

-Thanks for reading, 

Chula 

12


From: Randy& Louise Tweed [tweed@undalumni.org] 




Attachments: Journal 1.doc 

Journal 1.doc (27 

KB) 

13


From: CA222girl@aol.com 



Subject: Jounal #1 

I agree with everyone who has said this is going to be an interesting yet challenging semester. I 

believe that every class we have taken so far, whether good or bad, has had something that we have 

taken out of it which will make us grow as individuals and teachers. And I think having that attitude 

makes things a little easier at times. 

So to the reading...I found the intro to the Sagan book to have many points that I agreed with and I 

even felt at some points that I was reading my own reflection on science. "I wish I could tell you about 

inspirational teachers in science from my elementary or junior high or high schools days. But as I 

think back on it, there were none" (xiii). This is sad because I hear so many people say this about 

science. Science is feared by so many and I want to change that. I can honestly say that I was 

absolutely dreading this semester because I fear science. But after thinking about it and reading this 

intro...I want to change that for the kids I teach. I want to be that inspirational teacher that makes an 

impact on a child. I want to be a confident, interesting and fun science teacher. 

Later on in the introduction it talks about being taught to follow rules like a recipe from a cookbook 

without any explanation. I think this is horrible. Especially with math and science. In order to really 

understand something, kids need to know why...anyone needs to know why. And I believe that there 

is more than one correct way. Kids should be allowed to explore and experiment with their work. That 

is half the fun of science. 

And one last thing that I took out of this intro had to do with the fact that his parents knew very little 

about science yet taught him the most important tools to the scientific method. This shows that we will 

touch kids lives even when we don't know that we are. We must be confident and when we don't 

know something, we need to find out. 

I am very eager to read on, start over with science and discover it all over again! 

Casey Cunningham 

14


From: Jennifer Ramos [ramos039@csusm.edu] 


To: LIST-SERVER 


As we embark on another semester, I am a bit anxious and a little apprehensive 

about what is to be learned, taught, understood, and revealed throughout the 

semester. But I am confident as time rolls on, I will be more comfortable and 

excited about what is to come in our learning and teaching of the subject. 

Science. Since we have been in the ICP Program, we have yet to dive into the 

many topics and themes that surround this very important subject. I cannot 

wait to really start exploring and discussing the issues of science. I am 

anxious to learn more and expand my knowledge and understanding of both 

science and pseudoscience, as mentioned and introduced in our readings from 

Carl Sagan's book. 

While doing the reading from the chapters of Sagan, I found myself really 

intrigued and curious about all of the arguments and content packed into the 

couple of chapters. After reading them, I found myself guilty of thinking of 

some of the pseudoscience as real science. But as Sagan explains, most of us 

believe it because we are not educated enough about science. As a result, I am 

now even more anxious to learn as much as I possibly can this semester in 

class and also through the readings. 

I can see just how important science is to the future generations on Earth. As 

a future teacher, I am obligated to teach the students about this subject. 

After reading the National Science Education Standards, I can see that there 

is a dedication to making students science literate. Just as Sagan touches on 

the the mass science illiteracy of the human population, the National Research 

Council proposes to bridge the gap and "[...] guide our nation toward a 

scientifically literate society" (p. 11). With that, I am interested in 

learning more about how I can take part in educating students to promote a 

more science literate generation. 

Jennifer Ramos 

15


From: Mike Runnestrand [miketheoldman@adelphia.net] 



Subject: Journal #1 (of 2....tops) 

All I have to say to this "creationism" vs. "the sane person's way of thinking" debate can be summed 

up (as all important things can) with a quote from the Simpsons: 

Prayer has no place in public schools, just like facts have no place in organized religion. 

- Superintendent Chalmers 

I'm not exactly sure what this whole Journal thing is about yet, especially since I have that "science 

background" email to send off also. From what I have pieced together from half-heartedly reading the 

first two sentences of everyone else's, is that I am supposed to be writing about how I feel this 

semester. It all seems very Dr. Phil-ish for my tastes, but what do I know. 

I am five minutes into this journal, and I already have an impending-doom headache. The impending 

doom is that I am going to spend every Sunday night for the next four and a half months exactly like 

this. How depressing. The only thing that appeals to me less than reading twenty-three journal 

entries from people over the age of 12 (my preferred colleagues, no offense) is writing one. I have a 

feeling this semester is going to be a hell of a lot of work. Luckily it seems that tests are weighted 

pretty heavily, so homework may not be as big of a deal as I fear. I haven't read any of the books yet 

(ha, "yet," get it?) because I haven't had the opportunity to purchase them yet, so I can't ethically join 

into the enthralling "chapter 1 was interesting and other comments that don't really mean that I've 

read it" conversation. This journal is very journalish, in that it is all over the place. This can be blamed 

on three compounding things: 

1. This is an e-mail journal. 

2. E-mail requires a computer with internet access. 

3. My computer is located in my room, notoriously the most fun place in North County (just ask Louise 

Tweed). 

Each level of blame creates a new distraction level that really hampers my ability to spit out a coherent journal 

for everyone to delete. I promise the next one will be so deep that it will make the Mariannas Trench look like 

this. 

-Mike Runnestrand, Comic Relief 

16


From: Kaylee102595@aol.com 



Subject: Journal 1; Jenny Fiala 

I am starting this semester with great enthusiasm. I have really enjoyed science throughout my 

experience as a student and I hope that my experience will continue now. From the readings I am 

getting an anticipation for what is coming. I have began to read some of the other literature as well 

and it all seems intriguing to me. I am not saying that I am the best science student, by far I am not 

the best science student, but I truly enjoy science. I love the experiements, the reasoning needed to 

complete them and the satisfaction of completing them and sometimes getting the answer that I was 

hoping for. Again, I am hoping for an exciting semester and I know that it will be a difficult load but I 

think I am up for the challenge. 

Jenny Fiala 

17


From: mcdon032 [mcdon032@csusm.edu] 




Well, I think this journal idea is great. I've already taken a look at 

everyone's opinions/ideas and I feel that we are all becoming a community. I 

think everyone has and will bring their own interesting facts or experiences 

along with the discussions on the readings in class. 

I think Karis and Robert bring up a good point about Creation and Evolution. 

First, I'm a PK(pastor's kid)so I was raised on very strong christian values. 

Therefore, I have a strong belief in creation. But in todays' society church 

and state is seperate. Therefore, no matter how much I pray for and want to 

happen, talking about God, specifcally Jesus, in schools probably won't happen 

in my life time which is unfortunately very sad to say. I like the idea of 

having a middle ground but even having that might have it's problems. 

Don't get me wrong. I think Science is important for our society. Without 

scientific advances, we couldn't be where we are today. That is for sure. But 

when science is used to find out data/facts about the 

earth/humans/animals/history, I think that you can find the same information 

in the Bible with more definite, realistic, and valid numbers. Example: 

Evolutionists say earth was created billions and billions of years ago. With 

creation, God created earth in simply 6 days so earth is only a little less 

than 7,ooo yrs old. I guess since I believe in creation, it seems like that 

theory seems to be too easy but maybe too amazing to understand. But that is 

exactly what faith is all about. 

Now about the readings. I just got done doing all of the readings and I found 

that a lot of the information repeated itself, which is good so that all of us 

can then actually remember what we're reading about. The Framework and 

Standards both bring up excellent points on how science should be taught and 

experienced in the classroom. I then learned the Framework, which I thought 

was only used by teachers, is said can be used by parents to help their kids 

out by knowing exactly what they are learning about. After reading Sagan I 

felt like it empowered me to want to become a better teacher than definitely 

the ones described. 

Thanks for reading mine! 

Laurie McDonald :) 

18


From: kirke003 [kirke003@csusm.edu] 


To: List Server for Science 

Subject: Journal? 

O.k., now I am a bit confused. I thought I just did the journal entry, but 

apparently I did the writing assignment #1. As with many things, clarity 

comes later. 

How do I feel about this semester? I am both stressed with the complexities 

of the workload and with understanding the of it all. 

I don't have a whole lot of formal science background, my only asset is my 

curiosity for how things work. 

So, are these journals just talking about science as we expand our 

understandings throughout the semster? 

SEE YA, Ann 

Ann Kirkendall kirke003@csusm.edu 

19




To: science 

Subject: Am I sending this to the right place? 

If someone else in the cohort reads this, can you please e-mail me back. I am 

e-mailing them to ICP-F@mailhost1.csusm.edu 

Is that the right place? 

Ann 


20



Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 8:35 AM 


Subject: Re: Am I sending this to the right place? 

this is right ann. 

> 

> From: kirke003 

> Date: 2004/01/26 Mon AM 02:34:21 EST 

> To: science 

> Subject: Am I sending this to the right place? 

> 

> If someone else in the cohort reads this, can you please e-mail me back. I am 

> e-mailing them to ICP-F@mailhost1.csusm.edu 

> 

> Is that the right place? 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> Ann Kirkendall kirke003@csusm.edu 

> 

> 

21


From: griff030 [griff030@csusm.edu] 



Subject: jOURNAL 1 

This semester we were told was going to be our hardest one yet. I am not so 

sure that I agree with that statement because Math was every hard for me last 

semester and I love science. I feel that if problems do a rise in the classes 

I have a great support from my Cohort to get through it. 

After reading the book so far I feel that it is a pretty easy book and I hope 

all the other books are like this one. I think that after taking this class I 

am going to be walking away from it a smarter man. 

I also feel that our professors this semster may seem that they are going to 

be hard teachers but we just need to buckle down and do this. The classes we 

have taken so far in the Cohort have been pretty easy and now we have to work 

for our grade. So I say lets have a great semester work hard and if we have 

problems don't be affarid to ask the teacher or your classmate. 

I also am very happy to see that out teachers this sememter do take time out 

of class and talk about each of us over coffee. I really think that is cool 

because it not only helps them to get to know us it also helps us gain the 

knowledge that they feel we need to work on. To add to this I feel that the 

paper we just had to write about our science background was a great idea to 

place each student and find out where they are in the class. 

Have a great day 

Jonathan 

22


From: tinne002 [tinne002@csusm.edu] 



Subject: journal 1 

I am very excited to get back into science. It has always been very 

challenging for me but I enjoy the challenge. Sagan seems to be full of great 

idea. I like the way he writes. The reading started to get pretty heavy but it 

really made me think. .The standards overview was a good introduction to this 

semester. It triggered a lot old facts and concepts into my mind and got me 

prepared to learn about science and how to teach it. I expect to learn a lot 

this semester. 

23



Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 4:56 PM 


Subject: Re: Journal #1 

I enjoyed reading your response to all this creation vs. evolution discussion. We are 

stuck in the same boat, wanting to teach about God and our beliefs, but going into the 

public school system prevents that. 

Many would tell us to simply teach at a private school so we can be in our own ground and 

not deal with this. But I am called to teach in public schools as you must be. I want to 

be that one good influence, that one Christian teacher in a public school...b/c if we as 

Christians all flock to the private schools, I would feel responsible for the lack of God 

in the public schools. And as I tell fellow Christian I am going into the public school 

system I hear a sigh of relief and a twinkle in their eye, they are proud and excited to 

see whar God is going to do. 

> 

> From: mcdon032 

> Date: 2004/01/26 Mon AM 02:23:45 EST 


> Subject: Journal #1 

> 

> Well, I think this journal idea is great. I've already taken a look at 

> everyone's opinions/ideas and I feel that we are all becoming a community. I 

> think everyone has and will bring their own interesting facts or experiences 

> along with the discussions on the readings in class. 

> 

> I think Karis and Robert bring up a good point about Creation and Evolution. 

> First, I'm a PK(pastor's kid)so I was raised on very strong christian values. 

> Therefore, I have a strong belief in creation. But in todays' society church 

> and state is seperate. Therefore, no matter how much I pray for and want to 

> happen, talking about God, specifcally Jesus, in schools probably won't happen 

> in my life time which is unfortunately very sad to say. I like the idea of 

> having a middle ground but even having that might have it's problems. 

> 

> Don't get me wrong. I think Science is important for our society. Without 

> scientific advances, we couldn't be where we are today. That is for sure. But 

> when science is used to find out data/facts about the 

> earth/humans/animals/history, I think that you can find the same information 

> in the Bible with more definite, realistic, and valid numbers. Example: 

> Evolutionists say earth was created billions and billions of years ago. With 

> creation, God created earth in simply 6 days so earth is only a little less 

> than 7,ooo yrs old. I guess since I believe in creation, it seems like that 

> theory seems to be too easy but maybe too amazing to understand. But that is 

> exactly what faith is all about. 

> 

> Now about the readings. I just got done doing all of the readings and I found 

> that a lot of the information repeated itself, which is good so that all of us 

> can then actually remember what we're reading about. The Framework and 

> Standards both bring up excellent points on how science should be taught and 

> experienced in the classroom. I then learned the Framework, which I thought 

> was only used by teachers, is said can be used by parents to help their kids 

> out by knowing exactly what they are learning about. After reading Sagan I 

> felt like it empowered me to want to become a better teacher than definitely 

> the ones described. 

> 

> Thanks for reading mine! 

> 

> Laurie McDonald :) 

> 

> 

24

25


From: Cynthia Reyes [mrstkdsd@yahoo.com] 

Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2004 7:12 PM 


Subject: Journal Entry #1 

I am still a little lost in regards to this class, but hopefully things will get cleared up tomorrow. I found 

the group discussion about our science experiences to be interesting. It's says a lot about the 

elementary science curriculum when so many people don't even have any recollection of doing 

science in their early school years. That is a shame, since science is one of the most intriguing 

subjects when taught in an interesting way. The good thing is, it seems like most of us really want to 

make it fun and memorable for our future students. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



26


From: sosno001 [sosno001@csusm.edu] 




Attachments: LBST 361B Journal #1.doc 

LBST 361B Journal 

#1.doc (24 K... 

27





Subject: Journal entry #2 

Wow! These readings are pretty deep. I love philosophy and never really 

correlated it to the science that we learn today. The line that sticks out 

most predominately to me from Chapter one in Russell is; "Berkeley tells us it 

is an idea in the mind of God; sober science, scarcely less wonderful, tells 

us it is a vast collection of electric charges in violent motion. (PG. 16). I 

took a college level philosophy class and we had this very same argument come 

up. However, it is very easily thrown back into the scientist court by saying 

that perhaps it is in Gods mind that the collection of electric charges are 

taking place. 

My favorite quote from philosopher Descartes is brought up in the second 

article "I think, therefore I am." I like this quote because it makes me 

believe in free will and that we are beings in this vast solar system that 

have individual minds that react upon stimuli in our own unique way. 

Interestingly enough the argument that things are there to be seen or we are 

there to see things was a heated discussion in our class. I would have like 

to have though that the world revolved around me and that the reason people 

are on this earth was so that I can see them and react to them. This view I 

have proven over the years to not be true, but I was a firm believer as a 

child. Truly, who really knows for certain if we are not just living in 

someone dream or people around us are living in our dream. 

The problem brought up with the space is something that is above and beyond my 

thinking level. I don't wish to tackle that argument. 

I would like to pose a question that I have pondered for many years; it is a 

proven fact that energy cannot be destroyed, it can only be displaced. If 

that is the case and it is known that the human body is a collection of 

energy, then what happen when we die? Does the energy pass on? Sorry that 

might be going a little to deep into the strange brain of mine. 

As far as the other readings are concerned, I feel that giving 119 pages to 

download and read it quite a lot for the second week of school, or for any 

week of school along with the other readings for our other classes. So I 

regretfully did not get to the other readings by the time I had written this. 

Hopefully I will have chance to catch up this weekend. 

-Chula 

28






To my surprise, the Sagan book is not a bad book to read. I wouldn't pick it 

up just for fun, but as for a book I have to read its kind of interesting. He 

makes a lot of statements that I think are true. For example, on page 26 he 

states that "we have also arranged things so that almost no one understands 

science and technology. This is a prescription for disaster." I agree with 

this because science is so complex and has many components that are very 

intimidating and that is why I think many of us just look at anything related 

to science and are uninterested in it. Furthermore, this is probably the 

reason why our education system lacks in science teachers. "When it gets 

complicated...we shy away from it because it seems too difficult (or because 

we've been taught so poorly), we surrender the ability to take charge of our 

future." These are very valid points that Sagan makes. I know I am not the 

only one who thinks that science is too difficult and does not really want to 

attempt to conquer this fear. However, when and if one does conquer the fear 

and finally understands a concept that it is "gratifying." 

I hope throughout this semester that there comes a time that I will find 

gratification in learning more about science. 


29





Subject: Journal 2: Jenny Fiala 

Chula, 

I agree with you on the reading load. I am still fighting my computer and printer to download and print 

the rest of the second readings. I feel that you have touched upon some very interesting and deep 

questions in your journal and I would like to discuss them back with you. I too have taken the 

necessary courses in science and philosophy and such issues of debate have arose. Fate or choice, 

religion vs. science, and so on. I found your idea on the energy within a human very interesting. I 

have recently found myself pondering the same such questions. In science we are animals we need 

nurishment, shelter, and so on to survive, but as humans we also have the ability for complex thought 

and choice of lifestyles. The average gopher, for example, does not ponder whether or not he is going 

to buy when the housing prices go down. Although we are grouped into the animal kingdom we have 

many traits that separate us from them. The idea that our bodies are energy sources and it is said in 

science that energy transfers and changes and you brought up the notion of our energy transferring 

after our bodies die. From a scientific standpoint the energy does transfer, heat, the main energy 

made from our bodies, leaves our bodies after we die. Now as a human with feelings, emotions, 

memories, and desires, or otherwise our Souls, those are back to the philosophical notions of energy. 

I myself would like to believe that a part of us stays behind when we are gone, but I do not believe it 

is in the form that you are speaking of, I believe that a part of us lives on in people that we have 

touched throughout our lives. That we live on in their memories and so scientifically since they are 

emitting heat, we are living on in energy even after we are gone. 

Jenny Fiala 

30






I think Chula was right when she said that the readings were deep. For 

example, the Russel readings were really making my thinking really seem out of 

there. After reading the first part of Russel and thinking about how 

everything made of matter can only be part of our own imagination or our or 

sensations, I thought I was in the Matrix movie. The reason why I say that is 

because I felt I was Keanu Reeves (sorry for my spelling)and I would have to 

go through all of the experiences he had to go through to eventaully accept 

that I was part of a world that was controlled by the MAtrix, a world of 

really binary digits and codes but regular life to humans. In this case, we 

are being told in Russel that a simple table could actaully not be there at 

all, and the only reason we see or feel it is because of our sense of touch, 

feeling, and smell. I too that it was interesting to think that things made of 

matter are actually certain ideas in the mind of God. The other readings of 

Russel I thought to be really interesting. It's almost amazing to think that 

matter is really something mental and not physically there(idealists). 

Rainoff's reading on "wavelike fluctuations" was also interesting to read 

about how the number of physical discoveries from England, France and Germany 

all of 3 common traits, and within these traits each of their long and short 

waves correspond similarly to their own economic lifes. I think with such 

information like that, there can so many other hypotheses and experiments done 

in order to find out more information about each of those countries. 

Murton's "arabian intellectual Dev." was kind of boring to me. It would have 

been probably more interesting to me if I could only understand half of the 

things he wastalking about. What I got after reading this, I found that these 

scientists were able to chart out information on intellectual dev. of the 

Arabic culture from the 8th and 14th century by using Dr. Sartonn's "History 

of Science". 

In Bruer's "new theory" I felt that I to had believed that human minds work 

like computers. I know sometimes when I'm done with typing up a document that 

took so time, afterwards I'm still thinking as a computer. Sometimes I'll do 

something, and I would think I could just hit the back button to redo what I 

just did. When it talked about assessment methods such as testing I thought 

that testing may show you performance levels and trends over a period of time, 

but tests can never tell someone that the students taking test may be or may 

not be good test takers. I wonder then what tests are really testing students 

for, because really most of the time scores on tests is really the only 

important thing that is evaluated and nothing else. I like the quote, "we need 

new teaching methods and new approaches to education" (pg.6). I think he means 

that we, as teachers, need to keep up with the changes of society and we need 

to learn what does and doesn't work with our students each year that we teach 

so that we can better tune into their interests and learning capabilities. 

Lastly, Sagan was really not that interesting to me. It actually shocked me 

with some criticisms toward religion. I think criticisms are okay if they can 

be backed up with evidence. Not to make this a big issue but when Sagan said 

that there are errors in philosophies of religion I think he would be wrong 

about Christianity. He says that "the scripture was divinely inspired- a 

phrase with many meanings." There is actually only one true meaning and let's 

just use the whole verse from the bible and you'll see that what Sagan said it 

untrue. "Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came 

about by the prophet's own interpretation. For prophecy never had it's origins 

in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the 

Holy Spirit." 2 Peter 1:20,21. 

Well, sorry if this journal was too long. I guess I got too much into it. :) 

Laurie :) 

31



Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2004 12:05 AM 



Chula, I am responding to your journal. I am still printing out all the readings myself, and it is already 

11:30pm. Scanned copies print VERY slowly!!!!! 

I was interested in your statement about energy not being destroyed, just replaced. I know they might 

say it is a proven fact, but being the skeptic, I don't think that is true. Much of science is more like 

proven theory, which too me, isn't proof at all. I know this doesn't help answer your question about 

dying and where your energy goes, but you just reminded me of the part of science I find rather 

disturbing. 

I like science that I can see and touch and prove. And I don't really understand the whole energy and 

relativity thing anyway. I think it is abstract, kind of like algebraic definitions in math, if you get my 

drift. 

I also liked the quote, "I think, therefore I am". I can't bring myself to believe that I am someone's 

dream, or even that I am a dream myself, it's much too demon-like for my mind. 

Ok, well, it's now 11:51pm and I am finally done printing, only took about an hour or so!!!! 

While I was waiting, I read some other journals from the class. 

In response to Alexandra's: Interesting take on things. While I don't actually disagree with some of it, I 

do have a different take on the medical issue. 

I personally think medical science does destroy people: Take Ritalin for example. Too many parents, 

teachers, psych and other so-called authorities would rather make things easier for themselves than 

better for the child being drugged. I haven't seen any real proof that ADD and related conditions exist, 

yet they continue to drug young children with dangerous drugs to treat it. Dealing with a walking 

zombie might make the adults lives easier, but what about the quality of life of the child? And watch 

some of the drug commercials on TV. The side effects are often worse than the condition the drugs 

are used to treat. 

Something else to ponder: Could disease be a means of population control? I am sure that most 

people will cringe when I say I think so. If you look at the pros and cons of saving everyone from 

every disease that comes along, then look at how China is dealing with their population problem, well, 

it's just a thought. (By the way, I meant natural occurring disease, not government induced disease). 

Maybe I better quit before I dig myself a very deep hole. I think I will get off my skeptic box and go to 

bed. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



33






I agree with others in our class that Carl Sagan is an interesting writer. He 

brings up a lot 

important yer overlooked issues. Scientist are the back bone of history. It is 

amazing to 

me how much scientists are involved with history , poitics and technology. 

With out 

scientists I cannot even imagine where we would be at today. I find it 

fascinating how 

Sagan writes about solid proven science and the myths of pseudoscience. One 

line that 

particulary stood out to me was when he wrote about how people do not always 

find 

what they want to find in science so they turn to religion and myths for 

support. For 

example people do not like the thought of death being the end of it all so 

they believe or 

create an after life so that they do not have to fear the end. "Because 

science carries us 

toward an understanding of how the world is, rather than how we would wish it 

to be, its 

findings may not in all cases be immediately comprehensible or satisfying" 

(Sagan 29). 

That is a great line because people are often times not happy or satisfied 

with how things 

are as they are so they must add colorful yet fake beliefs into their world to 

make life 

better when actually it is already perfect how it is, It is perfect in its 

imperfect ways. It is 

amazing to me that people out there are working to prove General Relativity 

wrong. The 

thought of disproving a theory created by Einstein just blows my mind. Can you 

imaging 

working to disprove Einstein's theory? Not I. 

Moving of to our other readings I really enjoyed reading from Russell in The 

Problems of 

Philosophy; Appearance and Reality, The Existence of Matter and Nature of 

Matter. The 

first chapter really started to trip me out. All this talk about pespectives 

and how we see 

things and weather or not it is real or if anyone see's anything the same 

really got my 

brain turning. I can see this chapter speaking on multiple levels. We can see 

things 

simply from a different position in the room or with a different light hitting 

an object or it 

can go much deeper by thinking that our mind is telling us what we see but 

what we are 

looking at might be something very different. The way we live life and our 

beliefs also 

effect our perspective of how we analyze situations and see objects. There is 

still a quote 

from this echoing in my mind and that is "What i seems to be and what it is". 

I am in to 

Bishop Berkley, he states that there is no such thing as matter the world is 

made up and 

perceived by our minds and ideas. I see a lot of truth in that statment. I 

34

wouldn't stake my 

life on that quote but it definatly got me to thinking about why people are so 

different. 

Sense data is a term i have never heared before.I beleive it is about how 

light, sound 

etc. waves are the physical cause of our sensations and any object independent 

of us 

corresoponds to the sense we feel in our private space. ANYWAYS before i get 

to deep 

with that i would like to say somehting about the reading titled Wavelike 

Fluctuations. 

Yeah, well that one really hurt my brain. I almost feel like we had to read it 

just so we 

could maybe relate to how our future students feel about learning about 

science and how 

difficult it can be to read about. So could someone tell me if I am on the 

right track. This 

was about England, Germany and France and when the fluctuation and growth of 

discoveries in science and physical history took place. I believe it compared 

our detailed 

records and tables of Germany, France and England to Auerbach's less detailed 

tales. I 

noticed that all three countries had similar waves between 1830-1900 and that 

each 

country has a period of long waves of creative productivity in individual 

decades. If I am 

reading the tables correctly Germany and England have similar waves. I take it 

that long 

waves represent long temp fluctuations in tempo of change of prices, wages, 

trade and 

turnover. The discoveries highlighted between 1771-1900's were heat, light, 

electrcity 

and magnetism. I did read the Arabian Intellectual Development 700-1300 but it 

is to late 

for me to get into that and it was very hard for me to make sense of. I read a 

lot today and 

I was bumbed that there was so much to read but it was all very fun 

interesting and 

challenging for me to read. I recommend that everyone reads everything. 

Bye-Bye. Your 

Pal Marin. 

35


From: Ann Kirkendall [zestydu69@yahoo.com] 



Subject: Journal entry #2 Ann Kirkendall 

I must say that I am not sure what to say. This is all very deep. I know that we have people in our 

cohort who are very religious, so this topic can be a touchy one for some. I myself, think no one has 

the right answer. Throughout history, we struggle to make sense of our world we make up structures 

to give us a sense of order. These structures are constantly changing, as do ideas within science 

itself. As we learn new ways of looking at things, our old structures are forever altered. Once our mind 

has been stretched to a new idea, we can never go back again. I do not think that anyone has the 

right answer about religion. I think that the religion that people believe in is a form of social control. I 

am not saying that there is not something out there , I am saying that I don't think anyone has the 

right answer. Throughout history, including current day, people have done terrible things in the name 

of religion and in the name of science. Throughout! history, including current day again, religion has 

tried to justify the mistreatment of certain groups of people. People used religion to justify slavery, to 

justify all of the social hierarchies that our religious world seems to believe in. Through the 

brainwashing of religion, Mathew Sheppard was beaten and left to die, and the people in that town 

think he got what he deserved. I think that people are too easily controlled. I believe that there are 

seudo-religions, just as there are seudo-sciences and that people need to use their own common 

sense and judgment along with their beliefs. I think that our understandings of our world whether it be 

our social constructions, our current views on science, or our numerous views on religion, are 

constantly changing. As we encounter new ideas, we open doors that we never knew existed. What 

we think we know now will seem so very different to future generations. 

_____ 



36








KB) 

37








KB) 

Here is my journal. I don't know if it makes any sense. I was just writing my 

ideas LATE last night. 

Teresa 

38


From: Mike Runnestrand [miketheoldman@adelphia.net] 

Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2004 1:50 PM 

To: Cohort f science listserve 

Subject: euglena 

http://www.jracademy.com/~mlechner/archive1999/euglena.html 

39





Subject: Re: euglena 

Thanks Mike!! I remember what they are now, very cool. Can't wait till class next week so we can play 

with them. Keep up the good work entertaining us in the classroom 

Cynthia 

Mike Runnestrand wrote: 


_____ 



40





Subject: Re: Journal 2 

Louise, can you resend your journal? It won't open. Maybe copy and paste it into the email instead of 

sending it as an attachment. 

Cynthia 

Randy& Louise Tweed wrote: 

> ATTACHMENT part 2 application/msword name=Journal 2.doc 

_____ 



41



Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2004 9:57 AM 


Subject: Re: Journal entry #2 Ann Kirkendall 

Wihtout going overboard here, I just want to say that I would never use what I believe in 

to cause harm in anyone else, and I am embarrassed at thsoe who use Christianity as an 

excuse to do so. The Bible does not tell us to even hate our enemies but to love them. 

Matthew 6:44 says "But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good 

to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you." In 

other words, Jesus tells his followers basically not even to hurt a fly. Those that do 

are lost and confused. 

So I hope this helps you to hate us a little less and like us a little more. For you 

cannot judge Christians or any religion or group of people for those that make mistakes. 

And I am in no way thinking you are judging anyone! You are a kind and loving person and 

I am thrilled to know what you think about religions...but for the sake of this journal I 

am responding. : ) 

I had a Muslim friend throughout the 9-11 tragedy who's entire family was still at home in 

the Middle East and we discussed his pain of being accused for what the hijackers did. He 

helped me to realize that I can't make assumptions that an entire people are the same as 

the few that do wrong. 

> 

> From: Ann Kirkendall 

> Date: 2004/01/28 Wed AM 07:08:50 PST 


> Subject: Journal entry #2 Ann Kirkendall 

> 

> I must say that I am not sure what to say. This is all very deep. I know that we have 

people in our cohort who are very religious, so this topic can be a touchy one for some. I 

myself, think no one has the right answer. Throughout history, we struggle to make sense 

of our world we make up structures to give us a sense of order. These structures are 

constantly changing, as do ideas within science itself. As we learn new ways of looking at 

things, our old structures are forever altered. Once our mind has been stretched to a new 

idea, we can never go back again. I do not think that anyone has the right answer about 

religion. I think that the religion that people believe in is a form of social control. I 

am not saying that there is not something out there , I am saying that I don't think 

anyone has the right answer. Throughout history, including current day, people have done 

terrible things in the name of religion and in the name of science. Throughout history, 

including curre! 

nt! 

> day 

> again, religion has tried to justify the mistreatment of certain groups of people. 

People used religion to justify slavery, to justify all of the social hierarchies that our 

religious world seems to believe in. Through the brainwashing of religion, Mathew Sheppard 

was beaten and left to die, and the people in that town think he got what he deserved. I 

think that people are too easily controlled. I believe that there are seudo-religions, 

just as there are seudo-sciences and that people need to use their own common sense and 

judgment along with their beliefs. I think that our understandings of our world whether it 

be our social constructions, our current views on science, or our numerous views on 

religion, are constantly changing. As we encounter new ideas, we open doors that we never 

knew existed. What we think we know now will seem so very different to future generations. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

42

--------------------------------- 

> Do you Yahoo!? 

> Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! 

> 

43





Subject: journal 2- casey cunningham 

I was doing the reading from Ochanji's class and a few things really caught my attention so I 

thought I would bring them up and see what you guys thought about them. In Chapter 1 of Learning 

from Cases it stated that elementary students in the United States spend less than 20 minutes a day 

studying science. In the past I probably would have said who cares but this is sad. This is why people 

get to college and the majority of them say I hate science. We would probably hate reading and 

writing too if we only spent 20 minutes on it a day. We would hate it because we would not know how 

to approach it properly and I believe that this is the case with many when it comes to science. 

Research also showed that 75 percent of lower elementary (K-3) and 90 percent of upper 

elementary (4-6) science instruction involves lecture and discussion teaching methods. This is sad 

especially in the lower grades because a 2nd grader will not get anything out of hearing a lecture 

about bugs but when you actually bring in those bugs...boy do those kids learn. It gets them excited 

about learning...Hands one experiences are crucial, in my opinion in order to get students interested 

and excited about learning. 

Another thing that really got me going was the first Case 2.1. I think it is great that a school would 

pair new teachers with veteran teachers to help them a long but this veteran teacher in my opinion 

was horrible. Did any one else agree. I understand that it is a poverty school but to say not to really 

bother with them because they won't go to college anyway really upsets me. We are not to judge who 

can go to college or not. We should be encouraging them as teachers to strive for the best and try 

their hardest. So having a veteran teacher tell a new teacher not to bother with group hands on 

experiences in science can only bring that new teacher down. That is taking everything that we have 

learned in our preparation to become teachers and flushing it down the toilet. So that got me going a 

little bit..can you tell? That is why I decided to write about it...I would like to hear what you guys 

think...Am I reading it wrong or is that what you guys got out of it too? Have a good weekend! 

44





Subject: Re: euglena 

In a message dated 1/28/04 1:50:38 PM Pacific Standard Time, miketheoldman@adelphia.net writes: 


Thanks Mike....Now I know all about euglenas :) 

45



Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2004 12:14 PM 



For my second journal entry I would like to comment on the class discussion. 

It seems there is going to be some lively discussions. I sure am looking 

forward to it. The discussion in Yamashta’s class about the table being there 

or not, really got me to thinking. I asked myself, “Are my bills really there? 

” I know the money is not there to pay them. But, if my bills are not really 

there, do I have to pay them? I’m confused now. I’m going to curl up in a 

little ball in the corner of my house (if the corner is really there) and rock 

back and forth. 

46






You are too funny, Cecilia!! Let's take it a step further. If the table doesn't exist, and your bills and 

money don't exist, then neither does this journal. Hmmmmmm. I think we just saved ourselves some 

time that doesn't exist either. 

tille002 wrote: 

For my second journal entry I would like to comment on the class discussion. 

It seems there is going to be some lively discussions. I sure am looking 

forward to it. The discussion in Yamashta’s class about the table being there 

or not, really got me to thinking. I asked myself, “Are my bills really there? 

” I know the money is not there to pay them. But, if my bills are not really 

there, do I have to pay them? I’m confused now. I’m going to curl up in a 

little ball in the corner of my house (if the corner is really there) and rock 

back and forth. 

_____ 



47


From: Mike Runnestrand [mikerunnestrand@hotmail.com] 


To: icp-f@csusm.edu 

Subject: Entertainment for the physics minded/gangsta rap minded 

http://www.mchawking.com/index.php 

Click multimedia then MP3's 

Warning: This site, especially the songs, will offend 99% of the people in 

our cohort. The other 1%, you know who you are, check it out. 

_________________________________________________________________ 

What are the 5 hot job markets for 2004? Click here to find out. 

http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFindJobsIn2004.htm? 

siteid=CBMSN3006&sc_extcmp=JS_wi08_dec03_hotmail1 

48





Subject: Re: Entertainment for the physics minded/gangsta rap minded 

Mike, you get the award!!!! I think you have more free time on your hands than I do. Funny stuff, by 

the way, and not offended. Cynthia 


http://www.mchawking.com/index.php 

Click multimedia then MP3's 

Warning: This site, especially the songs, will offend 99% of the people in 

our cohort. The other 1%, you know who you are, check it out. 

_________________________________________________________________ 


http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFindJobsIn2004.htm 

?siteid=CBMSN3006&sc_extcmp=JS_wi08_dec03_hotmail1 

_____ 



49





Cc: jleblanc@temvalley.com 


From the desk of: Jane M. Leblanc 

Do any of you people realize who often Professor Yamashita says "does 

that make sense." In class next week, I'm going to record how many times the 

dear Professor repeats this phrase. I'm betting at least fifteen times. 

Anyway, thanks Mike for the statement you made in class Wednesday about what 

does it matter whether a table is a table or not. Some teachers are still in 

the 1960s where a good joint provided for all kinds of interesting discussions 

(not that I would know). I hope we learn something more out of this class than 

what's been laid on the table. Does that make sense? 

50


From: marti171 [marti171@csusm.edu] 


To: LBST 361B 


After the first class, I just hope I learn something. Science has not been my 

favorite subject, but I would like to know more about it. I hope that by the 

end of the semester the question "How does society construct science?" is 

answered. I have read chapter 1 in the Sagan book. By reading it, I realized 

that I need to have a positive attitude towards science so that when it is my 

time to teach it, my students would also have a positive attitude. I would 

like them to have an interest in the world and everything that sorround us. 

Hopefully, the class would allow me, like the professor said, to become more 

critical about science and find the relationship between science and society. 

51


From: Michael Renner [birdnerd13@yahoo.com] 




Attachments: journal2.doc 

journal2.doc (22 

KB) 

__________________________________ 




52



Sent: Friday, January 30, 2004 10:57 AM 


Subject: RE: Entertainment for the physics minded/gangsta rap minded 

very funny! I relate to him on so many levels. all my shootings be drive bys 

too, in liberity city. 

>From: "Mike Runnestrand" 

>Reply-To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

>To: icp-f@csusm.edu 

>Subject: Entertainment for the physics minded/gangsta rap minded 

>Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 18:05:21 -0800 

> 

>http://www.mchawking.com/index.php 

> 

> 

>Click multimedia then MP3's 

> 

>Warning: This site, especially the songs, will offend 99% of the people in 

>our cohort. The other 1%, you know who you are, check it out. 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>What are the 5 hot job markets for 2004? Click here to find out. 

>http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFindJobsIn2004.htm? 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Check out the new MSN 9 Dial-up — fast & reliable Internet access with prime 

features! http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=dialup/home&ST=1 

53



Sent: Friday, January 30, 2004 11:49 AM 


Subject: evolution 

Latest Developments 

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/040130/480/axf10901300933 AP Photo 

Ga. Official Wants to Replace 'Evolution' 

(AP) - The state's school superintendent has proposed striking the word evolution from Georgia's science curriculum and 

replacing it with the phrase "biological changes over time." 

Saw this on yahoo. 

_____ 



54






Cecilia, 

You're the best. When all the rest of the world is concerned about reality and chaos, you and Manny 

are the two people I know that can make it fun. Thanks for the "reality" check and a comic relief. 

Jenny :) 

55





Subject: Re: Journal entry #2 Ann Kirkendall 

Who is this? You did not write your name. 

Jenny Fiala 

56





Subject: Question 

Hey gang. I really do not want to get caught up in the Creation/ Evolution 

disscussion 

because it leads us, or me at least, to circular speaking but I have a curious 

question. 

Okay so, I want a real answer I am not critisizing this theory or supporting 

it I am neutral 

about it and I just have a happy, nice, fun question. If God created 

evolution and apes as 

well then how did he do it if evolution started some 4.6 billion years ago and 

God started 

life what 4 or 7 thousand years ago. Just tell me what you think. Respectfully 

all ya' alls, 

Marin. If anyone responds would you title the e-mail Answer. Take care. 

57





Subject: Re: Question 

When Did God Create the Heavens and the 

Earth? 

By Hugh Ross, Ph.D. 

(this isn't the whole article, but I thought maybe this would help answer your question) 

(SEE HIGHLIGHTED PART) 

So, what does the Bible say about when the universe was created? In Habakkuk 3:6 the mountains 

are declared to be "ancient" and the hills "age-old." In Proverbs 8:22-31 God compares His eternality 

to the length of time the oceans and mountains have been in place and to the span of time since He 

created the heavens. The figures of speech used in Psalm 90:2-6, Ecclesiastes 1: 3-11, and Micah 

6:2 all depict the immeasurable antiquity of God's presence upon (and plans for) the earth. If you 

understand even a little about physics, you will see that the claim made in Genesis 22:17, Jeremiah 

33:22, and Hebrews 11: 12, namely that the stars are more numerous than the largest numbers used 

by the Hebrews and Greeks, implies a minimum age for the universe significantly in excess of that 

proposed in the 16th century by Archbishop Ussher. 

Why, then, does Moses use the Hebrew word yowm, translated "day," for the six periods of creation? 

In English we would use words like "era," "age," or "epoch" to describe long periods of time. But, in 

Hebrew there are no such words. The word olam is often suggested, but it is defined as "forever," 

"perpetual," "lasting," "always," "of olden times," or "the remote past, future, or both." its range of 

usage does not include a set period of time. Thus, yowm would be the most appropriate Hebrew word 

to refer to a specific, though lengthy, period of time. Even in English we sometimes use the word day 

for an epoch, as in "the day of the Romans" or "the day of the dinosaurs." 

Cynthia 

tinne002 wrote: 

Hey gang. I really do not want to get caught up in the Creation/ Evolution 

disscussion 

because it leads us, or me at least, to circular speaking but I have a curious 

question. 

Okay so, I want a real answer I am not critisizing this theory or supporting 

it I am neutral 

about it and I just have a happy, nice, fun question. If God created 

evolution and apes as 

58

well then how did he do it if evolution started some 4.6 billion years ago and 

God started 

life what 4 or 7 thousand years ago. Just tell me what you think. Respectfully 

all ya' alls, 

Marin. If anyone responds would you title the e-mail Answer. Take care. 

_____ 



59





Subject: Answer 

yo. kent hovind, the scientist i mentioned, says that the earth isnt that old. thus 

evolution and the idea that it all happened 4+ billion years ago is all a hoax. so 

really, you only can believe in one or the other. you either believe the earth is VERY 

old with dinosaurs roaming the earth, or you believe in God as the Creator which happened 

thousands of years ago. God didn't create the earth and life billions of years ago. this 

doesnt mean there were no dinos, it just means they didnt exist all that long ago. does 

this help? i got off on the dino tangent. 

> 

> From: tinne002 

> Date: 2004/01/31 Sat PM 01:05:54 PST 


> Subject: Question 

> 

> Hey gang. I really do not want to get caught up in the Creation/ Evolution 

> disscussion 

> because it leads us, or me at least, to circular speaking but I have a curious 

> question. 

> Okay so, I want a real answer I am not critisizing this theory or supporting 

> it I am neutral 

> about it and I just have a happy, nice, fun question. If God created 

> evolution and apes as 

> well then how did he do it if evolution started some 4.6 billion years ago and 

> God started 

> life what 4 or 7 thousand years ago. Just tell me what you think. Respectfully 

> all ya' alls, 

> Marin. If anyone responds would you title the e-mail Answer. Take care. 

> 

> 

-karis kroeker- 

60





Subject: more euglena 

http://mtlab.biol.tsukuba.ac.jp/WWW/PDB/Images/Mastigophora/Euglena/ 

This link has pictures of real euglena and you can enlarge them x16, very cool!!! 

Cynthia 

_____ 



61






http://protist.i.hosei.ac.jp/Movies/htmls/Mastigophora/Euglena/ 

moving euglena 

_____ 



62



Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 12:31 AM 


Subject: RE: Answer 

what logic or truth does Kent Hovind use to back up all of these theories of 

his. 

he has also made comments such as.... 

"If Evolution is true, there is no Creator, so laws come from mans opinion. 

That is called a democracy, which is a terrible form of government. 

Democracies always degenerate into dictatorships. In America, it is sad to 

say, has become a democracy." Source: Hovind 1999 Seminar Transcript 1b from 

http://216.248.142.66/SeminarOnline/Text/Transcript1.shtm 

"What do HIV, West Nile Fever, Gulf war syndrome, chronic fatigue syndrome, 

multiple sclerosis, Wegener's disease, Parkinson's disease, Crohn's colitis, 

Type I diabetes, and collagen-vascular diseases such as rheumatoid arthritis 

and Alzheimer's have in common? These plagues were all developed as a joint 

effort by the money masters and governments of the world under the guise of 

biowarfare research." 

Source: http://www.drdino.com/cse.asp?pg=articles&specific=53 [May 2003] 

New World Order, coming to a city near you. They are starting next month in 

South America, putting microchips in people. That's the plan. America is 

slated for this fall. Put microchips in the palm of the right hand. 

Source: http://www.cbbc.net/RS/ 6 Jan 2002 Session #3 @ 24:00 

To be honest the guy kinda sounds like a conspiracy freak. He definently 

does not like America, science, government, man driven thought or a bunch of 

other things that many of us value. 

I'm not saying that he doesn't have the right to a point of view, just that 

his point of view has no basis in substatiated claims. 

If you want to read more criticism's about this man go to (some of it is 

pretty funny): 

http://www.geocities.com/kenthovind/ 

http://home.austarnet.com.au/stear/bartelt_dissertation_on_hovind_thesis.htm 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Find high-speed ‘net deals — comparison-shop your local providers here. 

https://broadband.msn.com 

63





Subject: RE: Answer 

Good info Robert. I checked out some of the claims on snopes.com. Urban legends. 

This guy doesn't appear to be a real credible source. Thanks for sharing. 

Cynthia 

Robert Atchison wrote: 

what logic or truth does Kent Hovind use to back up all of these theories of 

his. 

he has also made comments such as.... 

"If Evolution is true, there is no Creator, so laws come from mans opinion. 

That is called a democracy, which is a terrible form of government. 

Democracies always degenerate into dictatorships. In America, it is sad to 

say, has become a democracy." Source: Hovind 1999 Seminar Transcript 1b from 

http://216.248.142.66/SeminarOnline/Text/Transcript1.shtm 

"What do HIV, West Nile Fever, Gulf war syndrome, chronic fatigue syndrome, 

multiple sclerosis, Wegener's disease, Parkinson's disease, Crohn's colitis, 

Type I diabetes, and collagen-vascular diseases such as rheumatoid arthritis 

and Alzheimer's have in common? These plagues were all developed as a joint 

effort by the money masters and governments of the world un! der the guise of 

biowarfare research." 

Source: http://www.drdino.com/cse.asp?pg=articles&specific=53 [May 2003] 

New World Order, coming to a city near you. They are starting next month in 

South America, putting microchips in people. That's the plan. America is 

slated for this fall. Put microchips in the palm of the right hand. 

Source: http://www.cbbc.net/RS/ 6 Jan 2002 Session #3 @ 24:00 

To be honest the guy kinda sounds like a conspiracy freak. He definently 

does not like America, science, government, man driven thought or a bunch of 

other things that many of us value. 

I'm not saying that he doesn't have the right to a point of view, just that 

his point of view has no basis in substatiated claims. 

If you want to read more criticism's about this man go to (some of it is 

pretty funny): 


http://home.austarnet.com.au/stear/bartelt_dissertation_on_hovind_thesis.htm 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Find high-speed ‘net deals — comparison-shop your local providers here. 

https://broadband.msn.com 

_____ 

64



65





Subject: Journal #2: revolution 

Dear Class, 

Throughout the ages there has been some sort of means to control the masses. 

Sagan often comments on the need to bring science (true science) to the 

masses as a necessary means to insure the success of our future world. In 

many ways I agree with his assumptions on this particular issue, but would 

none the less like to purpose something to the contraire. If everyone was to 

be well versed in the sciences, they would in turn move towards a degree of 

empowerment. This is by no means a goal of any present government. 

Governments want people to be passive and complacent, so that their 

necessary agenda can be easily transfixed through various forms of media and 

governmental law. If people, all people, commanded the power of science they 

would naturally be more inquisitive because science teaches you to question. 

There has been a long standing tradition of creating complacent citizens. I 

believe it was originally Marx who stated that “religion is the opiate of 

the masses” and today the opiate comes in the form of pseudoscience, 

religion, falsehood democracies and the media. The general idea in all these 

forms of behavior being complacency not activism. 

So in some sense Sagan is speaking of more than just the need for educating 

the world in the ways of science, he is speaking to a revolution for the 

disenfranchised. To learn is one thing, but to learn how to think for 

yourself is revolutionary. I can only imagine a world in which people were 

all inquisitive in nature and to be perfectly honest I don’t know if it 

would necessarily be a good thing. Think about the roles of humans and the 

nature of being. How would we be able to live in harmony or anything close? 

I don’t know if I believe that we must have followers and leaders, not just 

leaders. These are just some thoughts; maybe you all can help me to world 

through them. 

Your pal, 


_________________________________________________________________ 

Get a FREE online virus check for your PC here, from McAfee. 

http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 

66



Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 12:03 PM 


Subject: Re: Journal #2: revolution 

Thoughtful journal write-up, Robert. I think this is why science is on the back-burner in public schools. 

Can't have a bunch of inquisitve students questioning the establishment. This is also why public 

education continues to push their social agenda. Look at all the time they spend on teaching the 

things children are supposed to learn from their parents, churches etc. And look how they keep 

passing these students to the next grade without the skills necessary to even have a chance to 

succeed. Then they tell the teachers they must teach all these students, knowing full well, they are 

making it almost impossible for teachers to deliver a good high-quality education. Its very easy to 

control the future population because they are making sure they are not being educated in the things 

that allow them to think for themselves. 

Cynthia 


Dear Class, 

Throughout the ages there has been some sort of means to control the masses. 

Sagan often comments on the need to bring science (true science) to the 

masses as a necessary means to insure the success of our future world. In 

many ways I agree with his assumptions on this particular issue, but would 

none the less like to purpose something to the contraire. If everyone was to 

be well versed in the sciences, they would in turn move towards a degree of 

empowerment. This is by no means a goal of any present government. 

Governments want people to be passive and complacent, so that their 

necessary agenda can be easily transfixed through various forms of media and 

governmental law. If people, all people, commanded the power of science they 

would naturally be more inquisitive because science teaches you to question. 

There has! been a long standing tradition of creating complacent citizens. I 

believe it was originally Marx who stated that “religion is the opiate of 

the masses” and today the opiate comes in the form of pseudoscience, 

religion, falsehood democracies and the media. The general idea in all these 

forms of behavior being complacency not activism. 

So in some sense Sagan is speaking of more than just the need for educating 

the world in the ways of science, he is speaking to a revolution for the 

disenfranchised. To learn is one thing, but to learn how to think for 

yourself is revolutionary. I can only imagine a world in which people were 

all inquisitive in nature and to be perfectly honest I don’t know if it 

would necessarily be a good thing. Think about the roles of humans and the 

nature of being. How would we be able to live in harmony or anything close? 

I don’t know if I believe that we must have followers and leaders, not just 

leaders. Th! ese are just some thoughts; maybe you all can help me to world 

through them. 

Your pal, 


67

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



68





Subject: Re: journal 2- casey cunningham 

CA222girl@aol.com wrote: 


thought I would bring them up and see what you guys thought about them. In Chapter 1 of 

Learning from Cases it stated that elementary students in the United States spend less than 20 

minutes a day studying science. In the past I probably would have said who cares but this is sad. 

This is why people get to college and the majority of them say I hate science. We would probably 

hate reading and writing too if we only spent 20 minutes on it a day. We would hate it because we 

would not know how to approach it properly and I believe that this is the case with many when it 

comes to science. 


elementary (4-6) science instruction involves lecture and discussion teaching methods. This is sad 

especially in the lower grades because a 2nd grader will not get anything out of hearing a lecture 

about bugs but when you actually bring in those bugs...boy do those kids learn. It gets them 

excited about learning...Hands one experiences are crucial, in my opinion in order to get students 

interested and excited about learning. 

Another thing that really got me going was the first Case 2.1. I think it is great that a school 

would pair new teachers with veteran teachers to help them a long but this veteran teacher in my 

opinion was horrible. Did any one else agree. I understand that it is a poverty school but to say not 

to really bother with them because they won't go to college anyway really upsets me. We are not 

to judge who can go to college or not. We should be encouraging them as teachers to strive for 

the best and try their hardest. So having a veteran teacher tell a new teacher not to bother with 

group hands on experiences in science can only bring that new teacher down. That is taking 

everything that we have learned in our preparation to become teachers and flushing it down the 

toilet. So that got me going a little bit..can you tell? That is why I decided to write about it...I would 

like to hear what you guys think...Am I reading it wrong or is that what y! ou guys got out of it too? 

Have a good weekend! 

Casey, I agree with you. I find that the older teachers have an attitude that is different from what 

they are teaching us to have. Perhaps that is why they want a change. I believe we should teach 

all children as if all of them will go to college because you never know what opportunies will 

become available to them in their futures. 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gif Ann 

_____ 



69


From: lande008 [lande008@csusm.edu] 




Attachments: 361jrnl2.doc 

361jrnl2.doc (21 

KB) 

Dear Class, 

here is my second journal 

Matheno 

70






Ann, I agree that teachers should believe in their students, regardless of their socio-economic 

backgrounds. But please don't label ALL old teachers as evil, I might have to take offense, lol. I don't 

think you can generalize about that type of thing. There are lots of experienced older teachers who 

are really good. The real problem is all the teachers that are only there to collect a paycheck, and 

believe me.........there are tons of those, young and old. They do the most harm to the students 

because they don't care if a child learns anything. I don't even think they realize how detrimental their 

lack of enthusiasm is to the students, not that it would matter, i am sure. 

Cynthia 

Ann Kirkendall wrote: 





minutes a day studying science. In the past I probably would have said who cares but this is 

sad. This is why people get to college and the majority of them say I hate science. We would 

probably hate reading and writing too if we only spent 20 minutes on it a day. We would hate it 

because we would not know how to approach it properly and I believe that this is the case with 

many when it comes to science. 


elementary (4-6) science instruction involves lecture and discussion teaching methods. This is 

sad especially in the lower grades because a 2nd grader will not get anything out of hearing a 

lecture about bugs but when you actually bring in those bugs...boy do those kids learn. It gets 

them excited about learning...Hands one experiences are crucial, in my opinion in order to get 

students interested and excited about learning. 


would pair new teachers with veteran teachers to help them a long but this veteran teacher in 

my opinion was horrible. Did any one else agree. I understand that it is a poverty school but to 

say not to really bother with them because they won't go to college anyway really upsets me. 

We are not to judge who can go to college or not. We should be encouraging them as teachers 

to strive for the best and try their hardest. So having a veteran teacher tell a new teacher not to 

bother with group hands on experiences in science can only bring that new teacher down. That 

is taking everything that we have learned in our preparation to become teachers and flushing it 

down the toilet. So that got me going a little bit..can you tell? That is why I decided to write 

about it...I would like to hear what you guys think...Am I reading it wrong or is that what y! ! ou 

guys got out of it too? Have a good weekend! 

Casey, I agree with you. I find that the older teachers have an attitude that is different from 

what they are teaching us to have. Perhaps that is why they want a change. I believe we 

should teach all children as if all of them will go to college because you never know what 

opportunies will become available to them in their futures. 

71

_____ 




_____ 



72





Subject: Journal entry #3 

Attachments: Journal #3.doc 

Journal #3.doc (30 

KB) 

Hi class, 

In my journal response, I kind of got a little lenghty. Not about my Wows, 

but about my Hmmms. It is not intended to ruffle anyone's feathers, and it 

does not mean that I hate any groups of people. I was thinking outside the 

box which produced food for thought. 

Ann 


73






Cynthia, 

You are correct, I didn't catch that comment as coming across that way. I argree. 

Ann :o) 

Cynthia Reyes wrote: 

Ann, I agree that teachers should believe in their students, regardless of their socio-economic 

backgrounds. But please don't label ALL old teachers as evil, I might have to take offense, lol. I 

don't think you can generalize about that type of thing. There are lots of experienced older 

teachers who are really good. The real problem is all the teachers that are only there to collect a 

paycheck, and believe me.........there are tons of those, young and old. They do the most harm to 

the students because they don't care if a child learns anything. I don't even think they realize how 

detrimental their lack of enthusiasm is to the students, not that it would matter, i am sure. 

Cynthia 



I was doing the reading from Ochanji's class and a few things really caught my attention 

so I thought I would bring them up and see what you guys thought about them. In Chapter 

1 of Learning from Cases it stated that elementary students in the United States spend less 

than 20 minutes a day studying science. In the past I probably would have said who cares 

but this is sad. This is why people get to college and the majority of them say I hate 

science. We would probably hate reading and writing too if we only spent 20 minutes on it a 

day. We would hate it because we would not know how to approach it properly and I 

believe that this is the case with many when it comes to science. 

Research also showed that 75 percent of lower elementary (K-3) and 90 percent of 

upper elementary (4-6) science instruction involves lecture and discussion teaching 

methods. This is sad especially in the lower grades because a 2nd grader will not get 

anything out of hearing a lecture about bugs but when you actually bring in those 

bugs...boy do those kids learn. It gets them excited about learning...Hands one experiences 

are crucial, in my opinion in order to get students interested and excited about learning. 

Another thing that really got me going was the first Case 2.1. I think it is great that a 

school would pair new teachers with veteran teachers to help them a long but this veteran 

teacher in my opinion was horrible. Did any one else agree. I understand that it is a poverty 

school but to say not to really bother with them because they won't go to college anyway 

really upsets me. We are not to judge who can go to college or not. We should be 

encouraging them as teachers to strive for the best and try their hardest. So having a 

veteran teacher tell a new teacher not to bother with group hands on experiences in 

science can only bring that new teacher down. That is taking everything that we have 

74

_____ 

_____ 

learned in our preparation to become teachers and flushing it down the toilet. So that got 

me going a little bit..can you tell? That is why I decided to write about it...I would like to hear 

what you guys think...Am I reading it wrong or is that what y! ! ! ou guys got out of it too? 

Have a good weekend! 










_____ 



75





Subject: Re: Journal entry #3 

If you are talking to me, my feathers weren't ruffled, Ann. I just thought I would make the point that 

age and experience has nothing to do with it. Not all teachers have the passion necessary to be good 

teachers. Cynthia http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gif 

kirke003 wrote: 

Hi class, 

In my journal response, I kind of got a little lenghty. Not about my Wows, 

but about my Hmmms. It is not intended to ruffle anyone's feathers, and it 

does not mean that I hate any groups of people. I was thinking outside the 

box which produced food for thought. 

Ann 


> ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=Journal #3.doc 

_____ 



76





Cc: jleblanc@temvalley.com 


From the desk of J. Leblanc 

First of all, if they one can tell me how to excess the class articles 

assigned I'd appreciate some idiot-proof directions on how to download them. 

I was reading Sagan's The Demon Haunted World (sorry, I can't seem to 

underline)and was rather shocked as to some of the references made in the book 

concerning the lack of interest science seems to generate among the academic 

world. It easy interesting to note how civilizations have crumbled to do the 

ignorance of not stressing the important of science in their country. I can 

think of several examples in which science was the determing factor. For 

example, most wars have been won due to advanced weaponry. Troy was lost 

because of a mechanical horse. Many of the third world countries won't be 

third world countries if they employed technology with the resources available 

within their land. 

I hope that I can continue to keep the spark alive by ensuring science is 

implement within my classroom. 

77






Click on "schedule". You should see a excel-like table. The articles are in blue. You just need to click 

on them (they are links). If you have dial-up, it may take awhile for them to appear, and printing takes 

a long time too, so you might just want to read them off the computer screen. Cynthia 

lebla003 wrote: 

From the desk of J. Leblanc 

First of all, if they one can tell me how to excess the class articles 

assigned I'd appreciate some idiot-proof directions on how to download them. 

I was reading Sagan's The Demon Haunted World (sorry, I can't seem to 

underline)and was rather shocked as to some of the references made in the book 

concerning the lack of interest science seems to generate among the academic 

world. It easy interesting to note how civilizations have crumbled to do the 

ignorance of not stressing the important of science in their country. I can 

think of several examples in which science was the determing factor. For 

example, most wars have been won due to advanced weaponry. Troy was lost 

because of a mechanical horse. Many of the third world countries won't be 

third world countries if they employed technology with the resources available 

within their land. 

I hope that I can continue to keep the spark alive by ensuring science is 

implement within my classroom. 

_____ 



78




To: journal 

Subject: journal 

I read the "Learning Cycles" article today. I think this is a great way to organize lesson activities. It 

seems like it would really help teachers focus on what it is they are trying to teach when they are 

planning lessons. It reminds me of the "Into, Through and Beyond" format. Into=Exploration, 

Through=Concept, and Beyond=Application. In other words, get the students interested and excited 

about the concept first, ensure they are getting the concept, and then have them apply it. It also 

seems to me that Prof. Karas is using this format in our 381 class. Last Wed., he got us interested by 

allowing us to explore with the motion sensor. This week will be the concept part, and next week the 

application. Just a thought, not sure if I am reading too much into it. 

Back to the learning cycle: I think it is very tempting for teachers to teach first, and let students 

explore later, if at all. While I was writing up my 3 science experiences, I realized the things I 

remember most are the things I DID in science, not what the teacher taught. I have no recollection at 

all of a teacher teaching me anything (as in a lecture), except in college, but then that is still very 

recent. This actually fits right in with my teaching philosophy anyway. I have always been a firm 

believer in having students DO things to learn, its just all a little clearer to me today. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



79




To: listserve 

Subject: Fwd: [Fwd: Children's Logic !!] 

Attachments: [Fwd: Children's Logic !!] 

[Fwd: Children's 

Logic !!] 

Note: forwarded message attached. 

__________________________________ 




80





Subject: Re: robert 

all i can say is that i am not kent hovind, so i cannot say what logic or truth he uses. 

i have heard his messages and seen him enough to know that he does back everything up, i 

just can't remember it all. the point is, it doesnt matter who he is, what he says, how 

he backs things up...what matters is that i have faith in what i believe in. some things 

are unexplainable, some things have no sensory evidence but none of that makes a 

difference to me. ive made the choice to put my faith in the Bible and every word of it. 

i never meant to offend you or anyone else, so i apologize if i have. when i said to 

marin that you can only believe in evolution or God, you cannot believe in both...i didnt 

word that correctly. what i meant was that you can only believe in one: evolution or the 

Bible. 

a person could believe in God and not the Bible, 

a person could believe in God and evolution, 

but a person cannot believe in the Word of God and evolution as they contradict each 

other. 

so on that note, im going to gracefully bow out of disputing evolution vs. creation as it 

was never my intention to persuade any of you. it was, however, my intention to challenge 

you to consider the idea of God/Creation/Jesus/etc...it's up to you as individuals to take 

it further or ignore it. 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/01 Sun AM 12:30:45 PST 


> Subject: RE: Answer 

> 

> what logic or truth does Kent Hovind use to back up all of these theories of 

> his. 

> he has also made comments such as.... 

> "If Evolution is true, there is no Creator, so laws come from mans opinion. 

> That is called a democracy, which is a terrible form of government. 

> Democracies always degenerate into dictatorships. In America, it is sad to 

> say, has become a democracy." Source: Hovind 1999 Seminar Transcript 1b from 

> http://216.248.142.66/SeminarOnline/Text/Transcript1.shtm 

> 

> "What do HIV, West Nile Fever, Gulf war syndrome, chronic fatigue syndrome, 

> multiple sclerosis, Wegener's disease, Parkinson's disease, Crohn's colitis, 

> Type I diabetes, and collagen-vascular diseases such as rheumatoid arthritis 

> and Alzheimer's have in common? These plagues were all developed as a joint 

> effort by the money masters and governments of the world under the guise of 

> biowarfare research." 

> Source: http://www.drdino.com/cse.asp?pg=articles&specific=53 [May 2003] 

> 

> New World Order, coming to a city near you. They are starting next month in 

> South America, putting microchips in people. That's the plan. America is 

> slated for this fall. Put microchips in the palm of the right hand. 

> Source: http://www.cbbc.net/RS/ 6 Jan 2002 Session #3 @ 24:00 

> 

> To be honest the guy kinda sounds like a conspiracy freak. He definently 

> does not like America, science, government, man driven thought or a bunch of 

> other things that many of us value. 

> I'm not saying that he doesn't have the right to a point of view, just that 

> his point of view has no basis in substatiated claims. 

> 

> If you want to read more criticism's about this man go to (some of it is 

> pretty funny): 

81


> http://home.austarnet.com.au/stear/bartelt_dissertation_on_hovind_thesis.htm 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> Find high-speed ‘net deals — comparison-shop your local providers here. 

> https://broadband.msn.com 

> 

> 


82





Subject: journal numero dos 

I know that a few of us where wondering what happens to the energy in us once 

we are dead. After much pondering I figure that after we die we become part of 

the a food chain, we bocome pontential food sources for other organisms, and 

as a result there is little matter and energy wasted in natural ecosystems. I 

remember studying about trophic levels in my biology class. Trophic levels are 

feeding levels that are assign to organismsm in an ecosystem, the levels are 

assigned depending on whether the organism is a consumer or a producer or what 

it eats or decomposes. In each trophic level there is contains a certain level 

of biomass(the dry weight of all organic matter contained in organisms), thus 

energy that is stored in a biomass is transferred to one trophic level to 

another. Every time there is a transfer of energy from one trophic level to 

another usable energy is degraded and lost to the environment as low-quality 

heat. It is unbelievable how much energy is lost from one trophic level to the 

next there is usually a 80-95% loss of energy within each transfer. 

this are just my thoughts about the issue of life after death or should I say 

my hypothesis. 

chao, 

Karla 

83





Subject: Re: journal numero dos 

Does this hold true if we get cremated? I guess some organism might eat ash, but then, maybe it just 

nourishes other organisms in order to keep it all going. 

Cynthia 

Karla Garduno wrote: 

I know that a few of us where wondering what happens to the energy in us once 

we are dead. After much pondering I figure that after we die we become part of 

the a food chain, we bocome pontential food sources for other organisms, and 

as a result there is little matter and energy wasted in natural ecosystems. I 

remember studying about trophic levels in my biology class. Trophic levels are 

feeding levels that are assign to organismsm in an ecosystem, the levels are 

assigned depending on whether the organism is a consumer or a producer or what 

it eats or decomposes. In each trophic level there is contains a certain level 

of biomass(the dry weight of all organic matter contained in organisms), thus 

energy that is stored in a biomass is transferred to one trophic level to 

another. Every time there is a transfer of energy from one trophic lev! el to 

another usable energy is degraded and lost to the environment as low-quality 

heat. It is unbelievable how much energy is lost from one trophic level to the 

next there is usually a 80-95% loss of energy within each transfer. 

this are just my thoughts about the issue of life after death or should I say 


chao, 

Karla 

_____ 



84





Subject: RE: journal 

I really liked your "Into, Through and Beyond" analogy for the "Exploration, Concept and Application." I too, thought it 

would be hard to teach exploration first and then concept and then application, but it makes sense, especially with 

science. Allow the students to explore which then engages them into the subject. I remember in middle school finding 

history incredibly boring simply because it was taught through lecture and reading of text books. Then our teacher got a 

"wild hair" and decided to have us form groups and make a diorama of the Tudors (a period of time in English history). To 

this day (almost 30 years later) I can still remember lots of facts and nuances about the Tudors and it also got me 

interested in history. 

~ Louise 

-----Original Message----- 

From: Cynthia Reyes [mailto:mrstkdsd@yahoo.com] 


To: journal 


I read the "Learning Cycles" article today. I think this is a great way to organize lesson activities. It 

seems like it would really help teachers focus on what it is they are trying to teach when they are 

planning lessons. It reminds me of the "Into, Through and Beyond" format. Into=Exploration, 

Through=Concept, and Beyond=Application. In other words, get the students interested and 

excited about the concept first, ensure they are getting the concept, and then have them apply it. It 

also seems to me that Prof. Karas is using this format in our 381 class. Last Wed., he got us 

interested by allowing us to explore with the motion sensor. This week will be the concept part, 

and next week the application. Just a thought, not sure if I am reading too much into it. 

Back to the learning cycle: I think it is very tempting for teachers to teach first, and let students 

explore later, if at all. While I was writing up my 3 science experiences, I realized the things I 

remember most are the things I DID in science, not what the teacher taught. I have no recollection 

at all of a teacher teaching me anything (as in a lecture), except in college, but then that is still 

very recent. This actually fits right in with my teaching philosophy anyway. I have always been a 

firm believer in having students DO things to learn, its just all a little clearer to me today. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



85





Subject: RE: journal numero dos 

I think that you're right. I believe that our bodies decompose and 

become nutrients for other organisms. I'm not sure what happens to our 

souls though. Do they go to heaven or hell, depending on how "good" 

they've been here on Earth or in this dimension? That was more of a 

rhetorical question, but feel free to answer it if you have a theory or 

even an answer! 

~ Louise 


From: Karla Garduno [mailto:gardu001@csusm.edu] 




I know that a few of us where wondering what happens to the energy in us 

once 

we are dead. After much pondering I figure that after we die we become 

part of 

the a food chain, we bocome pontential food sources for other organisms, 

and 

as a result there is little matter and energy wasted in natural 

ecosystems. I 

remember studying about trophic levels in my biology class. Trophic 

levels are 

feeding levels that are assign to organismsm in an ecosystem, the levels 

are 

assigned depending on whether the organism is a consumer or a producer 

or what 

it eats or decomposes. In each trophic level there is contains a certain 

level 

of biomass(the dry weight of all organic matter contained in organisms), 

thus 

energy that is stored in a biomass is transferred to one trophic level 

to 

another. Every time there is a transfer of energy from one trophic level 

to 

another usable energy is degraded and lost to the environment as 

low-quality 

heat. It is unbelievable how much energy is lost from one trophic level 

to the 

next there is usually a 80-95% loss of energy within each transfer. this 

are just my thoughts about the issue of life after death or should I say 


chao, 

Karla 

86





Subject: RE: journal 2- casey cunningham 

I agree with you Casey. I was appalled at how little time is spent on teaching science and how little hands on exploring 

the students get to do. Unfortunately, one of the things I've found among many veteran teachers (although not all), is that 

they have a philosophy of "this is how I learned it, there's nothing wrong with it, so I'm going to teach my students the 

same way." This also goes for other subject matters i.e. math and rote memorization. I think it is so important for 

teachers to learn new ways of teaching and to keep up with technology. I also agree with yours and Ann's comment 

about all children should be taught from an educator that believes that each and every student has the potential to go to 

college. The choice of whether to go or not should be the students (or their family). 

When doing my field practicum, a few of the teachers would comment on specific students and how they'd be lucky to 

graduate from high school (these were 3rd graders being discussed). I felt terrible that the teachers were practically 

giving up on these students now and they're only 8 and 9 years old! Although I knew that these students had learning 

challenges, it never crossed my mind that they would graduate high school. I hope to instill in my students that they have 

as much ability as the next person to graduate high school and college. 

Nuff said ~ Louise 


From: Ann Kirkendall [mailto:zestydu69@yahoo.com] 








minutes a day studying science. In the past I probably would have said who cares but this is 

sad. This is why people get to college and the majority of them say I hate science. We would 

probably hate reading and writing too if we only spent 20 minutes on it a day. We would hate it 

because we would not know how to approach it properly and I believe that this is the case with 

many when it comes to science. 


elementary (4-6) science instruction involves lecture and discussion teaching methods. This is 

sad especially in the lower grades because a 2nd grader will not get anything out of hearing a 

lecture about bugs but when you actually bring in those bugs...boy do those kids learn. It gets 

them excited about learning...Hands one experiences are crucial, in my opinion in order to get 

students interested and excited about learning. 


would pair new teachers with veteran teachers to help them a long but this veteran teacher in 

my opinion was horrible. Did any one else agree. I understand that it is a poverty school but to 

say not to really bother with them because they won't go to college anyway really upsets me. 

We are not to judge who can go to college or not. We should be encouraging them as teachers 

to strive for the best and try their hardest. So having a veteran teacher tell a new teacher not to 

87

_____ 

bother with group hands on experiences in science can only bring that new teacher down. That 

is taking everything that we have learned in our preparation to become teachers and flushing it 

down the toilet. So that got me going a little bit..can you tell? That is why I decided to write 

about it...I would like to hear what you guys think...Am I reading it wrong or is that what y! ou 

guys got out of it too? Have a good weekend! 








88





Subject: RE: more euglena 

Very cool! Thank you. 

~ Louise 






http://mtlab.biol.tsukuba.ac.jp/WWW/PDB/Images/Mastigophora/Euglena/ 

This link has pictures of real euglena and you can enlarge them x16, very cool!!! 

Cynthia 

_____ 



89






Hi class, 

I have really enjoyed the reading the Sagan book. It 

has me opening my eyes to science again. As a child I 

remember the wonder I had for science. I remember 

getting science magazines in school (Does anyone else 

remember these?), which displayed articles on gadgets 

that scientists are working on for the future. I am 

still waiting for the helicopter car that flies over 

traffic. I couldn’t wait to open the pages of this 

magazine and see what great inventions science would 

come up with next. I was in awe of science, I wanted 

to know and gain knowledge about science. I have been 

far removed from that awe. When I look at science now 

I see destruction, Sagan says, “Our technology has 

produced thalidomide, CFCs, Agent Orange, nerve gas, 

pollution of air and water, species extinctions, and 

industries so powerful they can ruin the climate of 

the planet” (pg. 11). Science has become the cause of 

many problems in this world. In media we hear of 

these problems all the time. It is hard not to wonder 

what this world would be like without the destruction 

of science. I wonder what a world like that would 

look like? Why should I like science? As a religious 

person I have been led to believe by other religious 

people that science at times is the enemy. Science is 

cast in a very negative light in our society 

(especially religious societies). I am told so many 

times that science is bad that I allow that negativism 

in an allow myself to believe the same. As a future 

teacher this is a horrible, close-minded way about 

thinking about science (or anything). How will I 

teach truth about science when my heart is filled with 

hatred for it? 

This book is helping me realize that I need to be 

more open-minded about science. I was struck by this 

quote, “It is morally as bad not to care whether a 

thing is true or not, so long as it makes you feel 

good, as it is not to care how you got your money as 

long as you got it” (pg. 12). It feels good to talk 

and discuss matters of truth with people who have 

similar beliefs. It is easy to come up with similar 

conclusions. But, truth is not fully achieved. It is 

morally wrong for me to sit back and say science is 

bad and wrong when I don’t challenge my own beliefs on 

truth. It is also wrong for me as a teacher to be 

close-minded about something I am going to teach. How 

ineffective would that be? I would never want to ruin 

the wonder kids have for science. The wonder I wish I 

still had. 

Joey 

__________________________________ 



90


91


From: Jennifer Ramos [ramos_jenn@hotmail.com] 




As I think about what to write about in this journal entry, I am unsure in 

what direction I want to take. I can choose to address the assigned 

readings, class dicsussions, or topics addressed in my fellow classmates' 

journal entries, but I am interested in exploring another thought. That is, 

why LBST 361, Science and Society, is a required course for my 

major/program. Why is it that I must learn about the connection between the 

two? Just how will taking this class make a difference in my education? How 

will it assist in furthering my education, knowledge, and ability to become 

a teacher? What will I be able to take from this course and apply to real 

life situations? How will it affect me as a person within a society? In 

hopes of finding an answer to my many questions, I decide to take a look at 

the course description for this class (located on the CSUSM website - 

courtesy of the General Catalog 2002-2004.) The course description for LBST 

361B states: 

LBST 361B (3) 

The Social Construction of Science 

Explores the field of social construction of science, an interdisciplinary 

area of investigation, built from existing perspectives in the social 

sciences (predominantly sociology, but also anthropology, 

social-linguistics, history, and philosophy). Introduces students to the 

basic theoretical concepts required for understanding the social situation 

of science and its contributions to the social world. Introduces students to 

the analysis of science as a social phenomenon, its internal and external 

constructions, and its practices. It will also show the ideas in science are 

reflected in the development of social policy. The application of the basic 

tools and key concepts in the course will be accomplished through a focused 

exercise that explores one specific area of science such as information 

technologies. Corequisites: EDMS 545B and ID 381. Prerequisite: Consent of 

Department Chair. 

After reading and re-reading the description several times, I think I have 

worked out some possible answers to my posed questions. I think that in 

order to teach science (when I become a teacher,) I must understand the 

social situation of science in order to teach it students who are members of 

the society. Students are part of society. To understand science and its 

contributions to the world, I must know and understand my role within 

society. There is a connection between the two and this can be viewed 

through the social phenomenon and the constructions and practices of 

science. 

I think that what a person believes in, regarding any subject, will come 

into play when that subject is taught to students. Although this should not 

be the case, and personal views should be swept aside when trying to teach 

impartially, I think that it does happen. I hope that by taking this course, 

it will be a positive in my educational experience. I want to explore and 

find understading in the connection between science and society. I am 

confident that what I learn, ponder, and explore will assist in furthering 

my education, knowledge, and the ability in becoming a teacher. I guess I'm 

just eager to find out how it will affect me as a person within society. 

I think that science can be viewed all around us. I've never really ever 

made the conscious attempt at exploring the connection between science and 

society until taking this class. I can only hope that this course will help 

me in seeing the connection between it all a bit more clearly. 

92

Thanks for taking the time to read my brainstorm session. At least for my 

own good, I needed to get some of my thoughts down. 

~Jennifer Ramos 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Check out the coupons and bargains on MSN Offers! 

http://shopping.msn.com/softcontent/softcontent.aspx?scmId=1418 

93



Sent: Monday, February 02, 2004 9:10 AM 

To: ICP-F 

Subject: journal 2 sorry i wanted to space out the paragrapghs 

After reading what people had to say in your journal it got me thinking about 

myself and what I belive about science and religion. I am torn between some of 

your ideas that you presented in your journal. But I do belive that science 

has caused a lot of problems over the years with harmful inventions like 

produced thalidomide, CFCs, Agent Orange, nerve gas,pollution of air and 

water, species extinctions, and industries so powerful they can ruin the 

climate ofthe planet” (pg. 11). Now on the other hand we need to remeber all 

the good things that science had done for us over our lives like great 

enventions cars, electricty, phone ect. 

I personally am not that religious but I do belive in god and so on so maybe I 

dont really understand where you guys are coming from when you say that 

teaching science is going to be hard for you because of your religion. I think 

that you should not change the way of your teaching because you feel that it 

is wrong due to your religious back ground. The children in the schools need 

to learn science and then maybe after they will be able to decide their 

actions on it and not what you think about it. 

The Sagan book I think will help open the eyes of some religious stduents in 

our class and show them that they need to be more open minded about science. I 

hope that this book will help those challenge their belives and make sure that 

they are making decision about their ideas of science. 

94





Subject: Breaking all bonds of continuity, logic, and canon...here is journal #2 

There are those who would say that this journal was due last wednesday. 

Still others that say I should be working, and not doing my schoolwork from 

the office. To those, I offer a heartfelt "p'shaw." 

The reason for my uncharacteristic "doing" of "something" comes after my 

uncharacteristic "reading" of a "book" that isn't "Lord" of the "Rings." I 

read the section in Sagan's book about pseudoscience and I absolutely 

friggin' loved it. Reading it, I felt for literally the first time, that a 

college textbook could be enjoyable and worth reading. After the 

psuedoscience chapter I began to read ahead into the aliens chapter, then I 

came to my senses and realized I shouldn't shoot my studious wad all in one 

night. 

I'm not entirely sure how I would define a "wow" moment yet, but I had 

plenty of "Oh, cool" moments while reading. I love learning useless little 

factoids, and this chapter was full of them. The canals that everyone saw on 

mars that weren't even really there? Cool! Pointing out how different 

cultures see different things in the markings on the moon was also extremely 

interesting, and very relevent given the general mindset of our class. That 

mindset being "I am right because this is what I believe." Granted I haven't 

read many of your journals (and as an aside, why the hell are you reading 

mine? Get a life) but from what I have read, I haven't seen many people who 

were open to interpretations of things that they see only in black and white 

(God and science in this case). The only person I saw mix the two was 

Robert, and I was fairly sure he was just playing Devil's Advocate (a movie 

in which I believe you see Charlzie Theron's boobs, if anyone is 

interested). Crap, I am out of time. I will keep reading Sagan's book, and 

commenting on what he writes. As for the others, I'll give them a shot, but 

I have a feeling I'll be sitting out of those conversations. I'll see you 

all in 30 minutes. Not that I am a procrastinator or anything. As a wise 

man once said "Why put off til tomorrow, that which can be done the day 

after tomorrow?" 

-Mike Runnestrand 

_________________________________________________________________ 



95



Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 11:04 AM 



Do our souls need to go to Heven or Hell to make us be a good person or can't 

we just 

be a good person and be satisfied with dying and giving ourself to the earth 

for nutrience 

and that's the end. I would be glad to give my body to the earth in return for 

what a great 

life earth has given me. That in itself is satifactory enough for me. I know 

that I am a good 

person and I do not need the fear of hell or glory of heaven to encourage me 

to be good. 

Just be good for no reason at all. But that's just me. It's all in what makes 

you happy and 

fufilled. 

>===== Original Message From "Randy& Louise Tweed" ==== 

= 

>I think that you're right. I believe that our bodies decompose and 

>become nutrients for other organisms. I'm not sure what happens to our 

>souls though. Do they go to heaven or hell, depending on how "good" 

>they've been here on Earth or in this dimension? That was more of a 

>rhetorical question, but feel free to answer it if you have a theory or 

>even an answer! 

>~ Louise 

> 

>-----Original Message----- 

>From: Karla Garduno [mailto:gardu001@csusm.edu] 

>Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 8:33 PM 

>To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

>Subject: journal numero dos 

> 

> 

>I know that a few of us where wondering what happens to the energy in us 

>once 

>we are dead. After much pondering I figure that after we die we become 

>part of 

>the a food chain, we bocome pontential food sources for other organisms, 

>and 

>as a result there is little matter and energy wasted in natural 

>ecosystems. I 

>remember studying about trophic levels in my biology class. Trophic 

>levels are 

>feeding levels that are assign to organismsm in an ecosystem, the levels 

>are 

>assigned depending on whether the organism is a consumer or a producer 

>or what 

>it eats or decomposes. In each trophic level there is contains a certain 

>level 

>of biomass(the dry weight of all organic matter contained in organisms), 

>thus 

>energy that is stored in a biomass is transferred to one trophic level 

>to 

>another. Every time there is a transfer of energy from one trophic level 

96

to 

>another usable energy is degraded and lost to the environment as 

>low-quality 

>heat. It is unbelievable how much energy is lost from one trophic level 

>to the 

>next there is usually a 80-95% loss of energy within each transfer. this 

>are just my thoughts about the issue of life after death or should I say 

> 

>my hypothesis. 

>chao, 

>Karla 

97






Are souls for real, or are they like the table? 

Cynthia 


Do our souls need to go to Heven or Hell to make us be a good person or can't 

we just 

be a good person and be satisfied with dying and giving ourself to the earth 

for nutrience 

and that's the end. I would be glad to give my body to the earth in return for 

what a great 

life earth has given me. That in itself is satifactory enough for me. I know 

that I am a good 

person and I do not need the fear of hell or glory of heaven to encourage me 

to be good. 

Just be good for no reason at all. But that's just me. It's all in what makes 

you happy and 

fufilled. 

>===== Original Message From "Randy& Louise Tweed" ==== 

= 

>I think that you're right. I believe that our bodies decompose and 

>become nutrients for other organisms. I'm not sure what happens to our 

>souls though. D! o they go to heaven or hell, depending on how "good" 

>they've been here on Earth or in this dimension? That was more of a 

>rhetorical question, but feel free to answer it if you have a theory or 

>even an answer! 

>~ Louise 

> 


>From: Karla Garduno [mailto:gardu001@csusm.edu] 



>Subject: journal numero dos 

> 

> 

>I know that a few of us where wondering what happens to the energy in us 

>once 

>we are dead. After much pondering I figure that after we die we become 

>part of 

>the a food chain, we bocome pontential food sources for other organisms, 

98

and 

>as a result there is little matter and energy wasted in natural 

>ecosystems. I 

>remember studying about trophic levels in my biology class. Trophic 

>levels are 

>feeding levels that are assign to organismsm in an ecosystem, ! the levels 

>are 

>assigned depending on whether the organism is a consumer or a producer 

>or what 

>it eats or decomposes. In each trophic level there is contains a certain 

>level 

>of biomass(the dry weight of all organic matter contained in organisms), 

>thus 

>energy that is stored in a biomass is transferred to one trophic level 

>to 

>another. Every time there is a transfer of energy from one trophic level 

>to 

>another usable energy is degraded and lost to the environment as 

>low-quality 

>heat. It is unbelievable how much energy is lost from one trophic level 

>to the 

>next there is usually a 80-95% loss of energy within each transfer. this 

>are just my thoughts about the issue of life after death or should I say 

> 

>my hypothesis. 

>chao, 

>Karla 

_____ 



99



Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 2:05 PM 


Subject: RE: Marin's journal numero dos 

Marin, 

You are being good for a reason. The reason being that it makes you feel 

fulfilled and happy. Also, with today's developments in caskets, many people 

are not giving the body back to the earth. In fact the preservation of the 

body for the unknown coming has been a tradition for thousands of years. It 

is possible by the time we die our bodies will be able to be preserved in 

chambers for thousands of years to come. Thus, us humans will continue to 

strip the earth of everything it has, nevering giving back to the cycle of 

life. 

>From: tinne002 



>Subject: RE: journal numero dos 

>Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:03:44 -0800 

> 

>Do our souls need to go to Heven or Hell to make us be a good person or 

>can't 

>we just 

>be a good person and be satisfied with dying and giving ourself to the 

>earth 

>for nutrience 

>and that's the end. I would be glad to give my body to the earth in return 

>for 

>what a great 

>life earth has given me. That in itself is satifactory enough for me. I 

>know 

>that I am a good 

>person and I do not need the fear of hell or glory of heaven to encourage 

>me 

>to be good. 

>Just be good for no reason at all. But that's just me. It's all in what 

>makes 

>you happy and 

>fufilled. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >===== Original Message From "Randy& Louise Tweed" 

>==== 

>= 

> >I think that you're right. I believe that our bodies decompose and 

> >become nutrients for other organisms. I'm not sure what happens to our 

> >souls though. Do they go to heaven or hell, depending on how "good" 

> >they've been here on Earth or in this dimension? That was more of a 

> >rhetorical question, but feel free to answer it if you have a theory or 

> >even an answer! 

> >~ Louise 

> > 

> >-----Original Message----- 

> >From: Karla Garduno [mailto:gardu001@csusm.edu] 

> >Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 8:33 PM 

> >To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

100


> > 

> > 

> >I know that a few of us where wondering what happens to the energy in us 

> >once 

> >we are dead. After much pondering I figure that after we die we become 

> >part of 

> >the a food chain, we bocome pontential food sources for other organisms, 

> >and 

> >as a result there is little matter and energy wasted in natural 

> >ecosystems. I 

> >remember studying about trophic levels in my biology class. Trophic 

> >levels are 

> >feeding levels that are assign to organismsm in an ecosystem, the levels 

> >are 

> >assigned depending on whether the organism is a consumer or a producer 

> >or what 

> >it eats or decomposes. In each trophic level there is contains a certain 

> >level 

> >of biomass(the dry weight of all organic matter contained in organisms), 

> >thus 

> >energy that is stored in a biomass is transferred to one trophic level 

> >to 

> >another. Every time there is a transfer of energy from one trophic level 

> >to 

> >another usable energy is degraded and lost to the environment as 

> >low-quality 

> >heat. It is unbelievable how much energy is lost from one trophic level 

> >to the 

> >next there is usually a 80-95% loss of energy within each transfer. this 

> >are just my thoughts about the issue of life after death or should I say 

> > 

> >my hypothesis. 

> >chao, 

> >Karla 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



101






Hm....I think the earth will soon be cluttered with selfish, dead individuals. For the sake of the earth, 

and our children, I say we all sign a pact to either be cremated or be buried in simple pine boxes that 

will quickly rot and nourish the earth. 

Cynthia 


Marin, 








life. 

>From: tinne002 




>Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:03:44 -0800 

> 


>can't 

>we just 

>be ! a good person and be satisfied with dying and giving ourself to the 

>earth 



>for 

>what a great 


>know 



>me 

>to be good. 


>makes 


>fufilled. 

> 

> 

102

> 

> 

> >===== Original Message From "Randy& Louise Tweed" 

>==== 

>= 




> >they've been here! on Earth or in this dimension? That was more of a 



> >~ Louise 

> > 





> >Subject: journal numero dos 

> > 

> > 


> >once 


> >part of 


> >and 




> >levels are 

> >feeding levels that are assig! n to organismsm in an ecosystem, the levels 

> >are 


> >or what 


> >level 


> >thus 


> >to 


> >to 




> >to the 


> >are just my thoughts about the issue of life after death or should I say 

> > 


> >chao, 

> >Karla 

103

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



104






jCynthia 

Where do I sign? It is too much to want to take up space both dead and 

alive! 

>From: Cynthia Reyes 



>Subject: RE: Marin's journal numero dos 

>Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:11:23 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>Hm....I think the earth will soon be cluttered with selfish, dead 

>individuals. For the sake of the earth, and our children, I say we all sign 

>a pact to either be cremated or be buried in simple pine boxes that will 

>quickly rot and nourish the earth. 

>Cynthia 

> 

>Robert Atchison wrote: 

>Marin, 

>You are being good for a reason. The reason being that it makes you feel 

>fulfilled and happy. Also, with today's developments in caskets, many 

>people 

>are not giving the body back to the earth. In fact the preservation of the 

>body for the unknown coming has been a tradition for thousands of years. It 

>is possible by the time we die our bodies will be able to be preserved in 

>chambers for thousands of years to come. Thus, us humans will continue to 

>strip the earth of everything it has, nevering giving back to the cycle of 

>life. 

> 

> 

> >From: tinne002 

> >Reply-To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 


> >Subject: RE: journal numero dos 

> >Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:03:44 -0800 

> > 

> >Do our souls need to go to Heven or Hell to make us be a good person or 

> >can't 

> >we just 

> >be a good person and be satisfied with dying and giving ourself to the 

> >earth 

> >for nutrience 

> >and that's the end. I would be glad to give my body to the earth in 

>return 

> >for 

> >what a great 

> >life earth has given me. That in itself is satifactory enough for me. I 

> >know 

> >that I am a good 

> >person and I do not need the fear of hell or glory of heaven to encourage 

> >me 

> >to be good. 

> >Just be good for no reason at all. But that's just me. It's all in what 

> >makes 

> >you happy and 

> >fufilled. 

105

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > >===== Original Message From "Randy& Louise Tweed" 

> >==== 

> >= 

> > >I think that you're right. I believe that our bodies decompose and 

> > >become nutrients for other organisms. I'm not sure what happens to our 

> > >souls though. Do they go to heaven or hell, depending on how "good" 

> > >they've been here on Earth or in this dimension? That was more of a 

> > >rhetorical question, but feel free to answer it if you have a theory or 

> > >even an answer! 

> > >~ Louise 

> > > 

> > >-----Original Message----- 

> > >From: Karla Garduno [mailto:gardu001@csusm.edu] 

> > >Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 8:33 PM 

> > >To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

> > >Subject: journal numero dos 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >I know that a few of us where wondering what happens to the energy in 

>us 

> > >once 

> > >we are dead. After much pondering I figure that after we die we become 

> > >part of 

> > >the a food chain, we bocome pontential food sources for other 

>organisms, 

> > >and 

> > >as a result there is little matter and energy wasted in natural 

> > >ecosystems. I 

> > >remember studying about trophic levels in my biology class. Trophic 

> > >levels are 

> > >feeding levels that are assign to organismsm in an ecosystem, the 

>levels 

> > >are 

> > >assigned depending on whether the organism is a consumer or a producer 

> > >or what 

> > >it eats or decomposes. In each trophic level there is contains a 

>certain 

> > >level 

> > >of biomass(the dry weight of all organic matter contained in 

>organisms), 

> > >thus 

> > >energy that is stored in a biomass is transferred to one trophic level 

> > >to 

> > >another. Every time there is a transfer of energy from one trophic 

>level 

> > >to 

> > >another usable energy is degraded and lost to the environment as 

> > >low-quality 

> > >heat. It is unbelievable how much energy is lost from one trophic level 

> > >to the 

> > >next there is usually a 80-95% loss of energy within each transfer. 

>this 

> > >are just my thoughts about the issue of life after death or should I 

>say 

> > > 

> > >my hypothesis. 

> > >chao, 

> > >Karla 

> > 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

106


>http://wine.msn.com/ 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

>Do you Yahoo!? 

>Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Scope out the new MSN Plus Internet Software — optimizes dial-up to the max! 

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107






Hey Guys, 

I should be doing my other homework, but no, for some reason I am reading these darn journals.... 

hee hee. Anyway, I say cremate us. With the way humankind is encroaching on the last bits of 

natural habitat like a swarm of locus, I say "burn me baby". Sell my valuable property with a lot size 

of 4' by 8' by 6' and go have a toast in remembrance of me..... 

Hasta la vista baby, 



Marin, 








life. 





>Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:03:44 -0800 

> 


>can't 

>we just 

>be ! a good person and be satisfied with dying and giving ourself to the 

>earth 



>for 

>what a great 


>know 



>me 

>to be good. 


108

makes 


>fufilled. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >===== Original Message From "Randy& Louise Tweed" 

>==== 

>= 




> >they've been here! on Earth or in this dimension? That was more of a 



> >~ Louise 

> > 





> >Subject: journal numero dos 

> > 

> > 


> >once 


> >part of 


> >and 




> >levels are 

> >feeding levels that are assig! n to organismsm in an ecosystem, the levels 

> >are 


> >or what 


> >level 


> >thus 


> >to 


> >to 




> >to the 


109

are just my thoughts about the issue of life after death or should I say 

> > 


> >chao, 

> >Karla 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



110





Subject: Cynthia Robert Ann 

Im all about being cremated and thrown in the ocean but I just had a better 

idea. We can 

feed our carcase to a vulture that way we won't take up space on the planet, 

and we will 

also help bring life to the vulture. I dunno. marin 

111





Subject: Re: Cynthia Robert Ann 

what if i were to butt into this conversation, as you all probably expected... and suggest 

that you worry less about your useless dead body and concern yourselves more with what 

happens next, if you think anything else could happen after death... 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 06:13:51 PST 


> Subject: Cynthia Robert Ann 

> 

> Im all about being cremated and thrown in the ocean but I just had a better 

> idea. We can 

> feed our carcase to a vulture that way we won't take up space on the planet, 

> and we will 

> also help bring life to the vulture. I dunno. marin 

> 

> 


112





Subject: Life 

Let's stop talking about death and be grateful that we are alive right now. 

Who care about 

yesterday today or tommorow go tell the person in the next room you love them 

and 

mean it. Be excited and live it up. I love ya all. MT 

113






one more thought... 

if you think death is really the end, 

if that's it... 

than what is the purpose of your life? 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 06:13:51 PST 



> 




> and we will 


> 

> 


114





I live to live not to die 

115





Subject: I live to love 

I live to love everyone. 

116






Well, I have no scientific proof, but I think my purpose in life is to be a teacher. 

Cynthia 

karisanne@adelphia.net wrote: 

one more thought... 

if you think death is really the end, 

if that's it... 

than what is the purpose of your life? 

> 

> From: tinne002 

> Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 06:13:51 PST 



> 




> and we will 


> 

> 


_____ 



117






I am not thinking about what happens next. And who is to say my dead body will be useless? We 

were talking about feeding the earth with it, rather than cluttering the earth with expensive coffins. For 

my part, this was a light-hearted topic of conversation. Not really in the mood to ponder anything I 

can't answer, lol. 

Cynthia 


what if i were to butt into this conversation, as you all probably expected... and suggest that you 

worry less about your useless dead body and concern yourselves more with what happens next, if 

you think anything else could happen after death... 

> 

> From: tinne002 

> Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 06:13:51 PST 



> 




> and we will 


> 

> 


_____ 



118





Subject: Re: Re: Cynthia Robert Ann 

cynthia, thats a good response. 

> 

> From: Cynthia Reyes 

> Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 07:40:49 PST 


> Subject: Re: Cynthia Robert Ann 

> 

> Well, I have no scientific proof, but I think my purpose in life is to be a teacher. 

> Cynthia 

> 

> karisanne@adelphia.net wrote: 

> one more thought... 

> if you think death is really the end, 

> if that's it... 

> than what is the purpose of your life? 

> > 

> > From: tinne002 

> > Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 06:13:51 PST 

> > To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

> > Subject: Cynthia Robert Ann 

> > 

> > Im all about being cremated and thrown in the ocean but I just had a better 

> > idea. We can 

> > feed our carcase to a vulture that way we won't take up space on the planet, 

> > and we will 

> > also help bring life to the vulture. I dunno. marin 

> > 

> > 

> 

> -karis kroeker- 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


119






Well, Marin, I guess we could nourish the vultures, but to tell you the truth, they aren't on the top of 

my list. I think my body can go to a golden eagle or some other beautiful bird. 

Cynthia 


Im all about being cremated and thrown in the ocean but I just had a better 

idea. We can 

feed our carcase to a vulture that way we won't take up space on the planet, 

and we will 

also help bring life to the vulture. I dunno. marin 

_____ 



120





Subject: The meaning of life. 

There is no inherent point to our lives. We are on this earth to reproduce, 

just like every other animal. To quote Gandalf (hopefully the first of many 

times) "All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to 

you." We are essentially a more complicated version of the mayfly. The 

mayfly is born, hopefully reproduces, and dies roughly 24 hours after its 

birth. What's the point of its life? Do mayflys go to heaven? If not, why? 

If humans are the only creatures worthy of God's eternal love, then why does 

the Mayfly exist? It doesn't influence our lives at all. Except for the fact 

that it gives a glimpse into the ultimate futility of existance. The highly 

evolved human mind has given itself purpose by creating complex societies. 

The promise of heaven, and the warning of hell, was just a way to keep 

peasants from realizing that their lives really didn't mean anything. If 

everyone felt that way, then who would harvest the king's crops? But if 

everyone keeps working and being good, then they will go to heaven. Pretty 

good incentive program. It really would have worked too, except for all the 

hypocrisy in all organized religions. "I don't have to follow ALL the rules, 

as long as I feel bad about breaking them." 

In short: The meaning of life is enjoy yourself and be good to one another, 

religion was invented to combat human nature which says "enjoy yourself and 

screw everyone else." Some people can combat this feeling without the threat 

of hell or the promise of heaven, but simply because it makes life better. 

I wish I could offer up a more well thought out and researched argument, but 

American Idol is starting. 

PS: Something is F'd up with the listserve, because i dont get all the 

emails. I get emails from cynthia that respons to emails that i never got. I 

dont get it, if any of the professors know anything about it, let me know. 

_________________________________________________________________ 


http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFindJobsIn2004.htm? 


121





Subject: Re: The meaning of life. 

Its a conspiracy Mike. And after this posting, you are definitely going to hell!!!! 

Cynthia 

PS see you there. 


There is no inherent point to our lives. We are on this earth to reproduce, 

just like every other animal. To quote Gandalf (hopefully the first of many 

times) "All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to 

you." We are essentially a more complicated version of the mayfly. The 

mayfly is born, hopefully reproduces, and dies roughly 24 hours after its 

birth. What's the point of its life? Do mayflys go to heaven? If not, why? 

If humans are the only creatures worthy of God's eternal love, then why does 

the Mayfly exist? It doesn't influence our lives at all. Except for the fact 

that it gives a glimpse into the ultimate futility of existance. The highly 

evolved human mind has given itself purpose by creating complex societies. 

The promise of heaven, and the warning of hell, was just a way to keep 

peasants from realiz! ing that their lives really didn't mean anything. If 

everyone felt that way, then who would harvest the king's crops? But if 

everyone keeps working and being good, then they will go to heaven. Pretty 

good incentive program. It really would have worked too, except for all the 

hypocrisy in all organized religions. "I don't have to follow ALL the rules, 

as long as I feel bad about breaking them." 

In short: The meaning of life is enjoy yourself and be good to one another, 

religion was invented to combat human nature which says "enjoy yourself and 

screw everyone else." Some people can combat this feeling without the threat 

of hell or the promise of heaven, but simply because it makes life better. 

I wish I could offer up a more well thought out and researched argument, but 

American Idol is starting. 

PS: Something is F'd up with the listserve, because i dont get all the 

emails. I get emails from cynthia that respons to emails tha! t i never got. I 

dont get it, if any of the professors know anything about it, let me know. 

_________________________________________________________________ 


http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFindJobsIn2004.htm 

?siteid=CBMSN3006&sc_extcmp=JS_wi08_dec03_hotmail1 

_____ 


122


123





Subject: Re: mike 

what's a mayfly? 

is it the same thing as a june bug? 

> 

> From: "Mike Runnestrand" 

> Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 07:56:27 PST 


> Subject: The meaning of life. 

> 

> There is no inherent point to our lives. We are on this earth to reproduce, 

> just like every other animal. To quote Gandalf (hopefully the first of many 

> times) "All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to 

> you." We are essentially a more complicated version of the mayfly. The 

> mayfly is born, hopefully reproduces, and dies roughly 24 hours after its 

> birth. What's the point of its life? Do mayflys go to heaven? If not, why? 

> If humans are the only creatures worthy of God's eternal love, then why does 

> the Mayfly exist? It doesn't influence our lives at all. Except for the fact 

> that it gives a glimpse into the ultimate futility of existance. The highly 

> evolved human mind has given itself purpose by creating complex societies. 

> The promise of heaven, and the warning of hell, was just a way to keep 

> peasants from realizing that their lives really didn't mean anything. If 

> everyone felt that way, then who would harvest the king's crops? But if 

> everyone keeps working and being good, then they will go to heaven. Pretty 

> good incentive program. It really would have worked too, except for all the 

> hypocrisy in all organized religions. "I don't have to follow ALL the rules, 

> as long as I feel bad about breaking them." 

> 

> In short: The meaning of life is enjoy yourself and be good to one another, 

> religion was invented to combat human nature which says "enjoy yourself and 

> screw everyone else." Some people can combat this feeling without the threat 

> of hell or the promise of heaven, but simply because it makes life better. 

> 

> I wish I could offer up a more well thought out and researched argument, but 

> American Idol is starting. 

> 

> PS: Something is F'd up with the listserve, because i dont get all the 

> emails. I get emails from cynthia that respons to emails that i never got. I 

> dont get it, if any of the professors know anything about it, let me know. 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> What are the 5 hot job markets for 2004? Click here to find out. 

> http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFindJobsIn2004.htm? 


> 

> 


124






No, its like a fly, but more mayish. Or like a may, but more flyish. 

More importantly, all the girlies say I'm pretty fly for a mayfly. 

>From: 


>To: 

>Subject: Re: mike 

>Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:17:49 -0800 

> 

>what's a mayfly? 

>is it the same thing as a june bug? 

> > 

> > From: "Mike Runnestrand" 

> > Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 07:56:27 PST 


> > Subject: The meaning of life. 

> > 

> > There is no inherent point to our lives. We are on this earth to 

>reproduce, 

> > just like every other animal. To quote Gandalf (hopefully the first of 

>many 

> > times) "All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given 

>to 

> > you." We are essentially a more complicated version of the mayfly. The 

> > mayfly is born, hopefully reproduces, and dies roughly 24 hours after 

>its 

> > birth. What's the point of its life? Do mayflys go to heaven? If not, 

>why? 

> > If humans are the only creatures worthy of God's eternal love, then why 

>does 

> > the Mayfly exist? It doesn't influence our lives at all. Except for the 

>fact 

> > that it gives a glimpse into the ultimate futility of existance. The 

>highly 

> > evolved human mind has given itself purpose by creating complex 

>societies. 

> > The promise of heaven, and the warning of hell, was just a way to keep 

> > peasants from realizing that their lives really didn't mean anything. If 

> > everyone felt that way, then who would harvest the king's crops? But if 

> > everyone keeps working and being good, then they will go to heaven. 

>Pretty 

> > good incentive program. It really would have worked too, except for all 

>the 

> > hypocrisy in all organized religions. "I don't have to follow ALL the 

>rules, 

> > as long as I feel bad about breaking them." 

> > 

> > In short: The meaning of life is enjoy yourself and be good to one 

>another, 

> > religion was invented to combat human nature which says "enjoy yourself 

>and 

> > screw everyone else." Some people can combat this feeling without the 

>threat 

> > of hell or the promise of heaven, but simply because it makes life 

125

etter. 

> > 

> > I wish I could offer up a more well thought out and researched argument, 

>but 

> > American Idol is starting. 

> > 

> > PS: Something is F'd up with the listserve, because i dont get all the 

> > emails. I get emails from cynthia that respons to emails that i never 

>got. I 

> > dont get it, if any of the professors know anything about it, let me 

>know. 

> > 

> > _________________________________________________________________ 

> > What are the 5 hot job markets for 2004? Click here to find out. 

> > 

>http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFindJobsIn2004.htm? 


> > 

> > 

> 

>-karis kroeker- 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



126






http://www.uky.edu/Agriculture/CritterFiles/casefile/insects/mayflies/mayflies.htm 


No, its like a fly, but more mayish. Or like a may, but more flyish. 

More importantly, all the girlies say I'm pretty fly for a mayfly. 

>From: 


>To: 


>Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:17:49 -0800 

> 

>what's a mayfly? 

>is it the same thing as a june bug? 

> > 

> > From: "Mike Runnestrand" 

> > Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 07:56:27 PST 


> > Subject: The meaning of life. 

> > 

> > There is no inherent point to our lives. We are on this earth to 

>reproduce, 

> > just like every other animal. To quote Gandalf (hopefully the first of 

>many 

> > times) "All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is! given 

>to 

> > you." We are essentially a more complicated version of the mayfly. The 

> > mayfly is born, hopefully reproduces, and dies roughly 24 hours after 

>its 

> > birth. What's the point of its life? Do mayflys go to heaven? If not, 

>why? 

> > If humans are the only creatures worthy of God's eternal love, then why 

>does 

> > the Mayfly exist? It doesn't influence our lives at all. Except for the 

>fact 

> > that it gives a glimpse into the ultimate futility of existance. The 

>highly 

> > evolved human mind has given itself purpose by creating complex 

>societies. 

> > The promise of heaven, and the warning of hell, was just a way to keep 

127

peasants from realizing that their lives really didn't mean anything. If 

> > everyone felt that way, then who would harvest the king's crops? But if 

> > everyone keeps working and being good, then t! hey will go to heaven. 

>Pretty 

> > good incentive program. It really would have worked too, except for all 

>the 

> > hypocrisy in all organized religions. "I don't have to follow ALL the 

>rules, 

> > as long as I feel bad about breaking them." 

> > 

> > In short: The meaning of life is enjoy yourself and be good to one 

>another, 

> > religion was invented to combat human nature which says "enjoy yourself 

>and 

> > screw everyone else." Some people can combat this feeling without the 

>threat 

> > of hell or the promise of heaven, but simply because it makes life 

>better. 

> > 

> > I wish I could offer up a more well thought out and researched argument, 

>but 

> > American Idol is starting. 

> > 

> > PS: Something is F'd up with the listserve, because i dont get all the 

> > emails. I get emails from cynthia that respon! s to emails that i never 

>got. I 

> > dont get it, if any of the professors know anything about it, let me 

>know. 

> > 

> > _________________________________________________________________ 

> > What are the 5 hot job markets for 2004? Click here to find out. 

> > 

>http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFindJobsIn2004.ht 

m?siteid=CBMSN3006&sc_extcmp=JS_wi08_dec03_hotmail1 

> > 

> > 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



128





Subject: Re: Life 

I love you guys....... http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/07.gif Ann 


Let's stop talking about death and be grateful that we are alive right now. 

Who care about 

yesterday today or tommorow go tell the person in the next room you love them 

and 

mean it. Be excited and live it up. I love ya all. MT 

_____ 



129






As they say, "Everyone dies, but not everyone really lives." To enjoy your life in whatever way you 

deem necessary is up to you naturally. Free will, remember. The question is how many people did 

you wrong in your pursuit of happiness? As the discussion went the other day, take time to notice the 

world around you. The world that most of us are trying to hurry through to achieve the next level. 

Sometimes we just have to take a step back from everything and enjoy the present without worrying 

about the past or the future because afterall we are all fragile creatures whom are not invinsible and 

our day maybe now or in fifty years so like Marin said remember to tell the people that you care about 

that you love them everyday and live not with regret. 

Jenny Fiala 

130





Subject: Re: Re: mike 

thanks for clearing that up mike. 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 09:43:24 PST 


> Subject: Re: mike 

> 

> No, its like a fly, but more mayish. Or like a may, but more flyish. 

> 

> More importantly, all the girlies say I'm pretty fly for a mayfly. 

> 

> 

> >From: 


> >To: 

> >Subject: Re: mike 

> >Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:17:49 -0800 

> > 

> >what's a mayfly? 

> >is it the same thing as a june bug? 

> > > 

> > > From: "Mike Runnestrand" 

> > > Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 07:56:27 PST 

> > > To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

> > > Subject: The meaning of life. 

> > > 

> > > There is no inherent point to our lives. We are on this earth to 

> >reproduce, 

> > > just like every other animal. To quote Gandalf (hopefully the first of 

> >many 

> > > times) "All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given 

> >to 

> > > you." We are essentially a more complicated version of the mayfly. The 

> > > mayfly is born, hopefully reproduces, and dies roughly 24 hours after 

> >its 

> > > birth. What's the point of its life? Do mayflys go to heaven? If not, 

> >why? 

> > > If humans are the only creatures worthy of God's eternal love, then why 

> >does 

> > > the Mayfly exist? It doesn't influence our lives at all. Except for the 

> >fact 

> > > that it gives a glimpse into the ultimate futility of existance. The 

> >highly 

> > > evolved human mind has given itself purpose by creating complex 

> >societies. 

> > > The promise of heaven, and the warning of hell, was just a way to keep 

> > > peasants from realizing that their lives really didn't mean anything. If 

> > > everyone felt that way, then who would harvest the king's crops? But if 

> > > everyone keeps working and being good, then they will go to heaven. 

> >Pretty 

> > > good incentive program. It really would have worked too, except for all 

> >the 

> > > hypocrisy in all organized religions. "I don't have to follow ALL the 

> >rules, 

> > > as long as I feel bad about breaking them." 

> > > 

131

In short: The meaning of life is enjoy yourself and be good to one 

> >another, 

> > > religion was invented to combat human nature which says "enjoy yourself 

> >and 

> > > screw everyone else." Some people can combat this feeling without the 

> >threat 

> > > of hell or the promise of heaven, but simply because it makes life 

> >better. 

> > > 

> > > I wish I could offer up a more well thought out and researched argument, 

> >but 

> > > American Idol is starting. 

> > > 

> > > PS: Something is F'd up with the listserve, because i dont get all the 

> > > emails. I get emails from cynthia that respons to emails that i never 

> >got. I 

> > > dont get it, if any of the professors know anything about it, let me 

> >know. 

> > > 

> > > _________________________________________________________________ 

> > > What are the 5 hot job markets for 2004? Click here to find out. 

> > > 

> >http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFindJobsIn2004.htm? 


> > > 

> > > 

> > 

> >-karis kroeker- 

> > 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> Get a FREE online virus check for your PC here, from McAfee. 

> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 

> 

> 


132





Subject: Great Googley Moogley 

Great Googley Moogley, 

This list-serve cracks me up. 

See you tomorrow, 


_____ 



133





Subject: Re: jenny 

on that note jenny.... 

i will tell you what the Man i put all my faith and trust in has to say...jesus : ) 

"therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. 

sufficient for the day is its own trouble." matthew 6:34 

> 

> From: Kaylee102595@aol.com 

> Date: 2004/02/03 Tue PM 10:17:35 PST 


> Subject: Re: Cynthia Robert Ann 

> 

> As they say, "Everyone dies, but not everyone really lives." To enjoy your 

> life in whatever way you deem necessary is up to you naturally. Free will, 

> remember. The question is how many people did you wrong in your pursuit of 

> happiness? As the discussion went the other day, take time to notice the world around 

> you. The world that most of us are trying to hurry through to achieve the next 

> level. Sometimes we just have to take a step back from everything and enjoy 

> the present without worrying about the past or the future because afterall we 

> are all fragile creatures whom are not invinsible and our day maybe now or in 

> fifty years so like Marin said remember to tell the people that you care about 

> that you love them everyday and live not with regret. 

> Jenny Fiala 

> 

> 


134






After reading everything for this week, I think I've gotten a major headache. 

I either understand somewhat what the author is telling me and I may or may 

not have some interest, or I have no idea whatsoever. My favorite author of 

all Sagan, yeah right, simply goes on ridiculing about religion as always. But 

I try to show my respect my still reading his book. He goes on to say about 

the mysteries of crop cirlces, aliens, and faces on animals and planets. First 

of all, I think crop circles were either a hoax to begin with or could have 

come from magnetic fields from the earth. Who knows, maybe God was trying to 

tell us something, but I know Sagan would never want to say something positive 

about religion. I tend not to agree with how old certain things were in 

Sagan's reading, because it doesn't make any sense whatsoever to me as a 

Christian. Now let's talk about aliens. Well, there probably a hoax as well 

and I think that even if there were aliens, God would have let us communicate 

to them in a unique time and way, and just because their are aliens now where 

were they back in the old times, like biblical times? Obviously if the Bible 

doesn't say anything about aliens than there probably aren't any aliens at 

all.But one may think that the Bible doesn't say anything about dinosaurs and 

they have been proven to be discovered. Well, one interesting thing though 

about the Bible is that it says that there were once dinosaurs which later on 

scientists found out by finding and observing fossils in the ground. "Look at 

the behemoth, which I made along with you and which feeds on grass like an ox. 

What strength he has in his loins, what power in the muscles of his belly! His 

tail sways like a cedar; tge sinews of his thighs are close-knit. His bones 

are tubes of bronze, his limbs like rods of iron. He ranks first among the 

works of God, yet his Maker can approach him with his sword." Job 40: 15-19. 

Lastly, the faces on animals and planets to me are just about how animals have 

faces on themselves for protection just like Sagan had said. But the faces on 

the planets do seem pretty wierd. My favorite cartoon character is Bugs Bunny, 

so I almost went on the internet to see Bugs Bunny's face on the certain star 

described in the Sagan reading. 

Enough about Sagan,Knorr and Collins seemed to talk about the sociology of 

knowledge and the sociology of science. After reading both passages, do I have 

even some understanding of what those terms mean? Nope. The word usage is so 

detailed and unfamiliar to me, that I couldn't even understand any sentence 

that I read. Maybe, if I'm allowed to guess what the terms mean I would say 

that we are reading about how society and are own social values that we have 

as individuals, are a big influence in our understanding and study of science. 

I know this is true for me since my religious values in life determine what 

kind of decisions I make. I hope, though in class, we can all come to know 

exactly what the specific terms mean. I did read Ruse but I clearly don't see 

what his point or what he is trying to say to the reader. 

Gottfried had talked about the old and new physics along with the scientific 

method. I think he was trying to show how much, as a society, we have advanced 

in our scientific knowledge to be able to form a new type of physics. Other 

than that I liked Shermer's article article talking about remoting viewing. 

That's pretty cool that someone could actually set their mind to let them 

visually see and feel every detail at a particular place. It's seems to me 

like you are transporting your body to a different location somewhere else, 

like in star trek when the people say "energize!" and they mysteriously go 

away and are transported somewhere else. I also liked Panek's article 

describing how art and science pretty much go hand and hand throughout 

history. That just proves to show that everything in one way or another could 

be connected. 

135

Well, that's it! :) 


136





Subject: Oh Yeah 

Cohort F, 

Have I told you lately how much I love you? Well, I do. I will always remember the fun times we have 

together as well as our struggles. Life is so much more interesting with all of you in it. I am glad to 

know you all. 

xoxoxo 

Ann 

_____ 



137





Subject: p.s. 

I totally meant what I just said, even though it sounded corny. 


_____ 



138





Subject: Re: Oh Yeah 

Ann, you're the best! 

:) Jenny F. 

139





Subject: Re: Oh Yeah 

((((((((((ANN))))))))))) (hugs) 

Cynthia 


Cohort F, 

Have I told you lately how much I love you? Well, I do. I will always remember the fun times 

we have together as well as our struggles. Life is so much more interesting with all of you in it. I 

am glad to know you all. 

xoxoxo 

Ann 

_____ 



_____ 



140






Your post is interesting Laurie. I guess that maybe science and religion can get along then. Both 

agree there were dinosaurs. As far as the remote-viewing article, I thought his point was that it was a 

hoax. Hm.....did I read it wrong? Well, regardless, to me it is. I have met too many people who like to 

claim they have various supernatural powers, and it never seems to me they really do. Call me a 

skeptic, lol. I think the art one was interesting because if you think about it, art is a reflection of what 

the artist observes, (oh, that would be science) only the judging of it's merit is subjective, rather than 

objective. You couldn't have art without science if you think about it, of course you couldn't have life 

without science either (feel free to get me started). Cynthia 

mcdon032 wrote: 

After reading everything for this week, I think I've gotten a major headache. 

I either understand somewhat what the author is telling me and I may or may 

not have some interest, or I have no idea whatsoever. My favorite author of 

all Sagan, yeah right, simply goes on ridiculing about religion as always. But 

I try to show my respect my still reading his book. He goes on to say about 

the mysteries of crop cirlces, aliens, and faces on animals and planets. First 

of all, I think crop circles were either a hoax to begin with or could have 

come from magnetic fields from the earth. Who knows, maybe God was trying to 

tell us something, but I know Sagan would never want to say something positive 

about religion. I tend not to agree with how old certain things were in 

Sagan's reading, because it doesn't make any sense whatsoever to me as a 

Chr! istian. Now let's talk about aliens. Well, there probably a hoax as well 

and I think that even if there were aliens, God would have let us communicate 

to them in a unique time and way, and just because their are aliens now where 

were they back in the old times, like biblical times? Obviously if the Bible 

doesn't say anything about aliens than there probably aren't any aliens at 

all.But one may think that the Bible doesn't say anything about dinosaurs and 

they have been proven to be discovered. Well, one interesting thing though 

about the Bible is that it says that there were once dinosaurs which later on 

scientists found out by finding and observing fossils in the ground. "Look at 

the behemoth, which I made along with you and which feeds on grass like an ox. 

What strength he has in his loins, what power in the muscles of his belly! His 

tail sways like a cedar; tge sinews of his thighs are close-knit. His bones 

are tubes of bronze, his! limbs like rods of iron. He ranks first among the 

works of God, yet his Maker can approach him with his sword." Job 40: 15-19. 

Lastly, the faces on animals and planets to me are just about how animals have 

faces on themselves for protection just like Sagan had said. But the faces on 

the planets do seem pretty wierd. My favorite cartoon character is Bugs Bunny, 

so I almost went on the internet to see Bugs Bunny's face on the certain star 

described in the Sagan reading. 

Enough about Sagan,Knorr and Collins seemed to talk about the sociology of 

knowledge and the sociology of science. After reading both passages, do I have 

even some understanding of what those terms mean? Nope. The word usage is so 

141

detailed and unfamiliar to me, that I couldn't even understand any sentence 

that I read. Maybe, if I'm allowed to guess what the terms mean I would say 

that we are reading about how society and are own social values that we have 

as ind! ividuals, are a big influence in our understanding and study of science. 

I know this is true for me since my religious values in life determine what 

kind of decisions I make. I hope, though in class, we can all come to know 

exactly what the specific terms mean. I did read Ruse but I clearly don't see 

what his point or what he is trying to say to the reader. 

Gottfried had talked about the old and new physics along with the scientific 

method. I think he was trying to show how much, as a society, we have advanced 

in our scientific knowledge to be able to form a new type of physics. Other 

than that I liked Shermer's article article talking about remoting viewing. 

That's pretty cool that someone could actually set their mind to let them 

visually see and feel every detail at a particular place. It's seems to me 

like you are transporting your body to a different location somewhere else, 

like in star trek when the people say "energize!" and ! they mysteriously go 

away and are transported somewhere else. I also liked Panek's article 

describing how art and science pretty much go hand and hand throughout 

history. That just proves to show that everything in one way or another could 

be connected. 

Well, that's it! :) 


_____ 



142



Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 8:42 AM 


Subject: I HAD NO SOUND AND NO BODY... 

Attachments: Journal #2.doc 

Journal #2.doc (24 

KB) 

143





Subject: Re: The meaning of life. 

Mike, 

I appreciate your thoughts on the topics being 

discussed. Your journals are a fresh gust of reality 

blowing across and clearing the air from my stuffy and 

overcrowded mailbox! I knew I could count on you to 

bring out that quote from the wise old Gandolph, it 

was bound to show up sooner or later. 

Peace, 

Michael 

__________________________________ 




144





Subject: a thought for all... 

...the physical world is a mere reflection of each 

person's individual perception of life. -r. rathbun 

__________________________________ 




145





Subject: Wow's! 

"To myself I seem to have been only like a boy playing on the seashore, and diverting myself in now 

and then finding a smoother pebble or a prettier shell than ordinary, whilst the great ocean of truth lay 

all undiscovered before me." 

~ Sir Isaac Newton 

146




To: ICP-F 

Subject: RE: Life 

Wow guys! I felt like you all were reading my mind. I have been wondering why 

I bother to read this stuff anyways. Tomorrow would it really matter. AM I 

really going to be grateful that I read this books. I figured that life is 

more about the memories I share with people rather than the silly assignments, 

bills than need to be paid, and the sorority drama I must solve. I started to 

read these 116 emails I have and though it start about death and all. I 

realize how grateful I am for living. And getting to share these mondays and 

wednesdays with you all. You all are so sweet and so supportive. So in 

conclusion, thanks for the inspriation. I guess if I did not have to know 

these journals then I would have missed all these quotes and special messages. 

Maybe I should start doing my assignments. Thanks you all! 

147




To: ICP-F 

Subject: journal three 



KB) 

Alright ladies and germs her is my journal three. Once again.It is not much 

about science, more about me. 

148



Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 6:06 PM 


Subject: Re: journal three 

Teresa wrote: 

"I know this is extreme, but if my attention span is only seven to eight minutes long " 

Ok, Teresa, I know you want me to stop all the emails but I couldn't resist!!! 

The real question is: Why are American's attention spans only 7-8 minutes? I have read some 

research on this (not recently) and it is because that is how long a tv show goes in between 

commercials. This creates a circuit in the brain of those who watch a lot of tv. So.......the attention 

span isn't the real problem, it the TV. Now add to this video and computer games. There were kids in 

my field practicum last semester that you could tell were addicted to video games. They had to have 

something in their hands the whole time they were in class. And yes, some of these kids were labeled 

ADD or ADHD. My hypothesis is that this isn't a disease, it is a condition created by the misuse of 

technology. 

Cynthia 

summe004 wrote: 

Alright ladies and germs her is my journal three. Once again.It is not much 

about science, more about me. 

> ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=Journal 3.doc 

_____ 



149





Subject: Re: cynthia 

what does it mean if i change the channel to look for other things to watch before the 

commercials start? or during the commercial i find something else to watch? and if that 

something else is on commercials, i find a third channel as backup? 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/04 Wed PM 06:06:11 PST 


> Subject: Re: journal three 

> 

> Teresa wrote: 

> "I know this is extreme, but if my attention span is only seven to eight minutes long " 

> 

> Ok, Teresa, I know you want me to stop all the emails but I couldn't resist!!! 

> The real question is: Why are American's attention spans only 7-8 minutes? I have read 

some research on this (not recently) and it is because that is how long a tv show goes in 

between commercials. This creates a circuit in the brain of those who watch a lot of tv. 

So.......the attention span isn't the real problem, it the TV. Now add to this video and 

computer games. There were kids in my field practicum last semester that you could tell 

were addicted to video games. They had to have something in their hands the whole time 

they were in class. And yes, some of these kids were labeled ADD or ADHD. My hypothesis is 

that this isn't a disease, it is a condition created by the misuse of technology. 

> Cynthia 

> summe004 wrote: 

> Alright ladies and germs her is my journal three. Once again.It is not much 

> about science, more about me. 

> 

> 

> > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=Journal 3.doc 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


150





so what im beginning to wonder is, 

i have written quite a few short emails this week... 

and do those count as this week's journal? 

its all so strange to me to have little structure. 

in the end i wouldnt want to find out i dont get full credit for all 15 journals b/c i 

didnt write a novel every single week. 

i was just talking to lowe today about the differences between his teaching style and 

karas' and how i wasnt sure what was expected of me in his class regarding labs and writeups, 

since he doesnt lay down the rules. in some sense i like that b/c we have more 

freedom but on the other hand im worried about my grade and want to track it throughout 

the semester. cant do that for yamashita. 

and although the actual grades we receice in college for every class arent checked by our 

future employer, i cant shake the feeling that A is the best and i wont settle for less. 

casey knows what im talking about, dont ya. 

so i dont know where i started with this email and i dont know where i ended up, but im 

done. 


151






"what does it mean if i change the channel to look for other things to watch 

before the commercials start? or during the commercial i find something 

else to watch? and if that something else is on commercials, i find a third 

channel as backup?" 

Strangely enough, that proves that there is no god. 

> > 

> > From: Cynthia Reyes 

> > Date: 2004/02/04 Wed PM 06:06:11 PST 


> > Subject: Re: journal three 

> > 

> > Teresa wrote: 

> > "I know this is extreme, but if my attention span is only seven to 

>eight minutes long " 

> > 

> > Ok, Teresa, I know you want me to stop all the emails but I couldn't 

>resist!!! 

> > The real question is: Why are American's attention spans only 7-8 

>minutes? I have read some research on this (not recently) and it is because 

>that is how long a tv show goes in between commercials. This creates a 

>circuit in the brain of those who watch a lot of tv. So.......the attention 

>span isn't the real problem, it the TV. Now add to this video and computer 

>games. There were kids in my field practicum last semester that you could 

>tell were addicted to video games. They had to have something in their 

>hands the whole time they were in class. And yes, some of these kids were 

>labeled ADD or ADHD. My hypothesis is that this isn't a disease, it is a 

>condition created by the misuse of technology. 

> > Cynthia 

> > summe004 wrote: 

> > Alright ladies and germs her is my journal three. Once again.It is not 

>much 

> > about science, more about me. 

> > 

> > 

> > > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=Journal 3.doc 

> > 

> > 

> > --------------------------------- 

> > Do you Yahoo!? 

> > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! 

> > 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



152






Well, Karis, I think that means you have a new psuedo-disorder called telecomentia. And the 

research I have done on it shows that your attention span will continually dwindle until you no longer 

have the ability to watch any amount of tv programming, only the commercials and you will mistake 

them for actual tv shows. By the way, there is no cure. 

Cynthia 


what does it mean if i change the channel to look for other things to watch before the commercials 

start? or during the commercial i find something else to watch? and if that something else is on 

commercials, i find a third channel as backup? 

> 

> From: Cynthia Reyes 

> Date: 2004/02/04 Wed PM 06:06:11 PST 


> Subject: Re: journal three 

> 

> Teresa wrote: 

> "I know this is extreme, but if my attention span is only seven to eight minutes long " 

> 

> Ok, Teresa, I know you want me to stop all the emails but I couldn't resist!!! 

> The real question is: Why are American's attention spans only 7-8 minutes? I have read some 

research on this (not recently) and it is because that is how long a tv show goes in between 

commercials. This creates a circuit in the brain of those who! watch a lot of tv. So.......the attention 

span isn't the real problem, it the TV. Now add to this video and computer games. There were kids 

in my field practicum last semester that you could tell were addicted to video games. They had to 

have something in their hands the whole time they were in class. And yes, some of these kids 

were labeled ADD or ADHD. My hypothesis is that this isn't a disease, it is a condition created by 

the misuse of technology. 

> Cynthia 

> summe004 wrote: 

> Alright ladies and germs her is my journal three. Once again.It is not much 

> about science, more about me. 

> 

> 

> > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=Journal 3.doc 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


153

_____ 


Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online 

154






mike, i like your response better!!! 

cynthia 


"what does it mean if i change the channel to look for other things to watch 

before the commercials start? or during the commercial i find something 

else to watch? and if that something else is on commercials, i find a third 

channel as backup?" 

Strangely enough, that proves that there is no god. 

> > 

> > From: Cynthia Reyes 

> > Date: 2004/02/04 Wed PM 06:06:11 PST 


> > Subject: Re: journal three 

> > 

> > Teresa wrote: 

> > "I know this is extreme, but if my attention span is only seven to 

>eight minutes long " 

> > 

> > Ok, Teresa, I know you want me to stop all the emails but I couldn't 

>resist!!! 

> > The real question is: Why are American's attention spans only 7-8 

>minutes? I have r! ead some research on this (not recently) and it is because 

>that is how long a tv show goes in between commercials. This creates a 

>circuit in the brain of those who watch a lot of tv. So.......the attention 

>span isn't the real problem, it the TV. Now add to this video and computer 

>games. There were kids in my field practicum last semester that you could 

>tell were addicted to video games. They had to have something in their 

>hands the whole time they were in class. And yes, some of these kids were 

>labeled ADD or ADHD. My hypothesis is that this isn't a disease, it is a 

>condition created by the misuse of technology. 

> > Cynthia 

> > summe004 wrote: 

> > Alright ladies and germs her is my journal three. Once again.It is not 

>much 

> > about science, more about me. 

> > 

> > 

> > > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=Journal 3.doc 

155

> > 

> > --------------------------------- 


> > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! 

> > 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



156





Subject: TV and Attention Span 

Just in case anyone is interested in the topic of TV and attention span. Something to think about if 

you are planning to have kids in the future. Also, good to know because you will have these kids in 

your classroom. When my kids were in school, they were not allowed to watch TV during the week for 

this reason. One result? They read A LOT of books and became good readers. Cynthia 

http://users.stargate.net/~cokids/VisualMedia.html 

not too long, but a good article 

http://library.thinkquest.org/C005704/content_la_infl_tv.php3 

easy to read, good info. 

_____ 



157






mike, you are walking on thin ice with me. 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/04 Wed PM 07:40:44 PST 


> Subject: Re: cynthia 

> 

> 

> "what does it mean if i change the channel to look for other things to watch 

> before the commercials start? or during the commercial i find something 

> else to watch? and if that something else is on commercials, i find a third 

> channel as backup?" 

> 

> Strangely enough, that proves that there is no god. 

> 

> 

> 

> > > 

> > > From: Cynthia Reyes 

> > > Date: 2004/02/04 Wed PM 06:06:11 PST 

> > > To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

> > > Subject: Re: journal three 

> > > 

> > > Teresa wrote: 

> > > "I know this is extreme, but if my attention span is only seven to 

> >eight minutes long " 

> > > 

> > > Ok, Teresa, I know you want me to stop all the emails but I couldn't 

> >resist!!! 

> > > The real question is: Why are American's attention spans only 7-8 

> >minutes? I have read some research on this (not recently) and it is because 

> >that is how long a tv show goes in between commercials. This creates a 

> >circuit in the brain of those who watch a lot of tv. So.......the attention 

> >span isn't the real problem, it the TV. Now add to this video and computer 

> >games. There were kids in my field practicum last semester that you could 

> >tell were addicted to video games. They had to have something in their 

> >hands the whole time they were in class. And yes, some of these kids were 

> >labeled ADD or ADHD. My hypothesis is that this isn't a disease, it is a 

> >condition created by the misuse of technology. 

> > > Cynthia 

> > > summe004 wrote: 

> > > Alright ladies and germs her is my journal three. Once again.It is not 

> >much 

> > > about science, more about me. 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=Journal 3.doc 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > --------------------------------- 

> > > Do you Yahoo!? 

> > > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! 

> > > 

> > 


> > 

158

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> Learn how to choose, serve, and enjoy wine at Wine @ MSN. 

> http://wine.msn.com/ 

> 

> 


159




To: LBST 361B 


I did not know what to write on this journal. All the talk about what makes 

sense and doesn't make sense, does not make any sense to me. I feel overwhelm 

by all the readings even when I have not done all of them. Just by listening 

to you, my fellow classmates, and by reading the emails, my head starts to 

hurt. However, I would like to point out a quote from Sagan that interested 

me. Here it is, "Not explaining science seems to me pervese." To me, it means 

that not only scientists are entitled to understand science, but the rest of 

the people. However, my question is how can science be explained? Because then 

Sagan says, "Science is more than a body of knowledge; it is a way of 

thinking." So I guess now I understand that memorizing terms, concepts and all 

that stuff is not really useful when there is no thinking involved. Memorizing 

can be easy, but do we really understand what we are memorazing? I remember 

when I was in elementary school, memorizing things was really easy to me. I 

didn't have to spend hours studying for tests. I could memorize things two 

hours before the test and I did pretty well (of course that has changed). 

However, I forgot much of the information which in many cases didn't 

understand. I don't want my students to do that; I want them to think. But 

first I have to do it myself, right? 

160





Subject: Re: journal 3 

This is an excert from "What is Science?" by Richard Feynman. I think you have it 

exactly right, Judith. It's not about the names, it's about being able to understand the 

concept, what is happening as it relates to your world and being able to think with it. 

And understanding comes with observing, questioning, testing and analyzing it so that it 

useful information. That doesn't mean you have to be in a laboratory, it can take place 

anywhere and on any level. Cynthia 

Regarding this business about names and words, I would tell you another story. 'We 

used to go up to the Catskill Mountains for vacations. In New York, you go the Catskill 

Mountains for vacations. The poor husbands had to go to work during the week, but they 

would come rushing out for weekends and stay with their families. On the weekends, my 

father would take me for walks in the woods. He often took me for walks, and we 

learned all about nature, and so an, in the process. But the other children, friends of 

mine also wanted to go, and tried to get my father to take them. He didn't want to, 

because he said I was more advanced. I'm not trying to tell you how to teach, because 

what my father was doing was with a class of just one student; if he had a class of more 

than one, he was incapable of doing it. 

So we went alone for our walk in the woods. But mothers were very powerful in those 

day's as they are now, and they convinced the other fathers that they had to take their 

own sons out for walks in the woods. So all fathers took all sons out for walks in the 

woods one Sunday afternoon. The next day, Monday, we were playing in the fields and 

this boy said to me, "See that bird standing on the stump there? What's the name of 

it?" 

I said, "I haven't got the slightest idea." 

He said, 'It’s a brown-throated thrush. Your father doesn't teach you much about 

science." 

I smiled to myself, because my father had already taught me that [the name] doesn't 

tell me anything about the bird. He taught me "See that bird? It's a brown-throated 

thrush, but in Germany it's called a halsenflugel, and in Chinese they call it a chung ling 

and even if you know all those names for it, you still know nothing about the bird--you 

only know something about people; what they call that bird. Now that thrush sings, and 

teaches its young to fly, and flies so many miles away during the summer across the 

country, and nobody knows how it finds its way," and so forth. There is a difference 

between the name of the thing and what goes on. 

161

marti171 wrote: 

I did not know what to write on this journal. All the talk about what makes 

sense and doesn't make sense, does not make any sense to me. I feel overwhelm 

by all the readings even when I have not done all of them. Just by listening 

to you, my fellow classmates, and by reading the emails, my head starts to 

hurt. However, I would like to point out a quote from Sagan that interested 

me. Here it is, "Not explaining science seems to me pervese." To me, it means 

that not only scientists are entitled to understand science, but the rest of 

the people. However, my question is how can science be explained? Because then 

Sagan says, "Science is more than a body of knowledge; it is a way of 

thinking." So I guess now I understand that memorizing terms, concepts and all 

that stuff is not really useful when there is no thinking involved. Memorizing 

! can be easy, but do we really understand what we are memorazing? I remember 

when I was in elementary school, memorizing things was really easy to me. I 

didn't have to spend hours studying for tests. I could memorize things two 

hours before the test and I did pretty well (of course that has changed). 

However, I forgot much of the information which in many cases didn't 

understand. I don't want my students to do that; I want them to think. But 

first I have to do it myself, right? 

_____ 



162





Subject: Regarding Thin Ice, but not the game, which was always inferior to Cootie 

Then all is going according to plan! :) 

>From: 


>To: 


>Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 20:28:08 -0800 

> 

>mike, you are walking on thin ice with me. 

> > 


> > Date: 2004/02/04 Wed PM 07:40:44 PST 


> > Subject: Re: cynthia 

> > 

> > 

> > "what does it mean if i change the channel to look for other things to 

>watch 

> > before the commercials start? or during the commercial i find 

>something 

> > else to watch? and if that something else is on commercials, i find a 

>third 

> > channel as backup?" 

> > 

> > Strangely enough, that proves that there is no god. 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > > > 

> > > > From: Cynthia Reyes 

> > > > Date: 2004/02/04 Wed PM 06:06:11 PST 

> > > > To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

> > > > Subject: Re: journal three 

> > > > 

> > > > Teresa wrote: 

> > > > "I know this is extreme, but if my attention span is only seven to 

> > >eight minutes long " 

> > > > 

> > > > Ok, Teresa, I know you want me to stop all the emails but I couldn't 

> > >resist!!! 

> > > > The real question is: Why are American's attention spans only 7-8 

> > >minutes? I have read some research on this (not recently) and it is 

>because 

> > >that is how long a tv show goes in between commercials. This creates a 

> > >circuit in the brain of those who watch a lot of tv. So.......the 

>attention 

> > >span isn't the real problem, it the TV. Now add to this video and 

>computer 

> > >games. There were kids in my field practicum last semester that you 

>could 

> > >tell were addicted to video games. They had to have something in their 

> > >hands the whole time they were in class. And yes, some of these kids 

>were 

> > >labeled ADD or ADHD. My hypothesis is that this isn't a disease, it is 

>a 

163

condition created by the misuse of technology. 

> > > > Cynthia 

> > > > summe004 wrote: 

> > > > Alright ladies and germs her is my journal three. Once again.It is 

>not 

> > >much 

> > > > about science, more about me. 

> > > > 

> > > > 

> > > > > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=Journal 3.doc 

> > > > 

> > > > 

> > > > --------------------------------- 

> > > > Do you Yahoo!? 

> > > > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! 

> > > > 

> > > 

> > >-karis kroeker- 

> > > 

> > 

> > _________________________________________________________________ 

> > Learn how to choose, serve, and enjoy wine at Wine @ MSN. 

> > http://wine.msn.com/ 

> > 

> > 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



164



Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 12:36 AM 


Subject: 1819 flu 

Just a little rhyme to get you motivated to read the Kolata book. 

Erupting during the final stages of World War I, this global disaster reinforced the era’s nihilism and 

apocalyptic visions of despair. “I had a little bird/Its name was Enza/I opened the 

window/And in-flew-enza,” morbidly sang the children as they skipped rope 

_____ 



165





Subject: RE: TV & Attention SPAN- Casey Cunningham journal 3 

I guess I will go off Cynthia and Teresa and everyone else who has gotten involved! I totally agree 

with the fact that kids watch entirely way too much T.V. It has gotten to the point where it is ridiculous. 

I remember when I was little and I came home from school- I did my homework and then went outside 

to play until it was time for dinner. Then we ate dinner (without the t.v. on and had a conversation). 

That is what kills me about families today. They don't talk at the dinner table. I think that is such an 

important time of the day- to hear about your families day. This was something that my family has 

always done and still do. Why do people need the T.V. on when they are eating....can't they take a 

break for 45minutes. 

I haven't done any research on it like Cynthia has but I think that it definately makes sense. And now 

with the T.V.'s in the cars...kids are always watching T.V. I have heard moms say that the t.v. in the 

car is a life saver...that she never hears a peep out of her kids....well I think i would want to talk to my 

kids and hear what they have to say. I am not saying my family is the Brady Bunch (well we kind of 

are) but we used to sing songs or listen to kids music in the car which I think is much more stimulating 

then throwing on a DVD. So in short- I totally agree with you Cynthia and think that it is a very 

interesting topic. I think many of the problems today are part of the over use of t.v. and video games. 

Not even to mention obesity which is a whole other topic to get in to! 

166



Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 1:10 PM 


Subject: creationists vs. scientists 

This article was in today's San Diego Union Tribune: 

 

Scientists and creationists have a new ground zero: the Grand Canyon. 

At issue is a book being sold at Grand Canyon National Park that claims the canyon dates to the 

biblical flood in Genesis. That would make this natural wonder thousands of years old instead of 

millions of years old, which is the contention of scientists. 

Answers in Genesis, a Christian ministry whose essays appear in the book, is urging supporters to 

ask park service officials to permit "Grand Canyon: A Different View" to remain on the shelves of the 

park's three bookstores. But the other side says keeping it there would make it look as if the 

government is endorsing this viewpoint. 

"It is the job of the National Park Service to present the best scientific information possible to the 

public, and the book is complete pseudoscience," William Ausich, president of the Paleontological 

Society, told Religion News Service. 

But a park spokesman suspects the book will stay there. "The superintendent just reordered 

additional copies," the spokesman said. 

_____ 



167








KB) 

Have a lovely weekend! 

168






As discussion continues to arise regarding belief 

systems, theories, and truths, I find that I have 

been wondering about how these things can potentially 

affect people through the actions and words of others. 

This brings me to ponder why some people are so 

adamant about vocalizing their beliefs and even 

spreading them, as in the case of some religions that 

practice missionary work, or as I have heard it 

called, religious imposition. 

I believe that faith is an important ability for all 

to possess, whether it is faith in a certain religion, 

faith in oneself and others, or faith that 

extraterrestrial beings are on their way to come and 

help humans combat the dilemmas of the world. To me 

it is not a matter of what one has faith in that is 

important, rather it is the state of having faith, or 

being faithful to each other that is important. When 

faith becomes an issue for me is when it transforms 

and is imposed on others as ultimate truth. 

Every person on this planet has beliefs and faiths 

that are ultimate truths to them based on their 

experiences in life. For people to speak of their 

beliefs or faiths as ultimate truths and behave in 

ways that influence or affect others based on these 

truths troubles me. This is an ironic situation 

because we all, consciously or not, act on what we 

believe to be true in our every day living. But 

awareness of our actions and how we interact with 

others gives us control over whether or not we 

interfere with other people’s lives. Many people 

though, walk through life with shortsighted and 

self-serving filters over their eyes, and in the 

process end up interfering in the lives of others 

instead of just letting them live and be who they are. 

So why then, do so many people go about their lives 

behaving in ways with the intention of influencing 

others to see things according to their beliefs and 

truths? Is it out of fear that what they believe may 

not be true unless others believe in it as well? Is 

it a fear of being able to look at them selves in deep 

contemplation and reflect upon why they act and do the 

things that they do? Spiritualist and author R. 

Rathbun once wrote, “Behavioral justification is the 

perpetuation of ignorance and a great darkness across 

the expanse of mankind.” Justification often comes as 

a result of feelings of inferiority, weakness, or that 

one is not worthy to act or say what it is they feel 

they must justify. But justification of both actions 

and words may only be part of a reality that we create 

our selves in order to protect our selves from what we 

are afraid to face. 

I retain an ever present and undying belief inside of 

me that people have the ability to live without fear 

of them selves or one another, that open minds will be 

valued and heartfelt questioning honored. I believe 

that the only truths in this life of mine are the ones 

169

that I find and create for myself, and the only way to 

continue to grow and make meaning of this world is to 

walk with an open mind, questioning all that I 

encounter. 

P.S: In addition to this journal I was inspired to 

create a collage regarding my thoughts on the topics 

of creationism, evolution, and religion, as some 

things are easier for me to express in images. I was 

unable to attach the scanned file, as it is pretty big 

and I didn’t want to crash anyone’s computer. If you 

would like to see it, I would gladly share it with 

you. Just let me know. Michael 

__________________________________ 


Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. 

http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html 

170





Subject: RE: journal 3 

Michael, 

I would love to see your collage! With respect to your idea of faith 

and how we all have faith etc., I completely agree. As a Christian, I 

often find myself in a dilemma when it comes to Christian missionaries. 

I wonder what right do we (Christians) have in teaching other cultures, 

tribes, people, Christianity when perhaps they were quite happy with 

whatever faith system they possessed. Christians have argued with me 

that it is our obligation as Christians to spread the word of Christ. 

This is certainly okay with me, but to share a faith with someone is one 

thing, but to pressure or force an entire population is quite another. 

If someone were to ask me about Christ, I would be happy to share my 

thoughts, but I feel differently about going somewhere and "teaching" 

about Christ unless my visit were an invitation. Does this make sense? 

I also question if this makes me less of a Christian - something that I 

ponder often. Anyway, gotta go and feed the Tweed Tribe! 


From: Michael Renner [mailto:birdnerd13@yahoo.com] 




As discussion continues to arise regarding belief 

systems, theories, and truths, I find that I have 

been wondering about how these things can potentially 

affect people through the actions and words of others. 

This brings me to ponder why some people are so 

adamant about vocalizing their beliefs and even 

spreading them, as in the case of some religions that 

practice missionary work, or as I have heard it 

called, religious imposition. 

I believe that faith is an important ability for all 

to possess, whether it is faith in a certain religion, 

faith in oneself and others, or faith that 

extraterrestrial beings are on their way to come and 

help humans combat the dilemmas of the world. To me 

it is not a matter of what one has faith in that is 

important, rather it is the state of having faith, or 

being faithful to each other that is important. When 

faith becomes an issue for me is when it transforms 

and is imposed on others as ultimate truth. 

Every person on this planet has beliefs and faiths 

that are ultimate truths to them based on their 

experiences in life. For people to speak of their 

beliefs or faiths as ultimate truths and behave in 

ways that influence or affect others based on these 

truths troubles me. This is an ironic situation 

because we all, consciously or not, act on what we 

believe to be true in our every day living. But 

awareness of our actions and how we interact with 

others gives us control over whether or not we 

interfere with other people's lives. Many people 

though, walk through life with shortsighted and 

self-serving filters over their eyes, and in the 

171

process end up interfering in the lives of others 

instead of just letting them live and be who they are. 

So why then, do so many people go about their lives 

behaving in ways with the intention of influencing 

others to see things according to their beliefs and 

truths? Is it out of fear that what they believe may 

not be true unless others believe in it as well? Is 

it a fear of being able to look at them selves in deep contemplation and 

reflect upon why they act and do the things that they do? Spiritualist 

and author R. Rathbun once wrote, "Behavioral justification is the 

perpetuation of ignorance and a great darkness across the expanse of 

mankind." Justification often comes as a result of feelings of 

inferiority, weakness, or that one is not worthy to act or say what it 

is they feel they must justify. But justification of both actions and 

words may only be part of a reality that we create our selves in order 

to protect our selves from what we are afraid to face. 

I retain an ever present and undying belief inside of 

me that people have the ability to live without fear 

of them selves or one another, that open minds will be 

valued and heartfelt questioning honored. I believe 

that the only truths in this life of mine are the ones 

that I find and create for myself, and the only way to 

continue to grow and make meaning of this world is to 

walk with an open mind, questioning all that I 

encounter. 

P.S: In addition to this journal I was inspired to 

create a collage regarding my thoughts on the topics 

of creationism, evolution, and religion, as some 

things are easier for me to express in images. I was 

unable to attach the scanned file, as it is pretty big 

and I didn't want to crash anyone's computer. If you 

would like to see it, I would gladly share it with 

you. Just let me know. Michael 

__________________________________ 




172




To: LBST 361B 

Subject: quote 

Just wanted to share the following quote: 

If a little knowledge is dangerous, where is a man who has so much as to be 

out of danger? - Thomas Henry Huxley 

judith :-0 

173





Subject: Re: Journal3 ET 

Marin, Maybe art is an expression of the artists understanding of science. 

Cynthia 


I try to be open minded and i feel like I do give everything some thought. i 

do believe in a 

lot of things. I wouldn't stake my life on anything but I do spend a lot of 

time wondering 

what life is where I can from and where I am going. I got a kick out of 

Sagans reading 

when he spoke about some people being closed minded and others being to open 

minded. For example people who live their daily lives based on what a psychic 

tell him or 

her. Not to knock the words of wisdom delivered by a psychic or tarot cards in 

fact 

sometimes i read any horescope in the paper just for fun and I do not base my 

life on it 

but I certainly can relate to it, find a topic that relates to it and ponder 

about what direction 

I am going with it. Let me go back to closed mind, neutral mind, open mind and 

too 

opend of a mind. tis brings ! up a topic that I have had a hard time beliving 

in, extraterrestrial 

life. I have never seen a fact opened my mind to beleive in aliens 

but is that 

closed minded of me. When I asked myself this question I instantly had, for 

lack of better 

words, sympathy for aliens if they do exist. Don't be scared my fellow 

classmates I am not 

going to re-direct my life to the study and following of extraterrestial life 

but I feel like I had 

to let the possible idea of it into a small fraction of my mind. Who am i to 

say it doesn't 

exist. This universe is so vast and untouched in so many ways that I feel like 

I have to 

keep the wonder alive just like I want my future student's to open theri minds 

to the 

possbilities of life. 

Before I leave the topic of aliens i have to mention one more thing and 

remeber I have 

bad eye sight. Last year my boyfriend, at the time, and my self were sleeping 

I woke up 

and saw this ov! al shaped airplane hovering outside my window it was blue I 

looked at it 

174

for a while and told Ernie to look and we watched it float back in forth. I 

looked at the 

clock it was 3:00 AM I laught because it was so wierd and I fell asleep again. 

I woke back 

up at 4:30AM and it was still floating outside my window and Ernie was still 

watching it. 

To this day we still ask each other what it was. With a joking tone in our 

voices we would 

say, "it was an alien" and we would laugh. I wouldn't allow the thought to 

come in my 

mind that it might actually be one. I feel like there must be some 

explaination for what we 

saw I still wonder about what explaination it would be because i was to closed 

mided to 

actually believe it could be extraterrestrial life. I am not any where near 

being convenced 

that it was an alien but I have to allow that small bit of wonder into my 

mind. It' is what 

keeps life exciting, to wonder ab! out things and to not seal the deal and give 

into any one 

idea or explaination. 

Moving on to what makes sense and what doesn't make sense. Some or many of you 

might say that this e-mail doesn't makes sense. It may mean nothing to you but 

to me it 

means something. As my thoughts flow out I even sruprise myself. Do you ever 

sit back 

and ask your self what you think of life and what you were before this life 

and what and 

where you will be after, if there is even a before and after. I know what 

different religions 

say and what different theories and books have to say. Does it make sense to 

you? Can 

you challenge it and just ask youself for a second, pushing all that you have 

read aside if 

at all possible, and wonder for an hour what sense you can make of life on 

your oun. I did 

it the other day and I found a lot of sense and non-sense in my thoughts. I 

never knew 

that side of me I felt renewed and excite! d to see the marinistic view of life. 

I think in a lot 

of situations in life we want to open the envelope and have someone tell us 

the answers 

we think we should know. But a lot of times we already know and once the 

envelope is 

opened the process to find the anwer is taken away. It reminds me of your 

b-day or the 

holidays when you want to know what your family or friends got for you so you 

snoop 

around find and you get sad that you didn't wait and guess find out when the 

time came. I 

am willing to bet money on the fact that nobody is reading this e-mail any 

more. 

'Knowledge filters the the lens through which we see the world"-Sherman 

175

Everyone is right in what they believe because they believe in what they 

believe. I know 

that talk of religion and faith and science can be very frustrating but let's 

not become 

enemies because of our differences for one day we will be teaching a diverese 

class of 

miniatur! e cohort F's and how will we face our children's differences. 

One last thought the art of science; UUUUUUUUUuuuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhh So 

nature distancing and drawings of planets is a commonality between art and 

science but 

once science began to focus on mass energy and particles it grew apart. Is 

this because 

we cannot draw energy and matter. Aren't panintings and sculptures or theatre 

full of 

energy and life and matter. i wonder if maybe in the mid 1800's when science 

and art 

began to go their individual direction that maybe they just became one of the 

same thing. 

Science being the explaination and art being the evidence. Who knows go away. 

Take 

care. Marin the Great. 

_____ 



176




To: journal 

Subject: Homing Pigeon Research 

This is just too funny!!! So I guess the pigeons are adapting to the modern environment? But what did 

they do before the English built roads? And does this apply to only English pigeons, or do American 

pigeons follow the roads too? Do we even have homing pigeons here, or just the freeloader kind who 

hang out at the fast food joints? 

Cynthia 

Secret of Homing Pigeons Revealed 

Reuters 

Thu Feb 5, 7:45 AM ET 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/my/my16.gif Add Oddly Enough - Reuters to My Yahoo! 

LONDON (Reuters) - The secret of carrier pigeons' uncanny ability to find their way home has been 

discovered by British scientists: the feathered navigators follow the roads just like we do. 

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news? 

tmpl=story&u=/ydownload_ap/20040205/photos_net_ap_yn/1076012494 

AP Photo 

Related Links 

• Tracking Homing Pigeons Using GPS (Oxford Univ.) 

Researchers at Oxford University spent 10 years studying homing pigeons using global positioning satellite (GPS) and 

were stunned to find the birds often don't navigate by taking bearing from the sun. 

Instead they fly along motorways, turn at junctions and even go around roundabouts, adding miles to their journeys, 

British newspapers reported on Thursday. 

"It really has knocked our research team sideways," Professor Tim Guilford said in the Daily Telegraph. 

"It is striking to see the pigeons fly straight down the A34 Oxford bypass, and then sharply curve off at the traffic lights 

before curving off again at the roundabout," he said in The Times. 

Guilford said pigeons use their own navigational system when doing long-distance trips or when a bird does a journey for 

the first time. 

But when they have flown a journey more than once they home in on an habitual route home. 

"In short it looks like it is mentally easier for a bird to fly down a road...they are just making their journey as simple as 

possible." 

_____ 



177





Subject: RE: Homing swallow Research 

# THE HOLY GRAIL 

Arthur approaches an isolated castle guarded by soldiers ( #1 & #2 ) ..... 

S #1: Where'd you get the coconuts? 

A : We found them. 

S #1: Found them? In Mercia? The coconut's tropical! 

A : What do you mean? 

S #1: Well, this is a temperate zone. 

A : The swallow may fly south with the sun or the house martin or the plover 

may seek warmer climes in winter, yet these are not strangers to our land? 

S #1: Are you suggesting coconuts migrate? 

A : Not at all. They could be carried. 

S #1: What? A swallow carrying a coconut? 

A: It could grip it by the husk! 

S #1: It's not a question of where he grips it! It's a simple question of 

weight ratios! A five ounce bird could not carry a one pound coconut. 

A: Well, it doesn't matter. Will you go and tell your master that Arthur 

from the Court of Camelot is here. 

S #1: Listen. In order to maintain air-speed velocity, a swallow needs to 

beat its wings forty-three times every second, right? 

A: Please! 

S #1: Am I right? 

A: I'm not interested! 

S #2: It could be carried by an African swallow! 

S #1: Oh, yeah, an African swallow maybe, but not a European swallow. That's 

my point. 

S #2: Oh, yeah, I agree with that. 

A: Will you ask your master if he wants to join my court at Camelot?! 

S #1: But then of course a-- African swallows are non-migratory. 

S #2: Oh, yeah... 

S #1: So they couldn't bring a coconut back anyway... 



>To: journal 

>Subject: Homing Pigeon Research 

>Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:24:06 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>This is just too funny!!! So I guess the pigeons are adapting to the modern 

>environment? But what did they do before the English built roads? And does 

>this apply to only English pigeons, or do American pigeons follow the roads 

>too? Do we even have homing pigeons here, or just the freeloader kind who 

>hang out at the fast food joints? 

>Cynthia 

> 

>Secret of Homing Pigeons Revealed 

> Thu Feb 5, 7:45 AM ET 

>Add Oddly Enough - Reuters to My Yahoo! 

> 

>LONDON (Reuters) - The secret of carrier pigeons' uncanny ability to find 

>their way home has been discovered by British scientists: the feathered 

>navigators follow the roads just like we do. 

> 

178

AP Photo 

>Related Links•Tracking Homing Pigeons Using GPS (Oxford Univ.) 

>Researchers at Oxford University spent 10 years studying homing pigeons 

>using global positioning satellite (GPS) and were stunned to find the birds 

>often don't navigate by taking bearing from the sun. 

> 

>Instead they fly along motorways, turn at junctions and even go around 

>roundabouts, adding miles to their journeys, British newspapers reported on 

>Thursday. 

> 

>"It really has knocked our research team sideways," Professor Tim Guilford 

>said in the Daily Telegraph. 

> 

>"It is striking to see the pigeons fly straight down the A34 Oxford bypass, 

>and then sharply curve off at the traffic lights before curving off again 

>at the roundabout," he said in The Times. 

> 

>Guilford said pigeons use their own navigational system when doing 

>long-distance trips or when a bird does a journey for the first time. 

> 

>But when they have flown a journey more than once they home in on an 

>habitual route home. 

> 

>"In short it looks like it is mentally easier for a bird to fly down a 

>road...they are just making their journey as simple as possible." 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Optimize your Internet experience to the max with the new MSN Premium 

Internet Software. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200359ave/direct/01/ 

179






Hm..................Is this sense or nonsense? So I guess we still don't have an answer. I think I feel a 

Hypothesis coming on. Well, maybe not. Maybe I better just search the web about the ancestor's of 

English homing pigeons. If you figure it all out, please let me know. 

Cyntiha 



















S! #1: Listen. In order to maintain air-speed velocity, a swallow needs to 


A: Please! 





my point. 




S #2: Oh, yeah... 


>From: Cynthia Reyes 


>To: journal 

180

Subject: Homing Pigeon Research 


> 



&! gt;this apply to only English pigeons, or do American pigeons follow the roads 



>Cynthia 

> 




> 




> 

>AP Photo 





> 


>roundabouts, addin! g miles to their journeys, British newspapers reported on 

>Thursday. 

> 



> 




> 



> 



> 



> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by fil! ing online 

_________________________________________________________________ 



181

_____ 



182






maybe this explains the Reuter's article: The US Army Signal Corp had it's own special pigeon 

messaging unit until the 1950's or so. A young Mr. Reuter (of Reuter's News fame) made his fortune 

sending financial information via messenger pigeon. 



















S! #1: Listen. In order to maintain air-speed velocity, a swallow needs to 


A: Please! 





my point. 




S #2: Oh, yeah... 




>To: journal 


183

Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:24:06 -0800 (PST) 

> 



&! gt;this apply to only English pigeons, or do American pigeons follow the roads 



>Cynthia 

> 




> 




> 

>AP Photo 





> 


>roundabouts, addin! g miles to their journeys, British newspapers reported on 

>Thursday. 

> 



> 




> 



> 



> 



> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by fil! ing online 

_________________________________________________________________ 



184

_____ 



185



Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 12:02 AM 



Ok, here is some other interesting info on the homing pigeons. I think I figured out the road thing. This 

says the pigeons use some magnetic field to help find there way, but that they also need a map. 

Obviously, they are members of AAA. 

But the real news is: We now know the real reason they grounded the Concord. It was making all the 

homing pigeons get lost. 

This is from the BBC. 

Thursday, 16 March, 2000, 13:53 GMT 

Concorde sends pigeons off course 

Concorde: May "deafen" the birds 

Shock waves from Concorde may be to blame for the mysterious disappearance of thousands of homing pigeons, 

scientists believe. 

The supersonic airliner could "deafen" the birds, preventing them from hearing the low-frequency sounds that may help 

them to find their way home, New Scientist magazine reports. 

In June 1997, 60,000 English pigeons were released in France and around a third of them were never seen again. It has 

now been suggested the birds lost their way after crossing the path of low frequency shock waves generated by 

Concorde's sonic boom. 

Pigeons have the equivalent of an in-built compass which allows them to navigate using the Earth's magnetic field and the 

position of the Sun. But they also need a map sense as well - a mental chart linking their starting point with their 

destination. 


maybe this explains the Reuter's article: The US Army Signal Corp had it's own special pigeon 

messaging unit until the 1950's or so. A young Mr. Reuter (of Reuter's News fame) made his 

fortune sending financial information via messenger pigeon. 











186









S! ! #1: Listen. In order to maintain air-speed velocity, a swallow needs to 


A: Please! 





my point. 




S #2: Oh, yeah... 




>To: journal 



> 



&! amp;! gt;this apply to only English pigeons, or do American pigeons follow the roads 



>Cynthia 

> 




> 




> 

>AP Photo 





> 


>roundabout! s, addin! g miles to their journeys, British newspapers reported on 

187

_____ 

>Thursday. 

> 



> 




> 



> 



> 



> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fas! t by fil! ing online 

_________________________________________________________________ 





_____ 



188




To: journal 

Subject: 300 mil year old mountains found underground 

Mountains Buried Beneath Mississippi 

By Larry O'Hanlon, Discovery News 

189 

Font Size: [small] [medium] [large] 

Feb. 2, 2004 — There are tremendous mountains to be found in Mississippi, if you dig deep enough. 

Despite its modern mean elevation of just 300 feet, the state of Mississippi has hidden underground 

"pristine" 300-million year-old mountains that once towered thousands of feet and ranged all the way 

to Mexico, say geologists who are getting a clearer picture of the buried Ouachita Mountain range 

and the ancient collision that created it. 

"When we developed our picture here it looked very much like a picture of a modern collision zone," 

said geologist Dennis Harry of the University of Alabama. 

The layout of the once-great Ouachita Mountains have been pieced together by geologists using oil 

exploration drilling records, seismic reflection profiling and gravity measurements. Harry co-authored 

an article on the deeply buried Ouachita Mountains in the January issue of GSA Bulletin. 

In Mississippi, the peaks of the Ouachitas are 2 1/2 to 3 1/2 miles underground, with roots extending 

down to more than 20 miles, said Harry. All that mountain material, made of jumbled-up islands 

predating Pangea, create a noticeable bulge in gravitational force that's unusual for such a low-lying 

place as Mississippi, unless there are mountains underneath. 

The long-lost Ouachita Mountains of Mississippi are a remarkably unchanged remnant of a very 

different North America that was bordered by an ocean containing a large chain of Japan-like offshore 

islands, said Harry. 

The ancient Southern Ocean closed up as plate tectonics pushed continents together. When the 

island chains eventually got wedged between the sea and the North America continent, they piled up 

into mountains that stretched from present-day northern Mexico through eastern Texas, up into 

southeast Arkansas and then down into Mississippi, said University of Mississippi geologist Bill 

Thomas, who has studied other remnants of the Ouachitas. 

The island pile-up was just one part of the global continental crush that created the supercontinent 

Pangea, which became the only continent on Earth at the time. 

When Pangea eventually broke apart about 225 million years ago, the Gulf of Mexico and the modern 

arrangement of continents began to take shape. For the Ouachitas, it meant the collision forces that 

made them were gone, and they simply subsided and were buried by the muds and gravels of what 

eventually became the great rivers of the Midwest United States. 

The Ouachitas are an important part of an increasingly detailed picture geologists are getting of the 

evolution of North America, Thomas explained.

_____ 



190





Subject: Journal3 ET 

I try to be open minded and i feel like I do give everything some thought. i 

do believe in a 

lot of things. I wouldn't stake my life on anything but I do spend a lot of 

time wondering 

what life is where I can from and where I am going. I got a kick out of 

Sagans reading 

when he spoke about some people being closed minded and others being to open 

minded. For example people who live their daily lives based on what a psychic 

tell him or 

her. Not to knock the words of wisdom delivered by a psychic or tarot cards in 

fact 

sometimes i read any horescope in the paper just for fun and I do not base my 

life on it 

but I certainly can relate to it, find a topic that relates to it and ponder 

about what direction 

I am going with it. Let me go back to closed mind, neutral mind, open mind and 

too 

opend of a mind. tis brings up a topic that I have had a hard time beliving 

in, extraterrestrial 

life. I have never seen a fact opened my mind to beleive in aliens 

but is that 

closed minded of me. When I asked myself this question I instantly had, for 

lack of better 

words, sympathy for aliens if they do exist. Don't be scared my fellow 

classmates I am not 

going to re-direct my life to the study and following of extraterrestial life 

but I feel like I had 

to let the possible idea of it into a small fraction of my mind. Who am i to 

say it doesn't 

exist. This universe is so vast and untouched in so many ways that I feel like 

I have to 

keep the wonder alive just like I want my future student's to open theri minds 

to the 

possbilities of life. 

Before I leave the topic of aliens i have to mention one more thing and 

remeber I have 

bad eye sight. Last year my boyfriend, at the time, and my self were sleeping 

I woke up 

and saw this oval shaped airplane hovering outside my window it was blue I 

looked at it 

for a while and told Ernie to look and we watched it float back in forth. I 

looked at the 

clock it was 3:00 AM I laught because it was so wierd and I fell asleep again. 

I woke back 

up at 4:30AM and it was still floating outside my window and Ernie was still 

watching it. 

To this day we still ask each other what it was. With a joking tone in our 

voices we would 

say, "it was an alien" and we would laugh. I wouldn't allow the thought to 

come in my 

mind that it might actually be one. I feel like there must be some 

explaination for what we 

saw I still wonder about what explaination it would be because i was to closed 

mided to 

actually believe it could be extraterrestrial life. I am not any where near 

being convenced 

191

that it was an alien but I have to allow that small bit of wonder into my 

mind. It' is what 

keeps life exciting, to wonder about things and to not seal the deal and give 

into any one 

idea or explaination. 

Moving on to what makes sense and what doesn't make sense. Some or many of you 

might say that this e-mail doesn't makes sense. It may mean nothing to you but 

to me it 

means something. As my thoughts flow out I even sruprise myself. Do you ever 

sit back 

and ask your self what you think of life and what you were before this life 

and what and 

where you will be after, if there is even a before and after. I know what 

different religions 

say and what different theories and books have to say. Does it make sense to 

you? Can 

you challenge it and just ask youself for a second, pushing all that you have 

read aside if 

at all possible, and wonder for an hour what sense you can make of life on 

your oun. I did 

it the other day and I found a lot of sense and non-sense in my thoughts. I 

never knew 

that side of me I felt renewed and excited to see the marinistic view of life. 

I think in a lot 

of situations in life we want to open the envelope and have someone tell us 

the answers 

we think we should know. But a lot of times we already know and once the 

envelope is 

opened the process to find the anwer is taken away. It reminds me of your 

b-day or the 

holidays when you want to know what your family or friends got for you so you 

snoop 

around find and you get sad that you didn't wait and guess find out when the 

time came. I 

am willing to bet money on the fact that nobody is reading this e-mail any 

more. 

'Knowledge filters the the lens through which we see the world"-Sherman 

Everyone is right in what they believe because they believe in what they 

believe. I know 

that talk of religion and faith and science can be very frustrating but let's 

not become 

enemies because of our differences for one day we will be teaching a diverese 

class of 

miniature cohort F's and how will we face our children's differences. 

One last thought the art of science; UUUUUUUUUuuuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhh So 

nature distancing and drawings of planets is a commonality between art and 

science but 

once science began to focus on mass energy and particles it grew apart. Is 

this because 

we cannot draw energy and matter. Aren't panintings and sculptures or theatre 

full of 

energy and life and matter. i wonder if maybe in the mid 1800's when science 

and art 

began to go their individual direction that maybe they just became one of the 

same thing. 

Science being the explaination and art being the evidence. Who knows go away. 

Take 

care. Marin the Great. 

192




To: ICP-F 

Subject: Journal four 

Yes, finally, I have found something worth reading. I really like the Flu 

book. I read it at work and kept telling my kids different facts while I was 

reading. I think they thought I was a little weird. Then after I put the book 

down and realized that this book was not that bad, and I wondered why I liked 

it? First, I think because I have read more than 11 pages and the author 

hasn't told me that she was just making this Flu of 1918 up. Yet, if I get to 

the end and then I realize that this was all a fairy tale, I think I will be a 

little upset. (Don't worry I already looked it up and realized that it really 

did happen.) Also, I like it becasue it is real, and could have and did happen 

to anyone, there was nothing you could really do to save yourself, that least 

not so far in the book. So, it touchs everyone. 

I also wondered why no one tells us about this epidemic. I think it is because 

it is too scary. I mean if people knew about this tragedy every time someone 

got the flu, they would think they were dying. I mean if someone sneezed in a 

store, people would get scared and run out fearing death. I mean this last 

winter when we thought that the flu was really bad, and the news told us to go 

get the flu shot. Many people did. I instead drank orange juice every day, 

why? The smae reason because the media told me that orange juice can protect 

you from illnesses. I have no other reason, besides it tastes good. People 

including myself, are so easily manipulated into ideas. If the news mentioned 

the flu of 1918, people would go insane making random and false connections 

and think that the world was going to come to an end. I think this story is 

just too powerful for the general public, there are too many crazy people out 

there. (Good, thing I am above all that with my college education. hee hee) 

When I first started to read this book, I was not really taken back from the 

numbers until somewhere (I promised I read it) it said that 1 out of four 

people died from this disease. I was amazed. I looked around my house at work 

and realized two of my kids would have died. One person in my family would 

have died, 11 girls in my sorority would be dead. Then I realized that maybe 

this illnesses should come back. There would be so much parking availible on 

campus, less, time waiting at the grocery store, I would have priority 

registration for classes, less people to compete with when I want a job. The 

world is too overpopulated anyways. Then I realized, I am twenty one years 

old, I probably would have been the one to die. Then I realized this flu thing 

would only help if I could decided who died (good-bye professor fierro)and 

since God probably won't let that happen anytime soon. I am really glad I 

don't live in 1918, and will hope that this doesn't repeat itself anytime 

soon. 

193



Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 12:05 PM 


Subject: Journal #4 - Bush Calls Gay Marriage Ruling 'Troubling' 

Attachments: Check out AOL News - Bush Calls Gay Marriage Ruling 'Troubling' 

Check out AOL 

News - Bush Call... 


Ann's Journal #4, Bush opposing gay marriages, 

Can't we just live and let live? If this is not your cup of tea, don't drink it! Why do we try and tell other 

adults how to live their lives? 

Sense, non-sense: Homosexuality is not contagious. 

If sexuality were contagious, then there would not be any homosexuals. 

Ann 

_____ 



194





Subject: Re: Journal #4 - Bush Calls Gay Marriage Ruling 'Troubling' 

I don't think President Bush is telling anyone how to live their lives. The purpose of marriage, from the 

Christian point of view, (feel free to correct me if I am wrong about this) is to procreate. Couples of the 

same sex cannot procreate without an outside source of the opposite sex, therefore, no need to get 

married. That doesn't mean you can't live your life the way you want. President Bush is not telliing 

anyone they can't be gay, and like you, he is just stating his opinion based on his beliefs. 

Cynthia 




Can't we just live and let live? If this is not your cup of tea, don't drink it! Why do we try and tell 

other adults how to live their lives? 



Ann 

_____ 



> ATTACHMENT part 2 message/rfc822 

From: Zestydu69@aol.com 

Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 09:32:34 EST 

Subject: Check out AOL News - Bush Calls Gay Marriage Ruling 'Troubling' 

To: zestydu69@yahoo.com 

Click here: AOL News - Bush Calls Gay Marriage Ruling 'Troubling' 

_____ 



195






Cynthia, I hear what you are saying. This is how I feel. Although marriage may have began as a 

union to ensure the livelihoods of possible offspring, I think marriage is more than a union to 

procreate. I think marriage is a commitment to another individual of whom you choose to spend your 

life with. It's like a buddy system of love, support, and companionship. I think marriage makes the 

commitment of two individuals recognized, valid, official, etc. As for children, gay couples are 

perfectly capable of having their own offspring (as are couples who are infertile) or raising some of 

the countless children who need a loving and stable home environment. 

As for the president, by his disapproval of the legalization of homosexual marriage, he is denying a 

large portion of the united states the right to celebrate, strengthen, and further their commitment to 

one another. It used to be illegal for blacks and whites to get married too. I wonder if people truly 

believe that homosexuality is wrong, or are they just brainwashed by a society that is run 

through churches, presidents, and the like that tell them how to feel about it. I am not saying that 

everyone should be homosexual or anything, I am just suggesting that our views and feelings could 

be passed down and influenced by the strong disapproval of homosexuality from past generations 

and from the churches. 

I brought this article up because it is a current event in the paper and because it is one of the many 

views of the church (religion) that continues to be a topic of debate. It is also an extension of the 

multicultural/diversity we will be encountering in our future professions as educators, as well as the 

future of tomorrow. 

I think people should be free to go to church and honor whatever religion they choose, if any. I think 

some people have the impression that I am against religion, but I am not. I believe some people 

need that structure to live their lives by; and I can see how it can bring a sense of comfort for them. I 

have a brother who is Christian and who is strongly into his religion, and I also have a sister who is a 

lesbian. I can see both view points. I see that religion has brought a sense of purpose to my 

brother's life, and that is good for him. But I do not think my sister should be denied the same rights 

that the general population are given automatically. She, as do countless other individuals, deserve 

the same right to have their love for their unions to be legalized. 

It seems as though president Bush, in the name of religion, is blocking the legalization of homosexual 

marriage. So yes, it does seem to me that by fighting against the legalization of marriage for this 

population of our society, he is keeping homosexuals from achieving a higher level of commitment to 

one another. They have the right to be married just like anyone else in this world does. 

If we really think about it, would it really harm anyone if homosexual marriage was legalized? 

Ann 


I don't think President Bush is telling anyone how to live their lives. The purpose of marriage, from 

the Christian point of view, (feel free to correct me if I am wrong about this) is to procreate. 

Couples of the same sex cannot procreate without an outside source of the opposite sex, 

196

therefore, no need to get married. That doesn't mean you can't live your life the way you want. 

President Bush is not telliing anyone they can't be gay, and like you, he is just stating his opinion 

based on his beliefs. 

Cynthia 




Can't we just live and let live? If this is not your cup of tea, don't drink it! Why do we try and 

tell other adults how to live their lives? 



Ann 

_____ 

_____ 











_____ 



197





Subject: Re: Journal four 

I do think it is possible that it could theorectically happen again. However, I think there are some 

things that are different today that prevent it from happening. Take the SARS situation for example. 

That had the potential to spread all over and kill tons of people, but why didn't it? One big difference 

(in my opinion), is communication. News of SARS spread around the world. The world took action by 

limiting travel to and from the afftected areas. I think this goes a long way to stop the spread of 

disease. Another difference is that there was a shortage of medical practitioners back then. While 

there is no cure for the flu, doctors are able to treat pnemonia and things, which was often the real 

cause of death in 1918, not the flu. And the technology we have to day is more advanced than in that 

time. For anybody still worried about dying from the flu, here are some precautions you can take that 

have been successful (according to some) in the past: 

Chicken or Pigeon soup (there's those damn pigeons again) 

The medicine of choice was a hot onion poultice on the chest. To prepare the poultice the onions 

were sliced and heated in the skillet until very hot 

Something else I found online: The flu epidemic was purportedly caused by vaccines given to the 

soldiers and other people like health workers. Could this be why young adults and healthy were the 

ones dying? Evidently, the soldiers were given between 14 and 25 vaccines for various diseases. 

SENSE OR NONSENSE? 

Cynthia 


Yes, finally, I have found something worth reading. I really like the Flu 

book. I read it at work and kept telling my kids different facts while I was 

reading. I think they thought I was a little weird. Then after I put the book 

down and realized that this book was not that bad, and I wondered why I liked 

it? First, I think because I have read more than 11 pages and the author 

hasn't told me that she was just making this Flu of 1918 up. Yet, if I get to 

the end and then I realize that this was all a fairy tale, I think I will be a 

little upset. (Don't worry I already looked it up and realized that it really 

did happen.) Also, I like it becasue it is real, and could have and did happen 

to anyone, there was nothing you could really do to save yourself, that least 

not so far in the book. So, it touchs everyone. 

I also wondered why no o! ne tells us about this epidemic. I think it is because 

it is too scary. I mean if people knew about this tragedy every time someone 

got the flu, they would think they were dying. I mean if someone sneezed in a 

store, people would get scared and run out fearing death. I mean this last 

winter when we thought that the flu was really bad, and the news told us to go 

get the flu shot. Many people did. I instead drank orange juice every day, 

why? The smae reason because the media told me that orange juice can protect 

you from illnesses. I have no other reason, besides it tastes good. People 

including myself, are so easily manipulated into ideas. If the news mentioned 

the flu of 1918, people would go insane making random and false connections 

198

and think that the world was going to come to an end. I think this story is 

just too powerful for the general public, there are too many crazy people out 

there. (Good, thing I am above all that with my co! llege education. hee hee) 

When I first started to read this book, I was not really taken back from the 

numbers until somewhere (I promised I read it) it said that 1 out of four 

people died from this disease. I was amazed. I looked around my house at work 

and realized two of my kids would have died. One person in my family would 

have died, 11 girls in my sorority would be dead. Then I realized that maybe 

this illnesses should come back. There would be so much parking availible on 

campus, less, time waiting at the grocery store, I would have priority 

registration for classes, less people to compete with when I want a job. The 

world is too overpopulated anyways. Then I realized, I am twenty one years 

old, I probably would have been the one to die. Then I realized this flu thing 

would only help if I could decided who died (good-bye professor fierro)and 

since God probably won't let that happen anytime soon. I am really glad I 

don't li! ve in 1918, and will hope that this doesn't repeat itself anytime 

soon. 

_____ 



199






Ann, I understand what you are saying. I wanted to make the point that the President is a Christian 

and has a right to his opinion. The marriage laws were based on the Christian religion, so I can 

understand why people feel that it should be between a man and a woman. President Bush would 

have to compromise his integrity to pretend to support something he doesn't believe in. In the same 

way, I wouldn't expect you or anybody else to stand up for something you don't believe in. I don't 

think anybody need a piece of paper to commit to someone else. And I think perhaps the main 

reason that the gay community is fighting to get included is for financial reasons. Of course, that is a 

generalization, because no doubt, there are exceptions. Myself, I do not support gay marriage, 

however, I think that they should be able to file joint tax returns, get health care as a couple and 

things like that. My opinion is only that, and no! t based on religion. I have no problem with people 

living their lives in the manner they see fit, just as I do. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, I hear what you are saying. This is how I feel. Although marriage may have began as a 

union to ensure the livelihoods of possible offspring, I think marriage is more than a union to 

procreate. I think marriage is a commitment to another individual of whom you choose to spend 

your life with. It's like a buddy system of love, support, and companionship. I think marriage 

makes the commitment of two individuals recognized, valid, official, etc. As for children, gay 

couples are perfectly capable of having their own offspring (as are couples who are infertile) or 

raising some of the countless children who need a loving and stable home environment. 

As for the president, by his disapproval of the legalization of homosexual marriage, he is denying 

a large portion of the united states the right to celebrate, strengthen, and further their commitment 

to one another. It used to be illegal for blacks and whites to get married too. I wonder if people 

truly believe that homosexuality is wrong, or are they just brainwashed by a society that is run 

through churches, presidents, and the like that tell them how to feel about it. I am not saying that 

everyone should be homosexual or anything, I am just suggesting that our views and feelings 

could be passed down and influenced by the strong disapproval of homosexuality from past 

generations and from the churches. 

I brought this article up because it is a current event in the paper and because it is one of the 

many views of the church (religion) that continues to be a topic of debate. It is also an extension 

of the multicultural/diversity we will be encountering in our future professions as educators, as well 

as the future of tomorrow. 

I think people should be free to go to church and honor whatever religion they choose, if any. I 

think some people have the impression that I am against religion, but I am not. I believe some 

people need that structure to live their lives by; and I can see how it can bring a sense of comfort 

for them. I have a brother who is Christian and who is strongly into his religion, and I also have a 

sister who is a lesbian. I can see both view points. I see that religion has brought a sense of 

purpose to my brother's life, and that is good for him. But I do not think my sister should be 

denied the same rights that the general population are given automatically. She, as do countless 

other individuals, deserve the same right to have their love for their unions to be legalized. 

200

It seems as though president Bush, in the name of religion, is blocking the legalization of 

homosexual marriage. So yes, it does seem to me that by fighting against the legalization of 

marriage for this population of our society, he is keeping homosexuals from achieving a higher 

level of commitment to one another. They have the right to be married just like anyone else in this 

world does. 


Ann 


_____ 

I don't think President Bush is telling anyone how to live their lives. The purpose of marriage, 

from the Christian point of view, (feel free to correct me if I am wrong about this) is to 

procreate. Couples of the same sex cannot procreate without an outside source of the 

opposite sex, therefore, no need to get married. That doesn't mean you can't live your life the 

way you want. President Bush is not telliing anyone they can't be gay, and like you, he is just 

stating his opinion based on his beliefs. 

Cynthia 




Can't we just live and let live? If this is not your cup of tea, don't drink it! Why do we try 

and tell other adults how to live their lives? 



Ann 









201

_____ 

_____ 





_____ 



202




To: journal 

Subject: gay marriage (for balance) 

Just for balance, Kerry doesn't approve of gay marriage either. 

Cynthia 

Statement from John Kerry on Massachusetts Gay Marriage Ruling 

http://www.johnkerry.com/images/pixel.gif 

November 18, 2003 

For Immediate Release 

“I have long believed that gay men and lesbians should be assured equal protection and the same 

benefits – from health to survivor benefits to hospital visitation - that all families deserve. While I 

continue to oppose gay marriage, I believe that today’s decision calls on the Massachusetts state 

legislature to take action to ensure equal protection for gay couples. These protections are long over 

due.” 

_____ 



203






Hey Cynthia, 

I see that we have a difference of opinion, and that is fine. Everyone is entitled to feel how they feel. 

Everyone brings to the table their own wagon-full of life's experiences, which makes their viewpoints 

unique from others. In the process of respecting other people's viewpoints on issues such as these, I 

only hope that each person gains a better understanding for the diverse issues we live with. 

I realize that change happens very slowly in societies, otherwise their would be chaos and turmoil. 

I just wish that everyone would get along in our society: live, love, be happy, help one another. We 

can not fully understand one another until we have walked in each others shoes. People fear 

what they do not understand, and then again, I fear what I do understand. 

See ya later alligator, 



Ann, I understand what you are saying. I wanted to make the point that the President is a 

Christian and has a right to his opinion. The marriage laws were based on the Christian religion, 

so I can understand why people feel that it should be between a man and a woman. 

President Bush would have to compromise his integrity to pretend to support something he 

doesn't believe in. In the same way, I wouldn't expect you or anybody else to stand up for 

something you don't believe in. I don't think anybody need a piece of paper to commit to someone 

else. And I think perhaps the main reason that the gay community is fighting to get included is for 

financial reasons. Of course, that is a generalization, because no doubt, there are exceptions. 

Myself, I do not support gay marriage, however, I think that they should be able to file joint tax 

returns, get health care as a couple and things like that. My opinion is only that, and no! ! t based 

on religion. I have no problem with people living their lives in the manner they see fit, just as I do. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, I hear what you are saying. This is how I feel. Although marriage may have began as 

a union to ensure the livelihoods of possible offspring, I think marriage is more than a union to 

procreate. I think marriage is a commitment to another individual of whom you choose to 

spend your life with. It's like a buddy system of love, support, and companionship. I think 

marriage makes the commitment of two individuals recognized, valid, official, etc. As for 

children, gay couples are perfectly capable of having their own offspring (as are couples who 

are infertile) or raising some of the countless children who need a loving and stable home 

environment. 

As for the president, by his disapproval of the legalization of homosexual marriage, he is 

204

denying a large portion of the united states the right to celebrate, strengthen, and further their 

commitment to one another. It used to be illegal for blacks and whites to get married too. 

I wonder if people truly believe that homosexuality is wrong, or are they just brainwashed 

by a society that is run through churches, presidents, and the like that tell them how to feel 

about it. I am not saying that everyone should be homosexual or anything, I am just 

suggesting that our views and feelings could be passed down and influenced by the 

strong disapproval of homosexuality from past generations and from the churches. 

I brought this article up because it is a current event in the paper and because it is one of the 

many views of the church (religion) that continues to be a topic of debate. It is also an 

extension of the multicultural/diversity we will be encountering in our future professions as 

educators, as well as the future of tomorrow. 

I think people should be free to go to church and honor whatever religion they choose, if any. I 

think some people have the impression that I am against religion, but I am not. I believe some 

people need that structure to live their lives by; and I can see how it can bring a sense of 

comfort for them. I have a brother who is Christian and who is strongly into his religion, and I 

also have a sister who is a lesbian. I can see both view points. I see that religion has brought 

a sense of purpose to my brother's life, and that is good for him. But I do not think my sister 

should be denied the same rights that the general population are given automatically. She, as 

do countless other individuals, deserve the same right to have their love for their unions to be 

legalized. 

It seems as though president Bush, in the name of religion, is blocking the legalization of 

homosexual marriage. So yes, it does seem to me that by fighting against the legalization of 

marriage for this population of our society, he is keeping homosexuals from achieving a higher 

level of commitment to one another. They have the right to be married just like anyone else in 

this world does. 


Ann 


I don't think President Bush is telling anyone how to live their lives. The purpose of 

marriage, from the Christian point of view, (feel free to correct me if I am wrong about this) 

is to procreate. Couples of the same sex cannot procreate without an outside source of the 

opposite sex, therefore, no need to get married. That doesn't mean you can't live your life 

the way you want. President Bush is not telliing anyone they can't be gay, and like you, he 

is just stating his opinion based on his beliefs. 

Cynthia 




Can't we just live and let live? If this is not your cup of tea, don't drink it! Why do we try 

205

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

and tell other adults how to live their lives? 



Ann 















_____ 



206






Jesus was a gay, black, alien woman. 

Mike "Stirring the Stew" Runnestrand 

>From: Ann Kirkendall 



>Subject: Re: Journal #4 - Bush Calls Gay Marriage Ruling 'Troubling' 

>Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:18:28 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>Hey Cynthia, 

> 

>I see that we have a difference of opinion, and that is fine. Everyone is 

>entitled to feel how they feel. Everyone brings to the table their own 

>wagon-full of life's experiences, which makes their viewpoints unique from 

>others. In the process of respecting other people's viewpoints on issues 

>such as these, I only hope that each person gains a better understanding 

>for the diverse issues we live with. 

> 

>I realize that change happens very slowly in societies, otherwise their 

>would be chaos and turmoil. 

> 

>I just wish that everyone would get along in our society: live, love, be 

>happy, help one another. We can not fully understand one another until we 

>have walked in each others shoes. People fear what they do not understand, 

>and then again, I fear what I do understand. 

> 

>See ya later alligator, 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 

>Cynthia Reyes wrote: 

>Ann, I understand what you are saying. I wanted to make the point that the 

>President is a Christian and has a right to his opinion. The marriage laws 

>were based on the Christian religion, so I can understand why people feel 

>that it should be between a man and a woman. President Bush would have to 

>compromise his integrity to pretend to support something he doesn't believe 

>in. In the same way, I wouldn't expect you or anybody else to stand up for 

>something you don't believe in. I don't think anybody need a piece of paper 

>to commit to someone else. And I think perhaps the main reason that the 

>gay community is fighting to get included is for financial reasons. Of 

>course, that is a generalization, because no doubt, there are exceptions. 

>Myself, I do not support gay marriage, however, I think that they should be 

>able to file joint tax returns, get health care as a couple and things like 

>that. My opinion is only that, and no! t based on religion. I have no 

>problem with people li! 

> ving 

> their lives in the manner they see fit, just as I do. 

>Cynthia 

> 

>Ann Kirkendall wrote: 

>Cynthia, I hear what you are saying. This is how I feel. Although 

>marriage may have began as a union to ensure the livelihoods of possible 

207

offspring, I think marriage is more than a union to procreate. I think 

>marriage is a commitment to another individual of whom you choose to spend 

>your life with. It's like a buddy system of love, support, and 

>companionship. I think marriage makes the commitment of two individuals 

>recognized, valid, official, etc. As for children, gay couples are 

>perfectly capable of having their own offspring (as are couples who are 

>infertile) or raising some of the countless children who need a loving and 

>stable home environment. 

> 

>As for the president, by his disapproval of the legalization of homosexual 

>marriage, he is denying a large portion of the united states the right to 

>celebrate, strengthen, and further their commitment to one another. It 

>used to be illegal for blacks and whites to get married too. I wonder if 

>people truly believe that homosexuality is wrong, or are they just 

>brainwashed by a society that is run through churches, presidents, and the 

>like that tell them how to feel about it. I am not saying that everyone 

>should be homosexual or anything, I am just suggesting that our views and 

>feelings could be passed down and influenced by the strong disapproval of 

>homosexuality from past generations and from the churches. 

> 

>I brought this article up because it is a current event in the paper and 

>because it is one of the many views of the church (religion) that continues 

>to be a topic of debate. It is also an extension of the 

>multicultural/diversity we will be encountering in our future professions 

>as educators, as well as the future of tomorrow. 

> 

>I think people should be free to go to church and honor whatever religion 

>they choose, if any. I think some people have the impression that I am 

>against religion, but I am not. I believe some people need that structure 

>to live their lives by; and I can see how it can bring a sense of comfort 

>for them. I have a brother who is Christian and who is strongly into his 

>religion, and I also have a sister who is a lesbian. I can see both view 

>points. I see that religion has brought a sense of purpose to my brother's 

>life, and that is good for him. But I do not think my sister should be 

>denied the same rights that the general population are given automatically. 

> She, as do countless other individuals, deserve the same right to have 

>their love for their unions to be legalized. 

> 

>It seems as though president Bush, in the name of religion, is blocking the 

>legalization of homosexual marriage. So yes, it does seem to me that by 

>fighting against the legalization of marriage for this population of our 

>society, he is keeping homosexuals from achieving a higher level of 

>commitment to one another. They have the right to be married just like 

>anyone else in this world does. 

> 

>If we really think about it, would it really harm anyone if homosexual 

>marriage was legalized? 

> 

>Ann 

> 


>I don't think President Bush is telling anyone how to live their lives. The 

>purpose of marriage, from the Christian point of view, (feel free to 

>correct me if I am wrong about this) is to procreate. Couples of the same 

>sex cannot procreate without an outside source of the opposite sex, 

>therefore, no need to get married. That doesn't mean you can't live your 

>life the way you want. President Bush is not telliing anyone they can't be 

>gay, and like you, he is just stating his opinion based on his beliefs. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

> 

>Note: forwarded message attached. 

> 

> 

208


> 

>Can't we just live and let live? If this is not your cup of tea, don't 

>drink it! Why do we try and tell other adults how to live their lives? 

> 

>Sense, non-sense: Homosexuality is not contagious. 

>If sexuality were contagious, then there would not be any homosexuals. 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

> > ATTACHMENT part 2 message/rfc822 

>From: Zestydu69@aol.com 

>Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 09:32:34 EST 

>Subject: Check out AOL News - Bush Calls Gay Marriage Ruling 'Troubling' 

>To: zestydu69@yahoo.com 

> 

>Click here: AOL News - Bush Calls Gay Marriage Ruling 'Troubling' 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



209






Mike you certainly add the element of chaos! :) 

Jenny 

210




To: journal 

Subject: How about the timing of this news article? 

Study Shows Why 1918 Flu Epidemic Was So Deadly 

Reuters 

Fri Feb 6,12:17 AM ET 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/my/my16.gif Add Science - Reuters to My Yahoo! 

By Maggie Fox, Health and Science Correspondent 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The 1918 flu virus, which killed 20 million people around the world, was 

probably so deadly because of a unique bird-like protein, U.S. and British scientists reported on 

Thursday. 

Photo 

Reuters Photo 

Like a current outbreak of bird flu in east Asia, the 1918 influenza appears to have jumped from birds to people with little 

change, they wrote in this week's issue of the journal Science. 

But unlike the 1918 flu, the current bird flu, which has killed 16 people, so far has not developed the mutation that allowed 

influenza to decimate human populations 80 years ago. 

"What (this study) says is this transmission between birds and humans seems to be able to happen in more than one 

way," John Skehel of Britain's Medical Research Council, who led one study, said in a telephone interview. 

Two teams of researchers analyzed samples of the virus from the 1918 outbreak and said it bears the clear hallmarks of a 

bird virus that mutated very little before jumping from birds to people. 

Health officials in China, Thailand, South Korea (news - web sites) and Vietnam are scrambling to control the current 

outbreak of avian influenza, known as H5N1. It is lethal to people, which is often the case when viruses leap from one 

species to another. 

In 1997 when it first appeared in Hong Kong it was contained very quickly because it did not spread from human to 

human, but only from birds to people. 

So far this year only 16 people have been killed, but there is some evidence it may have begun spreading from person to 

person. If that happens, experts fear the virus has the potential to be as bad as the 1918 epidemic. 

Understanding just what it is about the viruses that makes them deadly, and what makes them able to live and spread 

among humans, will be key to controlling or pre-empting future epidemics, the researchers noted. 

DUG UP FROM THE PAST 

Skehel's team and another led by Ian Wilson at the Scripps Research Institute in La Jolla, California looked at bits of the 

virus extracted from the bodies of victims, some buried in Alaska permafrost and others saved in laboratory jars. 

They looked specifically at a part of the virus called hemagglutinin, which is a protein the virus uses to infect cells. Each 

strain of virus has a unique hemagglutinin structure, and scientists believe small mutations of the protein are what allows 

the virus to infect new species. 

211

The 1918 virus was an H1 virus -- different from H5N1. 

They found it had some unique structures that may have given it "novel mechanisms" for infecting people, Wilson and 

colleagues wrote. This may explain why the 1918 epidemic killed so many young, healthy adults. 

And this explains why the current avian flu outbreak has, so far, not lived up to fears, said Skehel. 

"Presumably, what's blocking this current flu from spreading person-to-person is that its hemagglutinin structure has not 

yet evolved such that it can efficiently infect humans," Skehel said in a statement. 

"This tells us more about the transmission of infections from birds to humans," he added. 

"However, it will not have an immediate impact on the situation currently unfolding in the Far East with the chicken flu 

known as H5, since, from our previous work, we know that the 1918 and the H5 hemagglutinins are quite different." 

He said scientists should be testing birds for various forms of influenza to see what else may be lurking out there with the 

potential to infect people. 

_____ 



212



Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 7:07 AM 


Subject: Re: How about the timing of this news article? 

!Si, Que intersante! Speak of the devel. 

Ann 


Study Shows Why 1918 Flu Epidemic Was So Deadly 

Reuters 

Fri Feb 6,12:17 AM ET 


By Maggie Fox, Health and Science Correspondent 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The 1918 flu virus, which killed 20 million people around the world, 

was probably so deadly because of a unique bird-like protein, U.S. and British scientists reported 

on Thursday. 

Photo 

Reuters Photo 

Like a current outbreak of bird flu in east Asia, the 1918 influenza appears to have jumped from birds to people with 

little change, they wrote in this week's issue of the journal Science. 

But unlike the 1918 flu, the current bird flu, which has killed 16 people, so far has not developed the mutation that 

allowed influenza to decimate human populations 80 years ago. 

"What (this study) says is this transmission between birds and humans seems to be able to happen in more than one 

way," John Skehel of Britain's Medical Research Council, who led one study, said in a telephone interview. 

Two teams of researchers analyzed samples of the virus from the 1918 outbreak and said it bears the clear hallmarks 

of a bird virus that mutated very little before jumping from birds to people. 

Health officials in China, Thailand, South Korea (news - web sites) and Vietnam are scrambling to control the current 

outbreak of avian influenza, known as H5N1. It is lethal to people, which is often the case when viruses leap from one 

species to another. 

In 1997 when it first appeared in Hong Kong it was contained very quickly because it did not spread from human to 

human, but only from birds to people. 

So far this year only 16 people have been killed, but there is some evidence it may have begun spreading from 

person to person. If that happens, experts fear the virus has the potential to be as bad as the 1918 epidemic. 

Understanding just what it is about the viruses that makes them deadly, and what makes them able to live and spread 

among humans, will be key to controlling or pre-empting future epidemics, the researchers noted. 

DUG UP FROM THE PAST 

213

Skehel's team and another led by Ian Wilson at the Scripps Research Institute in La Jolla, California looked at bits of 

the virus extracted from the bodies of victims, some buried in Alaska permafrost and others saved in laboratory jars. 

They looked specifically at a part of the virus called hemagglutinin, which is a protein the virus uses to infect cells. 

Each strain of virus has a unique hemagglutinin structure, and scientists believe small mutations of the protein are 

what allows the virus to infect new species. 

The 1918 virus was an H1 virus -- different from H5N1. 

They found it had some unique structures that may have given it "novel mechanisms" for infecting people, Wilson and 

colleagues wrote. This may explain why the 1918 epidemic killed so many young, healthy adults. 

And this explains why the current avian flu outbreak has, so far, not lived up to fears, said Skehel. 

"Presumably, what's blocking this current flu from spreading person-to-person is that its hemagglutinin structure has 

not yet evolved such that it can efficiently infect humans," Skehel said in a statement. 

"This tells us more about the transmission of infections from birds to humans," he added. 

"However, it will not have an immediate impact on the situation currently unfolding in the Far East with the chicken flu 

known as H5, since, from our previous work, we know that the 1918 and the H5 hemagglutinins are quite different." 

He said scientists should be testing birds for various forms of influenza to see what else may be lurking out there with 

the potential to infect people. 

_____ 



_____ 



214





Subject: opps 

Opps, I mean "devil" 


_____ 



215





Subject: THE BIRD FLU RE: How about the timing of this news article? 

Well, what do you know? Birds get the flu too. Since this avian flu in East 

Asia has already victimized 16 people, I wonder exactly how this H5N1 was 

transmitted from bird to human. Hmmm...do I want to know? And since this flu 

may have begun evolving to pass from human to human, and it's not strong 

enough to be as deadly as the flu of 1918 yet, I hope the evolution of this 

bird flu doen't happen too quickly. I know that I don't want to die because 

of some bird! 

Reading this article also makes me wonder how they name these flu"s": H5N1, 

H5, H1, etc. Maybe it has something to do with the hemagglitinin, you know, 

"[the] protein the virus uses to infect cells." And I wonder if they will be 

able to contain this one within East Asia? I mean, how can you keep a bird 

(if it's in the wild) from flying to other countries and geographical areas? 

In fact, how does one know exactly which birds to contain? 

Wow, I find this really, really interesting. Okay, so here is my second 

incentive to start Kolata's book. 

P.S. Cynthia, you are so Internet savvy! I wish I was motivated to read as 

much as you do. (I'll keep on wishing.) 




>To: journal 

>Subject: How about the timing of this news article? 


> 

>Study Shows Why 1918 Flu Epidemic Was So Deadly 

> Fri Feb 6,12:17 AM ET 

>Add Science - Reuters to My Yahoo! 

>By Maggie Fox, Health and Science Correspondent 

>WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The 1918 flu virus, which killed 20 million people 

>around the world, was probably so deadly because of a unique bird-like 

>protein, U.S. and British scientists reported on Thursday. 

> 

>Reuters Photo 

> 

>Like a current outbreak of bird flu in east Asia, the 1918 influenza 

>appears to have jumped from birds to people with little change, they wrote 

>in this week's issue of the journal Science. 

> 

>But unlike the 1918 flu, the current bird flu, which has killed 16 people, 

>so far has not developed the mutation that allowed influenza to decimate 

>human populations 80 years ago. 

> 

>"What (this study) says is this transmission between birds and humans seems 

>to be able to happen in more than one way," John Skehel of Britain's 

>Medical Research Council, who led one study, said in a telephone interview. 

> 

>Two teams of researchers analyzed samples of the virus from the 1918 

>outbreak and said it bears the clear hallmarks of a bird virus that mutated 

>very little before jumping from birds to people. 

> 

216

Health officials in China, Thailand, South Korea (news - web sites) and 

>Vietnam are scrambling to control the current outbreak of avian influenza, 

>known as H5N1. It is lethal to people, which is often the case when viruses 

>leap from one species to another. 

> 

>In 1997 when it first appeared in Hong Kong it was contained very quickly 

>because it did not spread from human to human, but only from birds to 

>people. 

> 

>So far this year only 16 people have been killed, but there is some 

>evidence it may have begun spreading from person to person. If that 

>happens, experts fear the virus has the potential to be as bad as the 1918 

>epidemic. 

> 

>Understanding just what it is about the viruses that makes them deadly, and 

>what makes them able to live and spread among humans, will be key to 

>controlling or pre-empting future epidemics, the researchers noted. 

> 

>DUG UP FROM THE PAST 

> 

>Skehel's team and another led by Ian Wilson at the Scripps Research 

>Institute in La Jolla, California looked at bits of the virus extracted 

>from the bodies of victims, some buried in Alaska permafrost and others 

>saved in laboratory jars. 

> 

>They looked specifically at a part of the virus called hemagglutinin, which 

>is a protein the virus uses to infect cells. Each strain of virus has a 

>unique hemagglutinin structure, and scientists believe small mutations of 

>the protein are what allows the virus to infect new species. 

> 

>The 1918 virus was an H1 virus -- different from H5N1. 

> 

>They found it had some unique structures that may have given it "novel 

>mechanisms" for infecting people, Wilson and colleagues wrote. This may 

>explain why the 1918 epidemic killed so many young, healthy adults. 

> 

>And this explains why the current avian flu outbreak has, so far, not lived 

>up to fears, said Skehel. 

> 

>"Presumably, what's blocking this current flu from spreading 

>person-to-person is that its hemagglutinin structure has not yet evolved 

>such that it can efficiently infect humans," Skehel said in a statement. 

> 

>"This tells us more about the transmission of infections from birds to 

>humans," he added. 

> 

>"However, it will not have an immediate impact on the situation currently 

>unfolding in the Far East with the chicken flu known as H5, since, from our 

>previous work, we know that the 1918 and the H5 hemagglutinins are quite 

>different." 

>He said scientists should be testing birds for various forms of influenza 

>to see what else may be lurking out there with the potential to infect 

>people. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Get some great ideas here for your sweetheart on Valentine's Day - and 

beyond. http://special.msn.com/network/celebrateromance.armx 

217

218





Subject: RE: THE BIRD FLU RE: How about the timing of this news article? 

I always felt I'd be killed by a bird. But I always envisioned it as more of a cage match 

with an ostrich in heat. 

Do birds go into heat? Probably not, but it adds a bit of sex humor to the violent joke. 

This makes it appeal to a broader audience. This has been saturday's comedy lesson with 

Mike. 


From: "Jennifer Ramos" 

Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 6:37 PM 

To: "ICP-F@csusm.edu" 

Subject: THE BIRD FLU RE: How about the timing of this news article? 







of some bird! 





(if it's in the wild) from flying to other countries and geographical areas? 









>To: journal 



> 








> 


> 



219

in this week's issue of the journal Science. 

> 




> 




> 




> 

>Health officials in China, Thailand, South Korea (news - web sites) and 




> 



>people. 

> 

>So far this year only 16 people have been killed, but there is some 



>epidemic. 

> 




> 


> 





> 





> 


> 




> 

>And this explains why the current avian flu outbreak has, so far, not lived 


> 




> 



> 




>different." 



220

people. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



221





Subject: Re: THE BIRD FLU RE: How about the timing of this news article? 

From the CDC: 

Characteristics of Avian Influenza in Birds 

Certain water birds act as hosts of influenza viruses by carrying the virus in their intestines and 

shedding it. Infected birds shed virus in saliva, nasal secretions and feces. Avian influenza viruses 

spread among susceptible birds when they have contact with contaminated nasal, respiratory and 

fecal material from infected birds; however, fecal-to-oral transmission is the most common mode of 

spread. 

Most influenza viruses cause no symptoms, or only mild ones in wild birds; however, the range of 

symptoms in birds varies greatly depending on the strain of virus and the type of bird. Infection with 

certain avian influenza A viruses (for example, some H5 and H7 strains) can cause widespread 

disease and death among some species of wild and especially domesticated birds such as chickens 

and turkeys. 

More Info: 

http://www.who.int/csr/don/2004_01_15/en/ world health organization 

http://www.vadscorner.com/h5n1.html 

Avian Influenza Infections in Humans 

Confirmed instances of avian influenza viruses infecting humans since 1997 include: 

• 1997: In Hong Kong, avian influenza A (H5N1) infected both chickens and humans. This was the 

first time an avian influenza virus had ever been found to transmit directly from birds to humans. 

During this outbreak, 18 people were hospitalized and 6 of them died. To control the outbreak, 

authorities killed about 1.5 million chickens to remove the source of the virus. Scientists 

determined that the virus spread primarily from birds to humans, though rare person-to-person 

infection was noted. 

• 1999: In Hong Kong, cases of avian influenza A H9N2 were confirmed in 2 children. Both patients 

222

ecovered, and no additional cases were confirmed. The evidence suggested that poultry was the 

source of infection and the main mode of transmission was from bird to human. However, the 

possibility of person-to-person transmission remained open. Several additional human H9N2 

infections were reported from mainland China in 1998-99. 

• 2003: Two cases of avian influenza A (H5N1) infection occurred among members of a Hong Kong 

family that had traveled to China. One person recovered, the other died. How or where these 2 

family members were infected was not determined. Another family member died of a respiratory 

illness in China, but no testing was done. No additional cases were reported. 

• 2003: Avian influenza A (H7N7) infections among poultry workers and their families were 

confirmed in the Netherlands during an outbreak of avian flu among poultry. More than 80 cases 

of H7N7 illness were reported (the symptoms were mostly confined to eye infections, with some 

respiratory symptoms), and 1 patient died (in a veterinarian who had visited an affected farm). 

There was evidence of some human-to-human transmission. 

• 2003: H9N2 infection was confirmed in a child in Hong Kong. The child was hospitalized but 

recovered. 

Introduction and Spread of AI Virus 

Exposure of poultry to migratory waterfowl and the international movement of poultry, poultry 

equipment, 

and people pose risks for introducing AI into U.S. poultry. Once introduced, the disease can be 

spread from bird to bird by direct contact. AI viruses can also be spread by manure, equipment, 

vehicles, egg flats, crates, and people whose clothing or shoes have come in contact with the virus. 

AI viruses can remain viable at moderate temperatures for long periods in the environment and can 

survive indefinitely in frozen material. 

I think this is why they were killing all those birds in China. 

Cynthia 

Jennifer Ramos wrote: 







of some bird! 





223

(if it's in the wild) from flying to other countries and geographical a! reas? 









>To: journal 



> 








> 


> 



>in this week's issue of the journal Science. 

> 




> 




> 




> 

>Health officials in China, Thailand, South Korea (news - web sites) and 




> 



>people. 

> 

224

So far this year only 16 people have been killed, but there is some 



>epidemic. 

> 




> 


> 





> 





> 


> 




> 

>And this explains why the current avian flu outbreak has,! so far, not lived 


> 




> 



> 




>different." 



>people. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund f! ast by filing online 

225

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



226





Subject: Right to Pursue Happiness 

Dude I am distraught. People should be able to marry who ever they want. It is 

ridiculous 

that people have the power to stop gay marriages. When two people are in love 

and 

want to share their lives together they should be able to make the promise, 

wear the ring 

and vowl to be faithful to each other. what is the big deal why do people 

want to stop 

such a beautiful thing. My friend told me she doesn't believe in gay marriages 

and I said 

what if I told you that I was gay and she said that I would go to hell. This 

made me very 

sad because two of my dearest friends are gay and they are the warmest, 

sweetest, most 

respectful and mindful people I know, and I might not know much but I know 

they are not 

going to H-E doulble hockey stick. I listened to my friends opinion and I had 

to settle my 

self down by convincing myself that she would not hate me and that she would 

still be my 

friend but that she thought that it would be a shame that I would go to hell 

when I died. 

Well gotta jet. 

As a first step people should at least be able to have a secular legal 

contract where 

inheritance rights, rights of children, medical rights could be exercised by 

both parties in 

a legal union. So I guess that's not marriage but it is more than what they 

got now. Marin. 

A little poem to keep us mindful 

We shape clay into a pot, 

but it is the emptiness inside 

that holds whatever we want. 

227




To: journal 

Subject: Kind of a wow 

I was working with 2 boys today, a 2nd and a 4th grader. I was doing sight vocabulary with the 

2nd grader. The word I showed him was "compound". I asked him if he knew what it meant. 

He said, "yes, like the compound lenses of a dragonfly, right?" Hmmmm..... I said, "Well, I 

don't know, do dragonflies have compound lenses in their eyes?" He said "yes, they have the 

most lenses of insects." Well, I then said I didn't know that and asked the other student if he 

knew anything about compound lenses. He said, "sure, it's like a fly, you only see one of them, 

but they see millions of you!" Ok, so we were definitely off the subjects of reading and writing 

now, but boy were we having a great conversation. They were so excited to share what they 

knew about this, I just let them keep going. Of couse, as soon as I got home, I did some online 

research to verify what they were telling me, and guess what? They had it right!!! Well, maybe 

the fly doesn't see millions of you, but they see alot more than one. See the article below if 

you are interested. So....is this a wow moment? It reminded me a little of the chpt. 3 case 

study about the kid that was a pain in the butt, but knew tons of stuff about simple machines. 

Anyway, just thought I would share what I learned from a couple of great kids today!! 

How Good is Insect Eyesight? 

Most insects have a view of the world that is very different from ours, because their eyes are built on 

a different plan. Insects such as the housefly, the hornet, the butterfly, and the beetle, have what we 

call compound eyes. These eyes are made up of many separate units. Some, like the dragon fly, 

have as many as thirty thousand units per eye, each with its own lens. Others, like the ant, have only 

six. 

With a compound eye, the insect sees a mosaic image. This looks something like the highly 

magnified dots of a newspaper photograph. Because the lenses in the insect's eyes have a fixed 

focus, and can't be adjusted for distance, insects see shapes poorly. 

On the other hand, compound eyes are excellent for detecting motion. Houseflies and dragon flies 

have eyes that cover most of their head. This gives them almost 360 degree vision, enabling them to 

see predators coming from any direction. That's why a house fly usually escapes our attack, unless 

we hit it quickly from behind using a fly swatter. 

Most insects can see some colour. While our eyes see a full spectrum of wave lengths from red to 

violet, many insects see a limited range of colours. The colours they detect are the ones most useful 

for finding food and shelter. 

So next time you stalk a fly, remember it does have eyes in the back of its head. 

_____ 

228



229





Subject: Re: Right to Pursue Happiness 

I think we are all safe from hell, someone just made that whole fire and brimstone thing up! And if I 

am wrong, may I burn in hell. 

Cynthia 



ridiculous 


and 


wear the ring 


want to stop 


and I said 


made me very 




they are not 


to settle my 

self down by convinci! ng myself that she would not hate me and that she would 

still be my 


when I died. 












_____ 

230



231





Subject: Re: Right to Pursue Happiness 

Marin, 

I hear ya barking, me speeka the same language. 

Te Amor Mi Hermana, 

Ann 



ridiculous 


and 


wear the ring 


want to stop 


and I said 


made me very 




they are not 


to settle my 

self down by convinci! ng myself that she would not hate me and that she would 

still be my 


when I died. 












_____ 

232



233




To: journal 

Subject: chicken panic 

Flu Fears Force Killing of Delaware Birds 

Reuters 

Sat Feb 7, 2:02 PM ET (see article online on yahoo) 

And another case of infected chickens. Ok, so humans get the flu if they eat these chickens? Do you 

think people eat chickens infected with all these different flu viruses all the time and just don't know it? 

I find it hard to believe that all of the sudden, these chickens pose a health threat. Maybe this is a 

conspiracy to raise the price of chickens, cows, pigs, etc. Or.....maybe someone wants us to stop 

eating animals. Looks like I need to do some more research, back to the online laboratory. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



234





Subject: Re: chicken panic 

Ok, I found a very interesting article about the avian flu. This is getting kind of freaky. I for one am 

gonna make sure I start dodging bird feces of any kind, just to be safe. 

http://www.time.com/time/asia/magazine/article/0,13673,501040126-579024,00.html 

Cynthia 

One more thought: Is it just coincidence that we are being required to read about the flu thing? 

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm I think I better stop my research or I am gonna have to lock myself in the 

house for an undetermined amount of time. 



Reuters 


And another case of infected chickens. Ok, so humans get the flu if they eat these chickens? Do 

you think people eat chickens infected with all these different flu viruses all the time and just don't 

know it? I find it hard to believe that all of the sudden, these chickens pose a health threat. Maybe 

this is a conspiracy to raise the price of chickens, cows, pigs, etc. Or.....maybe someone wants us 

to stop eating animals. Looks like I need to do some more research, back to the online laboratory. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



_____ 



235





Subject: Re: chicken panic 

Cynthia, 

It is pretty freaky. What a coincidence! 

Ann 


Ok, I found a very interesting article about the avian flu. This is getting kind of freaky. I for one am 

gonna make sure I start dodging bird feces of any kind, just to be safe. 

http://www.time.com/time/asia/magazine/article/0,13673,501040126-579024,00.html 

Cynthia 

One more thought: Is it just coincidence that we are being required to read about the flu thing? 

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm I think I better stop my research or I am gonna have to lock myself in the 

house for an undetermined amount of time. 



Reuters 


_____ 

_____ 

And another case of infected chickens. Ok, so humans get the flu if they eat these chickens? 

Do you think people eat chickens infected with all these different flu viruses all the time and 

just don't know it? I find it hard to believe that all of the sudden, these chickens pose a health 

threat. Maybe this is a conspiracy to raise the price of chickens, cows, pigs, etc. Or.....maybe 

someone wants us to stop eating animals. Looks like I need to do some more research, back 

to the online laboratory. 

Cynthia 





_____ 


236


237






I just want to say that I am writing these journals for my classmates and for 

our dear professor, since he clearly reads them. If I were writing these 

journals for me I would be addressing the voices in my head. The language I 

use for the voices in my head is not appropriate for mixed company. 

At the moment I feel overwhelmed with the reading and the topics going around 

in the journals. I have not really processed any data. The data does not 

compute! I imagine it's because I've been a little stressed trying to keep up 

with the reading, I guess I picked the wrong semester to quit drinking! 

The Sagan book is interesting especially the part about aliens. He says there 

is no proof there are aliens, but I don't rule anything out because there are 

far too many unexplained events in this world. Besides, if my husband says he 

was abducted by aliens and that's why he was out all night, then he was 

abducted by aliens! 

I want to comment on the topic going around briefly about going to hell. I am 

not a religious person and here's why: Before I married my husband, his best 

friend (we'll call him Dick) found God and became super religious. Dick told 

me that Mike, my husband, would lead me on the wrong path. He said my husband 

was going to hell for his beliefs. I told him that he did not have the 

authority to say that and he said, "God gives me the authority!" I won't say 

exactly what I said to him, but lets just say I told him where he could shove 

his God and his authority. Ever since then I have been on the path to hell and 

religion free. I am serious when I say that I have never been happier! I would 

like to add that I don't have a problem with people who are religious. I am a 

firm believer that people should live their lives any way they desire. 

Here ends journal entry #3. 

Cecilia 

238






Cecilia, I just love your posts!!! You picked a good name for the friend. I am not religious either, so 

we can be neighbors in hell. I sure hope Dick won't be nearby though, it might spoil all the fun. 

Cynthia 


I just want to say that I am writing these journals for my classmates and for 

our dear professor, since he clearly reads them. If I were writing these 

journals for me I would be addressing the voices in my head. The language I 

use for the voices in my head is not appropriate for mixed company. 

At the moment I feel overwhelmed with the reading and the topics going around 

in the journals. I have not really processed any data. The data does not 

compute! I imagine it's because I've been a little stressed trying to keep up 

with the reading, I guess I picked the wrong semester to quit drinking! 

The Sagan book is interesting especially the part about aliens. He says there 

is no proof there are aliens, but I don't rule anything out because there are 

far too many unexplained events in this world. Besides, if my husband says he 

was abdu! cted by aliens and that's why he was out all night, then he was 

abducted by aliens! 

I want to comment on the topic going around briefly about going to hell. I am 

not a religious person and here's why: Before I married my husband, his best 

friend (we'll call him Dick) found God and became super religious. Dick told 

me that Mike, my husband, would lead me on the wrong path. He said my husband 

was going to hell for his beliefs. I told him that he did not have the 

authority to say that and he said, "God gives me the authority!" I won't say 

exactly what I said to him, but lets just say I told him where he could shove 

his God and his authority. Ever since then I have been on the path to hell and 

religion free. I am serious when I say that I have never been happier! I would 

like to add that I don't have a problem with people who are religious. I am a 

firm believer that people should live their lives any way they desire. 

Here ends j! ournal entry #3. 

Cecilia 

_____ 



239




To: journal 

Subject: euglena findings 

Hey Cecilia, What kind of results did you and your partner have with the euglena experiment? I am 

curious if anyone found that the euglena preferred the dark like ours did. Maybe ours were just black 

sheep. Cynthia 

_____ 



240





Subject: Re: Journal 3- Casey 

I have never met so many people that are looking forward to going to hell...kind of scary Casey 

241





Subject: Re: euglena findings 

Ours liked the dark...really liked the dark too! Casey 

242





Subject: Re: euglena findings 

Oh good, thanks for replying. 


Ours liked the dark...really liked the dark too! Casey 

_____ 



243




To: CA222girl@aol.com; ICP-F 

Subject: RE: Journal 3- Casey 

I lived with my mother-in-law for one year; hell would be a piece of cake. 

Cecilia 

>===== Original Message From CA222girl@aol.com ===== 

>I have never met so many people that are looking forward to going to 

>hell...kind of scary Casey 

244






I am not looking forward to going to hell, I just can't make myself believe it exists. By no means am I 

even saying I am right about it. Only time will tell. And if I am wrong, I guess I will just have to make 

the best of it. 

To Cecilia.............Geez, aliens and mother-in-laws, I think you are already in hell, or were and 

escaped, right? 


I lived with my mother-in-law for one year; hell would be a piece of cake. 

Cecilia 


>I have never met so many people that are looking forward to going to 

>hell...kind of scary Casey 

_____ 



245


From: Maggie0750@aol.com 




So now i'm really FRUSTRATED! I am at my parent's house and my mom's piece of s*** computer 

won't let me send out any emails with any of my email accounts so I guess will see if this works! So... 

if you read this don't reply to me using this email, its my mom's email account. 

WEll since I'm on the topic of frustration, I will let you all know that this whole journal thing every week 

is driving me crazy! I hate receiving a million emails that I hardly read. Many of the discussion among 

the emails are discussions that I would rather not discuss in this matter. The million emails, the new 

email account I created just because of this, and Mike perhaps you can enlighten me with the whole 

hotmail email because I think hotmail sucks! I don't think its very user friendly. 

Moving on. I am very disappointed in the Sagan book. Chapter 3 was horrible. I read a couple of 

pages then flipped to the back page and read the last paragraph. The idea of seeing images on other 

images, such as The Man in the Moon I never really thought of in a science kind of way. I think that it 

would not be a big deal if we saw images upon other images if those images never had a name. If we 

never named "man" or "face" then it would never be a big deal. The fact that we see images in clouds 

or that animals are born with certain distinct markings of other images is something ironic. Do you 

really think that some unknown power created Mickey Mouse on the side of a cow? Or a dog's face 

(or whatever) in the clouds. I think it is facinating to see, but the whole science behind it..... is there 

really one? I don't think so. 

Chapter 4 of Sagan was even worse than chapter 3. I read the first paragraph then flipped to the las 

paragraph again and read it. It was like something out of some crazy movie I would never see! I am 

the biggest chicken in the world and didn't care to read about aliens and UFO's and whatever else the 

chapter was about. 

I hope the other chapters are better than the last two. If this book continues to talk about things like 

the last two chapters then I'm going to stop reading this book. 

Carrie Gilardone 

246


From: I812lastnight@aol.com 



Subject: (no subject) 

hmmm 

247





Subject: Re: (no subject) 

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm who is this mystery person? 

I812lastnight@aol.com wrote: 

hmmm 

_____ 



248





Subject: God and Aliens 

Since God does not reside on Earth, but reportedly visits earth frequently 

to show prophecies to unknowing people, is he an alien? I think that s/he 

might fit the description of an alien, without that whole poking and 

prodding thing. Just a thought! Hey and maybe we can call angels and demons, 

aliens too. This would allow us to bridge the gap between pseudoscience and 

religion. Then possible we might be able to all join hands and sing "kumbaya 

my alien, kumbaya." 

Smile :0 no I said smile:) 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Create your own personal Web page with the info you use most, at My MSN. 

http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200364ave/direct/01/ 

249





Subject: Re: God and Aliens 

Nice sermon, Reverend Robert! And catchy hymn, I like it. You might be on to something here. 


Since God does not reside on Earth, but reportedly visits earth frequently 

to show prophecies to unknowing people, is he an alien? I think that s/he 

might fit the description of an alien, without that whole poking and 

prodding thing. Just a thought! Hey and maybe we can call angels and demons, 

aliens too. This would allow us to bridge the gap between pseudoscience and 

religion. Then possible we might be able to all join hands and sing "kumbaya 

my alien, kumbaya." 

Smile :0 no I said smile:) 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



250




To: Cynthia Reyes; ICP-F 


I just want to clarify that I don't believe in hell since there is no 

scientific proof that it exists. I simply stated that I was sentenced to hell 

for having my own beliefs and not following someone else's. Besides if hell 

did exists, I should have received some confirmation of my sentence by now. 

Cecilia :) 

>===== Original Message From Cynthia Reyes ===== 

>I am not looking forward to going to hell, I just can't make myself believe 

it exists. By no means am I even saying I am right about it. Only time will 

tell. And if I am wrong, I guess I will just have to make the best of it. 

> 

>To Cecilia.............Geez, aliens and mother-in-laws, I think you are 

already in hell, or were and escaped, right? 

> 

>tille002 wrote: 

>I lived with my mother-in-law for one year; hell would be a piece of cake. 

>Cecilia 

> 

>>===== Original Message From CA222girl@aol.com ===== 

>>I have never met so many people that are looking forward to going to 

>>hell...kind of scary Casey 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



251





Subject: RE: Kind of a wow 

This is an example of why teaching can be so rewarding. This also addresses the question that I posed for discussion in 

Prof. Ochanji's class, which is, when students are engaged in learning, how do you stop the lesson/learning because of 

time constraints. If you had had to wrap up the discussion that these boys had with you before they were ready, I'm sure 

they would have been disappointed. It's moments like you experienced that make teaching worthwhile! 

~ Louise 




To: journal 

Subject: Kind of a wow 

I was working with 2 boys today, a 2nd and a 4th grader. I was doing sight vocabulary with 

the 2nd grader. The word I showed him was "compound". I asked him if he knew what it 

meant. He said, "yes, like the compound lenses of a dragonfly, right?" Hmmmm..... I said, 

"Well, I don't know, do dragonflies have compound lenses in their eyes?" He said "yes, 

they have the most lenses of insects." Well, I then said I didn't know that and asked the 

other student if he knew anything about compound lenses. He said, "sure, it's like a fly, 

you only see one of them, but they see millions of you!" Ok, so we were definitely off the 

subjects of reading and writing now, but boy were we having a great conversation. They 

were so excited to share what they knew about this, I just let them keep going. Of couse, as 

soon as I got home, I did some online research to verify what they were telling me, and 

guess what? They had it right!!! Well, maybe the fly doesn't see millions of you, but they 

see alot more than one. See the article below if you are interested. So....is this a wow 

moment? It reminded me a little of the chpt. 3 case study about the kid that was a pain in 

the butt, but knew tons of stuff about simple machines. Anyway, just thought I would share 

what I learned from a couple of great kids today!! 

How Good is Insect Eyesight? 

Most insects have a view of the world that is very different from ours, because their eyes are built 

on a different plan. Insects such as the housefly, the hornet, the butterfly, and the beetle, have 

what we call compound eyes. These eyes are made up of many separate units. Some, like the 

dragon fly, have as many as thirty thousand units per eye, each with its own lens. Others, like the 

ant, have only six. 

With a compound eye, the insect sees a mosaic image. This looks something like the highly 

magnified dots of a newspaper photograph. Because the lenses in the insect's eyes have a fixed 

252

focus, and can't be adjusted for distance, insects see shapes poorly. 

On the other hand, compound eyes are excellent for detecting motion. Houseflies and dragon 

flies have eyes that cover most of their head. This gives them almost 360 degree vision, enabling 

them to see predators coming from any direction. That's why a house fly usually escapes our 

attack, unless we hit it quickly from behind using a fly swatter. 

Most insects can see some colour. While our eyes see a full spectrum of wave lengths from red 

to violet, many insects see a limited range of colours. The colours they detect are the ones most 

useful for finding food and shelter. 

So next time you stalk a fly, remember it does have eyes in the back of its head. 

_____ 



253




To: journal 

Subject: poem 

Ok, I know this sounds a little too deep coming from me. I was thinking we 

could change the "sisterhood" to "teacherhood" or "cohorthood". A little 

art, science and mushy stuff mixed in. 

The Truth of the Sisterhood 

We start as a grain of sand. 

Rolling and turning, 

Tumbling and jumbling, 

Nudged along by the currents of life 

Battered about by the waves of emotion. 

Along the way we run into other grains 

Just like us and 

Perhaps a little different 

A different shape 

A different texture 

A different color. 

We bump into some grains 

And rejoice in the meeting 

It feels good to have contact, 

As if we met an old friend. 

We share much in common 

It feels right 

We want to stay together but, 

We are pulled by the current 

To a new place 

Where we run into more grains of sand. 

Some are rough 

And irritate like sandpaper. 

Others seem distant and dull 

And want to be left alone. 

Still others are mean and 

Band with other grains to 

Smother us. 

We feel frightened and 

Try to roll away 

But the current is too strong. 

It pulls us back to 

The ! grains we don't like. 

We search for a friendly face 

We yearn for the grains we met before, 

The ones with whom we feel most comfortable. 

254

We feel stuck and frustrated 

And remain there until 

We begin to see the possibilities. 

We begin to like where we are 

Even without our comforts. 

We find that given enough time, 

The dull and distant grains 

come to us and are willing to be friends 

We find that the grains that feel like sandpaper 

Can be softened by rubbing against them. 

We wonder if there are other possibilities 

For the grains of sand that have tried 

To smother us. 

We observe them 

As they bustle and jumble together 

And feel the heat they create. 

At first it agitates and irritates 

But later on we observe 

That given enough time 

The heat serves to melt each grain 

Ever so slightly so that 

Eventually they begin to look alike 

The more time they spend together 

The more heat they generate 

And they ble! nd together so much 

That it becomes difficult to tell 

Where one grain begins and 

Another ends. 

And thus we observe the formation 

Of the sisterhood 

From tiny individual grains of sand 

Through friendship and comfort 

Through irritation and adversity 

We come together and 

Create something bigger than ourselves 

Bigger than our own grain of sand. 

We are fused together through heat 

To create glass 

And from glass we form a window 

© Debbie Gawrych 

_____ 



255





Subject: RE: poem 

What about Father Hood with Patrick Swayze? 



>To: journal 

>Subject: poem 

>Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:25:59 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>Ok, I know this sounds a little too deep coming from me. I was thinking we 

>could change the "sisterhood" to "teacherhood" or "cohorthood". A little 

>art, science and mushy stuff mixed in. 

> 

>The Truth of the Sisterhood 

> 

>We start as a grain of sand. 

>Rolling and turning, 

>Tumbling and jumbling, 

>Nudged along by the currents of life 

>Battered about by the waves of emotion. 

> 

>Along the way we run into other grains 

>Just like us and 

>Perhaps a little different 

>A different shape 

>A different texture 

>A different color. 

> 

>We bump into some grains 

>And rejoice in the meeting 

>It feels good to have contact, 

>As if we met an old friend. 

>We share much in common 

>It feels right 

>We want to stay together but, 

> 

>We are pulled by the current 

>To a new place 

>Where we run into more grains of sand. 

>Some are rough 

>And irritate like sandpaper. 

>Others seem distant and dull 

>And want to be left alone. 

>Still others are mean and 

>Band with other grains to 

>Smother us. 

> 

>We feel frightened and 

>Try to roll away 

>But the current is too strong. 

>It pulls us back to 

>The grains we don't like. 

>We search for a friendly face 

>We yearn for the grains we met before, 

>The ones with whom we feel most comfortable. 

>We feel stuck and frustrated 

256

And remain there until 

>We begin to see the possibilities. 

> 

>We begin to like where we are 

>Even without our comforts. 

>We find that given enough time, 

>The dull and distant grains 

>come to us and are willing to be friends 

>We find that the grains that feel like sandpaper 

>Can be softened by rubbing against them. 

>We wonder if there are other possibilities 

>For the grains of sand that have tried 

>To smother us. 

> 

>We observe them 

>As they bustle and jumble together 

>And feel the heat they create. 

>At first it agitates and irritates 

>But later on we observe 

>That given enough time 

>The heat serves to melt each grain 

>Ever so slightly so that 

>Eventually they begin to look alike 

> 

>The more time they spend together 

>The more heat they generate 

>And they blend together so much 

>That it becomes difficult to tell 

>Where one grain begins and 

>Another ends. 

> 

>And thus we observe the formation 

>Of the sisterhood 

>From tiny individual grains of sand 

>Through friendship and comfort 

>Through irritation and adversity 

>We come together and 

>Create something bigger than ourselves 

>Bigger than our own grain of sand. 

>We are fused together through heat 

>To create glass 

>And from glass we form a window 

> 

>© Debbie Gawrych 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Keep up with high-tech trends here at "Hook'd on Technology." 

http://special.msn.com/msnbc/hookedontech.armx 

257





Subject: RE: poem 

I knew I could count on you, Mike!! 

Cynthia 


What about Father Hood with Patrick Swayze? 



>To: journal 

>Subject: poem 


> 

>Ok, I know this sounds a little too deep coming from me. I was thinking we 

>could change the "sisterhood" to "teacherhood" or "cohorthood". A little 

>art, science and mushy stuff mixed in. 

> 

>The Truth of the Sisterhood 

> 

>We start as a grain of sand. 

>Rolling and turning, 

>Tumbling and jumbling, 

>Nudged along by the currents of life 

>Battered about by the waves of emotion. 

> 

>Along the way we run into other grains 

>Just like us and 

>Perhaps a little different 

>A different shape 

>A different texture 

>A different color. 

> 

>We bump into some grains 

>And rejoice in the meeting 

>It feels good to have contact, 

>As if we met an old friend. 

>We share much in common 

>It feels right 

>We want to stay together but, 

> 

>We are pulled by the current 

>To a new place 

>Where we run into more grains of sand. 

>Some are rough 

258

And irritate like sandpaper. 

>Others seem distant and dull 

>And want to be left alone. 

>Still others are mean and 

>Band with other grains to 

>Smother us. 

> 

>We feel frightened and 

>Try to roll away 

>But the current is too strong. 

>It pulls us back to 

>The grains we don't like. 

>We search for a friendly face 

>We yearn for the grains we met before, 

>The ones with whom we feel most comfortable. 

>We feel stuck and frustrated 

>And remain there until 

>We begin to see the possibilities. 

> 

>W! e begin to like where we are 

>Even without our comforts. 

>We find that given enough time, 

>The dull and distant grains 

>come to us and are willing to be friends 

>We find that the grains that feel like sandpaper 

>Can be softened by rubbing against them. 

>We wonder if there are other possibilities 

>For the grains of sand that have tried 

>To smother us. 

> 

>We observe them 

>As they bustle and jumble together 

>And feel the heat they create. 

>At first it agitates and irritates 

>But later on we observe 

>That given enough time 

>The heat serves to melt each grain 

>Ever so slightly so that 

>Eventually they begin to look alike 

> 

>The more time they spend together 

>The more heat they generate 

>And they blend together so much 

>That it becomes difficult to tell 

>Where one grain begins and 

>Another ends. 

> 

>And thus we observe the formation 

>Of the sisterhood 

>From tiny individual grains of sand 

>Through friendship and comfort 

>Through irritation and adversity 

>We come together and 

259

Create something bigger than ourselves 

>Bigger than our own grain of sand. 

>We are fused together through heat 

>To create glass 

>And from glass we form a window 

> 

>© Debbie Gawrych 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



260





Subject: Jenny Fiala: Journal 4 

I have read ahead in the Kolata book and have found the book to be very interesting. The idea that 40 

million people died of this flu virus and it is hardly ever spoken of in medical history but for a few lines. 

I believe that if the scientists were able to explain what was the cause of the virus and that they knew 

or know what to do to prevent that catastrophe from happening again if the virus were to return, then 

the history of this epidemic would have been more publicized. I believe that society is still very afraid 

of what it doesn't understand and so in order to bury their ignorance on this topic they simply do not 

discuss it. I am very interested to see how this story plays out and have began discussing it with my 

family trying to get the older people in my family to try to remember if their families ever spoke of this 

time or if they knew anything about it. So far they only knew that it happened and about how many 

people died but they don't realize the cause of it and are unaware of the lurking possibility that that 

sort of epidemic could happen again. 

Jenny Fiala 

261




To: Class List 

Subject: Journal for the week of 2/2 and 2/4 

Dear Class, 

I thought the reading this week were somewhat interesting and i just wanted to 

add my little tid bit to the discussion board. I have been reading the 

majority of the online discussions and wish that these topics were being 

further elaborated on in class so we could get some face to face dialogue but 

anyways. The thought of aliens in the universe or world is quite 

controversial today and has been in the past. All that i can think of on this 

topic is not little gray asexual expressionless beings but rather the thought 

that the source of all life on our planet is that bright thing in the sky 

known as the sun or during (Ramses of Egypt's hayday as i briefly mentioned to 

Mike RunDMC) god. And without that sun producing that wonderful warmth we 

take for granted here in sd we would literally sitting on a tiny island in the 

left hand corner of the milky way called earth freezing our tails off until 

eventually we could no longer suffice. Which brings me to my point, when 

looking into the sky on a clear night one can see literally thousands of 

opportunities for the stability of life forms from the prescence of heat being 

produced by the sun so in my estimation their could be someone up their typing 

away thinking about other lifes on other suns they look at during the evening 

hours on the planet ?. I hope we get a chance to discuss further and many 

other science and life related topics over the course of the semester and i 

will continue to enjoy and respond to the interesting thoughts being discussed 

via this online message board. 

sincerely, 

Matheno Landers 

262





Subject: Re: Jenny Fiala: Journal 4 

I think they do know what caused the pandemic. They have isolated the virus. Scientists currently 

have samples from 3 (i think) victims that they found, one in Alaska (i think) and 2 soldiers (i don't 

remember where from). The problem is that a pandemic is usually caused by a mutated form of a 

common virus that is able to attach to human receptors. Because it is in a mutated form, our bodies 

haven't built up immunities to fight it when it hits. By the time vaccines can be developed, ( i think 4-6 

months) the virus can spread and make lots of people sick and/or kill them. As you can see, I am 

writing this from memory, hence all the i thinks. There is actually tons of info on this online. I even 

read something about a law that was passed in San Diego requiring people to wear gauze masks or 

they would be fined $100. It also said people would cut holes in the gauze so they could smoke, lol. 

Cynthia 

Kaylee102595@aol.com wrote: 

I have read ahead in the Kolata book and have found the book to be very interesting. The idea 

that 40 million people died of this flu virus and it is hardly ever spoken of in medical history but for 

a few lines. I believe that if the scientists were able to explain what was the cause of the virus and 

that they knew or know what to do to prevent that catastrophe from happening again if the virus 

were to return, then the history of this epidemic would have been more publicized. I believe that 

society is still very afraid of what it doesn't understand and so in order to bury their ignorance on 

this topic they simply do not discuss it. I am very interested to see how this story plays out and 

have began discussing it with my family trying to get the older people in my family to try to 

remember if their families ever spoke of this time or if they knew anything about it. So far they only 

knew that it happened and about how many people died but they don't realize the cause of i! t and 

are unaware of the lurking possibility that that sort of epidemic could happen again. 

Jenny Fiala 

_____ 



263





Subject: Re: Journal 3- Casey 

I hear that! My time starts in July. I'm already getting warmer:) 

Jenny Fiala 

264





Subject: WOW! (aka-journal #3 finally) 

I just got my internet back at my house and checked 157 e-mails. 

Realistically I skimmed them all. Shiver me Timbers, I had no idea all of 

this was going on. Cythia, you are amazing, your wealth of knowledge and 

finding things on the internet is extraordinary! Mike, your a funny guy (I'll 

leave it at that!) There are some real quality journals being written. I am 

sort of understanding now how Yamashita was telling us to compare ourselves 

with our fellow classmates to see our quality of writing. 

I would like to say that my great aunt was alive during the outbreak of 1918. 

She told me that she was so scared because she couldn't see her friends or 

some of her family, she was kept in a room and fed through the door because 

her family was afraid that she would get sick because she was so young. Of 

course they really didn't understand it fully at that time. I think that in 

our lifetime we are going to accidentally make a huge epidemic that no 

antibiotic will cure. This "flu" will get so large and beat through all the 

antibiotics because so many people take antibiotics like they are merly a tic 

tac. They feed them to their children like they should be feeding them 

vitamins. The doctors precribe them as a quick way to get the patient out of 

the office and the money from the HMO's in their pocket. I think its 

rediculous! This book really makes you take a different approach to science 

and how humans figure things out. 

The other thing I would like to comment about is the Sagan book about aliens. 

I would like to come out and say it "I believe in aliens" (whew! I feel so 

much better now) I think that to believe that earth is the only inhabitable 

planet in this gigantic galaxy makes you ignorant. However, if they have 

visited this earth, why do they chose to probe and prod at people ( or 

coartoon people,like Homer Simpson) Why not look into the brains of Einstien 

or me! An even deeper thought that Robert and I had once discussed after 

sipping down a little on grandpa's cough syrup was that maybe aliens visit us 

in ways that we think of as ghosts????? People that have beleived to 

experience ghost claim to feel a presense around them, but can't see it, which 

is often similar to what people that have had alien encouters will admmit to. 

On the other hand, it seems very odd that people from all over the world have 

described their alien intruders as nearly the exact same creature, how would 

that have happened unless they were all telling the truth! Maybe the aliens 

can chose if they want to be visible or not? OHHHH NO! I might be on to 

something now. 

I have dabled a little in the other books, but nothing I care to mention 

about. I am happy to be back in the game and prepared to share my opinion 

about all the cockameme on the list server. 

-Yours truly, 

Chula 

265





Subject: Re: WOW! (aka-journal #3 finally) 

Hi Chula, 

Viruses cannot be cured by antibiotics and no misuse of them can make them immune to antibiotics 

or you. Antibiotics work against bacteria only and that is when overuse of the antibiotics makes 

bacteria resistant to them. Viruses do not have the genetic makeup that antibiotics work on and there 

is controversy about whether or not the viruses are living organisms or not. The only way to protect 

against viruses is through immunizations and sometimes those do not even work because the way 

they are made is through viruses and antibodies of past illnesses. Either the patient is injected with 

dead or immobilized virus so that they make their own antibodies to it or the patient is injected with 

antibodies that have already been cultured to counteract the virus before it infects more cells. 

Jenny Fiala 

266





Subject: Journal #3 or maybe #4 

hey class, 

So between the Kolata book and the Sagan book I am becoming increasingly 

disheartened in life. If you start to think about and really think about, 

life is merely a series of predictable circumstances waiting to be 

discovered. This is not to say that you can't choose to not throw the ball, 

just that the ball will indefinitely act in accordance to given laws of 

motion if thrown. Thus, things that do not fallow in accordance to this are 

dismissed away or found to be a hoax. 

I don't know maybe there is something to be said for ignorance. I guess 

there was something said, "ignorance is bliss." I recently watched the film 

"Big Fish." It was an awesome commentary on the constructions of individual 

realities. What is fact to one, is fiction to another. 

Did the 1918 Influenza pandemic every really happen? Well until the start of 

this class my perception of it's existence was non-existent. So in my frame 

of mind it may as well have never existed. I know that sounds like a selfish 

statement, but how I (I in respect to society) construct my reality is based 

on only truths that have been exposed to me. Now that I know that the flu 

can cause your lungs to become saturated with a foamy red substance and that 

it could cause me to choke and die, I will probably view the flu in a much 

different light from now on. 

Is this a good thing? 

thanks for reading. 

your pal, 


_________________________________________________________________ 



267





Subject: Re: WOW! (aka-journal #3 finally) 

About the aliens: I guess all those people could be telling the truth if.............all the aliens that visit us 

are from the same planet. Or, they could have seen pictures of what other people said they saw and 

said they saw one giving that description. If there are aliens, there must be more than one other 

civilization though, maybe in other solar systems. I just wish an alien would show up at a concert or 

church service so lots of people could see it. Or maybe go on the Jay Leno show, so millions could 

see. Anything is possible. 

In regards to the anitbiotics, Jenny is correct. Antibiotics only work on bacteria. Thats why it doesn't 

do any good to take it for a cold. Just keep the onion poultice on hand in case this bird flu spreads, 

that will be your best bet (see previous post). I had a bowl of french onion soup last night, as a preemptive 

precaution. 

Cynthia 

silco001 wrote: 

I just got my internet back at my house and checked 157 e-mails. 

Realistically I skimmed them all. Shiver me Timbers, I had no idea all of 

this was going on. Cythia, you are amazing, your wealth of knowledge and 

finding things on the internet is extraordinary! Mike, your a funny guy (I'll 

leave it at that!) There are some real quality journals being written. I am 

sort of understanding now how Yamashita was telling us to compare ourselves 

with our fellow classmates to see our quality of writing. 

I would like to say that my great aunt was alive during the outbreak of 1918. 

She told me that she was so scared because she couldn't see her friends or 

some of her family, she was kept in a room and fed through the door because 

her family was afraid that she would get sick because she was so young. Of 

course they really didn't understand it ! fully at that time. I think that in 

our lifetime we are going to accidentally make a huge epidemic that no 

antibiotic will cure. This "flu" will get so large and beat through all the 

antibiotics because so many people take antibiotics like they are merly a tic 

tac. They feed them to their children like they should be feeding them 

vitamins. The doctors precribe them as a quick way to get the patient out of 

the office and the money from the HMO's in their pocket. I think its 

rediculous! This book really makes you take a different approach to science 

and how humans figure things out. 

The other thing I would like to comment about is the Sagan book about aliens. 

I would like to come out and say it "I believe in aliens" (whew! I feel so 

much better now) I think that to believe that earth is the only inhabitable 

planet in this gigantic galaxy makes you ignorant. However, if they have 

visited this earth, why do they chose to probe and prod ! at people ( or 

coartoon people,like Homer Simpson) Why not look into the brains of Einstien 

or me! An even deeper thought that Robert and I had once discussed after 

sipping down a little on grandpa's cough syrup was that maybe aliens visit us 

in ways that we think of as ghosts????? People that have beleived to 

experience ghost claim to feel a presense around them, but can't see it, which 

is often similar to what people that have had alien encouters will admmit to. 

268

On the other hand, it seems very odd that people from all over the world have 

described their alien intruders as nearly the exact same creature, how would 

that have happened unless they were all telling the truth! Maybe the aliens 

can chose if they want to be visible or not? OHHHH NO! I might be on to 

something now. 

I have dabled a little in the other books, but nothing I care to mention 

about. I am happy to be back in the game and prepared to share my opinion 

about all! the cockameme on the list server. 

-Yours truly, 

Chula 

_____ 



269





Subject: Re: Journal #3 or maybe #4 

Onions, Robert, lots of onions. And stay away from the bird droppings. 


hey class, 

So between the Kolata book and the Sagan book I am becoming increasingly 

disheartened in life. If you start to think about and really think about, 

life is merely a series of predictable circumstances waiting to be 

discovered. This is not to say that you can't choose to not throw the ball, 

just that the ball will indefinitely act in accordance to given laws of 

motion if thrown. Thus, things that do not fallow in accordance to this are 

dismissed away or found to be a hoax. 

I don't know maybe there is something to be said for ignorance. I guess 

there was something said, "ignorance is bliss." I recently watched the film 

"Big Fish." It was an awesome commentary on the constructions of individual 

realities. What is fact to one, is fiction to another. 

Did the 1918 Influenza pandemic every really happen? Well until t! he start of 

this class my perception of it's existence was non-existent. So in my frame 

of mind it may as well have never existed. I know that sounds like a selfish 

statement, but how I (I in respect to society) construct my reality is based 

on only truths that have been exposed to me. Now that I know that the flu 

can cause your lungs to become saturated with a foamy red substance and that 

it could cause me to choke and die, I will probably view the flu in a much 

different light from now on. 

Is this a good thing? 

thanks for reading. 

your pal, 


_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



270





Subject: Journal #3 - Influenza 

Ever since the topic of the new East Asia avian flu has been brought to the 

table, I have found myself to be more and more drawn to it. I am curious 

about these influenzas. Their origin, how they travel, and who they affect. 

I'm like a little kid, fascinated by a topic presented in school and wanting 

to learn more about it. I am glad that something I am interested in has 

finally been brought up. Better late than never. 

With beginning Gina Kolata's book on the flu of 1918, I am beginning to find 

anwers to some of my questions about the deadly influenzas. The bird flu in 

East Asia has raised a lot of questions for me and now I may begin to find 

more answers. 

Since being in this class, reading the e-mails, and doing the assigned 

readings, I find myself doing more science each and every day. I am more 

observant of the world around me. I have begun asking myself and others more 

questions about the things surrounding me, thoughts in my head, and 

contemporary issues revolving around science. I am starting to see more 

science and starting to look through the eyes of a new perosn who is 

conciously trying harder to be more scientific. I think that in order to be 

able to teach it some day, and be good at it, I have to practice more. So I 

am really making that effort to pursue my little "wows" and curiosity. 

As I've already said, this influenza thing has really caught my attention. 

So we all thought that this season of the flu was bad? I can't wait to find 

out more about the deadliest flu of the century in Kolata's book. It wasn't 

that long ago...1918. Yes, we are more advanced now, technologically, 

medicinally, and scientifically, but can it happen again? Are we ready? Or 

is it too far back, that we shouldn't even think something like it could 

happen now? I don't know, it's pretty scary to me. 

Hopefully soon, I will get my answers, and in finding those answers, think 

of new questions. After all, I'm trying to practice this whole "science" 

thing. 


_________________________________________________________________ 

Check out the great features of the new MSN 9 Dial-up, with the MSN Dial-up 

Accelerator. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/ 

271





Subject: Journal #5 (same topic) 

As I can see, my topics have not been hooking the fish in the bowl. People probably don't give a "bird 

dropping" about them because issues like the legalization of homosexual marriage don't directly 

involve them. I hope that the people who disagree with this the most are hit straight on with 

something in their lives that forces them to take a closer look at these issues. Not many people don't 

talk about these issues like they don't talk about "the 1918 flu". 

The more I think and learn about science, the more frustrated I get with religion because it seems to 

me that large sections of our population follow "like sheep" the outdated ideas of their "textbook" (the 

bible) about issues that are very real and are happening right NOW that don't make sense. 

I don't mind if people go to church, they can live their lives governed by those rules. BUT, I do get 

mad at religion because it is telling another section of America that they can't get married. LIVE (your 

life the way you want to) AND LET (others have the same rights to) LIVE (their lives the way they 

want to). Is this liberty and justice for all? Or is this one of the many loop holes or grandfather 

clauses that allow injustices to continue? 

In our classes they have been teaching us to think about all the different cultures and the diversities, I 

think this also covers homosexuality. I brought up the discussion of the legalization of homosexual 

marriage because it is a current event, and it just blows me away that we do not JUST LEGALIZE IT ! 

Many people think that homosexuals are entitled to rights and benefits under domestic partnership; 

well, after talking to my sister this weekend about what I have been writing in these journals she 

informed me that these benefits would be nice if this really did take place. It's a sort of nice idea that 

is hardly ever provided by employers and the such. So please do not just assume that benefits are 

alive an thriving for this section of the population. This kind of reminds me of "Separate but NOT 

equal" of our not too long ago history. 

I saw a movie once I think was called "The Lottery" were each year this little town has a lottery and 

the person who is picked gets stoned to death by the rest of the townspeople. Religion, to me, seems 

like this because it is continuing on with ideas that don't make any sense, yet people keep following 

them. "Why doesn't someone stand up and just say this is not right?" 

Am I the only one who is trying to stand up and yell from the top of my lungs that this is not right? 

Can anyone please genuinely answer this? 

What harm would it be in passing a law that legalized homosexual marriage? 

Ann 

_____ 



272





Subject: Science is boring 

Hi class, 

In doing the reading from Sagan’s book I have found 

that science is at many times very boring. The 

scientific method basically eliminates any idea of awe 

in the world and worlds around us. Whenever something 

amazing happens that could potentially be supernatural 

we know that science will be there to make sure that 

there is a reasonable explanation for it. We as 

humans love to fantasize, we love to think that there 

is more to this world than what science can provide. 

We love to engross ourselves in the mysteries of the 

unknown. We love to make more of things than there 

really is. It is not amazing that gossip is so much 

fun. We want to be part of something bigger than what 

science tells us we are. A good example of this is in 

the movie “Big Fish”. This story is about a father 

and son who do not get along, but are forced to talk 

when the father is dying. The Father is always 

telling tall tales about his life admittingly 

stretching the truth. The father is like many humans 

who don’t care about the details, but just want a good 

story. The son is like science; he hates his dad’s 

stories because they are not full of truths. He feels 

that he never was able to know his real father because 

of all the lies and fantasies his father has told him. 

Most of us are like the father; we want exaggerations 

of the truth. We don’t care that we are hearing 

something that is false, we just want to hear 

something that is fascinating. The son is portrayed 

in the movie as boring and grumpy. He is portrayed as 

a drag, he doesn’t go along with his father’s lies, 

he just wants the boring truth. Who besides scientist 

just wants the boring truth? 

Sagan say’s, “All science asks is to employ the same 

levels of skepticism we use in buying a used car…” 

(pg. 76). Skepticism is not very fun. How many of 

use like buying a used car? Buying a used car is one 

of the most painstaking processes I’ve ever been 

through. So when Sagan asks that we employ skepticism 

in our lives, I think where is the excitement? What 

do I have to look forward to? But, more importantly 

how can I make the scientific process something that 

children will want to take part in? 

Joey 

__________________________________ 




273





Subject: Images of aliens...just childhood demons? 

Sagan does arouse the questions of aliens and makes us skeptical about the 

faces on Mars. He has us look at why humans put such faith in these 

experiences. What is this really about? Are we so desperate? We want hope, we 

create hope, and we look for validation of that hope in the patterns we see in 

things, like the tortilla with the image of Jesus. I am not certain if there 

is such a thing as aliens and do not discredit people's experiences with 

aliens. Chula posed a good point that if these special people did not have the 

experiences of alien intruders then why have "people from all over the 

world...described their alien intruders as nearly the exact same creature." I 

too have wondered the same thing. In trying to make sense of this, I think 

about what we as humans have in common, as a starting point. We were all 

children once and dealt with life challenges with our limited life 

experiences. Some of us were fortunate enough to grow up in a loving home 

environment where the nightmares of the day did not make there way into our 

dreams. But for less fortunate children, we were haunted by the giants in our 

lives who at times had taken monstrous forms in moments of rage. Is it 

possible that aliens are just a side effect of a childhood gone wrong or 

childhood fears that have not been dealt with? Is it possible that the reason 

that so many people describe similar alien encounters is because our childhood 

experiences are not so different, therefore, the images of those internal 

demons that we have not worked through are not so different? Are our alien 

experiences just images of those who have hurt us but we fear facing that 

truth? It would be easier to see our intruder or abuser as the form of an 

alien than face the fact that our mother had Munchausen by Proxy, or that 

someone you respected and love sexually assaulted you, or that you were made 

to feel less than human for most of your life,or...or...or anything else that 

left you hurt and filled with so many unanswered questions. Is it possible 

that if we are not introspective about our lives that our images are distorted 

in the form of aliens because we really do want to work through those painful 

things? When I hear about people's encounter with aliens, I am given no 

background on their life and the emotional baggage left from childhood not yet 

processed. Instead of just focusing on whether aliens exist or not, why not 

study these people and see what threads tie them together. What internal 

demons are they battling with in the twilight hours of their abduction? In the 

meantime, let's see to it that our children have at least teachers that truly 

care and can give them a moment of peace in their day. (Alexandra) 

274





Subject: flu 

so i know everyone has anlready talked about the flu but i wasnt about to join in and miss 

a weeks journal by writing one in a week i already had a journal...so here i am a week 

late. 

as soon as i started the book i was so scared. 

3 years ago this week, i got so sick i thought i was going to die and i prayed that i 

would. its hard for me to explain how serious it was for me, so just know that it was. 

ever since, i have been terrified when it comes time for flu and cold seasons. b/c if i 

were to get that sick again, i dont know how i would survive it. 

so in reading this book, as you can imagine, i am panicked and parinoid. im plugging 

along though and am very much interested,its just hard to read something that taps into 

your biggest fear. imagine if you had to read a book or watch a movie based on one of the 

most traumatic and scariest times in your life. fun. 

but when i read some parts to my mom, the nurse...she didnt think twice before saying "but 

medicine has come so far, it would never happen like that again." 

at first i got angry and though have a little heart...but then if comforted me, realizing 

that i dont think it could be the same. 

however, no amount of medicine helped me 3 years ago... 

i was sick for 3 weeks, missing 2 weeks of school. 

i take that back, one bit of medicine worked, the codeine. 


275





Subject: RE: Science is boring 

Hi Joey, 

You really hit the nail on the head for me. When I think of science, 

boring is probably an understatement! For me, doing science involves, 

recording, observing, testing etc., which I don't really care for. But, 

what I do enjoy about science is the exploring, the wonderment, thinking 

about the "why's" of how things happen a certain way. 

What I am looking forward to is exploring those "why's" with my 

students. For example, just this weekend, a bunch of children were 

asking "WHY does my shadow move?" So, I decided to get them involved in 

a "scientific experiment". At 11am I got the children to stand on 

various spots marked "X" on our driveway and then I drew around their 

shadow with chalk. At 11:30am I had them stand on their same "X" spot 

and with different colored chalk drew around their shadow (which of 

course was in a different place than their original shadow). Oh my 

gosh, you could just feel the excitement in the air as the children were 

figuring out why their shadow had moved (the children ranged in ages 

from 3-8). I explained to them how the Earth moved around the sun and 

how that made their shadows change. This is the type of "science" that 

I really enjoy! 

~ Louise 


From: Joey Benson [mailto:hobo_jojo@yahoo.com] 




Hi class, 

In doing the reading from Sagan's book I have found 







humans love to fantasize, we love to think that there 







the movie "Big Fish". This story is about a father 





who don't care about the details, but just want a good 

story. The son is like science; he hates his dad's 





276

of the truth. We don't care that we are hearing 




a drag, he doesn't go along with his father's lies, 



Sagan say's, "All science asks is to employ the same 

levels of skepticism we use in buying a used car." 



of the most painstaking processes I've ever been 






Joey 

__________________________________ 




277




To: ICP-F 


After reading many different write ups on here a few of them caught my eye 

and really had me think what I thought about it. These write ups were the ones 

on aliens. I noticed that many people think that aliens are real while few 

think that they are not. Well personally I am in the group that belive in 

aliens the reason is because I have seen some wierd S%^& when I used to go 

camping when I was younger out in the desert. I seen flying objects that were 

very bright. Then when you see movie likeM.I.B it real starts the wheels 

turing and makes you think do we have aliensliving on the earth today. I know 

I know it was a fake movie but it stillmakes you think. 

The crop circles disscusion on page 73 of the sagan book makes you think can a 

human make these circles with the mechanical device of a board and and rope. I 

personally feel that it can be done. The reason why is because I have seen a 

whole show on how they make the circles all you really need is good math 

skills and a few close buddies to pull this off. When people say oh what about 

all these other crop circles all over the world remeber when one person finds 

out how to do it then they most likely will copy it. 

I really do not agree with Sagan's ideas about "the tools of skepticism are 

generally unavailable to the citizens of our society." (page77) I think that 

this really depends on what kind of a person you are and if you need to ask 

questions to understand. I persoanlly I am very skeptical I need to ask 

questions because I usally do not understand what is going on or what needs to 

be done. 

278



Sent: Monday, February 09, 2004 8:22 PM 


Cc: laurie_c_mcdonald22@hotmail.com; silco001@csusm.edu 

Subject: Another perspective on aliens to think about... 

Hi Laurie & Chula, 

I too was perplexed on the idea of aliens and after much thinking I came up 

with more of a question. Is it possible that alien encounters are but our 

childhood demons and issues, which surface in what may seem like alien 

encounters? I found your inquiries very interesting and thought I share my 

thoughts on aliens with you. 

Here are my thoughts on the idea of aliens. 

Sagan does arouse the questions of aliens and makes us skeptical about the 

faces on Mars. He has us look at why humans put such faith in these 

experiences. What is this really about? Are we so desperate? We want hope, we 

create hope, and we look for validation of that hope in the patterns we see in 

things, like the tortilla with the image of Jesus. I am not certain if there 

is such a thing as aliens and do not discredit people's experiences with 

aliens. Chula posed a good point that if these special people did not have the 

experiences of alien intruders then why have "people from all over the 

world...described their alien intruders as nearly the exact same creature." I 

too have wondered the same thing. In trying to make sense of this, I think 

about what we as humans have in common, as a starting point. We were all 

children once and dealt with life challenges with our limited life 

experiences. Some of us were fortunate enough to grow up in a loving home 

environment where the nightmares of the day did not make there way into our 

dreams. But for less fortunate children, we were haunted by the giants in our 

lives who at times had taken monstrous forms in moments of rage. Is it 

possible that aliens are just a side effect of a childhood gone wrong or 

childhood fears that have not been dealt with? Is it possible that the reason 

that so many people describe similar alien encounters is because our childhood 

experiences are not so different, therefore, the images of those internal 

demons that we have not worked through are not so different? Are our alien 

experiences just images of those who have hurt us but we fear facing that 

truth? It would be easier to see our intruder or abuser as the form of an 

alien than face the fact that our mother had Munchausen by Proxy, or that 

someone you respected and love sexually assaulted you, or that you were made 

to feel less than human for most of your life,or...or...or anything else that 

left you hurt and filled with so many unanswered questions. Is it possible 

that if we are not introspective about our lives that our images are distorted 

in the form of aliens because we really do want to work through those painful 

things? When I hear about people's encounter with aliens, I am given no 

background on their life and the emotional baggage left from childhood not yet 

processed. Instead of just focusing on whether aliens exist or not, why not 

study these people and see what threads tie them together. What internal 

demons are they battling with in the twilight hours of their abduction? In the 

meantime, let's see to it that our children have at least teachers that truly 

care and can give them a moment of peace in their day. (Alexandra) 

279





Subject: RE: Science is boring 

What a cool impromtu science lesson, Louise! I know you said you didn't like the parts of science that 

inclue recording, observing and testing, but..................isn't that what you did with these kids? Maybe 

you just didn't realize that's what you were doing. See, science is fun!!!!!!!!!! 

Cynthia 


Hi Joey, 

You really hit the nail on the head for me. When I think of science, 

boring is probably an understatement! For me, doing science involves, 

recording, observing, testing etc., which I don't really care for. But, 

what I do enjoy about science is the exploring, the wonderment, thinking 

about the "why's" of how things happen a certain way. 

What I am looking forward to is exploring those "why's" with my 

students. For example, just this weekend, a bunch of children were 

asking "WHY does my shadow move?" So, I decided to get them involved in 

a "scientific experiment". At 11am I got the children to stand on 

various spots marked "X" on our driveway and then I drew around their 

shadow with chalk. At 11:30am I had them stand on their same "X" spot 

and with different colored chalk drew around their shadow (which of 

course was in a ! different place than their original shadow). Oh my 

gosh, you could just feel the excitement in the air as the children were 

figuring out why their shadow had moved (the children ranged in ages 

from 3-8). I explained to them how the Earth moved around the sun and 

how that made their shadows change. This is the type of "science" that 

I really enjoy! 

~ Louise 


From: Joey Benson [mailto:hobo_jojo@yahoo.com] 




Hi class, 

In doing the reading from Sagan's book I have found 







280

humans love to fantasize, we lo! ve to think that there 







the movie "Big Fish". This story is about a father 





who don't care about the details, but just want a good 

story. The son is like science; he hates his dad's 





of the truth. We don't ca! re that we are hearing 




a drag, he doesn't go along with his father's lies, 



Sagan say's, "All science asks is to employ the same 

levels of skepticism we use in buying a used car." 



of the most painstaking processes I've ever been 






Joey 

__________________________________ 




_____ 



281





Subject: Fwd: RE: Journal #5 (same topic) 

Attachments: RE: Journal #5 (same topic) 

RE: Journal #5 

(same topic) 


_____ 



282




To: journal 

Subject: bird flu - 1918 flu connection? 

The response is a little technical, but this is interesting. It was written by Dr. Niman from Harvard 

University. I found this on a message board that he posts to. 

Cynthia 

Re:Vietnam H5N1 With 1918 Mutations 

« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2004, 07:31:39 pm » Reply with quote 

_____ 

If I'm reading your post correctly,the present avian flu may be a descendant of the 1918 pandemic 

strain. 

Is this possible ? 

Vietnam H5N1 With 1918 Mutations 

« on: February 03, 2004, 04:21:50 pm » Reply with quote 

_____ 

Here are some of the somewhat restricted mutations in the NA gene product that are found in the 

Vietnam isolate. Most are also in the smuggled ducks, but one that is not found in that isolate, but 

many others including a sequence from the 1918 Pandemic is of particular concern. 

The mutation, P340S. is rarely found in H5N1 isolates. The only one I saw was from a 1959 chicken 

in Scotland. Instead the mutation is found in various species with many different H's in combinations 

with N1 (H1, H6, H7, H9, H11). The new isolate seems to have an expanded target for fatal 

infections. I'm sure there is more to come as more of the genome as sequenced, but the virus looks 

pretty nasty just from taking a quick peek The presence of these mutations may be why victims of the 

1918 pandemic are being exhumed for another look. 

_____ 



283





Subject: Re: Journal #5 (same topic) 

Ok, Ann. I am going to play devil's advocate. In a different post you mentioned switching places with 

others so you would know how it feels. If you put yourself in the shoes of a religious person, would 

you want to legalize it? Homosexuality is not acceptable in many religions. I am not saying it is right 

or wrong, just that this is what they truly believe. And the reality is, there are a lot of religious people 

in our society. When a minority has a different viewpoint from the masses, does that automatically 

make their viewpoint right, or should that viewpoint be accepted just because it is a minority 

viewpoint? 

In regards to why no one is posting to this topic: I think this is a touchy subject for many people, and 

very risky. In this college environment, it might not be acceptable to have a conservative opinion. I 

don't think its worth the risk because it won't change anybody's mind. People believe what they do for 

personal or religious reasons. 

I also think you are correct in saying if it doesn't affect people personally, maybe they aren't interested 

in it. Kind of like the 1918 flu, lol. 

That being said, I commend you for daring to bring it up. That was a risk too. You go, girl. 

Cynthia 


As I can see, my topics have not been hooking the fish in the bowl. People probably don't give a 

"bird dropping" about them because issues like the legalization of homosexual marriage don't 

directly involve them. I hope that the people who disagree with this the most are hit straight on 

with something in their lives that forces them to take a closer look at these issues. Not many 

people don't talk about these issues like they don't talk about "the 1918 flu". 

The more I think and learn about science, the more frustrated I get with religion because it seems 

to me that large sections of our population follow "like sheep" the outdated ideas of their 

"textbook" (the bible) about issues that are very real and are happening right NOW that don't 

make sense. 

I don't mind if people go to church, they can live their lives governed by those rules. BUT, I do get 

mad at religion because it is telling another section of America that they can't get married. LIVE 

(your life the way you want to) AND LET (others have the same rights to) LIVE (their lives the way 

they want to). Is this liberty and justice for all? Or is this one of the many loop holes or 

grandfather clauses that allow injustices to continue? 

In our classes they have been teaching us to think about all the different cultures and the 

diversities, I think this also covers homosexuality. I brought up the discussion of the legalization of 

homosexual marriage because it is a current event, and it just blows me away that we do not 

JUST LEGALIZE IT ! 

Many people think that homosexuals are entitled to rights and benefits under domestic 

partnership; well, after talking to my sister this weekend about what I have been writing in these 

journals she informed me that these benefits would be nice if this really did take place. It's a sort 

of nice idea that is hardly ever provided by employers and the such. So please do not just 

assume that benefits are alive an thriving for this section of the population. This kind of reminds 

284

me of "Separate but NOT equal" of our not too long ago history. 

I saw a movie once I think was called "The Lottery" were each year this little town has a lottery 

and the person who is picked gets stoned to death by the rest of the townspeople. Religion, to 

me, seems like this because it is continuing on with ideas that don't make any sense, yet people 

keep following them. "Why doesn't someone stand up and just say this is not right?" 

Am I the only one who is trying to stand up and yell from the top of my lungs that this is not right? 

Can anyone please genuinely answer this? 

What harm would it be in passing a law that legalized homosexual marriage? 

Ann 

_____ 



_____ 



285








KB) 

286





Subject: Response to Cynthia 

Cynthia, 

I don't mind that you play devil's advocate. I realize this is a topic that a lot of people do not like 

talking about. But, I believe it is a topic worth fighting for. I was once a religious person who went to 

church, in fact, my sister who is gay, was the one who got me into going to church. After a while I 

began to see a pattern with (some, but not all) of the Christians we went to church with. They would 

act however they wanted all week long and went to church on Sunday where they acted all high and 

mighty. It is too bad that these people tainted my view, but they were not the only reason I began to 

question religion, I questioned it for many various reasons. But when I did talk about the magic wand 

thing in my last journal, I was not excluding myself. I am not without sin, nor is anyone. 

I do not see how talking about this subject is risky? Is it risky to talk about the social injustices of our 

not to distant past which included the segregation of African Americans, or is it risky to talk about the 

brave women who fought to make it possible for women to vote? I realize that the topic of 

homosexuality is a "hush hush" topic. But I believe it is a topic that needs to be brought out into 

the open so people can face their fears and misunderstandings of homosexuals. Homosexuals are 

not monsters. If you really think about the definition of monstrosity, you will see that keeping this 

segment of our population from attaining their equal rights is a monstrosity. 

To live in fear of hate crimes, to live in fear of losing your job, to live in a world that spreads, through 

ignorance and religion, its poisonous fumes of prejudice injustices about homosexuality to generation 

after generation in a land that prides itself on standing for liberty and justice for all is total injustice. 

So to me, this needs to be talked about, and this needs to be stopped. How can this happen if 

it people alway remain on the "hush hush" about it? If I open the eyes of one person, then my effort 

will not be in vain. I had to put up with so many injustices growing up that as an adult I adamantly 

say, "Not on my watch"! 

How can we as humans with compassion, allow this to continue. How can we as educated 

individuals who are encouraged to think outside of the box, allow this to happen? I am sure that there 

are many people out there that know at least one homosexual person. Your uncle, your aunt, your 

best friend, your brother, your sister, your cousin, your next door neighbor, your favorite teacher... 

don't these people deserve their a chance to build a life which includes marriage? Why do we allow 

this injustice to continue? Who died and gave us the right to condemn others and keep them from a 

meaningful life? Isn't what we are allowing to continue a crime in itself? 

So, again, I ask you, what harm would come by legalizing homosexual marriage? 

Ann 

_____ 



287





Subject: Check this out 

Here are a few famous homosexuals, just think how many there are that are not on this list? 

Ann 

http://www.gaybiz.com/say/history/ 

_____ 



288





Subject: Re: Response to Cynthia 

Hi Ann, In regards to being a risky topic, I think it depends on which side of the fence you are on. 

Anybody who agrees with you wouldn't really be taking a risk. However, those that don't would be. It 

is not politically correct to speak out against homosexuality. Being this is a list serve, if the wrong 

person read it...............you get my meaning. As far as gay people being mistreated, I don't believe I 

said anything about that. I have been thinking more about the marriage thing since we have been 

posting though. As a rule, I don't think any law should be written with specific people named, 

meaning, ethnicity, sexuality etc. So, if the marriage law is written using the word "people", then I 

think it would be left to the discretion of each individual state to interpret it. Those states that chose to 

include gay marriage could, and those that don't, well, don't. This is a democracy, sort of, so that 

might be a realistic way to go. How is that for a compromise? See, I! can be a reasonable person. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

I don't mind that you play devil's advocate. I realize this is a topic that a lot of people do not like 

talking about. But, I believe it is a topic worth fighting for. I was once a religious person who went 

to church, in fact, my sister who is gay, was the one who got me into going to church. After a 

while I began to see a pattern with (some, but not all) of the Christians we went to church with. 

They would act however they wanted all week long and went to church on Sunday where they 

acted all high and mighty. It is too bad that these people tainted my view, but they were not the 

only reason I began to question religion, I questioned it for many various reasons. But when I did 

talk about the magic wand thing in my last journal, I was not excluding myself. I am not without 

sin, nor is anyone. 

I do not see how talking about this subject is risky? Is it risky to talk about the social injustices of 

our not to distant past which included the segregation of African Americans, or is it risky to talk 

about the brave women who fought to make it possible for women to vote? I realize that the topic 

of homosexuality is a "hush hush" topic. But I believe it is a topic that needs to be brought out into 

the open so people can face their fears and misunderstandings of homosexuals. Homosexuals 

are not monsters. If you really think about the definition of monstrosity, you will see that keeping 

this segment of our population from attaining their equal rights is a monstrosity. 

To live in fear of hate crimes, to live in fear of losing your job, to live in a world that spreads, 

through ignorance and religion, its poisonous fumes of prejudice injustices about homosexuality to 

generation after generation in a land that prides itself on standing for liberty and justice for 

all is total injustice. So to me, this needs to be talked about, and this needs to be stopped. How 

can this happen if it people alway remain on the "hush hush" about it? If I open the eyes of one 

person, then my effort will not be in vain. I had to put up with so many injustices growing up that 

as an adult I adamantly say, "Not on my watch"! 

How can we as humans with compassion, allow this to continue. How can we as educated 

individuals who are encouraged to think outside of the box, allow this to happen? I am sure that 

there are many people out there that know at least one homosexual person. Your uncle, your 

289

aunt, your best friend, your brother, your sister, your cousin, your next door neighbor, your favorite 

teacher... don't these people deserve their a chance to build a life which includes marriage? Why 

do we allow this injustice to continue? Who died and gave us the right to condemn others and 

keep them from a meaningful life? Isn't what we are allowing to continue a crime in itself? 

So, again, I ask you, what harm would come by legalizing homosexual marriage? 

Ann 

_____ 



_____ 



290





Subject: for louise 

Maybe this is why we never heard of it. I HAVE heard of La Grippe. 

The 1918 Spanish Flu (also termed la grippe) pandemic charged across America in seven days and 

across the world in three months. 

Another reason: 

Several county residents who survived the 1918 influenza epidemic were willing to be interviewed for 

a study conducted by UW-Oshkosh faculty and students during spring 2001. Many mentioned that no 

one spoke about this time period because it was so terrible. Now, eighty years later, they wanted to 

talk about it and share with the community. Many commented on the remedies used to treat the flu. 

Some lost parents and siblings. Some felt guilty, believing they had brought the flu home from school; 

they witnessed the horrific symptoms in the adults surrounding them. None were able to comprehend 

the scope of the influenza epidemic in the neighboring communities or the nation as a whole. 

For the whole article: http://www.uwosh.edu/departments/biology/shors/fluarticle.htm 

_____ 



291





Subject: Journal #4 or #5 gay marriage 

Waz-up Ann and class, 

To be frank, don't worry i am still robert, the debate over homosexual 

marriage is an extremely complicated and segregated debate. Many would say 

that homosexuals do not deserve the rights of marriage due to the fact that 

marriage by definition, thank you Mr.. Bush and religious "wise men", is 

between a man and a women. These people would also say by recognizing 

homosexuals with marriage they would legitimize a disgusting practice of 

human lust (have they seen some of these porn sites with straight couples, 

that's lust). Most democrat and republican politicians are openly against 

gay marriage. So the questions arises, in the face of such hostile 

conditions what are those who do believe that people are people and deserve 

equal rights suppose to do (same topic throughout US history)? 

Well the answer may very well lay in a fiscal rebellion, as it is known that 

today money is KING. What happens when all of the "straight couples" around 

the country, who believe in same sex unions, stop signing their marriage 

certificates? What happens when the government is unable to collect the 

higher taxes due to this act? 

What happens when people start making comparable donations, as compared to 

the fundamentalist christians, churches, fundamentalists and religious 

zealots, to candidates that support causes such as gay marriage? What 

happens when the government is no longer full of people who are against gay 

marriages? 

Money is the number one way to ensure that your views will be heard in this 

country. It is depressing, but true. Filter money from your cause and one 

may very well find themselves the victor, as in the person that won the 

fight. 

This is not to suggest that other avenues can't be taken, but it is 

suggesting that without the help of religious institutions (one of the 

greatest powers within the U.S.) or fiscal bombardment, openly homosexual 

marriages are certainly a long way off. It is not fare, but this (not being 

fare) is what the country was founded on! 

with love and respect to all (I really do mean this), 


P.S. 

I could certainly be totally wrong! But, it is fun to write and talk as if 

you know everything (I am learning this from Sagan). 




>Subject: Response to Cynthia Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 15:50:00 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>Cynthia, 

> 

>I don't mind that you play devil's advocate. I realize this is a topic 

>that a lot of people do not like talking about. But, I believe it is a 

>topic worth fighting for. I was once a religious person who went to 

292

church, in fact, my sister who is gay, was the one who got me into going to 

>church. After a while I began to see a pattern with (some, but not all) of 

>the Christians we went to church with. They would act however they wanted 

>all week long and went to church on Sunday where they acted all high and 

>mighty. It is too bad that these people tainted my view, but they were not 

>the only reason I began to question religion, I questioned it for many 

>various reasons. But when I did talk about the magic wand thing in my last 

>journal, I was not excluding myself. I am not without sin, nor is anyone. 

> 

>I do not see how talking about this subject is risky? Is it risky to talk 

>about the social injustices of our not to distant past which included the 

>segregation of African Americans, or is it risky to talk about the brave 

>women who fought to make it possible for women to vote? I realize that the 

>topic of homosexuality is a "hush hush" topic. But I believe it is a topic 

>that needs to be brought out into the open so people can face their fears 

>and misunderstandings of homosexuals. Homosexuals are not monsters. If 

>you really think about the definition of monstrosity, you will see that 

>keeping this segment of our population from attaining their equal rights is 

>a monstrosity. 

> 

>To live in fear of hate crimes, to live in fear of losing your job, to live 

>in a world that spreads, through ignorance and religion, its poisonous 

>fumes of prejudice injustices about homosexuality to generation after 

>generation in a land that prides itself on standing for liberty and justice 

>for all is total injustice. So to me, this needs to be talked about, and 

>this needs to be stopped. How can this happen if it people alway remain on 

>the "hush hush" about it? If I open the eyes of one person, then my effort 

>will not be in vain. I had to put up with so many injustices growing up 

>that as an adult I adamantly say, "Not on my watch"! 

> 

>How can we as humans with compassion, allow this to continue. How can we 

>as educated individuals who are encouraged to think outside of the box, 

>allow this to happen? I am sure that there are many people out there that 

>know at least one homosexual person. Your uncle, your aunt, your best 

>friend, your brother, your sister, your cousin, your next door neighbor, 

>your favorite teacher... don't these people deserve their a chance to build 

>a life which includes marriage? Why do we allow this injustice to 

>continue? Who died and gave us the right to condemn others and keep them 

>from a meaningful life? Isn't what we are allowing to continue a crime in 

>itself? 

>So, again, I ask you, what harm would come by legalizing homosexual 

>marriage? 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Click here for a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee. 


293





Subject: Re: Journal #4 or #5 gay marriage 

I think you are probably right, Robert. The problem is that not enough people actually support the 

viewpoint to make it work. Now that could change eventually, but it isn't the case right now. In 

Massachusetts, only 1/3 of the people support gay marriage. But I do like your marriage certificate 

idea, thats a creative approach. 

Cynthia 


Waz-up Ann and class, 

To be frank, don't worry i am still robert, the debate over homosexual 

marriage is an extremely complicated and segregated debate. Many would say 

that homosexuals do not deserve the rights of marriage due to the fact that 

marriage by definition, thank you Mr.. Bush and religious "wise men", is 

between a man and a women. These people would also say by recognizing 

homosexuals with marriage they would legitimize a disgusting practice of 

human lust (have they seen some of these porn sites with straight couples, 

that's lust). Most democrat and republican politicians are openly against 

gay marriage. So the questions arises, in the face of such hostile 

conditions what are those who do believe that people are people and deserve 

equal rights suppose to do (same topic throughout US history)? 

Well the answer may ver! y well lay in a fiscal rebellion, as it is known that 

today money is KING. What happens when all of the "straight couples" around 

the country, who believe in same sex unions, stop signing their marriage 

certificates? What happens when the government is unable to collect the 

higher taxes due to this act? 

What happens when people start making comparable donations, as compared to 

the fundamentalist christians, churches, fundamentalists and religious 

zealots, to candidates that support causes such as gay marriage? What 

happens when the government is no longer full of people who are against gay 

marriages? 

Money is the number one way to ensure that your views will be heard in this 

country. It is depressing, but true. Filter money from your cause and one 

may very well find themselves the victor, as in the person that won the 

fight. 

This is not to suggest that other avenues can't be taken, but it is 

suggesting that witho! ut the help of religious institutions (one of the 

greatest powers within the U.S.) or fiscal bombardment, openly homosexual 

marriages are certainly a long way off. It is not fare, but this (not being 

fare) is what the country was founded on! 

294

with love and respect to all (I really do mean this), 


P.S. 

I could certainly be totally wrong! But, it is fun to write and talk as if 

you know everything (I am learning this from Sagan). 

>From: Ann Kirkendall 



>Subject: Response to Cynthia Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 15:50:00 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>Cynthia, 

> 

>I don't mind that you play devil's advocate. I realize this is a topic 

>that a lot of people do not like talking about. But, I believe it is a 

>topic worth fighting for. I was once a religious person who went to 

>church, in fact, my sister who is g! ay, was the one who got me into going to 

>church. After a while I began to see a pattern with (some, but not all) of 

>the Christians we went to church with. They would act however they wanted 

>all week long and went to church on Sunday where they acted all high and 

>mighty. It is too bad that these people tainted my view, but they were not 

>the only reason I began to question religion, I questioned it for many 

>various reasons. But when I did talk about the magic wand thing in my last 

>journal, I was not excluding myself. I am not without sin, nor is anyone. 

> 

>I do not see how talking about this subject is risky? Is it risky to talk 

>about the social injustices of our not to distant past which included the 

>segregation of African Americans, or is it risky to talk about the brave 

>women who fought to make it possible for women to vote? I realize that the 

>topic of homosexuality is a "hush hush"! topic. But I believe it is a topic 

>that needs to be brought out into the open so people can face their fears 

>and misunderstandings of homosexuals. Homosexuals are not monsters. If 

>you really think about the definition of monstrosity, you will see that 

>keeping this segment of our population from attaining their equal rights is 

>a monstrosity. 

> 

>To live in fear of hate crimes, to live in fear of losing your job, to live 

>in a world that spreads, through ignorance and religion, its poisonous 

>fumes of prejudice injustices about homosexuality to generation after 

>generation in a land that prides itself on standing for liberty and justice 

>for all is total injustice. So to me, this needs to be talked about, and 

>this needs to be stopped. How can this happen if it people alway remain on 

>the "hush hush" about it? If I open the eyes of one person, then my effort 

>will not be in vain. I ha! d to put up with so many injustices growing up 

>that as an adult I adamantly say, "Not on my watch"! 

> 

>How can we as humans with compassion, allow this to continue. How can we 

>as educated individuals who are encouraged to think outside of the box, 

>allow this to happen? I am sure that there are many people out there that 

>know at least one homosexual person. Your uncle, your aunt, your best 

295

friend, your brother, your sister, your cousin, your next door neighbor, 

>your favorite teacher... don't these people deserve their a chance to build 

>a life which includes marriage? Why do we allow this injustice to 

>continue? Who died and gave us the right to condemn others and keep them 

>from a meaningful life? Isn't what we are allowing to continue a crime in 

>itself? 

>So, again, I ask you, what harm would come by legalizing homosexual 

>marriage? 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



296





Subject: Oh Robert... 

Domo arigato Mr. Roboto, 

Are you saying that it would cost additional money to extend an already existing law to allow all 

citizens to get married? 

Why do homosexuals have to pay into the mechanism that allows marriage to everyone but them? 

Forget about going to hell, anyone who has a heart, tries to make a difference, and runs up 

against undefeatible obstacles already lives in hell. 

I guess some people's piece of the apple pie is all moldy even though they have to pay the 

same amount, and then some, as a fresh piece that their neighbor gets. And their neighbor is eating 

their piece of pie right in front of them. 

And then, some people's apple pie has ice cream on top (ice cream made from the sweat, blood, 

tears, and lost dreams of those who are not a part of the "BIG CLUB"). 

I'm so tired of the bullshit. I hate this mechanism we call civilization. 

"I pledge allegence to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, 

one nation, under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for (some) all." And this is why I 

hate what religion allows people to do. 

In a world like this, why do I even get out of bed in the morning? 


_____ 



297





Subject: RE: Oh Robert... 

"And their neighbor is eating their piece of pie right in front of them." 

Wins the award for funniest unintentional, yet completely fitting sexual 

innuendo of the week. 




>Subject: Oh Robert... 


> 

>Domo arigato Mr. Roboto, 

> 

>Are you saying that it would cost additional money to extend an already 

>existing law to allow all citizens to get married? 

> 

>Why do homosexuals have to pay into the mechanism that allows marriage to 

>everyone but them? 

> 

>Forget about going to hell, anyone who has a heart, tries to make a 

>difference, and runs up against undefeatible obstacles already lives in 

>hell. 

> 

>I guess some people's piece of the apple pie is all moldy even though they 

>have to pay the same amount, and then some, as a fresh piece that their 

>neighbor gets. And their neighbor is eating their piece of pie right in 

>front of them. 

>And then, some people's apple pie has ice cream on top (ice cream made from 

>the sweat, blood, tears, and lost dreams of those who are not a part of the 

>"BIG CLUB"). 

> 

>I'm so tired of the bullshit. I hate this mechanism we call civilization. 

>"I pledge allegence to the flag of the United States of America, and to the 

>republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible with 

>liberty and justice for (some) all." And this is why I hate what religion 

>allows people to do. 

> 

>In a world like this, why do I even get out of bed in the morning? 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



298

299


From: Carrie Gilardone [carriegilardone@hotmail.com] 



Subject: RE: Journal #3 - Influenza 

Hey Jennifer, first of all, i'm actually reading through these emails... 

well most of them. I don't do aliens so i'm skipping all discussion on 

aliens. But I guess your email caught my attention because I am still not 

completely hooked on this science thing. I don't understand how some of the 

things were reading applies to teaching elementary students??? I wonder if 

i'm looking at it from the wrong perspective?? Science interest me, but only 

certain aspects of it. When I was reading the case about Mr. Edmonds and how 

he wasn't really interested in the topic of simple machines, i thought about 

myself. I know as a teacher though that I will need to find a way to make my 

students interested. 

The Kolata book has me interested and I am very curious. I find myself 

asking many questions as i read. But how will this knowledge help me teach 

elementary students? I am still trying to figure every thing out this 

semester. I had my reservations about science, and still do. But it is still 

early in the semester and i'm going to try to put this all together. WEll, 

just a couple of thoughts. I had some other thoughts, but its getting late. 

So until tomorrow. Later. 

>From: "Jennifer Ramos" 



>Subject: Journal #3 - Influenza 

>Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 23:58:28 -0800 

> 

>Ever since the topic of the new East Asia avian flu has been brought to the 

>table, I have found myself to be more and more drawn to it. I am curious 

>about these influenzas. Their origin, how they travel, and who they affect. 

>I'm like a little kid, fascinated by a topic presented in school and 

>wanting to learn more about it. I am glad that something I am interested in 

>has finally been brought up. Better late than never. 

> 

>With beginning Gina Kolata's book on the flu of 1918, I am beginning to 

>find anwers to some of my questions about the deadly influenzas. The bird 

>flu in East Asia has raised a lot of questions for me and now I may begin 

>to find more answers. 

> 

>Since being in this class, reading the e-mails, and doing the assigned 

>readings, I find myself doing more science each and every day. I am more 

>observant of the world around me. I have begun asking myself and others 

>more questions about the things surrounding me, thoughts in my head, and 

>contemporary issues revolving around science. I am starting to see more 

>science and starting to look through the eyes of a new perosn who is 

>conciously trying harder to be more scientific. I think that in order to be 

>able to teach it some day, and be good at it, I have to practice more. So I 

>am really making that effort to pursue my little "wows" and curiosity. 

> 

>As I've already said, this influenza thing has really caught my attention. 

>So we all thought that this season of the flu was bad? I can't wait to find 

>out more about the deadliest flu of the century in Kolata's book. It wasn't 

>that long ago...1918. Yes, we are more advanced now, technologically, 

>medicinally, and scientifically, but can it happen again? Are we ready? Or 

>is it too far back, that we shouldn't even think something like it could 

>happen now? I don't know, it's pretty scary to me. 

> 

300

Hopefully soon, I will get my answers, and in finding those answers, think 

>of new questions. After all, I'm trying to practice this whole "science" 

>thing. 

> 

>~Jennifer Ramos 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Check out the great features of the new MSN 9 Dial-up, with the MSN Dial-up 

>Accelerator. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/ 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Let the advanced features & services of MSN Internet Software maximize your 

online time. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200363ave/direct/01/ 

301





Subject: RE: Oh Robert... 

Mike, it's about time you chime in. And thanks for point out the deeper meaning because I totally 

missed it. 










> 


> 



> 



> 



>hell. 

> 

>I guess some peo! ple's piece of the apple pie is all moldy even though they 






>"BIG CLUB"). 

> 






> 


302

> Ann 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



303






Reading more about aliens in the Sagan book was kind of boring for me because 

I think that it's all just a hoax to begin with. I will tell you though that 

just last night I was out with my parents and we were going home from eating 

out, when we saw something in the sky that had lights blinking on the top, 

bottom, and sides of it. Well, my mom and I are the adventurous type so we 

made my dad drive closer to it to find out what it really was. I was joking 

with my parents by telling them that we might get abducted by aliens if we're 

not cautious. But we continued going west until we got to where the beach 

campsite was, and we parked on the side of the road to look at it. Well, it 

was funny because once we stopped and just watched it in the sky, two other 

cars parked behind us and were looking at it as well. By this time my mom and 

I were just cracking up. As we continued to watched it, it moved side to side 

and just stayed lifted in the night air. Then as I contiued looking at it, my 

eyes were getting to be better focused on it and all of us could tell that it 

was just a blimp floating over the ocean. So we left knowing what it was, but 

it was wierd because the blimp started heading south along with us. When I saw 

this my parents even became surprised. Then as we did a u-turn to head back 

home, the blimp started going back north along with us. As we started going 

east, the blimp just stayed next to the beach. So I guess if I were one of 

those people who believed in UFO's I would have said that I saw one that night 

not realizing that it was just a stupid blimp. I thought it would be funny to 

tell all of you about that experience. I think that there's truth about how 

the government may be keeping secrets from society, but there's probably 

nothing that is has any truth to it when there is the matter about aliens. 

Overall,I don't think that keeping secrets is anything new in our society 

anyways. The hallucinations/dreams part was interesting. I think they are just 

all from what we want to think about and so are just part of our own 

imaginations. Again, just to let you know Sagan again criticizes religion 

every chapter by saying in a paragraph or two that religion has its 

falsehoods, which makes me utterly mad. 

Kolata, on the other hand, is really fascinating. I asked my parents and 

boyfriend if they ever heard about the flu epidemic and they said no. Once I 

told them about it, they were really surprised. After reading all of the 

situations and experiences that people were going through with their sickness, 

I practically had to put the book down to take a break from it. I don't know 

what I would have done if I were one of the lucky ones and I didn't get 

infected and I had a choice between helping the sick get better, or just stay 

away from the sick and just enjoy life as much as I could. I could see that 

argument either way. 


304





Subject: I expected more... 

If this was a topic that I didn't care about, I might have found that funny, but there was no sexual 

meaning intended from that statement. I am offended that this topic is taken so lightly; I guess I 

expected more from people. It is no different than trying to talk to my father about not hating black 

people. I thought I could make a difference at least with individual people. I see now that my efforts 

have gone in vain. 

"Dear God, 

Save me from (most, but not all of) your followers and those who walk through life with 

blinders on". 

Ann 


Mike, it's about time you chime in. And thanks for point out the deeper meaning because I totally 

missed it. 










> 


> 



> 



> 



>hell. 

> 

305

_____ 

>I guess some peo! ! ple's piece of the apple pie is all moldy even though they 






>"BIG CLUB"). 

> 






> 


> 

> Ann 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 





_____ 



306





Subject: RE: I expected more... 

I think that you totally missed my point Ann. Maybe you should read my 

e-mail again and think about what it was truly suggesting, instead of trying 

to counteract it right away. Just an idea. 

love yah, 

Robert 




>Subject: I expected more... 

>Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:31:54 -0800 (PST) 

> 

> 

>If this was a topic that I didn't care about, I might have found that 

>funny, but there was no sexual meaning intended from that statement. I am 

>offended that this topic is taken so lightly; I guess I expected more from 

>people. It is no different than trying to talk to my father about not 

>hating black people. I thought I could make a difference at least with 

>individual people. I see now that my efforts have gone in vain. 

> 

>"Dear God, 

> Save me from (most, but not all of) your followers and those who walk 

>through life with blinders on". 

> 

>Ann 

> 


>Mike, it's about time you chime in. And thanks for point out the deeper 

>meaning because I totally missed it. 

> 

> 

>Mike Runnestrand wrote: 

>"And their neighbor is eating their piece of pie right in front of them." 

> 

>Wins the award for funniest unintentional, yet completely fitting sexual 

>innuendo of the week. 

> 

> 

> >From: Ann Kirkendall 



> >Subject: Oh Robert... 

> >Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:56:57 -0800 (PST) 

> > 

> >Domo arigato Mr. Roboto, 

> > 

> >Are you saying that it would cost additional money to extend an already 

> >existing law to allow all citizens to get married? 

> > 

> >Why do homosexuals have to pay into the mechanism that allows marriage to 

> >everyone but them? 

> > 

> >Forget about going to hell, anyone who has a heart, tries to make a 

> >difference, and runs up against undefeatible obstacles already lives in 

> >hell. 

307

> >I guess some peo! ple's piece of the apple pie is all moldy even though 

>they 

> >have to pay the same amount, and then some, as a fresh piece that their 

> >neighbor gets. And their neighbor is eating their piece of pie right in 

> >front of them. 

> >And then, some people's apple pie has ice cream on top (ice cream made 

>from 

> >the sweat, blood, tears, and lost dreams of those who are not a part of 

>the 

> >"BIG CLUB"). 

> > 

> >I'm so tired of the bullshit. I hate this mechanism we call civilization. 

> >"I pledge allegence to the flag of the United States of America, and to 

>the 

> >republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible with 

> >liberty and justice for (some) all." And this is why I hate what religion 

> >allows people to do. 

> > 

> >In a world like this, why do I even get out of bed in the morning? 

> > 

> > Ann 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 

> >Do you Yahoo!? 

> >Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Create your own personal Web page with the info you use most, at My MSN. 

>http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200364ave/direct/01/ 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



308





Subject: government- Journal Casey Cunningham 

I have been thinking alot about our discussion in class. Some one asked in class why we 

didn't know about this? Why is this not in our history books. An explanation from another 

classmate was that the government chooses not to talk about this issue. The government 

sensors what the public hears and doesn't hear. Why? That is what I wonder. Why do they 

choose what we can and can not tolerate. The government hides so much information from us. 

And my other question is Is that a good thing or bad thing? 

When people know things...they panic. Like the chicken thing that is going on. Robert was 

explaining to me that you can't get that flu from eating the chicken so what is the point 

of scaring everyone? Some things, in my opinion are better left unknown. Many disagree and 

I know i will hear about it but I would rather not know. Like the book we are reading and 

the movie we watched. I started getting nervous wondering...will this ever happen again? 

But on the other hand there have been things that I would want to know. So I don't 

know...I go back and forth on this issue. What do you guys think? 

309




To: LBST 361B 


To be honest I got kind of frighten about influenza. It is a scary thought to 

think about how viruses can cause such harm. I was thinking about when the 

professor asked why many people don't know about it and even people from that 

time did not talk about it either. There was silence. I think that's how 

people during that time chose to deal with it because, like it was said in 

class, people felt helpless and without defense. If they talked about it, they 

were empowering the disease even after it was gone. It is like talkig about 

defeat. And I don't think no one likes to talk about defeat. 

Now, it makes me think that when I was in school, teachers avoided certain 

topics. For instance, I know that some of my teachers in Mexico, decided not 

to mentioned topics and events that involved the government and uprisings and 

protests against it. It makes me mad because certain events affected the 

people, but the government chose to hide, manipulate and even destroy 

information that could answer so many questions about how certian events 

happened. 

I am saying this because as a future teacher, how do I choose what topics to 

talk about and how would I deal with topics brought up by my students? I ask 

myself, "Am I capable to make the right decisions? Will I make the right 

decisions? Being a teacher really holds a lot more responsibilities than I 

thought. 

Judith 

310






Deciding what to teach can be a real dilemma, Judith. I think the standards probably will make a lot of 

the choices for you. If you have anytime left after you meet these, I suggest picking things you are 

passionate about. Your students will feel your excitement, and just maybe it will be contagious. On 

thing to think about: If you have children read from a wide variety of books, they can be exposed to 

tons of things, without you having to hit on everyone in your lessons. Biographies about people like 

George Washington Carver, non-fiction books about bugs, animals, volcanoes, etc. Even historical 

fiction can teach kids about history. Another thing that is possible, a list of topics students can pick 

from for individual research projects that they can give a class presentation about. No teacher can 

teacher everything, but thinking about what students will benefit most from learning about when you 

plan your lessons might steer you in the right direction. Just use your gut! !!! 

Cynthia 


To be honest I got kind of frighten about influenza. It is a scary thought to 

think about how viruses can cause such harm. I was thinking about when the 

professor asked why many people don't know about it and even people from that 

time did not talk about it either. There was silence. I think that's how 

people during that time chose to deal with it because, like it was said in 

class, people felt helpless and without defense. If they talked about it, they 

were empowering the disease even after it was gone. It is like talking about 

defeat. And I don't think no one likes to talk about defeat. 

Now, it makes me think that when I was in school, teachers avoided certain 

topics. For instance, I know that some of my teachers in Mexico, decided not 

to mentioned topics and events that involved the government and uprisings and 

protests agains! t it. It makes me mad because certain events affected the 

people, but the government chose to hide, manipulate and even destroy 

information that could answer so many questions about how certain events 

happened. 

I am saying this because as a future teacher, how do I choose what topics to 

talk about and how would I deal with topics brought up by my students? I ask 

myself, "Am I capable to make the right decisions? Will I make the right 

decisions? Being a teacher really holds a lot more responsibilities than I 

thought. 

Judith 

_____ 



311

312




To: ICP-F 


Thanks, Cynthia. I guess it takes guts to teach. I think that when you want 

the best for your students, you do what is in your power to bring that to 

them. I hope that I am able to do that because I want them to succeed and have 

an interest in learning. 

judith 


>Deciding what to teach can be a real dilemma, Judith. I think the standards 

probably will make a lot of the choices for you. If you have anytime left 

after you meet these, I suggest picking things you are passionate about. Your 

students will feel your excitement, and just maybe it will be contagious. On 

thing to think about: If you have children read from a wide variety of books, 

they can be exposed to tons of things, without you having to hit on everyone 

in your lessons. Biographies about people like George Washington Carver, 

non-fiction books about bugs, animals, volcanoes, etc. Even historical fiction 

can teach kids about history. Another thing that is possible, a list of topics 

students can pick from for individual research projects that they can give a 

class presentation about. No teacher can teacher everything, but thinking 

about what students will benefit most from learning about when you plan your 

lessons might steer you in the right direction. Just use your gut!!! 

>Cynthia 

> 

>marti171 wrote: 

>To be honest I got kind of frighten about influenza. It is a scary thought to 

>think about how viruses can cause such harm. I was thinking about when the 

>professor asked why many people don't know about it and even people from that 

>time did not talk about it either. There was silence. I think that's how 

>people during that time chose to deal with it because, like it was said in 

>class, people felt helpless and without defense. If they talked about it, 

they 

>were empowering the disease even after it was gone. It is like talking about 

>defeat. And I don't think no one likes to talk about defeat. 

> 

>Now, it makes me think that when I was in school, teachers avoided certain 

>topics. For instance, I know that some of my teachers in Mexico, decided not 

>to mentioned topics and events that involved the government and uprisings and 

>protests against it. It makes me mad because certain events affected the 

>people, but the government chose to hide, manipulate and even destroy 

>information that could answer so many questions about how certain events 

>happened. 

> 

>I am saying this because as a future teacher, how do I choose what topics to 

>talk about and how would I deal with topics brought up by my students? I ask 

>myself, "Am I capable to make the right decisions? Will I make the right 

>decisions? Being a teacher really holds a lot more responsibilities than I 

>thought. 

> 

>Judith 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



313

314






That is half the battle, wanting them to succeed. Just have confidence in yourself, you are going to be 

a great teacher. 


Thanks, Cynthia. I guess it takes guts to teach. I think that when you want 

the best for your students, you do what is in your power to bring that to 

them. I hope that I am able to do that because I want them to succeed and have 

an interest in learning. 

judith 


>Deciding what to teach can be a real dilemma, Judith. I think the standards 

probably will make a lot of the choices for you. If you have anytime left 

after you meet these, I suggest picking things you are passionate about. Your 

students will feel your excitement, and just maybe it will be contagious. On 

thing to think about: If you have children read from a wide variety of books, 

they can be exposed to tons of things, without you having to hit on everyone 

in your lessons. Biographies about! people like George Washington Carver, 

non-fiction books about bugs, animals, volcanoes, etc. Even historical fiction 

can teach kids about history. Another thing that is possible, a list of topics 

students can pick from for individual research projects that they can give a 

class presentation about. No teacher can teacher everything, but thinking 

about what students will benefit most from learning about when you plan your 

lessons might steer you in the right direction. Just use your gut!!! 

>Cynthia 

> 

>marti171 wrote: 

>To be honest I got kind of frighten about influenza. It is a scary thought to 

>think about how viruses can cause such harm. I was thinking about when the 

>professor asked why many people don't know about it and even people from that 

>time did not talk about it either. There was silence. I think that's how 

>people during that time chose to deal with it because, like it was said in 

>class, people felt helpless and without defense. If they talked about it, 

they 

>were empowering the disease even after it was gone. It is like talking about 

>defeat. And I don't think no one likes to talk about defeat. 

> 

>Now, it makes me think that when I was in school, teachers avoided certain 

>topics. For instance, I know that some of my teachers in Mexico, decided not 

>to mentioned topics and events that involved the government and uprisings and 

>protests against it. It makes me mad because certain events affected the 

>people, but the government chose to hide, manipulate and even destroy 

315

information that could answer so many questions about how certain events 

>happened. 

> 

>I am saying this because as a future teacher, how do I choose what topics to 

>talk about and how would I deal with topics brought up by my students? I ask 

>myself, "Am I capable to make the right decisio! ns? Will I make the right 

>decisions? Being a teacher really holds a lot more responsibilities than I 

>thought. 

> 

>Judith 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 



316




To: journal 

Subject: solving for the wrong problem 

Hi everyone, I know you are sick of me posting, but............. 

Robert and I had a conversation after Prof. Yamashita's class today, and I think he has a pretty good 

hypothesis about this class. I will let him explain it if he wants to. But anyway, he got me thinking. 

Prof. Yamashita talked about how people were solving for the wrong problem in regards to the flu. 

Now obviously, he was hinting at something, and I don't think it has anything to do with the flu. So, 

back to evolution and creationism. No one can prove either theory. So, are we solving for the wrong 

problem? Should we be looking at something else? I haven't gotten any further than this, but maybe 

someone else has an idea. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



317





Subject: Solving for the wrong problem 

On that train of thought, 

I agree. I know that in my lifetime I will never be able to prove or not prove if there is a God or not, 

but actually I am not trying to prove that. In my lifetime I know that I can not convince people who feel 

strongly about religion to accept different lifestyles such as homosexuality, but I am not actually trying 

to do that either. In my lifetime I may be capable of opening individual eyes that were once closed, 

but that is not my point. 

I think I am trying to discover why we afford certain rights to the majority of our society and not extend 

the same rights to those who we feel are different from ourselves, the homosexual minority. 

I think maybe people are stuck trying to prove if it is moral or not when they will never be able 

to come to a conclusion. 

But the reality of what we do know is that they are kept from attaining their full potential because they 

are not given their rights, and I do not think that is right. 

Let's solve for what we do know and what we can honestly look at and correct, human treatment 

towards other humans. 

Or is this all noise on the side of the road that as individuals we choose not to look at? 

Ann 

_____ 



318





Subject: government control 

I think that the government chooses what they want to show us because they are ultimately in control 

of us. They are running top secret experiments probably as we speak. There are people so high up 

that the chaos of our everyday existence never touches their realm. 

We can only educate ourselves. We can only be responsible for our own individual actions. We can 

only do the best that we can, and that's all we can do. 

Ann 

p.s. Cynthia and I were talking about the 1918 flu and thought maybe the government was testing 

some germs as warfare? Maybe that's why it is not talked about? Who really knows? But, I think 

people need to bring things out into the open, so they can learn from them. KNOWLEDGE IS 

POWER! 

_____ 



319





Subject: Re: Solving for the wrong problem 

You may be right about the morality issue. It isn't something that can be proven, only agreed upon. 

Maybe if we get rid of religion, we could solve that problem. That sounds logical at first glance. But 

without morality, what would happen? We could allow people to live their lives in any manner they 

wish, and not just in the area of sexuality. People could be free to abuse drugs with no reparcussions, 

murder when they want to, steal etc. But that wouldn't be civilization, it would be chaos. The problem 

is where to draw the line. Now, I suppose we could have morality without religion, but someone will 

need to draw up the new rules. Historically, the rules have been quite similar to the ones used in the 

10 commandmants (ie Hammorabi), but I guess they could be open for interpretation. 

In regards to solving for the wrong problem and marriage: What if we just get rid of the financial and 

legal benefits of marriage? Then it could just be a personal commitment between 2 people. No 

marriage license, no permission. That might save us a lot of money and headache in divorce court. 

Marriage isn't the sacred thing it once was anyway. People get tired of the effort required and move 

on to the next person they find attractive. It doesn't appear that humans were meant for monogomous 

relationships anyway, just watch daytime tv. Ok, so then there is the problem of sexually transmitted 

diseases. That might become a bigger problem, but then it could serve as population control. 

Hm...the more I think about it, the more complex it gets. 

Perhaps the big worry with gay marriage is what comes next. It really isn't a big deal if 2 men or 2 

women want to be lifetime mates, although I don't think the divorce rates would be any lower among 

these partners than others. But then, what about the men or women who want to marry many people 

or children or animals? I know it sounds ridiculous, but there is the slippery slope theory. I just think a 

lot of people fear that there is worse to come. 

Just in case I pissed anyone off with "marriage not being sacred", I don't really believe that, at least 

for myself. I am still married to the man I had kids with, and he in the only husband I have ever had, 

lol. 

Ann, someday maybe it will be acceptable for gays to be married. After all, like you said, segregation 

wasn't ok either. But prejudice is still around and it has been many years. While things are better, they 

still have a long way to go. Everything takes time. Patience is a virtue. I think someone famous said 

that. 

Well, after all this rambling, I still don't know what problem we should really be solving for. 

Cynthia 


On that train of thought, 

I agree. I know that in my lifetime I will never be able to prove or not prove if there is a God or not, 

but actually I am not trying to prove that. In my lifetime I know that I can not convince people who 

feel strongly about religion to accept different lifestyles such as homosexuality, but I am not 

actually trying to do that either. In my lifetime I may be capable of opening individual eyes that 

were once closed, but that is not my point. 

I think I am trying to discover why we afford certain rights to the majority of our society and not 

extend the same rights to those who we feel are different from ourselves, the homosexual 

minority. 

320

I think maybe people are stuck trying to prove if it is moral or not when they will never be 

able to come to a conclusion. 

But the reality of what we do know is that they are kept from attaining their full potential because 

they are not given their rights, and I do not think that is right. 

Let's solve for what we do know and what we can honestly look at and correct, human treatment 

towards other humans. 

Or is this all noise on the side of the road that as individuals we choose not to look at? 

Ann 

_____ 



_____ 



321




To: journal 

Subject: RE: solving for the wrong problem 

I was also puzzled when prof. Yamashita said that people were solving for the 

wrong problem, the flu. Then it makes me think that there have been other 

times when people have been solving for the wrong problem too. I have a friend 

that always says, "for real problems, there are real solutions." So I guess we 

need to focus on the reality of the problem taking into consideration many 

factors like the period, the people, the place, etc. How? I don't know. What 

do you guys think? 

judith 


>Hi everyone, I know you are sick of me posting, but............. 

>Robert and I had a conversation after Prof. Yamashita's class today, and I 

think he has a pretty good hypothesis about this class. I will let him explain 

it if he wants to. But anyway, he got me thinking. Prof. Yamashita talked 

about how people were solving for the wrong problem in regards to the flu. Now 

obviously, he was hinting at something, and I don't think it has anything to 

do with the flu. So, back to evolution and creationism. No one can prove 

either theory. So, are we solving for the wrong problem? Should we be looking 

at something else? I haven't gotten any further than this, but maybe someone 

else has an idea. 

>Cynthia 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



322





Subject: RE: government control 

Is knowledge power? 

some very popular written knowledge sources, 

the communist manifesto, Old testament, the koran, origin of the species, 

the meaning of Dreams, 

The satanic bible, The souls of black folk, Sunnah, Mein Kampf, Nahjul 

Balagha, The Theory of Relativity, the total woman, Bhagavad-Gita, The new 

testament, Tibetan Book of the Dead, 

Book of Mormon Christianity, Dianetics, common sense, the double helix. 

by no means is this a complete list, but as you can see these forms of 

knowledge taken independently contain power (assuming one puts power to 

them). Yet, when you start to cross reference the knowledge contained within 

the pages you have a group of conflicting messages. 

So is knowledge power or is a select belief in one type of knowledge power? 

And is it only power because of the numbers of people who give it 

creditability or is it power despite the numbers of people? 




>Subject: government control 


> 

>I think that the government chooses what they want to show us because they 

>are ultimately in control of us. They are running top secret experiments 

>probably as we speak. There are people so high up that the chaos of our 

>everyday existence never touches their realm. 

> 

>We can only educate ourselves. We can only be responsible for our own 

>individual actions. We can only do the best that we can, and that's all we 

>can do. 

> 

>Ann 

> 

>p.s. Cynthia and I were talking about the 1918 flu and thought maybe the 

>government was testing some germs as warfare? Maybe that's why it is not 

>talked about? Who really knows? But, I think people need to bring things 

>out into the open, so they can learn from them. KNOWLEDGE IS POWER! 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Plan your next US getaway to one of the super destinations here. 

http://special.msn.com/local/hotdestinations.armx 

323






I think knowledge is power. If you think about it, solutions can only 

be derived if you have the knowledge to solve the problem. Most jobs 

require some knowledge and with that knowledge comes power which in our 

society often means money. Plumbers make around $150 an hour because of 

what they know, doctors/lawyers/architects etc. make good money because 

of their knowledge (I'm not sure why teachers aren't up in that pay 

scale but that's another discussion!). I think power comes from what 

you DO with the knowledge you possess. Unfortunately, many people abuse 

their power and people get hurt in the process. Knowing the Bible, 

Koran, Mein Kampf, Nahjul Balagha, The Theory of Relativity, etc., is 

wonderful; it's what you do with what you've learned that is important. 

TTFN ~ Louise 


From: Robert Atchison [mailto:ratchison001@hotmail.com] 






the communist manifesto, Old testament, the koran, origin of the 

species, 



Balagha, The Theory of Relativity, the total woman, Bhagavad-Gita, The 

new 





them). Yet, when you start to cross reference the knowledge contained 

within 


So is knowledge power or is a select belief in one type of knowledge 

power? 

And is it only power because of the numbers of people who give it 







> 

>I think that the government chooses what they want to show us because 

>they 

>are ultimately in control of us. They are running top secret 

experiments 

>probably as we speak. There are people so high up that the chaos of 

our 


> 

324

We can only educate ourselves. We can only be responsible for our own 

>individual actions. We can only do the best that we can, and that's 

all we 

>can do. 

> 

>Ann 

> 

>p.s. Cynthia and I were talking about the 1918 flu and thought maybe 

>the 

>government was testing some germs as warfare? Maybe that's why it is 

not 

>talked about? Who really knows? But, I think people need to bring 

things 


> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



325






Actually, money is power, and absolute power corrupts, lol. But I think you are right, Louise, ability is 

the real knowledge. You have to be able to produce to get the money and the power. Maybe teachers 

don't get the money because some people think all they do is spit facts for students to spit back. And 

since you only have a student (in most places) for one year, you never have a product to hold up to 

prove you have ABILITY. 

Cynthia 


I think knowledge is power. If you think about it, solutions can only 

be derived if you have the knowledge to solve the problem. Most jobs 

require some knowledge and with that knowledge comes power which in our 

society often means money. Plumbers make around $150 an hour because of 

what they know, doctors/lawyers/architects etc. make good money because 

of their knowledge (I'm not sure why teachers aren't up in that pay 

scale but that's another discussion!). I think power comes from what 

you DO with the knowledge you possess. Unfortunately, many people abuse 

their power and people get hurt in the process. Knowing the Bible, 

Koran, Mein Kampf, Nahjul Balagha, The Theory of Relativity, etc., is 

wonderful; it's what you do with what you've learned that is important. 

TTFN ~ Louise 








the communist manifesto, Old testament, the koran, origin of the 

species, 



Balagha, The Theory of Relativity, the total woman, Bhagavad-Gita, The 

new 






within 


326

So is knowledge power or is a select belief in one type of knowledge 

power? 

And is i t only power because of the numbers of people who give it 







> 

>I think that the government chooses what they want to show us because 

>they 

>are ultimately in control of us. They are running top secret 

experiments 

>probably as we speak. There are people so high up that the chaos of 

our 


> 

>We can only educate ourselves. We can only be responsible for our own 

>individual actions. We can only do the best that we can, and that's 

all we 

>can do. 

> 

>Ann 

> 

>p.s. Cynthia and I were talking about the 1918 flu and thought maybe 

>the 

>government was testing some germs as warfare? Ma ybe that's why it is 

not 

>talked about? Who really knows? But, I think people need to bring 

things 


> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



327





Subject: Stickin' it to the man 

Rebellion is not dead! 

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040212/D80LTLDO1.html 

Good for them! 

_________________________________________________________________ 



328





Subject: Re: Stickin' it to the man 

LOL, I saw that on yahoo.. See Ann, no worries. Laws don't mean anything anyway. 


Rebellion is not dead! 

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040212/D80LTLDO1.html 

Good for them! 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



329





Subject: to Tweed 

But is your knowledge power if no one else believes in it? 

>From: "Randy& Louise Tweed" 


>To: 

>Subject: RE: government control 

>Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:03:21 -0800 

> 

>I think knowledge is power. If you think about it, solutions can only 

>be derived if you have the knowledge to solve the problem. Most jobs 

>require some knowledge and with that knowledge comes power which in our 

>society often means money. Plumbers make around $150 an hour because of 

>what they know, doctors/lawyers/architects etc. make good money because 

>of their knowledge (I'm not sure why teachers aren't up in that pay 

>scale but that's another discussion!). I think power comes from what 

>you DO with the knowledge you possess. Unfortunately, many people abuse 

>their power and people get hurt in the process. Knowing the Bible, 

>Koran, Mein Kampf, Nahjul Balagha, The Theory of Relativity, etc., is 

>wonderful; it's what you do with what you've learned that is important. 

>TTFN ~ Louise 

> 


>From: Robert Atchison [mailto:ratchison001@hotmail.com] 

>Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2004 12:32 PM 



> 

> 

>Is knowledge power? 

>some very popular written knowledge sources, 

>the communist manifesto, Old testament, the koran, origin of the 

>species, 

>the meaning of Dreams, 

>The satanic bible, The souls of black folk, Sunnah, Mein Kampf, Nahjul 

>Balagha, The Theory of Relativity, the total woman, Bhagavad-Gita, The 

>new 

>testament, Tibetan Book of the Dead, 

>Book of Mormon Christianity, Dianetics, common sense, the double helix. 

> 

>by no means is this a complete list, but as you can see these forms of 

>knowledge taken independently contain power (assuming one puts power to 

>them). Yet, when you start to cross reference the knowledge contained 

>within 

>the pages you have a group of conflicting messages. 

> 

>So is knowledge power or is a select belief in one type of knowledge 

>power? 

>And is it only power because of the numbers of people who give it 

>creditability or is it power despite the numbers of people? 

> 

> >From: Ann Kirkendall 



> >Subject: government control 

> >Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 09:23:33 -0800 (PST) 

330

> >I think that the government chooses what they want to show us because 

> >they 

> >are ultimately in control of us. They are running top secret 

>experiments 

> >probably as we speak. There are people so high up that the chaos of 

>our 

> >everyday existence never touches their realm. 

> > 

> >We can only educate ourselves. We can only be responsible for our own 

> >individual actions. We can only do the best that we can, and that's 

>all we 

> >can do. 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 

> >p.s. Cynthia and I were talking about the 1918 flu and thought maybe 

> >the 

> >government was testing some germs as warfare? Maybe that's why it is 

>not 

> >talked about? Who really knows? But, I think people need to bring 

>things 

> >out into the open, so they can learn from them. KNOWLEDGE IS POWER! 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Plan your next US getaway to one of the super destinations here. 

>http://special.msn.com/local/hotdestinations.armx 

> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Find great local high-speed Internet access value at the MSN High-Speed 

Marketplace. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200360ave/direct/01/ 

331





Subject: RE: to Tweed 

I think "power" needs to be defined. For example, if you believe in 

your own knowledge then isn't there power in that knowledge? 

~ Louise 









>To: 


>Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:03:21 -0800 

> 




>society often means money. Plumbers make around $150 an hour because 

>of what they know, doctors/lawyers/architects etc. make good money 

>because of their knowledge (I'm not sure why teachers aren't up in that 

>pay scale but that's another discussion!). I think power comes from 

>what you DO with the knowledge you possess. Unfortunately, many people 

>abuse their power and people get hurt in the process. Knowing the 

>Bible, Koran, Mein Kampf, Nahjul Balagha, The Theory of Relativity, 

>etc., is wonderful; it's what you do with what you've learned that is 

>important. TTFN ~ Louise 

> 






> 

> 



>the communist manifesto, Old testament, the koran, origin of the 

>species, the meaning of Dreams, 



>new 



> 



332


>within the pages you have a group of conflicting messages. 

> 


>power? And is it only power because of the numbers of people who give 

>it creditability or is it power despite the numbers of people? 

> 






> > 


> >they are ultimately in control of us. They are running top secret 

>experiments 


>our 


> > 

> >We can only educate ourselves. We can only be responsible for our 

> >own individual actions. We can only do the best that we can, and 

> >that's 

>all we 

> >can do. 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 


> >the government was testing some germs as warfare? Maybe that's why 

> >it is 

>not 


>things 


> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



333





Subject: RE: Money, money, money$ 

Robert, 

I am so with you on the MONEY thing, it is so true that when there is money 

involved, specially during election years, the lobbyist flash large amounts of 

money in the candidates face so that their issues would be dealt with...and 

what do the prospective candidates do: they take interest on the lobbyist 

issues(supposedly)--and also large undisclosed amounts of money that later 

leads them into troubling(but that scam is a whole nother story)-- and put 

them on their agenda. It is sad but true that the government and those that 

are campaigning tend to pay attention to the issues that will fund their 

campaign or institution. 

Karla 


>Waz-up Ann and class, 

>To be frank, don't worry i am still robert, the debate over homosexual 

>marriage is an extremely complicated and segregated debate. Many would say 

>that homosexuals do not deserve the rights of marriage due to the fact that 

>marriage by definition, thank you Mr.. Bush and religious "wise men", is 

>between a man and a women. These people would also say by recognizing 

>homosexuals with marriage they would legitimize a disgusting practice of 

>human lust (have they seen some of these porn sites with straight couples, 

>that's lust). Most democrat and republican politicians are openly against 

>gay marriage. So the questions arises, in the face of such hostile 

>conditions what are those who do believe that people are people and deserve 

>equal rights suppose to do (same topic throughout US history)? 

> 

>Well the answer may very well lay in a fiscal rebellion, as it is known that 

>today money is KING. What happens when all of the "straight couples" around 

>the country, who believe in same sex unions, stop signing their marriage 

>certificates? What happens when the government is unable to collect the 

>higher taxes due to this act? 

> 

>What happens when people start making comparable donations, as compared to 

>the fundamentalist christians, churches, fundamentalists and religious 

>zealots, to candidates that support causes such as gay marriage? What 

>happens when the government is no longer full of people who are against gay 

>marriages? 

> 

>Money is the number one way to ensure that your views will be heard in this 

>country. It is depressing, but true. Filter money from your cause and one 

>may very well find themselves the victor, as in the person that won the 

>fight. 

> 

>This is not to suggest that other avenues can't be taken, but it is 

>suggesting that without the help of religious institutions (one of the 

>greatest powers within the U.S.) or fiscal bombardment, openly homosexual 

>marriages are certainly a long way off. It is not fare, but this (not being 

>fare) is what the country was founded on! 

> 

> 

>with love and respect to all (I really do mean this), 

>Robert Atchison 

> 

>P.S. 

>I could certainly be totally wrong! But, it is fun to write and talk as if 

>you know everything (I am learning this from Sagan). 

334

> 

> 

>>From: Ann Kirkendall 

>>Reply-To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

>>To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

>>Subject: Response to Cynthia Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 15:50:00 -0800 (PST) 

>> 

>>Cynthia, 

>> 

>>I don't mind that you play devil's advocate. I realize this is a topic 

>>that a lot of people do not like talking about. But, I believe it is a 

>>topic worth fighting for. I was once a religious person who went to 

>>church, in fact, my sister who is gay, was the one who got me into going to 

>>church. After a while I began to see a pattern with (some, but not all) of 

>>the Christians we went to church with. They would act however they wanted 

>>all week long and went to church on Sunday where they acted all high and 

>>mighty. It is too bad that these people tainted my view, but they were not 

>>the only reason I began to question religion, I questioned it for many 

>>various reasons. But when I did talk about the magic wand thing in my last 

>>journal, I was not excluding myself. I am not without sin, nor is anyone. 

>> 

>>I do not see how talking about this subject is risky? Is it risky to talk 

>>about the social injustices of our not to distant past which included the 

>>segregation of African Americans, or is it risky to talk about the brave 

>>women who fought to make it possible for women to vote? I realize that the 

>>topic of homosexuality is a "hush hush" topic. But I believe it is a topic 

>>that needs to be brought out into the open so people can face their fears 

>>and misunderstandings of homosexuals. Homosexuals are not monsters. If 

>>you really think about the definition of monstrosity, you will see that 

>>keeping this segment of our population from attaining their equal rights is 

>>a monstrosity. 

>> 

>>To live in fear of hate crimes, to live in fear of losing your job, to live 

>>in a world that spreads, through ignorance and religion, its poisonous 

>>fumes of prejudice injustices about homosexuality to generation after 

>>generation in a land that prides itself on standing for liberty and justice 

>>for all is total injustice. So to me, this needs to be talked about, and 

>>this needs to be stopped. How can this happen if it people alway remain on 

>>the "hush hush" about it? If I open the eyes of one person, then my effort 

>>will not be in vain. I had to put up with so many injustices growing up 

>>that as an adult I adamantly say, "Not on my watch"! 

>> 

>>How can we as humans with compassion, allow this to continue. How can we 

>>as educated individuals who are encouraged to think outside of the box, 

>>allow this to happen? I am sure that there are many people out there that 

>>know at least one homosexual person. Your uncle, your aunt, your best 

>>friend, your brother, your sister, your cousin, your next door neighbor, 

>>your favorite teacher... don't these people deserve their a chance to build 

>>a life which includes marriage? Why do we allow this injustice to 

>>continue? Who died and gave us the right to condemn others and keep them 

>>from a meaningful life? Isn't what we are allowing to continue a crime in 

>>itself? 

>>So, again, I ask you, what harm would come by legalizing homosexual 

>>marriage? 

>> 

>>Ann 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 

>>Do you Yahoo!? 

>>Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

335


>http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



336





Subject: RE: to Tweed 

Here you go, Louise! Pick your definition. 

pow·er [ pówr ] 

noun (plural pow·ers) 

1. ability or capacity to do something: the ability, skill, or capacity to do something 

2. strength: physical force or strength 

3. control and influence: control and influence over other people and their actions 

4. political control: the political control of a country, exercised by its government or leader 

5. authority to act: the authority to act or do something according to a law or rule 

6. somebody with power: somebody who has political or financial power 

7. important country: a country that has military or economic resources and is considered to have 

political influence over other countries 

8. persuasiveness: the ability to influence people’s judgment or emotions 

9. skill: a faculty, skill, or ability 

http://encarta.msn.com/xImages/dictionary/bullet.gif http://encarta.msn.com/xImages/trans.gifmusical 

powers 

**************************** Thought we should define this too. 

knowl·edge [ nóllij ] 

noun 

1. information in mind: general awareness or possession of information, facts, ideas, truths, or 

principles 

http://encarta.msn.com/xImages/dictionary/bullet.gif http://encarta.msn.com/xImages/trans.gifHer 

knowledge and interests are extensive. 

337

2. specific information: clear awareness or explicit information, for example, of a situation or fact 

http://encarta.msn.com/xImages/dictionary/bullet.gif http://encarta.msn.com/xImages/trans.gifI 

believe they have knowledge of the circumstances. 

3. all that can be known: all the information, facts, truths, and principles learned throughout time 

http://encarta.msn.com/xImages/dictionary/bullet.gif http://encarta.msn.com/xImages/trans.gifWith all 

our knowledge, we still haven’t found a cure for the common cold. 

4. learning through experience or study: familiarity or understanding gained through experience or 

study 

http://encarta.msn.com/xImages/dictionary/bullet.gif 

http://encarta.msn.com/xImages/trans.gifknowledge of nuclear physics 

5. intercourse: sexual intercourse ( archaic ) 


I think "power" needs to be defined. For example, if you believe in 

your own knowledge then isn't there power in that knowledge? 

~ Louise 







>From: "Randy& Louise Tweed" 


>To: 


>Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:03:21 -0800 

> 




>society often means mone y. Plumbers make around $150 an hour because 

338

of what they know, doctors/lawyers/architects etc. make good money 

>because of their knowledge (I'm not sure why teachers aren't up in that 

>pay scale but that's another discussion!). I think power comes from 

>what you DO with the knowledge you possess. Unfortunately, many people 

>abuse their power and people get hurt in the process. Knowing the 

>Bible, Koran, Mein Kampf, Nahjul Balagha, The Theory of Relativity, 

>etc., is wonderful; it's what you do with what you've learned that is 

>important. TTFN ~ Louise 

> 






> 

> 



>the communist manifesto, Old testament, the kor an, origin of the 

>species, the meaning of Dreams, 



>new 



> 



>them). Yet, when you start to cross reference the knowledge contained 

>within the pages you have a group of conflicting messages. 

> 


>power? And is it only power because of the numbers of people who give 

>it creditability or is it power despite the numbers of people? 

> 






> > 


> >they are ultimately in control of us. They are running top secret 

>experiments 


>our 


> > 

> >We can only educate ourselves. We can only be responsible for our 

339

own individual actions. We can only do the best that we can, and 

> >that's 

>all we 

> >can do. 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 


> >the government was testing some germs as warfare? Maybe that's why 

> >it is 

>not 


>things 


> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



340





Subject: The Ladies 

Those ladies that got married were so cute. I was thriiled to hear of their 

marriage. They 

looked so happy. It is took bad they had to wait 51 years to tie the knot. 

MARIN 

341





Subject: Re: The Ladies 

It also isn't legal, just symbolic. The citizens of California decided in 2000 that marriage can only be 

between a man and a woman. But it was a good publicity stunt on the part of San Francisco's mayor. 

Cynthia 


Those ladies that got married were so cute. I was thriiled to hear of their 

marriage. They 

looked so happy. It is took bad they had to wait 51 years to tie the knot. 

MARIN 

_____ 



342




To: listserve 


The issue of gay marriage is one that is extremely 

complicated and has no one solution, as there will 

always be people who oppose the idea and those who 

support it. But beyond just supporting or opposing gay 

marriage, there are much greater issues. It is true, 

as Cynthia stated, that segregation was not right and 

although abolished, racism still lives on with 

deep-rooted strength is many parts of the United 

States. It is also extremely disheartening that some 

people relate the acceptance of homosexual marriage to 

a society that would end up in chaotic turmoil in 

which people are then allowed to exploit children or 

animals. It is due to fear-based ignorance such as 

this that monstorization of homosexuals and bigotry 

toward homosexuality continues on today in one of the 

most advanced societies in the world. 

Homosexuals are a minority group and have faced 

discrimination and second-class citizenship for a 

great part of history, only avoiding such treatment if 

remaining quiet and out of sight, as if their lives do 

not exist. But in today’s society, I believe that 

homosexuals have the opportunity to not only defeat 

many of the inequalities and injustices that continue 

to affect the gay and lesbian community, but also to 

create institutions and places within society that 

value and honor their unique experiences and values. 

Sexual orientation has an ever-decreasing relevance 

on daily life in today’s world, and many people are 

beginning to see that what is more important in life 

is the act of living life. Homosexuals are more 

liberated now to live their lives without regard to 

the bigoted and ignorant beliefs of others due to 

increasing acceptance and elimination of fear through 

education. But there is, though, the necessity for 

persistence on the part of the homosexual population 

and support from others to establish and maintain 

tolerance and equal rights, as these have yet to be 

fully realized in the homosexual community. 

One of the most heated debates regarding equal 

rights for homosexuals today is the prospect of giving 

homosexuals the right to legally marry under the 

existing institution of marriage. The institution of 

marriage is an aging one, and like many religions in 

the world, marriage is becoming outdated and useless 

in today’s societal structures. This is not to say 

that marriage has no place and is still not important 

to some people. But I see the institution of marriage 

evolving into something new. As people and societies 

evolve, what they hold onto as valuable and integral 

to their lives changes and adapts to their current 

living situations and reflects their life experiences. 

The original purpose of marriage, to maintain and 

support the heterosexual family value of reproduction, 

is becoming more and more outdated as the family 

structure is changing over time. We no longer need to 

raise young’ns to tend the farms. In fact, we need to 

343

start thinking about making less of them. 

So as tradition-preserving straight people fight 

diligently to keep marriage “pure” and available to 

non-heathens only, I say to all homosexuals, let them. 

Still existing is the much-needed fight for equality 

and justice for homosexuals, but those are separate 

issues from the prospect of letting homosexuals 

partake in and register under the existing institution 

of marriage. I see the battle to allow homosexuals to 

marry under the same institution as their straight 

brothers and sisters as misguided and missing some 

major points on the part of homosexuals. Those points 

are that homosexuals, and all people, fall under the 

category as humans and are therefore entitled to the 

same rights as all others, straight, white, 

transsexual, black, undecided, etc, and that marriage 

was designed for straight people and the values that 

they hold to. Therefore, I am perplexed at why so 

many gay and lesbian people are fighting to obtain 

something that does not truly honor or validate their 

lives in any way??? 

The fact of the matter is that there have never 

been unionizing institutions created by and 

established solely for homosexuals, and if there have, 

they have never been honored or legitimized to the 

extent of the heterosexual institution of marriage. 

The institution of marriage that exists now never has 

and never will be inclusive of the values that 

homosexuals hold to and that honor their existence and 

experiences, and the marriage rights that many 

homosexuals are fighting for now do not honor their 

lives or the commitments they want to make with their 

loved ones. Looking at a greater picture, it is 

essentially a fight in the wrong direction for where I 

believe homosexuals want to be in society. I see this 

issue of gay marriage as an opportunity for the gay 

population to create something sacred for themselves, 

something more fitting that will honor the deepest and 

most sacred elements of their relationships. If the 

idea of marriage is to commit to creating a bond 

between two people, should not that bond be fitted 

properly to maintain the integrity of that sacred 

union? 

We need not re-invent the wheel, but we 

definitely do not need to try and make the existing 

wheels of marriage fit onto a car of commitment that 

it was not designed for. It would be a wonderful 

world where all people could just get along and be 

equal, but that is highly idealistic and ultimately 

unrealistic, and I believe that viewpoint is dangerous 

to hold in a world that, in many parts, still values 

segregation, racism, sexism, imperialism, elitism, 

capitalism, and the like. Besides, it is the 

differences among us that create the beautiful quilt 

of life. But we must strive, always, to sew that quilt 

with threads of respect, equality, and honor. 

There is no avoiding the realities of the present, 

and to be successful at or achieve anything, we must 

work within the present in order to value the diverse 

experiences that have brought us to the place we now 

stand to be able to live meaningful lives. We must all 

continue to fight for equality, justice, and respect. 

But we must remember that equality, justice, and 

respect do not look the same for everyone, there is 

some catching up to do for some. Ultimately, life 

only has the meaning that we make for it. We are left 

344

then, to wonder what gives our lives meaning? Where 

does meaning in our lives come from? The answers to 

those questions may go beyond what can be stated by 

words, but we are all here living our lives together, 

each one of us on a pathway seeking the keys to unlock 

the meaning of our own lives…our only 

responsibilities: to live truthfully and not interfere 

in the pathway of our fellow man and woman. 

Peace, 

Michael 

__________________________________ 




345






Bravo, Michael. This is well thought out and well written. I like you point of view. I think you might be 

solving for the right problem. 

Cynthia 

Michael Renner wrote: 

















Homosexuals are a minor ity group and have faced 


















persistence on the part of t he homosexual population 





346

ights for homosexuals today is the prospect of giving 













support the heterosexual family val ue of reproduction, 





































essentially a fight in the wrong di rection for where I 



347







union? 










capitalism, and the like. Besides, it i s the 






















Peace, 

Michael 

__________________________________ 




_____ 

348



349





Subject: journal 5 - 1/3 of the way done!!! 

Oh my God - I hadn't checked my email in a while. I was scared to see what my 

sorority wanted me to do this week, and now I have 204 emails. STOP EMAILING 

ME! JUST KIDDING!! I am surprised I could get that many emails. I now have a 

new email record. Wow! Well, I read the next reading for Monday and Wednesday 

in the parking lot at work. Long story! Anyways - I waws shocked by the next 

two chapters. It is all about hallucinations and science and religion. I think 

- I was reading by street light for three hours. It made me think back to when 

I was in elementary school and sleeping over with my best friend. We were 

talking about aliens and if they would come and get us who would they take 

first. I told her that she was sleeping by the window so they would get her 

first. Then she snapped but, that aliens do not come in through the window, 

instead they float through the ceiling. I looked up in my room and realized 

that I had way more ceiling than her, ran out of my room crying to my mom! 

Anyways, I think that in my life I have encountered miraclous experiences from 

God. I like to think that I am special like that, even though Laurie would 

deny that. Yet, as I read, I wondered was I hallucinating these things - are 

these events just as truthful as seeing an UFO. Could my stories be in the 

national enquirer? (I wonder how much they would pay for that) That really 

scared me? I continued to think about it and I have conviced myself that these 

events are quite different than seeing aliens landing on our planet. Because 

unlike aliens and science - God and relgion require a lot of faith. In my 

faith I believe that God is in these events, that is what makes seeing God or 

having wonderful unexplainable things happen, and it makes me warm and fuzzy 

inside. I like that feeling and that it why I am going to stop thinking I am 

as crazy as people who see UFOs and continue to believe that I witnessed a 

messsage from God - it gets me through the days! 

P.S. Gay and Lesbian marriage - my opinion is as long as it doesn't hurt 

anyone and makes you happy - more power to ya!! 

350





Subject: FWD: Happy Valentines Day 

Attachments: image009.jpg; image008.jpg; image007.jpg; image006.jpg; image005.jpg; image004.jpg; 

image003.jpg; image002.jpg; image001.jpg 

image009.jpg (70 

KB) 


KB) 


KB) 


KB) 


KB) 


KB) 

351 


KB) 


KB) 


KB) 

Hey ladies and germs - feeling lonely on Valentines day? My 

roommate and I 

will be watching movies together and eating chocolate frozen yogurt (less 

calories than ice cream. hee hee) if any one wants to come over. Just call! 

Teresa 

(858) 372-6709 

DeJaY DeJurneTT 

Scheduling Coordinator 

Creative Touch Interiors 

Phone 858-621-6545 

Fax 858-695-2817 

DDeJurneTT@ctihome.com 


From: Alice Dejurnett [mailto:aliced@psginc.com] 


To: ddejurnett@ctihome.com 

Subject: FW: Happy Valentines Day 


From: Cindy Lin 


To: Helen Hartford; Alice Dejurnett; Melliza Espiritu; Mandy 

Khouphongsy; Elizabeth Esbenshade; Nicole Figueroa 

Subject: Happy Valentines Day 

B 

 





Subject: I thought of y'all! 

I have this calendar about crazy teaching moments. This one made me think of 

our discussions and I decided to send it all to you guys! 

Here it goes: 

"A little girl was talking to her teacher about whales. The teacher said it 

was physically impossible for a whale to swallow a human because even though 

it was a very large mammal, its throat was very small. The little girl stated 

that Jonah was swallowed by a whale. The teacher reiterated that a whale could 

not swallow a human; it was physically impossible. The little girl said "When 

I get to heaven I will ask Jonah." The teacher asked,"What if Jonah went to 

hell?" The little girl replied, "Then you ask him." 

Hee hee 

352





Subject: Re: I thought of y'all! 

That's a good one!! 


I have this calendar about crazy teaching moments. This one made me think of 

our discussions and I decided to send it all to you guys! 

Here it goes: 

"A little girl was talking to her teacher about whales. The teacher said it 

was physically impossible for a whale to swallow a human because even though 

it was a very large mammal, its throat was very small. The little girl stated 

that Jonah was swallowed by a whale. The teacher reiterated that a whale could 

not swallow a human; it was physically impossible. The little girl said "When 

I get to heaven I will ask Jonah." The teacher asked,"What if Jonah went to 

hell?" The little girl replied, "Then you ask him." 

Hee hee 

_____ 



353




To: journal 

Subject: New Theory for the Incan Counting System 

Incan Counting System Decoded? 

By Rossella Lorenzi, Discovery News 

354 

Font Size: [small] [medium] [large] 

Jan. 29, 2004 — The Inca invented a powerful counting system that could be used to make complex 

calculations without the tiniest mistake, according to an Italian engineer who claims to have cracked 

the mathematics of this still mysterious ancient population. 

Begun in the Andean highlands in about 1200, the Inca ruled the largest empire on Earth by the time 

their last emperor, Atahualpa, was garroted by Spanish conquistadors in 1533. 

Long been considered the only major Bronze Age civilization without a written language, they left 

mysterious objects that, according to the latest research, would have been used to store units of 

information. 

Recent studies are investigating the hypothesis that elaborated knotted strings known as khipu 

contain a hidden written language stored following a seven-bit binary code. Nobody, however, had 

been able to explain the meaning of these geometrical tablets known as yupana. 

Different in size and shape, the yupana had been often interpreted as a stylized fortress model. Some 

scholars also interpreted it as a counting board, but how the abacus would have worked remained a 

mystery. 

"It took me about 40 minutes to solve the riddle. I am not an expert on pre-Columbian civilizations. I 

simply decoded a 16th century drawing from a book on mathematical enigmas I received as a 

Christmas present," engineer Nicolino De Pasquale said. 

The drawing was found in a 1,179 page letter by the Peruvian Felipe Guaman Poma de Ayala to the 

King of Spain. A simple array of cells consisting of five rows and four columns, the drawing showed 

one circle in the right cell on the bottom row, two circles in the next cell, three circles in the other one 

and five circles in the last cell of the row. The same pattern applied to the above rows. 

According to De Pasquale, the circles in the cells are nothing but the first numbers of the Fibonacci 

series, in which each number is a sum of two previous: 1, 2, 3, 5. 

The abacus would then work on a base 40 numbering system. 

"Instead, all scholars based their calculations according to a base 10 counting system. But 

calculations made to base 40 are quicker, and can be easily reconverted to base 10," Antonio Aimi, 

curator of the exhibition "Peru, 3,000 Years of Masterpieces" running in Florence, told Discovery 

News. 

"Since we lack definitive archaeological evidence, we tested this claim on 16 yupana from museums 

across the world. De Pasquale's system works on all of them," Antonio Aimi, curator of the exhibition 

"Peru, 3,000 years of masterpieces" running in Florence, told Discovery News.

The Inca's calculating system (see an example of how it works in the slide show) does not take into 

consideration the number zero. Moreover, numbers do not exist as graphic representations. 

According to Aimi, in most cases the Inca made their calculations by simply drawing rows and 

columns on the ground. The unusual counting way is described in an account by the Spanish priest 

José de Acosta, who lived among the Inca from 1571 to 1586. 

"To see them use another kind of calculator, with maize kernels, is a perfect joy... . They place one 

kernel here, three somewhere else and eight, I do not know where. They move one kernel here and 

there and the fact is that they are able to complete their computation without making the smallest 

mistake," Acosta wrote in his book "Historia Natural Moral de las Indias." 

The claim has sparked a dispute among scholars. 

Gary Urton, professor of Precolumbian studies at Harvard University, an authority on khipu research, 

told Discovery News: "The fact that an explanation can be constructed for one or even several 

yupana that conforms to this theory of a base 40 numbering system amongst the Incas is of some 

modest interest. 

"How would one explain the many statements in the Spanish chronicles, both those written by 

Spaniards and by literate Andeans, who stated quite straightforwardly that the Inca used a base 10 

counting system? This system is also attested in a mountain of early colonial documents that 

describe how the Inca organized their administrative system according to a base 10 counting 

system." 

As Aimi concedes, the claim has the limits of any interpretative system that isn't proven with definitive 

historical evidence. 

"We would need to find a Rosetta yupana, something similar to the deciphering of Egyptian 

hieroglyphics from the Rosetta stone. Since we can't have it, I would consider a strong evidence the 

fact that the system works on all yupana examined," he said. 

_____ 



355




To: journal 

Subject: Is Pagan and Christian the same thing? 

Ok, help me out here. I thought that Pagan and Christian were 2 different things. 

Cynthia 

Saudi Arabia Says Valentine's Day Incurs God's Ire 

Reuters 

Fri Feb 13, 5:08 AM ET 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/my/my16.gif Add World - Reuters to My Yahoo! 

RIYADH (Reuters) - Saudi Arabia's religious authorities have ordered Muslims to shun the "pagan" 

holiday of Valentine's Day (news - web sites) so as not to incur God's wrath, the local al-Riyadh 

newspaper said Friday. 

"It is a pagan Christian holiday and Muslims who believe in God and Judgment Day should not celebrate or acknowledge 

it or congratulate (people on it). It is a duty to shun it to avoid God's anger and punishment," said an edict issued by Saudi 

Arabia's fatwa committee published in the Arabic-language daily. 

_____ 



356





Subject: Re: Is Pagan and Christian the same thing? 

Never mind, I figured it out. Valentine's Day evidently has Roman (pagan) and Christian traditions 

mixed, hence the pagan Christian holiday reference. 


Ok, help me out here. I thought that Pagan and Christian were 2 different things. 

Cynthia 

Saudi Arabia Says Valentine's Day Incurs God's Ire 

Reuters 

Fri Feb 13, 5:08 AM ET 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/my/my16.gif Add World - Reuters to My Yahoo! 

RIYADH (Reuters) - Saudi Arabia's religious authorities have ordered Muslims to shun the 

"pagan" holiday of Valentine's Day (news - web sites) so as not to incur God's wrath, the local al- 

Riyadh newspaper said Friday. 

"It is a pagan Christian holiday and Muslims who believe in God and Judgment Day should not celebrate or 

acknowledge it or congratulate (people on it). It is a duty to shun it to avoid God's anger and punishment," said an 

edict issued by Saudi Arabia's fatwa committee published in the Arabic-language daily. 

_____ 



_____ 



357






Hey gang. I am feeling very under the weather but I gotta charge through this. 

Let me 

start by setting a senario. 

As Sophia from The Golden Girls would say... Picture this, Athens 431 B.C, a 

sickness 

descendes upon the entire city. The rich, once surrounded by all the gold ever 

desired, 

free from worldly concerns. The poor, suffering, living day by day in order to 

keep their 

families alive. By night fall, a dark plague lingers through the city and one 

by one takes 

the lives of citizens, rich and poor. Those who are not bothered by the 

invisible virus 

listens to the town plead for help and some sort of relief from their 

suffering. Bodies 

piling in the streets. Friends and family asking for help, but you are not yet 

infected you 

still have a life to live. 

What do you do? 

I have been dwelling on this situation for the past week. I am the kind of 

person who feels 

emotionally fufilled by helping others even before I consider my own needs. I 

want 

people to be have and to feel loved and to love me. BUT, I cheerish live so 

much and I 

think about what a miracle it is that we are here, how ever we got here. So I 

ask my self 

what would I do if everyone around me was dying and I was somehow the 

fortunate one 

to remain clear of such a deadly disease. What if I was dealt weak cards in 

life and was 

faced with a constant uphill battle. Then suddenly death stricks all but me 

and riches 

were at my finger tips. If I did take over the life of the towns riches no 

trial would ever take 

place because everyone involved was dying or dead. 

Maybe my time would be short so would I live it up, "drink heavily, enjoy life 

to the full, go 

round singing and merrymaking, and gratify all of one's cravings whenever the 

opportunity offered, and shrug the whole thing off as on enormous joke." 

But what is life with nobody to share it with. Would it be easier, would there 

be less 

suffering if i did help my loved ones and risk my life in the process. 

I couldn't say either way because I have not been in that situation but just 

thinking about 

it makes me slightly understand what people are faced with and the thoughts 

that must 

go through their minds when a deadly virus sweeps through and destroys so many 

lives. 

Say you did live through it and the town was rebuilt and life grew plentiful 

again. Would I 

want to drag the past out and all the horrible emotions that went with it. Or 

is it better off 

left alone as if it never happend. 

Something inside me tells me that, this was a major reason why the 1918 flu is 

so 

358

untalked about. That many deaths so fast so many questions unanswered. 

Basically it is 

what I would think of as hell. Imagine seeing so many dead bodies that it 

suddenly 

doesn't even bother you anymore. 

It makes me think about the times really bad or sad things have happend in my 

life. Like 

when my old old friend Gustavo died of cancer in my neighbors house. I was 

asked to 

move the body onto the couch it was emtional and creepy I sat with the family 

all night 

and we have never talked about it again. It is not because we don't love Gus, 

but 

because words cannot explain what we went through that night and non of us 

ever want 

to relive it again. 

One more thing I want to bring up is the cholera epidemic. Not a pretty sight. 

The 

description in the book of what happens to a person is by far the worst 

symptoms I have 

ever come across. Dude I don't care who you are or what kind of drugs you give 

me 

nothing can help you in that situation. I seriously feel for ol' William 

Sprout. I don't want to 

bum anyone out but think about how Mr. Sprout felt, "doubled over in pain, and 

watery, 

white-speckled diarrhea poured from his bowels, seemingly gallons of it." 

Duuuudddddeeeee that's all I can say. If I surrvived that I can tell ya this 

much I would 

burry that story and never talk about it again. That story versus death makes 

death sound 

like a vacation in the Bahamas. Im out take care of yourselves. Remember, 

Vitamin C, 

chew on garlic, stay healthy and out of the way from nasty viruses if at all 

possible. Marin 

359





Subject: journal for the week of 2/9 & 2/11 

Dear Class, 

As I was doing the reading for this week I was struck by a mental picture of 

what the senarios described in the Kolata book must have looked like. To have 

an resort to giving people straight shots (no not tequila Robert j.k.) of a 

dead humans bodily secretion in an effort to nullify the effects of the flu 

must have been quite a tramatic experience both for the recipient and the 

person providing the innoculation who probably knew full well that it was more 

likely to have adverse affects than a healing one. Also the image of a family 

or village of eskimos being nearly whiped out and having an igloo filled with 

frozen bodies being ripped to shreds by starving dogs is quite disconcerning 

but in my eyes pails in comparison to the meausures their children had to take 

to survive by burying themselves under the bodies of their loved ones and 

elders, and when found were understandably traumatized by the experience. 

On a lighter note perhaps, as I was doing this reading on the fifth floor of 

the kellogg library today i watched as a fire broke out near the dairy in san 

marcos. its flames went from billowing black smoke to white smoke then air 

support flew in both planes with retardant and helicopters with water to try 

and fight the flames. It is i must say quite a sight to see when a plane 

flies into the smoke of a fire and drops its retardent barely missing the 

flames and watching the red just linger in the air doing little to help. 

However, the brave fire fighters and pilots were victorious today because from 

my vantage point they seem to have contained the blaze but when i leave from 

here i will see if it is truly out. i'll keep my fingers crossed. 

happy valentines day to all and see ya semana proximo, 


360





Subject: hallucinations 

Dear class, 

Sagan described in his book the state of being sort of half asleep and half 

awake and called it i believe sleep paralysis. I have experienced this state 

numerous times and it is really a trip. from what i have experienced, you are 

just laying their sort of hearing what is going on around you and all you can 

do is say eyelids open up please and they fail to respond and your forehead 

starts to ache and it is just a weird feeling until you start to be able and 

control you body and wake up. This is definitely a type of hallucination and 

i am not looking forward to the next time i am laying in bed feeling helpless 

against whatever may be lurking in my room usually my cat. 

peace, 

Matheno 

361






You make reading your journal sooooo fun!! And you personal story really helped explain why maybe 

people didn't talk about it. I haven't ever had someone close to me die, at least in a sudden manner, 

so I can't imagine how that would feel. I also don't know how I would react if people were dying 

around me. My first thought is that I would run for the hills and try to avoid whatever was killing 

everyone. But then, life wouldn't be too exciting if I was the only person left alive. So, maybe I would 

try to comfort the others and just hope that I would die too, but quickly and without pain of course. 

Cynthia 


Hey gang. I am feeling very under the weather but I gotta charge through this. 

Let me 

start by setting a senario. 

As Sophia from The Golden Girls would say... Picture this, Athens 431 B.C, a 

sickness 

descendes upon the entire city. The rich, once surrounded by all the gold ever 

desired, 

free from worldly concerns. The poor, suffering, living day by day in order to 

keep their 

families alive. By night fall, a dark plague lingers through the city and one 

by one takes 

the lives of citizens, rich and poor. Those who are not bothered by the 

invisible virus 

listens to the town plead for help and some sort of relief from their 

suffering. Bodies 

piling in the streets. Friends and family asking for help, but you are not yet 

infected you 

still have a life to live. 

What do you do? 

I have been dwelling on this situa tion for the past week. I am the kind of 

person who feels 

emotionally fufilled by helping others even before I consider my own needs. I 

want 

people to be have and to feel loved and to love me. BUT, I cheerish live so 

much and I 

think about what a miracle it is that we are here, how ever we got here. So I 

ask my self 

what would I do if everyone around me was dying and I was somehow the 

fortunate one 

to remain clear of such a deadly disease. What if I was dealt weak cards in 

life and was 

faced with a constant uphill battle. Then suddenly death stricks all but me 

and riches 

were at my finger tips. If I did take over the life of the towns riches no 

trial would ever take 

362

place because everyone involved was dying or dead. 

Maybe my time would be short so would I live it up, "drink heavily, enjoy life 

to the full, go 

round singing and merrymaking, and gratify all of one's cravings whenever the 

opportunity offered , and shrug the whole thing off as on enormous joke." 

But what is life with nobody to share it with. Would it be easier, would there 

be less 

suffering if i did help my loved ones and risk my life in the process. 

I couldn't say either way because I have not been in that situation but just 

thinking about 

it makes me slightly understand what people are faced with and the thoughts 

that must 

go through their minds when a deadly virus sweeps through and destroys so many 

lives. 

Say you did live through it and the town was rebuilt and life grew plentiful 

again. Would I 

want to drag the past out and all the horrible emotions that went with it. Or 

is it better off 

left alone as if it never happend. 

Something inside me tells me that, this was a major reason why the 1918 flu is 

so 

untalked about. That many deaths so fast so many questions unanswered. 

Basically it is 

what I would think of as hell. Imagine seeing so many dead bodies that it 

suddenly 

doesn't even bother you anymore. 

It makes me think about the times really bad or sad things have happend in my 

life. Like 

when my old old friend Gustavo died of cancer in my neighbors house. I was 

asked to 

move the body onto the couch it was emtional and creepy I sat with the family 

all night 

and we have never talked about it again. It is not because we don't love Gus, 

but 

because words cannot explain what we went through that night and non of us 

ever want 

to relive it again. 

One more thing I want to bring up is the cholera epidemic. Not a pretty sight. 

The 

description in the book of what happens to a person is by far the worst 

symptoms I have 

ever come across. Dude I don't care who you are or what kind of drugs you give 

me 

nothing can help you in that situation. I seriously feel for ol' William 

Sprout. I don't want to 

bum anyone out but think about how Mr. Sprout fe lt, "doubled over in pain, and 

watery, 

white-speckled diarrhea poured from his bowels, seemingly gallons of it." 

Duuuudddddeeeee that's all I can say. If I surrvived that I can tell ya this 

much I would 

burry that story and never talk about it again. That story versus death makes 

death sound 

like a vacation in the Bahamas. Im out take care of yourselves. Remember, 

363

Vitamin C, 

chew on garlic, stay healthy and out of the way from nasty viruses if at all 

possible. Marin 

_____ 



364





Subject: RE: journal for the week of 2/9 & 2/11 

Matheno, the only other time I have seen something that may have 

resembled what Kolata talks about in the chapter you mentioned was the 

terrible carnage and atrocities of the Holocaust. I was privileged to 

be able to spend some time in Israel where I spent a great deal of my 

time at the Yad Vashem Museum in Jerusalem This museum memorializes the 

Six Million who perished in the Holocaust. The Holocaust was, most 

certainly, human inflicted, and although there is no evidence as of yet, 

where the Flu came from, it too could have evolved from human 

intervention. The main difference between these two events is that the 

Holocaust was premeditated, thereby, in my opinion, making it that much 

worse. It's interesting though that we, as a society, have chosen to 

forget about the Flu pandemic of 1918 but have made great efforts to 

memorialize the tragedies of the Holocaust. Anyway, I agree with you 

that what those people went through during that time (1918) was just 

horrific and I hope that history doesn't repeat itself! 

Happy Valentines 

~ Louise 


From: lande008 [mailto:lande008@csusm.edu] 




Dear Class, 

As I was doing the reading for this week I was struck by a mental 

picture of 

what the senarios described in the Kolata book must have looked like. 

To have 

an resort to giving people straight shots (no not tequila Robert j.k.) 

of a 

dead humans bodily secretion in an effort to nullify the effects of the 

flu 

must have been quite a tramatic experience both for the recipient and 

the 

person providing the innoculation who probably knew full well that it 

was more 

likely to have adverse affects than a healing one. Also the image of a 

family 

or village of eskimos being nearly whiped out and having an igloo filled 

with 

frozen bodies being ripped to shreds by starving dogs is quite 

disconcerning 

but in my eyes pails in comparison to the meausures their children had 

to take 

to survive by burying themselves under the bodies of their loved ones 

and 

elders, and when found were understandably traumatized by the 

experience. 

On a lighter note perhaps, as I was doing this reading on the fifth 

floor of 

365

the kellogg library today i watched as a fire broke out near the dairy 

in san 

marcos. its flames went from billowing black smoke to white smoke then 

air 

support flew in both planes with retardant and helicopters with water to 

try 

and fight the flames. It is i must say quite a sight to see when a 

plane 

flies into the smoke of a fire and drops its retardent barely missing 

the 

flames and watching the red just linger in the air doing little to help. 

However, the brave fire fighters and pilots were victorious today 

because from 

my vantage point they seem to have contained the blaze but when i leave 

from 

here i will see if it is truly out. i'll keep my fingers crossed. 

happy valentines day to all and see ya semana proximo, 


366





Subject: Puts even Casey's ring to shame.... 

http://sacbee.com/state_wire/story/8260120p-9190734c.html 

_________________________________________________________________ 



367





Subject: Re: Puts even Casey's ring to shame.... 

It's only diamond plated, Mike!!! And who exactly went to the star to test what it is made out of? If I 

were Casey, I would keep the one on her finger. 

Cynthia 

"The theory suggests that as a star turns into a white dwarf, it exhausts all of its fuel. And as it cools, 

oxygen and other heavy elements crystallize and drop into the middle of the star, with carbon 

crystallizing later into a shell of pure diamond." EXN.ca 


http://sacbee.com/state_wire/story/8260120p-9190734c.html 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



368





Subject: Question/Journal: Jenny Fiala 

I have been reading ahead in the Kolata book because it is the only one that interests me this far, 

and I have stumbled onto a personal question that was brought up in the reading. 'Would I choose to 

participate in a nationwide vaccine campaign in the theory that a pandemic virus could possibly come 

back?' As it was, there had been confirmed cases during the 1970's that proved that the swine-flu had 

returned in an Army camp and one man had died, but they still were unsure of the original virus 

because they did not have any viable specimens of it and so they were acting on their best guess as 

to make vaccines from the new virus and distribute it nationally. I think that I would like to take the 

vaccine. As to my knowledge this vaccine did not hurt anyone that received it and it gave the 

population a better chance of surviving the pandemic if it had begun again with the same flu virus. 

What would you guys do? I know how you feel about it Cynthia:) What about the rest of you? 

Jenny Fiala 

369





Subject: Re: Question/Journal: Jenny Fiala 

Sorry, Jenny. I know you don't want me to reply, but it did have adverse affects for some people. 

From the Washington Compost: 

"What killed the program, though, was the observation in early December that people given the swine 

flu vaccine had an increased risk of developing Guillain-Barre syndrome, a rare, usually reversible but 

occasionally fatal form of paralysis. Research showed that while the actual risk for Guillain-Barre was 

only about 1 in 1,000 among people who had received the vaccine, that was about seven times 

higher than for people who didn't get the shot. 

On Dec. 16, the swine flu vaccine campaign was halted. About 45 million people had been 

immunized. The federal government eventually paid out $90 million in damages to people who 

developed Guillain-Barre. The total bill for the program was more than $400 million." 


I have been reading ahead in the Kolata book because it is the only one that interests me this 

far, and I have stumbled onto a personal question that was brought up in the reading. 'Would I 

choose to participate in a nationwide vaccine campaign in the theory that a pandemic virus could 

possibly come back?' As it was, there had been confirmed cases during the 1970's that proved 

that the swine-flu had returned in an Army camp and one man had died, but they still were unsure 

of the original virus because they did not have any viable specimens of it and so they were acting 

on their best guess as to make vaccines from the new virus and distribute it nationally. I think that 

I would like to take the vaccine. As to my knowledge this vaccine did not hurt anyone that received 

it and it gave the population a better chance of surviving the pandemic if it had begun again with 

the same flu virus. What would you guys do? I know how you feel about it Cynthia:) What a bout 

the rest of you? 

Jenny Fiala 

_____ 



370





Subject: Re: Question/Journal: Jenny Fiala 

I appreciate the response Cynthia:) I can always count on you:) 

Jenny 

371





Subject: Teachers Pay 

I think teachers are not paid very much because it is mainly a job filled my women. And we should 

know that women traditionally get paid less than men. 

Ann 

_____ 



372





Subject: Come on know... 

Come on know, 

I don't think it is fair to categorize homosexuality with all of those other things. Is that how you truly 

feel? I am unfortunately really sick right now and I don't have the strength to reply, but I assure you 

that I am surprised that people make such assumptions, or am I surprised? 

Ann 

_____ 



373





Subject: KNowledge is Power 

I originally said knowledge is power such as: If you have the knowledge of the mechanics of your car, 

the guys fixing it can not try and trick you into getting repairs that you do not need. More like that kind 

of knowledge... 

Ann 

_____ 



374






Michael, 

Thank You... 

Ann 


















Homosexuals are a minor ity group and have faced 


















persistence on the part of t he homosexual population 





375

ights for homosexuals today is the prospect of giving 













support the heterosexual family val ue of reproduction, 





































essentially a fight in the wrong di rection for where I 



376







union? 










capitalism, and the like. Besides, it i s the 






















Peace, 

Michael 

__________________________________ 




_____ 

377



378





Subject: The Flu Book- my official journal entry for this upcoming week. 

The flu^2, 

As luck would have it, I am super sicky right now. Which explains why I felt so run down last week. 

Don't worry, I don't think it is the 1918 flu though. Although it might be H5N1. 

So, through burning eyes, stuffed up nose, headache, achy exhausted body with a dash of waves of 

nausea and intestinal distress (or what I like to refer to as "Fire water"), I decided to read the Flu book 

which I might add is more intense when you actually feel sick yourself. It's kinda like smella-vision 

(insert Mike's Joke) or virtual reality... 

Anyway, I don't want to spoil it for anyone, but I must say that I can't think of anything that sounds 

appetizing to eat because you usually eat stuff like chicken noodle soup when you are sick.... but the 

thought of eggs, chickens, pork..... as you will see in the book, kinda lost their appeal to me. So 

maybe I will go eat some mad cow meat? 

See ya Monday (maybe not?) 

Ann 

_____ 



379





Subject: Re: Come on know... 

Who are you talking to, Ann? I can't tell what post you are referring to, but if it was mine, NO, that is 

not my opinion. I was just trying to point out what some people with opposing views think. Yes, I really 

have heard this stuff. It doesn't really matter who is wrong or right, or even if anybody is. But I think it 

is important to try to look at things from every point of view, not just your own. And I don't mean just 

you, everyone. Even if some of that stuff sounds way out there and ridiculous, there are people who 

will try to push the envelope, just because they can. Some individuals get great pleasure in trying to 

destroy our society. 

Cynthia 


Come on know, 

I don't think it is fair to categorize homosexuality with all of those other things. Is that how you 

truly feel? I am unfortunately really sick right now and I don't have the strength to reply, but I 

assure you that I am surprised that people make such assumptions, or am I surprised? 

Ann 

_____ 



_____ 



380





Subject: Re: Teachers Pay 

Hey, Ann! I thought you were sick? You trying to stir up more trouble? LOL, Hope you feel better 

soon. 

Cynthia 


I think teachers are not paid very much because it is mainly a job filled my women. And we 

should know that women traditionally get paid less than men. 

Ann 

_____ 



_____ 



381




To: lebla003@csusm.edu 

Cc: ICP-F@csusm.edu 


While reading the Kolata book, I suddenly started feeling ill. My throat felt 

sore and my ears experienced a pain sensation. Perhaps I was reading more into 

the Kolate book. I was trying to realize what they might be going through. I 

was feeling more than I should have. Anyway, I remember when I took my infant 

son to the hospital because he had an extremely high fever. As I was standing 

there with him in my arms, it seemed the fever went through him and into me 

because the next day he was no longer sick, but I was. 

Reading the Kolata book makes me wonder about a couple things. First of 

all, when there is a crisis in people's life, why do so many people turn 

towards god. Never mind if they haven't prayed all year up until that point. 

Does have a god or belief in one make people cope better? Whenever I feel I 

need spiritual intervention, I ask for a solution or sign that things are 

going to be all right. I usually get one. 

Another thing that brothers me is that some people murdered their loved 

ones because they did not want them to experience the illness spreading around 

or perhaps they had it and wanted to spare them the pain, so they shot their 

family members. Suicide is very common when there are disasters in our 

history. The Great Depression had people jumping out of buildings because they 

lost money in the stock market. I could go on with a list of events that 

people killed themselves. I was just wondering what disaster would have to 

happen in order for someone to put a bullet in their head. 

382





Subject: RE: Puts even Casey's ring to shame.... 

where's the pic mike??? It's all talk and no show. Must not be true. 




>Subject: Puts even Casey's ring to shame.... 

>Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:58:47 -0800 

> 

>http://sacbee.com/state_wire/story/8260120p-9190734c.html 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Optimize your Internet experience to the max with the new MSN Premium 

>Internet Software. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200359ave/direct/01/ 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



383





Subject: Re: Puts even Casey's ring to shame.... 

I agree. 




>Subject: Re: Puts even Casey's ring to shame.... 


> 

>It's only diamond plated, Mike!!! And who exactly went to the star to test 

>what it is made out of? If I were Casey, I would keep the one on her 

>finger. 

>Cynthia 

> 

>"The theory suggests that as a star turns into a white dwarf, it exhausts 

>all of its fuel. And as it cools, oxygen and other heavy elements 

>crystallize and drop into the middle of the star, with carbon crystallizing 

>later into a shell of pure diamond." EXN.ca 

> 

>Mike Runnestrand 

>wrote:http://sacbee.com/state_wire/story/8260120p-9190734c.html 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Optimize your Internet experience to the max with the new MSN Premium 

>Internet Software. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200359ave/direct/01/ 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



384





Subject: Teachers Pay (roberts journal #something) 

Think about it? Teachers are contracted to work about 195 days in the year, 

only 190 of those days are spent with actually students. Teachers can only 

be required to work 1265 hours during a year. this is about 6.4 hours per 

contracted day! 

If you then figure that teachers make about 35,000.00 dollars a year 

starting, a beginning teacher is making about twenty-seven dollars an hour 

(if they only work the required contracted hours). Even if a teacher spends 

an extra 2 hours (over the required contracted hours) per day they are 

required to work, they will still be making about twenty-one dollars an 

hour. 

This can be compared to someone whom is making 45,000.00 dollars a year, but 

required to work eight hours a day for the approximately 235 working days in 

a year. These people would be making about 23 dollars an hour. 

Teachers may really make more than they let on? The average teaching salary 

in california is about $54,000. This is about forty-two dollars per 

contracted hour! Often times teachers get extra money for doing other 

services for the school, (summer school, reading programs, after school 

tutoring, in-service programs). 

This pay does not even mention the great benefits that teachers can obtain, 

medical and otherwise. 

So I don't really know that I can say that teachers are really underpaid. 

Oh yah and think about all the internal rewards as well! 

teaching can be thought of as both a fiscally and internally rewarding job. 

What are the implications of that? 

Hope all is well in all your lives, 





>Subject: Teachers Pay 

>Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 15:02:45 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>I think teachers are not paid very much because it is mainly a job filled 

>my women. And we should know that women traditionally get paid less than 

>men. 

>Ann 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



385

386





Subject: Re: Teachers Pay (roberts journal #something) 

You make a lot of good points, makes sense to me. Teachers actually make a little bit more, because 

we really only have about 180 days of school. Compare this to other countries: 

Japan 243 New Zealand 190 

West Germany 266-240 Nigeria 190 

South Korea 220 British Columbia 185 

Israel 216 France 185 

Luxembourg 216 Ontario 185 

Soviet Union 211 Ireland 184 

Netherlands 200 New Brunswick 182 

Scotland 200 Quebec 180 

Thailand 200 Spain 180 

Hong Kong 195 Sweden 180 

England/Wales 192 United States 180 

Hungary 192 French Belgium 175 

Switzerland 191 Flemish Belgium 160 

Finland 190 

Of course, bare counts of school days do not tell us everything we might like to know about academic 

calendars. Japan's Ministry of Education, Science and Culture prescribes a minimum of 210 calendar 

days of classroom instruction, including half-days on Saturdays. Local school boards have the option 

of adding more time, and typically call for a total of about 240 days, often using the bulk of the 

additional days for field trips, sports activities, student festivals, and graduation ceremonies. In the 

United States the 180-day school year must accommodate field trips, school-wide assemblies, inservice 

training for teachers, and anything else that needs doing, reducing the real number of days of 

classroom instruction to something considerably less than 180. 

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/educatio/barr2f.htm 

Cynthia 











hour. 


387

equired to work eight hours a day for the approximately 235 working days in 


T eachers may really make more than they let on? The average teaching salary 


















> 



>men. 

>Ann 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



388






Howdy, 

I guess it all depends on who's pay someone is comparing teachers to. It seems like all I hear is 

"teachers don't get paid that much, so you must not be in it for the money." Robert, you have brought 

forth some very useful information for the next time someone brings up the topic. I will add it to my 

own ideas. 

You seem to know a lot Robert-son. Maybe you can answer this long overdue question I have 

pondered my whole life? How many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie pop? 

Wax on, wax off, 












hour. 















389








> 



>men. 

>Ann 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



390





Subject: GREAT GOOGLY MOOGLY 

Hi Class, 

As you can tell I am feeling a little bit better, of course writing this e-mail might use up all my available 

ATP (energy). BUT, has anyone else (besides me who is sicky Pooh and who has no life or human 

contact right now) read Sagan's current chapter on demon haunted world? GREAT GOOGLY 

MOOGLY!!!!! 

I think that if I had to choose to live during the times of the witch hunts or the times of the 1918 flu, I 

would take my chances on getting the flu. In fact, getting the flu and dying within 2-3 days would be a 

blessing compared to the lives of the "accused witches" and all their families in the witch hunt days. 

I have read about the mind boggling tortures and extreme monstrosities committed by (at the time) 

"good church going folk" and other "non-church going folk" like Vlad the Impaler... before, but I am 

always left with a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach when I realize how utterly evil humans can be. 

It's as if their are not any words in my vocabulary (or in any dictionary) that can sum up how terrible 

this must have been. Those poor "accused witches". They were basically violated in every sense 

possible beyond what my mind can even imagine. 

Yuck, maybe I need to watch some t.v. right now...... Seinfeld, Friends, The Simpson's, Sponge 

Bob.... 


_____ 



391





Subject: RE: Teachers Pay (roberts journal #something) 

You are right in that teachers get paid for working 195 days. What you 

have to consider is making the annual salary spread over the full 

working year which is 2080 hours. This would then calculate to $16.83 

per hour. Of course, teachers have the option of working during the 

summer, tutoring etc. Many other professionals also have the 

opportunity to work "on the side" and make additional money too. After 

working many years in human resources and seeing what someone with a 

degree in business, right out of college (age 22) makes versus what we 

as teachers with an additional year of school makes just doesn't seem 

right. I also don't think that the teaching profession is given the 

credit that it warrants (other than being a professor). All I'm saying 

is that I don't believe that people who really want to teach do it for 

the money. And, I do think that teachers should be in the same league 

as doctors/lawyers/architects/accountants etc. After all, without 

teachers, nobody would hold these other elite professions! Goooooo 

teachers!!!!!! 





Subject: Teachers Pay (roberts journal #something) 

Think about it? Teachers are contracted to work about 195 days in the 

year, 

only 190 of those days are spent with actually students. Teachers can 

only 

be required to work 1265 hours during a year. this is about 6.4 hours 

per 



starting, a beginning teacher is making about twenty-seven dollars an 

hour 

(if they only work the required contracted hours). Even if a teacher 

spends 



hour. 

This can be compared to someone whom is making 45,000.00 dollars a year, 

but 

required to work eight hours a day for the approximately 235 working 

days in 


Teachers may really make more than they let on? The average teaching 

salary 





This pay does not even mention the great benefits that teachers can 

obtain, 

392


So I don't really know that I can say that teachers are really 

underpaid. 

Oh yah and think about all the internal rewards as well! teaching can be 

thought of as both a fiscally and internally rewarding job. 









> 

>I think teachers are not paid very much because it is mainly a job 

>filled 

>my women. And we should know that women traditionally get paid less 

than 

>men. 

>Ann 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Check out the great features of the new MSN 9 Dial-up, with the MSN 

Dial-up 


393





Subject: Discussion Question EDMS 545B 

Boy I think it's a shame that Judith McGonigal left classroom teaching. It's people like her who 

engage student's who might otherwise be lost in the conundrum of the education scope. I believe it's 

important to share the educational responsibilities with the student's family. Therefore, why wouldn't 

a principal support a teacher who is obviously making great academic accomplishments with the 

students, receiving kudos from the parent's and is going above and beyond the educational 

standards in the science discipline? How as a new teacher can you implement new innovations in 

your classroom without stepping on the toes of your colleagues and/or the principal? 

394






Ann, 

I think it's comparing a teacher with the qualifications and responsibilities that they have with someone of another 

profession, with potentially less education but makes quite a lot more than teachers generally do. For example, I used to 

hire business majors (1995) right out of college making $50,000 a year. They would generally receive annual bonuses, 

pay raises, great benefit packages, provided training (during the work week) and as long as they were doing well at their 

job, they had the potential to double their salary in five years. As teachers, I don't think we're on the same platform as 

other professions when it comes to recognition and salary. And, I think you or maybe it was Cynthia said that traditionally 

teaching was seen as a woman's job and that is perhaps why the salary hasn't caught up with other professions. 

Hope you're feeling better :) 

~ Louise 






Howdy, 

I guess it all depends on who's pay someone is comparing teachers to. It seems like all I hear is 

"teachers don't get paid that much, so you must not be in it for the money." Robert, you have 

brought forth some very useful information for the next time someone brings up the topic. I will 

add it to my own ideas. 

You seem to know a lot Robert-son. Maybe you can answer this long overdue question I have 

pondered my whole life? How many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie pop? 

Wax on, wax off, 












hour. 

395

_____ 






















> 



>men. 

>Ann 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 





396

397





Subject: Oops 

Sorry guys, 

I sent the discussion question to the list server instead of to Prof. Ochanji. I guess that's what a glass 

of wine will do to you while you're trying to work/study!! So, I guess you'll see it again in EDMS 545B. 

See ya then! 

TTFN ~ Louise 

398






Louise I totally agree with you that teacher's should make as much as 

doctor's, lawyer's etc. because without us they would be nothing. Not to 

mention I think its wrong that we as American's make it okay for 

actors/actresses, professional sports players and other people in the 

entertainment business to make millions of dollars. We as American's go to 

the movies, buy CD's, go to concerts, watch crazy tv shows and then the 

entertainment business thinks its okay to pay these people millions of 

dollars because they've got the whole world's attention. What about 

teachers? What about EMT's. They make minimum wage to save someone's life. I 

think thats rediculous! In general, I think America doesn't see the teaching 

profession as a high end paying profession. I think we would have better 

teacher's if we were paid better. Obviously, were not in it for the money 

but wouldn't it be nice to know that the government and American's alike 

valued the teaching profession like they do the entertainment world??? 

WEll thats my two cents on this topic. See ya all tomorrow! 



>To: 

>Subject: RE: Teachers Pay (roberts journal #something) 

>Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 21:09:47 -0800 

> 

>You are right in that teachers get paid for working 195 days. What you 

>have to consider is making the annual salary spread over the full 

>working year which is 2080 hours. This would then calculate to $16.83 

>per hour. Of course, teachers have the option of working during the 

>summer, tutoring etc. Many other professionals also have the 

>opportunity to work "on the side" and make additional money too. After 

>working many years in human resources and seeing what someone with a 

>degree in business, right out of college (age 22) makes versus what we 

>as teachers with an additional year of school makes just doesn't seem 

>right. I also don't think that the teaching profession is given the 

>credit that it warrants (other than being a professor). All I'm saying 

>is that I don't believe that people who really want to teach do it for 

>the money. And, I do think that teachers should be in the same league 

>as doctors/lawyers/architects/accountants etc. After all, without 

>teachers, nobody would hold these other elite professions! Goooooo 

>teachers!!!!!! 

> 





>Subject: Teachers Pay (roberts journal #something) 

> 

> 

>Think about it? Teachers are contracted to work about 195 days in the 

>year, 

>only 190 of those days are spent with actually students. Teachers can 

>only 

>be required to work 1265 hours during a year. this is about 6.4 hours 

>per 

>contracted day! 

> 

399


>starting, a beginning teacher is making about twenty-seven dollars an 

>hour 

>(if they only work the required contracted hours). Even if a teacher 

>spends 

>an extra 2 hours (over the required contracted hours) per day they are 

>required to work, they will still be making about twenty-one dollars an 

>hour. 

> 

>This can be compared to someone whom is making 45,000.00 dollars a year, 

>but 

>required to work eight hours a day for the approximately 235 working 

>days in 

>a year. These people would be making about 23 dollars an hour. 

> 

>Teachers may really make more than they let on? The average teaching 

>salary 

>in california is about $54,000. This is about forty-two dollars per 

>contracted hour! Often times teachers get extra money for doing other 

>services for the school, (summer school, reading programs, after school 

>tutoring, in-service programs). 

> 

>This pay does not even mention the great benefits that teachers can 

>obtain, 

>medical and otherwise. 

>So I don't really know that I can say that teachers are really 

>underpaid. 

> 

>Oh yah and think about all the internal rewards as well! teaching can be 

>thought of as both a fiscally and internally rewarding job. 

>What are the implications of that? 

> 

>Hope all is well in all your lives, 


> 

> 

> 

> 

> 




> >Subject: Teachers Pay 

> >Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 15:02:45 -0800 (PST) 

> > 

> >I think teachers are not paid very much because it is mainly a job 

> >filled 

> >my women. And we should know that women traditionally get paid less 

>than 

> >men. 

> >Ann 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Check out the great features of the new MSN 9 Dial-up, with the MSN 

>Dial-up 


> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

400



401






I think another reason that might be being overlooked is that teacher salaries are paid with tax money 

(unless you work in a private school). Nationwide, how many teachers to you think there are? It might 

seem like a pittance when you look at individual teacher salaries, but multiply that by a zillion! (I don't 

feel like researching how many teachers there are in the U.S. right now, so that is just an estimate). 

And besides, they are only kids we are teaching, not real people, and....we are only teaching them to 

do something that most people take for granted. Any moron can do that!!! 

(And no, I don't really think that, so settle down!) 

Cynthia 

Carrie Gilardone wrote: 


















>To: 

>Subject: RE: Teachers Pay (roberts journal #something) 

>Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 21:09:47 -0800 

> 











402

credit that it warrants (other than being a professor). All I'm saying 






> 






> 

> 


>year, 

> only 190 of those days are spent with actually students. Teachers can 

>only 


>per 


> 

>If you then figure that teachers make about 35,000.00 dollars a year 


>hour 


>spends 



>hour. 

> 


>but 


>days in 


> 


>salary 

>in cali fornia is about $54,000. This is about forty-two dollars per 

>contracted hour! Often times teachers get extra money for doing other 



> 


>obtain, 



>underpaid. 

> 




403



> 

> 

> 

> 

> 






> > 


> >filled 


>than 

> >men. 

> >Ann 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 


>Dial-up 


> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



404





Subject: Re: RE: Teachers Pay (roberts journal #something) 

all i got to say on this topic is... 

marry a bread winner! 

sorry guys. : ) 

> 

> From: "Carrie Gilardone" 

> Date: 2004/02/15 Sun PM 10:18:22 PST 


> Subject: RE: Teachers Pay (roberts journal #something) 

> 

> Louise I totally agree with you that teacher's should make as much as 

> doctor's, lawyer's etc. because without us they would be nothing. Not to 

> mention I think its wrong that we as American's make it okay for 

> actors/actresses, professional sports players and other people in the 

> entertainment business to make millions of dollars. We as American's go to 

> the movies, buy CD's, go to concerts, watch crazy tv shows and then the 

> entertainment business thinks its okay to pay these people millions of 

> dollars because they've got the whole world's attention. What about 

> teachers? What about EMT's. They make minimum wage to save someone's life. I 

> think thats rediculous! In general, I think America doesn't see the teaching 

> profession as a high end paying profession. I think we would have better 

> teacher's if we were paid better. Obviously, were not in it for the money 

> but wouldn't it be nice to know that the government and American's alike 

> valued the teaching profession like they do the entertainment world??? 

> 

> WEll thats my two cents on this topic. See ya all tomorrow! 

> 

> 

> >From: "Randy& Louise Tweed" 


> >To: 

> >Subject: RE: Teachers Pay (roberts journal #something) 

> >Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 21:09:47 -0800 

> > 

> >You are right in that teachers get paid for working 195 days. What you 

> >have to consider is making the annual salary spread over the full 

> >working year which is 2080 hours. This would then calculate to $16.83 

> >per hour. Of course, teachers have the option of working during the 

> >summer, tutoring etc. Many other professionals also have the 

> >opportunity to work "on the side" and make additional money too. After 

> >working many years in human resources and seeing what someone with a 

> >degree in business, right out of college (age 22) makes versus what we 

> >as teachers with an additional year of school makes just doesn't seem 

> >right. I also don't think that the teaching profession is given the 

> >credit that it warrants (other than being a professor). All I'm saying 

> >is that I don't believe that people who really want to teach do it for 

> >the money. And, I do think that teachers should be in the same league 

> >as doctors/lawyers/architects/accountants etc. After all, without 

> >teachers, nobody would hold these other elite professions! Goooooo 

> >teachers!!!!!! 

> > 


> >From: Robert Atchison [mailto:ratchison001@hotmail.com] 



> >Subject: Teachers Pay (roberts journal #something) 

> > 

405

> >Think about it? Teachers are contracted to work about 195 days in the 

> >year, 

> >only 190 of those days are spent with actually students. Teachers can 

> >only 

> >be required to work 1265 hours during a year. this is about 6.4 hours 

> >per 

> >contracted day! 

> > 

> >If you then figure that teachers make about 35,000.00 dollars a year 

> >starting, a beginning teacher is making about twenty-seven dollars an 

> >hour 

> >(if they only work the required contracted hours). Even if a teacher 

> >spends 

> >an extra 2 hours (over the required contracted hours) per day they are 

> >required to work, they will still be making about twenty-one dollars an 

> >hour. 

> > 

> >This can be compared to someone whom is making 45,000.00 dollars a year, 

> >but 

> >required to work eight hours a day for the approximately 235 working 

> >days in 

> >a year. These people would be making about 23 dollars an hour. 

> > 

> >Teachers may really make more than they let on? The average teaching 

> >salary 

> >in california is about $54,000. This is about forty-two dollars per 

> >contracted hour! Often times teachers get extra money for doing other 

> >services for the school, (summer school, reading programs, after school 

> >tutoring, in-service programs). 

> > 

> >This pay does not even mention the great benefits that teachers can 

> >obtain, 

> >medical and otherwise. 

> >So I don't really know that I can say that teachers are really 

> >underpaid. 

> > 

> >Oh yah and think about all the internal rewards as well! teaching can be 

> >thought of as both a fiscally and internally rewarding job. 

> >What are the implications of that? 

> > 

> >Hope all is well in all your lives, 

> >Robert Atchison 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > >From: Ann Kirkendall 

> > >Reply-To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 


> > >Subject: Teachers Pay 

> > >Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 15:02:45 -0800 (PST) 

> > > 

> > >I think teachers are not paid very much because it is mainly a job 

> > >filled 

> > >my women. And we should know that women traditionally get paid less 

> >than 

> > >men. 

> > >Ann 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >--------------------------------- 

> > >Do you Yahoo!? 

> > >Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online 

> > 

406

_________________________________________________________________ 

> >Check out the great features of the new MSN 9 Dial-up, with the MSN 

> >Dial-up 

> >Accelerator. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/ 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> Find great local high-speed Internet access value at the MSN High-Speed 

> Marketplace. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200360ave/direct/01/ 

> 

> 


407






Hello to everyone, 

Well i've stopped reading the Sagan book the Alien and ufo stuff was too 

much for me. It give me nightmares. You would of thought i was a second 

grader. So to Ann, it sounds like you enjoyed the reading. I guess i'll 

leave that information up to you to read. But even now I wonder how that 

book is connected to science? I know the guy in the book is a science 

professor, but whats the deal with the alien and crazy talk? Is there a 

science connection that will be able to apply to elementary students? 

As for the Kolata book, its still very interesting. I'm sure my face looks 

pretty funny as i'm reading it though. The details and the images you get 

while you read are pretty vivid and after seeing the video in class it makes 

things more explicit. I couldn't even imagine living in that era. I am not 

sure what I would do if something like that occured again. I know my grandma 

was alive during that time and I keep forgettting to ask my dad if he knows 

anything about it. Should be interesting. 

Ohhhh.... on another note, I think the cases that are presented in our book 

for Ochanji's class are great. I think all of them are great scenarios that 

we can learn and benefit from. The one that caught my attention this week is 

"The Tension of Being on the Cutting Edge" by Judith McGonigal. Wow! What an 

amazing teacher to take a "teachable moment" and allow students to go with 

it. I think that it is horrible that she lacked support from her collegues, 

administration and most of all her principal. I understand that there are 

standards to meet so that your students can pass the state tests, but really 

they are probably learning more from that one project than they are all year 

by skimming through material to meet the test standards. Also, i thought 

that this would be a great way to get students interested in science at an 

early age. I think that if i had a teacher like this from kindergarten or 

first grade and through elementary school then I might view science 

differently today. I think by teaching science by inquiry it captivates the 

students attention and allows them to be creative and explore things on 

their own rather than being told what to do. Furthermore, I thought that it 

was amazing that she had so many parents supporting her and their students. 

This did raise some questions for me though. If you were in a low 

socio-economic performing school, how much parent support to you think you 

would have? Well i could go on and on about this stuff, but its getting 

late. So until next time. Later. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



408





Subject: Journal # 4 - Aliens & UFOs and Hallucinations & Ghosts 

After taking a break from the Sagan readings lately, this week I decided to 

get back into them. I think I picked a good time for it too (but that’s just 

me.) The readings got me thinking about two topics: Aliens & UFOs and 

Hallucinations & Ghosts. 

1. Aliens & UFOs: 

With NASA’s interest in Mars, a Mars rover, Spirit, has been launched over 

to the planet recently. A little while ago, I remember hearing on the news 

that Mars could have sustained life at one time because scientists believe 

that water may have been present on the planet. (So we assume that all life 

forms need water to survive?) Okay, but who is to say that there is 

currently no life on the planet at this time. No man has been on Mars, yet. 

Just imagine, say there is living life on Mars. Scenario: NASA goes and 

launches the Mars rover (a UFO) onto Mars. The living life on Mars (aliens) 

think the rover is a UFO and may have something to do with the aliens (us, 

the U.S.) It’s just like the movie, The Day the Earth Stood Still…spaceships 

(UFOs), robots, and a guy from outer space (alien?). Hmmm, it could happen. 

(?) 

2. Hallucinations & Ghosts: 

Sagan’s chapter on Hallucinations (p. 104) got me thinking about this 

comparison: hallucinations vs. ghosts. Sagan suggests that hearing a voice 

or seeing a form is a hallucination because one is hearing or seeing 

something that does not exist. But does it exist? Is that really a ghost one 

is seeing or just another hallucination? So when I’m home alone and I hear a 

voice, is it a ghost or just my imagination? My Grandma has a picture of my 

Uncle Johnny that was taken in a mansion in Hawaii, a long time ago. He went 

with his family to visit this mansion that was haunted with a ghost, a bride 

who was killed on her wedding day in this mansion. As my Uncle and his 

family walked into the foyer, a red carpeted staircase was right in front of 

them. My Uncle’s wife took a picture of him with the stairs behind him. When 

the pictures were developed, behind Uncle Johnny, descending from the 

staircase is a white, iridescent, smoke-like figure. It looks like a bride, 

in her wedding dress, with a veil over her face, carrying a bouquet of 

flowers. So is this picture a hallucination? Or is it a ghost? 

Thoughts to ponder… 


_________________________________________________________________ 



409





Subject: Journal #4 - General Musings 

Without having to do any actual work, and looking at past e-mails, I shall 

here and now attempt to briefly respond to all topics that I remember 

reading about over the last week. 

#1 Homosexual marriage 

Homosexual marriage is outlawed, at the core, because of money. If there 

were no guidelines on marriage, then me and my friend could get married and 

get any tax breaks that that implies. The reason people are fighting against 

it is to "protect the sanctity of marriage." I guess the 50% divorce rate is 

perfectly sanctified in their eyes. If the religious right is so insecure in 

their own marriages that they can't allow others to be happy also, then 

maybe they just aren't molesting enough altar boys to get out all their 

sexual frustrations. If people understood why homosexuality existed, then I 

think there would be no debate. I know what you're saying "what does he 

mean, why it exists?" Well I'll tell you. Homosexuality is an inborn trait 

that is God's way of combating overpopulation. If we can get up to a 50% 

homosexual population, then our population may actually stop spiraling out 

of control and we may be able to live in piece and I won't have to wait for 

45 god damned minutes to get all the way up el camino real at 5pm. God is 

all knowing and all seeing, so he has planned our sexualities accordingly. 

Smart guy that God. So all the people who think they are doing God's work by 

denouncing homosexuality, they are actually just pissing him off for 

doubting his vision. They will all being going to hell, which to the best of 

my knowledge is supposed to be some really hot place that totally sucks ass. 

#2 The Flu 

Ask someone that's dying of lung cancer for months if they would rather have 

a disease that kills you in 24 hours. The 1918 flu was another one of God's 

attempts at population control. That one didn't work so he stepped up 

production on the new and improved Homosexual. If there was another disease 

epidemic that killed a bunch of people (American people of course, because 

we really don't give a shit about all those people dying of AIDS in Africa. 

In fact, that's probably not even true, it's just liberal propaganda) it 

would do us a world of good. Kill off all the sick and weak members of the 

population. I know you'd all be upset if you didn't have anyone to beg you 

for nickels on the freeway off ramps, or harass you while you walk into 

vons, but trust me, we'd be better off. "Hey Mike, I bet you wouldn't be 

saying this if you were going to die from this new disease." New or old, I'm 

going to die of something, and I'd rather have it take 24 hours than the 

rest of my life. Hey wait.... 

#3 Aliens 

Aliens exist. There is no doubt. You have doubt you say? Then you are 

incredibly arrogant I say. In this gigantic universe, of which we are but a 

tiny dingleberry on the ass of the cosmos, how could we be so foolish to 

assume that we are the only life forms? We aren't the oldest planet, we 

aren't the oldest solar system, and we aren't the oldest galaxy. Maybe 

something that's been around for a billion more years than us has had a 

chance to harbor life also. Maybe? Anyone willing to consider it? Ok, so 

you either believe aliens exist, or you are completely self centered and 

410

elieve the sun revolves around the earth...the flat earth. So they exist, 

but have they visited earth? Hmmm...probably not. Technology advanced enough 

to reach our planet from another solar system would also be advanced enough 

to learn everything about the human body from one or 2 specimens. So why 

keep coming back and taking people? Other than to get the Time/Life book 

commercials on TV when i used to spend the night at my grandma's house to 

totally scare the bejeezus out of me. Screw you Time/Life. Screw you for all 

Time until there is no Life left in your withered husk. 

#4 Teacher's pay 

We'll get paid enough. None of our teacher's were ever in danger of starving 

to death. Girls, marry a rich guy. Guys, marry a rich girl, or even better, 

don't get married at all. (Y+X)-Z=A Where Y equals the husband's income, X 

equals the wife's income, Z equals the wife's expenditures and amount spent 

on gifts for said wife, and A equals what is left over for the man. Oh, and 

A=0. Always. 

Hmmm...what else has been shooting back and forth in these journals...can't 

say I recall. Don't want to hit the back button or this would probably all 

be erased. Sure i could just hit ctrl+n and then back. But I don't want to 

reveal how techno savvy I am in case i need to plead ignorance sometime in 

the future. Oh crap...I've said too much. 


_________________________________________________________________ 



411





Subject: Re: Oops 

I am still trying to recover from the bottle of wine that I had yesterday:) I feel your pain love:) 

Jenny Fiala 

412


From: Joey Benson [hobo_jojo21@hotmail.com] 




Hi class, 

I’m having a hard time with how easy Sagan writes off UFO sightings to 

hallucinations. “…Surveys have shown that 10 to 25 percent of ordinary, 

functioning people have experienced, at least once in their lifetimes, a 

vivid hallucination” (pg. 104). I find it odd that Sagan is relying on 

surveys to prove his point. How do you take a survey to distinguish the 

percent of people who have hallucinations (Sagan doen’t mention this)? 

Hallucinations are as weird to me as aliens are. I cannot recall any times 

where I can say I experienced hallucinations. I am confused to what exactly 

a hallucination is, and how someone who did not experience the 

“hallucination” can make the distinction of reality and hallucination for 

the person who actually did experience the “hallucination”. It is easy for 

me, who has never experienced a hallucination to say that every weird thing 

that happens to people in this world only happens when people hallucinate. 

I don’t know what they are experiencing and I have never experienced it so 

it must be untrue. What kind of rational is this? I have admired how Sagan 

has used science to prove his stance on many issues of the unknown. He has 

made a lot of sense to me. I don’t understand how he can now just throw in 

hallucinations. What is really known about hallucinations? How much does 

science know about hallucinations? I get the feeling from reading this book 

that science doesn’t know very much about hallucinations. So why does Sagan 

so readily use it to explain why people experience what they experience. It 

just don’t understand how he can say that there is no such thing as UFO 

visits, religious experiences, ghost sightings, etc… because 10 to 25 

percent of ordinary people have experienced hallucinations. His argument is 

weak. He is proving the unknown with the unknown. 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 



413






You could have picked my jaw off the ground after reading your message below -- until I read your last phrase and then I 

sighed a huge WHEW! You are right though that we are paid out of taxes (public school teachers) and that the taxes 

have to be stretched over the "zillion" or so teachers. What makes me a little crazy is that if some of these politicians 

went a little lighter on their social calendars i.e. private jets, fancy dinners, etc. which often gets footed by the tax payer, 

maybe there would be more money in the coffers to pay teachers and perhaps we wouldn't have such a large burn-out 

rate. ~ Louise 






I think another reason that might be being overlooked is that teacher salaries are paid with tax 

money (unless you work in a private school). Nationwide, how many teachers to you think there 

are? It might seem like a pittance when you look at individual teacher salaries, but multiply that by 

a zillion! (I don't feel like researching how many teachers there are in the U.S. right now, so that is 

just an estimate). And besides, they are only kids we are teaching, not real people, and....we are 

only teaching them to do something that most people take for granted. Any moron can do that!!! 

(And no, I don't really think that, so settle down!) 

Cynthia 



















>To: 

414


>Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 21:09:47 -0800 

> 











>credit that it warrants (other than being a professor). All I'm saying 






> 






> 

> 


>year, 

> only 190 of those days are spent with actually students. Teachers can 

>only 


>per 


> 

>If you then figure that teachers make about 35,000.00 dollars a year 


>hour 


>spends 



>hour. 

> 


>but 


>days in 


> 


>salary 

>in cali fornia is about $54,000. This is about forty-two dollars per 

415




> 


>obtain, 



>underpaid. 

> 




> 



> 

> 

> 

> 

> 






> > 


> >filled 


>than 

> >men. 

> >Ann 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 


>Dial-up 


> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



416

_____ 



417





Subject: YEEEEEEE HAAAAAAAA 

YEEEEEEE HAAAAAAAA, 

Let's get this party started! I love to see all the lively topics flying around like UFO's. 

I will remain a wall flower until I feel better though. 

Ann 

P.S. The Sagan book keeps me awake at night.. 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/02.gif and not in a good way... 

_____ 



418





Subject: RE: Journal #4 - General Musings 

Just curious Mike - what the heck is a dingleberry and does the cosmos 

really have an arse??? 

~ Louise 


From: Mike Runnestrand [mailto:mikerunnestrand@hotmail.com] 



Subject: Journal #4 - General Musings 

Without having to do any actual work, and looking at past e-mails, I 

shall 

here and now attempt to briefly respond to all topics that I remember 

reading about over the last week. 

#1 Homosexual marriage 

Homosexual marriage is outlawed, at the core, because of money. If there 

were no guidelines on marriage, then me and my friend could get married 

and 

get any tax breaks that that implies. The reason people are fighting 

against 

it is to "protect the sanctity of marriage." I guess the 50% divorce 

rate is 

perfectly sanctified in their eyes. If the religious right is so 

insecure in 

their own marriages that they can't allow others to be happy also, then 

maybe they just aren't molesting enough altar boys to get out all their 

sexual frustrations. If people understood why homosexuality existed, 

then I 

think there would be no debate. I know what you're saying "what does he 

mean, why it exists?" Well I'll tell you. Homosexuality is an inborn 

trait 

that is God's way of combating overpopulation. If we can get up to a 50% 

homosexual population, then our population may actually stop spiraling 

out 

of control and we may be able to live in piece and I won't have to wait 

for 

45 god damned minutes to get all the way up el camino real at 5pm. God 

is 

all knowing and all seeing, so he has planned our sexualities 

accordingly. 

Smart guy that God. So all the people who think they are doing God's 

work by 

denouncing homosexuality, they are actually just pissing him off for 

doubting his vision. They will all being going to hell, which to the 

best of 

my knowledge is supposed to be some really hot place that totally sucks 

ass. 

#2 The Flu 

419

Ask someone that's dying of lung cancer for months if they would rather 

have 

a disease that kills you in 24 hours. The 1918 flu was another one of 

God's 

attempts at population control. That one didn't work so he stepped up 

production on the new and improved Homosexual. If there was another 

disease 

epidemic that killed a bunch of people (American people of course, 

because 

we really don't give a shit about all those people dying of AIDS in 

Africa. 

In fact, that's probably not even true, it's just liberal propaganda) it 

would do us a world of good. Kill off all the sick and weak members of 

the 

population. I know you'd all be upset if you didn't have anyone to beg 

you 

for nickels on the freeway off ramps, or harass you while you walk into 

vons, but trust me, we'd be better off. "Hey Mike, I bet you wouldn't be 

saying this if you were going to die from this new disease." New or old, 

I'm 

going to die of something, and I'd rather have it take 24 hours than the 

rest of my life. Hey wait.... 

#3 Aliens 

Aliens exist. There is no doubt. You have doubt you say? Then you are 

incredibly arrogant I say. In this gigantic universe, of which we are 

but a 

tiny dingleberry on the ass of the cosmos, how could we be so foolish to 

assume that we are the only life forms? We aren't the oldest planet, we 

aren't the oldest solar system, and we aren't the oldest galaxy. Maybe 

something that's been around for a billion more years than us has had a 

chance to harbor life also. Maybe? Anyone willing to consider it? Ok, 

so 

you either believe aliens exist, or you are completely self centered and 

believe the sun revolves around the earth...the flat earth. So they 

exist, 

but have they visited earth? Hmmm...probably not. Technology advanced 

enough 

to reach our planet from another solar system would also be advanced 

enough 

to learn everything about the human body from one or 2 specimens. So why 

keep coming back and taking people? Other than to get the Time/Life book 

commercials on TV when i used to spend the night at my grandma's house 

to 

totally scare the bejeezus out of me. Screw you Time/Life. Screw you for 

all 

Time until there is no Life left in your withered husk. 

#4 Teacher's pay 

We'll get paid enough. None of our teacher's were ever in danger of 

starving 

to death. Girls, marry a rich guy. Guys, marry a rich girl, or even 

better, 

don't get married at all. (Y+X)-Z=A Where Y equals the husband's income, 

X 

420

equals the wife's income, Z equals the wife's expenditures and amount 

spent 

on gifts for said wife, and A equals what is left over for the man. Oh, 

and 

A=0. Always. 

Hmmm...what else has been shooting back and forth in these 

journals...can't 

say I recall. Don't want to hit the back button or this would probably 

all 

be erased. Sure i could just hit ctrl+n and then back. But I don't want 

to 

reveal how techno savvy I am in case i need to plead ignorance sometime 

in 

the future. Oh crap...I've said too much. 


_________________________________________________________________ 



421





Subject: Influenza... 

The more I read about the 1918 flu the more questions that come to the 

surface. To some degree it is understandable why the 1918 epidemic was left 

out of our history. After all, history usually presents a pretty narrow focus 

on historical events. History rarely incorporates science, philosophy, 

technology, the history of a culture and a science. The history of science is 

usually limited to inventions. How about the history of science and health? 

Moreover, what is a virus? How about looking at what is a virus from the 

perspective of what it is rather than focusing solely on whether the 1918 flu 

can happen to me. If our only concern is, can it happen to me? Then the 

investigation stops there given the time lapse since the 1918 flu epidemic and 

our lack of interest or faith that it will not happen again. Rather then 

looking at alleviating the symptoms of the flu, why not try to find out the 

underlining cause of the 1918 flu. We can begin by looking at our perception 

of disease. This thing we call illness what is it really? What is really going 

on? Disease is a western thought. The Chinese and Indian medicine, for 

example, considers disease to be a lack of ease. Maybe we need to develop a 

new philosophical paradigm to match the question of what is a virus and what 

patterns, interactions, and influences do viruses have on our lives. Again, 

finding out the underlining cause rather than the focus of alleviating the 

symptoms needs to be considered. Is the body ever rid of disease? We are 

always looking for ways to make our lives more antiseptic, secure, and safe. 

Let’s pay attention to the affect of a body coming out of a viral attack? What 

is the healing body going through? Taking into account evolution, what is the 

purpose of a virus? How can something that never existed before come to be? 

How does it become dominant and kill 40 million people? Are viruses alive or 

just things? We know now that viruses do not have cells raising another 

question. What is alive or not alive? Is there a pattern to viruses or are the 

patterns random? A virus appears to be an opportunistic life form. Is there a 

relationship between the host and the virus? Why does a virus alter its 

environment and kills the host? A virus seems to evolve not just move and like 

little machines they go on as if programmed with very specific purpose to 

adapt to the their environment. Viruses need the host's cells to grow. Given 

the 1918 flu epidemic one can place viruses on the top of the predatory chain. 

Is HIV not caused by a virus? Are the answers to understanding viruses like 

the HIV virus locked in the mystery of the 1918 epidemic? We know that “the 

virus will have changed enough to evade the immune system’s defenses” (Kolata 

86). Does a virus have some form of intelligence? Hopefully, Kolata’s book 

will address my questions. (Alexandra’s Journal #4) 

422





Subject: Re: Influenza...Casey Cunningham 

As I was reading Alexandra's journal a lot of thoughts started coming to my head so I thought that I 

would make those thoughts my journal. I noticed that she asked some questions like why is the flu 

never talked about? We hear that word hundreds of times in a week. Somebody always has some 

sort of the flu or at least that is what they call it. 

Why haven't we ever learned about viruses. I think it is important to teach people about it. I learned 

about what a virus was from my doctor. I asked her because I was curious many years ago. She 

explained it all to me. But why can't we make it a lesson in school so that kids know about it. I can't be 

harmful to know about something like the flu. 

I noticed in the movie that we watched the children were a lot of times left in the dark about things. 

Many of their friends were dying but nobaody gave them any explanations as to why. Maybe it is 

because they did not know why but ignoring the issue is not the right thing to do. Alexandra asks a lot 

of good questions, probably questions that a lot of people wonder. 

I think that health goes along with science and I am sure it is not a standard but would be very 

beneficial for kids to learn about. I enjoyed reading this journal and would like to know the answer to 

many of the questions myself. 

423




To: ICP-F 


At first I did not want to touch this subject of gay marriage then I started 

to read what people had to say and I wanted to express my feelings about it 

also. From watching the news and reading the paper many people say that it is 

not right to let gay couples get married. To quote good old Bush "marraige is 

between a man and a woman" These are the ones that feel that gay marriage is 

not right and is a disgusting pratice of affection. I personally feel that gay 

marriage is quite ok I have close family that pratice this and I have no 

problem at all with it. If two people love each other then why cant they be 

together. I remeber back when interracial marriage was getting the attention 

that gay marriage is and we went through with the interracial marriage so why 

not allow these gay couples the right to be together. I think that people are 

affarid for the change and they feel that this would impact the world today. 

People need to get there heads out of their A@@ and open their eyes these gay 

couples will still be on the street and in restaurants no matter if they have 

a marriage certificate or not. So why not give them the satifaction of joining 

their love with one another. To qoute the Bible "God created us all equal" so 

why dont we go by this and give these couples there equallity. 

Marriage is a beautiful thing that needs to be shared with everyone! 

424




To: ICP-F 


Sagan point of not really being awake is something I have thought a lot about 

long before reading it within my life. Sometimes I think we go through our 

lives never really living. We continue our daily routine and go through our 

ups and downs. People that have lived a hard life say that you have never 

really lived until you (i.e.- watch you own child die, or survive the 

depression, etc.) In some aspect I suppose that you are tested against your 

will to survive and make experiences like that something to grow on. However, 

is that really living. It is a fact that we only use 15% of our brain power, 

if that is so, what could we potentially do with the other 85%. Would we that 

be really living if we were able to tap into the greater depths of our brains? 

Maybe we would be able to tap into a higher source of knowledge and find the 

answers to all of the controversal questions that we ponder today and then 

after we know all the answers then we could really live!!?????? 

I have really gotten into the Flu book, as long as I don't remind myself that 

I am reading it for a class. I think watching the movie made the horror in the 

book more easily picturable (not necessarily a good thing). I think fear drove 

the U.S. and Europe into not telling the rest of the world. It was not 

mandated at that time to spread the word of disease, so why would they? 

I have read many of the journal entries for this week and have every intention 

of submitting responces, but not now! See you all in class. 

-Chula 

425





Subject: Re: Journal #4 - General Musings 

Louise it is better that you don't know:) 

Jenny Fiala 

426






Thanks Jonathan and all of those who have talked with me about this subject. 

I see some people are starting to restore my faith in humanity. I was getting truely bummed out. 

There truely are a few candles in the dark. 

Ann 

griff030 wrote: 

At first I did not want to touch this subject of gay marriage then I started 

to read what people had to say and I wanted to express my feelings about it 

also. From watching the news and reading the paper many people say that it is 

not right to let gay couples get married. To quote good old Bush "marraige is 

between a man and a woman" These are the ones that feel that gay marriage is 

not right and is a disgusting pratice affection. I personally feel that gay 

marriage is quite ok I have close family that pratice this and I have no 

problem at all with it. If two people love each other then why cant they be 

together. I remeber back when interracial marriage was getting the attention 

that gay marriage is and we went through with the interracial marriage so why 

not allow these gay couples the right to be together. I think that people are 

a ffarid for the change and they feel that this would impact the world today. 

People need to get there heads out of their A@@ and open their eyes these gay 

couples will still be on the street and in restaurants no matter if they have 

a marriage certificate or not. So why not give them the satifaction of joining 

their love with one another. To qoute the Bible "God created us all equal" so 

why dont we go by this and give these couples there equallity. 

Marriage is a beautiful thing that needs to be shared with everyone! 

_____ 



427


From: Jesus Christ [theword143@hotmail.com] 



Subject: hello cohort f 

I have been listening to the noise on this list serve for some time now. 

Interesting I must say. Thy group is one of great divirisity and many 

misconceptions. For we all know that there is but one truth. One absolute 

truth. Mind you to be careful of your misdealings. 

Love, 

Jesus Christ* 

*Not the real jesus christ just a voice speaking of his most noble word. 

"O'Lord, we have sinned against you grievously, yet help us for the sake of 

your own reputation!" 

Jeremiah 14:7 

_________________________________________________________________ 



428


From: Charles Darwin [charlezdarwyn@hotmail.com] 



Subject: new to the group 

Greetings Cohort F, 

Charlez Darwyn here. I noticed we have a new class member, all be it a 

phoney. 

I too am joining your group, if for no other reason than to help you 

discover the truth. 

Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those 

who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that 

this or that problem will never be solved by science. 

Charles Darwin 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Stay informed on Election 2004 and the race to Super Tuesday. 

http://special.msn.com/msn/election2004.armx 

429





Subject: RE: new to the group and homosexuality 

Dear Charles, 

We may certainly find the truth, but I have already spoken with my father 

about you and lets just say that I have learned a thing or two about your 

person. I hope that peace resides in your heart. 

The issue of homosexuality has been of frequent importance for this cohort 

of F. It has been written that, 

"You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an 

abomination." Lev. 18:22 

and, 

"Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of 

God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, 

nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor 

drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God." 1 

Cor. 6:9-10 

Yet it is wise to remember, 

"Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall 

be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you 

again. And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but 

considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, first 

cast out the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to 

cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye." – Matthew: 7:1-5 

Be wise to believe that this is but the true word! 

Your Pal, 

Jesus 

>From: "Charles Darwin" 



>Subject: new to the group 

>Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 21:35:15 -0800 

> 

>Greetings Cohort F, 

>Charlez Darwyn here. I noticed we have a new class member, all be it a 

>phoney. 

> 

>I too am joining your group, if for no other reason than to help you 

>discover the truth. 

> 

>Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is 

>those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively 

>assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. 

>Charles Darwin 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Stay informed on Election 2004 and the race to Super Tuesday. 

>http://special.msn.com/msn/election2004.armx 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

430

Store more e-mails with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage – 4 plans to choose from! 


431





Subject: Homosexuality 

Homosexual behaviour occurs in more than 450 different animal species 

worldwide, and is found in every major geographical region and every major 

animal group Homosexuality in some species appears to play a social role. 

For instance, bonobos will have sex with same-sex partners to calm tensions 

after a squabble, or to make sure that a large amount of food is shared. 

But for some species, humans included, homosexual behavior may have no 

adaptive value at all. 

"Looking for any single conceptual framework to explain homosexual behavior 

is an unattainable goal," says Vasey, one of the leading researchers on 

homosexual behavior. In female Japanese macaques, homosexual behavior 

appears to have evolved from female strategies to coerce reticent males to 

mate with them. Eager females will mount unwilling males and prompt them to 

mate with them - a strategy that was easily expanded to mounting other 

females. Despite these evolutionary origins, however, homosexual behavior 

among Japanese macaques may have no adaptive value - just as our tailbone 

evolved but is no longer useful. We lust because our ancestors' lust just 

helped pass their lustful genes on to us—What else does a man become a great 

chieftain for? 

Since such behavior is part of our evolutionary genetics, I argue that we 

must not legislate against it, even though it is producing too much 

population. The remedy, I say, is not to return to Biblical morality, but to 

promote "safe sex" and abortion (perhaps also infanticide and euthanasia), 

and even homosexuality. These practices are said to be common in the animal 

world, so are part of acceptable evolutionary philosophy. 

It is important to distinguish between the point of view of the individual 

and that of the species. An individual can be a nonbreeder, a species 

cannot. The point of view of an individual is a life's time. The time scale 

of a species is millions of years. That is what evolution is about. And 

therefore, what would it hurt if we were to embrace homosexual marriage? 

Humans will never become extinct because of it. 

Charlez Darwyn 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Dream of owning a home? Find out how in the First-time Home Buying Guide. 

http://special.msn.com/home/firsthome.armx 

432





Subject: Re: Influenza... 

Well, Alexandra, I think you are on the right track. From what I have found, HIV keeps mutating and that is why it 

is so difficult to make a vaccine for it, or find a cure. A virus gone amuck. Viruses are parasites, they don't care 

about your feelings or what you want. Very selfish individuals. 

Cynthia 

Seaweed extract effective against flu, possibly HIV: Japanese researcher 

Wednesday, 22-Oct-2003 1:31AM PDT 

The same agent, which stops the virus' multiplication process, might also be effective against other viral 

diseases, such as AIDS, Yuto Kamei, assistant professor of marine biotechnology at Saga University in southern 

Japan, told AFP. 

"We hope this will result in the creation of a new flu drug," Kamei said. 

"We have only experimented with the flu virus. But this may lead to the development of medication for other 

diseases, such as AIDS," he said. 

Austrian Researchers Test Flu Vaccine Against HIV 

Reuters newMedia - Monday November 12, 2001 

Louis Charbonneau 

VIENNA (Reuters) - Researchers at Vienna's Institute of Applied Microbiology say they are testing a 

possible way to prevent HIV infection with a modified flu vaccine. 

Dr. Boris Ferko, a member of the Austrian research team, said laboratory mice inoculated with flu 

viruses laced with material from the HIV/AIDS virus exhibited a significant anti-HIV immunity 

response. 

433

The material in the flu virus appeared to function as an antigen, a substance alien to the body 

capable of stimulating an immune response. The details of the institute's study were published in the 

October 2001 issue of the Journal of Virology. 

"The mice appeared to develop an immunity to the HIV virus after getting the modified influenza," 

Ferko told Reuters on Friday. 

...... 

HIV has proven especially difficult for vaccine developers because it is an elusive, constantly 

mutating virus that misleads and systemically destroys the human immune system. 

AIDS, Flu Viruses 'Harpoon' Cells 

By William J. Cromie 

Once Wiley became intimately acquainted with the flu virus, his knowledge and intuition told him that 

the AIDS virus must operate in a similar way. 

"We were surprised when we found that it was more like the flu virus than we ever imagined," he 

says. 

sosno001 wrote: 

The more I read about the 1918 flu the more questions that come to the 

surface. To some degree it is understandable why the 1918 epidemic was left 

out of our history. After all, history usually presents a pretty narrow focus 

on historical events. History rarely incorporates science, philosophy, 

technology, the history of a culture and a science. The history of science is 

usually limited to inventions. How about the history of science and health? 

Moreover, what is a virus? How about looking at what is a virus from the 

perspective of what it is rather than focusing solely on whether the 1918 flu 

can happen to me. If our only concern is, can it happen to me? Then the 

investigation stops there given the time lapse since the 1918 flu epidemic and 

our lack of interest or faith that it will not happen again. Rather then 

looking at alleviati ng the symptoms of the flu, why not try to find out the 

underlining cause of the 1918 flu. We can begin by looking at our perception 

of disease. This thing we call illness what is it really? What is really going 

on? Disease is a western thought. The Chinese and Indian medicine, for 

example, considers disease to be a lack of ease. Maybe we need to develop a 

new philosophical paradigm to match the question of what is a virus and what 

patterns, interactions, and influences do viruses have on our lives. Again, 

finding out the underlining cause rather than the focus of alleviating the 

symptoms needs to be considered. Is the body ever rid of disease? We are 

always looking for ways to make our lives more antiseptic, secure, and safe. 

434

Let’s pay attention to the affect of a body coming out of a viral attack? What 

is the healing body going through? Taking into account evolution, what is the 

purpose of a virus? How can something that never exist ed before come to be? 

How does it become dominant and kill 40 million people? Are viruses alive or 

just things? We know now that viruses do not have cells raising another 

question. What is alive or not alive? Is there a pattern to viruses or are the 

patterns random? A virus appears to be an opportunistic life form. Is there a 

relationship between the host and the virus? Why does a virus alter its 

environment and kills the host? A virus seems to evolve not just move and like 

little machines they go on as if programmed with very specific purpose to 

adapt to the their environment. Viruses need the host's cells to grow. Given 

the 1918 flu epidemic one can place viruses on the top of the predatory chain. 

Is HIV not caused by a virus? Are the answers to understanding viruses like 

the HIV virus locked in the mystery of the 1918 epidemic? We know that “the 

virus will have changed enough to evade the immune system’s defenses” (Kolata 

8 6). Does a virus have some form of intelligence? Hopefully, Kolata’s book 

will address my questions. (Alexandra’s Journal #4) 

_____ 



435






Joey, I think you are hallucinating!!! (kidding) It would be pretty hard to find solid evidence of 

something that doesn't exist. Like people seeing Jesus crying on a tree trunk, or where ever it is they 

claim to see him. People see what they want to see, it is quite aberated. Maybe Sagan is trying to 

make a connection between things like religion and hallucinations, neither can be proven. I read Chpt. 

8, and he was talking about the people getting instructions from Mary etc and how it is always 

peasants or powerless people who get these messages. Maybe that is how these people try to get 

some power of their own. Just a thought. 

Cynthia 

SPEAKING OF HALLUCINATIONS, JUST WHO IS THIS SO-CALLED JESUS THAT HAS 

INFILTRATED OUR SIGHT? AND IT APPEARS HE HAS A FRIEND? OR AM I JUST 

HALLUCINATING? ARE THEY NOT REALLY HERE AT ALL? WHAT THE HECK IS GOING ON? 

MAYBE PROF. YAMASHITA DIDN'T LIKE THE SEAT SWITCHING IN CLASS AND HAS DECIDED 

TO GET BACK AT US? SENSE OR NONSENSE? 

Joey Benson wrote: 

Hi class, 

I’m having a hard time with how easy Sagan writes off UFO sightings to 

hallucinations. “…Surveys have shown that 10 to 25 percent of ordinary, 

functioning people have experienced, at least once in their lifetimes, a 

vivid hallucination” (pg. 104). I find it odd that Sagan is relying on 

surveys to prove his point. How do you take a survey to distinguish the 

percent of people who have hallucinations (Sagan doen’t mention this)? 

Hallucinations are as weird to me as aliens are. I cannot recall any times 

where I can say I experienced hallucinations. I am confused to what exactly 

a hallucination is, and how someone who did not experience the 

“hallucination” can make the distinction of reality and hallucination for 

the person who actually did experience the “hallucination”. It is easy for 

me, who has never experienced a halluci nation to say that every weird thing 

that happens to people in this world only happens when people hallucinate. 

I don’t know what they are experiencing and I have never experienced it so 

it must be untrue. What kind of rational is this? I have admired how Sagan 

has used science to prove his stance on many issues of the unknown. He has 

made a lot of sense to me. I don’t understand how he can now just throw in 

hallucinations. What is really known about hallucinations? How much does 

science know about hallucinations? I get the feeling from reading this book 

that science doesn’t know very much about hallucinations. So why does Sagan 

so readily use it to explain why people experience what they experience. It 

just don’t understand how he can say that there is no such thing as UFO 

visits, religious experiences, ghost sightings, etc… because 10 to 25 

percent of ordinary people have experienced hallucinations. His argument is 

weak. He is p roving the unknown with the unknown. 

Joey 

436

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



437






Don't tell me you are hallucinating too!!!! I am trying to picture you making funny faces as you read. 

Be careful, someone might throw you in the funny farm. I think this class was designed to drive us all 

crazy, but I won't have any part of that! I refuse to go insane. 

Cynthia 


Hello to everyone, 

Well i've stopped reading the Sagan book the Alien and ufo stuff was too 

much for me. It give me nightmares. You would of thought i was a second 

grader. So to Ann, it sounds like you enjoyed the reading. I guess i'll 

leave that information up to you to read. But even now I wonder how that 

book is connected to science? I know the guy in the book is a science 

professor, but whats the deal with the alien and crazy talk? Is there a 

science connection that will be able to apply to elementary students? 

As for the Kolata book, its still very interesting. I'm sure my face looks 

pretty funny as i'm reading it though. The details and the images you get 

while you read are pretty vivid and after seeing the video in class it makes 

things more explicit. I couldn't even imagine living in that era. I am not 

sure what I w ould do if something like that occured again. I know my grandma 

was alive during that time and I keep forgettting to ask my dad if he knows 

anything about it. Should be interesting. 

Ohhhh.... on another note, I think the cases that are presented in our book 

for Ochanji's class are great. I think all of them are great scenarios that 

we can learn and benefit from. The one that caught my attention this week is 

"The Tension of Being on the Cutting Edge" by Judith McGonigal. Wow! What an 

amazing teacher to take a "teachable moment" and allow students to go with 

it. I think that it is horrible that she lacked support from her collegues, 

administration and most of all her principal. I understand that there are 

standards to meet so that your students can pass the state tests, but really 

they are probably learning more from that one project than they are all year 

by skimming through material to meet the test standards. Also, i thought 

th at this would be a great way to get students interested in science at an 

early age. I think that if i had a teacher like this from kindergarten or 

first grade and through elementary school then I might view science 

differently today. I think by teaching science by inquiry it captivates the 

students attention and allows them to be creative and explore things on 

their own rather than being told what to do. Furthermore, I thought that it 

was amazing that she had so many parents supporting her and their students. 

This did raise some questions for me though. If you were in a low 

socio-economic performing school, how much parent support to you think you 

would have? Well i could go on and on about this stuff, but its getting 

438

late. So until next time. Later. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



439




To: journal 

Subject: Unidentified subject! 

First crime genes, now this!!!! cynthia 

Cheating in sports could become genetic 

Therapy program builds bigger rats, worries 

By Bruce Lieberman 

STAFF WRITER 

SEATTLE – Some seriously pumped-up rats have set rodent records hauling weights up little ladders 

in a Philadelphia lab, where genetic engineering may be shaping the future of the National Football 

League. 

And that is not necessarily good news, scientists here said yesterday. At a time when some athletes 

will do just about anything to make their bodies bigger, stronger and faster, gene therapy is a whole 

new frontier. 

More . . . 

_____ 



440




To: journal 

Subject: Breast Cancer and Antibiotics 

OK, Ladies, good thing I refuse to take antibiotics!! 

Cynthia 

Report Links Breast Cancer to Antibiotic Use 

Reuters 

Tue Feb 17,12:28 PM ET 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/my/my16.gif Add Health - Reuters to My Yahoo! 

CHICAGO (Reuters) - Women exposed to higher amounts of antibiotics have as much as twice the 

risk of breast cancer, but it is not known if the treatment is an actual cause of the most common form 

of cancer afflicting women worldwide, researchers said on Tuesday. 

In Yahoo! Health 

Chronic Heartburn Chronic Heartburn 

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More from Yahoo! Health: 

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The findings however are consistent with an earlier Finnish study of almost 10,000 women and pending further research 

they underscore the need to use antibiotics prudently, the report said. 

The study from the University of Washington in Seattle was based on a look at 10,219 women in a group health plan, 

some of whom were being treated for breast cancer. Antibiotic use of the patients studied was determined by the 

prescription records maintained by the health plan. 

It found that women who took antibiotics for more than 500 days, or had more than 25 prescriptions, over an average 

period of 17 years had more than twice the risk of breast cancer as women who had not taken any antibiotics. 

The risk was smaller for women who took antibiotics for fewer days. But even women who had between one and 25 

prescriptions over an average of 17 years were about one and a half times more likely to be diagnosed with breast cancer 

than women who didn't take any antibiotics. 

The increased risk involved all classes of antibiotics that they studied. 

"Increasing cumulative days of antibiotic use was also associated with death due to breast cancer ...," said the study, 

which was published in the Journal of the American Medical Association (news - web sites). 

_____ 



441

442





Subject: J4 :I see dead people... 

Okay, I don't actually see dead people anymore, but I used to when I lived 

with my mom. Apparently they were just hallucinations. I am glad Sagan 

cleared all that up for me, I just wish I would have known they were mere 

hallucinations a long time ago; it sure would have saved me a great deal of 

childhood trauma! 

Sagan doesn't mention it, but dogs hallucinate too. One time my brother and I 

were sitting in our living room chatting, the dog made a whining noise and we 

looked up to see a figure of a man standing in the corner. The next thing I 

know the dog and my brother were practically tripping over each other trying 

to get out the door. You can choose to believe this story or not, I have 

decided to reject Sagan's explanation because I think it makes for more 

interesting conversations to talk about ghosts rather than hallucinations. 

That is the beauty of being able to think for yourself, you can accept the 

data you receive, or reject it. 

Now I want to comment on the topic of same sex marriage. I say it should be 

allowed! I certainly see nothing wrong with it. Ann, you yourself said change 

is slow. Just think, there is a generation of people growing up watching more 

gay characters on t.v. and more celebrities are choosing to be openly gay. 

Things have already changed and they will continue to do so. Hopefully this 

next generation will be more openminded. You hang in there Ann! 

Mike brought up an interesting point about aliens being so advanced that they 

don't need to visit this planet repeatedly. This may be true, but what if the 

aliens coming here are actually alien gangs? For all we know they are so 

advanced that they are bored. Aliens could be hanging out and one could say, 

"Hey, let's go pick up an Earthling and stick something up its ass!" 

I am pretty sure aliens don't have advocate groups such as Aliens Against 

Probing Earthlings (A.A.P.E.) or Aliens Against Semen Sampling (A.A.S.S.) 

Just in case anyone is wondering, the only alien I've seen is my cousin Nacho, 

but he is of the illegal variety. 

In closing, I would like to welcome Mr. Christ and Mr. Darwin to our 

listserve. I think it will be interesting to hear what they have to say, 

although I think Mr. Christ is just trying to promote his new movie. 

Personally I would rather see "Dirty Dancing Havana Nights." 

Bye, Cecilia 

443





Subject: the nature of this listserve 

so for my journal this week, i thought i would ocmment on the nature of this listserve. 

one thing ive been wanting to comment on is how free people feel to say everything and 

anything. i know that email is an easy way to say things you might otherwise not mention 

in person, but im amazed at how far people have taken this notion. 

and this is why i have stopped reading journals. rather than allowing journals to get me 

all riled up, i have decided to ignore them. and its working out great for me. i never 

intended on disregarding what everyone writes, but in order to be relaxed i have to do 

this for myself. for the most part, this listserve robs me of my peace, so for my mind, 

body and soul, im refraining. 

another comment.... 

at first i was very upset with the Jesus Christ and darwin emails. but now im recognizing 

that they arent neccessarily offensive. they most likely will come a point when i think 

they have crossed a line, so far its been alright. and whomever is playing these roles is 

not only being a strong witness to the class by playing Jesus but is reading the Bible. 

im very impressed. as for darwin, not a strong fight as far as im concerned. 

another comment... 

go see the passion of Jesus Christ. see what He has to offer you and what He did just for 

you. 

lastly... 

please have common courtesy on here. dont disregard other people's feelings or beliefs. 

dont attack, dont place blame, and dont be hurtful just because you can. 


444





Subject: RE: the nature of this listserve 

"I am a strong advocate for free thought on all subjects, yet it appears to 

me (whether rightly or wrongly) that direct arguments against christianity & 

theism produce hardly any effect on the public; & freedom of thought is best 

promoted by the gradual illumination of men's minds, which follow[s] from 

the advance of science. It has, therefore, been always my object to avoid 

writing on religion, & I have confined myself to science." 

So, I think I will pass on the movie, but thanks for the invite. 

C. Darwyn 

>From: 


>To: 

>Subject: the nature of this listserve 

>Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:27:23 -0800 

> 

>so for my journal this week, i thought i would ocmment on the nature of 

>this listserve. one thing ive been wanting to comment on is how free 

>people feel to say everything and anything. i know that email is an easy 

>way to say things you might otherwise not mention in person, but im amazed 

>at how far people have taken this notion. 

>and this is why i have stopped reading journals. rather than allowing 

>journals to get me all riled up, i have decided to ignore them. and its 

>working out great for me. i never intended on disregarding what everyone 

>writes, but in order to be relaxed i have to do this for myself. for the 

>most part, this listserve robs me of my peace, so for my mind, body and 

>soul, im refraining. 

>another comment.... 

>at first i was very upset with the Jesus Christ and darwin emails. but now 

>im recognizing that they arent neccessarily offensive. they most likely 

>will come a point when i think they have crossed a line, so far its been 

>alright. and whomever is playing these roles is not only being a strong 

>witness to the class by playing Jesus but is reading the Bible. im very 

>impressed. as for darwin, not a strong fight as far as im concerned. 

>another comment... 

>go see the passion of Jesus Christ. see what He has to offer you and what 

>He did just for you. 

>lastly... 

>please have common courtesy on here. dont disregard other people's 

>feelings or beliefs. dont attack, dont place blame, and dont be hurtful 

>just because you can. 

> 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Take off on a romantic weekend or a family adventure to these great U.S. 

locations. http://special.msn.com/local/hotdestinations.armx 

445






Thank you for sticking to what you know (or what you think you know). Someone else already wrote 

about religion, and the result is the Bible. Most people believe it is a very reliable source of religious 

info. 

Cynthia 

Charles Darwin wrote: 

"I am a strong advocate for free thought on all subjects, yet it appears to 

me (whether rightly or wrongly) that direct arguments against christianity & 

theism produce hardly any effect on the public; & freedom of thought is best 

promoted by the gradual illumination of men's minds, which follow[s] from 

the advance of science. It has, therefore, been always my object to avoid 

writing on religion, & I have confined myself to science." 

So, I think I will pass on the movie, but thanks for the invite. 

C. Darwyn 

>From: 


>To: 


>Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:27:23 -0800 

> 
















>alright. and whomever is playing these roles i s not only being a strong 






446

lastly... 




> 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



447






Cynthia, 

The Bible is only a reliable source if you believe in it. Otherwise it is a 

document of stories written by people. 

Ann says waz-up! we are doing are project! 




>Subject: RE: the nature of this listserve 


> 

>Thank you for sticking to what you know (or what you think you know). 

>Someone else already wrote about religion, and the result is the Bible. 

>Most people believe it is a very reliable source of religious info. 

>Cynthia 

> 

>Charles Darwin wrote: 

>"I am a strong advocate for free thought on all subjects, yet it appears to 

>me (whether rightly or wrongly) that direct arguments against christianity 

>& 

>theism produce hardly any effect on the public; & freedom of thought is 

>best 

>promoted by the gradual illumination of men's minds, which follow[s] from 

>the advance of science. It has, therefore, been always my object to avoid 

>writing on religion, & I have confined myself to science." 

> 

>So, I think I will pass on the movie, but thanks for the invite. 

>C. Darwyn 

> 

> 

> >From: 


> >To: 

> >Subject: the nature of this listserve 

> >Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:27:23 -0800 

> > 

> >so for my journal this week, i thought i would ocmment on the nature of 

> >this listserve. one thing ive been wanting to comment on is how free 

> >people feel to say everything and anything. i know that email is an easy 

> >way to say things you might otherwise not mention in person, but im 

>amazed 

> >at how far people have taken this notion. 

> >and this is why i have stopped reading journals. rather than allowing 

> >journals to get me all riled up, i have decided to ignore them. and its 

> >working out great for me. i never intended on disregarding what everyone 

> >writes, but in order to be relaxed i have to do this for myself. for the 

> >most part, this listserve robs me of my peace, so for my mind, body and 

> >soul, im refraining. 

> >another comment.... 

> >at first i was very upset with the Jesus Christ and darwin emails. but 

>now 

> >im recognizing that they arent neccessarily offensive. they most likely 

> >will come a point when i think they have crossed a line, so far its been 

> >alright. and whomever is playing these roles is not only being a strong 

> >witness to the class by playing Jesus but is reading the Bible. im very 

448

impressed. as for darwin, not a strong fight as far as im concerned. 

> >another comment... 

> >go see the passion of Jesus Christ. see what He has to offer you and what 

> >He did just for you. 

> >lastly... 

> >please have common courtesy on here. dont disregard other people's 

> >feelings or beliefs. dont attack, dont place blame, and dont be hurtful 

> >just because you can. 

> > 

> > 


> > 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Take off on a romantic weekend or a family adventure to these great U.S. 

>locations. http://special.msn.com/local/hotdestinations.armx 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Watch high-quality video with fast playback at MSN Video. Free! 


449






Karis, 

The passion is a great representation of the last days of Jesus Christ in 

Jerusalum. Many have argued that it is an anti-semetic movie. This shall be 

questioned! Thine group should know that Jesus was a jew and had a Jewish 

mother and had many Jewish fallowers. This movie depicts these notions 

perfectly, the Roman state and isolated members are responsible for the 

death of Jesus, not the all Jews. Jesus was crucified on a Roman cross. 

These traits must be recognized by thine group. 

Darwin, you should truly learn to believe in more than the observable. For 

thine heart is full of confusion and thy mouth is part of coruption. Faith 

in God is more than just a debate, it is the truth! 

"Build yourselves up in your most holy faith and pray in the Holy Spirit. 

Keep yourselves in God's love as you wait for the mercy of our Lord Jesus 

Christ." Jude 20-21 

>From: 


>To: 


>Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:27:23 -0800 

> 






















>lastly... 




> 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Say “good-bye” to spam, viruses and pop-ups with MSN Premium -- free trial 

450

offer! http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200359ave/direct/01/ 

451






Karis, 

The passion is a great representation of the last days of Jesus Christ in 

Jerusalum. Many have argued that it is an anti-semetic movie. This shall be 

questioned! Thine group should know that Jesus was a jew and had a Jewish 

mother and had many Jewish fallowers. This movie depicts these notions 

perfectly, the Roman state and isolated members are responsible for the 

death of Jesus, not the all Jews. Jesus was crucified on a Roman cross. 

These traits must be recognized by thine group. 

Darwin, you should truly learn to believe in more than the observable. For 

thine heart is full of confusion and thy mouth is part of coruption. Faith 

in God is more than just a debate, it is the truth! 

"Build yourselves up in your most holy faith and pray in the Holy Spirit. 

Keep yourselves in God's love as you wait for the mercy of our Lord Jesus 

Christ." Jude 20-21 

>From: 


>To: 


>Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:27:23 -0800 

> 






















>lastly... 




> 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee when you click here. 

452


453






I know that Robert. I was just sticking up for the believers, someone has to. It seems like their faith is 

getting picked on alot, so I am trying to show my support. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

The Bible is only a reliable source if you believe in it. Otherwise it is a 

document of stories written by people. 

Ann says waz-up! we are doing are project! 




>Subject: RE: the nature of this listserve 


> 

>Thank you for sticking to what you know (or what you think you know). 

>Someone else already wrote about religion, and the result is the Bible. 

>Most people believe it is a very reliable source of religious info. 

>Cynthia 

> 

>Charles Darwin wrote: 

>"I am a strong advocate for free thought on all subjects, yet it appears to 

>me (whether rightly or wrongly) that direct arguments against christianity 

>& 

>theism produce hardly any effect on the public; & freedom of thought is 

>best 

>promoted by the gradual illumination of men's minds, which follow[s] from 

>the advance of science. It has, therefore, been always my object to avoid 

>writing on religion, & I have confined myself to science." 

> 

>So, I think I will pass on the movie, but thanks for the invite. 

>C. Darwyn 

> 

> 

> >From: 


> >To: 

> >Subject: the nature of this listserve 

> >Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:27:23 -0800 

> > 

> >so for my journal this week, i thought i would ocmment on the nature of 

> >this listserve. one thing ive been wanting to comment on is how free 

454

people feel to say everything and anything. i know that email is an easy 

> >way to say things you might otherwise not mention in person, but im 

>amazed 

& gt; >at how far people have taken this notion. 

> >and this is why i have stopped reading journals. rather than allowing 

> >journals to get me all riled up, i have decided to ignore them. and its 

> >working out great for me. i never intended on disregarding what everyone 

> >writes, but in order to be relaxed i have to do this for myself. for the 

> >most part, this listserve robs me of my peace, so for my mind, body and 

> >soul, im refraining. 

> >another comment.... 

> >at first i was very upset with the Jesus Christ and darwin emails. but 

>now 

> >im recognizing that they arent neccessarily offensive. they most likely 

> >will come a point when i think they have crossed a line, so far its been 

> >alright. and whomever is playing these roles is not only being a strong 

> >witness to the class by playing Jesus but is reading the Bible. im very 

> >impressed. as for darwin, not a strong fight as far as im concerned. 

> >another comment... 

> >go see the passion of Jesus Christ. see what He has to offer you and what 

> >He did just for you. 

> >lastly... 

> >please have common courtesy on here. dont disregard other people's 

> >feelings or beliefs. dont attack, dont place blame, and dont be hurtful 

> >just because you can. 

> > 

> > 


> > 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



455





Subject: Re: J4 :I see dead people... 

Cecilia, 

Damn girl, you crack me up. I love it when you lay it all out there... 

See Ya tomorrow, 

Ann 

































456



Bye, Cecilia 

_____ 


Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. 

457





Subject: Re: J4 :I see dead people... 

I hate to say it, but Mike is really slacking these days. MIKE, if you read this, Cecelia has you way 

beat for the Golden Wit award!!!! Keep it coming, you make my day!! 

By the way, I wonder what would happen if the alien gangs abducted the illegal aliens? Would they 

form one big gang (or group of aliens that just happen to hang out and do experiments together in a 

nice martian neighborhood) and plan some way to get back at all us nonbelievers? 

Cynthia 


Cecilia, 

Damn girl, you crack me up. I love it when you lay it all out there... 

See Ya tomorrow, 

Ann 

























458

_____ 











Bye, Cecilia 



_____ 



459





Subject: Does anyone ever feel like this? 

Attachments: Human Allelopathy.JPG 

Human 

lelopathy.JPG (34 KB 

Does anyone ever feel like this? 

I do sometimes, but not right now.... 

NOTE TO SELF: 

homework first, list serve second!!!! 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gifAnn 

_____ 



460




To: LBST 361B 

Subject: aliens 

I didn't want to comment on aliens because I don't really believe that they 

exist. However, I think it would be selfish of me to think that we are the 

only ones in this vast universe. So maybe there are some other creatures, 

probably weird creatures, out there. 

judith 

461





Subject: RE: aliens 

I agree with you Judith. I think it would be rather obnoxious of us to 

believe that we are the only living inhabitants in the whole universe. 

I'm just not sure if I believe that aliens have visited Earth. And, I'm 

on even shakier ground when people start talking about abductions, so I 

guess I may agree with Sagan when he talks about "...scientists who have 

taken UFOs seriously have tended to keep alien abductions at face 

value..." (p103). ~ Louise 


From: marti171 [mailto:marti171@csusm.edu] 


To: LBST 361B 

Subject: aliens 

I didn't want to comment on aliens because I don't really believe that 

they 

exist. However, I think it would be selfish of me to think that we are 

the 

only ones in this vast universe. So maybe there are some other 

creatures, 

probably weird creatures, out there. 

judith 

462




To: journal 

Subject: any visual learners here? 

This first one is very cool. You can click on a cell part and see it at work (virtual job). There is a quiz 

at the end so you can see how much you know about cells. 

http://www.tvdsb.on.ca/westmin/science/sbi3a1/Cells/cells.htm 

http://gslc.genetics.utah.edu/units/basics/cell/ 

http://www.cbs.dtu.dk/staff/dave/roanoke/bio101ch05.htm 

_____ 



463





Subject: RE: any visual learners here? 

Hey Cynthia, 

I was doing my biology reading and took a break to read some journals. I clicked on the first website you provided and it 

proved to be really helpful. Thanks for helping out those of us that need a little extra boost when it comes to all this 

science stuff! :) ~ Louise 




To: journal 


This first one is very cool. You can click on a cell part and see it at work (virtual job). There is a 

quiz at the end so you can see how much you know about cells. 




_____ 



464






No problem! My biology bood still hasn't arrived in the mail, so I am having to find alternate ways of 

studying for the quiz tomorrow. http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/15.gif 

Cynthia 


Hey Cynthia, 

I was doing my biology reading and took a break to read some journals. I clicked on the first website you provided 

and it proved to be really helpful. Thanks for helping out those of us that need a little extra boost when it comes to all 

this science stuff! :) ~ Louise 

_____ 

_____ 




To: journal 


This first one is very cool. You can click on a cell part and see it at work (virtual job). There is 

a quiz at the end so you can see how much you know about cells. 








465





Subject: Re: any visual learners here? 

thanks cynthia. 

there is also a really good brain pop movie on cell structure. 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/17 Tue PM 09:56:07 PST 

> To: journal 

> Subject: any visual learners here? 

> 

> This first one is very cool. You can click on a cell part and see it at work (virtual 

job). There is a quiz at the end so you can see how much you know about cells. 

> 

> http://www.tvdsb.on.ca/westmin/science/sbi3a1/Cells/cells.htm 

> 

> http://gslc.genetics.utah.edu/units/basics/cell/ 

> 

> http://www.cbs.dtu.dk/staff/dave/roanoke/bio101ch05.htm 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 


> Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. 

> 


466






Thanks, Karis. That is a good little movie! I wonder if Prof. Lowe used that to write his lecture notes, 

lol. Same analogy. I sure hope he uses the same quiz. 

Cynthia 


thanks cynthia. 

there is also a really good brain pop movie on cell structure. 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/17 Tue PM 09:56:07 PST 

> To: journal 

> Subject: any visual learners here? 

> 

> This first one is very cool. You can click on a cell part and see it at work (virtual job). There is a 


> 

> http://www.tvdsb.on.ca/westmin/science/sbi3a1/Cells/cells.htm 

> 

> http://gslc.genetics.utah.edu/units/basics/cell/ 

> 

> http://www.cbs.dtu.dk/staff/dave/roanoke/bio101ch05.htm 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


_____ 



467






Cynthia, 

Those are cool. I think I will use them to get ready for the quiz tomorrow. 

Thanks, 

Ann http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gif 


This first one is very cool. You can click on a cell part and see it at work (virtual job). There is a 





_____ 



_____ 



468






I tried to read Sagan again and it talked about the same things as usual. 

Aliens, sexually abductions, UFOs, and hallucinations. But this time we had to 

read about demons and the witch trials in Europe. I think watching the moving 

"The Salem Witch Trials" on tv a week before actually reading this part in 

Sagan, really made me rethink visually what everything looked like and how 

things worked back then. Tons of innocent people got killed because they 

wouldn't give in to someone else's plea to say that the person was a satan 

worshiper or saw demons. The Sagan book told about too many incidents which 

really didn't make me feel good in myself. Especially when he started talking 

about demons and how they are connected with Christianity. That is so off the 

wall, that I'm not surprised Sagan would come up with such an unbelievable 

theory. 

The Flu book also seemed to be disturbing. I think that I could never 

volunteer to get sick in order to help society find a cure for a disease 

because of everything that you would have to go through. LEtting someone cough 

on you or taking in blood from someone else that may already have the flu is 

so outstanding. Finding out the flu worked really had been observed and tested 

by many, but it only seemed that a few really found out the uniqueness of it. 

Thank goodness that Hultin went into the area of studying diseases and not 

forestry, because I wonder where we would be today in our understanding of the 

flu epidemic. 

I noticed there was some talk abou the new movie by Mel Gibson coming out, 

"The Passion of Christ".I found out that Gibson wanted the movie to be so 

exact and real from the Bible, that he has the movie in the latin language 

with english subtitles, because back then Christ didn't speak english. I was 

kinf of surprised to see the movie rated R, because I thought as Christians we 

are suppose to be teaching society to watch what values and morals, if any, 

you are getting from movies. Usually movies with a rating R is usually means 

very violent, shows explicit sexually scenes, or whatever. I found out that 

the movie actually shows Christ's crucifixion very explicitly that its very 

violent. 

I think I'm going to check out more about the movie before seeing it. 


469


From: Beaver Cleaver [bustapooh2002@yahoo.com] 



Subject: hey hey 

Hey hey 

_____ 



470






Thanks cynthia! it should help me out a lot. 



>To: journal 

>Subject: any visual learners here? 


> 

>This first one is very cool. You can click on a cell part and see it at 

>work (virtual job). There is a quiz at the end so you can see how much you 

>know about cells. 

> 

>http://www.tvdsb.on.ca/westmin/science/sbi3a1/Cells/cells.htm 

> 

>http://gslc.genetics.utah.edu/units/basics/cell/ 

> 

>http://www.cbs.dtu.dk/staff/dave/roanoke/bio101ch05.htm 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



471


From: Karla Garduno [gardu001@msn.com] 



Subject: those trippin moments 

Attachments: Emoticon3.gif 

As I was having a second look at chapter six of the Sagan book I came across the paragraph on sleep 

paralysis. I realized that I go through the sensations and feelings that he describes; I tend to go through 

them late at night or when I am home alone. The only problem with me is that it does not happened when 

I am sleeping I am fully awake when I start to experience immobility and anxiousness thinking someone 

is in the living room. Sagan goes on to mention that you feel this awful weight in the chest as if “someone 

is sitting or lying there” for me I don’t necessarily think someone is immediately next to me but I do have 

“visual hallucinations” of someone suddenly appearing at the doorway. When ever I hear a random noise 

I just stop what I am doing and wait for the person whom I think is in the house to appear and to do 

something horrible to me…I even start thinking of what I would do if it was to happen, for example: yell 

“fire” so that others will hear me and come help, keep the phone next to me so that I can call the police, 

or keep waking my boyfriend up to let him know that I think someone is out there in the living room, by 

the way he tells me that I am trippin and goes back to sleep. 

I tend do homework late at night because that is the only time that I am able to concentrate, but 

once sleeping paralysis (or should I say awake paralysis) kicks in I go straight to bed …once I start to 

think that I am hearing noises because someone is trying to break in or is already in the house I just put 

myself to sleep, because I cannot concentrate having the feeling that someone is out there. When I go to 

bed I try to sleep away from the door because I am going to bed thinking that the person is still out there 

and he/she is soon going to come in the room and attack. I let my boyfriend sleep on that side of the bed. 

Emoticon3.gif (315 

B) 

karla 

472




To: journal 

Subject: preview of next week's classroom topic (Yamashita) 

Ok, "data instrument theory" is kind of hard to research. But, if what I found has anything to 

do with class next week, it should be interesting (and complicated). Someone in our class said 

we might be the subjects of an experiment. I can't remember who said this, but you might be 

on to something. Of course, I am sure it also has something to do with organizing the stuff we 

write in the journals and deciding if its valid or not, or reliable. I am still not sure how this all 

fits together, and how we are supposed to measure people's opinions, but then, that probably 

isn't it at all. Please feel free to read on and become confused along with me, lol. Cynthia (or 

take the easy road, and just delete this post) 

Measurement Theory 

• A questionnaire is a data collection instrument 

• This implies that what is measures must be standardised: the same questions asked of every 

respondent, in the same way, in order that the data recorded means the same thing - 

standardisation is what allows the use of computers (and statistics) to analyse it 

• This is related to Reliability: the instrument will get the same results in the same circumstances 

• Validity is also important: an instrument (e.g., a set of questions) is valid insofar as it measures 

what it is intended to measure 

• An instrument can be valid without being reliable, and vice versa 

• For instance, a set of questions designed to assess right-wing attitudes may be reliable (provide 

consistent results) but not valid (if scoring high is not very strongly associated with being rightwing, 

etc. ) 

• Reliability is very important for comparison: without it we cannot compare cases or attribute 

differences between cases to their other characteristics - reliability is essential for analysis 

• Without validity, there is no point to analysis - you're not studying what you think you're studying 

1. Introduction 

Measurement may be defined as the process of determining the value or level, either qualitative or 

quantitative, of a particular attribute for a particular unit of analysis. In organizational research, the 

unit of analysis may be the individual, the group, or the organization itself. The measurement process 

is an integral part of organizational research. Brilliant theories and research studies may be perfectly 

constructed in every other detail, yet organizational research will be a failure unless we can 

adequately measure our concepts (Bailey, 1987). Measurement generally entails the assignment of 

473

numbers to concepts or variables. 'Net sales' and 'stock price' are examples of organizational 

measurements that most of us are familiar with. Such attributes that are measured in numerical terms 

are called quantitative attributes or variables. Other organizational concepts, particularly attitudes, 

may be much more difficult to measure. For instance, a concept such as 'authoritar ianism' may not 

be directly observable, although its effects may be, and may involve more than one dimensions. Such 

concepts are theoretically important for organizational research but may pose significant 

measurement problems. http://www.brint.com/papers/compint.htm 

Not sure if this next one has anything to do with the data thing, but it sort of reminded me of what 

Prof. Yamashita was talking about in class. Take it for what its worth. 

Information processing research deals explicitly with memory and the retention of material. 

Many of the so-called "transfer of knowledge" or "...across the curriculum" studies can be 

placed in this area. College students tend to experiment with different strategies for making 

connections between their courses. A first type, called "holists", adopt a global framework. 

They look at their classes from the top-down, and then make connections at abstract levels, 

occasionally absorbing a detail or two from a particular class to help them make the abstract 

connections. A second type, called "serialists", develop their understanding from the bottomup, 

slowly, logically, methodically. With serialists, theoretical and practical strands of 

knowledge are learned separately, with these students quite able to distinguish what they got 

out of a course in terms of "theory" and "practice". Serialists are also called "parallel 

learners" and holists are called "versatile learn ers" (Ford 1985). The implications of this 

research relate to test-taking strategies. Serialists perform well on reiterative exams, such as 

those with True-False or Multiple-Choice formats. Holists need essay formats in order to work 

out the semantic features they have incorporated into their global understanding. 

http://faculty.ncwc.edu/toconnor/reportls.htm 

_____ 



474





Subject: a child's imagination 

I also came across another section that really intrigued me the sectioned that I am talking about is in 

chapter six of the Sagan book and talks about children's imagination and the different reactions that 

parents have towards the child's fantasies (top of p.108). My child is not old enough to tell me his 

fabulous stories about what he dreamt, but I sure can wait for that moment. He does make believe in 

a lot of other different way though...right now we are having issues when it comes to eating, so when I 

am feeding him we imagine that the spoon is an airplane or what ever he chooses it to be. Whenever 

he doesn't want to eat I pick up the spoon and tell him "ok lets pretend this is a truck...he then goes 

no no no, and tells me to pretend it is another thing such as a fishy." It is amazing how this really gets 

his interest going and he soon forgets that he did not want to eat a little while ago. I think it is 

fascinating how children make up stories, character, scenes, etc., but its also unfortunate that some 

parents prefer not to confabulate about their children's fantasies. 

475





Subject: Re: those trippin moments 



paralysis. I realized that I go through the sensations and feelings that he describes; I tend to go through 

them late at night or when I am home alone. The only problem with me is that it does not happened when 

I am sleeping I am fully awake when I start to experience immobility and anxiousness thinking someone 

is in the living room. Sagan goes on to mention that you feel this awful weight in the chest as if “someone 

is sitting or lying there” for me I don’t necessarily think someone is immediately next to me but I do have 

“visual hallucinations” of someone suddenly appearing at the doorway. When ever I hear a random noise 

I just stop what I am doing and wait for the person whom I think is in the house to appear and to do 

something horrible to me…I even start thinking of what I would do if it was to happen, for example: yell 

“fire” so that others will hear me and come help, keep the phone next to me so that I can call the police, 

or keep waking my boyfriend up to let him know that I think someone is out there in the living room, by 

the way he tells me that I am trippin and goes back to sleep. 

I tend do homework late at night because that is the only time that I am able to concentrate, but 

once sleeping paralysis (or should I say awake paralysis) kicks in I go straight to bed …once I start to 

think that I am hearing noises because someone is trying to break in or is already in the house I just put 

myself to sleep, because I cannot concentrate having the feeling that someone is out there. When I go to 

bed I try to sleep away from the door because I am going to bed thinking that the person is still out there 

and he/she is soon going to come in the room and attack. I let my boyfriend sleep on that side of the bed. 


B) 

karla 

476





Subject: kumbaya 

Hello again cohort f, 

I would once again like to discuss evolution, but from a different angle. 

About 100 years ago, most scientists were creationists. Many of them were 

trying to firgure out how God did things. What they came up with was the 

"old earth" and "species originating by evolution" theories. You know, we 

the evolutionists are not heathens, just mortals trying to make sense of the 

world. Now, in regards to species evolving, when life reproduces itself, 

there are mutations that take place. You might compare this to the flu virus 

you have been reading about. Why does it mutate? To survive. Those that 

mutate in a beneficial way will succeed and pass on their genes to another 

generation. Since nothing ever stays the same, everything has to change to 

survive. These mutated forms eventually diverge, becoming genetically 

different over time. If enough time passes, these two populations become so 

different they lose the ability to reproduce together. Perhaps, this is how 

the flu virus eventually passes from birds to humans or other animals. 

Now compare this to what all of you post in the journal. Remember, things 

can't stay the same, or they will die off. This might also be applied to 

beliefs or opinions. The evolution of a society, how and what it thinks and 

believes. This may scare many of you; what might happen if your beliefs 

didin't evolve, would they die off? Perhaps. But what if the new beliefs are 

wrong, will they survive, or just mutate into something new again? 

Evolution makes predictions about what we expect to happen next. Keep in 

mind that catagories (like opinions) are man-made and artificial. Nature 

will not necessarily follow them. But maybe some new mutated catagories 

could be developed that would allow evolutionists and creationists to join 

together once again in the search for the truth. 

Sincerely, 


_________________________________________________________________ 



477





Subject: Re: kumbaya 

Gee, Darwin, I think you might be out on a scientific limb somewhere. Let me see if I have this right. 

Living things mutate, beliefs mutate, and opinions mutate. So, in the case of gay marriage being right 

or wrong (man-made catagories), our beliefs could mutate to believe it is either acceptable or not. For 

example: The marriage gene (XY) mutates so that now (XY), (XX), and (YY) are randomly possible. 

Since you believe in the survival of the fittest, eventually, those that are not beneficial will die out, but 

the ones that adapt to the changing environment (maybe our mad-made catagories) will survive. This 

is starting to sound like Gattaca, the futuristic movie. Although I don't recall any gay characters, it 

would be possible because they use genetic selection to reproduce instead of sex. The most 

important thing is that they select the most perfect genes to reproduce offspring. Ok, maybe it doesn't 

sound like that movie at all, but it is still a good movie. I think the point is, viewpoint mutate, and what 

was once viewed as important, no longer is. Something new is created. Cynthia 


Hello again cohort f, 

I would once again like to discuss evolution, but from a different angle. 

About 100 years ago, most scientists were creationists. Many of them were 

trying to firgure out how God did things. What they came up with was the 

"old earth" and "species originating by evolution" theories. You know, we 

the evolutionists are not heathens, just mortals trying to make sense of the 

world. Now, in regards to species evolving, when life reproduces itself, 

there are mutations that take place. You might compare this to the flu virus 

you have been reading about. Why does it mutate? To survive. Those that 

mutate in a beneficial way will succeed and pass on their genes to another 

generation. Since nothing ever stays the same, everything has to change to 

survive. These mutated forms eventually diverge, becoming genetically 

di fferent over time. If enough time passes, these two populations become so 

different they lose the ability to reproduce together. Perhaps, this is how 

the flu virus eventually passes from birds to humans or other animals. 

Now compare this to what all of you post in the journal. Remember, things 

can't stay the same, or they will die off. This might also be applied to 

beliefs or opinions. The evolution of a society, how and what it thinks and 

believes. This may scare many of you; what might happen if your beliefs 

didin't evolve, would they die off? Perhaps. But what if the new beliefs are 

wrong, will they survive, or just mutate into something new again? 

Evolution makes predictions about what we expect to happen next. Keep in 

mind that catagories (like opinions) are man-made and artificial. Nature 

will not necessarily follow them. But maybe some new mutated catagories 

could be developed that would allow evolutionists and creationists to jo in 

together once again in the search for the truth. 

Sincerely, 


_________________________________________________________________ 

478



_____ 



479






Hmmm, Karla. I think Sagan might want to put you in his book. Cynthia 



paralysis. I realized that I go through the sensations and feelings that he describes; I tend to go 

through them late at night or when I am home alone. The only problem with me is that it does not 

happened when I am sleeping I am fully awake when I start to experience immobility and anxiousness 

thinking someone is in the living room. Sagan goes on to mention that you feel this awful weight in the 

chest as if “someone is sitting or lying there” for me I don’t necessarily think someone is immediately 

next to me but I do have “visual hallucinations” of someone suddenly appearing at the doorway. 

When ever I hear a random noise I just stop what I am doing and wait for the person whom I think is 

in the house to appear and to do something horrible to me…I even start thinking of what I would do 

if it was to happen, for example: yell “fire” so that others will hear me and come help, keep the phone 

next to me so that I can call the police, or keep waking my boyfriend up to let him know that I think 

someone is out there in the living room, by the way he tells me that I am trippin and goes back to 

sleep. 

I tend do homework late at night because that is the only time that I am able to concentrate, 

but once sleeping paralysis (or should I say awake paralysis) kicks in I go straight to bed …once I 

start to think that I am hearing noises because someone is trying to break in or is already in the house 

I just put myself to sleep, because I cannot concentrate having the feeling that someone is out there. 

When I go to bed I try to sleep away from the door because I am going to bed thinking that the person 

is still out there and he/she is soon going to come in the room and attack. I let my boyfriend sleep on 

that side of the bed. 

Winking smiley emoticonkarla 

_____ 



480






I think the real issue is to know when you need to change some of your beliefs because they have 

died off. One hates to admit that something that they truly believe in turns out to be wrong. 

481






And I wonder who gets to decide who is wrong or right? cynthia 


I think the real issue is to know when you need to change some of your beliefs because they have 

died off. One hates to admit that something that they truly believe in turns out to be wrong. 

_____ 



482






you know for yourself, but whether or not you will admit it................... 

483






Hey Karla, 

Wow! I am glad to hear someone else bring this up. I can be a big scaredy cat, but not exactly the 

same as you. I once, a few years ago, (well damn, maybe actually like ten years ago, time flys...) I 

was living in my apartment and I was laying in my bed about 30-45 mins after attempting to go to 

sleep. I woke up in like a state of panic because I had feeling that there was a weight on my chest 

and shoulders (like I was being pinned down by some unseen evil presence). Boy howdy, that 

scared the ($$#&*^%(%^&(%) out of me, well not literally, but you know what I am talking about. 

When the situation subsided, I high tailed it out of my bedroom and ran into the other room where my 

room mate was sleeping. I told him about it and he believed me, and we both thought that maybe the 

best thing for me to do was to go back in my bedroom and suck it up. Face whatever it was in a 

sense because if it was evil, I am kinda defenseless anyway. So, for my own sanity I would have to 

deal with whatever the consequences might bring. So I went back in my room and went to bed. It 

has not happened again. I always thought it was something big, bad, and scary. 

This semester, I was actually relieved to hear Sagan describe this type of thing as a brain chemistry 

thing happening. And I was actually starting to think how empowering these scientific answer were. 

But, at the same time, a tiny part of me wonders if I will ever be confronted with a situation where I will 

see a ghost or something. I am torn. I thought I was becoming a little more brave, that the world was 

making a little more sense... UNTIL, CELILIA TALKED ABOUT SEEING GHOSTS AND STUFF..... 

DAMN.... NOW, I AM WONDERING ALL OVER AGAIN!!!!! 

But, I must say, I think (so I say now in the safety of the CSUSM library with tons of people around 

me) I would confront something and try and figure out what it wanted with me, and if it was a bad 

thing, I would "OPEN UP A CAN OF WHOOP ASS" and give it "HELL" if it tried to mess with me!!! 

Talk to ya later, 




paralysis. I realized that I go through the sensations and feelings that he describes; I tend to go 

through them late at night or when I am home alone. The only problem with me is that it does not 

happened when I am sleeping I am fully awake when I start to experience immobility and anxiousness 

thinking someone is in the living room. Sagan goes on to mention that you feel this awful weight in the 

chest as if “someone is sitting or lying there” for me I don’t necessarily think someone is immediately 

next to me but I do have “visual hallucinations” of someone suddenly appearing at the doorway. 

When ever I hear a random noise I just stop what I am doing and wait for the person whom I think is 

in the house to appear and to do something horrible to me…I even start thinking of what I would do 

if it was to happen, for example: yell “fire” so that others will hear me and come help, keep the phone 

next to me so that I can call the police, or keep waking my boyfriend up to let him know that I think 

484

someone is out there in the living room, by the way he tells me that I am trippin and goes back to 

sleep. 

I tend do homework late at night because that is the only time that I am able to concentrate, 

but once sleeping paralysis (or should I say awake paralysis) kicks in I go straight to bed …once I 

start to think that I am hearing noises because someone is trying to break in or is already in the house 

I just put myself to sleep, because I cannot concentrate having the feeling that someone is out there. 

When I go to bed I try to sleep away from the door because I am going to bed thinking that the person 

is still out there and he/she is soon going to come in the room and attack. I let my boyfriend sleep on 

that side of the bed. 

Winking smiley emoticonkarla 

_____ 



485





Subject: Change 

I love watching my thoughts evolve. it cracks me up the way I believe and 

understand 

one thing then discover something different the next day. It keeps life 

exciting but it 

makes me wonder if I will ever know if something is for sure. Do I even need 

to know if 

things are for sure? life suddenly feels very airy and free for thoughts to 

flow through and 

change as they like. I guess we just need to catch a thought observe it, 

question it, 

predict, hypothsis, test, then evaluate it. Then we either let it be or else 

go throught the 

scientific method again and take to an unexplored level. 

Remeber the only thing you can count on is change. 

Cynthia, a while ago you were writing about alien gangs being abducted by 

illegal aliens 

then forming one big gang. I was wondering why you put illegal aliens with 

alien gangs. 

Aliens are not illegal and we do not know if they are human like. And illegal 

aliens are 

human beings, yes here illegally but they are humans with feelings and I 

question if it is 

okay to put them in the same group as aliens. I may be way off, just seeking 

clarity on 

the comment. Marin 

486





Subject: Get scared 

I get so scared at night cause I live in a dark cold garage it's a cute little 

place but the 

ocean air brings in creepy sounds. I have to walk through a thick garden full 

of cats and 

noises then once I get to the room i have to run across the whole room to turn 

on the 

light. I always picture someone on the bed ready to grab me or hurt me. But 

then I go 

through my Kung fu moves in my mind and I feel relieved because I see it as a 

time to 

finally put my kung fu skills to the test. Why are these feeling and images of 

unwelcome 

people so real. It is all in my head, huh. Fear of the dark, a place for 

others to hide and a 

time when no one is awake. It is amazing that our minds can intensify heart 

beating 

patterns and even shape an image. The mind is a powerful thing...Marin 

487





Subject: Re: Get scared- Casey Cunningham 

OK- I thought I was definately the biggest scardy cat on earth but now I know I am not alone. I am 

always scared. I have absolutely no reason to be scared and I am scared. I can not tell the number of 

times I have called by brother or boyfriend to tell them that some one is in my house. And I really 

thought someone was in my house. And I would not be able to sleep until I knew for sure that no one 

was in my house. After a while they started to get anoyed with me because there has never been 

anyone in my house. I wonder why am I scared. Nothing has ever happened to me where I should be 

scared. I am so bad that when I just moved up here to San marcos...the very first thing I did before I 

got cable or anything was get an alarm installed. Since I have lived here I have been pretty good but I 

still imagine people- bad people crawling underneath the alarm beams and getting to my room. I do 

live alone! I grew up in a house where we didn't even lock our doors before we went to bed. It is only 

when I am alone. I know- I could be crazy..is it society that makes me scared or am I just a freak? 

And all you people who respond to this be nice...I am sensitive :) CAsey 

488





Subject: Re: Change 

Easy, Marin! Cecilia was commenting on aliens and her cousin. I just put them together, and it wasn't 

a serious comment. But, if you think about it, we do classify certain aliens as being illegal, and if 

aliens from another planet came here, unless they got green cards or visas ahead of time, they would 

also be considered illegal. Regardless if it is right or wrong, that is the way our society catagorizes 

them. 

cynthia 



understand 




to know if 




question it, 








alien gang s. 


aliens are 




clarity on 


_____ 



489




To: journal 

Subject: Give me an infusion of the fake stuff!!!! 

Anybody see a problem with this? 

Artificial Blood Tested Without Consent 

AP 

47 minutes ago 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/my/my16.gif Add Top Stories - AP to My Yahoo! 

By LINDSEY TANNER, AP Medical Writer 

CHICAGO - Paramedics are testing an experimental blood substitute on severely injured patients 

without their consent in an unusual study under way or proposed at 20 hospitals around the country. 

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/040219/480/cx10102191853 

AP Photo 

• Polyheme (Northfield Labs) 

In Yahoo! Health 

Chronic Heartburn Chronic Heartburn 

Need Relief? 

_____ 

More from Yahoo! Health: 

• Check Your Symptoms 

• How Is It Diagnosed? 

• Available Treatments 

Related Links 

The study was launched last month in Denver and follows similar research that was halted in 1998, when more than 20 

patients died after getting a different experimental blood substitute. 

Supporters say the current product, PolyHeme, made by Northfield Laboratories of Evanston, Ill., is safer and could save 

many of the nearly 100,000 people who die of bleeding injuries each year nationwide. 

"It could revolutionize how we take care of resuscitation in the United States and across the world," said lead investigator 

Dr. Ernest Moore, chief of trauma surgery at Denver Health Medical Center. 

The research is part of a race to find what doctors call the holy grail of emergency medicine: a product that works like 

human blood to save victims of car crashes, shootings or other trauma but could be carried in ambulances and given to 

people of any blood type. 

Patients will be randomly selected to receive PolyHeme intravenously or standard saline solution at the scene or en route 

to the hospital. 

490

Because severely bleeding trauma patients often are unconscious or in shock, they are unable to give the consent 

required for experimental treatment. As a result, the researchers in this case are being allowed to bypass the consent 

rules under a 1996 federal exemption that applies to emergency, potentially lifesaving research. 

The exemption requires the research to be publicized beforehand in communities where the study will be conducted, both 

to let people opt out if they are ever injured and to give the community a chance to express any objections. In effect, the 

community briefings are used to obtain consent. 

The Food and Drug Administration (news - web sites) has approved about 15 such no-consent studies since the 

exemption was added. 

University of Pennsylvania bioethicist Dr. Jason Karlawish said there is nothing unethical about the concept. 

Some patients' rights advocates disagreed, especially considering the deaths in the earlier study of emergency room 

patients given a Baxter Healthcare blood substitute. 

The study "is another one along that slippery slope that's essentially demolishing your individual right not to become 

experimental subjects unless we give prior, voluntary, informed, comprehending consent," said Vera Sharav, president of 

the New York-based Alliance for Human Research Protection, a group concerned with the safety of the millions of 

Americans who participate in medical research each year. 

_____ 



491





Subject: RE: Change 

I also wondered why the INS used the word "aliens" to describe people who are not citizens. When I arrived in the U.S., I 

was told I was a "Resident Alien" which didn't exactly make me feel very welcome to the good 'ole U S of A! I did check 

though, and I don't have any antennae coming out of my head, so I consider myself a "Resident of the U.S.A." ~ Louise 






Easy, Marin! Cecilia was commenting on aliens and her cousin. I just put them together, and it 

wasn't a serious comment. But, if you think about it, we do classify certain aliens as being illegal, 

and if aliens from another planet came here, unless they got green cards or visas ahead of time, 

they would also be considered illegal. Regardless if it is right or wrong, that is the way our society 

catagorizes them. 

cynthia 



understand 




to know if 




question it, 








alien gang s. 


aliens are 




clarity on 

492

_____ 




493





Subject: Unidentified subject! 

Darwin and I have talked at length about the possible ways in which to take 

this evolution vs. creationism discussion, this was the original reason for 

the creation of such characters. For some time it has troubled me to see 

that both sides of the debate are somewhat un-educated to the beginning 

principles of each subject. 

We have decided to proceed with the understanding that you all know the 

basic argument, from both sides of the coin. Now my friends let us look at 

the markings upon the coin around the coin and the matter that holds them 

together. For there must be some common ground if thy coin is but one. 

We challenge you all to come up with a way in which common ground can be 

created to help these to theories. We challenge you to get uncomfortable for 

just a moment. Because if your belief structure is truly steadfast, there is 

no reason in the world not to challenge it. 

It has been and will be our every intention to spur critical debate and for 

that we apologize if anyone is or has been offended. Please try to take are 

challenge to heart and express to others what you have learned. 

And yes Yamashita is not the holder of all knowledge, he may in fact be 

wrong about this class and the individuals within. 

“False facts are highly injurious to the progress of science, for they often 

endure long; but false views, if supported by some evidence, do little harm, 

for everyone takes a salutary pleasure in proving their falseness; and when 

this is done, one path towards error is closed and the road to truth is 

often at the same time opened.” Charles Darwin 

JeSus and DarWin 

_________________________________________________________________ 



494






Wow, this topic has created a lot of discussion about personal experiences. 

(Good topic, Karla!) 

I have often felt the same, in a similar way as Karla's experience, but not 

quite as extreme. I actually think/feel that I will bump into someone or 

something that I can't see. That scares me! Yes, it often happens at night, 

with the lights of, and I'm alone. But it seems so real. Hallucination? 

Don't know...but it's hard to think it is a hallucination when I'm there 

feeling so scared. It's so real! So scared that my heart is pounding out of 

my chest, my palms get sweaty, I start having shortness of breath... I guess 

I just work myself up so much; I get that scared. 

I think that if I bury myself under the covers of my bed, I will be out of 

harms way. Like I am hiding from the someone or something that is scaring 

me. As long as I continue to think that I'm hiding, I'm okay, because then 

it can't find me. I feel safe. 

Karla, Karis, Ann, you might want to try it. 

~Jennifer R. 




>Subject: Re: those trippin moments 


> 

>Hey Karla, 

> 

>Wow! I am glad to hear someone else bring this up. I can be a big scaredy 

>cat, but not exactly the same as you. I once, a few years ago, (well damn, 

>maybe actually like ten years ago, time flys...) I was living in my 

>apartment and I was laying in my bed about 30-45 mins after attempting to 

>go to sleep. I woke up in like a state of panic because I had feeling that 

>there was a weight on my chest and shoulders (like I was being pinned down 

>by some unseen evil presence). Boy howdy, that scared the ($$#&*^%(%^&(%) 

>out of me, well not literally, but you know what I am talking about. 

> 

>When the situation subsided, I high tailed it out of my bedroom and ran 

>into the other room where my room mate was sleeping. I told him about it 

>and he believed me, and we both thought that maybe the best thing for me to 

>do was to go back in my bedroom and suck it up. Face whatever it was in a 

>sense because if it was evil, I am kinda defenseless anyway. So, for my 

>own sanity I would have to deal with whatever the consequences might bring. 

> So I went back in my room and went to bed. It has not happened again. I 

>always thought it was something big, bad, and scary. 

> 

>This semester, I was actually relieved to hear Sagan describe this type of 

>thing as a brain chemistry thing happening. And I was actually starting to 

>think how empowering these scientific answer were. 

> 

>But, at the same time, a tiny part of me wonders if I will ever be 

>confronted with a situation where I will see a ghost or something. I am 

>torn. I thought I was becoming a little more brave, that the world was 

>making a little more sense... UNTIL, CELILIA TALKED ABOUT SEEING GHOSTS 

495

AND STUFF..... DAMN.... NOW, I AM WONDERING ALL OVER AGAIN!!!!! 

> 

>But, I must say, I think (so I say now in the safety of the CSUSM library 

>with tons of people around me) I would confront something and try and 

>figure out what it wanted with me, and if it was a bad thing, I would "OPEN 

>UP A CAN OF WHOOP ASS" and give it "HELL" if it tried to mess with me!!! 

> 

>Talk to ya later, 

> 

>Ann 

> 

>Karla Garduno wrote: 

> 

>As I was having a second look at chapter six of the Sagan book I came 

>across the paragraph on sleep paralysis. I realized that I go through the 

>sensations and feelings that he describes; I tend to go through them late 

>at night or when I am home alone. The only problem with me is that it does 

>not happened when I am sleeping I am fully awake when I start to experience 

>immobility and anxiousness thinking someone is in the living room. Sagan 

>goes on to mention that you feel this awful weight in the chest as if 

>“someone is sitting or lying there” for me I don’t necessarily think 

>someone is immediately next to me but I do have “visual hallucinations” of 

>someone suddenly appearing at the doorway. When ever I hear a random noise 

>I just stop what I am doing and wait for the person whom I think is in the 

>house to appear and to do something horrible to me…I even start thinking of 

>what I would do if it was to happen, for example: yell “fire” so that 

>others will hear me and come help, kee 

> p the 

> phone next to me so that I can call the police, or keep waking my 

>boyfriend up to let him know that I think someone is out there in the 

>living room, by the way he tells me that I am trippin and goes back to 

>sleep. 

> 

> I tend do homework late at night because that is the only 

>time that I am able to concentrate, but once sleeping paralysis (or should 

>I say awake paralysis) kicks in I go straight to bed …once I start to think 

>that I am hearing noises because someone is trying to break in or is 

>already in the house I just put myself to sleep, because I cannot 

>concentrate having the feeling that someone is out there. When I go to bed 

>I try to sleep away from the door because I am going to bed thinking that 

>the person is still out there and he/she is soon going to come in the room 

>and attack. I let my boyfriend sleep on that side of the bed. 

> 

>karla 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Find and compare great deals on Broadband access at the MSN High-Speed 


496





Subject: RE: Unidentified subject! 

Jezus and Darwyn wood bolth half moore credibility if thay new how to spel 

chek. 

>From: "Jesus Christ" 



>Subject: Unidentified subject! 

>Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:47:53 +0000 

> 

>Darwin and I have talked at length about the possible ways in which to take 

>this evolution vs. creationism discussion, this was the original reason for 

>the creation of such characters. For some time it has troubled me to see 

>that both sides of the debate are somewhat un-educated to the beginning 

>principles of each subject. 

>We have decided to proceed with the understanding that you all know the 

>basic argument, from both sides of the coin. Now my friends let us look at 

>the markings upon the coin around the coin and the matter that holds them 

>together. For there must be some common ground if thy coin is but one. 

>We challenge you all to come up with a way in which common ground can be 

>created to help these to theories. We challenge you to get uncomfortable 

>for just a moment. Because if your belief structure is truly steadfast, 

>there is no reason in the world not to challenge it. 

>It has been and will be our every intention to spur critical debate and for 

>that we apologize if anyone is or has been offended. Please try to take are 

>challenge to heart and express to others what you have learned. 

>And yes Yamashita is not the holder of all knowledge, he may in fact be 

>wrong about this class and the individuals within. 

>“False facts are highly injurious to the progress of science, for they 

>often endure long; but false views, if supported by some evidence, do 

>little harm, for everyone takes a salutary pleasure in proving their 

>falseness; and when this is done, one path towards error is closed and the 

>road to truth is often at the same time opened.” Charles Darwin 

> 

>JeSus and DarWin 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Say “good-bye” to spam, viruses and pop-ups with MSN Premium -- free trial 

>offer! http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200359ave/direct/01/ 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



497





Subject: Louise is an alien, sorry honey, but it's true. 

a·li·en 

adj. 

Owing political allegiance to another country or government; foreign: alien 

residents. 

Belonging to, characteristic of, or constituting another and very different 

place, society, or person; strange. See Synonyms at foreign. 

Dissimilar, inconsistent, or opposed, as in nature: emotions alien to her 

temperament. 

n. 

An unnaturalized foreign resident of a country. Also called noncitizen. 

A person from another and very different family, people, or place. 

A person who is not included in a group; an outsider. 

A creature from outer space: science fiction about an invasion of aliens. 

Ecology. An organism, especially a plant or animal, that occurs in or is 

naturalized in a region to which it is not native. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



498





Subject: Re: RE: Unidentified subject! 

mike i was soo gonna say that. 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/19 Thu PM 06:27:11 PST 


> Subject: RE: Unidentified subject! 

> 

> 

> Jezus and Darwyn wood bolth half moore credibility if thay new how to spel 

> chek. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >From: "Jesus Christ" 



> >Subject: Unidentified subject! 

> >Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:47:53 +0000 

> > 

> >Darwin and I have talked at length about the possible ways in which to take 

> >this evolution vs. creationism discussion, this was the original reason for 

> >the creation of such characters. For some time it has troubled me to see 

> >that both sides of the debate are somewhat un-educated to the beginning 

> >principles of each subject. 

> >We have decided to proceed with the understanding that you all know the 

> >basic argument, from both sides of the coin. Now my friends let us look at 

> >the markings upon the coin around the coin and the matter that holds them 

> >together. For there must be some common ground if thy coin is but one. 

> >We challenge you all to come up with a way in which common ground can be 

> >created to help these to theories. We challenge you to get uncomfortable 

> >for just a moment. Because if your belief structure is truly steadfast, 

> >there is no reason in the world not to challenge it. 

> >It has been and will be our every intention to spur critical debate and for 

> >that we apologize if anyone is or has been offended. Please try to take are 

> >challenge to heart and express to others what you have learned. 

> >And yes Yamashita is not the holder of all knowledge, he may in fact be 

> >wrong about this class and the individuals within. 

> >“False facts are highly injurious to the progress of science, for they 

> >often endure long; but false views, if supported by some evidence, do 

> >little harm, for everyone takes a salutary pleasure in proving their 

> >falseness; and when this is done, one path towards error is closed and the 

> >road to truth is often at the same time opened.” Charles Darwin 

> > 

> >JeSus and DarWin 

> > 

> >_________________________________________________________________ 

> >Say “good-bye” to spam, viruses and pop-ups with MSN Premium -- free trial 

> >offer! http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200359ave/direct/01/ 

> > 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> Stay informed on Election 2004 and the race to Super Tuesday. 

> http://special.msn.com/msn/election2004.armx 

> 

> 

499


500





Subject: Illusions 

Attachments: image001.jpg; image002.jpg; image003.gif; image004.gif; image005.gif; image006.jpg; 

image007.jpg; image008.jpg; image009.jpg; image010.jpg; image011.jpg 

Something a little different from our journals. Enjoy! 

DO YOU SEE ONE MAN...OR TWO PERSONS? 


KB) 

***************************************************************************************** 


KB) 

******************************************************************************************* 

A face.....or the the word 'liar' ? 

image003.gif (1 KB) 

*********************************************************** 

What do you see in the following? 

Do you see the word "LIFT" or a bunch of black splotches? 

Girls usually are able to spot the word "lift" easily but men normally find it more difficult. 


********************************************************** 


501

Ask yourself which center circle looks bigger, the one on the left, or the one on the right? 

No, Wait! Look again. They are the same size! 

********************************************************** 


KB) 

How many horses in this picture? 

The answer is 7. 

********************************************************************************************* 


KB) 

Look the middle column.......where does it end? 

************************************************************************* 


KB) 

Is this woman old? When you first look at this image, most see a very old woman. Some people see a 

young woman instead of the old one. Do you see them both? 

********************************************************************* 


KB) 

This is a so called "impossible object". This means that it's impossible to build it! But drawing it is not 

impossible as you see in the image. 

******************************************************************************************* 


KB) 

****************************************************************************************************************************************** 

********* 

502


KB) 

_____ 

503





Subject: RE: Louise is an alien, sorry honey, but it's true. 

As I can't find those darned antennae, I think I'll go with the 

"non-citizen" definition. Or, perhaps, I'm really an organism 

considering that I am an animal who has been naturalized in a region 

that is not native to me. Something to ponder.... 





Subject: Louise is an alien, sorry honey, but it's true. 

a.li.en 

adj. 

Owing political allegiance to another country or government; foreign: 

alien 

residents. 

Belonging to, characteristic of, or constituting another and very 

different 

place, society, or person; strange. See Synonyms at foreign. 

Dissimilar, inconsistent, or opposed, as in nature: emotions alien to 

her 

temperament. 

n. 

An unnaturalized foreign resident of a country. Also called noncitizen. 

A person from another and very different family, people, or place. 

A person who is not included in a group; an outsider. 

A creature from outer space: science fiction about an invasion of 

aliens. 

Ecology. An organism, especially a plant or animal, that occurs in or is 

naturalized in a region to which it is not native. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



504





Subject: Re: Get scared 

Hey Marin, 

I thought of something that might help you. From one scaredy cat to another, put a light that you 

can turn, right inside your door!!!! Then, you won't have to go across your whole room just to turn 

the light on. Because the boogie man may be waiting for you on your bed!!!! 

Or, another possibility might involve buying "THE CLAPPER", you know, clap on....clap off... 

Of course, you may clap the light on when you enter the room, but then, that "wise old boogie man" 

might just clap his hands too. Then, it would be like a disco, and your neighbors would just think you 

were having another wild party. They would say, "that Marin, damn she throws the best parties!!" 

And another neighbor might comment, "Man, I love this song... 'Kung Fu Fighting', by Carl Douglas"... 

"Oh ho ho hooo.... Oh ho ho hooo....... Oh ho ho hooo, everybody was kung fu fighting, those cats 

were fast as lighting, in fact it was a little bit frightening, but they fought with expert timing.... there 

were funky China men from funky China town....." 



I get so scared at night cause I live in a dark cold garage it's a cute little 

place but the 

ocean air brings in creepy sounds. I have to walk through a thick garden full 

of cats and 

noises then once I get to the room i have to run across the whole room to turn 

on the 

light. I always picture someone on the bed ready to grab me or hurt me. But 

then I go 

through my Kung fu moves in my mind and I feel relieved because I see it as a 

time to 

finally put my kung fu skills to the test. Why are these feeling and images of 

unwelcome 

people so real. It is all in my head, huh. Fear of the dark, a place for 

others to hide and a 

time when no one is awake. It is amazing that our minds can intensify heart 

beating 

patterns and even shape an image. The mind is a powerful thing...Marin 

_____ 



505

506






Casey, 

You are not alone... I am a BIG scaredy cat. In fact, when I go camping with my friends, they start 

getting mad because I start scaring them too. I am all jumpy like "what was that?" "Did you hear 

that?" And at night in the tent, I am wide awake thinking that someone could come up and cut the 

tent open and kill us all. My friend Veronica, who I do most of my camping with, snores. So between 

here long inhaling of snore and her long exhaling of a snore... I listen super hard for anyone sneaking 

up on our tent. I have thought about buying a huge pair of ugly boots from a thrift store to 

strategically place outside the entrance of the tent, so that if someone saw them and heard that 

snoring going on in the tent, they might conclude some big guy was sleeping in there and hopefully 

not mess with us. Needless to say I don't sleep very well when I am afraid. 

I think that being afraid is natures way of keeping us safe. In the wild, there are reasons to be alert 

and jumpy. But, I do know that when we feed into our fears it only makes them intensify. 

My sister used to scare the (*&^%$%&&&^^%%^&&*() out of me when I was younger. We used to 

live out in Valley Center on five acres. My mom would sometimes leave me and my sister there alone 

at night. When I was in the about the 5th grade, one evening my sister and I were out there alone, 

and my sister Diane, wanted to scare me (me didn't have cable, I guess she got bored a lot). 

Anyway, I was talking on the phone to my friend and my sister came into the kitchen where I was and 

pointed behind me and yelled "oh my God" and ran off leaving me there, but not before flipping all the 

lights off as she exited each room. I hung up the phone and ran to catch up with her as the darkness 

and the intensifying fear was chasing me. Our house was huge, I talking 3,600 square feet of big 

scary house on five acres out in the middle of nowhere. 

So, Diane ran up the stairs, and I was stumbling to stay on her heels. She ran to the top of the stairs 

and into her room. BOOM, she slammed the door in my face. I pounded, and I pleaded, "Please let 

me in...Please". She wouldn't. I slowly turned around and realized it was pitch black. As my eyes 

adjusted, I could see down the flight of stairs and into the library (which I always felt a little afraid of...it 

was a scary room). 

Anyway, my heart was pounding, I kept pleading for Diane to let me in her room with her and she 

kept denying to let me in. I started to cry. This only made things worse for me. The tears in my 

eyes made it hard to see clearly. And I started to do that thing that kids do when they cry hard. You 

know, they kind of start breathing funny and get so worked up they can't talk without stuttering there 

words out. (I could show you much more easily than trying to describe it). 

So, I couldn't see very well, I was all worked up... I thought I was starting to see things. And as I 

tried to wipe the tears away to really see if I was seeing scary things down in the library, I started to 

really freak out. After about an hour of torture, Diane finally let me in, but only under her strict rules 

and conditions. I could stay in her room until Mom came home, but I had to pay her money, and I had 

to sleep with my head right by her bedroom door....Not next to her bed where I really wanted to sleep. 

You would think things would be rectified once Mom got home.... Well, they were not. I was kicked 

507

out of Diane's room and now I was knocking on the outside of my Mom's locked door pleading with 

her to let me sleep in her room. She didn't let me in. I had to go and sleep in my own room and try 

and calm myself down. So believe me, I won't make fun of you for being afraid 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gif. I understand. 

I have had a lot of things happen to shape my scaredy cat personality. The only advice I have, is to 

try not to feed into it..... it only makes things get more scary. Try and be as brave as you 

can... and I know that sometimes, that is so hard to do. Your heart pounds so hard 

sometimes that it sounds like a drum beating in your head. 

Casey, you are not alone with your fear. I think it is especially common for women to be afraid. I 

think you're perfectly normal, I would worry if someone didn't have any fear. 

Your fellow scaredy cat, 



OK- I thought I was definately the biggest scardy cat on earth but now I know I am not alone. I am 

always scared. I have absolutely no reason to be scared and I am scared. I can not tell the 

number of times I have called by brother or boyfriend to tell them that some one is in my house. 

And I really thought someone was in my house. And I would not be able to sleep until I knew for 

sure that no one was in my house. After a while they started to get anoyed with me because there 

has never been anyone in my house. I wonder why am I scared. Nothing has ever happened to 

me where I should be scared. I am so bad that when I just moved up here to San marcos...the 

very first thing I did before I got cable or anything was get an alarm installed. Since I have lived 

here I have been pretty good but I still imagine people- bad people crawling underneath the alarm 

beams and getting to my room. I do live alone! I grew up in a house where w e didn't even lock our 

doors before we went to bed. It is only when I am alone. I know- I could be crazy..is it society that 

makes me scared or am I just a freak? And all you people who respond to this be nice...I am 

sensitive :) CAsey 

_____ 



508






RE: Casey, you are not alone with your fear. I think it is especially common for women to be afraid. I 


This appears to be a bit sexist, and written by a fellow female, no less. Hmmmmmmm 

Cynthia 


Casey, 

You are not alone... I am a BIG scaredy cat. In fact, when I go camping with my friends, they 

start getting mad because I start scaring them too. I am all jumpy like "what was that?" "Did you 

hear that?" And at night in the tent, I am wide awake thinking that someone could come up and 

cut the tent open and kill us all. My friend Veronica, who I do most of my camping with, snores. 

So between here long inhaling of snore and her long exhaling of a snore... I listen super hard for 

anyone sneaking up on our tent. I have thought about buying a huge pair of ugly boots from a 

thrift store to strategically place outside the entrance of the tent, so that if someone saw them and 

heard that snoring going on in the tent, they might conclude some big guy was sleeping in there 

and hopefully not mess with us. Needless to say I don't sleep very well when I am afraid. 

I think that being afraid is natures way of keeping us safe. In the wild, there are reasons to be 

alert and jumpy. But, I do know that when we feed into our fears it only makes them intensify. 

My sister used to scare the (*&^%$%&&&^^%%^&&*() out of me when I was younger. We used 

to live out in Valley Center on five acres. My mom would sometimes leave me and my sister there 

alone at night. When I was in the about the 5th grade, one evening my sister and I were out there 

alone, and my sister Diane, wanted to scare me (me didn't have cable, I guess she got bored a 

lot). Anyway, I was talking on the phone to my friend and my sister came into the kitchen where I 

was and pointed behind me and yelled "oh my God" and ran off leaving me there, but not before 

flipping all the lights off as she exited each room. I hung up the phone and ran to catch up with 

her as the darkness and the intensifying fear was chasing me. Our house was huge, I talking 

3,600 square feet of big scary house on five acres out in the middle of nowhere. 

So, Diane ran up the stairs, and I was stumbling to stay on her heels. She ran to the top of the 

stairs and into her room. BOOM, she slammed the door in my face. I pounded, and I pleaded, 

"Please let me in...Please". She wouldn't. I slowly turned around and realized it was pitch black. 

As my eyes adjusted, I could see down the flight of stairs and into the library (which I always felt a 

little afraid of...it was a scary room). 

Anyway, my heart was pounding, I kept pleading for Diane to let me in her room with her and she 

kept denying to let me in. I started to cry. This only made things worse for me. The tears in 

my eyes made it hard to see clearly. And I started to do that thing that kids do when they cry 

hard. You know, they kind of start breathing funny and get so worked up they can't talk without 

stuttering there words out. (I could show you much more easily than trying to describe it). 

509

So, I couldn't see very well, I was all worked up... I thought I was starting to see things. And as I 

tried to wipe the tears away to really see if I was seeing scary things down in the library, I started 

to really freak out. After about an hour of torture, Diane finally let me in, but only under her strict 

rules and conditions. I could stay in her room until Mom came home, but I had to pay her money, 

and I had to sleep with my head right by her bedroom door....Not next to her bed where I really 

wanted to sleep. 

You would think things would be rectified once Mom got home.... Well, they were not. I was 

kicked out of Diane's room and now I was knocking on the outside of my Mom's locked door 

pleading with her to let me sleep in her room. She didn't let me in. I had to go and sleep in my 

own room and try and calm myself down. So believe me, I won't make fun of you for being 

afraid http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gif. I understand. 

I have had a lot of things happen to shape my scaredy cat personality. The only advice I have, is 

to try not to feed into it..... it only makes things get more scary. Try and be as brave as you 

can... and I know that sometimes, that is so hard to do. Your heart pounds so hard 

sometimes that it sounds like a drum beating in your head. 

Casey, you are not alone with your fear. I think it is especially common for women to be afraid. I 





_____ 

OK- I thought I was definately the biggest scardy cat on earth but now I know I am not alone. I 

am always scared. I have absolutely no reason to be scared and I am scared. I can not tell the 

number of times I have called by brother or boyfriend to tell them that some one is in my 

house. And I really thought someone was in my house. And I would not be able to sleep until I 

knew for sure that no one was in my house. After a while they started to get anoyed with me 

because there has never been anyone in my house. I wonder why am I scared. Nothing has 

ever happened to me where I should be scared. I am so bad that when I just moved up here to 

San marcos...the very first thing I did before I got cable or anything was get an alarm installed. 

Since I have lived here I have been pretty good but I still imagine people- bad people crawling 

underneath the alarm beams and getting to my room. I do live alone! I grew up in a house 

where w e didn't even lock our doors before we went to bed. It is only when I am alone. I know- 

I could be crazy..is it society that makes me scared or am I just a freak? And all you people 

who respond to this be nice...I am sensitive :) CAsey 



_____ 

510



511





Subject: Re: Unidentified subject! 

Dear God, 

I am perfectly open to learn about both sides of the coin. You have seen me try to do this my whole 

life. You also know how hard I have struggled to arrive at this given point in time. In fact, as you 

know, I was trying to debunk the exaggerated fears and misconceptions people have of 

homosexuality by bringing it out into the open. I was trying to point out how I don't think it is right for 

people to keep others from having things that everyone else gets to have. And as you already know, 

I was trying to tell people that the health benefits and stuff everyone thinks that homosexuals are 

supposed to have available to them, are hardly ever offered; and if they are, there are loop holes that 

ultimately keep them from getting them. Maybe that is an avenue that needs to be considered, or 

maybe like Mike said, there needs to be a totally different type of equal union (called somethin g else 

other than marriage) so that those who have a hard time with the idea of homosexual marriage will be 

o.k. it being called something else. 

God, you know me... you know what a big heart I have. You see how I go around wagging my tail 

and trying to be good to people. You know my intentions are to create equity and social justice. You 

also know, that as a teacher, I want my students to be a part of classroom atmosphere that is 

"conceived in liberty and dedicated to the proposition that all . . . [people] are created equal". God, 

please give me the strength to stand up for myself as well as others. Please help me to be a good 

person. Please help me to be a teacher (in school and in life) that really makes a difference in 

people's lives. Please give me the strength, and the confidence, and the wisdom to make a 

difference while I am alive on this planet we call earth. You know I love you, and tell Darwin that I 

love him too. Heck, please tell the whole cohort that I love them too. God, do you think they know 

what a great group of people I think they are? Do you think they know that these years that we are 

spending together will always be etched in my memory, and that years from now I will look back 

on my time at CSUSM I will smile. 

God, please let them know... 


Jesus Christ wrote: 













512













_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



513





Subject: Re: Illusions 

That was cool Louise, Thanks... Ann 


Something a little different from our journals. Enjoy! 

DO YOU SEE ONE MAN...OR TWO PERSONS? 

1de6ed2.jpg 

***************************************************************************************** 

1de6ef8.jpg 

******************************************************************************************* 

A face.....or the the word 'liar' ? 

1de6f0a.gif 

*********************************************************** 

What do you see in the following? 

Do you see the word "LIFT" or a bunch of black splotches? 

Girls usually are able to spot the word "lift" easily but men normally find it more difficult. 

1de6f18.gif 

********************************************************** 

1de6f25.gif 

Ask yourself which center circle looks bigger, the one on the left, or the one on the right? 

No, Wait! Look again. They are the same size! 

********************************************************** 

1de6f34.jpg 

How many horses in this picture? 

The a nswer is 7. 

********************************************************************************************* 

1de6f46.jpg 

Look the middle column.......where does it end? 

************************************************************************* 

514

1de6f58.jpg 

Is this woman old? When you first look at this image, most see a very old woman. Some people see a 

young woman instead of the old one. Do you see them both? 

********************************************************************* 

1de6f6b.jpg 

This is a so called "impossible object". This means that it's impossible to build it! But drawing it is not 

impossible as you see in the image. 

******************************************************************************************* 

1de6f7d.jpg 

************************************************************************************************************************************* 

************** 

1de6f91.jpg 

_____ 

_____ 



515






Hey trouble maker.... Have a good weekend. 

Ann 


RE: Casey, you are not alone with your fear. I think it is especially common for women to be 

afraid. I think you're perfectly normal, I would worry if someone didn't have any fear. 


Cynthia 


Casey, 

You are not alone... I am a BIG scaredy cat. In fact, when I go camping with my friends, they 

start getting mad because I start scaring them too. I am all jumpy like "what was that?" "Did 

you hear that?" And at night in the tent, I am wide awake thinking that someone could come 

up and cut the tent open and kill us all. My friend Veronica, who I do most of my camping with, 

snores. So between here long inhaling of snore and her long exhaling of a snore... I listen 

super hard for anyone sneaking up on our tent. I have thought about buying a huge pair of 

ugly boots from a thrift store to strategically place outside the entrance of the tent, so that if 

someone saw them and heard that snoring going on in the tent, they might conclude some big 

guy was sleeping in there and hopefully not mess with us. Needless to say I don't sleep very 

well when I am afraid. 

I think that being afraid is natures way of keeping us safe. In the wild, there are reasons to be 

alert and jumpy. But, I do know that when we feed into our fears it only makes them intensify. 

My sister used to scare the (*&^%$%&&&^^%%^&&*() out of me when I was younger. We 

used to live out in Valley Center on five acres. My mom would sometimes leave me and my 

sister there alone at night. When I was in the about the 5th grade, one evening my sister and I 

were out there alone, and my sister Diane, wanted to scare me (me didn't have cable, I guess 

she got bored a lot). Anyway, I was talking on the phone to my friend and my sister came into 

the kitchen where I was and pointed behind me and yelled "oh my God" and ran off leaving me 

there, but not before flipping all the lights off as she exited each room. I hung up the phone 

and ran to catch up with her as the darkness and the intensifying fear was chasing me. Our 

house was huge, I talking 3,600 square feet of big scary house on five acres out in the middle 

of nowhere. 

So, Diane ran up the stairs, and I was stumbling to stay on her heels. She ran to the top of the 

stairs and into her room. BOOM, she slammed the door in my face. I pounded, and I pleaded, 

"Please let me in...Please". She wouldn't. I slowly turned around and realized it was pitch 

black. As my eyes adjusted, I could see down the flight of stairs and into the library (which I 

516

always felt a little afraid of...it was a scary room). 

Anyway, my heart was pounding, I kept pleading for Diane to let me in her room with her and 

she kept denying to let me in. I started to cry. This only made things worse for me. The 

tears in my eyes made it hard to see clearly. And I started to do that thing that kids do when 

they cry hard. You know, they kind of start breathing funny and get so worked up they can't 

talk without stuttering there words out. (I could show you much more easily than trying to 

describe it). 

So, I couldn't see very well, I was all worked up... I thought I was starting to see things. And 

as I tried to wipe the tears away to really see if I was seeing scary things down in the library, I 

started to really freak out. After about an hour of torture, Diane finally let me in, but only under 

her strict rules and conditions. I could stay in her room until Mom came home, but I had to pay 

her money, and I had to sleep with my head right by her bedroom door....Not next to her bed 

where I really wanted to sleep. 

You would think things would be rectified once Mom got home.... Well, they were not. I was 

kicked out of Diane's room and now I was knocking on the outside of my Mom's locked door 

pleading with her to let me sleep in her room. She didn't let me in. I had to go and sleep in my 

own room and try and calm myself down. So believe me, I won't make fun of you for being 

afraid http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gif. I understand. 

I have had a lot of things happen to shape my scaredy cat personality. The only advice I have, 

is to try not to feed into it..... it only makes things get more scary. Try and be as brave 

as you can... and I know that sometimes, that is so hard to do. Your heart pounds so 

hard sometimes that it sounds like a drum beating in your head. 

Casey, you are not alone with your fear. I think it is especially common for women to be afraid. 

I think you're perfectly normal, I would worry if someone didn't have any fear. 




OK- I thought I was definately the biggest scardy cat on earth but now I know I am not 

alone. I am always scared. I have absolutely no reason to be scared and I am scared. I can 

not tell the number of times I have called by brother or boyfriend to tell them that some one 

is in my house. And I really thought someone was in my house. And I would not be able to 

sleep until I knew for sure that no one was in my house. After a while they started to get 

anoyed with me because there has never been anyone in my house. I wonder why am I 

scared. Nothing has ever happened to me where I should be scared. I am so bad that when 

I just moved up here to San marcos...the very first thing I did before I got cable or anything 

was get an alarm installed. Since I have lived here I have been pretty good but I still 

imagine people- bad people crawling underneath the alarm beams and getting to my room. 

I do live alone! I grew up in a house where w e didn't even lock our doors before we went to 

bed. It is only when I am alone. I know- I could be crazy..is it society that makes me scared 

517

_____ 

_____ 

or am I just a freak? And all you people who respond to this be nice...I am sensitive :) 

CAsey 





_____ 



518






I think I will, Ann. Maybe we could just say women are more likely to admit their fears? But even that 

is a stereotype. No getting away from it, I guess. We lowly humans just have to categorize 

everything!!! 

Cynthia 


Hey trouble maker.... Have a good weekend. 

Ann 


RE: Casey, you are not alone with your fear. I think it is especially common for women to be 



Cynthia 


Casey, 

You are not alone... I am a BIG scaredy cat. In fact, when I go camping with my friends, 

they start getting mad because I start scaring them too. I am all jumpy like "what was 

that?" "Did you hear that?" And at night in the tent, I am wide awake thinking that 

someone could come up and cut the tent open and kill us all. My friend Veronica, who I do 

most of my camping with, snores. So between here long inhaling of snore and her long 

exhaling of a snore... I listen super hard for anyone sneaking up on our tent. I have thought 

about buying a huge pair of ugly boots from a thrift store to strategically place outside the 

entrance of the tent, so that if someone saw them and heard that snoring going on in the 

tent, they might conclude some big guy was sleeping in there and hopefully not mess with 

us. Needless to say I don't sleep very well when I am afraid. 

I think that being afraid is natures way of keeping us safe. In the wild, there are reasons to 

be alert and jumpy. But, I do know that when we feed into our fears it only makes them 

intensify. 

My sister used to scare the (*&^%$%&&&^^%%^&&*() out of me when I was younger. We 

used to live out in Valley Center on five acres. My mom would sometimes leave me and 

my sister there alone at night. When I was in the about the 5th grade, one evening my 

sister and I were out there alone, and my sister Diane, wanted to scare me (me didn't have 

cable, I guess she got bored a lot). Anyway, I was talking on the phone to my friend and 

my sister came into the kitchen where I was and pointed behind me and yelled "oh my 

God" and ran off leaving me there, but not before flipping all the lights off as she exited 

519

each room. I hung up the phone and ran to catch up with her as the darkness and the 

intensifying fear was chasing me. Our house was huge, I talking 3,600 square feet of big 

scary house on five acres out in the middle of nowhere. 

So, Diane ran up the stairs, and I was stumbling to stay on her heels. She ran to the top of 

the stairs and into her room. BOOM, she slammed the door in my face. I pounded, and I 

pleaded, "Please let me in...Please". She wouldn't. I slowly turned around and realized it 

was pitch black. As my eyes adjusted, I could see down the flight of stairs and into the 

library (which I always felt a little afraid of...it was a scary room). 

Anyway, my heart was pounding, I kept pleading for Diane to let me in her room with her 

and she kept denying to let me in. I started to cry. This only made things worse for me. 

The tears in my eyes made it hard to see clearly. And I started to do that thing that kids do 

when they cry hard. You know, they kind of start breathing funny and get so worked up 

they can't talk without stuttering there words out. (I could show you much more easily than 

trying to describe it). 

So, I couldn't see very well, I was all worked up... I thought I was starting to see things. 

And as I tried to wipe the tears away to really see if I was seeing scary things down in the 

library, I started to really freak out. After about an hour of torture, Diane finally let me in, 

but only under her strict rules and conditions. I could stay in her room until Mom came 

home, but I had to pay her money, and I had to sleep with my head right by her bedroom 

door....Not next to her bed where I really wanted to sleep. 

You would think things would be rectified once Mom got home.... Well, they were not. I 

was kicked out of Diane's room and now I was knocking on the outside of my Mom's locked 

door pleading with her to let me sleep in her room. She didn't let me in. I had to go and 

sleep in my own room and try and calm myself down. So believe me, I won't make fun of 

you for being afraid http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gif. I 

understand. 

I have had a lot of things happen to shape my scaredy cat personality. The only advice I 

have, is to try not to feed into it..... it only makes things get more scary. Try and be 

as brave as you can... and I know that sometimes, that is so hard to do. Your heart 

pounds so hard sometimes that it sounds like a drum beating in your head. 

Casey, you are not alone with your fear. I think it is especially common for women to be 





OK- I thought I was definitely the biggest scardy cat on earth but now I know I am not 

alone. I am always scared. I have absolutely no reason to be scared and I am scared. I 

can not tell the number of times I have called by brother or boyfriend to tell them that 

520

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

some one is in my house. And I really thought someone was in my house. And I would 

not be able to sleep until I knew for sure that no one was in my house. After a while they 

started to get annoyed with me because there has never been anyone in my house. I 

wonder why am I scared. Nothing has ever happened to me where I should be scared. I 

am so bad that when I just moved up here to San Marcos...the very first thing I did 

before I got cable or anything was get an alarm installed. Since I have lived here I have 

been pretty good but I still imagine people- bad people crawling underneath the alarm 

beams and getting to my room. I do live alone! I grew up in a house where w e didn't 

even lock our doors before we went to bed. It is only when I am alone. I know- I could 

be crazy..is it society that makes me scared or am I just a freak? And all you people 

who respond to this be nice...I am sensitive :) Casey 







_____ 



521







Yo Louise, 

And how do you know that aliens do have antennae's, have you actually seen a real alien and are just 

not talking about it? 


B) 

Karla 

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Randy& Louise Tweed 




I also wondered why the INS used the word "aliens" to describe people who are not citizens. When I arrived in the 

U.S., I was told I was a "Resident Alien" which didn't exactly make me feel very welcome to the good 'ole U S of A! I 

did check though, and I don't have any antennae coming out of my head, so I consider myself a "Resident of the 

U.S.A." ~ Louise 






Easy, Marin! Cecilia was commenting on aliens and her cousin. I just put them together, and it 

wasn't a serious comment. But, if you think about it, we do classify certain aliens as being 

illegal, and if aliens from another planet came here, unless they got green cards or visas 

ahead of time, they would also be considered illegal. Regardless if it is right or wrong, that is 

the way our society catagorizes them. 

cynthia 



understand 




to know if 




522

_____ 

question it, 








alien gang s. 


aliens are 




clarity on 




523






Ann, this isn't God, so I am not here to answer your prayers. I understand why you might think that 

each and everyone of us should be able to have the same things. But, you know, that just isn't how 

things work in our world, or universe for that matter. Look at Mars for instance, it doesn't have any 

trees or flowers. How unfair is that? While we all may be created equal (but I would debate that in the 

scientific sense), everyone makes choices in life, and with choices come consequences. I could 

choose to wear pink everyday because it is my favorite color. But I run the risk of being made fun of, 

or at least thought of as a pink freak. And I would probably get sick of my favorite color. So maybe I 

would think twice about it and wear something besides pink to prevent these things from happening. I 

can also choose to believe or not believe in God. If I were to tell everyone I meet what my beliefs are, 

there would be consequences. It is still my choice. I think people can be passionate about things, but 

before they act, they should consider what will happen if. I tend to believe in the theory of "the 

greatest good for the greatest number". No matter the choices an individual or society makes, there 

will always be those who disagree. I don't think anything can ever be fair to everyone, whether its me 

or someone else. But I do think that I am responsible for everything that happens in my life, good or 

bad. Everything is a reaction (or consequence) to something I do or don't do. Although, I have to 

admit, sometimes it is much easier to blame it on someone else!!!And for the record, I am not saying 

your stance is wrong, because I don't have the answer. Cynthia 


Dear God, 

I am perfectly open to learn about both sides of the coin. You have seen me try to do this my 

whole life. You also know how hard I have struggled to arrive at this given point in time. In fact, 

as you know, I was trying to debunk the exaggerated fears and misconceptions people have of 

homosexuality by bringing it out into the open. I was trying to point out how I don't think it is right 

for people to keep others from having things that everyone else gets to have. And as you already 

know, I was trying to tell people that the health benefits and stuff everyone thinks that 

homosexuals are supposed to have available to them, are hardly ever offered; and if they are, 

there are loop holes that ultimately keep them from getting them. Maybe that is an avenue that 

needs to be considered, or maybe like Mike said, there needs to be a totally different type of equal 

union (called somethin g else other than marriage) so that those who have a hard time with the 

idea of homosexual marriage will be o.k. it being called something else. 

God, you know me... you know what a big heart I have. You see how I go around wagging my tail 

and trying to be good to people. You know my intentions are to create equity and social justice. 

You also know, that as a teacher, I want my students to be a part of classroom atmosphere that is 

"conceived in liberty and dedicated to the proposition that all . . . [people] are created equal". 

God, please give me the strength to stand up for myself as well as others. Please help me to be a 

good person. Please help me to be a teacher (in school and in life) that really makes a difference 

in people's lives. Please give me the strength, and the confidence, and the wisdom to make a 

difference while I am alive on this planet we call earth. You know I love you, and tell Darwin that I 

love him too. Heck, please tell the whole cohort that I love them too. God, do you think they know 

what a great group of people I think they are? Do you think they know that these years that we 

are spending together will always be etched in my memory, and that years from now I will look 

524

ack on my time at CSUSM I will smile. 

God, please let them know... 


Jesus Christ wrote: 

_____ 

























_________________________________________________________________ 





_____ 



525






See, thats proof Louise is one!!! She obviously knows more than she is letting on. 


Yo Louise, 

And how do you know that aliens do have antennae's, have you actually seen a real alien and are 

just not talking about it? 

Disappointed smiley emoticonKarla 






I also wondered why the INS used the word "aliens" to describe people who are not citizens. When I arrived in 

the U.S., I was told I was a "Resident Alien" which didn't exactly make me feel very welcome to the good 'ole U S 

of A! I did check though, and I don't have any antennae coming out of my head, so I consider myself a "Resident 

of the U.S.A." ~ Louise 






Easy, Marin! Cecilia was commenting on aliens and her cousin. I just put them together, 

and it wasn't a serious comment. But, if you think about it, we do classify certain aliens as 

being illegal, and if aliens from another planet came here, unless they got green cards or 

visas ahead of time, they would also be considered illegal. Regardless if it is right or wrong, 

that is the way our society catagorizes them. 

cynthia 



understand 




to know if 




question it, 

526

_____ 

_____ 








alien gang s. 


aliens are 




clarity on 






527







Hey Karla, 

I guess I'm stereotyping them just like Sagan! ~ Louise 


From: Karla Garduno [mailto:gardu001@msn.com] 




Yo Louise, 

And how do you know that aliens do have antennae's, have you actually seen a real alien and are 

just not talking about it? 


B) 

Karla 






I also wondered why the INS used the word "aliens" to describe people who are not citizens. When I arrived in 

the U.S., I was told I was a "Resident Alien" which didn't exactly make me feel very welcome to the good 'ole U S 

of A! I did check though, and I don't have any antennae coming out of my head, so I consider myself a "Resident 

of the U.S.A." ~ Louise 






Easy, Marin! Cecilia was commenting on aliens and her cousin. I just put them together, 

and it wasn't a serious comment. But, if you think about it, we do classify certain aliens as 

being illegal, and if aliens from another planet came here, unless they got green cards or 

visas ahead of time, they would also be considered illegal. Regardless if it is right or wrong, 

that is the way our society catagorizes them. 

cynthia 


528

_____ 


understand 




to know if 




question it, 








alien gang s. 


aliens are 




clarity on 




529




To: journal 

Subject: More Flu News 

Bird Flu Found in Cats in Asia; Canada on Alert 

Reuters 

1 hour, 59 minutes ago 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/my/my16.gif Add Top Stories - Reuters to My Yahoo! 

By Vissuta Pothong 

BANGKOK (Reuters) - Two domestic cats in Thailand have died of the same bird flu that has killed at 

least 22 people in Asia, a veterinarian said on Friday, a day after Canada announced its first case of 

a different strain of the virus. 

Slideshow Slideshow: Bird Flu 

Photo 

Reuters Photo 

Reuters Photo 

Reuters 

The discoveries have alarmed scientists, who now fear the disease can spread as easily between species as it has 

between countries. 

They said on Friday developing human vaccines must be a priority to prevent a flu pandemic like the one in 1918 that 

killed up to 50 million people worldwide. 

"It is a pandemic threat constantly simmering," Dr Marion Koopmans, of the National Institute of Public Health and the 

Environment in the Netherlands, told Reuters in London. 

China confirmed two more suspected outbreaks of the influenza H5N1 virus in two provinces on Friday, and Thai officials 

said the virus had reappeared in two provinces that had been declared under control. 

With the virus spreading at an unprecedented rate through poultry, and with 22 people dead in Asia, researchers warned 

it poses a substantial threat to human health. 

In two reports in the Lancet medical journal, Koopmans and Professor Malik Peiris of the University of Hong Kong, who 

both dealt with previous cases of animal-to-human transmission of flu, described why the current avian outbreak is so 

dangerous. 

Koopmans said it is possible the virus may not be completely controlled in poultry because it is so widespread, which 

furthered the case for making a vaccine a top priority. 

An Australian government research lab said a locally-developed drug, Relenza, used for treating human influenza, had 

proven effective against bird flu in laboratory tests. 

CATS DIED NEAR INFECTED FARM 

The virus has also crossed the species barrier to domestic animals, and in Bangkok on Friday scientists confirmed the 

deaths of two house cats. 

530

"We found H5N1 in two of the three cats," said Teerapol Sirinaruemit, a veterinarian at Kasetsart University's animal 

hospital, who conducted autopsies on three animals. 

"They might have caught the virus from eating chicken carcasses or from live chickens that had bird flu," he said. 

The three were among 15 cats living in a house located near an infected chicken farm 40 miles west of Bangkok, 

Teerapol said. 

Fourteen cats died, but it was unclear if all had been infected with the H5N1 virus. One cat was still alive. 

"We are going to bring the live one, which is quite sick, to the hospital today to check its health," Teerapol said. 

The Food and Agriculture Organization (news - web sites) said on Friday the cat deaths required "more careful scientific 

analysis." 

"We also need to know what specific diagnostic tests were performed and how the testing was carried out," the Romebased 

group said in a statement. 

"FAO advises that cats or other carnivores or omnivores (i.e. swine) should not be fed with carcasses of dead or culled 

birds." 

Besides killing humans and millions of wild and farmed birds across Asia, the H5N1 strain showed earlier this week it can 

jump to other species after a rare clouded leopard at a zoo near Bangkok was confirmed as dying of bird flu. 

Reports earlier this month that the virus had spread to pigs, with an immune system similar to humans', turned out to be 

false. 

"Clearly the more animal species that are infected with the avian flu virus, the bigger is the risk to humans they may catch 

the virus from animals," Bjorn Melgaard, the World Health Organization (news - web sites)'s Thailand representative, told 

Reuters. 

"We need to be very, very watchful." 

JAPAN BANS CANADIAN POULTRY 

Meanwhile, the Canadian Food Inspection Agency was still conducting laboratory tests, but officials said they had 

identified the H7 strain of avian influenza in British Columbia -- the same type found recently in Delaware in the United 

States. 

Japan reacted immediately, saying it was halting all imports of poultry from Canada. 

As news of the virus infection in cats spread, Thai Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, cautioned Thais not to feed their 

pets uncooked chicken meat. 

"Please don't panic," Thaksin told reporters in Bangkok. But he added: "If animals eat raw infected chicken, they will have 

no immunity." 

Another veterinarian said it was unclear whether the dead cats had eaten cooked or raw meat. Health experts say wellcooked 

chicken and eggs pose no danger. 

"Although the virus can spread to cats, which can easily catch flu, it is controllable," said Professor Thaneerat Santiwat, 

dean of Kasetsart University's veterinary faculty. 

Teerapol had also performed autopsies on the two exotic cats suspected of having bird flu at a zoo near Bangkok. 

He said his tests had confirmed that a rare Thai leopard, which was fed raw infected chicken, died of the H5N1 virus last 

month. The other big cat, a white tiger, had recovered from the disease, he said. 

531

_____ 



532




To: journal 

Subject: Can Wheat make you Hallucinate? 

Schizophrenia is a form of hallucination, isn't it? So couldn't gluten intolerance be the source 

of other hallucinations as well? Let's do an experiment: Anyone in our class who 

hallucinates, STOP eating gluten, and we can see if the hallucinations go away. Any takers? 

Gluten Clue Found in Schizophrenia Cause Hunt 

Reuters 

Thu Feb 19, 7:34 PM ET 


LONDON (Reuters) - Schizophrenia could be linked to an allergy to gluten, a protein found in wheat 

and other grains, scientists said on Friday. 

Gluten intolerance, known as coeliac disease, can erupt at any age but mostly affects people between the ages of 30 and 

45, often causing weight loss, diarrhea and fatigue. 

"A history of coeliac disease is a risk factor for schizophrenia," the researchers wrote in an article for the British Medical 

Journal. 

The scientists recommended a gluten-free diet to treat coeliac disease, and said some clinical trials had shown that 

cutting out cereals also alleviated symptoms of schizophrenia. 

The study, a collaboration between Johns Hopkins medical institutions in the United States and Denmark's Aarhus 

Universities and Aarhus Psychiatric Hospital, tested 7,997 schizophrenic patients in a Danish psychiatric unit. 

However, the scientists stressed the result reflected only a small proportion of cases since both diseases were rare. 

Last year, a study found a link between parental age and schizophrenia. Drug use has also been cited as a potential 

trigger for the mental illness. 

_____ 



533






I feel that Sagan should have titled chapter 7 "Sex and the Demon-Haunted World." Practically every 

paragraph in this chapter has some connection with sex. Not that sex is a bad thing - but this chapter 

spins a sinister, ugliness about sex. Women became pregnant out of wedlock, which in historical 

times (and to some degree, even today) was considered contemptible. I'm sure that many of the 

pregnancies were fathered by the priests as suggested on page 117, "There are cases in which nuns 

reported, in some befuddlement, a striking resemblance between the incubus and the priestconfessor, 

or the bishop, and awoke the next morning, as one 15th century chronicler put it, to "find 

themselves polluted just as if they had commingled with a man"." In order to explain away these 

pregnancies and encounters, these women must have had unlawful sex with demons! It's kind of 

funny how these days you don't here too much about babies being fathered by demons, unless of 

course, you read the grocery store tabloids - but that's another story! 

Personally, I think that the "nominally celibate priests" were getting their sexual kicks by having the 

task of carefully inspecting women's genitalia (those who had been accused of being witches) and 

that at witch trials they got to pay "close attention to the quality and quantity of orgasm in the 

supposed copulations of defendants with demons..." The priests were so revered by the communities 

that people would not believe the futile defenses of a "mere" woman. Too bad they didn't have the 

DNA technology of today, because if they did, many thousands of women would not have lost their 

lives to fabrications and many men would think twice about having unlawful sex (consensual or 

otherwise) with women. ~ Louise 

534





Subject: Re: More Flu News 

Dag Namet!!! 

DON'T MESS WITH MY KITTY!!!! 

What are we supposed to do now? O.K., close the the doors, no more help from the U.S.A.... No 

more money, no more aid, no more world traveling, no more importing/exporting!!!! Everybody 

march in a single file line to the bathroom and wash your hands. No more raising livestock, no more 

kissing, no more hugging, no more sneezing, no more coughing. No more public restrooms, no more 

postal service sending mail, no more looking at each other, no more t.v., no more Internet, no more 

long walks on the beach, no more laughing, no more crying... AND definitely... NO MORE SEX... No 

more drinking coffee, no more picking your nose... Hmmmm, what else? 

Damn, science needs some advancement right about now... Stop the plastic surgeries and all that 

useless vanity and start learning more about these viruses; and teach these other countries 

(or whoever is encouraging mutant virus growth) about healthier ways to raise their animals? Maybe 

we should all become vegetarians like the book Diet for a New America by (I think) Tim Robbins... 

Or, the other side of the coin might be... let them and us die. We have had too many medical 

advancements already and we are living way too long, and we are having way too many babies, and 

our babies are having way too many babies... 

This is a hard subject, as are most subjects that have many views. We are all products of our 

personalities, our upbringings, our societies that we live in, our gender roles, our sex roles, our 

ethnicities, our majority/minority status, and our placement along the time line of life. 




Reuters 




BANGKOK (Reuters) - Two domestic cats in Thailand have died of the same bird flu that has 

killed at least 22 people in Asia, a veterinarian said on Friday, a day after Canada announced its 

first case of a different strain of the virus. 

Photo 

Reuters Photo 

Reuters Photo 

535


Reuters 

The discoveries have alarmed scientists, who now fear the disease can spread as easily between species as it has 

between countries. 

They said on Friday developing human vaccines must be a priority to prevent a flu pandemic like the one in 1918 that 

killed up to 50 million people worldwide. 

"It is a pandemic threat constantly simmering," Dr Marion Koopmans, of the National Institute of Public Health and the 

Environment in the Netherlands, told Reuters in London. 

China confirmed two more suspected outbreaks of the influenza H5N1 virus in two provinces on Friday, and Thai 

officials said the virus had reappeared in two provinces that had been declared under control. 

With the virus spreading at an unprecedented rate through poultry, and with 22 people dead in Asia, researchers 

warned it poses a substantial threat to human health. 

In two reports in the Lancet medical journal, Koopmans and Professor Malik Peiris of the University of Hong Kong, 

who both dealt with previous cases of animal-to-human transmission of flu, described why the current avian outbreak 

is so dangerous. 

Koopmans said it is possible the virus may not be completely controlled in poultry because it is so widespread, which 

furthered the case for making a vaccine a top priority. 

An Australian government research lab said a locally-developed drug, Relenza, used for treating human influenza, 

had proven effective against bird flu in laboratory tests. 


The virus has also crossed the species barrier to domestic animals, and in Bangkok on Friday scientists confirmed 

the deaths of two house cats. 

"We found H5N1 in two of the three cats," said Teerapol Sirinaruemit, a veterinarian at Kasetsart University's animal 

hospital, who conducted autopsies on three animals. 






The Food and Agriculture Organization (news - web sites) said on Friday the cat deaths required "more careful 

scientific analysis." 

"We also need to know what specific diagnostic tests were performed and how the testing was carried out," the 

Rome-based group said in a statement. 

"FAO advises that cats or other carnivores or omnivores (i.e. swine) should not be fed with carcasses of dead or 

culled birds." 

Besides killing humans and millions of wild and farmed birds across Asia, the H5N1 strain showed earlier this week it 

can jump to other species after a rare clouded leopard at a zoo near Bangkok was confirmed as dying of bird flu. 

536

Reports earlier this month that the virus had spread to pigs, with an immune system similar to humans', turned out to 

be false. 

"Clearly the more animal species that are infected with the avian flu virus, the bigger is the risk to humans they may 

catch the virus from animals," Bjorn Melgaard, the World Health Organization (news - web sites)'s Thailand 

representative, told Reuters. 




identified the H7 strain of avian influenza in British Columbia -- the same type found recently in Delaware in the 

United States. 


As news of the virus infection in cats spread, Thai Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, cautioned Thais not to feed 

their pets uncooked chicken meat. 

"Please don't panic," Thaksin told reporters in Bangkok. But he added: "If animals eat raw infected chicken, they will 

have no immunity." 

Another veterinarian said it was unclear whether the dead cats had eaten cooked or raw meat. Health experts say 

well-cooked chicken and eggs pose no danger. 

"Although the virus can spread to cats, which can easily catch flu, it is controllable," said Professor Thaneerat 

Santiwat, dean of Kasetsart University's veterinary faculty. 

Teerapol had also performed autopsies on the two exotic cats suspected of having bird flu at a zoo near Bangkok. 

He said his tests had confirmed that a rare Thai leopard, which was fed raw infected chicken, died of the H5N1 virus 

last month. The other big cat, a white tiger, had recovered from the disease, he said. 

_____ 



_____ 



537





Subject: Re: Journal #5 (God, maybe you can help with this one?) 

Louise, (and class, and God, and Darwin) 

I am so glad that you brought this up. It seems as though every time I hint around about stuff like 

this, I feel like I am the only one reading into that way. Now, I realize that this may sound sexist or 

whatever and I am opening myself up to be criticized....but, in my experiences in life (which probably 

influence my drive for equality), I have come to my own personal conclusion that (the world is a big 

men's club). And I do not want to offend any man who might be reading this. It is not your personal 

fault, it is a fault of our society as a whole because we continue to pass these roles and views on 

generation after generation. If one were to step back and examine our whole society, they would see 

things much clearer than they can see things if they are living in it and all caught up in it. Our 

advertising (T.V., movies, magazines, music, , our vocabulary, our sex roles, our bibles, our social 

status, our clothing, our shoes ...) all show which sex is favored, which sex is dominant, which sex 

holds the power... 

Think about how we teach our young boys to not act like a girl; for example, "oh you big sissy, you 

throw like a girl". Or a coach when he is mad at his team will call refer to them as "ladies". If we use 

the role of being female as an insult, what is that teaching our children? How does this make the girls 

feel? If the feminine role was not consider less than, then it would not be felt as an insult... 

And as we can see reading about the Sagan stuff, it has been happening for hundreds of years.... 

I have a challenge for anyone who is interested. And I am curious myself to discover the 

answers. (maybe we can do this as a group in Dr. Yamashita's class?) The challenge is: make 

a list of all the bad, degrading names for women that we have in just the American language, 

and then make a column next to this list, and list all the bad, degrading, names for men... I 

think that language reveals a lot about how a society thinks and feels.... 



I feel that Sagan should have titled chapter 7 "Sex and the Demon-Haunted World." Practically 

every paragraph in this chapter has some connection with sex. Not that sex is a bad thing - but 

this chapter spins a sinister, ugliness about sex. Women became pregnant out of wedlock, which 

in historical times (and to some degree, even today) was considered contemptible. I'm sure that 

many of the pregnancies were fathered by the priests as suggested on page 117, "There are 

cases in which nuns reported, in some befuddlement, a striking resemblance between the incubus 

and the priest-confessor, or the bishop, and awoke the next morning, as one 15th century 

chronicler put it, to "find themselves polluted just as if they had commingled with a man"." In order 

to explain away these pregnancies and encounters, these women must have had unlawful sex 

with demons! It's kind of funny how these days you don' t here too much about babies being 

fathered by demons, unless of course, you read the grocery store tabloids - but that's another 

story! 

538

Personally, I think that the "nominally celibate priests" were getting their sexual kicks by having the 

task of carefully inspecting women's genitalia (those who had been accused of being witches) and 

that at witch trials they got to pay "close attention to the quality and quantity of orgasm in the 

supposed copulations of defendants with demons..." The priests were so revered by the 

communities that people would not believe the futile defenses of a "mere" woman. Too bad they 

didn't have the DNA technology of today, because if they did, many thousands of women would 

not have lost their lives to fabrications and many men would think twice about having unlawful sex 

(consensual or otherwise) with women. ~ Louise 

_____ 



539






Ann, you are right!! Advertising does show which sex has the power, and it's the WOMEN!!!! Sex 

sells!! You can get a man to do anything if you know how to use it!! Men will fall for anything, lol. 

Those poor boys are helpless under our power! 

Cynthia 


Louise, (and class, and God, and Darwin) 

I am so glad that you brought this up. It seems as though every time I hint around about stuff like 

this, I feel like I am the only one reading into that way. Now, I realize that this may sound sexist or 

whatever and I am opening myself up to be criticized....but, in my experiences in life (which 

probably influence my drive for equality), I have come to my own personal conclusion that (the 

world is a big men's club). And I do not want to offend any man who might be reading this. It is 

not your personal fault, it is a fault of our society as a whole because we continue to pass these 

roles and views on generation after generation. If one were to step back and examine our whole 

society, they would see things much clearer than they can see things if they are living in it and all 

caught up in it. Our advertising (T.V., movies, magazines, music, , our vocabulary, our sex roles, 

our bibles, our social status, our clothing, our shoes ...) all show which sex is favored, which sex is 

dominant, which sex holds the power... 

Think about how we teach our young boys to not act like a girl; for example, "oh you big sissy, you 

throw like a girl". Or a coach when he is mad at his team will call refer to them as "ladies". If we 

use the role of being female as an insult, what is that teaching our children? How does this make 

the girls feel? If the feminine role was not consider less than, then it would not be felt as an 

insult... 

And as we can see reading about the Sagan stuff, it has been happening for hundreds of years.... 

I have a challenge for anyone who is interested. And I am curious myself to discover the 

answers. (maybe we can do this as a group in Dr. Yamashita's class?) The challenge is: 

make a list of all the bad, degrading names for women that we have in just the American 

language, and then make a column next to this list, and list all the bad, degrading, names 

for men... I think that language reveals a lot about how a society thinks and feels.... 



I feel that Sagan should have titled chapter 7 "Sex and the Demon-Haunted World." Practically 

every paragraph in this chapter has some connection with sex. Not that sex is a bad thing - 

but this chapter spins a sinister, ugliness about sex. Women became pregnant out of wedlock, 

540

_____ 

which in historical times (and to some degree, even today) was considered contemptible. I'm 

sure that many of the pregnancies were fathered by the priests as suggested on page 117, 

"There are cases in which nuns reported, in some befuddlement, a striking resemblance 

between the incubus and the priest-confessor, or the bishop, and awoke the next morning, as 

one 15th century chronicler put it, to "find themselves polluted just as if they had commingled 

with a man"." In order to explain away these pregnancies and encounters, these women must 

have had unlawful sex with demons! It's kind of funny how these days you don' t here too 

much about babies being fathered by demons, unless of course, you read the grocery store 

tabloids - but that's another story! 

Personally, I think that the "nominally celibate priests" were getting their sexual kicks by having 

the task of carefully inspecting women's genitalia (those who had been accused of being 

witches) and that at witch trials they got to pay "close attention to the quality and quantity of 

orgasm in the supposed copulations of defendants with demons..." The priests were so 

revered by the communities that people would not believe the futile defenses of a "mere" 

woman. Too bad they didn't have the DNA technology of today, because if they did, many 

thousands of women would not have lost their lives to fabrications and many men would think 

twice about having unlawful sex (consensual or otherwise) with women. ~ Louise 



_____ 



541






Hey, leave my computer out of this!!!! Nobody else needs to touch it, and as far as I know, computer 

viruses haven't mutated enough to get passed on to humans. And viruses of the other kind are not 

passed through the internet. I think we should all just drink more alcohol as a preventative measure. If 

anything can kill a stubborn virus, alcohol can. Its my standard cure for everything. You don't see me 

missing any days of school cuz I am sick, lol. 

Cynthia 


Dag Namet!!! 

DON'T MESS WITH MY KITTY!!!! 

What are we supposed to do now? O.K., close the the doors, no more help from the U.S.A.... No 

more money, no more aid, no more world traveling, no more importing/exporting!!!! Everybody 

march in a single file line to the bathroom and wash your hands. No more raising livestock, no 

more kissing, no more hugging, no more sneezing, no more coughing. No more public restrooms, 

no more postal service sending mail, no more looking at each other, no more t.v., no more 

Internet, no more long walks on the beach, no more laughing, no more crying... AND definitely... 

NO MORE SEX... No more drinking coffee, no more picking your nose... Hmmmm, what else? 

Damn, science needs some advancement right about now... Stop the plastic surgeries and all 

that useless vanity and start learning more about these viruses; and teach these other countries 

(or whoever is encouraging mutant virus growth) about healthier ways to raise their animals? 

Maybe we should all become vegetarians like the book Diet for a New America by (I think) Tim 

Robbins... 

Or, the other side of the coin might be... let them and us die. We have had too many medical 

advancements already and we are living way too long, and we are having way too many babies, 

and our babies are having way too many babies... 

This is a hard subject, as are most subjects that have many views. We are all products of our 

personalities, our upbringings, our societies that we live in, our gender roles, our sex roles, our 

ethnicities, our majority/minority status, and our placement along the time line of life. 




Reuters 



542


BANGKOK (Reuters) - Two domestic cats in Thailand have died of the same bird flu that has 

killed at least 22 people in Asia, a veterinarian said on Friday, a day after Canada announced 

its first case of a different strain of the virus. 


Photo 

Reuters Photo 

Reuters Photo 

Reuters 

The discoveries have alarmed scientists, who now fear the disease can spread as easily between species as it 

has between countries. 

They said on Friday developing human vaccines must be a priority to prevent a flu pandemic like the one in 1918 

that killed up to 50 million people worldwide. 

"It is a pandemic threat constantly simmering," Dr Marion Koopmans, of the National Institute of Public Health and 

the Environment in the Netherlands, told Reuters in London. 

China confirmed two more suspected outbreaks of the influenza H5N1 virus in two provinces on Friday, and Thai 

officials said the virus had reappeared in two provinces that had been declared under control. 

With the virus spreading at an unprecedented rate through poultry, and with 22 people dead in Asia, researchers 

warned it poses a substantial threat to human health. 

In two reports in the Lancet medical journal, Koopmans and Professor Malik Peiris of the University of Hong 

Kong, who both dealt with previous cases of animal-to-human transmission of flu, described why the current 

avian outbreak is so dangerous. 

Koopmans said it is possible the virus may not be completely controlled in poultry because it is so widespread, 

which furthered the case for making a vaccine a top priority. 

An Australian government research lab said a locally-developed drug, Relenza, used for treating human 

influenza, had proven effective against bird flu in laboratory tests. 


The virus has also crossed the species barrier to domestic animals, and in Bangkok on Friday scientists 

confirmed the deaths of two house cats. 

"We found H5N1 in two of the three cats," said Teerapol Sirinaruemit, a veterinarian at Kasetsart University's 

animal hospital, who conducted autopsies on three animals. 






543

_____ 

The Food and Agriculture Organization (news - web sites) said on Friday the cat deaths required "more careful 

scientific analysis." 

"We also need to know what specific diagnostic tests were performed and how the testing was carried out," the 

Rome-based group said in a statement. 

"FAO advises that cats or other carnivores or omnivores (i.e. swine) should not be fed with carcasses of dead or 

culled birds." 

Besides killing humans and millions of wild and farmed birds across Asia, the H5N1 strain showed earlier this 

week it can jump to other species after a rare clouded leopard at a zoo near Bangkok was confirmed as dying of 

bird flu. 

Reports earlier this month that the virus had spread to pigs, with an immune system similar to humans', turned 

out to be false. 

"Clearly the more animal species that are infected with the avian flu virus, the bigger is the risk to humans they 

may catch the virus from animals," Bjorn Melgaard, the World Health Organization (news - web sites)'s Thailand 

representative, told Reuters. 




identified the H7 strain of avian influenza in British Columbia -- the same type found recently in Delaware in the 

United States. 


As news of the virus infection in cats spread, Thai Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, cautioned Thais not to feed 

their pets uncooked chicken meat. 

"Please don't panic," Thaksin told reporters in Bangkok. But he added: "If animals eat raw infected chicken, they 

will have no immunity." 

Another veterinarian said it was unclear whether the dead cats had eaten cooked or raw meat. Health experts say 

well-cooked chicken and eggs pose no danger. 

"Although the virus can spread to cats, which can easily catch flu, it is controllable," said Professor Thaneerat 

Santiwat, dean of Kasetsart University's veterinary faculty. 

Teerapol had also performed autopsies on the two exotic cats suspected of having bird flu at a zoo near 

Bangkok. 

He said his tests had confirmed that a rare Thai leopard, which was fed raw infected chicken, died of the H5N1 

virus last month. The other big cat, a white tiger, had recovered from the disease, he said. 



544

_____ 



_____ 



545





Subject: RE: Give me an infusion of the fake stuff!!!! 

What is going on? The doctor says that there is nothing unethical about 

this...well I think there is! It may be ethical to whomever decided to 

execute this experiment, but to other people, those being infused with this 

fake blood, may think it is unethical. 

I, for one, would not want to be a lab rat for this experiment, especially 

without my consent. I am a regular blood doner, and would want the real 

stuff pumped into me before a substitute was. Let's look at this another 

way. It's like brand names vs. generic names. Okay, so do Doritos really 

taste the same as Vons brand cheese tortillas chips? Or does Dr. Pepper 

really taste equivalent to Dr. Skipper? What about Kraft American chesse 

slices vs. Safeway brand American cheese slices? (I don't think they are 

made with as much milk as Kraft uses). Real blood vs. fake blood (that is 

not proven yet to be as effective)? I think I just proved my point. 

You know, some people would really have a problem with this. I know people 

who do not ingest foreign liquids, substances, atibiotics, etc. into their 

bodies. If they learned that this experimental blood substitute was injected 

into them, they would be livid. Who knows, maybe this fake blood is killing 

people rather than saving their lives. Who decides that it is ready to be 

tested out on humans? Is it even safe enough to be experimented? I don't 

know...but I better not ever find out that I was the lab rat...especially if 

I'm dead. 




>To: journal 

>Subject: Give me an infusion of the fake stuff!!!! 


> 

>Anybody see a problem with this? 

> 

> 

>Artificial Blood Tested Without Consent 

> 47 minutes ago 

>Add Top Stories - AP to My Yahoo! 

>By LINDSEY TANNER, AP Medical Writer 

>CHICAGO - Paramedics are testing an experimental blood substitute on 

>severely injured patients without their consent in an unusual study under 

>way or proposed at 20 hospitals around the country. 

> 

>AP Photo 

>Related Links•Polyheme (Northfield Labs)In Yahoo! HealthChronic Heartburn 

>Need Relief? 

>--------------------------------- 

>More from Yahoo! Health:• Check Your Symptoms• How Is It Diagnosed?• 

>Available Treatments 

>The study was launched last month in Denver and follows similar research 

>that was halted in 1998, when more than 20 patients died after getting a 

>different experimental blood substitute. 

> 

>Supporters say the current product, PolyHeme, made by Northfield 

546

Laboratories of Evanston, Ill., is safer and could save many of the nearly 

>100,000 people who die of bleeding injuries each year nationwide. 

> 

>"It could revolutionize how we take care of resuscitation in the United 

>States and across the world," said lead investigator Dr. Ernest Moore, 

>chief of trauma surgery at Denver Health Medical Center. 

> 

>The research is part of a race to find what doctors call the holy grail of 

>emergency medicine: a product that works like human blood to save victims 

>of car crashes, shootings or other trauma but could be carried in 

>ambulances and given to people of any blood type. 

> 

>Patients will be randomly selected to receive PolyHeme intravenously or 

>standard saline solution at the scene or en route to the hospital. 

> 

>Because severely bleeding trauma patients often are unconscious or in 

>shock, they are unable to give the consent required for experimental 

>treatment. As a result, the researchers in this case are being allowed to 

>bypass the consent rules under a 1996 federal exemption that applies to 

>emergency, potentially lifesaving research. 

> 

>The exemption requires the research to be publicized beforehand in 

>communities where the study will be conducted, both to let people opt out 

>if they are ever injured and to give the community a chance to express any 

>objections. In effect, the community briefings are used to obtain consent. 

> 

>The Food and Drug Administration (news - web sites) has approved about 15 

>such no-consent studies since the exemption was added. 

> 

>University of Pennsylvania bioethicist Dr. Jason Karlawish said there is 

>nothing unethical about the concept. 

> 

>Some patients' rights advocates disagreed, especially considering the 

>deaths in the earlier study of emergency room patients given a Baxter 

>Healthcare blood substitute. 

> 

>The study "is another one along that slippery slope that's essentially 

>demolishing your individual right not to become experimental subjects 

>unless we give prior, voluntary, informed, comprehending consent," said 

>Vera Sharav, president of the New York-based Alliance for Human Research 

>Protection, a group concerned with the safety of the millions of Americans 

>who participate in medical research each year. 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



547





Subject: j:5 Look outside your bubble... 

Hola clase, 

I have been thinking more on the ideas of 

perspectives and beliefs and how these things relate 

to the way that I see the world and process 

information. My beliefs are the foundation of my 

thoughts, my perspective is the lens through which I 

view things, and the filter through which new ideas 

and information are processed. My perspective and 

beliefs I have never seen as being static, they change 

over time and with each new experience, each new idea 

that I think and analyze my way through eventually 

lead me to a point of understanding that feels true to 

me. Along this journey to understanding, many things 

change. Proof of this is that I am not the same 

person, (intellectually, spiritually), that I was even 

a year ago. So what have I allowed to change in me, 

how have I changed, and what are the elements that 

motivated change within myself to reach new levels in 

life? 

Part of the answer is that I am an open person. 

By that I mean that I am open to new experiences and 

new ideas, and that I am willing to try and understand 

the ways that other people see and perceive things 

differently than I might. I feel that it is from our 

life experiences that the forms of our understanding 

and how we perceive things in life take shape, and 

sharing our modes of understanding with other open and 

willing people is a valuable way of making deeper 

connections with, and understanding more about our own 

perceptions and beliefs. I am willing to challenge 

what I believe, not because I doubt the truth of my 

beliefs or that I am seeking to adopt those of others, 

but because I believe that looking at how my beliefs 

stand up to other people’s experiences, which are 

shared through and exist in their perceptions and 

beliefs, only provides deeper insight and 

understanding of my own… sometimes even changing them. 

“Change has a considerable psychological impact on the 

human mind. To the fearful it is threatening because 

it means that things may get worse. To the hopeful it 

is encouraging because things may get better. To the 

confident it is inspiring because the challenge exists 

to make things better.” -King Whitney Jr.- 

So how will I approach and react to my future 

students and the beliefs and perspectives they bring 

into the classroom? On what level will I engage in 

opening myself up to gain deeper insight into their 

experiences in relation to my own and expect them to 

do the same? I am perplexed at the notion of creating 

a classroom environment that not only honors students’ 

beliefs and experiences, but also engages students to 

question and consider, with openness, the beliefs and 

548

experiences of others. I want for my future students 

to feel secure in their beliefs, but also to expand 

and modify these beliefs in order to change, to move 

forward and grow. How do I do that if some of their 

beliefs are not based on growth, openness, or possibly 

even foster closing their minds to other beliefs or 

notions? What if a foundation of some student’s 

belief is to merely accept those of others as wrong or 

misguided, but never be open to understanding them, or 

even hear them. It would not be wrong for them to 

close their minds, if that is their will. But where 

does that leave me as their teacher? How would I 

reach these children if my approach to teaching were 

based on exploring, questioning, and understanding 

beliefs other than their own based on what is believed 

to be true by the individual? 

Bubbles are beautiful to behold, but they become 

prisons when we choose to live in and view the world 

from within them. As a teacher, I hope to burst the 

bubbles of as many students as I can. I want my 

students to value looking at and doing things in 

different ways. I understand that innovation and 

effort on my part as a teacher may only go as far as 

each individual will allow it to go and that I cannot 

ask anyone to change or grow if they are not willing. 

But as a teacher, I will have each class of students 

for nine or so months of their lives. During that 

time, what I can do is allow these students to know me 

and learn from me what they will, and hopefully, from 

the interests that I share with them and the growth 

they will see me make, they too will consider looking 

at and doing things differently…and maybe grow from 

that. 

__________________________________ 



http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools 

549 

Michael




To: LBST 361B 


After the discussion on Wednesday, I started thinking about myself and the way 

I express myself. You all know that I am a quiet person and that I usually do 

not get engage in class conversations. That doesn’t mean that I am not 

thinking; I am and I am listening to what you guys have to say about different 

topics. While I am listening I am formulating my own point of view and if I 

have to say something I’ll say it (although I have not done this with you 

guys). When I go out with my friends, they also know that I am quiet. But I 

love it when everyone quiets down to listen to what I have to say. I don’t 

like to talk just to talk or to argue with someone. I like to say what I think 

hoping people are listening to me and are learning something from and about 

me. That’s what I try to do when I listen to others. I have a friend that 

tells me to be more expressive about my ideas, beliefs and opinions and I 

agree with him. However, it is going to take time for me to evolve. Evolution 

did not happen from one day to another, the same can be said about attitudes, 

opinions, beliefs and ideas. “Evolution is to me series with 

development.”–Gladstone 

Since I mentioned evolution, I just want to say that I want to learn more 

about it and also about creationism. I personally believe in God, and that He 

created men. The Bible says so in Genesis 2:7 “the LORD God formed the man 

from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, 

and the man became a living being.” I am not going to say more about it for 

now, but I will be thinking on ways to express what I believe. 

Hasta luego, see ya later, 

Judith 

550




To: ICP-F; tinne002 


I don't believe that the only thing that you can count on is change. I think 

learning from our past history can tells us where we are today, like a 

society, and where we migth go in the future. Not everything changes. 

Laurie :) 

>===== Original Message From tinne002 ===== 

>I love watching my thoughts evolve. it cracks me up the way I believe and 

>understand 

>one thing then discover something different the next day. It keeps life 

>exciting but it 

>makes me wonder if I will ever know if something is for sure. Do I even need 

>to know if 

>things are for sure? life suddenly feels very airy and free for thoughts to 

>flow through and 

>change as they like. I guess we just need to catch a thought observe it, 

>question it, 

>predict, hypothsis, test, then evaluate it. Then we either let it be or else 

>go throught the 

>scientific method again and take to an unexplored level. 

> 

>Remeber the only thing you can count on is change. 

> 

>Cynthia, a while ago you were writing about alien gangs being abducted by 

>illegal aliens 

>then forming one big gang. I was wondering why you put illegal aliens with 

>alien gangs. 

>Aliens are not illegal and we do not know if they are human like. And illegal 

>aliens are 

>human beings, yes here illegally but they are humans with feelings and I 

>question if it is 

>okay to put them in the same group as aliens. I may be way off, just 

seeking 

>clarity on 

>the comment. Marin 

551





Subject: RE: Get scared- Casey Cunningham 

I haven't read Sagan's chapter 6 yet which I heard to be about your mind 

playing games on you, but I totally admit that I too get scared. I'm 

housesitting right now in this huge house while taking care of a small dog as 

well. Whenever I go to bed at night or early morning, I always close my door 

because I don't want to worry about looking outside my door. I rather have 

someone have to open the door so that I can at least be warned that someone 

coming in. So all of you who get scared at night time, I definitely 

understand!@ 

Laurie :) 


>OK- I thought I was definately the biggest scardy cat on earth but now I know 

>I am not alone. I am always scared. I have absolutely no reason to be scared 

>and I am scared. I can not tell the number of times I have called by brother 

>or boyfriend to tell them that some one is in my house. And I really thought 

>someone was in my house. And I would not be able to sleep until I knew for 

sure 

>that no one was in my house. After a while they started to get anoyed with me 

>because there has never been anyone in my house. I wonder why am I scared. 

>Nothing has ever happened to me where I should be scared. I am so bad that 

when I 

>just moved up here to San marcos...the very first thing I did before I got 

>cable or anything was get an alarm installed. Since I have lived here I have 

>been pretty good but I still imagine people- bad people crawling underneath 

the 

>alarm beams and getting to my room. I do live alone! I grew up in a house 

where 

>we didn't even lock our doors before we went to bed. It is only when I am 

>alone. I know- I could be crazy..is it society that makes me scared or am I 

just 

>a freak? And all you people who respond to this be nice...I am sensitive :) 

>CAsey 

552




To: Ann Kirkendall; ICP-F 

Subject: RE: Journal #5 (God, maybe you can help with this one?) 

That's interesting that you said that Ann because my boyfriend is taking a 

class on women's studies and it mainly about Feminism. We just were talking 

about the phrase, "You throw like a sissy!" can convey a lot about degrading 

the female gender. I told him maybe we should cnage the phrase to "You throw 

weird!." This would not convey any gender conflict and people would understand 

what you are saying. 

Laurie :) 

>===== Original Message From Ann Kirkendall ===== 

>Louise, (and class, and God, and Darwin) 

> 

>I am so glad that you brought this up. It seems as though every time I hint 

around about stuff like this, I feel like I am the only one reading into that 

way. Now, I realize that this may sound sexist or whatever and I am opening 

myself up to be criticized....but, in my experiences in life (which probably 

influence my drive for equality), I have come to my own personal conclusion 

that (the world is a big men's club). And I do not want to offend any man who 

might be reading this. It is not your personal fault, it is a fault of our 

society as a whole because we continue to pass these roles and views on 

generation after generation. If one were to step back and examine our whole 

society, they would see things much clearer than they can see things if they 

are living in it and all caught up in it. Our advertising (T.V., movies, 

magazines, music, , our vocabulary, our sex roles, our bibles, our social 

status, our clothing, our shoes ...) all show which sex is favored, which se 

> x is 

> dominant, which sex holds the power... 

> 

>Think about how we teach our young boys to not act like a girl; for example, 

"oh you big sissy, you throw like a girl". Or a coach when he is mad at his 

team will call refer to them as "ladies". If we use the role of being female 

as an insult, what is that teaching our children? How does this make the 

girls feel? If the feminine role was not consider less than, then it would 

not be felt as an insult... 

> 

>And as we can see reading about the Sagan stuff, it has been happening for 

hundreds of years.... 

> 

>I have a challenge for anyone who is interested. And I am curious myself to 

discover the answers. (maybe we can do this as a group in Dr. Yamashita's 

class?) The challenge is: make a list of all the bad, degrading names for 

women that we have in just the American language, and then make a column next 

to this list, and list all the bad, degrading, names for men... I think that 

language reveals a lot about how a society thinks and feels.... 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 

> 

>Randy& Louise Tweed wrote: 

>I feel that Sagan should have titled chapter 7 "Sex and the Demon-Haunted 

World." Practically every paragraph in this chapter has some connection with 

sex. Not that sex is a bad thing - but this chapter spins a sinister, 

ugliness about sex. Women became pregnant out of wedlock, which in historical 

times (and to some degree, even today) was considered contemptible. I'm sure 

that many of the pregnancies were fathered by the priests as suggested on page 

553

117, "There are cases in which nuns reported, in some befuddlement, a striking 

resemblance between the incubus and the priest-confessor, or the bishop, and 

awoke the next morning, as one 15th century chronicler put it, to "find 

themselves polluted just as if they had commingled with a man"." In order to 

explain away these pregnancies and encounters, these women must have had 

unlawful sex with demons! It's kind of funny how these days you don't here 

too much about babies being fathered by demons, unless of course, you read t 

> he 

> grocery store tabloids - but that's another story! 

>Personally, I think that the "nominally celibate priests" were getting their 

sexual kicks by having the task of carefully inspecting women's genitalia 

(those who had been accused of being witches) and that at witch trials they 

got to pay "close attention to the quality and quantity of orgasm in the 

supposed copulations of defendants with demons..." The priests were so revered 

by the communities that people would not believe the futile defenses of a 

"mere" woman. Too bad they didn't have the DNA technology of today, because 

if they did, many thousands of women would not have lost their lives to 

fabrications and many men would think twice about having unlawful sex 


> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



554





Subject: RE: Journal #5 (God, maybe you can help with this one?) 

I think men will fall for anything which is great for us ladys, but I think 

that our society is mainly a male controlled or directed society (if I using 

the correct wordage there). 

Laurie :) 


>Ann, you are right!! Advertising does show which sex has the power, and it's 

the WOMEN!!!! Sex sells!! You can get a man to do anything if you know how to 

use it!! Men will fall for anything, lol. Those poor boys are helpless under 

our power! 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Louise, (and class, and God, and Darwin) 

> 

>I am so glad that you brought this up. It seems as though every time I hint 

around about stuff like this, I feel like I am the only one reading into that 

way. Now, I realize that this may sound sexist or whatever and I am opening 

myself up to be criticized....but, in my experiences in life (which probably 

influence my drive for equality), I have come to my own personal conclusion 

that (the world is a big men's club). And I do not want to offend any man who 

might be reading this. It is not your personal fault, it is a fault of our 

society as a whole because we continue to pass these roles and views on 

generation after generation. If one were to step back and examine our whole 

society, they would see things much clearer than they can see things if they 

are living in it and all caught up in it. Our advertising (T.V., movies, 

magazines, music, , our vocabulary, our sex roles, our bibles, our social 

status, our clothing, our shoes ...) all show which sex is favored, which se 

> x is 

> dominant, which sex holds the power... 

> 

>Think about how we teach our young boys to not act like a girl; for example, 

"oh you big sissy, you throw like a girl". Or a coach when he is mad at his 

team will call refer to them as "ladies". If we use the role of being female 

as an insult, what is that teaching our children? How does this make the 

girls feel? If the feminine role was not consider less than, then it would 

not be felt as an insult... 

> 

>And as we can see reading about the Sagan stuff, it has been happening for 

hundreds of years.... 

> 

>I have a challenge for anyone who is interested. And I am curious myself to 

discover the answers. (maybe we can do this as a group in Dr. Yamashita's 

class?) The challenge is: make a list of all the bad, degrading names for 

women that we have in just the American language, and then make a column next 

to this list, and list all the bad, degrading, names for men... I think that 

language reveals a lot about how a society thinks and feels.... 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 

> 


>I feel that Sagan should have titled chapter 7 "Sex and the Demon-Haunted 

World." Practically every paragraph in this chapter has some connection with 

555

sex. Not that sex is a bad thing - but this chapter spins a sinister, 

ugliness about sex. Women became pregnant out of wedlock, which in historical 

times (and to some degree, even today) was considered contemptible. I'm sure 

that many of the pregnancies were fathered by the priests as suggested on page 

117, "There are cases in which nuns reported, in some befuddlement, a striking 

resemblance between the incubus and the priest-confessor, or the bishop, and 

awoke the next morning, as one 15th century chronicler put it, to "find 

themselves polluted just as if they had commingled with a man"." In order to 

explain away these pregnancies and encounters, these women must have had 

unlawful sex with demons! It's kind of funny how these days you don' t here 

too much about babies being fathered by demons, unless of course, you read 

> the 

> grocery store tabloids - but that's another story! 

>Personally, I think that the "nominally celibate priests" were getting their 

sexual kicks by having the task of carefully inspecting women's genitalia 

(those who had been accused of being witches) and that at witch trials they 

got to pay "close attention to the quality and quantity of orgasm in the 

supposed copulations of defendants with demons..." The priests were so revered 

by the communities that people would not believe the futile defenses of a 

"mere" woman. Too bad they didn't have the DNA technology of today, because 

if they did, many thousands of women would not have lost their lives to 

fabrications and many men would think twice about having unlawful sex 


> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

>--------------------------------- 



556





Subject: My Journal (just my thoughts of the week) 

I was reading through the many posts and I was thinking about the discussion 

on wednesday. I found myself wanting to express myself in some other medium, 

so I wrote a poem. Anyway I hope that everyone is having a good weekend. 

This class is very heavy for me at points, but only because I let it. Hope 

you all like my poem and I look forward to seeing you on monday. 

LOSS OF SIGHT 

the eyes of humanity 

now retain their docile positions 

with retreat from all that is not true. 

yet with truth and relativity 

being both of friend and of foe, 

in the light the truth begins to become frail. 

it is within the all and the plenty, 

found around the outskirts of words, 

the exposed now becomes very real 

with a heartfelt sense of earth. 

knowledge held by one 

truth held by all 

earth beneath a foot 

collectively their 

eyes retain their docile positions. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



557





Subject: RE: j:5 Look outside your bubble... 

Michael, 

I am amazed at reading how you have changed and opened up as a person. That 

is a great accomplishment and one that is held in high regard, especially 

because you want to be a teacher. 

In order to touch students and be completely open towards them and their 

beliefs, it starts with the kind of person the teacher is. I think that you 

are in the right place at this time. You are in the right place to be a role 

model for your students and those around you. I think that if more people 

were open and comfortable with their own beliefs, there would be more 

understanding in the world. 

I think that students would be honored to have you as their teacher. A 

teacher that is a constant reminder that looking outside the bubble creates 

more ways to view and live different expereinces. 

I think your revelation is a model to us all...and a level for each of us to 

strive for. 

>From: Michael Renner 



>Subject: j:5 Look outside your bubble... 


> 

>Hola clase, 

> 

> I have been thinking more on the ideas of 

>perspectives and beliefs and how these things relate 

>to the way that I see the world and process 

>information. My beliefs are the foundation of my 

>thoughts, my perspective is the lens through which I 

>view things, and the filter through which new ideas 

>and information are processed. My perspective and 

>beliefs I have never seen as being static, they change 

>over time and with each new experience, each new idea 

>that I think and analyze my way through eventually 

>lead me to a point of understanding that feels true to 

>me. Along this journey to understanding, many things 

>change. Proof of this is that I am not the same 

>person, (intellectually, spiritually), that I was even 

>a year ago. So what have I allowed to change in me, 

>how have I changed, and what are the elements that 

>motivated change within myself to reach new levels in 

>life? 

> Part of the answer is that I am an open person. 

>By that I mean that I am open to new experiences and 

>new ideas, and that I am willing to try and understand 

>the ways that other people see and perceive things 

>differently than I might. I feel that it is from our 

>life experiences that the forms of our understanding 

>and how we perceive things in life take shape, and 

>sharing our modes of understanding with other open and 

>willing people is a valuable way of making deeper 

558

connections with, and understanding more about our own 

>perceptions and beliefs. I am willing to challenge 

>what I believe, not because I doubt the truth of my 

>beliefs or that I am seeking to adopt those of others, 

>but because I believe that looking at how my beliefs 

>stand up to other people’s experiences, which are 

>shared through and exist in their perceptions and 

>beliefs, only provides deeper insight and 

>understanding of my own… sometimes even changing them. 

> 

> 

>“Change has a considerable psychological impact on the 

>human mind. To the fearful it is threatening because 

>it means that things may get worse. To the hopeful it 

>is encouraging because things may get better. To the 

>confident it is inspiring because the challenge exists 

>to make things better.” -King Whitney Jr.- 

> 

> So how will I approach and react to my future 

>students and the beliefs and perspectives they bring 

>into the classroom? On what level will I engage in 

>opening myself up to gain deeper insight into their 

>experiences in relation to my own and expect them to 

>do the same? I am perplexed at the notion of creating 

>a classroom environment that not only honors students’ 

>beliefs and experiences, but also engages students to 

>question and consider, with openness, the beliefs and 

>experiences of others. I want for my future students 

>to feel secure in their beliefs, but also to expand 

>and modify these beliefs in order to change, to move 

>forward and grow. How do I do that if some of their 

>beliefs are not based on growth, openness, or possibly 

>even foster closing their minds to other beliefs or 

>notions? What if a foundation of some student’s 

>belief is to merely accept those of others as wrong or 

>misguided, but never be open to understanding them, or 

>even hear them. It would not be wrong for them to 

>close their minds, if that is their will. But where 

>does that leave me as their teacher? How would I 

>reach these children if my approach to teaching were 

>based on exploring, questioning, and understanding 

>beliefs other than their own based on what is believed 

>to be true by the individual? 

> Bubbles are beautiful to behold, but they become 

>prisons when we choose to live in and view the world 

>from within them. As a teacher, I hope to burst the 

>bubbles of as many students as I can. I want my 

>students to value looking at and doing things in 

>different ways. I understand that innovation and 

>effort on my part as a teacher may only go as far as 

>each individual will allow it to go and that I cannot 

>ask anyone to change or grow if they are not willing. 

>But as a teacher, I will have each class of students 

>for nine or so months of their lives. During that 

>time, what I can do is allow these students to know me 

>and learn from me what they will, and hopefully, from 

>the interests that I share with them and the growth 

>they will see me make, they too will consider looking 

>at and doing things differently…and maybe grow from 

>that. 

> 

> Michael 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 


559


>http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



560






Judith, 

Okay, hopefully we will all be quiet enough to hear what you have to say. 

It's your turn! 


>From: marti171 


>To: LBST 361B 

>Subject: journal 5 

>Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:06:09 -0800 

> 

>After the discussion on Wednesday, I started thinking about myself and the 

>way 

>I express myself. You all know that I am a quiet person and that I usually 

>do 

>not get engage in class conversations. That doesn’t mean that I am not 

>thinking; I am and I am listening to what you guys have to say about 

>different 

>topics. While I am listening I am formulating my own point of view and if I 

>have to say something I’ll say it (although I have not done this with you 

>guys). When I go out with my friends, they also know that I am quiet. But I 

>love it when everyone quiets down to listen to what I have to say. I don’t 

>like to talk just to talk or to argue with someone. I like to say what I 

>think 

>hoping people are listening to me and are learning something from and about 

>me. That’s what I try to do when I listen to others. I have a friend that 

>tells me to be more expressive about my ideas, beliefs and opinions and I 

>agree with him. However, it is going to take time for me to evolve. 

>Evolution 

>did not happen from one day to another, the same can be said about 

>attitudes, 

>opinions, beliefs and ideas. “Evolution is to me series with 

>development.”–Gladstone 

> 

>Since I mentioned evolution, I just want to say that I want to learn more 

>about it and also about creationism. I personally believe in God, and that 

>He 

>created men. The Bible says so in Genesis 2:7 “the LORD God formed the man 

>from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of 

>life, 

>and the man became a living being.” I am not going to say more about it 

>for 

>now, but I will be thinking on ways to express what I believe. 

> 

>Hasta luego, see ya later, 

> 

>Judith 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



561

562





Subject: Judith 

Judith, 

I am all ears whenever you need me to be.... I can only imagine that you have a lot to say. I value 

your thoughts. 

Ann 

_____ 



563





Subject: Re: My Journal (just my thoughts of the week) 

Robert, I love your poem!! You never seize to amaze me. By the way, I have your sunglasses in my 

car. 

Cynthia 


I was reading through the many posts and I was thinking about the discussion 

on wednesday. I found myself wanting to express myself in some other medium, 

so I wrote a poem. Anyway I hope that everyone is having a good weekend. 

This class is very heavy for me at points, but only because I let it. Hope 

you all like my poem and I look forward to seeing you on monday. 

LOSS OF SIGHT 

the eyes of humanity 

now retain their docile positions 

with retreat from all that is not true. 

yet with truth and relativity 

being both of friend and of foe, 

in the light the truth begins to become frail. 

it is within the all and the plenty, 

found around the outskirts of words, 

the exposed now becomes very real 

with a heartfelt sense of earth. 

knowledge held by one 

truth held by all 

earth beneath a foot 

collectively their 

eyes retain their docile positions. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



564





Subject: Re: Get scared 

I know exactly how you feel Marin. Even when we know that there is no one there and there is 

nothing to be afraid of we can still put ourselves into a physical state of panic. I really do believe that 

humans have mind over body control and that we just haven't figured out how to control it. 

Jenny Fiala 

565






Casey 

I think our fear comes from both natural instincts as well as society induced. I don't know how many 

times I have been able to watch the news and not seen a story about a violent crime committed 

against an innocent person at random and usually in or near their own homes. It makes us fear our 

own neighbors. This knowledge mixed with our natural animal instincts of 'fight or flight' causes a very 

real reaction in us to be on our guard when we are alone. Have you ever watched the Discovery 

channel with the herds of animals, they stay in herds because there is safety in numbers. I think we 

have this tendency as well. When there is no one there to watch our backs when we are vulnerable 

then we experience an intensified feeling of uneasiness. 

Jenny Fiala 

566







Today is Sunday and as I look at my window I see lots of rain. It kind of 

correlates to the feelings I had after Wednesday class. If I take anything 

away from that class it will be the statement that in order to help students 

we must find out how we learn. What I'm confused about is that how we learn 

seems to be based on our behaviors because it appears that behavior was the 

focal point of class. 

According to B.F. Skinner, learning is based on conditional circumstances in 

which rewards and punishments shape our behavior. So, in turn, we learn 

through our actions. We learn what is right and wrong based on the 

conditioning (reward and punishment) we receive throughout our lives. I guess 

what I'm trying to understand is that in order to discover how a child learns 

must we look at his/her behavior and base our assessment on that? 

How we deal with classmates also seem to connect to how we learn. I thought it 

rather unfair to place students with peers in the same group and disagree with 

that assumption. For example, an individual stated he only deals with peers 

that understand him because of the way he talks. That would be devastating in 

a classroom. Can you image only dealing with students that understand your way 

of speaking and forgetting the rest. I know that would not happen in a 

classroom, but I can understand that happening with peers. 

567





Subject: Re: Give me an infusion of the fake stuff!!!! 

WOW! I have worked with the FDA breathing down my neck before and I would have thought that 

they would allow this sort of experiment. All of our work had to be tested and retested under 

circumstances that would never really occur. They are usually very strict and we weren't even making 

stuff that could kill people if the device had a defect. I am surprised! I hope I am not a research 

project in some pharmaceutical company's search to become rich. 

Jenny Fiala 

568






Don't be offended Louise. I looked up the definition of 'alien' for you and this is what Mr. Webster 

says, "relating, belonging, or owing allegiance to another country or government". It is just a term that 

through the years of its use it has gotten a bad rapt for being used in unpleasant situations. Please 

don't take offense afterall we are all aliens to somewhere:) 

Jenny Fiala 

569





Subject: Re: Louise is an alien, sorry honey, but it's true. 

Okay this sucks... I am always behind in these damn emails. I came back to 56 emails in 2 days!!!!!!!! 

I cannot decide to start at the top of the list or the bottom because if I start at the top I don't know 

what you people are referring to and if I start and the bottom and start replying to them, someone else 

has usually already done that type of reply. FRUSTRATION SETTING IN!!!!!!!! By the way my in-law 

'aliens' are coming home today and my noodle is already fried from that so I think I am done here. 

ADIOS LOS LOCOS DE MI CEREBRO! Voy a leer los emails en espanol, solamente........ 

Jenny Fiala 

aaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh 

570






Oh man, 

what did i miss now.... I thought there was only jesus and darwin. is there a god now tooo........WHO 

ARE THESE PEOPLE????? 

571






Pink, huh? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA....... Just kidding Cynthia. I am sure you look great in pink even 

though I have never seen you in it. 

:) Jenny Fiala 

572






Does anyone wonder how the roles of men and women came about in the beginning of time?? I often 

wonder how the conversation went. "Well, you see i got these parts and you got those parts so I am 

the stronger sex and so I am in charge." I wonder..... And what about the species of animals in which 

the are matriarchal societies and males just come into the picture during mating season and then they 

are shoved out again so that the females live prosperous happy lives. Well, all I know is that if the first 

woman had been more vocal and said, " Ya, well you may have more parts, but I have obviously got 

the bigger brain so I am in charge." I wonder how the world would be today??? 

Jenny Fiala 

573






Nah, 

you just come in drunk huh? HAHA Just kiddin 

Jenny Fiala 

574





Subject: RE: j:5 Look outside your bubble... 

Wow! Michael that is really cool. You will be a great teacher and you are 

an understanding human. 




>Subject: j:5 Look outside your bubble... 


> 

>Hola clase, 

> 

> I have been thinking more on the ideas of 

>perspectives and beliefs and how these things relate 

>to the way that I see the world and process 

>information. My beliefs are the foundation of my 

>thoughts, my perspective is the lens through which I 

>view things, and the filter through which new ideas 

>and information are processed. My perspective and 

>beliefs I have never seen as being static, they change 

>over time and with each new experience, each new idea 

>that I think and analyze my way through eventually 

>lead me to a point of understanding that feels true to 

>me. Along this journey to understanding, many things 

>change. Proof of this is that I am not the same 

>person, (intellectually, spiritually), that I was even 

>a year ago. So what have I allowed to change in me, 

>how have I changed, and what are the elements that 

>motivated change within myself to reach new levels in 

>life? 

> Part of the answer is that I am an open person. 

>By that I mean that I am open to new experiences and 

>new ideas, and that I am willing to try and understand 

>the ways that other people see and perceive things 

>differently than I might. I feel that it is from our 

>life experiences that the forms of our understanding 

>and how we perceive things in life take shape, and 

>sharing our modes of understanding with other open and 

>willing people is a valuable way of making deeper 

>connections with, and understanding more about our own 

>perceptions and beliefs. I am willing to challenge 

>what I believe, not because I doubt the truth of my 

>beliefs or that I am seeking to adopt those of others, 

>but because I believe that looking at how my beliefs 

>stand up to other people’s experiences, which are 

>shared through and exist in their perceptions and 

>beliefs, only provides deeper insight and 

>understanding of my own… sometimes even changing them. 

> 

> 

>“Change has a considerable psychological impact on the 

>human mind. To the fearful it is threatening because 

>it means that things may get worse. To the hopeful it 

>is encouraging because things may get better. To the 

>confident it is inspiring because the challenge exists 

>to make things better.” -King Whitney Jr.- 

575

> So how will I approach and react to my future 

>students and the beliefs and perspectives they bring 

>into the classroom? On what level will I engage in 

>opening myself up to gain deeper insight into their 

>experiences in relation to my own and expect them to 

>do the same? I am perplexed at the notion of creating 

>a classroom environment that not only honors students’ 

>beliefs and experiences, but also engages students to 

>question and consider, with openness, the beliefs and 

>experiences of others. I want for my future students 

>to feel secure in their beliefs, but also to expand 

>and modify these beliefs in order to change, to move 

>forward and grow. How do I do that if some of their 

>beliefs are not based on growth, openness, or possibly 

>even foster closing their minds to other beliefs or 

>notions? What if a foundation of some student’s 

>belief is to merely accept those of others as wrong or 

>misguided, but never be open to understanding them, or 

>even hear them. It would not be wrong for them to 

>close their minds, if that is their will. But where 

>does that leave me as their teacher? How would I 

>reach these children if my approach to teaching were 

>based on exploring, questioning, and understanding 

>beliefs other than their own based on what is believed 

>to be true by the individual? 

> Bubbles are beautiful to behold, but they become 

>prisons when we choose to live in and view the world 

>from within them. As a teacher, I hope to burst the 

>bubbles of as many students as I can. I want my 

>students to value looking at and doing things in 

>different ways. I understand that innovation and 

>effort on my part as a teacher may only go as far as 

>each individual will allow it to go and that I cannot 

>ask anyone to change or grow if they are not willing. 

>But as a teacher, I will have each class of students 

>for nine or so months of their lives. During that 

>time, what I can do is allow these students to know me 

>and learn from me what they will, and hopefully, from 

>the interests that I share with them and the growth 

>they will see me make, they too will consider looking 

>at and doing things differently…and maybe grow from 

>that. 

> 

> Michael 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 




> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



576





Subject: RE: Change/ Laurie 

I see what you mean. That we learn from things of the past in it's original 

unchanged 

version. But we are learning about somthing of the past, it happened already 

so we are 

not re-living it we are observing it as it was, so I see that as a change. 

Also people 

observe things of the past on different levels but there are always minor 

changes over 

time or even things that were written a long time ago even very small changes, 

changes 

that we may add and not even notice just by the way we learn about things and 

make 

connections to it with our own lives. The change can be so minor as to who is 

reading 

what from the past and how they percieve it. Where we were in the past and 

where we 

are going in the future is change maybe not in content but the day has changes 

and 

there is a change in who is learning about what. I have to tell ya something 

funny, When I 

wrote the quote in the journal I was taling about change as in coins, money. 

But it is cool 

that you saw it how you saw it. Marin 

>I don't believe that the only thing that you can count on is change. I think 

>learning from our past history can tells us where we are today, like a 

>society, and where we migth go in the future. Not everything changes. 

> 

>Laurie :) 

> 

>>===== Original Message From tinne002 ===== 

>>I love watching my thoughts evolve. it cracks me up the way I believe and 

>>understand 

>>one thing then discover something different the next day. It keeps life 

>>exciting but it 

>>makes me wonder if I will ever know if something is for sure. Do I even need 

>>to know if 

>>things are for sure? life suddenly feels very airy and free for thoughts to 

>>flow through and 

>>change as they like. I guess we just need to catch a thought observe it, 

>>question it, 

>>predict, hypothsis, test, then evaluate it. Then we either let it be or else 

>>go throught the 

>>scientific method again and take to an unexplored level. 

>> 

>>Remeber the only thing you can count on is change. 

>> 

>>Cynthia, a while ago you were writing about alien gangs being abducted by 

>>illegal aliens 

>>then forming one big gang. I was wondering why you put illegal aliens with 

>>alien gangs. 

>>Aliens are not illegal and we do not know if they are human like. And 

illegal 

>>aliens are 

577


>>question if it is 

>>okay to put them in the same group as aliens. I may be way off, just 

>seeking 

>>clarity on 

>>the comment. Marin 

578






Marin are we truly observing history as it was, or are we observing history 

as it was interpreted? 




>Subject: RE: Change/ Laurie 

>Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 15:06:33 -0800 

> 

>I see what you mean. That we learn from things of the past in it's original 

>unchanged 

>version. But we are learning about somthing of the past, it happened 

>already 

>so we are 

>not re-living it we are observing it as it was, so I see that as a change. 

>Also people 

>observe things of the past on different levels but there are always minor 

>changes over 

>time or even things that were written a long time ago even very small 

>changes, 

>changes 

>that we may add and not even notice just by the way we learn about things 

>and 

>make 

>connections to it with our own lives. The change can be so minor as to who 

>is 

>reading 

>what from the past and how they percieve it. Where we were in the past and 

>where we 

>are going in the future is change maybe not in content but the day has 

>changes 

>and 

>there is a change in who is learning about what. I have to tell ya 

>something 

>funny, When I 

>wrote the quote in the journal I was taling about change as in coins, 

>money. 

>But it is cool 

>that you saw it how you saw it. Marin 

> 

> 

> 

> >I don't believe that the only thing that you can count on is change. I 

>think 

> >learning from our past history can tells us where we are today, like a 

> >society, and where we migth go in the future. Not everything changes. 

> > 

> >Laurie :) 

> > 

> >>===== Original Message From tinne002 ===== 

> >>I love watching my thoughts evolve. it cracks me up the way I believe 

>and 

> >>understand 

> >>one thing then discover something different the next day. It keeps life 

> >>exciting but it 

579

makes me wonder if I will ever know if something is for sure. Do I even 

>need 

> >>to know if 

> >>things are for sure? life suddenly feels very airy and free for thoughts 

>to 

> >>flow through and 

> >>change as they like. I guess we just need to catch a thought observe it, 

> >>question it, 

> >>predict, hypothsis, test, then evaluate it. Then we either let it be or 

>else 

> >>go throught the 

> >>scientific method again and take to an unexplored level. 

> >> 

> >>Remeber the only thing you can count on is change. 

> >> 

> >>Cynthia, a while ago you were writing about alien gangs being abducted 

>by 

> >>illegal aliens 

> >>then forming one big gang. I was wondering why you put illegal aliens 

>with 

> >>alien gangs. 

> >>Aliens are not illegal and we do not know if they are human like. And 

>illegal 

> >>aliens are 

> >>human beings, yes here illegally but they are humans with feelings and I 

> >>question if it is 

> >>okay to put them in the same group as aliens. I may be way off, just 

> >seeking 

> >>clarity on 

> >>the comment. Marin 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



580





Dear class, 

Sagan's explanation of "copycat" crimes is one that is pretty familiar to 

people in our day in age and known as "urban legends" thanks to the media in 

the united states andn i'm sure most of us have experiences our own such as 

someone at the club Ice House got stuck with a needle that said welcome to the 

world of aids or the infamous wake up in ice with no kidneys but it is playing 

to our fears and they are doing a good job. gotta go the library is closed. 

Matheno 

581






Actually, when you learn about the past, you are only getting someone's interpretation of what 

happened. For example, history books. It all depends on the author and their viewpoint, not the actual 

events. Their truth might not be someone else's truth. I think if you read a Japanese text about 

WW11, you might think of it differently than if you read an American text or one from other countries. 

But if you are talking about your personal past, your memory of events can change over time as well. 

You make think about an event in one way, then somewhere down the line, you might think of it 

differently because other experiences have changed your thinking. Cynthia 



unchanged 


so we are 


Also people 


changes over 


changes 


make 


reading 


where we 


and 

there is a change in who is learning about what . I have to tell ya something 

funny, When I 







> 

>Laurie :) 

> 



>>understand 

582




>>to know if 








>> 


>> 






illegal 

>>aliens are 

>>human beings, yes here illegally but they are humans with feelings and I 



>seeking 

>>clarity on 


_____ 



583






Well I think we are observing history as it was interpreted, and then we 

interpret the 

interpretation into a way that we can understand it. So Im sure there has be 

some 

change. 

>Marin are we truly observing history as it was, or are we observing history 

>as it was interpreted? 

> 

> 

>>From: tinne002 



>>Subject: RE: Change/ Laurie 

>>Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 15:06:33 -0800 

>> 

>>I see what you mean. That we learn from things of the past in it's original 

>>unchanged 

>>version. But we are learning about somthing of the past, it happened 

>>already 

>>so we are 

>>not re-living it we are observing it as it was, so I see that as a change. 

>>Also people 

>>observe things of the past on different levels but there are always minor 

>>changes over 

>>time or even things that were written a long time ago even very small 

>>changes, 

>>changes 

>>that we may add and not even notice just by the way we learn about things 

>>and 

>>make 

>>connections to it with our own lives. The change can be so minor as to who 

>>is 

>>reading 

>>what from the past and how they percieve it. Where we were in the past and 

>>where we 

>>are going in the future is change maybe not in content but the day has 

>>changes 

>>and 

>>there is a change in who is learning about what. I have to tell ya 

>>something 

>>funny, When I 

>>wrote the quote in the journal I was taling about change as in coins, 

>>money. 

>>But it is cool 

>>that you saw it how you saw it. Marin 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> >I don't believe that the only thing that you can count on is change. I 

>>think 

>> >learning from our past history can tells us where we are today, like a 

>> >society, and where we migth go in the future. Not everything changes. 

>> > 

584

Laurie :) 

>> > 

>> >>===== Original Message From tinne002 ===== 

>> >>I love watching my thoughts evolve. it cracks me up the way I believe 

>>and 

>> >>understand 

>> >>one thing then discover something different the next day. It keeps life 

>> >>exciting but it 

>> >>makes me wonder if I will ever know if something is for sure. Do I even 

>>need 

>> >>to know if 

>> >>things are for sure? life suddenly feels very airy and free for thoughts 

>>to 

>> >>flow through and 

>> >>change as they like. I guess we just need to catch a thought observe it, 

>> >>question it, 

>> >>predict, hypothsis, test, then evaluate it. Then we either let it be or 

>>else 

>> >>go throught the 

>> >>scientific method again and take to an unexplored level. 

>> >> 

>> >>Remeber the only thing you can count on is change. 

>> >> 

>> >>Cynthia, a while ago you were writing about alien gangs being abducted 

>>by 

>> >>illegal aliens 

>> >>then forming one big gang. I was wondering why you put illegal aliens 

>>with 

>> >>alien gangs. 

>> >>Aliens are not illegal and we do not know if they are human like. And 

>>illegal 

>> >>aliens are 

>> >>human beings, yes here illegally but they are humans with feelings and I 

>> >>question if it is 

>> >>okay to put them in the same group as aliens. I may be way off, just 

>> >seeking 

>> >>clarity on 

>> >>the comment. Marin 

>> 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



585






Thank you! You always have a way of finding the positive and making people smile :) I really like the 

definition you found in Webster's too. I think you're right about how the word "alien" has received 

such a bad rapt and it's interesting how the word "alien" can incorporate so many different aspects 

(illegal, foreign, outer space etc.). 

TTFN ~ Louise 


From: Kaylee102595@aol.com [mailto:Kaylee102595@aol.com] 




Don't be offended Louise. I looked up the definition of 'alien' for you and this is what Mr. Webster 

says, "relating, belonging, or owing allegiance to another country or government". It is just a term 

that through the years of its use it has gotten a bad rapt for being used in unpleasant situations. 

Please don't take offense afterall we are all aliens to somewhere:) 

Jenny Fiala 

586






Cynthia, this is so true. Receiving my education in England, I learned about historical facts from the English point of view. 

Any maps in an English text book will show England at the center of the globe, just as an American map shows America 

at the center of the globe. Sorry - got off my original thoughts there.... Okay - I'm back on track... So, I took a history 

class shortly after arriving in the U.S. and I couldn't believe how the text books and the professor professed such utter 

propaganda (at least in my mind) and I told the professor so. He brought to class a bunch of history books related to the 

20th century that were written from different countries but had been translated in English. After reviewing the books, the 

whole class was dumbfounded when we realized that the same events i.e. WWII had been written about so completely 

differently depending on whose point of view it was being interpreted from (kinda wordy - sorry!). I then understood, that it 

wasn't just the American historians who were full of propaganda, it stemmed from every country. Everything is open to 

interpretation that is why effective communication is just so important. Gotta get the kids in bed so I'll get back to the 

listserver later. ~ Louise 






Actually, when you learn about the past, you are only getting someone's interpretation of what 

happened. For example, history books. It all depends on the author and their viewpoint, not the 

actual events. Their truth might not be someone else's truth. I think if you read a Japanese text 

about WW11, you might think of it differently than if you read an American text or one from other 

countries. But if you are talking about your personal past, your memory of events can change over 

time as well. You make think about an event in one way, then somewhere down the line, you 

might think of it differently because other experiences have changed your thinking. Cynthia 



unchanged 


so we are 


Also people 


changes over 


changes 


make 


reading 


where we 


and 

587

_____ 

there is a change in who is learning about what . I have to tell ya something 

funny, When I 







> 

>Laurie :) 

> 



>>understand 

>>one thing then discover something different the next day. It keeps life 



>>to know if 








>> 


>> 






illegal 

>>aliens are 

>>human beings, yes here illegally but they are humans with feelings and I 



>seeking 

>>clarity on 




588





Subject: Things that make you go HMMMM! (journal #5) 

After reading all the journals it is obvious that we have a few threads being 

woven throughout. Certain people respond to certain journals. I chose not to 

respond to the journals for many reasons, one of them being because I think 

that it is difficult to know if someone is being sarcastic or mean with the 

words they chose to write. I would much rather talk to people in person so 

they could look me in the eyes when we discuss certain matters. 

I was thinking (yes, it hurt my brain because I haven't done it in awhile!) 

What if aliens from another planet are una-sex and either mate could get 

pregnant or plant their seed? They would be looking in on us thinking that 

the same sex marriage is no big deal and that it wouldn't matter who married 

who. That changes the whole theory of how marriage and procreation happens on 

other planets. And if God created the universe then he created them to be 

uni-sex and then he is okay with same sex marriages. 

A true scary story- I babysat for a family that lived in a decent 

neighborhood, but there was a barrio a few streets away. Often groups of men 

would roam the streets and were caught looking in peoples windows. There was 

a neighborhood watch program and I felt fairly safe in the house. The parents 

were always out late and so I often fell asleep with the kids or on the couch. 

I heard a rattling on the glass back door, it woke me up. I thought it was 

probably the wind, but decided to go check anyway. As I was helping myself to 

the refrigerator the electricity went out. I ran over to the window to see if 

other neighbor's homes were out and all the lights were on. I started to 

panic, I got my purse with my cell phone and ran into the kids room and locked 

the door. I called my big brother that lived down the street and told him 

someone is trying to break in. He came over with a bat and a few friends. In 

the mean time I called the parents and told them, they rushed home. When 

everyone arrived at the house including the police, they found numerous 

peoples foot prints all around the property and wet foot prints at every door. 

They were never able to explain how the electricity was knocked out. But I am 

glad that I had every door locked and had my cell phone. It took me a month to 

go back and baby-sit for that family again. 

After writing that I thought to myself, holy sneakers! I live all by myself 

now and although I give myself a fright every once in awhile I still manage to 

keep it cool, until just now after that story which made me go make sure my 

door was locked and then I locked myself in my bedroom. 

I was reading my social psychology books and came across some interesting 

thoughts I would like to share... 

In regards to people's beliefs and such- 

"We are eager to verify our beliefs but less inclined to seek evidence that 

might disprove them. We call this phenomenon the CONFIRMATION BIAS." (Myers, 

2000) I thought this related to what Yamashita was saying in class last time, 

but here is scientific research that says we actually do it. 

Here is a question for anyone that has read all the way to here without 

erasing it- 

Do attitudes predict behavior or does behavior predict attitude???? 

-Thanks for reading! See you in class. 

Chula 

589

590





Subject: Re: Things that make you go HMMM! 

Re: Confirmation Bias 

Assuming psycological research is scientific, then it may support it. 

Re: Attitude/Behavior 

I think someone's behavior can affect my attitude, which is based on my attitude caused by behavior. 

But then, I think my attitude could affect someone's behavior as well, depending on their attitude. 

Cynthia 


After reading all the journals it is obvious that we have a few threads being 

woven throughout. Certain people respond to certain journals. I chose not to 

respond to the journals for many reasons, one of them being because I think 

that it is difficult to know if someone is being sarcastic or mean with the 

words they chose to write. I would much rather talk to people in person so 

they could look me in the eyes when we discuss certain matters. 

I was thinking (yes, it hurt my brain because I haven't done it in awhile!) 

What if aliens from another planet are uni-sex and either mate could get 

pregnant or plant their seed? They would be looking in on us thinking that 

the same sex marriage is no big deal and that it wouldn't matter who married 

who. That changes the whole theory of how marriage and procreation happens on 

other planets. An d if God created the universe then he created them to be 

uni-sex and then he is okay with same sex marriages. 

A true scary story- I babysat for a family that lived in a decent 

neighborhood, but there was a bario a few streets away. Often groups of men 

would roam the streets and were caught looking in peoples windows. There was 

a neighborhood watch program and I felt fairly safe in the house. The parents 

were always out late and so I often fell asleep with the kids or on the couch. 

I heard a rattling on the glass back door, it woke me up. I thought it was 

probably the wind, but decided to go check anyway. As I was helping myself to 

the refridgerator the electricity went out. I ran over to the window to see if 

other neighbor's homes were out and all the lights were on. I started to 

panic, I got my purse with my cell phone and ran into the kids room and locked 

the door. I called my big brother that lived down the street and told him 

someone is trying to break in. He came over with a bat and a few friends. In 

the mean time I called the parents and told them, they rushed home. When 

everyone arrived at the house including the police, they found numberous 

peoples foot prints all around the property and wet foot prints at every door. 

They were never able to explain how the electricity was knocked out. But I am 

glad that I had every door locked and had my cell phone. It took me a month to 

go back and babysit for that family again. 

After writing that I thought to myself, holy sneakers! I live all by myself 

now and although I give myself a fright every once in awhile I still manage to 

591

keep it cool, until just now after that story which made me go make sure my 

door was locked and then I locked myself in my bedroom. 

I was reading my social psychology books and came across some interesting 

thoughts I would like to share... 

In regards to people's beliefs and such- "We are eager to verify our beliefs but less inclined to 

seek evidence that 

might disprove them. We call this phenominon the CONFIRMATION BIAS." (Myers, 

2000) I thought this related to what Yamashita was saying in class last time, 

but here is scientific research that says we actually do it. 

Here is a question for anyone that has read all the way to here without 

erasing it- 

Do attitudes predict behavior or does behavior predict attitude???? 

-Thanks for reading! See you in class. 

Chula 

_____ 



592






Michael 

I share a lot of your thoughts. I guess i've never really thought about them 

as deep as you have. But thanks for bringing this to my attention :) I do 

have to say that I am pretty open to new ideas and new perspectives on life 

and for this matter change in general. I've got into some heated discussions 

with some friends about change and "looking outside" the bubble and to my 

surprise I am amazed at how comfortable people are within their bubble. On 

many occassions while talking to friends, family, classmates, etc. i've 

stopped and thought about that certain situation from another point of view. 

I know i don't voice my opinion but it doesn't mean that I don't think about 

things. Looking back the reason I am at CSUSM right now is because I needed 

a change in my life and to see things beyond where I grew up. I knew the 

world had more to offer outside of where I was living. 

As a future teacher I would like to think that I can help my students view 

things from different perspectives. Its okay to have your own beliefs, but I 

think you should be open to different views. No one said you had to believe 

them, just be willing to listen or consider another side. Well, Michael I 

think your going to make a great teacher! 




>Subject: RE: j:5 Look outside your bubble... 

>Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 19:47:31 -0800 

> 

>Michael, 

> 

>I am amazed at reading how you have changed and opened up as a person. That 

>is a great accomplishment and one that is held in high regard, especially 

>because you want to be a teacher. 

> 

>In order to touch students and be completely open towards them and their 

>beliefs, it starts with the kind of person the teacher is. I think that you 

>are in the right place at this time. You are in the right place to be a 

>role model for your students and those around you. I think that if more 

>people were open and comfortable with their own beliefs, there would be 

>more understanding in the world. 

> 

>I think that students would be honored to have you as their teacher. A 

>teacher that is a constant reminder that looking outside the bubble creates 

>more ways to view and live different expereinces. 

> 

>I think your revelation is a model to us all...and a level for each of us 

>to strive for. 

> 

> 

>>From: Michael Renner 



>>Subject: j:5 Look outside your bubble... 

>>Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 10:33:17 -0800 (PST) 

>> 

>>Hola clase, 

>> 

593

I have been thinking more on the ideas of 

>>perspectives and beliefs and how these things relate 

>>to the way that I see the world and process 

>>information. My beliefs are the foundation of my 

>>thoughts, my perspective is the lens through which I 

>>view things, and the filter through which new ideas 

>>and information are processed. My perspective and 

>>beliefs I have never seen as being static, they change 

>>over time and with each new experience, each new idea 

>>that I think and analyze my way through eventually 

>>lead me to a point of understanding that feels true to 

>>me. Along this journey to understanding, many things 

>>change. Proof of this is that I am not the same 

>>person, (intellectually, spiritually), that I was even 

>>a year ago. So what have I allowed to change in me, 

>>how have I changed, and what are the elements that 

>>motivated change within myself to reach new levels in 

>>life? 

>> Part of the answer is that I am an open person. 

>>By that I mean that I am open to new experiences and 

>>new ideas, and that I am willing to try and understand 

>>the ways that other people see and perceive things 

>>differently than I might. I feel that it is from our 

>>life experiences that the forms of our understanding 

>>and how we perceive things in life take shape, and 

>>sharing our modes of understanding with other open and 

>>willing people is a valuable way of making deeper 

>>connections with, and understanding more about our own 

>>perceptions and beliefs. I am willing to challenge 

>>what I believe, not because I doubt the truth of my 

>>beliefs or that I am seeking to adopt those of others, 

>>but because I believe that looking at how my beliefs 

>>stand up to other people’s experiences, which are 

>>shared through and exist in their perceptions and 

>>beliefs, only provides deeper insight and 

>>understanding of my own… sometimes even changing them. 

>> 

>> 

>>“Change has a considerable psychological impact on the 

>>human mind. To the fearful it is threatening because 

>>it means that things may get worse. To the hopeful it 

>>is encouraging because things may get better. To the 

>>confident it is inspiring because the challenge exists 

>>to make things better.” -King Whitney Jr.- 

>> 

>> So how will I approach and react to my future 

>>students and the beliefs and perspectives they bring 

>>into the classroom? On what level will I engage in 

>>opening myself up to gain deeper insight into their 

>>experiences in relation to my own and expect them to 

>>do the same? I am perplexed at the notion of creating 

>>a classroom environment that not only honors students’ 

>>beliefs and experiences, but also engages students to 

>>question and consider, with openness, the beliefs and 

>>experiences of others. I want for my future students 

>>to feel secure in their beliefs, but also to expand 

>>and modify these beliefs in order to change, to move 

>>forward and grow. How do I do that if some of their 

>>beliefs are not based on growth, openness, or possibly 

>>even foster closing their minds to other beliefs or 

>>notions? What if a foundation of some student’s 

>>belief is to merely accept those of others as wrong or 

>>misguided, but never be open to understanding them, or 

>>even hear them. It would not be wrong for them to 

>>close their minds, if that is their will. But where 

>>does that leave me as their teacher? How would I 

594

each these children if my approach to teaching were 

>>based on exploring, questioning, and understanding 

>>beliefs other than their own based on what is believed 

>>to be true by the individual? 

>> Bubbles are beautiful to behold, but they become 

>>prisons when we choose to live in and view the world 

>>from within them. As a teacher, I hope to burst the 

>>bubbles of as many students as I can. I want my 

>>students to value looking at and doing things in 

>>different ways. I understand that innovation and 

>>effort on my part as a teacher may only go as far as 

>>each individual will allow it to go and that I cannot 

>>ask anyone to change or grow if they are not willing. 

>>But as a teacher, I will have each class of students 

>>for nine or so months of their lives. During that 

>>time, what I can do is allow these students to know me 

>>and learn from me what they will, and hopefully, from 

>>the interests that I share with them and the growth 

>>they will see me make, they too will consider looking 

>>at and doing things differently…and maybe grow from 

>>that. 

>> 

>> Michael 

>> 

>> 

>>__________________________________ 


>>Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. 

>>http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools 

>> 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Watch high-quality video with fast playback at MSN Video. Free! 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Find and compare great deals on Broadband access at the MSN High-Speed 


595





Subject: Re: Things that make you go HMMMM! (journal #5) 

Hey Chula, 

Yes I read your whole email. I believe the answer to your question, for me atleast, is the first one, 

'attitudes predict behavior". For example, if I go into a situation with a negative attitude already, I most 

likely won't have a good experience. 

Jenny Fiala 

596





Subject: RE: My Journal (just my thoughts of the week) 

Thanks Robert 

Much better than reading a bunch of paragraphs 

>From: "Robert Atchison" 



>Subject: My Journal (just my thoughts of the week) 

>Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:45:36 -0800 

> 

>I was reading through the many posts and I was thinking about the 

>discussion on wednesday. I found myself wanting to express myself in some 

>other medium, so I wrote a poem. Anyway I hope that everyone is having a 

>good weekend. This class is very heavy for me at points, but only because I 

>let it. Hope you all like my poem and I look forward to seeing you on 

>monday. 

> 

>LOSS OF SIGHT 

> 

>the eyes of humanity 

>now retain their docile positions 

>with retreat from all that is not true. 

> 

>yet with truth and relativity 

>being both of friend and of foe, 

>in the light the truth begins to become frail. 

> 

>it is within the all and the plenty, 

>found around the outskirts of words, 

>the exposed now becomes very real 

>with a heartfelt sense of earth. 

> 

>knowledge held by one 

>truth held by all 

>earth beneath a foot 

> 

>collectively their 

>eyes retain their docile positions. 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Watch high-quality video with fast playback at MSN Video. Free! 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



597





Subject: So much we don't know...Journal 5 

I was watching a documentary of the Munich Massacre today (during the 

Olympic games of nineteen seventy two). It documented the Palestinian 

terrorist attack on the Israel athletes during the Summer Olympics Games of 

1972. As I was watching the documentary, I remember being perplexed that I 

did not know about this (maybe because it was before I was born) but it 

reminded me about a point I brought up in one of our recent class sessions 

when we were discussing about how we never heard of the flu pandemic of 

1918, unitl now. 

It brought me back to thinking about how much information we, as a society, 

are not privy to. I sit here and think about how much we do not know about. 

We are kept from the "confidential" information that the government keeps 

only to themselves. Sometimes, it is information that no one will admit 

exists. Information that "accidentally" gets lost or is hidden so far below 

all of the other government secrets, it is almost as if it were forgetten 

about completely. So I continue to wonder why society is only given 

information that is filtered. Information that is "approved" by our 

government to be let out and leaked to the public. 

Now I know the government is not a total conspiracy, but.... No really, it's 

just mind boggling to think about how much we are controlled. Thinking about 

it reminds me of the book, The Giver, by Lois Lowry. The government of their 

community made all of the rules so that their community could be perfect. 

Everything was uniform, everyone had a certain function, a certain job 

within the community to make it run smoothly and stay perfect. Maybe this is 

why our society does not know about the CIA, government, and "men in black". 

Are they trying to keep us from rising up and disrupting the society that 

they have constructed for us to live in? 

On the other hand, I know that if we really knew everything we would all go 

mad and there probably would be complete and utter chaos. Maybe the 

government is filtering and keeping information from us for our own good. 

They just want to protect us, right? They're looking out for our own good. 

(I'm smiling.) 

So how does this new realization of mine relate to our future profession as 

teachers? I think it just reminds me to never stop learning as much as I 

possibly can. Knowledge is power. (Sorry for the cliche). But I think that 

the key to learning is to truly absorb as much information as possible. It 

might not always be information that we want to know, but it is important. 

As members of society, I think that more one knows the more well rounded 

they are. 

Now even if we all don't think it's all a conspiracy, I truly do believe 

that it is good to learn as much information as we possible can. The good, 

the bad, and the ugly. 

Just something else to ponder. 

~Jennfer Ramos 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Click, drag and drop. My MSN is the simple way to design your homepage. 


598

599






Hi class 

Something didn’t sit well with me after our class on Wednesday. I had a 

hard time with it because I felt like I was being called out to be more 

expressive with my thought and beliefs. I’ve known that I am not expressive 

in groups (I didn’t need this exercise to figure that out). I think that 

giving your thoughts is important, but when it comes to beliefs I have 

difficulty. In a group there are so many different beliefs and ideas that 

when one belief is shared many are there to question them. This has been 

shown on our list serve. After reading many journals I do have thoughts on 

what is being said but have never sent those comments back to those people. 

I have found that it is easier to keep my thought to myself rather than risk 

the uncertainty of how the other will receive it. This is a lot safer way 

to live, and that has been my argument for why I keep to myself in groups. 

This I guess this would be like living in a bubble. The thought of that 

upsets me because I know that I am an open person. I am not static in my 

beliefs and I enjoy listening and internalizing what others have to say 

about their beliefs. My problem is that I don’t allow others to do the same 

with me. I don’t give others the opportunity to see what is going on inside 

me. I am beginning to realize that it is worse to say nothing and 

experience no rejection than it is to say something and have a chance of 

being rejected. Being more expressive is a process I have been working on 

for quite some time, and have become comfortable with it in one on one 

situation. I think I was upset after class because I realized I needed a 

lot more work. I have found in life you can never be comfortable with who 

you are as an individual. Every time I feel that I am happy with whom I am 

something like Wednesdays class shows me that I am far from the person I 

have the potential to be. I am happy for the discomfort life brings me and 

the change it brings on me, I’m just not to thrilled on making that change. 

I have more to say, but like I said I’m not that expressive. 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 



600





Subject: So much you don't know. 

I'm at work so this will be very brief. Just because we don't know something 

doesn't mean we are being kept in the dark. If you hear about something like 

the 1918 flu, or "Munich Massacre," and say "Hey, how come I never heard of 

that before?" then it is due to your own lack of desire to learn, not of a 

conspiracy. If there is a book written on something that you can buy at 

Waldenbooks, then it is NOT being covered up by the government! I don't know 

why everyone assumes that they should know everything that has happened in 

history, and if they haven't heard of it by now, it must be through the 

fault of someone else. You only learn what you are told unless you go out 

looking for your own information. If there is a published book on it, it's 

not a cover-up. If you know enough about X to say "How come the history 

books don't talk about X?" then it is not being hidden from you, you just 

haven't chosen to learn more about it. The only things that are truly 

covered up are things NO ONE has ever heard of. And Jenifer, while your 

e-mail did spark me to reply, don't take this as a personal affront. This is 

aimed at the entire class. Yamashita always says "why haven't we heard about 

this?" in regards to the flu. The answer is because before this class, NO 

ONE CARED! I still don't, the end. 





>Subject: So much we don't know...Journal 5 

>Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 23:56:05 -0800 

> 

> 

>I was watching a documentary of the Munich Massacre today (during the 

>Olympic games of nineteen seventy two). It documented the Palestinian 

>terrorist attack on the Israel athletes during the Summer Olympics Games of 

>1972. As I was watching the documentary, I remember being perplexed that I 

>did not know about this (maybe because it was before I was born) but it 

>reminded me about a point I brought up in one of our recent class sessions 

>when we were discussing about how we never heard of the flu pandemic of 

>1918, unitl now. 

> 

>It brought me back to thinking about how much information we, as a society, 

>are not privy to. I sit here and think about how much we do not know about. 

>We are kept from the "confidential" information that the government keeps 

>only to themselves. Sometimes, it is information that no one will admit 

>exists. Information that "accidentally" gets lost or is hidden so far below 

>all of the other government secrets, it is almost as if it were forgetten 

>about completely. So I continue to wonder why society is only given 

>information that is filtered. Information that is "approved" by our 

>government to be let out and leaked to the public. 

> 

>Now I know the government is not a total conspiracy, but.... No really, 

>it's just mind boggling to think about how much we are controlled. Thinking 

>about it reminds me of the book, The Giver, by Lois Lowry. The government 

>of their community made all of the rules so that their community could be 

>perfect. Everything was uniform, everyone had a certain function, a certain 

>job within the community to make it run smoothly and stay perfect. Maybe 

>this is why our society does not know about the CIA, government, and "men 

>in black". Are they trying to keep us from rising up and disrupting the 

601

society that they have constructed for us to live in? 

> 

>On the other hand, I know that if we really knew everything we would all go 

>mad and there probably would be complete and utter chaos. Maybe the 

>government is filtering and keeping information from us for our own good. 

>They just want to protect us, right? They're looking out for our own good. 

>(I'm smiling.) 

> 

>So how does this new realization of mine relate to our future profession as 

>teachers? I think it just reminds me to never stop learning as much as I 

>possibly can. Knowledge is power. (Sorry for the cliche). But I think that 

>the key to learning is to truly absorb as much information as possible. It 

>might not always be information that we want to know, but it is important. 

>As members of society, I think that more one knows the more well rounded 

>they are. 

> 

>Now even if we all don't think it's all a conspiracy, I truly do believe 

>that it is good to learn as much information as we possible can. The good, 

>the bad, and the ugly. 

> 

>Just something else to ponder. 

> 

>~Jennfer Ramos 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Click, drag and drop. My MSN is the simple way to design your homepage. 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



602





Subject: Re: So much you don't know. 

Mike, 

I think you're involved in a conspiracy. I think we are all being tested as to how long we can survive in 

this school and you are there as a comic relief when some of us are just about to give up:) Thanks! 

Jenny Fiala 

603




To: ICP-F; Kaylee102595@aol.com 

Subject: RE: Get scared- Casey Cunningham 

First, this scared thing. I love trying to trick myself that there might be 

someone there in my house. I can imagine things in my head and what would I 

do. Any time, I hear the cats run through the house, I just imagine that it 

might not be just the cats. I love it. Probably because my life is so boring 

that I need to make drama in my head. There is a slight adrenline rush and I 

love that. It is the same thing when people go on rollercoaster. I think it is 

so funny that you all don't enjoy your imagination. 

604




To: ICP-F 


I totally agree with the people in the class that had a problem on last 

wednesdays class when we talked about our thoughts and our beliefs. First of 

all I am not a person that talks a lot in class and their is a reasom for that 

I personally do not feel that I am up to some of your guys intelligence. I 

feel that when I talk in class it is short and to the point because then I 

dont have to do in to detail and explain. When we talked in class about all 

the religion stuff people express their feelings but I keep mine to myself for 

one main reason not to piss anyone off. Although if it gets to me after a 

while like the "gay marriage" did I will express my feelings on it. 

This class so far has given me new ideas about the world and our class and out 

future classrooms. I am happy that I get this change to read these emails and 

learn more about each one of you on a higher level. So if I dont respnd to 

peoples journals its because either I dont feel I can talk to you on your 

level or I just dont know what to say. 

Have a great day 

Jonathan 

605






WEIRDO!!!! Just kiddin! You know you are everyones favorite little sister!! 


606





Subject: journal five. 

Alright, i read the Sagan this weekend. And the one part that stuck out to me 

was how he talked about how people who have been abused (any type) can make 

hallucinations to deal with there tragedy. It is so funny, because my little 

foster kids do that. I have seen that craziest things - like their parent 

will call and the will tell me that a stranger called them, like they are 

trying to forget. It is crazy to see 18 years olds scared to shut their door 

or keep there lights on because they fear that the someone will come and get 

them. It is never there their parents (or whoever abused them) but instead 

that someone else will come and get them. Alright that is my journal, I could 

not really relate to much more, because reading these books is no fun. 

p.s. my roomamate's cats both have the flu and then my roommate got sick. SHe 

blames the cats. Cynthia do you know if there is any cat to person epidemic 

going around, so I can warn her. HEE HEE 

607





Subject: Re: Journal #5 Things that make you go HMMM! 

Chula- 

You hit it right on for me. My feelings have been hurt a couple of times becuase of this journal. I will 

admit that I am a very sensitive person which makes me sensitive towards other peoples feelings. I 

would never want to intentionally hurt any one whether they are my friend or not so when you made 

the comment 

" I chose not to respond to the journals for many reasons, one of them being because I think that it is 

difficult to know if someone is being sarcastic or mean with the words they chose to write. I would 

much rather talk to people in person so they could look me in the eyes when we discuss certain 

matters." 

This is exactly how I feel. The comments that have been made in the past could have been sarcastic 

or they could have been mean but it would be much easier to find that out by body language and 

tone. You cannot get any of that through e-mails. So Chula you put into words exactly how I was 

feeling. There are people who say that they will say what they want no matter how it makes someone 

feel but I, for one, am not one of those people. Casey 

608





Subject: Re: So much you don't know. 

And another thing: How many of your love history, besides me of course? Just try to imagine if they 

put ALL of history in the book you are required to read for your history class. I can hear you moaning 

and groaning already!!! For all you non- history buffs: Quit while you are ahead. And if you do like 

history, follow Mike's advice and get the book. 

(Short and to the point, just in case any of you missed all my opinionated wisdom this past weekend, I 

actually had something else to do for a change) 

Cynthia 


I'm at work so this will be very brief. Just because we don't know something 

doesn't mean we are being kept in the dark. If you hear about something like 

the 1918 flu, or "Munich Massacre," and say "Hey, how come I never heard of 

that before?" then it is due to your own lack of desire to learn, not of a 

conspiracy. If there is a book written on something that you can buy at 

Waldenbooks, then it is NOT being covered up by the government! I don't know 

why everyone assumes that they should know everything that has happened in 

history, and if they haven't heard of it by now, it must be through the 

fault of someone else. You only learn what you are told unless you go out 

looking for your own information. If there is a published book on it, it's 

not a cover-up. If you know enough about X to say "How come the history 

books don't talk about X?" then it is not being hidden from you, you just 

haven't chosen to learn more about it. The only things that are truly 

covered up are things NO ONE has ever heard of. And Jenifer, while your 

e-mail did spark me to reply, don't take this as a personal affront. This is 

aimed at the entire class. Yamashita always says "why haven't we heard about 

this?" in regards to the flu. The answer is because before this class, NO 

ONE CARED! I still don't, the end. 


>From: "Jennifer Ramos" 



>Subject: So much we don't know...Journal 5 

>Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 23:56:05 -0800 

> 

> 

>I was watching a documentary of the Munich Massacre today (during the 

>Olympic games of nineteen seventy two). It documented the Palestinian 

>terrorist attack on the Israel athletes during the Summer Olympics Games of 

>1972. As I w as watching the documentary, I remember being perplexed that I 

>did not know about this (maybe because it was before I was born) but it 

>reminded me about a point I brought up in one of our recent class sessions 

609

when we were discussing about how we never heard of the flu pandemic of 

>1918, unitl now. 

> 

>It brought me back to thinking about how much information we, as a society, 

>are not privy to. I sit here and think about how much we do not know about. 

>We are kept from the "confidential" information that the government keeps 

>only to themselves. Sometimes, it is information that no one will admit 

>exists. Information that "accidentally" gets lost or is hidden so far below 

>all of the other government secrets, it is almost as if it were forgetten 

>about completely. So I continue to wonder why society is only given 

>information that is filtered. Information that is "approved" by our 

>government to be let out and leaked to the public. 

> 

>Now I know the government is not a total conspiracy, but.... No really, 

>it's just mind boggling to think about how much we are controlled. Thinking 

>about it reminds me of the book, The Giver, by Lois Lowry. The government 

>of their community made all of the rules so that their community could be 

>perfect. Everything was uniform, everyone had a certain function, a certain 

>job within the community to make it run smoothly and stay perfect. Maybe 

>this is why our society does not know about the CIA, government, and "men 

>in black". Are they trying to keep us from rising up and disrupting the 

>society that they have constructed for us to live in? 

> 

>On the other hand, I know that if we really knew everything we would all go 

>mad and there probably would be complete and utter chaos. Maybe the 

>government is filtering and kee ping information from us for our own good. 

>They just want to protect us, right? They're looking out for our own good. 

>(I'm smiling.) 

> 

>So how does this new realization of mine relate to our future profession as 

>teachers? I think it just reminds me to never stop learning as much as I 

>possibly can. Knowledge is power. (Sorry for the cliche). But I think that 

>the key to learning is to truly absorb as much information as possible. It 

>might not always be information that we want to know, but it is important. 

>As members of society, I think that more one knows the more well rounded 

>they are. 

> 

>Now even if we all don't think it's all a conspiracy, I truly do believe 

>that it is good to learn as much information as we possible can. The good, 

>the bad, and the ugly. 

> 

>Just something else to ponder. 

> 

>~Jennfer Ramos 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Click, drag and drop. My MSN is the simple way to design your homepage. 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



610

_____ 



611





Subject: Re: journal five. 

Well, Teresa, there were some cats that got the flu from chickens and ended up dead, so......it could 

be possible!!! All it takes is a little mutation. Cynthia 


Alright, i read the Sagan this weekend. And the one part that stuck out to me 

was how he talked about how people who have been abused (any type) can make 

hallucinations to deal with there tragedy. It is so funny, because my little 

foster kids do that. I have seen that craziest things - like their parent 

will call and the will tell me that a stranger called them, like they are 

trying to forget. It is crazy to see 18 years olds scared to shut their door 

or keep there lights on because they fear that the someone will come and get 

them. It is never there their parents (or whoever abused them) but instead 

that someone else will come and get them. Alright that is my journal, I could 

not really relate to much more, because reading these books is no fun. 

p.s. my roomamate's cats both have the flu and then my roommate got sick. SHe 

blames the cats. Cynthia do you know if there is any cat to person epidemic 

going around, so I can warn her. HEE HEE 

_____ 



612






Casey, I will confess to using sarcasm in my posts, but only to stimulate thinking. (I don't think its 

working, so maybe I will have to come up with a new angle). But, I don't post anything that is meant to 

be mean, and it is never personal. Not that you were pointing the finger, lol. I think this journal is sort 

of an interesting way of looking at issues from different points of view. By reading what others think, it 

makes me think about things more than I normally would. Being the weirdo I am, I think its fun. Ok, 

feel free to send the men in the white coats over to my house. 

Cynthia 


Chula- 

You hit it right on for me. My feelings have been hurt a couple of times becuase of this journal. 

I will admit that I am a very sensitive person which makes me sensitive towards other peoples 

feelings. I would never want to intentionally hurt any one whether they are my friend or not so 

when you made the comment 

" I chose not to respond to the journals for many reasons, one of them being because I think that 

it is difficult to know if someone is being sarcastic or mean with the words they chose to write. I 

would much rather talk to people in person so they could look me in the eyes when we discuss 

certain matters." 

This is exactly how I feel. The comments that have been made in the past could have been 

sarcastic or they could have been mean but it would be much easier to find that out by body 

language and tone. You cannot get any of that through e-mails. So Chula you put into words 

exactly how I was feeling. There are people who say that they will say what they want no matter 

how it makes someone feel but I, for one, am not one of those people. Casey 

_____ 



613






Hi Joey, You know, there are many people who are not comfortable with expressing their beliefs. And 

the fact is (in my not so humble opinion), that is completely fine. You shouldn't feel like you have to. I 

obviously don't have a problem with expressing mine, but that is me. Maybe it is because I am older, 

but I don't ever even expect anyone to agree with me!! So feel free to disagree, whether you post a 

response or not. I just figure, I will put it out there, and the rest of you are free to read it or delete it. 

The bottom line is, we are all different, and each of us has to do what is right for ourselves, to heck 

with what others think you should do. 

Cynthia 


Hi class 

Something didn’t sit well with me after our class on Wednesday. I had a 

hard time with it because I felt like I was being called out to be more 

expressive with my thought and beliefs. I’ve known that I am not expressive 

in groups (I didn’t need this exercise to figure that out). I think that 

giving your thoughts is important, but when it comes to beliefs I have 

difficulty. In a group there are so many different beliefs and ideas that 

when one belief is shared many are there to question them. This has been 

shown on our list serve. After reading many journals I do have thoughts on 

what is being said but have never sent those comments back to those people. 

I have found that it is easier to keep my thought to myself rather than risk 

the uncertainty of how the other will receive it. This is a lot safer way 

to live, and that ha s been my argument for why I keep to myself in groups. 

This I guess this would be like living in a bubble. The thought of that 

upsets me because I know that I am an open person. I am not static in my 

beliefs and I enjoy listening and internalizing what others have to say 

about their beliefs. My problem is that I don’t allow others to do the same 

with me. I don’t give others the opportunity to see what is going on inside 

me. I am beginning to realize that it is worse to say nothing and 

experience no rejection than it is to say something and have a chance of 

being rejected. Being more expressive is a process I have been working on 

for quite some time, and have become comfortable with it in one on one 

situation. I think I was upset after class because I realized I needed a 

lot more work. I have found in life you can never be comfortable with who 

you are as an individual. Every time I feel that I am happy with whom I am 

something like Wednesdays class shows me that I am far from the person I 

have the potential to be. I am happy for the discomfort life brings me and 

the change it brings on me, I’m just not to thrilled on making that change. 

I have more to say, but like I said I’m not that expressive. 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 



614

_____ 



615






Well Jenny, I tried to find some info to make you wrong, but alas, I have failed (unless you count the 

amazon women). I seem to remember that there were some cultures that gave women power, I just 

can't remember who it was. But the problem is, if everyone is on equal footing, it makes society very 

difficult. OK everyone, throw your fits!! 

Cynthia 


Does anyone wonder how the roles of men and women came about in the beginning of time?? I 

often wonder how the conversation went. "Well, you see i got these parts and you got those parts 

so I am the stronger sex and so I am in charge." I wonder..... And what about the species of 

animals in which the are matriarchal societies and males just come into the picture during mating 

season and then they are shoved out again so that the females live prosperous happy lives. Well, 

all I know is that if the first woman had been more vocal and said, " Ya, well you may have more 

parts, but I have obviously got the bigger brain so I am in charge." I wonder how the world would 

be today??? 

Jenny Fiala 

_____ 



616






You haven't offended me Cynthia! Casey 

617




To: journal 

Subject: pandora and technology 

Which came first, the chicken or the egg? 

So, technology is not an entity in itself, duh! Everything has other implications related to politics, 

economics, ethics etc. Gee, I think I new that already. But then everything can be dissected down to 

isolated parts of the whole. And of course, the technologists think they are the most important piece, 

as do the sociologists, biologists, and everyone else. Ok, I am getting desperate for something 

interesting to come up. I did flip through Sagan, then skipped right ahead to the last chapter. I think 

that one is the best, but I will wait to discuss it when we finally get there. Sorry for the negative 

review, but I am getting bored with our topics. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



618





Subject: Re: pandora and technology 

One more thing: Anybody read the kid's book "Castle in the Attic"? The 2 faces of Janus are in there 

too, and its a much better read, lol. 

Cynthia 


Which came first, the chicken or the egg? 

So, technology is not an entity in itself, duh! Everything has other implications related to politics, 

economics, ethics etc. Gee, I think I new that already. But then everything can be dissected down 

to isolated parts of the whole. And of course, the technologists think they are the most important 

piece, as do the sociologists, biologists, and everyone else. Ok, I am getting desperate for 

something interesting to come up. I did flip through Sagan, then skipped right ahead to the last 

chapter. I think that one is the best, but I will wait to discuss it when we finally get there. Sorry for 

the negative review, but I am getting bored with our topics. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



_____ 



619





Subject: This weeks enrty or something like that? 

Hi Class, 

I have been staying away from the journals for a couple of days because I never get other things 

done if I let myself get wrapped up in them (my grades might soon reflect this). 

I am glad to see more people becoming more open. I, on the other hand, think I have been too open; 

so, I am going to be quiet and listen for a while. I am absorbing all the posts and I am processing 

them. If anyone wants to talk with me above and beyond about anything, I'm right here... or in class, 

just whistle and I'll be there. 

ANN http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/50.gif 

_____ 



620





Subject: J5: 

I want to comment on what Chula said about not knowing if people are being 

mean or sarcastic in their posts. 

For my part, I don't have a mean bone in my body (unless someone pisses me 

off) but I do have a sarcastic one. Let the record show that my posts are not 

meant to offend anybody. If you knew me you'd know that. I realize that few 

people really know me because I really don't open up to them ; I have to make 

sure they are not aliens in disguise first. If you know nothing else about me, 

know that I have a sense of humor-and a wicked one at that. My posts are 

mainly meant to be humorous; they will rarely be filled with deep thoughts or 

insights because I would rather leave the serious issues for the more eloquent 

people. 

In closing I just want to say that I think this listserve is great because 

anyone can say what they feel and be heard. It's especially good because 

people like Judith, Jonathan and I can never get a word in edgewise during 

class. 

Cecilia 

621






Hey Cynthia, 

I hear that you are trying to find a society that gave women power. Well 

many scholars believe that the Minoan Civilization gave a lot of power or at 

least equal power to the female group of society. They were seen in 

positions of great power and lived within a "peaceful" society. Here are 

some pretty cool websites to take a look at. Have fun. 

http://www.aafla.org/SportsLibrary/NASSH_Proceedings/NP1976/NP1976i.pdf 

http://www.admin.northpark.edu/dkoeller/Classes/TI/Minoan.N.html 

http://kravcev9.tripod.com/arch2/id2.html 

http://www.cyonic-nemeton.com/MinoanWomen.htm 




>Subject: Re: Journal #5 (God, maybe you can help with this one?) 

>Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:34:41 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>Well Jenny, I tried to find some info to make you wrong, but alas, I have 

>failed (unless you count the amazon women). I seem to remember that there 

>were some cultures that gave women power, I just can't remember who it was. 

>But the problem is, if everyone is on equal footing, it makes society very 

>difficult. OK everyone, throw your fits!! 

>Cynthia 

> 

>Kaylee102595@aol.com wrote: 

>Does anyone wonder how the roles of men and women came about in the 

>beginning of time?? I often wonder how the conversation went. "Well, you 

>see i got these parts and you got those parts so I am the stronger sex and 

>so I am in charge." I wonder..... And what about the species of animals in 

>which the are matriarchal societies and males just come into the picture 

>during mating season and then they are shoved out again so that the females 

>live prosperous happy lives. Well, all I know is that if the first woman 

>had been more vocal and said, " Ya, well you may have more parts, but I 

>have obviously got the bigger brain so I am in charge." I wonder how the 

>world would be today??? 

>Jenny Fiala 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



622





Subject: RE: So much you don't know. 

What society decides to distribute on a broad base and what people "choose" 

to consume, tells you a lot about the society. I believe that there are very 

few conspiracies, but that often times subjects are swept under the rug and 

not publicized, that does not mean that the information does not exist. We 

live in a society in which people enjoy disposable knowledge fed to them by 

the media. I agree with you Mike, in that if people truly want to find out 

about a certain subject all they need to do is get off the lazy butts and 

look for it. And for Yamashita's question of "why have we not heard of 

this?" I agree with you in that no one cared enough to search it out and 

when someone finally did they found out, it is as simple as that. The 

majority of society does not care about what goes on in the world unless it 

directly effects them or someone they know. Once the flu died off it no 

longer effected their lives, they where happy to be done with it. 




>Subject: So much you don't know. 

>Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:23:35 -0800 

> 

>I'm at work so this will be very brief. Just because we don't know 

>something doesn't mean we are being kept in the dark. If you hear about 

>something like the 1918 flu, or "Munich Massacre," and say "Hey, how come I 

>never heard of that before?" then it is due to your own lack of desire to 

>learn, not of a conspiracy. If there is a book written on something that 

>you can buy at Waldenbooks, then it is NOT being covered up by the 

>government! I don't know why everyone assumes that they should know 

>everything that has happened in history, and if they haven't heard of it by 

>now, it must be through the fault of someone else. You only learn what you 

>are told unless you go out looking for your own information. If there is a 

>published book on it, it's not a cover-up. If you know enough about X to 

>say "How come the history books don't talk about X?" then it is not being 

>hidden from you, you just haven't chosen to learn more about it. The only 

>things that are truly covered up are things NO ONE has ever heard of. And 

>Jenifer, while your e-mail did spark me to reply, don't take this as a 

>personal affront. This is aimed at the entire class. Yamashita always says 

>Yamashita in regards to the flu. The answer is because before this class, 

>NO ONE CARED! I still don't, the end. 

> 

>-Mike Runnestrand 

> 

> 

>>From: "Jennifer Ramos" 



>>Subject: So much we don't know...Journal 5 

>>Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 23:56:05 -0800 

>> 

>> 

>>I was watching a documentary of the Munich Massacre today (during the 

>>Olympic games of nineteen seventy two). It documented the Palestinian 

>>terrorist attack on the Israel athletes during the Summer Olympics Games 

>>of 1972. As I was watching the documentary, I remember being perplexed 

>>that I did not know about this (maybe because it was before I was born) 

>>but it reminded me about a point I brought up in one of our recent class 

>>sessions when we were discussing about how we never heard of the flu 

623

pandemic of 1918, unitl now. 

>> 

>>It brought me back to thinking about how much information we, as a 

>>society, are not privy to. I sit here and think about how much we do not 

>>know about. We are kept from the "confidential" information that the 

>>government keeps only to themselves. Sometimes, it is information that no 

>>one will admit exists. Information that "accidentally" gets lost or is 

>>hidden so far below all of the other government secrets, it is almost as 

>>if it were forgetten about completely. So I continue to wonder why society 

>>is only given information that is filtered. Information that is "approved" 

>>by our government to be let out and leaked to the public. 

>> 

>>Now I know the government is not a total conspiracy, but.... No really, 

>>it's just mind boggling to think about how much we are controlled. 

>>Thinking about it reminds me of the book, The Giver, by Lois Lowry. The 

>>government of their community made all of the rules so that their 

>>community could be perfect. Everything was uniform, everyone had a certain 

>>function, a certain job within the community to make it run smoothly and 

>>stay perfect. Maybe this is why our society does not know about the CIA, 

>>government, and "men in black". Are they trying to keep us from rising up 

>>and disrupting the society that they have constructed for us to live in? 

>> 

>>On the other hand, I know that if we really knew everything we would all 

>>go mad and there probably would be complete and utter chaos. Maybe the 

>>government is filtering and keeping information from us for our own good. 

>>They just want to protect us, right? They're looking out for our own good. 

>>(I'm smiling.) 

>> 

>>So how does this new realization of mine relate to our future profession 

>>as teachers? I think it just reminds me to never stop learning as much as 

>>I possibly can. Knowledge is power. (Sorry for the cliche). But I think 

>>that the key to learning is to truly absorb as much information as 

>>possible. It might not always be information that we want to know, but it 

>>is important. As members of society, I think that more one knows the more 

>>well rounded they are. 

>> 

>>Now even if we all don't think it's all a conspiracy, I truly do believe 

>>that it is good to learn as much information as we possible can. The good, 

>>the bad, and the ugly. 

>> 

>>Just something else to ponder. 

>> 

>>~Jennfer Ramos 

>> 

>>_________________________________________________________________ 

>>Click, drag and drop. My MSN is the simple way to design your homepage. 

>>http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200364ave/direct/01/ 

>> 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



624





Subject: Re: J5: 

Whatever Cecilia! I know what you are like at school and you never shut up. :) I have been reading 

everyone's journals now and I think that people are backing away from issues because they are afraid 

to hurt people's feelings. I am sorry but the way I view these journals is totally isolated from the 

people themselves. I feel that everyone is finally opening up and I would hat for you people to 

become quiet again because you think you are offending others. I think we all know each other a little 

better than this and we can agree to disagree on these topics without taking offense to other people's 

opinions. I want to know what you really think and I WILL NOT THINK DIFFERENT of you when you 

do so. So bring it on people these emails are getting dry:) 

Love you all, 

Jenny Fiala 

625






I agree!! I have nothing to respond to. Come on people, I have free time on my hands. 

Cynthia 


Whatever Cecilia! I know what you are like at school and you never shut up. :) I have been 

reading everyone's journals now and I think that people are backing away from issues because 

they are afraid to hurt people's feelings. I am sorry but the way I view these journals is totally 

isolated from the people themselves. I feel that everyone is finally opening up and I would hat for 

you people to become quiet again because you think you are offending others. I think we all know 

each other a little better than this and we can agree to disagree on these topics without taking 

offense to other people's opinions. I want to know what you really think and I WILL NOT THINK 

DIFFERENT of you when you do so. So bring it on people these emails are getting dry:) 

Love you all, 

Jenny Fiala 

_____ 



626






Thanks, Robert!! To be honest, I didn't look very hard. I know, that isn't like me, but I have been 

scouring the web for wedding stuff, its more fun at the moment. 

Cynthia 


Hey Cynthia, 

I hear that you are trying to find a society that gave women power. Well 

many scholars believe that the Minoan Civilization gave a lot of power or at 

least equal power to the female group of society. They were seen in 

positions of great power and lived within a "peaceful" society. Here are 

some pretty cool websites to take a look at. Have fun. 

http://www.aafla.org/SportsLibrary/NASSH_Proceedings/NP1976/NP1976i.pdf 

http://www.admin.northpark.edu/dkoeller/Classes/TI/Minoan.N.html 

http://kravcev9.tripod.com/arch2/id2.html 

http://www.cyonic-nemeton.com/MinoanWomen.htm 





>Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:34:41 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>Well Jenny, I tried to find some info to make you wrong, but alas, I have 

>failed (unless you count the amazon women). I seem to remember that there 

>were some cultures that gave women power, I just can't remember who it was. 

>But the problem is, if everyone is on equal footing, it makes society very 

>difficult. OK everyone, throw your fits!! 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Does anyone wonder how the roles of men and women came about in the 

>beginning of time?? I often wonder how the conversation went. "Well, you 

>see i got these parts and you got those parts so I am the stronger sex and 

>so I am in charge." I wonder..... And what about the species of animals in 

>which the are matriarchal societies and males just come into the picture 

>during mating season and then they are shoved out again so that the females 

>live prosperous happy lives. Well, all I know is that if the first woman 

>ha d been more vocal and said, " Ya, well you may have more parts, but I 

>have obviously got the bigger brain so I am in charge." I wonder how the 

>world would be today??? 

>Jenny Fiala 

627

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



628





Subject: no offense 

I hate everyone. Except you. Discuss. 


From: "Cynthia Reyes" 




I agree!! I have nothing to respond to. Come on people, I have free time on my hands. 

Cynthia 


Whatever Cecilia! I know what you are like at school and you never shut up. :) I have been 

reading everyone's journals now and I think that people are backing away from issues because 

they are afraid to hurt people's feelings. I am sorry but the way I view these journals is totally 

isolated from the people themselves. I feel that everyone is finally opening up and I would hat for 

you people to become quiet again because you think you are offending others. I think we all know 

each other a little better than this and we can agree to disagree on these topics without taking 

offense to other people's opinions. I want to know what you really think and I WILL NOT THINK 

DIFFERENT of you when you do so. So bring it on people these emails are getting dry:) 

Love you all, 

Jenny Fiala 

_____ 



629





Subject: RE: J5: 

Okay Jenny and Cynthia, I won't hold back. I will continue to say what I 

think. I'm going to try to think up a good controversial topic and I'll report 

back later. Cecilia :) 


>I agree!! I have nothing to respond to. Come on people, I have free time on 

my hands. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Whatever Cecilia! I know what you are like at school and you never shut up. 

:) I have been reading everyone's journals now and I think that people are 

backing away from issues because they are afraid to hurt people's feelings. I 

am sorry but the way I view these journals is totally isolated from the people 

themselves. I feel that everyone is finally opening up and I would hat for you 

people to become quiet again because you think you are offending others. I 

think we all know each other a little better than this and we can agree to 

disagree on these topics without taking offense to other people's opinions. I 

want to know what you really think and I WILL NOT THINK DIFFERENT of you when 

you do so. So bring it on people these emails are getting dry:) 

>Love you all, 

>Jenny Fiala 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



630






wedding stuff is fun at first and then the stress sets in! have fun while 

you can. Haha. 






> 

>Thanks, Robert!! To be honest, I didn't look very hard. I know, that isn't 

>like me, but I have been scouring the web for wedding stuff, its more fun 

>at the moment. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Hey Cynthia, 

>I hear that you are trying to find a society that gave women power. Well 

>many scholars believe that the Minoan Civilization gave a lot of power or 

>at 

>least equal power to the female group of society. They were seen in 

>positions of great power and lived within a "peaceful" society. Here are 

>some pretty cool websites to take a look at. Have fun. 

> 

>http://www.aafla.org/SportsLibrary/NASSH_Proceedings/NP1976/NP1976i.pdf 

>http://www.admin.northpark.edu/dkoeller/Classes/TI/Minoan.N.html 

>http://kravcev9.tripod.com/arch2/id2.html 

>http://www.cyonic-nemeton.com/MinoanWomen.htm 

> 

> 

> 

> >From: Cynthia Reyes 



> >Subject: Re: Journal #5 (God, maybe you can help with this one?) 

> >Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:34:41 -0800 (PST) 

> > 

> >Well Jenny, I tried to find some info to make you wrong, but alas, I have 

> >failed (unless you count the amazon women). I seem to remember that there 

> >were some cultures that gave women power, I just can't remember who it 

>was. 

> >But the problem is, if everyone is on equal footing, it makes society 

>very 

> >difficult. OK everyone, throw your fits!! 

> >Cynthia 

> > 

> >Kaylee102595@aol.com wrote: 

> >Does anyone wonder how the roles of men and women came about in the 

> >beginning of time?? I often wonder how the conversation went. "Well, you 

> >see i got these parts and you got those parts so I am the stronger sex 

>and 

> >so I am in charge." I wonder..... And what about the species of animals 

>in 

> >which the are matriarchal societies and males just come into the picture 

> >during mating season and then they are shoved out again so that the 

>females 

631

live prosperous happy lives. Well, all I know is that if the first woman 

> >had been more vocal and said, " Ya, well you may have more parts, but I 

> >have obviously got the bigger brain so I am in charge." I wonder how the 

> >world would be today??? 

> >Jenny Fiala 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 


> >Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



632






Speaking of that, can you bring me the name and # for your photographer? Looks like we are gonna 

need a different one. Thanks, Cynthia 


wedding stuff is fun at first and then the stress sets in! have fun while 

you can. Haha. 






> 

>Thanks, Robert!! To be honest, I didn't look very hard. I know, that isn't 

>like me, but I have been scouring the web for wedding stuff, its more fun 

>at the moment. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Hey Cynthia, 

>I hear that you are trying to find a society that gave women power. Well 

>many scholars believe that the Minoan Civilization gave a lot of power or 

>at 

>least equal power to the female group of society. They were seen in 

>positions of great power and lived within a "peaceful" society. Here are 

>some pretty cool websites to take a look at. Have fun. 

> 

>http://www.aafla.org/SportsLibrary/NASSH_Proceedings/NP1976/NP1976i.pdf 

>http://www.admin.northpark.edu/dkoeller/Classes/TI/Minoan.N.html 

>http://kravcev9.tripod.com/arch2/id2.html 

>http://www.cyonic-nemeton.com/MinoanWomen.htm 

> 

> 

> 




> >Subject: Re: Journal #5 (God, maybe you can help with this one?) 

> >Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:34:41 -0800 (PST) 

> > 

> >Well Jenny, I tried to find some info to make you wrong, but alas, I have 

> >failed (unless you count the amazon women). I seem to remember that there 

> >were some cultures that gave women power, I just can't remember who it 

633

was. 

> >But the problem is, if everyone is on equal footing, i t makes society 

>very 

> >difficult. OK everyone, throw your fits!! 

> >Cynthia 

> > 

> >Kaylee102595@aol.com wrote: 

> >Does anyone wonder how the roles of men and women came about in the 

> >beginning of time?? I often wonder how the conversation went. "Well, you 

> >see i got these parts and you got those parts so I am the stronger sex 

>and 

> >so I am in charge." I wonder..... And what about the species of animals 

>in 

> >which the are matriarchal societies and males just come into the picture 

> >during mating season and then they are shoved out again so that the 

>females 

> >live prosperous happy lives. Well, all I know is that if the first woman 

> >had been more vocal and said, " Ya, well you may have more parts, but I 

> >have obviously got the bigger brain so I am in charge." I wonder how the 

> >world would be today??? 

> >Jen ny Fiala 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 


> >Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



634





Subject: hello 

Cohort F, 

I was a little concerned when I woke up the next morning to check to see if my 

submission for journal #5 went through and found that not only was mine not on 

the e-mail, but neither was any else's. So now I know that you all recieved 

mine (I guess 4 times) but I have no idea what anyone else is writting. I 

hope resubscribing worked and I can get back into the drama unfolding. If this 

has happened to anyone else I would like to know. 

-See you in class! 

Chula 

635


From: hada@cox.net 



Subject: Solongo's mask Alexandra 

Solongo 

The water is warm 

Two little girls bathe 

One three 

The other two 

No worries 

No fears 

Just a child's play 

Mother's voice yells, 

It time to come out 

They hear her voice 

But soon forget 

If you are not out soon, 

I will get 

Him 

Who? 

Solongo 

Both girls panic 

Their hearts are racing 

As they try to figure out what to do 

The older of the two grabs the little one 

With no words spoken 

They climb mother's high bed 

And hide underneath the covers 

Their little minds are racing 

The older child remembers being found in the same place 

Understanding not why 

She can't see out, yet Solongo always sees in 

She grabs her sister 

Runs to the living room where there is a cot bed behind a couch 

It is closed 

She shoves her little sister 

And squeezes herself on the other side 

The air is hot 

There is no air 

The girls can't breathe 

They are weak and almost lifeless 

Mother panics 

There's no trace of her girls 

The older one squeezes her head out just before losing consciousness 

Mother rescues her daughters 

From 

Solongo 

Could mother and Solongo be one and the same? Years later the girls realized that it was 

mother underneath the mask, Solongo's mask. He was real. His skin was made of thick flesh 

color. His face was ugly and angry. He had to be the devil. They learned to fear this 

devil and the hold it had on their mother. Mother created this monster. The girls swear to 

this day that they saw it breathing in the closet. Solongo was real and so were all the 

nightmares, hallucinations, and ghosts there after. Mother moved the family to a big 

house on Broadway, and Solongo moved in to. Solongo gained more power and had access to 

the girls' and boys' room at night. The house had an attic and a basement where evil 

things lived. The five children witnessed images of Solongo, ghosts, candles, and heard 

strange noises in the early evening hours. Is it possible that all the children were 

hallucinating? Or does evil once welcomed take on an ether form? 

636

The children first learned of God through their mother and father and came to know the 

devil as the fallen angel. The devil always seemed to have more power for he made himself 

known. God always seemed out of reach especially when the molester moved into the house 

along with Solongo. Maybe, Solongo had taken on a human form. Baths were never sacred 

again. The children grew up believing that God did not dwell in a place where the devil 

lived. The older of the two little girls found solace in her young wisdom that said to her 

spirit that God was crying with her and kept her company throughout all of her years of 

pain. The same little girl grew up believing that God has been one with her spirit all of 

her life. How else could she have found the strength to survive in a house where God was 

not welcomed? It matters not whether we see God in the form of a Buddha, a prophet, a 

virgin, a prostitute, a Goddess, a tree, an animal?in order to experience God physically. 

Does God not dw 

ell in all things including in what science calls evolution? Some of us are more in touch 

with our God nature and other of us are just beginning to open up enough to not judge 

people's faith and seek to understand a child's cry and the images that haunt their 

dreams. 

Maybe, we should not be arguing about what form God represent for us and instead look at 

our human ability to be good and bad. It's easy to blame all of our evil doings on some 

devil that we have given power to instead of accepting that we have the ability to harm 

others. Men have done much harm under the name of God instead seeking to understand that 

part of their nature that can be evil or bad. Look at what we have done, for example, 

during The Witch Craze from the 14th to the 17th century because women or so called 

Witches represented a political, religious, and sexual threat to the Protestant, Catholic 

Church, and the State. These women were healers, nurses, and midwives who served their 

community. Let's also look at what the Spaniards did to the Indians under the name of God. 

They branded them and abused them believing they were less than animals. My Indian 

heritage has almost been wiped out because of this. Where was God? He has been with us and 

has given us the strengt 

h to get through it all. Some of us worship God in his Goddess form because the female 

image is less threatening and does not remind us of our sexual abuse, others worship God 

in his Buddha form because he radiates peace, and others perform rituals under the name of 

science in honor of God?The many ways and forms that we worship God are endless. God gave 

us our awareness of goodness and badness. Does God not have the ability to take on many 

forms and the ability to be in all things, yet we fear one another for being Christians, 

Jehovah Witness, Jewish, Pagans, Catholics, Scientists ? Instead of looking at ourselves 

through the eyes of others, we blame God and refuse to accept that it is Men that are 

responsible for their own self destruction and the separation that exist. We instead blame 

God by believing that world is corrupt because we do not worship the same religion. When 

it truth, it is Men that are corrupt and hide behind Solongo's mask. (Alexandra's Journal 

#5) 

637





umm so i havent gotten any emails in days and i thought, gee this is really quiet for us. 

then i found out ive missed over 50 emails. so i resubscribed. chula, i got your email 

from casey who forwarded me all the "worth reading" journals....and i guess im having the 

same problem as you. joey had this happen to him too. what is going on with this thing? 

it just randomly times us out and unsubscribes us or what?? 

638





Subject: Re: 

Hm, So what is the criteria for a journal post to be "worth reading"? 

Cynthia 


umm so i havent gotten any emails in days and i thought, gee this is really quiet for us. then i 

found out ive missed over 50 emails. so i resubscribed. chula, i got your email from casey who 

forwarded me all the "worth reading" journals....and i guess im having the same problem as you. 

joey had this happen to him too. what is going on with this thing? it just randomly times us out and 

unsubscribes us or what?? 

_____ 



639






I can't help but say that there was tons of reading for this week. I'm glad 

that throughout the week I had read a little each day so that I could 

eventually get all of it done. 

Kolata's book is getting a little boring because I think what is happening 

is becoming too stretched out, that it takes forever to one to read what 

happens in just a couple of years set of time. I think that it stinks that we 

in the United States had found the vaccine for the virus that was talked about 

in Chapter 6 and 7, thinking that it could be the flu epidemic happening all 

over again, and then finding out that the vaccine only caused a certain 

syndrome in people to get sick or die. When I read this I alomost thought then 

what else could have been done. It's like you try so hard with something and 

go through so much trouble and effort, and then you come to a sign that says 

dead end or "go back to go". I would have definitely been screaming at myself 

I were one of those scientists trying to cure the virus problem. I think the 

decision that the president Ford made regarding starting the campaign to 

vaccinate everyone was good because you have to be safe than sorry. The 

problem of course was that a lot of money was spent and the vaccine didn't 

work and it only caused more problems. But who would have realized that. 

In Sagan, I think that whenever we have hallucinations or we see things that 

we think or real and true, I believe that it's all from our own minds. Our 

minds are what make up what we want to see or think about. So, for example, 

you are in a dark room with the door shut to your room and you hear noises 

outside the door, your mind wants you to think that someone or something maybe 

right outside the door or whatever. To change the subject, I think it's funny 

that Sagan continues talking about aliens abductions and sexual interactions 

with aliens. Obviously this guy really believes or likes to study about 

aliens. 

Bijker's article was interesting to me. The whole bridge incident with the 

earthquake was very astonishing to me. My brother, who actually now lives in 

S.F. told me about it and how a certain portion of the top level actually came 

down and hit the bottom part of the bridge killing tons of people. If you go 

on that bridge, my brother had showed me the spot where the city had left as 

kind of a memorial to remember the people by because the lights above are out 

and so it's dark at night time. He then told me that they are going to build 

another bridge next to it and leave the bottom part of the first bridge still 

there. I could see this already happening since I went there about a month ago 

and there was a huge crain next to the first bridge already. I'm thinking the 

bottom part of the first bridge will probably become a place for homeless 

people or a place where visitors and tourists can go and buy things at kiosks 

set up along the way. 

Bijker's got me to think about the Terminator, because I was wondering that 

if technology can affect us so much in society including affecting our health, 

do any of you think that someday technology will control our lives completely 

to the extent that machines could almost rule over us someday? 

Last but not least Latour. After reading it and rereading it I still 

couldn't get the point of it. I liked the visual pictures of the two heads and 

the comic strip, because I'm more of a visual learner. But I honestly don't 

understand what was trying to be said. 

640





Subject: Journal #6 mess-up 

Sorry everyone but the Journal #6 just sent to you was from me. Have a nice 

day! 

Laurie :) 

641






I think we were given the bridge article to read in order to make a connection between the flu virus 

vaccine and how technology is shaped by society or visa versa. You have to way the pros and cons 

and make the best decision you can based on what you know or...think you know. Pandora goes 

along with the same thing. Its like it depends which face of Janus you are looking from. Should we 

wait to see if the epidemic hits before giving the vaccine, or should we go ahead and give it just in 

case it does hit? Do the benefits outweigh the consequences? What will the repercussions be? Can 

we skimp on the bridge and hope its ok, or should we spend a lot more money and build it like the big 

one will hit? What if it doesn't? Was it worth the extra money? Someone has to make these decisions. 

Same goes with education. Should we teach students the way they are telling us in school and hope 

they are right? Or should we do it another way? Which way is more cost effective and shoul d that be 

a consideration? I could go on, but lucky you, I need to go to bed. Cynthia 


I can't help but say that there was tons of reading for this week. I'm glad 

that throughout the week I had read a little each day so that I could 

eventually get all of it done. 

Kolata's book is getting a little boring because I think what is happening 

is becoming too stretched out, that it takes forever to one to read what 

happens in just a couple of years set of time. I think that it stinks that we 

in the United States had found the vaccine for the virus that was talked about 

in Chapter 6 and 7, thinking that it could be the flu epidemic happening all 

over again, and then finding out that the vaccine only caused a certain 

syndrome in people to get sick or die. When I read this I alomost thought then 

what else could have been done. It's like you try so hard with something and 

go through so much trouble and effort, and then you come to a sign that says 

dead end or "go back to go". I would have definitely been screaming at myself 

I were one of those scientists trying to cure the virus problem. I think the 

decision that the president Ford made regarding starting the campaign to 

vaccinate everyone was good because you have to be safe than sorry. The 

problem of course was that a lot of money was spent and the vaccine didn't 

work and it only caused more problems. But who would have realized that. 

In Sagan, I think that whenever we have hallucinations or we see things that 

we think or real and true, I believe that it's all from our own minds. Our 

minds are what make up what we want to see or think about. So, for example, 

you are in a dark room with the door shut to your room and you hear noises 

outside the door, your mind wants you to think that someone or something maybe 

right outside the door or whatever. To change the subject, I think it's funny 

that Sagan continues talking about aliens abductions and sexual interactions 

with aliens. Obviously this guy really believes or likes to study about 

aliens. 

Bijker's article was interesting to me. The whole bridge incident with the 

earthquake was very astonishing to me. My brother, who actually now lives in 

S.F. told me about it and how a certain portion of the top level actually came 

down and hit the bottom part of the bridge killing tons of people. If you go 

642

on that bridge, my brother had showed me the spot where the city had left as 

kind of a memorial to remember the people by because the lights above are out 

and so it's dark at night time. He then told me that they are going to build 

another bridge next to it and leave the bottom part of the first bridge still 

there. I could see this already happening since I went there about a month ago 

and there was a huge crain next to the first bridge already. I'm thinking the 

bottom part of the first bridge wil l probably become a place for homeless 

people or a place where visitors and tourists can go and buy things at kiosks 

set up along the way. 

Bijker's got me to think about the Terminator, because I was wondering that 

if technology can affect us so much in society including affecting our health, 

do any of you think that someday technology will control our lives completely 

to the extent that machines could almost rule over us someday? 

Last but not least Latour. After reading it and rereading it I still 

couldn't get the point of it. I liked the visual pictures of the two heads and 

the comic strip, because I'm more of a visual learner. But I honestly don't 

understand what was trying to be said. 

_____ 



643





Subject: Re: Re: 

well, i wont name names, but there were quite a few of you considered "worth reading" 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/24 Tue PM 10:50:59 PST 


> Subject: Re: 

> 

> Hm, So what is the criteria for a journal post to be "worth reading"? 

> Cynthia 

> 


> umm so i havent gotten any emails in days and i thought, gee this is really quiet for 

us. then i found out ive missed over 50 emails. so i resubscribed. chula, i got your email 

from casey who forwarded me all the "worth reading" journals....and i guess im having the 

same problem as you. joey had this happen to him too. what is going on with this thing? it 

just randomly times us out and unsubscribes us or what?? 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


644





Subject: Re: Cynthia- Worth Reading- Casey 

The worth reading ones were from the last two days because Karis had not received anything since 

Feb 13th and I thought that would be too many journals to read at once. So that was the ones that I 

forwarded to Karis...Don't get offended anyone...I think all of your journals are worth reading :) 

And to touch upon what Jenny said...I think that people should state their feelings..believe me...I am a 

big advocate of stating your feelings...all I was saying miss Jenny is that people should be cautious of 

others feelings while doing this...That is all...and if my feelings get hurt I am a big girl I will get through 

it. 

645




To: journal 

Subject: who deserves a scholorship? 

Choose "Wisely" that which you wish to study, if you want a scholorship!! 

Heaven forbid, if you want to study religion. Another undercutting of religious freedom in this country? 

I bet they allow scholorships to study evolution and some other things I won't mention. Cynthia 

Court OKs Denial of Divinity Scholarships 

AP 



By ANNE GEARAN, Associated Press Writer 

WASHINGTON - The Supreme Court, in a new rendering on separation of church and state, voted 

Wednesday to let states withhold scholarships from students studying theology. 

The court's 7-2 ruling held that the state of Washington was within its rights to deny a taxpayer-funded scholarship to a 

college student who was studying to be a minister. That holding applies even when money is available to students 

studying anything else. 

"Training someone to lead a congregation is an essentially religious endeavor," Chief Justice William H. Rehnquist wrote 

for the court majority. "Indeed, majoring in devotional theology is akin to a religious calling as well as an academic 

pursuit." 

_____ 



646




To: LBST 361B 

Subject: Madcow 

Attachments: madcow.doc 

madcow.doc (210 

KB) 

Enjoy!!!! 

647





Subject: RE: Madcow 

Very cute Judith! 




To: LBST 361B 


Enjoy!!!! 

648





Subject: RE: Madcow 

What's with the mad cow, I didn't get it. My mailbox was overflowing when I got home. 

Cynthia 


Very cute Judith! 




To: LBST 361B 


Enjoy!!!! 

_____ 


Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail 

649





so i havent written anything this week and i have nothing to say because i was kicked off 

the listserve for the past week and am a little out of the loop. soooo, what do i have to 

say.... 

well i was all about reading the FLU but after the first few chapters it's just the same 

thing over and over, so i dont have anything to say about that. 

i went to see PASSION last night, but i will not discuss that on here. if you want to 

talk to me about it, i would be more than happy to. 

my DOG got bit by something in the face and her eye is swollen shut. if you know what i 

could do for her, let me know. 

the WAVES are huge, so i do recommend that you come down to the beach to see them. 

ok, serioulsy ive sat here thinking for a while and i got nothing. what do you say when 

you have nothing on your mind?? maybe something will come up later that will be a worth 

read. 


650




To: journal 

Subject: Mars Rocks!! 

OK, These scientists are having way more fun than we are. Cynthia 

Mars Rocks! Eclectic Music Moves Rover Mission 

SPACE.com 

Thu Feb 26,10:18 AM ET 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/my/my16.gif Add Science - Space.com to My Yahoo! 

By Robert Roy Britt 

Senior Science Writer, SPACE.com 

You won't find the following playlist on any radio station. Only a Martian would mix ABBA with R. Kelly, Beyonc with Gene 

Autry, and the Rolling Stones with Rodgers and Hammerstein. 

Or someone pretending to be a Martian. 

The eclectic playlist is Mars rover Spirit mission manager Mark Adler's way of waking exhausted engineers and scientists 

who are working and sleeping on Mars time and dealing with a sometimes temperamental rover millions of miles away. 

And with entries like the Ramones' "I Wanna Be Sedated," it shows that NASA (news - web sites) people are anything but 

stuffy. 

The music can lighten tense times. During the nail-biting moments before Spirit's descent and landing in January, at the 

suggestion of team member Rob Manning, Adler played Bobby McFerrin's "Don't Worry, Be Happy." 

The Beatles tune "We Can Work it Out" greeted the team one morning as it tried to debug computer problems that stalled 

Spirit for several days. For other reasons that become clear as you read the list, even The Cars get airtime, as does 

Weird Al Yankovic (either you know his music all too well or you never heard of him). 

And, of course, Elvis makes an appearance, singing "Stuck On You" after a frustrating day of no driving. 

Most of the songs are played in the morning shortly after the crew has assembled for work. Adler has picked the bulk of 

the music heard by his team at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory. Music was played for the 1997 Pathfinder crew 

members, too. 

A separate team operating Spirit's twin, Opportunity, is also following the tradition but apparently is not so well organized 

in cataloguing their playlist. Earlier this week, however, the Opportunity group began their day listening to "Rock Around 

the Clock" by Bill Haley and his Comets. 

Adler and his colleagues take requests for the Spirit playlist but ultimately run their own show. 

"We get lots of suggestions from inside the team and out, and they do get used," he told SPACE.com. "That is, when the 

suggestions are good ones." 

Adler has preselected a few songs that mention rivers and running water, in the event that Spirit discovers what it went 

looking for. He did not reveal what those songs were. But he said, "I also have U2's 'I Still Haven't Found What I'm 

Looking For' to play before that." 

651

Below is the Spirit playlist, along with some explanations by Adler for why the songs were chosen. A sol is a Martian day, 

slightly longer than a day on Earth at 24 hours, 37 minutes. 

• Sol 2: Good Morning, Good Morning, by the Beatles. 

• Sol 3: Oh What a Beautiful Mornin', by Rodgers and Hammerstein. 

• Sol 4: Hail to the Chief, by the Mormon Tabernacle Choir. (Presidential phone call.) 

• Sol 5: Satisfaction, by the Rolling Stones. ("I can't get no ...", Air bags not cooperating.) 

• Sol 6: Get Up, Stand Up, by Bob Marley. (Lift mechanism actuated.) 

• Sol 7: Da Da Da, by Casaca. (Brazilian song suggested by investigator from Brazil, RRGTM student that week from 

Brazil.) 

• Sol 8: Soak Up the Sun, by Cheryl Crow. (Laid-back sol.) 

• Sol 9: I Can See Clearly Now, by Jimmy Cliff. (Picture taking sol.) 

• Sol 10: Unchained, by Van Halen; Hit the Road Jack, by Buster Poindexter; Turn, Turn, Turn, by the Byrds. (Cablecutting, 

backup on landing deck. start turn on deck.) 

• Sol 11: I Get Around, by the Beach Boys; Round and Round, by Ratt; You Spin Me 'Round, by Thala. (Rest of turn 

on landing deck.) 

• Sol 12: Born to be Wild, by Steppenwolf; Rawhide, by Riders in the Sky; Who Let The Dogs Out?, by the Baha 

Men. (Egress.) 

• Sol 13: Reach Out, by the Four Tops. (First robotic arm activity.) 

• Sol 14: You've Got The Magic Touch, by the Platters. (Touching robotic arm down on Mars.) 

• Sol 15: If You Love Somebody Set Them Free, by Sting; Roam, by The B-52's; Good Times Roll, by The Cars. 

(Last engineering activities, first drive on the surface.) 

• Sol 16: After Midnight, by Eric Clapton; Trash Day, by Weird Al Yankovic. (Crew starts Mars day after California 

midnight, part of the sol dedicated to deleting contents of flash.) 

• Sol 17: We Will Rock You, by Queen. (First arm activities and observations on a rock.) 

• Sol 18: Sledgehammer, by Peter Gabriel. (Intended first [Rock Abrasion Tool] RAT sol, though ran into problems 

later, to put it mildly.) 

• Sol 19: S.O.S., by Abba. (Objective was to regain contact with Spirit after a loss of communications. We did.) 

• Sol 20: Baby, Talk to Me, from the musical Bye Bye Birdie. (Objective was to get Spirit to send data. She did.) 

• Sol 21: Satellite, by The Hooters. (A rousing lullaby for when we were trying, and succeeded, to get the rover to go to 

sleep.) 

• Sol 22: We Can Work it Out, by The Beatles. (Beginning debugging activities to get Spirit back to normal.) 

• Sol 23: Start Me Up, by the Rolling Stones. (Booting in crippled mode.) 

• Sol 24: Flash, by Queen. (Clearly a flash problem, continuing to debug.) 

• Sol 25: (You're The) Devil In Disguise, by Elvis Presley, and With a Little Help From My Friends, by The Beatles. 

(Continuing debug, got picture!) 

• Sol 26: I Want a New Drug, by Huey Lewis & The News. (Trying yet another recipe for getting task trace, still didn't 

work.) 

• Sol 27: Anticipation, by Carly Simon. (Seeing if the file deletes will do the trick or not. They did.) 

• Sol 28: On the Road Again, by Willie Nelson. ("Can't wait to get back on ...", back to normal use of the flash file 

system, itching to get going.) 

• Sol 29: Here Comes the Sun, by The Beatles. (More normal operations, Mars Express coordinated overflight.) 

• Sol 30: Lean On Me, performed by Club Nouveau. (Intended RAT brush sol, pressing RAT on rock, though activities 

did not complete.) 

• Sol 31: I Wanna Be Sedated, by the Ramones. (Very low activity sol to get the rover rested and ready for surgery on 

the following sol.) 

• Sol 32: Wipe Out, by The Surfaris, and We're Not Gonna Take It, by 

• Twisted Sister. (File system reformat.) 

• Sol 33: Back In the Saddle Again, by Gene Autry, and The Star Spangled Banner, performed by Beyonc. (Back to 

normal operations, color flag picture on RAT.) 

• Sol 34: The Laundry Cycle: Pounded on a Rock, by The Bobs, and Bump N' Grind, by R. Kelly. (First RAT 

652

grinding.) 

• Sol 35: Up Around the Bend, by Credence Clearwater Revival. (Intended drive around lander to begin drive to 

crater. Didn't get anywhere though.) 

• Sol 36: Stuck On You, by Elvis Presley. (Drive didn't work yestersol -- we've been stuck here for weeks. Drive did 

work later that sol.) 

• Sol 37: Proud Mary, performed by Tina Turner. ("And we're rolling, rolling, rolling on the river ...", first long drive, 

ended up being more than 20 meters.) 

• Sol 38: Runnin' With the Devil, by Van Halen. (HGA [High Gain Antenna] problem that sol, no activities, song played 

late in the sol.) 

• Sol 39: Hit the Road Jack, by Buster Poindexter. (Another long drive -- yes, this is a reuse of that song.) 

• Sol 40: What a Wonderful World, by Louis Armstrong. (Mars, that is.) 

• Sol 41: Open Road Song, by Eve 6. (Driving song, though only did several inches of driving to position in front of 

rock.) 

• Sol 42: Lift Up Every Stone, by John Hiatt. (Observations of the rock "Mimi".) 

• Sol 43: Livin' On a Prayer, by Bon Jovi. (Many sols tend to start with our fingers crossed.) 

• Sol 44: Way Over Yonder, by Carole King. (Heading for that crater.) 

• Sol 45: Touch Me in the Morning, by Diana Ross. (Touch and go sol.) 

• Sol 46: Wake Up Little Susie, by The Everly Brothers. (Generic wake-up song.) 

• Sol 47: Dig Down Deep, by Hot Soup. (Trenching sol.) 

• Sol 48: Working in the Coal Mine, by Devo. (Working in the trench.) 

• Sol 49: Coisinha Do Pai, by Beth Carvalho. (Brazilian song played on Mars Pathfinder, played again for Carnival 

weekend.) 

• Sol 50: Samba De Marte, by Beth Carvalho. (Brazilian song written by same artist inspired by use of previous song 

on MPF, this one is a "Mars Samba", also for Carnival weekend. Starts off "Hello NASA!".) 

• Sol 51: Chariots of Fire, by Vangelis. (Appropriate for slow-motion races.) 

_____ 



653




To: journal 

Subject: carl sagan and chapter 11 

I just read chapter 11 of the Sagan book. Well, actually, I didn't really read much of it, just skimmed it 

because it is just samples of reviews about what he wrote, which I found rather uninteresting. But one 

thing caught my eye, (don't ask why). Someone mentioned a project called SETI. I decided to find out 

something about it. (see link below). First, I noticed an article called "Darwin's Universe". That was 

really pretty interesting. But besides Darwin, guess who else is mentioned in it? That's right, Sagan, 

lol. OK, I admit it, I didn't have any idea who he was, other than he wrote this book. Well anyway, I 

guess he was somebody, lol. They even have a "Carl Sagan Endowed Chair" in this organization. If 

you are interested, (lets see if we have any takers) here is the link: 

http://www.seti.org/Welcome.html 

AND some info on Sagan if you don't want to bother. Cynthia 

About Carl Sagan 

1934 - 1996 

Sagan, Carl Edward was the David Duncan Professor of Astronomy and Space Sciences and 

Director of the Laboratory for Planetary Studies at Cornell University. Sagan was a member of the 

SETI Institute Board of Trustees at the time of his death. He has played a leading role in the Mariner, 

Viking, and Voyager spacecraft expeditions to the planets, for which he received the NASA Medals 

for Exceptional Scientific Achievement and (twice) for Distinguished Public Service. 

Once a research assistant of the Nobel Prize-winning geneticist H. J. Muller, his continuing research 

on the origin of life began in the 1950s. The Masursky Award from the American Astronomical Society 

cites "his extraordinary contributions to the development of planetary science. As a scientist trained in 

both astronomy and biology, Dr. Sagan has made seminal contributions to the study of planetary 

atmospheres, planetary surfaces, the history of the Earth, and exobiology. Many of the most 

productive planetary scientists working today are his present and former students and associates." 

His book Cosmos (accompanying his Emmy- and Peabody-award-winning television series of the 

same name) was the best-selling science book ever published in the English language. His novel 

Contact is soon to be major motion picture (Warner Bros.). Co-founder and President of The 

Planetary Society, he severs as Distinguished Visiting Scientist, Jet Propulsion Laboratory, California 

Institute of Technology. Dr. Sagan has received the Pulitzer Prize, the Oersted Medal, and many 

other awards - including eighteen honorary degrees from American colleges and universities - for his 

contributions to science, literature, education, and the preservation of the environment. 

Sagan was a member of the SETI Institute Board of Trustees at the time of his death. 

_____ 



654





Subject: Re: who deserves a scholorship? (As seen through Ann's lense of life) My thought for the 

week... 

Hi everyone, 

This is my thought for the week as seen through my lense that I view the world though... 

This article (to me) seems like a teachable moment.... This is a good example of what the whole 

homosexual marriage denial is like. Can anyone besides me make the connection? 

If you took the words out and replaced them with the topic I have been advocating for, do you see the 

connection? 

I will do just that... 

By ANN KIRKENDALL, Cohort - F Press Writer 

THE U.S.A - President Bush, in a new rendering on marriage laws and the separation of church and 

state, spoke Tuesday to let states withhold the right to marry homosexual couples. 

The nation's 45 - 55 ruling held that the United States of America was within its rights to deny a legally binding marriage 

licenses to a couples who are the sames sex. That holding applies even when the United States Constitution and The 

Pledge of Allegiance stand for "liberty and justice for all", and marriage licenses are available to any combination of 

couples as long as there is one male and one female. 

"Two law abiding, tax paying citizens who live in a country that stands for "liberty and justice for all" who want to be 

married to their life partner is apparently illegal," Chief Ann Kirkendall wrote for the world to see". "Indeed, wanting to 

have the same legal rights as any other citizen in the United States, is akin to a homosexual calling as well as 

an heterosexual pursuit." 

Just something to consider... 

Ann 

The percents and such are not accurate, but the whole idea is... 



Heaven forbid, if you want to study religion. Another undercutting of religious freedom in this 

country? I bet they allow scholorships to study evolution and some other things I won't mention. 

Cynthia 

655


AP 




WASHINGTON - The Supreme Court, in a new rendering on separation of church and state, voted 

Wednesday to let states withhold scholarships from students studying theology. 

The court's 7-2 ruling held that the state of Washington was within its rights to deny a taxpayer-funded scholarship to 

a college student who was studying to be a minister. That holding applies even when money is available to students 

studying anything else. 

"Training someone to lead a congregation is an essentially religious endeavor," Chief Justice William H. Rehnquist 

wrote for the court majority. "Indeed, majoring in devotional theology is akin to a religious calling as well as an 

academic pursuit." 

_____ 



_____ 



656





Subject: Re: who deserves a scholorship? (As seen through Ann's lense of life) My thought for the 

week... 

Very creative, Ann. You are probably right, everyone should be able to marry whomever they want. I 

think I will have to change my opinion on the marriage thing. In fact, I am thinking of taking a second 

husband. Double the love, double the money. As far as the scholarships go, I would only say it isn't 

illegal (yet) to study religion. Artists can get grants to trash religion, but you can't get a scholarship to 

study it. Now, if the majority of the people in this country agree that religion is evil and should be 

made illegal, then maybe the ruling would be reasonable. Give it time, I am sure it will happen. 

Cynthia 


Hi everyone, 

This is my thought for the week as seen through my lense that I view the world though... 

This article (to me) seems like a teachable moment.... This is a good example of what the whole 

homosexual marriage denial is like. Can anyone besides me make the connection? 

If you took the words out and replaced them with the topic I have been advocating for, do you see 

the connection? 

I will do just that... 

By ANN KIRKENDALL, Cohort - F Press Writer 

THE U.S.A - President Bush, in a new rendering on marriage laws and the separation of church 

and state, spoke Tuesday to let states withhold the right to marry homosexual couples. 

The nation's 45 - 55 ruling held that the United States of America was within its rights to deny a legally binding 

marriage licenses to a couples who are the sames sex. That holding applies even when the United States 

Constitution and The Pledge of Allegiance stand for "liberty and justice for all", and marriage licenses are available 

to any combination of couples as long as there is one male and one female. 

"Two law abiding, tax paying citizens who live in a country that stands for "liberty and justice for all" who want to be 

married to their life partner is apparently illegal," Chief Ann Kirkendall wrote for the world to see". "Indeed, wanting to 

have the same legal rights as any other citizen in the United States, is akin to a homosexual calling as well as 

an heterosexual pursuit." 

Just something to consider... 

Ann 

The percents and such are not accurate, but the whole idea is... 

657



Heaven forbid, if you want to study religion. Another undercutting of religious freedom in this 

country? I bet they allow scholorships to study evolution and some other things I won't 

mention. Cynthia 


AP 



_____ 

_____ 


WASHINGTON - The Supreme Court, in a new rendering on separation of church and state, 

voted Wednesday to let states withhold scholarships from students studying theology. 

The court's 7-2 ruling held that the state of Washington was within its rights to deny a taxpayer-funded 

scholarship to a college student who was studying to be a minister. That holding applies even when money is 

available to students studying anything else. 

"Training someone to lead a congregation is an essentially religious endeavor," Chief Justice William H. 

Rehnquist wrote for the court majority. "Indeed, majoring in devotional theology is akin to a religious calling as 

well as an academic pursuit." 





_____ 



658





Subject: Be your best friend 

Whew! I just read so many journals I feel like I just had you all over for 

tea. I have not 

been to the list serve lately because I was abducted, and while I was away I 

got the flu 

and ended up disecting owl pellets with angels. It's nice to be back. 

ANYWAYS... 

Everyone is writting very interesting stuff. I think we all have a general 

idea as to what 

kind of people we are. Of couse we do not know details about each other but I 

bet we 

could say two words about each person in our class that would at least 

somewhat 

describe his or her personality. We are all good people working to become the 

best 

teachers we can be. What am I getting at? I don't know but I think all of you 

are really 

cool. I think we should not be so arfaid to speak up about our thoughts. Here 

is an 

analogy. When I would get into a confrontation with my old boyfriend it was 

tuff and we 

would have different views and different opinions but when we talked through 

our 

differences I would always feel an amazing sense of closness with him even if 

we still 

had difference of opinion in the end. If everyone in the world had the same 

view it would 

be super boring. I used to always just agree with people to be nice but now I 

get excited 

when I can express a different opinion. My best friend Erin choses to back up 

opposing 

sides in every conversation just to make it more interesting. To this day I 

don't know 

where he stands on any topic but it's fun to talk to him because here tears 

apart and 

analyses both sides to everything to the fullest extent. 

Let's learn form each other and appreciate each other. In a year or so we will 

never be 

together again in this group. So let's make the time we have together a 

learning 

expereince that will help us learn more about ourselves through each other. 

Surrender to 

yourself, be confident, be your best friend and back yourself up. I always 

thought that you 

should be your best friend because if you think about it you are made up of 

everything 

you like, you buy things you like cause you think it's cool you act how you 

act cause 

that's how you think you should act. Each of us are a perfect concoction of 

what you think 

a person should be so of course your super cool. You hang out with people that 

you 

share interests with but in the end you are still the coolest because you are 

everything 

you think a person should be. Make sense. Marin 

659

660





Subject: Re: Be your best friend 

I think you are cool too, Marin! One thing I would disagree with is that we are all made up of 

everything we like. If that were true, we wouldn't need to improve ourselves. I for one don't think I am 

that perfect, not even close. But knowing that makes me try to improve. 

Cynthia 


Whew! I just read so many journals I feel like I just had you all over for 

tea. I have not 

been to the list serve lately because I was abducted, and while I was away I 

got the flu 

and ended up disecting owl pellets with angels. It's nice to be back. 

ANYWAYS... 

Everyone is writting very interesting stuff. I think we all have a general 

idea as to what 

kind of people we are. Of couse we do not know details about each other but I 

bet we 

could say two words about each person in our class that would at least 

somewhat 

describe his or her personality. We are all good people working to become the 

best 

teachers we can be. What am I getting at? I don't know but I think all of you 

are really 

cool. I think we should not be so arfaid to speak up about our thoughts. Here 

is an 

analogy. When I would get into a confrontatio n with my old boyfriend it was 

tuff and we 

would have different views and different opinions but when we talked through 

our 

differences I would always feel an amazing sense of closness with him even if 

we still 

had difference of opinion in the end. If everyone in the world had the same 

view it would 

be super boring. I used to always just agree with people to be nice but now I 

get excited 

when I can express a different opinion. My best friend Erin choses to back up 

opposing 

sides in every conversation just to make it more interesting. To this day I 

don't know 

where he stands on any topic but it's fun to talk to him because here tears 

apart and 

analyses both sides to everything to the fullest extent. 

Let's learn form each other and appreciate each other. In a year or so we will 

never be 


661

learning 

expereince that will help us learn more about ourselves through each other. 

Surrender to 

yourself, be confident, be your best friend and back yourself up. I always 

thought that you 

should be your best friend because if you think about it you are made up of 

everything 

you like, you buy things you like cause you think it's cool you act how you 

act cause 

that's how you think you should act. Each of us are a perfect concoction of 

what you think 

a person should be so of course your super cool. You hang out with people that 

you 

share interests with but in the end you are still the coolest because you are 

everything 

you think a person should be. Make sense. Marin 

_____ 



662





Subject: Mathematical Viewpoint 

A little something to think about! 

From a strictly mathematical viewpoint 

it goes like this: 

What Makes 100%? What does it mean to give MORE than 

100%? Ever wonder about those people who say they 

are giving more than 100%? We have all been to those 

meetings where someone wants you to give over 100%. 

How about achieving 103%? What makes up 100% in life? 

Here's a little mathematical formula that might help 

you answer these questions: 

If: 

A B C D E F G H I J K L M N O P Q R S T U V W X Y Z is 

represented as: 

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 

26. 

Then: 

H-A-R-D-W-O-R-K 

8+1+18+4+23+15+18+11 = 98% 

663

and 

K-N-O-W-L-E-D-G-E 

11+14+15+23+12+5+4+7+5 = 96% 

But, 

A-T-T-I-T-U-D-E 

1+20+20+9+20+21+4+5 = 100% 

And, 

B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T 

2+21+12+12+19+8+9+20 = 103% 

AND, look how far ass kissing will take you. 

A-S-S-K-I-S-S-I-N-G 

1+19+19+11+9+19+19+9+14+7 = 118% 

So, one can then conclude with mathematical 

certainty that While Hard work and Knowledge will 

get you close, and, Attitude will get you there, 

Bullshit and Ass kissing will put you over the top. 

664





Subject: Re: Mathematical Viewpoint 

This is too good for words!!! I was going to put a coded message, but then this code is too easy for 

the professors to figure out. Cynthia 


A little something to think about! 

From a strictly mathematical viewpoint 

it goes like this: 

What Makes 100%? What does it mean to give MORE than 

100%? Ever wonder about those people who say they 

are giving more than 100%? We have all been to those 

meetings where someone wants you to give over 100%. 

How about achieving 103%? What makes up 100% in life? 

Here's a little mathematical formula that might help 

you answer these questions: 

If: 

A B C D E F G H I J K L M N O P Q R S T U V W X Y Z is 

represented as: 

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 

25 26. 

Then: 

665

H-A-R-D-W-O-R-K 

8+1+18+4+23+15+18+11 = 98% 

and 

K-N-O-W-L-E-D-G-E 

11+14+15+23+12+5+4+7+5 = 96% 

But, 

A-T-T-I-T-U-D-E 

1+20+20+9+20+21+4+5 = 100% 

And, 

B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T 

2+21+12+12+19+8+9+20 = 103% 

AND, look how far ass kissing will take you. 

A-S-S-K-I-S-S-I-N-G 

1+19+19+11+9+19+19+9+14+7 = 118% 

So, one can then conclude with mathematical 

certainty that While Hard work and Knowledge will 

get you close, and, Attitude will get you there, 

Bullshit and Ass kissing will put you over the top. 

666

_____ 



667





Subject: sex and living together 

ok, so now that i got your attention....i have a couple things to say that i have always 

wondered about... 

what is the point in getting married when you already have sex and live together? 

i have known and do know many people that have been engaging in sex and are living 

together and are choosing to get married. 

my curiosity arises when i realize these couples have everything a married couple has. 

so why get married? what is the point? you have sex, you live together, you probably at 

this point vacation together. if you do vacation together, how is that different then an 

early honeymoon which ruins the one to come? 

so, how exciting could your wedding night be? how exciting can your honeymoon be? and 

how exciting can it be to come home to a house you own together? 

i am looking at this without my christianity in mind. you should all know that i did not 

grow up christian by any means. this feeling and curiosity has always been in the back of 

my mind, even before i wanted to live my life for God and surrender my life to Him. 

so, isnt marriage at this point just a piece of paper and a waste of money? or maybe it 

just means a break in your taxes. oh how romantic. 

i would never want to take the romance and excitement out of my wedding night and 

honeymoon. why not make it special? why not avoid vacationing together so that when you 

do take your honeymooon it will be the most amazing moment in your lives? a feeling that 

is so worth it and so unfortunate to spoil. why not put the tradition back into marriage 

and carry your wife over the threshold for the very first time? 

i know that my wedding will be filled with anticipation and gittiness (if i can make that 

a word) because of what is to come. i know that my honeymoon will be an intimate and 

special time unlike any other. and i know that when we walk into our new home, we will be 

thrilled to start our life together. 

i know this is a very private topic and you may not want to share. but at this point, i 

guess i am just challenging you to see the traditional aspects of the wedding, everything 

that leads up to and everything after, that make it so worth while. 

maybe i just dont get it. i cant see past the romance and unspoiled intimacy. 


668





Subject: test run 

i sent an email that never came back to me, so im just sending this as a test run to see 

if this one gets sent back to me. 


669





Subject: RE: sex and living together 

The reason people have sex and live together before they get married is 

because you don't want to gamble the rest of your life on the hope that you 

MIGHT be sexually compatible, and you will PROBABLY be able to live together 

in harmony. 

As for romantic christian wedding nights, I direct you all here: 

http://www.theonion.com/onion3510/awkward_sex_encounter.html 

Much like an elf going under ground when a dwarf dare not*, I actually agree 

with Karis on something. I dont see a real point to getting married, unless 

you are part of Team Jesus. I really feel that marriage is an outdated 

institution. The reason a lot of people get married is because we are all 

raised with the expectation that it's the only normal thing to do when one 

gets older. People in their 40's who have never been married are almost 

always labeled as losers or weirdos. I could be perfectly happy living with 

someone and never getting married. The problem is, women are generally 

soulless greed factories that are only happy with an endless barrage of 

diamonds and cake. So in order to keep the love faucet flowing, you need to 

pony up with the ring, and keep 'em coming. 

*"This is a thing unheard of!" -Gimli 

>From: 


>To: 

>Subject: sex and living together 

>Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:00:08 -0800 

> 

>ok, so now that i got your attention....i have a couple things to say that 

>i have always wondered about... 

> 

>what is the point in getting married when you already have sex and live 

>together? 

> 

>i have known and do know many people that have been engaging in sex and are 

>living together and are choosing to get married. 

> 

>my curiosity arises when i realize these couples have everything a married 

>couple has. 

> 

>so why get married? what is the point? you have sex, you live together, 

>you probably at this point vacation together. if you do vacation together, 

>how is that different then an early honeymoon which ruins the one to come? 

> 

>so, how exciting could your wedding night be? how exciting can your 

>honeymoon be? and how exciting can it be to come home to a house you own 

>together? 

> 

>i am looking at this without my christianity in mind. you should all know 

>that i did not grow up christian by any means. this feeling and curiosity 

>has always been in the back of my mind, even before i wanted to live my 

>life for God and surrender my life to Him. 

> 

670

so, isnt marriage at this point just a piece of paper and a waste of money? 

>or maybe it just means a break in your taxes. oh how romantic. 

> 

>i would never want to take the romance and excitement out of my wedding 

>night and honeymoon. why not make it special? why not avoid vacationing 

>together so that when you do take your honeymooon it will be the most 

>amazing moment in your lives? a feeling that is so worth it and so 

>unfortunate to spoil. why not put the tradition back into marriage and 

>carry your wife over the threshold for the very first time? 

> 

>i know that my wedding will be filled with anticipation and gittiness (if i 

>can make that a word) because of what is to come. i know that my honeymoon 

>will be an intimate and special time unlike any other. and i know that 

>when we walk into our new home, we will be thrilled to start our life 

>together. 

> 

>i know this is a very private topic and you may not want to share. but at 

>this point, i guess i am just challenging you to see the traditional 

>aspects of the wedding, everything that leads up to and everything after, 

>that make it so worth while. 

> 

>maybe i just dont get it. i cant see past the romance and unspoiled 

>intimacy. 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



671





Subject: Re: sex and living together 

Well, here is why Rosie O'Donnell got married. 

"We were both inspired to come here after the sitting president said the vile and vicious and hateful 

comments he did," O'Donnell said. 

More spiteful than romantic, but to each her own. 

I used to think it was a commitment between a man and a woman that they would stay together and 

support each other till death do they part. Sad to say, that doesn't seem to be it anymore (me 

excluded of course). Currently, I think it is the tax break, and you are right, that is not romantic. But, 

even if people live together and do that other stuff, prior to getting married, while it wouldn't be the 

same as your experience will be, it is still something special. And then there was the stigma of 

bastard children, but that has gone by the wayside, so its no longer a valid reason to get married 

either. It's looking like it really isn't very necessary anymore. If we just get rid of marriage, we could 

save a bundle on divorce and avoid all commitment and responsibility. (sarcasm) 

Cynthia 

PS Karis, Hang on to your vision and your reasons, they are good ones. 


ok, so now that i got your attention....i have a couple things to say that i have always wondered 

about... 

what is the point in getting married when you already have sex and live together? 

i have known and do know many people that have been engaging in sex and are living together 

and are choosing to get married. 

my curiosity arises when i realize these couples have everything a married couple has. 

so why get married? what is the point? you have sex, you live together, you probably at this point 

vacation together. if you do vacation together, how is that different then an early honeymoon 

which ruins the one to come? 

so, how exciting could your wedding night be? how exciting can your honeymoon be? and how 

exciting can it be to come home to a house you own together? 

i am looking at this without my christianity in mind. you should all k now that i did not grow up 

christian by any means. this feeling and curiosity has always been in the back of my mind, even 

before i wanted to live my life for God and surrender my life to Him. 

so, isnt marriage at this point just a piece of paper and a waste of money? or maybe it just means 

a break in your taxes. oh how romantic. 

i would never want to take the romance and excitement out of my wedding night and honeymoon. 

672

why not make it special? why not avoid vacationing together so that when you do take your 

honeymooon it will be the most amazing moment in your lives? a feeling that is so worth it and so 

unfortunate to spoil. why not put the tradition back into marriage and carry your wife over the 

threshold for the very first time? 

i know that my wedding will be filled with anticipation and gittiness (if i can make that a word) 

because of what is to come. i know that my honeymoon will be an intimate and special time unlike 

any other. and i know that when we w alk into our new home, we will be thrilled to start our life 

together. 

i know this is a very private topic and you may not want to share. but at this point, i guess i am just 

challenging you to see the traditional aspects of the wedding, everything that leads up to and 

everything after, that make it so worth while. 

maybe i just dont get it. i cant see past the romance and unspoiled intimacy. 


_____ 



673






so if sex is awkward with someone, you mutually decide after that first encounter, this 

isnt right and never see each other again? 

as far as im concerned, you COMMUNICATE and get things right. havent you listened to dr. 

drew or whomever, they all say to ask questions, tell, and communicate what works and 

doesnt work. so on that note, i disagree with a one night stand simply b/c it wasnt 

perfect. 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/27 Fri PM 10:51:22 PST 


> Subject: RE: sex and living together 

> 

> The reason people have sex and live together before they get married is 

> because you don't want to gamble the rest of your life on the hope that you 

> MIGHT be sexually compatible, and you will PROBABLY be able to live together 

> in harmony. 

> 

> As for romantic christian wedding nights, I direct you all here: 

> 

> http://www.theonion.com/onion3510/awkward_sex_encounter.html 

> 

> Much like an elf going under ground when a dwarf dare not*, I actually agree 

> with Karis on something. I dont see a real point to getting married, unless 

> you are part of Team Jesus. I really feel that marriage is an outdated 

> institution. The reason a lot of people get married is because we are all 

> raised with the expectation that it's the only normal thing to do when one 

> gets older. People in their 40's who have never been married are almost 

> always labeled as losers or weirdos. I could be perfectly happy living with 

> someone and never getting married. The problem is, women are generally 

> soulless greed factories that are only happy with an endless barrage of 

> diamonds and cake. So in order to keep the love faucet flowing, you need to 

> pony up with the ring, and keep 'em coming. 

> 

> 

> *"This is a thing unheard of!" -Gimli 

> 

> 

> >From: 


> >To: 

> >Subject: sex and living together 

> >Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:00:08 -0800 

> > 

> >ok, so now that i got your attention....i have a couple things to say that 

> >i have always wondered about... 

> > 

> >what is the point in getting married when you already have sex and live 

> >together? 

> > 

> >i have known and do know many people that have been engaging in sex and are 

> >living together and are choosing to get married. 

> > 

> >my curiosity arises when i realize these couples have everything a married 

> >couple has. 

> > 

> >so why get married? what is the point? you have sex, you live together, 

674

you probably at this point vacation together. if you do vacation together, 

> >how is that different then an early honeymoon which ruins the one to come? 

> > 

> >so, how exciting could your wedding night be? how exciting can your 

> >honeymoon be? and how exciting can it be to come home to a house you own 

> >together? 

> > 

> >i am looking at this without my christianity in mind. you should all know 

> >that i did not grow up christian by any means. this feeling and curiosity 

> >has always been in the back of my mind, even before i wanted to live my 

> >life for God and surrender my life to Him. 

> > 

> >so, isnt marriage at this point just a piece of paper and a waste of money? 

> >or maybe it just means a break in your taxes. oh how romantic. 

> > 

> >i would never want to take the romance and excitement out of my wedding 

> >night and honeymoon. why not make it special? why not avoid vacationing 

> >together so that when you do take your honeymooon it will be the most 

> >amazing moment in your lives? a feeling that is so worth it and so 

> >unfortunate to spoil. why not put the tradition back into marriage and 

> >carry your wife over the threshold for the very first time? 

> > 

> >i know that my wedding will be filled with anticipation and gittiness (if i 

> >can make that a word) because of what is to come. i know that my honeymoon 

> >will be an intimate and special time unlike any other. and i know that 

> >when we walk into our new home, we will be thrilled to start our life 

> >together. 

> > 

> >i know this is a very private topic and you may not want to share. but at 

> >this point, i guess i am just challenging you to see the traditional 

> >aspects of the wedding, everything that leads up to and everything after, 

> >that make it so worth while. 

> > 

> >maybe i just dont get it. i cant see past the romance and unspoiled 

> >intimacy. 

> > 


> > 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> Take off on a romantic weekend or a family adventure to these great U.S. 

> locations. http://special.msn.com/local/hotdestinations.armx 

> 

> 


675






Mike, It's not about diamonds and cake, its about diamonds and purses and shoes. I got this on the 

good authority of my daughter who has recently trapped some poor soul and got her name added on 

his credit cards even before the wedding day. So forget the cake and think big: Coach, Prada, Lous 

Vuitton, Dooney and Burke, and Gucci. 

Cynthia 


The reason people have sex and live together before they get married is 

because you don't want to gamble the rest of your life on the hope that you 

MIGHT be sexually compatible, and you will PROBABLY be able to live together 

in harmony. 

As for romantic christian wedding nights, I direct you all here: 

http://www.theonion.com/onion3510/awkward_sex_encounter.html 

Much like an elf going under ground when a dwarf dare not*, I actually agree 

with Karis on something. I dont see a real point to getting married, unless 

you are part of Team Jesus. I really feel that marriage is an outdated 

institution. The reason a lot of people get married is because we are all 

raised with the expectation that it's the only normal thing to do when one 

gets older. People in their 40's who have never been married are almost 

always labeled as losers or weirdos. I could be perfectly happy living with 

someone and never getting married. The problem is, women are generally 

soulless greed factories that are only happy with an endless barrage of 

diamonds and cake. So in order to keep the love faucet flowing, you need to 

pony up with the ring, and keep 'em coming. 

*"This is a thing unheard of!" -Gimli 

>From: 


>To: 

>Subject: sex and living together 

>Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:00:08 -0800 

> 

>ok, so now that i got your attention....i have a couple things to say that 

>i have always wondered about... 

> 

>what is the point in getting married when you already have sex and live 

>together? 

> 

676

i have known and do know many people that have been engaging in sex and are 

>living together and are choosing to get married. 

> 

>my curiosity arises wh en i realize these couples have everything a married 

>couple has. 

> 

>so why get married? what is the point? you have sex, you live together, 

>you probably at this point vacation together. if you do vacation together, 

>how is that different then an early honeymoon which ruins the one to come? 

> 

>so, how exciting could your wedding night be? how exciting can your 

>honeymoon be? and how exciting can it be to come home to a house you own 

>together? 

> 

>i am looking at this without my christianity in mind. you should all know 

>that i did not grow up christian by any means. this feeling and curiosity 

>has always been in the back of my mind, even before i wanted to live my 

>life for God and surrender my life to Him. 

> 

>so, isnt marriage at this point just a piece of paper and a waste of money? 

>or maybe it just means a break in your taxes. oh how romantic. 

> 

>i would never want to take the romance and excitement out of my wedding 

>night and honeymoon. why not make it special? why not avoid vacationing 

>together so that when you do take your honeymooon it will be the most 

>amazing moment in your lives? a feeling that is so worth it and so 

>unfortunate to spoil. why not put the tradition back into marriage and 

>carry your wife over the threshold for the very first time? 

> 

>i know that my wedding will be filled with anticipation and gittiness (if i 

>can make that a word) because of what is to come. i know that my honeymoon 

>will be an intimate and special time unlike any other. and i know that 

>when we walk into our new home, we will be thrilled to start our life 

>together. 

> 

>i know this is a very private topic and you may not want to share. but at 

>this point, i guess i am just challenging you to see the traditional 

>aspects of the wedding, ever ything that leads up to and everything after, 

>that make it so worth while. 

> 

>maybe i just dont get it. i cant see past the romance and unspoiled 

>intimacy. 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 

677



678






This is a very interesting topic and one that I would like to give my 

"two cents" to. I have been married twice. The first time I married, I 

did everything the "old fashioned" way. We dated, he came over to my 

parents home for dinner, we went out eating, dancing, partying etc. We 

never lived together and after we got married he did carry me over the 

threshold (I was much skinnier then). Then the nightmare started! I 

was living with a man that I really didn't know that well. There were 

things about him I didn't know that you can only know when you've been 

intimate with someone. Besides that he was a complete slob, demanded 

certain meals, expected me to dress a certain way, yada, yada, yada. 

Thankfully, I got out of the marriage, no kids, no strings! After a 

while, I met my current husband. After knowing each other a year, we 

moved in together and lived together for four years before getting 

married. We've been married 9 years this year! Our honeymoon was the 

best and the memories still make me glow! We decided to get married 

because we knew we wanted to spend the rest of our lives together, and 

why not? Our relationship never changed because we did get married. 

The only thing that changed was my last name, and that was my choice! 

I don't think God will punish me for living in sin for four years 

because He knows that I found someone I want to spend the rest of my 

life with. I didn't want to make the same mistake again, so by living 

with Randy first, I got to know all about him and his little quirks 

which I accepted, and then when we got married, there were no surprises! 

~ Louise 


From: karisanne@adelphia.net [mailto:karisanne@adelphia.net] 



Subject: sex and living together 

ok, so now that i got your attention....i have a couple things to say 

that i have always wondered about... 

what is the point in getting married when you already have sex and live 

together? 

i have known and do know many people that have been engaging in sex and 

are living together and are choosing to get married. 

my curiosity arises when i realize these couples have everything a 

married couple has. 

so why get married? what is the point? you have sex, you live 

together, you probably at this point vacation together. if you do 

vacation together, how is that different then an early honeymoon which 

ruins the one to come? 

so, how exciting could your wedding night be? how exciting can your 

honeymoon be? and how exciting can it be to come home to a house you 

own together? 

679

i am looking at this without my christianity in mind. you should all 

know that i did not grow up christian by any means. this feeling and 

curiosity has always been in the back of my mind, even before i wanted 

to live my life for God and surrender my life to Him. 

so, isnt marriage at this point just a piece of paper and a waste of 

money? or maybe it just means a break in your taxes. oh how romantic. 

i would never want to take the romance and excitement out of my wedding 

night and honeymoon. why not make it special? why not avoid 

vacationing together so that when you do take your honeymooon it will be 

the most amazing moment in your lives? a feeling that is so worth it 

and so unfortunate to spoil. why not put the tradition back into 

marriage and carry your wife over the threshold for the very first time? 

i know that my wedding will be filled with anticipation and gittiness 

(if i can make that a word) because of what is to come. i know that my 

honeymoon will be an intimate and special time unlike any other. and i 

know that when we walk into our new home, we will be thrilled to start 

our life together. 

i know this is a very private topic and you may not want to share. but 

at this point, i guess i am just challenging you to see the traditional 

aspects of the wedding, everything that leads up to and everything 

after, that make it so worth while. 

maybe i just dont get it. i cant see past the romance and unspoiled 

intimacy. 


680





Subject: RE: Be your best friend 

Yep Yep Yep I hear ya barking big dog. I have many areas that I need to 

improve. Didn't 

think about that. Marin 


>I think you are cool too, Marin! One thing I would disagree with is that we 

are all made 

up of everything we like. If that were true, we wouldn't need to improve 

ourselves. I for 

one don't think I am that perfect, not even close. But knowing that makes me 

try to 

improve. 

>Cynthia 

> 

>tinne002 wrote: 

>Whew! I just read so many journals I feel like I just had you all over for 

>tea. I have not 

>been to the list serve lately because I was abducted, and while I was away I 

>got the flu 

>and ended up disecting owl pellets with angels. It's nice to be back. 

>ANYWAYS... 

>Everyone is writting very interesting stuff. I think we all have a general 

>idea as to what 

>kind of people we are. Of couse we do not know details about each other but I 

>bet we 

>could say two words about each person in our class that would at least 

>somewhat 

>describe his or her personality. We are all good people working to become the 

>best 

>teachers we can be. What am I getting at? I don't know but I think all of you 

>are really 

>cool. I think we should not be so arfaid to speak up about our thoughts. Here 

>is an 

>analogy. When I would get into a confrontation with my old boyfriend it was 

>tuff and we 

>would have different views and different opinions but when we talked through 

>our 

>differences I would always feel an amazing sense of closness with him even if 

>we still 

>had difference of opinion in the end. If everyone in the world had the same 

>view it would 

>be super boring. I used to always just agree with people to be nice but now I 

>get excited 

>when I can express a different opinion. My best friend Erin choses to back up 

>opposing 

>sides in every conversation just to make it more interesting. To this day I 

>don't know 

>where he stands on any topic but it's fun to talk to him because here tears 

>apart and 

>analyses both sides to everything to the fullest extent. 

>Let's learn form each other and appreciate each other. In a year or so we 

will 

>never be 

681


>learning 

>expereince that will help us learn more about ourselves through each other. 

>Surrender to 

>yourself, be confident, be your best friend and back yourself up. I always 

>thought that you 

>should be your best friend because if you think about it you are made up of 

>everything 

>you like, you buy things you like cause you think it's cool you act how you 

>act cause 

>that's how you think you should act. Each of us are a perfect concoction of 

>what you think 

>a person should be so of course your super cool. You hang out with people 

that 

>you 

>share interests with but in the end you are still the coolest because you are 

>everything 

>you think a person should be. Make sense. Marin 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail 

682






You are so romantic Mike 

683





Subject: Everything 

Should people live together before they get married? I don't know. I think it 

is beautiful if 

you can wait. But like Louise said sometimes you do not really know a person 

until you 

live with them. I think sometimes you just need a glimps of how it would be to 

live with 

him/her. Maybe like a year before you get married you could stay together for 

a month 

just to test the waters. I would think that God would be happy if you did that 

because you 

would show him that you really want to be together and make things work so you 

have to 

just make sure you can stand each other under living situations. 

I went to a wedding a few years ago. My good Christian friends Cory and Vory 

got 

married and after they said their vowls they shared their first kiss. It was 

very powerful 

and a little awkward for the two to share this moment in front of a crowd but 

powerful. I 

think that it was a beautiful moment it would be cool if it happened more. 

However, It was 

a very rare moment, and I have not heared of anything like it sense. Karas I 

am counting 

on you to have that special perfect wedding day you deserve it for the 

devotion you have 

given to God. 

Other topics: 

I wrote some notes yesterday as I read through the journals. 

Ramos- made me think about how mind bogling it its to tink about how much we 

are 

controlled to think ow others (government) wants us to think. I have to admit 

i got a little 

sketched when I read tht line because it made me question everything I know. I 

watch the 

new read the paper. All this stuff is written by jouranlists, reporters, 

politicians what if in 

college all of these groups of people were given an education designed by the 

government. Politicians know that these are the people who communicate with 

all the 

rest of us so they could use them to structure how the world should maintaine 

it'sorder, at 

least through thier eyes. like the Dihydrogen Monoxide we were lead to believe 

it was 

somthing other than water, some of us got pissed, we wanted to figure out 

more about it. 

The government could very well play with our emotions the same way the 

Dihydrogen 

Monoxide topic did with some of us. With the elections coming up it is hard to 

decide 

what is good and bad. The adds mess with us so much that we loose sight of 

what want 

for our state and country. Sometimes I just want to move to the forest so no 

one can 

through issues,and problems at me I am so curious to live a life away from 

freeway and 

684

political chaos. What can I learn from nature and survival what will my values 

and beliefs 

be if I lived in a small community in the forest. I have done this before I 

know what 

happens. It amazing suddenly just breathing and being becomes a miracle. 

Cecilia I really want to get to know your "wicked humor". I find your posts to 

be very 

humorous, simple, open and thoughtful. I can see your humor peek trough here 

and 

there and it makes me very curious as to who you are. 

Teressa you kill me. I wish I could pond my scary thought off on to you so 

that life would 

not be such a boar for you. I wish I could enjoy my scary imaginations but I 

am usually to 

busy being sacred to enjoy the rush. 

Solongo Deep nicely written. Theere is so much thougth and reflection in your 

writting 

Alexandra. A quote you wrote really make me think and smile, 

"Does God dwell in all things including what science calls evolution?" 

I started to think after reading this question why can't we have both, God and 

evolution. 

Sure it will be a little rough around the edges but so is evolution and so is 

religion. 

Maybe every thing does not fit like a perfect puzzle. Maybe it shouldn't. 

There is too much 

information in the world today to make every peice fit. Either you believe one 

thing and 

you make the puzzle pieces fit or you have a jumbled up puzzle but you are 

okay with 

that. There are always going to be quarks and problems in our lives. Life will 

slip away if 

we just focus on how to get rid of all the problems then live life when they 

are gone. 

Problems will always be here we just have to be okay with that and live and 

deal with it 

and appreciate all the good. All I know is that things are more like they are 

now than they 

have ever been before. I also think that God exits in many ways. We may call 

him/her 

different names but the same morals are found throughout religion. Studying 

Zen 

Buddhism I was asked to know the Ten Cardinal Precepts, they may look 

familiar.. 

I resolve not to kill but to cheerish all life 

I resolve not to take what is not given, but to respect all things. 

I resolve not to misuse sexuality 

I resolve not to lie but to speak the truth 

It goes on, there is a total of ten, but my point is that many people fight 

over religion and 

what is so ironic about that is that often times they are living very similar 

lives. Many 

religions have a great deal in common people just decide to knock other 

religions 

because they lack the same title but they follow the same guidlines. 

Enlightenment, 

heaven, glory is found in the end. You know what I feel like I should peace 

out now. 

These are just thought that have been rolling in my head. My thoughts are 

easily altered I 

just felt like I should open up a little. Enjoy your weekend. 

P.S. The readings are good. Love line 91X was talking about the flu the other 

day and 

brought up interesting facts about the virus. I gotta jet but ask me aobut it 

685

if you want. 

Marin 

686






Way to go Louise! Yes this is Jenny the heathen of the class:) And I would like to be in on this topic 

too. Finally something interesting and something I know a little about. So, everyone get ready to drop 

your jaws:) I Jenny, as you all know me as being so innocent and sweet, lived with my boyfriend now 

fiance before as well. We had our own apartment in Rancho Penaquitos when I was 20 years old. 

Mind you we had already been dating for 5 years by then. Yes, that's right, we started dating when I 

was 15 years old. So the question being did it ruin what we are experiencing now and why are we 

getting married after all this time? Well, to be in love with someone does not become a situation 

where you say that we have lived together or whatever and now there is nothing else for us to 

experience together. It means that everyday you enjoy their company and you look forward to being 

with them forever. Marriage is a declaration to the world that you love one another and a special 

moment where you share intimate vows, if you write some of them, that explain what you mean to 

each other and how you view your future together. This is why Manny and I opted to retreat to a 

private ceremony in front of only our closest family and friends where the focus is on us and not the 

food at the reception or if people will enjoy the party. We have chosen to take this intimate special 

experience and just enjoy the moment. If you think that that will be boring to me and not special or not 

memorable then you have obviously never really been in love. No matter what you experience 

together it is always special and it is worth the journey. So yes for living together:) 

Jenny Fiala 

687






Very well said, Jenny! I think you captured to true meaning of marriage. The whole wedding thing is 

just a formality, and it can be whatever you want it to be. I might as well join you and Louise, My 

husband and I lived together before getting married too. We also had our kids first. But, eventually we 

did get married and still are married. While I don't regret how I did it, I do respect others who do it the 

traditional way as well. Take my daughter for instance, she will be getting married before living or 

sleeping with her future husband and I am totally fine with that. I think it all depends of the individuals 

involved, no right or wrong answer for this. Cynthia 


Way to go Louise! Yes this is Jenny the heathen of the class:) And I would like to be in on this 

topic too. Finally something interesting and something I know a little about. So, everyone get 

ready to drop your jaws:) I Jenny, as you all know me as being so innocent and sweet, lived with 

my boyfriend now fiance before as well. We had our own apartment in Rancho Penaquitos when I 

was 20 years old. Mind you we had already been dating for 5 years by then. Yes, that's right, we 

started dating when I was 15 years old. So the question being did it ruin what we are experiencing 

now and why are we getting married after all this time? Well, to be in love with someone does not 

become a situation where you say that we have lived together or whatever and now there is 

nothing else for us to experience together. It means that everyday you enjoy their company and 

you look forward to being with them forever. Marriage is a declaration to the world that you love 

one another and a special moment where you share intimate vows, if you write some of them, that 

explain what you mean to each other and how you view your future together. This is why Manny 

and I opted to retreat to a private ceremony in front of only our closest family and friends where 

the focus is on us and not the food at the reception or if people will enjoy the party. We have 

chosen to take this intimate special experience and just enjoy the moment. If you think that that 

will be boring to me and not special or not memorable then you have obviously never really been 

in love. No matter what you experience together it is always special and it is worth the journey. So 

yes for living together:) 

Jenny Fiala 

_____ 



688





Subject: Re: Everything 

Marin, Don't worry too much about our government controlling everything and everyone. They are just 

the protitutes for the special interests groups who have the real power. The government only does 

what they are paid to do, kind of like puppets. 

Cynthia 


Should people live together before they get married? I don't know. I think it 

is beautiful if 

you can wait. But like Louise said sometimes you do not really know a person 

until you 

live with them. I think sometimes you just need a glimps of how it would be to 

live with 

him/her. Maybe like a year before you get married you could stay together for 

a month 

just to test the waters. I would think that God would be happy if you did that 

because you 

would show him that you really want to be together and make things work so you 

have to 

just make sure you can stand each other under living situations. 

I went to a wedding a few years ago. My good Christian friends Cory and Vory 

got 

married and after they said their vowls they shared their first kiss. It was 

very powerful 

and a little awkward for the two to share this mome nt in front of a crowd but 

powerful. I 

think that it was a beautiful moment it would be cool if it happened more. 

However, It was 

a very rare moment, and I have not heared of anything like it sense. Karas I 

am counting 

on you to have that special perfect wedding day you deserve it for the 

devotion you have 

given to God. 

Other topics: 

I wrote some notes yesterday as I read through the journals. 

Ramos- made me think about how mind bogling it its to tink about how much we 

are 

controlled to think ow others (government) wants us to think. I have to admit 

i got a little 

sketched when I read tht line because it made me question everything I know. I 

watch the 

new read the paper. All this stuff is written by jouranlists, reporters, 

politicians what if in 

college all of these groups of people were given an education designed by the 

689

government. Politicians know that these are the people who communicate with 

all the 

rest of us so they could use them to structure how the world should maintaine 

it'sorder, at 

least through thier eyes. like the Dihydrogen Monoxide we were lead to believe 

it was 

somthing other than water, some of us got pissed, we wanted to figure out 

more about it. 

The government could very well play with our emotions the same way the 

Dihydrogen 

Monoxide topic did with some of us. With the elections coming up it is hard to 

decide 

what is good and bad. The adds mess with us so much that we loose sight of 

what want 

for our state and country. Sometimes I just want to move to the forest so no 

one can 

through issues,and problems at me I am so curious to live a life away from 

freeway and 

political chaos. What can I learn from nature and survival what will my values 

and beliefs 

be if I lived in a small community in the forest. I have done this before I 

know what 

happens. It amazing suddenly just br eathing and being becomes a miracle. 

Cecilia I really want to get to know your "wicked humor". I find your posts to 

be very 

humorous, simple, open and thoughtful. I can see your humor peek trough here 

and 

there and it makes me very curious as to who you are. 

Teressa you kill me. I wish I could pond my scary thought off on to you so 

that life would 

not be such a boar for you. I wish I could enjoy my scary imaginations but I 

am usually to 

busy being sacred to enjoy the rush. 

Solongo Deep nicely written. Theere is so much thougth and reflection in your 

writting 

Alexandra. A quote you wrote really make me think and smile, 

"Does God dwell in all things including what science calls evolution?" 

I started to think after reading this question why can't we have both, God and 

evolution. 

Sure it will be a little rough around the edges but so is evolution and so is 

religion. 

Maybe every thing does not fit like a p erfect puzzle. Maybe it shouldn't. 

There is too much 

information in the world today to make every peice fit. Either you believe one 

thing and 

you make the puzzle pieces fit or you have a jumbled up puzzle but you are 

okay with 

that. There are always going to be quarks and problems in our lives. Life will 

slip away if 

we just focus on how to get rid of all the problems then live life when they 

690

are gone. 

Problems will always be here we just have to be okay with that and live and 

deal with it 

and appreciate all the good. All I know is that things are more like they are 

now than they 

have ever been before. I also think that God exits in many ways. We may call 

him/her 

different names but the same morals are found throughout religion. Studying 

Zen 

Buddhism I was asked to know the Ten Cardinal Precepts, they may look 

familiar.. 

I resolve not to kill but to cheerish all life 

I resolve not to take what is not given, but to respect all things. 

I resolve not to misuse sexuality 

I resolve not to lie but to speak the truth 

It goes on, there is a total of ten, but my point is that many people fight 

over religion and 

what is so ironic about that is that often times they are living very similar 

lives. Many 

religions have a great deal in common people just decide to knock other 

religions 

because they lack the same title but they follow the same guidlines. 

Enlightenment, 

heaven, glory is found in the end. You know what I feel like I should peace 

out now. 

These are just thought that have been rolling in my head. My thoughts are 

easily altered I 

just felt like I should open up a little. Enjoy your weekend. 

P.S. The readings are good. Love line 91X was talking about the flu the other 

day and 

brought up interesting facts about the virus. I gotta jet but ask me aobut it 

if you want. 

Marin 

_____ 



691





Subject: living together and marriage 

Ahhh Haaa, 

The vine is shaking... 

After reading everyone's journals up to this point, I thought of a few things: 

My first thought has to do with living together before marriage. Would you buy a pair of shoes without 

trying them on? Just because they are marked as your size does not mean they will fit right. You 

could go to the store everyday and look at them in the window, pick them up with your hands, carry 

them around the store a little, hold them up to your pants to see if you like the color, But, for anyone 

who has had an uncomfortable pair of shoes knows, no matter how much you where them, they 

always hurt your feet. 

Another thought about marriage being allowed to some couples and not others, (Karis and others 

who wrote on this), Just imagine all the wonderful love, happiness, anticipation of being 

together....etc., but never being able to have it. (Kind of like a glass ceiling- you can see everyone 

elses happiness and success, but you can not have it). What if you were not allowed to get married 

because some group of people said you were wrong? How would you feel? Would you be 

frustrated? Would you just live your life without your special someone? Would you end up living 

together? 

As for what Marin said in her journal about the government being in control of what people think and 

know, I agree that groups in power brain wash their followers to believe what they want them to 

believe. For example, children are not born with hateful feelings towards people who have different 

colors of skin, or who walk with a limp, or who are a little slower than the rest... The same goes with 

sexuality... Our society teaches us how to be; it is our society that poisons us against homosexuality. 

What we really should do is watch children on how they treat people (before they are poisoned by our 

society that is). If you watch children, they can be so honest, caring, and loving. But, we as a society 

poison their minds with prejudices, and gender roles, and hateful values. 

What amazes me is that people are so set in their thinking that they keep passing the bullshit on. 

The cycle of violence!!! The cycle of prejudices!!! The cycle of hate! 

Whether it is legalizing marriage between homosexuals, or accepting differences in other people, our 

actions ARE NOT SET IN STONE!!! We do have the choice to get up and stand up for what is the 

right thing to do. 

How would any of us like it if it was forbidden to marry our boyfriend or our girlfriend. How would you 

feel if there were groups of people around, including the president of the United States of 

America ("liberty and justice for some but not all") who told you that who you loved and wanted to 

spend your life with was a sin and that you can not get married? And that the only alternatives they 

give you do not offer any of the benefits that marriage does... 

How would you feel if you went to Baskin Robins and out of the 31 flavors, they said you can only 

have vanilla even though everyone else gets to have whatever flavor they want? 

692

How would you feel if your society at face value was polite to your face because it is not politically 

correct to hate homosexuals? But, by their actions and laws, the very same society was condemning 

you for what you believed in? Actions speak louder than words. 

Does anyone realize that the suicide rate for homosexuals is much, much larger than it is for 

heterosexuals? In no doubt connected with the laws and values we keep passing on to generation 

after generation. I am still amazed that there are not more people like myself who want to stand up 

and scream "THAT THIS IS A BUNCH OF BULLSHIT!" 

Does anyone realize that this is our time in history. We have choices NOW. That the history we read 

about had their choices and their consequences. If it were not for our fore mothers who stood up for 

women's rights, we would still be the property of men to do with as they pleased. 

That if the civil rights movement never took place, we would still be castrating and hanging "Negro's" 

from the nearest tree. I went to Balboa Park to the art museum and stood in front of a painting for the 

longest time. This painting was titled" Southern Holiday (The Lynching 1936) by Sternberg. 

Southern Holiday 

Southern Holiday is the artist's brutal indictment of the lynchings and the oppression of African- 

Americans in the 1930s. Sternberg described himself as "filled with anger and shame" as he read 

newspaper accounts of racist atrocities and treated this theme several times in powerful prints and 

paintings. In this work, Sternberg depicts a castrated African-American man about to be hung feetfirst 

from a tree. He symbolized what he considered to be the decaying culture of the south through 

the broken columns, included depictions of factories as icons of economic oppression, and painted 

the white population, stripped naked of the civilizing veneer of clothing and thriving on the backs of 

anguished African-Americans. 

http://us.f215.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?DMid=8478_960582_873_425_1931_0_1082_4262_ 

2655232039&YY=86107&inc=25&order=down&sort=date&pos=0&view=&head=&box=Draft 

Anyway, I better stop before I say too much... 

I end this journal entry with the following quote by J.F. Wright, 

"True religion is the life we live, not the creed we profess". 

Think about this... (a quote by Ann Kirkendall) 

"To stop injustices from happening takes the combined efforts of INDIVIDUAL choices 

and INDIVIDUAL voices..... Don't blindly follow the crowd; educate yourselves on the 

truths and stand up for others as you would hope they would stand up for you"... Ann 

_____ 



693





Subject: Re: living together and marriage 

Ann, I admire you for standing up for what you believe in. I think it is great you are willing to put 

yourself on the line and state what you believe. I don't think anybody needs a marriage certificate to 

be happy, gay or straight. I also don't think just because someone wants something, they should 

automatically be indulged. Just like the ice cream store: What if the reason the person only gets 

vanilla is because they are allergic to all the other flavors? Sometimes there are reasons why people 

don't get everything they want. In order to have a civil society, we have to set guidelines. They may 

not necessarily fit with everyone's beliefs, but they may prevent chaos. I would like to be able to go 

into a restaurant, have dinner and smoke a cigarette with a cup of coffee, but I can't do that. Society 

doesn't think I should be able to. I don't see anyone standing up for my rights to do that. Is it fair? 

NO, but it is something I have to live with, or should I say, cho ose to live with. I could stop smoking, 

and probably will eventually, but for now, I just don't eat in restaurants. Am I wrong to want to smoke 

in a restaurant? Maybe, maybe not. 

Cynthia 


Ahhh Haaa, 



My first thought has to do with living together before marriage. Would you buy a pair of shoes 

without trying them on? Just because they are marked as your size does not mean they will fit 

right. You could go to the store everyday and look at them in the window, pick them up with your 

hands, carry them around the store a little, hold them up to your pants to see if you like the color, 

But, for anyone who has had an uncomfortable pair of shoes knows, no matter how much you 

where them, they always hurt your feet. 

Another thought about marriage being allowed to some couples and not others, (Karis and others 

who wrote on this), Just imagine all the wonderful love, happiness, anticipation of being 

together....etc., but never being able to have it. (Kind of like a glass ceiling- you can see everyone 

elses happiness and success, but you can not have it). What if you were not allowed to get 

married because some group of people said you were wrong? How would you feel? Would you 

be frustrated? Would you just live your life without your special someone? Would you end up 

living together? 

As for what Marin said in her journal about the government being in control of what people think 

and know, I agree that groups in power brain wash their followers to believe what they want them 

to believe. For example, children are not born with hateful feelings towards people who have 

different colors of skin, or who walk with a limp, or who are a little slower than the rest... The 

same goes with sexuality... Our society teaches us how to be; it is our society that poisons us 

against homosexuality. What we really should do is watch children on how they treat people 

(before they are poisoned by our society that is). If you watch children, they can be so honest, 

caring, and loving. But, we as a society poison their minds with prejudices, and gender roles, and 

694

hateful values. 

What amazes me is that people are so set in their thinking that they keep passing the bullshit on. 

The cycle of violence!!! The cycle of prejudices!!! The cycle of hate! 

Whether it is legalizing marriage between homosexuals, or accepting differences in other people, 

our actions ARE NOT SET IN STONE!!! We do have the choice to get up and stand up for what 

is the right thing to do. 

How would any of us like it if it was forbidden to marry our boyfriend or our girlfriend. How would 

you feel if there were groups of people around, including the president of the United States of 

America ("liberty and justice for some but not all") who told you that who you loved and wanted to 

spend your life with was a sin and that you can not get married? And that the only alternatives 

they give you do not offer any of the benefits that marriage does... 

How would you feel if you went to Baskin Robins and out of the 31 flavors, they said you can only 

have vanilla even though everyone else gets to have whatever flavor they want? 

How would you feel if your society at face value was polite to your face because it is not politically 

correct to hate homosexuals? But, by their actions and laws, the very same society was 

condemning you for what you believed in? Actions speak louder than words. 


heterosexuals? In no doubt connected with the laws and values we keep passing on to 

generation after generation. I am still amazed that there are not more people like myself who 

want to stand up and scream "THAT THIS IS A BUNCH OF BULLSHIT!" 

Does anyone realize that this is our time in history. We have choices NOW. That the history we 

read about had their choices and their consequences. If it were not for our fore mothers who 

stood up for women's rights, we would still be the property of men to do with as they pleased. 

That if the civil rights movement never took place, we would still be castrating and hanging 

"Negro's" from the nearest tree. I went to Balboa Park to the art museum and stood in front of a 

painting for the longest time. This painting was titled" Southern Holiday (The Lynching 1936) by 

Sternberg. 



Americans in the 1930s. Sternberg described himself as "filled with anger and shame" as he read 

newspaper accounts of racist atrocities and treated this theme several times in powerful prints and 

paintings. In this work, Sternberg depicts a castrated African-American man about to be hung feetfirst 

from a tree. He symbolized what he considered to be the decaying culture of the south 

through the broken columns, included depictions of factories as icons of economic oppression, 

and painted the white population, stripped naked of the civilizing veneer of clothing and thriving on 

the backs of anguished African-Americans. 

http://us.f215.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?DMid=8478_960582_873_425_1931_0_1082_4262_ 

2655232039&YY=86107&inc=25&order=down&sort=date&pos=0&view=&head=&box=Draft 


695




"To stop injustices from happening takes the combined efforts of INDIVIDUAL 

choices and INDIVIDUAL voices..... Don't blindly follow the crowd; educate 

yourselves on the truths and stand up for others as you would hope they would 

stand up for you"... Ann 

_____ 



_____ 



696






On how we treat others… 

I am always amazed at the way people treat each other, 

in public, in relationships, and in their families. 

Sometimes I find that I am amazed for good reasons, at 

how incredibly loving a person may be to others and I 

think quietly, taking note to myself, “…what a 

beautiful person and way of living they have found.” 

I also find examples of positive behavior and 

treatment of others in books that I read…other 

people’s ideas about love and how to live well are 

fascinating to me. At other times, more often than I 

care for, I am amazed for reasons that are not as 

good. 

I have always been a natural observer of things in 

life, and that is how I have learned so much and have 

gained the insight into life that I find valuable for 

my life. This year has brought so many new things for 

me thus far, and it continues to do so every day. I 

am realizing that these new things are not necessarily 

things that are being created now or that never 

existed before. Rather, many of these new things that 

I am experiencing are things that I have somehow 

brought into light and have let into my life…they are 

things that have always been here for the viewing and 

experiencing, but it is only now that I am ready to 

experience them that I am becoming aware of them. 

I appreciate what this semester and its professors 

are bringing to the table as food for thought. The 

observations that I am making are beginning to take 

different forms, different purposes, and I find that 

there are more connections between my new observations 

of the world around me with my own life. I find that 

the question, “What are the data points?” constantly 

repeats through my mind as I view the world and make 

my connections. It has been a new way to analyze life 

for me, being the over-analyzer that I sometimes can 

be. 

I have been looking lately at peoples’ relationships 

and treatment of others on the basis of love lately, 

my own included, and am finding out some interesting 

things. I am convinced that most people have issues 

with love: defining it, talking about it, describing 

it, and giving and receiving it freely without 

connections. I have sensed and felt love in the 

simplest of situations, for example, when a friend 

makes you a warm cup of peppermint tea with the 

perfect amount of honey in it. I have also seen the 

opposite, when people cannot do or say anything for 

another without reciprocation or without their actions 

being some way to instill a sense of control. I have 

started with the relationships in my own life, 

analyzing my interactions with people in my life, what 

I think when I do things for others, trying to 

identify where the threads of love lay. It’s a 

humbling practice, I can assure you that, but a 

697

necessary one for me, as I do not want to go through 

life without ever realizing my ability to interact 

with all others from a place of love and compassion. 

There have been people in my life, whom I thought 

loved me and who I thought were loving individuals, 

who have exploded and attacked others without warning, 

inflicting psychological trauma and poisoning a room 

with negativity and dysfunction. These are painful 

situations to experience even when the people involved 

are total strangers, but when the situation involves 

ones you know and love, the result for me is a sense 

of sadness and follows with deep inner-reflection. 

These are the situations that I pay close attention to 

and learn so much more about others and myself from, 

and although they are uncomfortable and sometimes even 

seem regretful, I see them as data points to pay close 

attention to. For myself, they are lessons about love 

and respect for all people and allow me to stop and 

evaluate my input, expectations, and identify what I 

react to and why in my relations with others. It 

helps me to remember the interconnection that I share 

with all other people in this world, as energy and 

matter cannot be created or removed on this planet, 

the things that make me are what make everyone else 

and have been a part of everything on this planet 

since it began forming millions of years ago. Why 

then, would people not treat others how they would 

wish to be treated? I work on this a little each day, 

starting with myself, moving outward from that place. 

Michael R. 

__________________________________ 


Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail. 


698






Cynthia and/or whomever else this may apply, 

I am trying my darnedest, but it doesn't seem as though you are understanding the magnitude of what 

I am trying to express. And (Cynthia) I know darn well you will write back saying that I don't get what 

you are trying to say to me, even though I feel that I do (which is why I fight even harder!). 

If your son or daughter told you that they were homosexual, would you love them any less? Wouldn't 

you want them to be able to live as safely, and happily as anyone else in our society? If they work 

hard, go to college and want to live openly and happily like anyone else, which includes having the 

option of marrying, (with all of the pros and cons that goes with it, if they so choose), do they not 

deserve this as much as anyone else deserves it? Do they not deserve an equal chance to live a 

successful, happy, rewarding life just as much as anyone else? 

I still do not see why talking about this subject is "putting myself on the line?" Am I honestly and truly 

not seeing something that could have a dangerous outcome because I am choosing to talk about 

homosexuals in the context of religion and marriage... etc? 

I guess what I do not get is how our society is so (bleep, bleep, bleeped-up) that there are not more 

people like myself who want to take personal action and not let injustices take place. "NOT ON MY 

WATCH!" 

The difference between smoking in a restaurant and being homosexual are choices. The last time I 

checked, being homosexual is not hazardous to your health (only if people make it so), but smoking is 

both hazardous to your health as well as anyone around breathing in your second hand smoke. 

I can prove that we were not born with a cigarette hanging out of our mouths, but can you prove 

people are not born homosexual? 

Do I have a choice what color my skin is? Do you have a choice of whether you have freckles or not, 

or if you hair is curly or straight? By your journal entries, it seems as though you feel being 

homosexual is a choice people can control? Do people have the choice of being heterosexual as 

much as they have a choice of being homosexual? If people can turn on or off their sexuality (like a 

light switch) then does that mean that everyone is equally capable of being homosexual but they 

choose to be straight? 

If you feel (and I am not positive that you do) that homosexuals should suppress their feelings to 

conform to the greater majority, is that not the same as asking a heterosexual person to suppress 

their feeling and conform to a homosexual relationship? Does that choice sound distasteful to you? 

Don't you think it is equally distasteful for homosexuals who are suppressing their feelings? 

I wish people would express why they despise homosexuals or any hated group by that matter? 

Unless there are tangible examples, how can anyone discuss these and/or disprove or enlighten 

these stereotypes? 

699

Why do people dislike certain groups? If you peeled back all the layers, what is at the core of the 

hatred? And, is it even legitimate? Is it like the Hatfield's and the McCoy's. They hate each other 

because their granddaddies hated each other...etc. etc. etc. 

I realize that the likelihood of you writing back with something that stings a bit and is frustrating. 

I would hope that instead you could come up with some legitimate, genuine, thoughtful responses. 

Ann 



yourself on the line and state what you believe. I don't think anybody needs a marriage certificate 

to be happy, gay or straight. I also don't think just because someone wants something, they 

should automatically be indulged. Just like the ice cream store: What if the reason the person only 

gets vanilla is because they are allergic to all the other flavors? Sometimes there are reasons why 

people don't get everything they want. In order to have a civil society, we have to set guidelines. 

They may not necessarily fit with everyone's beliefs, but they may prevent chaos. I would like to 

be able to go into a restaurant, have dinner and smoke a cigarette with a cup of coffee, but I can't 

do that. Society doesn't think I should be able to. I don't see anyone standing up for my rights to 

do that. Is it fair? NO, but it is something I have to live with, or should I say, cho ose to live with. I 

could stop smoking, and probably will eventually, but for now, I just don't eat in restaurants. Am I 

wrong to want to smoke in a restaurant? Maybe, maybe not. 

Cynthia 


Ahhh Haaa, 



My first thought has to do with living together before marriage. Would you buy a pair of shoes 

without trying them on? Just because they are marked as your size does not mean they will fit 

right. You could go to the store everyday and look at them in the window, pick them up with 

your hands, carry them around the store a little, hold them up to your pants to see if you like 

the color, But, for anyone who has had an uncomfortable pair of shoes knows, no matter how 

much you where them, they always hurt your feet. 

Another thought about marriage being allowed to some couples and not others, (Karis and 

others who wrote on this), Just imagine all the wonderful love, happiness, anticipation of being 

together....etc., but never being able to have it. (Kind of like a glass ceiling- you can see 

everyone elses happiness and success, but you can not have it). What if you were not allowed 

to get married because some group of people said you were wrong? How would you feel? 

Would you be frustrated? Would you just live your life without your special someone? Would 

you end up living together? 

As for what Marin said in her journal about the government being in control of what people 

think and know, I agree that groups in power brain wash their followers to believe what they 

want them to believe. For example, children are not born with hateful feelings towards people 

who have different colors of skin, or who walk with a limp, or who are a little slower than the 

rest... The same goes with sexuality... Our society teaches us how to be; it is our society that 

700

poisons us against homosexuality. What we really should do is watch children on how they 

treat people (before they are poisoned by our society that is). If you watch children, they can 

be so honest, caring, and loving. But, we as a society poison their minds with prejudices, and 

gender roles, and hateful values. 

What amazes me is that people are so set in their thinking that they keep passing the bullshit 

on. The cycle of violence!!! The cycle of prejudices!!! The cycle of hate! 

Whether it is legalizing marriage between homosexuals, or accepting differences in other 

people, our actions ARE NOT SET IN STONE!!! We do have the choice to get up and stand 

up for what is the right thing to do. 

How would any of us like it if it was forbidden to marry our boyfriend or our girlfriend. How 

would you feel if there were groups of people around, including the president of the United 

States of America ("liberty and justice for some but not all") who told you that who you loved 

and wanted to spend your life with was a sin and that you can not get married? And that the 

only alternatives they give you do not offer any of the benefits that marriage does... 

How would you feel if you went to Baskin Robins and out of the 31 flavors, they said you can 

only have vanilla even though everyone else gets to have whatever flavor they want? 

How would you feel if your society at face value was polite to your face because it is not 

politically correct to hate homosexuals? But, by their actions and laws, the very same society 

was condemning you for what you believed in? Actions speak louder than words. 


heterosexuals? In no doubt connected with the laws and values we keep passing on to 

generation after generation. I am still amazed that there are not more people like myself who 

want to stand up and scream "THAT THIS IS A BUNCH OF BULLSHIT!" 

Does anyone realize that this is our time in history. We have choices NOW. That the history 

we read about had their choices and their consequences. If it were not for our fore mothers 

who stood up for women's rights, we would still be the property of men to do with as they 

pleased. 


"Negro's" from the nearest tree. I went to Balboa Park to the art museum and stood in front of 

a painting for the longest time. This painting was titled" Southern Holiday (The Lynching 

1936) by Sternberg. 



Americans in the 1930s. Sternberg described himself as "filled with anger and shame" as he 

read newspaper accounts of racist atrocities and treated this theme several times in powerful 

prints and paintings. In this work, Sternberg depicts a castrated African-American man about to 

be hung feet-first from a tree. He symbolized what he considered to be the decaying culture of 

the south through the broken columns, included depictions of factories as icons of economic 

oppression, and painted the white population, stripped naked of the civilizing veneer of clothing 

and thriving on the backs of anguished African-Americans. 

701

_____ 

_____ 

http://us.f215.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?DMid=8478_960582_873_425_1931_0_1082_ 

4262_2655232039&YY=86107&inc=25&order=down&sort=date&pos=0 

&view=&head=&box=Draft 







yourselves on the truths and stand up for others as you would hope they would 

stand up for you"... Ann 





_____ 



702






Ann, I think you are putting words and feelings into my posts that are not there. I don't dispise 

homosexuals. I also think you have every right to pursue happiness and success. And if for you that 

means a marriage certificate, I think you should fight for it. And if one of my children told me they 

were homosexual, it wouldn't change my viewpoint, nor would it change how I feel about them. I think 

individuals are separate from issues. I judge people on who they are, not what they are. That said, 

maybe we are getting somewhere here. You said I can't prove people are not born homosexual, and 

you are right. However, I think it would be beneficial to see some real scientific research done on the 

topic. If society was given some real data to base their opinions and views on, things might change. 

But I think that many see homosexuality as an abnormal lifestyle, and are therefore resistant to 

accepting it as part of the mainstream society, in other words normal. I am not saying this to disagree 

with you or make you wrong or upset you, but I just think you might want to at least try to understand 

why other people might not agree with you. Not everyone thinks homosexuality is normal or even 

acceptable, and trying to force people to change their minds will most likely be met with resistance. I 

am not telling you you shouldn't do that, however, but just know it will take time for people to change, 

maybe even generations. 

Cynthia (not a homosexual hater) 



I am trying my darnedest, but it doesn't seem as though you are understanding the magnitude of 

what I am trying to express. And (Cynthia) I know darn well you will write back saying that I don't 

get what you are trying to say to me, even though I feel that I do (which is why I fight even 

harder!). 

If your son or daughter told you that they were homosexual, would you love them any less? 

Wouldn't you want them to be able to live as safely, and happily as anyone else in our society? If 

they work hard, go to college and want to live openly and happily like anyone else, which includes 

having the option of marrying, (with all of the pros and cons that goes with it, if they so choose), 

do they not deserve this as much as anyone else deserves it? Do they not deserve an equal 

chance to live a successful, happy, rewarding life just as much as anyone else? 

I still do not see why talking about this subject is "putting myself on the line?" Am I honestly and 

truly not seeing something that could have a dangerous outcome because I am choosing to talk 

about homosexuals in the context of religion and marriage... etc? 

I guess what I do not get is how our society is so (bleep, bleep, bleeped-up) that there are not 

more people like myself who want to take personal action and not let injustices take place. "NOT 

ON MY WATCH!" 

The difference between smoking in a restaurant and being homosexual are choices. The last time 

I checked, being homosexual is not hazardous to your health (only if people make it so), but 

smoking is both hazardous to your health as well as anyone around breathing in your second 

703

hand smoke. 

I can prove that we were not born with a cigarette hanging out of our mouths, but can you prove 

people are not born homosexual? 

Do I have a choice what color my skin is? Do you have a choice of whether you have freckles or 

not, or if you hair is curly or straight? By your journal entries, it seems as though you feel being 

homosexual is a choice people can control? Do people have the choice of being heterosexual as 

much as they have a choice of being homosexual? If people can turn on or off their sexuality (like 

a light switch) then does that mean that everyone is equally capable of being homosexual but they 


If you feel (and I am not positive that you do) that homosexuals should suppress their feelings to 

conform to the greater majority, is that not the same as asking a heterosexual person to suppress 

their feeling and conform to a homosexual relationship? Does that choice sound distasteful to 

you? Don't you think it is equally distasteful for homosexuals who are suppressing their feelings? 

I wish people would express why they despise homosexuals or any hated group by that matter? 

Unless there are tangible examples, how can anyone discuss these and/or disprove or enlighten 

these stereotypes? 

Why do people dislike certain groups? If you peeled back all the layers, what is at the core of the 

hatred? And, is it even legitimate? Is it like the Hatfield's and the McCoy's. They hate each other 

because their granddaddies hated each other...etc. etc. etc. 

I realize that the likelihood of you writing back with something that stings a bit and is frustrating. 

I would hope that instead you could come up with some legitimate, genuine, thoughtful responses. 

Ann 



yourself on the line and state what you believe. I don't think anybody needs a marriage 

certificate to be happy, gay or straight. I also don't think just because someone wants 

something, they should automatically be indulged. Just like the ice cream store: What if the 

reason the person only gets vanilla is because they are allergic to all the other flavors? 

Sometimes there are reasons why people don't get everything they want. In order to have a 

civil society, we have to set guidelines. They may not necessarily fit with everyone's beliefs, 

but they may prevent chaos. I would like to be able to go into a restaurant, have dinner and 

smoke a cigarette with a cup of coffee, but I can't do that. Society doesn't think I should be 

able to. I don't see anyone standing up for my rights to do that. Is it fair? NO, but it is 

something I have to live with, or should I say, cho ose to live with. I could stop smoking, and 

probably will eventually, but for now, I just don't eat in restaurants. Am I wrong to want to 

smoke in a restaurant? Maybe, maybe not. 

Cynthia 


Ahhh Haaa, 


704


My first thought has to do with living together before marriage. Would you buy a pair of 

shoes without trying them on? Just because they are marked as your size does not mean 

they will fit right. You could go to the store everyday and look at them in the window, pick 

them up with your hands, carry them around the store a little, hold them up to your pants to 

see if you like the color, But, for anyone who has had an uncomfortable pair of shoes 

knows, no matter how much you where them, they always hurt your feet. 

Another thought about marriage being allowed to some couples and not others, (Karis and 

others who wrote on this), Just imagine all the wonderful love, happiness, anticipation of 

being together....etc., but never being able to have it. (Kind of like a glass ceiling- you can 

see everyone elses happiness and success, but you can not have it). What if you were not 

allowed to get married because some group of people said you were wrong? How would 

you feel? Would you be frustrated? Would you just live your life without your special 

someone? Would you end up living together? 

As for what Marin said in her journal about the government being in control of what people 

think and know, I agree that groups in power brain wash their followers to believe what they 

want them to believe. For example, children are not born with hateful feelings towards 

people who have different colors of skin, or who walk with a limp, or who are a little slower 

than the rest... The same goes with sexuality... Our society teaches us how to be; it is our 

society that poisons us against homosexuality. What we really should do is watch children 

on how they treat people (before they are poisoned by our society that is). If you watch 

children, they can be so honest, caring, and loving. But, we as a society poison their minds 

with prejudices, and gender roles, and hateful values. 

What amazes me is that people are so set in their thinking that they keep passing the 

bullshit on. The cycle of violence!!! The cycle of prejudices!!! The cycle of hate! 

Whether it is legalizing marriage between homosexuals, or accepting differences in other 

people, our actions ARE NOT SET IN STONE!!! We do have the choice to get up and 

stand up for what is the right thing to do. 

How would any of us like it if it was forbidden to marry our boyfriend or our girlfriend. How 

would you feel if there were groups of people around, including the president of the United 

States of America ("liberty and justice for some but not all") who told you that who you 

loved and wanted to spend your life with was a sin and that you can not get married? And 

that the only alternatives they give you do not offer any of the benefits that marriage does... 

How would you feel if you went to Baskin Robins and out of the 31 flavors, they said you 

can only have vanilla even though everyone else gets to have whatever flavor they want? 


politically correct to hate homosexuals? But, by their actions and laws, the very same 

society was condemning you for what you believed in? Actions speak louder than 

words. 

Does anyone realize that the suicide rate for homosexuals is much, much larger than it is 

for heterosexuals? In no doubt connected with the laws and values we keep passing on to 

generation after generation. I am still amazed that there are not more people like myself 

705

_____ 

_____ 

who want to stand up and scream "THAT THIS IS A BUNCH OF BULLSHIT!" 

Does anyone realize that this is our time in history. We have choices NOW. That the 

history we read about had their choices and their consequences. If it were not for our fore 

mothers who stood up for women's rights, we would still be the property of men to do with 

as they pleased. 


"Negro's" from the nearest tree. I went to Balboa Park to the art museum and stood in front 

of a painting for the longest time. This painting was titled" Southern Holiday (The Lynching 

1936) by Sternberg. 


Southern Holiday is the artist's brutal indictment of the lynchings and the oppression of 

African-Americans in the 1930s. Sternberg described himself as "filled with anger and 

shame" as he read newspaper accounts of racist atrocities and treated this theme several 

times in powerful prints and paintings. In this work, Sternberg depicts a castrated African- 

American man about to be hung feet-first from a tree. He symbolized what he considered to 

be the decaying culture of the south through the broken columns, included depictions of 

factories as icons of economic oppression, and painted the white population, stripped 

naked of the civilizing veneer of clothing and thriving on the backs of anguished African- 

Americans. 

http://us.f215.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?DMid=8478_960582_873_425_1931_0_1082_ 

4262_2655232039&YY=86107&inc=25&order=down&sort=date&pos=0 








yourselves on the truths and stand up for others as you would hope they 

would stand up for you"... Ann 



706

_____ 





_____ 



707




To: ICP-F 


I don't know if anyone responded to my last journal because the damn thing 

kicked me off. Oh well! I just found a really great quote from Gerry Spence 

who is an attorney for justice and freedom, that relates a little to what the 

journal discussions are about: 

"I would rather have a mind opend by wonder than one closed by belief." I 

think that not only do I agree 100% with this statement but we spend so much 

time closing our minds to difficult topics because they are not something that 

we are directly involved in or we have been told how to think and do not want 

to stray from that. I am not knocking beliefs but I think that if we could 

all open our minds and question "the data points" that we see we would gain a 

whole new perspective of others and where they are coming from. Gerry Spence 

also said "My intent is to tell the truth as I know it, realizing that what is 

true for my may be blastphemy for others." In other words we should open our 

minds to others but not be afraid to beleive what we think is true, always 

remembering that what is true for you may not be for everyone. 

I have been spending a great deal of time alone lately, which has led me to a 

state of mind that I have not visited in some time. A state of mind that 

allows me to think how important our relationships are in our lives. Often we 

take them for granted. Many people think that living together before marriage 

is not only a sin but lacking in the element of surprise. I personally thnk 

that many men beleive "Why buy the cow, if I get the milk for free." I know 

in my last relationship we lived together for nearly 3 years and if I hadn't 

mentioned marriage he would have lived like that forever. Lucky for me I did 

and he ran away like a dog with his tail between his legs. I think it depends 

on the individual situation and that there are pro's an con's to both. I 

would prefer to know if my new husband leaves the cap off the toothpaste or 

watches TV in the nude before I live with him. The little quirks can drive a 

person insane no matter how much you thought you loved them. 

Before I bore any of you anymore I will leave with on last quote for thought; 

I have always been afraid. It is a painful feeling, fear. It sits down in the 

bottom part of the belly and hurts. But it is the energy of survival. I have 

always been afraid of fear and at the same time grateful for it--afraid of its 

pain and grateful that because of the pain I can take steps to eradicate it by 

overcoming that which frightens me. 

One who is afraid reacts to it as any animal. If one is a rabbit, one runs 

into one's hole and hides. If one is a turtle one pulls back into one's shell. 

We have all known people who react to their fear in this fashion. Some call 

them shy. Some, wrongfully, call them cowards. Never reach your hand down into 

a rabbit's hole and try to pull the rabbit out. You will only extract a bloody 

finger. 

-also by Gerry 

PS-I like what this guy has to say. Check it out if you want: 

http://www.gerryspence.com/shared.html 

708





Subject: we have different lenses..... 

Cynthia, class, Jesus, and Darwin, 

Serious section of text: 

It is hard for me not to read your journal entries without feeling the emotion or the sting of what I feel 

behind them. I guess the lens with which I view the world is different than your lens, at least on this 

issue. I can't get you to see through my glasses with my prescription, and I can't see through your 

glasses with your prescription. 

I don't want to force anyone to see things they do not want to see. It's like trying to get my cat to look 

at herself in the mirror, (if anyone has ever tried this, it is practically impossible) they never look at 

themselves. I was only hoping to open peoples eyes, to broaden their horizons, to deepen their 

understandings, but I find myself once again not going anywhere. 

Humorous section of text: 

Note to self, "front door, side door, back porch, family room window- all locked up tight". Question to 

self, "Are there any other possible entry points?" 

Advice from right shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/21.gif, "look for the 

good in people, they might someday see things your way". 

Advice from left shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/16.gif, "Give-um hell!" 

Ann 

P.S. I am kinda bummed that Jesus never answered the e-mail I sent him, was it because I 

addressed it to God? Was he hanging out with Darwin having a good time and got behind on his emails 

from Cohort-F? Jesus, Darwin.....are you still out there somewhere in cyberspace? 



homosexuals. I also think you have every right to pursue happiness and success. And if for you 

that means a marriage certificate, I think you should fight for it. And if one of my children told me 

they were homosexual, it wouldn't change my viewpoint, nor would it change how I feel about 

them. I think individuals are separate from issues. I judge people on who they are, not what they 

are. That said, maybe we are getting somewhere here. You said I can't prove people are not born 

homosexual, and you are right. However, I think it would be beneficial to see some real scientific 

research done on the topic. If society was given some real data to base their opinions and views 

on, things might change. But I think that many see homosexuality as an abnormal lifestyle, and 

are therefore resistant to accepting it as part of the mainstream society, in other words normal. I 

am not saying this to disagree with you or make you wrong or upset you, but I just think you might 

want to at least try to understand why other people might not agree with you. Not everyone thinks 

homosexuality is normal or even acceptable, and trying to force people to change their minds will 

most likely be met with resistance. I am not telling you you shouldn't do that, however, but just 

know it will take time for people to change, maybe even generations. 


709



I am trying my darnedest, but it doesn't seem as though you are understanding the magnitude 

of what I am trying to express. And (Cynthia) I know darn well you will write back saying that I 

don't get what you are trying to say to me, even though I feel that I do (which is why I fight 

even harder!). 


Wouldn't you want them to be able to live as safely, and happily as anyone else in our society? 

If they work hard, go to college and want to live openly and happily like anyone else, which 

includes having the option of marrying, (with all of the pros and cons that goes with it, if they 

so choose), do they not deserve this as much as anyone else deserves it? Do they not 

deserve an equal chance to live a successful, happy, rewarding life just as much as anyone 

else? 

I still do not see why talking about this subject is "putting myself on the line?" Am I honestly 

and truly not seeing something that could have a dangerous outcome because I am choosing 

to talk about homosexuals in the context of religion and marriage... etc? 

I guess what I do not get is how our society is so (bleep, bleep, bleeped-up) that there are not 

more people like myself who want to take personal action and not let injustices take place. 

"NOT ON MY WATCH!" 

The difference between smoking in a restaurant and being homosexual are choices. The last 

time I checked, being homosexual is not hazardous to your health (only if people make it so), 

but smoking is both hazardous to your health as well as anyone around breathing in your 

second hand smoke. 

I can prove that we were not born with a cigarette hanging out of our mouths, but can you 

prove people are not born homosexual? 

Do I have a choice what color my skin is? Do you have a choice of whether you have freckles 

or not, or if you hair is curly or straight? By your journal entries, it seems as though you feel 

being homosexual is a choice people can control? Do people have the choice of being 

heterosexual as much as they have a choice of being homosexual? If people can turn on or 

off their sexuality (like a light switch) then does that mean that everyone is equally capable of 

being homosexual but they choose to be straight? 

If you feel (and I am not positive that you do) that homosexuals should suppress their 

feelings to conform to the greater majority, is that not the same as asking a heterosexual 

person to suppress their feeling and conform to a homosexual relationship? Does that choice 

sound distasteful to you? Don't you think it is equally distasteful for homosexuals who are 

suppressing their feelings? 

I wish people would express why they despise homosexuals or any hated group by that 

matter? Unless there are tangible examples, how can anyone discuss these and/or disprove 

or enlighten these stereotypes? 

710

Why do people dislike certain groups? If you peeled back all the layers, what is at the core of 

the hatred? And, is it even legitimate? Is it like the Hatfield's and the McCoy's. They hate 

each other because their granddaddies hated each other...etc. etc. etc. 

I realize that the likelihood of you writing back with something that stings a bit and is 

frustrating. I would hope that instead you could come up with some legitimate, genuine, 

thoughtful responses. 

Ann 


Ann, I admire you for standing up for what you believe in. I think it is great you are willing to 

put yourself on the line and state what you believe. I don't think anybody needs a marriage 

certificate to be happy, gay or straight. I also don't think just because someone wants 

something, they should automatically be indulged. Just like the ice cream store: What if the 

reason the person only gets vanilla is because they are allergic to all the other flavors? 

Sometimes there are reasons why people don't get everything they want. In order to have a 

civil society, we have to set guidelines. They may not necessarily fit with everyone's beliefs, 

but they may prevent chaos. I would like to be able to go into a restaurant, have dinner and 

smoke a cigarette with a cup of coffee, but I can't do that. Society doesn't think I should be 

able to. I don't see anyone standing up for my rights to do that. Is it fair? NO, but it is 

something I have to live with, or should I say, cho ose to live with. I could stop smoking, 

and probably will eventually, but for now, I just don't eat in restaurants. Am I wrong to want 

to smoke in a restaurant? Maybe, maybe not. 

Cynthia 


Ahhh Haaa, 



My first thought has to do with living together before marriage. Would you buy a pair of 

shoes without trying them on? Just because they are marked as your size does not 

mean they will fit right. You could go to the store everyday and look at them in the 

window, pick them up with your hands, carry them around the store a little, hold them up 

to your pants to see if you like the color, But, for anyone who has had an uncomfortable 

pair of shoes knows, no matter how much you where them, they always hurt your feet. 

Another thought about marriage being allowed to some couples and not others, (Karis 

and others who wrote on this), Just imagine all the wonderful love, happiness, 

anticipation of being together....etc., but never being able to have it. (Kind of like a 

glass ceiling- you can see everyone elses happiness and success, but you can not have 

it). What if you were not allowed to get married because some group of people said you 

were wrong? How would you feel? Would you be frustrated? Would you just live your 

life without your special someone? Would you end up living together? 

As for what Marin said in her journal about the government being in control of what 

people think and know, I agree that groups in power brain wash their followers to 

believe what they want them to believe. For example, children are not born with hateful 

711

feelings towards people who have different colors of skin, or who walk with a limp, or 

who are a little slower than the rest... The same goes with sexuality... Our society 

teaches us how to be; it is our society that poisons us against homosexuality. What we 

really should do is watch children on how they treat people (before they are poisoned by 

our society that is). If you watch children, they can be so honest, caring, and loving. 

But, we as a society poison their minds with prejudices, and gender roles, and hateful 

values. 

What amazes me is that people are so set in their thinking that they keep passing the 

bullshit on. The cycle of violence!!! The cycle of prejudices!!! The cycle of hate! 

Whether it is legalizing marriage between homosexuals, or accepting differences in 

other people, our actions ARE NOT SET IN STONE!!! We do have the choice to get 

up and stand up for what is the right thing to do. 

How would any of us like it if it was forbidden to marry our boyfriend or our girlfriend. 

How would you feel if there were groups of people around, including the president of the 

United States of America ("liberty and justice for some but not all") who told you that 

who you loved and wanted to spend your life with was a sin and that you can not get 

married? And that the only alternatives they give you do not offer any of the benefits 

that marriage does... 

How would you feel if you went to Baskin Robins and out of the 31 flavors, they said you 

can only have vanilla even though everyone else gets to have whatever flavor they 

want? 


politically correct to hate homosexuals? But, by their actions and laws, the very same 

society was condemning you for what you believed in? Actions speak louder than 

words. 

Does anyone realize that the suicide rate for homosexuals is much, much larger than it 

is for heterosexuals? In no doubt connected with the laws and values we keep passing 

on to generation after generation. I am still amazed that there are not more people like 

myself who want to stand up and scream "THAT THIS IS A BUNCH OF BULLSHIT!" 

Does anyone realize that this is our time in history. We have choices NOW. That the 

history we read about had their choices and their consequences. If it were not for our 

fore mothers who stood up for women's rights, we would still be the property of men to 

do with as they pleased. 

That if the civil rights movement never took place, we would still be castrating and 

hanging "Negro's" from the nearest tree. I went to Balboa Park to the art museum and 

stood in front of a painting for the longest time. This painting was titled" Southern 

Holiday (The Lynching 1936) by Sternberg. 


Southern Holiday is the artist's brutal indictment of the lynchings and the oppression of 

African-Americans in the 1930s. Sternberg described himself as "filled with anger and 

shame" as he read newspaper accounts of racist atrocities and treated this theme 

712

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

several times in powerful prints and paintings. In this work, Sternberg depicts a 

castrated African-American man about to be hung feet-first from a tree. He symbolized 

what he considered to be the decaying culture of the south through the broken columns, 

included depictions of factories as icons of economic oppression, and painted the white 

population, stripped naked of the civilizing veneer of clothing and thriving on the backs 

of anguished African-Americans. 

http://us.f215.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?DMid=8478_960582_873_425_1931_0_ 

1082_4262_2655232039&YY=86107&inc=25&order=down&sort=date&pos=0 






"To stop injustices from happening takes the combined efforts of 

INDIVIDUAL choices and INDIVIDUAL voices..... Don't blindly follow the 

crowd; educate yourselves on the truths and stand up for others as you 

would hope they would stand up for you"... Ann 









_____ 

713



714





Subject: Re: Chula's journal entry 

Chula, 

Is my style of writing too abrupt, or is it my topic that most people don't want to touch? Except for 

Cynthia, she's not afraid to confront anyone... 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gif, are you Cynthia? 

There are many insightful journal entries that have made me wonder about people and their beliefs 

(my own beliefs and actions as well). I realize how hard it is for people to see things differently. 

Do you remember a few years ago when the "big thing" was those pictures that if you relaxed your 

eyes enough and looked through the objects on the picture (instead of the objects themselves), you 

could actually see the picture within the objects? 

I think most people do this in life, including myself. They have a hard time looking past the objects 

(their interpretation of the world) which keeps them from seeing the picture (other peoples' views of 

the world). O.K. everyone, relax your eyes, look past the objects and stare straight through the 

picture, I think we will find the answers there.... 


_____ 



715






Michael, 

It is so refreshing to read your journals and know that there are people 

out there (especially in our society), who stop and take in the beauty 

around them. I try to do it, but it's definitely a conscious thought 

and often one that I force myself to do. I tend to be one of those who 

get caught up in the rat race of life. But, I do go to lengths to make 

sure that not only do I treat people properly, but that I teach my 

children that all people and living things should be respected and 

loved. I think it's great that you're finding the "data points" (I'm 

still having a hard time figuring out what they might be -- I know, I 

know, I just need to slow down and I'm sure I'll see them!). Anyway, I 

think it is lovely that you have found love in the simple things such as 

the peppermint tea. Our world would certainly be a more pleasant place 

if we treated one another with respect and love and enjoyed the simple 

things in life. 

With love and respect, 

~ Louise 






On how we treat others. 

I am always amazed at the way people treat each other, 

in public, in relationships, and in their families. 

Sometimes I find that I am amazed for good reasons, at 

how incredibly loving a person may be to others and I 

think quietly, taking note to myself, ".what a 

beautiful person and way of living they have found." 

I also find examples of positive behavior and 

treatment of others in books that I read.other 

people's ideas about love and how to live well are 

fascinating to me. At other times, more often than I 

care for, I am amazed for reasons that are not as 

good. 

I have always been a natural observer of things in 

life, and that is how I have learned so much and have 

gained the insight into life that I find valuable for 

my life. This year has brought so many new things for 

me thus far, and it continues to do so every day. I 

am realizing that these new things are not necessarily 

things that are being created now or that never 

existed before. Rather, many of these new things that 

I am experiencing are things that I have somehow 

brought into light and have let into my life.they are 

things that have always been here for the viewing and experiencing, but 

716

it is only now that I am ready to experience them that I am becoming 

aware of them. 

I appreciate what this semester and its professors 

are bringing to the table as food for thought. The observations that I 

am making are beginning to take different forms, different purposes, and 

I find that there are more connections between my new observations of 

the world around me with my own life. I find that the question, "What 

are the data points?" constantly repeats through my mind as I view the 

world and make my connections. It has been a new way to analyze life 

for me, being the over-analyzer that I sometimes can be. 

I have been looking lately at peoples' relationships 

and treatment of others on the basis of love lately, 

my own included, and am finding out some interesting 


with love: defining it, talking about it, describing 

it, and giving and receiving it freely without 

connections. I have sensed and felt love in the 

simplest of situations, for example, when a friend 

makes you a warm cup of peppermint tea with the 

perfect amount of honey in it. I have also seen the 

opposite, when people cannot do or say anything for 

another without reciprocation or without their actions 

being some way to instill a sense of control. I have 

started with the relationships in my own life, 

analyzing my interactions with people in my life, what 

I think when I do things for others, trying to 

identify where the threads of love lay. It's a 

humbling practice, I can assure you that, but a 

necessary one for me, as I do not want to go through 

life without ever realizing my ability to interact 

with all others from a place of love and compassion. 

There have been people in my life, whom I thought 

loved me and who I thought were loving individuals, 

who have exploded and attacked others without warning, inflicting 

psychological trauma and poisoning a room with negativity and 

dysfunction. These are painful situations to experience even when the 

people involved are total strangers, but when the situation involves 

ones you know and love, the result for me is a sense 

of sadness and follows with deep inner-reflection. 

These are the situations that I pay close attention to 

and learn so much more about others and myself from, 

and although they are uncomfortable and sometimes even 

seem regretful, I see them as data points to pay close attention to. 

For myself, they are lessons about love and respect for all people and 

allow me to stop and evaluate my input, expectations, and identify what 

I 

react to and why in my relations with others. It 

helps me to remember the interconnection that I share 

with all other people in this world, as energy and 

matter cannot be created or removed on this planet, 

the things that make me are what make everyone else 

and have been a part of everything on this planet 

since it began forming millions of years ago. Why 

then, would people not treat others how they would 

wish to be treated? I work on this a little each day, 

starting with myself, moving outward from that place. 

Michael R. 

__________________________________ 




717

718





Subject: social evolution 

Ann, 

While I prefer to stay within the boundaries of biological science, I can 

say that it seems as if moral rules develop slowly over time, by way of 

individual sympathetic judgement, which is guided by socially established 

rules of behavior. In other words, social evolution is itself a conflict 

where one side is struggling for uniformity and solidarity, while the other 

is demanding variation and individuality. Eventually, through communication 

of these conflicting ideals and beliefs a new set of morals will emerge. Of 

course ,this does not guarantee the progress of moral development, only 

social change, which could be either positive or negative. And based on my 

own theories of biological evolution, those who best adapt have the 

potential to survive. 

Sincerely, 

C. Darwyn 

_________________________________________________________________ 



719





Subject: Re: we have different lenses..... 

Ann--- 

I did not try to put any sting in my posts. I am responding to yours because it seems you want to 

discuss it. I was hoping others would jump in, but that doesn't seem to be happening. For the record, I 

am able to see this from your perspective. Looking at something from someone else's point of view 

doesn't mean you have to change yours, although it could happen. I don't think the point of this 

journal is to get everyone to come to an agreement on any one perspective, it doesn't happen in the 

real world, and it probably won't happen here. That is not a bad thing. I think social issues are 

particularly complex because no matter what you decide to agree with, there always seems to be 

some negative consequence to go with it. No societal decision comes without a price that some group 

will have to pay. Cynthia 




It is hard for me not to read your journal entries without feeling the emotion or the sting of what I 

feel behind them. I guess the lens with which I view the world is different than your lens, at least 

on this issue. I can't get you to see through my glasses with my prescription, and I can't see 

through your glasses with your prescription. 

I don't want to force anyone to see things they do not want to see. It's like trying to get my cat to 

look at herself in the mirror, (if anyone has ever tried this, it is practically impossible) they never 

look at themselves. I was only hoping to open peoples eyes, to broaden their horizons, to deepen 

their understandings, but I find myself once again not going anywhere. 


Note to self, "front door, side door, back porch, family room window- all locked up tight". Question 

to self, "Are there any other possible entry points?" 

Advice from right shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/21.gif, "look for the 

good in people, they might someday see things your way". 

Advice from left shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/16.gif, "Give-um 

hell!" 

Ann 


addressed it to God? Was he hanging out with Darwin having a good time and got behind on his 

e-mails from Cohort-F? Jesus, Darwin.....are you still out there somewhere in cyberspace? 



720

homosexuals. I also think you have every right to pursue happiness and success. And if for 

you that means a marriage certificate, I think you should fight for it. And if one of my children 

told me they were homosexual, it wouldn't change my viewpoint, nor would it change how I feel 

about them. I think individuals are separate from issues. I judge people on who they are, not 

what they are. That said, maybe we are getting somewhere here. You said I can't prove people 

are not born homosexual, and you are right. However, I think it would be beneficial to see 

some real scientific research done on the topic. If society was given some real data to base 

their opinions and views on, things might change. But I think that many see homosexuality as 

an abnormal lifestyle, and are therefore resistant to accepting it as part of the mainstream 

society, in other words normal. I am not saying this to disagree with you or make you wrong or 

upset you, but I just think you might want to at least try to understand why other people might 

not agree with you. Not everyone thinks homosexuality is normal or even acceptable, and 

trying to force people to change their minds will most likely be met with resistance. I am not 

telling you you shouldn't do that, however, but just know it will take time for people to change, 





I am trying my darnedest, but it doesn't seem as though you are understanding the 

magnitude of what I am trying to express. And (Cynthia) I know darn well you will write 

back saying that I don't get what you are trying to say to me, even though I feel that I do 

(which is why I fight even harder!). 


Wouldn't you want them to be able to live as safely, and happily as anyone else in our 

society? If they work hard, go to college and want to live openly and happily like anyone 

else, which includes having the option of marrying, (with all of the pros and cons that goes 

with it, if they so choose), do they not deserve this as much as anyone else deserves it? 

Do they not deserve an equal chance to live a successful, happy, rewarding life just as 

much as anyone else? 

I still do not see why talking about this subject is "putting myself on the line?" Am I honestly 

and truly not seeing something that could have a dangerous outcome because I am 

choosing to talk about homosexuals in the context of religion and marriage... etc? 

I guess what I do not get is how our society is so (bleep, bleep, bleeped-up) that there are 

not more people like myself who want to take personal action and not let injustices take 

place. "NOT ON MY WATCH!" 

The difference between smoking in a restaurant and being homosexual are choices. The 

last time I checked, being homosexual is not hazardous to your health (only if people make 

it so), but smoking is both hazardous to your health as well as anyone around breathing 

in your second hand smoke. 

I can prove that we were not born with a cigarette hanging out of our mouths, but can you 

prove people are not born homosexual? 

Do I have a choice what color my skin is? Do you have a choice of whether you have 

721

freckles or not, or if you hair is curly or straight? By your journal entries, it seems as though 

you feel being homosexual is a choice people can control? Do people have the choice of 

being heterosexual as much as they have a choice of being homosexual? If people can 

turn on or off their sexuality (like a light switch) then does that mean that everyone is 

equally capable of being homosexual but they choose to be straight? 


feelings to conform to the greater majority, is that not the same as asking a heterosexual 

person to suppress their feeling and conform to a homosexual relationship? Does that 

choice sound distasteful to you? Don't you think it is equally distasteful for homosexuals 

who are suppressing their feelings? 


matter? Unless there are tangible examples, how can anyone discuss these and/or 

disprove or enlighten these stereotypes? 

Why do people dislike certain groups? If you peeled back all the layers, what is at the core 

of the hatred? And, is it even legitimate? Is it like the Hatfield's and the McCoy's. They 

hate each other because their granddaddies hated each other...etc. etc. etc. 




Ann 


Ann, I admire you for standing up for what you believe in. I think it is great you are 

willing to put yourself on the line and state what you believe. I don't think anybody needs 

a marriage certificate to be happy, gay or straight. I also don't think just because 

someone wants something, they should automatically be indulged. Just like the ice 

cream store: What if the reason the person only gets vanilla is because they are allergic 

to all the other flavors? Sometimes there are reasons why people don't get everything 

they want. In order to have a civil society, we have to set guidelines. They may not 

necessarily fit with everyone's beliefs, but they may prevent chaos. I would like to be 

able to go into a restaurant, have dinner and smoke a cigarette with a cup of coffee, but 

I can't do that. Society doesn't think I should be able to. I don't see anyone standing up 

for my rights to do that. Is it fair? NO, but it is something I have to live with, or should I 

say, cho ose to live with. I could stop smoking, and probably will eventually, but for now, 

I just don't eat in restaurants. Am I wrong to want to smoke in a restaurant? Maybe, 

maybe not. 

Cynthia 


Ahhh Haaa, 



My first thought has to do with living together before marriage. Would you buy a pair 

722

of shoes without trying them on? Just because they are marked as your size does 

not mean they will fit right. You could go to the store everyday and look at them in 

the window, pick them up with your hands, carry them around the store a little, hold 

them up to your pants to see if you like the color, But, for anyone who has had an 

uncomfortable pair of shoes knows, no matter how much you where them, they 

always hurt your feet. 

Another thought about marriage being allowed to some couples and not others, 

(Karis and others who wrote on this), Just imagine all the wonderful love, happiness, 

anticipation of being together....etc., but never being able to have it. (Kind of like a 

glass ceiling- you can see everyone elses happiness and success, but you can not 

have it). What if you were not allowed to get married because some group of people 

said you were wrong? How would you feel? Would you be frustrated? Would you 

just live your life without your special someone? Would you end up living together? 

As for what Marin said in her journal about the government being in control of what 

people think and know, I agree that groups in power brain wash their followers to 

believe what they want them to believe. For example, children are not born with 

hateful feelings towards people who have different colors of skin, or who walk with a 

limp, or who are a little slower than the rest... The same goes with sexuality... Our 

society teaches us how to be; it is our society that poisons us against homosexuality. 

What we really should do is watch children on how they treat people (before they 

are poisoned by our society that is). If you watch children, they can be so honest, 

caring, and loving. But, we as a society poison their minds with prejudices, and 

gender roles, and hateful values. 

What amazes me is that people are so set in their thinking that they keep passing 

the bullshit on. The cycle of violence!!! The cycle of prejudices!!! The cycle of 

hate! 

Whether it is legalizing marriage between homosexuals, or accepting differences in 

other people, our actions ARE NOT SET IN STONE!!! We do have the choice to 

get up and stand up for what is the right thing to do. 

How would any of us like it if it was forbidden to marry our boyfriend or our girlfriend. 

How would you feel if there were groups of people around, including the president of 

the United States of America ("liberty and justice for some but not all") who told you 

that who you loved and wanted to spend your life with was a sin and that you can 

not get married? And that the only alternatives they give you do not offer any of the 

benefits that marriage does... 

How would you feel if you went to Baskin Robins and out of the 31 flavors, they said 

you can only have vanilla even though everyone else gets to have whatever flavor 

they want? 

How would you feel if your society at face value was polite to your face because it is 

not politically correct to hate homosexuals? But, by their actions and laws, the very 

same society was condemning you for what you believed in? Actions speak 

louder than words. 

Does anyone realize that the suicide rate for homosexuals is much, much larger 

than it is for heterosexuals? In no doubt connected with the laws and values we 

723

_____ 

keep passing on to generation after generation. I am still amazed that there are not 

more people like myself who want to stand up and scream "THAT THIS IS A 

BUNCH OF BULLSHIT!" 

Does anyone realize that this is our time in history. We have choices NOW. That 

the history we read about had their choices and their consequences. If it were not 

for our fore mothers who stood up for women's rights, we would still be the property 

of men to do with as they pleased. 

That if the civil rights movement never took place, we would still be castrating and 

hanging "Negro's" from the nearest tree. I went to Balboa Park to the art museum 

and stood in front of a painting for the longest time. This painting was titled" 

Southern Holiday (The Lynching 1936) by Sternberg. 


Southern Holiday is the artist's brutal indictment of the lynchings and the oppression 

of African-Americans in the 1930s. Sternberg described himself as "filled with anger 

and shame" as he read newspaper accounts of racist atrocities and treated this 

theme several times in powerful prints and paintings. In this work, Sternberg depicts 

a castrated African-American man about to be hung feet-first from a tree. He 

symbolized what he considered to be the decaying culture of the south through the 

broken columns, included depictions of factories as icons of economic oppression, 

and painted the white population, stripped naked of the civilizing veneer of clothing 

and thriving on the backs of anguished African-Americans. 

http://us.f215.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?DMid=8478_960582_873_425_1931_0 

_1082_4262_2655232039&YY=86107&inc=25&order=down&sort=date&pos=0 







INDIVIDUAL choices and INDIVIDUAL voices..... Don't blindly follow the 

crowd; educate yourselves on the truths and stand up for others as you 

would hope they would stand up for you"... Ann 



724

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 









_____ 



725






Cynthia, 

I realize that you do not mean to put sting into your words, but they do feel like they contain a stinging 

angent at times. Over our time together in our cohort, I have come to realize that is just the way you 

express yourself and I should try not to take it personally. Your like a little spit fire, and that can a 

good thing in certain situations; I just need to realize that it is your style of communication and it is not 

meant as being personal. 

I thought about what you said last night, that my writing seemed as though I was assuming (you) 

personally felt one way or another, or that I was reading into, or putting ideas into your text that you 

say were not there. And my answer to that is that I was not just writing to you as an individual. I was 

trying to talk to our cohort and to the world in a sense in hopes that someone else would jump in. 

However, it seems as though you and I are the only ones who end up discussing things head on. 

Maybe I can't make the world a better place? Maybe all those years when I was younger and had to 

put up with the bullshit that went along with growing up in my family only to hear, "When you grow up, 

you can have things the way you want them" is not true either. 

Maybe, except for the few acts of human kindness I encounter, (only enough to keep me from 

starving to death) the world is a bunch of bull? I used to think that people (if given good examples 

and were educated about certain topics) are loving and excepting. I have a hard time accepting how 

people just don't care. If certain topics don't effect them in any way it is just an annoying noise on the 

side of the road. Like a homeless person holding up a sign on the side of the road saying they are 

homeless and hungry. Do we really care? Maybe for a second or two, (and we try not to look at 

them- we try not to look into their eyes and make that connection) or at least until the light turns green 

and we are on our way again. 

Maybe I need to stop fighting what feels like an impossible fight, at least right now, because what I 

am fighting for is far beyond the face value of marriage. Perhaps I have bitten off more than I can 

chew by myself; actually, I never realized that I would be by myself? Trying to swim upstream can be 

very tiring. Maybe I need to try and look at things from a different focus altogether? At least for my 

own sanity? Maybe people give up (and maybe don't even try at all) because they run into brick walls 

like I feel I keep runing into? I still have a hard time accepting this. 

Well, I realize that I am starting to ramble on again. I am starting to talk to not just you, Cynthia, but 

to the world. 

Adios for now, 

Ann 


Ann--- 

726

I did not try to put any sting in my posts. I am responding to yours because it seems you want to 

discuss it. I was hoping others would jump in, but that doesn't seem to be happening. For the 

record, I am able to see this from your perspective. Looking at something from someone else's 

point of view doesn't mean you have to change yours, although it could happen. I don't think the 

point of this journal is to get everyone to come to an agreement on any one perspective, it doesn't 

happen in the real world, and it probably won't happen here. That is not a bad thing. I think social 

issues are particularly complex because no matter what you decide to agree with, there always 

seems to be some negative consequence to go with it. No societal decision comes without a price 

that some group will have to pay. Cynthia 




It is hard for me not to read your journal entries without feeling the emotion or the sting of 

what I feel behind them. I guess the lens with which I view the world is different than your lens, 

at least on this issue. I can't get you to see through my glasses with my prescription, and I 

can't see through your glasses with your prescription. 

I don't want to force anyone to see things they do not want to see. It's like trying to get my cat 

to look at herself in the mirror, (if anyone has ever tried this, it is practically impossible) they 

never look at themselves. I was only hoping to open peoples eyes, to broaden their horizons, 

to deepen their understandings, but I find myself once again not going anywhere. 


Note to self, "front door, side door, back porch, family room window- all locked up tight". 

Question to self, "Are there any other possible entry points?" 

Advice from right shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/21.gif, "look for 

the good in people, they might someday see things your way". 

Advice from left shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/16.gif, "Give-um 

hell!" 

Ann 


addressed it to God? Was he hanging out with Darwin having a good time and got behind on 

his e-mails from Cohort-F? Jesus, Darwin.....are you still out there somewhere in cyberspace? 


Ann, I think you are putting words and feelings into my posts that are not there. I don't 

dispise homosexuals. I also think you have every right to pursue happiness and success. 

And if for you that means a marriage certificate, I think you should fight for it. And if one of 

my children told me they were homosexual, it wouldn't change my viewpoint, nor would it 

change how I feel about them. I think individuals are separate from issues. I judge people 

on who they are, not what they are. That said, maybe we are getting somewhere here. You 

said I can't prove people are not born homosexual, and you are right. However, I think it 

would be beneficial to see some real scientific research done on the topic. If society was 

727

given some real data to base their opinions and views on, things might change. But I think 

that many see homosexuality as an abnormal lifestyle, and are therefore resistant to 

accepting it as part of the mainstream society, in other words normal. I am not saying this 

to disagree with you or make you wrong or upset you, but I just think you might want to at 

least try to understand why other people might not agree with you. Not everyone thinks 

homosexuality is normal or even acceptable, and trying to force people to change their 

minds will most likely be met with resistance. I am not telling you you shouldn't do that, 

however, but just know it will take time for people to change, maybe even generations. 





magnitude of what I am trying to express. And (Cynthia) I know darn well you will write 

back saying that I don't get what you are trying to say to me, even though I feel that I do 

(which is why I fight even harder!). 

If your son or daughter told you that they were homosexual, would you love them any 

less? Wouldn't you want them to be able to live as safely, and happily as anyone else 

in our society? If they work hard, go to college and want to live openly and happily like 

anyone else, which includes having the option of marrying, (with all of the pros and 

cons that goes with it, if they so choose), do they not deserve this as much as anyone 

else deserves it? Do they not deserve an equal chance to live a successful, happy, 

rewarding life just as much as anyone else? 

I still do not see why talking about this subject is "putting myself on the line?" Am I 

honestly and truly not seeing something that could have a dangerous outcome because 

I am choosing to talk about homosexuals in the context of religion and marriage... etc? 

I guess what I do not get is how our society is so (bleep, bleep, bleeped-up) that there 

are not more people like myself who want to take personal action and not let injustices 

take place. "NOT ON MY WATCH!" 

The difference between smoking in a restaurant and being homosexual are choices. 

The last time I checked, being homosexual is not hazardous to your health (only if 

people make it so), but smoking is both hazardous to your health as well as anyone 

around breathing in your second hand smoke. 

I can prove that we were not born with a cigarette hanging out of our mouths, but can 

you prove people are not born homosexual? 

Do I have a choice what color my skin is? Do you have a choice of whether you have 

freckles or not, or if you hair is curly or straight? By your journal entries, it seems as 

though you feel being homosexual is a choice people can control? Do people have the 

choice of being heterosexual as much as they have a choice of being homosexual? If 

people can turn on or off their sexuality (like a light switch) then does that mean that 

everyone is equally capable of being homosexual but they choose to be straight? 


728

feelings to conform to the greater majority, is that not the same as asking a 

heterosexual person to suppress their feeling and conform to a homosexual 

relationship? Does that choice sound distasteful to you? Don't you think it is equally 

distasteful for homosexuals who are suppressing their feelings? 


matter? Unless there are tangible examples, how can anyone discuss these and/or 

disprove or enlighten these stereotypes? 

Why do people dislike certain groups? If you peeled back all the layers, what is at the 

core of the hatred? And, is it even legitimate? Is it like the Hatfield's and the McCoy's. 

They hate each other because their granddaddies hated each other...etc. etc. etc. 




Ann 


Ann, I admire you for standing up for what you believe in. I think it is great you are 

willing to put yourself on the line and state what you believe. I don't think anybody 

needs a marriage certificate to be happy, gay or straight. I also don't think just 

because someone wants something, they should automatically be indulged. Just like 

the ice cream store: What if the reason the person only gets vanilla is because they 

are allergic to all the other flavors? Sometimes there are reasons why people don't 

get everything they want. In order to have a civil society, we have to set guidelines. 

They may not necessarily fit with everyone's beliefs, but they may prevent chaos. I 

would like to be able to go into a restaurant, have dinner and smoke a cigarette with 

a cup of coffee, but I can't do that. Society doesn't think I should be able to. I don't 

see anyone standing up for my rights to do that. Is it fair? NO, but it is something I 

have to live with, or should I say, cho ose to live with. I could stop smoking, and 

probably will eventually, but for now, I just don't eat in restaurants. Am I wrong to 

want to smoke in a restaurant? Maybe, maybe not. 

Cynthia 


Ahhh Haaa, 



My first thought has to do with living together before marriage. Would you buy a 

pair of shoes without trying them on? Just because they are marked as your size 

does not mean they will fit right. You could go to the store everyday and look at 

them in the window, pick them up with your hands, carry them around the store a 

little, hold them up to your pants to see if you like the color, But, for anyone who 

has had an uncomfortable pair of shoes knows, no matter how much you where 

them, they always hurt your feet. 

729

Another thought about marriage being allowed to some couples and not others, 

(Karis and others who wrote on this), Just imagine all the wonderful love, 

happiness, anticipation of being together....etc., but never being able to have it. 

(Kind of like a glass ceiling- you can see everyone elses happiness and success, 

but you can not have it). What if you were not allowed to get married because 

some group of people said you were wrong? How would you feel? Would you 

be frustrated? Would you just live your life without your special someone? 

Would you end up living together? 

As for what Marin said in her journal about the government being in control of 

what people think and know, I agree that groups in power brain wash their 

followers to believe what they want them to believe. For example, children are 

not born with hateful feelings towards people who have different colors of skin, or 

who walk with a limp, or who are a little slower than the rest... The same goes 

with sexuality... Our society teaches us how to be; it is our society that poisons 

us against homosexuality. What we really should do is watch children on how 

they treat people (before they are poisoned by our society that is). If you watch 

children, they can be so honest, caring, and loving. But, we as a society poison 

their minds with prejudices, and gender roles, and hateful values. 

What amazes me is that people are so set in their thinking that they keep passing 

the bullshit on. The cycle of violence!!! The cycle of prejudices!!! The cycle 

of hate! 

Whether it is legalizing marriage between homosexuals, or accepting differences 

in other people, our actions ARE NOT SET IN STONE!!! We do have the 

choice to get up and stand up for what is the right thing to do. 

How would any of us like it if it was forbidden to marry our boyfriend or our 

girlfriend. How would you feel if there were groups of people around, including 

the president of the United States of America ("liberty and justice for some but 

not all") who told you that who you loved and wanted to spend your life with was 

a sin and that you can not get married? And that the only alternatives they give 

you do not offer any of the benefits that marriage does... 

How would you feel if you went to Baskin Robins and out of the 31 flavors, they 

said you can only have vanilla even though everyone else gets to have whatever 

flavor they want? 

How would you feel if your society at face value was polite to your face because 

it is not politically correct to hate homosexuals? But, by their actions and laws, 

the very same society was condemning you for what you believed in? Actions 

speak louder than words. 

Does anyone realize that the suicide rate for homosexuals is much, much larger 

than it is for heterosexuals? In no doubt connected with the laws and values we 

keep passing on to generation after generation. I am still amazed that there are 

not more people like myself who want to stand up and scream "THAT THIS IS A 

BUNCH OF BULLSHIT!" 

Does anyone realize that this is our time in history. We have choices NOW. 

That the history we read about had their choices and their consequences. If it 

730

_____ 

_____ 

were not for our fore mothers who stood up for women's rights, we would still be 

the property of men to do with as they pleased. 

That if the civil rights movement never took place, we would still be castrating 

and hanging "Negro's" from the nearest tree. I went to Balboa Park to the art 

museum and stood in front of a painting for the longest time. This painting was 

titled" Southern Holiday (The Lynching 1936) by Sternberg. 


Southern Holiday is the artist's brutal indictment of the lynchings and the 

oppression of African-Americans in the 1930s. Sternberg described himself as 

"filled with anger and shame" as he read newspaper accounts of racist atrocities 

and treated this theme several times in powerful prints and paintings. In this 

work, Sternberg depicts a castrated African-American man about to be hung feetfirst 

from a tree. He symbolized what he considered to be the decaying culture of 

the south through the broken columns, included depictions of factories as icons 

of economic oppression, and painted the white population, stripped naked of the 

civilizing veneer of clothing and thriving on the backs of anguished African- 

Americans. 

http://us.f215.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?DMid=8478_960582_873_425_ 

1931_0_1082_4262_2655232039&YY=86107&inc=25 

&order=down&sort=date&pos=0&view=&head=&box=Draft 






INDIVIDUAL choices and INDIVIDUAL voices..... Don't blindly follow 

the crowd; educate yourselves on the truths and stand up for others 

as you would hope they would stand up for you"... Ann 





731

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 









_____ 



732





Subject: Re: social evolution 

Hey Darwin, 

I see what you are saying... it's just very frustrating when you are on the side that wants the change. 

When people are on the side that benefits from the current roles of society, they have no reason or 

incentive to change. Why would they want to give up their hierarchal position on the thrown? Our 

society already revolves around and supports their needs. I just hate how, as a society, people are 

kind to another's face, but by our actions, we stab each other in the back. I will try to hang in there, 

what choice do I have? 

Thanks for writing to me... and I really do mean that! 

Ann 


Ann, 

While I prefer to stay within the boundaries of biological science, I can 

say that it seems as if moral rules develop slowly over time, by way of 

individual sympathetic judgement, which is guided by socially established 

rules of behavior. In other words, social evolution is itself a conflict 

where one side is struggling for uniformity and solidarity, while the other 

is demanding variation and individuality. Eventually, through communication 

of these conflicting ideals and beliefs a new set of morals will emerge. Of 

course ,this does not guarantee the progress of moral development, only 

social change, which could be either positive or negative. And based on my 

own theories of biological evolution, those who best adapt have the 

potential to survive. 

Sincerely, 

C. Darwyn 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



733






Good morning Ann, Guess we are the only ones here, lol. Don't get down on yourself because you 

can't change the world, no individual can (in my opinion). But you can change things around you, a 

little bit at a time. Eventually, it spreads and the world does change. Maybe we shouldn't fight for 

change, maybe that is the wrong road. You know how they say "set a good example" and "be a good 

role model". Perhaps that is the way to change things. Let people see what we mean, not hear it. Ok, 

I will be passing the offering tray now. Have a good day. Lets both look for one good thing in the 

world as we go about our day, and maybe it can make us smile. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

I realize that you do not mean to put sting into your words, but they do feel like they contain a 

stinging angent at times. Over our time together in our cohort, I have come to realize that is just 

the way you express yourself and I should try not to take it personally. Your like a little spit fire, 

and that can a good thing in certain situations; I just need to realize that it is your style of 

communication and it is not meant as being personal. 

I thought about what you said last night, that my writing seemed as though I was assuming (you) 

personally felt one way or another, or that I was reading into, or putting ideas into your text that 

you say were not there. And my answer to that is that I was not just writing to you as an 

individual. I was trying to talk to our cohort and to the world in a sense in hopes that someone 

else would jump in. However, it seems as though you and I are the only ones who end up 

discussing things head on. 

Maybe I can't make the world a better place? Maybe all those years when I was younger and had 

to put up with the bullshit that went along with growing up in my family only to hear, "When you 

grow up, you can have things the way you want them" is not true either. 


starving to death) the world is a bunch of bull? I used to think that people (if given good examples 

and were educated about certain topics) are loving and excepting. I have a hard 

time accepting how people just don't care. If certain topics don't effect them in any way it is just 

an annoying noise on the side of the road. Like a homeless person holding up a sign on the side 

of the road saying they are homeless and hungry. Do we really care? Maybe for a second or two, 

(and we try not to look at them- we try not to look into their eyes and make that connection) or 

at least until the light turns green and we are on our way again. 

Maybe I need to stop fighting what feels like an impossible fight, at least right now, because what I 

am fighting for is far beyond the face value of marriage. Perhaps I have bitten off more than I can 

chew by myself; actually, I never realized that I would be by myself? Trying to swim upstream can 

be very tiring. Maybe I need to try and look at things from a different focus altogether? At least 

for my own sanity? Maybe people give up (and maybe don't even try at all) because they run into 

brick walls like I feel I keep runing into? I still have a hard time accepting this. 

734

Well, I realize that I am starting to ramble on again. I am starting to talk to not just you, Cynthia, 

but to the world. 


Ann 


Ann--- 

I did not try to put any sting in my posts. I am responding to yours because it seems you want 

to discuss it. I was hoping others would jump in, but that doesn't seem to be happening. For 

the record, I am able to see this from your perspective. Looking at something from someone 

else's point of view doesn't mean you have to change yours, although it could happen. I don't 

think the point of this journal is to get everyone to come to an agreement on any one 

perspective, it doesn't happen in the real world, and it probably won't happen here. That is not 

a bad thing. I think social issues are particularly complex because no matter what you decide 

to agree with, there always seems to be some negative consequence to go with it. No societal 

decision comes without a price that some group will have to pay. Cynthia 




It is hard for me not to read your journal entries without feeling the emotion or the sting of 

what I feel behind them. I guess the lens with which I view the world is different than your 

lens, at least on this issue. I can't get you to see through my glasses with my prescription, 

and I can't see through your glasses with your prescription. 

I don't want to force anyone to see things they do not want to see. It's like trying to get my 

cat to look at herself in the mirror, (if anyone has ever tried this, it is practically impossible) 

they never look at themselves. I was only hoping to open peoples eyes, to broaden their 

horizons, to deepen their understandings, but I find myself once again not going anywhere. 




Advice from right shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/21.gif, "look 

for the good in people, they might someday see things your way". 

Advice from left shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/16.gif, "Giveum 

hell!" 

Ann 


addressed it to God? Was he hanging out with Darwin having a good time and got behind 

on his e-mails from Cohort-F? Jesus, Darwin.....are you still out there somewhere in 

cyberspace? 

735


Ann, I think you are putting words and feelings into my posts that are not there. I don't 

dispise homosexuals. I also think you have every right to pursue happiness and 

success. And if for you that means a marriage certificate, I think you should fight for it. 

And if one of my children told me they were homosexual, it wouldn't change my 

viewpoint, nor would it change how I feel about them. I think individuals are separate 

from issues. I judge people on who they are, not what they are. That said, maybe we 

are getting somewhere here. You said I can't prove people are not born homosexual, 

and you are right. However, I think it would be beneficial to see some real scientific 

research done on the topic. If society was given some real data to base their opinions 

and views on, things might change. But I think that many see homosexuality as an 

abnormal lifestyle, and are therefore resistant to accepting it as part of the mainstream 

society, in other words normal. I am not saying this to disagree with you or make you 

wrong or upset you, but I just think you might want to at least try to understand why 

other people might not agree with you. Not everyone thinks homosexuality is normal or 

even acceptable, and trying to force people to change their minds will most likely be met 

with resistance. I am not telling you you shouldn't do that, however, but just know it will 

take time for people to change, maybe even generations. 





magnitude of what I am trying to express. And (Cynthia) I know darn well you will 

write back saying that I don't get what you are trying to say to me, even though I feel 

that I do (which is why I fight even harder!). 

If your son or daughter told you that they were homosexual, would you love them 

any less? Wouldn't you want them to be able to live as safely, and happily as 

anyone else in our society? If they work hard, go to college and want to live openly 

and happily like anyone else, which includes having the option of marrying, (with 

all of the pros and cons that goes with it, if they so choose), do they not deserve this 

as much as anyone else deserves it? Do they not deserve an equal chance to live a 

successful, happy, rewarding life just as much as anyone else? 

I still do not see why talking about this subject is "putting myself on the line?" Am I 

honestly and truly not seeing something that could have a dangerous outcome 

because I am choosing to talk about homosexuals in the context of religion and 

marriage... etc? 

I guess what I do not get is how our society is so (bleep, bleep, bleeped-up) that 

there are not more people like myself who want to take personal action and not let 

injustices take place. "NOT ON MY WATCH!" 

The difference between smoking in a restaurant and being homosexual are choices. 

The last time I checked, being homosexual is not hazardous to your health (only if 

736

people make it so), but smoking is both hazardous to your health as well as anyone 

around breathing in your second hand smoke. 

I can prove that we were not born with a cigarette hanging out of our mouths, but 

can you prove people are not born homosexual? 

Do I have a choice what color my skin is? Do you have a choice of whether you 

have freckles or not, or if you hair is curly or straight? By your journal entries, it 

seems as though you feel being homosexual is a choice people can control? Do 

people have the choice of being heterosexual as much as they have a choice of 

being homosexual? If people can turn on or off their sexuality (like a light switch) 

then does that mean that everyone is equally capable of being homosexual but they 


If you feel (and I am not positive that you do) that homosexuals should suppress 

their feelings to conform to the greater majority, is that not the same as asking a 


relationship? Does that choice sound distasteful to you? Don't you think it is equally 

distasteful for homosexuals who are suppressing their feelings? 

I wish people would express why they despise homosexuals or any hated group by 

that matter? Unless there are tangible examples, how can anyone discuss these 

and/or disprove or enlighten these stereotypes? 

Why do people dislike certain groups? If you peeled back all the layers, what is at 

the core of the hatred? And, is it even legitimate? Is it like the Hatfield's and the 

McCoy's. They hate each other because their granddaddies hated each other...etc. 

etc. etc. 


frustrating. I would hope that instead you could come up with some legitimate, 

genuine, thoughtful responses. 

Ann 


Ann, I admire you for standing up for what you believe in. I think it is great you 

are willing to put yourself on the line and state what you believe. I don't think 

anybody needs a marriage certificate to be happy, gay or straight. I also don't 

think just because someone wants something, they should automatically be 

indulged. Just like the ice cream store: What if the reason the person only gets 

vanilla is because they are allergic to all the other flavors? Sometimes there are 

reasons why people don't get everything they want. In order to have a civil 

society, we have to set guidelines. They may not necessarily fit with everyone's 

beliefs, but they may prevent chaos. I would like to be able to go into a 

restaurant, have dinner and smoke a cigarette with a cup of coffee, but I can't do 

that. Society doesn't think I should be able to. I don't see anyone standing up for 

my rights to do that. Is it fair? NO, but it is something I have to live with, or should 

I say, cho ose to live with. I could stop smoking, and probably will eventually, but 

for now, I just don't eat in restaurants. Am I wrong to want to smoke in a 

restaurant? Maybe, maybe not. 

Cynthia 

737


Ahhh Haaa, 



My first thought has to do with living together before marriage. Would you 

buy a pair of shoes without trying them on? Just because they are marked as 

your size does not mean they will fit right. You could go to the store everyday 

and look at them in the window, pick them up with your hands, carry them 

around the store a little, hold them up to your pants to see if you like the color, 

But, for anyone who has had an uncomfortable pair of shoes knows, no 

matter how much you where them, they always hurt your feet. 

Another thought about marriage being allowed to some couples and not 

others, (Karis and others who wrote on this), Just imagine all the wonderful 

love, happiness, anticipation of being together....etc., but never being able to 

have it. (Kind of like a glass ceiling- you can see everyone elses happiness 

and success, but you can not have it). What if you were not allowed to get 

married because some group of people said you were wrong? How would 

you feel? Would you be frustrated? Would you just live your life without your 

special someone? Would you end up living together? 

As for what Marin said in her journal about the government being in control of 

what people think and know, I agree that groups in power brain wash their 

followers to believe what they want them to believe. For example, children 

are not born with hateful feelings towards people who have different colors of 

skin, or who walk with a limp, or who are a little slower than the rest... The 

same goes with sexuality... Our society teaches us how to be; it is our society 

that poisons us against homosexuality. What we really should do is watch 

children on how they treat people (before they are poisoned by our society 

that is). If you watch children, they can be so honest, caring, and loving. But, 

we as a society poison their minds with prejudices, and gender roles, and 

hateful values. 

What amazes me is that people are so set in their thinking that they keep 

passing the bullshit on. The cycle of violence!!! The cycle of prejudices!!! 

The cycle of hate! 

Whether it is legalizing marriage between homosexuals, or accepting 

differences in other people, our actions ARE NOT SET IN STONE!!! We do 

have the choice to get up and stand up for what is the right thing to do. 


girlfriend. How would you feel if there were groups of people around, 

including the president of the United States of America ("liberty and justice for 

some but not all") who told you that who you loved and wanted to spend your 

life with was a sin and that you can not get married? And that the only 

alternatives they give you do not offer any of the benefits that marriage 

738

does... 

How would you feel if you went to Baskin Robins and out of the 31 flavors, 

they said you can only have vanilla even though everyone else gets to have 

whatever flavor they want? 

How would you feel if your society at face value was polite to your face 

because it is not politically correct to hate homosexuals? But, by their actions 

and laws, the very same society was condemning you for what you believed 

in? Actions speak louder than words. 

Does anyone realize that the suicide rate for homosexuals is much, much 

larger than it is for heterosexuals? In no doubt connected with the laws and 

values we keep passing on to generation after generation. I am still amazed 

that there are not more people like myself who want to stand up and scream 

"THAT THIS IS A BUNCH OF BULLSHIT!" 

Does anyone realize that this is our time in history. We have choices NOW. 

That the history we read about had their choices and their consequences. If it 

were not for our fore mothers who stood up for women's rights, we would still 

be the property of men to do with as they pleased. 

That if the civil rights movement never took place, we would still be castrating 

and hanging "Negro's" from the nearest tree. I went to Balboa Park to the art 

museum and stood in front of a painting for the longest time. This painting 

was titled" Southern Holiday (The Lynching 1936) by Sternberg. 



oppression of African-Americans in the 1930s. Sternberg described himself 

as "filled with anger and shame" as he read newspaper accounts of racist 

atrocities and treated this theme several times in powerful prints and 

paintings. In this work, Sternberg depicts a castrated African-American man 

about to be hung feet-first from a tree. He symbolized what he considered to 

be the decaying culture of the south through the broken columns, included 

depictions of factories as icons of economic oppression, and painted the 

white population, stripped naked of the civilizing veneer of clothing and 

thriving on the backs of anguished African-Americans. 

http://us.f215.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?DMid=8478_960582_873_425_ 

1931_0_1082_4262_2655232039&YY=86107&inc=25 






739

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 


INDIVIDUAL choices and INDIVIDUAL voices..... Don't blindly 

follow the crowd; educate yourselves on the truths and stand up 

for others as you would hope they would stand up for you"... Ann 















_____ 

740



741






Hey Cynthia, 

That sounds like a good plan. Take care and I will see you tomorrow. 




can't change the world, no individual can (in my opinion). But you can change things around you, 

a little bit at a time. Eventually, it spreads and the world does change. Maybe we shouldn't fight for 

change, maybe that is the wrong road. You know how they say "set a good example" and "be a 

good role model". Perhaps that is the way to change things. Let people see what we mean, not 

hear it. Ok, I will be passing the offering tray now. Have a good day. Lets both look for one good 

thing in the world as we go about our day, and maybe it can make us smile. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 


stinging angent at times. Over our time together in our cohort, I have come to realize that is 

just the way you express yourself and I should try not to take it personally. Your like a little spit 

fire, and that can a good thing in certain situations; I just need to realize that it is your style of 


I thought about what you said last night, that my writing seemed as though I was assuming 

(you) personally felt one way or another, or that I was reading into, or putting ideas into your 

text that you say were not there. And my answer to that is that I was not just writing to you as 

an individual. I was trying to talk to our cohort and to the world in a sense in hopes that 

someone else would jump in. However, it seems as though you and I are the only ones who 

end up discussing things head on. 

Maybe I can't make the world a better place? Maybe all those years when I was younger and 

had to put up with the bullshit that went along with growing up in my family only to hear, "When 

you grow up, you can have things the way you want them" is not true either. 


starving to death) the world is a bunch of bull? I used to think that people (if given good 

examples and were educated about certain topics) are loving and excepting. I have a hard 

time accepting how people just don't care. If certain topics don't effect them in any way it is 

just an annoying noise on the side of the road. Like a homeless person holding up a sign on 

the side of the road saying they are homeless and hungry. Do we really care? Maybe for a 

second or two, (and we try not to look at them- we try not to look into their eyes and make that 

742

connection) or at least until the light turns green and we are on our way again. 

Maybe I need to stop fighting what feels like an impossible fight, at least right now, because 

what I am fighting for is far beyond the face value of marriage. Perhaps I have bitten off more 

than I can chew by myself; actually, I never realized that I would be by myself? Trying to swim 

upstream can be very tiring. Maybe I need to try and look at things from a different focus 

altogether? At least for my own sanity? Maybe people give up (and maybe don't even try at 

all) because they run into brick walls like I feel I keep runing into? I still have a hard time 

accepting this. 

Well, I realize that I am starting to ramble on again. I am starting to talk to not just you, 

Cynthia, but to the world. 


Ann 


Ann--- 

I did not try to put any sting in my posts. I am responding to yours because it seems you 

want to discuss it. I was hoping others would jump in, but that doesn't seem to be 

happening. For the record, I am able to see this from your perspective. Looking at 

something from someone else's point of view doesn't mean you have to change yours, 

although it could happen. I don't think the point of this journal is to get everyone to come to 

an agreement on any one perspective, it doesn't happen in the real world, and it probably 

won't happen here. That is not a bad thing. I think social issues are particularly complex 

because no matter what you decide to agree with, there always seems to be some negative 

consequence to go with it. No societal decision comes without a price that some group will 

have to pay. Cynthia 




It is hard for me not to read your journal entries without feeling the emotion or the sting 

of what I feel behind them. I guess the lens with which I view the world is different than 

your lens, at least on this issue. I can't get you to see through my glasses with my 

prescription, and I can't see through your glasses with your prescription. 

I don't want to force anyone to see things they do not want to see. It's like trying to get 

my cat to look at herself in the mirror, (if anyone has ever tried this, it is practically 

impossible) they never look at themselves. I was only hoping to open peoples eyes, to 

broaden their horizons, to deepen their understandings, but I find myself once again not 

going anywhere. 




743

Advice from right shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/21.gif, 

"look for the good in people, they might someday see things your way". 

Advice from left shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/16.gif, 

"Give-um hell!" 

Ann 

P.S. I am kinda bummed that Jesus never answered the e-mail I sent him, was it 

because I addressed it to God? Was he hanging out with Darwin having a good time 

and got behind on his e-mails from Cohort-F? Jesus, Darwin.....are you still out there 

somewhere in cyberspace? 


Ann, I think you are putting words and feelings into my posts that are not there. I 

don't dispise homosexuals. I also think you have every right to pursue happiness 

and success. And if for you that means a marriage certificate, I think you should fight 

for it. And if one of my children told me they were homosexual, it wouldn't change my 





research done on the topic. If society was given some real data to base their 

opinions and views on, things might change. But I think that many see 

homosexuality as an abnormal lifestyle, and are therefore resistant to accepting it as 

part of the mainstream society, in other words normal. I am not saying this to 

disagree with you or make you wrong or upset you, but I just think you might want to 

at least try to understand why other people might not agree with you. Not everyone 

thinks homosexuality is normal or even acceptable, and trying to force people to 

change their minds will most likely be met with resistance. I am not telling you you 

shouldn't do that, however, but just know it will take time for people to change, 





I am trying my darnedest, but it doesn't seem as though you are understanding 

the magnitude of what I am trying to express. And (Cynthia) I know darn well you 

will write back saying that I don't get what you are trying to say to me, even 

though I feel that I do (which is why I fight even harder!). 



anyone else in our society? If they work hard, go to college and want to live 

openly and happily like anyone else, which includes having the option of 

marrying, (with all of the pros and cons that goes with it, if they so choose), do 

they not deserve this as much as anyone else deserves it? Do they not deserve 

an equal chance to live a successful, happy, rewarding life just as much as 

anyone else? 

744

I still do not see why talking about this subject is "putting myself on the line?" Am 

I honestly and truly not seeing something that could have a dangerous outcome 




there are not more people like myself who want to take personal action and not 

let injustices take place. "NOT ON MY WATCH!" 

The difference between smoking in a restaurant and being homosexual are 

choices. The last time I checked, being homosexual is not hazardous to your 

health (only if people make it so), but smoking is both hazardous to your health 

as well as anyone around breathing in your second hand smoke. 








then does that mean that everyone is equally capable of being homosexual but 

they choose to be straight? 




relationship? Does that choice sound distasteful to you? Don't you think it is 

equally distasteful for homosexuals who are suppressing their feelings? 

I wish people would express why they despise homosexuals or any hated group 

by that matter? Unless there are tangible examples, how can anyone discuss 

these and/or disprove or enlighten these stereotypes? 

Why do people dislike certain groups? If you peeled back all the layers, what is 

at the core of the hatred? And, is it even legitimate? Is it like the Hatfield's and 

the McCoy's. They hate each other because their granddaddies hated each 

other...etc. etc. etc. 

I realize that the likelihood of you writing back with something that stings a bit 

and is frustrating. I would hope that instead you could come up with some 

legitimate, genuine, thoughtful responses. 

Ann 





745


indulged. Just like the ice cream store: What if the reason the person only 

gets vanilla is because they are allergic to all the other flavors? Sometimes 

there are reasons why people don't get everything they want. In order to have 

a civil society, we have to set guidelines. They may not necessarily fit with 

everyone's beliefs, but they may prevent chaos. I would like to be able to go 

into a restaurant, have dinner and smoke a cigarette with a cup of coffee, but 

I can't do that. Society doesn't think I should be able to. I don't see anyone 

standing up for my rights to do that. Is it fair? NO, but it is something I have to 

live with, or should I say, cho ose to live with. I could stop smoking, and 

probably will eventually, but for now, I just don't eat in restaurants. Am I wrong 

to want to smoke in a restaurant? Maybe, maybe not. 

Cynthia 


Ahhh Haaa, 




buy a pair of shoes without trying them on? Just because they are 

marked as your size does not mean they will fit right. You could go to the 

store everyday and look at them in the window, pick them up with your 

hands, carry them around the store a little, hold them up to your pants to 

see if you like the color, But, for anyone who has had an uncomfortable 

pair of shoes knows, no matter how much you where them, they always 

hurt your feet. 


others, (Karis and others who wrote on this), Just imagine all the 

wonderful love, happiness, anticipation of being together....etc., but never 

being able to have it. (Kind of like a glass ceiling- you can see everyone 

elses happiness and success, but you can not have it). What if you were 

not allowed to get married because some group of people said you were 

wrong? How would you feel? Would you be frustrated? Would you just 

live your life without your special someone? Would you end up living 

together? 

As for what Marin said in her journal about the government being in 

control of what people think and know, I agree that groups in power brain 

wash their followers to believe what they want them to believe. For 

example, children are not born with hateful feelings towards people who 

have different colors of skin, or who walk with a limp, or who are a little 

slower than the rest... The same goes with sexuality... Our society 

teaches us how to be; it is our society that poisons us against 

homosexuality. What we really should do is watch children on how they 

treat people (before they are poisoned by our society that is). If you watch 

children, they can be so honest, caring, and loving. But, we as a society 

746



passing the bullshit on. The cycle of violence!!! The cycle of 

prejudices!!! The cycle of hate! 


differences in other people, our actions ARE NOT SET IN STONE!!! We 

do have the choice to get up and stand up for what is the right thing to 

do. 



including the president of the United States of America ("liberty and justice 

for some but not all") who told you that who you loved and wanted to 

spend your life with was a sin and that you can not get married? And that 

the only alternatives they give you do not offer any of the benefits that 

marriage does... 


they said you can only have vanilla even though everyone else gets to 

have whatever flavor they want? 


because it is not politically correct to hate homosexuals? But, by their 

actions and laws, the very same society was condemning you for what 

you believed in? Actions speak louder than words. 


larger than it is for heterosexuals? In no doubt connected with the laws 

and values we keep passing on to generation after generation. I am still 

amazed that there are not more people like myself who want to stand up 


Does anyone realize that this is our time in history. We have choices 

NOW. That the history we read about had their choices and their 

consequences. If it were not for our fore mothers who stood up for 

women's rights, we would still be the property of men to do with as they 

pleased. 

That if the civil rights movement never took place, we would still be 

castrating and hanging "Negro's" from the nearest tree. I went to Balboa 

Park to the art museum and stood in front of a painting for the longest 

time. This painting was titled" Southern Holiday (The Lynching 1936) by 

Sternberg. 



oppression of African-Americans in the 1930s. Sternberg described 

747

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

himself as "filled with anger and shame" as he read newspaper accounts 

of racist atrocities and treated this theme several times in powerful prints 

and paintings. In this work, Sternberg depicts a castrated African- 

American man about to be hung feet-first from a tree. He symbolized what 

he considered to be the decaying culture of the south through the broken 

columns, included depictions of factories as icons of economic 

oppression, and painted the white population, stripped naked of the 


Americans. 

http://us.f215.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?DMid=8478_960582_873_ 

425_1931_0_1082_4262_2655232039&YY=86107&inc=25 






"To stop injustices from happening takes the combined efforts 

of INDIVIDUAL choices and INDIVIDUAL voices..... Don't 

blindly follow the crowd; educate yourselves on the truths and 

stand up for others as you would hope they would stand up for 

you"... Ann 








748

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 










_____ 



749





Subject: RE: we have different lenses..... 

I think you made a good point Cynthia that "you can change things around you, a little bit at at time." This is one of the 

reasons I want to be a teacher. We know it's a cliché when we say we want to make a difference in children's lives, that's 

why we want to become a teacher, but if this is how we can change the world a little bit at a time, why not start with open 

and fresh young minds? We, as teachers can also hopefully recognize the potential and contribution that each child can 

offer our world and by being great teachers we can gently guide these young people in their endeavors. ~ Louise 







can't change the world, no individual can (in my opinion). But you can change things around you, 

a little bit at a time. Eventually, it spreads and the world does change. Maybe we shouldn't fight for 

change, maybe that is the wrong road. You know how they say "set a good example" and "be a 

good role model". Perhaps that is the way to change things. Let people see what we mean, not 

hear it. Ok, I will be passing the offering tray now. Have a good day. Lets both look for one good 

thing in the world as we go about our day, and maybe it can make us smile. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 


stinging angent at times. Over our time together in our cohort, I have come to realize that is 

just the way you express yourself and I should try not to take it personally. Your like a little spit 

fire, and that can a good thing in certain situations; I just need to realize that it is your style of 


I thought about what you said last night, that my writing seemed as though I was assuming 

(you) personally felt one way or another, or that I was reading into, or putting ideas into your 

text that you say were not there. And my answer to that is that I was not just writing to you as 

an individual. I was trying to talk to our cohort and to the world in a sense in hopes that 

someone else would jump in. However, it seems as though you and I are the only ones who 

end up discussing things head on. 

Maybe I can't make the world a better place? Maybe all those years when I was younger and 

had to put up with the bullshit that went along with growing up in my family only to hear, "When 

you grow up, you can have things the way you want them" is not true either. 


starving to death) the world is a bunch of bull? I used to think that people (if given good 

examples and were educated about certain topics) are loving and excepting. I have a hard 

750

time accepting how people just don't care. If certain topics don't effect them in any way it is 

just an annoying noise on the side of the road. Like a homeless person holding up a sign on 

the side of the road saying they are homeless and hungry. Do we really care? Maybe for a 

second or two, (and we try not to look at them- we try not to look into their eyes and make that 

connection) or at least until the light turns green and we are on our way again. 

Maybe I need to stop fighting what feels like an impossible fight, at least right now, because 

what I am fighting for is far beyond the face value of marriage. Perhaps I have bitten off more 

than I can chew by myself; actually, I never realized that I would be by myself? Trying to swim 

upstream can be very tiring. Maybe I need to try and look at things from a different focus 

altogether? At least for my own sanity? Maybe people give up (and maybe don't even try at 

all) because they run into brick walls like I feel I keep runing into? I still have a hard time 

accepting this. 

Well, I realize that I am starting to ramble on again. I am starting to talk to not just you, 

Cynthia, but to the world. 


Ann 


Ann--- 

I did not try to put any sting in my posts. I am responding to yours because it seems you 

want to discuss it. I was hoping others would jump in, but that doesn't seem to be 

happening. For the record, I am able to see this from your perspective. Looking at 

something from someone else's point of view doesn't mean you have to change yours, 

although it could happen. I don't think the point of this journal is to get everyone to come to 

an agreement on any one perspective, it doesn't happen in the real world, and it probably 

won't happen here. That is not a bad thing. I think social issues are particularly complex 

because no matter what you decide to agree with, there always seems to be some negative 

consequence to go with it. No societal decision comes without a price that some group will 

have to pay. Cynthia 




It is hard for me not to read your journal entries without feeling the emotion or the sting 

of what I feel behind them. I guess the lens with which I view the world is different than 

your lens, at least on this issue. I can't get you to see through my glasses with my 

prescription, and I can't see through your glasses with your prescription. 

I don't want to force anyone to see things they do not want to see. It's like trying to get 

my cat to look at herself in the mirror, (if anyone has ever tried this, it is practically 

impossible) they never look at themselves. I was only hoping to open peoples eyes, to 

broaden their horizons, to deepen their understandings, but I find myself once again not 

going anywhere. 

751




Advice from right shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/21.gif, 

"look for the good in people, they might someday see things your way". 

Advice from left shoulder http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/16.gif, 

"Give-um hell!" 

Ann 

P.S. I am kinda bummed that Jesus never answered the e-mail I sent him, was it 

because I addressed it to God? Was he hanging out with Darwin having a good time 

and got behind on his e-mails from Cohort-F? Jesus, Darwin.....are you still out there 

somewhere in cyberspace? 


Ann, I think you are putting words and feelings into my posts that are not there. I 

don't dispise homosexuals. I also think you have every right to pursue happiness 

and success. And if for you that means a marriage certificate, I think you should fight 

for it. And if one of my children told me they were homosexual, it wouldn't change my 





research done on the topic. If society was given some real data to base their 

opinions and views on, things might change. But I think that many see 

homosexuality as an abnormal lifestyle, and are therefore resistant to accepting it as 

part of the mainstream society, in other words normal. I am not saying this to 

disagree with you or make you wrong or upset you, but I just think you might want to 

at least try to understand why other people might not agree with you. Not everyone 

thinks homosexuality is normal or even acceptable, and trying to force people to 

change their minds will most likely be met with resistance. I am not telling you you 

shouldn't do that, however, but just know it will take time for people to change, 





I am trying my darnedest, but it doesn't seem as though you are understanding 

the magnitude of what I am trying to express. And (Cynthia) I know darn well you 

will write back saying that I don't get what you are trying to say to me, even 

though I feel that I do (which is why I fight even harder!). 



anyone else in our society? If they work hard, go to college and want to live 

openly and happily like anyone else, which includes having the option of 

752

marrying, (with all of the pros and cons that goes with it, if they so choose), do 

they not deserve this as much as anyone else deserves it? Do they not deserve 

an equal chance to live a successful, happy, rewarding life just as much as 

anyone else? 

I still do not see why talking about this subject is "putting myself on the line?" Am 

I honestly and truly not seeing something that could have a dangerous outcome 




there are not more people like myself who want to take personal action and not 

let injustices take place. "NOT ON MY WATCH!" 

The difference between smoking in a restaurant and being homosexual are 

choices. The last time I checked, being homosexual is not hazardous to your 

health (only if people make it so), but smoking is both hazardous to your health 

as well as anyone around breathing in your second hand smoke. 








then does that mean that everyone is equally capable of being homosexual but 

they choose to be straight? 




relationship? Does that choice sound distasteful to you? Don't you think it is 

equally distasteful for homosexuals who are suppressing their feelings? 

I wish people would express why they despise homosexuals or any hated group 

by that matter? Unless there are tangible examples, how can anyone discuss 

these and/or disprove or enlighten these stereotypes? 

Why do people dislike certain groups? If you peeled back all the layers, what is 

at the core of the hatred? And, is it even legitimate? Is it like the Hatfield's and 

the McCoy's. They hate each other because their granddaddies hated each 

other...etc. etc. etc. 

I realize that the likelihood of you writing back with something that stings a bit 

and is frustrating. I would hope that instead you could come up with some 

legitimate, genuine, thoughtful responses. 

Ann 


753





indulged. Just like the ice cream store: What if the reason the person only 

gets vanilla is because they are allergic to all the other flavors? Sometimes 

there are reasons why people don't get everything they want. In order to have 

a civil society, we have to set guidelines. They may not necessarily fit with 

everyone's beliefs, but they may prevent chaos. I would like to be able to go 

into a restaurant, have dinner and smoke a cigarette with a cup of coffee, but 

I can't do that. Society doesn't think I should be able to. I don't see anyone 

standing up for my rights to do that. Is it fair? NO, but it is something I have to 

live with, or should I say, cho ose to live with. I could stop smoking, and 

probably will eventually, but for now, I just don't eat in restaurants. Am I wrong 

to want to smoke in a restaurant? Maybe, maybe not. 

Cynthia 


Ahhh Haaa, 




buy a pair of shoes without trying them on? Just because they are 

marked as your size does not mean they will fit right. You could go to the 

store everyday and look at them in the window, pick them up with your 

hands, carry them around the store a little, hold them up to your pants to 

see if you like the color, But, for anyone who has had an uncomfortable 

pair of shoes knows, no matter how much you where them, they always 

hurt your feet. 


others, (Karis and others who wrote on this), Just imagine all the 

wonderful love, happiness, anticipation of being together....etc., but never 

being able to have it. (Kind of like a glass ceiling- you can see everyone 

elses happiness and success, but you can not have it). What if you were 

not allowed to get married because some group of people said you were 

wrong? How would you feel? Would you be frustrated? Would you just 

live your life without your special someone? Would you end up living 

together? 

As for what Marin said in her journal about the government being in 

control of what people think and know, I agree that groups in power brain 

wash their followers to believe what they want them to believe. For 

example, children are not born with hateful feelings towards people who 

have different colors of skin, or who walk with a limp, or who are a little 

slower than the rest... The same goes with sexuality... Our society 

754

teaches us how to be; it is our society that poisons us against 

homosexuality. What we really should do is watch children on how they 

treat people (before they are poisoned by our society that is). If you watch 

children, they can be so honest, caring, and loving. But, we as a society 



passing the bullshit on. The cycle of violence!!! The cycle of 

prejudices!!! The cycle of hate! 


differences in other people, our actions ARE NOT SET IN STONE!!! We 

do have the choice to get up and stand up for what is the right thing to 

do. 



including the president of the United States of America ("liberty and justice 

for some but not all") who told you that who you loved and wanted to 

spend your life with was a sin and that you can not get married? And that 

the only alternatives they give you do not offer any of the benefits that 

marriage does... 


they said you can only have vanilla even though everyone else gets to 

have whatever flavor they want? 


because it is not politically correct to hate homosexuals? But, by their 

actions and laws, the very same society was condemning you for what 

you believed in? Actions speak louder than words. 


larger than it is for heterosexuals? In no doubt connected with the laws 

and values we keep passing on to generation after generation. I am still 

amazed that there are not more people like myself who want to stand up 


Does anyone realize that this is our time in history. We have choices 

NOW. That the history we read about had their choices and their 

consequences. If it were not for our fore mothers who stood up for 

women's rights, we would still be the property of men to do with as they 

pleased. 

That if the civil rights movement never took place, we would still be 

castrating and hanging "Negro's" from the nearest tree. I went to Balboa 

Park to the art museum and stood in front of a painting for the longest 

time. This painting was titled" Southern Holiday (The Lynching 1936) by 

Sternberg. 

755

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 



oppression of African-Americans in the 1930s. Sternberg described 

himself as "filled with anger and shame" as he read newspaper accounts 

of racist atrocities and treated this theme several times in powerful prints 

and paintings. In this work, Sternberg depicts a castrated African- 

American man about to be hung feet-first from a tree. He symbolized what 

he considered to be the decaying culture of the south through the broken 

columns, included depictions of factories as icons of economic 

oppression, and painted the white population, stripped naked of the 


Americans. 

http://us.f215.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?DMid=8478_960582_873_ 

425_1931_0_1082_4262_2655232039&YY=86107&inc=25 






"To stop injustices from happening takes the combined efforts 

of INDIVIDUAL choices and INDIVIDUAL voices..... Don't 

blindly follow the crowd; educate yourselves on the truths and 

stand up for others as you would hope they would stand up for 

you"... Ann 







756

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 











757






In reading the chapter "The Dragon in My Garage" it occurred to me that perhaps Sagan is one of 

those adults who as a child never experienced Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, goblins at Halloween, 

heroes and princesses at Disneyland etc. We as adults, for the most part, understand that these are 

make believe figures or dressed up characters which we allow ourselves to submerge into the land of 

fantasy. So, it seems to me that perhaps some adults, for whatever reason, may want to believe in 

aliens, or dragons in their garages or whatever happens to tickle their fancy. But, Sagan seems very 

glib about those individuals and although I understand that as a scientist he requires evidence of 

dragons, aliens and such like; perhaps he should just let folk believe what they want to believe as 

long as it doesn't hurt anyone. Although at this point I guess that's a rather moot point seeings that 

Sagan is dead! 

~ Louise 

758





Subject: Teresa and Casey 

Excellent idea Teresa, and Thank you Casey for getting it on-track.... Count me in 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif 

Catch you all on the flip side, 

Ann 

_____ 



759





Subject: Journal for the week of 2/23 & 2/25 

Dear class, 

I thought that the two articles by Bijker and Latour were important and 

pertained very much so to the society that we live in today. Bijker pointed 

out that technology isn't constant evolving on its own, but rather that humans 

have to be pushing the envelope and in need of newer, better technology in 

order for the technology for all to change. Because we have come so far 

technologically and seem to have everything we could possibly need in terms of 

technology. i.e. cellular phones to keep in constant contact or the ability 

to shop for groceries via the internet we may be in danger of becoming 

technologically complacent as a whole. Latour pointed out that the three 

scientist each had a problem of not having the necessary technology readily 

available to meet there needs and a choice had to be made rather to be content 

with the existing technology and believe that what their was was the best 

possibly available. That brings me to my point. In today's society, we 

expect our computers and technology to work without problems and in the case 

our technology doesn't meet our needs we seek out someone else to fix the 

problem. Young people as a whole are so satisfied with simply watching t.v. 

or playing video games now a days that we as a people are not producing a mass 

of individuals who are willing and capable of continuing our technological 

advances but rather satisfied with our current ones. Although there are a 

handful of people out there who seek to make the next breakthrough, so many 

aren't that the next improvement for the life of humans may not come for a 

long while, or until enough people decide that Windows XP isn't cutting it for 

them or being able to administer a vaccine (Star Trek style no needles) needs 

to occur during their lifetime, and before many more people are lost to 

disease from mass vaccinations. 

Matheno 

760





Subject: JOurnal something??? 

hmmm.... i don't have much to say this week other than I haven't checked my 

email in a few days and it seems as though i've been inundated again. So I 

quickly read through most of them ;) And for the most part, I don't have 

much to say, but i have a few thoughts. Nothing too deep though. 

In reference to Karis' entry I think it depends on who you are and where you 

stand with your beliefs. Traditions these days have gone to the way side. 

So, who's to say that living with someone before your married isn't the new 

tradition of the new century? Either way, I am not against either one. I see 

your point though Karis. But it all lies within each person and their 

situation. 

My wow moment! was last week in Ochanji's class when we actually applied 

concepts from Karas class to what we were doing in Ochanji's class. Seems to 

be my only connection this semester with all of the classes. Pretty 

frustrating :( 

Today as i was sitting in church I was captured by one of the messages 

"science." I am not going to go into this just thought i'd mention it. 

Well, i said i didn't have much to say and I don't. So i'm going to go now. 

Later. 

Hey to Casey and Teresa.... sounds like a good plan. Who's starting it? 

Someone let me know. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



761





Subject: Re: JOurnal something??? 

I would be interested in hearing the "science" thing you heard in church. Feel free to post it, and I 

promise I won't respond. I really am interested though. cynthia 


hmmm.... i don't have much to say this week other than I haven't checked my 

email in a few days and it seems as though i've been inundated again. So I 



In reference to Karis' entry I think it depends on who you are and where you 

stand with your beliefs. Traditions these days have gone to the way side. 

So, who's to say that living with someone before your married isn't the new 

tradition of the new century? Either way, I am not against either one. I see 


situation. 


concepts from Karas class to what we were doing in Ochanji's class. Seems to 





Well, i said i didn't have much to say and I don't. So i'm going to go now. 

Later. 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



762






Michael-- 

Your thoughts are so well planned out and are amazing! In some sense I have 

always analyzed life and many other things, but have not conveyed any of my 

analysis' on here. Many nights I lay awake in bed analyzing and thinking 

about things, but never thought to put forth any of those thoughts out in 

the open. Just wanted to say thanks for sharing :) 






> 

>On how we treat others… 

> 

>I am always amazed at the way people treat each other, 

>in public, in relationships, and in their families. 

>Sometimes I find that I am amazed for good reasons, at 

>how incredibly loving a person may be to others and I 

>think quietly, taking note to myself, “…what a 

>beautiful person and way of living they have found.” 

>I also find examples of positive behavior and 

>treatment of others in books that I read…other 

>people’s ideas about love and how to live well are 

>fascinating to me. At other times, more often than I 

>care for, I am amazed for reasons that are not as 

>good. 

> I have always been a natural observer of things in 

>life, and that is how I have learned so much and have 

>gained the insight into life that I find valuable for 

>my life. This year has brought so many new things for 

>me thus far, and it continues to do so every day. I 

>am realizing that these new things are not necessarily 

>things that are being created now or that never 

>existed before. Rather, many of these new things that 

>I am experiencing are things that I have somehow 

>brought into light and have let into my life…they are 

>things that have always been here for the viewing and 

>experiencing, but it is only now that I am ready to 

>experience them that I am becoming aware of them. 

> I appreciate what this semester and its professors 

>are bringing to the table as food for thought. The 

>observations that I am making are beginning to take 

>different forms, different purposes, and I find that 

>there are more connections between my new observations 

>of the world around me with my own life. I find that 

>the question, “What are the data points?” constantly 

>repeats through my mind as I view the world and make 

>my connections. It has been a new way to analyze life 

>for me, being the over-analyzer that I sometimes can 

>be. 

> I have been looking lately at peoples’ relationships 

>and treatment of others on the basis of love lately, 

>my own included, and am finding out some interesting 

763


>with love: defining it, talking about it, describing 

>it, and giving and receiving it freely without 

>connections. I have sensed and felt love in the 

>simplest of situations, for example, when a friend 

>makes you a warm cup of peppermint tea with the 

>perfect amount of honey in it. I have also seen the 

>opposite, when people cannot do or say anything for 

>another without reciprocation or without their actions 

>being some way to instill a sense of control. I have 

>started with the relationships in my own life, 

>analyzing my interactions with people in my life, what 

>I think when I do things for others, trying to 

>identify where the threads of love lay. It’s a 

>humbling practice, I can assure you that, but a 

>necessary one for me, as I do not want to go through 

>life without ever realizing my ability to interact 

>with all others from a place of love and compassion. 

> There have been people in my life, whom I thought 

>loved me and who I thought were loving individuals, 

>who have exploded and attacked others without warning, 

>inflicting psychological trauma and poisoning a room 

>with negativity and dysfunction. These are painful 

>situations to experience even when the people involved 

>are total strangers, but when the situation involves 

>ones you know and love, the result for me is a sense 

>of sadness and follows with deep inner-reflection. 

>These are the situations that I pay close attention to 

>and learn so much more about others and myself from, 

>and although they are uncomfortable and sometimes even 

>seem regretful, I see them as data points to pay close 

>attention to. For myself, they are lessons about love 

>and respect for all people and allow me to stop and 

>evaluate my input, expectations, and identify what I 

>react to and why in my relations with others. It 

>helps me to remember the interconnection that I share 

>with all other people in this world, as energy and 

>matter cannot be created or removed on this planet, 

>the things that make me are what make everyone else 

>and have been a part of everything on this planet 

>since it began forming millions of years ago. Why 

>then, would people not treat others how they would 

>wish to be treated? I work on this a little each day, 

>starting with myself, moving outward from that place. 

> 

> Michael R. 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 


>Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail. 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



764





Subject: Re: Journal for the week of 2/23 & 2/25 

Hi Matheno, After reading your journal, I had to go back and re-read the articles to figure out what you 

were talking about. I guess I must have understood it differently, not necessarily correctly. I thought 

they were saying that several societal factors (social, political, economic etc) shape how technology is 

developed and that it is heterogeous, based on who needed it or was developing it. In the case of the 

flu vaccine, they were developing technology based on a medical need, but didn't have the 

fundamental technology to succeed. I don't think it was a lack of interest, they didn't know what they 

were looking for, or that the need for alternative technology was there. But, because of the failure, 

they did eventually develop the new technology and then discovered that what they thought was 

caused by bacteria was really a virus. So technology was shaped by medical, political and economic 

factors. 

ie: technology is exogenous: derived or originating externally 

Even so, I suppose a lack of interest could also act as an outside influence that shapes technology by 

way of stopping or slowing the progress. However, I don't think this is the case. We may not be 

techno nerds working to invent or discover great things, but there are lots of people who are. We just 

depend on them to do the work, so we can enjoy the benefits. 

Cynthia 

lande008 wrote: 

Dear class, 











available to meet there needs and a choice had to be made rather to be content with the existing 

technology and believe that what their was was the best 











765


to occur during their lifetime, and be fore many more people are lost to 


Matheno 

_____ 



766





Subject: Group Paper 

Hi Carrie, 

Casey sent out an e-mail with a class list. I was first on the list, so 

I wrote my piece and forwarded it to Laurie who was next on the list. 

Check the list and see where you are on it and find out if the person 

before you has received it. Hope that makes sense. See you tomorrow. 

~ Louise 


From: Carrie Gilardone [mailto:carriegilardone@hotmail.com] 



Subject: JOurnal something??? 

hmmm.... i don't have much to say this week other than I haven't checked 

my 

email in a few days and it seems as though i've been inundated again. So 

I 



In reference to Karis' entry I think it depends on who you are and where 

you 

stand with your beliefs. Traditions these days have gone to the way 

side. 

So, who's to say that living with someone before your married isn't the 

new 

tradition of the new century? Either way, I am not against either one. I 

see 


situation. 


concepts from Karas class to what we were doing in Ochanji's class. 

Seems to 





Well, i said i didn't have much to say and I don't. So i'm going to go 

now. 

Later. 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Store more e-mails with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage - 4 plans to choose 

from! 


767

768





Subject: RE: Group Paper 

thanks Louise! 



>To: 

>Subject: Group Paper 

>Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:27:33 -0800 

> 

>Hi Carrie, 

> 

>Casey sent out an e-mail with a class list. I was first on the list, so 

>I wrote my piece and forwarded it to Laurie who was next on the list. 

>Check the list and see where you are on it and find out if the person 

>before you has received it. Hope that makes sense. See you tomorrow. 

>~ Louise 

> 


>From: Carrie Gilardone [mailto:carriegilardone@hotmail.com] 



>Subject: JOurnal something??? 

> 

> 

>hmmm.... i don't have much to say this week other than I haven't checked 

>my 

>email in a few days and it seems as though i've been inundated again. So 

>I 

>quickly read through most of them ;) And for the most part, I don't have 

> 

>much to say, but i have a few thoughts. Nothing too deep though. 

> 

>In reference to Karis' entry I think it depends on who you are and where 

>you 

>stand with your beliefs. Traditions these days have gone to the way 

>side. 

>So, who's to say that living with someone before your married isn't the 

>new 

>tradition of the new century? Either way, I am not against either one. I 

>see 

>your point though Karis. But it all lies within each person and their 

>situation. 

> 

>My wow moment! was last week in Ochanji's class when we actually applied 

> 

>concepts from Karas class to what we were doing in Ochanji's class. 

>Seems to 

>be my only connection this semester with all of the classes. Pretty 

>frustrating :( 

> 

>Today as i was sitting in church I was captured by one of the messages 

>"science." I am not going to go into this just thought i'd mention it. 

> 

>Well, i said i didn't have much to say and I don't. So i'm going to go 

>now. 

>Later. 

769

>Hey to Casey and Teresa.... sounds like a good plan. Who's starting it? 

>Someone let me know. 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Store more e-mails with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage - 4 plans to choose 

>from! 


> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



770





Subject: JOrnal something...Cynthia 

Cynthia, 

Let me first explain that I started out this semester excited about science 

and thought i'd really enjoy it. WEll it hasn't exactly been the way I 

thought. So, i've been thinking a lot lately about what am i suppose to be 

getting out of all of these classes that will help me as a future teacher? 

So it was just weird today as I was sitting in church (how funny that is 

because I haven't been to church in a while) and one of the pastor's got up 

and introduced this guy (forgot his name) who happens to be a scientist. He 

got up and spoke about science and how it has influence his life and how its 

all around us. Furthermore, this guy was talking about how he always 

wondered how things worked and so when all else failed he took it apart if 

he could, or sought out someone who could answer his question. But, all 

along the answers were really with God. He knows everything. AFter all he is 

the creator of all things. Then he introduced the next song "How Great You 

Are" that we all sang. But along with the song was a movie that this dude 

put together that he couldn't even explain. It was something that you had to 

see. (I can try to explain it to you tomorrow if you want, just ask me) 

But it made me think, is God talking to me? Is he trying to answer my 

questions of science? So cynthia, that was my science thing. 




>Subject: Re: JOurnal something??? Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:12:29 -0800 

>(PST) 

> 

>I would be interested in hearing the "science" thing you heard in church. 

>Feel free to post it, and I promise I won't respond. I really am interested 

>though. cynthia 

> 

>Carrie Gilardone wrote:hmmm.... i don't have 

>much to say this week other than I haven't checked my 

>email in a few days and it seems as though i've been inundated again. So I 



> 


>you 

>stand with your beliefs. Traditions these days have gone to the way side. 

>So, who's to say that living with someone before your married isn't the new 


>see 


>situation. 

> 


>concepts from Karas class to what we were doing in Ochanji's class. Seems 

>to 



> 



771

>Well, i said i didn't have much to say and I don't. So i'm going to go now. 

>Later. 

> 



> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Store more e-mails with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage – 4 plans to choose from! 


> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Get fast, reliable access with MSN 9 Dial-up. Click here for Special Offer! 


772





Subject: Re: JOrnal something...Cynthia 

Wow, Carrie! That is very cool. Kinda funny how you picked today to go to church. And the idea that 

you can be a scientist and have God is very encouraging, regardless of religious beliefs. Maybe that 

is kinda of like the article about external forces shaping technology. Maybe for that scientist, that force 

is God, and it inspires him in his ventures. Thanks for sharing, I like to hear these kinds of stories. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 























>(PST) 

> 




> 

>Carrie Gilardone wrote:hmmm .... i don't have 




773


> 


>you 




>see 


>situation. 

> 



>to 



> 



> 


>Later. 

> 



> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



774






Sorry, Carrie, So much for my promises. I commented before I even thought about it. 


Wow, Carrie! That is very cool. Kinda funny how you picked today to go to church. And the idea 

that you can be a scientist and have God is very encouraging, regardless of religious beliefs. 

Maybe that is kinda of like the article about external forces shaping technology. Maybe for that 

scientist, that force is God, and it inspires him in his ventures. Thanks for sharing, I like to hear 

these kinds of stories. Cynthia 


Cynthia, 























>(PST) 

> 




> 

775

_____ 

>Carrie Gilardone wrote:hmmm .... i don't have 





> 


>you 




>see 


>situation. 

> 



>to 



> 



> 


>Later. 

> 



> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 





_____ 

776



777






no worries cynthia. I guess i expected you too. 




>Subject: Re: JOrnal something...Cynthia 


> 

>Sorry, Carrie, So much for my promises. I commented before I even thought 

>about it. 

> 

>Cynthia Reyes wrote:Wow, Carrie! That is very cool. 

>Kinda funny how you picked today to go to church. And the idea that you can 

>be a scientist and have God is very encouraging, regardless of religious 

>beliefs. Maybe that is kinda of like the article about external forces 

>shaping technology. Maybe for that scientist, that force is God, and it 

>inspires him in his ventures. Thanks for sharing, I like to hear these 

>kinds of stories. Cynthia 

> 

>Carrie Gilardone wrote: 

>Cynthia, 

> 

>Let me first explain that I started out this semester excited about science 

>and thought i'd really enjoy it. WEll it hasn't exactly been the way I 

>thought. So, i've been thinking a lot lately about what am i suppose to be 

>getting out of all of these classes that will help me as a future teacher? 

>So it was just weird today as I was sitting in church (how funny that is 

>because I haven't been to church in a while) and one of the pastor's got up 

>and introduced this guy (forgot his name) who happens to be a scientist. He 

>got up and spoke about science and how it has influence his life and how 

>its 

>all around us. Furthermore, this guy was talking about how he always 

>wondered how things worked and so when all else failed he took it apart if 

>he could, or sought out someone who could answer his question. But, all 

>along the answers were really with God. He knows everything. AFter all he 

>is 

>the creator of all things. Then he introduced the next song "How Great You 

>Are" that we all sang. But along with the song was a movie that this dude 

>put together that he couldn't even explain. It was something that you had 

>to 

>see. (I can try to explain it to you tomorrow if you want, just ask me) 

>But it made me think, is God talking to me? Is he trying to answer my 

>questions of science? So cynthia, that was my science thing. 

> 

> 




> >Subject: Re: JOurnal something??? Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:12:29 -0800 

> >(PST) 

> > 

> >I would be interested in hearing the "science" thing you heard in church. 

> >Feel free to post it, and I promise I won't respond. I really am 

>interested 

> >though. cynthia 

778

> >Carrie Gilardone wrote:hmmm .... i don't have 

> >much to say this week other than I haven't checked my 

> >email in a few days and it seems as though i've been inundated again. So 

>I 

> >quickly read through most of them ;) And for the most part, I don't have 

> >much to say, but i have a few thoughts. Nothing too deep though. 

> > 

> >In reference to Karis' entry I think it depends on who you are and where 

> >you 

> >stand with your beliefs. Traditions these days have gone to the way side. 

> >So, who's to say that living with someone before your married isn't the 

>new 

> >tradition of the new century? Either way, I am not against either one. I 

> >see 

> >your point though Karis. But it all lies within each person and their 

> >situation. 

> > 

> >My wow moment! was last week in Ochanji's class when we actually applied 

> >concepts from Karas class to what we were doing in Ochanji's class. Seems 

> >to 

> >be my only connection this semester with all of the classes. Pretty 

> >frustrating :( 

> > 

> >Today as i was sitting in church I was captured by one of the messages 

> >"science." I am not going to go into this just thought i'd mention it. 

> > 

> >Well, i said i didn't have much to say and I don't. So i'm going to go 

>now. 

> >Later. 

> > 

> >Hey to Casey and Teresa.... sounds like a good plan. Who's starting it? 

> >Someone let me know. 

> > 

> >_________________________________________________________________ 

> >Store more e-mails with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage – 4 plans to choose 

>from! 

> >http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200362ave/direct/01/ 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 


> >Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Get fast, reliable access with MSN 9 Dial-up. Click here for Special Offer! 


> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



779

780





Subject: Biblical principles of marriage 

This is very interesting... 

Here is a list of biblical terms that one of my brothers sent me. I am passing them on. 

Should we take the Bible word for word, or are picking and choosing what we want? 

Ann 

Check this one out ... very interesting stuff. 

Read the whole thing: 

The Presidential Prayer Team is currently urging us to "Pray for the 

President as he seeks wisdom on how to legally codify the definition of 

marriage. Pray that it will be according to Biblical principles. With many 

forces insisting on variant definitions of marriage, pray that God's Word 

and His standards will be honored by our government." 

Any good religious person believes prayer should be balanced by action. So 

here, in support of the Prayer Team's admirable goals, is a proposed 

Constitutional Amendment codifying marriage entirely on biblical 

principles: 

A. Marriage in the United States shall consist of a union between one man 

and o ne or more women (Genesis 29:17-28; II Samuel 3:2-5). 

B. Marriage shall not impede a man's right to take concubines in addition 

to his wife or wives (II Samuel 5:13; I Kings 11:3; II Chronicles 11:21). 

C. A marriage shall be considered valid only if the wife is a virgin. If 

the wife is not a virgin, she shall be executed. (Deuteronomy 22:13-21). 

D. Marriage of a believer and a non-believer shall be forbidden (Genesis 

24:3; Numbers 25:1-9; Ezra 9:12; Nehemiah 10:30). 

E. Since marriage is for life, neither this Constitution nor the 

constitution of any State, nor any state or federal law, shall be construed 

to permit divorce (Deuteronomy 22:19; Mark 10:9). 

F. If a married man dies without children, his brother shall marry the 

widow. If he refuses to marry his brother's widow or deliberately does not 

give her children, he shall pay a fine of one shoe and be otherwise 

punished 

in a manner to be determined by law (Genesis 38: 6-10; Deuteronomy 25:5-10). 

G. In lieu of marriage, if there are no acceptable men in your town, it is 

required that you get your father drunk and have sex with him (even if he 

previously offered you up as a sex toy to men young and old), tag-teaming 

with any sisters you may have. Of course, this rule applies only if you are 

female (Genesis 19:31-36). 

781

_____ 



782




To: ICP-F 

Subject: COUNT ME INTO FOR THE PAPER CASEY 

GREAT IDEA GUYS 

\JOINATHAN 

783





Subject: Re: Biblical principles of marriage 

Ann, You do realize these are not quotes from the bible? This is made up, I even checked. Cynthia 


This is very interesting... 

Here is a list of biblical terms that one of my brothers sent me. I am passing them on. 

Should we take the Bible word for word, or are picking and choosing what we want? 

Ann 

Check this one out ... very interesting stuff. 

Read the whole thing: 

The Presidential Prayer Team is currently urging us to "Pray for the 

President as he seeks wisdom on how to legally codify the definition of 

marriage. Pray that it will be according to Biblical principles. With many 

forces insisting on variant definitions of marriage, pray that God's Word 

and His standards will be honored by our government." 

Any good religious person believes prayer should be balanced by action. So 

here, in support of the Prayer Team's admirable goals, is a proposed 

Constitutional Amendment codifying marriage entirely on biblical 

principles: 

A. Marriage in the United States shall consist of a union between one man 

and o ne or more women (Genesis 29:17-28; II Samuel 3:2-5). 

B. Marriage shall not impede a man's right to take concubines in addition 

to his wife or wives (II Samuel 5:13; I Kings 11:3; II Chronicles 11:21). 

C. A marriage shall be considered valid only if the wife is a virgin. If 

the wife is not a virgin, she shall be executed. (Deuteronomy 22:13-21). 

D. Marriage of a believer and a non-believer shall be forbidden (Genesis 

24:3; Numbers 25:1-9; Ezra 9:12; Nehemiah 10:30). 

E. Since marriage is for life, neither this Constitution nor the 

constitution of any State, nor any state or federal law, shall be construed 

to permit divorce (Deuteronomy 22:19; Mark 10:9). 

F. If a married man dies without children, his brother shall marry the 

widow. If he refuses to marry his brother's widow or deliberately does not 

give her children, he shall pay a fine of one shoe and be otherwise 

punished 

in a manner to be determined by law (Genesis 38: 6-10; Deuteronomy 25:5-10). 

G. In lieu of marriage, if there are no acceptable men in your town, it is 

required that you get your father drunk and have sex with him (even if he 

previously offered you up as a sex toy to men young and old), tag-teaming 

784

_____ 

with any sisters you may have. Of course, this rule applies only if you are 

female (Genesis 19:31-36). 



_____ 



785





Subject: Journal 6: Newton's 3rd Law 

As I was flying home from the San Francisco Bay Area tonight, I was thinking 

about what I was going to write about in my journal entry for this week. I 

was thinking maybe the "Flu"...but we are all over that. So I then I was 

thinking about an issue that brings science and society together...and then 

it hit me. I was literally experiencing a huge part of science and society 

at that moment. AIRPLANE!!! I was seeing the application and connection. 

In Dr. Karas' class last week we discussed Newton's three laws. Newton's 

third law states: If two objects interact, they exert forces on one another 

that have equal size and opposite directions. This is exactly how an 

airplane works! 

I thought it was totally cool that I was making this connection. The flight 

I was on was completely full...135 passengers. At that moment, I realized 

just how much we experience science within our society every single day. I 

know it's cliché, but science is all around us. 

Poll: How many of us don't think twice before taking an airplane as a main 

mode of transportation to a far away destination? I think most of us. 

See, we don't think twice. Most of us don't think about how a plane works 

when we are on the airplane. We are not making the connection between 

science and society. Transportation is a huge part of our society. So many 

people fly every day. A century ago we were not as advanced in flying 

airplanes. If it were not for science, we would not be as advanced as we are 

in technology, transportation, medicine, etc. 

I know that I never was more consciously aware of my surroundings before 

taking this class. I can honestly say that I have become more observant. In 

fact, I told my friend about his the other day. I said that I was very 

observant. I think by now, we all should be more observant. We are 

practicing it every day, consciously or sub-consciously. 

Think about it... 


_________________________________________________________________ 



786



Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 8:20 AM 


Subject: Re: ann 

ann i do have to agree with cynthia to some degree on this one. there are SOME Biblical 

truths to only a FEW these but they are all, but one, from the Old Testament. Jesus set 

us free from the OT thus we do not abide by these rules any longer. The only verse in the 

New Testament was rewritten to no longer mean the same thing. I suggest you check your 

source and their motivation, check which version of the Bible and do NOT read these verses 

out of context as they can be construed to mean something very different. 

> 


> Date: 2004/02/29 Sun PM 11:14:11 PST 


> Subject: Biblical principles of marriage 

> 

> This is very interesting... 

> Here is a list of biblical terms that one of my brothers sent me. I am passing them on. 

> Should we take the Bible word for word, or are picking and choosing what we want? 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> Check this one out ... very interesting stuff. 

> 

> Read the whole thing: 

> 

> The Presidential Prayer Team is currently urging us to "Pray for the 

> President as he seeks wisdom on how to legally codify the definition of 

> marriage. Pray that it will be according to Biblical principles. With many 

> forces insisting on variant definitions of marriage, pray that God's Word 

> and His standards will be honored by our government." 

> 

> Any good religious person believes prayer should be balanced by action. So 

> here, in support of the Prayer Team's admirable goals, is a proposed 

> Constitutional Amendment codifying marriage entirely on biblical 

> principles: 

> 

> A. Marriage in the United States shall consist of a union between one man 

> and one or more women (Genesis 29:17-28; II Samuel 3:2-5). 

> 

> B. Marriage shall not impede a man's right to take concubines in addition 

> to his wife or wives (II Samuel 5:13; I Kings 11:3; II Chronicles 11:21). 

> 

> C. A marriage shall be considered valid only if the wife is a virgin. If 

> the wife is not a virgin, she shall be executed. (Deuteronomy 22:13-21). 

> 

> D. Marriage of a believer and a non-believer shall be forbidden (Genesis 

> 24:3; Numbers 25:1-9; Ezra 9:12; Nehemiah 10:30). 

> 

> E. Since marriage is for life, neither this Constitution nor the 

> constitution of any State, nor any state or federal law, shall be construed 

> to permit divorce (Deuteronomy 22:19; Mark 10:9). 

> 

> F. If a married man dies without children, his brother shall marry the 

> widow. If he refuses to marry his brother's widow or deliberately does not 

> give her children, he shall pay a fine of one shoe and be otherwise 

> punished 

> in a manner to be determined by law (Genesis 38:6-10; Deuteronomy 25:5-10). 

> 

> G. In lieu of marriage, if there are no acceptable men in your town, it is 

787

equired that you get your father drunk and have sex with him (even if he 

> previously offered you up as a sex toy to men young and old), tag-teaming 

> with any sisters you may have. Of course, this rule applies only if you are 

> female (Genesis 19:31-36). 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 


> Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail 

> 


788





Subject: Who would want to be president. Journal 6 

Hi class, 

This past week while reading the flu book I was very interested in the 

swine flu fiasco. It was amazing to me to see how much responsibility 

science has on the well being of the people in this nation. I have taken 

for granted this responsibility science has taken and the safety it provides 

for me and the ones I love. With so little known about the swine flu, 

president Ford with the aid of scientists made a decision to use 135 million 

dollars to vaccinate the whole nation. This was a decision that was make 

out of sheer fear that 1918 would happen all over again. The swine flu was 

unproven and so was the potential it could have on spreading and becoming an 

epidemic. President Ford made the decision to error on the side of caution 

and potentially save millions, rather than choose the route that if this flu 

didn’t spread, would allow him to save face. In thinking about this 

decision Ford had to make I couldn’t help but make the connection with a 

similar decision made by a president from our time (or at least my time). 

With the fear of terror that struck this nation after 9-11, president Bush I 

believed faced a similar dilemma. He had the responsibility of the 

protecting the safety of all the people of this nation, like Ford did. They 

both experienced a threat that could potentially devastate that safety. 

They both had to make a decision and I believe they both made a similar 

decision. President Bush chooses that he would be proactive on his pursuit 

to get rid of this threat and so did president Ford. They both made a 

decision that I would argue would be on the side of caution. They both had 

a backlash from this decision, Ford more than Bush, which was inevitable. 

No matter what decision they made they would experience criticism. With a 

presidential election in the near future it makes you wonder why anyone 

would want to take on this type of responsibility. 

I also noticed while reading the flu book that many of the scientists shared 

a love for the arts. Taubenberger composed music, while Duncan was a 

musician, and Oxford was a poet. It makes you wonder how these people with 

science minds are so easily drawn in by art. What are the data points (just 

kidding)? 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 



789






Karis, Thanks for clarifying this. I checked the references online, as I am not familiar with the quotes. 

But when I put in (example: Genesis 29: 17-28) I didn't see anything related to the quote above it. I 

checked a couple more, and still saw nothing. This might be a dumb question, but I will risk it: Is 

Genesis in the old and new testament? Maybe I was looking in the wrong one all together. One of the 

most obvious clues that these might not be authentic, is the last one. I did some other checking, and it 

looks like this is one of those things spreading on the internet by people with a particular viewpoint 

and strange sense of humor. Cynthia 


ann i do have to agree with cynthia to some degree on this one. there are SOME Biblical truths to 

only a FEW these but they are all, but one, from the Old Testament. Jesus set us free from the OT 

thus we do not abide by these rules any longer. The only verse in the New Testament was 

rewritten to no longer mean the same thing. I suggest you check your source and their motivation, 

check which version of the Bible and do NOT read these verses out of context as they can be 

construed to mean something very different. 

> 

> From: Ann Kirkendall 

> Date: 2004/02/29 Sun PM 11:14:11 PST 


> Subject: Biblical principles of marriage 

> 

> This is very interesting... 

> Here is a list of biblical terms that one of my brothers sent me. I am passing them on. 

> Should we take the Bible word for word, or are picking and choosing what we want? 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> Check this one out ... very interesting stuff. 

> 

> Read the whole thing: 

> 

> The Presidential Prayer Team is currently urging us to "Pray for the 

> President as he seeks wisdom on how to legally codify the definition of 

> marriage. Pray that it will be according to Biblical principles. With many 

> forces insisting on variant definitions of marriage, pray that God's Word 

> and His standards will be honored by our government." 

> 

> Any good religious person believes prayer should be balanced by action. So 

> here, in support of the Prayer Team's admirable goals, is a proposed 

> Constitutional Amendment codifying marriage entirely on biblical 

> principles: 

> 

> A. Marriage in the United States shall consist of a union between one man 

> and one or more women (Genesis 29:17-28; II Samuel 3:2-5). 

790

> ; B. Marriage shall not impede a man's right to take concubines in addition 

> to his wife or wives (II Samuel 5:13; I Kings 11:3; II Chronicles 11:21). 

> 

> C. A marriage shall be considered valid only if the wife is a virgin. If 

> the wife is not a virgin, she shall be executed. (Deuteronomy 22:13-21). 

> 

> D. Marriage of a believer and a non-believer shall be forbidden (Genesis 

> 24:3; Numbers 25:1-9; Ezra 9:12; Nehemiah 10:30). 

> 

> E. Since marriage is for life, neither this Constitution nor the 

> constitution of any State, nor any state or federal law, shall be construed 

> to permit divorce (Deuteronomy 22:19; Mark 10:9). 

> 

> F. If a married man dies without children, his brother shall marry the 

> widow. If he refuses to marry his brother's widow or deliberately does not 

> give her children, he shall pay a fine of one shoe and be otherwise 

> punished 

> in a manner to be det ermined by law (Genesis 38:6-10; Deuteronomy 25:5-10). 

> 

> G. In lieu of marriage, if there are no acceptable men in your town, it is 

> required that you get your father drunk and have sex with him (even if he 

> previously offered you up as a sex toy to men young and old), tag-teaming 

> with any sisters you may have. Of course, this rule applies only if you are 

> female (Genesis 19:31-36). 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


_____ 



791





Subject: Re: Re: ann 

Genesis is the first book in the Bible which is the OT 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/01 Mon AM 08:42:17 PST 


> Subject: Re: ann 

> 

> Karis, Thanks for clarifying this. I checked the references online, as I am not familiar 

with the quotes. But when I put in (example: Genesis 29: 17-28) I didn't see anything 

related to the quote above it. I checked a couple more, and still saw nothing. This might 

be a dumb question, but I will risk it: Is Genesis in the old and new testament? Maybe I 

was looking in the wrong one all together. One of the most obvious clues that these might 

not be authentic, is the last one. I did some other checking, and it looks like this is 

one of those things spreading on the internet by people with a particular viewpoint and 

strange sense of humor. Cynthia 

> 


> ann i do have to agree with cynthia to some degree on this one. there are SOME Biblical 

truths to only a FEW these but they are all, but one, from the Old Testament. Jesus set us 

free from the OT thus we do not abide by these rules any longer. The only verse in the New 

Testament was rewritten to no longer mean the same thing. I suggest you check your source 

and their motivation, check which version of the Bible and do NOT read these verses out of 

context as they can be construed to mean something very different. 

> > 

> > From: Ann Kirkendall 

> > Date: 2004/02/29 Sun PM 11:14:11 PST 


> > Subject: Biblical principles of marriage 

> > 

> > This is very interesting... 

> > Here is a list of biblical terms that one of my brothers sent me. I am passing them 

on. 

> > Should we take the Bible word for word, or are picking and choosing what we want? 

> > 

> > Ann 

> > 

> > Check this one out ... very interesting stuff. 

> > 

> > Read the whole thing: 

> > 

> > The Presidential Prayer Team is currently urging us to "Pray for the 

> > President as he seeks wisdom on how to legally codify the definition of 

> > marriage. Pray that it will be according to Biblical principles. With many 

> > forces insisting on variant definitions of marriage, pray that God's Word 

> > and His standards will be honored by our government." 

> > 

> > Any good religious person believes prayer should be balanced by action. So 

> > here, in support of the Prayer Team's admirable goals, is a proposed 

> > Constitutional Amendment codifying marriage entirely on biblical 

> > principles: 

> > 

> > A. Marriage in the United States shall consist of a union between one man 

> > and one or more women (Genesis 29:17-28; II Samuel 3:2-5). 

> > 

> > B. Marriage shall not impede a man's right to take concubines in addition 

> > to his wife or wives (II Samuel 5:13; I Kings 11:3; II Chronicles 11:21). 

792

> > C. A marriage shall be considered valid only if the wife is a virgin. If 

> > the wife is not a virgin, she shall be executed. (Deuteronomy 22:13-21). 

> > 

> > D. Marriage of a believer and a non-believer shall be forbidden (Genesis 

> > 24:3; Numbers 25:1-9; Ezra 9:12; Nehemiah 10:30). 

> > 

> > E. Since marriage is for life, neither this Constitution nor the 

> > constitution of any State, nor any state or federal law, shall be construed 

> > to permit divorce (Deuteronomy 22:19; Mark 10:9). 

> > 

> > F. If a married man dies without children, his brother shall marry the 

> > widow. If he refuses to marry his brother's widow or deliberately does not 

> > give her children, he shall pay a fine of one shoe and be otherwise 

> > punished 

> > in a manner to be determined by law (Genesis 38:6-10; Deuteronomy 25:5-10). 

> > 

> > G. In lieu of marriage, if there are no acceptable men in your town, it is 

> > required that you get your father drunk and have sex with him (even if he 

> > previously offered you up as a sex toy to men young and old), tag-teaming 

> > with any sisters you may have. Of course, this rule applies only if you are 

> > female (Genesis 19:31-36). 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > --------------------------------- 


> > Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail 

> > 

> 


> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


793





Subject: Re: Cynthia's thoughts on change 

Andy Warhol was quoted as saying, "They actually 

say that time changes things, but you actually have to 

change things yourself." I think that he was right. 

I appreciate your thoughts Cynthia, as they are very 

realistic and reasonable, and they can also be 

positive and warming. They are proof of thought beyond 

agenda or personal gain. 

In one of your correspondences with Ann, you said 

that we can be "role models." As Gandhi once said, "Be 

the change you want to see in the world." Being the 

change that you want to see really is one of the only 

succesful ways to create change in the world because 

it starts with the one and only person that we have 

any control over changing...ourselves. I think change 

does happen on a personal level and moves outward into 

the world. Hopefully others are aware enough to pick 

out little pieces of other's lives/thoughts that get 

them thinking about their own thoughts and actions. 

What better environment to provide models for 

living (acting/thinking/etc.), than a school. That is 

also why teaching is such an incredibly important and 

powerful position in society, yet so under-rated in 

its potential and importance. Yes, we do have to cover 

content and all the "required" things, but what about 

the "life stuff?" These are the things that we can 

fit into our classes only by being and acting in ways 

that set examples and allow children the opportunity 

to observe and experience them through us as their 

teachers. It is not a teacher's place to change or 

interfere with other people's ways of being, but we 

can set examples. 

Michael 

__________________________________ 




794






After reading through some of the postings this week I think Louises stood out 

the most and was right on about how Sagan wants everyone to belive what he has 

to say. Its kinda like an old saying its my way or the highway. Sagan likes to 

mess with your mind I think and dose a good job at doing it. I cant belive how 

closed minded Sagan is about people dressing up and becoming something else. 

Like Louise said he is an indivivdual that had a hard childhood with basically 

no easter bunny, tooth fairy and even Santa Claus. I think that dressing up in 

these outfits may be make beleive but to see the faces of the children that 

beleive it will make you day. I personally feel that Sagan like to look down 

on alot of people for many things he just needs to kick back and put up his 

feet get over it. 

795




To: LBST 361B 


Ok. About the homesexual topic, I feel hesitant to say something because for 

me is not easy to talk about it. In one sense I agree with those who believe 

that everyone should marry whoever they want. If others can, why can't they do 

it, right? 

My question is "what is marriage?" I think that the meaning marriage has 

evolved. For instance, my grandmother sees it as a sacred thing and divorce is 

out of the picture. She says that when someone wants to get married is a very 

serious decision. For others, living together without being legally married, 

is like being married. 

With respect to homosexual marriage, I am sorry, but I just can't picture it. 

But who am I to judge people based on their sexual orientation and on their 

decisions? If it is what they want, it is their decision. the thing is that 

they are finding so many opositions. Since heterosexual marriage has been 

there for so long, it is going to take time to accept something new. It might 

be common in other species, but in humans, the oposition will continue. 

Oh well, I got a little distracted and I lost my thought. If I remember, I 

will post it later. 

judith 

796






Okay kids, 

I must admit I haven't read a lot of the journals. I thought dancing my life 

away was much more important than school work. Don't worry I will spend 

Ochanji's class time reading all 105 of them, beasts. But here is my journal, 

I think it is from the reading for wednesday but this quote stood out during 

my half reading/half sleeping: "We tell children about Santa Claus, the Easter 

Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy for reasons we think are emotionally sound, but 

then disabuse them of these myths before they're are grown. Why retract? 

Because their well-being as adults depends on them knowing the world as it 

really is. We worry, and for good reason, about adults who still believe in 

Santa Claus" (page 207). I love this because I was so hurt when I found out 

santa claus was not real. Why? Why tell me that it is just made up, and why 

put children through this. Wh yam I still certain that I saw the easter bunny 

hopping through the woods behind our house when I was four. And why was I so 

hurt to know that these creatures are not real? I think adults tell us about 

thesecharacters because it is the adult way of pretend and wishing they were 

still kids. Kids love believe in made up friends and other people of the 

imagination, these people make the world more fun and still adults continue to 

make the world a little more fun while playing children's games of santa claus 

and the easter bunny. 

I can even remember when I was in elementary school and learning about 

Christopher Columbus and the colonization. When you are little: Columbus 

discovered America, not just America but the United States and the indians or 

should I say Native Americans and the pilgrams ate thanksgiving together and 

everyone was happy. Then in middle school, you learn that Columbus did not 

really land in the United States and there were time when the Native Americans 

and the PIlgrams did not get along, but overall everyone was happy. Then in 

high school, you learn that Columbus sailed many times landing in different 

spots each time in LAtin and South America, not even making it to United 

States. That europeans still believed that the Americas were a different 

location of India, and the NAtive AMericans were massacred and died from many 

diseases from the europeans and it just gets worst from there. Why make it so 

happy when we are young. I say either make a complete fairy tale and let me 

believe that all is right in the world or tell me exactly how it was so I 

don't feel betrayed. The end 

797



Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 12:53 PM 


Subject: Santa God 

We tell children about Santa Claus for the same reason that organized 

religion was invented: to control them. Organized religion was a way to keep 

people in control by telling them they were sacrificing their immortal souls 

by doing "bad" things (like two girls kissing each other, which I think we 

can all agree, is a very good thing). 

It is difficult to explain to a child the concept of infinity, let alone 

that they will spend that time burning and swallowing boiling acid if they 

keep hitting their brother. This is why the mythology of Santa Claus built 

up into a ferver. Originally, Santa Claus brought presents to the good 

children, and coal to the bad children. This was a way to keep kids in line 

that they could understand. However, it has lost all it's power because no 

matter how rotten and horrible a kid is, if their parents have money, 

they're still getting christmas presents. 

We can all laugh and joke about Santa Claus, but what proof does anyone have 

that God is more real? Our parents told us Santa Claus was real, we believed 

them. The bible tells you God is real, you believe it. It makes sense for a 

child to believe its parents, but why take the same leap of faith as an 

adult because some institution wrote all this stuff down thousands of years 

ago? Do people who believe in God and follow an organized religion believe 

everything people tell them? If that's the case I have to start spreading 

the word about my 14 inch genitalia. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



798





Subject: Re: Santa God 

14 inches, really? I bet you are the envy of the locker room. 


We tell children about Santa Claus for the same reason that organized 

religion was invented: to control them. Organized religion was a way to keep 

people in control by telling them they were sacrificing their immortal souls 

by doing "bad" things (like two girls kissing each other, which I think we 

can all agree, is a very good thing). 

It is difficult to explain to a child the concept of infinity, let alone 

that they will spend that time burning and swallowing boiling acid if they 

keep hitting their brother. This is why the mythology of Santa Claus built 

up into a ferver. Originally, Santa Claus brought presents to the good 

children, and coal to the bad children. This was a way to keep kids in line 

that they could understand. However, it has lost all it's power because no 

matter how rotten and horrible a kid is, if their parents ha ve money, 

they're still getting christmas presents. 

We can all laugh and joke about Santa Claus, but what proof does anyone have 

that God is more real? Our parents told us Santa Claus was real, we believed 

them. The bible tells you God is real, you believe it. It makes sense for a 

child to believe its parents, but why take the same leap of faith as an 

adult because some institution wrote all this stuff down thousands of years 

ago? Do people who believe in God and follow an organized religion believe 

everything people tell them? If that's the case I have to start spreading 

the word about my 14 inch genitalia. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



799






Maybe it is all a lesson in betrayal at a level children can handle. They need to learn that the world is 

full of people who will lie to them. This teaches children to be skeptical and think for themselves. 

Heck, if they can't believe their parents, then they better not believe anybody else. If they are smart, 

they will learn to study the data and interpret it for themselves, then base their opinions on what they 

find out. Tricky, but a pretty good (and enjoyable) way to teach a horrible concept. Cynthia 


Okay kids, 

I must admit I haven't read a lot of the journals. I thought dancing my life 

away was much more important than school work. Don't worry I will spend 

Ochanji's class time reading all 105 of them, beasts. But here is my journal, 

I think it is from the reading for wednesday but this quote stood out during 

my half reading/half sleeping: "We tell children about Santa Claus, the Easter 

Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy for reasons we think are emotionally sound, but 

then disabuse them of these myths before they're are grown. Why retract? 

Because their well-being as adults depends on them knowing the world as it 

really is. We worry, and for good reason, about adults who still believe in 

Santa Claus" (page 207). I love this because I was so hurt when I found out 

santa claus was not real. Why? Why tell me that it is just made up, and why put children 

through this. Wh yam I still certain that I saw the easter bunny 

hopping through the woods behind our house when I was four. And why was I so 

hurt to know that these creatures are not real? I think adults tell us about 

thesecharacters because it is the adult way of pretend and wishing they were 

still kids. Kids love believe in made up friends and other people of the 

imagination, these people make the world more fun and still adults continue to 

make the world a little more fun while playing children's games of santa claus 

and the easter bunny. 

I can even remember when I was in elementary school and learning about 

Christopher Columbus and the colonization. When you are little: Columbus 

discovered America, not just America but the United States and the indians or 

should I say Native Americans and the pilgrams ate thanksgiving together and 

everyone was happy. Then in middle school, you learn that Columbus did not 

reall y land in the United States and there were time when the Native Americans 

and the PIlgrams did not get along, but overall everyone was happy. Then in 

high school, you learn that Columbus sailed many times landing in different 

spots each time in LAtin and South America, not even making it to United 

States. That europeans still believed that the Americas were a different 

location of India, and the NAtive AMericans were massacred and died from many 

diseases from the europeans and it just gets worst from there. Why make it so 

happy when we are young. I say either make a complete fairy tale and let me 

believe that all is right in the world or tell me exactly how it was so I 

don't feel betrayed. The end 

800

_____ 



801





Subject: Re: Journal for the week of 2/23 & 2/25 

I agree.... now, insert the topic of "homosexual marriage" and "societial change" in that same 

argument format....that's what I am talking about... 

Ann 


Dear class, 











available to meet there needs and a choice had to be made rather to be content with the existing 

technology and believe that what their was was the best 












to occur during their lifetime, and be fore many more people are lost to 


Matheno 

_____ 



802




To: journal 

Subject: Presidential Prayer Team 

I thought I would find out what exactly the Prayer Team is. Evidently, it is a private, non-profit 

organization (not run by the president). It looks like a group that supports the president. Anyway, they 

had this quote posted on there that I thought might help explain why many people use religion to back 

their political and moral stances. 

" We've staked the whole future of American civilization not on the power of government, far from it. 

We have staked the future of all our political institutions upon the capacity of each and all of us . . . to 

Govern ourselves according to the commandments of God. The future and success of America is not 

in this Constitution, but in the laws of God upon which this Constitution is founded." 

--President James Madison 

Here is another one from Adams: 

Adams has been called “The Father of the American Revolution.” His political involvement is widely 

acknowledged and valued. But it was Adam’s Christian faith that guided his political views. His 

essay, The Rights of the Colonists was widely circulated in 1772. In it he wrote, “The right to freedom 

being the gift of the Almighty…The rights of the colonists as Christians…may be best understood by 

reading and carefully studying the institution of The Great Law Giver and Head of the Christian 

Church, which are to be found clearly written and promulgated in the New Testament.” 

This quote is posted on the site, but comes from an interview with the President and Diane Sawyer: 

PRESIDENT BUSH: I think we're all sinners. One of my favorite Bible verses says, "Why would I 

take a speck out of your eye when I have a log in my own?” (Matthew 7:3-5). And having said that, 

however, I do believe in the sanctity of marriage. ... but I don't see that as conflict with being a 

tolerant person or an understanding person. 

Definition 

sanctity [Show phonetics] 

noun 

1 the sanctity of human life/marriage, etc. when something is very important and deserves respect 

2 [U] the quality of being holy: 

the sanctity of a cemetery/tomb 

(from Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary) 

I am not writing this to back any position I take on the topic. I just thought it might be good to look at 

how the founding fathers viewed things during the time the constitution was written. The Christian 

religion was and to some extent, still is deeply imbedded in our government and political views. 

803

Depending on your beliefs, this can be good or bad. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



804





Subject: Re: Presidential Prayer Team 

sanctify, as used in the Bible, is best described as set apart for God 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/01 Mon PM 04:36:34 PST 


> Subject: Presidential Prayer Team 

> 

> I thought I would find out what exactly the Prayer Team is. Evidently, it is a private, 

non-profit organization (not run by the president). It looks like a group that supports 

the president. Anyway, they had this quote posted on there that I thought might help 

explain why many people use religion to back their political and moral stances. 

> 

> " We've staked the whole future of American civilization not on the power of government, 

far from it. We have staked the future of all our political institutions upon the capacity 

of each and all of us . . . to Govern ourselves according to the commandments of God. The 

future and success of America is not in this Constitution, but in the laws of God upon 

which this Constitution is founded." 

> --President James Madison 

> 

> Here is another one from Adams: 

> Adams has been called ?The Father of the American Revolution.? His political 

involvement is widely acknowledged and valued. But it was Adam?s Christian faith that 

guided his political views. His essay, The Rights of the Colonists was widely circulated 

in 1772. In it he wrote, ?The right to freedom being the gift of the Almighty?The rights 

of the colonists as Christians?may be best understood by reading and carefully studying 

the institution of The Great Law Giver and Head of the Christian Church, which are to be 

found clearly written and promulgated in the New Testament.? 

> 

> 

> This quote is posted on the site, but comes from an interview with the President and 

Diane Sawyer: 

> 

> PRESIDENT BUSH: I think we're all sinners. One of my favorite Bible verses says, "Why 

would I take a speck out of your eye when I have a log in my own?? (Matthew 7:3-5). And 

having said that, however, I do believe in the sanctity of marriage. ... but I don't see 

that as conflict with being a tolerant person or an understanding person. 

> Definition 

> sanctity [Show phonetics] 

> noun 

> 1 the sanctity of human life/marriage, etc. when something is very important and 

deserves respect 

> 

> 2 [U] the quality of being holy: 

> the sanctity of a cemetery/tomb 

> 

> (from Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary) 

> 

> 

> I am not writing this to back any position I take on the topic. I just thought it might 

be good to look at how the founding fathers viewed things during the time the constitution 

was written. The Christian religion was and to some extent, still is deeply imbedded in 

our government and political views. Depending on your beliefs, this can be good or bad. 

> 

> Cynthia 

> 

> 

805

> --------------------------------- 



> 


806





Subject: Re: Presidential Prayer Team 

Thanks, Karis. I knew I could count on you. Can you tell me what that would mean in the context of 

marriage? I am trying to figure all this out. Cynthia 


sanctify, as used in the Bible, is best described as set apart for God 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/01 Mon PM 04:36:34 PST 

> To: journal 

> Subject: Presidential Prayer Team 

> 

> I thought I would find out what exactly the Prayer Team is. Evidently, it is a private, non-profit 

organization (not run by the president). It looks like a group that supports the president. Anyway, 

they had this quote posted on there that I thought might help explain why many people use 

religion to back their political and moral stances. 

> 

> " We've staked the whole future of American civilization not on the power of government, far 

from it. We have staked the future of all our political institutions upon the capacity of each and all 

of us . . . to Govern ourselves according to the commandments of God. The future and success of 

America is not in this Constitution, but in the laws of God upon which this Constitution is founded." 

> --President James Madison 

> 

> Here is another one from Adams: 

> Adams has been called ?The Father of the American Revolution.? His political involvement is 

widely acknowledged and valued. But it was Adam?s Christian faith that guided his political views. 

His essay, The Rights of the Colonists was widely circulated in 1772. In it he wrote, ?The right to 

freedom being the gift of the Almighty?The rights of the colonists as Christians?may be best 

understood by reading and carefully studying the institution of The Great Law Giver and Head of 

the Christian Church, which are to be found clearly written and promulgated in the New 

Testament.? 

> 

> 

> This quote is posted on the site, but comes from an interview with the President and Diane 

Sawyer: 

> 

> PRESIDENT BUSH: I think we're all sinners. One of my favorite Bible verses says, "Why would I 

take a speck out of your eye when I have a log in my own?? (Matthew 7:3-5). And having said 

that, however, I do believe in the sanctity of marriage. ... but I don't see that as conflict with being 

a tolerant person or an understanding person. 

> Definition 

> sanctity [Show phonetics] 

> noun 

> 1 the sanctity of human life/marriage, etc. when something is very important and deserves 

respect 

807

> 2 [U] the quality of being holy: 

> the sanctity of a cemetery/tomb 

> 

> (from Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary) 

> 

> 

> I am not writing this to back any position I take on the topic. I just thought it might be good to 

look at how the founding fathers viewed things during the time the constitution was written. The 

Christian religion was and to some extent, still is deeply imbedded in our government and political 

views. Depending on your beliefs, this can be good or bad. 

> 

> Cynthia 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


_____ 



808





Subject: Re: Re: Presidential Prayer Team 

well, the same thing, that your marriage is set apart for God which means A LOT. for 

example, put God first in your marriage, follow Him and His Word, wives submit to your 

husbands, husbands love your wives as Jesus loved and gave up His life for the church, 

etc. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/01 Mon PM 05:03:55 PST 


> Subject: Re: Presidential Prayer Team 

> 

> Thanks, Karis. I knew I could count on you. Can you tell me what that would mean in the 

context of marriage? I am trying to figure all this out. Cynthia 

> 

> karisanne@adelphia.net wrote:sanctify, as used in the Bible, is best described as set 

apart for God 

> > 


> > Date: 2004/03/01 Mon PM 04:36:34 PST 

> > To: journal 

> > Subject: Presidential Prayer Team 

> > 

> > I thought I would find out what exactly the Prayer Team is. Evidently, it is a 

private, non-profit organization (not run by the president). It looks like a group that 

supports the president. Anyway, they had this quote posted on there that I thought might 

help explain why many people use religion to back their political and moral stances. 

> > 

> > " We've staked the whole future of American civilization not on the power of 

government, far from it. We have staked the future of all our political institutions upon 

the capacity of each and all of us . . . to Govern ourselves according to the commandments 

of God. The future and success of America is not in this Constitution, but in the laws of 

God upon which this Constitution is founded." 

> > --President James Madison 

> > 

> > Here is another one from Adams: 

> > Adams has been called ?The Father of the American Revolution.? His political 







> > 

> > 

> > This quote is posted on the site, but comes from an interview with the President and 

Diane Sawyer: 

> > 

> > PRESIDENT BUSH: I think we're all sinners. One of my favorite Bible verses says, "Why 

would I take a speck out of your eye when I have a log in my own?? (Matthew 7:3-5). And 

having said that, however, I do believe in the sanctity of marriage. ... but I don't see 

that as conflict with being a tolerant person or an understanding person. 

> > Definition 

> > sanctity [Show phonetics] 

> > noun 

> > 1 the sanctity of human life/marriage, etc. when something is very important and 


> > 

809

2 [U] the quality of being holy: 

> > the sanctity of a cemetery/tomb 

> > 

> > (from Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary) 

> > 

> > 

> > I am not writing this to back any position I take on the topic. I just thought it 

might be good to look at how the founding fathers viewed things during the time the 

constitution was written. The Christian religion was and to some extent, still is deeply 

imbedded in our government and political views. Depending on your beliefs, this can be 

good or bad. 

> > 

> > Cynthia 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > --------------------------------- 



> > 

> 


> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


810






OK, so is it like you are honoring him by getting married? And living your married life in a way that 

follows the word of God, for example: not cheating on your husband or wife? So, in a way, it is a 

spiritual thing that says you believe in what he stands for and this is a way to show that? Cynthia 


well, the same thing, that your marriage is set apart for God which means A LOT. for example, put 

God first in your marriage, follow Him and His Word, wives submit to your husbands, husbands 

love your wives as Jesus loved and gave up His life for the church, etc. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/01 Mon PM 05:03:55 PST 


> Subject: Re: Presidential Prayer Team 

> 

> Thanks, Karis. I knew I could count on you. Can you tell me what that would mean in the context 

of marriage? I am trying to figure all this out. Cynthia 

> 

> karisanne@adelphia.net wrote:sanctify, as used in the Bible, is best described as set apart for 

God 

> > 


> > Date: 2004/03/01 Mon PM 04:36:34 PST 

> > To: journal 

> > Subject: Presidential Pr ayer Team 

> > 

> > I thought I would find out what exactly the Prayer Team is. Evidently, it is a private, non-profit 

organization (not run by the president). It looks like a group that supports the president. Anyway, 

they had this quote posted on there that I thought might help explain why many people use 

religion to back their political and moral stances. 

> > 

> > " We've staked the whole future of American civilization not on the power of government, far 

from it. We have staked the future of all our political institutions upon the capacity of each and all 

of us . . . to Govern ourselves according to the commandments of God. The future and success of 

America is not in this Constitution, but in the laws of God upon which this Constitution is founded." 

> > --President James Madison 

> > 

> > Here is another one from Adams: 

> > Adams has been called ?The Father of the American Revolution.? His political involve ment is 

widely acknowledged and valued. But it was Adam?s Christian faith that guided his political views. 

His essay, The Rights of the Colonists was widely circulated in 1772. In it he wrote, ?The right to 

freedom being the gift of the Almighty?The rights of the colonists as Christians?may be best 

understood by reading and carefully studying the institution of The Great Law Giver and Head of 

the Christian Church, which are to be found clearly written and promulgated in the New 

Testament.? 

811

> > 

> > This quote is posted on the site, but comes from an interview with the President and Diane 

Sawyer: 

> > 

> > PRESIDENT BUSH: I think we're all sinners. One of my favorite Bible verses says, "Why 

would I take a speck out of your eye when I have a log in my own?? (Matthew 7:3-5). And having 

said that, however, I do believe in the sanctity of marriage. ... but I don't see that as conflict with 

being a tolerant person or an understanding person. 

> > Definition 

> > sanctity [Show phonetics] 

> > noun 

> > 1 the sanctity of human life/marriage, etc. when something is very important and deserves 

respect 

> > 

> > 2 [U] the quality of being holy: 

> > the sanctity of a cemetery/tomb 

> > 

> > (from Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary) 

> > 

> > 

> > I am not writing this to back any position I take on the topic. I just thought it might be good to 

look at how the founding fathers viewed things during the time the constitution was written. The 

Christian religion was and to some extent, still is deeply imbedded in our government and political 

views. Depending on your beliefs, this can be good or bad. 

> > 

> > Cynthia 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > --------------------------------- 



&g t; > 

> 


> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


_____ 



812






pretty much well said. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/01 Mon PM 05:25:07 PST 


> Subject: Re: Re: Presidential Prayer Team 

> 

> OK, so is it like you are honoring him by getting married? And living your married life 

in a way that follows the word of God, for example: not cheating on your husband or wife? 

So, in a way, it is a spiritual thing that says you believe in what he stands for and this 

is a way to show that? Cynthia 

> 

> karisanne@adelphia.net wrote:well, the same thing, that your marriage is set apart for 

God which means A LOT. for example, put God first in your marriage, follow Him and His 

Word, wives submit to your husbands, husbands love your wives as Jesus loved and gave up 

His life for the church, etc. 

> > 


> > Date: 2004/03/01 Mon PM 05:03:55 PST 


> > Subject: Re: Presidential Prayer Team 

> > 

> > Thanks, Karis. I knew I could count on you. Can you tell me what that would mean in 

the context of marriage? I am trying to figure all this out. Cynthia 

> > 

> > karisanne@adelphia.net wrote:sanctify, as used in the Bible, is best described as set 

apart for God 

> > > 

> > > From: Cynthia Reyes 

> > > Date: 2004/03/01 Mon PM 04:36:34 PST 

> > > To: journal 

> > > Subject: Presidential Prayer Team 

> > > 

> > > I thought I would find out what exactly the Prayer Team is. Evidently, it is a 

private, non-profit organization (not run by the president). It looks like a group that 

supports the president. Anyway, they had this quote posted on there that I thought might 

help explain why many people use religion to back their political and moral stances. 

> > > 

> > > " We've staked the whole future of American civilization not on the power of 

government, far from it. We have staked the future of all our political institutions upon 

the capacity of each and all of us . . . to Govern ourselves according to the commandments 

of God. The future and success of America is not in this Constitution, but in the laws of 

God upon which this Constitution is founded." 

> > > --President James Madison 

> > > 

> > > Here is another one from Adams: 

> > > Adams has been called ?The Father of the American Revolution.? His political 







> > > 

> > > 

> > > This quote is posted on the site, but comes from an interview with the President and 

813

Diane Sawyer: 

> > > 

> > > PRESIDENT BUSH: I think we're all sinners. One of my favorite Bible verses says, 

"Why would I take a speck out of your eye when I have a log in my own?? (Matthew 7:3-5). 

And having said that, however, I do believe in the sanctity of marriage. ... but I don't 

see that as conflict with being a tolerant person or an understanding person. 

> > > Definition 

> > > sanctity [Show phonetics] 

> > > noun 

> > > 1 the sanctity of human life/marriage, etc. when something is very important and 


> > > 

> > > 2 [U] the quality of being holy: 

> > > the sanctity of a cemetery/tomb 

> > > 

> > > (from Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary) 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > I am not writing this to back any position I take on the topic. I just thought it 

might be good to look at how the founding fathers viewed things during the time the 

constitution was written. The Christian religion was and to some extent, still is deeply 

imbedded in our government and political views. Depending on your beliefs, this can be 

good or bad. 

> > > 

> > > Cynthia 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > --------------------------------- 

> > > Do you Yahoo!? 

> > > Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail 

> > > 

> > 

> > -karis kroeker- 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > --------------------------------- 



> > 

> 


> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


814



Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 8:04 AM 


Subject: Paper 

Where is it. i don't think it's gonna make it around. Any ideas. Wanna start a 

second one. 

Maybe I'll do my own. Anyone need a partner. Yo Chula call me. Marin 

815





Subject: Re: Paper 

I am still waiting for the paper. Cynthia 


Where is it. i don't think it's gonna make it around. Any ideas. Wanna start a 

second one. 

Maybe I'll do my own. Anyone need a partner. Yo Chula call me. Marin 

_____ 


Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster. 

816





Subject: Good morning 

Good morning Cynthia. Marin 

817





Subject: Re: Good morning 

Hi Marin, Hope you are having a good day. I am still waiting in anticipation of the paper. 

Cynthia 


Good morning Cynthia. Marin 

_____ 



818





Subject: RE: Paper 

Just to let you all know,Mike was adding to the paper yesterday. So hopefully 

everyone else on the list will start adding to it quickly. 

Laurie :) 


>I am still waiting for the paper. Cynthia 

> 

>tinne002 wrote:Where is it. i don't think it's gonna 

make it around. Any ideas. Wanna start a 

>second one. 

>Maybe I'll do my own. Anyone need a partner. Yo Chula call me. Marin 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster. 

819





Subject: Quotes who said "Quotes"? 

Hi Cynthia, Karas, and Class, 

I realize that my subject title read: "biblical principals of marriage", but I never said that those were 

"quotes" from the bible, I said that they were terms from the bible. In other words someone's synopsis 

of how they understand those versus. 

In fact, that is a HUGE problem with the bible. There are so many GRAY areas that people DO USE 

IT for their benefit. I agree. 

One of the reasons I brought it up in class is so that we could all look at it together and discuss it, and 

learn from each other. I was kind of disappointed at the outcome of the class and that there was not 

more learning. But it did get more people talking. It seems as though there are not many people who 

want to discuss this topic on the journals. I feel like the only person I discuss this with is Cynthia. 

How can WE learn more if no one talks about it? I would say this is a big event in our current times 

shouldn't it be discussed? It's not going to go away. Why not learn more about it? 

I am frustrated and confused at how people pick and choose to use the bible for their own 

benefit. That's why I am frustrated that the president wants to use it in his decision. 

I think that people have historically as well as currently use the bible to benefit their stance on various 

positions. 

Historically, in America, were there is "liberty and justice for all" people used the bible to justify 

slavery. 

Historically, in America, were there is "liberty and justice for all" people used the bible to keep women 

from climbing up the ladder to a more equal position with men. 

Currently, in America, were there is "liberty and justice for all" people are using the bible to keep 

homosexuals couples (two consenting and loving adults) from having the option to marry. 

I know the topic of homosexuality is a difficult topic to discuss; but the only way to make it less difficult 

is to bring it "out of the closet" in a sense, and let the light cast away all the shadows of 

misconceptions about it. I think it has been such a long time since I first dealt with this with my sister 

and my family, that I have forgotten that uncomfortable step in thinking that people must go through. 

It's like jumping from one rooftop to the one next to it. When you look down, it's scary. You really 

want to stay on the roof where you are already because it is what you are used to. But, once you are 

brave enough and you jump, you see that it was not so bad after all. And you can't see why you 

hesitated for so long? I am already on the other rooftop trying to let you guys know that it's o.k., it just 

looks scarier than it actually is. 

I can only imagine the powerful feelings (good and bad) that rushed through the veins of all those 

courageous people in our not to distance past who stood up for what they believed in. They stood up 

against the norms of society and they pushed the envelope until in tore out of the confines that 

promoted these injustices. And, if they had not of done this, would any of us women be attending 

820

college, or any "Negros" for that matter, or would we even have names such as "African American" 

etc.? 

This is our time! (mine as well as yours)!!! Our time to be written about in future history books, our 

time to stand up for what we believe in!! This is our time to look at both sides of the coin and to 

make a decision for ourselves as to what's right and wrong. It is in this sense that I wrote, 

"KNOWLEDGE IS POWER!" in a past journal posting. If you have knowledge, people are less likely 

to be able to pull the wool over your eyes. Dissect the misconceptions and discover the truths. 

I am not against people following a religion. I believe everyone should be able to live their lives the 

way they chose, as long as it is not hurting anyone. Let homosexuals have the same rights available 

so that they have a choice of marriage (or an equal union- which does not currently exist). 

I get angry when I see the president trying to use "religion" to form his decision on a constitutional 

amendment to band homosexual marriage because there is so much GRAY area. I think he needs to 

look at the constitution and make sure that America is standing for what America claims it stands for 

"liberty and justice for all"! It seems as though what he is trying to do is enforce "liberty and justice for 

heterosexuals", and that makes me frustrated. 

I am not anyones enemy or some extreme parasite that has latched onto cohort f, "it's Me Ann!", I just 

want to explore issues and learn from one another. I want to know the truth. If cohort f was like the 

Justice League and everyone joined forces with their life experiences and their personal knowledge, 

just think of what powerful "Super Heros" we would be!!!! Come on..... Fly with with me.... Learn 

with me.... I don't have all the answers by myself..... 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gifYour fellow explorer, Ann 

_____ 



821





Subject: A GOOD THOUGHT 

Dear Class, 

Here is something I found written by Charles Sanders Peirce. I wanted to pass on to my fellow 

explorers. 

"There is one thing even more vital to science than intelligent methods; and that 

is, the sincere desire to find out the truth, whatever it may be." 


_____ 



822





Subject: Re: Paper 

its coming round prettty fast, be patient my friend. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/02 Tue AM 08:04:25 PST 


> Subject: Paper 

> 

> Where is it. i don't think it's gonna make it around. Any ideas. Wanna start a 

> second one. 

> Maybe I'll do my own. Anyone need a partner. Yo Chula call me. Marin 

> 

> 


823





Subject: Re: Quotes who said "Quotes"? 

ok ann, i too think its disappointing that people manipulate and take things out of 

context or change things in the Bible. thats why i find it soooo important to read the 

Bible for yourself, go directly to the source rather than through hearsay. it doesnt 

matter what the source, Bible or research book, its important to read the source and 

interpret it for yourself. 

i also was a little bummed at how the class discussion went only b/c i felt like nothing 

was accomplished and we all interrupted each other, ignoring the point previoulsy made. 

next time i think ill pass around my umbrella so that only the person with the umbrella 

can talk. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/02 Tue AM 09:03:54 PST 


> Subject: Quotes who said "Quotes"? 

> 

> Hi Cynthia, Karas, and Class, 

> 

> I realize that my subject title read: "biblical principals of marriage", but I never 

said that those were "quotes" from the bible, I said that they were terms from the bible. 

In other words someone's synopsis of how they understand those versus. 

> In fact, that is a HUGE problem with the bible. There are so many GRAY areas that 

people DO USE IT for their benefit. I agree. 

> 

> One of the reasons I brought it up in class is so that we could all look at it together 

and discuss it, and learn from each other. I was kind of disappointed at the outcome of 

the class and that there was not more learning. But it did get more people talking. It 

seems as though there are not many people who want to discuss this topic on the journals. 

I feel like the only person I discuss this with is Cynthia. How can WE learn more if no 

one talks about it? I would say this is a big event in our current times shouldn't it be 

discussed? It's not going to go away. Why not learn more about it? 

> 

> I am frustrated and confused at how people pick and choose to use the bible for their 

own benefit. That's why I am frustrated that the president wants to use it in his 

decision. 

> 

> I think that people have historically as well as currently use the bible to benefit 

their stance on various positions. 

> 

> Historically, in America, were there is "liberty and justice for all" people used the 

bible to justify slavery. 

> 

> Historically, in America, were there is "liberty and justice for all" people used the 

bible to keep women from climbing up the ladder to a more equal position with men. 

> 

> Currently, in America, were there is "liberty and justice for all" people are using the 

bible to keep homosexuals couples (two consenting and loving adults) from having the 

option to marry. 

> 

> I know the topic of homosexuality is a difficult topic to discuss; but the only way to 

make it less difficult is to bring it "out of the closet" in a sense, and let the light 

cast away all the shadows of misconceptions about it. I think it has been such a long 

time since I first dealt with this with my sister and my family, that I have forgotten 

that uncomfortable step in thinking that people must go through. It's like jumping from 

one rooftop to the one next to it. When you look down, it's scary. You really want to 

824

stay on the roof where you are already because it is what you are used to. But, once you 

are brave enough and you jump, you see that it was not so bad after all. And you can't 

see why you hesitated for so long? I am already on the other rooftop trying to let you 

guys know that it's o.k., it just looks scarier than it actually is. 

> 

> I can only imagine the powerful feelings (good and bad) that rushed through the veins of 

all those courageous people in our not to distance past who stood up for what they 

believed in. They stood up against the norms of society and they pushed the envelope 

until in tore out of the confines that promoted these injustices. And, if they had not of 

done this, would any of us women be attending college, or any "Negros" for that matter, or 

would we even have names such as "African American" etc.? 

> 

> This is our time! (mine as well as yours)!!! Our time to be written about in future 

history books, our time to stand up for what we believe in!! This is our time to look at 

both sides of the coin and to make a decision for ourselves as to what's right and wrong. 

It is in this sense that I wrote, "KNOWLEDGE IS POWER!" in a past journal posting. If you 

have knowledge, people are less likely to be able to pull the wool over your eyes. 

Dissect the misconceptions and discover the truths. 

> 

> I am not against people following a religion. I believe everyone should be able to live 

their lives the way they chose, as long as it is not hurting anyone. Let homosexuals have 

the same rights available so that they have a choice of marriage (or an equal union- which 

does not currently exist). 

> 

> I get angry when I see the president trying to use "religion" to form his decision on a 

constitutional amendment to band homosexual marriage because there is so much GRAY area. 

I think he needs to look at the constitution and make sure that America is standing for 

what America claims it stands for "liberty and justice for all"! It seems as though what 

he is trying to do is enforce "liberty and justice for heterosexuals", and that makes me 

frustrated. 

> 

> I am not anyones enemy or some extreme parasite that has latched onto cohort f, "it's Me 

Ann!", I just want to explore issues and learn from one another. I want to know the 

truth. If cohort f was like the Justice League and everyone joined forces with their life 

experiences and their personal knowledge, just think of what powerful "Super Heros" we 

would be!!!! Come on..... Fly with with me.... Learn with me.... I don't have all the 

answers by myself..... 

> 

> Your fellow explorer, Ann 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 


> Yahoo! Search - Find what you?re looking for faster. 

> 


825






Subject: Journal 6/Marriage sucks and God was a Hippie 

First of all, I want to thank Ann for bringing out a subject that is fun and 

interesting to talk about. Many people have various opinions on gay marriages 

and god's role in that relationship while President Bush is trying to gain 

extra votes needed to win an election. Did you ever wonder why gasoline prices 

were at a all time high since President Bush was in office? Perhaps it is all 

the contributions from the oil companies to his campaign and it is his way of 

saying thank you to them - not us. Anyway, after two failed marriages, I have 

come to the conclusion that marriage sucks no matter what sex your other 

partner is. If they ever promise you that they will change - run, no matter 

what, run. 

I was trying to figure out where in the bible god makes reference to marriage. 

I read a lot about consummating a relationship, but the actual ceremony seems 

to allude me. Then I remembered that god has long hair, has a beard, and wears 

long robes complete with a hallucinogenic halo around his head and I came to 

the conclusion that god was a hippie and believed in free love-no commitment 

required. After all, where in the bible does it say Adam and Eve were married? 

826





Subject: Journal 6000, something to chew on. 

Hey class, 

I have been sick and very tired, but I am trying to keep up with you guys. 

Hope you all enjoy, see you tomorrow. 

Within each day is a chance to decide what path to take. Although I call 

this chance a decision I do not want to elude that there are societal 

factors which come into to play within these decisions. When reading Chapter 

19 of Sagan I began to think about that amount of time most people think 

about “learning how to learn,” with relation to ourselves in the cohort. One 

would think that we, as a group, would be the zenith of people learning how 

to learn, in that we are preparing ourselves to learn how to be teachers 

within a society of quick change and diversity. Our thoughts as future 

teachers are expected to be inclusive to all traditions, which include, 

ethnicities, cultures, religions and ideologies, but a tradition is often in 

direct opposition of change. Therefore there seems to be an inherent 

struggle between an individuals traditions and the institution of education 

within the United States if designed as an institution of change. 

What are the implications of this? 

One may be able to see that if “what needs to be learned” is in constant 

development and if people are not challenged to disavow their traditions, 

movement is quickly staggered, if not halted all together. Is it then 

important to realize the necessity, within a society so culturally diverse, 

for a common based instruction in which the teacher is not emotional tied to 

one instruction or the next. It may be only within this type of instruction 

that bias can be absolved from the teacher’s personal views. 

Was this the basis for standard based instruction? 

One may want to conclude that it is. It may be the only way in which a 

teacher can propagate knowledge based on a society’s development without 

facing public persecution due to the traditions of a diverse society. In 

fact the standards are written as if they were a legal document and for some 

they have become just that? 

Is the push of science standards connected to the governments need for 

scientific development? Is this in direct conflict with traditional roles of 

religion? How does this truly support inclusive education? Are people, staff 

and students, becoming alienated within their own schools, due to their 

views? Is there any way to prevent this? 

_________________________________________________________________ 



827




To: journal 

Subject: FLU PAPER 

Ok People, Joey is at work all day, so I just sent the paper on to Judith. Cynthia 

_____ 



828



Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 12:13 PM 


Subject: Re: FLU PAPER 

WHAT TIME IS JUDITH AT SCHOOL TIL? 

829





Subject: Re: Journal 6000, something to chew on. 

You make some very good points, Robert. I think education has gotten away from actually teaching 

(academics), and spend a lot of time indoctrinating students on social issues. At one time, that was 

the parent's job. But the education system seems to feel the need to bypass parents so they can 

inform them about their views on sex, religion, diversity etc. No wonder kids can't read and add. If 

teachers would just demand respect (regardless of the issue) for and from everyone, leave the social 

issues to the parents, then they could get on with educating our students so they are capable of being 

productive citizens. That was the original intent, I believe. We still need that tax base of middle class 

workers, lol. Cynthia 


Hey class, 

I have been sick and very tired, but I am trying to keep up with you guys. 

Hope you all enjoy, see you tomorrow. 

Within each day is a chance to decide what path to take. Although I call 

this chance a decision I do not want to elude that there are societal 

factors which come into to play within these decisions. When reading Chapter 

19 of Sagan I began to think about that amount of time most people think 

about “learning how to learn,” with relation to ourselves in the cohort. One 

would think that we, as a group, would be the zenith of people learning how 

to learn, in that we are preparing ourselves to learn how to be teachers 

within a society of quick change and diversity. Our thoughts as future 

teachers are expected to be inclusive to all traditions, which include, 

ethnicities, cultures, religions and ideologies, but a tradition is often in 

direct opposition of change. Therefore there seems to be an inherent 

struggle between an individuals traditions and the institution of education 

within the United States if designed as an institution of change. 

What are the implications of this? 

One may be able to see that if “what needs to be learned” is in constant 

development and if people are not challenged to disavow their traditions, 

movement is quickly staggered, if not halted all together. Is it then 

important to realize the necessity, within a society so culturally diverse, 

for a common based instruction in which the teacher is not emotional tied to 

one instruction or the next. It may be only within this type of instruction 

that bias can be absolved from the teacher’s personal views. 

Was this the basis for standard based instruction? 

One may want to conclude that it is. It may be the only way in which a 

teacher can propagate kn owledge based on a society’s development without 

facing public persecution due to the traditions of a diverse society. In 

fact the standards are written as if they were a legal document and for some 

830

they have become just that? 

Is the push of science standards connected to the governments need for 

scientific development? Is this in direct conflict with traditional roles of 

religion? How does this truly support inclusive education? Are people, staff 

and students, becoming alienated within their own schools, due to their 

views? Is there any way to prevent this? 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



831





Subject: Re: FLU PAPER 

I have no idea, I don't think the person who answered the phone speaks much english, and my 

spanish is even worse, so I didn't try to find out. Geez, if only foreign language classes really taught 

us how to speak another language!!! Cynthia 


WHAT TIME IS JUDITH AT SCHOOL TIL? 

_____ 



832





Subject: Wait time 

Dear Class, 

I am so glad to hear more people expressing their thoughts. I feel like we are at the threshold of 

beginning to learn from one another. I want to apply some wait time now. 

I'm listening and learning.... 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gifYour fellow explorer, Ann 

_____ 



833





Subject: PAPER TRACKER 2000 

Hi anxious paper waiters, me included. 

I am in the library right now, but I am heading home soon. I will be their (at home) checking on-line 

periodically throughout the day. So the people before me are Alexandra, Chula, and Marin. So let 

me know when it's coming... Marin, call me on my cell phone (760) 855-6343 otherwise I won't be 

able to get your call (I have dial-up a connection) 


Ann 

_____ 



834




To: ICP-F 

Subject: great job!!! 

Wow guys, 

I am impressed. For as crazy as this could be, y'all are on top of this. So 

far so good!! Keep up the good work. Also, I will make a cover page for the 

paper. Is there anyone who choose not to write in this paper? I do not want to 

include you in the paper then. Please let me know. Have a wonderful day kids!! 

Teresa 

>Hi anxious paper waiters, me included. 

> 

>I am in the library right now, but I am heading home soon. I will be their 

(at home) checking on-line periodically throughout the day. So the people 

before me are Alexandra, Chula, and Marin. So let me know when it's coming... 

Marin, call me on my cell phone (760) 855-6343 otherwise I won't be able to 

get your call (I have dial-up a connection) 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



835





Subject: thought about ceremonial law and gay marriage from the Bible 

Importance: High 

I know that the first impression someone will get is the length of this email. 

It is very long, but I can guarantee any of you in class that all of it is 

true. Therefore, the TRUTH is potrayed here in this email. Please if you have 

any interest, read some parts of this email, because it may just shed a light 

on your own understanding. Thank you! Laurie :) 

--> First of all, most of the information from the Biblical principles of 

marriage email is from the Old Testament. This means that the people of Israel 

were following the Old Testament Ceremonial Law because they were doing what 

God had told them to do until the coming of the Messiah. I had a chance to 

meet with my dad who, if any of you don¡¦t know, is a pastor and we went 

through some Bible verses. We found some verses that explained why there was a 

change from the law in the Old Testament to the law in the New Testament. 

To explain this the Bible clearly says, ¡§What I mean is this: The law, 

introduced 430 years later, does not set aside the covenant previously 

established by God and thus do away with the promise. For if the inheritance 

depends on the law, then it no longer depends on a promise; but God in his 

grace gave it to Abraham through a promise. 

What then, was the purpose of the law? It was added because of 

transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come. The law 

was put into effect through angels by a mediator. A mediator, however, does 

not represent just one party; but God is one. 

Is the law, therefore, opposed to the promises of God? Absolutely not! For 

if a law had been given that could impart life, then righteousness would 

certainly have come by the law. But the Scripture declares that the whole 

world is a prisoner of sin, so that what was promised, being given through 

faith in Jesus Christ, might been given to those who believe. 

Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until 

faith should be revealed. So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ 

that we might be justifies by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer 

under the supervision of the law.¡¨ (Galatians 3: 17-25) 

--> Then the Ten Commandments were brought to the people and this was the 

start of the New Testament Law. This law would ensure and protect the future 

of Israel. 

---------------------------------------------------------------------- 

--> Another key issue is gay marriage. Again, the bible verses used in the 

Bible verses email were clearly out of context, and to do that with the Bible 

is practically destroying its validity. I had found some Bible verses that are 

not out of context and are very true to their meaning in this case: 

„h Hebrews 13:4¡X¡§Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed 

kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.¡¨ 

„h (Before this verse, the Bible is talking about Adam and Eve and how Eve was 

made from Adam¡¦s rib) Genesis 2:24 ¡V For this reason a man will leave his 

father and mother and will be untied to his wife, and they will become one 

flesh.¡¨„³ Husband and wife, no other combinations like man and man or woman 

and woman. 

„h Romans 7:2 ¡V ¡§¡Kby law a married woman is bound to her husband as long 

as he is alive, but if her husband dies, she is released from the law of 

836

marriage. So then, if she marries another man while her husband is still 

alive, she is called an adulteress, But if her husband dies, she is released 

from that law and is not an adulteress, even though she marries another man.¡¨ 

„³ Meaning she is marrying a man not another woman. 

„h 1 Corinthians 7:14, 39 ¡V For the unbelieving husband has been sanctified 

through his wife, and the unbelieving wife has been sanctified through her 

believing husband. 

Otherwise your children would be unclean, but as it is, they are holy.¡¨ „³ 

Again husband and wife. ¡§A woman is bound to her husband as long as he lives. 

But if her husband dies, she is free to marry anyone she wishes, but he must 

belong to the Lord. In my judgment, she is happier if she stays as she is--and 

I think that I too have the spirit of God.¡¨ „³ Paul writes that a woman only 

can remarry another man if her husband dies. 

„h (Before this verse, the Bible is talking about how all of us should be 

¡§living as Children of Light¡¨. In other words, go in life the way God would 

want you to) Ephesians 5:21¡X¡§Submit to one another out of reverence for 

Christ. Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord. For the husband is the 

head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is 

the Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit 

to their husbands in everything. Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ 

loved the church and gave himself up for her to make her holy, cleansing her 

by the washing with water through the word, and present her to himself as a 

radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or other blemish, but holy and 

blameless. In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own 

bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. After all, no one ever hated his 

own body, but he feeds and cares for it, just as Christ does the church¡Xfor 

we are members of his body.¡¨ It then goes states the same verse of Genesis 

2:24. „³ The Bible is saying that Christ sees the relationship of marriage 

between a husband and his wife as very serious relationship. Christ even 

compares the relationship a husband and wife has, to Him and the church. 

„h Romans 1:24-27 ¡V ¡§Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of 

their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one 

another. They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served 

God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator 

¡Xwho is forever praised. Amen. Because of this, God gave them over to 

shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural 

ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and 

were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with 

other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.¡¨ 

„³ The Bible is saying that God let them do their homosexual sins to therefore 

let them go to the extreme so that they would eventually learn that what they 

were doing was wrong. God was obviously sadden and hurt to let his people go 

through this, but he had to let them go through with what they were doing 

because they would only learn from going to the extreme. 

„h 1 Corinthians 6:19-20¡X¡§Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a man 

commits are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own 

body. Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in 

you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; you were bought at 

a price. Therefore honor God with your body.¡¨„³ Paul is saying that your body 

is like a temple of God. God died on the cross in order to repay for our sins, 

and therefore that was to shoe that our bodies were bought at a price, a high 

price. So we should respect God by respecting our own bodies. 

„h Galatians 5:19-21¡XThe acts of sinful nature are obvious: sexual 

immorality, impurity, and debauchery(meantions more acts of sins)¡K¡K.I warn 

you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the 

kingdom of God.¡¨„³ The Bible is clearly saying that whoever is doing sexual 

immoral and impure acts will not be able to go to Heaven. But thank goodness 

that God had died on the cross, so that if anyone does commit these kinds of 

837

sins, he or she can come to God in prayer and ask God to forgive them. After 

that God is expecting the person to never commit that act of sin again and 

this would help change their lives in the direction in which God would want 

them to do. 

„h (This verse is talking about the city of Sodom and Gomorrah. Two angels had 

gone to the city and Lot recognized what they were and bowed done out of 

respect to them. He then let them stay in his house over night. Genesis 19:3-5 

¡X¡§But he [Lot] so strongly that they did go with him and entered his house. 

He prepared a meal for them, baking bread without yeast, and they ate. Before 

they had gone to bed, all the men from every part of the city of Sodom¡Xboth 

young and old¡Xsurrounged the house. They called Lot, ¡¥Where are the men who 

cam to you tonight? Bring them out ot us so that we can have sex with them.¡¦ 

Lot went outside to meet them and shut the door behind him and said, ¡¥No, my 

friends. Don¡¦t do this wicked thing¡Kfor they have come under the protection 

of my roof.¡¦ ¡¥Get out of our way,¡¦they replied. And they sqid, ¡¥This 

fellowcame here as an alien, and now he wants to play the judge! We¡¦ll treat 

you worse than them.¡¦ They kept bringing pressure on Lot and moves forward to 

break down the door. The men inside (which were the two angels) reached out 

and pulled Lot back into the house and shut the door. Then they struck the men 

who were at the door of the house, young and old with blindness so that they 

could not find the door.¡¨ Later on the angels tell Lot to escape the city 

with his family and tell anyone else there that he knew, and tell them to 

leave as well. By the time Lot and his family left, the city was rained down 

by burning sulfur by the Lord and so everyone living there and vegetation as 

well, were destroyed.„³ This simple story talks about how in a city there 

people who were homosexuals and they were wanting to have sex with the angles. 

God doesn¡¦t approve of this sexual immoral sin and therefore had the city 

destroyed. 

-->Interesting fact: the city¡¦s name Sodom comes from the word sodomy which 

means having sexual relations with the same sex and/or animals. 

838





Subject: Re: thought about ceremonial law and gay marriage from the Bible 

Laurie, Thanks for making such an effort!! I like how you posted the quote, then gave explanations. I 

appreciate you taking the time to show us why some people might not agree with the current issue. 

Cynthia 


I know that the first impression someone will get is the length of this email. 

It is very long, but I can guarantee any of you in class that all of it is 

true. Therefore, the TRUTH is potrayed here in this email. Please if you have 

any interest, read some parts of this email, because it may just shed a light 

on your own understanding. Thank you! Laurie :) 

--> First of all, most of the information from the Biblical principles of 

marriage email is from the Old Testament. This means that the people of Israel 

were following the Old Testament Ceremonial Law because they were doing what 

God had told them to do until the coming of the Messiah. I had a chance to 

meet with my dad who, if any of you don¡¦t know, is a pastor and we went 

through some Bible verses. We found some verses that explained why there was a 

change from the law in t he Old Testament to the law in the New Testament. 

To explain this the Bible clearly says, ¡§What I mean is this: The law, 

introduced 430 years later, does not set aside the covenant previously 

established by God and thus do away with the promise. For if the inheritance 

depends on the law, then it no longer depends on a promise; but God in his 

grace gave it to Abraham through a promise. 

What then, was the purpose of the law? It was added because of 

transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come. The law 

was put into effect through angels by a mediator. A mediator, however, does 

not represent just one party; but God is one. 

Is the law, therefore, opposed to the promises of God? Absolutely not! For 

if a law had been given that could impart life, then righteousness would 

certainly have come by the law. But the Scripture declares that the whole 

world is a prisoner of sin, so that what was promised, being given thr ough 

faith in Jesus Christ, might been given to those who believe. 

Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until 

faith should be revealed. So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ 

that we might be justifies by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer 

under the supervision of the law.¡¨ (Galatians 3: 17-25) 

--> Then the Ten Commandments were brought to the people and this was the 

start of the New Testament Law. This law would ensure and protect the future 

of Israel. 

---------------------------------------------------------------------- 

--> Another key issue is gay marriage. Again, the bible verses used in the 

Bible verses email were clearly out of context, and to do that with the Bible 

839

is practically destroying its validity. I had found some Bible verses that are 

not out of context and are very true to their meaning in this case: 

„h Hebrews 13:4¡X¡§Marriage should be hono red by all, and the marriage bed 

kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.¡¨ 

„h (Before this verse, the Bible is talking about Adam and Eve and how Eve was 

made from Adam¡¦s rib) Genesis 2:24 ¡V For this reason a man will leave his 

father and mother and will be untied to his wife, and they will become one 

flesh.¡¨„³ Husband and wife, no other combinations like man and man or woman 

and woman. 

„h Romans 7:2 ¡V ¡§¡Kby law a married woman is bound to her husband as long 

as he is alive, but if her husband dies, she is released from the law of 

marriage. So then, if she marries another man while her husband is still 

alive, she is called an adulteress, But if her husband dies, she is released 

from that law and is not an adulteress, even though she marries another man.¡¨ 

„³ Meaning she is marrying a man not another woman. 

„h 1 Corinthians 7:14, 39 ¡V For the unbelieving husband has been sanctified 

through his wife, and the unbelieving wife has been sanctified through her 

believing husband. 

Otherwise your children would be unclean, but as it is, they are holy.¡¨ „³ 

Again husband and wife. ¡§A woman is bound to her husband as long as he lives. 

But if her husband dies, she is free to marry anyone she wishes, but he must 

belong to the Lord. In my judgment, she is happier if she stays as she is--and 

I think that I too have the spirit of God.¡¨ „³ Paul writes that a woman only 

can remarry another man if her husband dies. 

„h (Before this verse, the Bible is talking about how all of us should be 

¡§living as Children of Light¡¨. In other words, go in life the way God would 

want you to) Ephesians 5:21¡X¡§Submit to one another out of reverence for 

Christ. Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord. For the husband is the 

head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is 

the Savior. Now as th e church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit 

to their husbands in everything. Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ 

loved the church and gave himself up for her to make her holy, cleansing her 

by the washing with water through the word, and present her to himself as a 

radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or other blemish, but holy and 

blameless. In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own 

bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. After all, no one ever hated his 

own body, but he feeds and cares for it, just as Christ does the church¡Xfor 

we are members of his body.¡¨ It then goes states the same verse of Genesis 

2:24. „³ The Bible is saying that Christ sees the relationship of marriage 

between a husband and his wife as very serious relationship. Christ even 

compares the relationship a husband and wife has, to Him and the church. 

„h Romans 1:24-27 ¡V ¡§Therefore God gave them over in the sin ful desires of 

their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one 

another. They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served 

God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator 

¡Xwho is forever praised. Amen. Because of this, God gave them over to 

shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural 

840

ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and 

were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with 

other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.¡¨ 

„³ The Bible is saying that God let them do their homosexual sins to therefore 

let them go to the extreme so that they would eventually learn that what they 

were doing was wrong. God was obviously sadden and hurt to let his people go 

through this, but he had to let them go through with what they were doing 

because they would only learn from going to the extreme. 

„h 1 Corinthians 6:19-20¡X¡§Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a man 

commits are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own 

body. Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in 

you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; you were bought at 

a price. Therefore honor God with your body.¡¨„³ Paul is saying that your body 

is like a temple of God. God died on the cross in order to repay for our sins, 

and therefore that was to shoe that our bodies were bought at a price, a high 

price. So we should respect God by respecting our own bodies. 

„h Galatians 5:19-21¡XThe acts of sinful nature are obvious: sexual 

immorality, impurity, and debauchery(meantions more acts of sins)¡K¡K.I warn 

you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the 

kingdom of God.¡¨„³ The Bible is clearly saying that whoever is doing sexual 

immoral and impure acts will not be able to go to Heaven. But thank goodness 

that God had died on the cross, so that if anyone does commit these kinds of 

sins, he or she can come to God in prayer and ask God to forgive them. After 

that God is expecting the person to never commit that act of sin again and 

this would help change their lives in the direction in which God would want 

them to do. 

„h (This verse is talking about the city of Sodom and Gomorrah. Two angels had 

gone to the city and Lot recognized what they were and bowed done out of 

respect to them. He then let them stay in his house over night. Genesis 19:3-5 

¡X¡§But he [Lot] so strongly that they did go with him and entered his house. 

He prepared a meal for them, baking bread without yeast, and they ate. Before 

they had gone to bed, all the men from every part of the city of Sodom¡Xboth 

young and old¡Xsurrounged the house. They called Lot, ¡¥Where are the men who 

cam to you tonight? Bring them out ot us so that we can have sex with them.¡¦ 

Lot went outside to meet them and shut the door behind him and said, ¡¥No, my 

friends. Don¡¦t do this wicked thing¡Kfor they have come under the protection 

of my roof.¡¦ ¡¥Get out of our way,¡¦they replied. And they sqid, ¡¥This 

fellowcame here as an alien, and now he wants to play the judge! We¡¦ll treat 

you worse than them.¡¦ They kept bringing pressure on Lot and moves forward to 

break down the door. The men inside (which were the two angels) reached out 

and pulled Lot back into the house and shut the door. Then they struck the men 

who were at the door of the house, young and old with blindness so that they 

could not find the door.¡¨ Later on the angels tell Lot to escape the city 

with his family and tell anyone else there that he knew, and tell them to 

leave as well. By the time Lot and his family left, the city was rained down 

by burning sulfur by th e Lord and so everyone living there and vegetation as 

well, were destroyed.„³ This simple story talks about how in a city there 

people who were homosexuals and they were wanting to have sex with the angles. 

God doesn¡¦t approve of this sexual immoral sin and therefore had the city 

destroyed. 

841

-->Interesting fact: the city¡¦s name Sodom comes from the word sodomy which 

means having sexual relations with the same sex and/or animals. 

_____ 



842




To: journal 

Subject: Re: Slander 

Jane said: Did you ever wonder why gasoline prices 



saying thank you to them - not us. 

Recently, it was reported that OPEC was keeping the price of oil at a certain level (for their own 

profit, not ours). The President does not control OPEC. 

The United States averaged total gross oil (crude and products) imports of an estimated 11.4 

MMBD during 2002, representing around 58% of total U.S. oil demand. Around two-fifths of this oil 

came from OPEC nations, with Persian Gulf sources accounting for about one-fifth of total U.S. oil 

imports. Overall, the top suppliers of oil to the United States during 2002 were Canada (1.9 MMBD), 

Saudi Arabia (1.6 MMBD), Mexico (1.5 MMBD), and Venezuela (1.4 MMBD). 

Venezuela has had worker strikes that have affected the price of their oil. The war in Iraq has also 

increased the price of oil. There probably isn't a political conspiracy among the President and his 

"friends". 

Jane, you have a right to dislike the president, but at least try to back up your comments with some 

data. 

Cynthia 

slander [Show phonetics] 

noun [C or U] 

a false spoken statement about someone which damages their reputation, or the making of such a 

statement: 

_____ 



843





Subject: jonathan's email address 

Jonathan, 

I am trying to email you the paper but I don't have the right email address. 

I also tried calling your house but there is no answer. 

call me, 

Karla 

844





Subject: Re: jonathan's email address 

Jonathon's e-mail address in griff030@csusm.edu 

845





Subject: Me wrong 

listen to casey I had it wrong. griff030 Maybe. I duunnnoo. Marin 

846






I tried it with that address and it keeps coming back. Do you have his cell #? 






Jonathon's e-mail address in griff030@csusm.edu 

847






No I don't..I guess send it to the next person and just leave him a message at his house....This whole 

thing is more complicated than I expected....I know that is the right address so I don't know what to 

tell you 

848





Subject: karla send it to me! 

>From: "Karla Garduno" 

I can do my part right now and pass it on quick! 


>To: 

>Subject: Re: jonathan's email address 

>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:26:55 -0800 

> 

>I tried it with that address and it keeps coming back. Do you have his cell 

>#? 

> ----- Original Message ----- 

> From: CA222girl@aol.com 


> Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 3:22 PM 

> Subject: Re: jonathan's email address 

> 

> 

> Jonathon's e-mail address in griff030@csusm.edu 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Fast. Reliable. Get MSN 9 Dial-up - 3 months for the price of 1! 

(Limited-time Offer) http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/ 

849





Subject: send it to the next person on the list 

It's already all crazy send it to the next personon the list. Marin 

850





Subject: Re: karla send it to me! 

The only thing is if you guys keep changing the order...you have to let other people know..The people 

that haven't gone yet are 

Joey, Judith, Matheno, Jenny 

.Jonathan 

.Alexandra 

Chula 

Marin 

Ann 

Robert 

.Karla 

Jane 

Cecilia 

twenty-third….Teresa 

851





Subject: Re: send it to the next person on the list 

jonathan already has it. 


From: tinne002 



Subject: send it to the next person on the list 

It's already all crazy send it to the next personon the list. Marin 

852





Subject: RE: send it to the next person on the list 

I will take it and then give it to marin, if you want, at least we know its 

moving then. 




>Subject: send it to the next person on the list 

>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:40:30 -0800 

> 

>It's already all crazy send it to the next personon the list. Marin 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

One-click access to Hotmail from any Web page – download MSN Toolbar now! 

http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/ 

853





Subject: Re: send it to the next person on the list 

I guess I am staying out of it...you guys can decide 

854






I think everything is working fine Jonathan is finishing up and he will send it to Alexandra. 






The only thing is if you guys keep changing the order...you have to let other people know..The 

people that haven't gone yet are 

Joey, Judith, Matheno, Jenny 

.Jonathan 

.Alexandra 

Chula 

Marin 

Ann 

Robert 

.Karla 

Jane 

Cecilia 

twenty-third….Teresa 

855






who do i send it to because you already did it? is it Jane. 



>To: 

>Subject: Re: karla send it to me! 

>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:55:17 -0800 

> 

>I think everything is working fine Jonathan is finishing up and he will 

>send it to Alexandra. 




> Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 3:41 PM 

> Subject: Re: karla send it to me! 

> 

> 

> The only thing is if you guys keep changing the order...you have to let 

>other people know..The people that haven't gone yet are 

> Joey, Judith, Matheno, Jenny 

> .Jonathan 

> 

> .Alexandra 

> 

> Chula 

> 

> Marin 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> Robert 

> 

> .Karla 

> 

> Jane 

> 

> Cecilia 

> 

> twenty-thirdâ€¦.Teresa 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Learn how to help protect your privacy and prevent fraud online at Tech 

Hacks & Scams. http://special.msn.com/msnbc/techsafety.armx 

856





Subject: i sent it to CHULA ALEXANDRA DID NOT ANSWER THE PHONE 

857





Subject: group flu paper 

Dear class, 

I am waiting to here from either Joey or Judith in regards to our paper. I am 

on campus until 9:00 p.m. tonight so i will hopefully receive it with ample 

time to do my contribution to the paper. Hope to here from somebody soon. 

Matheno 

858





Subject: This is neat 

Attachments: FW: This is neat! 

FW: This is neat! 

> 

> From: BabyKare@aol.com 

> Date: 2004/03/02 Tue PM 04:50:20 PST 

> To: karisanne@adelphia.net 

> Subject: Fwd: FW: This is neat! 

> 

> 

> 

> 


859





Subject: Re: This is neat 

That is sooooo cool, Karis!!! I will be sending it to some people who will appreciate it. 


> 

> From: BabyKare@aol.com 

> Date: 2004/03/02 Tue PM 04:50:20 PST 

> To: karisanne@adelphia.net 

> Subject: Fwd: FW: This is neat! 

> 

> 

> 

> 



From: "Catbert" 

To: "Karis Kroeker" 

Subject: FW: This is neat! 

Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:05:52 -0800 

Subject: This is neat! 

_____ 

Place your mouse on the X below...Highlight from the X to the O using your mouse 

from the X below to the O.. See what happens......... 

X EVEN WHEN YOU CAN'T SEE HIM...GOD IS THERE! O 

If you like this, pass it on! 



860





Subject: FLu Paper? 

Can anyone tell me who has the paper now? I am all confused by the posts now, 

am I still supposed to pass it to Joey? I am home in case anyone wants to pass 

it to me. If my phone is busy it is because I am on the computer checking to 

see who has the paper. Thanks, Cecilia 

861





Subject: The paper 

I have the paper and will send it to Ann. Marin 

862





Subject: Re: Slander 

Cynthia, 

Please don't take this the wrong way, but....I just thought I would remind everyone to be nice. I felt 

the ouch of this e-mail and it wasn't even a response to me. If people are attacked when they talk, no 

one will open up and talk. 

Ann 


Jane said: Did you ever wonder why gasoline prices 



saying thank you to them - not us. 

Recently, it was reported that OPEC was keeping the price of oil at a certain level (for their own 

profit, not ours). The President does not control OPEC. 

The United States averaged total gross oil (crude and products) imports of an estimated 11.4 

MMBD during 2002, representing around 58% of total U.S. oil demand. Around two-fifths of this oil 

came from OPEC nations, with Persian Gulf sources accounting for about one-fifth of total U.S. oil 

imports. Overall, the top suppliers of oil to the United States during 2002 were Canada (1.9 

MMBD), Saudi Arabia (1.6 MMBD), Mexico (1.5 MMBD), and Venezuela (1.4 MMBD). 

Venezuela has had worker strikes that have affected the price of their oil. The war in Iraq has also 

increased the price of oil. There probably isn't a political conspiracy among the President and his 

"friends". 

Jane, you have a right to dislike the president, but at least try to back up your comments with 

some data. 

Cynthia 

slander [Show phonetics] 

noun [C or U] 

a false spoken statement about someone which damages their reputation, or the making of such a 

statement: 

_____ 



863

_____ 



864





Subject: added thoughts ( not a journal entry)- PS-I got the paper and sent it on 

Cohort F, 

I recieved the paper from Jon and sent it to Marin at about 5:15pm or so. 

Hopefully it will get around to everyone. I was slightly proturbed that it 

did not seemed to be in essay form, nor really making much sense. I suggest 

to everyone that gets the paper next to either organize it as the deem 

necessary or at least make sure that you read the entire paper and not just 

the previous paragraph, becuause it is strting to contradict itself. Wow! I am 

seeing this paper a little bit more difficult and stressful then doing it in 

smaller groups. I hope it all works out. 

other thought on Gay marriages- 

I would like to say I am in agreement with gay marriages for many reasons- I 

think that our country has changed so much just in the last 100 years for 

example woman able to vote, minorities able to vote, and now why not let 

another group of monorities have a say in their own lives. With the cosntant 

change there is always room for more change. I think that it may not happen 

in the next year, but certainly in our lifetime, gay marriages will be 

accepted at legal binding as well as honorable between two people that 

sincerely love eachother. The gay people that I have met in my life time 

usually have more bonding, everlasting relationships more so than others that 

have no concept of what a healthy relationship should consist of. 

I would also like to think back on my alien theory. Which for those who 

didn't read it said that maybe aliens are both sexes (uni-sex). If God created 

the heavens and the earth as well as all the other planets then he created 

them and beleives that having intimate relations with the same sex is OKAY! I 

think this is a profound thought that deserves credit. 

I think that the bible was created to avoid caos, and through history it has 

proven pretty much to be the case that if you beleive what some person wrote 

to be true then you will live life accordingly and will not commit the acts 

they call sins. Therefore, everything is in order, caos siezes to exist! 

What more can I say, but that I would like to think that I am a very loving 

person that is willing and able to accept anyone that accepts me. I live by 

the golden rule that is also in my philosophy "Do unto others and you would 

have other do unto you" I try to live everyday with the belief that good 

things happen to good people and I would never intentionally degrade another 

person for my own benefit. I don't know if there is a heaven, but I do know 

that I live by my own morals and beliefs. Who is to say that we live in 

heaven but the name of it is earth, it would all be relative to the eye's of 

the beholder. 

There is way to much beauty in this world to neglect it. 

-thanks 

Chula 

865





Subject: Re: chula 

when i got the paper, which was early on, i was pretty impressed and thought it was coming 

along great, so i dont know if something changed or our styles are different, but in the 

end we will be able to discuss the whole process. 

> 

> From: silco001 

> Date: 2004/03/02 Tue PM 06:33:29 PST 


> Subject: added thoughts ( not a journal entry)- PS-I got the paper and sent it on 

> 

> Cohort F, 

> I recieved the paper from Jon and sent it to Marin at about 5:15pm or so. 

> Hopefully it will get around to everyone. I was slightly proturbed that it 

> did not seemed to be in essay form, nor really making much sense. I suggest 

> to everyone that gets the paper next to either organize it as the deem 

> necessary or at least make sure that you read the entire paper and not just 

> the previous paragraph, becuause it is strting to contradict itself. Wow! I am 

> seeing this paper a little bit more difficult and stressful then doing it in 

> smaller groups. I hope it all works out. 

> 

> other thought on Gay marriages- 

> I would like to say I am in agreement with gay marriages for many reasons- I 

> think that our country has changed so much just in the last 100 years for 

> example woman able to vote, minorities able to vote, and now why not let 

> another group of monorities have a say in their own lives. With the cosntant 

> change there is always room for more change. I think that it may not happen 

> in the next year, but certainly in our lifetime, gay marriages will be 

> accepted at legal binding as well as honorable between two people that 

> sincerely love eachother. The gay people that I have met in my life time 

> usually have more bonding, everlasting relationships more so than others that 

> have no concept of what a healthy relationship should consist of. 

> I would also like to think back on my alien theory. Which for those who 

> didn't read it said that maybe aliens are both sexes (uni-sex). If God created 

> the heavens and the earth as well as all the other planets then he created 

> them and beleives that having intimate relations with the same sex is OKAY! I 

> think this is a profound thought that deserves credit. 

> I think that the bible was created to avoid caos, and through history it has 

> proven pretty much to be the case that if you beleive what some person wrote 

> to be true then you will live life accordingly and will not commit the acts 

> they call sins. Therefore, everything is in order, caos siezes to exist! 

> What more can I say, but that I would like to think that I am a very loving 

> person that is willing and able to accept anyone that accepts me. I live by 

> the golden rule that is also in my philosophy "Do unto others and you would 

> have other do unto you" I try to live everyday with the belief that good 

> things happen to good people and I would never intentionally degrade another 

> person for my own benefit. I don't know if there is a heaven, but I do know 

> that I live by my own morals and beliefs. Who is to say that we live in 

> heaven but the name of it is earth, it would all be relative to the eye's of 

> the beholder. 

> There is way to much beauty in this world to neglect it. 

> -thanks 

> Chula 

> 

> 

> 


866

867





Subject: who has flu paper now? 

I was just wondering who has the flu paper right now. It seems like we are 

getting down to the last people of the list. So hangin there everyone! Teresa 

said that she would like to get it to her at the end by 11:30pm tonight. So 

let's get this paper done. :) 

Laurie :) 

868





Subject: RE: FLu Paper? 

Cecilia, 

I am still expecting to recieve the paper from you, I will be checking my 

email waiting for it, but to increase speed could you call me when you send 

it.(760) 807-9930. I will then send it to judith, and call her. If I can't 

contact her on the phone I will send it to Matheno. Matheno is there a way 

I can contact you at school to let you know you will recieve the paper? 

Joey 

>From: tille002 



>Subject: FLu Paper? 

>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:28:22 -0800 

> 

>Can anyone tell me who has the paper now? I am all confused by the posts 

>now, 

>am I still supposed to pass it to Joey? I am home in case anyone wants to 

>pass 

>it to me. If my phone is busy it is because I am on the computer checking 

>to 

>see who has the paper. Thanks, Cecilia 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



869




To: Joey Benson; ICP-F 


Joey, 

I sent my part to Cecilia and she will add it to the paper. So don't worry 

about sending to me. Send it directly to Matheno. 

I hope this works. 

Judith 

>===== Original Message From "Joey Benson" ===== 

>Cecilia, 

>I am still expecting to recieve the paper from you, I will be checking my 

>email waiting for it, but to increase speed could you call me when you send 

>it.(760) 807-9930. I will then send it to judith, and call her. If I can't 

>contact her on the phone I will send it to Matheno. Matheno is there a way 

>I can contact you at school to let you know you will recieve the paper? 

>Joey 

> 

> 

>>From: tille002 



>>Subject: FLu Paper? 

>>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:28:22 -0800 

>> 

>>Can anyone tell me who has the paper now? I am all confused by the posts 

>>now, 

>>am I still supposed to pass it to Joey? I am home in case anyone wants to 

>>pass 

>>it to me. If my phone is busy it is because I am on the computer checking 

>>to 

>>see who has the paper. Thanks, Cecilia 

>> 

>> 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee when you click here. 


870






Joey, I don't have the paper yet, but I think Matheno has it now. Don't worry 

I will call you when I send, if I ever get it. Cecilia 


>Cecilia, 

>I am still expecting to recieve the paper from you, I will be checking my 

>email waiting for it, but to increase speed could you call me when you send 

>it.(760) 807-9930. I will then send it to judith, and call her. If I can't 

>contact her on the phone I will send it to Matheno. Matheno is there a way 

>I can contact you at school to let you know you will recieve the paper? 

>Joey 

> 

> 

>>From: tille002 



>>Subject: FLu Paper? 

>>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:28:22 -0800 

>> 

>>Can anyone tell me who has the paper now? I am all confused by the posts 

>>now, 

>>am I still supposed to pass it to Joey? I am home in case anyone wants to 

>>pass 

>>it to me. If my phone is busy it is because I am on the computer checking 

>>to 

>>see who has the paper. Thanks, Cecilia 

>> 

>> 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee when you click here. 


871





Subject: Flu 

From my current understanding I will be the last to recieve the paper before 

sending it to Teresa. If someone is supposed to go after me let me know, 

otherwise I will send the paper to Teresa. 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Create a Job Alert on MSN Careers and enter for a chance to win $1000! 

http://msn.careerbuilder.com/promo/kaday.htm?siteid=CBMSN_1K&sc_extcmp=JS_JASweep_MSNHotm2 

872





Subject: WHERE"S THE PAPER!!! 

This is Jenny. I have not added my part to the paper yet and I an not sure whom is supposed to send 

it top me now. WHo has not written in the paper?? I also have Judith's part to add to the paper so just 

send it to me now thank you. 

Jenny Fiala 

873





Subject: Re: Flu 

Do you have the paper now? This is Jenny. Please send it to me. Thanks 

874





Subject: Re: WHERE"S THE PAPER!!! 

Hi Everyone, 

I have the paper now and I am adding my part and then sending it to Joey. To my understanding he 

is the last person before Teresa so this is the end of the class. Good job everyone. I will look through 

it as some people suggested to see if there are some things that I can help to make it flow better so 

that Teresa won't have to do it all by herself tonight. See you all tomorrow. 


875






I was told that Alexandra has not recieved the paper yet, so after Jenny 

sends it to me I will send it to Alexandra. She will then send it to 

Teresa. 

Joey 

>From: Kaylee102595@aol.com 



>Subject: Re: WHERE"S THE PAPER!!! 

>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 23:52:46 EST 

> 

>Hi Everyone, 

> I have the paper now and I am adding my part and then sending it to Joey. 

>To 

>my understanding he is the last person before Teresa so this is the end of 

>the class. Good job everyone. I will look through it as some people 

>suggested to 

>see if there are some things that I can help to make it flow better so that 

>Teresa won't have to do it all by herself tonight. See you all tomorrow. 

>:) Jenny Fiala 

_________________________________________________________________ 



876





Subject: RE: WHERE"S THE PAPER!!! 

I still don't have the paper and my blood pressure is going up waiting for 

it... No worries, I will drive myself to the hospital if the pain in my chest 

doesn't go away. Cecilia 


>I was told that Alexandra has not recieved the paper yet, so after Jenny 

>sends it to me I will send it to Alexandra. She will then send it to 

>Teresa. 

>Joey 

> 

> 

>>From: Kaylee102595@aol.com 



>>Subject: Re: WHERE"S THE PAPER!!! 

>>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 23:52:46 EST 

>> 

>>Hi Everyone, 

>> I have the paper now and I am adding my part and then sending it to Joey. 

>>To 

>>my understanding he is the last person before Teresa so this is the end of 

>>the class. Good job everyone. I will look through it as some people 

>>suggested to 

>>see if there are some things that I can help to make it flow better so that 

>>Teresa won't have to do it all by herself tonight. See you all tomorrow. 

>>:) Jenny Fiala 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Learn how to help protect your privacy and prevent fraud online at Tech 

>Hacks & Scams. http://special.msn.com/msnbc/techsafety.armx 

877






Cecilia, 

Jenny has the paper now and I was told she was going to send it to me. I 

will send it to you before sending it to Alexandra. The order should look 

like this, Jenny-Joey-Cecilia-Alexandra-Teresa. 

Joey 



>To: "Joey Benson" , ICP-F 

>Subject: RE: WHERE"S THE PAPER!!! 

>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 21:08:01 -0800 

> 

>I still don't have the paper and my blood pressure is going up waiting for 

>it... No worries, I will drive myself to the hospital if the pain in my 

>chest 

>doesn't go away. Cecilia 

> 

> 

> >===== Original Message From "Joey Benson" ===== 

> >I was told that Alexandra has not recieved the paper yet, so after Jenny 

> >sends it to me I will send it to Alexandra. She will then send it to 

> >Teresa. 

> >Joey 

> > 

> > 

> >>From: Kaylee102595@aol.com 

> >>Reply-To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

> >>To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

> >>Subject: Re: WHERE"S THE PAPER!!! 

> >>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 23:52:46 EST 

> >> 

> >>Hi Everyone, 

> >> I have the paper now and I am adding my part and then sending it to 

>Joey. 

> >>To 

> >>my understanding he is the last person before Teresa so this is the end 

>of 

> >>the class. Good job everyone. I will look through it as some people 

> >>suggested to 

> >>see if there are some things that I can help to make it flow better so 

>that 

> >>Teresa won't have to do it all by herself tonight. See you all tomorrow. 

> >>:) Jenny Fiala 

> > 

> >_________________________________________________________________ 

> >Learn how to help protect your privacy and prevent fraud online at Tech 

> >Hacks & Scams. http://special.msn.com/msnbc/techsafety.armx 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Get business advice and resources to improve your work life, from bCentral. 

http://special.msn.com/bcentral/loudclear.armx 

878





Subject: Re: thought about ceremonial law and gay marriage from the Bible 

it seems like quite a statement to say that the 

information in this email is THE TRUTH. as we have 

all discussed, truth is only relevant and true if 

people believe it is, for them and them only, whether 

it is on an individual level or involves groups 

connected by their beliefs. that is one of the 

benefits of this country, that we are free to believe 

in the things we feel are the truth. caution should be 

taken though, because to make a blanket statement that 

the biblical information presented in this email is 

the TRUTH is a blatent generalization and ignorant one 

at that. a claim to ultimate truth is usually a sign 

of fear, an attempt to control, or just plain 

insensititvity to other cultures, belief systems, and 

personal faiths. i appreciate the time and effort 

taken to present us all with accurate biblical 

information based on what your religion, laurie, 

believes is true. it does help to clarify some of the 

confusion between the quotes we discussed in class in 

relation to their context in the passages in the 

bible. your contribution also clarifies the original 

institution of marriage and its purposes and origin, 

meaningful stuff for homosexuals and straight folk 

alike to understand that gay marriage under the 

original institution is not legitimate. 

this supports an earlier email i sent regarding my 

position on gay marriage in which i state that 

marriage is what two people believe justifies a sacred 

union between them, and if straight folks want to 

protect and are going to use the one intended for 

them, good. unfortunately for gay folks, there has 

never been an institution designed for them that 

honors the unique experiences and sacred bonds that 

exist between men and other men and between woman and 

other women. at least not one that has been as 

widely accepted as the original heterosexually 

designed institution of marriage that exists today. i 

am in full support of all the homosexual couples that 

are taking their part in history and are getting 

married, it is a necessary action that must take 

place. i wish i could hug the mayors who have 

bravery, integrity, and honorability and have opposed 

the outdated belief system within the government 

structure, which DOES NOT support equality for all. 

change is always happening and always will. now is 

a time of great change and it is time that homosexuals 

have what all people should have: freedom to marry and 

have all of the rights associated with marriage 

between heterosexuals. what many gay people need to 

do though, is understand that marriage as it exists 

today is not designed for them, and fighting to marry 

under the existing institution is treading water in 

the swim to reach the warm beaches of equality. i 

believe that we need gay people who are pissed off, 

angry, and ready to fight for equality. we also need 

879

gay people to go and get married right now under the 

existing institution of marriage. we need mayors to 

continue doing what they're doing. and we also need 

people to start thinking a little further ahead in 

terms of change. this is a time for homosexuals to 

create what has never existed for them but should have 

been there ages ago, that thing we are fighting for 

now that will fill the inherited voids of love going 

unnoticed and disguised, of lives lived in the 

inequitable shadows of compromise for the comfort of 

the close-minded, missguided masses. minds evolve. 

awareness is contagious. love does conquer. but 

change is never fast or easily distinguishable in its 

moments of occurance. one cannot order, demand, or 

experience change any more than they can feel how it 

feels to be a year older their birthday...change is a 

process over time with many elements. it is a matter 

of reactions to and understanding change that we find 

our part in it...what is your part? 

michael 

__________________________________ 


Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster 

http://search.yahoo.com 

880





Subject: GUYS CALM DOWN ITS ALMOST DONE got some info for you read it 

JENNY HAS IT NOW SHE IS MAKING IT FLOW AND DOING PAGE NUMBERS AND ALL thanx 

jenny AND THEN Joey-Cecilia-Alexandra-Teresa 

then its done 

jonathan your info man 

881




To: ICP-F; Michael Renner 

Subject: RE: thought about ceremonial law and gay marriage from the Bible 

Hey Micheal, 

I guess the reason why I said that my email has the TRUTH in it, was to show 

how deeply I believe in the Bible. People in our class may not have agreed to 

what I had to say, but at least I took the time to research from my own "data 

points", explained to you that my "instrument" that I used was the Bible, and 

showed you what my "theory" would come from it. I respect yours and everyone 

else's opinion that might differ from mine. I just think that if it will take 

a lot of angry people who are homosexuals to try to change this world, then I 

as a christian will try show my side as well by using the Bible. I think that 

because our world is changing, I as a christian will have to stand up more and 

more in what I believe is true. I'm glad that had a chance to talk about this 

issue on a mature debate and approach. Thank you for responding to me. It'll 

be interesting where our future in this world we'll lead us to. 

Laurie :) 

>===== Original Message From Michael Renner ===== 

> it seems like quite a statement to say that the 

>information in this email is THE TRUTH. as we have 

>all discussed, truth is only relevant and true if 

>people believe it is, for them and them only, whether 

>it is on an individual level or involves groups 

>connected by their beliefs. that is one of the 

>benefits of this country, that we are free to believe 

>in the things we feel are the truth. caution should be 

>taken though, because to make a blanket statement that 

>the biblical information presented in this email is 

>the TRUTH is a blatent generalization and ignorant one 

>at that. a claim to ultimate truth is usually a sign 

>of fear, an attempt to control, or just plain 

>insensititvity to other cultures, belief systems, and 

>personal faiths. i appreciate the time and effort 

>taken to present us all with accurate biblical 

>information based on what your religion, laurie, 

>believes is true. it does help to clarify some of the 

>confusion between the quotes we discussed in class in 

>relation to their context in the passages in the 

>bible. your contribution also clarifies the original 

>institution of marriage and its purposes and origin, 

>meaningful stuff for homosexuals and straight folk 

>alike to understand that gay marriage under the 

>original institution is not legitimate. 

> this supports an earlier email i sent regarding my 

>position on gay marriage in which i state that 

>marriage is what two people believe justifies a sacred 

>union between them, and if straight folks want to 

>protect and are going to use the one intended for 

>them, good. unfortunately for gay folks, there has 

>never been an institution designed for them that 

>honors the unique experiences and sacred bonds that 

>exist between men and other men and between woman and 

>other women. at least not one that has been as 

>widely accepted as the original heterosexually 

>designed institution of marriage that exists today. i 

882

am in full support of all the homosexual couples that 

>are taking their part in history and are getting 

>married, it is a necessary action that must take 

>place. i wish i could hug the mayors who have 

>bravery, integrity, and honorability and have opposed 

>the outdated belief system within the government 

>structure, which DOES NOT support equality for all. 

> change is always happening and always will. now is 

>a time of great change and it is time that homosexuals 

>have what all people should have: freedom to marry and 

>have all of the rights associated with marriage 

>between heterosexuals. what many gay people need to 

>do though, is understand that marriage as it exists 

>today is not designed for them, and fighting to marry 

>under the existing institution is treading water in 

>the swim to reach the warm beaches of equality. i 

>believe that we need gay people who are pissed off, 

>angry, and ready to fight for equality. we also need 

>gay people to go and get married right now under the 

>existing institution of marriage. we need mayors to 

>continue doing what they're doing. and we also need 

>people to start thinking a little further ahead in 

>terms of change. this is a time for homosexuals to 

>create what has never existed for them but should have 

>been there ages ago, that thing we are fighting for 

>now that will fill the inherited voids of love going 

>unnoticed and disguised, of lives lived in the 

>inequitable shadows of compromise for the comfort of 

>the close-minded, missguided masses. minds evolve. 

>awareness is contagious. love does conquer. but 

>change is never fast or easily distinguishable in its 

>moments of occurance. one cannot order, demand, or 

>experience change any more than they can feel how it 

>feels to be a year older their birthday...change is a 

>process over time with many elements. it is a matter 

>of reactions to and understanding change that we find 

>our part in it...what is your part? 

> michael 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 


>Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster 

>http://search.yahoo.com 

883






Yes the order looks good to me. I am done and sending it on to Joey:) 

Jenny Fiala 

884






I'm with Michael for this one. I was thrilled to read the legit biblical 

quotes, they are 

interesting to me because i have not read much from the bible and I do have my 

wonders 

about the stories/history in the bible. But like what Michael said truth is 

only relevant and 

true if people believe it is, for them and them only. Like I said it (the 

bible) is interesting to 

me but it is not MY complete truth. I cannot allow my mind to believe all the 

things in the 

bible because my mind has already created it's own freedom of thoughts that 

welcomes 

the love and connection between any two beings, homosexual couples included. 

Im not 

saying everyone else doesn't have freedom of thoughts just in this situation 

particularly, 

your own thought with zero guides to follow. Many people, not all Cynthia I 

know I know, 

follow the beliefs of their parents and we trust in our families to guide us 

in the right 

direction. I follow the same belief systems as my parents as many of you 

probably do to. 

And we all know that our parents would not send us to a place that is not 

right so just 

think about what you believe in and why and smile to yourself because you know 

you are 

following the right path. I am smiling. Smile with me and let's atleast agree 

that we can 

smile because we know we have found a path that works for ourselves. 

Last thought: It would be hard for gay's to get into a religion that does not 

welcome them, 

huh. That's my thougth they are not right they are not wrong. They are just 

present. Marin 

P.S great effort on the paper everybody. I cannot wait to see how it turned 

out. Peace. 














>insensititvity to other cultures, belief systems, and 







885

ible. your contribution also clarifies the original 

















>am in full support of all the homosexual couples that 



























>inequitable shadows of compromise for the comfort of 









>our part in it...what is your part? 

> michael 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 




886






It was interesting to see the opinions I got from the email I sent regarding 

ceremonial law and gay marriage. I look at it in two ways. First, I see it as 

a way to help me understand another side's facts, and then from those what 

facts that I have that can practically compete with those. Secondly, I see 

this as a perfect lesson to be learned because I'll have the same kind of 

situations in my classroom or with parents of students. In other words, I 

learning right now in the present in order to be ready for my future, and I 

think that all of us in this class should look at it this way. Yes, the 

readings are long, sometimes boring, and long (oh wait, did I already say 

long? :)) But I've seen a pattern of what things we can actually learn from 

all of this. I think one could be perserverance. Just keeping up on the 

reading and trying to figure out what each author is trying to say, is a tough 

thing to do. Also seeing different ways of seeing issues and situations is 

another. Someday in our classroom we'll have students that may solve problems 

a different way. What will you do as a teacher? Will you just tell them to do 

it the way the book says it to do? Or will you ask the student to explain to 

you how they got the answer? I guess what I'm saying is, everything happens 

for a reason or purpose. So if we are all taking these classes at school, then 

instead of just doing the minimum we should allow our thinking to extend to an 

even higher level. So that's what I've discovered so far, now to talking about 

the reading. 

Sagan actually seemed to be a little interesting, especially the toolkit. 

The tools in this toolkit seemed to all have some sense to them. One of them 

known as the slippery slope which Yamashita had talked in class, I had known 

before about. I think today in our society, there are a lot of slippery slopes 

on political issues or even on human thinking. 

Then the Flu book seemed to leave me hanging after reading it. I figured 

that would happened since the book kept letting out more and more ideas of how 

the flu was started. Just like the book was saying at the end, it sounds like 

the flu can start from anywhere and won't be detected until it will be too 

late again. Who knows when the next epidemic will be? 

The reading from Fujimura was kind of boring. I think that this person has a 

real interest in Cancer treatment, which is definitely good. But he put so 

much detail in everything that I became lost and not interested in it anymore. 

From both of the readings from this author, I bet there are many situations in 

which one could see the data insturment theory. I also have to say that this 

reading showed me that any scientific work can be very detailed and long, that 

it would have to have a lot of teamwork and anaylzing in order to go through 

just one hypothesis. 

Laurie :) 

887





Subject: RE: Journal #7 

I really liked what you had to say about learning what we're learning 

today so that we can be prepared for the future. As human beings I 

believe that we are naturally curious and want answers to questions. 

But, I think it's very important to always question and seek out 

answers. This helps us to grow and potentially see things from a 

perspective that is new to us. We may not always find an answer, 

moreover, we may not find the answer we were looking for, but I think we 

should continue to pursue our curiosities, not only because we are human 

beings, but because we are going to be role models to thousands of 

children in our careers as educators. 

I was genuinely thrilled to see some debates occurring over the 

listserver which were handled with a mode of decorum and maturity. 

Sometimes it can be very difficult to not only express how you feel 

about a particular issue, but controlling the urge to want to persuade 

the opposing debaters can almost be exacting. Here here, cheers, jolly 

oh and all that good stuff mates -- keep up the great debates! Your 

friendly Brit' ~ Louise 


From: mcdon032 [mailto:mcdon032@csusm.edu] 




It was interesting to see the opinions I got from the email I sent 

regarding 

ceremonial law and gay marriage. I look at it in two ways. First, I see 

it as 

a way to help me understand another side's facts, and then from those 

what 

facts that I have that can practically compete with those. Secondly, I 

see 

this as a perfect lesson to be learned because I'll have the same kind 

of 

situations in my classroom or with parents of students. In other words, 

I 

learning right now in the present in order to be ready for my future, 

and I 

think that all of us in this class should look at it this way. Yes, the 

readings are long, sometimes boring, and long (oh wait, did I already 

say 

long? :)) But I've seen a pattern of what things we can actually learn 

from 

all of this. I think one could be perserverance. Just keeping up on the 

reading and trying to figure out what each author is trying to say, is a 

tough 

thing to do. Also seeing different ways of seeing issues and situations 

is 

another. Someday in our classroom we'll have students that may solve 

problems 

a different way. What will you do as a teacher? Will you just tell them 

to do 

it the way the book says it to do? Or will you ask the student to 

explain to 

888

you how they got the answer? I guess what I'm saying is, everything 

happens 

for a reason or purpose. So if we are all taking these classes at 

school, then 

instead of just doing the minimum we should allow our thinking to extend 

to an 

even higher level. So that's what I've discovered so far, now to talking 

about 

the reading. 

Sagan actually seemed to be a little interesting, especially the 

toolkit. 

The tools in this toolkit seemed to all have some sense to them. One of 

them 

known as the slippery slope which Yamashita had talked in class, I had 

known 

before about. I think today in our society, there are a lot of slippery 

slopes 

on political issues or even on human thinking. 

Then the Flu book seemed to leave me hanging after reading it. I 

figured 

that would happened since the book kept letting out more and more ideas 

of how 

the flu was started. Just like the book was saying at the end, it sounds 

like 

the flu can start from anywhere and won't be detected until it will be 

too 

late again. Who knows when the next epidemic will be? 

The reading from Fujimura was kind of boring. I think that this person 

has a 

real interest in Cancer treatment, which is definitely good. But he put 

so 

much detail in everything that I became lost and not interested in it 

anymore. 

From both of the readings from this author, I bet there are many 

situations in 

which one could see the data insturment theory. I also have to say that 

this 

reading showed me that any scientific work can be very detailed and 

long, that 

it would have to have a lot of teamwork and anaylzing in order to go 

through 

just one hypothesis. 

Laurie :) 

889





Subject: HILARIOUS 

this is absolutely hilarious how this paper has worked out and YOU KNOW that yamashita is 

gonna have a field day analyzing this. although this was a challenge, we all pulled 

together and made it and i think that despite the troubles, the experience is something we 

should all contemplate. i certainly dont regret our decision b/c i think this was a great 

experience for us all. 


890




To: ICP-F; Michael Renner; tinne002 


Yeah, I think that some may think that Christianity hate homosexuals. 

Chirstians don't hate homosexuals though, and don't hate the person who may be 

homosexual. We and God hate the immoral sin that they are doing. BUT I want 

everyone to know that God welcomes anyone who has seriously contemplated about 

what direction they are going in life and is willing to see what God has 

planned for them in their lives by changing their own lives. As a christian I 

see homosexuals and even have friends that are homosexual, and all I can do as 

a christian is just have some christian influence on them and listen to them 

as well. I want so badly to tell them to change, but I know it would be very 

difficult for them to do this so suddenly in their lives and they would 

probablt disregard me as a friend anymore. So I guess I can at least pray 

about it, because I know God has a plan for all of us. "Finally, brothers, 

whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, 

whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable--if anything is excellent or 

praiseworthy--think about such things. Whatever you have learned or received 

or heard from me, or seen in me--put it into practice. And the God of peace 

will be with you." (Phillipians 4:8,9) 

Laurie :) 


>I'm with Michael for this one. I was thrilled to read the legit biblical 

>quotes, they are 

>interesting to me because i have not read much from the bible and I do have 

my 

>wonders 

>about the stories/history in the bible. But like what Michael said truth is 

>only relevant and 

>true if people believe it is, for them and them only. Like I said it (the 

>bible) is interesting to 

>me but it is not MY complete truth. I cannot allow my mind to believe all the 

>things in the 

>bible because my mind has already created it's own freedom of thoughts that 

>welcomes 

>the love and connection between any two beings, homosexual couples included. 

>Im not 

>saying everyone else doesn't have freedom of thoughts just in this situation 

>particularly, 

>your own thought with zero guides to follow. Many people, not all Cynthia I 

>know I know, 

>follow the beliefs of their parents and we trust in our families to guide us 

>in the right 

>direction. I follow the same belief systems as my parents as many of you 

>probably do to. 

>And we all know that our parents would not send us to a place that is not 

>right so just 

>think about what you believe in and why and smile to yourself because you 

know 

>you are 

>following the right path. I am smiling. Smile with me and let's atleast agree 

>that we can 

>smile because we know we have found a path that works for ourselves. 

>Last thought: It would be hard for gay's to get into a religion that does not 

>welcome them, 

>huh. That's my thougth they are not right they are not wrong. They are just 

>present. Marin 

891

P.S great effort on the paper everybody. I cannot wait to see how it turned 

>out. Peace. 

> 

>> it seems like quite a statement to say that the 

>>information in this email is THE TRUTH. as we have 

>>all discussed, truth is only relevant and true if 

>>people believe it is, for them and them only, whether 

>>it is on an individual level or involves groups 

>>connected by their beliefs. that is one of the 

>>benefits of this country, that we are free to believe 

>>in the things we feel are the truth. caution should be 

>>taken though, because to make a blanket statement that 

>>the biblical information presented in this email is 

>>the TRUTH is a blatent generalization and ignorant one 

>>at that. a claim to ultimate truth is usually a sign 

>>of fear, an attempt to control, or just plain 

>>insensititvity to other cultures, belief systems, and 

>>personal faiths. i appreciate the time and effort 

>>taken to present us all with accurate biblical 

>>information based on what your religion, laurie, 

>>believes is true. it does help to clarify some of the 

>>confusion between the quotes we discussed in class in 

>>relation to their context in the passages in the 

>>bible. your contribution also clarifies the original 

>>institution of marriage and its purposes and origin, 

>>meaningful stuff for homosexuals and straight folk 

>>alike to understand that gay marriage under the 

>>original institution is not legitimate. 

>> this supports an earlier email i sent regarding my 

>>position on gay marriage in which i state that 

>>marriage is what two people believe justifies a sacred 

>>union between them, and if straight folks want to 

>>protect and are going to use the one intended for 

>>them, good. unfortunately for gay folks, there has 

>>never been an institution designed for them that 

>>honors the unique experiences and sacred bonds that 

>>exist between men and other men and between woman and 

>>other women. at least not one that has been as 

>>widely accepted as the original heterosexually 

>>designed institution of marriage that exists today. i 

>>am in full support of all the homosexual couples that 

>>are taking their part in history and are getting 

>>married, it is a necessary action that must take 

>>place. i wish i could hug the mayors who have 

>>bravery, integrity, and honorability and have opposed 

>>the outdated belief system within the government 

>>structure, which DOES NOT support equality for all. 

>> change is always happening and always will. now is 

>>a time of great change and it is time that homosexuals 

>>have what all people should have: freedom to marry and 

>>have all of the rights associated with marriage 

>>between heterosexuals. what many gay people need to 

>>do though, is understand that marriage as it exists 

>>today is not designed for them, and fighting to marry 

>>under the existing institution is treading water in 

>>the swim to reach the warm beaches of equality. i 

>>believe that we need gay people who are pissed off, 

>>angry, and ready to fight for equality. we also need 

>>gay people to go and get married right now under the 

>>existing institution of marriage. we need mayors to 

>>continue doing what they're doing. and we also need 

>>people to start thinking a little further ahead in 

>>terms of change. this is a time for homosexuals to 

>>create what has never existed for them but should have 

>>been there ages ago, that thing we are fighting for 

>>now that will fill the inherited voids of love going 

892

unnoticed and disguised, of lives lived in the 

>>inequitable shadows of compromise for the comfort of 

>>the close-minded, missguided masses. minds evolve. 

>>awareness is contagious. love does conquer. but 

>>change is never fast or easily distinguishable in its 

>>moments of occurance. one cannot order, demand, or 

>>experience change any more than they can feel how it 

>>feels to be a year older their birthday...change is a 

>>process over time with many elements. it is a matter 

>>of reactions to and understanding change that we find 

>>our part in it...what is your part? 

>> michael 

>> 

>> 

>>__________________________________ 


>>Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster 

>>http://search.yahoo.com 

893






Attachments: reply 

reply (591 B) 

>This is Alexandra it is 10:20 pm and I have not received the paper yet... 


> Date: 2004/03/02 Tue PM 11:37:48 EST 


> Subject: WHERE"S THE PAPER!!! 

> 

> This is Jenny. I have not added my part to the paper yet and I an not sure 

> whom is supposed to send it top me now. WHo has not written in the paper?? I 

> also have Judith's part to add to the paper so just send it to me now thank you. 

> Jenny Fiala 

> 

> 

894





Subject: love homosexuals 

i havent been home and am excited to read the responses to laurie's email, but i opened 

this one and saw the first line..."I think that some may think that Christianity hate 

homosexuals." my comment on this...I LOVE all people including homosexuals. we are all 

called to love one another (according to the Bible) regardless of who they are. 

and on that note, my mom had a gay secretary that we loved to death. he was an awesome 

guy and just because mom and i are christian and disagree with his lifestyle, we never 

held that against him or prevented a friendship from developing. and he knowing how we 

felt, did they same and loved us back and treasured the friendship. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/02 Tue PM 10:16:02 PST 

> To: ICP-F , Michael Renner , 

> tinne002 

> Subject: RE: thought about ceremonial law and gay marriage from the Bible 

> 

> Yeah, I think that some may think that Christianity hate homosexuals. 

> Chirstians don't hate homosexuals though, and don't hate the person who may be 

> homosexual. We and God hate the immoral sin that they are doing. BUT I want 

> everyone to know that God welcomes anyone who has seriously contemplated about 

> what direction they are going in life and is willing to see what God has 

> planned for them in their lives by changing their own lives. As a christian I 

> see homosexuals and even have friends that are homosexual, and all I can do as 

> a christian is just have some christian influence on them and listen to them 

> as well. I want so badly to tell them to change, but I know it would be very 

> difficult for them to do this so suddenly in their lives and they would 

> probablt disregard me as a friend anymore. So I guess I can at least pray 

> about it, because I know God has a plan for all of us. "Finally, brothers, 

> whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, 

> whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable--if anything is excellent or 

> praiseworthy--think about such things. Whatever you have learned or received 

> or heard from me, or seen in me--put it into practice. And the God of peace 

> will be with you." (Phillipians 4:8,9) 

> 

> Laurie :) 

> 

> >===== Original Message From tinne002 ===== 

> >I'm with Michael for this one. I was thrilled to read the legit biblical 

> >quotes, they are 

> >interesting to me because i have not read much from the bible and I do have 

> my 

> >wonders 

> >about the stories/history in the bible. But like what Michael said truth is 

> >only relevant and 

> >true if people believe it is, for them and them only. Like I said it (the 

> >bible) is interesting to 

> >me but it is not MY complete truth. I cannot allow my mind to believe all the 

> >things in the 

> >bible because my mind has already created it's own freedom of thoughts that 

> >welcomes 

> >the love and connection between any two beings, homosexual couples included. 

> >Im not 

> >saying everyone else doesn't have freedom of thoughts just in this situation 

> >particularly, 

> >your own thought with zero guides to follow. Many people, not all Cynthia I 

> >know I know, 

> >follow the beliefs of their parents and we trust in our families to guide us 

895

in the right 

> >direction. I follow the same belief systems as my parents as many of you 

> >probably do to. 

> >And we all know that our parents would not send us to a place that is not 

> >right so just 

> >think about what you believe in and why and smile to yourself because you 

> know 

> >you are 

> >following the right path. I am smiling. Smile with me and let's atleast agree 

> >that we can 

> >smile because we know we have found a path that works for ourselves. 

> >Last thought: It would be hard for gay's to get into a religion that does not 

> >welcome them, 

> >huh. That's my thougth they are not right they are not wrong. They are just 

> >present. Marin 

> >P.S great effort on the paper everybody. I cannot wait to see how it turned 

> >out. Peace. 

> > 

> >> it seems like quite a statement to say that the 

> >>information in this email is THE TRUTH. as we have 

> >>all discussed, truth is only relevant and true if 

> >>people believe it is, for them and them only, whether 

> >>it is on an individual level or involves groups 

> >>connected by their beliefs. that is one of the 

> >>benefits of this country, that we are free to believe 

> >>in the things we feel are the truth. caution should be 

> >>taken though, because to make a blanket statement that 

> >>the biblical information presented in this email is 

> >>the TRUTH is a blatent generalization and ignorant one 

> >>at that. a claim to ultimate truth is usually a sign 

> >>of fear, an attempt to control, or just plain 

> >>insensititvity to other cultures, belief systems, and 

> >>personal faiths. i appreciate the time and effort 

> >>taken to present us all with accurate biblical 

> >>information based on what your religion, laurie, 

> >>believes is true. it does help to clarify some of the 

> >>confusion between the quotes we discussed in class in 

> >>relation to their context in the passages in the 

> >>bible. your contribution also clarifies the original 

> >>institution of marriage and its purposes and origin, 

> >>meaningful stuff for homosexuals and straight folk 

> >>alike to understand that gay marriage under the 

> >>original institution is not legitimate. 

> >> this supports an earlier email i sent regarding my 

> >>position on gay marriage in which i state that 

> >>marriage is what two people believe justifies a sacred 

> >>union between them, and if straight folks want to 

> >>protect and are going to use the one intended for 

> >>them, good. unfortunately for gay folks, there has 

> >>never been an institution designed for them that 

> >>honors the unique experiences and sacred bonds that 

> >>exist between men and other men and between woman and 

> >>other women. at least not one that has been as 

> >>widely accepted as the original heterosexually 

> >>designed institution of marriage that exists today. i 

> >>am in full support of all the homosexual couples that 

> >>are taking their part in history and are getting 

> >>married, it is a necessary action that must take 

> >>place. i wish i could hug the mayors who have 

> >>bravery, integrity, and honorability and have opposed 

> >>the outdated belief system within the government 

> >>structure, which DOES NOT support equality for all. 

> >> change is always happening and always will. now is 

> >>a time of great change and it is time that homosexuals 

> >>have what all people should have: freedom to marry and 

> >>have all of the rights associated with marriage 

896

etween heterosexuals. what many gay people need to 

> >>do though, is understand that marriage as it exists 

> >>today is not designed for them, and fighting to marry 

> >>under the existing institution is treading water in 

> >>the swim to reach the warm beaches of equality. i 

> >>believe that we need gay people who are pissed off, 

> >>angry, and ready to fight for equality. we also need 

> >>gay people to go and get married right now under the 

> >>existing institution of marriage. we need mayors to 

> >>continue doing what they're doing. and we also need 

> >>people to start thinking a little further ahead in 

> >>terms of change. this is a time for homosexuals to 

> >>create what has never existed for them but should have 

> >>been there ages ago, that thing we are fighting for 

> >>now that will fill the inherited voids of love going 

> >>unnoticed and disguised, of lives lived in the 

> >>inequitable shadows of compromise for the comfort of 

> >>the close-minded, missguided masses. minds evolve. 

> >>awareness is contagious. love does conquer. but 

> >>change is never fast or easily distinguishable in its 

> >>moments of occurance. one cannot order, demand, or 

> >>experience change any more than they can feel how it 

> >>feels to be a year older their birthday...change is a 

> >>process over time with many elements. it is a matter 

> >>of reactions to and understanding change that we find 

> >>our part in it...what is your part? 

> >> michael 

> >> 

> >> 

> >>__________________________________ 

> >>Do you Yahoo!? 

> >>Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster 

> >>http://search.yahoo.com 

> 

> 

> 


897






Good application of Yamashita's lecture, Laurie. You got it all in there, and it works!! 

Having the Bible as your truth is just as valid as someone else's truth. Thanks for posting. 

Cynthia 


Hey Micheal, 

I guess the reason why I said that my email has the TRUTH in it, was to show 

how deeply I believe in the Bible. People in our class may not have agreed to 

what I had to say, but at least I took the time to research from my own "data 

points", explained to you that my "instrument" that I used was the Bible, and 

showed you what my "theory" would come from it. I respect yours and everyone 

else's opinion that might differ from mine. I just think that if it will take 

a lot of angry people who are homosexuals to try to change this world, then I 

as a christian will try show my side as well by using the Bible. I think that 

because our world is changing, I as a christian will have to stand up more and 

more in what I believe is true. I'm glad that had a chance to talk about this 

issue on a mature debate and approach. Thank you f or responding to me. It'll 

be interesting where our future in this world we'll lead us to. 

Laurie :) 















>insensititvity to other cul tures, belief systems, and 







898

ible. your contribution also clarifies the original 

















>am in full support of all the homosexual couples that 



























>inequitable shadows of comprom ise for the comfort of 









899

our part in it...what is your part? 

> michael 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 




_____ 



900




To: hada@cox.net; ICP-F 


Alright, it is 11:30 and there is no paper. I am going to bed and waking up 

at 5:00 in the morning to finish it. It better be there kids. 

Teresa 

p.s. i am not happy and probably will be bitter tomorrow. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>> From: Kaylee102595@aol.com 

>> Date: 2004/03/02 Tue PM 11:37:48 EST 

>> To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

>> Subject: WHERE"S THE PAPER!!! 

>> 

>> This is Jenny. I have not added my part to the paper yet and I an not sure 

>> whom is supposed to send it top me now. WHo has not written in the paper?? 

I 

>> also have Judith's part to add to the paper so just send it to me now thank 

you. 

>> Jenny Fiala 

>> 

>> 

901



Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 12:00 AM 


Subject: I agree 

I think this group paper was a great idea. I just wish we could have gotten 

the idea out a week sooner, so that we didn't all have to stress to get it 

done. And poor Teresa, I feel for you girl. I am up writing a paper so I 

thought I would check in on the flu paper to see how things are going. See 

you all tomorrow. 

-Chula 

902





Subject: FWD: scratch it ...LOL 

Attachments: image001.gif; image001.gif 

image001.gif (39 

KB) 

image001.gif (39 

KB) 

I am sending this to you all who made me wake up this morning at 

four to 

finish my work. Just kidding!! I thought it was so cute. 

Teresa 

DeJaY DeJurneTT 

Scheduling Coordinator 

Creative Touch Interiors 

Phone 858-621-6545 

Fax 858-695-2817 

DDeJurneTT@ctihome.com 

> -----Original Message----- 

> From: Dawn Silvia 

> Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 3:23 PM 

> To: Crystal Hewett; Anna Slonim; Becky Yuiska; Chy Carlyle; Dejay 

> Dejurnett; Brian Lyman; Andrea Ruiz 

> Subject: FW: scratch it ...LOL 

> 

> 

> 

----- Forwarded Message ----- 

From: 

Subject: (none) 

: 

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the 

crotch of the person who screws up your day 

and may their arms be too short to scratch... 

AMEN 


From: STLLRNING@aol.com 

To: DallasElen , 

Blkeyedlady , 

Angelfishsj , 

k928magnu , 

Truebluewi , 

Nee814 , 

Snugglebearangel , 

KellyMcOB , 

POConnor22 , 

Karen7455 , 

Ireneparalegal , 

903

Jusmisef , 

Carpet7549 , 

Slackmommy1 , 

KJT882 , 

PJ40YRS , 

Skenn24638 , 

sarah937 , 

Meandmyco , 

Angal54 , 

HGwillow , 

Ansmeg99 , 

Kdebbiea 

Subject: scratch it 

FRIENDSHIP PRAYER 

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the 

crotch of the person who screws up your day 

and may their arms be too short to scratch... 

AMEN 

904





Subject: Dear Class 

Dear Class, 

Great job with the paper... Yeeee Haaa http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif 


http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif... 

See all of you later. 

Oh yeah, one more thing. I am so glad that our cohort is talking and bringing in ideas and starting to 

really dissect current issues. And I was thinking to myself that there is so much stuff people want to 

say sometimes that people don't really listen to what the other side is telling them. I am guilty of this 

myself at times. So, I ran across a quote from Ernest Hemingway that I thought might remind us of 

what we should remember. 

"When people talk, listen completely. Most people never listen." 

See you in class you Super Heros, 

Ann 

_____ 



905





Subject: listen completely 

God gave us only one mouth but two ears. 

think about it. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/03 Wed AM 07:08:20 PST 


> Subject: Dear Class 

> 

> Dear Class, 

> Great job with the paper... Yeeee Haaa ... 

> 

> See all of you later. 

> 

> Oh yeah, one more thing. I am so glad that our cohort is talking and bringing in ideas 

and starting to really dissect current issues. And I was thinking to myself that there is 

so much stuff people want to say sometimes that people don't really listen to what the 

other side is telling them. I am guilty of this myself at times. So, I ran across a 

quote from Ernest Hemingway that I thought might remind us of what we should remember. 

> 

> "When people talk, listen completely. Most people never listen." 

> 

> See you in class you Super Heros, 

> Ann 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


906



Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 8:10 PM 


Subject: 1918 Flu Movie 

there is a movie, The Killer Flu, on KPBS right now. it is different from the film we 

watched in class. i gotta say how strange it is that we had never heard of this flu until 

this class and kolata's book and over the course of weeks, i have seen reference to it on 

the news, a new book, a magazine article and a new movie. why is that? 


907





Subject: Re: 1918 Flu Movie 

It's kind of like when you buy a new car, then all of the sudden you see the same car everywhere. I 

think we are just aware of it, so it catches our attention. 

Cynthia 


there is a movie, The Killer Flu, on KPBS right now. it is different from the film we watched in 

class. i gotta say how strange it is that we had never heard of this flu until this class and kolata's 

book and over the course of weeks, i have seen reference to it on the news, a new book, a 

magazine article and a new movie. why is that? 


_____ 



908





Subject: Bewildered 

After reading all the e-mails from the past day, I was overwhelmed. The thing that stood out most to 

me was how Christians say that they do not hate homosexuals. They love the homosexual but hate 

the sin. This does not sit well in my gut. To me it feels like a double message; a message shared by 

so many that it hurts to think about it. 

To me it feels like a mother going up to hug her child and tell the child that she loves them, but in the 

process of hugging them, she takes a knife and stabs her child it the back. As the child looks at the 

mother in disbelief, the mother ones again tells the child that she love them, but she HATES WHO 

THEY ARE. 

To me it feels like the sexual double standard that is common among males and females. A guy is 

cool and a stud if he sleeps with a lot of women, but a girl is a slut if she sleeps with a few herself. 

Simularly, a heterosexual is honored, pure and glorified if they want to get married, have sex, and 

spend thier lives with the one they love, but homosexuals are dishonored, immoral, and sinners 

because they want to get married, have sex, and spend thier lives with the one they love. 

What kind of effect do you think that has on these individuals? Do you think it makes them feel good 

about themselves? How would anyone like to be treated this way? How would anyone like a to be 

excluded like homosexuals are being excluded? Can anyone put themselves in these shoes and tell 

me that it is o.k. to do this? 

I am greatly saddened by the actions of so many people who not only think this is alright, but they feel 

with a great passion that they have a right to impose their beliefs on couples consisting of two 

consenting adults. 

I still can not understand why one group is able to tell another group what to do? It's like I 

want to yell, "why are you telling other people how to run their lives?" Homosexuals are NOT hurting 

anyone. Why do people hold them down? Can anyone imagine the weight they must carry on their 

shoulders? For what? Nothing!, only because "people" choose to go out of their way to keep them 

from achieving equality. 

I truly do not understand. To me, these actions are a sin. 

"IMAGINE THERE'S NO HEAVEN- 

IT'S EASY IF YOU TRY- 

NO HELL BELOW US 

AND ABOVE US ONLY SKY. 

IMAGINE ALL THE PEOPLE 

LIVING FOR TODAY... 

IMAGINE THERE'S NO COUNTRIES 

IT ISN'T HARD TO DO- 

NOTHING TO KILL OR DIE FOR 

AND NO RELIGION TOO. 


LIVING LIFE IN PEACE... 

IMAGINE NO POSSESSION. 

909

I WONDER IF YOU CAN- 

NO NEED FOR GREED OR HUNGER 

A ... [SISTERHOOD]...OF MAN 


SHARING ALL THE WORLD... 

YOU MAY SAY: I'M A DREAMER- 

BUT I AM NOT THE ONLY ONE- 

AND I HOPE SOMEDAY YOU WILL JOIN US 

AND THE WORLD WILL BE AS ONE..." 

John Lennon 


_____ 



910





Subject: RE: 1918 Flu Movie 

Hmmm...I know that we are never as observant about something until it has 

been brought to our attention in some way or another. It often happens to me 

that when I learn about something interesting, I suddenly begin tuning in 

more when it is brought up. I think that it is being referenced more and 

more, since it was brought to my attention. Yet what I really think is that 

it may have been referenced before but I never tuned in because the 

observation was not a conscious effort. 

But it could also be the season. We just had a pretty bad flu season that 

passed at the end of last year. It got a little scary when people starting 

dying of it (surfacing the memories of the 1918 flu). Maybe some thought it 

was time to educate us about the pandemic. 

Interesting... 


>From: 


>To: 

>Subject: 1918 Flu Movie Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 20:09:59 -0800 

> 

>there is a movie, The Killer Flu, on KPBS right now. it is different from 

>the film we watched in class. i gotta say how strange it is that we had 

>never heard of this flu until this class and kolata's book and over the 

>course of weeks, i have seen reference to it on the news, a new book, a 

>magazine article and a new movie. why is that? 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar – includes FREE pop-up blocking! 


911





Subject: Re: cynthia and jennifer 

thanks for your thoughts ladies. my mom and i were talking about the flu and watching the 

movie and came to the same conclusion, awareness. pretty cool how that happens huh? 

> 

> From: "Jennifer Ramos" 

> Date: 2004/03/03 Wed PM 10:30:10 PST 


> Subject: RE: 1918 Flu Movie 

> 

> Hmmm...I know that we are never as observant about something until it has 

> been brought to our attention in some way or another. It often happens to me 

> that when I learn about something interesting, I suddenly begin tuning in 

> more when it is brought up. I think that it is being referenced more and 

> more, since it was brought to my attention. Yet what I really think is that 

> it may have been referenced before but I never tuned in because the 

> observation was not a conscious effort. 

> 

> But it could also be the season. We just had a pretty bad flu season that 

> passed at the end of last year. It got a little scary when people starting 

> dying of it (surfacing the memories of the 1918 flu). Maybe some thought it 

> was time to educate us about the pandemic. 

> 

> Interesting... 

> 

> ~Jennifer Ramos 

> 

> 

> >From: 


> >To: 

> >Subject: 1918 Flu Movie Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 20:09:59 -0800 

> > 

> >there is a movie, The Killer Flu, on KPBS right now. it is different from 

> >the film we watched in class. i gotta say how strange it is that we had 

> >never heard of this flu until this class and kolata's book and over the 

> >course of weeks, i have seen reference to it on the news, a new book, a 

> >magazine article and a new movie. why is that? 

> > 


> > 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar – includes FREE pop-up blocking! 

> http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/ 

> 

> 


912



Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2004 7:11 AM 


Subject: awareness 

I was going to say that the only reason you are seeing more Flu stuff is that because now 

you are aware of it, but Cynthia beat me to it (surprise!). I do want to make a comment on 

Karis's reaction that it was "pretty cool how that happens." Well, no, it's not cool at 

all. This is the same reason that white people don't think there is a problem with racism, 

and why straight people don't understand why the gay people feel so discriminated against. 

It's an unfortunate human trait, most people have their heads in the sand and think if 

everything is ok for them, it must be for everyone else. 


From: "karisanne@adelphia.net" 



Subject: Re: cynthia and jennifer 

thanks for your thoughts ladies. my mom and i were talking about the flu and watching the 

movie and came to the same conclusion, awareness. pretty cool how that happens huh? 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/03 Wed PM 10:30:10 PST 


> Subject: RE: 1918 Flu Movie 

> 

> Hmmm...I know that we are never as observant about something until it has 

> been brought to our attention in some way or another. It often happens to me 

> that when I learn about something interesting, I suddenly begin tuning in 

> more when it is brought up. I think that it is being referenced more and 

> more, since it was brought to my attention. Yet what I really think is that 

> it may have been referenced before but I never tuned in because the 

> observation was not a conscious effort. 

> 

> But it could also be the season. We just had a pretty bad flu season that 

> passed at the end of last year. It got a little scary when people starting 

> dying of it (surfacing the memories of the 1918 flu). Maybe some thought it 

> was time to educate us about the pandemic. 

> 

> Interesting... 

> 


> 

> 

> >From: 


> >To: 

> >Subject: 1918 Flu Movie Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 20:09:59 -0800 

> > 

> >there is a movie, The Killer Flu, on KPBS right now. it is different from 

> >the film we watched in class. i gotta say how strange it is that we had 

> >never heard of this flu until this class and kolata's book and over the 

> >course of weeks, i have seen reference to it on the news, a new book, a 

> >magazine article and a new movie. why is that? 

> > 


> > 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

913

Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar - includes FREE pop-up blocking! 

> http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/ 

> 

> 


914





Subject: Amendment to my last post 

Please realize that everything I have been talking about this semester extends into the classroom 

setting. I am not talking about some extreem sideline topic. This is something that takes place 

everyday. Homosexuals live in this society, they work in this society, they have children in our 

schools, they are some of our teachers, they are here too. So this is relevant, it is current, it is 

significant, and it is important. 

My reactions in this e-mail and my last one are in reaction to what the TRUTH preaches. But keep in 

mind... I do not hate the Christian... I disagree with what they preach... This is not intended to be 

mean in any way, shape, or form, my intensions are to express how the statement christian's use 

when addressing their feelings about homsexuals, I love the homosexual, but hate the sin. To me 

that is the same as saying ... 

- I love the homosexual, but hate their sin... 

- I love the Christian, but hate thier religion... 

- I love the black, the mexican, the asian, but I hate their cultures... 

-I love the teacher, but hate what they teach... 

- I love the preacher, but hate what they preach... 

I don't understand? ... to me you can not seperate one from the other. 


_____ 



915





Subject: A really BIG one.... 

I forgot this really big one: 

Maybe more people can relate to this one... 

I love the feminist, but hate what she stands for... 

because it goes against the church, the bible (Old Version - Bible 1.1, New Version - Bible 1.2 ...); yet 

without her and what she stands for, where would any of us females be today? 

Sense? Nonsense? Data: Input: Theory 

Ann 

_____ 



916





Subject: baloney detection 

so i was reading in Sagan, his chapter on detecting the baloney and how imporant it is to 

test everything. it raises the question, who are you gonna listen to in life? 

in order to decipher the truth and to detect the baloney (for us Christians it's the 

Bible, for others it may be something different)you have to be open but skeptical. how do 

you do both?? 

there is a happy medium in which your openness leads to growth and your skeptisim leads to 

discernment. 

for me the skepticism comes natural, especially when it comes to other beliefs or 

challenges against my beliefs. 

opennes on the other hand is hard for me to grasp. how can a strong Christian be open, 

doesnt that mean i am willing to change my beliefs? well, no. it means i still have so 

much to learn, so much more to grow. i dont by any means know every word in the Bible. 

when is the last time you memorized over 1000 pages. impossible right, well not to me b/c 

i desire to learn everything i can about my God and His Word. thus im open to grow. 

so lemme put this into context of a non-Christian. you have beliefs, dont you? you have 

your set ways just as i do. you are skeptical to change those ways and not so open to 

hand them over and believe something foreign to you. so where is your happy medium? 

well, its lies in an openness to grow, to learn, to listen. but dont leave out 

skepticism. have discernment, do not just go with the flow and dont trust the 

counterfeit. 

what do i mean by counterfeit? well, how often does a counterfeit look fake? most of the 

time it doesnt. the fake $20 bill looks the same as the real $20. this is where your 

skepticism comes into play. 

so how you gonna do this? the same holds true for both Christians and non-Christians. 

test the message and check the messenger. Christians, does it contradict the Bible, does 

it contradict a clear Word from the Lord? non-Christians, does it contradict your truths? 

does it contradict your goals in life? for both, you need to check the messenger, their 

track records and character count. 

whether Christian or non-Christian you are responsible for who you follow. 

so when you are trying to detect the baloney as sagan puts it, consider what i have said. 

who are you gonna listen to? 


917





Subject: Catholic School- Journal 

I had no idea what I was going to write about this week. I was thinking and then the comment of the 

Catholic school girl thing sparked my attention. As you all know I attended Catholic school from 

Kindergarten through Twelfth grade. I guess I am not the stereotype of your typical school girl who is 

wild and crazy but I really enjoyed my schooling experience. I am not going to lie...it was very strict at 

times but I think that kids do need that structure or else you could get a couple of those wild Catholic 

School girls on your hands! And believe me I know what you all are talking about because I had a few 

in my grade. 

Anyway the point I wanted to write about is the reason why I want to teach in a Catholic school verses 

a Public school despite the $8,000 difference in pay. I believe that it is very important to be able to 

talk about what you believe in. I think my faith is what gets me through each day. I base so many of 

my thoughts and decisions on that...so if a child asked me about God or heaven or hell...we could 

have a conversation about it without getting me getting fired. I also like the structure of Catholic 

school. I think that so many teachers get so burned out because they have to put up with very difficult 

students. I am not saying we should give up on those students but teachers have a lot to do with 

parent involvement and discipline in the Catholic schools. 

When we go around and share what grade we want to teach...I would really love second. The reason 

for this is this is the year they make their first communion-which is a sacrament in the church-and I 

would enjoy to prepare them for that and guide them through it. I want to be a teacher no matter what 

and where but this would be my first choice. So this is how I feel about the community of Catholics 

schools. 

To Ann- I really don't know what to say other then I want to tell you this story of a good friend of mine. 

He is always in Church on Sunday. He is also gay. I asked him once...what makes you come to 

church every week even though the church is telling you that you can be gay...you just can't practice 

being gay. And he told me that is the religion in which he believes and if that is the way the church 

feels then he will continue praying about it. To me this seems so hard but it just what he believes. So I 

thought I would share this story with you. Some people just believe what they believe and have faith 

in that. I know that doesn't help much though! Casey Cunningham 

918





Subject: Re: awareness 

so then wouldnt it be "pretty cool" when the awareness happens? then our heads arent in 

the sand any longer. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/04 Thu AM 11:21:13 PST 

> To: 

> Subject: awareness 

> 

> I was going to say that the only reason you are seeing more Flu stuff is that because 

now you are aware of it, but Cynthia beat me to it (surprise!). I do want to make a 

comment on Karis's reaction that it was "pretty cool how that happens." Well, no, it's not 

cool at all. This is the same reason that white people don't think there is a problem with 

racism, and why straight people don't understand why the gay people feel so discriminated 

against. It's an unfortunate human trait, most people have their heads in the sand and 

think if everything is ok for them, it must be for everyone else. 

> 

> 


919




To: Mike Runnestrand; icp-f@csusm.edu 

Subject: RE: awareness 

Wow! Mike that sucks but your right. You always know what's going on, on the 

flip side 

huh. 

>I was going to say that the only reason you are seeing more Flu stuff is that 

because 

now you are aware of it, but Cynthia beat me to it (surprise!). I do want to 

make a 

comment on Karis's reaction that it was "pretty cool how that happens." Well, 

no, it's not 

cool at all. This is the same reason that white people don't think there is a 

problem with 

racism, and why straight people don't understand why the gay people feel so 

discriminated against. It's an unfortunate human trait, most people have their 

heads in 

the sand and think if everything is ok for them, it must be for everyone else. 

920




To: ICP-F 

Subject: totally random 

I saw this quote and thought of you guys... 

"A good essay is 10% inspiration, 15% perspiration, and 75% desperation" 

Then our paper must be the best one yet!! hee hee 

921






Re: awareness of racism 

You make a good point about this. Living in California, I don't think we see the level of racism that 

exists in other areas of the country. I think it gives us a false sense of "everything is OK, racism is a 

thing of the past". A few weeks ago, I had a dinner meeting for one of my other classes. One of the 

students brought her mom that was visiting from VERMONT. She was extremely racist and wasn't 

even aware of it. We had some intersting conversations. I was not aware that some people in the 

northeast were racist. Granted, she is from an older generation, but still, what an eye opener. I think a 

good experiment is for white people to go into ethnic communities. I have done this often. It gives you 

a little taste of what it is like to be looked at with suspicion, just because of how you look. If you go 

back enough times, they get to know you and their attitudes change. People need to take the time to 

get to know others as individuals, not as part of a certain group. It is too easy to 

generalize (stereotype) when you classify people according to color, sexuality, religion etc. 

Cynthia 


I was going to say that the only reason you are seeing more Flu stuff is that because now you are 

aware of it, but Cynthia beat me to it (surprise!). I do want to make a comment on Karis's reaction 

that it was "pretty cool how that happens." Well, no, it's not cool at all. This is the same reason that 

white people don't think there is a problem with racism, and why straight people don't understand 

why the gay people feel so discriminated against. It's an unfortunate human trait, most people 

have their heads in the sand and think if everything is ok for them, it must be for everyone else. 

_____ 



922






I'm saying it shouldn't be something that needs to hit you. If people open 

their eyes then it won't take some BS cal state class to let them know that 

just because their lives are great, other people's don't completely suck. No 

one's "wow" moment should be "Whoa, slavery was bad!" 

>From: 


>To: 

>Subject: Re: awareness 

>Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:25:52 -0800 

> 

>so then wouldnt it be "pretty cool" when the awareness happens? then our 

>heads arent in the sand any longer. 

> > 


> > Date: 2004/03/04 Thu AM 11:21:13 PST 

> > To: 

> > Subject: awareness 

> > 

> > I was going to say that the only reason you are seeing more Flu stuff is 

>that because now you are aware of it, but Cynthia beat me to it 

>(surprise!). I do want to make a comment on Karis's reaction that it was 

>"pretty cool how that happens." Well, no, it's not cool at all. This is the 

>same reason that white people don't think there is a problem with racism, 

>and why straight people don't understand why the gay people feel so 

>discriminated against. It's an unfortunate human trait, most people have 

>their heads in the sand and think if everything is ok for them, it must be 

>for everyone else. 

> > 

> > 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



923






I agree. Now we just have to try to become more aware of everything. Boy, are we gonna be busy!! 

Cynthia 


so then wouldnt it be "pretty cool" when the awareness happens? then our heads arent in the 

sand any longer. 

> 

> From: "Mike Runnestrand" 

> Date: 2004/03/04 Thu AM 11:21:13 PST 

> To: 

> Subject: awareness 

> 

> I was going to say that the only reason you are seeing more Flu stuff is that because now you 

are aware of it, but Cynthia beat me to it (surprise!). I do want to make a comment on Karis's 

reaction that it was "pretty cool how that happens." Well, no, it's not cool at all. This is the same 

reason that white people don't think there is a problem with racism, and why straight people don't 

understand why the gay people feel so discriminated against. It's an unfortunate human trait, most 

people have their heads in the sand and think if everything is ok for them, it must be for everyone 

else. 

> 

> 


_____ 



924



Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2004 12:17 PM 


Subject: Re: baloney detection 

I just read the boloney chapter, thanks for sparking my interest. I thought this was one of the better 

ones (till he started picking on my cigarettes at the end, lol). The detection kit could be valuable if 

used properly, although I think this would probably be hard for those on a mission to get their way 

about something. I also think some of his examples are a bit biased by his beliefs. The part about 

Ramtha at the beginning was very entertaining for me; I actually know a lady that is a follower!!! Dare 

I admit that? She is also a pyschologist, go figure. OK, end of book report. 

Cynthia 

Now, to connect this to the Cancer bandwagon article. Um....maybe they should read the boloney 

chapter. It seems to me if you focus all your resources on one hypothesis, you are taking a big 

chance that you are right. It may seem like the logical thing to do, but I personally don't think so. In 

the case of cancer, maybe that is why it is taking so long to figure out how to effectively deal with the 

disease. It's kind of like the flu virus. They thought they were dealing with a bacteria, focused soley on 

that, and guess what, they were wrong. What if some people had gone in another direction? Could it 

have made a difference? Maybe not in the case of the flu, because it didn't last long enough. But I 

think with other things, jumping on the bandwagon could be detrimental to your health or your life! 


so i was reading in Sagan, his chapter on detecting the baloney and how imporant it is to test 

everything. it raises the question, who are you gonna listen to in life? 

in order to decipher the truth and to detect the baloney (for us Christians it's the Bible, for others it 

may be something different)you have to be open but skeptical. how do you do both?? 

there is a happy medium in which your openness leads to growth and your skeptisim leads to 

discernment. 

for me the skepticism comes natural, especially when it comes to other beliefs or challenges 

against my beliefs. 

opennes on the other hand is hard for me to grasp. how can a strong Christian be open, doesnt 

that mean i am willing to change my beliefs? well, no. it means i still have so much to learn, so 

much more to grow. i dont by any means know every word in the Bible. when is the last time you 

m emorized over 1000 pages. impossible right, well not to me b/c i desire to learn everything i can 

about my God and His Word. thus im open to grow. 

so lemme put this into context of a non-Christian. you have beliefs, dont you? you have your set 

ways just as i do. you are skeptical to change those ways and not so open to hand them over and 

believe something foreign to you. so where is your happy medium? well, its lies in an openness to 

grow, to learn, to listen. but dont leave out skepticism. have discernment, do not just go with the 

flow and dont trust the counterfeit. 

what do i mean by counterfeit? well, how often does a counterfeit look fake? most of the time it 

doesnt. the fake $20 bill looks the same as the real $20. this is where your skepticism comes into 

play. 

925

so how you gonna do this? the same holds true for both Christians and non-Christians. test the 

message and check the messenger. Christians, does it contradict the Bible, does it contradict a 

clear Wo rd from the Lord? non-Christians, does it contradict your truths? does it contradict your 

goals in life? for both, you need to check the messenger, their track records and character count. 

whether Christian or non-Christian you are responsible for who you follow. 

so when you are trying to detect the baloney as sagan puts it, consider what i have said. who are 

you gonna listen to? 


_____ 



926






On the whole, I think it is "pretty cool" when we become aware of 

something - sort of like learning something new. But, on the flip side, 

what might make it "not so cool" is when you become aware of something 

and choose to ignore, remain ignorant or become complacent about what 

you have become aware of. An example of this would be becoming aware of 

a child being abused. As teachers we are mandated to report suspected 

child abuse. As citizens or aliens (whatever the case), if we are aware 

of this type of situation, we should take the responsibility and report 

it. Now I realize we can't go around acting on everything we become 

aware of (although I did wear a sign around my neck when I was pregnant 

with Nick saying "yes I am PREGNANT and not just FAT") for those who 

weren't aware that I was actually pregnant - that's a whole other story! 

But it is in our power, when we do become aware of something (especially 

something as ugly as abuse) to report it, shed light on it, find out 

more about it - just do something about it. Okay, I'm off my soap box! 

TTFN ~ Louise 






I was going to say that the only reason you are seeing more Flu stuff is 

that because now you are aware of it, but Cynthia beat me to it 

(surprise!). I do want to make a comment on Karis's reaction that it was 

"pretty cool how that happens." Well, no, it's not cool at all. This is 

the same reason that white people don't think there is a problem with 

racism, and why straight people don't understand why the gay people feel 

so discriminated against. It's an unfortunate human trait, most people 

have their heads in the sand and think if everything is ok for them, it 

must be for everyone else. 

927






That's right, Louise. With awareness comes responsibility. Cynthia 


On the whole, I think it is "pretty cool" when we become aware of 

something - sort of like learning something new. But, on the flip side, 

what might make it "not so cool" is when you become aware of something 

and choose to ignore, remain ignorant or become complacent about what 

you have become aware of. An example of this would be becoming aware of 

a child being abused. As teachers we are mandated to report suspected 

child abuse. As citizens or aliens (whatever the case), if we are aware 

of this type of situation, we should take the responsibility and report 

it. Now I realize we can't go around acting on everything we become 

aware of (although I did wear a sign around my neck when I was pregnant 

with Nick saying "yes I am PREGNANT and not just FAT") for those who 

weren't aware that I was actually pregnant - that's a whole other story! 

But it is in our power, when we do become aware of something (especially 

something as ugly as abuse) to report it, shed light on it, find out 

more about it - just do something about it. Okay, I'm off my soap box! 

TTFN ~ Louise 






I was going to say that the only reason you are seeing more Flu stuff is 

that because now you are aware of it, but Cynthia beat me to it 

(surprise!). I do want to make a comment on Karis's reaction that it was 


the same reason that white people don't think there is a problem with 

racism, and why straight people don't understand why the gay people feel 

so discriminated against. It's an unfortunate human trait, most people 

have their heads in the sand and think if everyt hing is ok for them, it 

must be for everyone else. 

_____ 


928


929





Subject: MI NOMBRE 

DEAR CLASS, 

I THOUGHT THAT WITH ALL OF THE DISCUSSIONS ABOUT GOD AND STUFF AND HOW WE PLAN 

TO BE EDUCATORS AND JUST EVERYTHING THAT IT WAS ABOUT TIME TO SHARE WITH YALL 

WHO I WAS NAMED AFTER AND SOME OF THIS TEACHERS REMARKABLE KNOWLEDGE. PLEASE 

TAKE THE TIME TO READ BECAUSE I DON'T SHARE THIS INFORMATION WITH ANYBODY 

ALTHOUGH IT IS ONLY A CLICK AWAY. START ON CHAPTER THIRTEEN AND GO THROUGH 

FIFTEEN THERE IS OTHER INTERESTING INFORMATION ON THIS WEBSITE SO CHECK IT OUT 

IF YOU WANT. 

PEACE, 

MATHENO 

http://reluctant-messenger.com/aquarian_gospel.htm 

couldn't get it to work as a hyperlink 

930





Subject: Re: MI NOMBRE 

Hi Matheno, I am currently reading some stuff on the link you listed. Am I correct in thinking that this 

is based on the work of Edgar Cayce? I was reading the part about evolution and it mentioned the 

infinite number of universes. I think Sagan mentioned that in the baloney chapter. I am not saying its 

baloney, just making a connection to our reading. Anyway, I am going to continue reading; it is pretty 

interesting. Thanks for sharing, I will get back to you when I finish. Cynthia 


DEAR CLASS, 

I THOUGHT THAT WITH ALL OF THE DISCUSSIONS ABOUT GOD AND STUFF AND HOW 

WE PLAN 

TO BE EDUCATORS AND JUST EVERYTHING THAT IT WAS ABOUT TIME TO SHARE WITH 

YALL 

WHO I WAS NAMED AFTER AND SOME OF THIS TEACHERS REMARKABLE KNOWLEDGE. 

PLEASE 


ALTHOUGH IT IS ONLY A CLICK AWAY. START ON CHAPTER THIRTEEN AND GO 

THROUGH 

FIFTEEN THERE IS OTHER INTERESTING INFORMATION ON THIS WEBSITE SO CHECK IT 

OUT 

IF YOU WANT. 

PEACE, 

MATHENO 



_____ 



931





Subject: RE: awareness-LOUISE 

Louise, 

Whats a soap box? 



>To: 

>Subject: RE: awareness 

>Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:35:28 -0800 

> 

>On the whole, I think it is "pretty cool" when we become aware of 

>something - sort of like learning something new. But, on the flip side, 

>what might make it "not so cool" is when you become aware of something 

>and choose to ignore, remain ignorant or become complacent about what 

>you have become aware of. An example of this would be becoming aware of 

>a child being abused. As teachers we are mandated to report suspected 

>child abuse. As citizens or aliens (whatever the case), if we are aware 

>of this type of situation, we should take the responsibility and report 

>it. Now I realize we can't go around acting on everything we become 

>aware of (although I did wear a sign around my neck when I was pregnant 

>with Nick saying "yes I am PREGNANT and not just FAT") for those who 

>weren't aware that I was actually pregnant - that's a whole other story! 

>But it is in our power, when we do become aware of something (especially 

>something as ugly as abuse) to report it, shed light on it, find out 

>more about it - just do something about it. Okay, I'm off my soap box! 


> 

> 


>From: Mike Runnestrand [mailto:mikerunnestrand@hotmail.com] 

>Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2004 11:21 AM 


>Subject: awareness 

> 

> 

>I was going to say that the only reason you are seeing more Flu stuff is 


>(surprise!). I do want to make a comment on Karis's reaction that it was 

>"pretty cool how that happens." Well, no, it's not cool at all. This is 

>the same reason that white people don't think there is a problem with 

>racism, and why straight people don't understand why the gay people feel 

>so discriminated against. It's an unfortunate human trait, most people 

>have their heads in the sand and think if everything is ok for them, it 

>must be for everyone else. 

> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



932






2. A temporary platform used while making an impromptu or nonofficial public speech. 

It is kind of an old-fashioned term, Carrie, lol. Dare I say I am showing my age, since I know this? I 

have no idea why Louise knows what it means. Cynthia 


Louise, 




>To: 


>Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:35:28 -0800 

> 









>it. Now I realize w e can't go around acting on everything we become 








> 

> 






> 

> 



>(surprise!). I do want to make a comment on Karis's reaction that i t was 

933







> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



934





Subject: Re: MI NOMBRE 

Matheno, were you really named after the person in the book? That is kind of cool. To be honest, I 

had never heard the name before I met you. Glad to know where it came from. 

What I find particularly interesting is that this was transcribed near the time the Book of Mormon was 

transcribed, and both done in the United States. I wonder if what was happening during this time has 

anything to do with spiritual people searching for more answers, like maybe the accepted doctrine of 

conventional churches wasn't answering all their questions. I think I would need to do more research 

on this to draw any real conclusions. But another connection: I think the Mormons believe in the 

multiple universe thing too, but with a twist. Maybe I should stop here, this could take years to figure 

out. The rest of my comment is down below, I sort of messed up on the order I pasted stuff. 

"Levi is the transcriber, but who is the author of the Aquarian Gospel? None other than Jesus, Christ 

Himself, wrote this book! How can this be? Jesus knew that every word He spoke and every act He 

performed was being recorded in The Book Of God's Remembrance; and He knew that 1,800 years 

after His lifetime, a man would be born into the world who would gain enough strength to open our 

Father’s sacred Recording, and thereby become a direct eyewitness to all the events of Jesus’ life; 

and he would transcribe a totally accurate and detailed account of His life and teachings." 

Akashic Records 

_____ 

A theosophical term referring to an universal filing system which records every occurring thought, 

word, and action. The records are impressed on a subtle substance called akasha (or Soniferous 

Ether). In Hindu mysticism this akasha is thought to be the primary principle of nature from which the 

other four natural principles, fire, air, earth, and water, are created. These five principles also 

represent the five senses of the human being. 

Some indicate the akashic records are similar to a Cosmic or collective consciousness. The records 

have been referred to by different names including the Cosmic Mind, the Universal Mind, the 

collective unconscious, or the collective subconscious. Others think the akashic records make 

clairvoyance and psychic perception possible. 

From what I read, Levi was a preacher during the Civil War era. And he somehow transcribed "The 

Book of Remembrance" or Akashic Records, which in Levi's version is the Aquarian Book on the link 

you posted. Evidently, Edgar Cayce, also transcribed the records. I read some of his stuff a million 

years ago, although I don't recall it being religious, but I could be wrong. In my opinion, he was rather 

odd, a bit far out there for me. Cynthia 


DEAR CLASS, 

935

I THOUGHT THAT WITH ALL OF THE DISCUSSIONS ABOUT GOD AND STUFF AND HOW 

WE PLAN 

TO BE EDUCATORS AND JUST EVERYTHING THAT IT WAS ABOUT TIME TO SHARE WITH 

YALL 

WHO I WAS NAMED AFTER AND SOME OF THIS TEACHERS REMARKABLE KNOWLEDGE. 

PLEASE 


ALTHOUGH IT IS ONLY A CLICK AWAY. START ON CHAPTER THIRTEEN AND GO 

THROUGH 

FIFTEEN THERE IS OTHER INTERESTING INFORMATION ON THIS WEBSITE SO CHECK IT 

OUT 

IF YOU WANT. 

PEACE, 

MATHENO 



_____ 



936



Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 12:23 AM 


Subject: Re: Catholic School- Journal 

Hey Casey, 

I realize that I express myself a lot sometimes; I just get so passionate about things that are so 

important. I get very frustrated and sad with how the world really works. I sometimes think 

that somehow I can make a difference, that I can make the world a better place. I have to realize that 

what I see so vividly clear, is not visible to a lot people. 

Thanks for responding , 

Ann 


I had no idea what I was going to write about this week. I was thinking and then the comment of 

the Catholic school girl thing sparked my attention. As you all know I attended Catholic school 

from Kindergarten through Twelfth grade. I guess I am not the stereotype of your typical school 

girl who is wild and crazy but I really enjoyed my schooling experience. I am not going to lie...it 

was very strict at times but I think that kids do need that structure or else you could get a couple of 

those wild Catholic School girls on your hands! And believe me I know what you all are talking 

about because I had a few in my grade. 

Anyway the point I wanted to write about is the reason why I want to teach in a Catholic school 

verses a Public school despite the $8,000 difference in pay. I believe that it is very important to be 

able to talk about what you believe in. I think my faith is what gets me through each day. I base so 

many of my thoughts and decisions on that...so if a child asked me about God or heaven or 

hell...we could have a conversation about it without getting me getting fired. I also like the 

structure of Catholic school. I think that so many teachers get so burned out because they have to 

put up with very difficult students. I am not saying we should give up on those students but 

teachers have a lot to do with parent involvement and discipline in the Catholic schools. 

When we go around and share what grade we want to teach...I would really love second. The 

reason for this is this is the year they make their first communion-which is a sacrament in the 

church-and I would enjoy to prepare them for that and guide them through it. I want to be a 

teacher no matter what and where but this would be my first choice. So this is how I feel about the 

community of Catholics schools. 

To Ann- I really don't know what to say other then I want to tell you this story of a good friend of 

mine. He is always in Church on Sunday. He is also gay. I asked him once...what makes you 

come to church every week even though the church is telling you that you can be gay...you just 

can't practice being gay. And he told me that is the religion in which he believes and if that is the 

way the church feels then he will continue praying about it. To me this seems so hard but it just 

what he believes. So I thought I would share this story with you. Some people just believe what 

they believe and have faith in that. I know that doesn't help much though! 


_____ 

937



938






You made my day Cynthia! :) ~ Louise 






2. A temporary platform used while making an impromptu or nonofficial public speech. 

It is kind of an old-fashioned term, Carrie, lol. Dare I say I am showing my age, since I know this? I 

have no idea why Louise knows what it means. Cynthia 


Louise, 




>To: 


>Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:35:28 -0800 

> 









>it. Now I realize w e can't go around acting on everything we become 








> 

> 


939

_____ 





> 

> 



>(surprise!). I do want to make a comment on Karis's reaction that i t was 

>"pretty cool how that happens." Well, no, it's not cool at all. This is 






> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 





940





Subject: Re: Catholic School- Journal 

But that does not mean that you should give up. The same goes with a lot of things...especially 

religion. A lot of people do not believe what I believe but that does not mean I am going to stop 

believing. Casey 

941




To: AKeshavarz@aol.com; Duches5548@aol.com; GIB2AC@aol.com; GIB3kc@aol.com; 

HanaeAXO@aol.com; hotaling@sandiego.edu; Lilcookie01@aol.com; Phillips, Amanda J; 

Turbochickengrl@aol.com; Alfred Pecson; Azer Maggay; Christopher McMullin; Dejay 

Dejurnett; Emily Roads; ICP-F@csusm.edu; Irene; Melissa Nohr; Renee Bond; Tanja 

Schroeder 

Hi, 

I am creating a birthday calendar for myself. Can you please click on the link 

below and enter your birthday for me. Don't worry it is quick, and you don't 

have to enter your year of birth:-). 

http://www.BirthdayAlarm.com/dob/11945532a525203569b363 

Thanks, 

Teresa 

942



Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 12:19 PM 


Subject: RE: A really BIG one.... 

I think you are totally putting the female topic or any of the other topics 

you suggested, out of context. Of course women had to take a course of action 

in order to vote. They were trying to gain voting rights that would then 

affect our government system. But saying this is the same thing with 

homosexual rights is bogus! 

Ann, in a calmer matter I think that whatever I say about my beliefs, you are 

just going to contradict them no matter what. That's fine because that's what 

you believe in. I on the other hand have different beliefs than yours. Anyone 

can see that we are both truly passionate about what we believe in, but 

whatever I go through in my life I know that God will always be right with me 

and that brings so much comfort in my life. Therefore, I am going to stand for 

my christian beliefs and I know God will guide my ways. God bless! 

"I can do everything through him who gives me strength" Phillippians 4:13. 

Laurie :) 


>I forgot this really big one: 

> 

>Maybe more people can relate to this one... 

>I love the feminist, but hate what she stands for... 

>because it goes against the church, the bible (Old Version - Bible 1.1, New 

Version - Bible 1.2 ...); yet without her and what she stands for, where would 

any of us females be today? 

> 

>Sense? Nonsense? Data: Input: Theory 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



943






Laurie, 

By your responses it feels as though you are getting angry. I am growing frustrated myself. Let's just 

leave it alone and agree that we do not agree. I think no matter how I try to explain my stance, you 

will block it with your bible. I feel that I am totally right and valid in my thoughts, feelings, and 

knowledge of the homosexual community. You feel you are totally right and valid in your thoughts, 

feelings, and knowledge of living in the christian community. I would not want this to cause ripples in 

our working relationship. 

"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke 

(1729-97) 

Ann 


I think you are totally putting the female topic or any of the other topics 

you suggested, out of context. Of course women had to take a course of action 

in order to vote. They were trying to gain voting rights that would then 


homosexual rights is bogus! 

Ann, in a calmer matter I think that whatever I say about my beliefs, you are 

just going to contradict them no matter what. That's fine because that's what 

you believe in. I on the other hand have different beliefs than yours. Anyone 

can see that we are both truly passionate about what we believe in, but 

whatever I go through in my life I know that God will always be right with me 

and that brings so much comfort in my life. Therefore, I am going to stand for 

my christian beliefs and I know God will guide my ways. God bless! 

"I can do everything through him who gives me strength" Phillippians 4:13. 

Laurie :) 


>I forgot this really big one: 

> 

>Maybe more people can relate to this one... 

>I love the feminist, but hate what she stands for... 

>because it goes against the church, the bible (Old Version - Bible 1.1, New 

944

Version - Bible 1.2 ...); yet without her and what she stands for, where would 

any of us females be today? 

> 

>Sense? Nonsense? Data: Input: Theory 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 



945





Subject: RE: Catholic School- Journal 

I think it is very hard to make the whole world a better place. We have to 

start small. We 

must first learn how to shine the light in one corner of the world. Ann I 

think you are doing 

a very good job at it. 

>Hey Casey, 

> 

>I realize that I express myself a lot sometimes; I just get so passionate 

about things that 

are so important. I get very frustrated and sad with how the world really 

works. I 

sometimes think that somehow I can make a difference, that I can make the 

world a better 

place. I have to realize that what I see so vividly clear, is not visible to 

a lot people. 

>Thanks for responding , 

>Ann 

> 

>CA222girl@aol.com wrote: 

>I had no idea what I was going to write about this week. I was thinking and 

then the 

comment of the Catholic school girl thing sparked my attention. As you all 

know I 

attended Catholic school from Kindergarten through Twelfth grade. I guess I am 

not the 

stereotype of your typical school girl who is wild and crazy but I really 

enjoyed my 

schooling experience. I am not going to lie...it was very strict at times but 

I think that kids 

do need that structure or else you could get a couple of those wild Catholic 

School girls 

on your hands! And believe me I know what you all are talking about because I 

had a few 

in my grade. 

> 

>Anyway the point I wanted to write about is the reason why I want to teach in 

a Catholic 

school verses a Public school despite the $8,000 difference in pay. I believe 

that it is very 

important to be able to talk about what you believe in. I think my faith is 

what gets me 

through each day. I base so many of my thoughts and decisions on that...so if 

a child 

asked me about God or heaven or hell...we could have a conversation about it 

without 

getting me getting fired. I also like the structure of Catholic school. I 

think that so many 

teachers get so burned out because they have to put up with very difficult 

students. I am 

not saying we should give up on those students but teachers have a lot to do 

with parent 

involvement and discipline in the Catholic schools. 

946

>When we go around and share what grade we want to teach...I would really love 

second. The reason for this is this is the year they make their first 

communion-which is a 

sacrament in the church-and I would enjoy to prepare them for that and guide 

them 

through it. I want to be a teacher no matter what and where but this would be 

my first 

choice. So this is how I feel about the community of Catholics schools. 

> 

>To Ann- I really don't know what to say other then I want to tell you this 

story of a good 

friend of mine. He is always in Church on Sunday. He is also gay. I asked him 

once...what makes you come to church every week even though the church is 

telling you 

that you can be gay...you just can't practice being gay. And he told me that 

is the religion 

in which he believes and if that is the way the church feels then he will 

continue praying 

about it. To me this seems so hard but it just what he believes. So I thought 

I would share 

this story with you. Some people just believe what they believe and have faith 

in that. I 

know that doesn't help much though! 


> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



947





Subject: RE: (none) 

When is your birthday Teresa? Marin 

>Hi, 

> 

>I am creating a birthday calendar for myself. Can you please click on the 

link 

>below and enter your birthday for me. Don't worry it is quick, and you don't 

>have to enter your year of birth:-). 

> 

> http://www.BirthdayAlarm.com/dob/11945532a525203569b363 

> 

>Thanks, 

>Teresa 

948




To: journal 

Subject: awareness/flu 

OK, I am watching "Joan of Arcadia"; its a re-run, which I saw before. This kid mentions the flu 

epidemic of 1918, wondering why it is still so obscure even though it killed more people than WW1. 

Last time I saw this episode, I didn't even notice that. Of course, it was before school started. More 

apparent proof that we notice things when we are aware of them!! Cynthia 

_____ 



949




To: journal 

Subject: Doable Problems 

Did anybody read this article? Personally, I think it was written in a very complicated manner 

(unnecessarily so), but really isn't all that complicated. I think the author must have felt the need to 

sound scholarly for some reason. So here is how I tried to connect it to something we are familiar 

with. Feel free to give your imput. 

Work Organization: Experiment, Laboratory, Social World 

"Experiment" could be the students and the work they do in school. 

"Laboratory" could be the teacher and the classroom. 

"Social World" could be the school administration, Dept. of Ed, parents etc. 

Articulation sort of works to tie these different entities together. The teacher plans the experiments 

(lessons, projects), based on standards or whatever the administration recommends/orders. The 

teacher also administers the tests to show results of learning, which is used to show the important 

people and parents proof that students are producing a product in their experiments. The curriculum 

would also be articulation. So would the "Blueprint for Success", "No Child Left Behind" etc. 

OK, does anybody feel better off knowing this? LOL. Me either. Ok, going back to watch "Test the 

Nation". Cynthia 

_____ 



950



Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 10:42 AM 



I agree, 

Awareness........... Hmmmmm...awareness and what I am aware of....... 

I notice my topics in almost every aspect of our society because I am aware of them. I have been 

aware of the unequal view and treatment of women in our society my whole life. I have been aware 

of the unequal view and treatment of homosexuals for about half of my life. I don't think America was 

aware at how many homosexual couples there were that had the fortitude to stand up and make the 

gesture of getting married either. Just think of how many there are in our society that remain quiet in 

our society...... 

Awareness........... Hmmmm.... awareness and what I am aware of......... Ann 


OK, I am watching "Joan of Arcadia"; its a re-run, which I saw before. This kid mentions the flu 

epidemic of 1918, wondering why it is still so obscure even though it killed more people than 

WW1. Last time I saw this episode, I didn't even notice that. Of course, it was before school 

started. More apparent proof that we notice things when we are aware of them!! Cynthia 

_____ 



_____ 



951






Ann, 

So if both of you do nothing, in order to not disrupt an already supposed 

"working relationship". Does that mean that evil will now triumph? (based on 

your quote) 




>Subject: RE: A really BIG one.... 

>Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:33:46 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>Laurie, 

> 

>By your responses it feels as though you are getting angry. I am growing 

>frustrated myself. Let's just leave it alone and agree that we do not 

>agree. I think no matter how I try to explain my stance, you will block it 

>with your bible. I feel that I am totally right and valid in my thoughts, 

>feelings, and knowledge of the homosexual community. You feel you are 

>totally right and valid in your thoughts, feelings, and knowledge of living 

>in the christian community. I would not want this to cause ripples in our 

>working relationship. 

> 

> 

>"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do 

>nothing." - Edmund Burke (1729-97) 

> 

> 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 

>mcdon032 wrote: 

>I think you are totally putting the female topic or any of the other topics 

>you suggested, out of context. Of course women had to take a course of 

>action 

>in order to vote. They were trying to gain voting rights that would then 

>affect our government system. But saying this is the same thing with 

>homosexual rights is bogus! 

> 

>Ann, in a calmer matter I think that whatever I say about my beliefs, you 

>are 

>just going to contradict them no matter what. That's fine because that's 

>what 

>you believe in. I on the other hand have different beliefs than yours. 

>Anyone 

>can see that we are both truly passionate about what we believe in, but 

>whatever I go through in my life I know that God will always be right with 

>me 

>and that brings so much comfort in my life. Therefore, I am going to stand 

>for 

>my christian beliefs and I know God will guide my ways. God bless! 

> 

>"I can do everything through him who gives me strength" Phillippians 4:13. 

> 

>Laurie :) 

952

> >===== Original Message From Ann Kirkendall ===== 

> >I forgot this really big one: 

> > 

> >Maybe more people can relate to this one... 

> >I love the feminist, but hate what she stands for... 

> >because it goes against the church, the bible (Old Version - Bible 1.1, 

>New 

>Version - Bible 1.2 ...); yet without her and what she stands for, where 

>would 

>any of us females be today? 

> > 

> >Sense? Nonsense? Data: Input: Theory 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 


> >Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Frustrated with dial-up? Lightning-fast Internet access for as low as 

$29.95/month. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200360ave/direct/01/ 

953





Subject: RE: Catholic School- Journal 

Importance: Low 

but, where is the middle ground? Only two sides have been presented, any gray, any blue, any pink, 

any truth???????????????????????? http://graphics.hotmail.com/i.p.emdgust.gif 



>To: Ann Kirkendall , ICP-F 

>Subject: RE: Catholic School- Journal 

>Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:42:30 -0800 

> 

>I think it is very hard to make the whole world a better place. We have to 

>start small. We 

>must first learn how to shine the light in one corner of the world. Ann I 

>think you are doing 

>a very good job at it. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >Hey Casey, 

> > 

> >I realize that I express myself a lot sometimes; I just get so passionate 

>about things that 

>are so important. I get very frustrated and sad with how the world really 

>works. I 

>sometimes think that somehow I can make a difference, that I can make the 

>world a better 

>place. I have to realize that what I see so vividly clear, is not visible to 

>a lot people. 

> >Thanks for responding , 

> >Ann 

> > 

> >CA222girl@aol.com wrote: 

> >I had no idea what I was going to write about this week. I was thinking and 

>then the 

954

comment of the Catholic school girl thing sparked my attention. As you all 

>know I 

>attended Catholic school from Kindergarten through Twelfth grade. I guess I am 

>not the 

>stereotype of your typical school girl who is wild and crazy but I really 

>enjoyed my 

>schooling experience. I am not going to lie...it was very strict at times but 

>I think that kids 

>do need that structure or else you could get a couple of those wild Catholic 

>School girls 

>on your hands! And believe me I know what you all are talking about because I 

>had a few 

>in my grade. 

> > 

> >Anyway the point I wanted to write about is the reason why I want to teach in 

>a Catholic 

>school verses a Public school despite the $8,000 difference in pay. I believe 

>that it is very 

>important to be able to talk about what you believe in. I think my faith is 

>what gets me 

>through each day. I base so many of my thoughts and decisions on that...so if 

>a child 

>asked me about God or heaven or hell...we could have a conversation about it 

>without 

>getting me getting fired. I also like the structure of Catholic school. I 

>think that so many 

>teachers get so burned out because they have to put up with very difficult 

>students. I am 

>not saying we should give up on those students but teachers have a lot to do 

>with parent 

>involvement and discipline in the Catholic schools. 

> > 

> >When we go around and share what grade we want to teach...I would really love 

>second. The reason for this is this is the year they make their first 

>communion-which is a 

>sacrament in the church-and I would enjoy to prepare them for that and guide 

>them 

>through it. I want to be a teacher no matter what and where but this would be 

>my first 

>choice. So this is how I feel about the community of Catholics schools. 

> > 

> >To Ann- I really don't know what to say other then I want to tell you this 

>story of a good 

>friend of mine. He is always in Church on Sunday. He is also gay. I asked him 

>once...what makes you come to church every week even though the church is 

>telling you 

>that you can be gay...you just can't practice being gay. And he told me that 

>is the religion 

>in which he believes and if that is the way the church feels then he will 

>continue praying 

>about it. To me this seems so hard but it just what he believes. So I thought 

>I would share 

>this story with you. Some people just believe what they believe and have faith 

955

in that. I 

>know that doesn't help much though! 

>Casey Cunningham 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

_____ 

Fast. Reliable. Get MSN 9 Dial-up - 3 months for the price of 1! (Limited-time Offer) 

956





Subject: Journal entry #xxxx 

Awareness, 

"Blackbird singing in the dead of night 

Take these broken wings and learn to fly 

All your life 

You were only waiting for this moment to arise 

Blackbird singing in the dead of night 

Take these sunken eyes and learn to see 

All your life 

You were only waiting for this moment to be free. 

Blackbird fly Blackbird fly 

Into the light of the dark black night. 

Blackbird fly Blackbird fly 

Into the light of the dark black night. 

Blackbird singing in the dead of night 

Take these broken wings and learn to fly 

All your life 



You were only waiting for this moment to arise." 

(John Lennon/Paul McCartney) 

Ann 

_____ 



957






Robert, 

No, this means that because we have to work on projects together and because I do not want to 

make it so uncomfortable that it interferes with that requirement that maybe this is a door that is not 

ready to be opened. 

I was trying to open another door that more people could relate too, but people do not see my 

connection to society and how other areas have drifted from the male dominated words of the bible. 

For example: feminism...does it not go against the views of the bible to submitting yourself to 

"males" and all the male centeredness of the bible?.... Man's SEED, Virginity, is she a Madonna or is 

she a whore? Woman are portrayed as second class scapegoats for so many things in society. Eve 

ate the apple... it's her fault, she talked Adam into eating the apple too. Bad eve.... it's all her fault for 

how society treats women, etc. 

But if people can not see that real life and what is written in the bible have changed when women 

fought for more equal rights, then they can not connect it to homosexuality and their fight for more 

equal rights. So it seems as though until they can understand point A, they can not understand point 

B (which is harder to understand). 

I am growing frustrated and running out of ways to explain it (nicely explain it that is). I am sadly 

realizing that there are certain groups of people who just don't understand what I am talking about. 

Ann 


Ann, 



your quote) 






> 

>Laurie, 

> 






958

totally right and valid in your thoughts, feelings, and knowl edge of living 



> 

> 



> 

> 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 




>action 




> 


>are 


>what 


>Anyone 



>me 


>for 


> 


> 

>Laurie :) 

> 



> > 




>New 


>would 


> > 

> >Sense? Nonsense? Data: I nput: Theory 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 

959

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



960






In otherwords, 

It means that for "evil" not to triumph, more people need to be "enlighten" who don't feel as adamantly 

strong, in hopes that they will make up for in numbers for the "evil" that the others fail to budge from. 



Robert, 

No, this means that because we have to work on projects together and because I do not want to 

make it so uncomfortable that it interferes with that requirement that maybe this is a door that is 

not ready to be opened. 

I was trying to open another door that more people could relate too, but people do not see my 

connection to society and how other areas have drifted from the male dominated words of the 

bible. For example: feminism...does it not go against the views of the bible to submitting yourself 

to "males" and all the male centeredness of the bible?.... Man's SEED, Virginity, is she a 

Madonna or is she a whore? Woman are portrayed as second class scapegoats for so many 

things in society. Eve ate the apple... it's her fault, she talked Adam into eating the apple too. 

Bad eve.... it's all her fault for how society treats women, etc. 

But if people can not see that real life and what is written in the bible have changed when women 


equal rights. So it seems as though until they can understand point A, they can not understand 

point B (which is harder to understand). 

I am growing frustrated and running out of ways to explain it (nicely explain it that is). I am sadly 


Ann 


Ann, 



your quote) 





961

Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:33:46 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>Laurie, 

> 






>totally right and valid in your thoughts, feelings, and knowl edge of living 



> 

> 



> 

> 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 




>action 




> 


>are 


>what 


>Anyone 



>me 


>for 


> 


> 

>Laurie :) 

> 



> > 




962

_____ 

>New 


>would 


> > 

> >Sense? Nonsense? Data: I nput: Theory 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 





_____ 



963



Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 2:35 PM 



Ann, 

so in your opinion, evil has triumphed within this discussion? because many of the people do feel 

adamantly strong, on both sides. Is anyone finding the gray? Is there a gray to be found? or is it one 

way or the highway? 

Left-------------------------------------------------------------------------Right 

notice the space in-between! where do you fall? where do I fall? where do we all fall? Ashes ashes, 

pocket full of posies. http://graphics.hotmail.com/i.p.emcrook.gif 

http://graphics.hotmail.com/i.p.emcocktl.gif 





>Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 11:57:49 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>In otherwords, 

> 

>It means that for "evil" not to triumph, more people need to be "enlighten" who don't feel as 

adamantly strong, in hopes that they will make up for in numbers for the "evil" that the others fail to 

budge from. 

> 

>Ann 


>Robert, 

> 

>No, this means that because we have to work on projects together and because I do not want to 

make it so uncomfortable that it interferes with that requirement that maybe this is a door that is not 

ready to be opened. 

> 

>I was trying to open another door that more people could relate too, but people do not see my 

connection to society and how other areas have drifted from the male dominated words of the bible. 

For example: feminism...does it not go against the views of the bible to submitting yourself to 

964

"males" and all the male centeredness of the bible?.... Man's SEED, Virginity, is she a Madonna or is 

she a whore? Woman are portrayed as second class scapegoats for so many things in society. Eve 

ate the apple... it's her fault, she talked Adam into eating the apple too. Bad eve.... it's all her fault for 

how society treats women, etc. 

> 

>But if people can not see that real life and what is written in the bible have changed when women 


equal rights. So it seems as though until they can understand point A, they can not understand point 

B (which is harder to understand). 

> 

>I am growing frustrated and running out of ways to explain it (nicely explain it that is). I am sadly 


> 

>Ann 

> 


>Ann, 

>So if both of you do nothing, in order to not disrupt an already supposed 

>"working relationship". Does that mean that evil will now triumph? (based on 

>your quote) 

> 

> 




> >Subject: RE: A really BIG one.... 

> >Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:33:46 -0800 (PST) 

> > 

> >Laurie, 

> > 

> >By your responses it feels as though you are getting angry. I am growing 

> >frustrated myself. Let's just leave it alone and agree that we do not 

> >agree. I think no matter how I try to explain my stance, you will block it 

> >with your bible. I feel that I am totally right and valid in my thoughts, 

> >feelings, and knowledge of the homosexual community. You feel you are 

> >totally right and valid in your thoughts, feelings, and knowl edge of living 

> >in the christian community. I would not want this to cause ripples in our 

> >working relationship. 

> > 

> > 

> >"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do 

> >nothing." - Edmund Burke (1729-97) 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 

> > 

> >mcdon032 wrote: 

> >I think you are totally putting the female topic or any of the other topics 

> >you suggested, out of context. Of course women had to take a course of 

> >action 

> >in order to vote. They were trying to gain voting rights that would then 

965


> >homosexual rights is bogus! 

> > 

> >Ann, in a calmer matter I think that whatever I say about my beliefs, you 

> >are 

> >just going to contradict them no matter what. That's fine because that's 

> >what 

> >you believe in. I on the other hand have different beliefs than yours. 

> >Anyone 

> >can see that we are both truly passionate about what we believe in, but 

> >whatever I go through in my life I know that God will always be right with 

> >me 

> >and that brings so much comfort in my life. Therefore, I am going to stand 

> >for 

> >my christian beliefs and I know God will guide my ways. God bless! 

> > 

> >"I can do everything through him who gives me strength" Phillippians 4:13. 

> > 

> >Laurie :) 

> > 

> > >===== Original Message From Ann Kirkendall ===== 

> > >I forgot this really big one: 

> > > 

> > >Maybe more people can relate to this one... 

> > >I love the feminist, but hate what she stands for... 

> > >because it goes against the church, the bible (Old Version - Bible 1.1, 

> >New 

> >Version - Bible 1.2 ...); yet without her and what she stands for, where 

> >would 

> >any of us females be today? 

> > > 

> > >Sense? Nonsense? Data: I nput: Theory 

> > > 

> > >Ann 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >--------------------------------- 


> > >Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster. 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Frustrated with dial-up? Lightning-fast Internet access for as low as 

>$29.95/month. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200360ave/direct/01/ 

> 

> 

966

>--------------------------------- 



> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 

Frustrated with dial-up? Lightning-fast Internet access for as low as $29.95/month. 

967





Subject: Wake Up! 

I need to buy a baoney kit detector does anyone know where I can find one? We 

should 

buy a class kit as well. This chapter made me think about the conversations in 

Yamashitas class. I am so overwhelmed with my thoughts lately. I do not know 

why I think 

as I do but my instincts tell me that my views are valid. I however, want to 

test my 

thoughts and opinions why is my logical thinking satisfying to me. Actually is 

my logical 

thinking satisfying. I enjoy my views but I like it when people like Cynthia 

and Robert 

point out to me that there is often more to be thought of. I can relate this 

to my bad eye 

sight. I can see the world but it is a blur. But when I get closer to things 

or when I put my 

glasses (lenses) on I have a better view, things are more clear and when you 

really listen 

to somebody or look at thigs up close you understand more and you can get a 

sense of 

his/her insights and emotions. 

You know what is strange about listening to other views is that people often 

focus on the 

fact that others need to be open minded and change their views they don't 

realize that 

they themselves are the one's that should do it. I am guilty of this. A lot of 

the time people 

need more logic and need be more open minded but I am ignoring the fact that 

maybe I 

need to analyze my logic and check for any rhetorical fallcies. Before we open 

up our 

baloey detection kit we need to ditch bias thinking. (What I want to say is 

not coming out 

right). 

Let me start over Why should anyones theories be legit when biases are behind 

the 

experiments. Do we just pick and choose what to beleive in as we go. I guess 

we can 

see, read or hear things we don't like and that can help us paint a clearer 

picture of what 

we do like. I do not know who to trust or what to read anymore. I wish that 

babies could 

talk to me and explain things to me because their minds are so pure / unbias 

and their 

emotions are so honest. There are so many books a views about everything in 

the world. 

I guess I just need more facts, I desire clean and clear facts free of any 

biases. All I want 

is to be more aware of everyones emotions. it sucks when people make fun of 

things and 

they do not realize that they hurting the person standing right next to them. 

How do we 

become aware of things if people do not open up and share with the world who 

they 

really are. On the flip side of that comment how do become more aware of 

everything 

going on with out having to hurt somebody before you realize it is an issue. 

968

Let me use 

an analogy to make this more clear. My friends boyfriend died and i did not 

know it. On 

valentine's day I asked her where her honey is and she told me he died. How 

was I so 

unaware of this. I felt like such an ass. Am I so caught up in my own life 

that I did not pay 

attention to what was going on in my friends (not a close friend just and 

aquaintance) life. 

When did I close my eyes and ears. Why did i have to find out about my 

ignorance and 

unawareness in such a painful way? A quote comes to mind from Diogenes the 

Cynic 

(412-323 B.C.E) "Of what use is philosopher who doesn't hurt anybody's 

feelings?" I was 

sad though that I was so closed minded about what has been happening in my 

friends 

life but it was also an effective wake up call. I am grateful it happend 

becuase it helped 

me learn an important lesson it also showed me that maybe I claim to be awake 

and 

aware but I question if I really am and if I am to what extent. I guess 

sometimes in order 

for us to understand others view or to be more aware of life and others 

feelings we have 

to get painfully kicked in the groind before we can really truly open up and 

understand 

people, issues, views, reality. 

I shall end this rambling thought with a quote from the great 

philosopher-wizard from 

Lord of the Rings Gandalf, "If you have walked all these days with closed ears 

and mind 

asleep, wake up now!" Marin 

969





Subject: RE: A really BIG one.... but even bigger 

Noooooooooo Roooooooobbbbbbbbeeeeeerrrrrrrtttttt, 

It does not mean that evil has triumphed.... It means I am getting a headache because I keep 

running into a big hard wall. It means I am recoiling, learning from my encounters, and looking for 

other ways to continue. But, along the journey, I hope that the gray area people will gain a better 

"AWARENESS" of what is going about the injustices that are taking place because we all know, "if it 

has nothing to do with you or your immediate life, most people don't care", they are not AWARE of 

these issues, or they just flat out don't care. 

With what I have been fighting for, I think on the bottom layer are homosexuals, the middle gray area 

is the average citizen who is not extremely religious, has a different more excepting religion, or they 

are not religious at all, and then there are the religious extremest on the top area. Even if I aim at the 

top layer, most of my repelled arrows will fall in the gray area, and that is the area that can make a 

difference with their individual actions. 

I am only fighting for equality. And the biggest thing that stands in the way right now is religion, 

and its radioactive by products on the views of society. If equal rights were available to homosexuals, 

I would not even be having this discussion. There would be no reason to. 

Maybe we should have different class marriages, like Class A (religious marriages), Class B (Grey 

area people marriages), and Class C (Dark Grey [or rainbow colored]people marriages). And make 

them all equal as far as commitment, benefits, acknowledgment of a loving committed relationship, 

justification, etc. Then, the top layer will be happy, the middle area will be happy, and the bottom 

layer will be happy. And I would be happy.... 

Just like a generic oreo cookie, but with one outter layer white, and one brown, and the creamy 

middle of grey people. 



Ann, 

so in your opinion, evil has triumphed within this discussion? because many of the people do feel 

adamantly strong, on both sides. Is anyone finding the gray? Is there a gray to be found? or is it 

one way or the highway? 

970

Left-------------------------------------------------------------------------Right 

notice the space in-between! where do you fall? where do I fall? where do we all fall? Ashes 

ashes, pocket full of posies. http://graphics.hotmail.com/i.p.emcrook.gif 

http://graphics.hotmail.com/i.p.emcocktl.gif 





>Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 11:57:49 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>In otherwords, 

> 

>It means that for "evil" not to triumph, more people need to be "enlighten" who don't feel as 

adamantly strong, in hopes that they will make up for in numbers for the "evil" that the others fail 

to budge from. 

> 

>Ann 


>Robert, 

> 

>No, this means that because we have to work on projects together and because I do not want to 

make it so uncomfortable that it interferes with that requirement that maybe this is a door that is 


> 

>I was trying to open another door that more people could relate too, but people do not see my 



to "males" and all the male centeredness of the bible?.... Man's SEED, Virginity, is she a 

Madonna or is she a whore? Woman are portrayed as second class scapegoats for so many 

things in society. Eve ate the apple... it's her fault, she talked Adam into eating the apple too. 

Bad eve.... it's all her fault for how society treats women, etc. 

> 

>But if people can not see that real life and what is written in the bible have changed when women 


equal rights. So it seems as though until they can understand point A, they can not understand 

point B (which is harder to understand). 

> 

>I am growing frustrated and running out of ways to explain it (nicely explain it that is). I am sadly 


> 

>Ann 

> 


>Ann, 

>So if both of you do nothing, in order to not disrupt an already supposed 

>"working relationship". Does that mean that evil will now triumph? (based on 

>your quote) 

> 

> 

971

From: Ann Kirkendall 




> >Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:33:46 -0800 (PST) 

> > 

> >Laurie, 

> > 

> >By your responses it feels as though you are getting angry. I am growing 

> >frustrated myself. Let's just leave it alone and agree that we do not 

> >agree. I think no matter how I try to explain my stance, you will block it 

> >with your bible. I feel that I am totally right and valid in my thoughts, 

> >feelings, and knowledge of the homosexual community. You feel you are 

> >totally right and valid in your thoughts, feelings, and knowl edge of living 

> >in the christian community. I would not want this to cause ripples in our 

> >working relationship. 

> > 

> > 

> >"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do 

> >nothing." - Edmund Burke (1729-97) 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 

> > 

> >mcdon032 wrote: 

> >I think you are totally putting the female topic or any of the other topics 

> >you suggested, out of context. Of course women had to take a course of 

> >action 

> >in order to vote. They were trying to gain voting rights that would then 

> >affect our government system. But saying this is the same thing with 

> >homosexual rights is bogus! 

> > 

> >Ann, in a calmer matter I think that whatever I say about my beliefs, you 

> >are 

> >just going to contradict them no matter what. That's fine because that's 

> >what 

> >you believe in. I on the other hand have different beliefs than yours. 

> >Anyone 

> >can see that we are both truly passionate about what we believe in, but 

> >whatever I go through in my life I know that God will always be right with 

> >me 

> >and that brings so much comfort in my life. Therefore, I am going to stand 

> >for 

> >my christian beliefs and I know God will guide my ways. God bless! 

> > 

> >"I can do everything through him who gives me strength" Phillippians 4:13. 

> > 

> >Laurie :) 

> > 

> > >===== Original Message From Ann Kirkendall ===== 

> > >I forgot this really big one: 

972

> > >Maybe more people can relate to this one... 

> > >I love the feminist, but hate what she stands for... 

> > >because it goes against the church, the bible (Old Version - Bible 1.1, 

> >New 

> >Version - Bible 1.2 ...); yet without her and what she stands for, where 

> >would 

> >any of us females be today? 

> > > 

> > >Sense? Nonsense? Data: I nput: Theory 

> > > 

> > >Ann 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >--------------------------------- 


> > >Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster. 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 


_____ 



973





Subject: J6 or 7 

I would like to respond to some of the topics going around, but I can't 

because I have school stuff to do. Since I don't have much to say, I'll just 

say this: I am glad the flu topic is over! The book started off interesting 

and then it got boring and I found it difficult to read, all the while I was 

reading it I was thinking, "Somewhere out there there's a nerd that actually 

finds this interesting." Yamashita kept mentioning a "twist" in the book, was 

there a twist, or was that something he said to make us read the whole thing? 

Cecilia 

974






spoken with a kind voice... 

hi ann. i know there have been discussions, debates, and arguments about your desires and 

religion. you keep mentioning the "gray area"...and i just wanted to tell you that for us 

Christians (Jesus freaks as some call us) there is no gray area. what we believe in is 

very black and white, you either believe or you dont and if you do, you believe and follow 

every word (except for those luke warm Christians). 

and luke warm Christians (those that talk the talk but dont walk the walk OR have one foot 

in and one foot out) could be considered the "gray area", because they are more in the 

world then strong Christians, but they are not true followers of Christ. they are not a 

good example of a Christ-like life, they are not good witnesses. 

so back to us strong Christians, we believe the Bible in its entirity and we do not 

compromise (gray area) so when you ask us to be open minded or hope that we might consider 

your views, we just cannot b/c that would mean we are not following our truth, the Bible. 

i have tried to stay out of this discussion because you would not like what i have to say 

because i follow the Words of the Lord and you know what He says. i didnt want to hurt 

your feelings or add to that wall you keep running into. 

so i guess what i am trying to let you know, is that you are barking up the wrong tree 

when it comes to homosexuality and Christians (which you have probably already figured 

out). no gray area with us and its the gray area that leads us astray from walking right 

with the Lord so we don't go there. 

i avoid all compromise, for me that means not going to bars/clubs with friends, not dating 

a non-Christian just for the sake of dating, no sex before marriage, etc. and i cant 

compromise on homosexual marriage. i just cant stray from what i hold as the truth, or 

else that means i will compromise elsewhere going down a slippery slope, a downward 

spiral. 

i hope you understand what i am trying to explain to you. its here to help you move on so 

you arent wasting your energy on deaf ears. 

if it is possible, as much as depends on you, live peaceably with all men. (romans 

12:18). 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/06 Sat PM 06:20:14 PST 


> Subject: RE: A really BIG one.... but even bigger 

> 

> Noooooooooo Roooooooobbbbbbbbeeeeeerrrrrrrtttttt, 

> 

> It does not mean that evil has triumphed.... It means I am getting a headache because I 

keep running into a big hard wall. It means I am recoiling, learning from my encounters, 

and looking for other ways to continue. But, along the journey, I hope that the gray area 

people will gain a better "AWARENESS" of what is going about the injustices that are 

taking place because we all know, "if it has nothing to do with you or your immediate 

life, most people don't care", they are not AWARE of these issues, or they just flat out 

don't care. 

> 

> With what I have been fighting for, I think on the bottom layer are homosexuals, the 

middle gray area is the average citizen who is not extremely religious, has a different 

more excepting religion, or they are not religious at all, and then there are the 

975

eligious extremest on the top area. Even if I aim at the top layer, most of my repelled 

arrows will fall in the gray area, and that is the area that can make a difference with 

their individual actions. 

> 

> I am only fighting for equality. And the biggest thing that stands in the way right now 

is religion, and its radioactive by products on the views of society. If equal rights 

were available to homosexuals, I would not even be having this discussion. There would be 

no reason to. 

> 

> Maybe we should have different class marriages, like Class A (religious marriages), 

Class B (Grey area people marriages), and Class C (Dark Grey [or rainbow colored]people 

marriages). And make them all equal as far as commitment, benefits, acknowledgment of a 

loving committed relationship, justification, etc. Then, the top layer will be happy, the 

middle area will be happy, and the bottom layer will be happy. And I would be happy.... 

> Just like a generic oreo cookie, but with one outter layer white, and one brown, and the 

creamy middle of grey people. 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 

> Robert Atchison wrote: 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> Ann, 

> 

> so in your opinion, evil has triumphed within this discussion? because many of the 

people do feel adamantly strong, on both sides. Is anyone finding the gray? Is there a 

gray to be found? or is it one way or the highway? 

> 

> Left-------------------------------------------------------------------------Right 

> 

> notice the space in-between! where do you fall? where do I fall? where do we all fall? 

Ashes ashes, pocket full of posies. 

> 

> 

> 

> 





> >Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 11:57:49 -0800 (PST) 

> > 

> >In otherwords, 

> > 

> >It means that for "evil" not to triumph, more people need to be "enlighten" who don't 

feel as adamantly strong, in hopes that they will make up for in numbers for the "evil" 

that the others fail to budge from. 

> > 

> >Ann 

> >Ann Kirkendall wrote: 

> >Robert, 

> > 

> >No, this means that because we have to work on projects together and because I do not 

want to make it so uncomfortable that it interferes with that requirement that maybe this 

is a door that is not ready to be opened. 

> > 

> >I was trying to open another door that more people could relate too, but people do not 

see my connection to society and how other areas have drifted from the male dominated 

976

words of the bible. For example: feminism...does it not go against the views of the 

bible to submitting yourself to "males" and all the male centeredness of the bible?.... 

Man's SEED, Virginity, is she a Madonna or is she a whore? Woman are portrayed as second 

class scapegoats for so many things in society. Eve ate the apple... it's her fault, she 

talked Adam into eating the apple too. Bad eve.... it's all her fault for how society 

treats women, etc. 

> > 

> >But if people can not see that real life and what is written in the bible have changed 

when women fought for more equal rights, then they can not connect it to homosexuality and 

their fight for more equal rights. So it seems as though until they can understand point 

A, they can not understand point B (which is harder to understand). 

> > 

> >I am growing frustrated and running out of ways to explain it (nicely explain it that 

is). I am sadly realizing that there are certain groups of people who just don't 

understand what I am talking about. 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 

> >Robert Atchison wrote: 

> >Ann, 

> >So if both of you do nothing, in order to not disrupt an already supposed 

> >"working relationship". Does that mean that evil will now triumph? (based on 

> >your quote) 

> > 

> > 

> > >From: Ann Kirkendall 



> > >Subject: RE: A really BIG one.... 

> > >Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:33:46 -0800 (PST) 

> > > 

> > >Laurie, 

> > > 

> > >By your responses it feels as though you are getting angry. I am growing 

> > >frustrated myself. Let's just leave it alone and agree that we do not 

> > >agree. I think no matter how I try to explain my stance, you will block it 

> > >with your bible. I feel that I am totally right and valid in my thoughts, 

> > >feelings, and knowledge of the homosexual community. You feel you are 

> > >totally right and valid in your thoughts, feelings, and knowl edge of living 

> > >in the christian community. I would not want this to cause ripples in our 

> > >working relationship. 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do 

> > >nothing." - Edmund Burke (1729-97) 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >Ann 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >mcdon032 wrote: 

> > >I think you are totally putting the female topic or any of the other topics 

> > >you suggested, out of context. Of course women had to take a course of 

> > >action 

> > >in order to vote. They were trying to gain voting rights that would then 

> > >affect our government system. But saying this is the same thing with 

> > >homosexual rights is bogus! 

> > > 

> > >Ann, in a calmer matter I think that whatever I say about my beliefs, you 

> > >are 

> > >just going to contradict them no matter what. That's fine because that's 

> > >what 

> > >you believe in. I on the other hand have different beliefs than yours. 

> > >Anyone 

> > >can see that we are both truly passionate about what we believe in, but 

977

whatever I go through in my life I know that God will always be right with 

> > >me 

> > >and that brings so much comfort in my life. Therefore, I am going to stand 

> > >for 

> > >my christian beliefs and I know God will guide my ways. God bless! 

> > > 

> > >"I can do everything through him who gives me strength" Phillippians 4:13. 

> > > 

> > >Laurie :) 

> > > 

> > > >===== Original Message From Ann Kirkendall ===== 

> > > >I forgot this really big one: 

> > > > 

> > > >Maybe more people can relate to this one... 

> > > >I love the feminist, but hate what she stands for... 

> > > >because it goes against the church, the bible (Old Version - Bible 1.1, 

> > >New 

> > >Version - Bible 1.2 ...); yet without her and what she stands for, where 

> > >would 

> > >any of us females be today? 

> > > > 

> > > >Sense? Nonsense? Data: I nput: Theory 

> > > > 

> > > >Ann 

> > > > 

> > > > 

> > > > 

> > > >--------------------------------- 

> > > >Do you Yahoo!? 

> > > >Yahoo! Search - Find what you?re looking for faster. 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >--------------------------------- 


> > >Yahoo! Search - Find what you?re looking for faster. 

> > 

> >_________________________________________________________________ 

> >Frustrated with dial-up? Lightning-fast Internet access for as low as 

> >$29.95/month. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200360ave/direct/01/ 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 


> >Yahoo! Search - Find what you?re looking for faster. 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 

> Frustrated with dial-up? Lightning-fast Internet access for as low as $29.95/month. 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 

978


979






Karis, 

I appreciate you speaking with a kind voice. It is a shame that after all the fancy dancing and long 

time periods of sitting in front of my computer trying to methodically portray my stance, that not much, 

if any, has changed. In fact I wonder if it has created a division more than it created understanding? 

I never said that I didn't believe in a God, I just can not by the life of me follow the bible because it 

goes against what I believe in as a woman fighting for equal recognition in everyday life, and it goes 

against those that I love. 

If Christians only see things in black or white they will never accept anything other than how they 

interpret the bible. Maybe the best avenue is, which has been suggested earlier, a separate marriage 

that includes everyone who does not want to live by the bible. Or maybe a law needs to pass that 

makes society treat domestic partnership seriously and offer all the benefits, acknowledgments, etc. 

that they do not offer, but that society seems to think exists for homosexuals. 

I think my main concern with the president wanting to make an amendment to ban homosexual 

marriage is that it will close that door without opening another alternative. It is obvious that there are 

a lot of homosexual people in America who want to be married, and they need avenues for unions 

that provide benefits, commitments, support, etc. just like "marriage". I think that would be fair for 

now if they actually did this. 



spoken with a kind voice... 

hi ann. i know there have been discussions, debates, and arguments about your desires and 

religion. you keep mentioning the "gray area"...and i just wanted to tell you that for us Christians 

(Jesus freaks as some call us) there is no gray area. what we believe in is very black and white, 

you either believe or you dont and if you do, you believe and follow every word (except for those 

luke warm Christians). 

and luke warm Christians (those that talk the talk but dont walk the walk OR have one foot in and 

one foot out) could be considered the "gray area", because they are more in the world then strong 

Christians, but they are not true followers of Christ. they are not a good example of a Christ-like 

life, they are not good witnesses. 

so back to us strong Christians, we believe the Bible in its entirity and we do not compromise (g 

ray area) so when you ask us to be open minded or hope that we might consider your views, we 

just cannot b/c that would mean we are not following our truth, the Bible. 

i have tried to stay out of this discussion because you would not like what i have to say because i 

follow the Words of the Lord and you know what He says. i didnt want to hurt your feelings or add 

980

to that wall you keep running into. 

so i guess what i am trying to let you know, is that you are barking up the wrong tree when it 

comes to homosexuality and Christians (which you have probably already figured out). no gray 

area with us and its the gray area that leads us astray from walking right with the Lord so we don't 

go there. 

i avoid all compromise, for me that means not going to bars/clubs with friends, not dating a non- 

Christian just for the sake of dating, no sex before marriage, etc. and i cant compromise on 

homosexual marriage. i just cant stray from what i hold as the truth, or else that means i will 

compromise elsewhere going down a slippery slope, a downward spiral. 

i hope you understand what i am trying to explain to you. its here to help you move on so you 

arent wasting your energy on deaf ears. 

if it is possible, as much as depends on you, live peaceably with all men. (romans 12:18). 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/06 Sat PM 06:20:14 PST 


> Subject: RE: A really BIG one.... but even bigger 

> 

> Noooooooooo Roooooooobbbbbbbbeeeeeerrrrrrrtttttt, 

> 

> It does not mean that evil has triumphed.... It means I am getting a headache because I keep 

running into a big hard wall. It means I am recoiling, learning from my encounters, and looking for 

other ways to continue. But, along the journey, I hope that the gray area people will gain a better 

"AWARENESS" of what is going about the injustices that are taking place because we all know, "if 

i t has nothing to do with you or your immediate life, most people don't care", they are not AWARE 

of these issues, or they just flat out don't care. 

> 

> With what I have been fighting for, I think on the bottom layer are homosexuals, the middle gray 

area is the average citizen who is not extremely religious, has a different more excepting religion, 

or they are not religious at all, and then there are the religious extremest on the top area. Even if I 

aim at the top layer, most of my repelled arrows will fall in the gray area, and that is the area that 

can make a difference with their individual actions. 

> 

> I am only fighting for equality. And the biggest thing that stands in the way right now is religion, 

and its radioactive by products on the views of society. If equal rights were available to 

homosexuals, I would not even be having this discussion. There would be no reason to. 

> 

> Maybe we should have different class marriages, like Class A (religious marriages), Class B 

(Grey area people marriages), and Class C (Dark Grey [or rainbow colored]people marriages). 

And make them all equal as far as commitment, benefits, acknowledgment of a loving committed 

relationship, justification, etc. Then, the top layer will be happy, the middle area will be happy, and 

the bottom layer will be happy. And I would be happy.... 

> Just like a generic oreo cookie, but with one outter layer white, and one brown, and the creamy 

middle of grey people. 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 

> Robert Atchison wrote: 

981

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> Ann, 

> 

> so in your opinion, evil has triumphed within this discussion? because many of the people do 

feel adamantly strong, on both sides. Is anyone finding the gray? Is there a gray to be found? or is 

it one way or the highway? 

> 

> Left-------------------------------------------------------------------------Right 

> 

> notice the space in-between! where do you fall? where do I fall? where do we all fall? Ashes 

ashes, pocket full of posies. 

> 

> 

> 

> 





> >Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 11:57:49 -0800 (PST) 

> > 

> >In otherwords, 

> > 

> >It means that for "evil" not to triumph, more people need to be "enlighten" who don't feel as 

adamantly strong, in hopes that they will make up for in numbers for the "evil" that the others fail 

to budge from. 

> > 

> >Ann 

> >Ann Kirkendall wrote: 

> >Robert, 

> > 

> >No, this means that because we have to work on projects together and because I do not want 

to make it so uncomfortable that it interferes with that requirement that maybe this is a door that is 


> > 

> >I was trying to open another door that more people could relate too, but people do not see my 



to "males" and all the male centeredness of the bible?.... Man's SEED, Virginity, is she a Madonna 

or is she a whore? Woman are portrayed as second class scapegoats for so many things in 

society. Eve ate the apple... it's her fault, she talked Adam into eating the apple too. Bad eve.... it's 

all her fault for how society treats women, etc. 

> > 

> >But if people can not see that real life and what is written in the bible have changed when 

women fought for more equal rights, then they can not connect it to homosexuality and their fight 

982

for more equal rights. So it seems as though until they can understand point A, they can not 

understand point B (which is harder to understand). 

> > 

> >I am growing frustrated and running out of ways to explain it (nicely explain it that is). I am 

sadly realizing that there are certain groups of people who just don't understand what I am talking 

about. 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 


> >Ann, 

> >So if both of you do nothing, in order to not disrupt an already supposed 

> >"working relationship". Does that mean that evil will now triumph? (based on 

> >your quote) 

> > 

> > 

> > >From: Ann Kirkendall 



> > >Subject: RE: A really BIG one.... 

> > >Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:33:46 -0800 (PST) 

> > > 

> > >Laurie, 

> > > 

> > >By y our responses it feels as though you are getting angry. I am growing 

> > >frustrated myself. Let's just leave it alone and agree that we do not 

> > >agree. I think no matter how I try to explain my stance, you will block it 

> > >with your bible. I feel that I am totally right and valid in my thoughts, 

> > >feelings, and knowledge of the homosexual community. You feel you are 

> > >totally right and valid in your thoughts, feelings, and knowl edge of living 

> > >in the christian community. I would not want this to cause ripples in our 

> > >working relationship. 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do 

> > >nothing." - Edmund Burke (1729-97) 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >Ann 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >mcdon032 wrote: 

> > >I think you are totally putting the female topic or any of the other topics 

> > >you suggested, out of context. Of course women had to take a course of 

> > >action 

> > >in order to vote. They were trying to gain voting rights that would then 

> > >affect our government system. But saying this is the same thing with 

> > >homosexual rights is bogus! 

> > > 

> > >Ann, in a calmer matter I think that whatever I say about my beliefs, you 

> > >are 

> > >just going to contradict them no matter what. That's fine because that's 

983

what 

> > >you believe in. I on the other hand have different beliefs than yours. 

> > >Anyone 

> > >can see that we are both truly passionate about what we believe in, but 

> > >whatever I go through in my life I know that God will always be right with 

> > >me 

&g t; > >and that brings so much comfort in my life. Therefore, I am going to stand 

> > >for 

> > >my christian beliefs and I know God will guide my ways. God bless! 

> > > 

> > >"I can do everything through him who gives me strength" Phillippians 4:13. 

> > > 

> > >Laurie :) 

> > > 

> > > >===== Original Message From Ann Kirkendall ===== 

> > > >I forgot this really big one: 

> > > > 

> > > >Maybe more people can relate to this one... 

> > > >I love the feminist, but hate what she stands for... 

> > > >because it goes against the church, the bible (Old Version - Bible 1.1, 

> > >New 

> > >Version - Bible 1.2 ...); yet without her and what she stands for, where 

> > >would 

> > >any of us females be today? 

> > > > 

> > > >Sense? N onsense? Data: I nput: Theory 

> > > > 

> > > >Ann 

> > > > 

> > > > 

> > > > 

> > > >--------------------------------- 

> > > >Do you Yahoo!? 

> > > >Yahoo! Search - Find what you?re looking for faster. 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > 

> > > 

> > >--------------------------------- 


> > >Yahoo! Search - Find what you?re looking for faster. 

> > 

> >_________________________________________________________________ 



> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> > 

> >--------------------------------- 

984



> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 

> Frustrated with dial-up? Lightning-fast Internet access for as low as $29.95/month. 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


_____ 



985



Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 12:23 AM 


Subject: re: ann 

Dear those who are reading these journals, 

I just wanted to add to the jounal entry I just wrote to Karas. I wanted to talk about the benefits of 

marriage so that we can see what homosexuals are missing out on and to make sure that these 

benefits are included in homosexual unions when society lets them come together under an equal but 

NOT "MARRIAGE" union. 

I found the following stuff from a website. 

Sincerely your fellow explorer, 

Ann with a plan... http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/50.gif notice my thinking hat is 

on... 

horizontal rule 

On the order of 1,400 legal rights are conferred upon married couples in the U.S. Typically these are 

composed of about 400 state benefits and over 1,000 federal benefits. Among them are the rights to: 

bullet joint parenting; 

bullet joint adoption; 

bullet joint foster care, custody, and visitation (including non-biological parents); 

bullet status as next-of-kin for hospital visits and medical decisions where one partner is too ill to 

be competent; 

bullet joint insurance policies for home, auto and health; 

bullet dissolution and divorce protections such as community property and child support; 

bullet immigration and residency for partners from other countries; 

bullet inheritance automatically in the absence of a will; 

bullet joint leases with automatic renewal rights in the event one partner dies or leaves the house 

or apartment; 

bullet inheritance of jointly-owned real and personal property through the right of survivorship 

(which avoids the time and expense and taxes in probate); 

bullet benefits such as annuities, pension plans, Social Security, and Medicare; 

bullet spousal exemptions to property tax increases upon the death of one partner who is a coowner 

of the home; 

bullet veterans' discounts on medical care, education, and home loans; joint filing of tax returns; 

bullet joint filing of customs claims when traveling; 

bullet wrongful death benefits for a surviving partner and children; 

bullet bereavement or sick leave to care for a partner or child; 

bullet decision-making power with respect to whether a deceased partner will be cremated or not 

and where to bury him or her; 

bullet crime victims' recovery benefits; 

bullet loss of consortium tort benefits; 

bullet domestic violence protection orders; 

986

ullet judicial protections and evidentiary immunity; 

bullet and more.... 

Most of these legal and economic benefits cannot be privately arranged or contracted for. For 

example, absent a legal (or civil) marriage, there is no guaranteed joint responsibility to the 

partner and to third parties (including children) in such areas as child support, debts to creditors, 

taxes, etc. In addition, private employers and institutions often give other economic privileges and 

other benefits (special rates or memberships) only to married couples. And, of course, when people 

cannot marry, they are denied all the emotional and social benefits and responsibilities of marriage 

as well. 

http://web.ask.com/redir?bpg=http%3a%2f%2fweb.ask.com%2fweb%3fq%3dwhat%2bare%2bthe% 

2bbenefits%2bof%2bmarriage%253f%26o%3d0%26page%3d1&q=what+are+the+benefits+of+marriage% 

3f&u=http%3a%2f%2ftm.wc.ask.com%2fr%3ft%3dan%26s%3da%26uid%3d2c6511a49c6511a49%26sid% 

3d3c6511a49c6511a49%26qid%3d6960089850124A478B1FEE2E1813BCDF%26io%3d0%26sv% 

3dza5cb0de9%26o%3d0%26ask%3dwhat%2bare%2bthe%2bbenefits%2bof%2bmarriage%253f%26uip% 

3dc6511a49%26en%3dte%26eo%3d-100%26pt%3dLEGAL%2bAND%2bECONOMIC%2bBENEFITS%2bOF% 

2bMARRIAGE%26ac%3d24%26qs%3d0%26pg%3d1%26ep%3d1%26te_par%3d103%26te_id%3d%26u% 

3dhttp%3a%2f%2fwww.religioustolerance.org%2fmar_bene.htm&s=a&bu=http%3a%2f% 

2fwww.religioustolerance.org%2fmar_bene.htm&qte=0&o=0http://web.ask.com/redir?bpg=http%3a% 

2f%2fweb.ask.com%2fweb%3fq%3dwhat%2bare%2bthe%2bbenefits%2bof%2bmarriage%253f% 

26o%3d0%26page%3d1&q=what+are+the+benefits+of+marriage%3f&u=http%3a%2f% 

2ftm.wc.ask.com%2fr%3ft%3dan%26s%3da%26uid%3d2c6511a49c6511a49%26sid% 

3d3c6511a49c6511a49%26qid%3d6960089850124A478B1FEE2E1813BCDF%26io%3d0%26sv% 

3dza5cb0de9%26o%3d0%26ask%3dwhat%2bare%2bthe%2bbenefits%2bof%2bmarriage%253f% 

26uip%3dc6511a49%26en%3dte%26eo%3d-100%26pt%3dLEGAL%2bAND%2bECONOMIC% 

2bBENEFITS%2bOF%2bMARRIAGE%26ac%3d24%26qs%3d0%26pg%3d1%26ep%3d1% 

26te_par%3d103%26te_id%3d%26u%3dhttp%3a%2f%2fwww.religioustolerance.org% 

2fmar_bene.htm&s=a&bu=http%3a%2f%2fwww.religioustolerance.org%2fmar_bene.htm&qte=0&o=0 

_____ 



987




To: journal 

Subject: quotes 

"Today I know that I cannot control the ocean tides. I can only go with the flow... When I struggle and 

try to organize the Atlantic to my specifications, I sink. If I flail and thrash and growl and grumble, I go 

under. But if I let go and float, I am borne aloft." (Marie Stilkind) 

Democracy does not guarantee equality of conditions - it only guarantees equality of 

opportunity. 

"You don't get harmony when everybody sings the same note." 

--- by Doug Floyd 

There is so much good in the worst of us, 

And so much bad in the best of us, 

That it hardly becomes any of us 

To talk about the rest of us. 

~Edward Wallis Hoch 

_____ 



988





Subject: I have a question.. 

Dear, those who have an answer, 

I can not leave this topic before I understand one of my original questions. I was in the shower this 

morning and I was thinking about the discussion and how it has been going, and that was when I 

remembered (a shower revelation) one of the reasons that I brought those interpretations of the old 

testament up in Yamashita's class. 

If there are Christians who follow the bible word for word, like Karas described, and if you do not go 

by the old testament, but by the new testament which was written quite some time ago, then why do 

all of the Christian women get to benefit from all the hard work, sweat, turmoil, ridicule, and 

frustration that our fore-mothers had to go through to get women on a more level playing field with 

men? Thier actions went against the bible. They went out on a very narrow limb for their time. Back 

in the day, women were the property of their husbands and they had to do whatever he said, good or 

bad. 

Why do modern day Christian women who follow the bible (no gray area) get to vote, wear pants, 

leave the house, go to college, go to the movies, use the Internet, talk on the phone, go places 

without their husbands, have their own checking account, have a career themselves, drive a car, cut 

their hair, etc. This is not strictly following the bible. So, my original feeling of people picking and 

choosing what they want to follow was valid. 

As I see it, the feminist movement (women's movement) goes against what the bible says, and that 

was one of my points in bringing that up, but some of us thought that was bogus. Is that bogus? If 

so, why? 

Striving to understand, 


_____ 



989





Subject: Re: I have a question.. 

I don't think the Bible says women are to be prisoners in their home. If I am wrong, please point out 

where I can read it. There is nothing unchristianlike about women doing the things you mentioned. 

Being submissive to your husband only means that he is OK with what you are doing, not that you are 

his slave. Cynthia 


Dear, those who have an answer, 

I can not leave this topic before I understand one of my original questions. I was in the shower 

this morning and I was thinking about the discussion and how it has been going, and that was 

when I remembered (a shower revelation) one of the reasons that I brought those interpretations 

of the old testament up in Yamashita's class. 

If there are Christians who follow the bible word for word, like Karas described, and if you do not 

go by the old testament, but by the new testament which was written quite some time ago, then 

why do all of the Christian women get to benefit from all the hard work, sweat, turmoil, ridicule, 

and frustration that our fore-mothers had to go through to get women on a more level playing field 

with men? Thier actions went against the bible. They went out on a very narrow limb for their 

time. Back in the day, women were the property of their husbands and they had to do whatever 

he said, good or bad. 

Why do modern day Christian women who follow the bible (no gray area) get to vote, wear pants, 


without their husbands, have their own checking account, have a career themselves, drive a car, 

cut their hair, etc. This is not strictly following the bible. So, my original feeling of people picking 

and choosing what they want to follow was valid. 

As I see it, the feminist movement (women's movement) goes against what the bible says, and 

that was one of my points in bringing that up, but some of us thought that was bogus. Is that 

bogus? If so, why? 

Striving to understand, 


_____ 



_____ 


990


991



Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 12:52 PM 



Hi Ann, 

I believe you are correct in believing that people who stand behind a belief system. There are a few 

reasons that they follow certain belief systems, from my observation, 1. to protect them from 

situations in which they don't know what they should do or what to say, so they quote someone else's 

interpretation of what to do in that situation 2. and answer questions that they don't understand, not 

having an answer scares a lot of people. Although such people have strong beliefs they are still 

humans and I believe that humans practice the BBD method, bigger better deal. When a situation 

arises in which their belief system states certain actions should be taken and the "believers" choose 

to follow another path because they are following their human nature of BBD. Now I believe in the 

BBD method but I also think it is hypocritical for people whom preach one way and act in another. So 

Ann if I have not thoroughly confused you, I agree that people should not only pick and choose their 

beliefs if they are all along preaching that they are moral believers. They should admit that they follow 

what best serves them and drop what doesn't. 

Jenny Fiala 

992





Subject: Re: quotes 

Here is a quote from Gloria Steinem which I think cover a lot of territory. 

"The first problem for all of us, men and women, is not to learn, but to unlearn." 

Ann 


"Today I know that I cannot control the ocean tides. I can only go with the flow... When I struggle 

and try to organize the Atlantic to my specifications, I sink. If I flail and thrash and growl and 

grumble, I go under. But if I let go and float, I am borne aloft." (Marie Stilkind) 

Democracy does not guarantee equality of conditions - it only guarantees equality of 

opportunity. 

"You don't get harmony when everybody sings the same note." 

--- by Doug Floyd 

There is so much good in the worst of us, 

And so much bad in the best of us, 

That it hardly becomes any of us 

To talk about the rest of us. 

~Edward Wallis Hoch 

_____ 



_____ 



993






Jenny, 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/06.gif + 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/33.gif = 



Hi Ann, 

I believe you are correct in believing that people who stand behind a belief system. There are a 

few reasons that they follow certain belief systems, from my observation, 1. to protect them from 

situations in which they don't know what they should do or what to say, so they quote someone 

else's interpretation of what to do in that situation 2. and answer questions that they don't 

understand, not having an answer scares a lot of people. Although such people have strong 

beliefs they are still humans and I believe that humans practice the BBD method, bigger better 

deal. When a situation arises in which their belief system states certain actions should be taken 

and the "believers" choose to follow another path because they are following their human nature 

of BBD. Now I believe in the BBD method but I also think it is hypocritical for people whom preach 

one way and act in another. So Ann if I have not thoroughly confuse d you, I agree that people 

should not only pick and choose their beliefs if they are all along preaching that they are moral 

believers. They should admit that they follow what best serves them and drop what doesn't. 

Jenny Fiala 

_____ 



994




To: journal 

Subject: Can't we all just get along? 

"The first problem for all of us, men and women, is not to learn, but to unlearn." 

Ann 

I agree, Ann, this quote can cover a lot. I think we all could unlearn some of our prejudices. For all the 

differences that are being pointed out, I think we could find even more things we agree on. I would 

prefer to focus on these because all the finger pointing and criticism of "the others" beliefs, doesn't 

result in anything positive. Give people a chance to know you as a person, not as an enemy. Perhaps 

then, what you are demanding might not be met with such resistance. Cynthia 

_____ 



995





Subject: Karis: black and white, journal something 

Dear Karis, 

The tone of this e-mail is meant to be concerned. 

It seems like according to the new testament women should not teach? You said that it is black and 

white, no shades of gray, but this is one instance for you in which you have chosen to see the gray. 

Why not in other areas? I think that Ann may be right in saying that people pick their belief system in 

order to support their lifestyles. lifestyle comes before beliefs? Christian women have benefited 

greatly from the feminist movement as well as many other movements (ie civil rights). So there are 

shades of gray? No one has the right answers? 

Please do not take this the wrong way, I'm just trying to understand the black and white. 

There has been little discussion concerning alternate meanings of Timothy 2:12. The most popular translations of the 

Christian Scriptures (New Testament) are in general agreement: 

bullet "I do not permit a woman to teach, nor to have authority over her husband..." The New Testament; Richmond 

Lattimore 

bullet "I do not permit women to teach or dictate to the men..." The Revised English Bible. 

bullet "But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man..." King James Version. 

bullet "I do not permit a woman to teach, nor to have authority over her husband..." New American Bible. 

bullet "They should be silent and not be allowed to teach or to tell men what to do..." Contemporary English Version. 

bullet "I do not let women teach men or have authority over them..." New Living Translation 

bullet "I permit no woman to teach or to have authority over a man..." New Revised Standard Version 


996

Reply-To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 


>Subject: Re: I have a question.. 

>Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:07:28 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>I don't think the Bible says women are to be prisoners in their home. If I am wrong, please point out 

where I can read it. There is nothing unchristianlike about women doing the things you mentioned. 

Being submissive to your husband only means that he is OK with what you are doing, not that you are 

his slave. Cynthia 

> 

>Ann Kirkendall wrote:Dear, those who have an answer, 

> 

>I can not leave this topic before I understand one of my original questions. I was in the shower this 

morning and I was thinking about the discussion and how it has been going, and that was when I 

remembered (a shower revelation) one of the reasons that I brought those interpretations of the old 

testament up in Yamashita's class. 

> 

>If there are Christians who follow the bible word for word, like Karas described, and if you do not go 

by the old testament, but by the new testament which was written quite some time ago, then why do 

all of the Christian women get to benefit from all the hard work, sweat, turmoil, ridicule, and frustration 

that our fore-mothers had to go through to get women on a more level playing field with men? Thier 

actions went against the bible. They went out on a very narrow limb for their time. Back in the day, 

women were the property of their husbands and they had to do whatever he said, good or bad. 

> 

>Why do modern day Christian women who follow the bible (no gray area) get to vote, wear pants, 


without their husbands, have their own checking account, have a career themselves, drive a car, cut 

their hair, etc. This is not strictly following the bible. So, my original feeling of people picking and 

choosing what they want to follow was valid. 

> 

>As I see it, the feminist movement (women's movement) goes against what the bible says, and that 

was one of my points in bringing that up, but some of us thought that was bogus. Is that bogus? If 

so, why? 

> 

>Striving to understand, 

> 

>Ann 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 


997





Subject: Scholastic Book Orders 

REMINDER: 

If you would like to place a book order, please bring your order to class tomorrow. 

See you then. ~ Louise 

998






As I was getting bored with Sagan and Kolata, I thought I'd delve into the Fujimura "Bandwagons" 

reading. Although most of it was over my head, I did sort of understand the part (if you care to look) 

on page 5 which discusses the "The State of Cancer Research Before The 1970's." It talks about 

how researchers had typically worked on prokaryotes and because the aim of the research on cancer 

was to cure cancer in human beings, researchers needed to work on eukaryotic DNA which is what 

humans possess. Before our biology class this would have been a bunch of mumbo-jumbo, but the 

fuzziness was clearing up in this part of the article because of our studies on the prokaryotes and 

eukaryotes. It was nice to see a relationship from one of our science classes to another. Even if I did 

not know about the prokaryotes and eukaryotes, I thought the article was still rather interesting simply 

because I learned how far we have come in our medical/scientific research in the last 30 years. ~ 

Louise 

999





Subject: My thoughts about nature and science.... 

When I think of my favorite things to do in life, I think of exploring nature. I have, in fact, had this 

passion my whole life. There is not much that brings me greater pleasure, contentment, and 

excitement, than when I am discovering, taking-in with all my senses, and observing the natural world 

around me. Whether it be winter, spring, summer, or fall, I love them all. Whether it be hot or cold, 

windy, cloudy, clear, drizzly, raining, hailing, or crisp and clear, I love them all. Whether it be night, 

pre-dawn, early morning, afternoon, or sunset, I love them all. If I had to choose a favorite season, I 

would choose early springtime, like it is right now. 

The things that I observe in this world are the little things that most people walk past unnoticed. Ever 

since I was a little girl, I found great pleasure in turning over logs, rocks..etc. to see what creatures 

dwell beneath. I think the best gifts I ever got when I was a little girl growing up on a farm were frogs 

and lizards that my dad found and gave to me. I would keep them about a day, and then let them go. 

I think that I have a hard time with the thought of dissection because I feel I don't have the right to 

destroy a little creature; I am not worthy to kill it and cut it open, it seems like such a waste. At least 

maybe someone should eat it so it was not wasted. That's my personal view even though I know 

there is much to be learned in that process. 

As an 8 year old, I had "stinky" my hamster, who I saved from being fed to a snake in a pet store. 

Stinky and I had many great adventures. He was my favorite pet and he knew all my sorrows and 

joys. 

As a young teenager, I used to spend hours crawling among the rocks on the hillsides and the dirt 

covered paths in Valley Center looking for reptiles.. lizards, snakes, horny toads. 

Today, I have three house cats and I love to watch them, and I enjoy their calming company. One of 

my favorite pets is my Russian Tortoise. She lives outside in the backyard. In fact, as I am writing 

this posting, I can see her cruising around the yard. She woke up about a week ago from hibernating 

over the winter. 

I love to go explore around my backyard and inspect the wild flowers, and the insects; I love to listen 

to the wind blowing through the trees, and to listen to the birds singing so happily from tree to tree. 

When I go out in the yard, my tortoise walks up to me and climbs on my foot, and if I am barefoot or 

wearing my Birkenstocks, it tickles. I love to feed my tortoise the fresh vegetables that I grow in my 

garden. She is so fun to watch. I always have a big grin on my face when I go out to see her 

and when I come in from having seen her. She is my little yard mascot. 

When I am out in nature, especially when I am camping, and I am thinking about the hustle and the 

bustle of our modern day life, I am saddened. I hate what humans do to one another; I hate what 

humans do to our land; and I hate how humans take for granted so many things in life. It is in these 

moments that it hurts the most to see how people spread hatred among each other in issues such as 

the one I have been fighting for, legal rights for homosexuals. When I am out in the wilderness, I see 

so many variations in the patterns of life. One is not any better than the next, but they all add beauty 

because they give such great variety. How boring would nature be if it all looked the same? 

When I think of me being a teacher in the not to distant future, I can see me passing on my 

1000

excitement for the natural world that we live in because there is wonderment, excitement, and 

because nature has such a great calming effect on one's inner being. 

Live, let live, and love each other for the differences we all bring to the table, for it is in this great 

variety that life is so wonderful. 

Ann 

_____ 



1001





Subject: journal for the week of March 1st and 3rd 

Dear class, 

I read the article by Fujimara titled bandwagons and i saw some major 

similarities between the world of cancer research and the world of education 

today. The "cookbook" as it was called which provided a researcher with 

"recipes" about the current known data regarding cancer sounds incredibly 

similar to the standards that teachers are now using in the class. companies 

that provdie cheap and easy to use materials to researchers sound a lot like 

the companies mcgraw-hill and bancroft that provide schools with texts that 

closely follow these accepted standards. and to top it off, researchers were 

so worried about not getting results in a specified time period that they just 

went along with the status quo in an attempt to just be another person on the 

bandwagon and continue getting financial support. now teachers have to worry 

about their students doing well on standardized tests in math and english 

sometimes at the exspense of the arts and athletics but teachers realize that 

if their students are not up to grade level in the core areas they may be at 

risk of not receiving tenure so they simply jump on the bandwagon and make 

sure that they follow the standards to go along with what is accepted. 

sincerely, 


1002





Subject: Reflection our collective flu paper... 

Looking back at the flu paper created by the whole class, the paper provides at the most 

information for someone who has not read the book. It brings to our awareness that the 

1918 Flu existed, the fact that science did not know how the flu got started, brings to 

our awareness the millions of lives that were lost, why we as a society lacked awareness 

of the 1918 Flu Epidemic, and science relentless attempt to solve the mystery. A few 

voices attempted to make a connection between the 1918 flu and other pivotal events in our 

history; however, many of the voices had a common tone and suggested that teachers seek 

knowledge, stay informed, and seek to have a voice in order to protect our children. The 

paper as a whole lacked depth, questions that were stimulated by the readings, the 

relationship between science, society, technology, history, and other specific area of 

studies. It was difficult to develop ones own thought especially if by the time the paper 

was received it remaine 

d undeveloped, yet it was in its final stage. For the most part the analysis on the 1918 

flu remained in the box. Rarely are we given the opportunity to think outside of the box 

without being judged, but this was not one of those times. We as a class have been given 

the opportunity to think outside of the box and seek to make connections, seek out 

patterns, and understand our role in the process. This was an opportunity to make 

connections between the two articles titled, ?Opening Pandora?s Black Box? and ?Shaping 

Technology/Building Society.? The class paper was worthwhile exploring because it gave us 

the opportunity to see what happens when we become a group. Taking into consideration that 

the time frame was limited to two days, none the less; it appears that people took the 

opportunity to participate on a collaborative flu paper rather than have to really reflect 

deeply on the subject. It is easier to serve in the role of supporter rather than lead the 

way with provoking 

thoughts that requires research, analytical thinking, and risking standing alone. 

After reading Kolata?s book and the two articles on technology and Pandora?s Black Box, I 

understand why the 1918 flu appears to be left out of our history. It not so much that is 

left out of our history but that there exist in our belief system a division between 

science, technology, history, social science, politics, economic, etc. It is our own lack 

of seeking to understand more than just our own personal world that contributes to our 

ignorance about past events or what is going on, for example, in the scientific world 

today. We are given the opportunity to seek to understand the world not only from our 

perspective but from the perspective, for example, of technology?s role in shaping of ?the 

historical, the economic, the political, and the psychological, as well as with the 

sociological? as stated by Wiebe E. Bijker and John Law in the technology article. 

Yamashita?s class challenges us to think outside of what we are comfortable with, so we no 

longer remain ignorant to 

things that we later blame our government for not informing us. In our age of the 

Internet, technology, education, media, etc. there is much to discover if we seek. Our 

government is not responsible for telling us everything it is up to us to wake up and seek 

to educate ourselves and stay informed. We wonder why we did not know about the 1918 flu, 

yet when given the opportunity to understand the role of science, history, technology?we 

prefer to go back to the way it was before we knew because of fear, or because it is too 

much work to think of intellectually, or it does not matter because God will take care of 

it all; He has a bigger plan for us. (Alexandra's Journal #6) 

1003





Subject: The division of God, Men, and Science... 

So many of us hide under God?s wings because it is too scary to think for ourselves or 

challenge the system we live in. Instead, like the story of the man who drowned because he 

was waiting for God to save him. God sent him a boat and others to help, but he refused 

because his faith in God was so great. He was so sure that his belief in God alone would 

keep him from drowning. Then when he got to heaven, he wondered why God let him drown. It 

is then that God tells him that He sent him help but he refused. God, in what ever form 

we praise him gave us our mind, our heart, and our intuitive nature, and our desire to 

feel connected and search for wisdom and truth. Yet, we have no faith in our thoughts, 

feelings, intellect, etc. even though God gave us these gifts. We trust ourselves so 

little, and we fear so much because we have bought into the belief of some devil tempting 

our heart, thoughts, mind, and even our bodies. God made us sexual being, yet we blame the 

devil for our o 

wn lack of self control instead of taking personal responsibility. God gave us our wisdom 

good and bad, and we can destroy with it or do good with it. It is our division that keeps 

us from moving forward. God does not divide us. We divide us. 

Science too has its division and it is probably why it has taken so long for technology 

and science to come together to solve part of the 1918 flu mystery. Science itself is 

further divided as we learn in the ?Opening Pandora?s Black Box? article, which teach us 

about two faces of science known as the ?two-faced Janus.? These two faces of science 

stubborn by nature turn their backs on one another. Author Bruno Latour provides the 

following examples so we can understand this division: 

Face One 

? Ready Made Science 

? Just get the facts straight 

? Just get the most efficient machine 

? Once the machine works people will be convinced 

? When things are true they hold 

Face Two 

? Science in the Making 

? Get rid of all the useless facts 

? Decide on what efficiency should be 

? The machine will work when all the relevant people are convinced 

? When things hold they start becoming true 

This double face of science was apparent throughout the reading of Kolata?s book on the 

1918 Flu Epidemic. Initially at the start of the book, we learn that epidemics like Ebola, 

The Black Death, and 1918 Flu were unexplained mysteries, for example, The Black Death was 

explained in terms of religion. It was believed that The Black Death was caused because 

men did not fear the gods or the law, and the law was closely tied to religious beliefs. 

Think of us having this type of thinking today that all of our ailments, such as, Cancer, 

Down Syndrome, Luke Garrett?s disease, the Flu, HIV/AIDS, etc. was caused by God because 

we do not fear Him. There are those who do belief this. 

Many of the science?s and technology?s discoveries of medicine, x-rays,teacing tools, 

computers, etc. would probably not exist if religion and state were not somewhat separate. 

Ailments would probably continue to be explained as it being God?s way of teaching us 

humility and fear. If people really lived only by the word of God or the bible they would 

seek no further education outside of the bible, no medicine, no science, no technology or 

understanding of the world around them. No one is really a so call true Christian because 

nothing is so easily defined as black and white. Christians too depend on doctors, 

teachers, social workers, government, politics, science, etc. to survive. The word of God 

alone would never be enough food. God provided us our mind, life experiences, 

intropection, etc to continue to feed us. If the bible was our only source for survival, 

women would definitely not step outside of their roles of wives and mothers given their 

biblical roles. As we can se 

e, religion too is like a double edge sword because in order to survive in our society 

the words of God is adapted to fit more and more into our society. It matters not the 

exact translation from Hebrew or Greek for even in those days society was adapting to the 

1004

world around them. Yet people who are considered different, for example, homosexual, are 

judged by Christians and the like when the Christians themselves are further away from 

purity of heart and mind while bending the words of God to further and further maintain 

their status-quo in society, which brings another question. Who decided that the words of 

God stops evolving in the limitations of the bible? Is the bible really the only way to 

heaven? What about the blind, deaf, disabled, old, sick, poor? Do they not get to go to 

heaven? Or do you believe their life exist as it does a result of a sin rather than look 

at what men has done to the environment. Who was at the pulpit when the decision was made 

for which books 

to include in the bible? What were their ultimate motivates? Was it God who instilled 

fear of God in our society or was it men? Did these few voices in the bible keep true to 

God?s wishes? Were they as wholesome, pure, and good as God would have wished them to be? 

If we did not read all of the other books in the bible, for example, written by Matthew, 

Mark, Samuel, or the book on proverbs based on the fear of the Lord, and read only words 

of Jesus the prophet as our savor. Wouldn't the ?voice? of the son of God be enough to 

feed our spirit? and the only real voice worthy of our reflection and contemplation? I 

trust God but not men who claim to be inspired by God. Nothing in the final product that 

has been touched my men remains untainted and it is why I seek for God within the way the 

blind, deaf, disabled, or poor villagers who learn of God through hymns and prayers. Our 

soul came into this world to experience God just as we are disabled, poor, gay, 

heterosexual, victims of 

our circumstance, etc. Is it too much to consider that true faith is found within rather 

than in the words of men who claim to be inspired by God? Were these same men at the 

pulpit not the same men whose ultimate goal for power tainted God's word to keep society 

suppressed the way the Church and the State kept women suppressed during the witch craze? 

It would have not been convenient for the other voices left out of the bible to bring up 

that homosexuality have existed since the beginning of time when procreation was the 

preaching of the times. How could the preachers sanctify homosexuality while preaching 

procreation? Society in the early days was not based on equality of men, women, race or 

other. It is today that people feel the wrath of being homosexual because society push for 

marriage lures with benefits that only married people can have to show their privilege 

status in society. The things that a married couple is entitled to is something that 

homosexuals would want 

equal rights to. Division creates a desire for change. We don?t chose who we love anymore 

than you chose to be born male or female with a drive for the opposite sex or the same 

sex. The fear of HIV/AIDS has us trapped in the Athens way of thinking about The Black 

Death. Unfortunately, perspicuity and lack of honor of thy body has bought on the 

contraction of STDs and we blame this on the homosexual people because they have become 

our modern age scapegoat. With all these differences no wonder why the 1918 flu has been 

forgotten. We are in more threat of destroying ourselves through our biases, hate, and 

abuse on others than we are of dying from the flu. None the less, we need catastrophes 

like the 1918 flu, the 1989 collapse of Nimitz Highway, September 11th for science, 

technology, history, politics, economic, society with its believes...to come together and 

realize that we need to work together for the greater good. 

1005


From: spiritualdancer@cox.net 



Subject: The division between God, Men, Science... 

So many of us hide under God's wings because it is too scary to think for ourselves or 

challenge the system we live in. Instead, like the story of the man who drowned because he 

was waiting for God to save him. God sent him a boat 

and others to help, but he refused because his faith in God was so great. He was so sure 

that his belief in God alone would keep him from drowning. Then when he got to heaven, he 

wondered why God let him drown. It is then that God tells him that He sent him help but he 

refused. God, in what ever form we praise him gave us our mind, our heart, and our 

intuitive nature, and our desire to feel connected and search for wisdom and truth. Yet, 

we have no faith 

in our thoughts, feelings, intellect, etc. even though God gave us these gifts. We trust 

ourselves so little, and we fear so much because we have bought into the belief of some 

devil tempting our heart, thoughts, mind, and even our 

bodies. God made us sexual being, yet we blame the devil for our own lack of self control 

instead of taking personal responsibility. God gave us our wisdom good and bad, and we can 

destroy with it or do good with it. It is our division 

that keeps us from moving forward. God does not divide us. We divide us. 

Science too has its division and it is probably why it has taken so long for technology 

and science to come together to solve part of the 1918 flu mystery. Science itself is 

further divided as we learn in the "Opening Pandora's Black 

Box" article, which teaches us about the two faces of science known as the "two-faced 

Janus." These two faces of science are stubborn by nature turn their backs on one 

another. Author Bruno Latour provides the following examples so we can understand this 

division: 

Face One 

-Ready Made Science 

-Just get the facts straight 

-Just get the most efficient machine 

-Once the machine works people will be convinced 

-When things are true they hold 

Face Two 

-Science in the Making 

-Get rid of all the useless facts 

-Decide on what efficiency should be 

-The machine will work when all the relevant people are convinced 

-When things hold they start becoming true 

This double face of science was apparent throughout the reading of Kolata's book on the 

1918 Flu Epidemic. Initially at the start of the book, we learn that epidemics like Ebola, 

The Black Death, and 1918 Flu were unexplained 

mysteries, for example, The Black Death was explained in terms of religion. It was 

believed that The Black Death was caused because men did not fear the gods or the law, and 

the law was closely tied to religious beliefs. Think of us 

having this type of thinking today that all of our ailments, such as, Cancer, Down 

Syndrome, Luke Garrett's disease, the Flu, HIV/AIDS...was caused by God because we do not 

fear Him. There are those who do belief this. Many of the science's and technology's 

discoveries of medicine, x-rays, 

teaching tools, computers, etc. would probably not exist if religion and state were not 

somewhat separate. Ailments would probably continue to be explained as it being 

God's way of teaching us humility and fear. If people really lived only by the word of God 

or the bible they would seek no further education outside of the bible, no medicine, no 

science, no technology or understanding of the world 

around them. No one is really a so call true Christian because nothing is so easily 

defined as black and white. Christians too depend on doctors, teachers, social workers, 

government, politics, science, etc. to survive. The word of God alone would not be enough 

food. God provided us our mind, life experiences, intropection, education, science, 

technology...to continue to feed us. If the 

bible was our only source for survival, women would definitely not step outside of their 

1006

oles of wives and 

mothers given their biblical roles. As we can see, religion too is like a double edge 

sword because in order to survive in our society the words of God is adapted to fit more 

and more into our society. It matters not the exact translation from Hebrew or Greek for 

even in those days society was adapting to the world around them. Yet people who are 

considered different, for example, homosexual, are judged by Christians and the like when 

the Christians 

themselves are further away from purity of heart and mind while bending the words of God 

to further and further maintain their status-quo in society, which brings another 

question. Who decided that the words of God stops evolving in the limitations or 

contradictory of the bible? Is the bible really the only way to heaven? What about the 

blind, deaf, disabled, old, sick, poor? Do they not get to go to 

heaven? Or do you believe their life exist as it does a result of a sin rather than look 

at what men has done to the environment. Who was at the pulpit when the decision was made 

for which books to include in the bible? What were their ultimate motivates? Was it God 

who instilled fear of God in our society or was it men? Did these few voices in the bible 

keep true to God's wishes? Were they as wholesome, pure, and good as God would have wished 

them to be? If we did not read all of the other books in the bible, for example, written 

by Matthew, Mark, Samuel, or the book on proverbs based on the fear of the Lord, and read 

only the words of Jesus the prophet and our savor. Would not the "voice" of the son of God 

be enough to feed our spirit? and the only real voice worthy of our reflection and 

contemplation? I trust God but not men who claimed to be 

inspired by God when inserting their thoughts in the bible. Nothing in the final product 

that has been touched my men remains untainted and it is why I seek for God within the way 

the blind, deaf,disabled, or poor villagers who 

learn of God through hymns and prayers. Our soul came into this world to experience God 

just as we are disabled, poor, gay,heterosexual, victims of our circumstance, etc. Is it 

too much to consider that true faith is found within rather than in the words of men who 

claim to be inspired by God? Were these same men at the pulpit not the same men whose 

ultimate goal for power tainted God's word to keep society suppressed the way the Church 

and the State kept women suppressed during the witch craze? It would have not been 

convenient for the other voices left out of the bible to bring up that homosexuality have 

existed since the beginning of time when procreation was the preaching of the times. How 

could the preachers sanctify homosexuality while preaching procreation? Society in the 

early days was not based on 

equality of men, women, race or other. Homosexual are experiencing the wrath of being gay 

because society pushes for marriage with lures of benefits that only married people can 

have to show their privilege status in society. 

The things that married couples are entitled to is something that homosexuals would want 

equal rights to. Is it a fight for equality or marriage? The state does not honor the 

sacred church wedding. Division creates a desire for change. We don't chose who we love 

anymore than you chose to be born male or female with a drive for the opposite sex or the 

same sex. The fear of HIV/AIDS has us trapped in the Athens 

way of thinking about The Black Death. Unfortunately, perspicuity and lack of honor of thy 

body has bought on the contraction of STDs, and we blame this on the homosexual people 

because they have become our modern age scapegoat. With all these differences no wonder 

why the 1918 flu has been forgotten. We are in more threat of destroying ourselves through 

our biases, hate, and abuse on 

others than we are of dying from the flu. None the less, we need catastrophes, like the 

1918 flu, the 1989 collapse of Nimitz Highway, September 11th... for science, technology, 

history, politics, economic, society with its believes... 

to come together and realize that we need to work together for the greater good. 

(Alexandra's Journal #7) 

1007





Subject: Jennifer's Journal #7: Activity on the List Server 

As I sit at the computer every day to check the posts to the List Server, it 

is interesting to see what topics are being discussed. I am noticing that 

the same topics are being discussed by the same people. For example, 

religion and homosexual marriage is one that I think has been over done 

lately. 

It takes a lot of effort in writing out about such a topic to persuade and 

encourage people to think a certain way on the issue. Often times, those 

writing about it already feel one way or another about the issue. However, 

they choose to write about an issue that will not persuade every one in our 

class to see it one way or the other. And even if every one agrees one way 

or the other, both sides will never be happy. In fact, there are only a 

handful of people that have voiced their opinion about the matter and have 

chosen to do so on this List Server. 

Personally, I do not feel that this forum is an effective one to have a 

debate of this magnitude. Just as people choose to write about the topic 

here, there are also many people that choose not to read about the topic 

being presented. See, the way things work here, is that people get to choose 

what they write and what they read. If so much effort is being put into the 

writing, it would be nice to know that people are choosing to read it. It is 

so easy to delete the e-mails that one does not find interest in or chooses 

to engage in. I think that if time is going to be spent posting it, it would 

be good to know that one is making a difference and maybe pushing others to 

think about the issue put forth. But how can one be sure? They cannot, and 

this is exactly my point. 

It is a choice to read the posts, but not a choice to write the posts. It is 

not a choice to post because if one does not post, their grade will suffer 

(since this journal assignment is a significant part of our grade in this 

class). 

I think that when the same people post about a certain issue over and over 

again, without new people entering the conversation, it is a clue to move on 

to something else. Sure one is bringing the issue to the attention of those 

on the List Server, but changing their opinion, I'm not so sure. 

Maybe this is just a way to expose one's beliefs. After all, one chooses 

what to say here and even if other people's minds don't change as a result 

of it, it gets it off one's chest. They wrote down their beliefs, posted it, 

and maybe people thought about it. Maybe they thought a little more about 

their own beliefs in the process. After all, maybe this is the whole purpose 

of the List Server, to explore one's self just a little bit more. Just a 

little deeper that they would have without. 

(But I still think a new topic is due.) 


_________________________________________________________________ 



1008







reply (8 KB) 

its been my understanding that this verse, 1 Timothy 2:12, is referring to 

women teaching in the church. i looked in two of my Bibles and a reference book and ran 

out of time to continue my search...i had intended to look up the Greek words to get a 

true understanding, but i just didnt get that far tonight. it has always been taught that 

a woman should not teach in the church, as a pastor, based on this verse. i havent ever 

heard it any other way, for example, that women should not teach in the school system. 

if taken in context, it is Paul writing to Timothy and it is to be read to the Ephesian 

church. and we do not know what was going on at this time and in this place. well, i do 

not know. 

i havent studied 1 Timothy yet, but it is one i've always enjoyed so when that time comes, 

if i have a deeper answer, i can let you know. until then, i can only tell you what i 

know up to this point. good enough? 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/07 Sun PM 02:58:00 PST 


> Subject: Karis: black and white, journal something 

> 

> 


1009





Subject: Re: Jennifer's Journal #7: Activity on the List Server 

Hi Jennifer. I agree it is time for a new topic, I think I posted a desire for one a couple of weeks ago. 

Unfortunately, no one has started one that people have shown interest in. I do think the one good 

thing that came out of the "over-done" topic is that a few new people finally did begin to post, which I 

was happy about. Regardless of viewpoint, I like to see what others think. Unfortunately, no one is 

willing to step into the gray area, so the same arguement keep getting repeating and the topic goes 

nowhere. And this is fine too, as long as we move on to something else.Cynthia 

PLEASE POST A NEW TOPIC FOR US!!!! 


As I sit at the computer every day to check the posts to the List Server, it 

is interesting to see what topics are being discussed. I am noticing that 

the same topics are being discussed by the same people. For example, 

religion and homosexual marriage is one that I think has been over done 

lately. 

It takes a lot of effort in writing out about such a topic to persuade and 

encourage people to think a certain way on the issue. Often times, those 

writing about it already feel one way or another about the issue. However, 

they choose to write about an issue that will not persuade every one in our 

class to see it one way or the other. And even if every one agrees one way 

or the other, both sides will never be happy. In fact, there are only a 

handful of people that have voiced their opinion about the matter and have 

chosen to do so o n this List Server. 

Personally, I do not feel that this forum is an effective one to have a 

debate of this magnitude. Just as people choose to write about the topic 

here, there are also many people that choose not to read about the topic 

being presented. See, the way things work here, is that people get to choose 

what they write and what they read. If so much effort is being put into the 

writing, it would be nice to know that people are choosing to read it. It is 

so easy to delete the e-mails that one does not find interest in or chooses 

to engage in. I think that if time is going to be spent posting it, it would 

be good to know that one is making a difference and maybe pushing others to 

think about the issue put forth. But how can one be sure? They cannot, and 

this is exactly my point. 

It is a choice to read the posts, but not a choice to write the posts. It is 

not a choice to post because if one does not post, their grade will suffer 

(since this journal assignment is a significant part of our grade in this 

class). 

I think that when the same people post about a certain issue over and over 

again, without new people entering the conversation, it is a clue to move on 

to something else. Sure one is bringing the issue to the attention of those 

1010

on the List Server, but changing their opinion, I'm not so sure. 

Maybe this is just a way to expose one's beliefs. After all, one chooses 

what to say here and even if other people's minds don't change as a result 

of it, it gets it off one's chest. They wrote down their beliefs, posted it, 

and maybe people thought about it. Maybe they thought a little more about 

their own beliefs in the process. After all, maybe this is the whole purpose 

of the List Server, to explore one's self just a little bit more. Just a 

little deeper that they would have without. 

(But I still think a new topic is due.) 

~J ennifer Ramos 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



1011





Subject: beliefs and lifestyles 

i have read in a few different emails that we choose our beliefs based on our lifestyles. 

for example, i chose Christianity because it best fits my lifestyle. WRONG 

so what does it take to walk right with the Lord? it consists of tremendous sacrifices. 

i did not choose to be Christian because i was a goody-two-shoes, because i thought 

everything the Bible had to say was right on with my beliefs at the time. i didnt even 

know what the Bible said. 

by no means was this how it happened for me and probably not for most "born again" 

Christians (those who did not grow up Christian but have come to know Christ later in 

their life). 

i can say from a Christian stand point, that Christians do not choose to be Christian 

because it best fits their lifestyle. im not sure that it fits anyone's lifestyle. 

i not only had to give up everything my life came to be (guys, parties, "partying", 

typical friday and saturday nights, certain music, etc.) but i had to give up my friends. 

and to this day i struggle to find as many friends as i had before all this. 

is it all worth it? more than you would ever know. i would give up so much more than 

this just to have one day with God. 

my FAVORITE worship song... 

"for here my heart is satisfied within your presence...better is one day in your courts, 

better is one day in your house, than thousands elsewhere..." 


1012





Subject: Journal 7 The Truth 

It is interesting to see what topics are being discussed, but like Jennifer 

says its time for a new one. 

I think if other people were going to discuss the topics being discussed it 

would have been done by now. Personally, many of the major discussions are 

topics that I am not interested in, or discussing in depth like this. But 

thank you Jennifer for bringing this up, it gave me something to write 

about. Sort of. 

As many of the discussion have not been of much interest to me, I am finding 

it hard to respond every week. It seems like each weeks gets more difficult. 

As I was driving home tonight I was thinking to myself what am i going to 

write about? So, I'll take this discussion in a totally different direction 

than what has been discussed. 

Well i was just having this discussion with a friend online about the truth. 

So, here's my discussion on the truth. My friend had asked me what about a 

person makes me mad? I responded by telling him, I hate it when people lie. 

It doesn't make any sense to lie. I figure lying just gets you in more 

trouble than you would of been in if you would of told the truth. So just 

tell the truth even if it hurts or is wrong? Obviously, if you did something 

wrong there are consequences for that. As for what those consequences are, 

is up to the situation and whose involved. I think this is important for 

children to understand as well. Sometimes telling the truth turns out not to 

be so bad after all. Children need to understand that they have to be held 

accountable for their actions and if they've done wrong, then they should 

own up to it. Even admitting you did something bad/wrong is better than 

lying about it. But I guess even famous people lie and are devious. Martha 

Stuart was just found guilty on all four?? charges. She probably would not 

have had four felonies against her if she had told the truth from the 

begining, but she lied to federal people and did a bunch of other things, 

that just got her in more trouble. So, perhaps she'll pay for her mistakes. 

She's a human being, and just because she has lots of money doesn't mean she 

should let go so easily. WEll, those are my thoughts for this journal. 

Exciting stuff huh??? 




>Subject: Jennifer's Journal #7: Activity on the List Server 

>Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 21:26:11 -0800 

> 

>As I sit at the computer every day to check the posts to the List Server, 

>it is interesting to see what topics are being discussed. I am noticing 

>that the same topics are being discussed by the same people. For example, 

>religion and homosexual marriage is one that I think has been over done 

>lately. 

> 

>It takes a lot of effort in writing out about such a topic to persuade and 

>encourage people to think a certain way on the issue. Often times, those 

>writing about it already feel one way or another about the issue. However, 

>they choose to write about an issue that will not persuade every one in our 

>class to see it one way or the other. And even if every one agrees one way 

>or the other, both sides will never be happy. In fact, there are only a 

>handful of people that have voiced their opinion about the matter and have 

>chosen to do so on this List Server. 

1013

>Personally, I do not feel that this forum is an effective one to have a 

>debate of this magnitude. Just as people choose to write about the topic 

>here, there are also many people that choose not to read about the topic 

>being presented. See, the way things work here, is that people get to 

>choose what they write and what they read. If so much effort is being put 

>into the writing, it would be nice to know that people are choosing to read 

>it. It is so easy to delete the e-mails that one does not find interest in 

>or chooses to engage in. I think that if time is going to be spent posting 

>it, it would be good to know that one is making a difference and maybe 

>pushing others to think about the issue put forth. But how can one be sure? 

>They cannot, and this is exactly my point. 

> 

>It is a choice to read the posts, but not a choice to write the posts. It 

>is not a choice to post because if one does not post, their grade will 

>suffer (since this journal assignment is a significant part of our grade in 

>this class). 

> 

>I think that when the same people post about a certain issue over and over 

>again, without new people entering the conversation, it is a clue to move 

>on to something else. Sure one is bringing the issue to the attention of 

>those on the List Server, but changing their opinion, I'm not so sure. 

> 

>Maybe this is just a way to expose one's beliefs. After all, one chooses 

>what to say here and even if other people's minds don't change as a result 

>of it, it gets it off one's chest. They wrote down their beliefs, posted 

>it, and maybe people thought about it. Maybe they thought a little more 

>about their own beliefs in the process. After all, maybe this is the whole 

>purpose of the List Server, to explore one's self just a little bit more. 

>Just a little deeper that they would have without. 

> 

>(But I still think a new topic is due.) 

> 


> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>One-click access to Hotmail from any Web page – download MSN Toolbar now! 

>http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/ 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1014





Subject: Re: Jennifer's Journal 6: List Server Activity 

Dear Class, 

(Jennifer) please don't take any of this the wrong way, it is not directed specifically at you. I am 

responding to your journal entry, but I am also responding to the class on the topic too; it just 

happens to be attached to your entry. 

I understand that there are some people who do not want to get involved in the topic that I brought 

up. In the beginning it was brought up because it is a current topic in our society that effects many 

more people than the average citizen realizes. I also brought it up because it has a lot to do with the 

science and society vs. religion (creation) Darwin's theory and the creation theory; that's how it 

started off. Then, no one but Cynthia really ever responded to any journal postings. It grew from 

there, my wanting to know WHY grew BIGGER and BIGGER. Then, when I was growing tired do 

to mainly negative responses, and felt like dropping the debate, little things sprung up and I continued 

the discussion. 

Last semester in our teaching practicum, I was having first graders listening to music and having 

them do different movements like: hopping, marching...etc. When I had them do skipping, one little 

boy came over to me and said, "I don't want to do skipping" I said "why? You are doing such a good 

job?" He told me he didn't want to because his mommy says it's GAY...... I think this is a very 

appropriate topic for future teachers. What are we going to do when faced with similar situations? 

This was another reason I brought the topic of homosexuality up on the list serve. 

I agree, I am growing tired of this topic falling on deaf ears, and I truly think that is a shame that more 

people don't care to promote equality in the land of liberty and justice for (ALL?). I still don't think 

there is anything wrong with two consenting adults wanting to express their love for one another in a 

union "like marriage"with all of its bells and whistles, a right that everyone else in America has. It 

does not hurt anyone. I used to think that is was mainly religious people who opposed homosexuality 

the most, perhaps I was wrong? Look at all "the blackbirds" that flew to San Fransico with broken 

wings to join in the gesture to get married. Does that not open any eyes that maybe change needs to 

happen? That our current society has outgrown its old skin and needs to shed into the next state of 

equality? 

On the other hand, there is no one stating that there could not have been more than one discussion 

happening at one time, along side this topic. At the very least it has given people a topic to respond 

to in addition to the readings. Please... bring up something to talk about...whatever you want. There 

should not be too many uncomfortable topics to discuss after this this topic. I will just sit quietly and 

try to bite my tongue if the urge comes up to talk about what is happening with our societies current 

stance on the homosexual marriage debate, but you know I will be thinking about it ... 

Tired, frustrated and angry and at the state of our society, 

Ann the sad explorer of cohort F http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/17.gif 


1015

As I sit at my computer every day, I find myself checking the List Server 

(my Hotmail account) for new activity. I must be honest, lately, I haven't 

been exactly into the topics being discussed. 

People talk. Let's face it, that is what we do. One chooses the topics 

brought to the table and the depths of which the topics are addressed, 

argued, and/or explored. I find it interesting that the same people are 

arguing the same topics. But just as these topics are chosen to be written 

and posted on the List Server, the topics are being chosen to be read as 

well. 

I see a lot of effort being put into some of the e-mails on the topic of 

homosexuality and religion. I think to myself, are these people really 

opening the minds of those who are reading their posts? Do they really think 

that by writing these e-mails, they are changing pe ople's minds one way or 

the other? Maybe they are, but for myself, it's not working. 

On the contrary, just as a lot of effort is going into the writing, there 

has to be effort going into the deciphering of the reading in order for mind 

changing to be effective. One has to really think about the topic of 

homosexuality and religion, for example, to make up their mind or change 

their mind one way or the other. That is, if homosexual marriage is okay or 

not, according to their own opinion. If one has not made up their own mind 

on their position of this topic, I'm not sure if this is the right kind of 

forum for this debate to be effective. 

There are some people that have their personal viewpoint on topics set a 

certain way. Some don't. Yes, I'm sure that some people haven't fully made 

up their minds on their stances too. But, even so, they may be choosing not 

to get involved in the topics being brought forward. Please don't get m e 

wrong. I am not saying that arguing one's point of view is not effective. I 

just think that this is not the forum in which it can be as effective 

because people are choosing what they want to hear. Just as we choose what 

we are writing about here, people are choosing what they read about. More 

so, people don't have a choice not to participate in the List Server because 

it is a significant part of our grade for this class, and if one does not 

participate, grades will suffer. 

All I'm trying to say here is that one chooses at which depth they are going 

to dive into on this List Server. Some will choose to be very broad or very 

specific. Some will choose to write about topics they feel extremely 

passionate about, and some won't. Some will choose to participate in the 

topics being addressed and others will not. I'm sure that everyone has some 

sort of opinion about almost any topic. I have my opinion about homosexual 

marri age but I have chosen not to write or comment about it. This is my 

exact point. Some of us may have certain viewpoints, but are choosing not to 

share them on this List Server. As anyone can see, only a few people have 

chosen to commit themselves to the topic. There has been so much talk about 

certain topics, but not everyone is engaging themselves. It is not because 

they don't have an opinion, it is just because they don't want to engage in 

the conversation at hand. It shouldn't be taken personally. 

Maybe it's just time for a new topic. Sometimes I dread checking this List 

1016

Server because I think that topics are going nowhere. It's not worth getting 

so worked up about a certain issue. I'm not responding to them because I 

don't want to get involved in a topic that will reach no overwhelmingly left 

or right outcome at the end of this course. This issue will still be debated 

for a very long time. I don't have a topic to throw out there at this 

moment, but I do think a new topic is due. Let's see if a new topic shows up 

on the List Server soon. Will more people have something to say about it 

instead of only a few? 


_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



1017





Subject: lecturers 

As I was reading the bandwagon article I started to think about an article that I read, I don't remember 

if it was in the school's newspaper or in the north county times, but it was talking about the outcomes 

of the budget cuts and the effect that it will have on lecturers. The article mentioned that the lack of 

funds would mean that the university would have to lay-off several of the lecturers from Cal. State 

San Marcos. Reading this article made me think that maybe that is the reason why we always get 

shitty instructors (lecturers), because the professors that have been teaching there are in sabbatical 

leave and thus the lecturers take off where the professors left off. It seems to me that when ever I 

hear about a good professor I never get to take him/her because they are on sabbatical leave. Yes, I 

understand that these professors have to go do research, but I feel like we are spending all this 

money so that the professors could go and practice their field by conducting an outside experiment, in 

which, on a personal level, frankly I don't find that benefiting me. I hear about what these professor do 

when they are on sabbatical, but I don't ever see it being implemented in the classroom. The 

bandwagon article mentioned that institutions such as universities "are betting resources on 

molecular biological cancer research," in order to get some sort of recognition. I still believe that 

instead of the university having to pay for the professor to go on sabbatical plus have to pay for the 

lecturer to take his/her place I think it would be better for the professors to concentrate on teaching. 

Karla 

1018





Subject: Re: Journal 7 The Truth 

While I agree people need to take responsibility for what they have said, done etc., there is a gray 

area in regards to the truth. Sometimes it isn't really the best response in certain situations. Children 

are very honest, and they make for some very funny but embarrassing moments. Like when they say 

outloud in a store (in a very loud voice), Mommy, why is that lady soooooo fat? I think people have to 

weigh the circumstance, decide who will get hurt (by the truth or lie) and then act according to what 

will bring about the best result for all those concerned. I am beginning to think nothing is just black 

and white. I sure have seen a lot of gray lately. Cynthia 


It is interesting to see what topics are being discussed, but like Jennifer 

says its time for a new one. 

I think if other people were going to discuss the topics being discussed it 

would have been done by now. Personally, many of the major discussions are 

topics that I am not interested in, or discussing in depth like this. But 

thank you Jennifer for bringing this up, it gave me something to write 

about. Sort of. 

As many of the discussion have not been of much interest to me, I am finding 

it hard to respond every week. It seems like each weeks gets more difficult. 

As I was driving home tonight I was thinking to myself what am i going to 

write about? So, I'll take this discussion in a totally different direction 

than what has been discussed. 

Well i was just having this discussion with a friend online about the truth. 

So, here's my discussion on the truth. My friend had asked me what about a 

person makes me mad? I responded by telling him, I hate it when people lie. 

It doesn't make any sense to lie. I figure lying just gets you in more 

trouble than you would of been in if you would of told the truth. So just 

tell the truth even if it hurts or is wrong? Obviously, if you did something 

wrong there are consequences for that. As for what those consequences are, 

is up to the situation and whose involved. I think this is important for 

children to understand as well. Sometimes telling the truth turns out not to 

be so bad after all. Children need to understand that they have to be held 

accountable for their actions and if they've done wrong, then they should 

own up to it. Even admitting you did something bad/wrong is better than 

lying about it. But I guess even famous people lie and are devious. Martha 

Stuart was just found guilty on all four?? charges. She pr obably would not 

have had four felonies against her if she had told the truth from the 

begining, but she lied to federal people and did a bunch of other things, 

that just got her in more trouble. So, perhaps she'll pay for her mistakes. 

She's a human being, and just because she has lots of money doesn't mean she 

should let go so easily. WEll, those are my thoughts for this journal. 

Exciting stuff huh??? 

1019

From: "Jennifer Ramos" 



>Subject: Jennifer's Journal #7: Activity on the List Server 

>Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 21:26:11 -0800 

> 

>As I sit at the computer every day to check the posts to the List Server, 

>it is interesting to see what topics are being discussed. I am noticing 

>that the same topics are being discussed by the same people. For example, 

>religion and homosexual marriage is one that I think has been over done 

>lately. 

> 

>It takes a lot of effort in writing out about such a topic to persuade and 

>encourage people to think a certain way on the issue. Often times, those 

>writing about it already feel one way or another about the issue. However, 

>they choose to write about an issue that will not persuade every one in our 

>class to see it one way or the other. And even if every one agrees one way 

>or the other, both sides will never be happy. In fact, there are only a 

>handful of people that have voiced their opinion about the matter and have 

>chosen to do so on this List Server. 

> 

>Personally, I do not feel that this forum is an effective one to have a 

>debate of this magnitude. Just as people choose to write about the topic 

>here, there are also many people that choose not to read about the topic 

>being presented. See, the way things work here, is that people get to 

>choose wh at they write and what they read. If so much effort is being put 

>into the writing, it would be nice to know that people are choosing to read 

>it. It is so easy to delete the e-mails that one does not find interest in 

>or chooses to engage in. I think that if time is going to be spent posting 

>it, it would be good to know that one is making a difference and maybe 

>pushing others to think about the issue put forth. But how can one be sure? 

>They cannot, and this is exactly my point. 

> 

>It is a choice to read the posts, but not a choice to write the posts. It 

>is not a choice to post because if one does not post, their grade will 

>suffer (since this journal assignment is a significant part of our grade in 

>this class). 

> 

>I think that when the same people post about a certain issue over and over 

>again, without new people entering the conversation, it is a clue to move 

>on to something else. Sure one is bringing the issue to the attention of 

>those on the List Server, but changing their opinion, I'm not so sure. 

> 

>Maybe this is just a way to expose one's beliefs. After all, one chooses 

>what to say here and even if other people's minds don't change as a result 

>of it, it gets it off one's chest. They wrote down their beliefs, posted 

>it, and maybe people thought about it. Maybe they thought a little more 

>about their own beliefs in the process. After all, maybe this is the whole 

>purpose of the List Server, to explore one's self just a little bit more. 

>Just a little deeper that they would have without. 

> 

>(But I still think a new topic is due.) 

1020


> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>One-click access to Hotmail from any Web page – download MSN Toolbar now! 

>http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/ 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 


http://msn.careerbuilder.com/promo/kaday.htm?siteid=CBMSN_ 

1K&sc_extcmp=JS_JASweep_MSNHotm2 

_____ 



1021





Subject: After reading my last post, I realized something.... 

Dear class, 

After reading my last post, I realized that I was also talking to the world too, not just our cohort. I tend 

to drift into the bigger picture when I write. 

Ann 

_____ 



1022





Subject: Re: lecturers 

Hear hear!!!! Actually, they should hire instructors to teach class, and if they feel the need to do 

research, they should hire those people separately, and pay them by raising funds via private 

donations. After all, we are paying to learn, we deserve to have real teachers. NO OFFENSE 

PROFESSORS, I am sure you wouldn't be included in the group we are talking about, lol. Cynthia 


As I was reading the bandwagon article I started to think about an article that I read, I don't 

remember if it was in the school's newspaper or in the north county times, but it was talking about 

the outcomes of the budget cuts and the effect that it will have on lecturers. The article mentioned 

that the lack of funds would mean that the university would have to lay-off several of the lecturers 

from Cal. State San Marcos. Reading this article made me think that maybe that is the reason why 

we always get shitty instructors (lecturers), because the professors that have been teaching there 

are in sabbatical leave and thus the lecturers take off where the professors left off. It seems to me 

that when ever I hear about a good professor I never get to take him/her because they 

are on sabbatical leave. Yes, I understand that these professors have to go do research, but I feel 

like we are spending all this money so that the professors could go and practice th eir field by 

conducting an outside experiment, in which, on a personal level, frankly I don't find that benefiting 

me. I hear about what these professor do when they are on sabbatical, but I don't ever see it 

being implemented in the classroom. The bandwagon article mentioned that institutions such as 

universities "are betting resources on molecular biological cancer research," in order to get some 

sort of recognition. I still believe that instead of the university having to pay for the professor to go 

on sabbatical plus have to pay for the lecturer to take his/her place I think it would be better for the 

professors to concentrate on teaching. 

Karla 

_____ 



1023






This is a very scary subject and not one that I think most people are 

aware of. In my Biology 338 class I learned that water instead of oil 

will become the substance that wars will be fought over in the coming 

years. Only 1% of the Earths water is available to the planet for 

everything. The rest of the water is in the oceans, seas, glaciers etc. 

and unusable. It is estimated that we will run out of water around 

2050! I don't think that the average person does know the damages that 

we are causing the Earth. The western world, for the most part, is 

unfamiliar with sustainable agriculture. We are raping this Earth more 

rapidly than the Earth can replenish its resources and many of the 

resources are non-renewable. It would be very refreshing for the media 

to focus on the effects of damages that are caused and what we can do to 

remedy this dire situation. Knowledge is power (I think I said that 

before!) Instead they are more content to focus on Martha, Kobe, 

Britney... 

~ Louise 




To: listserve 


i have been wondering lately about the future of the 

Earth, as the science project i'm working on with my 

group made me face first-hand the polluted waters 

running right into the ocean i surf in. these are 

things that i know are happening, but that i try not 

to think about, especially when i'm out in the water. 

i think about how san diego is one of the most desired 

places to live on the west coast, where i was born, 

and how many people move into the mass-produced 

tract-homes every year. do they ever think about what 

is happening out in the ocean that they drive past in 

their s.u.v. every day? do they ever think about the 

effects of pollution, over-use, and depletion of the 

Earth's resources? i know that they are big topics, 

but does the average person have a clue about the 

situation in alaska and other arctic places where 

native people have not been able to go out on the sea 

ice to hunt for a coupele of years because the ice is 

melting? this problem gets more severe each year, and 

it is a big clear sign for all people...the world is 

heating up. 

it seems that the people of the world hardly think 

about the world outside of their own existence 

anymore, that as long as there is food in the grocery 

stores and gas at the gas station, life is ok. all 

this reading about energy lately has gotten me 

thinking about how much energy plays a part in the 

world and even in the pollution of the world, how 

lives are lost in wars over energy sources and how 

hundreds of thousands of acres of pristine, evolved 

ecosystms are sacrificed for access to energy sources. 

i wonder if i will see a major energy supply shortage 

1024

or a change in the main form of energy we use to power 

the majority of the world? or will the consequences 

of how we have used and continue to use energy become 

so acute that change must be made? 

in chapter 6 of the biology text the author writes a 

metaphor to describe the possible scenario for Earth, 

saying that the sun is like the wind-up spring in a 

music box that will one day wind out, as will every 

other star in the universe, "eventually leaving a 

cold, dark universe with little potential for life." 

well damn, if this is the case then we should start 

thinking about the value of life and re-access our 

priorities as humans. 

why not start using energy in more efficient and 

clean ways, because at the rate humans are going we 

will destroy the planet and most of it's potential to 

support life before the sun burns out, and what a 

waste that would be! people need to start thinking 

about the benefits of the "green world" and how much 

we really depend on its survival for our own. 

photosynthesis produces up to 155 billion tons of 

material each year. think of the clean air we could 

breathe and food we could eat by ensuring survival of 

the "green world" on Earth, and the "blue world" at 

that. or is this just all nonsense/noise on the side 

of the road in the s.u.v's world? 

__________________________________ 


Yahoo! Search - Find what you're looking for faster 


1025




To: ICP-F 

Subject: JOURNAL 7 

After this long weekend I took time to sit down and read our class paper again 

and I feel that the paper was pretty dam good. I really enjoyed reading it 

because I was able to see many different views of my classmates on the flu 

subject. I do feel that this paper was harder then doing our own paper because 

we had to work together in order to get it done on time. But through the hard 

times that we had trying to finish this paper I feel that it brought us 

together more as a chort. Even though each of us only had a small part in the 

paper I feel that we all learned something that ethier we did not know or did 

not understand. 

Jonathan 

1026





Subject: more on gay marriage 

I have been quiet on the discussions(?) about homosexual marriages. As 

some may know I am not quick to give my opinion. I have enjoyed the reading 

and hearing the conversations on this topic. From these conversations I 

have done a lot of thinking about my own beliefs and understandings about 

gay marriage. Here are some of my thoughts: 

As a Christian I am concerned at how vocal we are about gays. Yes, it is a 

sin to live a gay lifestyle, but this is just one of all sins that cause 

this world to move further and further away from God. Why do we focus on 

one sin? More importantly why do we focus on one group of people? I do 

believe that we are to love the sinner hate the sin. In this case it is 

love the gays hate their sin. Christians I believe, forget to look inward 

with this saying. We think that love the sinner only applies to 

non-Christians. The last time I checked ever person ever born in this world 

was born into sin (except Jesus). That means that everyone is a sinner. 

Everyone participates in activities that divide them from God. Christians 

are no different. Christians are no better than anyone else in the world. 

One sin is all you need to separate yourself from God for an eternity. What 

makes Christians different is that they acknowledge that they are sinners, 

and accept the gift of payment of these sins by the suffering of Jesus’ 

death. God has given us a second chance to be in communion with him. 

Christians are different in that they acknowledge they are sinners and try 

to avoid sin. I think Christians a lot of the times think that since they 

try not to sin, that makes their sin not as bad as a non-Christians sin. It 

bothers me when Christians say love the sinner not the sin because they are 

intending to be directed at only non-Christians. It is true we are called 

to love everyone, and because we are sinners like everyone else we have no 

authority to judge anyone else’s sin. When we say, love the gays, but hate 

their sin, we must also say love the Christian, but hate their sin. 

The Bible teaches that we (Christians) are not of this world. This world 

is not our home. Our home is with God in heaven. I struggle with finding 

the authority at which we have to force our beliefs on other people. In 

this case, I don’t know why we can force gays to do or not do anything. We 

have the authority to say and live by what we believe, but we cannot force 

our beliefs on other people. God doesn’t work this way. One of the 

greatest gifts God gives us is the gift of choice. We have the choice to 

follow him or not. Without choice would come unauthentic love, faith, 

worship, etc... People can also choose not to follow God. God has allowed 

for this to happen. But just because we choose to follow God I don’t see 

why we have the authority to make others to live the way we choose to live. 

This is not our world. 

These are just a few of my thoughts right now. I have found that I do have 

a lot to say on this topic, much more than I can add here and expect people 

to read this. So in no way do I think these are my complete thoughts. 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1027





Subject: Re: more on gay marriage 

Wow, Joey. Very well said. I think you found the gray. What you say, makes a lot of sense to me. It is 

important that all people respect the beliefs of others, even it they are not our beliefs. What is "right" 

for one, may not be right for the other. I think vocal resistance to anything comes from fear and 

ignorance, and that could be said about everything in life, on both sides of the fence, not just this 

issue. Thanks for posting. Cynthia 


I have been quiet on the discussions(?) about homosexual marriages. As 

some may know I am not quick to give my opinion. I have enjoyed the reading 

and hearing the conversations on this topic. From these conversations I 

have done a lot of thinking about my own beliefs and understandings about 

gay marriage. Here are some of my thoughts: 

As a Christian I am concerned at how vocal we are about gays. Yes, it is a 


this world to move further and further away from God. Why do we focus on 

one sin? More importantly why do we focus on one group of people? I do 

believe that we are to love the sinner hate the sin. In this case it is 

love the gays hate their sin. Christians I believe, forget to look inward 

with this saying. We think that love the sinner only applies to 

non-Christians. The last time I checked ever person ever born in this world 

was born into sin (except Jesus). That means that everyone is a sinner. 

Everyone participates in activities that divide them from God. Christians 

are no different. Christians are no better than anyone else in the world. 

One sin is all you need to separate yourself from God for an eternity. What 


and accept the gift of payment of these sins by the suffering of Jesus’ 

death. God has given us a second chance to be in communion with him. 

Christians are different in that they acknowledge they are sinners and try 

to avoid sin. I think Christians a lot of the times think that since they 

try not to sin, that makes their sin not as bad as a non-Christians sin. It 

bothers me when Christians say love the sinner not the sin because they are 

intending to be directed at only non-Christians. It is true we are called 

to love everyone, and because we are sinners like everyone else we have no 

authority to judge anyone else’s sin. When we say, love the gays, but hate 


The Bible teaches that we (Christians) are not of this world. This world 

is not our home. Our home is with God in heaven. I struggle with finding 

the authority at which we have to force our beliefs on other people. In 

this case, I don’t know why we can force gays to do or not do anything. We 

have the authority to say and live by what we believe, but we cannot force 

our beliefs on other people. God doesn’t work this way. One of the 

greatest gifts God gives us is the gift of choice. We have the choice to 

follow him or not. Without choice would come unauthentic love, faith, 

worship, etc... People can also choose not to follow God. God has allowed 

1028

for this to happen. But just because we choose to follow God I don’t see 

why we have the authority to make others to live the way we choose to live. 

This is not our world. 

These are just a few of my thoughts right now. I have found that I do have 

a lot to say on this topic, much more than I can add here and expect people 

to read this. So in no way do I think these are my complete thoughts. 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



1029





Subject: RE: more on gay marriage 

"Love the gays hate their sins", from my perspective that sounds very mean. 

Being gay 

makes up who a person is. It is not just a small part of their life, it is a 

major part of who 

they are. If you can not accept a person as they are then how can you truly 

love them as 

a human being? I understand that you say you only hate their action and not 

who they 

are, but being gay makes them who they are. Marin. 

>Wow, Joey. Very well said. I think you found the gray. What you say, makes a 

lot of 

sense to me. It is important that all people respect the beliefs of others, 

even it they are 

not our beliefs. What is "right" for one, may not be right for the other. I 

think vocal 

resistance to anything comes from fear and ignorance, and that could be said 

about 

everything in life, on both sides of the fence, not just this issue. Thanks 

for posting. 

Cynthia 

> 

>Joey Benson wrote:I have been quiet on the 

discussions(?) about homosexual marriages. As 

>some may know I am not quick to give my opinion. I have enjoyed the reading 

>and hearing the conversations on this topic. From these conversations I 

>have done a lot of thinking about my own beliefs and understandings about 

>gay marriage. Here are some of my thoughts: 

>As a Christian I am concerned at how vocal we are about gays. Yes, it is a 

>sin to live a gay lifestyle, but this is just one of all sins that cause 

>this world to move further and further away from God. Why do we focus on 

>one sin? More importantly why do we focus on one group of people? I do 

>believe that we are to love the sinner hate the sin. In this case it is 

>love the gays hate their sin. Christians I believe, forget to look inward 

>with this saying. We think that love the sinner only applies to 

>non-Christians. The last time I checked ever person ever born in this world 

>was born into sin (except Jesus). That means that everyone is a sinner. 

>Everyone participates in activities that divide them from God. Christians 

>are no different. Christians are no better than anyone else in the world. 

>One sin is all you need to separate yourself from God for an eternity. What 

>makes Christians different is that they acknowledge that they are sinners, 

>and accept the gift of payment of these sins by the suffering of Jesus 

>death. God has given us a second chance to be in communion with him. 

>Christians are different in that they acknowledge they are sinners and try 

>to avoid sin. I think Christians a lot of the times think that since they 

>try not to sin, that makes their sin not as bad as a non-Christians sin. It 

>bothers me when Christians say love the sinner not the sin because they are 

>intending to be directed at only non-Christians. It is true we are called 

>to love everyone, and because we are sinners like everyone else we have no 

>authority to judge anyone else’s sin. When we say, love the gays, but hate 

1030


>The Bible teaches that we (Christians) are not of this world. This world 

>is not our home. Our home is with God in heaven. I struggle with finding 

>the authority at which we have to force our beliefs on other people. In 

>this case, I don’t know why we can force gays to do or not do anything. We 

>have the authority to say and live by what we believe, but we cannot force 

>our beliefs on other people. God doesn’t work this way. One of the 

>greatest gifts God gives us is the gift of choice. We have the choice to 

>follow him or not. Without choice would come unauthentic love, faith, 

>worship, etc... People can also choose not to follow God. God has allowed 

>for this to happen. But just because we choose to follow God I don’t see 

>why we have the authority to make others to live the way we choose to live. 

>This is not our world. 

>These are just a few of my thoughts right now. I have found that I do have 

>a lot to say on this topic, much more than I can add here and expect people 

>to read this. So in no way do I think these are my complete thoughts. 

>Joey 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



1031





Subject: May last response 

I do not want to hurt anyone I am just expressing my personal feelings. Joey I 

am glad 

you shared you thoughts. Don't let my response freighten you from continuing 

to sharing 

your views. It is good to share views and personal opinions. We have to 

analyze both 

sides of issues to see a more complete picture. I wanted to address the quote 

you used 

because it went with what I wanted to say. A note to everyone: Keep sharing 

you views 

because they help us all learn and it helps us to become more pssionate 

beings.. 

1032




To: LBST 361B 


Hola a todos!!! (Hi to everyone!!!) 

I found myself having a hard time thinking on what I was going to write for 

this journal. The topics that are going on the list are interested, but for 

some reason I don’t feel motivated to respond. That makes me think about my 

future students. What if they are not interested on what I am teaching? What 

would I do or need to be able to create a learning environment? I, for sure, 

want my students to get engage in the classroom and actually learn. 

On another note, I admire all of you guys who have taken a stand on what you 

believe. However, throughout some emails, I have sensed some frustration 

because people don’t agree with each other. And sometimes I have felt some 

tension. I understand that we want to understand why people think the way they 

do, but sometimes that becomes a little hard. I just think that we need to be 

patient, and tolerant to others. 

One more thing, I was thinking of how when there is an action there is a 

reaction. So in our lives all the decisions that we make are going to have 

either bad or good consequences no matter if we are Jews, Christians,skinny, 

tall,Africans, single, or gay. Consequences might not happen today, or 

tomorrow, but soon we have to face them. 

And as a final thought I want to leave you with the following biblical verse: 

"Everything is permissible"--but not everything is beneficial. "Everything is 

permissible"--but not everything is constructive. 1 Corinthians 10:23 

Paz a todos, 

judith 

1033





Subject: Midterm study group??? 

Hello cohort, 

I see that Karas has posted sample midterms and solutions from previous 

semesters and recommends we study in groups, so i was wondering if anyone 

was interested???? 

carrie 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1034





Subject: just thinking 

Since this is a pretty long email, I at least want people to read this simple 

verse out of the Bible because it's really cool: 

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whosoever 

believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16. 

After reading all of the emails about the gay marriage, I think that Karis 

brings up some great points.Christians don't just pick christianity because it 

fits their lifestyle. I was raised on christian values from when I was born 

until now. So as I grew up I had no choice but follow in the christian path. 

But now that I'm seen as a legally independent adult in society I know that if 

I wanted to I could decide to escape my christian values and lead my life in a 

different direction. 

I guess what I'm saying is that I've had many things happen in my life where 

being a christian and having faith in Jesus has gotten me through so much. 

Even thinking of leaving Jesus behind and not having that kind of relationship 

with Him anymore would leave me very empty and lonely inside. I always have to 

make decisions in my life where the outcome could change my life, just like 

maybe the rest of us in the cohort. For me, I see things black and white and 

if I'm not sure what I should decide (kind of like a gray area which is like 

sin) then I pray about it and I know God will hear my prayer. He might not 

answer it the way I want Him to, but I know that if I try to put my faith in 

Him, then he will have a plan for my life. 

Using the Bible has helped guided me tremendously through life. Of course I 

don't know every story in the Bible, even though I wish I could. But reading 

about how certain people, and Jesus as well, went through difficult situations 

in life and then applying their faith to get through those difficult times is 

really cool. I then use experiences people had to go through and apply it to 

my own life. Pretty much I'm learning from someone else's past experiences. 

Also Joey brought up a good point that Christians do not dislike one 

particular sin, like homosexuality, but all other sins that we all encounter 

in our lives daily. 

I admire Karis and other christians in our cohort for sticking up for their 

christian beliefs because I feel like we are all in the same boat. It's so 

hard for a christian today in society because you stick up for what you 

believe in and you try to live a morally good and faithful life, but you're 

always watched by other christians and non christians. As a christian our goal 

is to be there and help other christians as well as nonchristians to see how 

Jesus can totally change their lives around to the positive. 

Just to let you know, I have dated my boyfriend for almost 5 years now and he 

was a unbeliever. The wonderful part is that he wanted to be baptised and 

confirmed into the christian faith, and so he was because he felt the Holy 

Spirit coming into his heart. I've seen how his faith has prospered through 

time, and how he can see how his faith has impacted his life. Especially after 

seeing The Passion of the Christ, he told me that he then realized that his 

worries in his own life is microscopic compared to what Jesus had to go 

through. 

I just realized I missed seeing Hidalgo tonight, you know that really cool 

horse race in the desert movie? But I think it was kind of worth it since I 

was able to hopefully show some christian influence.Good night everyone and 

1035

God bless. 

Laurie :) 

1036




To: Carrie Gilardone; ICP-F 

Subject: RE: Midterm study group??? 

Sure. I'm interested. Maybe we should all talk in class on Wednesday about it. 

Laurie :) 

>===== Original Message From "Carrie Gilardone" 

===== 

>Hello cohort, 

> 

>I see that Karas has posted sample midterms and solutions from previous 

>semesters and recommends we study in groups, so i was wondering if anyone 

>was interested???? 

> 

>carrie 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



1037






After reviewing the prior midterm exams that Prof. Karas posted, I'm 

definitely up for a study group! As Laurie suggested, perhaps this is 

something we can discuss on Wednesday. 

~ Louise 




To: Carrie Gilardone; ICP-F 


Sure. I'm interested. Maybe we should all talk in class on Wednesday 

about it. 

Laurie :) 

>===== Original Message From "Carrie Gilardone" 

> 

===== 

>Hello cohort, 

> 

>I see that Karas has posted sample midterms and solutions from 

>previous semesters and recommends we study in groups, so i was 

>wondering if anyone was interested???? 

> 

>carrie 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



1038






Thanks for the response Marin. I can see what you are saying. In my post I 

was trying to explain that the hate for a sin is the same, it doesn't matter 

who the sinner is. You could say love the pastor/priest but hate thier sin. 

I do not love gays any less than I love christians. I believe that sin is 

the same for all. If I hate someone for their sin then I must in turn hate 

myself, because I too am a sinner. 

Joey 



>To: Cynthia Reyes , ICP-F 

>Subject: RE: more on gay marriage 

>Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:31:38 -0800 

> 

>"Love the gays hate their sins", from my perspective that sounds very mean. 

>Being gay 

>makes up who a person is. It is not just a small part of their life, it is 

>a 

>major part of who 

>they are. If you can not accept a person as they are then how can you 

>truly 

>love them as 

>a human being? I understand that you say you only hate their action and not 

>who they 

>are, but being gay makes them who they are. Marin. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >Wow, Joey. Very well said. I think you found the gray. What you say, 

>makes a 

>lot of 

>sense to me. It is important that all people respect the beliefs of others, 

>even it they are 

>not our beliefs. What is "right" for one, may not be right for the other. I 

>think vocal 

>resistance to anything comes from fear and ignorance, and that could be 

>said 

>about 

>everything in life, on both sides of the fence, not just this issue. Thanks 

>for posting. 

>Cynthia 

> > 

> >Joey Benson wrote:I have been quiet on the 

>discussions(?) about homosexual marriages. As 

> >some may know I am not quick to give my opinion. I have enjoyed the 

>reading 

> >and hearing the conversations on this topic. From these conversations I 

> >have done a lot of thinking about my own beliefs and understandings about 

> >gay marriage. Here are some of my thoughts: 

> >As a Christian I am concerned at how vocal we are about gays. Yes, it is 

>a 

1039


> >this world to move further and further away from God. Why do we focus on 

> >one sin? More importantly why do we focus on one group of people? I do 

> >believe that we are to love the sinner hate the sin. In this case it is 

> >love the gays hate their sin. Christians I believe, forget to look inward 

> >with this saying. We think that love the sinner only applies to 

> >non-Christians. The last time I checked ever person ever born in this 

>world 

> >was born into sin (except Jesus). That means that everyone is a sinner. 

> >Everyone participates in activities that divide them from God. Christians 

> >are no different. Christians are no better than anyone else in the world. 

> >One sin is all you need to separate yourself from God for an eternity. 

>What 

> >makes Christians different is that they acknowledge that they are 

>sinners, 

> >and accept the gift of payment of these sins by the suffering of Jesus 

> >death. God has given us a second chance to be in communion with him. 

> >Christians are different in that they acknowledge they are sinners and 

>try 

> >to avoid sin. I think Christians a lot of the times think that since they 

> >try not to sin, that makes their sin not as bad as a non-Christians sin. 

>It 

> >bothers me when Christians say love the sinner not the sin because they 

>are 

> >intending to be directed at only non-Christians. It is true we are called 

> >to love everyone, and because we are sinners like everyone else we have 

>no 

> >authority to judge anyone else’s sin. When we say, love the gays, but 

>hate 

> >their sin, we must also say love the Christian, but hate their sin. 

> >The Bible teaches that we (Christians) are not of this world. This world 

> >is not our home. Our home is with God in heaven. I struggle with finding 

> >the authority at which we have to force our beliefs on other people. In 

> >this case, I don’t know why we can force gays to do or not do anything. 

>We 

> >have the authority to say and live by what we believe, but we cannot 

>force 

> >our beliefs on other people. God doesn’t work this way. One of the 

> >greatest gifts God gives us is the gift of choice. We have the choice to 

> >follow him or not. Without choice would come unauthentic love, faith, 

> >worship, etc... People can also choose not to follow God. God has allowed 

> >for this to happen. But just because we choose to follow God I don’t see 

> >why we have the authority to make others to live the way we choose to 

>live. 

> >This is not our world. 

> >These are just a few of my thoughts right now. I have found that I do 

>have 

> >a lot to say on this topic, much more than I can add here and expect 

>people 

> >to read this. So in no way do I think these are my complete thoughts. 

> >Joey 

> > 

> >_________________________________________________________________ 



> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1040

1041






Hey Judith, It's about time you posted!! That is a good quote. I think it could apply it to this journal too. 

OOPS, there I go with the "I" thing again, lol. Let me reword it. The people in this class could apply 

that quote to the journal entries. Now it sounds like I am accusing others of posting things that are not 

constructive! OK, I will try again. When posting to online journals, writers might want to consider 

whether or not an opinion is beneficial and/or constructive. How am I doing? See, its back to me 

again. I just can't escape the "I" !!!! 

Ok, I will be serious now. As teachers, it might be a good idea to leave the "I" out of it when 

approaching a topic for discussion. Some teachers will step to the side of the podium and state they 

will now be giving their opinion, so that students can differentiate between information given as facts 

and those that are given as opinions. 

In the case of the online journals, anyone is free to post a topic that interests them. Hopefully, 

someone will respond and get a good discussion going. I invite you to post something you would like 

to talk about, and lets see if we can get something going. 

Cynthia 


Hola a todos!!! (Hi to everyone!!!) 

I found myself having a hard time thinking on what I was going to write for 

this journal. The topics that are going on the list are interested, but for 

some reason I don’t feel motivated to respond. That makes me think about my 

future students. What if they are not interested on what I am teaching? What 

would I do or need to be able to create a learning environment? I, for sure, 

want my students to get engage in the classroom and actually learn. 

On another note, I admire all of you guys who have taken a stand on what you 

believe. However, throughout some emails, I have sensed some frustration 

because people don’t agree with each other. And sometimes I have felt some 

tension. I understand that we want to understand why people think the way they 

do, but sometimes that becomes a little hard. I just think that we need to be 

patient, and tolerant to others. 

One more thing, I was thinking of how when there is an action there is a 

reaction. So in our lives all the decisions that we make are going to have 

either bad or good consequences no matter if we are Jews, Christians,skinny, 

tall,Africans, single, or gay. Consequences might not happen today, or 

tomorrow, but soon we have to face them. 

And as a final thought I want to leave you with the following biblical verse: 

"Everything is permissible"--but not everything is beneficial. "Everything is 

permissible"--but not everything is constructive. 1 Corinthians 10:23 

1042

Paz a todos, 

judith 

_____ 



1043




To: journal 

Subject: Underlying Dynamics 

Professor Yamashita has been talking about the underlying dynamics in the journal posts; how we 

are communicating and solving, or not solving our disagreements, how people choose to post, what 

they choose to respond to etc. Well, I just thought I would tell you about an interesting (probably only 

to me, lol) connection. 

As some of you might know, I belong to an online Air Force Moms group. It is set up just like our 

journal, so everyone gets the posts and the responses. We talk about all kinds of things, some 

serious, lots about our airmen, but then lots of silly things like our favorite candy we remember from 

when we were kids. Anyway, the members are from all over the US, so it is a very diverse group. 

Well, about 2 weeks ago a cat fight ensued. One of the mom's son got kicked out of the AF because 

he got caught smoking pot. So of course she was upset, then she got angry and started blaming the 

AF for her son's problem. Thats when the claws came out. It was very entertaining. Then it finally died 

down, everything was all rosy, people were posting all the supportive surface level stuff again. But the 

boom! That same mom just couldn't let it go and posted another thing about the big problem the 

military has with drinking. (this had come up in the cat fight). 

So tonight was round 2. And this time around, more and different people began posting, just like in 

our journals. And some are posting requests to move on to new topics, just like in ours. Anyway, I just 

couldn't help but see the similarities in the flow of our journals and the AF one. This makes me a little 

curious. Given the same type of format, would any group act in the same way? Just something to 

think about. Cynthia 

PS I forgot a couple of similarities: We also have lurkers in our group. Some occasionally post their 

"book reports", i.e. "here is an update on my son". People respond, but since its just an update, it 

doesn't evoke any real discussions. And of course, there is the handful of vocal members (yes, I am 

one, lol), some on one side of a fight, some on the other, not that we argue all the time, because for 

the most part we don't, even if there are more than one viewpoint on something. Everyone knows 

who is on what side, at least of those who post all the time, just like this group. But most discussions 

are pretty civil, lol. One difference, and maybe age has something to do with it, or just the general 

outlook on life: there are no discussions of religion. Not that religion isn't there, because it is. Many of 

the members are very religious, and then some are not at allm and you see it in the posts. But I think 

everyone respects everyone's beliefs, and it is not somethin g we would ever debate. 

_____ 



1044





Subject: Re: more on gay marriage 

Joey...I am really impressed and couldn't agree with you more. Who are we to judge? We will all be 

judged when the time comes and until then all we can do is try to live the best possible life! Great 

thoughts. Casey 

1045






I liked this quote from Marin: "If you can not accept a person as they are 

then how can you truly love them as a human being?" First understand what you 

are saying, but we do this everyday. No one is perfect, each one of us has 

flaws ( and I am not saying that homosexuality is a flaw) and still we are 

told to love everyone. We overlook the flaw or different ideologies and still 

love that person. That is the best part, we do not have to accept the whole 

person to love them, we love them for how they make our lives better. People 

make mistakes and believe different things, and we do not have to agree or 

accept everything, if we have to accept everything about everyone no one would 

like anyone. 

Teresa 

>"Love the gays hate their sins", from my perspective that sounds very mean. 

>Being gay 

>makes up who a person is. It is not just a small part of their life, it is a 

>major part of who 

>they are. I understand that you say you only hate their action and not 

>who they 

>are, but being gay makes them who they are. Marin. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>>Wow, Joey. Very well said. I think you found the gray. What you say, makes a 

>lot of 

>sense to me. It is important that all people respect the beliefs of others, 

>even it they are 

>not our beliefs. What is "right" for one, may not be right for the other. I 

>think vocal 

>resistance to anything comes from fear and ignorance, and that could be said 

>about 

>everything in life, on both sides of the fence, not just this issue. Thanks 

>for posting. 

>Cynthia 

>> 

>>Joey Benson wrote:I have been quiet on the 

>discussions(?) about homosexual marriages. As 

>>some may know I am not quick to give my opinion. I have enjoyed the reading 

>>and hearing the conversations on this topic. From these conversations I 

>>have done a lot of thinking about my own beliefs and understandings about 

>>gay marriage. Here are some of my thoughts: 

>>As a Christian I am concerned at how vocal we are about gays. Yes, it is a 

>>sin to live a gay lifestyle, but this is just one of all sins that cause 

>>this world to move further and further away from God. Why do we focus on 

>>one sin? More importantly why do we focus on one group of people? I do 

>>believe that we are to love the sinner hate the sin. In this case it is 

>>love the gays hate their sin. Christians I believe, forget to look inward 

>>with this saying. We think that love the sinner only applies to 

>>non-Christians. The last time I checked ever person ever born in this world 

>>was born into sin (except Jesus). That means that everyone is a sinner. 

>>Everyone participates in activities that divide them from God. Christians 

>>are no different. Christians are no better than anyone else in the world. 

>>One sin is all you need to separate yourself from God for an eternity. What 

1046


>>and accept the gift of payment of these sins by the suffering of Jesus 

>>death. God has given us a second chance to be in communion with him. 

>>Christians are different in that they acknowledge they are sinners and try 

>>to avoid sin. I think Christians a lot of the times think that since they 

>>try not to sin, that makes their sin not as bad as a non-Christians sin. It 

>>bothers me when Christians say love the sinner not the sin because they are 

>>intending to be directed at only non-Christians. It is true we are called 

>>to love everyone, and because we are sinners like everyone else we have no 

>>authority to judge anyone else’s sin. When we say, love the gays, but hate 

>>their sin, we must also say love the Christian, but hate their sin. 

>>The Bible teaches that we (Christians) are not of this world. This world 

>>is not our home. Our home is with God in heaven. I struggle with finding 

>>the authority at which we have to force our beliefs on other people. In 

>>this case, I don’t know why we can force gays to do or not do anything. We 

>>have the authority to say and live by what we believe, but we cannot force 

>>our beliefs on other people. God doesn’t work this way. One of the 

>>greatest gifts God gives us is the gift of choice. We have the choice to 

>>follow him or not. Without choice would come unauthentic love, faith, 

>>worship, etc... People can also choose not to follow God. God has allowed 

>>for this to happen. But just because we choose to follow God I don’t see 

>>why we have the authority to make others to live the way we choose to live. 

>>This is not our world. 

>>These are just a few of my thoughts right now. I have found that I do have 

>>a lot to say on this topic, much more than I can add here and expect people 

>>to read this. So in no way do I think these are my complete thoughts. 

>>Joey 

>> 

>>_________________________________________________________________ 

>>Frustrated with dial-up? Lightning-fast Internet access for as low as 

>>$29.95/month. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200360ave/direct/01/ 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 


>>Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster. 

1047





Subject: Re: just thinking 

i think that cynthia made an interesting point in 

her more recent email responses about the airforce 

listserve relating to religion and beliefs. everybody 

has their beliefs and their practices in life and 

people who respect others' beliefs and live and let 

live are the ones who can communicate and work with 

others. something i have noticed on this listserve is 

that people are always responding to the issues that 

are raised from their own personal beliefs and 

perspectives, which is good to have a bearing on, but 

few times are the issues discussed in relation to 

historical and social contexts away from personal 

judgments. it feels like the discussions on the 

listserve are going around and around in circles in an 

endless attempt on people's parts to try and make 

others see their point of view or spread their 

religious views. this is probably never going to 

really produce anything of substance or deeper 

meaning. however, the listserve experience has been a 

wonderful way to open up discussion between people who 

wouldn't normally discuss things and to get to know 

what some of the more quiet ones in the cohort are 

thinking. 

so here i am, just thinking...about people's 

entries, their point, and how i process the 

information they post. there is this theme going on 

right now that smells like some sort of christian 

coalition or something. i am trying to understand the 

comments posted by people regarding their christianity 

and what relevance it has to keep repeating the same 

thing over and over. yes, we understand that certain 

people have certain faiths and beliefs, that everybody 

bases their decisions and feelings about issues in the 

world from their belief system, religious or not. but 

what are we getting at here? how does explaining why 

one agrees or disagrees about an issue relevant to the 

actual issue, which, like gay marriage for example, is 

much more deeply rooted and connected to society and 

history than someone's personal faith? 

let's talk about the structure underneath the whole 

issue. i beleive that religion does play a 

significant part in the way homosexuality is valued in 

today's society, as are many other factors, i'm sure. 

in order to discuss the issue outside of our own 

little lives, is it always necessary to state one's 

opinion and beliefs, or does that just detract from 

the deeper significances and elements of the issue? 

i think that the listserve has been a good way for 

us to solidify some of the things that we already had 

pretty good ideas about regarding each other, but what 

are we really talking about? i have to admit that 

some of the more 

personalized/judgmental/generalizing/dillusional 

entries have somehow discouraged me from even wanting 

to participate in the discussion board because i 

really have no interest in trying to make somebody 

1048

understand that my beleifs, my faith, and the 

lifestyle i may choose to live are valid or justified. 

i don't need anyone to validate or justify my life any 

more than they need me to validate or justify theirs, 

it is nobody's place to do so but in their own life. 

i appreciate people's thoughts and comments, please 

do not misinterperate this email. but people need to 

realize that if they are going to put their personal 

beliefs/faiths/etc on this listserve, they need to 

expect responses, some of which will seem painful if a 

person does not understand that their way of thinking 

is not the only way of thinking, or the only 

"truthful" one, at that. there is very little in this 

world that is black and white, most of it is "grey 

area". nothing is really constant, nor does anything 

really stay the same, and if it does than it is 

probably forced. i admire marin, ann, and other open 

minded people for sticking up for ALL people, 

regardless of faith, lifestyles, etc, without 

judgment. i unfortunately fail to see how it would be 

difficult for christians to live their lives according 

to their faith as it is for homosexuals, people of 

color, and other oppressed groups to live theirs. are 

christians really being watched all the time, are 

their personal lives and decisions in the news and up 

for other people to decide upon like homosexuals' 

lives are and black people's were? i think not, as 

american society is founded upon christian faith and 

many of the decisions that happen high up in the 

government are based on upholding these beliefs. the 

entire structure of our society has been designed for 

the advancement and to ensure the well being of the 

hetereosexual, god-fearing/believing/loving, white 

man. i might be more comfortable agreeing with the 

black man or homosexual who says that, "it's so hard 

for a black man/homosexual to live a fullfilling, 

faithful, and morally good life, but we're always 

being watched by the white man/fundamentalists, and we 

don't even have any goals to make other people believe 

in what we do or spread our faiths." think about 

that. 

michael 

--- mcdon032 wrote: 

> Since this is a pretty long email, I at least want 

> people to read this simple 

> verse out of the Bible because it's really cool: 

> 

> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and 

> only Son, that whosoever 

> believes in him shall not perish but have eternal 

> life." John 3:16. 

> 

> After reading all of the emails about the gay 

> marriage, I think that Karis 

> brings up some great points.Christians don't just 

> pick christianity because it 

> fits their lifestyle. I was raised on christian 

> values from when I was born 

> until now. So as I grew up I had no choice but 

> follow in the christian path. 

> But now that I'm seen as a legally independent adult 

> in society I know that if 

> I wanted to I could decide to escape my christian 

> values and lead my life in a 

1049

different direction. 

> 

> I guess what I'm saying is that I've had many things 

> happen in my life where 

> being a christian and having faith in Jesus has 

> gotten me through so much. 

> Even thinking of leaving Jesus behind and not having 

> that kind of relationship 

> with Him anymore would leave me very empty and 

> lonely inside. I always have to 

> make decisions in my life where the outcome could 

> change my life, just like 

> maybe the rest of us in the cohort. For me, I see 

> things black and white and 

> if I'm not sure what I should decide (kind of like a 

> gray area which is like 

> sin) then I pray about it and I know God will hear 

> my prayer. He might not 

> answer it the way I want Him to, but I know that if 

> I try to put my faith in 

> Him, then he will have a plan for my life. 

> 

> Using the Bible has helped guided me tremendously 

> through life. Of course I 

> don't know every story in the Bible, even though I 

> wish I could. But reading 

> about how certain people, and Jesus as well, went 

> through difficult situations 

> in life and then applying their faith to get through 

> those difficult times is 

> really cool. I then use experiences people had to go 

> through and apply it to 

> my own life. Pretty much I'm learning from someone 

> else's past experiences. 

> 

> Also Joey brought up a good point that Christians do 

> not dislike one 

> particular sin, like homosexuality, but all other 

> sins that we all encounter 

> in our lives daily. 

> 

> I admire Karis and other christians in our cohort 

> for sticking up for their 

> christian beliefs because I feel like we are all in 

> the same boat. It's so 

> hard for a christian today in society because you 

> stick up for what you 

> believe in and you try to live a morally good and 

> faithful life, but you're 

> always watched by other christians and non 

> christians. As a christian our goal 

> is to be there and help other christians as well as 

> nonchristians to see how 

> Jesus can totally change their lives around to the 

> positive. 

> 

> Just to let you know, I have dated my boyfriend for 

> almost 5 years now and he 

> was a unbeliever. The wonderful part is that he 

> wanted to be baptised and 

> confirmed into the christian faith, and so he was 

> because he felt the Holy 

> Spirit coming into his heart. I've seen how his 

> faith has prospered through 

> time, and how he can see how his faith has impacted 

> his life. Especially after 

1050

seeing The Passion of the Christ, he told me that he 

> then realized that his 

> worries in his own life is microscopic compared to 

> what Jesus had to go 

> through. 

> 

> I just realized I missed seeing Hidalgo tonight, you 

> know that really cool 

> horse race in the desert movie? But I think it was 

> kind of worth it since I 

> was able to hopefully show some christian 

> influence.Good night everyone and 

> God bless. 

> 

> Laurie :) 

> 

> 

__________________________________ 




1051





Subject: journal something 

Hello y'all... 

I am getting really bored with this reading. I have to walk around in circles 

and read out loud to myself not to fall asleep. Trust me, my roommates think I 

am really weird. I finished chapter 14 and the first quote is exactly what I 

was thinking just more eloquently. So read it because I am not going to waste 

more time writing it in to the journal. I think I am too smart for this book, 

I am always one step ahead of it. What can I say I am a genuis. SO this 

journal sucks, because I am not really interested at all. I think there is 

too much reading into everything for this class. Stop thinking so hard and 

live a little people. 

For ann, do not give up. Put your ideas out there. You might not touch 

everyone, but you will make a few think differently. Take baby steps, it will 

just take time. Patience is a virtue. Do not get frsutrated, please. 

So speaking of awareness and living your life. I must say that it is one thing 

to be aware of what is going on, but a completely another thing to act upon 

it. Right now, all we do is talk about ideas and problems in society. Anyone 

doing anything to change it? I think not, except maybe ann. Well, lucky for 

you all that I have many things for you guys to get involved in. (DO NOT CLICK 

TO ANOTHER JOURNAL, RIGHT NOW) 

Did you know that suicide is the 3rd leading death among young people? 

March 3rd - the yellow ribbon club (suicide prevention club on campus) is 

having a funraiser at cold stone in san marcos from 6-9pm. 25% of the profits 

goes to the club to help csusm cope and cure suicide of their students. 

Did you know that a women is beaten every 15 seconds? 

March 25th - AXO is having a fundraiser at ruby's in carlsbad to benefit 

survivors of domestic violence. 

April 14th - souplantation fundraiser- for survivors of domestic violence. 

April 20th - greek event on campus... guess what guys we are not all about 

barcardi, prada, and boys... 

I will be passing a jar around class on wednesday for donations for victims of 

domestic violence, I need $25. That means you all coulddonate a dollar and I 

would be stoked!! 

Stop just going to school and coming home. Get involved. How are you going to 

expect your students to get involved with extracurricular events when you 

never did when you were at school? How are going to expect things to change if 

you all do not do anythign about it? 

Have a great day, kids!! 

Teresa 

1052






geez louise! that's crazy...i can hardly even imagine 

what that situation would be like, and to think that 

we are not far from it. thanks for that input. 

michael 

--- Randy& Louise Tweed wrote: 

> This is a very scary subject and not one that I 

> think most people are 

> aware of. In my Biology 338 class I learned that 

> water instead of oil 

> will become the substance that wars will be fought 

> over in the coming 

> years. Only 1% of the Earths water is available to 

> the planet for 

> everything. The rest of the water is in the oceans, 

> seas, glaciers etc. 

> and unusable. It is estimated that we will run out 

> of water around 

> 2050! I don't think that the average person does 

> know the damages that 

> we are causing the Earth. The western world, for 

> the most part, is 

> unfamiliar with sustainable agriculture. We are 

> raping this Earth more 

> rapidly than the Earth can replenish its resources 

> and many of the 

> resources are non-renewable. It would be very 

> refreshing for the media 

> to focus on the effects of damages that are caused 

> and what we can do to 

> remedy this dire situation. Knowledge is power (I 

> think I said that 

> before!) Instead they are more content to focus on 

> Martha, Kobe, 

> Britney... 

> ~ Louise 

> 


> From: Michael Renner [mailto:birdnerd13@yahoo.com] 

> Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 9:03 PM 

> To: listserve 

> Subject: journal 7 

> 

> 

> i have been wondering lately about the future of the 

> Earth, as the science project i'm working on with my 

> group made me face first-hand the polluted waters 

> running right into the ocean i surf in. these are 

> things that i know are happening, but that i try not 

> to think about, especially when i'm out in the 

> water. 

> i think about how san diego is one of the most 

> desired 

> places to live on the west coast, where i was born, 

> and how many people move into the mass-produced 

1053

tract-homes every year. do they ever think about 

> what 

> is happening out in the ocean that they drive past 

> in 

> their s.u.v. every day? do they ever think about 

> the 

> effects of pollution, over-use, and depletion of the 

> Earth's resources? i know that they are big topics, 

> but does the average person have a clue about the 

> situation in alaska and other arctic places where 

> native people have not been able to go out on the 

> sea 

> ice to hunt for a coupele of years because the ice 

> is 

> melting? this problem gets more severe each year, 

> and 

> it is a big clear sign for all people...the world is 

> heating up. 

> it seems that the people of the world hardly think 

> about the world outside of their own existence 

> anymore, that as long as there is food in the 

> grocery 

> stores and gas at the gas station, life is ok. all 

> this reading about energy lately has gotten me 

> thinking about how much energy plays a part in the 

> world and even in the pollution of the world, how 

> lives are lost in wars over energy sources and how 

> hundreds of thousands of acres of pristine, evolved 

> ecosystms are sacrificed for access to energy 

> sources. 

> i wonder if i will see a major energy supply 

> shortage 

> or a change in the main form of energy we use to 

> power 

> the majority of the world? or will the consequences 

> of how we have used and continue to use energy 

> become 

> so acute that change must be made? 

> in chapter 6 of the biology text the author writes 

> a 

> metaphor to describe the possible scenario for 

> Earth, 

> saying that the sun is like the wind-up spring in a 

> music box that will one day wind out, as will every 

> other star in the universe, "eventually leaving a 

> cold, dark universe with little potential for life." 

> 

> well damn, if this is the case then we should start 

> thinking about the value of life and re-access our 

> priorities as humans. 

> why not start using energy in more efficient and 

> clean ways, because at the rate humans are going we 

> will destroy the planet and most of it's potential 

> to 

> support life before the sun burns out, and what a 

> waste that would be! people need to start thinking 

> about the benefits of the "green world" and how much 

> we really depend on its survival for our own. 

> photosynthesis produces up to 155 billion tons of 

> material each year. think of the clean air we could 

> breathe and food we could eat by ensuring survival 

> of 

> the "green world" on Earth, and the "blue world" at 

> that. or is this just all nonsense/noise on the 

> side 

> of the road in the s.u.v's world? 

1054

> __________________________________ 


> Yahoo! Search - Find what you're looking for faster 

> http://search.yahoo.com 

> 

> 

> 

__________________________________ 




1055






Perhaps this is where technology comes in. I seem to remember that there were some people 

working on desalination technology to convert salt water into usable water. In its current stage, it is 

probably still too expensive, but as they continue to inprove it, it may make a big difference. 

Here is a link if anyone wants to read about it. http://www.iestech.com/desalination.htm 

This topic supports the article we read about how economics and other factors shape technology. 

Cynthia 


geez louise! that's crazy...i can hardly even imagine 

what that situation would be like, and to think that 

we are not far from it. thanks for that input. 

michael 

--- Randy& Louise Tweed wrote: 

> This is a very scary subject and not one that I 

> think most people are 

> aware of. In my Biology 338 class I learned that 

> water instead of oil 

> will become the substance that wars will be fought 

> over in the coming 

> years. Only 1% of the Earths water is available to 

> the planet for 

> everything. The rest of the water is in the oceans, 

> seas, glaciers etc. 

> and unusable. It is estimated that we will run out 

> of water around 

> 2050! I don't think that the average person does 

> know the damages that 

> we are causing the Earth. The western world, for 

> the most part, is 

> unfamiliar with sustainable agriculture. We are 

> raping this Earth more 

> rapidly than the Earth can replenish its resources 

> and many of the 

> resources are non-renewable. It would be very 

> refreshing for the media 

> to focus on the effects of damages that are caused 

> and what we can do to 

> remedy this dire situation. Knowledge is power (I 

> think I said that 

> before!) Instead they are more content to focus on 

> Martha, Kobe, 

> Britney... 

1056

~ Louise 

> 


> From: Michael Renner [mailto:birdnerd13@yahoo.com] 

> Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 9:03 PM 

> To: listserve 

> Subject: journal 7 

> 

> 

> i have been wondering lately about the future of the 

> Earth, as the science project i'm working on with my 

> group made me face first-hand the polluted waters 

> running right into the ocean i surf in. these are 

> things that i know are happening, but that i try not 

> to think about, especially when i'm out in the 

> water. 

> i think about how san diego is one of the most 

> desired 

> places to live on the west coast, where i was born, 

> and how many people move into the mass-produced 

> tract-homes every year. do they ever think about 

> what 

> is happening out in the ocean that they drive past 

> in 

> their s.u.v. every day? do they ever think about 

> the 

> effects of pollution, over-use, and depletion of the 

> Earth's resources? i know that they are big topics, 

> but does the average person have a clue about the 

> situation in alaska and other arctic places where 

> native people have not been able to go out on the 

> sea 

> ice to hunt for a coupele of years because the ice 

> is 

> melting? this problem gets more severe e ach year, 

> and 

> it is a big clear sign for all people...the world is 

> heating up. 

> it seems that the people of the world hardly think 

> about the world outside of their own existence 

> anymore, that as long as there is food in the 

> grocery 

> stores and gas at the gas station, life is ok. all 

> this reading about energy lately has gotten me 

> thinking about how much energy plays a part in the 

> world and even in the pollution of the world, how 

> lives are lost in wars over energy sources and how 

> hundreds of thousands of acres of pristine, evolved 

> ecosystms are sacrificed for access to energy 

> sources. 

> i wonder if i will see a major energy supply 

> shortage 

> or a change in the main form of energy we use to 

1057

power 

> the majority of the world? or will the consequences 

> of how we have used and continue to use energy 

> become 

> so acu te that change must be made? 

> in chapter 6 of the biology text the author writes 

> a 

> metaphor to describe the possible scenario for 

> Earth, 

> saying that the sun is like the wind-up spring in a 

> music box that will one day wind out, as will every 

> other star in the universe, "eventually leaving a 

> cold, dark universe with little potential for life." 

> 

> well damn, if this is the case then we should start 

> thinking about the value of life and re-access our 

> priorities as humans. 

> why not start using energy in more efficient and 

> clean ways, because at the rate humans are going we 

> will destroy the planet and most of it's potential 

> to 

> support life before the sun burns out, and what a 

> waste that would be! people need to start thinking 

> about the benefits of the "green world" and how much 

> we really depend on its survival for our own. 

> photosynthesis produces up to 155 billion tons of 

> material each year. think of the clean air we could 

> breathe and food we could eat by ensuring survival 

> of 

> the "green world" on Earth, and the "blue world" at 

> that. or is this just all nonsense/noise on the 

> side 

> of the road in the s.u.v's world? 

> 

> __________________________________ 


> Yahoo! Search - Find what you're looking for faster 

> http://search.yahoo.com 

> 

> 

> 

__________________________________ 




_____ 



1058

1059




To: journal 

Subject: yesterday's lessons 

I just wanted to say, "Job well done" on the 2 lessons presented yesterday. I think I kind of freaked 

about the germ thing in class. Guess I can thank the Flu book for that one. I am not a hand shaker to 

begin with, I prefer to keep my germs to myself and let others keep theirs. 

Something I am wondering: How does the spread of bacteria compare to the spread of viruses? And 

how long do each of them live on a surface, such as a hand? Yes, I know, I could do the research, 

and maybe I will. 

The virus germs were actually the ones I was worried about. I haven't been sick and don't plan to, 

but shaking everyone's hands sure could increase my chances. 

Well anyway, I think both pairs did a good job on the lessons. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



1060





Subject: Re: just thinking- response to michael 

Hi Michael... 

I was just reading your e-mail and your thoughts have so much power behind them. They really 

intrigue me! Anyway...I don't think it is my place or anyone else's to tell someone how they should 

live. I, too, at times am very hesitant to really express myself out of fear. I don't want to hurt anyone 

and I don't want anyone to hurt me. So I tend to keep to myself when it comes to the list serve but it 

does get my thoughts going. After reading people's responses find myself responding in my head 

which I find a little more safe. Our beliefs are our beliefs...we know that and that is what matters...... 

Right?. Casey 

1061





Subject: Re: yesterday's lessons 

thank you cynthia, 

it's always very difficult to tell how these things 

go until i get some feedback. i appologize for 

freaking you out with the germ thing, as i do realize 

that some people take extra precautions in staying 

healthy. you are one of the few who are aware enough 

and didn't necessarily need that nasty little 

reminder. as far as the viruses go, we did make some 

relation to viruses and bacteria in the written lesson 

plan and some of the websites we gave also have info 

on viruses. i think though, that for the lesson it 

would have just been too much info to give all at 

once, especially since we wanted to focus on bacteria 

as the science element. i think that if you were to 

do this lesson in a classroom of younger students that 

you would definately want to make that 

connection...that viruses fall into the germ category. 

thanks for the input. michael 

--- Cynthia Reyes wrote: 

> I just wanted to say, "Job well done" on the 2 

> lessons presented yesterday. I think I kind of 

> freaked about the germ thing in class. Guess I can 

> thank the Flu book for that one. I am not a hand 

> shaker to begin with, I prefer to keep my germs to 

> myself and let others keep theirs. 

> 

> Something I am wondering: How does the spread of 

> bacteria compare to the spread of viruses? And how 

> long do each of them live on a surface, such as a 

> hand? Yes, I know, I could do the research, and 

> maybe I will. 

> 

> The virus germs were actually the ones I was 

> worried about. I haven't been sick and don't plan 

> to, but shaking everyone's hands sure could increase 

> my chances. 

> 

> Well anyway, I think both pairs did a good job on 

> the lessons. 

> Cynthia 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 


> Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster. 

__________________________________ 




1062





Subject: Re: yesterday's lessons 

Michael, I didn't mean you should have included that stuff in your lesson, lol. Your lesson just got me 

to thinking, which is a good thing. I will check out the websites you listed, since what I found earlier 

today didn't answer my questions. I thought your lesson went well, and didn't need anything added. 

Thanks for responding, 

Cynthia 


thank you cynthia, 

it's always very difficult to tell how these things 

go until i get some feedback. i appologize for 

freaking you out with the germ thing, as i do realize 

that some people take extra precautions in staying 

healthy. you are one of the few who are aware enough 

and didn't necessarily need that nasty little 

reminder. as far as the viruses go, we did make some 

relation to viruses and bacteria in the written lesson 

plan and some of the websites we gave also have info 

on viruses. i think though, that for the lesson it 

would have just been too much info to give all at 

once, especially since we wanted to focus on bacteria 

as the science element. i think that if you were to 

do this lesson in a classroom of younger students that 

you would definately want to make that 

connection...that viruses fall into the germ category. 

thanks for the input. michael 


> I just wanted to say, "Job well done" on the 2 

> lessons presented yesterday. I think I kind of 

> freaked about the germ thing in class. Guess I can 

> thank the Flu book for that one. I am not a hand 

> shaker to begin with, I prefer to keep my germs to 

> myself and let others keep theirs. 

> 

> Something I am wondering: How does the spread of 

> bacteria compare to the spread of viruses? And how 

> long do each of them live on a surface, such as a 

> hand? Yes, I know, I could do the research, and 

> maybe I will. 

> 

> The virus germs were actually the ones I was 

> worried about. I haven't been sick and don't plan 

> to, but shaking everyone's hands sure could increase 

1063

my chances. 

> 

> Well anyway, I think both pairs did a good job on 

> the lessons. 

> Cynthia 

> 

> ; 

> --------------------------------- 



__________________________________ 




_____ 



1064





Subject: Re: Midterm study group??? 

>Great idea:) 

Alexandra 


> Date: 2004/03/08 Mon PM 10:44:05 EST 


> Subject: Midterm study group??? 

> 

> Hello cohort, 

> 

> I see that Karas has posted sample midterms and solutions from previous 

> semesters and recommends we study in groups, so i was wondering if anyone 

> was interested???? 

> 

> carrie 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> Frustrated with dial-up? Lightning-fast Internet access for as low as 

> $29.95/month. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200360ave/direct/01/ 

> 

> 

1065





Subject: Re: journal something 

Dear Teresa, 

I smiling.... you are such a little ball of energy.... I wish I had your energy level. This semester has 

added to my storage of potential energy, and I need to turn it into kinetic energy before I bust a 

button..... Time to hit the gym and not the list serve.... Time to lift a dumb bell and not the lid to the 

pizza box.... 

P.S. there have been some really insightful journal postings about "you know what" 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/35.gif. 

See everyone tomorrow, 



Hello y'all... 

I am getting really bored with this reading. I have to walk around in circles 

and read out loud to myself not to fall asleep. Trust me, my roommates think I 

am really weird. I finished chapter 14 and the first quote is exactly what I 

was thinking just more eloquently. So read it because I am not going to waste 

more time writing it in to the journal. I think I am too smart for this book, 

I am always one step ahead of it. What can I say I am a genuis. SO this 

journal sucks, because I am not really interested at all. I think there is 

too much reading into everything for this class. Stop thinking so hard and 

live a little people. 

For ann, do not give up. Put your ideas out there. You might not touch 

everyone, but you will make a few think differently. Take baby steps, it will 

just take time. Patience is a virtue. Do not get frsutrated, please. 

So speaking of awareness and living your life. I must say that it is one thing 

to be aware of what is going on, but a completely another thing to act upon 

it. Right now, all we do is talk about ideas and problems in society. Anyone 

doing anything to change it? I think not, except maybe ann. Well, lucky for 

you all that I have many things for you guys to get involved in. (DO NOT CLICK 

TO ANOTHER JOURNAL, RIGHT NOW) 

Did you know that suicide is the 3rd leading death among young people? 

March 3rd - the yellow ribbon club (suicide prevention club on campus) is 

having a funraiser at cold stone in san marcos from 6-9pm. 25% of the profits 

goes to the club to help csusm cope and cure suicide of their students. 

Did you know that a women is beaten every 15 seconds? 

March 25th - AXO is having a fundraiser at ruby's in carlsbad to benefit 

survivors of domestic violence. 

April 14th - souplantation fundraiser- for survivors of domestic violence. 

1066

April 20th - greek event on campus... guess what guys we are not all about 

barcardi, prada, and boys... 

I will be passing a jar around class on wednesday for donations for victims of 

domestic violence, I need $25. That means you all coulddonate a dollar and I 

would be stoked!! 

Stop just going to school and coming home. Get involved. How are you going to 

expect your students to get involved with extracurricular events when you 

never did when you were at school? How are going to expect things to change if 

you all do not do anythign about it? 

Have a great day, kids!! 

Teresa 

_____ 



1067





Subject: scratch 

scratch scratch scratch 

think about it? got an itch? 

_____ 


1068





Subject: Journal #? 

I realize that I could get into a long discussion with myself about the 

readings, the lectures, religion or the world around us. However, that is 

exactly what it would be (a long discussion with myself). I will do my best to 

keep this short a sweet, maybe even worth readiing. 

The journals are interesting, but I feel I have put in my 2 cents and got a 

rotten apple back. So I won't respond to the hot topics that have been 

presented. The readings I find interesting when I get a chance to sit down and 

read them. 

My biggest ponder for the last couple years is where energy goes after we die. 

Quoted from our Hewitt book of physics (pg.91): 

Energy cannot be created or destroyed; it may be transformed from one form 

into another or transferred from one object to another, but the total amount 

of energy never changes. 

So, if this is the case, when we sleep we are potential energy as soon as we 

wake we are kenetic and potential, sometimes heat energy too! When we die we 

are no longer potential energy, or are we? Becuase when a person is cremated 

there ashes are burned and are heat energy. Or if they are buried then they 

are eaten by the worms to give them energy. I don't know the answers, but I 

have ideas. What are yours?????? 

-Chula 

1069





Subject: Might be helpful 

Hey Everyone, 

I was just trying to makes sense of some of this physics stuff and thought 

this website was helpful in case you want to check it out. 

http://www.glenbrook.k12.il.us/gbssci/phys/Class/1DKin/U1L1d.html 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1070





Subject: RE: just thinking 

After listening to people on the listserve I see that people are just starting 

to get angry or annoyed with all of the responses of gay marriage. Even though 

it seems that most of us are just arguing one side to the other, we are still 

learning from something. Yeah, it's easy to be the mediator or just be silent. 

Man, at times I think why do I write these long journals or why am I even 

telling people about what I believe in. Why don't I just stop talking and go 

back hidden in the crowd where I could be safe. It's hard because I feel like 

I should just be quiet and let the issue go, but that feeling of wanting to 

speak up and tell others, is like that sense of perserverance inside of us. We 

use it when we feel a close connection to something. So I've had a close 

connection to what I feel about the issue and so that's why I use God's Word 

and the Holy Spirit to help guide me. 

I do have some responses to some of the past emails: 

To me, faith plays a key part of how I think society is going into a good or 

bad way. Therefore, my faith which comes from the bible which talks about past 

experiences of people in society, which is then helping me think about today's 

society. Therefore, my faith is also deeply rooted to soceity because I'm 

learning from experiences. 

You wouldn't believe how much I've been watched by society for being a 

christian. By no means I am trying to connect this to homosexuals or black 

people. But think about it. If I were to just go off swearing like a sailor in 

class one day, everyone would be so surprised that I would do such a thing, 

including myself:) . Or let's say I do something else that might be consider 

wrong in society. I guarantee that someone would notice and then say to me how 

I'm not a christian and I only think I am one. So just like other groups of 

people in society, christians too are looked upon, judged and persecuted. 

Taking away prayer in schools and taking away the ten commandments from the 

courthouse is affecting the lives of many christians. Do you know that the 

judge of that courthouse with the commandments was fired because he refused 

for the commandments to be taken away? 

"Not only so, but we also rejoice in our suffering, because we know that 

suffering produces perserverance; perserverance, character; and 

character,hope." Romans 5:3 

I hope that my journal responses are here for anyone to read and not think 

that I'm imposing my belief on them. Since this is a free country I showing 

what values or morals I might carry through my life, and hopefully others may 

do the same. 

Laurie :) 


> i think that cynthia made an interesting point in 

>her more recent email responses about the airforce 

>listserve relating to religion and beliefs. everybody 

>has their beliefs and their practices in life and 

>people who respect others' beliefs and live and let 

>live are the ones who can communicate and work with 

>others. something i have noticed on this listserve is 

>that people are always responding to the issues that 

>are raised from their own personal beliefs and 

1071

perspectives, which is good to have a bearing on, but 

>few times are the issues discussed in relation to 

>historical and social contexts away from personal 

>judgments. it feels like the discussions on the 

>listserve are going around and around in circles in an 

>endless attempt on people's parts to try and make 

>others see their point of view or spread their 

>religious views. this is probably never going to 

>really produce anything of substance or deeper 

>meaning. however, the listserve experience has been a 

>wonderful way to open up discussion between people who 

>wouldn't normally discuss things and to get to know 

>what some of the more quiet ones in the cohort are 

>thinking. 

> so here i am, just thinking...about people's 

>entries, their point, and how i process the 

>information they post. there is this theme going on 

>right now that smells like some sort of christian 

>coalition or something. i am trying to understand the 

>comments posted by people regarding their christianity 

>and what relevance it has to keep repeating the same 

>thing over and over. yes, we understand that certain 

>people have certain faiths and beliefs, that everybody 

>bases their decisions and feelings about issues in the 

>world from their belief system, religious or not. but 

>what are we getting at here? how does explaining why 

>one agrees or disagrees about an issue relevant to the 

>actual issue, which, like gay marriage for example, is 

>much more deeply rooted and connected to society and 

>history than someone's personal faith? 

> let's talk about the structure underneath the whole 

>issue. i beleive that religion does play a 

>significant part in the way homosexuality is valued in 

>today's society, as are many other factors, i'm sure. 

>in order to discuss the issue outside of our own 

>little lives, is it always necessary to state one's 

>opinion and beliefs, or does that just detract from 

>the deeper significances and elements of the issue? 

> i think that the listserve has been a good way for 

>us to solidify some of the things that we already had 

>pretty good ideas about regarding each other, but what 

>are we really talking about? i have to admit that 

>some of the more 

>personalized/judgmental/generalizing/dillusional 

>entries have somehow discouraged me from even wanting 

>to participate in the discussion board because i 

>really have no interest in trying to make somebody 

>understand that my beleifs, my faith, and the 

>lifestyle i may choose to live are valid or justified. 

>i don't need anyone to validate or justify my life any 

>more than they need me to validate or justify theirs, 

>it is nobody's place to do so but in their own life. 

> 

> i appreciate people's thoughts and comments, please 

>do not misinterperate this email. but people need to 

>realize that if they are going to put their personal 

>beliefs/faiths/etc on this listserve, they need to 

>expect responses, some of which will seem painful if a 

>person does not understand that their way of thinking 

>is not the only way of thinking, or the only 

>"truthful" one, at that. there is very little in this 

>world that is black and white, most of it is "grey 

>area". nothing is really constant, nor does anything 

>really stay the same, and if it does than it is 

>probably forced. i admire marin, ann, and other open 

>minded people for sticking up for ALL people, 

1072

egardless of faith, lifestyles, etc, without 

>judgment. i unfortunately fail to see how it would be 

>difficult for christians to live their lives according 

>to their faith as it is for homosexuals, people of 

>color, and other oppressed groups to live theirs. are 

>christians really being watched all the time, are 

>their personal lives and decisions in the news and up 

>for other people to decide upon like homosexuals' 

>lives are and black people's were? i think not, as 

>american society is founded upon christian faith and 

>many of the decisions that happen high up in the 

>government are based on upholding these beliefs. the 

>entire structure of our society has been designed for 

>the advancement and to ensure the well being of the 

>hetereosexual, god-fearing/believing/loving, white 

>man. i might be more comfortable agreeing with the 

>black man or homosexual who says that, "it's so hard 

>for a black man/homosexual to live a fullfilling, 

>faithful, and morally good life, but we're always 

>being watched by the white man/fundamentalists, and we 

>don't even have any goals to make other people believe 

>in what we do or spread our faiths." think about 

>that. 

> michael 

> 

>--- mcdon032 wrote: 

>> Since this is a pretty long email, I at least want 

>> people to read this simple 

>> verse out of the Bible because it's really cool: 

>> 

>> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and 

>> only Son, that whosoever 

>> believes in him shall not perish but have eternal 

>> life." John 3:16. 

>> 

>> After reading all of the emails about the gay 

>> marriage, I think that Karis 

>> brings up some great points.Christians don't just 

>> pick christianity because it 

>> fits their lifestyle. I was raised on christian 

>> values from when I was born 

>> until now. So as I grew up I had no choice but 

>> follow in the christian path. 

>> But now that I'm seen as a legally independent adult 

>> in society I know that if 

>> I wanted to I could decide to escape my christian 

>> values and lead my life in a 

>> different direction. 

>> 

>> I guess what I'm saying is that I've had many things 

>> happen in my life where 

>> being a christian and having faith in Jesus has 

>> gotten me through so much. 

>> Even thinking of leaving Jesus behind and not having 

>> that kind of relationship 

>> with Him anymore would leave me very empty and 

>> lonely inside. I always have to 

>> make decisions in my life where the outcome could 

>> change my life, just like 

>> maybe the rest of us in the cohort. For me, I see 

>> things black and white and 

>> if I'm not sure what I should decide (kind of like a 

>> gray area which is like 

>> sin) then I pray about it and I know God will hear 

>> my prayer. He might not 

>> answer it the way I want Him to, but I know that if 

1073

I try to put my faith in 

>> Him, then he will have a plan for my life. 

>> 

>> Using the Bible has helped guided me tremendously 

>> through life. Of course I 

>> don't know every story in the Bible, even though I 

>> wish I could. But reading 

>> about how certain people, and Jesus as well, went 

>> through difficult situations 

>> in life and then applying their faith to get through 

>> those difficult times is 

>> really cool. I then use experiences people had to go 

>> through and apply it to 

>> my own life. Pretty much I'm learning from someone 

>> else's past experiences. 

>> 

>> Also Joey brought up a good point that Christians do 

>> not dislike one 

>> particular sin, like homosexuality, but all other 

>> sins that we all encounter 

>> in our lives daily. 

>> 

>> I admire Karis and other christians in our cohort 

>> for sticking up for their 

>> christian beliefs because I feel like we are all in 

>> the same boat. It's so 

>> hard for a christian today in society because you 

>> stick up for what you 

>> believe in and you try to live a morally good and 

>> faithful life, but you're 

>> always watched by other christians and non 

>> christians. As a christian our goal 

>> is to be there and help other christians as well as 

>> nonchristians to see how 

>> Jesus can totally change their lives around to the 

>> positive. 

>> 

>> Just to let you know, I have dated my boyfriend for 

>> almost 5 years now and he 

>> was a unbeliever. The wonderful part is that he 

>> wanted to be baptised and 

>> confirmed into the christian faith, and so he was 

>> because he felt the Holy 

>> Spirit coming into his heart. I've seen how his 

>> faith has prospered through 

>> time, and how he can see how his faith has impacted 

>> his life. Especially after 

>> seeing The Passion of the Christ, he told me that he 

>> then realized that his 

>> worries in his own life is microscopic compared to 

>> what Jesus had to go 

>> through. 

>> 

>> I just realized I missed seeing Hidalgo tonight, you 

>> know that really cool 

>> horse race in the desert movie? But I think it was 

>> kind of worth it since I 

>> was able to hopefully show some christian 

>> influence.Good night everyone and 

>> God bless. 

>> 

>> Laurie :) 

>> 

>> 

> 

> 

1074

__________________________________ 




1075





Subject: Plain Journal #8 

I'm here again to talk about what I read or learned from the readings for this 

week. Don't worry, it's not too long. I kept it somewhat short and sweet. 

Logino brought up the question, "How do we judge the claims of science?" I 

think simply reading Robbins, one could answer that question. (Yes, I did find 

a connection between the two books, I think :) ) Robbins suggests that there 

are many factors when choosing something in life. Some probably could be in 

the same category, but there is the political, social, economic, religious, 

values, attitude and ethics factors. Sure, evidence does play a part in 

deciding about anything, or in this case scientific issues. Overall, I think 

that we could see how these factors do play a big part of what we decide in 

life. I just realized that I think we were supposed to see how the data 

instrument theory is incorporated in the readings, especially the Robbins, but 

none of it didn't seem to connect to me well. 

Zeitz brings up the expert and novice thing. If I were to connect this to the 

classroom, so that I could try to think of something I had learned from this 

reading I would say that: If a student is an expert or novice in a particular 

subject area, we as teachers should use this knowledge to help build our 

lesson plans by. In other words, use the students' knowledge and interests to 

build a lesson plan with. I think we need both the experts' and novices' 

knowledge of things because if not then where would there be the process of 

learning? 

Laurie :) 

1076





Subject: Supply and demand 

Chula, we live in America. You would be lucky to get a rotten apple for 2 

cents. 

>From: silco001 



>Subject: Journal #? 

>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

> 

>I realize that I could get into a long discussion with myself about the 

>readings, the lectures, religion or the world around us. However, that is 

>exactly what it would be (a long discussion with myself). I will do my best 

>to 

>keep this short a sweet, maybe even worth readiing. 

> 

>The journals are interesting, but I feel I have put in my 2 cents and got a 

>rotten apple back. So I won't respond to the hot topics that have been 

>presented. The readings I find interesting when I get a chance to sit down 

>and 

>read them. 

> 

>My biggest ponder for the last couple years is where energy goes after we 

>die. 

> Quoted from our Hewitt book of physics (pg.91): 

>Energy cannot be created or destroyed; it may be transformed from one form 

>into another or transferred from one object to another, but the total 

>amount 

>of energy never changes. 

> 

>So, if this is the case, when we sleep we are potential energy as soon as 

>we 

>wake we are kenetic and potential, sometimes heat energy too! When we die 

>we 

>are no longer potential energy, or are we? Becuase when a person is 

>cremated 

>there ashes are burned and are heat energy. Or if they are buried then they 

>are eaten by the worms to give them energy. I don't know the answers, but I 

>have ideas. What are yours?????? 

>-Chula 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar – includes FREE pop-up blocking! 


1077






"Why don't I just stop talking" is the first interesting question to be 

posed on this list. 

>From: mcdon032 


>To: ICP-F , Michael Renner 

>Subject: RE: just thinking 

>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:44:43 -0800 

> 

>After listening to people on the listserve I see that people are just 

>starting 

>to get angry or annoyed with all of the responses of gay marriage. Even 

>though 

>it seems that most of us are just arguing one side to the other, we are 

>still 

>learning from something. Yeah, it's easy to be the mediator or just be 

>silent. 

>Man, at times I think why do I write these long journals or why am I even 

>telling people about what I believe in. Why don't I just stop talking and 

>go 

>back hidden in the crowd where I could be safe. It's hard because I feel 

>like 

>I should just be quiet and let the issue go, but that feeling of wanting to 

>speak up and tell others, is like that sense of perserverance inside of us. 

>We 

>use it when we feel a close connection to something. So I've had a close 

>connection to what I feel about the issue and so that's why I use God's 

>Word 

>and the Holy Spirit to help guide me. 

> 

>I do have some responses to some of the past emails: 

> 

>To me, faith plays a key part of how I think society is going into a good 

>or 

>bad way. Therefore, my faith which comes from the bible which talks about 

>past 

>experiences of people in society, which is then helping me think about 

>today's 

>society. Therefore, my faith is also deeply rooted to soceity because I'm 

>learning from experiences. 

> 

>You wouldn't believe how much I've been watched by society for being a 

>christian. By no means I am trying to connect this to homosexuals or black 

>people. But think about it. If I were to just go off swearing like a sailor 

>in 

>class one day, everyone would be so surprised that I would do such a thing, 

>including myself:) . Or let's say I do something else that might be 

>consider 

>wrong in society. I guarantee that someone would notice and then say to me 

>how 

>I'm not a christian and I only think I am one. So just like other groups of 

>people in society, christians too are looked upon, judged and persecuted. 

>Taking away prayer in schools and taking away the ten commandments from the 

>courthouse is affecting the lives of many christians. Do you know that the 

>judge of that courthouse with the commandments was fired because he refused 

1078

for the commandments to be taken away? 

> 

>"Not only so, but we also rejoice in our suffering, because we know that 

>suffering produces perserverance; perserverance, character; and 

>character,hope." Romans 5:3 

> 

>I hope that my journal responses are here for anyone to read and not think 

>that I'm imposing my belief on them. Since this is a free country I showing 

>what values or morals I might carry through my life, and hopefully others 

>may 

>do the same. 

> 

>Laurie :) 

> 

> 

> >===== Original Message From Michael Renner ===== 

> > i think that cynthia made an interesting point in 

> >her more recent email responses about the airforce 

> >listserve relating to religion and beliefs. everybody 

> >has their beliefs and their practices in life and 

> >people who respect others' beliefs and live and let 

> >live are the ones who can communicate and work with 

> >others. something i have noticed on this listserve is 

> >that people are always responding to the issues that 

> >are raised from their own personal beliefs and 

> >perspectives, which is good to have a bearing on, but 

> >few times are the issues discussed in relation to 

> >historical and social contexts away from personal 

> >judgments. it feels like the discussions on the 

> >listserve are going around and around in circles in an 

> >endless attempt on people's parts to try and make 

> >others see their point of view or spread their 

> >religious views. this is probably never going to 

> >really produce anything of substance or deeper 

> >meaning. however, the listserve experience has been a 

> >wonderful way to open up discussion between people who 

> >wouldn't normally discuss things and to get to know 

> >what some of the more quiet ones in the cohort are 

> >thinking. 

> > so here i am, just thinking...about people's 

> >entries, their point, and how i process the 

> >information they post. there is this theme going on 

> >right now that smells like some sort of christian 

> >coalition or something. i am trying to understand the 

> >comments posted by people regarding their christianity 

> >and what relevance it has to keep repeating the same 

> >thing over and over. yes, we understand that certain 

> >people have certain faiths and beliefs, that everybody 

> >bases their decisions and feelings about issues in the 

> >world from their belief system, religious or not. but 

> >what are we getting at here? how does explaining why 

> >one agrees or disagrees about an issue relevant to the 

> >actual issue, which, like gay marriage for example, is 

> >much more deeply rooted and connected to society and 

> >history than someone's personal faith? 

> > let's talk about the structure underneath the whole 

> >issue. i beleive that religion does play a 

> >significant part in the way homosexuality is valued in 

> >today's society, as are many other factors, i'm sure. 

> >in order to discuss the issue outside of our own 

> >little lives, is it always necessary to state one's 

> >opinion and beliefs, or does that just detract from 

> >the deeper significances and elements of the issue? 

> > i think that the listserve has been a good way for 

> >us to solidify some of the things that we already had 

> >pretty good ideas about regarding each other, but what 

1079

are we really talking about? i have to admit that 

> >some of the more 

> >personalized/judgmental/generalizing/dillusional 

> >entries have somehow discouraged me from even wanting 

> >to participate in the discussion board because i 

> >really have no interest in trying to make somebody 

> >understand that my beleifs, my faith, and the 

> >lifestyle i may choose to live are valid or justified. 

> >i don't need anyone to validate or justify my life any 

> >more than they need me to validate or justify theirs, 

> >it is nobody's place to do so but in their own life. 

> > 

> > i appreciate people's thoughts and comments, please 

> >do not misinterperate this email. but people need to 

> >realize that if they are going to put their personal 

> >beliefs/faiths/etc on this listserve, they need to 

> >expect responses, some of which will seem painful if a 

> >person does not understand that their way of thinking 

> >is not the only way of thinking, or the only 

> >"truthful" one, at that. there is very little in this 

> >world that is black and white, most of it is "grey 

> >area". nothing is really constant, nor does anything 

> >really stay the same, and if it does than it is 

> >probably forced. i admire marin, ann, and other open 

> >minded people for sticking up for ALL people, 

> >regardless of faith, lifestyles, etc, without 

> >judgment. i unfortunately fail to see how it would be 

> >difficult for christians to live their lives according 

> >to their faith as it is for homosexuals, people of 

> >color, and other oppressed groups to live theirs. are 

> >christians really being watched all the time, are 

> >their personal lives and decisions in the news and up 

> >for other people to decide upon like homosexuals' 

> >lives are and black people's were? i think not, as 

> >american society is founded upon christian faith and 

> >many of the decisions that happen high up in the 

> >government are based on upholding these beliefs. the 

> >entire structure of our society has been designed for 

> >the advancement and to ensure the well being of the 

> >hetereosexual, god-fearing/believing/loving, white 

> >man. i might be more comfortable agreeing with the 

> >black man or homosexual who says that, "it's so hard 

> >for a black man/homosexual to live a fullfilling, 

> >faithful, and morally good life, but we're always 

> >being watched by the white man/fundamentalists, and we 

> >don't even have any goals to make other people believe 

> >in what we do or spread our faiths." think about 

> >that. 

> > michael 

> > 

> >--- mcdon032 wrote: 

> >> Since this is a pretty long email, I at least want 

> >> people to read this simple 

> >> verse out of the Bible because it's really cool: 

> >> 

> >> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and 

> >> only Son, that whosoever 

> >> believes in him shall not perish but have eternal 

> >> life." John 3:16. 

> >> 

> >> After reading all of the emails about the gay 

> >> marriage, I think that Karis 

> >> brings up some great points.Christians don't just 

> >> pick christianity because it 

> >> fits their lifestyle. I was raised on christian 

> >> values from when I was born 

1080

until now. So as I grew up I had no choice but 

> >> follow in the christian path. 

> >> But now that I'm seen as a legally independent adult 

> >> in society I know that if 

> >> I wanted to I could decide to escape my christian 

> >> values and lead my life in a 

> >> different direction. 

> >> 

> >> I guess what I'm saying is that I've had many things 

> >> happen in my life where 

> >> being a christian and having faith in Jesus has 

> >> gotten me through so much. 

> >> Even thinking of leaving Jesus behind and not having 

> >> that kind of relationship 

> >> with Him anymore would leave me very empty and 

> >> lonely inside. I always have to 

> >> make decisions in my life where the outcome could 

> >> change my life, just like 

> >> maybe the rest of us in the cohort. For me, I see 

> >> things black and white and 

> >> if I'm not sure what I should decide (kind of like a 

> >> gray area which is like 

> >> sin) then I pray about it and I know God will hear 

> >> my prayer. He might not 

> >> answer it the way I want Him to, but I know that if 

> >> I try to put my faith in 

> >> Him, then he will have a plan for my life. 

> >> 

> >> Using the Bible has helped guided me tremendously 

> >> through life. Of course I 

> >> don't know every story in the Bible, even though I 

> >> wish I could. But reading 

> >> about how certain people, and Jesus as well, went 

> >> through difficult situations 

> >> in life and then applying their faith to get through 

> >> those difficult times is 

> >> really cool. I then use experiences people had to go 

> >> through and apply it to 

> >> my own life. Pretty much I'm learning from someone 

> >> else's past experiences. 

> >> 

> >> Also Joey brought up a good point that Christians do 

> >> not dislike one 

> >> particular sin, like homosexuality, but all other 

> >> sins that we all encounter 

> >> in our lives daily. 

> >> 

> >> I admire Karis and other christians in our cohort 

> >> for sticking up for their 

> >> christian beliefs because I feel like we are all in 

> >> the same boat. It's so 

> >> hard for a christian today in society because you 

> >> stick up for what you 

> >> believe in and you try to live a morally good and 

> >> faithful life, but you're 

> >> always watched by other christians and non 

> >> christians. As a christian our goal 

> >> is to be there and help other christians as well as 

> >> nonchristians to see how 

> >> Jesus can totally change their lives around to the 

> >> positive. 

> >> 

> >> Just to let you know, I have dated my boyfriend for 

> >> almost 5 years now and he 

> >> was a unbeliever. The wonderful part is that he 

> >> wanted to be baptised and 

1081

confirmed into the christian faith, and so he was 

> >> because he felt the Holy 

> >> Spirit coming into his heart. I've seen how his 

> >> faith has prospered through 

> >> time, and how he can see how his faith has impacted 

> >> his life. Especially after 

> >> seeing The Passion of the Christ, he told me that he 

> >> then realized that his 

> >> worries in his own life is microscopic compared to 

> >> what Jesus had to go 

> >> through. 

> >> 

> >> I just realized I missed seeing Hidalgo tonight, you 

> >> know that really cool 

> >> horse race in the desert movie? But I think it was 

> >> kind of worth it since I 

> >> was able to hopefully show some christian 

> >> influence.Good night everyone and 

> >> God bless. 

> >> 

> >> Laurie :) 

> >> 

> >> 

> > 

> > 

> >__________________________________ 


> >Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster 

> >http://search.yahoo.com 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1082




To: Mike Runnestrand; ICP-F 


Very funny Mike! 

>===== Original Message From "Mike Runnestrand" 

===== 

>"Why don't I just stop talking" is the first interesting question to be 

>posed on this list. 

> 

> 

>>From: mcdon032 


>>To: ICP-F , Michael Renner 

>>Subject: RE: just thinking 

>>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:44:43 -0800 

>> 

>>After listening to people on the listserve I see that people are just 

>>starting 

>>to get angry or annoyed with all of the responses of gay marriage. Even 

>>though 

>>it seems that most of us are just arguing one side to the other, we are 

>>still 

>>learning from something. Yeah, it's easy to be the mediator or just be 

>>silent. 

>>Man, at times I think why do I write these long journals or why am I even 

>>telling people about what I believe in. Why don't I just stop talking and 

>>go 

>>back hidden in the crowd where I could be safe. It's hard because I feel 

>>like 

>>I should just be quiet and let the issue go, but that feeling of wanting to 

>>speak up and tell others, is like that sense of perserverance inside of us. 

>>We 

>>use it when we feel a close connection to something. So I've had a close 

>>connection to what I feel about the issue and so that's why I use God's 

>>Word 

>>and the Holy Spirit to help guide me. 

>> 

>>I do have some responses to some of the past emails: 

>> 

>>To me, faith plays a key part of how I think society is going into a good 

>>or 

>>bad way. Therefore, my faith which comes from the bible which talks about 

>>past 

>>experiences of people in society, which is then helping me think about 

>>today's 

>>society. Therefore, my faith is also deeply rooted to soceity because I'm 

>>learning from experiences. 

>> 

>>You wouldn't believe how much I've been watched by society for being a 

>>christian. By no means I am trying to connect this to homosexuals or black 

>>people. But think about it. If I were to just go off swearing like a sailor 

>>in 

>>class one day, everyone would be so surprised that I would do such a thing, 

>>including myself:) . Or let's say I do something else that might be 

>>consider 

>>wrong in society. I guarantee that someone would notice and then say to me 

>>how 

>>I'm not a christian and I only think I am one. So just like other groups of 

1083

people in society, christians too are looked upon, judged and persecuted. 

>>Taking away prayer in schools and taking away the ten commandments from the 

>>courthouse is affecting the lives of many christians. Do you know that the 

>>judge of that courthouse with the commandments was fired because he refused 

>>for the commandments to be taken away? 

>> 

>>"Not only so, but we also rejoice in our suffering, because we know that 

>>suffering produces perserverance; perserverance, character; and 

>>character,hope." Romans 5:3 

>> 

>>I hope that my journal responses are here for anyone to read and not think 

>>that I'm imposing my belief on them. Since this is a free country I showing 

>>what values or morals I might carry through my life, and hopefully others 

>>may 

>>do the same. 

>> 

>>Laurie :) 

>> 

>> 

>> >===== Original Message From Michael Renner ===== 

>> > i think that cynthia made an interesting point in 

>> >her more recent email responses about the airforce 

>> >listserve relating to religion and beliefs. everybody 

>> >has their beliefs and their practices in life and 

>> >people who respect others' beliefs and live and let 

>> >live are the ones who can communicate and work with 

>> >others. something i have noticed on this listserve is 

>> >that people are always responding to the issues that 

>> >are raised from their own personal beliefs and 

>> >perspectives, which is good to have a bearing on, but 

>> >few times are the issues discussed in relation to 

>> >historical and social contexts away from personal 

>> >judgments. it feels like the discussions on the 

>> >listserve are going around and around in circles in an 

>> >endless attempt on people's parts to try and make 

>> >others see their point of view or spread their 

>> >religious views. this is probably never going to 

>> >really produce anything of substance or deeper 

>> >meaning. however, the listserve experience has been a 

>> >wonderful way to open up discussion between people who 

>> >wouldn't normally discuss things and to get to know 

>> >what some of the more quiet ones in the cohort are 

>> >thinking. 

>> > so here i am, just thinking...about people's 

>> >entries, their point, and how i process the 

>> >information they post. there is this theme going on 

>> >right now that smells like some sort of christian 

>> >coalition or something. i am trying to understand the 

>> >comments posted by people regarding their christianity 

>> >and what relevance it has to keep repeating the same 

>> >thing over and over. yes, we understand that certain 

>> >people have certain faiths and beliefs, that everybody 

>> >bases their decisions and feelings about issues in the 

>> >world from their belief system, religious or not. but 

>> >what are we getting at here? how does explaining why 

>> >one agrees or disagrees about an issue relevant to the 

>> >actual issue, which, like gay marriage for example, is 

>> >much more deeply rooted and connected to society and 

>> >history than someone's personal faith? 

>> > let's talk about the structure underneath the whole 

>> >issue. i beleive that religion does play a 

>> >significant part in the way homosexuality is valued in 

>> >today's society, as are many other factors, i'm sure. 

>> >in order to discuss the issue outside of our own 

>> >little lives, is it always necessary to state one's 

>> >opinion and beliefs, or does that just detract from 

1084

the deeper significances and elements of the issue? 

>> > i think that the listserve has been a good way for 

>> >us to solidify some of the things that we already had 

>> >pretty good ideas about regarding each other, but what 

>> >are we really talking about? i have to admit that 

>> >some of the more 

>> >personalized/judgmental/generalizing/dillusional 

>> >entries have somehow discouraged me from even wanting 

>> >to participate in the discussion board because i 

>> >really have no interest in trying to make somebody 

>> >understand that my beleifs, my faith, and the 

>> >lifestyle i may choose to live are valid or justified. 

>> >i don't need anyone to validate or justify my life any 

>> >more than they need me to validate or justify theirs, 

>> >it is nobody's place to do so but in their own life. 

>> > 

>> > i appreciate people's thoughts and comments, please 

>> >do not misinterperate this email. but people need to 

>> >realize that if they are going to put their personal 

>> >beliefs/faiths/etc on this listserve, they need to 

>> >expect responses, some of which will seem painful if a 

>> >person does not understand that their way of thinking 

>> >is not the only way of thinking, or the only 

>> >"truthful" one, at that. there is very little in this 

>> >world that is black and white, most of it is "grey 

>> >area". nothing is really constant, nor does anything 

>> >really stay the same, and if it does than it is 

>> >probably forced. i admire marin, ann, and other open 

>> >minded people for sticking up for ALL people, 

>> >regardless of faith, lifestyles, etc, without 

>> >judgment. i unfortunately fail to see how it would be 

>> >difficult for christians to live their lives according 

>> >to their faith as it is for homosexuals, people of 

>> >color, and other oppressed groups to live theirs. are 

>> >christians really being watched all the time, are 

>> >their personal lives and decisions in the news and up 

>> >for other people to decide upon like homosexuals' 

>> >lives are and black people's were? i think not, as 

>> >american society is founded upon christian faith and 

>> >many of the decisions that happen high up in the 

>> >government are based on upholding these beliefs. the 

>> >entire structure of our society has been designed for 

>> >the advancement and to ensure the well being of the 

>> >hetereosexual, god-fearing/believing/loving, white 

>> >man. i might be more comfortable agreeing with the 

>> >black man or homosexual who says that, "it's so hard 

>> >for a black man/homosexual to live a fullfilling, 

>> >faithful, and morally good life, but we're always 

>> >being watched by the white man/fundamentalists, and we 

>> >don't even have any goals to make other people believe 

>> >in what we do or spread our faiths." think about 

>> >that. 

>> > michael 

>> > 

>> >--- mcdon032 wrote: 

>> >> Since this is a pretty long email, I at least want 

>> >> people to read this simple 

>> >> verse out of the Bible because it's really cool: 

>> >> 

>> >> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and 

>> >> only Son, that whosoever 

>> >> believes in him shall not perish but have eternal 

>> >> life." John 3:16. 

>> >> 

>> >> After reading all of the emails about the gay 

>> >> marriage, I think that Karis 

1085

ings up some great points.Christians don't just 

>> >> pick christianity because it 

>> >> fits their lifestyle. I was raised on christian 

>> >> values from when I was born 

>> >> until now. So as I grew up I had no choice but 

>> >> follow in the christian path. 

>> >> But now that I'm seen as a legally independent adult 

>> >> in society I know that if 

>> >> I wanted to I could decide to escape my christian 

>> >> values and lead my life in a 

>> >> different direction. 

>> >> 

>> >> I guess what I'm saying is that I've had many things 

>> >> happen in my life where 

>> >> being a christian and having faith in Jesus has 

>> >> gotten me through so much. 

>> >> Even thinking of leaving Jesus behind and not having 

>> >> that kind of relationship 

>> >> with Him anymore would leave me very empty and 

>> >> lonely inside. I always have to 

>> >> make decisions in my life where the outcome could 

>> >> change my life, just like 

>> >> maybe the rest of us in the cohort. For me, I see 

>> >> things black and white and 

>> >> if I'm not sure what I should decide (kind of like a 

>> >> gray area which is like 

>> >> sin) then I pray about it and I know God will hear 

>> >> my prayer. He might not 

>> >> answer it the way I want Him to, but I know that if 

>> >> I try to put my faith in 

>> >> Him, then he will have a plan for my life. 

>> >> 

>> >> Using the Bible has helped guided me tremendously 

>> >> through life. Of course I 

>> >> don't know every story in the Bible, even though I 

>> >> wish I could. But reading 

>> >> about how certain people, and Jesus as well, went 

>> >> through difficult situations 

>> >> in life and then applying their faith to get through 

>> >> those difficult times is 

>> >> really cool. I then use experiences people had to go 

>> >> through and apply it to 

>> >> my own life. Pretty much I'm learning from someone 

>> >> else's past experiences. 

>> >> 

>> >> Also Joey brought up a good point that Christians do 

>> >> not dislike one 

>> >> particular sin, like homosexuality, but all other 

>> >> sins that we all encounter 

>> >> in our lives daily. 

>> >> 

>> >> I admire Karis and other christians in our cohort 

>> >> for sticking up for their 

>> >> christian beliefs because I feel like we are all in 

>> >> the same boat. It's so 

>> >> hard for a christian today in society because you 

>> >> stick up for what you 

>> >> believe in and you try to live a morally good and 

>> >> faithful life, but you're 

>> >> always watched by other christians and non 

>> >> christians. As a christian our goal 

>> >> is to be there and help other christians as well as 

>> >> nonchristians to see how 

>> >> Jesus can totally change their lives around to the 

>> >> positive. 

>> >> 

1086

Just to let you know, I have dated my boyfriend for 

>> >> almost 5 years now and he 

>> >> was a unbeliever. The wonderful part is that he 

>> >> wanted to be baptised and 

>> >> confirmed into the christian faith, and so he was 

>> >> because he felt the Holy 

>> >> Spirit coming into his heart. I've seen how his 

>> >> faith has prospered through 

>> >> time, and how he can see how his faith has impacted 

>> >> his life. Especially after 

>> >> seeing The Passion of the Christ, he told me that he 

>> >> then realized that his 

>> >> worries in his own life is microscopic compared to 

>> >> what Jesus had to go 

>> >> through. 

>> >> 

>> >> I just realized I missed seeing Hidalgo tonight, you 

>> >> know that really cool 

>> >> horse race in the desert movie? But I think it was 

>> >> kind of worth it since I 

>> >> was able to hopefully show some christian 

>> >> influence.Good night everyone and 

>> >> God bless. 

>> >> 

>> >> Laurie :) 

>> >> 

>> >> 

>> > 

>> > 

>> >__________________________________ 

>> >Do you Yahoo!? 

>> >Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster 

>> >http://search.yahoo.com 

>> 

>> 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



1087





Subject: Re: Supply and demand 

Chula, Why do you think you have gotten a rotten apple back? What does that mean? 

Now, on to the question of dead people and energy transformation. 

While some might consider the human body potential energy when it is sleeping, we might also think 

of it as a vessel that holds potential energy while it is sleeping. Do we really stop using energy when 

we sleep? Do we still burn calories? The body might be thought of as a furnace with its pilot always 

lit. It is always using energy, just not as much sometimes. You are probably correct about dead, 

buried bodies. When we die, we stop using energy, well, wait, maybe we don't. Do we use energy to 

decompose? If you look at a compost heap, the decompostion of waste matter creates heat, a form of 

energy. When we die, we become compost heaps, lol. Something to look forward to. The heat given 

off by the compost heap is a transfer of energy, excess energy given off in the process. A byproduct if 

you will. The decomposed body is transformed into potential energy, like a carrot or a dog bisquit or 

something. As you mentioned, it is potential energy for worms, even maggots and such. Nature is a 

wonderful thing. 

OK, do I get points for not saying "I"? Don't take what I just wrote as fact, I don't have anything but my 

mind to back it up, and I think that is in a state of decompostion. I am just experimenting with Prof. 

Yamashita's idea about saying not "I". 

Cynthia 



cents. 

>From: silco001 




>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

> 




>to 


> 




>and 

>read them. 

> 

>My bi ggest ponder for the last couple years is where energy goes after we 

>die. 

1088

Quoted from our Hewitt book of physics (pg.91): 



>amount 


> 


>we 


>we 


>cremated 




>-Chula 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar – includes FR EE pop-up blocking! 


_____ 



1089





Subject: Re: scratch 

You lost me on this one, Robert. Explain it to one who seems to be cerebrally challenged tonight. 

Cynthia 


scratch scratch scratch 

think about it? got an itch? 

_____ 


_____ 



1090




To: journal 

Subject: California Storm Damage 

Attachments: Damage.jpg 

Damage.jpg (101 

KB) 

It just shows you we have our problems here in California. 

With all the news on TV lately about the sub zero weather and snow that 

the east coast and upstate NY areas are experiencing, we shouldn't 

forget that California has it's share of devastating weather 

also. 

I've attached a photo illustrating the excessive damage caused to a home 

from a storm that passed through in my neighborhood from couple 

of days ago. It really makes you cherish what you have, and reminds us 

not to take life for granted!!! 

Warning: The attached picture is quite graphic and may not be suitable 

for younger viewers. 

_____ 



1091




To: journal 

Subject: "I" is an illegal word 

I have written 2 posts where I consciously tried not to use the word "I". I can see Prof. Yamashita's 

point he was trying to make in class on Monday. You can't do it very easily if you are stating opinions. 

It really requires that you post facts, because you are stating things as fact. This requires you to have 

your facts straight, unless you don't care if people take what you say as fact and not opinion. I am 

sure you are all just dying to try it, so go ahead. Post an entry about something without using "I". If 

this isn't enough of a challenge, feel free to leave out the word "you" as well. I have a feeling nobody 

is going to try this because it is more work than just tapping out a quick opinion. But that is just my 

opinion. Cynthia 

PS. I did have to put a disclaimer at the bottom of my no "I" post tonight because I didn't know if what 

I said was true and didn't have time to do the research required, which is part of the point, I guess. 

_____ 



1092





Subject: One of life's FUNNY little lessons... 

Dear Class, 

Here is one of life's FUNNY little lessons...... 

A farmer's donkey fell down into a well. The animal cried 

Piteously for hours as the farmer tried to figure out what to do. 

Finally, he decided the animal was old, and the well needed to be 

covered up anyway; it just wasn't worth it to retrieve the 

donkey. He invited all his neighbors to come over and help him. 

They all grabbed a shovel and began to shovel dirt into the well. 

At first, the donkey realized what was happening and cried 

horribly. Then, to everyone's amazement he quieted down. A few 

shovel loads later, the farmer finally looked down the well. He 

was astonished at what he saw. 

With each shovel of dirt that hit his back, the donkey was doing 

something amazing. He would shake it off and take a step up. As 

the farmer's neighbors continued to shovel dirt on top of the 

animal, he would shake it off and take a step up. Pretty soon, 

everyone was amazed as the donkey stepped up over the edge of the 

well and happily trotted off! 

Life is going to shovel dirt on you, all kinds of dirt. The 

trick to getting out of the well is to shake it off and take a 

1093

step up. Each of our troubles is a steppingstone. We can get out 

of the deepest wells just by not stopping, never giving up! Shake 

it off and take a step up. 

Remember the five simple rules to be happy: 

1. Free your heart from hatred - Forgive. 

2. Free your mind from worries - Most never happen 

3. Live simply and appreciate what you have. 

4. Give more. 

5. Expect less 

NOW -------- Enough of that crap . . . 

The donkey later came back and bit the shit out of the farmer 

who had tried to bury him. The gash from the bite got infected, 

and the farmer eventually died in agony from septic shock. 

MORAL FROM TODAY'S LESSON: 

When you do something wrong and try to cover your ass, it always 

comes back to bite you in the end. 

See ya later, http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif Ann 

_____ 



1094





Subject: Re: Supply and demand (with a twist of lime and no "I") 

Hey you two (Chula and Cynthia) ,and the other 20 something cohort "F"ers... 

Maybe since energy never dies, this is where the idea of living on comes from. Like if someone was 

a dog, a lesbian, a ear of corn, a blue bellied lizard, a christian, and a left handed canadian with an 

ear infection in there last life, when all of these people and objects died and rotted and fed the plants, 

bugs, vultures, flies (maggots), etc; and then came along a cute little deer and nibbled ever so gently 

at the soft fuzzy new growth of tender green grass that was growing really well it the spot where all of 

those things rotted, the deer now has a little something from all of the previous forms. And then, 

comes a long Buba from Kentucky, and he and his brother Leroy are out shooting cans and drinking 

whiskey. Ol Buba and Leroy see the cute little deer and decide to shoot it. The little deer dies, 

and Ol Buba and Leroy cut it up, and they eat it. Now, the original, or so we think original, dog, 

lesbian, ear of co rn, blue bellied lizard, christian, and the left handed canadian with an ear infection, 

and the deer, are in Ol Buba and Leroy. So, since energy never dies and it only transfers, maybe all 

things, are related on some level? So, when someone claims that they were Marilyn Monroe, or 

whoever, in a past life, maybe they are right? 

See ya later alligators, 

Ann 




While some might consider the human body potential energy when it is sleeping, we might also 

think of it as a vessel that holds potential energy while it is sleeping. Do we really stop using 

energy when we sleep? Do we still burn calories? The body might be thought of as a furnace with 

its pilot always lit. It is always using energy, just not as much sometimes. You are probably correct 

about dead, buried bodies. When we die, we stop using energy, well, wait, maybe we don't. Do we 

use energy to decompose? If you look at a compost heap, the decompostion of waste matter 

creates heat, a form of energy. When we die, we become compost heaps, lol. Something to look 

forward to. The heat given off by the compost heap is a transfer of energy, excess energy given 

off in the process. A byproduct if you will. The decomposed body is transformed into potential 

energy, like a carrot or a dog bisquit or something. As you mentioned, it is potential energy for 

worms, even maggots and such. Nature is a wonderful thing. 

OK, do I get points for not saying "I"? Don't take what I just wrote as fact, I don't have anything but 

my mind to back it up, and I think that is in a state of decompostion. I am just experimenting with 

Prof. Yamashita's idea about saying not "I". 

Cynthia 



cents. 

1095

_____ 





>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

> 




>to 


> 




>and 

>read them. 

> 


>die. 




>amount 


> 


>we 


>we 


>cremated 




>-Chula 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 





_____ 

1096



1097





Subject: RE: Might be helpful 

Thanks Carrie. I found that website easy to read and it helped cement 

some of the physics stuff floating around in my head! ~ Louise 





Subject: Might be helpful 

Hey Everyone, 

I was just trying to makes sense of some of this physics stuff and 

thought 

this website was helpful in case you want to check it out. 

http://www.glenbrook.k12.il.us/gbssci/phys/Class/1DKin/U1L1d.html 

_________________________________________________________________ 


http://msn.careerbuilder.com/promo/kaday.htm?siteid=CBMSN_1K&sc_extcmp=J 

S_JASweep_MSNHotm2 

1098





Subject: RE: California Storm Damage 

Great sense of humor Cynthia. Your message and picture started my day off right!! Thanks ~ Louise 




To: journal 

Subject: California Storm Damage 





also. 







_____ 



1099





Subject: Re: California Storm Damage 

That is tooooooooo funny..... LOL Ann 







also. 







_____ 



> ATTACHMENT part 2 image/pjpeg name=Damage.jpg 

_____ 



1100





Subject: RE: Supply and demand (with a twist of lime and no "I") 

Hey Ann, 

It sounds like your story is the "Circle of Life" theory. Energy doesn't disappear, it just transforms and you gave some 

great examples of how energy is continually being transformed. So, we have an idea of what happens to our body i.e. 

buried or cremated, and we've posed theories of the energy transforming from those dead bodies. The question remains, 

what happens to our soul or spirit when we die? Does that energy get transformed? Does it go to heaven or hell? Does 

our spirit or soul have energy? If we have a spirit or soul, is it connected to the body, therefore transforming its energy the 

same way? 

Okay Cynthia, I took your challenge and wrote this message without using the illegal "I" word. It was thought provoking to 

write the above without using that illegal word. My quest has been fulfilled! ~ Louise 







Maybe since energy never dies, this is where the idea of living on comes from. Like if someone 

was a dog, a lesbian, a ear of corn, a blue bellied lizard, a christian, and a left handed canadian 

with an ear infection in there last life, when all of these people and objects died and rotted and fed 

the plants, bugs, vultures, flies (maggots), etc; and then came along a cute little deer and nibbled 

ever so gently at the soft fuzzy new growth of tender green grass that was growing really well it 

the spot where all of those things rotted, the deer now has a little something from all of the 

previous forms. And then, comes a long Buba from Kentucky, and he and his brother Leroy are 

out shooting cans and drinking whiskey. Ol Buba and Leroy see the cute little deer and decide to 

shoot it. The little deer dies, and Ol Buba and Leroy cut it up, and they eat it. Now, the original, or 

so we think original, dog, lesbian, ear of co rn, blue bellied lizard, christian, and the left handed 

canadian with an ear infection, and the deer, are in Ol Buba and Leroy. So, since energy never 

dies and it only transfers, maybe all things, are related on some level? So, when someone claims 

that they were Marilyn Monroe, or whoever, in a past life, maybe they are right? 


Ann 






energy when we sleep? Do we still burn calories? The body might be thought of as a furnace 

with its pilot always lit. It is always using energy, just not as much sometimes. You are 

1101

probably correct about dead, buried bodies. When we die, we stop using energy, well, wait, 

maybe we don't. Do we use energy to decompose? If you look at a compost heap, the 

decompostion of waste matter creates heat, a form of energy. When we die, we become 

compost heaps, lol. Something to look forward to. The heat given off by the compost heap is a 

transfer of energy, excess energy given off in the process. A byproduct if you will. The 

decomposed body is transformed into potential energy, like a carrot or a dog bisquit or 

something. As you mentioned, it is potential energy for worms, even maggots and such. 

Nature is a wonderful thing. 

OK, do I get points for not saying "I"? Don't take what I just wrote as fact, I don't have anything 

but my mind to back it up, and I think that is in a state of decompostion. I am just 

experimenting with Prof. Yamashita's idea about saying not "I". 

Cynthia 



cents. 





>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

> 




>to 


> 




>and 

>read them. 

> 


>die. 




>amount 


> 


>we 


>we 


>cremated 

1102

_____ 

_____ 




>-Chula 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 







1103






That's good, Ann. Congrats on leaving out the I. Cynthia 



Maybe since energy never dies, this is where the idea of living on comes from. Like if someone 

was a dog, a lesbian, a ear of corn, a blue bellied lizard, a christian, and a left handed canadian 

with an ear infection in there last life, when all of these people and objects died and rotted and fed 

the plants, bugs, vultures, flies (maggots), etc; and then came along a cute little deer and nibbled 

ever so gently at the soft fuzzy new growth of tender green grass that was growing really well it 

the spot where all of those things rotted, the deer now has a little something from all of the 

previous forms. And then, comes a long Buba from Kentucky, and he and his brother Leroy are 

out shooting cans and drinking whiskey. Ol Buba and Leroy see the cute little deer and decide to 

shoot it. The little deer dies, and Ol Buba and Leroy cut it up, and they eat it. Now, the original, or 

so we think original, dog, lesbian, ear of co rn, blue bellied lizard, christian, and the left handed 

canadian with an ear infection, and the deer, are in Ol Buba and Leroy. So, since energy never 

dies and it only transfers, maybe all things, are related on some level? So, when someone claims 

that they were Marilyn Monroe, or whoever, in a past life, maybe they are right? 


Ann 






energy when we sleep? Do we still burn calories? The body might be thought of as a furnace 

with its pilot always lit. It is always using energy, just not as much sometimes. You are 

probably correct about dead, buried bodies. When we die, we stop using energy, well, wait, 

maybe we don't. Do we use energy to decompose? If you look at a compost heap, the 


compost heaps, lol. Something to look forward to. The heat given off by the compost heap is a 

transfer of energy, excess energy given off in the process. A byproduct if you will. The 




OK, do I get points for not saying "I"? Don't take what I just wrote as fact, I don't have anything 

but my mind to back it up, and I think that is in a state of decompostion. I am just 


Cynthia 

1104

_____ 



cents. 





>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

> 




>to 


> 




>and 

>read them. 

> 


>die. 




>amount 


> 


>we 


>we 


>cremated 




>-Chula 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1105

_____ 





_____ 



1106






Louise, You and Ann are to be commended!! Thanks for taking the challenge. What if the souls are 

are transferred into new bodies, such as newborn babies? Then they would continue to live on. No 

lost energy. If no body is available at the time of death, is it possible the soul hovers near Earth, kind 

of like the heat escaping in others energy transfers, waiting for a body to become available? Could 

these waiting souls be what we call ghosts? Hmmmmm...............Cynthia 


Hey Ann, 

It sounds like your story is the "Circle of Life" theory. Energy doesn't disappear, it just transforms and you gave some 

great examples of how energy is continually being transformed. So, we have an idea of what happens to our body 

i.e. buried or cremated, and we've posed theories of the energy transforming from those dead bodies. The question 

remains, what happens to our soul or spirit when we die? Does that energy get transformed? Does it go to heaven 

or hell? Does our spirit or soul have energy? If we have a spirit or soul, is it connected to the body, therefore 

transforming its energy the same way? 

Okay Cynthia, I took your challenge and wrote this message without using the illegal "I" word. It was thought 

provoking to write the above without using that illegal word. My quest has been fulfilled! ~ Louise 







Maybe since energy never dies, this is where the idea of living on comes from. Like if 

someone was a dog, a lesbian, a ear of corn, a blue bellied lizard, a christian, and a left 

handed canadian with an ear infection in there last life, when all of these people and objects 

died and rotted and fed the plants, bugs, vultures, flies (maggots), etc; and then came along a 

cute little deer and nibbled ever so gently at the soft fuzzy new growth of tender green grass 

that was growing really well it the spot where all of those things rotted, the deer now has a little 

something from all of the previous forms. And then, comes a long Buba from Kentucky, and 

he and his brother Leroy are out shooting cans and drinking whiskey. Ol Buba and Leroy see 

the cute little deer and decide to shoot it. The little deer dies, and Ol Buba and Leroy cut it up, 

and they eat it. Now, the original, or so we think original, dog, lesbian, ear of co rn, blue bellied 

lizard, christian, and the left handed canadian with an ear infection, and the deer, are in Ol 

Buba and Leroy. So, since energy never dies and it only transfers, maybe all things, are 

related on some level? So, when someone claims that they were Marilyn Monroe, or whoever, 

in a past life, maybe they are right? 


Ann 

1107




While some might consider the human body potential energy when it is sleeping, we might 

also think of it as a vessel that holds potential energy while it is sleeping. Do we really stop 

using energy when we sleep? Do we still burn calories? The body might be thought of as a 

furnace with its pilot always lit. It is always using energy, just not as much sometimes. You 

are probably correct about dead, buried bodies. When we die, we stop using energy, well, 

wait, maybe we don't. Do we use energy to decompose? If you look at a compost heap, the 


compost heaps, lol. Something to look forward to. The heat given off by the compost heap 

is a transfer of energy, excess energy given off in the process. A byproduct if you will. The 




OK, do I get points for not saying "I"? Don't take what I just wrote as fact, I don't have 

anything but my mind to back it up, and I think that is in a state of decompostion. I am just 


Cynthia 



cents. 





>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

> 




>to 


> 




>and 

>read them. 

> 


>die. 




1108

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

>amount 


> 


>we 


>we 


>cremated 




>-Chula 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 









1109






Hey Cynthia and Louise, and the class, 

Hmmmmm, the though of spirits hovering around waiting for a body sounds both interesting and 

scary in the same breath. It could make someone get the heebee geebeeis. Could it be that the spirit 

just turns off like a light switch? Some people think that animals have spirits too, so that adds the 

question of where their spirits go as well. Maybe no one has a spirit? What is the formal definition of 

spirit? If someone is considered brain dead, do they still have a spirit? If someone is being kept 

alive on life support, do they still have what we call a spirit? Hmmmmmm? 



Louise, You and Ann are to be commended!! Thanks for taking the challenge. What if the souls 

are are transferred into new bodies, such as newborn babies? Then they would continue to live 

on. No lost energy. If no body is available at the time of death, is it possible the soul hovers near 

Earth, kind of like the heat escaping in others energy transfers, waiting for a body to become 

available? Could these waiting souls be what we call ghosts? Hmmmmm...............Cynthia 


Hey Ann, 

It sounds like your story is the "Circle of Life" theory. Energy doesn't disappear, it just transforms and you gave 

some great examples of how energy is continually being transformed. So, we have an idea of what happens to 

our body i.e. buried or cremated, and we've posed theories of the energy transforming from those dead bodies. 

The question remains, what happens to our soul or spirit when we die? Does that energy get transformed? Does 

it go to heaven or hell? Does our spirit or soul have energy? If we have a spirit or soul, is it connected to the 

body, therefore transforming its energy the same way? 











handed canadian with an ear infection in there last life, when all of these people and 

objects died and rotted and fed the plants, bugs, vultures, flies (maggots), etc; and then 

came along a cute little deer and nibbled ever so gently at the soft fuzzy new growth of 

1110

tender green grass that was growing really well it the spot where all of those things rotted, 

the deer now has a little something from all of the previous forms. And then, comes a 

long Buba from Kentucky, and he and his brother Leroy are out shooting cans and drinking 

whiskey. Ol Buba and Leroy see the cute little deer and decide to shoot it. The little deer 

dies, and Ol Buba and Leroy cut it up, and they eat it. Now, the original, or so we think 

original, dog, lesbian, ear of co rn, blue bellied lizard, christian, and the left handed 

canadian with an ear infection, and the deer, are in Ol Buba and Leroy. So, since energy 

never dies and it only transfers, maybe all things, are related on some level? So, when 

someone claims that they were Marilyn Monroe, or whoever, in a past life, maybe they are 

right? 


Ann 




While some might consider the human body potential energy when it is sleeping, we 

might also think of it as a vessel that holds potential energy while it is sleeping. Do we 

really stop using energy when we sleep? Do we still burn calories? The body might be 

thought of as a furnace with its pilot always lit. It is always using energy, just not as 

much sometimes. You are probably correct about dead, buried bodies. When we die, 

we stop using energy, well, wait, maybe we don't. Do we use energy to decompose? If 

you look at a compost heap, the decompostion of waste matter creates heat, a form of 

energy. When we die, we become compost heaps, lol. Something to look forward to. 

The heat given off by the compost heap is a transfer of energy, excess energy given off 

in the process. A byproduct if you will. The decomposed body is transformed into 

potential energy, like a carrot or a dog bisquit or something. As you mentioned, it is 

potential energy for worms, even maggots and such. Nature is a wonderful thing. 

OK, do I get points for not saying "I"? Don't take what I just wrote as fact, I don't have 

anything but my mind to back it up, and I think that is in a state of decompostion. I am 

just experimenting with Prof. Yamashita's idea about saying not "I". 

Cynthia 



cents. 





>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

> 




1111

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

>to 


> 




>and 

>read them. 

> 


>die. 




>amount 


> 


>we 


>we 


>cremated 




>-Chula 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 









1112

_____ 



1113





Subject: Study Group - Physics Midterm 

If you are interested in joining an impromptu study group to study for the physics midterm, then here 

are the details: 

When: March 15th - after Prof. Ochanji's class 

Where: Louise's home 

Grub: Pot luck Mexican (enchilada's, corn bread, rice, margarita's will be provided) bring something! 

If you're interested in coming, please let Louise know at tweed@undalumni.org and she will send you 

her address and directions. We will also need an idea of how many are coming so that we can 

prepare enough enchilada's etc. 

1114






This subject is very interesting and thought provoking. My belief which comes from a Christian background is that your 

spirit or soul leaves your body, when your body dies and joins God in heaven or Satan in hell, depending on your 

judgment. Of course, I understand that people have many other ideas of what happens to your spirit or even if we 

possess a spirit. A dilemma that I have hit is that I would like to believe that the same is true for all animals, but to my 

knowledge, there is no mention of animals' spirits going to heaven or hell. So I have a hard time just thinking that their 

body dies and with their body their spirit dies too. Anyone able to shed some light?? As to being brain dead or being on 

life support, I just don't know the answer to those questions but I have given it a lot of thought. ~ Louise 








scary in the same breath. It could make someone get the heebee geebeeis. Could it be that the 

spirit just turns off like a light switch? Some people think that animals have spirits too, so that 

adds the question of where their spirits go as well. Maybe no one has a spirit? What is the formal 

definition of spirit? If someone is considered brain dead, do they still have a spirit? If someone is 

being kept alive on life support, do they still have what we call a spirit? Hmmmmmm? 





on. No lost energy. If no body is available at the time of death, is it possible the soul hovers 

near Earth, kind of like the heat escaping in others energy transfers, waiting for a body to 

become available? Could these waiting souls be what we call ghosts? 

Hmmmmm...............Cynthia 


Hey Ann, 

It sounds like your story is the "Circle of Life" theory. Energy doesn't disappear, it just transforms and you 

gave some great examples of how energy is continually being transformed. So, we have an idea of what 

happens to our body i.e. buried or cremated, and we've posed theories of the energy transforming from those 

dead bodies. The question remains, what happens to our soul or spirit when we die? Does that energy get 

transformed? Does it go to heaven or hell? Does our spirit or soul have energy? If we have a spirit or soul, 

is it connected to the body, therefore transforming its energy the same way? 


1115













tender green grass that was growing really well it the spot where all of those things 

rotted, the deer now has a little something from all of the previous forms. And then, 

comes a long Buba from Kentucky, and he and his brother Leroy are out shooting cans 

and drinking whiskey. Ol Buba and Leroy see the cute little deer and decide to shoot it. 

The little deer dies, and Ol Buba and Leroy cut it up, and they eat it. Now, the original, 

or so we think original, dog, lesbian, ear of co rn, blue bellied lizard, christian, and the 

left handed canadian with an ear infection, and the deer, are in Ol Buba and Leroy. So, 

since energy never dies and it only transfers, maybe all things, are related on some 

level? So, when someone claims that they were Marilyn Monroe, or whoever, in a 

past life, maybe they are right? 


Ann 


Chula, Why do you think you have gotten a rotten apple back? What does that 

mean? 



might also think of it as a vessel that holds potential energy while it is sleeping. Do 

we really stop using energy when we sleep? Do we still burn calories? The body 

might be thought of as a furnace with its pilot always lit. It is always using energy, 

just not as much sometimes. You are probably correct about dead, buried bodies. 

When we die, we stop using energy, well, wait, maybe we don't. Do we use energy 

to decompose? If you look at a compost heap, the decompostion of waste matter 

creates heat, a form of energy. When we die, we become compost heaps, lol. 

Something to look forward to. The heat given off by the compost heap is a transfer of 

energy, excess energy given off in the process. A byproduct if you will. The 

decomposed body is transformed into potential energy, like a carrot or a dog bisquit 

or something. As you mentioned, it is potential energy for worms, even maggots and 

such. Nature is a wonderful thing. 

OK, do I get points for not saying "I"? Don't take what I just wrote as fact, I don't 

have anything but my mind to back it up, and I think that is in a state of 

decompostion. I am just experimenting with Prof. Yamashita's idea about saying not 

1116

"I". 

Cynthia 



cents. 





>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

> 




>to 


> 




>and 

>read them. 

> 


>die. 




>amount 


> 


>we 


>we 


>cremated 




>-Chula 

> 

> 

________________________________________________________________ 

_ 



1117

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 









1118






So, if a spirit is not connected to the body and continues to exist after a person dies, it could go to 

heaven (maybe as potential energy?) and be sent back down to inhabit a new body (baby). There 

are people who believe this, and the thought is that they keep returning in this way, until they have 

learned all the lessons they need to learn. Like reincarnation. If you have ever heard of 

Numerology, this belief goes along with that. Numerology is fascinating; it uses your birth name, 

birth date and combinations of these as a way to classify personality types, life lessons, karma 

and other stuff. It is sort of along the lines of astrology, but doesn't use the planets as a way to 

classify data. I wonder what Sagan would think about it? 

Cynthia 

Definition 

This is from the Cambridge Dictionary. 

spirit (NOT BODY) [Show phonetics] 

noun 

1 [U] the characteristics of a person that are considered as being separate from the body, and which 

many religions believe continue to exist after the body dies: 

Although he's now living in America, I feel he's with me in spirit (= I feel he is present and is 

influencing me, in a way that is not physical). 

2 [C] the form of a dead person, similar to a ghost, or the presence of a dead person which you can 

feel but not see: 

an evil spirit 

The spirits of long-dead warriors seemed to haunt the area. 




scary in the same breath. It could make someone get the heebee geebeeis. Could it be that the 

spirit just turns off like a light switch? Some people think that animals have spirits too, so that 

adds the question of where their spirits go as well. Maybe no one has a spirit? What is the formal 

1119

definition of spirit? If someone is considered brain dead, do they still have a spirit? If someone is 

being kept alive on life support, do they still have what we call a spirit? Hmmmmmm? 





on. No lost energy. If no body is available at the time of death, is it possible the soul hovers 

near Earth, kind of like the heat escaping in others energy transfers, waiting for a body to 

become available? Could these waiting souls be what we call ghosts? 



Hey Ann, 

It sounds like your story is the "Circle of Life" theory. Energy doesn't disappear, it just transforms and you 

gave some great examples of how energy is continually being transformed. So, we have an idea of what 

happens to our body i.e. buried or cremated, and we've posed theories of the energy transforming from those 

dead bodies. The question remains, what happens to our soul or spirit when we die? Does that energy get 

transformed? Does it go to heaven or hell? Does our spirit or soul have energy? If we have a spirit or soul, 

is it connected to the body, therefore transforming its energy the same way? 














tender green grass that was growing really well it the spot where all of those things 

rotted, the deer now has a little something from all of the previous forms. And then, 

comes a long Buba from Kentucky, and he and his brother Leroy are out shooting cans 

and drinking whiskey. Ol Buba and Leroy see the cute little deer and decide to shoot it. 

The little deer dies, and Ol Buba and Leroy cut it up, and they eat it. Now, the original, 

or so we think original, dog, lesbian, ear of co rn, blue bellied lizard, christian, and the 

left handed canadian with an ear infection, and the deer, are in Ol Buba and Leroy. So, 

since energy never dies and it only transfers, maybe all things, are related on some 

level? So, when someone claims that they were Marilyn Monroe, or whoever, in a 

past life, maybe they are right? 


1120

Ann 


Chula, Why do you think you have gotten a rotten apple back? What does that 

mean? 



might also think of it as a vessel that holds potential energy while it is sleeping. Do 

we really stop using energy when we sleep? Do we still burn calories? The body 

might be thought of as a furnace with its pilot always lit. It is always using energy, 

just not as much sometimes. You are probably correct about dead, buried bodies. 

When we die, we stop using energy, well, wait, maybe we don't. Do we use energy 

to decompose? If you look at a compost heap, the decompostion of waste matter 

creates heat, a form of energy. When we die, we become compost heaps, lol. 

Something to look forward to. The heat given off by the compost heap is a transfer of 

energy, excess energy given off in the process. A byproduct if you will. The 

decomposed body is transformed into potential energy, like a carrot or a dog bisquit 

or something. As you mentioned, it is potential energy for worms, even maggots and 

such. Nature is a wonderful thing. 

OK, do I get points for not saying "I"? Don't take what I just wrote as fact, I don't 

have anything but my mind to back it up, and I think that is in a state of 

decompostion. I am just experimenting with Prof. Yamashita's idea about saying not 

"I". 

Cynthia 



cents. 





>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

> 




>to 


> 




>and 

>read them. 

> 

1121

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 


>die. 




>amount 


> 


>we 


>we 


>cremated 




>-Chula 

> 

> 

________________________________________________________________ 

_ 











_____ 

1122



1123





Subject: think 

What is that of which the commen sort is best? 


and why is it? 

_____ 


1124





Subject: Weight a minute (with no "I" and a cookie) 

Teresa, and cohort "F"ers 

Some believe it is a combination of both genetics and lifestyle that cause people's differing weights. 

Some peoples furnaces burn up more energy than others, and some burn much slower. And, if 

inactivity is added in, with higher calories and too much fat and simple sugars, etc., people gain 

weight. 

From a genetic standpoint, fat people would survive longer in case of a famine. Also, in cold climate, 

fat people have a built in winter coat. All the thin people would die off fairly quickly compared to their 

robust, hearty, big boned, Renaissance counterparts. Are they genetically more endowed? 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/33.gif Are they just living in the wrong time frame 

and not appreciated for their figures to be popular? Our society influences our views on what is 

beautiful and what is not. 

From a health standpoint, being overweight is not healthy. As our society continues on its fast paced, 

consumer driven, hectic lifestyles, many people don't have the active lifestyles of our fore-mothers 

and fore-fathers. Sitting in class, in a chair reading, in front of a computer reading and writing, 

stressed out, watching television, reaching for whatever food seems easy, fast, and tasty seems to 

be the lifestyle that is both bad and not unheard of for students. 

It is thought that fat people and obese people don't have as much energy because they have to cart 

around an extra 40 -200 lbs. of weight than a thinner or average weight person. So, do they really 

have less energy? Or is their energy the same, but used up faster than in a thin person? If they are 

putting more energy into the equation at the beginning and more energy in the end of the 

equation, do they balance each other out and NO WORK IS DONE? Conservation of energy? 

Go pick up 60 pounds of weight and hold on to it while you walk around the house a little; or if 

possible, put 60 pounds in your backpack or somehow attach it to your body and try out a day at 

CSUSM with all the stairs...... Can you imagine a super obese person? Their poor bodies, backs 

and joints can't even support their own weight sometimes. 



If obese people eat more food, which gives them more energy, wouldn't they 

have more energy... why are they so slow then? Hmmmm...How come we all do not 

have the same amount of ebnery and who determines how much energy each one of 

us gets? 

Look no I's, to bad it is only one sentence, kinda. 

teresa 

>Hey Cynthia and Louise, and the class, 

> 

>Hmmmmm, the though of spirits hovering around waiting for a body sounds both 

interesting and scary in the same breath. It could make someone get the heebee 

1125

geebeeis. Could it be that the spirit just turns off like a light switch? 

Some people think that animals have spirits too, so that adds the question of 

where their spirits go as well. Maybe no one has a spirit? What is the 

formal definition of spirit? If someone is considered brain dead, do they 

still have a spirit? If someone is being kept alive on life support, do they 

still have what we call a spirit? Hmmmmmm? 

> 

>Ann 

> 


>Louise, You and Ann are to be commended!! Thanks for taking the challenge. 

What if the souls are are transferred into new bodies, such as newborn babies? 

Then they would continue to live on. No lost energy. If no body is available 

at the time of death, is it possible the soul hovers near Earth, kind of like 

the heat escaping in others energy transfers, waiting for a body to become 

available? Could these waiting souls be what we call ghosts? 


> 

>Randy& Louise Tweed wrote: Hey Ann, 

> 

>It sounds like your story is the "Circle of Life" theory. Energy doesn't 

disappear, it just transforms and you gave some great examples of how energy 

is continually being transformed. So, we have an idea of what happens to our 

body i.e. buried or cremated, and we've posed theories of the energy 

transforming from those dead bodies. The question remains, what happens to 

our soul or spirit when we die? Does that energy get transformed? Does it go 

to heaven or hell? Does our spirit or soul have energy? If we have a spirit 

or soul, is it connected to the body, therefore transforming its energy the 

same way? 

> 

>Okay Cynthia, I took your challenge and wrote this message without using the 

illegal "I" word. It was thought provoking to write the above without using 

that illegal word. My quest has been fulfilled! ~ Louise 

> 


>From: Ann Kirkendall [mailto:zestydu69@yahoo.com] 

>Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 5:47 AM 


>Subject: Re: Supply and demand (with a twist of lime and no "I") 

> 

> 

>Hey you two (Chula and Cynthia) ,and the other 20 something cohort "F"ers... 

> 

&g t;Maybe since energy never dies, this is where the idea of living on comes 

from. Like if someone was a dog, a lesbian, a ear of corn, a blue bellied 

lizard, a christian, and a left handed canadian with an ear infection in there 

last life, when all of these people and objects died and rotted and fed the 

plants, bugs, vultures, flies (maggots), etc; and then came along a cute 

little deer and nibbled ever so gently at the soft fuzzy new growth of tender 

green grass that was growing really well it the spot where all of those things 

rotted, the deer now has a little something from all of the previous forms. 

And then, comes a long Buba from Kentucky, and he and his brother Leroy are 

out shooting cans and drinking whiskey. Ol Buba and Leroy see the cute little 

1126

deer and decide to shoot it. The little deer dies, and Ol Buba and Leroy cut 

it up, and they eat it. Now, the original, or so we think original, dog, 

lesbian, ear of co rn, blue bellied lizard, christian, and the left hande 

> d 

> canadian with an ear infection, and the deer, are in Ol Buba and Leroy. So, 

since energy never dies and it only transfers, maybe all things, are related 

on some level? So, when someone claims that they were Marilyn Monroe, or 


> 

>See ya later alligators, 

> 

>Ann 

> 


>Chula, Why do you think you have gotten a rotten apple back? What does that 

mean? 

>Now, on to the question of dead people and energy transformation. 

>While some might consider the human body potential energy when it is 

sleeping, we might also think of it as a vessel that holds potential energy 

while it is sleeping. Do we really stop using energy when we sleep? Do we 

still burn calories? The body might be thought of as a furnace with its pilot 

always lit. It is always using energy, just not as much sometimes. You are 

probably correct about dead, buried bodies. When we die, we stop using energy, 

well, wait, maybe we don't. Do we use energy to decompose? If you look at a 

compost heap, the decompostion of waste matter creates heat, a form of energy. 

When we die, we become compost heaps, lol. Something to look forward to. The 

heat given off by the compost heap is a transfer of energy, excess energy 

given off in the process. A byproduct if you will. The decomposed body is 

transformed into potential energy, like a carrot or a dog bisquit or 

something. As you mentioned, it is potential energy for worms, even maggots 

and such. Natu 

> re is a 

> wonderful thing. 

> 

>OK, do I get points for not saying "I"? Don't take what I just wrote as fact, 

I don't have anything but my mind to back it up, and I think that is in a 

state of decompostion. I am just experimenting with Prof. Yamashita's idea 

about saying not "I". 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Chula, we live in America. You would be lucky to get a rotten apple for 2 

>cents. 

> 

> 

>>From: silco001 



>>Subject: Journal #? 

>>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

>> 

>>I realize that I could get into a long discussion with myself about the 

>>readings, the lectures, religion or the world around us. However, that is 

1127

exactly what it would be (a long discussion with myself). I will do my best 

>>to 

>>keep this short a sweet, maybe even worth readiing. 

>> 

>>The journals are interesting, but I feel I have put in my 2 cents and got a 

>>rotten apple back. So I won't respond to the hot topics that have been 

>>presented. The readings I find interesting when I get a chance to sit down 

>>and 

>>read them. 

>> 

>>My bi ggest ponder for the last couple years is where energy goes after we 

>>die. 

>> Quoted from our Hewitt book of physics (pg.91): 

>>Energy cannot be created or destroyed; it may be transformed from one form 

>>into another or transferred from one object to another, but the total 

>>amount 

>>of energy never changes. 

>> 

>>So, if this is the case, when we sleep we are potential energy as soon as 

>>we 

>>wake we are kenetic and potential, sometimes heat energy too! When we die 

>>we 

>>are no longer potential energy, or are we? Becuase when a person is 

>>cremated 

>>there ashes are burned and are heat energy. Or if they are buried then they 

>>are eaten by the worms to give them energy. I don't know the answers, but I 

>>have ideas. What are yours?????? 

>>-Chula 

>> 

>> 

_____ 



1128





Subject: Re: Weight a minute (with no "I" and a cookie) 

Darn, Ann. You beat me too it. I was thinking about the boxes and the shelves from yesterday's 

lesson and how that could be connected. I should get up earlier, lol. 

Cynthia 

PS There must be a physics formula for how obese people burn energy. But it probably would have to 

include the extra friction caused be bigger size. Mike, Robert, Jenny, can you come up with one? 



Some believe it is a combination of both genetics and lifestyle that cause people's differing 

weights. Some peoples furnaces burn up more energy than others, and some burn much slower. 

And, if inactivity is added in, with higher calories and too much fat and simple sugars, etc., people 

gain weight. 

From a genetic standpoint, fat people would survive longer in case of a famine. Also, in cold 

climate, fat people have a built in winter coat. All the thin people would die off fairly quickly 

compared to their robust, hearty, big boned, Renaissance counterparts. Are they genetically more 

endowed? http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/33.gif Are they just living in the 

wrong time frame and not appreciated for their figures to be popular? Our society influences our 

views on what is beautiful and what is not. 

From a health standpoint, being overweight is not healthy. As our society continues on its fast 

paced, consumer driven, hectic lifestyles, many people don't have the active lifestyles of our foremothers 

and fore-fathers. Sitting in class, in a chair reading, in front of a computer reading and 

writing, stressed out, watching television, reaching for whatever food seems easy, fast, and tasty 

seems to be the lifestyle that is both bad and not unheard of for students. 

It is thought that fat people and obese people don't have as much energy because they have to 

cart around an extra 40 -200 lbs. of weight than a thinner or average weight person. So, do they 

really have less energy? Or is their energy the same, but used up faster than in a thin person? If 

they are putting more energy into the equation at the beginning and more energy in the end 

of the equation, do they balance each other out and NO WORK IS DONE? Conservation of 

energy? 


possible, put 60 pounds in your backpack or somehow attach it to your body and try out a day at 

CSUSM with all the stairs...... Can you imagine a super obese person? Their poor bodies, backs 

and joints can't even support their own weight sometimes. 



1129




us gets? 


teresa 


> 









> 

>Ann 

> 









> 


> 









same way? 

> 

>Okay Cynthia, I took your challenge and wrote this message without using the 



> 






> 

> 


> 

1130

&a mp;g t;Maybe since energy never dies, this is where the idea of living on comes 













> d 





> 


> 

>Ann 

> 



mean? 
















> re is a 


> 





>Cynthia 

> 



>cents. 

1131

_____ 

> 

> 





>>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

>> 



>>exactly what it would be (a long discussion with myself). I will do my best 

>>to 


>> 




>>and 

>>read them. 

>> 


>>die. 




>>amount 


>> 


>>we 


>>we 


>>cremated 




>>-Chula 

>> 

>> 



_____ 



1132





Subject: Re: think 

Dear Sweet Robert, 

I am sorry but for the life of me, I can not understand what you are trying to say? Please forgive me, 

as I am a member of the weaker and more feeble minded sex. I can not think about what you 

suggest until I am able to understand what you are proposing. Could you please find it in your heart 

to expand upon your thoughts so that I may understand? 

Hugs http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/08.gif Ann (female taught language 

differences in action) 

Notice the sweet nonthreatening demeanor and passive exposing of the belly? LOL 





_____ 


_____ 



1133





Subject: Re: Weight a minute (with no "I" and a cookie) 

What about (BMI) Basel metabolic rate? Or is that body mass index? It's one of those... I think 

it calculates how many calories different size people burn each day just to stay alive with basic 

functioning like breathing, heart beat, cell repair, etc. 

Damn, gotta get ready for school.... 

see ya, 

Ann 


Darn, Ann. You beat me too it. I was thinking about the boxes and the shelves from yesterday's 

lesson and how that could be connected. I should get up earlier, lol. 

Cynthia 

PS There must be a physics formula for how obese people burn energy. But it probably would 

have to include the extra friction caused be bigger size. Mike, Robert, Jenny, can you come up 

with one? 



Some believe it is a combination of both genetics and lifestyle that cause people's differing 

weights. Some peoples furnaces burn up more energy than others, and some burn much 

slower. And, if inactivity is added in, with higher calories and too much fat and simple sugars, 

etc., people gain weight. 

From a genetic standpoint, fat people would survive longer in case of a famine. Also, in cold 

climate, fat people have a built in winter coat. All the thin people would die off fairly quickly 

compared to their robust, hearty, big boned, Renaissance counterparts. Are they genetically 

more endowed? http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/33.gif Are they just 

living in the wrong time frame and not appreciated for their figures to be popular? Our society 

influences our views on what is beautiful and what is not. 

From a health standpoint, being overweight is not healthy. As our society continues on its fast 

paced, consumer driven, hectic lifestyles, many people don't have the active lifestyles of our 

fore-mothers and fore-fathers. Sitting in class, in a chair reading, in front of a computer 

reading and writing, stressed out, watching television, reaching for whatever food seems 

easy, fast, and tasty seems to be the lifestyle that is both bad and not unheard of for students. 

It is thought that fat people and obese people don't have as much energy because they have 

to cart around an extra 40 -200 lbs. of weight than a thinner or average weight person. So, do 

they really have less energy? Or is their energy the same, but used up faster than in a thin 

person? If they are putting more energy into the equation at the beginning and more 

1134

energy in the end of the equation, do they balance each other out and NO WORK IS 

DONE? Conservation of energy? 


possible, put 60 pounds in your backpack or somehow attach it to your body and try out a day 

at CSUSM with all the stairs...... Can you imagine a super obese person? Their poor bodies, 

backs and joints can't even support their own weight sometimes. 






us gets? 


teresa 


> 









> 

>Ann 

> 









> 


> 









same way? 

> 

1135

Okay Cynthia, I took your challenge and wrote this message without using the 



> 






> 

> 


> 

&a mp;a mp;g t;Maybe since energy never dies, this is where the idea of living on comes 













> d 





> 


> 

>Ann 

> 



mean? 















1136


> re is a 


> 





>Cynthia 

> 



>cents. 

> 

> 





>>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:28:13 -0800 

>> 



>>exactly what it would be (a long discussion with myself). I will do my best 

>>to 


>> 




>>and 

>>read them. 

>> 


>>die. 




>>amount 


>> 


>>we 


>>we 


>>cremated 




>>-Chula 

>> 

>> 

1137

_____ 

_____ 





_____ 



1138





Subject: good deed for the week!! 

Okay kids: 

First thank you so much for all of you who donated to support survivors of 

Domestic Violence!!! Feel free to continue donating, if you want, I will be 

in class all semester. I really appreciate it!!. But you're job is not done!! 

Didn't you know that you need to do one good deed a day in order to make it to 

heaven? Just kidding I made that up!! But still, here are two ways you can 

make a difference for this week. Are you ready to get involved. 

Tonight at Cold Stone in San Marcos from 6-9pm the Yellow Ribbon Club will be 

fundraising. Buy an ice cream and 25% of the profits will go back to the club 

so they can help students on campus to cope with suicide. I will be bringing 

my foster youth with me tonight. Hopefully I will see you there. 

Go to: 

for more information. 

But that’s not all: 

This Saturday at 6:30pm the MS Walk will be held at Lego land. You can show up 

early to register, and walk or make a donation. I will be there if I can get 

work off, so feel free to come with me. Have fun with friends, get some 

exercise, and support an great cause. For more information: 

http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2004/03/11/news/community/3_10_0422_39_06.txt 

Thanks for your continued support and I hope to see you all there. 

Teresa 

P.s. "Coming together is a beginning, staying together is progress, and 

working together is success." Henry Ford 

1139





Subject: t- shirts 

Hello ladies and germs: 

I am wondering if y'all would like to order "Cohort F" shirts. It would be 

really cute (opps, maybe cute is not the word I was going for... cool) to wear 

together for graduation. I need to know if anyone is interested in it. I need 

to know if y'all want: shirts, sweatshirts, hats, socks, anything. Also, if 

anyone has a design they wat to submit, we can do that too. Or else, I can use 

the greek templates and construct our own. Yay, for cohort f!! 

Let me know. 

Teresa 

1140






Or maybe common sense. That is also agreed upon, except by those who don't have it, lol. 

Cynthia 





_____ 


_____ 



1141






Well, it isn't prom dresses, roses or teachers. Could it be ground? Because it is something we can 

agree on? 

Cynthia 





_____ 


_____ 



1142





Subject: journal # 

Hello there again... yes I am trying to get all my computer stuff done. Last 

class, when we were talking about standards of the classroom, like we would 

not turn in a paper handwritten to a professor, and stuff like that. This 

subject connected to my experience last time I worked. So, I decided to share: 

On Tuesday I was working with some of the middle school foster children on 

their science faire project. The only requirements I knew about were for them 

to test something and make a paper and poster about the topic. Everything was 

due the next day, so their research and testing should be finished. Around the 

end of my shift, Tynishia asked if I cold look at her project. She was so 

excited about it. I was so excited to see what this little girl Tynishia did 

because she was so excited about her project. 

When she pulled out her poster and paper I was shocked. The paper was 

handwritten, (she fully has access to a computer), and the poster was plain. 

She had information straight from the internet, pictures, and in poor 

handwriting her title. There was no color, no substance, and none of her 

poster was her work. Let me remind you that it is 10:30 at night, and I am 

completely exhausted from working with the devils. I looked at her paper, and 

ask her if she wanted to type it. She told me, she did not want to. (I let 

that one go... I have learned to pick your battles and that was not one I 

would win.) 

Next I went for the poster; I then pulled some construction paper out and 

showed her how to put the pictures on the construction paper to make a 

colorful border around the pictures. I then told her to type her title in a 

cool font and print it out. Though the poster and paper needed much more work, 

by 11 both of us just wanted to go to bed. I was glad that she corrected some 

of the work, but I knew that she was going to be embarrassed with her project 

tomorrow. 

Then I wondered, why she thought that this work was good? Was she just happy 

to have her project done? Is it because her family (or lack of) background? 

Whose job is it to make sure that she knows what is required and expected from 

a project? I think teachers need to explain the requirements clearly, like 

please type you paper, every time. It is exhausting but still my sixth grader 

needed to hear that. I just think it is funny how some people look at students 

work and think it is great, and then other see the work and do not like it. 

Kind of like my physics labs, I try really hard and Karas says you could no 

better. I think that is why children need to assess their own work as well as 

the teacher. So that is my story… what do y’all think? 

1143






And then there is "common cause", "common law", and "common descent". 

Hm......they all have something in common. 

Universal common descent is the hypothesis that all living, terrestrial organisms are genealogically 

related. All existing species originated gradually by biological, reproductive processes on a geological 

timescale, and each modern organism is the genetic descendant of one original species. 

Cynthia 





_____ 


_____ 



1144





Subject: RE: scratch 

Attachments: scratch 

scratch 

It's a natural phenomenon, take monkeys for instance. There are a select few 

in the human species that have evolved beyond this most basic act. You might 

be one of them. 

Charlez 

>From: "Robert Atchison" 



>Subject: scratch 

>Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 20:43:02 -0800 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1145






RE: 

"in chapter 6 of the biology text the author writes a metaphor to describe 

the possible scenario for Earth, saying that the sun is like the wind-up 

spring in a music box that will one day wind out, as will every other star 

in the universe, "eventually leaving a cold, dark universe with little 

potential for life."" 

Everything that is born must die. Not only living beings, but inanimate 

objects like stars too. 

How will our sun die? 

Once the hydrogen inside the sun's core is used up, the sun will expand 

rapidly. It will grow and grow till it reaches the earth's orbit. And by 

then, it will be so hot, that it will consume the earth too. 

Such a huge star is called a red giant. Our sun will eventually become a red 

giant star some 5 billion years from now. And this will be the beginning of 

the final stages of its death. Slowly, the outer surface of the red giant 

will dissipate leaving behind a tiny, white and shimmering core called the 

white dwarf star. 

As the white dwarf star cools down, it will reach the final stage of its 

evolution and become a cold and inert heavenly object. This is often called 

the black dwarf and will be the final stage in the life of our sun. 

Whenever something dies, it creates something new. The death of the sun will 

create new substances which will form newer stars and newer planets. The 

entire universe is actually made of the ashes of dead stars. From 

Pitara.com 

____________________________________________________________________________ 

The sun will not be dying during our lifetime, or the lifetime of anyone we 

know. The sun's death is millions of years away. Humans have nothing to do 

with the life cycle of the sun, we couldn't kill it if we wanted to. Now 

fossil fuels from the earth, that's another subject. We could conceivably 

use those up, but it will still be a long time before that happens. For 

information on fossil fuels, go to this link: 

http://www.energyquest.ca.gov/story/chapter08.html 

Renewable energy 

Examples of renewable sources include solar and wind power. They are: 

clean and won't pollute the atmosphere 

safe - unlike nuclear 

won't run out - unlike oil, gas and coal 

- and there's a vast resource that's largely untapped. 

http://www.foe.co.uk/campaigns/climate/issues/green_energy/index.html 

The only real problem with green energy such as wind energy, is many people 

don't want the windmills placed near where they live. This happened on the 

east coast of the U.S.. What is that saying? You can't have your cake and 

eat it too? 




1146


>Subject: RE: journal 7 

>Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:08:19 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>geez louise! that's crazy...i can hardly even imagine 

>what that situation would be like, and to think that 

>we are not far from it. thanks for that input. 

> michael 

> 

> 

>--- Randy& Louise Tweed wrote: 

> > This is a very scary subject and not one that I 

> > think most people are 

> > aware of. In my Biology 338 class I learned that 

> > water instead of oil 

> > will become the substance that wars will be fought 

> > over in the coming 

> > years. Only 1% of the Earths water is available to 

> > the planet for 

> > everything. The rest of the water is in the oceans, 

> > seas, glaciers etc. 

> > and unusable. It is estimated that we will run out 

> > of water around 

> > 2050! I don't think that the average person does 

> > know the damages that 

> > we are causing the Earth. The western world, for 

> > the most part, is 

> > unfamiliar with sustainable agriculture. We are 

> > raping this Earth more 

> > rapidly than the Earth can replenish its resources 

> > and many of the 

> > resources are non-renewable. It would be very 

> > refreshing for the media 

> > to focus on the effects of damages that are caused 

> > and what we can do to 

> > remedy this dire situation. Knowledge is power (I 

> > think I said that 

> > before!) Instead they are more content to focus on 

> > Martha, Kobe, 

> > Britney... 

> > ~ Louise 

> > 

> > -----Original Message----- 

> > From: Michael Renner [mailto:birdnerd13@yahoo.com] 

> > Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 9:03 PM 

> > To: listserve 

> > Subject: journal 7 

> > 

> > 

> > i have been wondering lately about the future of the 

> > Earth, as the science project i'm working on with my 

> > group made me face first-hand the polluted waters 

> > running right into the ocean i surf in. these are 

> > things that i know are happening, but that i try not 

> > to think about, especially when i'm out in the 

> > water. 

> > i think about how san diego is one of the most 

> > desired 

> > places to live on the west coast, where i was born, 

> > and how many people move into the mass-produced 

> > tract-homes every year. do they ever think about 

> > what 

> > is happening out in the ocean that they drive past 

> > in 

> > their s.u.v. every day? do they ever think about 

> > the 

1147

effects of pollution, over-use, and depletion of the 

> > Earth's resources? i know that they are big topics, 

> > but does the average person have a clue about the 

> > situation in alaska and other arctic places where 

> > native people have not been able to go out on the 

> > sea 

> > ice to hunt for a coupele of years because the ice 

> > is 

> > melting? this problem gets more severe each year, 

> > and 

> > it is a big clear sign for all people...the world is 

> > heating up. 

> > it seems that the people of the world hardly think 

> > about the world outside of their own existence 

> > anymore, that as long as there is food in the 

> > grocery 

> > stores and gas at the gas station, life is ok. all 

> > this reading about energy lately has gotten me 

> > thinking about how much energy plays a part in the 

> > world and even in the pollution of the world, how 

> > lives are lost in wars over energy sources and how 

> > hundreds of thousands of acres of pristine, evolved 

> > ecosystms are sacrificed for access to energy 

> > sources. 

> > i wonder if i will see a major energy supply 

> > shortage 

> > or a change in the main form of energy we use to 

> > power 

> > the majority of the world? or will the consequences 

> > of how we have used and continue to use energy 

> > become 

> > so acute that change must be made? 

> > in chapter 6 of the biology text the author writes 

> > a 

> > metaphor to describe the possible scenario for 

> > Earth, 

> > saying that the sun is like the wind-up spring in a 

> > music box that will one day wind out, as will every 

> > other star in the universe, "eventually leaving a 

> > cold, dark universe with little potential for life." 

> > 

> > well damn, if this is the case then we should start 

> > thinking about the value of life and re-access our 

> > priorities as humans. 

> > why not start using energy in more efficient and 

> > clean ways, because at the rate humans are going we 

> > will destroy the planet and most of it's potential 

> > to 

> > support life before the sun burns out, and what a 

> > waste that would be! people need to start thinking 

> > about the benefits of the "green world" and how much 

> > we really depend on its survival for our own. 

> > photosynthesis produces up to 155 billion tons of 

> > material each year. think of the clean air we could 

> > breathe and food we could eat by ensuring survival 

> > of 

> > the "green world" on Earth, and the "blue world" at 

> > that. or is this just all nonsense/noise on the 

> > side 

> > of the road in the s.u.v's world? 

> > 

> > __________________________________ 


> > Yahoo! Search - Find what you're looking for faster 

> > http://search.yahoo.com 

> > 

1148

> > 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 




> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1149





Subject: NRG 

If you put a recently dead warm body next to a freezing live body the energy 

would transfer from the dead person to the cold person. In this situation we 

see a dead person actually saving someones life. NRG THOUGHTS. Marin 

1150





Subject: spirits 

Our spirits condensate into the air and sometimes you walk throught the 

molecules of spirit that is why you can sometimes feel your family or someone 

you love present. I guarantee this could probably, possibly be the situation 

with spirits. I'm making things up. I'll shut up now. Bye Bye Marin 

1151






and why is it the best? 

you came up with some good ones, I was looking for common sense. 

why is common sense the best sort of that which is common? think about what being common 

implies. 




>Subject: Re: think 

>Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:38:51 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>And then there is "common cause", "common law", and "common descent". 

>Hm......they all have something in common. 

> 

>Universal common descent is the hypothesis that all living, terrestrial organisms are genealogically 

related. All existing species originated gradually by biological, reproductive processes on a geological 

timescale, and each modern organism is the genetic descendant of one original species. 

> 

>Cynthia 

> 


>What is that of which the commen sort is best? 

> 

>think about it. 

>and why is it? 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

>Fast. Reliable. Get MSN 9 Dial-up - 3 months for the price of 1! (Limited-time Offer) 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 


1152





Subject: Bandable 

I went there...I jumped off the band wagon and decided to stop sitting on it 

and start reading it. Bandwagon was some heavy reading so was Doable. I worked 

with my science partner today and we ran into so many conflicts with our 

expereiment that made it seem at times that it is not douable. Sometimes the 

project is douable but the there are parts of the experiement that we want to 

understand and test but it just gets to crazy or brings in too many variables. 

The we must organize an experiment bring supporting evidence and present it to 

the world (or Cohort F). 

I don't think that that is what the two readings were trying to say but as I 

read it I was thinking about what went on in the lab today. The reading, did I 

mention it was heavy? I think that I understand that Scientists need to 

comtogether and create a universal way of sharing knowledge and reasearch. It 

makes sense to me. Looking back at the Flu book I realize that a universal 

style of conducting research would have been benificial for all the 

scientists, pathologists and virologist to have access to. Today through 

technology science is more doubable. By buying into a standardized package the 

world is able to operate in various social worlds as well.Well, well is 

right... 

consider + collect + coordinate + intergrate = Cohort F 

1153






very funny! Charles. 

>From: "Charles Darwin" 



>Subject: RE: scratch 

>Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:03:37 -0800 

> 

>It's a natural phenomenon, take monkeys for instance. There are a 

>select few in the human species that have evolved beyond this most 

>basic act. You might be one of them. 

>Charlez 

> 

> 

>>From: "Robert Atchison" 



>>Subject: scratch 

>>Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 20:43:02 -0800 

>> 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Create a Job Alert on MSN Careers and enter for a chance to win 

>$1000! 

>http://msn.careerbuilder.com/promo/kaday.htm?siteid=CBMSN_ 


>> 

_____ 


1154





Subject: Re: t- shirts 

That sounds very fun.... Ann 









Let me know. 

Teresa 

_____ 



1155






While we are on the topic, shouldn't we have a class picture to remeber everyone by? Maybe next 

semester..... 

Ann 









Let me know. 

Teresa 

_____ 



1156






adjective: of or associated with the great masses of people 

adjective: to be expected; standard 

adjective: of no special distinction or quality; widely known or commonly encountered; average or 

ordinary or usual (not so good) 

adjective: belonging to or participated in by a community as a whole; public 

adjective: of low or inferior quality or value (If this is the correct definition, we are in trouble) 

Common sense is good because it is logical from all angles, not just an emotional reaction. 

Cynthia 


and why is it the best? 

you came up with some good ones, I was looking for common sense. 

why is common sense the best sort of that which is common? think about what being common 

implies. 




>Subject: Re: think 


> 

>And then there is "common cause", "common law", and "common descent". 

>Hm......they all have something in common. 

> 

>Universal common descent is the hypothesis that all living, terrestrial organisms are 

genealogically related. All existing species originated gradually by biological, reproductive 

processes on a geological timescale, and each modern organism is the genetic descendant of one 

original species. 

> 

>Cynthia 

> 


>What is that of which the commen sort is best? 

> 

1157


>and why is it? 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

>Fast. Reliable. Get MSN 9 Dial-up - 3 months for the price of 1! (Limited-time Offer) 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 


_____ 



1158





Subject: Re: spirits 

But can you guarantee it? 

Cynthia 


Our spirits condensate into the air and sometimes you walk throught the 

molecules of spirit that is why you can sometimes feel your family or someone 

you love present. I guarantee this could probably, possibly be the situation 

with spirits. I'm making things up. I'll shut up now. Bye Bye Marin 

_____ 



1159




To: journal 

Subject: baby killers: some legal, some not 

Cynthia steps up to the soapbox. So what's new you say? 

I just heard a news report on tv. A lady was giving birth to twins in a hospital. They wanted to perform 

a c-section because of complications and she refused. One of the babies died.....and they might 

charge her with murder. Now mind you, you can legally kill your baby in a clinic or hospital if you call it 

an abortion, but you can't decide for yourself what medical intervention is in agreement with what you 

believe. Did this lady intentionally kill her baby? No, but she knew it was a risk, and she was willing to 

take it. Do women who get abortions intentionally kill their babies? Yes, and its OK. People die on the 

operating table all the time, are the doctors charged with murder? No. 

Sense or Nonsense? 

Cynthia 

_____ 



1160





Subject: RE: baby killers: some legal, some not 

good point cynthia 



>To: journal 

>Subject: baby killers: some legal, some not 


> 

>Cynthia steps up to the soapbox. So what's new you say? 

> 

>I just heard a news report on tv. A lady was giving birth to twins in a 

>hospital. They wanted to perform a c-section because of complications and 

>she refused. One of the babies died.....and they might charge her with 

>murder. Now mind you, you can legally kill your baby in a clinic or 

>hospital if you call it an abortion, but you can't decide for yourself 

>what medical intervention is in agreement with what you believe. Did this 

>lady intentionally kill her baby? No, but she knew it was a risk, and she 

>was willing to take it. Do women who get abortions intentionally kill their 

>babies? Yes, and its OK. People die on the operating table all the time, 

>are the doctors charged with murder? No. 

>Sense or Nonsense? 

>Cynthia 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 

FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar – get it now! 


1161





Subject: hmmmm 

Whats a one syllable word, but if you add one letter to it, it becomes a 

four syllable word? 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1162





Subject: RE: t- shirts 

I can do that too. I made the composite for our sorority and know a really 

great guy that will do it. Anyone else interested? 

Teresa 


>While we are on the topic, shouldn't we have a class picture to remeber 

everyone by? Maybe next semester..... 

> 

>Ann 

> 

>summe004 wrote: 

>Hello ladies and germs: 

>I am wondering if y'all would like to order "Cohort F" shirts. It would be 

>really cute (opps, maybe cute is not the word I was going for... cool) to 

wear 

>together for graduation. I need to know if anyone is interested in it. I need 

>to know if y'all want: shirts, sweatshirts, hats, socks, anything. Also, if 

>anyone has a design they wat to submit, we can do that too. Or else, I can 

use 

>the greek templates and construct our own. Yay, for cohort f!! 

>Let me know. 

>Teresa 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



1163




To: journal 

Subject: Novice Abstraction 

Well, I read that delightful "abstract" article. I have come to the conclusion that I couldn't possibly be a 

novice because I can't remember details about anything. That also goes for formulas. After all, that's 

what my computer is for. Now, I am not saying I am an expert, especially when it comes to physics; I 

don't think an expert's head would start spinning in the middle of a lecture on whatever that was 

Wednesday. Personally, I think formulas are very abstract, and therefore, one would need to be able 

to use them without thinking about it in order to be an expert. 

To me, experts can see the bigger picture, not just the immediate problem. When people solve for the 

immediate problem without looking at future implications, often times it creates more problems. This 

begins a downward spiral. For instance, the government needs more tax revenues, The novice 

reaction: Raise taxes. The expert reaction: Lower taxes. Does this sound like a discrepant event? 

Think of the bigger picture. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



1164





Subject: Re: RE: t- shirts 

teresa, i would get a cute little shirt, and a pic would be good. i know chula took some 

group photos last semester. 

> 

> From: summe004 

> Date: 2004/03/12 Fri AM 08:20:50 PST 

> To: Ann Kirkendall , ICP-F 

> Subject: RE: t- shirts 

> 

> I can do that too. I made the composite for our sorority and know a really 

> great guy that will do it. Anyone else interested? 

> Teresa 


> >While we are on the topic, shouldn't we have a class picture to remeber 

> everyone by? Maybe next semester..... 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 

> >summe004 wrote: 

> >Hello ladies and germs: 

> >I am wondering if y'all would like to order "Cohort F" shirts. It would be 

> >really cute (opps, maybe cute is not the word I was going for... cool) to 

> wear 

> >together for graduation. I need to know if anyone is interested in it. I need 

> >to know if y'all want: shirts, sweatshirts, hats, socks, anything. Also, if 

> >anyone has a design they wat to submit, we can do that too. Or else, I can 

> use 

> >the greek templates and construct our own. Yay, for cohort f!! 

> >Let me know. 

> >Teresa 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

> 


1165





Subject: Re: baby killers: some legal, some not 

Oh Cynthia...I love this topic. I for one am completely against any form of abortion. I do believe it is 

murder! From the moment of conception it is a baby in my opinion. You can hear tha heart beat...it 

has life. I did a whole research paper on this and it was really fascinating what I found. 

Anyway, I can't see any woman who knows that there are complications with delivery, ignore a 

doctor's order. I would say anything that saves the babies life- go ahead and do. Is it murder? Well 

seeing that a person can kill their baby up to 7 months- how could it be murder?. I think it is a horrible 

thing for her to do and something that she will have to live with for the rest of her life but I don't see 

how they could charge her with murder. Casey 

1166





Subject: Re: baby killers: some legal, some not 

Well, they did charge her with murder today. This seems kind of sketchy to me because the baby was 

stillborn. Do they know exactly when it died? She had gone in because the babies weren't moving 

and they recommended 2 hospitals to go to for a c-section, which she refused. Now, her reason was 

really weak, and I don't even know if she had any real belief considerations. The report said she was 

only concerned about having a scar, but I would hope there is more to it than that. However, I have a 

real problem with doctors and the law being able to dictate what I have to do to my body, or that of my 

children. In this case, it may have been medically or scientically sound advice, but who should 

ultimately be the one to make the decision? I think it has to be the person that will have to live with 

the outcome of that decision, the patient or parent. I remember back when I had my kids, the csection 

rate here in San Diego was a lot higher than it should have been, and proba bly still is. I think 

it was like 30%. I chose to deliver my children at home, with an illegal midwife. Had something 

happened, I could have been charged with murder too, I suppose, but for me, it was more of a risk (at 

least in terms of sanity) to have my kids in a hospital. I know that if I were to be classified, I would be 

put in the fringe group of anti-medical wackos, but hey, I am alive, well and kicking! 

Cynthia 


Oh Cynthia...I love this topic. I for one am completely against any form of abortion. I do believe 

it is murder! From the moment of conception it is a baby in my opinion. You can hear tha heart 

beat...it has life. I did a whole research paper on this and it was really fascinating what I found. 

Anyway, I can't see any woman who knows that there are complications with delivery, ignore a 

doctor's order. I would say anything that saves the babies life- go ahead and do. Is it murder? Well 

seeing that a person can kill their baby up to 7 months- how could it be murder?. I think it is a 

horrible thing for her to do and something that she will have to live with for the rest of her life but I 

don't see how they could charge her with murder. Casey 

_____ 



1167






sure, why not :) 

>From: summe004 


>To: Ann Kirkendall , ICP-F 

>Subject: RE: t- shirts 

>Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:20:50 -0800 

> 

>I can do that too. I made the composite for our sorority and know a really 

>great guy that will do it. Anyone else interested? 

>Teresa 



>everyone by? Maybe next semester..... 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 



> >I am wondering if y'all would like to order "Cohort F" shirts. It would 

>be 


>wear 

> >together for graduation. I need to know if anyone is interested in it. I 

>need 

> >to know if y'all want: shirts, sweatshirts, hats, socks, anything. Also, 

>if 

> >anyone has a design they wat to submit, we can do that too. Or else, I 

>can 

>use 



> >Teresa 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1168





Subject: RE: hmmmm 

ooppsss... whats a one syllable word, but if you add one letter to it, it 

becomes a three syllable word. ( not four.. my mistake) 

>From: "Carrie Gilardone" 



>Subject: hmmmm 

>Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 22:45:34 -0800 

> 

>Whats a one syllable word, but if you add one letter to it, it becomes a 

>four syllable word? 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Fast. Reliable. Get MSN 9 Dial-up - 3 months for the price of 1! 

>(Limited-time Offer) 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1169





Subject: RE: hmmmm 

No wonder I couldn't figure it out!! The word is ARE, add an A to the end and it becomes AREA. 3 

syllables. 

Cynthia 


ooppsss... whats a one syllable word, but if you add one letter to it, it 

becomes a three syllable word. ( not four.. my mistake) 

>From: "Carrie Gilardone" 



>Subject: hmmmm 

>Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 22:45:34 -0800 

> 

>Whats a one syllable word, but if you add one letter to it, it becomes a 

>four syllable word? 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Fast. Reliable. Get MSN 9 Dial-up - 3 months for the price of 1! 

>(Limited-time Offer) 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



1170





Subject: journal 8-doability 

Reading Fujimara’s article, Constructing Do-able 

Problems in Cancer Research: Articulating Alignment, 

was a little bit dry but was also very interesting, as 

I kept making connections between the doability, 

production, and articulation ideas with different 

areas of life. I think that Cynthia had touched on 

this one and made a connection to education, but I 

cannot recall exactly what she wrote on. 

What is interesting to me is the wide range of 

applicability of the theory of doability to areas 

outside of science. One can consider their personal 

life, for example, and try to determine what 

constitutes the experiment, the laboratory, and the 

social world. Then the production and the articulation 

can be identified at each one of these levels. 

One area of life that I applied the doability model 

to was teaching. I see the experiments as being the 

tasks, lessons, activities and so-forth that the class 

would participate in. The laboratory is the 

classroom, the place where the experiments are being 

carried out. The social world could be the 

neighborhood that the school is located in where most 

of the students live, or it could go larger into being 

the city, state, or the world, which would be a very 

large arena to consider. For my purposes in the 

application of the doability model to education, I 

would align the social world more closely with the 

immediate areas that the students come from and will 

most likely live in, branching outward into greater 

society. This is because for articulation to happen 

between the levels of experiment (the activities and 

concepts being taught), the laboratory (classroom), 

and the social world (local community), the proximity 

of these areas along with the 

interactions/consequences of actions in them must be 

close enough in order to align them. 

Towards the end of the article, Fujimara discusses 

standardization and packaging of tasks as visible in 

the training process and I found a connection to what 

he was talking about with the teacher education 

program. As students, we are explicitly trained how 

to teach information to children by being given 

background knowledge and information as well as the 

techniques and methods to teach this information. We 

learn about lesson plans, how to make modifications, 

and how to use and follow state education standards. 

However, there is a lack of emphasis on the 

articulation involved in doing these things and to 

learn how to identify and work with the different 

levels of making teaching doable. Teacher education 

programs hint at how to build classroom communities, 

manage students, communicate with parents, deal with 

administration, work with colleagues and deal with 

issues in the work place, and how to work within the 

social climate/context of the communities from which 

students come from. But these are just touched upon. 

1171

The lack of emphasis in the areas mentioned might be 

part of the reason so many teachers say that the 

“real” teacher education is when you get into the 

schools and start teaching. And maybe that is good. 

It may be impossible to address these areas with any 

sort of efficiency in university teacher education 

programs due to lack of time, as many other areas need 

to be covered, and also because many of these areas 

are up for personal consideration as to their 

importance and how to manage them. It could be that 

the teacher education program never really ends, that 

it is an ongoing process for teachers, perpetuated and 

made relevant through reflective processes. 

Relating Fujimara’s statement that standardized 

methods and machines do not guarantee that they will 

be used in the same way by everybody, this is true for 

the teaching practices and use of state education 

standards by teachers. Educators are given the 

standards as a bar that they must teach to at the 

minimum. But how teachers go about reaching that bar 

and even going beyond vary tremendously. So, teachers 

are expected to reach the same destination with their 

students, but how they get there and whether they go 

farther or deeper is of no relation to the standards, 

which may actually lead to a disparity between results 

of students’ education in the end, as they may have 

reached and passed the expected endpoint, but the 

results may not be comparable to each other, despite 

the same packaged, standardized benchmarks all 

teachers are required to use. Regardless of 

standardization and mechanical curricula that schools 

employ, diversity and individ 

__________________________________ 




1172





Subject: Re: journal 8-doability 

I think you do a good job of connecting the article to teaching. What you are saying, seems to agree 

with what Prof. Yamashita was saying in class. In my previous post about this, I had structured it a 

little differently. I put the students at the experiment level, because they are doing the work. But I can 

see how the teacher could be here as well. It is her lessons being put to the test. I then put the 

teacher as the laboratory with the classroom, the teacher really doing the articulating of the lessons 

for those little scientists. The social world was then the school administration, district and groups that 

wrote the standards, those who pass education laws and requirements and parents too. Really, the 

administrators are articulating the standards and laws, and this varies according to schools, districts 

etc. They are the ones who have to convince society that what they want to do in the lab is doable, 

and convince them they will get a product. So, basically, we are probably saying the same thing, 

just structured differently. 

Cynthia 


Reading Fujimara’s article, Constructing Do-able 

Problems in Cancer Research: Articulating Alignment, 

was a little bit dry but was also very interesting, as 

I kept making connections between the doability, 

production, and articulation ideas with different 

areas of life. I think that Cynthia had touched on 

this one and made a connection to education, but I 

cannot recall exactly what she wrote on. 

What is interesting to me is the wide range of 

applicability of the theory of doability to areas 

outside of science. One can consider their personal 

life, for example, and try to determine what 

constitutes the experiment, the laboratory, and the 

social world. Then the production and the articulation 

can be identified at each one of these levels. 

One area of life that I applied the doability model 

to was teaching. I see the experiments a s being the 

tasks, lessons, activities and so-forth that the class 

would participate in. The laboratory is the 

classroom, the place where the experiments are being 

carried out. The social world could be the 

neighborhood that the school is located in where most 

of the students live, or it could go larger into being 

the city, state, or the world, which would be a very 

large arena to consider. For my purposes in the 

application of the doability model to education, I 

would align the social world more closely with the 

immediate areas that the students come from and will 

most likely live in, branching outward into greater 

society. This is because for articulation to happen 

1173

etween the levels of experiment (the activities and 

concepts being taught), the laboratory (classroom), 

and the social world (local community), the proximity 

of these areas along with the 

interactions/consequences of actions in them must be 

close enough in order to align them. 

Towards the end of the article, Fujimara discusses 

standardization and packaging of tasks as visible in 

the training process and I found a connection to what 

he was talking about with the teacher education 

program. As students, we are explicitly trained how 

to teach information to children by being given 

background knowledge and information as well as the 

techniques and methods to teach this information. We 

learn about lesson plans, how to make modifications, 

and how to use and follow state education standards. 

However, there is a lack of emphasis on the 

articulation involved in doing these things and to 

learn how to identify and work with the different 

levels of making teaching doable. Teacher education 

programs hint at how to build classroom communities, 

manage students, communicate with parents, deal with 

administration, work with colleagues and deal with 

issues in the work place, and how to work within the 

social climate/context of the communities from which 

students come from. But these are just touched upon. 

The lack of emphasis in the areas mentioned might be 

part of the reason so many teachers say that the 

“real” teacher education is when you get into the 

schools and start teaching. And maybe that is good. 

It may be impossible to address these areas with any 

sort of efficiency in university teacher education 

programs due to lack of time, as many other areas need 

to be covered, and also because many of these areas 

are up for personal consideration as to their 

importance and how to manage them. It could be that 

the teacher education program never really ends, that 

it is an ongoing process for teachers, perpetuated and 

made relevant through reflective processes. 

Relating Fujimara’s statement that standardized 

methods and machines do not guarantee that they will 

be used in the same way by everybody, this is true for 

the tea ching practices and use of state education 

standards by teachers. Educators are given the 

standards as a bar that they must teach to at the 

minimum. But how teachers go about reaching that bar 

and even going beyond vary tremendously. So, teachers 

are expected to reach the same destination with their 

students, but how they get there and whether they go 

farther or deeper is of no relation to the standards, 

which may actually lead to a disparity between results 

of students’ education in the end, as they may have 

1174

eached and passed the expected endpoint, but the 

results may not be comparable to each other, despite 

the same packaged, standardized benchmarks all 

teachers are required to use. Regardless of 

standardization and mechanical curricula that schools 

employ, diversity and individ 

__________________________________ 




_____ 



1175




To: journal 

Subject: Could it happen again? 

Why is this interesting? Well, you have to know the song. Here it is: 

Late last night, when we were all in bed. 

Old Lady O'Leary left a lantern in the shed. 

And when the cow kicked it over, she winked her eye and said, 

"It'll be a hot time in old town tonight. 

Fire, Fire, Fire. 

Water, water, water. 

Save my child, save my child. 

Jump, Lady, Jump. 

AAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH 

(Repeat, faster each time) 

Did a Comet Trigger The Great Chicago Fire? 

By Irene Mona Klotz, Discovery News 

March 5, 2004 — Perhaps it was not Mrs. O'Leary's cow kicking over a lantern that sparked the 

Great Chicago Fire of 1871, which destroyed the downtown area and claimed 300 lives. 

New research lends credence to an alternative explanation: The fire, along with less-publicized and 

even more deadly blazes the same night in upstate Wisconsin and Michigan, was the result of a 

comet fragment crashing into Earth's atmosphere. 

The comet theory has been around — and most often discarded — since at least 1883, but Robert 

Wood, a retired McDonnell Douglas physicist, said never before has the orbital parameters of the 

rogue comet been taken into consideration. 

The likely suspect, in Wood's eyes, is a fragment from Biela's Comet, which had been circling the sun 

every six years and nine months before a close encounter with Jupiter caused it to break into two 

large fragments in 1845. During its next passage, astronomers noted a 1.5-million mile, 15-day gap 

between the two pieces. 

Wood said his analysis of the fragments' positions during subsequent orbits shows that Jupiter's 

gravity again affected their speed and trajectory, sending the smaller fragment on a path toward Earth 

that ended in October 1871. He presented his findings at a conference last week titled "Planetary 

Defense: Protecting Earth from Asteroids," held in Garden Grove, Calif. 

Wood cited eyewitness reports of spontaneous ignitions, lack of smoke and "fire balloons" falling from 

the sky to bolster his theory. If the fire had been caused by comet debris, which is believed to have 

consisted of small pieces of frozen methane, acetylene or other highly combustible chemicals, it also 

would explain the cause of the fires blazing north of Chicago, which wiped out 2,000 people and 

burned 4 million acres of farm and prairie lands. 

The deceased included many who showed no signs of being burned, Wood said. "This would be 

1176

consistent with either the absence of oxygen or the presence of carbon monoxide or carbon dioxide 

above lethal levels," — a rare — but not unprecedented — situation in large forest fires. 

In all, over a 24-hour period, an area of land the size of Connecticut was burned. Wood speculates 

the main body of the comet crashed into Lake Michigan, with peripheral fragments causing the fires in 

Chicago, Wisconsin and Michigan. 

NASA is among a handful of agencies and organizations working on cataloging potentially threatening 

near-Earth asteroids and comets. What would be done about any threatening asteroids, however, 

remains the domain of science fiction. 

"What's important about these findings," Wood said, "is that they show you people can actually get 

killed from something from out of space." 

_____ 



1177





Subject: Re: Could it happen again? 

I would imagine that people would die due to something of that magnitude. It is interesting because 

when I was taking a biology course it was mentioned that one of the major historical causes of 

extinction, within the animal kingdom, was climate change or asteroids or comet impacts. When the 

subject of asteroids came into play I started to think that it probably will not happen in my life time, 

but this article made me change my thoughts about the possibility of experiencing such an event. 

From: Cynthia Reyes 

To: journal 


Subject: Could it happen again? 

Why is this interesting? Well, you have to know the song. Here it is: 

Late last night, when we were all in bed. 

Old Lady O'Leary left a lantern in the shed. 

And when the cow kicked it over, she winked her eye and said, 

"It'll be a hot time in old town tonight. 

Fire, Fire, Fire. 

Water, water, water. 

Save my child, save my child. 

Jump, Lady, Jump. 

AAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH 

(Repeat, faster each time) 

Did a Comet Trigger The Great Chicago Fire? 

By Irene Mona Klotz, Discovery News 

March 5, 2004 Perhaps it was not Mrs. O'Leary's cow kicking over a lantern that sparked the 

Great Chicago Fire of 1871, which destroyed the downtown area and claimed 300 lives. 

New research lends credence to an alternative explanation: The fire, along with less-publicized 

and even more deadly blazes the same night in upstate Wisconsin and Michigan, was the result of 

a comet fragment crashing into Earth's atmosphere. 

The comet theory has been around and most often discarded since at least 1883, but Robert 

Wood, a retired McDonnell Douglas physicist, said never before has the orbital parameters of the 

rogue comet been taken into consideration. 

The likely suspect, in Wood's eyes, is a fragment from Biela's Comet, which had been circling the 

sun every six years and nine months before a close encounter with Jupiter caused it to break into 

two large fragments in 1845. During its next passage, astronomers noted a 1.5-million mile, 15day 

gap between the two pieces. 

1178

Wood said his analysis of the fragments' positions during subsequent orbits shows that Jupiter's 

gravity again affected their speed and trajectory, sending the smaller fragment on a path toward 

Earth that ended in October 1871. He presented his findings at a conference last week titled 

"Planetary Defense: Protecting Earth from Asteroids," held in Garden Grove, Calif. 

Wood cited eyewitness reports of spontaneous ignitions, lack of smoke and "fire balloons" falling 

from the sky to bolster his theory. If the fire had been caused by comet debris, which is believed to 

have consisted of small pieces of frozen methane, acetylene or other highly combustible 

chemicals, it also would explain the cause of the fires blazing north of Chicago, which wiped out 

2,000 people and burned 4 million acres of farm and prairie lands. 

The deceased included many who showed no signs of being burned, Wood said. "This would be 

consistent with either the absence of oxygen or the presence of carbon monoxide or carbon 

dioxide above lethal levels," a rare but not unprecedented situation in large forest fires. 

In all, over a 24-hour period, an area of land the size of Connecticut was burned. Wood 

speculates the main body of the comet crashed into Lake Michigan, with peripheral fragments 

causing the fires in Chicago, Wisconsin and Michigan. 

NASA is among a handful of agencies and organizations working on cataloging potentially 

threatening near-Earth asteroids and comets. What would be done about any threatening 

asteroids, however, remains the domain of science fiction. 

"What's important about these findings," Wood said, "is that they show you people can actually get 

killed from something from out of space." 

_____ 


Yahoo! Search - Find what you re looking for faster. 

1179





Subject: RE: hmmmm cynthia 

How did you know that cynthia??? Is it on the internet? 




>Subject: RE: hmmmm 


> 

>No wonder I couldn't figure it out!! The word is ARE, add an A to the end 

>and it becomes AREA. 3 syllables. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>ooppsss... whats a one syllable word, but if you add one letter to it, it 

>becomes a three syllable word. ( not four.. my mistake) 

> 

> 

> >From: "Carrie Gilardone" 


> >To: icp-f@csusm.edu 

> >Subject: hmmmm 

> >Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 22:45:34 -0800 

> > 

> >Whats a one syllable word, but if you add one letter to it, it becomes a 

> >four syllable word? 

> > 

> >_________________________________________________________________ 

> >Fast. Reliable. Get MSN 9 Dial-up - 3 months for the price of 1! 

> >(Limited-time Offer) 


> > 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



1180





Subject: RE: hmmmm cynthia 

Of course!! I searched earlier for the 4 syllable, but could only find the 3 syllable answer, lol. So when 

you posted the mistake, I already had the answer. 

Cynthia 


How did you know that cynthia??? Is it on the internet? 




>Subject: RE: hmmmm 


> 

>No wonder I couldn't figure it out!! The word is ARE, add an A to the end 

>and it becomes AREA. 3 syllables. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>ooppsss... whats a one syllable word, but if you add one letter to it, it 

>becomes a three syllable word. ( not four.. my mistake) 

> 

> 

> >From: "Carrie Gilardone" 


> >To: icp-f@csusm.edu 

> >Subject: hmmmm 

> >Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 22:45:34 -0800 

> > 

> >Whats a one syllable word, but if you add one letter to i t, it becomes a 

> >four syllable word? 

> > 

> >_________________________________________________________________ 

> >Fast. Reliable. Get MSN 9 Dial-up - 3 months for the price of 1! 

> >(Limited-time Offer) 


> > 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

1181



_________________________________________________________________ 




Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam 

1182





Subject: T-Shirts 

I would like a T-Shirt that says: 

Cohort F Baby Killers 

Some Legal, Some Not. 

And on that topic, I don't know of anywhere where you can get a legal abortion as your 

baby is sliding down the chute. You should able to wait till it's out so you can see if 

it's ugly or not. 





Subject: Re: RE: t- shirts 

teresa, i would get a cute little shirt, and a pic would be good. i know chula took some 

group photos last semester. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/12 Fri AM 08:20:50 PST 

> To: Ann Kirkendall , ICP-F 

> Subject: RE: t- shirts 

> 

> I can do that too. I made the composite for our sorority and know a really 

> great guy that will do it. Anyone else interested? 

> Teresa 



> everyone by? Maybe next semester..... 

> > 

> >Ann 

> > 



> >I am wondering if y'all would like to order "Cohort F" shirts. It would be 


> wear 

> >together for graduation. I need to know if anyone is interested in it. I need 

> >to know if y'all want: shirts, sweatshirts, hats, socks, anything. Also, if 

> >anyone has a design they wat to submit, we can do that too. Or else, I can 

> use 



> >Teresa 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 


> >Yahoo! Search - Find what you're looking for faster. 

> 

> 


1183

1184





Subject: We should all listen and learn from (A Little Lenny) 

Hey everyone, 

Everywhere I look lately I see so many things that mean much more than they did in the past. 

It's like I could hear the music all my life, but I can now hear the words too. 

Check this one out! Listen to a little Lenny.... 


Can We Find A Reason? 

"Is there anyone out there 

Willing to try ? 

Or are we satisfied with just getting by ? 

We've hurt mother nature 

Can't you see her she's crying 

We've robbed and we've raped her and taken her child 

And oh oh oh can we find a reason ? 

Just think about it 

And oh oh oh can we find a reason 

To live another season ? 

We're fighting more battles 

Everyday we're alive 

We should be rejoicing 

But instead we cry 

This world's so polluted 

You would think we were blind 

We poison our children 

Before they're defined 




To live another season ? yeah 

Excuse me for saying 

'Cause I've never been shy 

But if we don't stop this 

We sho'nuff goin' die 

Yes I hope we can make it 

'Cause this river's run dry 

1185

Now our only battle 

Will be to survive, hey 


Come on and think about it 



Yeah it's the new millennium 

Yeah yeah yeah 

Can we find a reason 




Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah ... 

It's the new millennium 



To live another season ?" 

Lenny Kravitz 




1186





Subject: RE: We should all listen and learn from (A Little Lenny) 

Hey Ann, 

Lenny's song is very thought provoking. You're right, so often we just listen to the music without actually thinking about 

the words (of course, that's easy to do on a lot of songs!). But songs like this can have an impact. Thanks for sharing. ~ 

Louise 





Subject: We should all listen and learn from (A Little Lenny) 

Hey everyone, 

Everywhere I look lately I see so many things that mean much more than they did in the 

past. It's like I could hear the music all my life, but I can now hear the words too. 

Check this one out! Listen to a little Lenny.... 


Can We Find A Reason? 

"Is there anyone out there 

Willing to try ? 

Or are we satisfied with just getting by ? 

We've hurt mother nature 

Can't you see her she's crying 

We've robbed and we've raped her and taken her child 





We're fighting more battles 

Everyday we're alive 

We should be rejoicing 

But instead we cry 

This world's so polluted 

You would think we were blind 

We poison our children 

Before they're defined 

1187




To live another season ? yeah 

Excuse me for saying 

'Cause I've never been shy 

But if we don't stop this 

We sho'nuff goin' die 

Yes I hope we can make it 

'Cause this river's run dry 

Now our only battle 

Will be to survive, hey 


Come on and think about it 



Yeah it's the new millennium 

Yeah yeah yeah 






It's the new millennium 



To live another season ?" 

Lenny Kravitz 




1188






Yes Teresa. Do it. 

Jenny 

1189





Subject: those things that change 

so i was reading through sagan, trying really. i didnt get much out of it or atleast not 

much to write about. but here i go, forcing something that wasnt there.... 

"Just when we've finally understood something the scientists are talking about, they tell 

us it isnt any longer true (247)." so my thought on this is...this is totally true and 

annoying. mom just rambled off a thousand examples, so i think ill share some. 

when i was in high school, i was told you should not go to bed with deodorant on because 

it causes cancer. this is no longer true. 

i was told all my life that i could gain or keep my weight on if i drink milk. this is no 

longer true. last week the news told me that drinking milk can cause you to lose weight. 

when cell phones first came out, we were told they can cause cancer. this turned out to 

be no longer true. then again it was true, and i put the useless sticker on the ear piece 

and now i wont get cancer. 

speaking of cancer, it seems that once upon a time only a few things caused cancer, this 

proves to be no longer true as everything causes cancer. a long time ago, caffeinated 

coffee was thought to cause cancer so everyone switched to decaf, but then they said decaf 

was worse, so they all switched back. 

i dotn know if this was scientifically proven, but kids sitting right in front of the tv 

were gonna (i dont remember) but this was no longer true. 

and reading under a poor light can cause you to lose your eyesight, no longer true. 

ok, you get my idea? 

so on that...lets quote the book again. 

"Scientists make mistakes (254)." 

awesome. so the very people we trust to tell us whats good for us, whatll save our lives 

and keep us healthy, dont relaly know what they are talkign about. 

they are alot like the weather man. 

he tells you its gonna rain, but the sun's out. he tells you it's sunny and its pouring. 

then the next day, he takes it back, oops no longer true. 

so because im Christian Karis, im gonna give you a verse that goes along with all this... 

Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever. Hebrews 13:8 


1190





Subject: Re: those things that change 

I like the weatherman comparison. Funny that you chose this as a topic. I just read that scientists 

have believed for quite sometime that females have all the eggs they will have for their life, from the 

time they are born. Well, guess what, new research seems to show that that isn't true either, lol. 

Cynthia 


so i was reading through sagan, trying really. i didnt get much out of it or atleast not much to write 

about. but here i go, forcing something that wasnt there.... 

"Just when we've finally understood something the scientists are talking about, they tell us it isnt 

any longer true (247)." so my thought on this is...this is totally true and annoying. mom just 

rambled off a thousand examples, so i think ill share some. 

when i was in high school, i was told you should not go to bed with deodorant on because it 

causes cancer. this is no longer true. 

i was told all my life that i could gain or keep my weight on if i drink milk. this is no longer true. last 

week the news told me that drinking milk can cause you to lose weight. 

when cell phones first came out, we were told they can cause cancer. this turned out to be no 

longer true. then again it was true, and i put the useless sticker on the ear piece and now i wont 

get cancer. 

speaking of cancer, it seems that once upon a time only a few things caused cancer, this proves 

to be no longer true as everything causes cancer. a long time ago, caffeinated coffee was thought 

to cause cancer so everyone switched to decaf, but then they said decaf was worse, so they all 

switched back. 

i dotn know if this was scientifically proven, but kids sitting right in front of the tv were gonna (i 

dont remember) but this was no longer true. 





awesome. so the very people we trust to tell us whats good for us, whatll save our lives and keep 

us healthy, dont relaly know what they are talkign about. 


he tells you its gonna rain, but the sun's out . he tells you it's sunny and its pouring. then the next 

day, he takes it back, oops no longer true. 

1191






1192





Subject: Re: Re: those things that change 

add that to the list cynthia! 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/13 Sat AM 11:36:35 PST 


> Subject: Re: those things that change 

> 

> I like the weatherman comparison. Funny that you chose this as a topic. I just read that 

scientists have believed for quite sometime that females have all the eggs they will have 

for their life, from the time they are born. Well, guess what, new research seems to show 

that that isn't true either, lol. 

> Cynthia 

> 


> so i was reading through sagan, trying really. i didnt get much out of it or atleast not 


> 

> "Just when we've finally understood something the scientists are talking about, they 

tell us it isnt any longer true (247)." so my thought on this is...this is totally true 

and annoying. mom just rambled off a thousand examples, so i think ill share some. 

> 

> when i was in high school, i was told you should not go to bed with deodorant on because 


> 

> i was told all my life that i could gain or keep my weight on if i drink milk. this is 

no longer true. last week the news told me that drinking milk can cause you to lose 

weight. 

> 

> when cell phones first came out, we were told they can cause cancer. this turned out to 



> 

> speaking of cancer, it seems that once upon a time only a few things caused cancer, this 




> 

> i dotn know if this was scientifically proven, but kids sitting right in front of the tv 


> 

> and reading under a poor light can cause you to lose your eyesight, no longer true. 

> 

> ok, you get my idea? 

> 

> so on that...lets quote the book again. 

> "Scientists make mistakes (254)." 

> awesome. so the very people we trust to tell us whats good for us, whatll save our lives 


> 

> they are alot like the weather man. 

> he tells you its gonna rain, but the sun's out. he tells you it's sunny and its pouring. 


> 

> so because im Christian Karis, im gonna give you a verse that goes along with all 

this... 

> Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever. Hebrews 13:8 

1193

> 

> 

> 


> 


> Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam 

> 


1194






Hey Karis, 

The correct answer is, they were going to "GO BLIND" if they sat right in front of the t.v. 

Ann 


so i was reading through sagan, trying really. i didnt get much out of it or atleast not much to write 

about. but here i go, forcing something that wasnt there.... 

"Just when we've finally understood something the scientists are talking about, they tell us it isnt 





i was told all my life that i could gain or keep my weight on if i drink milk. this is no longer true. last 

week the news told me that drinking milk can cause you to lose weight. 



get cancer. 

speaking of cancer, it seems that once upon a time only a few things caused cancer, this proves 










awesome. so the very people we trust to tell us whats good for us, whatll save our lives and keep 

us healthy, dont relaly know what they are talkign about. 


he tells you its gonna rain, but the sun's out . he tells you it's sunny and its pouring. then the next 

1195







1196






thats what i said and mom said, no i dont think that was it. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/13 Sat PM 04:32:25 PST 



> 

> Hey Karis, 

> 

> The correct answer is, they were going to "GO BLIND" if they sat right in front of the 

t.v. 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 


> so i was reading through sagan, trying really. i didnt get much out of it or atleast not 


> 

> "Just when we've finally understood something the scientists are talking about, they 



> 

> when i was in high school, i was told you should not go to bed with deodorant on because 


> 

> i was told all my life that i could gain or keep my weight on if i drink milk. this is 


weight. 

> 

> when cell phones first came out, we were told they can cause cancer. this turned out to 



> 

> speaking of cancer, it seems that once upon a time only a few things caused cancer, this 




> 

> i dotn know if this was scientifically proven, but kids sitting right in front of the tv 


> 


> 


> 



> awesome. so the very people we trust to tell us whats good for us, whatll save our lives 


> 


> he tells you its gonna rain, but the sun's out. he tells you it's sunny and its pouring. 


> 

> so because im Christian Karis, im gonna give you a verse that goes along with all 

1197

this... 


> 

> 

> 

> 


> 



> 


1198






That's what my parents used to say!!! Hmmmm.....I can still see. Cynthia 


Hey Karis, 

The correct answer is, they were going to "GO BLIND" if they sat right in front of the t.v. 

Ann 


so i was reading through sagan, trying really. i didnt get much out of it or atleast not much to 

write about. but here i go, forcing something that wasnt there.... 

"Just when we've finally understood something the scientists are talking about, they tell us it 

isnt any longer true (247)." so my thought on this is...this is totally true and annoying. mom just 




i was told all my life that i could gain or keep my weight on if i drink milk. this is no longer true. 

last week the news told me that drinking milk can cause you to lose weight. 


longer true. then again it was true, and i put the useless sticker on the ear piece and now i 

wont get cancer. 


proves to be no longer true as everything causes cancer. a long time ago, caffeinated coffee 

was thought to cause cancer so everyone switched to decaf, but then they said decaf was 

worse, so they all switched back. 







awesome. so the very people we trust to tell us whats good for us, whatll save our lives and 

1199

keep us healthy, dont relaly know what they are talkign about. 


he tells you its gonna rain, but the sun's out . he tells you it's sunny and its pouring. then the 

next day, he takes it back, oops no longer true. 








1200





Subject: What do you think? 

Okay, so I picked up the Bruer book. Definitely not a fun and easy read. I 

am not sure I understood everything but a couple of things did catch my 

attention. I looked at this chapter more from an educational point of view. 

"Prior knowledge affects how we interpret school instruction and thus 

affects what we can learn" (28) Hello!!!! If i am not mistaken, throughout 

this venture through ICP we have been taught that children learn by 

building on prior knowledge. Why do think so many teachers use the KWL 

charts. The greatest example of this is when a math (or any subject) teacher 

flies through a chapter in the beginning of the year, and well as expected 

when the student takes the test he/she does poorly. But do you think the 

teacher stops to make sure EVERYONE understood that chapter? Of course not. 

He/she keeps on going. So, by the middle of the year that student is still 

lost and dragging there feet because they didn't catch the concept in the 

beginning. This was crucial as the next chapter in the book built on the 

that information. Ultimately, I think then that those kinds of students go 

through the year disliking that subject because they didn't have any 

knowledge to build on. 

"In most classrooms, teachers don't have the time or the tools to figure out 

what knowledge children have before instruction" (43) WRONG! Who ever did 

this study obviously knew nothing about education and the techniques and 

theories behind teaching. Again, a perfect example of finding out what 

students know is a KWL chart. For reading many teachers use reading 

inventories to access students reading level. So, yes they are able to find 

out what knowledge children have before instruction. 

In the experiment that Siegler did with the 5 year olds and the 8 year olds 

was interesting. In one experiment he asked "Can 5 year olds learn to encode 

both weight and distance or is it beyond their level of cognitive 

development?" (46) From my perspective, what does a 5 year care how many 

pegs are on the left side and how many pegs are on the right side and what 

peg they are sitting on. Siegler concluded that "giving 5 year olds more 

time to study the configuration or more explicit instruction made no 

difference in their ability to reproduce teh configuration from memory" 

(46). If this experiment had been done so that the 5 years could relate to 

the experiment then I think he would of had different results. What do you 

think? For example if he would of used cookies or a toy or something that 

the child was interested in I think the results would of been different. In 

my experience 5 year old can reproduce anything they are interested in. I 

know Siegler was trying to see if they understood the concept of weight and 

distance, but in my experience those are concepts that are just being 

introduced to a child. For example, we all know that you have to tell a 5 

year old a million times at the dinner table to move his cup back from the 

edge of the table. This continues for a year or so. My point, they don't 

really understand the concept of distance. Once they realize they can't 

place their cup at the edge they begin to set in towards the center of the 

table thus demonstrating their understanding of distance. Again if you've 

ever watched a child play with building blocks that are different sizes they 

always just stack them up. They don't care if the bigger blocks are stacked 

on top of the smaller blocks. Soon they are frustrated because there blocks 

keep falling over. They dont' know that the bigger blocks are heavier and 

cause the blocks to fall over. I am sure I could of used a better example 

but this is what came to mind when i thought about weight and a 5 year old. 

So, I can keep going with this. But I'm sure this is long enough for right 

1201

now. I guess it had me thinking. So sense/non-sense? Did i misinterpret this 

chapter? 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1202






Karis, 

You know..... Now that I am thinking about it again... I think maybe it was, 

"you are going to ruin your eyes if you sit so close to the t.v.". 

Run that one by your ma ma. http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/33.gif 

Ann 



> 


> Date: 2004/03/13 Sat PM 04:32:25 PST 



> 

> Hey Karis, 

> 

> The correct answer is, they were going to "GO BLIND" if they sat right in front of the t.v. 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 


> so i was reading through sagan, trying really. i didnt get much out of it or atleast not much to 


> 

> "Just when we've finally understood something the scientists are talking about, they tell us it isnt 


rambled off a thousand examples, so i think ill sh are some. 

> 

> when i was in high school, i was told you should not go to bed with deodorant on because it 


> 

> i was told all my life that i could gain or keep my weight on if i drink milk. this is no longer true. 

last week the news told me that drinking milk can cause you to lose weight. 

> 

> when cell phones first came out, we were told they can cause cancer. this turned out to be no 


get cancer. 

> 

> speaking of cancer, it seems that once upon a time only a few things caused cancer, this proves 




> 

1203

i dotn know if this was scientifically proven, but kids sitting right in fron t of the tv were gonna (i 


> 


> 


> 



> awesome. so the very people we trust to tell us whats good for us, whatll save our lives and 


> 


> he tells you its gonna rain, but the sun's out. he tells you it's sunny and its pouring. then the next 


> 

> so because im Christian Karis, im gonna give you a verse that goes along with all this... 


> 

> 

> 

> 


> 


> Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, mor e storage, less spam 

> 




1204





Subject: Re: Monday in Yamashita's class-preparation 

Can anybody figure out how to find the John Hopkins stuff we are supposed to look at? 

Cynthia 

Pam Horner wrote: 

Hello! 

Monday, with Professor Yamashita in New York, we might talk about how literature and writing (two very different 

things, really two language forms) interact with and perhaps impact (!!!) science and the social sciences, as well 

as other disciplines. Literacy--reading, writing, and so unavoidably, thinking--is the go-between, the ether that 

connects and helps us to make sense of our and others' knowledge and experiences. 

In preparation, please explore the website of Harvard's Project Zero, particularly the work of David Perkins and 

Howard Gardner (both highly regarded cognitive scientists you should know about, if you don't already) as well as our 

library's John Hopkins Guide to Literary Theory & Criticism. (Please look at least at modernism and poststructuralism 

on the Web.) I expect everyone to be prepared to discuss the do-able and bandwagon concepts in a literary context. 

I'll explain why in class. 

See you Monday! Pam Horner 



1205






Oops, sorry, thought I was emailing the listserve. I will repost it. 

Cynthia 


Hello! 






Howard Gardner (both highly regarded cognitive scientists you should know about, if you don't already) as well as our 

library's John Hopkins Guide to Literary Theory & Criticism. (Please look at least at modernism and poststructuralism 

on the Web.) I expect everyone to be prepared to discuss the do-able and bandwagon concepts in a literary context. 





1206






ok, i am losing it. Ignore this post, can't figure out who i am emailing, lol 


Oops, sorry, thought I was emailing the listserve. I will repost it. 

Cynthia 


Hello! 






Howard Gardner (both highly regarded cognitive scientists you should know about, if you don't already) as well as 

our library's John Hopkins Guide to Literary Theory & Criticism. (Please look at least at modernism and 

poststructuralism on the Web.) I expect everyone to be prepared to discuss the do-able and bandwagon concepts 

in a literary context. 







1207






now that i think about it, this sounds more like it. 

cynthia 


Karis, 

You know..... Now that I am thinking about it again... I think maybe it was, 

"you are going to ruin your eyes if you sit so close to the t.v.". 

Run that one by your ma ma. http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/33.gif 

Ann 



> 


> Date: 2004/03/13 Sat PM 04:32:25 PST 



> 

> Hey Karis, 

> 

> The correct answer is, they were going to "GO BLIND" if they sat right in front of the t.v. 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 


> so i was reading through sagan, trying really. i didnt get much out of it or atleast not much to 


> 

> "Just when we've finally understood something the scientists are talking about, they tell us it 

isnt any longer true (247)." so my thought on this is...this is totally true and annoying. mom just 

rambled off a thousand examples, so i think ill sh are some. 

> 

> when i was in high school, i was told you should not go to bed with deodorant on because it 


> 

> i was told all my life that i could gain or keep my weight on if i drink milk. this is no longer 

true. last week the news told me that drinking milk can cause you to lose weight. 

> 

> when cell phones first came out, we were told they can cause cancer. this turned out to be 

no longer true. then again it was true, and i put the useless sticker on the ear piece and now i 

wont get cancer. 

> 

1208


proves to be no longer true as everything causes cancer. a long time ago, caffeinated coffee 

was thought to cause cancer so everyone switched to decaf, but then they said decaf was 

worse, so they all switched back. 

> 

> i dotn know if this was scientifically proven, but kids sitting right in fron t of the tv were gonna 

(i dont remember) but this was no longer true. 

> 


> 


> 



> awesome. so the very people we trust to tell us whats good for us, whatll save our lives and 


> 


> he tells you its gonna rain, but the sun's out. he tells you it's sunny and its pouring. then the 

next day, he takes it back, oops no longer true. 

> 

> so because im Christian Karis, im gonna give you a verse that goes along with all this... 


> 

> 

> 

> 


> 


> Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, mor e storage, less spam 

> 






1209





Subject: RE: those things that change 

If science is not to be trusted, why do you go to the doctor? 

When I get sick I know I'd rather have the latest medical treatment, cancer 

causing though it may be, than have some guy in a robe rub a bible all over 

me. 

>From: 


>To: 

>Subject: those things that change 

>Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 10:51:33 -0800 

> 

>so i was reading through sagan, trying really. i didnt get much out of it 

>or atleast not much to write about. but here i go, forcing something that 

>wasnt there.... 

> 

>"Just when we've finally understood something the scientists are talking 

>about, they tell us it isnt any longer true (247)." so my thought on this 

>is...this is totally true and annoying. mom just rambled off a thousand 

>examples, so i think ill share some. 

> 

>when i was in high school, i was told you should not go to bed with 

>deodorant on because it causes cancer. this is no longer true. 

> 

>i was told all my life that i could gain or keep my weight on if i drink 

>milk. this is no longer true. last week the news told me that drinking 

>milk can cause you to lose weight. 

> 

>when cell phones first came out, we were told they can cause cancer. this 

>turned out to be no longer true. then again it was true, and i put the 

>useless sticker on the ear piece and now i wont get cancer. 

> 

>speaking of cancer, it seems that once upon a time only a few things caused 

>cancer, this proves to be no longer true as everything causes cancer. a 

>long time ago, caffeinated coffee was thought to cause cancer so everyone 

>switched to decaf, but then they said decaf was worse, so they all switched 

>back. 

> 

>i dotn know if this was scientifically proven, but kids sitting right in 

>front of the tv were gonna (i dont remember) but this was no longer true. 

> 

>and reading under a poor light can cause you to lose your eyesight, no 

>longer true. 

> 

>ok, you get my idea? 

> 

>so on that...lets quote the book again. 

>"Scientists make mistakes (254)." 

>awesome. so the very people we trust to tell us whats good for us, whatll 

>save our lives and keep us healthy, dont relaly know what they are talkign 

>about. 

> 

>they are alot like the weather man. 

>he tells you its gonna rain, but the sun's out. he tells you it's sunny 

>and its pouring. then the next day, he takes it back, oops no longer true. 

1210

>so because im Christian Karis, im gonna give you a verse that goes along 

>with all this... 

>Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever. Hebrews 13:8 

> 

> 

> 

> 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1211





Subject: Re: Re: ann 

thats definitely it! moms outside so we'll have to make this decision on our own right 

now. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/13 Sat PM 08:53:53 PST 


> Subject: Re: ann 

> 

> Karis, 

> You know..... Now that I am thinking about it again... I think maybe it was, 

> "you are going to ruin your eyes if you sit so close to the t.v.". 

> Run that one by your ma ma. 

> 

> Ann 


> thats what i said and mom said, no i dont think that was it. 

> > 

> > From: Ann Kirkendall 

> > Date: 2004/03/13 Sat PM 04:32:25 PST 


> > Subject: Re: those things that change 

> > 

> > Hey Karis, 

> > 

> > The correct answer is, they were going to "GO BLIND" if they sat right in front of the 

t.v. 

> > 

> > Ann 

> > 

> > 

> > karisanne@adelphia.net wrote: 

> > so i was reading through sagan, trying really. i didnt get much out of it or atleast 

not much to write about. but here i go, forcing something that wasnt there.... 

> > 

> > "Just when we've finally understood something the scientists are talking about, they 



> > 

> > when i was in high school, i was told you should not go to bed with deodorant on 

because it causes cancer. this is no longer true. 

> > 

> > i was told all my life that i could gain or keep my weight on if i drink milk. this is 


weight. 

> > 

> > when cell phones first came out, we were told they can cause cancer. this turned out 

to be no longer true. then again it was true, and i put the useless sticker on the ear 

piece and now i wont get cancer. 

> > 

> > speaking of cancer, it seems that once upon a time only a few things caused cancer, 

this proves to be no longer true as everything causes cancer. a long time ago, caffeinated 



> > 

> > i dotn know if this was scientifically proven, but kids sitting right in front of the 

tv were gonna (i dont remember) but this was no longer true. 

1212

> > and reading under a poor light can cause you to lose your eyesight, no longer true. 

> > 

> > ok, you get my idea? 

> > 

> > so on that...lets quote the book again. 

> > "Scientists make mistakes (254)." 

> > awesome. so the very people we trust to tell us whats good for us, whatll save our 

lives and keep us healthy, dont relaly know what they are talkign about. 

> > 

> > they are alot like the weather man. 

> > he tells you its gonna rain, but the sun's out. he tells you it's sunny and its 

pouring. then the next day, he takes it back, oops no longer true. 

> > 

> > so because im Christian Karis, im gonna give you a verse that goes along with all 

this... 

> > Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever. Hebrews 13:8 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 


> > 


> > Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam 

> > 

> 


> 

> 



> 


1213





Subject: Re: Novice Abstraction 

yes, wasn't it a wonderful article? it was difficult 

to determine where some of the statements were coming 

from in that article, and there was a sense of 

classification going on that could almost get 

judgmental. it may have been that i interperated it 

ona different level than it was intended, but 

discussions that are about classifying people always 

seem to lead to some sort of judgment process. not to 

say that the term novice in the article was being used 

pejoratively, but who knows. so now, what does this 

information tell us, what do we do with it and where 

does it apply to approaches in teaching/learning? i 

need to think on it more. michael 


> Well, I read that delightful "abstract" article. I 

> have come to the conclusion that I couldn't possibly 

> be a novice because I can't remember details about 

> anything. That also goes for formulas. After all, 

> that's what my computer is for. Now, I am not saying 

> I am an expert, especially when it comes to 

> physics; I don't think an expert's head would start 

> spinning in the middle of a lecture on whatever that 

> was Wednesday. Personally, I think formulas are very 

> abstract, and therefore, one would need to be able 

> to use them without thinking about it in order to be 

> an expert. 

> To me, experts can see the bigger picture, not just 

> the immediate problem. When people solve for the 

> immediate problem without looking at future 

> implications, often times it creates more problems. 

> This begins a downward spiral. For instance, the 

> government needs more tax revenues, The novice 

> reaction: Raise taxes. The expert reaction: Lower 

> taxes. Does this sound like a discrepant event? 

> Think of the bigger picture. 

> Cynthia 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



__________________________________ 



http://mail.yahoo.com 

1214





Subject: burned out 

someone please give me some encouraging words or join me in my complaints.... 

im sooo burned out. sooo burned out. worse than usual. 

i cant make myself sit down and do even the smallest bit of studies. 

HELP 


1215





Subject: RE: science & Pam 

Pam, 

What makes you think that we are accepting Cynthia's examples as "science"? She is simply posting 

her knowledge base, which happens to be the whole entire internet. It is not necessarily her point of 

view, just various examples from source's searched. Your assumption is that we necessarily believe 

all the examples, or rather accept, all the examples she provides. Could the real answer lie in the fact 

that no one cares? Could it be that science is just another view point from which to see the world and 

Cynthia is providing one perspective within that science realm? Another question, why do you feel 

you should interject with your thoughts on Cynthia's postings? Is it because you disagree with them? 

But, by saying we, you are also including yourself, or was that meant to be a way of easing transition 

and acceptability? Thus, are you playing into your ascribe gender role? Is Cynthia playing into her's? 

Does it matter? Do y ou care? Was your point to see how the collective responds to an outlier? 

Just some thoughts. 

Robert 

>From: "Pam Horner" 


>To: 

>Subject: science 

>Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:01:14 -0800 

> 

>Why are we accepting Cynthia's examples as "science"? 

_____ 


1216






nope 


>To: "Robert Atchison" 

>Subject: RE: scratch 

>Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 18:49:36 -0800 

> 

>Aren't you Charlez Robert? marin 

> 

_____ 


1217





Subject: Re: burned out 

I am with you. Try planning a wedding at the same time. 

Cynthia 


someone please give me some encouraging words or join me in my complaints.... 

im sooo burned out. sooo burned out. worse than usual. 

i cant make myself sit down and do even the smallest bit of studies. 

HELP 




1218





Subject: RE: burned out 

Karis, 

It will be over before you know it. Plus we get spring break soon, which will help with the burnt out 

feeling. You will be teaching in a classroom and this is what you want to do with your life. These 

classes are just the necessary hoop to your personal fulfillment. What is seven more weeks or two 

and half more semesters, with respect to the rest of your life? The answer is nothing, or relatively 

little. Just push through these classes and remember the light at the end of the tunnel, all those 

smiling faces. Good luck and know that there are twenty-two of us behind you. Study up and conquer 

this hoop. We will all be able to rejoice at graduation and this will all be behind us. 

Sincerely, 


>From: 


>To: 

>Subject: burned out 

>Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 13:23:03 -0800 

> 

>someone please give me some encouraging words or join me in my complaints.... 

>im sooo burned out. sooo burned out. worse than usual. 

>i cant make myself sit down and do even the smallest bit of studies. 

>HELP 

> 


> 

_____ 


1219





Subject: Re: Re: burned out 

i am, my best friend is getting married and involving me in every step. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/14 Sun PM 02:19:07 PST 


> Subject: Re: burned out 

> 

> I am with you. Try planning a wedding at the same time. 

> Cynthia 

> 


> someone please give me some encouraging words or join me in my complaints.... 

> im sooo burned out. sooo burned out. worse than usual. 

> i cant make myself sit down and do even the smallest bit of studies. 

> HELP 

> 


> 



> 


1220







reply (2 KB) 

robert, that was so nice and encouraging. thank you. you have reminded me 

why i chose to go through this with a "cohort" rather than all on my own. guess we are 

all here to encourage each other, making graduation that much more meaningful. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/14 Sun PM 02:50:28 PST 


> Subject: RE: burned out 

> 

> 


1221






I feel your pain Cynthia....believe me....things are a little chaotic and I am over it all. And planning a 

wedding is way more fun than studying physics...no offense to Professor Karas. Casey 

1222






Go Robert...you would be a good inspirational speaker! Casey 

1223





Subject: Re: Re: burned out 

Hm....So maybe this is adding to the burn out? Like Robert says, we don't have that much longer to 

go, so I am sure we will get through it. I just try not to think about all the school projects at once, 

otherwise it gets too overwhelming. 

Cynthia 


i am, my best friend is getting married and involving me in every step. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/14 Sun PM 02:19:07 PST 


> Subject: Re: burned out 

> 

> I am with you. Try planning a wedding at the same time. 

> Cynthia 

> 


> someone please give me some encouraging words or join me in my complaints.... 

> im sooo burned out. sooo burned out. worse than usual. 

> i cant make myself sit down and do even the smallest bit of studies. 

> HELP 

> 


> 



> 




1224





Subject: Physics help 

Hey everyone, 

I know were all burned out with everything. I need spring break!!! But in 

case you find some energy here is a helpful site for our physics midterm. 

http://www.glenbrook.k12.il.us/gbssci/phys/Class/BBoard.html#energy 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1225






That's half the problem. Believe me, I like doing the wedding stuff more than the homework. But here 

I sit, doing science, lol. 

Cynthia 


I feel your pain Cynthia....believe me....things are a little chaotic and I am over it all. And planning 

a wedding is way more fun than studying physics...no offense to Professor Karas. Casey 



1226





Subject: Re: Physics help 

I like this site too. I have been using it all day to research the concepts behind our science fair lesson 

plan due tomorrow. Cynthia 


Hey everyone, 

I know were all burned out with everything. I need spring break!!! But in 

case you find some energy here is a helpful site for our physics midterm. 

http://www.glenbrook.k12.il.us/gbssci/phys/Class/BBoard.html#energy 

_________________________________________________________________ 






1227





Subject: Journal for the week of 3/8 and 3/10 

Dear Class, 

In reading the article by Longine titled Social Knowledge about the 

differences between good and bad science some questions were raised. He 

brought up the fact that social values are and have always been a part of the 

science's and because of this fact the social values of the dominant group of 

people (in the U.S. white males) are the one's that are commonly reinforced 

through scientific outcomes which should be free of bias if they are to be 

considered "good science." It was also questioned though that if this is the 

way things have always been is it necessary to change the status quo since it 

has worked so far and produced some incredible leaps in the sciences? 

Although a complete overhaul, where more women and people of color would be 

placed in leading research roles in science would theoretically and socially 

be wonderful, because of money and the people who decide what works will get 

funded won't happen anytime soon. However, with the amount of women in our 

cohort and some of the differnt ethnicities as well it is critically important 

for us to "put on our smily faces and thinking caps" when it is science time 

(as well as every other subject) to show every last one of our students that 

we are capable of understanding and practicing science and that it is a field 

that they should indeed pursue if they choose to do so. We as teachers need 

to make a differnce in the best available way possible to us, in the classroom 

and in an enthusiastic and knowledgable manner. 

peace, 

Matheno 

1228





Subject: Re: Journal for the week of 3/8 and 3/10 

And in order to change the status quo of "all white males", we need to educate all of our students in 

the sciences, so they are actually capable of filling those spots!! They have to know they can do it, 

and the have to want to do it. So, let's make science fun! Professor Lowe(e) has the right idea. The 

"court case" we are reading is entertaining and educational at the same time. Thank you, Professor. 


Dear Class, 

In reading the article by Longine titled Social Knowledge about the 

differences between good and bad science some questions were raised. He 

brought up the fact that social values are and have always been a part of the 

science's and because of this fact the social values of the dominant group of 

people (in the U.S. white males) are the one's that are commonly reinforced 

through scientific outcomes which should be free of bias if they are to be 

considered "good science." It was also questioned though that if this is the 

way things have always been is it necessary to change the status quo since it 

has worked so far and produced some incredible leaps in the sciences? 

Although a complete overhaul, where more women and people of color would be 

placed in leading research roles in science would theoretically and socially 

b e wonderful, because of money and the people who decide what works will get 

funded won't happen anytime soon. However, with the amount of women in our 


for us to "put on our smily faces and thinking caps" when it is science time 

(as well as every other subject) to show every last one of our students that 

we are capable of understanding and practicing science and that it is a field 

that they should indeed pursue if they choose to do so. We as teachers need 

to make a differnce in the best available way possible to us, in the classroom 

and in an enthusiastic and knowledgable manner. 

peace, 

Matheno 



1229






After reading the Fujimura article on the computer my eyes are strained and my 

brain is full. However, I did manage to jot down a few things that caught my 

eye and may be relevant in the class discussion tomorrow. Page 3 brings up 

that professors and science researchers that work at universities work there 

to build their careers. There careers are built on the amount of publications 

and their own popularity. Sadly they must conduct and find results of their 

research within a 5 year time period or they will go unrecognized and will 

never be published. 

*-This makes me think that it is possible for fudging of data to receive the 

results they need for a significant publication. 

Interestingly, the article also brought up the use of expensive equipment and 

the money spent on the project boosts favorability. 

"For many researchers, this decision to jump on the bandwagon to construct and 

solve problems on cancer in molecular biological terms was independent of 

whether or not the problem would yield cures for cancers." 

This is an outrage! The is a major social problem that extends beyond the 

science industry. People are so self consumed and in it for their own benefits 

that it is only a bonus if they are solving a problem that could potentially 

save lives. I pose this solution, if everyone worked for a common goal, beyond 

their self gratifying endeavors then science could work towards solutions, not 

publications or publicity! Take our cohort for example; usually we are all 

pretty self-consumed, doing our best to get through the monotony of our 

classes. However, when we had a common goal (our group paper) we pushed 

through it. We put aside any hostility that might have brewed from the list 

serve, contacted the necessary people and it got done. A problem was solved 

and we worked together to do it. 

". . .science is work and that scientific information is constructed through 

negotiations among actors working in organizational context." 

Sense or nonsense??????? 

-Thanks for reading (I know its a doosy!) 

Chula 

1230






Hm....So who will decide the "common goal" that the scientists should work for? Isn't this just jumping 

on the bandwagon? And what if that common goal is bacteria when they really should be looking at a 

virus? 

In regards to the "fudging" of data. I used to work with these guys that gathered and documented 

statistical data for people doing research. They told me they would just make numbers up, it was 

much faster. Pretty horrifying, especially since you figure this information is used to justify scientific 

research in HIV/Aids and other important areas. 

Cynthia 


After reading the Fujimura article on the computer my eyes are strained and my 

brain is full. However, I did manage to jot down a few things that caught my 

eye and may be relevant in the class discussion tomorrow. Page 3 brings up 

that professors and science researchers that work at universities work there 

to build their careers. There careers are built on the amount of publications 

and their own popularity. Sadly they must conduct and find results of their 

research within a 5 year time period or they will go unrecognized and will 

never be published. 

*-This makes me think that it is possible for fudging of data to receive the 

results they need for a significant publication. 

Interestingly, the article also brought up the use of expensive equipment and 

the money spent on the project boosts favorability. 

"For many researchers, th is decision to jump on the bandwagon to construct and 

solve problems on cancer in molecular biological terms was independent of 

whether or not the problem would yield cures for cancers." 

This is an outrage! The is a major social problem that extends beyond the 

science industry. People are so self consumed and in it for their own benefits 

that it is only a bonus if they are solving a problem that could potentially 

save lives. I pose this solution, if everyone worked for a common goal, beyond 

their self gratifying endeavors then science could work towards solutions, not 

publications or publicity! Take our cohort for example; usually we are all 

pretty self-consumed, doing our best to get through the monotony of our 

classes. However, when we had a common goal (our group paper) we pushed 

through it. We put aside any hostility that might have brewed from the list 

serve, contacted the necessary people and it got done. A problem was solve d 

and we worked together to do it. 

". . .science is work and that scientific information is constructed through 

negotiations among actors working in organizational context." 

Sense or nonsense??????? 


Chula 

1231



1232





Subject: RE: Journal #9 

Cynthia, 

I guess it would be like jumping on the bandwagon, but a different bandwagon. 

A good one that actually finds solutions and is less consumed with image 

and/or fame.-Chula 


>Hm....So who will decide the "common goal" that the scientists should work 

for? Isn't this just jumping on the bandwagon? And what if that common goal is 

bacteria when they really should be looking at a virus? 

> 

>In regards to the "fudging" of data. I used to work with these guys that 

gathered and documented statistical data for people doing research. They told 

me they would just make numbers up, it was much faster. Pretty horrifying, 

especially since you figure this information is used to justify scientific 

research in HIV/Aids and other important areas. 

>Cynthia 

> 

>silco001 wrote: 

>After reading the Fujimura article on the computer my eyes are strained and 

my 

>brain is full. However, I did manage to jot down a few things that caught my 

>eye and may be relevant in the class discussion tomorrow. Page 3 brings up 

>that professors and science researchers that work at universities work there 

>to build their careers. There careers are built on the amount of publications 

>and their own popularity. Sadly they must conduct and find results of their 

>research within a 5 year time period or they will go unrecognized and will 

>never be published. 

>*-This makes me think that it is possible for fudging of data to receive the 

>results they need for a significant publication. 

>Interestingly, the article also brought up the use of expensive equipment and 

>the money spent on the project boosts favorability. 

> 

>"For many researchers, this decision to jump on the bandwagon to construct 

and 

>solve problems on cancer in molecular biological terms was independent of 

>whether or not the problem would yield cures for cancers." 

>This is an outrage! The is a major social problem that extends beyond the 

>science industry. People are so self consumed and in it for their own 

benefits 

>that it is only a bonus if they are solving a problem that could potentially 

>save lives. I pose this solution, if everyone worked for a common goal, 

beyond 

>their self gratifying endeavors then science could work towards solutions, 

not 

>publications or publicity! Take our cohort for example; usually we are all 

>pretty self-consumed, doing our best to get through the monotony of our 

>classes. However, when we had a common goal (our group paper) we pushed 

>through it. We put aside any hostility that might have brewed from the list 

>serve, contacted the necessary people and it got done. A problem was solved 

>and we worked together to do it. 

>". . .science is work and that scientific information is constructed through 

>negotiations among actors working in organizational context." 

>Sense or nonsense??????? 

1233


>Chula 

> 

> 


>Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam 

1234





Subject: RE: burned out 

I've had this nice quote that I got from one of my high school teachers. I 

don't know who the author is but everyone should read it, since it might give 

the cohort some hope to get through school. 

Don't Quit 

Success is failure turned inside out- 

The silver tint of the clouds of doubt- 

It may be near when it seems afar- 

So stick to the fight when you are hardest hit- 

It's when things seem worse that you musn't quit. 

1235






I think the T-shirt thing is a good idea. We should talk about it or 

brainstorm some ideas in class sometime. 

Laurie :) 

1236





Subject: RE: baby killers: some legal, some not 

After reading about the emails on the mom killing her baby in pregnancy and 

people's opinion, I think that it would be hard to see if she really is a 

murderer or not. I think the decision making that the mom had to go through is 

like what female would have to go through to get an abortion. I tend to agree 

with Casey about abortion. 

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you 

apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations." Jeremiah 1:5. To me this 

verse is saying that God already has a plan in your life before you're even 

born, and for someone to stop that with just one decision of having or not 

having an abortion is so amazing, that's it's scary. 

So did this woman commit murder, I can't say if she is or isn't. I think that 

she should think about what is more important in her life, her own body or the 

life of her baby. Like Casey was saying, she will have to live with in 

decision the rest of her life. 

Laurie:) 

1237





Subject: Alexandra's journal 8 

At the start of Sagan's chapter 14 titled, "Antiscience," there is a quote in the very 

beginning that caught my attention, "It doesn't matter whether beliefs are true or not, as 

long as they're meaningful to you." Like Sagan, I wanted to belief in life after death 

when I learned that my father had cancer. I had faith that God would carry me through the 

difficult times ahead, yet felt restless and not prepared emotionally for the lost of my 

father. On one of my trips to spend time with him, I came across a book at the airport 

titled, "Talking to Heaven: A Medium's Message of Life After Death." Somehow that little 

book helped me understand that although my father was angry and physically fighting death 

that on a soul level he was ready. During that time in my life, that little book had 

meaning to me even though I am not one to believe in mediums. Sagan may have a point in 

saying that a medium is a fraud, but this fraud shared that in living in fear we cannot be 

in love. That m 

essage was important because I wanted to live my final days with my father in love and 

not fear. 

When I first learned of my father having cancer, I was ignorant on exactly what cancer 

was. He had a malignant tumor on his right lung from many years of welding that had 

metastasized through his body. I remember crying and not understanding why the doctors 

could not remove the bad lung and remove the cancer. Little did I know the role of science 

working in the shadows? I felt alone and knowledge always seemed to arrive one day too 

late. The doctors failed my father for he had been seeing a doctor who referred him to a 

lung specialist only too late. Everything slowed down around me. Nothing has been the same 

since. It was distressful to read Sagan's words that "cancer victims make pilgrimages to 

the Philippines, where 'psychic surgeons,' having palmed bits of chicken liver or goat 

heart, pretend to reach into the patient's innards and withdraw the diseased tissue, which 

is then triumphantly displayed." 

I respect the work of James Randi in Sagan's chapter on "Obsessed with Reality" for his 

work exposed "pretension and fraud" in what had become a business of faith healing. It's a 

crime to take advantage of some illness or state of emotional trauma. In my state of 

distress, I read as much as I could about lung cancer before my father past. After 

reading, Fujimura's articles, I realized the importance of staying in touch with what's 

going on in the science community. I now know how much science contributes in the study of 

diseases and bringing some level of support and hope, for example, to cancer patients and 

families. I now understand and appreciate long after my father's death the role of the 

radiation therapist and the oncologist. I know that someday as a future teacher, I will 

deal with children who have parents facing the threat of cancer or a child who is dealing 

with that threat. The more I grow spiritually, seek to know my students, and understand 

science's role in our 

society the better I can offer my students the support and understanding they need. I 

have had to deal with this first hand. My little brother was nine years old when our 

father lost the fight to cancer; he had emotional outbursts in school. Teachers were later 

surprised to learn what he had been through for his young years and developed a deeper 

level of understanding and took real interest in seeing that he succeeded in school. It 

will take for teachers to understand that science is not separate from our social 

environment to teach it with confidence, passion, and a concern for the future of science 

and how it impacts our children's lives. 

From Fujimura's article, I have learned how far science has come in the research of cancer 

since the 1970s; it is now in the hands of molecular biologist where the DNA genetic 

structure of cancer is studied. More important, it is refreshing to see that science is 

collaborating with molecular biology, physics, chemistry, DNA technologist, protein 

biochemists? It is a sense of community that spells success and that is what I aspire to 

bring into the classroom. To educate my students on the role of science in our society, I 

will see to it that they understand the team effort it takes for scientist to answer 

questions and research cures for terminal diseases. My students will have an understanding 

of the social support, and laboratory space needed to explore and experiment, for example, 

the role of cancer genes or on-cogenes through visual and hands-on work. Where will I 

start? 

1238

First of all, my students will understand that not much is possible in the way of science 

advancement without society's support and commercial investments for funding, for example, 

molecular experiments in collaboration with protein biochemist and x-ray 

crystallographers. The key word that my students will walk away understanding is the 

significance of "collaboration," which is explored in Longino's article, "Science as 

Social Knowledge." We learn that science reflects the values of its society; therefore, 

exclusion of women and racial groups reflects bad science because here science is 

supporting the very issues society needs to address. To see to it that science reflects 

good science, it is important that educators teach children how science fits into the 

bigger picture through hands-on activity and connecting science to real world situation 

in hopes to eliminate racial and sexual prejudices within our society and in the world of 

science. We can start by not building equa 

l confidence in both boys and girls science experience. Let's teach our children that 

it's about collaboration towards a greater good that makes the difference. Meaning it's 

about working together and building each other through teamwork and support. (Alexandra's 

journal #8) 

1239





Subject: Re: RE: burned out 

Thanks...I really needed the inspiration:) 

Alexandra 


> Date: 2004/03/15 Mon AM 01:02:27 EST 

> To: Cynthia Reyes , ICP-F 

> Subject: RE: burned out 

> 

> I've had this nice quote that I got from one of my high school teachers. I 

> don't know who the author is but everyone should read it, since it might give 

> the cohort some hope to get through school. 

> 

> Don't Quit 

> 

> Success is failure turned inside out- 

> The silver tint of the clouds of doubt- 

> It may be near when it seems afar- 

> So stick to the fight when you are hardest hit- 

> It's when things seem worse that you musn't quit. 

> 

> 

> 

1240





Subject: Re: anyone looked at Hopkin's stuff? 

> Hi Laurie, 

I was not able to get to the site either... 

Alexandra 


> Date: 2004/03/15 Mon AM 01:41:59 EST 

> To: "Pam Horner" , 

> Subject: anyone looked at Hopkin's stuff? 

> 

> Hey everyone, 

> 

> I have gotten to the John Hopkin's Guide to Literary Theory and Criticism, but 

> when I wanted to open the modernism and postmodernism links wants me to login 

> with a name and password. I tried my password I use for CSUSM email and it 

> didn't work. Does anyone have an idea of how to see the reading? 

> 

> P.S. Here's the internet site for the Hopkin's stuff: 

> http://www.press.jhu.edu/books/guide/g-index.html. Just find modernism and 

> postmodernism, but let me know if you find a way of opening them. 

> 

> Laurie :) 

> 

> 

> 

1241




To: hada@cox.net; ICP-F 

Subject: RE: anyone looked at Hopkin's stuff? 

I'm thinking of just going onto Google and searching for it on there. 

Laurie :) 

1242






For what its worth, it is your email and password. I got on, but since the topics Pam listed are actual 

titles, its hard to figure out what you are supposed to be reading. I just went online and read stuff 

there too. 

Cynthia 

hada@cox.net wrote: 

> Hi Laurie, 

I was not able to get to the site either... 

Alexandra 

> From: mcdon032 

> Date: 2004/03/15 Mon AM 01:41:59 EST 

> To: "Pam Horner" , 

> Subject: anyone looked at Hopkin's stuff? 

> 

> Hey everyone, 

> 

> I have gotten to the John Hopkin's Guide to Literary Theory and Criticism, but 

> when I wanted to open the modernism and postmodernism links wants me to login 

> with a name and password. I tried my password I use for CSUSM email and it 

> didn't work. Does anyone have an idea of how to see the reading? 

> 

> P.S. Here's the internet site for the Hopkin's stuff: 

> http://www.press.jhu.edu/books/guide/g-index.html. Just find modernism and 

> postmodernism, but let me know if you find a way of opening them. 

> 

> Laurie :) 

> 

> 

> 



1243






you have to go to csusm site and click on library first 


Hey everyone, 

I have gotten to the John Hopkin's Guide to Literary Theory and Criticism, but 

when I wanted to open the modernism and postmodernism links wants me to login 

with a name and password. I tried my password I use for CSUSM email and it 

didn't work. Does anyone have an idea of how to see the reading? 

P.S. Here's the internet site for the Hopkin's stuff: 

http://www.press.jhu.edu/books/guide/g-index.html. Just find modernism and 

postmodernism, but let me know if you find a way of opening them. 

Laurie :) 



1244





Subject: Re: Re: anyone looked at Hopkin's stuff? 


reply (2 KB) 

>I tried my email and password and was not able to get in. I will do a google 

search in the morning:) 

Alexandra 


> Date: 2004/03/15 Mon AM 02:09:11 EST 


> Subject: Re: anyone looked at Hopkin's stuff? 

> 

> For what its worth, it is your email and password. I got on, but since the topics Pam 

listed are actual titles, its hard to figure out what you are supposed to be reading. I 

just went online and read stuff there too. 

> Cynthia 

> 

> hada@cox.net wrote: 

> > Hi Laurie, 

> 

> I was not able to get to the site either... 

> 

> Alexandra 

> 

> 

> > From: mcdon032 

> > Date: 2004/03/15 Mon AM 01:41:59 EST 

> > To: "Pam Horner" , 

> > Subject: anyone looked at Hopkin's stuff? 

> > 

> > Hey everyone, 

> > 

> > I have gotten to the John Hopkin's Guide to Literary Theory and Criticism, but 

> > when I wanted to open the modernism and postmodernism links wants me to login 

> > with a name and password. I tried my password I use for CSUSM email and it 

> > didn't work. Does anyone have an idea of how to see the reading? 

> > 

> > P.S. Here's the internet site for the Hopkin's stuff: 

> > http://www.press.jhu.edu/books/guide/g-index.html. Just find modernism and 

> > postmodernism, but let me know if you find a way of opening them. 

> > 

> > Laurie :) 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> 



> 

1245





Subject: Re: Alexandra's journal 8 

"exclusion of women and racial groups reflects bad science" 

When these people are excluded, scientific matters that important to them are also excluded. Take 

heart attacks for instance. The male dominated scientific community for years focused on "heart 

attacks and men", ignoring the fact that many women have them too, and even may die more often 

from them. Had more women been doing the research, perhaps the focus would have been different. 

Think of all the diseases that affect minorities populations, who would more likely focus on those 

diseases? 

Cynthia 


At the start of Sagan's chapter 14 titled, "Antiscience," there is a quote in the very beginning that 

caught my attention, "It doesn't matter whether beliefs are true or not, as long as they're 

meaningful to you." Like Sagan, I wanted to belief in life after death when I learned that my father 

had cancer. I had faith that God would carry me through the difficult times ahead, yet felt restless 

and not prepared emotionally for the lost of my father. On one of my trips to spend time with him, I 

came across a book at the airport titled, "Talking to Heaven: A Medium's Message of Life After 

Death." Somehow that little book helped me understand that although my father was angry and 

physically fighting death that on a soul level he was ready. During that time in my life, that little 

book had meaning to me even though I am not one to believe in mediums. Sagan may have a 

point in saying that a medium is a fraud, but this fraud shared that in living in fear we cannot be in 

love. That m 

essage was important because I wanted to live my final days with my father in love and not fear. 

When I first learned of my father having cancer, I was ignorant on exactly what cancer was. He 

had a malignant tumor on his right lung from many years of welding that had metastasized 

through his body. I remember crying and not understanding why the doctors could not remove the 

bad lung and remove the cancer. Little did I know the role of science working in the shadows? I 

felt alone and knowledge always seemed to arrive one day too late. The doctors failed my father 

for he had been seeing a doctor who referred him to a lung specialist only too late. Everything 

slowed down around me. Nothing has been the same since. It was distressful to read Sagan's 

words that "cancer victims make pilgrimages to the Philippines, where 'psychic surgeons,' having 

palmed bits of chicken liver or goat heart, pretend to reach into the patient's innards and withdraw 

the diseased tissue, which is then triumphantly displayed." 

I respect the work of James Randi in Sagan's chapter on "Obsessed with Reality" for his work 

exposed "pretension and fraud" in what had become a business of faith healing. It's a crime to 

take advantage of some illness or state of emotional trauma. In my state of distress, I read as 

much as I could about lung cancer before my father past. After reading, Fujimura's articles, I 

realized the importance of staying in touch with what's going on in the science community. I now 

know how much science contributes in the study of diseases and bringing some level of support 

and hope, for example, to cancer patients and families. I now understand and appreciate long 

after my father's death the role of the radiation therapist and the oncologist. I know that someday 

as a future teacher, I will deal with children who have parents facing the threat of cancer or a child 

wh o is dealing with that threat. The more I grow spiritually, seek to know my students, and 

understand science's role in our 

society the better I can offer my students the support and understanding they need. I have had to 

1246

deal with this first hand. My little brother was nine years old when our father lost the fight to 

cancer; he had emotional outbursts in school. Teachers were later surprised to learn what he had 

been through for his young years and developed a deeper level of understanding and took real 

interest in seeing that he succeeded in school. It will take for teachers to understand that science 

is not separate from our social environment to teach it with confidence, passion, and a concern for 

the future of science and how it impacts our children's lives. 

From Fujimura's article, I have learned how far science has come in the research of cancer since 

the 1970s; it is now in the hands of molecular biologist where the DNA genetic structure of cancer 

is studied. More important, it is refreshing to see that science is collaborating with molecular 

biology, physics, chemistry, DNA technologist, protein biochemists? It is a sense of community 

that spells success and that is what I aspire to bring into the classroom. To educate my students 

on the role of science in our society, I will see to it that they understand the team effort it takes for 

scientist to answer questions and research cures for terminal diseases. My students will have an 

understanding of the social support, and laboratory space needed to explore and experiment, for 

example, the role of cancer genes or on-cogenes through visual and hands-on work. Where will I 

start? 



molecular experiments in collaboration with protein biochemist and x-ray crystallographers. The 

key word that my students will walk away understanding is the significance of "collaboration," 

which is explored in Longino's article, "Science as Social Knowledge." We learn that science 

reflects the values of its society; therefore, exclusion of women and racial groups reflects bad 

science because here science is supporting the very issues society needs to address. To see to it 

that science reflects good science, it is important that educators teach children how science fits 

into the bigger picture through hands-on activity and connecting science to real world situation in 

hopes to eliminate racial and sexual prejudices within our society and in the world of science. We 

can start by not building equa 

l confidence in both boys and girls science experience. Let's teach our children that it's about 

collaboration towards a greater good that makes the difference. Meaning it's about working 

together and building each other through teamwork and support. (Alexandra's journal #8) 



1247




To: journal 

Subject: science homework 

The 8th grade science teacher, Mrs. Parks, asked her class, "Which human body part increases 

to ten times its size when stimulated?" 

No one answered until little Mary stood up angrily and said, "You should not be asking eighthgraders 

a question like that! I'm going to tell my parents, and they will go and tell the principal, 

who will then fire you!" With a sneer on her face, she then sat back down. 

Mrs. Parks ignored her and asked the question again: "Which body part increases to 10 times its 

size when stimulated?" 

Little Mary's mouth fell open. She said to those around her, "Boy, is she gonna get in big 

trouble!" The teacher continued to ignore her and asked the class, "Anybody?" 

Finally, Billy stood up, looked around nervously and replied, "The body part that increases to 10 

times its size when stimulated is the pupil of the eye." 

"Very good, Billy," said Mrs. Parks. Then, turning to Mary, she said: "As for you, young lady, I 

have three things to say. One, you have a dirty mind. Two, you didn't read your homework. And 

three, one day you are going to be very, very disappointed." 



1248





Subject: Info for Harvard's Project Zero-Gardner and Perkins 

If any of you need to read the articles on Gardner and PErkins for tommarow, 

just use these internet sites. They should take you right to the stuff. 

http://www.pz.harvard.edu/PIs/DP.htm(Perkins) 

http://www.pz.harvard.edu/PIs/HG.htm (Gardner) 

Laurie :) 

1249




To: Cynthia Reyes; journal 

Subject: RE: science homework 

That's terrible!! lol 

Laurie :) 


>The 8th grade science teacher, Mrs. Parks, asked her class, "Which human body 

part increases to ten times its size when stimulated?" 

> 

> 

> 

>No one answered until little Mary stood up angrily and said, "You should not 

be asking eighth-graders a question like that! I'm going to tell my parents, 

and they will go and tell the principal, who will then fire you!" With a sneer 

on her face, she then sat back down. 

> 

> 

> 

>Mrs. Parks ignored her and asked the question again: "Which body part 

increases to 10 times its size when stimulated?" 

> 

> 

> 

>Little Mary's mouth fell open. She said to those around her, "Boy, is she 

gonna get in big trouble!" The teacher continued to ignore her and asked the 

class, "Anybody?" 

> 

> 

> 

>Finally, Billy stood up, looked around nervously and replied, "The body part 

that increases to 10 times its size when stimulated is the pupil of the eye." 

> 

> 

> 

>"Very good, Billy," said Mrs. Parks. Then, turning to Mary, she said: "As for 

you, young lady, I have three things to say. One, you have a dirty mind. Two, 

you didn't read your homework. And three, one day you are going to be very, 

very disappointed." 

> 

> 

> 

> 



1250





Subject: still having problems with Hopkin's stuff 

I still couldn't open the guide to literacy theory and critism with my CSUSM 

password. I even went throught the links from the school's website to get to 

it and it still didn't work. I'll just go on the internet for info, but thanks 

all of you for helping me. 

Laurie :) 

1251





Subject: Jennifer's Journal #8 

As I was reading this coming week's chapter, The Science of Mind: Analyzing 

Tasks, Behaviors, and Representations, out of the Bruer book, I was able to 

make a connection. (Side note: This was while I was flying home from 

Sacramento - like my week before last journal posting, I was able to make 

another connection. Hmmm, it might be the whole flying thing - lack of 

oxygen to the brain where I am able to make these connections). 

Right off the bat, Bruer poses the "balance-scale problem" to the reader. I 

could not help making the connection between this example with our second 

meeting of Dr. Ochanji's class in the beginning of the semester. In Dr. 

Ochanji's class, we did an activity called "Balancing Acts" where we 

followed the Learning Cycle. In this activity, we used paperclips and a 

piece of cardboard. Different numbers of paperclips were attached to 

different positions on the cardboard, and this whole apparatus was connected 

at the fulcrum to the table. Unconsciously, we were analyzing the tasks that 

was presented to us, just like Siegler's balance scale problem. We were 

utilizing our working memories and putting it to work. 

In our discussion in Dr. Ochanji's class about the "Balancing Acts" 

activity, the concept that was being taught was the law of torques, as 

described in the chapter by Bruer. We learned that the sum of the products 

on one side must equal the sum of the products on the other side, to balance 

the two sides. In other words, the position times the number of paper clips. 

How does this apply to us? Well, as future teachers we should be constantly 

challenging our students. We should be able to utilize this cognitive 

research and channel it into effective instruction in the classroom. 

Analyzing tasks will be a part of every day in the classroom in conjunction 

with instruction. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1252





Subject: Dover sole 

“My schema for a baseball game leads me to expect that I will spend around 3 

hours at the ballpark, and that if I eat there my dinner will be hot dogs 

and soda, not Dover sole” (Bruer pg. 26) 

I’m sure all of us have a schema for baseball, ballpark, dinner, hot dogs, 

and soda. But, does anyone have a schema for Dover sole? I know I didn’t 

and I am curious to see if anyone else does. 

I was reading through chapter 2 trying to make sense of how our minds work 

and it’s similarities to computers. I get to the associative structures and 

learn that they help us make predictions. Schemas are a way we link 

concepts in long-term memory. Ok, sorta maybe makes sense. Bruer uses an 

example to help the understanding of this. He starts talking about baseball 

and hotdogs, which I know. I have prior knowledge on this stuff. Bruer 

says, “prior knowledge affects how we interpret school instruction and thus 

affects what we can learn”(pg. 28). So prior knowledge is important in 

learning because it affects what we can learn. So his example was great, I 

was learning, but then at the end he throws in Dover sole. I read this and 

lost all concentration and all learning that was taking place was lost. 

What is Dover sole and how does it relate to hot dogs and sodas? I did look 

it up and found the meaning. Which made me mad because here was a chance 

for Bruer to assist in the understanding of a concept then blew it with the 

addition of an uncommon word. Why did he use this word? The conclusion I 

came up with was either I need a larger vocabulary or he has too big of one. 

In either cause the teacher’s job is to assist learning by making the 

information accessible to all who hear it. In Bruers case his students are 

all who read his book. This would be a large group of people that he 

doesn’t know. So for his group of students he uses Dover sole to help their 

understanding. 

Sometimes I think experts let their expertise go to their head. There are 

many teachers who have expertise feel the need to show off this knowledge, 

when it is their goal to relate it to the novice. I wish more teachers 

would worry more about the novices needs than the needs to show off their 

expertise. 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1253





Subject: journal 8 re: Journal for the week of 3/8 and 3/10 

After reading over the reading and then coming to this journal by Matheno It 

made me think about a few things. The soical vaules was one thing that caught 

my eye it talked about the typical white male and what he has done for us in 

science or what is know as good science. I our world today we have many 

different races and ethnic backgrounds but we dont allow them to voice their 

opinon in science why is that. The reason is because scientist believe that 

the dominanat group has a non bias opinion on science. I think that this is 

bull and we need to make this stop everyone needs to have there opinon and we 

should not catagorize any race at being dominant. "Aristole told us how women 

and slaves were inferior to free born Athenian males." In our world today I am 

proud to say that is not ture at all. Matheno brought up a good point about 

our chort and the women in it. He said, "with the amount of women in our 


for us to "put on our smily faces and thinking caps" when it is science 

time(as well as every other subject) to show every last one of our students 

that we are capable of understanding and practicing science and that it is a 

field that they should indeed pursue if they choose to do so." I think that 

this quote that Matheno said was awasome everyone needs to have and equal 

opportunity do what they want in their life and no one should have the right 

to tell them different just because they are a women or a different race. I 

also feel that we need to teach our students equal opportunity in the 

classroom. It will allow all stduents to voice their opinon and not be shut 

down. 

Thank you Metheno for opening my eyes 

Joanthan 

1254

Matheno 

1255





Subject: RE: science homework 

Well, Laurie you should know about this stuff sooner or later. Hee hee. 

Just kidding. I love ya bunches! 

Teresa 

>That's terrible!! lol 

> 

>Laurie :) 

> 

>>===== Original Message From Cynthia Reyes ===== 

>>The 8th grade science teacher, Mrs. Parks, asked her class, "Which human 

body 

>part increases to ten times its size when stimulated?" 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>>No one answered until little Mary stood up angrily and said, "You should not 

>be asking eighth-graders a question like that! I'm going to tell my parents, 

>and they will go and tell the principal, who will then fire you!" With a 

sneer 

>on her face, she then sat back down. 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>>Mrs. Parks ignored her and asked the question again: "Which body part 

>increases to 10 times its size when stimulated?" 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>>Little Mary's mouth fell open. She said to those around her, "Boy, is she 

>gonna get in big trouble!" The teacher continued to ignore her and asked the 

>class, "Anybody?" 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>>Finally, Billy stood up, looked around nervously and replied, "The body part 

>that increases to 10 times its size when stimulated is the pupil of the eye." 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>>"Very good, Billy," said Mrs. Parks. Then, turning to Mary, she said: "As 

for 

>you, young lady, I have three things to say. One, you have a dirty mind. Two, 

>you didn't read your homework. And three, one day you are going to be very, 

>very disappointed." 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 


>>Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam 

1256





Subject: My journal... 1/2 way done 

Okay... first I read or slept through sagan again. This is what I got out of 

it: since science is man- made, and man is not perfect, then science can not 

be perfect. It has all the flaws of humans. No duh!!! 

Second, sad for the mother!! Moving on... 

Third, Karis we are all frustrated and bored out of our minds. You are not 

alone. At least you people who are planning weddings have something to 

day-dream about. I spend my time thinking about...Where did hamsters live 

before we put them in cages as a pet? Why do people say "no offense" when 

they're about to offend someone? Why do they have the back pain medicine on 

the bottom shelf at the pharmacy? They have a show called "Unsolved 

Mysteries." What other kind of mysteries are there? Do they make coffins wider 

for dead fat people or is it a 1 size fits all kind of thing? 

Teresa 

Boredom is simply a lack of attention 

-- Christopher Fremantle 

1257




To: LBST 361B 


Hello, 

This might be off topic, but I wanted to share it with you. 

Yesterday while with a friend we were talking about leardership. 

"Un lider nace, no se hace" is a well known saying in Spanish. It means that a 

learder is born a leader. My friend and I were saying how there are people who 

are really born leaders. They have such qualities that make them great 

leaders, but we noticed that they have to go through a process so that they 

can become such leaders and their life experiences reflect that. 

"Un lider se hace, no nace" is the opposite of the other saying. It means that 

a leader is made, not born which tell us that if someone wants to become a 

leader he/she has to really work for it. 

In my opinion, both perspectives are valid. There are leaders that are born 

leaders, and there are other who are not, but that does not make them less 

leaders. It all depends on the person and how passionate he/she is. 

In the case of teaching, there are people who really have the call to be 

teachers while others become teachers because they know a subject so well. I 

have had teachers who studied to be teachers, but they don't know how to 

teach. On the other hand, I have had teachers, who did not study to become 

teachers, and they know their subject well and they can teach it. So I guess 

there are different kinds of teachers. Now I understand why there is a moment 

where you think about what you are doing to see if that's what you really want 

to do. 

I came to this conclusion: Whether you are born a teacher or not, but you feel 

it is your call, you are going to be great. The thing is how much you want to 

sacrifice for your students. Teaching is for those who put others before 

themselves. How great you want to be will also depend on how prepare you want 

to be, and experience will bring that. Maybe the first years are going to be 

tough and a lot of mistakes will be made, but as you go a long, you will learn 

more and more. Everything is a process as life itself, are you willing to go 

through it? 

I hope what I said makes any sense or maybe is nonsense. :-) 

judith 

1258





Subject: plastic bottles 

to those who offered to find casey and i plastic bottles: 

the idea turned out to be more than we bargained for, so we dont need plastic bottles 

anymore. 

thank you for trying to help us! 

karis and casey 


1259





Subject: for teresa again 

you are soo funny! 

youre right, us single cohort-ers have nothing else to think about but school. no 

wedding, no boyfriends, no future plans, nada. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/15 Mon AM 10:44:00 PST 

> To: "Joey Benson" , ICP-F 

> Subject: My journal... 1/2 way done 

> 

> Okay... first I read or slept through sagan again. This is what I got out of 

> it: since science is man- made, and man is not perfect, then science can not 

> be perfect. It has all the flaws of humans. No duh!!! 

> Second, sad for the mother!! Moving on... 

> Third, Karis we are all frustrated and bored out of our minds. You are not 

> alone. At least you people who are planning weddings have something to 

> day-dream about. I spend my time thinking about...Where did hamsters live 

> before we put them in cages as a pet? Why do people say "no offense" when 

> they're about to offend someone? Why do they have the back pain medicine on 

> the bottom shelf at the pharmacy? They have a show called "Unsolved 

> Mysteries." What other kind of mysteries are there? Do they make coffins wider 

> for dead fat people or is it a 1 size fits all kind of thing? 

> Teresa 

> Boredom is simply a lack of attention 

> 

> -- Christopher Fremantle 

> 

> 


1260




To: journal 

Subject: Pretend this example of science isn't from me 

For those of you who recall the topic of the Hubble coming up in class today, this is an awesome link!! 

It takes a few seconds to load cuz it is pictures, but well worth it. 

Cynthia 

http://wires.news.com.au/special/mm/030811-hubble.htm 



1261





Subject: worms 

Who wudda thunk that worms are good for you? 

About Worms 

Little Johnny watched the science teacher start the experiment 

with the worms. 

Four worms were placed into four separate jars. 

The first worm was put into a jar of alcohol. 

The second worm was put into a jar of cigarette smoke. 

The third worm was put into a jar of sperm. 

The fourth worm was put into a jar of soil. 

After one day, these were the results: 

The first worm in alcohol -- dead. 

Second worm in cigarette smoke -- dead. 

Third worm in sperm -- dead. 

Fourth worm in soil -- alive. 

So the Science teacher asked the class -- 

"What can you learn from this experiment." 

Little Johnny quickly raised his hand and said 

"As long as you drink, smoke and have sex, 

you won't have worms." 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1262





Subject: Re: worms 

LOL, that's a good one. Cynthia 


Who wudda thunk that worms are good for you? 

About Worms 

Little Johnny watched the science teacher start the experiment 

with the worms. 

Four worms were placed into four separate jars. 

The first worm was put into a jar of alcohol. 

The second worm was put into a jar of cigarette smoke. 

The third worm was put into a jar of sperm. 

The fourth worm was put into a jar of soil. 

After one day, these were the results: 

The first worm in alcohol -- dead. 

Second worm in cigarette smoke -- dead. 

Third worm in sperm -- dead. 

Fourth worm in soil -- alive. 

So the Science teacher asked the class -- 

"What can you learn from this experiment." 

Little Johnny quickly raised his hand and said 

"As long as you drink, smoke and have sex, 

you won't have worms." 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1263




1264





Subject: RE: Pretend this example of science isn't from me 

that was really cool. There is a lot that we don't understand within those pictures and even more that I 

personally don't understand. http://graphics.hotmail.com/i.p.emdgust.gifwow? 



>To: journal 

>Subject: Pretend this example of science isn't from me 

>Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 20:29:57 -0800 (PST) 

> 

>For those of you who recall the topic of the Hubble coming up in class today, this is an awesome 

link!! It takes a few seconds to load cuz it is pictures, but well worth it. 

>Cynthia 

> 

>http://wires.news.com.au/special/mm/030811-hubble.htm 

> 

> 



_____ 


1265





Subject: study again? 

Hey Y'all, 

If you are not yet burned out on studying, Ann and I will be meeting at the taco shop across the street 

from CSUSM at around 12:15 today(tue, 16th). We plan on learning all there is to know about 

physics(there sure is a lot to know), hope to see you there. 

Sincerely, 

Robert 

_____ 


1266





Subject: SCIENCE 

Hey class, 

Chaos in science, or the lack of conjunctions within research, may be related to its introduction into the 

capitalistic market and it’s overall profitability. The Hunt article alluded to this, although it placed the 

disclaimer that disjunction in scientific research have always been present. Constructivists view the world of 

science in terms of the people that are doing the studies; “scientific discoveries are not objective truths but only 

cultural artifacts, not representations of reality but self-serving products of the system.”(Hunt, pg6). So, the 

question that Pam posed the other day, “where do we get our science,” is very pertinent, if we come from a 

constructivist viewpoint. But, coming from a constructivist viewpoint one would see that all scientific research 

is “self-serving.” This goes back to the Longino article in which the values of the scientist, or rather the group 

that the scient ist works for, is called into to question. After thinking about these ideas and talking with people 

in the scientific community, it seems that it is not the scientist, but the producers and propagators of the science 

that apply science to values. The scientist is held up to scrutiny while publishing their methods and practices 

and are hung on a stick if there research is not reproducible under the same methods proposed within their 

methods and practices. Where as when “scientific” knowledge is produced and consumed within mass media, 

no methods are proposed. They simply state it as fact and thus if all is stated as fact and not an instrument in 

which to conduct further investigation, than there is going to be disjunction within the ranks of the scientific 

community. So instead of using science as a fact, one must use it as a tool to understand future developments. 

Therefore nothing within science should be seen as an absolute fact. It is within absolute facts that deception 

and disjunction live. Can this be applied to other areas, i.e. religion? Is this the reason for the use of the word 

faith within religion and not absolute truth? Can it be that understanding that nothing is absolute fact, or rather 

absolute truth, is the overall point of this class? What is the material that has been presented? How has been 

presented? Why has been presented in this way? Yamashita is always telling us to look at the our data points, 

but he himself is a large group of data points within the class. Sense or nonsense, maybe even common sense. 

Robert 

_____ 

Learn how to help protect your privacy and prevent fraud online at Tech Hacks & Scams. 

1267





Subject: grab the bull by the horns.... 

Dear cohort, 

Perhaps a strong action needed to push the pendulum in the other direction. Let's put all our eggs in 

one basket and teach a few generations of 98% all females (any ethnic, color, sexual preference, 

religion, etc.) about science. Forget about the guys, let's dumb them up a bit.... 


Just kidding..... 

Ann 



When these people are excluded, scientific matters that important to them are also excluded. 

Take heart attacks for instance. The male dominated scientific community for years focused on 

"heart attacks and men", ignoring the fact that many women have them too, and even may die 

more often from them. Had more women been doing the research, perhaps the focus would have 

been different. Think of all the diseases that affect minorities populations, who would more likely 

focus on those diseases? 

Cynthia 


At the start of Sagan's chapter 14 titled, "Antiscience," there is a quote in the very beginning 

that caught my attention, "It doesn't matter whether beliefs are true or not, as long as they're 

meaningful to you." Like Sagan, I wanted to belief in life after death when I learned that my 

father had cancer. I had faith that God would carry me through the difficult times ahead, yet felt 

restless and not prepared emotionally for the lost of my father. On one of my trips to spend 

time with him, I came across a book at the airport titled, "Talking to Heaven: A Medium's 

Message of Life After Death." Somehow that little book helped me understand that although 

my father was angry and physically fighting death that on a soul level he was ready. During 

that time in my life, that little book had meaning to me even though I am not one to believe in 

mediums. Sagan may have a point in saying that a medium is a fraud, but this fraud shared 

that in living in fear we cannot be in love. That m 

essage was important because I wanted to live my final days with my father in love and not 

fear. 

When I first learned of my father having cancer, I was ignorant on exactly what cancer was. He 

had a malignant tumor on his right lung from many years of welding that had metastasized 

through his body. I remember crying and not understanding why the doctors could not remove 

the bad lung and remove the cancer. Little did I know the role of science working in the 

shadows? I felt alone and knowledge always seemed to arrive one day too late. The doctors 

failed my father for he had been seeing a doctor who referred him to a lung specialist only too 

late. Everything slowed down around me. Nothing has been the same since. It was distressful 

to read Sagan's words that "cancer victims make pilgrimages to the Philippines, where 'psychic 

1268

surgeons,' having palmed bits of chicken liver or goat heart, pretend to reach into the patient's 

innards and withdraw the diseased tissue, which is then triumphantly displayed." 

I respect the work of James Randi in Sagan's chapter on "Obsessed with Reality" for his work 

exposed "pretension and fraud" in what had become a business of faith healing. It's a crime to 

take advantage of some illness or state of emotional trauma. In my state of distress, I read as 

much as I could about lung cancer before my father past. After reading, Fujimura's articles, I 

realized the importance of staying in touch with what's going on in the science community. I 

now know how much science contributes in the study of diseases and bringing some level of 

support and hope, for example, to cancer patients and families. I now understand and 

appreciate long after my father's death the role of the radiation therapist and the oncologist. I 

know that someday as a future teacher, I will deal with children who have parents facing the 

threat of cancer or a child wh o is dealing with that threat. The more I grow spiritually, seek to 

know my students, and understand science's role in our 

society the better I can offer my students the support and understanding they need. I have had 

to deal with this first hand. My little brother was nine years old when our father lost the fight to 

cancer; he had emotional outbursts in school. Teachers were later surprised to learn what he 

had been through for his young years and developed a deeper level of understanding and took 

real interest in seeing that he succeeded in school. It will take for teachers to understand that 

science is not separate from our social environment to teach it with confidence, passion, and a 

concern for the future of science and how it impacts our children's lives. 


since the 1970s; it is now in the hands of molecular biologist where the DNA genetic structure 

of cancer is studied. More important, it is refreshing to see that science is collaborating with 

molecular biology, physics, chemistry, DNA technologist, protein biochemists? It is a sense of 

community that spells success and that is what I aspire to bring into the classroom. To educate 

my students on the role of science in our society, I will see to it that they understand the team 

effort it takes for scientist to answer questions and research cures for terminal diseases. My 

students will have an understanding of the social support, and laboratory space needed to 

explore and experiment, for example, the role of cancer genes or on-cogenes through visual 

and hands-on work. Where will I start? 



molecular experiments in collaboration with protein biochemist and x-ray crystallographers. 

The key word that my students will walk away understanding is the significance of 

"collaboration," which is explored in Longino's article, "Science as Social Knowledge." We 

learn that science reflects the values of its society; therefore, exclusion of women and racial 

groups reflects bad science because here science is supporting the very issues society needs 

to address. To see to it that science reflects good science, it is important that educators teach 

children how science fits into the bigger picture through hands-on activity and connecting 

science to real world situation in hopes to eliminate racial and sexual prejudices within our 

society and in the world of science. We can start by not building equa 

l confidence in both boys and girls science experience. Let's teach our children that it's about 

collaboration towards a greater good that makes the difference. Meaning it's about working 

together and building each other through teamwork and support. (Alexandra's journal #8) 





1269





Subject: Re: grab the bull by the horns.... 

Nice theory, but there is a saying: Two wrongs don't make a right. Maybe women and minority 

scientists should get together and start their own research labs. They could apply for grants using 

vague hypotheses like regular scientists do, then shock the world with their findings. Get their own 

little bandwagon going, lol. Is it doable? 

Cynthia 


Dear cohort, 

Perhaps a strong action needed to push the pendulum in the other direction. Let's put all our eggs 

in one basket and teach a few generations of 98% all females (any ethnic, color, sexual 

preference, religion, etc.) about science. Forget about the guys, let's dumb them up a bit.... 



Ann 






more often from them. Had more women been doing the research, perhaps the focus would 

have been different. Think of all the diseases that affect minorities populations, who would 

more likely focus on those diseases? 

Cynthia 




long as they're meaningful to you." Like Sagan, I wanted to belief in life after death when I 

learned that my father had cancer. I had faith that God would carry me through the difficult 

times ahead, yet felt restless and not prepared emotionally for the lost of my father. On one 

of my trips to spend time with him, I came across a book at the airport titled, "Talking to 

Heaven: A Medium's Message of Life After Death." Somehow that little book helped me 

understand that although my father was angry and physically fighting death that on a soul 

level he was ready. During that time in my life, that little book had meaning to me even 

though I am not one to believe in mediums. Sagan may have a point in saying that a 

medium is a fraud, but this fraud shared that in living in fear we cannot be in love. That m 


fear. 

1270

When I first learned of my father having cancer, I was ignorant on exactly what cancer was. 

He had a malignant tumor on his right lung from many years of welding that had 





lung specialist only too late. Everything slowed down around me. Nothing has been the 

same since. It was distressful to read Sagan's words that "cancer victims make pilgrimages 

to the Philippines, where 'psychic surgeons,' having palmed bits of chicken liver or goat 

heart, pretend to reach into the patient's innards and withdraw the diseased tissue, which is 

then triumphantly displayed." 




distress, I read as much as I could about lung cancer before my father past. After reading, 

Fujimura's articles, I realized the importance of staying in touch with what's going on in the 

science community. I now know how much science contributes in the study of diseases and 

bringing some level of support and hope, for example, to cancer patients and families. I 

now understand and appreciate long after my father's death the role of the radiation 

therapist and the oncologist. I know that someday as a future teacher, I will deal with 

children who have parents facing the threat of cancer or a child wh o is dealing with that 

threat. The more I grow spiritually, seek to know my students, and understand science's 

role in our 

society the better I can offer my students the support and understanding they need. I have 

had to deal with this first hand. My little brother was nine years old when our father lost the 

fight to cancer; he had emotional outbursts in school. Teachers were later surprised to 

learn what he had been through for his young years and developed a deeper level of 

understanding and took real interest in seeing that he succeeded in school. It will take for 

teachers to understand that science is not separate from our social environment to teach it 

with confidence, passion, and a concern for the future of science and how it impacts our 

children's lives. 






bring into the classroom. To educate my students on the role of science in our society, I will 

see to it that they understand the team effort it takes for scientist to answer questions and 

research cures for terminal diseases. My students will have an understanding of the social 

support, and laboratory space needed to explore and experiment, for example, the role of 

cancer genes or on-cogenes through visual and hands-on work. Where will I start? 


advancement without society's support and commercial investments for funding, for 

example, molecular experiments in collaboration with protein biochemist and x-ray 


significance of "collaboration," which is explored in Longino's article, "Science as Social 

Knowledge." We learn that science reflects the values of its society; therefore, exclusion of 

women and racial groups reflects bad science because here science is supporting the very 

issues society needs to address. To see to it that science reflects good science, it is 

important that educators teach children how science fits into the bigger picture through 

hands-on activity and connecting science to real world situation in hopes to eliminate racial 

and sexual prejudices within our society and in the world of science. We can start by not 

building equa 

1271

l confidence in both boys and girls science experience. Let's teach our children that it's 

about collaboration towards a greater good that makes the difference. Meaning it's about 

working together and building each other through teamwork and support. (Alexandra's 

journal #8) 







1272










Cynthia 


Dear cohort, 






Ann 









Cynthia 














fear. 

1273























role in our 






























building equa 

1274




journal #8) 







1275










Cynthia 


Dear cohort, 






Ann 









Cynthia 














fear. 

1276























role in our 






























building equa 

1277




journal #8) 







1278




To: Icp-F@csusm.edu 

Subject: A Note From foxy Cleopatra 

Hey there, 

This is Ann's peanut, "Foxy Cleopatra", 

She has chosen not to talk about this topic any longer due to public opinion, but I overheard her sadly 

commenting to herself about all of talk about weddings and such on the list serve. She was saying 

how sad and unfair it is for the part of society that is not allowed to plan for such joyous events and 

how they have to watch silently on the sidelines as others who get to celebrate and be proud .... 

Foxy 



1279






Cynthia, 

Good in theory (is it doable- let's run it by legal 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/32.gif), but as long as the "Big Men's Club" is in 

charge, they screen what goes past them. 

Ann 






Cynthia 


Dear cohort, 

Perhaps a strong action needed to push the pendulum in the other direction. Let's put all our 

eggs in one basket and teach a few generations of 98% all females (any ethnic, color, sexual 




Ann 



When these people are excluded, scientific matters that important to them are also 

excluded. Take heart attacks for instance. The male dominated scientific community for 

years focused on "heart attacks and men", ignoring the fact that many women have them 

too, and even may die more often from them. Had more women been doing the research, 

perhaps the focus would have been different. Think of all the diseases that affect minorities 

populations, who would more likely focus on those diseases? 

Cynthia 




long as they're meaningful to you." Like Sagan, I wanted to belief in life after death 

1280

when I learned that my father had cancer. I had faith that God would carry me through 

the difficult times ahead, yet felt restless and not prepared emotionally for the lost of my 

father. On one of my trips to spend time with him, I came across a book at the airport 

titled, "Talking to Heaven: A Medium's Message of Life After Death." Somehow that little 

book helped me understand that although my father was angry and physically fighting 

death that on a soul level he was ready. During that time in my life, that little book had 

meaning to me even though I am not one to believe in mediums. Sagan may have a 

point in saying that a medium is a fraud, but this fraud shared that in living in fear we 

cannot be in love. That m 

essage was important because I wanted to live my final days with my father in love and 

not fear. 

When I first learned of my father having cancer, I was ignorant on exactly what cancer 

was. He had a malignant tumor on his right lung from many years of welding that had 

metastasized through his body. I remember crying and not understanding why the 

doctors could not remove the bad lung and remove the cancer. Little did I know the role 

of science working in the shadows? I felt alone and knowledge always seemed to arrive 

one day too late. The doctors failed my father for he had been seeing a doctor who 

referred him to a lung specialist only too late. Everything slowed down around me. 

Nothing has been the same since. It was distressful to read Sagan's words that "cancer 

victims make pilgrimages to the Philippines, where 'psychic surgeons,' having palmed 

bits of chicken liver or goat heart, pretend to reach into the patient's innards and 

withdraw the diseased tissue, which is then triumphantly displayed." 


work exposed "pretension and fraud" in what had become a business of faith healing. 

It's a crime to take advantage of some illness or state of emotional trauma. In my state 

of distress, I read as much as I could about lung cancer before my father past. After 

reading, Fujimura's articles, I realized the importance of staying in touch with what's 

going on in the science community. I now know how much science contributes in the 

study of diseases and bringing some level of support and hope, for example, to cancer 

patients and families. I now understand and appreciate long after my father's death the 

role of the radiation therapist and the oncologist. I know that someday as a future 

teacher, I will deal with children who have parents facing the threat of cancer or a child 

wh o is dealing with that threat. The more I grow spiritually, seek to know my students, 

and understand science's role in our 


have had to deal with this first hand. My little brother was nine years old when our father 

lost the fight to cancer; he had emotional outbursts in school. Teachers were later 

surprised to learn what he had been through for his young years and developed a 

deeper level of understanding and took real interest in seeing that he succeeded in 

school. It will take for teachers to understand that science is not separate from our 

social environment to teach it with confidence, passion, and a concern for the future of 

science and how it impacts our children's lives. 

From Fujimura's article, I have learned how far science has come in the research of 

cancer since the 1970s; it is now in the hands of molecular biologist where the DNA 

genetic structure of cancer is studied. More important, it is refreshing to see that science 

is collaborating with molecular biology, physics, chemistry, DNA technologist, protein 


bring into the classroom. To educate my students on the role of science in our society, I 

will see to it that they understand the team effort it takes for scientist to answer 

questions and research cures for terminal diseases. My students will have an 

understanding of the social support, and laboratory space needed to explore and 

experiment, for example, the role of cancer genes or on-cogenes through visual and 

hands-on work. Where will I start? 

1281






Knowledge." We learn that science reflects the values of its society; therefore, exclusion 

of women and racial groups reflects bad science because here science is supporting 

the very issues society needs to address. To see to it that science reflects good 

science, it is important that educators teach children how science fits into the bigger 

picture through hands-on activity and connecting science to real world situation in hopes 

to eliminate racial and sexual prejudices within our society and in the world of science. 

We can start by not building equa 


about collaboration towards a greater good that makes the difference. Meaning it's 

about working together and building each other through teamwork and support. 

(Alexandra's journal #8) 









1282





Subject: PHYSICS MIDTERM 

Attachments: Fall 2003 Midterm Exam.doc 

Fall 2003 Midterm 

Exam.doc (26... 

A group of us met last night to study for the midterm. We used the old midterms that 

Prof. Karas posted on the web. We needed help mostly with the FALL 2003 midterm. Please refer 

to it when looking at the attachment. We asked Prof. Karas to go over a couple of problems that we 

had difficulty with. Please see the attached as I tried to type up and summarize what he told us. If 

this doesn't help you, please contact Prof. Karas - he is waiting for your call / e-mail! 

Good luck tomorrow. ~ Louise 

1283





Subject: Re: plastic bottles 

WOWOWOWOWOW! Guys I just gathered up so many plastic bottles for you http://cdncf.aol.com/se/smi/0201d201a5/03 

I went into the recyclables. I am hurt..... That's okay. I hope your 

new idea is great. Good luck. 

Jenny Fiala 

1284






The Big Mens Club doesn't have to know. They can use "pen names" like authors do. That way those 

evil white men won't know they are women and minorities applying for the grant money. 


Cynthia, 

Good in theory (is it doable- let's run it by legal 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/32.gif), but as long as the "Big Men's Club" is 

in charge, they screen what goes past them. 

Ann 



scientists should get together and start their own research labs. They could apply for grants 

using vague hypotheses like regular scientists do, then shock the world with their findings. Get 

their own little bandwagon going, lol. Is it doable? 

Cynthia 


Dear cohort, 

Perhaps a strong action needed to push the pendulum in the other direction. Let's put all 

our eggs in one basket and teach a few generations of 98% all females (any ethnic, color, 

sexual preference, religion, etc.) about science. Forget about the guys, let's dumb them up 

a bit.... http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif 


Ann 



When these people are excluded, scientific matters that important to them are also 

excluded. Take heart attacks for instance. The male dominated scientific community for 

years focused on "heart attacks and men", ignoring the fact that many women 

have them too, and even may die more often from them. Had more women been doing 

the research, perhaps the focus would have been different. Think of all the diseases 

that affect minorities populations, who would more likely focus on those diseases? 

Cynthia 

1285



beginning that caught my attention, "It doesn't matter whether beliefs are true or not, 

as long as they're meaningful to you." Like Sagan, I wanted to belief in life after 

death when I learned that my father had cancer. I had faith that God would carry me 

through the difficult times ahead, yet felt restless and not prepared emotionally for 

the lost of my father. On one of my trips to spend time with him, I came across a 

book at the airport titled, "Talking to Heaven: A Medium's Message of Life After 

Death." Somehow that little book helped me understand that although my father was 

angry and physically fighting death that on a soul level he was ready. During that 

time in my life, that little book had meaning to me even though I am not one to 

believe in mediums. Sagan may have a point in saying that a medium is a fraud, but 

this fraud shared that in living in fear we cannot be in love. That m 

essage was important because I wanted to live my final days with my father in love 

and not fear. 

When I first learned of my father having cancer, I was ignorant on exactly what 

cancer was. He had a malignant tumor on his right lung from many years of welding 

that had metastasized through his body. I remember crying and not understanding 

why the doctors could not remove the bad lung and remove the cancer. Little did I 

know the role of science working in the shadows? I felt alone and knowledge always 

seemed to arrive one day too late. The doctors failed my father for he had been 

seeing a doctor who referred him to a lung specialist only too late. Everything slowed 

down around me. Nothing has been the same since. It was distressful to read 

Sagan's words that "cancer victims make pilgrimages to the Philippines, where 

'psychic surgeons,' having palmed bits of chicken liver or goat heart, pretend to 

reach into the patient's innards and withdraw the diseased tissue, which is then 

triumphantly displayed." 

I respect the work of James Randi in Sagan's chapter on "Obsessed with Reality" for 

his work exposed "pretension and fraud" in what had become a business of faith 

healing. It's a crime to take advantage of some illness or state of emotional trauma. 

In my state of distress, I read as much as I could about lung cancer before my father 

past. After reading, Fujimura's articles, I realized the importance of staying in touch 

with what's going on in the science community. I now know how much science 

contributes in the study of diseases and bringing some level of support and hope, for 

example, to cancer patients and families. I now understand and appreciate long after 

my father's death the role of the radiation therapist and the oncologist. I know that 

someday as a future teacher, I will deal with children who have parents facing the 

threat of cancer or a child wh o is dealing with that threat. The more I grow 

spiritually, seek to know my students, and understand science's role in our 


have had to deal with this first hand. My little brother was nine years old when our 

father lost the fight to cancer; he had emotional outbursts in school. Teachers were 

later surprised to learn what he had been through for his young years and developed 

a deeper level of understanding and took real interest in seeing that he succeeded in 

school. It will take for teachers to understand that science is not separate from our 

social environment to teach it with confidence, passion, and a concern for the future 

of science and how it impacts our children's lives. 

From Fujimura's article, I have learned how far science has come in the research of 

cancer since the 1970s; it is now in the hands of molecular biologist where the DNA 

genetic structure of cancer is studied. More important, it is refreshing to see that 

science is collaborating with molecular biology, physics, chemistry, DNA 

1286

technologist, protein biochemists? It is a sense of community that spells success 

and that is what I aspire to bring into the classroom. To educate my students on the 

role of science in our society, I will see to it that they understand the team effort it 

takes for scientist to answer questions and research cures for terminal diseases. My 

students will have an understanding of the social support, and laboratory space 

needed to explore and experiment, for example, the role of cancer genes or oncogenes 

through visual and hands-on work. Where will I start? 

First of all, my students will understand that not much is possible in the way of 

science advancement without society's support and commercial investments for 

funding, for example, molecular experiments in collaboration with protein biochemist 

and x-ray crystallographers. The key word that my students will walk away 

understanding is the significance of "collaboration," which is explored in Longino's 

article, "Science as Social Knowledge." We learn that science reflects the values of 

its society; therefore, exclusion of women and racial groups reflects bad science 

because here science is supporting the very issues society needs to address. To 

see to it that science reflects good science, it is important that educators teach 

children how science fits into the bigger picture through hands-on activity and 

connecting science to real world situation in hopes to eliminate racial and sexual 

prejudices within our society and in the world of science. We can start by not 

building equa 

l confidence in both boys and girls science experience. Let's teach our children that 

it's about collaboration towards a greater good that makes the difference. Meaning 

it's about working together and building each other through teamwork and support. 












1287





Subject: Re: jenny 

im sooo sorry jenny, i thought i would have put a stop to the efforts, i tried to hurry as 

soon as i knew we werent gonna do the bottle thing. thank you so much for helping us! 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/16 Tue PM 02:14:52 PST 


> Subject: Re: plastic bottles 

> 

> WOWOWOWOWOW! Guys I just gathered up so many plastic bottles for you I went 

> into the recyclables. I am hurt..... That's okay. I hope your new idea is 

> great. Good luck. 

> Jenny Fiala 

> 

> 


1288




To: listserve 

Subject: limitations of our language 

i found pam's comment about the limitations of 

language in our society very interesting. it is true, 

we do not have ways of describing and sharing certain 

experiences, feelings, and visions that we all have as 

part of the human experience. somewhere in the gap 

between the logical mind and the intuitive mind are 

walls created by society regarding the levels of 

accepting attempts to explore and tap into the 

intuitive mind. within this gap are also the 

frustrations of individuals battling themselves and 

society because they lack ways to express clearly to 

others what exists in their intuitive minds. is this 

where the roots of religion are? can this be why love 

is so difficult to define? 

also, how do the limitations of our language affect 

the doability of science once the other areas are 

dealt with (social world, laboratory, experiment)? 

does our language limit science in some ways becasue 

of its lack of complexity and ability to communicate 

ideas, experiences, concepts, etc. that are too 

dynamic and abstract to be conceptualized using our 

language? maybe the gap between scientists and all 

the rest of us exists due to their efforts to create 

ways of communicating certain scientific 

ideas/concepts that seem foreign to the non-scientist. 

this is a very fascinating problem. 

michael 

__________________________________ 




1289




To: journal 

Subject: mitosis and meiosis 

http://www.biologyinmotion.com/cell_division/ 

Virtually walk through them here. 

Cynthia 



1290





Subject: Re: limitations of our language 

It sounds like a nomenclature problem, along with lack of background knowledge. Having language to 

decribe something won't do any good if the person it is being described to doesn't have the concept 

understanding (background) to get it in the first place. I am not so sure language has anything to do 

with it. As far as intuitive things, feeling, faith etc, Is it really necessary to describe these things? Isn't 

it really something you have to experience? Everyone is different, therefore what may be ones 

expererience, won't necessarily be someone elses. 

Cynthia 



language in our society very interesting. it is true, 

we do not have ways of describing and sharing certain 

experiences, feelings, and visions that we all have as 

part of the human experience. somewhere in the gap 

between the logical mind and the intuitive mind are 

walls created by society regarding the levels of 

accepting attempts to explore and tap into the 

intuitive mind. within this gap are also the 

frustrations of individuals battling themselves and 

society because they lack ways to express clearly to 

others what exists in their intuitive minds. is this 

where the roots of religion are? can this be why love 

is so difficult to define? 

also, how do the limitations of our language affect 

the doability of science once the other areas are 

dealt with (social world, laboratory, experim ent)? 

does our language limit science in some ways becasue 


ideas, experiences, concepts, etc. that are too 

dynamic and abstract to be conceptualized using our 

language? maybe the gap between scientists and all 

the rest of us exists due to their efforts to create 

ways of communicating certain scientific 

ideas/concepts that seem foreign to the non-scientist. 

this is a very fascinating problem. 

michael 

__________________________________ 





1291


1292





Subject: Re: Dover sole 

Here is a schema for Dove Sole: 

By David Crystal 

THE ICE MAN UNDER THE BRIDGE 

lives on moth soup 

the string keeping up his green pants 

strangled a barking dog outside the 

boarded up all night off-licence. 

For twenty years he delivered ice to fishmongers 

from the mouth of the Thames to Greenwich. 

They lived on the best salmon cuts 

lobster on her birthday Dover sole for his. 

He never accepted the Doctor's prognosis 

and when his beloved wife died 

he packed her body in bed with ice 

kissed her brow like always 

left a note for the milkman 

and gently as ever, closed the front door. 


“My schema for a baseball game leads me to expect that I will spend around 3 

hours at the ballpark, and that if I eat there my dinner will be hot dogs 

and soda, not Dover sole” (Bruer pg. 26) 

I’m sure all of us have a schema for baseball, ballpark, dinner, hot dogs, 

and soda. But, does anyone have a schema for Dover sole? I know I didn’t 

and I am curious to see if anyone else does. 

I was reading through chapter 2 trying to make sense of how our minds work 

and it’s similarities to computers. I get to the associative structures and 

learn that they help us make predictions. Schemas are a way we link 

concepts in long-term memory. Ok, sorta maybe makes sense. Bruer uses an 

example to help the understanding of this. He starts talking about baseball 

and hotdogs, which I know. I have prior knowledge on this stuff. Bruer 

says, “prior kn owledge affects how we interpret school instruction and thus 

affects what we can learn”(pg. 28). So prior knowledge is important in 

learning because it affects what we can learn. So his example was great, I 

was learning, but then at the end he throws in Dover sole. I read this and 

lost all concentration and all learning that was taking place was lost. 

What is Dover sole and how does it relate to hot dogs and sodas? I did look 

it up and found the meaning. Which made me mad because here was a chance 

for Bruer to assist in the understanding of a concept then blew it with the 

addition of an uncommon word. Why did he use this word? The conclusion I 

came up with was either I need a larger vocabulary or he has too big of one. 

1293

In either cause the teacher’s job is to assist learning by making the 

information accessible to all who hear it. In Bruers case his students are 

all who read his book. This would be a large group of people that he 

do esn’t know. So for his group of students he uses Dover sole to help their 


Sometimes I think experts let their expertise go to their head. There are 

many teachers who have expertise feel the need to show off this knowledge, 

when it is their goal to relate it to the novice. I wish more teachers 

would worry more about the novices needs than the needs to show off their 

expertise. 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 





1294




To: listserve 

Subject: Fwd: bacteria powerpoint 

Attachments: bacteria powerpoint 

bacteria powerpoint 


__________________________________ 




1295





Subject: Journal Time 

Reading through Sagan I found a quote that will not leave my mind. 

'"Those who invalidate reason ought seriously consider whether they argue 

against 

reason with or without reason; if with reason, then they establish the 

principle that they 

are laboring to dethrone; but if they argue without reason (which, in order to 

be 

consistent with themselves they must do), they are out of reach of rational 

conviction, nor 

do they deserve a rational argument"(pg. 254). 

This quote boggles my mind. Can anyone tell me what it means? I like how it 

sounds but 

I don't think I could use any other words to describe its meaning. 

Those who say reason is wrong need to consider that if they fight against it 

with their own 

reason or if they decide not to use reason at all does that make it even less 

valid to not 

use reason? How do you argue with out reason to be consistent with yourself. 

If it makes 

sense to you then isn't that your reasoning. What is reasoning? I know it is 

the basis or 

motive for an action, decision, feeling or belief. It is also an underlying 

fact or cause that 

provides logical sense for a premise or occurence. 

Does underlying fact mean a fact you make up on your own form another fact. 

Sorry this 

is so confusing. i have been strugling with this thought and quote for days 

and my mind is 

buring to figure it out. I almost have that feeling that Pam told us about the 

other day. The 

feeling that my mind is taking this quote so deep that there has not yet been 

words 

created to have this conversation yet. 

Anyways, how's everyone doing? 

i have been reading Schools for though by John Bruer. I like this book it 

makes sense to 

me and it uses words that does not make me feel like the idiot the rest of 

these readings 

make me feel. I guess thatis how our future studetns will feel when we teach 

them 

subjects that we see as simple. Remember folks to have pacients with your 

future 

students because even though we may think the curriculum is simple or obvious 

just 

think, to them it may be as diffucult to them as Fujimura, or Zeitz is to us. 

Back to Bruer have been testing out the experiment in the office where you go 

in a room 

for 35 seconds and make note of all the things in there. I realize I have 

shit for short term 

memory. I still do not understand how I can remember things from when I was 

five years 

1296

old but I connot even remember what I read on a previous page in a book. 

What's up with 

that. It is, however, amazing how we make associaltions to memorize and learn 

new 

things. Our minds are amazing that they have the power to organize 

information, kinda 

like the computer. The diagram on page 27 of Bruer shows all the connections 

we make 

with the words we already know and the world we are learning. I guess that is 

how we 

can come up with answers we did not know we knew. We tie in associations we 

know 

Example, Tweety bird is yellow and canaries are yellow therefore there is a 

great 

posiblility that tweety bird is a canary. As Mike would say I can guarantee 

that Tweety 

bird could possibly be a canary. Well if anyone can give me more feedbakc on 

the 

means of the opening quote my brain would greatly appreciate it. 

That's all Folks. 

PS- Did anyone figure out how to connect the nine dots on page 33 of Bruer. i 

looked at 

the answer in the back and I totally do not have the intellegence to figure 

that out. 

Happy St. Patricks Day. If you don't celebrate it then Happy Day. Marin 

1297





Subject: Re: Journal Time 

Reason is really unreasonable, not logical. It is making excuses. It's like justifying why you do 

something. If its the right thing to do, it needs no justification. 

An example of being reasonable: You are meeting your friend at the movies. Your friend is late. While 

you are waiting, you are coming up with all the reasons she could be late. Does it make sense to do 

this? No, because you won't know if you are right till the friend gets there and justifies her reason for 

being late, probably with a lame apology. When you think about it, it really is kind of psychotic to do 

this, but probably everyone does do it. 

Cynthia 


Reading through Sagan I found a quote that will not leave my mind. 

'"Those who invalidate reason ought seriously consider whether they argue 

against 

reason with or without reason; if with reason, then they establish the 

principle that they 

are laboring to dethrone; but if they argue without reason (which, in order to 

be 

consistent with themselves they must do), they are out of reach of rational 

conviction, nor 

do they deserve a rational argument"(pg. 254). 

This quote boggles my mind. Can anyone tell me what it means? I like how it 

sounds but 

I don't think I could use any other words to describe its meaning. 

Those who say reason is wrong need to consider that if they fight against it 

with their own 

reason or if they decide not to use reason at all does that make it even less 

valid to not 

use reason? How do you argue with out reason to be consistent with yourself. 

If it makes 

sense to you then isn't that your reasoning. What is reasoning? I know it is 

the basis or 

motive for an action, decision, feeling or belief. It is also an underlying 

fact or cause that 

provides logical sense for a premise or occurence. 

Does underlying fact mean a fact you make up on your own form another fact. 

Sorry this 

is so confusing. i have been strugling with this thought and quote for days 

and my mind is 

buring to figure it out. I almost have that feeling that Pam told us about the 

other day. The 

1298

feeling that my mind is taking this quote so deep that there has not yet been 

words 

created to have this conversation yet. 

Anyways, how's everyone doing? 

i have been reading Schools for though by John Bruer. I like this book it 

makes sense to 

me and it uses words that does not make me feel like the idiot the rest of 

these re adings 

make me feel. I guess thatis how our future studetns will feel when we teach 

them 

subjects that we see as simple. Remember folks to have pacients with your 

future 

students because even though we may think the curriculum is simple or obvious 

just 

think, to them it may be as diffucult to them as Fujimura, or Zeitz is to us. 

Back to Bruer have been testing out the experiment in the office where you go 

in a room 

for 35 seconds and make note of all the things in there. I realize I have 

shit for short term 

memory. I still do not understand how I can remember things from when I was 

five years 

old but I connot even remember what I read on a previous page in a book. 

What's up with 

that. It is, however, amazing how we make associaltions to memorize and learn 

new 

things. Our minds are amazing that they have the power to organize 

information, kinda 

like the computer. The diagram on page 27 of Bruer shows all the connections 

we make 

with the words we already know and the world we are learning. I guess that is 

how we 

can come up with answers we did not know we knew. We tie in associations we 

know 

Example, Tweety bird is yellow and canaries are yellow therefore there is a 

great 

posiblility that tweety bird is a canary. As Mike would say I can guarantee 

that Tweety 

bird could possibly be a canary. Well if anyone can give me more feedbakc on 

the 

means of the opening quote my brain would greatly appreciate it. 

That's all Folks. 

PS- Did anyone figure out how to connect the nine dots on page 33 of Bruer. i 

looked at 

the answer in the back and I totally do not have the intellegence to figure 

that out. 

Happy St. Patricks Day. If you don't celebrate it then Happy Day. Marin 



1299

1300






Well, today I actually had some time to read the articles and chapters of our 

reading. So I'm sorry for the length of this email. I just had a lot things to 

discuss. 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

Sagan, my favorite author (not!). He and Hunt both mentioned Newton and how as 

a society we seem to be like Newton and have a limited world view of things. 

So they are saying that we should stop thinking this way, and try to expand 

your world. 

What bugged me is when Sagan said, "we go through life with the deck stacked 

against us and then we die, and that's it? Nothing but a dreamless and endless 

sleep?...Shouldn't we have a second chance on a level playing field?" If I 

were there I would tell Sagan that God did give us a chance to be good on 

Earth when there was the Garden of Eden. But since Adam and Eve fell into sin, 

then the world changed and sin came upon the world. In order to get a "second 

chance" I would ask what about eternal life in Heaven. In Heaven it will 

definitely be a "level playing field" because there will be no worries, no 

sadness, or anything else that is bad or sinful. 

The quote saying that "life was not reducible to the laws of physics and 

chemistry" according to religious/philosophical people should explain to the 

reader that because scientists need physical proof in order to believe in 

something, while religious people can just believe in it because the Bible 

says so and the have faith in it. 

Lastly, he pretty asks the reader what is the point of prayer if God already 

knows what you going to ask for, or that he already knows what will happen in 

this world. I would have to say that praying is a heart to heart talk with 

God, and that He wants to hear from you. By praynig to God you are showing how 

much you have faith in Him. 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

Bruer, to me, said that human minds and computers both use the same data 

points/processes to get a similar result. Which I think is interesting because 

I sometimes admit that I think like I'm doing a word document out of microsoft 

word because when I'm thinking about something or writing out something by 

hand, I might want to simply just hit the undo key instead of having to erase 

what I just wrote or rethink about what I was just thinking. Does this make 

sense to anyone. If not, I know it may sound confusing for the first time. 

Bruer puts it like this. "The human mind can be described as a computing 

device that builds and executes production-system programs." 

I like the fact that proper instruction helps children to aquire better rules, 

which then allows them to use the better rules to help them learn. Pretty easy 

formula right there! With this formula, Bruer points out that "representations 

are the symbolic links between the external environment and out internal, 

mental environment." So help kids learn with symbols and the use of symbols, 

because it will help them learn a concept or subject matter easier. Believe it 

or not, the same author brings up something else we as future teachers can 

use, and that is the same idea of scaffolding which to him is, "Prior 

knowledge influences what we notice and how we interpret new experiences" and 

how it "affects what we can learn". 

One thing that definitely impacted the way I will teach someday is that 

"working memory can hold and process only a limited amount of information, and 

that for only a short periods of time". Therefore, my teaching should have 

1301

enough informational material in it, but I must realize that my students will 

have a short atttention span. So I will learn to arrange and construct my 

lessons accordingly. 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

Hunt had said that people who have more fair, simpler, and coherent beliefs-or 

faith- have rejected scientific knowledge. This fact is not true to me, 

because like I had said since day one of what I thought of science. We needed 

the new scientific discoveries in our society, but at the same time I don;t 

believe in what everything science would tell me. So the fact of the matter 

is, I know what to and what not to believe in scientific knowledge. 

I think Glass' meta-analysis is interesting. The steps of formulating the 

problem, colleting data, evaluating the data, snythesizing the data, and later 

presenting the findings has made me to think of our similar the scientific 

method is to this process. The perfect quote from the passsage to describe the 

meta-anaylsis is that "to bring order out of choas." 

Both Hunt and Bruer seem to talk about meta-anylsis as the same way because 

you must get data from others and then put it together to find a 

result/conclusion. 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

Laurie :) 

1302






Here is my thought on why computers and people work in a similar manner: People designed 

computers. 

In regards to meta-analysis and bringing order to chaos: Could this be applied to entropy? 

Before I read the meta-analysis article, I read something about global warming. I was reading it to 

look for examples of the other article assignment about scientists working for political purposes or 

their own interests ( sorry don't remember the name of the article). Global warming is a very good 

example. They have refigured the data on that a million times. As technology advances, they look at 

more things in an attempt to find out which theory is more factual. There are all kinds of conflicting 

studies they are trying to make sense of, and meta-analysis seems to be a good way to draw a 

reasonable (lol) conclusion. 

Cynthia 


Well, today I actually had some time to read the articles and chapters of our 

reading. So I'm sorry for the length of this email. I just had a lot things to 

discuss. 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

Sagan, my favorite author (not!). He and Hunt both mentioned Newton and how as 

a society we seem to be like Newton and have a limited world view of things. 

So they are saying that we should stop thinking this way, and try to expand 

your world. 

What bugged me is when Sagan said, "we go through life with the deck stacked 

against us and then we die, and that's it? Nothing but a dreamless and endless 

sleep?...Shouldn't we have a second chance on a level playing field?" If I 

were there I would tell Sagan that God did give us a chance to be good on 

Earth when there was the Garden of Eden. But sin ce Adam and Eve fell into sin, 

then the world changed and sin came upon the world. In order to get a "second 

chance" I would ask what about eternal life in Heaven. In Heaven it will 

definitely be a "level playing field" because there will be no worries, no 

sadness, or anything else that is bad or sinful. 

The quote saying that "life was not reducible to the laws of physics and 

chemistry" according to religious/philosophical people should explain to the 

reader that because scientists need physical proof in order to believe in 

something, while religious people can just believe in it because the Bible 

says so and the have faith in it. 

Lastly, he pretty asks the reader what is the point of prayer if God already 

knows what you going to ask for, or that he already knows what will happen in 

this world. I would have to say that praying is a heart to heart talk with 

God, and that He wants to hear from you. By praynig to God you are sho wing how 

much you have faith in Him. 

1303

--------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

Bruer, to me, said that human minds and computers both use the same data 

points/processes to get a similar result. Which I think is interesting because 

I sometimes admit that I think like I'm doing a word document out of microsoft 

word because when I'm thinking about something or writing out something by 

hand, I might want to simply just hit the undo key instead of having to erase 

what I just wrote or rethink about what I was just thinking. Does this make 

sense to anyone. If not, I know it may sound confusing for the first time. 

Bruer puts it like this. "The human mind can be described as a computing 

device that builds and executes production-system programs." 

I like the fact that proper instruction helps children to aquire better rules, 

which then allows them to use the better rules to help them learn. Pretty easy 

formula right there! With this formula, Bruer points out that "representations 

are the symbolic links between the external environment and out internal, 

mental environment." So help kids learn with symbols and the use of symbols, 

because it will help them learn a concept or subject matter easier. Believe it 

or not, the same author brings up something else we as future teachers can 

use, and that is the same idea of scaffolding which to him is, "Prior 

knowledge influences what we notice and how we interpret new experiences" and 

how it "affects what we can learn". 

One thing that definitely impacted the way I will teach someday is that 

"working memory can hold and process only a limited amount of information, and 

that for only a short periods of time". Therefore, my teaching should have 

enough informational material in it, but I must realize that my students will 

have a short atttention span. So I will learn to arrange and c onstruct my 

lessons accordingly. 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

Hunt had said that people who have more fair, simpler, and coherent beliefs-or 

faith- have rejected scientific knowledge. This fact is not true to me, 

because like I had said since day one of what I thought of science. We needed 

the new scientific discoveries in our society, but at the same time I don;t 

believe in what everything science would tell me. So the fact of the matter 

is, I know what to and what not to believe in scientific knowledge. 

I think Glass' meta-analysis is interesting. The steps of formulating the 

problem, colleting data, evaluating the data, snythesizing the data, and later 

presenting the findings has made me to think of our similar the scientific 

method is to this process. The perfect quote from the passsage to describe the 

meta-anaylsis is that "to bring order out of choas." 

Both Hunt and Bruer seem to talk about meta-anylsis as the same way because 

you must get data from others and then put it together to find a 

result/conclusion. 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

Laurie :) 


1304


1305






i see the point being made that if somebody doesn't 

have the background knowledge then they would have 

trouble understanding a concept. but what about the 

scientists who are frustrated and are discussing the 

limitations of language in their field? regardless of 

being able to explain something to a novice, 

non-scientist, what it seems that pam was getting at 

was the overall limitations that language poses for 

the field of science in general. what is interesting 

is how that may affect the development of new ideas 

and the ability to explain/describe new and even more 

complex ideas and events if nothing in our language 

even comes close to what it is they are trying to 

describe? or because language does not exist to 

describe ideas/events at certain complex levels, does 

that put a cap on where current thinking can go? it 

fosters a curiosity about the evolution of language, 

how language changes in different groups and for 

different purposes. based on the snippet of what pam 

was talking about: if scientists are limited by the 

language that exists, then the development of language 

capable of communicating the complexities of science 

that are incompatable with existing language, and if 

in fact development of new ideas are inhibited/related 

to language, then they are ultimately connected to 

those who make action to change and create new 

language. then we have to wonder, who is changing 

language? 

regarding the intuitive experiences and ideas and 

being able to communicate them to others, true, they 

are all personal and unique things we all experience 

as humans. the statement that they are personal and 

unique to each of us is a wonderfully valid reason to 

communicate them to others, as doing so adds so much 

to strengthen connections with others and the process 

of building understanding. relating the intuitive 

thoughts, experiences, and visions to science, by 

sharing these things with others we are adding to the 

web of input data on the human/intellectual level, 

which can be connected to ideas from the logical mind 

and create completely new avenues of thought. 

resistance to sharing and accepting ideas about 

spirituality, abstract thought, and so on are a result 

of the society we live in, one that values ideas, 

language, and products of the logical mind, with the 

places accepted in society for products of the 

intuitive mind limited to artists, "new-agey people", 

and wierdos. 


> It sounds like a nomenclature problem, along with 

> lack of background knowledge. Having language to 

> decribe something won't do any good if the person it 

> is being described to doesn't have the concept 

1306

understanding (background) to get it in the first 

> place. I am not so sure language has anything to do 

> with it. As far as intuitive things, feeling, faith 

> etc, Is it really necessary to describe these 

> things? Isn't it really something you have to 

> experience? Everyone is different, therefore what 

> may be ones expererience, won't necessarily be 

> someone elses. 

> Cynthia 

> 

> Michael Renner wrote: 

> i found pam's comment about the limitations of 

> language in our society very interesting. it is 

> true, 

> we do not have ways of describing and sharing 

> certain 

> experiences, feelings, and visions that we all have 

> as 

> part of the human experience. somewhere in the gap 

> between the logical mind and the intuitive mind are 

> walls created by society regarding the levels of 

> accepting attempts to explore and tap into the 

> intuitive mind. within this gap are also the 

> frustrations of individuals battling themselves and 

> society because they lack ways to express clearly to 

> others what exists in their intuitive minds. is this 

> where the roots of religion are? can this be why 

> love 

> is so difficult to define? 

> also, how do the limitations of our language affect 

> the doability of science once the other areas are 

> dealt with (social world, laboratory, experiment)? 

> does our language limit science in some ways becasue 

> of its lack of complexity and ability to communicate 

> ideas, experiences, concepts, etc. that are too 

> dynamic and abstract to be conceptualized using our 

> language? maybe the gap between scientists and all 

> the rest of us exists due to their efforts to create 

> ways of communicating certain scientific 

> ideas/concepts that seem foreign to the 

> non-scientist. 

> this is a very fascinating problem. 

> michael 

> 

> __________________________________ 



> http://mail.yahoo.com 

> 

> 



__________________________________ 




1307






I see what you are saying, Michael. I just am not aware of the fact that people find our language 

limiting. Since it is only one way of communicating, I probably wouldn't expect it to cover every 

thought and feeling. I am sure this is a very narrow viewpoint. I was sort of waiting for Pam to tell us 

what language was "the one", but if it doesn't exist, what should we do? Make up a new one? Doesn't 

society make up new words to go with new ideas? Isn't this how our language evolves? Guess I just 

didn't see the point to begin with. Cynthia 


















fosters a curi osity about the evolution of language, 











language? 









1308












and wierdos. 






> understanding (background) to get it in the first 








> Cynthia 

> 


> i found pam's comment about the limitations of 


> true, 


> certain 


> as 










> love 






1309










> michael 

> 

> __________________________________ 




> 

> 



__________________________________ 






1310




To: journal 

Subject: mitosis animation 

This is a good website. Great animation and explanations, just in case anyone is still working on this 

assignment, or didn't quite understand it. 

Cynthia 

This came in the Riverdeep newsletter I get emailed to me. Great source for lots of education stuff. 



1311





Subject: Re: mitosis animation 

what is the website? 

1312





Subject: Re: mitosis animation 

Sorry, did i forget the link? My brain must be fried tonight. Here it is. 

http://www.cellsalive.com/mitosis.htm 


what is the website? 



1313




To: journal 

Subject: new twist on global warming 

This is a fascinating article on global warming. Another new theory that should prove to be very 

interesting to watch. I know its a bit long, but read it anyway. Toward the end of the article, the author 

makes a connection to large-scale deaths due to the black plague and small pox. Cynthia 

Early warming (from the Union Tribune, Quest section) 

http://www.signonsandiego.com/images/black.gif 

The origins of human-influenced climate change may be traced back 5,000 years 

By Richard Lovett 

March 17, 2004 

http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20040317/images/2004-03-17climate.jpg 

• Quest for learning 

Global warming is usually presumed to be a modern problem: a byproduct of the Industrial Revolution 

and its intensive use of carbon dioxide-producing fossil fuels. But humans have been changing the 

earth's climate for thousands of years, says William Ruddiman, an emeritus professor of 

environmental sciences from the University of Virginia. And the changes have been substantial. 

Even before the start of the industrial era, Ruddiman says, our ancestors may have warmed the globe 

sufficiently to stave off a new ice age. 

Ice ages are caused by variations in the Earth's orbit that alter the amount of sunlight reaching 

Canada, Siberia and Alaska during the brief arctic summer. During high-sunlight cycles, there's 

enough warmth to melt the previous winter's snows. During cold cycles, there isn't, and the snow 

gradually accumulates into glaciers. 

Graphic: 

Early warming 

These orbital variations occur in well-understood, long-term cycles. But the climate is also affected by 

cyclical changes in the atmospheric levels of two important greenhouse gases, carbon dioxide and 

methane, which trap solar heat that would otherwise radiate back into space. 

Methane is produced when vegetation decays beneath swamps and marshes. Scientists can use ice 

cores from Greenland and Antarctica to measure the amount of methane in the atmosphere during 

the past 400,000 years. These studies indicate that during eras when the Northern Hemisphere 

receives weaker summer sunlight, swamps and marshes shrink. In eras when solar energy is higher, 

rainfall increases and marshes expand. 

1314

Based on the pattern of prior cycles, methane levels should have reached a peak 11,000 years ago 

and been dropping ever since. But the Greenlandic ice cores show that 5,000 years ago, something 

went awry, and methane levels began to rise. 

"You have to throw 395,000 years of history out the window to come up with a natural explanation for 

this," Ruddiman said in San Francisco last December, at a meeting of the American Geophysical 

Union. 

His not-so-natural alternative? 

Five thousand years ago was just about the time people started creating artificial marshes to grow 

rice in Southeast Asia. 

By 2,000 years ago, rice farmers had already used up the flat land of the valleys and were beginning 

to build the hillside terraces we see today, releasing more and more methane as more paddies were 

built. 

At the same time, something was increasing the atmospheric content of carbon dioxide. The 

Greenlandic and Antarctic ice cores show that carbon dioxide levels fluctuate on natural cycles of 

22,000, 41,000 and 100,000 years. According to these patterns, carbon dioxide, like methane, should 

have reached a peak 11,000 years ago and dropped ever since. 

But it, too, dropped for only the first half of that cycle, then started to rebound – so much so that at the 

start of the industrial age, the level was already 15 percent "too" high. 

Previous scientists have posited various natural theories for the reversal of carbon dioxide levels. 

One theory is that changes in ocean chemistry are causing the seas to disgorge large quantities of 

previously absorbed carbon dioxide. Another is that it is due to a natural decline in forests, which 

remove large quantities of carbon dioxide from the air to form branches, leaves, bark and roots. When 

forests die, all of that stored carbon dioxide is returned to the air. 

But Ruddiman suggests that humans might be the cause. Studies of pollen particles trapped in lakebed 

sediments allow scientists to trace the spread of wheat, peas, lentils, flax and barley across 

regions that were naturally forest. As far back as 10,000 years ago, he says, people were beginning 

to cut down forests to make room for farming. 

These facts may have been overlooked by climate modelers, but they are well-known to historical 

geographers. In 1989, Ian G. Simmons of the University of Durham, England, wrote that by 2,000 

years ago, large segments of Southeast Asia, China, Southwestern Asia and the Mediterranean 

region were "greatly" deforested. 

And in a 2003 book, "Deforesting the Earth," Oxford geography professor Michael Williams reported 

that humans were already cutting down European forests 6,000 years ago, and that American Indians 

were clearing forests in the Mississippi River Valley as far back as 7,000 years ago to plant squash, 

sunflowers, maize and beans. 

"Most of Eurasia was deforested by the time of Christ," Ruddiman says. 

Counting trees 

In an effort to quantify the amount of preindustrial deforestation, Ruddiman turned to the Domesday 

Book, a census of Britain conducted by William the Conqueror in 1086 A.D. In addition to counting 

1315

people, William's census takers tallied the extent of forests, fields and pastures. According to figures 

in the Domesday Book, the 1.5 million people then living in England had already cut down 85 percent 

of their nation's trees. 

Extrapolating these per-capita land-clearing figures to the 57 million people living in China a thousand 

years earlier, plus the millions more in India, Southeast Asia and the Roman Empire, Ruddiman 

calculates that 2,000 years ago, deforestation was already quite extensive. 

Already, he says, tree cutting had released 700 to 900 billion tons of carbon dioxide to the air – 

enough to offset the natural decline and start driving levels of the gas back up again, thousands of 

years before anyone was using significant quantities of coal or oil. 

All of that carbon dioxide, Ruddiman adds, would warm the Earth by about 1.4 degrees – roughly the 

same amount that industrial-era emissions are believed to have warned it to date (but not by as much 

as today's emissions are expected to warm it in the future). 

How plague played in 

The effect, he says, is stronger at high latitudes – strong enough that climate models show that if 

people hadn't cut down so many trees, ice sheets might again be forming in parts of Canada such as 

Labrador and Baffin Island. 

Ruddiman backs up his tree-cutting theory by pointing to several dips in the atmospheric level of 

carbon dioxide that occurred over the past 2,000 years. None was large – only a few parts per million 

– but they appear to be too large to be explained by natural factors such as volcanic emissions. 

One of these dips occurred during the height of the Roman Empire. Another occurred in the 1400s, 

and a third occurred between 1500 and 1750 A.D. All of these, he says, link to periods when plagues 

killed off sizable fractions of the world's population. 

The first occurred at a time when bubonic plague killed 20 million people in China and the Roman 

Empire. The second correlates to the Black Death, which killed one-third of the people of Europe in its 

first year alone. The third was during an era when 90 percent of the 50 million to 120 million people 

living in Central and South America died of smallpox, measles and other European diseases, the 

single largest mass mortality in history. 

When that many people die, farms are abandoned and trees grow back quickly enough to take 

significant amounts of carbon dioxide back out of the air. 

Historical accounts of the Black Death, Ruddiman says, are full of stories about millions of abandoned 

farms. "These accounts don't give numbers of farms or acreage," he says, "but it's immense." 

Ralph Keeling, a professor of geochemistry at UCSD's Scripps Institution of Oceanography in La 

Jolla, says that confirmation of Ruddiman's theory will await the drilling of ice cores going back more 

than 400,000 years. 

That's because astronomical factors make our current interglacial period more akin to one that 

occurred slightly too early to show up on today's oldest cores. If that earlier warm spell shows the 

same methane and carbon dioxide anomalies we see in the past 8,000 years, then the cause is 

natural, and Ruddiman's theory goes down the drain. 

"He's making an appealing argument that is at least plausible," Keeling says, "but it could turn out to 

be wrong as we get better evidence." 

1316

Ruddiman admits that his thesis is controversial, referring to it as "an outrageous challenge to the 

conventional wisdom." But he also believes he's onto a previously overlooked link between history 

and climate modeling. 

"The most in-your-face statement I can make is that humans stopped a glaciation," he says. "And I 

think there's a strong case that can be made for that." 

Keeling doubts that the effect was strong enough to have staved off glaciers, but he agrees that 

Ruddiman is asking good questions. "At some level," he says, "it seems inevitable that early 

agriculture would have had an impact on the atmosphere. The question is simply how big that impact 

was." 

Richard Lovett is a freelance science writer in Portland, Ore. 



1317





Subject: Re: SCIENCE 

Chaos in science is a concept about space/time and spirituality; nothing is absolute. Out of chaos 

comes a higher order, it self-organizes. Their philosophy is that the old-school scientists had it all 

wrong. Linear problems are exceptions, not the rule as was once thought. How does all this fit in with 

our capitalistic society? As you mentioned, we have constructivist science, which builds on 

background knowledge (and bias). It is interesting that this is the approach we are being pushed to 

teach students. One student's truth might not be someone else's truth. Is it possible that by creating 

chaos through constructivism, we will eventually have more order? Will it actually all make sense if 

we succeed in creating a world of absolute chaos? Would capitalism succeed if there was no selfinterest 

among scientists and society as a whole? Is that even possible? Humans are egocentric by 

nature, even in non-capitalistic societies. They just hide their real intentions better th an free societies. 

Our understanding of the world and how it works is constantly evolving. Scientists "prove" things, only 

to be disproven. They develop a new hypothesis and try again. Self-serving reasons for research can 

stimulate interest, leading to great advances, ultimately benefiting society. It isn't necessarily a bad 

thing. 

Cynthia 


Hey class, 

Chaos in science, or the lack of conjunctions within research, may be related to its introduction into the 

capitalistic market and it’s overall profitability. The Hunt article alluded to this, although it placed the 

disclaimer that disjunction in scientific research have always been present. Constructivists view the world of 

science in terms of the people that are doing the studies; “scientific discoveries are not objective truths but 

only cultural artifacts, not representations of reality but self-serving products of the system.”(Hunt, pg6). 

So, the question that Pam posed the other day, “where do we get our science,” is very pertinent, if we come 

from a constructivist viewpoint. But, coming from a constructivist viewpoint one would see that all 

scientific research is “self-serving.” This goes back to the Longino article in which the values of the 

scientist, or rather the group that the scient ist works for, is called into to question. After thinking about 

these ideas and talking with people in the scientific community, it seems that it is not the scientist, but the 

producers and propagators of the science that apply science to values. The scientist is held up to scrutiny 

while publishing their methods and practices and are hung on a stick if there research is not reproducible 

under the same methods proposed within their methods and practices. Where as when “scientific” 

knowledge is produced and consumed within mass media, no methods are proposed. They simply state it as 

fact and thus if all is stated as fact and not an instrument in which to conduct further investigation, than 

there is going to be disjunction within the ranks of the scientific community. So instead of using science as a 

fact, one must use it as a tool to understand future developments. Therefore nothing within science should 

be seen as an absolute fact. It is within absolute facts that deception and disjunction live. Can this be applied 

to other areas, i.e. religion? Is this the reason for the use of the word faith within religion and not absolute 

truth? Can it be that understanding that nothing is absolute fact, or rather absolute truth, is the overall point 

of this class? What is the material that has been presented? How has been presented? Why has been 

presented in this way? Yamashita is always telling us to look at the our data points, but he himself is a large 

group of data points within the class. Sense or nonsense, maybe even common sense. 

1318

Robert 

_____ 

Learn how to help protect your privacy and prevent fraud online at Tech Hacks & Scams. 



1319




To: journal 

Subject: Motion in first grade 

Mike, this one is for you! 

Is this a great connection to our physics lesson or what? Did anybody think they could really 

use it in the classroom? Maybe our expectations are way too low. 

Cynthia 

Learning in Motion 

This first-grade teacher believes in trying the newest tools and techniques to engage her students 

and help them learn. 

by Kathleen D. Hogan, Hyattsville Elementary School, Hyattsville, Maryland 

At the end of this article see: 

• Standards Met in This Activity 

In the past few years, I have been interested in "teacher research," a practice that encourages 

teachers to collect and analyze data in their classrooms. The sources of data--student work, audio- 

and videotapes of class activities, student interviews, surveys, and anecdotal notes--enable me to 

delve into each child's reactions and responses as I develop or implement activities. 

When I first began doing teacher research, I met a first-grade teacher who was documenting how she 

used motion detectors with her students. Since motion detectors typically are used in high school and 

college physics classes, her research fascinated me. I decided to use a similar activity to promote 

inquiry and interpretation of graphs in my first-grade classroom. 

I used a motion detector and software designed for educational purposes and available from school 

suppliers such as Pascal and Vernier. The detector uses infrared signals and is attached to a 

computer with specially designed software that displays an object's or person's movement in the form 

of a graph. The graph represents how far the person is from the motion detector (distance) at each 

instant during the motion (time). 

In my classroom, I was able to connect the computer with a projector so that the children could see 

1320

the graphs on a classroom-size screen. When students moved in front of the motion detector, they 

could watch lines appear on a graph. As the children moved toward the motion detector and 

decreased their distance from the device, the lines on the graph would go down. As they moved away 

from the motion detector and increased the distance, the lines on the graph would go up. When a 

child stood still, a horizontal line appeared on the graph. 

Starting the Activity 

It is important to set up the computer and motion detector in an area with plenty of room so that the 

children can move freely. My goals for the initial activity were to explore motion and discuss the 

resulting graphs. I did not want the discussion to get lost in the fun--I wanted it to be a part of the fun. 

We began by having a conversation about motion detectors. (All of the dialogue that follows is taken 

from my research data.) 

One student said, "There is one at the grocery store. It is a black box up high that makes the door 

open when I come near it." He explained it could see him because it was "Magic!" 

I replied, "Okay. Technology is like magic...amazing things can happen when using technology." 

Another student pointed out, "Someone made it do that." 

I acknowledged this response by comparing the motion detector to video games: "There is something 

inside the game that senses that you are pushing the buttons. When you push the buttons, it makes 

something happen in the game." 

Next, it was time to "play" in front of the motion detector. I modeled for the students as I explained 

that they should move directly in front of the motion detector since that was where the sensor was 

located. They could move any way they chose, by themselves or with a partner. Some children 

moved backwards and forwards. Others stood still, shaking their arms and legs and jumping up and 

down. Others danced and did karate kicks. 

As each student or pair of students experimented, the class talked about the changing graphs and 

made connections to other things they had seen. 

They said, "It looks like mountains." "...like tall mountains and then short mountains." "...like the letter 

M." "...like the letter W." "No, they look like icicles." "They look like both (mountains and icicles)." 

"...like buildings." "...like a cow's udder." "...like those things in caves that hang down." One girl 

compared the look of the sloping lines to stock market graphs. 

Adding Depth to the Learning 

I hoped the children would notice the relationship between their directional movement and the line 

created on the graph. When the last student took his turn, someone noticed a similarity between his 

line and another student's line. We tried to replicate the line. One girl came close. She didn't explain 

1321

herself in words, but her movement demonstrated that she realized she had to move in a certain way 

to replicate the line. 

To extend this thinking, I gave the children some specific movements to use in front of the motion 

detector. First, I stood still and then moved slowly backwards, away from the motion detector. The 

students compared my line to the "mountains" earlier. Then, I asked a student to stand far away and 

walk slowly forward, toward the motion detector, and stop. This was the opposite of what I had done, 

and students compared the graphs. 

Then, I had the children predict what a line would look like, given specific directional commands. I 

acknowledged all responses, praising the students for their attempts. One girl, who was adamant that 

her prediction was right, said, "The line is going to go up when I go backwards." Her classmates 

cheered as she correctly modeled what she had predicted. More students were gaining 

understanding through this interaction. 

Next, I called out directions quickly for one student and then very slowly for another student. It was 

apparent that some were catching on to the fact that their speed also had an effect on the line. (The 

faster the person moved, the steeper the slope of the line.) Some observations were, "She made lots 

of letter Ms and he made only one." "That's because she went faster." These statements showed that 

the students were testing their thinking. 

Writing About the Experience 

The students wrote about this experience and created drawings that illustrated their writing. One 

student wrote, "I remembered when I made ice going down. I walked like I was dancing. I was 

standing still and dancing." Another student wrote, "I played with the motion detector. It made scribble 

scrabble. I stood still and made wobbled lines." Another wrote, "When I played with the motion 

detector it was fun. I went back and forth, and it made mountains. My friend did karate on the motion 

detector." 

To help the children write about their observations, I gave the students some sentence starters: When 

the person stood still...When the person walked forward...When the person walked away (or 

backward)... 

Most students wrote immediately. A few needed partners. One student only wrote a few words to 

describe his movement. He wanted to contribute, but writing was extremely difficult for him. His few 

words, "I stood still... straight," were just as powerful as another student's many words, "When I went 

in front of the motion detector, it made a straight line when I stood still. When I went backwards, it 

made a line that went up. When I went forwards the line went down." Both students were gaining 


I have presented this activity at several conferences. Many teachers are amazed that first graders are 

using this technology. However, at one conference, a teacher said, "We don't need motion detectors 

to teach graphing." I thought to myself, "We don't--but my students needed it." Several of the children 

needed another way to help them understand graphs as well as the motivation to try. The motion 

detector provided both. 

Because of the success with this activity, I teamed with a co-worker to develop a session that 

integrated science and language arts. We used the motion detector to teach writing of sequential 

1322

directions, a first-grade language arts learning outcome (Hogan & Barton, 2000). 

References 

Hogan, Kathleen & Barton, Pamela. (2000). Imagine Using a Motion Detector to Get Students to 

Write Clear Sequential Directions! Paper presented at the Fairfax County Teacher Researcher 

Conference, Tyson's Corner, VA and the Prince George's County Teachers-As-Researchers 

Conference, College Park, MD. 

Mokros, J.R. & Tinker, R.F. (1987). The Impact of Microcomputer-Based Labs on Children's Ability to 

Interpret Graphs. Journal of Research on Science Teaching 24, 369-383. 

National Board for Professional Teaching Standards. (2000). Retrieved April 9, 2001: www.nbpts.org 

National Research Council. (1996). National Science Education Standards. Washington DC: National 

Academy Press. 

Roberts, Deborah. (1998). Physics and First Graders--What a Good Match! Paper presented at the 

annual meeting of the American Educational Research Association, San Diego, CA. 

Science Hardware and Software for the Classroom. Retrieved April 9, 2001: www.vernier.com 

_____ 

Kathleen Hogan has a degree in early childhood education. Currently she teaches at Hyattsville, 

Maryland, Elementary School. The research project described in this article was funded through a 

grant from the U.S. Department of Education. Under the supervision of Emily van Zee, a science 

education faculty member at the University of Maryland at College Park, Hogan and other classroom 

teachers met biweekly, after school, developing research questions to explore in the context of their 

teaching practice. They were encouraged to present their case studies at conferences. 

Standards Met in This Activity 

The following National Science Education Teaching Standards were met through this activity. These 

standards help educators question their practice and act upon their thoughts about teaching, thus 

complementing the National Science Education Content Standards for Science as Inquiry. 

• Standard A: Teachers of science plan inquiry-based science activities. 

The students explored their own ways of moving in front of the motion detector. They observed, 

asked questions, made predictions, and tested their thinking. They recorded their thoughts. 

• Standard B: Teachers of science guide and facilitate learning science. 

I was there to guide the students as they explored ways of moving in front of the motion detector 

and discovered what happened. I facilitated their discussions and maintained a positive learning 

environment. 

• Standard C: Teachers of science engage in ongoing assessment of their teaching and of student 

learning. 

I used a videocassette recorder to assess my teaching and student learning. This enabled me to 

1323

focus on the students' reactions, responses, and understandings so I could plan what to do next. 

• Standard D: Teachers of science design and manage learning environments that provide students 

with the time, space, and resources needed for learning science. 

The students were given the necessary time and space to freely explore their movement in front of 

the motion detector and discuss their findings. I connected the computer to a projector so that all 

of the students could see the graphs at the same time. 

• Standard E: Teachers of science develop a community of science learners that reflects the 

intellectual rigor of scientific inquiry and the attitudes and social values conducive to science 

learning. 

The students are becoming better problem solvers. They were eager to discover answers for 

themselves. They have applied what they've learned in this activity to other situations as they 

continue making observations, asking questions, and solving problems. 

• Standard F: Teachers of science actively participate in the ongoing planning and development of 

the school science program. 

I have shared these activities with my colleagues and will be helping them develop and implement 

activities to use with their students. I evaluated the software and hardware necessary to do this 

activity and presented it to my school district's technology office. My principal purchased the 

necessary equipment as well as temperature probes that will help students gain understanding 

about graphs in another way. 

_____ 

Citation information 

Hogan, Kathleen D.. 2001. Learning in Motion. ENC Focus 8(4) 



1324






Louise and I were having an interesting conversation yesterday that really got me 

thinking. Why do we want to be teachers? We came in to the program with many 

different expectations mostly not knowing what lies ahead of us. We were told we 

would take all of these extra classes but that would waive us from the CSET. So to me 

and many others, I am now finding, that was a big perk to joining this program. As we 

are getting close to the end we now find out we have to take this test or else we cannot 

get a job. OK, so we have to do what we have to do to become teachers. But we were 

talking about why. Why after all of these classes and problems and excitement and 

many other emotions do we really want to be teachers. During a test last year..I asked 

our teacher a question about a problem. He told me that I am making it too 

complicated and his five year old daughter could solve that problem. That, of course, 

made me feel stupid and brought me to tears. Louise had a similar incident recently 

and she was talking to me about it. But we were agreeing that this is helping us to 

become better teachers and this is why we want to teach. Louise used the example of 

when a young student is struggling and looking at words on a paper that seem foreign 

to them (much like physics or other concepts we have struggled with) we are not going 

to say to them look closer it is easier than you think. We are going to have patience 

and work with this student until they can see the words on the paper and can read 

them. So I want to become a teacher not only because of the many good teachers that 

have inspired me to teach but also from the not so good teachers. Each of them has 

given me a reason to become a teacher and even though it is and has been extremely 

tough...we are doing it and we are almost there ( if I pass physics :) So Louise...on a 

day where I was ready to give up (yesterday) Thank you for giving me those thoughts. 

Casey 

1325





Subject: RE: Nine Dots Problem 

Thank you for your input. I wish I could think more outside the box because I 

know that 

that is where fresh and innovative thinking occurs. I wonder if there is a way 

to excersis 

your brain to help it think out side the box. Why do some of us assume that we 

are not 

allowed to go outide? Nothing in the rules said we couldn't. Marin 

>Ah, the nine dots is in David Perkins's book Archimedes Bathtub I sent 

>around on Monday. How weird is this! Really, I don't know what you do. It 

>discusses using simple puzzles to encourage intuitive thinking in young 

>people. Hint: think outside the square of the dots. Does it say you can't? 

>Expand your "particle wave of possibilities", your "possibilities of 

>experience" of the problem. Look at the language. Go outside the box. These 

>margins are the most interesting places, where innovative and fresh thinking 

>happens, at least in literature, critical theory, pop culture, design. 

>Perhaps science, too. 

> 

>My 15 year old got it and I never did. I peeked. 

> 

>Sorry, I couldn't help chiming in; I love Perkins. I'll stop this, I 

>promise. Pam 

>----- Original Message ----- 

>From: "tinne002" 

>To: 

>Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2004 10:38 PM 

>Subject: Journal Time 

> 

> 

>> Reading through Sagan I found a quote that will not leave my mind. 

>> '"Those who invalidate reason ought seriously consider whether they argue 

>> against 

>> reason with or without reason; if with reason, then they establish the 

>> principle that they 

>> are laboring to dethrone; but if they argue without reason (which, in 

>order to 

>> be 

>> consistent with themselves they must do), they are out of reach of 

>rational 

>> conviction, nor 

>> do they deserve a rational argument"(pg. 254). 

>> 

>> This quote boggles my mind. Can anyone tell me what it means? I like how 

>it 

>> sounds but 

>> I don't think I could use any other words to describe its meaning. 

>> 

>> Those who say reason is wrong need to consider that if they fight against 

>it 

>> with their own 

>> reason or if they decide not to use reason at all does that make it even 

>less 

>> valid to not 

>> use reason? How do you argue with out reason to be consistent with 

>yourself. 

1326

If it makes 

>> sense to you then isn't that your reasoning. What is reasoning? I know it 

>is 

>> the basis or 

>> motive for an action, decision, feeling or belief. It is also an 

>underlying 

>> fact or cause that 

>> provides logical sense for a premise or occurence. 

>> 

>> Does underlying fact mean a fact you make up on your own form another 

>fact. 

>> Sorry this 

>> is so confusing. i have been strugling with this thought and quote for 

>days 

>> and my mind is 

>> buring to figure it out. I almost have that feeling that Pam told us about 

>the 

>> other day. The 

>> feeling that my mind is taking this quote so deep that there has not yet 

>been 

>> words 

>> created to have this conversation yet. 

>> 

>> Anyways, how's everyone doing? 

>> 

>> i have been reading Schools for though by John Bruer. I like this book it 

>> makes sense to 

>> me and it uses words that does not make me feel like the idiot the rest of 

>> these readings 

>> make me feel. I guess thatis how our future studetns will feel when we 

>teach 

>> them 

>> subjects that we see as simple. Remember folks to have pacients with your 

>> future 

>> students because even though we may think the curriculum is simple or 

>obvious 

>> just 

>> think, to them it may be as diffucult to them as Fujimura, or Zeitz is to 

>us. 

>> Back to Bruer have been testing out the experiment in the office where 

>you go 

>> in a room 

>> for 35 seconds and make note of all the things in there. I realize I have 

>> shit for short term 

>> memory. I still do not understand how I can remember things from when I 

>was 

>> five years 

>> old but I connot even remember what I read on a previous page in a book. 

>> What's up with 

>> that. It is, however, amazing how we make associaltions to memorize and 

>learn 

>> new 

>> things. Our minds are amazing that they have the power to organize 

>> information, kinda 

>> like the computer. The diagram on page 27 of Bruer shows all the 

>connections 

>> we make 

>> with the words we already know and the world we are learning. I guess that 

>is 

>> how we 

>> can come up with answers we did not know we knew. We tie in associations 

>we 

>> know 

>> Example, Tweety bird is yellow and canaries are yellow therefore there is 

>a 

>> great 

1327

posiblility that tweety bird is a canary. As Mike would say I can 

>guarantee 

>> that Tweety 

>> bird could possibly be a canary. Well if anyone can give me more feedbakc 

>on 

>> the 

>> means of the opening quote my brain would greatly appreciate it. 

>> 

>> That's all Folks. 

>> PS- Did anyone figure out how to connect the nine dots on page 33 of 

>Bruer. i 

>> looked at 

>> the answer in the back and I totally do not have the intellegence to 

>figure 

>> that out. 

>> Happy St. Patricks Day. If you don't celebrate it then Happy Day. Marin 

>> 

>> 

1328






Could this be the difference between the novice and the expert? The expert can see outside box, 

while the novice is focused only on the inside. 

Cynthia 


Thank you for your input. I wish I could think more outside the box because I 

know that 

that is where fresh and innovative thinking occurs. I wonder if there is a way 

to excersis 

your brain to help it think out side the box. Why do some of us assume that we 

are not 

allowed to go outide? Nothing in the rules said we couldn't. Marin 

>Ah, the nine dots is in David Perkins's book Archimedes Bathtub I sent 

>around on Monday. How weird is this! Really, I don't know what you do. It 

>discusses using simple puzzles to encourage intuitive thinking in young 

>people. Hint: think outside the square of the dots. Does it say you can't? 

>Expand your "particle wave of possibilities", your "possibilities of 

>experience" of the problem. Look at the language. Go outside the box. These 

>margins are the most interesting place s, where innovative and fresh thinking 

>happens, at least in literature, critical theory, pop culture, design. 

>Perhaps science, too. 

> 

>My 15 year old got it and I never did. I peeked. 

> 

>Sorry, I couldn't help chiming in; I love Perkins. I'll stop this, I 

>promise. Pam 


>From: "tinne002" 

>To: 

>Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2004 10:38 PM 

>Subject: Journal Time 

> 

> 

>> Reading through Sagan I found a quote that will not leave my mind. 

>> '"Those who invalidate reason ought seriously consider whether they argue 

>> against 

>> reason with or without reason; if with reason, then they establish the 

>> principle that they 

>> are laboring to dethrone; but if they argue without reason (which, in 

>order to 

>> be 

>> consistent with themselves they must do), they are out of reach of 

1329

ational 

>> conviction, nor 

>> do they deserve a rational argument"(pg. 254). 

>> 

>> This quote boggles my mind. Can anyone tell me what it means? I like how 

>it 

>> sounds but 

>> I don't think I could use any other words to describe its meaning. 

>> 

>> Those who say reason is wrong need to consider that if they fight against 

>it 

>> with their own 

>> reason or if they decide not to use reason at all does that make it even 

>less 

>> valid to not 

>> use reason? How do you argue with out reason to be consistent with 

>yourself. 

>> If it makes 

>> sense to you then isn't that your reasoning. What is reasoning? I know it 

>is 

>> the basis or 

>> motive for an action, decision, feeling or belief. It is also an 

>underlying 

>> fact or cause that 

>> provides logical sense for a premise o r occurence. 

>> 

>> Does underlying fact mean a fact you make up on your own form another 

>fact. 

>> Sorry this 

>> is so confusing. i have been strugling with this thought and quote for 

>days 

>> and my mind is 

>> buring to figure it out. I almost have that feeling that Pam told us about 

>the 

>> other day. The 

>> feeling that my mind is taking this quote so deep that there has not yet 

>been 

>> words 

>> created to have this conversation yet. 

>> 

>> Anyways, how's everyone doing? 

>> 

>> i have been reading Schools for though by John Bruer. I like this book it 

>> makes sense to 

>> me and it uses words that does not make me feel like the idiot the rest of 

>> these readings 

>> make me feel. I guess thatis how our future studetns will feel when we 

>teach 

>> them 

>> subjects that we see as simple. Remember folks to have pacients with your 

>> future 

>> students because even though we may think the curriculum is simple or 

>obvious 

1330

just 

>> think, to them it may be as diffucult to them as Fujimura, or Zeitz is to 

>us. 

>> Back to Bruer have been testing out the experiment in the office where 

>you go 

>> in a room 

>> for 35 seconds and make note of all the things in there. I realize I have 

>> shit for short term 

>> memory. I still do not understand how I can remember things from when I 

>was 

>> five years 

>> old but I connot even remember what I read on a previous page in a book. 

>> What's up with 

>> that. It is, however, amazing how we make associaltions to memorize and 

>learn 

>> new 

>> things. Our minds are amazing that they have the power to organize 

>> information, kinda 

>> like th e computer. The diagram on page 27 of Bruer shows all the 

>connections 

>> we make 

>> with the words we already know and the world we are learning. I guess that 

>is 

>> how we 

>> can come up with answers we did not know we knew. We tie in associations 

>we 

>> know 

>> Example, Tweety bird is yellow and canaries are yellow therefore there is 

>a 

>> great 

>> posiblility that tweety bird is a canary. As Mike would say I can 

>guarantee 

>> that Tweety 

>> bird could possibly be a canary. Well if anyone can give me more feedbakc 

>on 

>> the 

>> means of the opening quote my brain would greatly appreciate it. 

>> 

>> That's all Folks. 

>> PS- Did anyone figure out how to connect the nine dots on page 33 of 

>Bruer. i 

>> looked at 

>> the answer in the back and I totally do not have the intellegence to 

>figure 

>> that out. 

>> Happy St. Patricks Day. If you don't celebrate it then Happy Day. Marin 

>> 

>> 



1331




To: journal 

Subject: VPA class on monday 

Those of you in the Arts/education class, Merryl said she would let us out early. I take that as a no on 

not showing up at all, however, do what you need to do. 

Cynthia 



1332





Subject: Re: VPA class on monday 

thanks cynthia for asking for us. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/18 Thu PM 12:35:59 PST 


> Subject: VPA class on monday 

> 

> Those of you in the Arts/education class, Merryl said she would let us out early. I take 

that as a no on not showing up at all, however, do what you need to do. 

> Cynthia 

> 



> 


1333





Subject: RE: Motion in first grade 

Oh my gosh! This is exactly what we are learning in Physics. In our lab, we 

even got to "play" with motion sensors to see what type of motion made 

different lines on the graph. Wow! This is application that I can see. The 

article even referred to inquiry teaching. Is it following the Learning 

Cycle? Looks good to me. Students are able to explore, are introduced to the 

concept, and then apply the concept. [Exploration, Concept Introduction, 

Application Activity] Well, who would have known. Guess we all better master 

these concepts....soon. We all might be using this Physics lesson in our own 

1st grade classroom one day. 

I guess it's true...kids these days are smarter than when we were in school. 

Just kidding. I guess nowadays kids are just exposed to more stuff. More 

technology application in the classroom. 




>To: journal 

>Subject: Motion in first grade 


> 

>Mike, this one is for you! 

>Is this a great connection to our physics lesson or what? Did anybody think 

>they could really use it in the classroom? Maybe our expectations are way 

>too low. 

> 

>Cynthia 

>Learning in Motion 

>This first-grade teacher believes in trying the newest tools and techniques 

>to engage her students and help them learn. 

> 

>by Kathleen D. Hogan, Hyattsville Elementary School, Hyattsville, Maryland 

>At the end of this article see: 

> Standards Met in This Activity 

> 

>In the past few years, I have been interested in "teacher research," a 

>practice that encourages teachers to collect and analyze data in their 

>classrooms. The sources of data--student work, audio- and videotapes of 

>class activities, student interviews, surveys, and anecdotal notes--enable 

>me to delve into each child's reactions and responses as I develop or 

>implement activities. 

> 

>When I first began doing teacher research, I met a first-grade teacher who 

>was documenting how she used motion detectors with her students. Since 

>motion detectors typically are used in high school and college physics 

>classes, her research fascinated me. I decided to use a similar activity to 

>promote inquiry and interpretation of graphs in my first-grade classroom. 

> 

>I used a motion detector and software designed for educational purposes and 

>available from school suppliers such as Pascal and Vernier. The detector 

>uses infrared signals and is attached to a computer with specially designed 

>software that displays an object's or person's movement in the form of a 

>graph. The graph represents how far the person is from the motion detector 

>(distance) at each instant during the motion (time). 

1334

>In my classroom, I was able to connect the computer with a projector so 

>that the children could see the graphs on a classroom-size screen. When 

>students moved in front of the motion detector, they could watch lines 

>appear on a graph. As the children moved toward the motion detector and 

>decreased their distance from the device, the lines on the graph would go 

>down. As they moved away from the motion detector and increased the 

>distance, the lines on the graph would go up. When a child stood still, a 

>horizontal line appeared on the graph. 

>Starting the Activity 

>It is important to set up the computer and motion detector in an area with 

>plenty of room so that the children can move freely. My goals for the 

>initial activity were to explore motion and discuss the resulting graphs. I 

>did not want the discussion to get lost in the fun--I wanted it to be a 

>part of the fun. 

> 

>We began by having a conversation about motion detectors. (All of the 

>dialogue that follows is taken from my research data.) 

> 

>One student said, "There is one at the grocery store. It is a black box up 

>high that makes the door open when I come near it." He explained it could 

>see him because it was "Magic!" 

> 

>I replied, "Okay. Technology is like magic...amazing things can happen when 

>using technology." 

> 

>Another student pointed out, "Someone made it do that." 

> 

>I acknowledged this response by comparing the motion detector to video 

>games: "There is something inside the game that senses that you are pushing 

>the buttons. When you push the buttons, it makes something happen in the 

>game." 

> 

>Next, it was time to "play" in front of the motion detector. I modeled for 

>the students as I explained that they should move directly in front of the 

>motion detector since that was where the sensor was located. They could 

>move any way they chose, by themselves or with a partner. Some children 

>moved backwards and forwards. Others stood still, shaking their arms and 

>legs and jumping up and down. Others danced and did karate kicks. 

> 

>As each student or pair of students experimented, the class talked about 

>the changing graphs and made connections to other things they had seen. 

> 

>They said, "It looks like mountains." "...like tall mountains and then 

>short mountains." "...like the letter M." "...like the letter W." "No, they 

>look like icicles." "They look like both (mountains and icicles)." "...like 

>buildings." "...like a cow's udder." "...like those things in caves that 

>hang down." One girl compared the look of the sloping lines to stock market 

>graphs. 

>Adding Depth to the Learning 

>I hoped the children would notice the relationship between their 

>directional movement and the line created on the graph. When the last 

>student took his turn, someone noticed a similarity between his line and 

>another student's line. We tried to replicate the line. One girl came 

>close. She didn't explain herself in words, but her movement demonstrated 

>that she realized she had to move in a certain way to replicate the line. 

> 

>To extend this thinking, I gave the children some specific movements to use 

>in front of the motion detector. First, I stood still and then moved slowly 

>backwards, away from the motion detector. The students compared my line to 

>the "mountains" earlier. Then, I asked a student to stand far away and walk 

>slowly forward, toward the motion detector, and stop. This was the opposite 

>of what I had done, and students compared the graphs. 

> 

>Then, I had the children predict what a line would look like, given 

>specific directional commands. I acknowledged all responses, praising the 

1335

students for their attempts. One girl, who was adamant that her prediction 

>was right, said, "The line is going to go up when I go backwards." Her 

>classmates cheered as she correctly modeled what she had predicted. More 

>students were gaining understanding through this interaction. 

> 

>Next, I called out directions quickly for one student and then very slowly 

>for another student. It was apparent that some were catching on to the fact 

>that their speed also had an effect on the line. (The faster the person 

>moved, the steeper the slope of the line.) Some observations were, "She 

>made lots of letter Ms and he made only one." "That's because she went 

>faster." These statements showed that the students were testing their 

>thinking. 

>Writing About the Experience 

>The students wrote about this experience and created drawings that 

>illustrated their writing. One student wrote, "I remembered when I made ice 

>going down. I walked like I was dancing. I was standing still and dancing." 

>Another student wrote, "I played with the motion detector. It made scribble 

>scrabble. I stood still and made wobbled lines." Another wrote, "When I 

>played with the motion detector it was fun. I went back and forth, and it 

>made mountains. My friend did karate on the motion detector." 

> 

>To help the children write about their observations, I gave the students 

>some sentence starters: When the person stood still...When the person 

>walked forward...When the person walked away (or backward)... 

> 

>Most students wrote immediately. A few needed partners. One student only 

>wrote a few words to describe his movement. He wanted to contribute, but 

>writing was extremely difficult for him. His few words, "I stood still... 

>straight," were just as powerful as another student's many words, "When I 

>went in front of the motion detector, it made a straight line when I stood 

>still. When I went backwards, it made a line that went up. When I went 

>forwards the line went down." Both students were gaining understanding. 

> 

>I have presented this activity at several conferences. Many teachers are 

>amazed that first graders are using this technology. However, at one 

>conference, a teacher said, "We don't need motion detectors to teach 

>graphing." I thought to myself, "We don't--but my students needed it." 

>Several of the children needed another way to help them understand graphs 

>as well as the motivation to try. The motion detector provided both. 

> 

>Because of the success with this activity, I teamed with a co-worker to 

>develop a session that integrated science and language arts. We used the 

>motion detector to teach writing of sequential directions, a first-grade 

>language arts learning outcome (Hogan & Barton, 2000). 

>References 

>Hogan, Kathleen & Barton, Pamela. (2000). Imagine Using a Motion Detector 

>to Get Students to Write Clear Sequential Directions! Paper presented at 

>the Fairfax County Teacher Researcher Conference, Tyson's Corner, VA and 

>the Prince George's County Teachers-As-Researchers Conference, College 

>Park, MD. 

> 

>Mokros, J.R. & Tinker, R.F. (1987). The Impact of Microcomputer-Based Labs 

>on Children's Ability to Interpret Graphs. Journal of Research on Science 

>Teaching 24, 369-383. 

> 

>National Board for Professional Teaching Standards. (2000). Retrieved April 

>9, 2001: www.nbpts.org 

> 

>National Research Council. (1996). National Science Education Standards. 

>Washington DC: National Academy Press. 

> 

>Roberts, Deborah. (1998). Physics and First Graders--What a Good Match! 

>Paper presented at the annual meeting of the American Educational Research 

>Association, San Diego, CA. 

> 

>Science Hardware and Software for the Classroom. Retrieved April 9, 2001: 

1336

www.vernier.com 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

> 

>Kathleen Hogan has a degree in early childhood education. Currently she 

>teaches at Hyattsville, Maryland, Elementary School. The research project 

>described in this article was funded through a grant from the U.S. 

>Department of Education. Under the supervision of Emily van Zee, a science 

>education faculty member at the University of Maryland at College Park, 

>Hogan and other classroom teachers met biweekly, after school, developing 

>research questions to explore in the context of their teaching practice. 

>They were encouraged to present their case studies at conferences. 

>Standards Met in This Activity 

>The following National Science Education Teaching Standards were met 

>through this activity. These standards help educators question their 

>practice and act upon their thoughts about teaching, thus complementing the 

>National Science Education Content Standards for Science as Inquiry. 

> 

> Standard A: Teachers of science plan inquiry-based science activities. 

>The students explored their own ways of moving in front of the motion 

>detector. They observed, asked questions, made predictions, and tested 

>their thinking. They recorded their thoughts. 

> Standard B: Teachers of science guide and facilitate learning science. 

>I was there to guide the students as they explored ways of moving in front 

>of the motion detector and discovered what happened. I facilitated their 

>discussions and maintained a positive learning environment. 

> Standard C: Teachers of science engage in ongoing assessment of their 

>teaching and of student learning. 

>I used a videocassette recorder to assess my teaching and student learning. 

>This enabled me to focus on the students' reactions, responses, and 

>understandings so I could plan what to do next. 

> Standard D: Teachers of science design and manage learning environments 

>that provide students with the time, space, and resources needed for 

>learning science. 

>The students were given the necessary time and space to freely explore 

>their movement in front of the motion detector and discuss their findings. 

>I connected the computer to a projector so that all of the students could 

>see the graphs at the same time. 

> Standard E: Teachers of science develop a community of science learners 

>that reflects the intellectual rigor of scientific inquiry and the 

>attitudes and social values conducive to science learning. 

>The students are becoming better problem solvers. They were eager to 

>discover answers for themselves. They have applied what they've learned in 

>this activity to other situations as they continue making observations, 

>asking questions, and solving problems. 

> Standard F: Teachers of science actively participate in the ongoing 

>planning and development of the school science program. 

>I have shared these activities with my colleagues and will be helping them 

>develop and implement activities to use with their students. I evaluated 

>the software and hardware necessary to do this activity and presented it to 

>my school district's technology office. My principal purchased the 

>necessary equipment as well as temperature probes that will help students 

>gain understanding about graphs in another way. 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

>Citation information 

>Hogan, Kathleen D.. 2001. Learning in Motion. ENC Focus 8(4) 

> 

> 



_________________________________________________________________ 

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1337

1338






This reminds me of a lesson that we did in VPA 321 on Monday. We cut up 6 

different colors of construction paper, each color into equal parts. For 

example, one color was cut in half, the other in thirds, the next in 

fourths, etc. Then, on one of the papers, we were to make a collage with the 

strips that we just cut out. The only directions given to us was to 

construct a collage. Well, I started out and then finally asked if we had to 

stay inside the boundaries of the paper. And the leader of the lesson asked 

me back, "I don't know, do you?" 

It's all in interpretation and thinking either outside or inside the box. In 

this case, I was under the impression that I had to stay inside the box, 

until I asked. I guess I'm a novice. 





>Subject: RE: Nine Dots Problem 


> 

>Could this be the difference between the novice and the expert? The expert 

>can see outside box, while the novice is focused only on the inside. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Thank you for your input. I wish I could think more outside the box because 

>I 

>know that 

>that is where fresh and innovative thinking occurs. I wonder if there is a 

>way 

>to excersis 

>your brain to help it think out side the box. Why do some of us assume that 

>we 

>are not 

>allowed to go outide? Nothing in the rules said we couldn't. Marin 

> 

> 

> >Ah, the nine dots is in David Perkins's book Archimedes Bathtub I sent 

> >around on Monday. How weird is this! Really, I don't know what you do. It 

> >discusses using simple puzzles to encourage intuitive thinking in young 

> >people. Hint: think outside the square of the dots. Does it say you 

>can't? 

> >Expand your "particle wave of possibilities", your "possibilities of 

> >experience" of the problem. Look at the language. Go outside the box. 

>These 

> >margins are the most interesting places, where innovative and fresh 

>thinking 

> >happens, at least in literature, critical theory, pop culture, design. 

> >Perhaps science, too. 

> > 

> >My 15 year old got it and I never did. I peeked. 

> > 

> >Sorry, I couldn't help chiming in; I love Perkins. I'll stop this, I 

> >promise. Pam 

1339


> >From: "tinne002" 

> >To: 

> >Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2004 10:38 PM 

> >Subject: Journal Time 

> > 

> > 

> >> Reading through Sagan I found a quote that will not leave my mind. 

> >> '"Those who invalidate reason ought seriously consider whether they 

>argue 

> >> against 

> >> reason with or without reason; if with reason, then they establish the 

> >> principle that they 

> >> are laboring to dethrone; but if they argue without reason (which, in 

> >order to 

> >> be 

> >> consistent with themselves they must do), they are out of reach of 

> >rational 

> >> conviction, nor 

> >> do they deserve a rational argument"(pg. 254). 

> >> 

> >> This quote boggles my mind. Can anyone tell me what it means? I like 

>how 

> >it 

> >> sounds but 

> >> I don't think I could use any other words to describe its meaning. 

> >> 

> >> Those who say reason is wrong need to consider that if they fight 

>against 

> >it 

> >> with their own 

> >> reason or if they decide not to use reason at all does that make it 

>even 

> >less 

> >> valid to not 

> >> use reason? How do you argue with out reason to be consistent with 

> >yourself. 

> >> If it makes 

> >> sense to you then isn't that your reasoning. What is reasoning? I know 

>it 

> >is 

> >> the basis or 

> >> motive for an action, decision, feeling or belief. It is also an 

> >underlying 

> >> fact or cause that 

> >> provides logical sense for a premise or occurence. 

> >> 

> >> Does underlying fact mean a fact you make up on your own form another 

> >fact. 

> >> Sorry this 

> >> is so confusing. i have been strugling with this thought and quote for 

> >days 

> >> and my mind is 

> >> buring to figure it out. I almost have that feeling that Pam told us 

>about 

> >the 

> >> other day. The 

> >> feeling that my mind is taking this quote so deep that there has not 

>yet 

> >been 

> >> words 

> >> created to have this conversation yet. 

> >> 

> >> Anyways, how's everyone doing? 

> >> 

> >> i have been reading Schools for though by John Bruer. I like this book 

1340

it 

> >> makes sense to 

> >> me and it uses words that does not make me feel like the idiot the rest 

>of 

> >> these readings 

> >> make me feel. I guess thatis how our future studetns will feel when we 

> >teach 

> >> them 

> >> subjects that we see as simple. Remember folks to have pacients with 

>your 

> >> future 

> >> students because even though we may think the curriculum is simple or 

> >obvious 

> >> just 

> >> think, to them it may be as diffucult to them as Fujimura, or Zeitz is 

>to 

> >us. 

> >> Back to Bruer have been testing out the experiment in the office where 

> >you go 

> >> in a room 

> >> for 35 seconds and make note of all the things in there. I realize I 

>have 

> >> shit for short term 

> >> memory. I still do not understand how I can remember things from when I 

> >was 

> >> five years 

> >> old but I connot even remember what I read on a previous page in a 

>book. 

> >> What's up with 

> >> that. It is, however, amazing how we make associaltions to memorize and 

> >learn 

> >> new 

> >> things. Our minds are amazing that they have the power to organize 

> >> information, kinda 

> >> like the computer. The diagram on page 27 of Bruer shows all the 

> >connections 

> >> we make 

> >> with the words we already know and the world we are learning. I guess 

>that 

> >is 

> >> how we 

> >> can come up with answers we did not know we knew. We tie in 

>associations 

> >we 

> >> know 

> >> Example, Tweety bird is yellow and canaries are yellow therefore there 

>is 

> >a 

> >> great 

> >> posiblility that tweety bird is a canary. As Mike would say I can 

> >guarantee 

> >> that Tweety 

> >> bird could possibly be a canary. Well if anyone can give me more 

>feedbakc 

> >on 

> >> the 

> >> means of the opening quote my brain would greatly appreciate it. 

> >> 

> >> That's all Folks. 

> >> PS- Did anyone figure out how to connect the nine dots on page 33 of 

> >Bruer. i 

> >> looked at 

> >> the answer in the back and I totally do not have the intellegence to 

> >figure 

> >> that out. 

> >> Happy St. Patricks Day. If you don't celebrate it then Happy Day. Marin 

1341

> >> 

> 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® 

Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 

1342





Subject: RE: Journal 

I was right there with you Casey. I was so close to "packing it in" too, but as we discussed, we can 

learn how to redirect our frustrations and struggles and apply it in a way which helps us to 

understand how children have difficulties in comprehending a concept or problem that seems so 

obvious to us. Finding out about having to take the CSET after committing to a program that waived 

the state exam was quite devastating to me, simply because I don't do well on tests and exams. But 

I've turned my frustrations around so that I have a positive attitude, because I know that when I pass 

the CSET, I can do anything! I am experiencing these frustrations and struggles, but I can now 

understand what my future students may be feeling when they come up against what seems like 

impossible odds to them. Having this knowledge and understanding will only make me a better 

teacher and I plan to be the best!! 

Have a lovely weekend. ~ Louise 


From: CA222girl@aol.com [mailto:CA222girl@aol.com] 




Louise and I were having an interesting conversation yesterday that really got me 

thinking. Why do we want to be teachers? We came in to the program with many 

different expectations mostly not knowing what lies ahead of us. We were told we 

would take all of these extra classes but that would waive us from the CSET. So to 

me and many others, I am now finding, that was a big perk to joining this program. 

As we are getting close to the end we now find out we have to take this test or else 

we cannot get a job. OK, so we have to do what we have to do to become teachers. 

But we were talking about why. Why after all of these classes and problems and 

excitement and many other emotions do we really want to be teachers. During a 

test last year..I asked our teacher a question about a problem. He told me that I am 

making it too complicated and his five year old daughter could solve that problem. 

That, of course, made me feel stupid and brought me to tears. Louise had a similar 

incident recently and she was talking to me about it. But we were agreeing that this 

is helping us to become better teachers and this is why we want to teach. Louise 

used the example of when a young student is struggling and looking at words on a 

paper that seem foreign to them (much like physics or other concepts we have 

struggled with) we are not going to say to them look closer it is easier than you 

think. We are going to have patience and work with this student until they can see 

the words on the paper and can read them. So I want to become a teacher not only 

1343

ecause of the many good teachers that have inspired me to teach but also from 

the not so good teachers. Each of them has given me a reason to become a 

teacher and even though it is and has been extremely tough...we are doing it and 

we are almost there ( if I pass physics :) So Louise...on a day where I was ready to 

give up (yesterday) Thank you for giving me those thoughts. Casey 

1344




To: Randy& Louise Tweed; ICP-F@csusm.edu 

Subject: RE: Journal 

Louise and Casey, I feel the same way, sometimes I just want to go postal 

because of these classes! I get frustrated because I just want to be a 

teacher not a rocket surgeon. But,I know that when (and if) I become a 

teacher, I will be a good one. The reason I want to be a teacher is because I 

have not forgotten what it's like to be a student and thanks to these classes 

(especially physics), I will never forget what it's like to struggle and feel 

lost. Cecilia 

>===== Original Message From "Randy& Louise Tweed" ===== 

>I was right there with you Casey. I was so close to "packing it in" 

>too, but as we discussed, we can learn how to redirect our frustrations 

>and struggles and apply it in a way which helps us to understand how 

>children have difficulties in comprehending a concept or problem that 

>seems so obvious to us. Finding out about having to take the CSET after 

>committing to a program that waived the state exam was quite devastating 

>to me, simply because I don't do well on tests and exams. But I've 

>turned my frustrations around so that I have a positive attitude, 

>because I know that when I pass the CSET, I can do anything! I am 

>experiencing these frustrations and struggles, but I can now understand 

>what my future students may be feeling when they come up against what 

>seems like impossible odds to them. Having this knowledge and 

>understanding will only make me a better teacher and I plan to be the 

>best!! 

> 

>Have a lovely weekend. ~ Louise 

> 

> 


>From: CA222girl@aol.com [mailto:CA222girl@aol.com] 



>Subject: Journal 

> 

> 

> 

>Louise and I were having an interesting conversation yesterday that 

>really got me thinking. Why do we want to be teachers? We came in to the 

>program with many different expectations mostly not knowing what lies 

>ahead of us. We were told we would take all of these extra classes but 

>that would waive us from the CSET. So to me and many others, I am now 

>finding, that was a big perk to joining this program. As we are getting 

>close to the end we now find out we have to take this test or else we 

>cannot get a job. OK, so we have to do what we have to do to become 

>teachers. But we were talking about why. Why after all of these classes 

>and problems and excitement and many other emotions do we really want to 

>be teachers. During a test last year..I asked our teacher a question 

>about a problem. He told me that I am making it too complicated and his 

>five year old daughter could solve that problem. That, of course, made 

>me feel stupid and brought me to tears. Louise had a similar incident 

>recently and she was talking to me about it. But we were agreeing that 

>this is helping us to become better teachers and this is why we want to 

>teach. Louise used the example of when a young student is struggling and 

>looking at words on a paper that seem foreign to them (much like physics 

>or other concepts we have struggled with) we are not going to say to 

>them look closer it is easier than you think. We are going to have 

>patience and work with this student until they can see the words on the 

1345

paper and can read them. So I want to become a teacher not only because 

>of the many good teachers that have inspired me to teach but also from 

>the not so good teachers. Each of them has given me a reason to become a 

>teacher and even though it is and has been extremely tough...we are 

>doing it and we are almost there ( if I pass physics :) So Louise...on a 

>day where I was ready to give up (yesterday) Thank you for giving me 

>those thoughts. Casey 

1346





Subject: frustration 

Okay kids, 

Keep on going!!! If you get frustrated with the bull shit assignments and 

requirements. Walk into a classroom, sit down, and absorb all of it... the 

laughter, the crayon smell, the dirty hands, pencil sharpner going, the pages 

turning, all of it. I promise when you walk out of the room, all the 

requirements, the assignments, the stupid people who think they know 

everything will disappear. And you will wonder why you ever thought about 

giving up!! Unfortunately, you must have to repeat this precedure every week! 

Teresa 

1347




To: ICP-F@csusm.edu; karisanne@adelphia.net 

Subject: RE: VPA class on monday 

So speaking to the VPA people in the cohort, are anyone of you going to go to 

class for like a half hour or 45 minutes and then leave, or are you guys just 

not going to show up at all? Please let me know what you guys are going to do. 

Thanks! 

Laurie :) 

>===== Original Message From ===== 

>thanks cynthia for asking for us. 

>> 

>> From: Cynthia Reyes 

>> Date: 2004/03/18 Thu PM 12:35:59 PST 

>> To: journal 

>> Subject: VPA class on monday 

>> 

>> Those of you in the Arts/education class, Merryl said she would let us out 

early. I take that as a no on not showing up at all, however, do what you need 

to do. 

>> Cynthia 

>> 

>> Do you Yahoo!? 

>> Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam 

>> 

> 


1348





Subject: RE: frustration 

Teresa, 

I know when I'm in the classroom (even as a parent) all the frustrations 

of being at university and all the hoops we have to jump, just melt 

away. There's something about being directly involved, hands-on, and 

interacting with the children that just make it so rewarding. I can see 

the light at the end of the tunnel and I know there's a rainbow at the 

end! It's all about staying positive and having a great attitude! ~ 

Louise 


From: summe004 [mailto:summe004@csusm.edu] 



Subject: frustration 

Okay kids, 

Keep on going!!! If you get frustrated with the bull shit assignments 

and 

requirements. Walk into a classroom, sit down, and absorb all of it... 

the 

laughter, the crayon smell, the dirty hands, pencil sharpner going, the 

pages 

turning, all of it. I promise when you walk out of the room, all the 

requirements, the assignments, the stupid people who think they know 

everything will disappear. And you will wonder why you ever thought 

about 

giving up!! Unfortunately, you must have to repeat this precedure every 

week! Teresa 

1349





Subject: Electricity ppt 

Attachments: Electricity.ppt 

Electricity.ppt (78 

KB) 

Here is Jonathan's and Cecilia's power point. 

1350





Subject: nuclear testing 

ok mike, this may not tie in to your new teaching-talk-only journals, but i gotta branch 

out. 

sagan's chapter on scientists' sin got me thinking about a class last semester. a lot of 

you took it too, whether or not you showed up is another story. but there was a brief 

moment when this class meant something to me. when i learned about all the nuclear bomb 

testing. 

sagan talks about the nuclear, hydrogen, thermonuclear weapons that brilliant scientists 

created. yes, they are brilliant, but how stupid can you be? creating weapons so 

powerful they can destroy miles and miles of life. what a good idea. 

sagan says, "sometimes scientists try to have it both ways: to take credit for those 

applications of science that enrich our lives, but to distance themselves from the 

instruments of death" (283). my thought on this...as they should, who wants to claim that 

they created such destructive weapons? well i guess some do... 

a few pages later he mentions the stress they must go through, those that take credit for 

such creations (287). "i did it, no i did it, no it was me." fight all you want boys, in 

the end you have destroyed our world. 

how powerful are nuclear weapons when at this point we arent the only ones with them? we 

destroy them, they destroy us, we just go in circles. i guess its time to build bigger 

and better ones. great idea, lets build something so powerful that we can commit world 

wide suicide. isnt that all this is? 

if you were in my class, you read (or pretended to read) routine contaminations. in all 

honesty, i loved this book. i highly recommend it and i think theres a lot to be said for 

nuclear testing. 

if you didnt already know, we build these bombs and then we test them on our own people, 

on our own military. and each test gets more and more dangerous. 

do you remember the scenes from nightbreaker? if you didnt see it, i highly recommend 

this too. its a wake up call to those of us who dont care about the weapons the world has 

made or what we do with them. 

so my thought on sagan's chapter and my class last semester, these scientists have sinned 

a sin that affects the entire world, not just them. 

now i could give the all original miss america speech that i want world peace, but thats 

not gonna happen. so i guess i have nothing to say but be aware. know how stupid these 

weapons are and the stupid choices america has made with them. 


1351





Subject: RE: nuclear testing 

Hi Karis, 

My grandfather (now deceased) was a scientist who worked with the 

development of the nuclear bomb. Because he was under some secrecy act, 

he couldn't divulge much information to me, but it was clear he felt 

that his research and work was beneficial to mankind. I would argue 

with him about the devastating effects that nuclear bombs could and have 

had. He would always point out Hiroshima and Nagasaki and say that the 

nuclear bombs are what ended the war with Japan, and that potentially 

more people could have been killed if the war had continued. After 

reading the Contaminations book and seeing the movie Nightbreaker, I'm 

even more convinced that nuclear bombs are NOT the way to go. Sagan, 

like most scientists, I'm sure, believe that what they are doing is for 

the benefit of the world and that they don't necessarily see what the 

potential affects could be even decades after their "brilliant science" 

has been unleashed. This is another one of those topics I could waffle 

on about, but again I will quietly slip off my soap box and continue 

studying for my bio midterm. ~ Louise 





Subject: nuclear testing 

ok mike, this may not tie in to your new teaching-talk-only journals, 

but i gotta branch out. 

sagan's chapter on scientists' sin got me thinking about a class last 

semester. a lot of you took it too, whether or not you showed up is 

another story. but there was a brief moment when this class meant 

something to me. when i learned about all the nuclear bomb testing. 

sagan talks about the nuclear, hydrogen, thermonuclear weapons that 

brilliant scientists created. yes, they are brilliant, but how stupid 

can you be? creating weapons so powerful they can destroy miles and 

miles of life. what a good idea. 

sagan says, "sometimes scientists try to have it both ways: to take 

credit for those applications of science that enrich our lives, but to 

distance themselves from the instruments of death" (283). my thought on 

this...as they should, who wants to claim that they created such 

destructive weapons? well i guess some do... 

a few pages later he mentions the stress they must go through, those 

that take credit for such creations (287). "i did it, no i did it, no 

it was me." fight all you want boys, in the end you have destroyed our 

world. 

how powerful are nuclear weapons when at this point we arent the only 

ones with them? we destroy them, they destroy us, we just go in 

circles. i guess its time to build bigger and better ones. great idea, 

lets build something so powerful that we can commit world wide suicide. 

isnt that all this is? 

1352

if you were in my class, you read (or pretended to read) routine 

contaminations. in all honesty, i loved this book. i highly recommend 

it and i think theres a lot to be said for nuclear testing. 

if you didnt already know, we build these bombs and then we test them on 

our own people, on our own military. and each test gets more and more 

dangerous. 

do you remember the scenes from nightbreaker? if you didnt see it, i 

highly recommend this too. its a wake up call to those of us who dont 

care about the weapons the world has made or what we do with them. 

so my thought on sagan's chapter and my class last semester, these 

scientists have sinned a sin that affects the entire world, not just 

them. 

now i could give the all original miss america speech that i want world 

peace, but thats not gonna happen. so i guess i have nothing to say but 

be aware. know how stupid these weapons are and the stupid choices 

america has made with them. 


1353






Hey Michael and class, and Pam, 

I totally agree.... Language limits ones ability to fully communicate and express ideas, thoughts, 

experiences, descriptions, etc. 

For instance, in Alaska there are many different words to describe snow. All the variations are 

necessary and they really make a difference when describing the snow. 

I have often found a lack of the right word to describe how I feel about something or how certain 

situations make me feel. It's like I cannot find a word that totally encompasses my feelings. 

For instance, when I read Sagan about what they did to the so called "witches", there is not a word 

that I know of that expresses how horrible that is, or how completely upset that makes me feel to 

imagine MAN-kind be capable of such monstrosities. 

There are often times when I enjoy something beautiful and I do not have the words to describe how 

wonderfully elated, or extremely at peace it makes me. 

A friend of mine just sent me pictures of his and his wife's new baby. The pictures not only show how 

absolutely beyond adorable little "Parker" is, but the pictures also so the love they feel for their new 

little "cutie pie". There are not words to fully describe this either, or how looking at these pictures 

makes me feel inside. 

Indeed, language is very limiting. Maybe that's why people say a picture is worth a thousand 

words...and that's not even descriptive enough. 

Ann 
















1354



fosters a curi osity about the evolution of language, 











language? 




















and wierdos. 






> understanding (background) to get it in the first 








> Cynthia 

> 


1355



> true, 


> certain 


> as 










> love 






> of its lack of complexity and ability to communicate 









> michael 

> 

> __________________________________ 




> 

> 



__________________________________ 






1356





Subject: Re: louise 

thanks louise for sharing that with me. theres no doubt that these scientists developed 

something that is incredible, devastating and beautiful. and it took smarts in order to 

do that. but i do wish they never did. you were in that class and you seem to agree. 

but it is interesting that you pointed out the bomb put an end to a potentially ongoing 

war. very interesting. 

> 

> From: "Randy& Louise Tweed" 

> Date: 2004/03/19 Fri PM 03:44:39 PST 

> To: 

> Subject: RE: nuclear testing 

> 

> Hi Karis, 

> 

> My grandfather (now deceased) was a scientist who worked with the 

> development of the nuclear bomb. Because he was under some secrecy act, 

> he couldn't divulge much information to me, but it was clear he felt 

> that his research and work was beneficial to mankind. I would argue 

> with him about the devastating effects that nuclear bombs could and have 

> had. He would always point out Hiroshima and Nagasaki and say that the 

> nuclear bombs are what ended the war with Japan, and that potentially 

> more people could have been killed if the war had continued. After 

> reading the Contaminations book and seeing the movie Nightbreaker, I'm 

> even more convinced that nuclear bombs are NOT the way to go. Sagan, 

> like most scientists, I'm sure, believe that what they are doing is for 

> the benefit of the world and that they don't necessarily see what the 

> potential affects could be even decades after their "brilliant science" 

> has been unleashed. This is another one of those topics I could waffle 

> on about, but again I will quietly slip off my soap box and continue 

> studying for my bio midterm. ~ Louise 

> 


> From: karisanne@adelphia.net [mailto:karisanne@adelphia.net] 

> Sent: Friday, March 19, 2004 1:14 PM 


> Subject: nuclear testing 

> 

> 

> ok mike, this may not tie in to your new teaching-talk-only journals, 

> but i gotta branch out. 

> 

> sagan's chapter on scientists' sin got me thinking about a class last 

> semester. a lot of you took it too, whether or not you showed up is 

> another story. but there was a brief moment when this class meant 

> something to me. when i learned about all the nuclear bomb testing. 

> 

> sagan talks about the nuclear, hydrogen, thermonuclear weapons that 

> brilliant scientists created. yes, they are brilliant, but how stupid 

> can you be? creating weapons so powerful they can destroy miles and 

> miles of life. what a good idea. 

> 

> sagan says, "sometimes scientists try to have it both ways: to take 

> credit for those applications of science that enrich our lives, but to 

> distance themselves from the instruments of death" (283). my thought on 

> this...as they should, who wants to claim that they created such 

> destructive weapons? well i guess some do... 

> 

1357

a few pages later he mentions the stress they must go through, those 

> that take credit for such creations (287). "i did it, no i did it, no 

> it was me." fight all you want boys, in the end you have destroyed our 

> world. 

> 

> how powerful are nuclear weapons when at this point we arent the only 

> ones with them? we destroy them, they destroy us, we just go in 

> circles. i guess its time to build bigger and better ones. great idea, 

> lets build something so powerful that we can commit world wide suicide. 

> isnt that all this is? 

> 

> if you were in my class, you read (or pretended to read) routine 

> contaminations. in all honesty, i loved this book. i highly recommend 

> it and i think theres a lot to be said for nuclear testing. 

> 

> if you didnt already know, we build these bombs and then we test them on 

> our own people, on our own military. and each test gets more and more 

> dangerous. 

> 

> do you remember the scenes from nightbreaker? if you didnt see it, i 

> highly recommend this too. its a wake up call to those of us who dont 

> care about the weapons the world has made or what we do with them. 

> 

> so my thought on sagan's chapter and my class last semester, these 

> scientists have sinned a sin that affects the entire world, not just 

> them. 

> 

> now i could give the all original miss america speech that i want world 

> peace, but thats not gonna happen. so i guess i have nothing to say but 

> be aware. know how stupid these weapons are and the stupid choices 

> america has made with them. 

> 

> 

> 

> 


> 

> 

> 

> 


1358






It all depends how something is used, and what the intention is behind it. We also get electricity from 

nuclear power, which probably came about because of what they learned by building defense 

weapons. Of course, not everyone thinks nulear energy is good, but until they start putting windmills 

up in their backyards, it is one source that provides lots of people with the power they need/want. 

Keep in mind, "Routine Contaminations" was written from a very biased viewpoint and may not 

necessarily be all fact. 

Cynthia 


thanks louise for sharing that with me. theres no doubt that these scientists developed something 

that is incredible, devastating and beautiful. and it took smarts in order to do that. but i do wish 

they never did. you were in that class and you seem to agree. but it is interesting that you pointed 

out the bomb put an end to a potentially ongoing war. very interesting. 

> 

> From: "Randy& Louise Tweed" 

> Date: 2004/03/19 Fri PM 03:44:39 PST 

> To: 


> 

> Hi Karis, 

> 




> that his research and work was beneficial to mankind. I wo uld argue 













> 


> From: karisanne@adelph ia.net [mailto:karisanne@adelphia.net] 




> 

1359



> 





> 





> 


> credit for those applications of s cience that enrich our lives, but to 




> 

> a few pages later he mentions the stress they must go through, those 



> world. 

> 






> 


> contaminations. in all honesty, i loved this book. i hig hly recommend 


> 



> dangerous. 

> 




> 



> them. 

> 





> 

> 

1360

BR>> 


> 

> 

> 

> 




1361





Subject: Keep your chins up 

I want to remind everyone, including myself.... 

Nobody can be an expert in everything....NOT EVEN TEACHERS.... it's not IF we are smart, it's 

HOW we are smart... You do not have to know everything about a topic to teach someone about it. 

My Dad taught me to whistle without being able to do it himself. As teachers we will have areas that 

we are stronger in (more than others), and the areas that we struggle in, we will learn ways to explain 

them and we will be learning more about them too. Sometimes, we will be learning right along with 

our students. 

Everyday is an opportunity to learn something new, or something different about something you 

thought you already knew. 

Do the BEST you can do, and that's all you can do..... No more, no less... 

Ann 



1362






Hey Laurie, 

I am not going to VPA. If we need to be at the school and be ready to rock-n-roll by 12:00, and we 

have never been to this school.... we need to allow a little extra time. If we go to VPA, it cuts it too 

close. I am not going to go. I wonder if this science fair was set up assuming that all of us don't have 

any other classes before our cohort classes? It puts us in quite a pickle if you ask me.... 

Ann 


So speaking to the VPA people in the cohort, are anyone of you going to go to 

class for like a half hour or 45 minutes and then leave, or are you guys just 

not going to show up at all? Please let me know what you guys are going to do. 

Thanks! 

Laurie :) 


>thanks cynthia for asking for us. 

>> 

>> From: Cynthia Reyes 

>> Date: 2004/03/18 Thu PM 12:35:59 PST 

>> To: journal 

>> Subject: VPA class on monday 

>> 

>> Those of you in the Arts/education class, Merryl said she would let us out 

early. I take that as a no on not showing up at all, however, do what you need 

to do. 

>> Cynthia 

>> 


>> Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, les s spam 

>> 

> 




1363






I think everyone should have their own windmill in each of their yards, balconies, or rooftops... Just 

think, we could generate our own energy.... 

Ann 


It all depends how something is used, and what the intention is behind it. We also get electricity 

from nuclear power, which probably came about because of what they learned by building 

defense weapons. Of course, not everyone thinks nulear energy is good, but until they start 

putting windmills up in their backyards, it is one source that provides lots of people with the power 

they need/want. Keep in mind, "Routine Contaminations" was written from a very biased viewpoint 

and may not necessarily be all fact. 

Cynthia 



something that is incredible, devastating and beautiful. and it took smarts in order to do that. 

but i do wish they never did. you were in that class and you seem to agree. but it is interesting 

that you pointed out the bomb put an end to a potentially ongoing war. very interesting. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/19 Fri PM 03:44:39 PST 

> To: 


> 

> Hi Karis, 

> 

















1364






> 

> 



> 





> 





> 






> 




> world. 

> 






> 




> 



> dangerous. 

> 




> 



> them. 

1365





> 

> 

> & lt; BR>> 


> 

> 

> 

> 






1366






Yes, and it would be FREE!!!! And you could sell your extra to the electric company. 

Cynthia 


I think everyone should have their own windmill in each of their yards, balconies, or rooftops... 

Just think, we could generate our own energy.... 

Ann 


It all depends how something is used, and what the intention is behind it. We also get 

electricity from nuclear power, which probably came about because of what they learned by 

building defense weapons. Of course, not everyone thinks nulear energy is good, but until they 

start putting windmills up in their backyards, it is one source that provides lots of people with 

the power they need/want. Keep in mind, "Routine Contaminations" was written from a very 

biased viewpoint and may not necessarily be all fact. 

Cynthia 



something that is incredible, devastating and beautiful. and it took smarts in order to do 

that. but i do wish they never did. you were in that class and you seem to agree. but it is 

interesting that you pointed out the bomb put an end to a potentially ongoing war. very 

interesting. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/19 Fri PM 03:44:39 PST 

> To: 


> 

> Hi Karis, 

> 











1367

like most scientists, I'm sure, believe that what they are doing is for 






> 






> 

> 



> 





> 





> 






> 




> world. 

> 






> 




> 



> dangerous. 

> 


1368

highly recommend this too. its a wake up call to those of us who dont 


> 



> them. 

> 





> 

> 

> & amp; lt; BR>> 


> 

> 

> 

> 








1369





Subject: Re: Keep your chins up 

Being smart means knowing where to get the info. Just make sure you understand it before you try to 

teach it. Doing a practice run through is a must do. 

And what is that saying anyway? Those who can do, those who can't teach? LOL 

Cynthia 


I want to remind everyone, including myself.... 

Nobody can be an expert in everything....NOT EVEN TEACHERS.... it's not IF we are smart, it's 

HOW we are smart... You do not have to know everything about a topic to teach someone about 

it. My Dad taught me to whistle without being able to do it himself. As teachers we will have 

areas that we are stronger in (more than others), and the areas that we struggle in, we will learn 

ways to explain them and we will be learning more about them too. Sometimes, we will be learning 

right along with our students. 

Everyday is an opportunity to learn something new, or something different about something you 

thought you already knew. 

Do the BEST you can do, and that's all you can do..... No more, no less... 

Ann 





1370






thanks for the reminder of the biased book! of course i agree with her cuz i liked the 

book, thought it was well written adn interesting, so i fell into her trap. : ) 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/19 Fri PM 05:02:47 PST 


> Subject: Re: louise 

> 

> It all depends how something is used, and what the intention is behind it. We also get 

electricity from nuclear power, which probably came about because of what they learned by 

building defense weapons. Of course, not everyone thinks nulear energy is good, but until 

they start putting windmills up in their backyards, it is one source that provides lots 

of people with the power they need/want. Keep in mind, "Routine Contaminations" was 

written from a very biased viewpoint and may not necessarily be all fact. 

> Cynthia 

> 


> thanks louise for sharing that with me. theres no doubt that these scientists developed 

something that is incredible, devastating and beautiful. and it took smarts in order to do 

that. but i do wish they never did. you were in that class and you seem to agree. but it 

is interesting that you pointed out the bomb put an end to a potentially ongoing war. very 

interesting. 

> > 

> > From: "Randy& Louise Tweed" 

> > Date: 2004/03/19 Fri PM 03:44:39 PST 

> > To: 

> > Subject: RE: nuclear testing 

> > 

> > Hi Karis, 

> > 

> > My grandfather (now deceased) was a scientist who worked with the 

> > development of the nuclear bomb. Because he was under some secrecy act, 

> > he couldn't divulge much information to me, but it was clear he felt 

> > that his research and work was beneficial to mankind. I would argue 

> > with him about the devastating effects that nuclear bombs could and have 

> > had. He would always point out Hiroshima and Nagasaki and say that the 

> > nuclear bombs are what ended the war with Japan, and that potentially 

> > more people could have been killed if the war had continued. After 

> > reading the Contaminations book and seeing the movie Nightbreaker, I'm 

> > even more convinced that nuclear bombs are NOT the way to go. Sagan, 

> > like most scientists, I'm sure, believe that what they are doing is for 

> > the benefit of the world and that they don't necessarily see what the 

> > potential affects could be even decades after their "brilliant science" 

> > has been unleashed. This is another one of those topics I could waffle 

> > on about, but again I will quietly slip off my soap box and continue 

> > studying for my bio midterm. ~ Louise 

> > 

> > -----Original Message----- 

> > From: karisanne@adelphia.net [mailto:karisanne@adelphia.net] 

> > Sent: Friday, March 19, 2004 1:14 PM 


> > Subject: nuclear testing 

> > 

> > 

> > ok mike, this may not tie in to your new teaching-talk-only journals, 

> > but i gotta branch out. 

1371

> > sagan's chapter on scientists' sin got me thinking about a class last 

> > semester. a lot of you took it too, whether or not you showed up is 

> > another story. but there was a brief moment when this class meant 

> > something to me. when i learned about all the nuclear bomb testing. 

> > 

> > sagan talks about the nuclear, hydrogen, thermonuclear weapons that 

> > brilliant scientists created. yes, they are brilliant, but how stupid 

> > can you be? creating weapons so powerful they can destroy miles and 

> > miles of life. what a good idea. 

> > 

> > sagan says, "sometimes scientists try to have it both ways: to take 

> > credit for those applications of science that enrich our lives, but to 

> > distance themselves from the instruments of death" (283). my thought on 

> > this...as they should, who wants to claim that they created such 

> > destructive weapons? well i guess some do... 

> > 

> > a few pages later he mentions the stress they must go through, those 

> > that take credit for such creations (287). "i did it, no i did it, no 

> > it was me." fight all you want boys, in the end you have destroyed our 

> > world. 

> > 

> > how powerful are nuclear weapons when at this point we arent the only 

> > ones with them? we destroy them, they destroy us, we just go in 

> > circles. i guess its time to build bigger and better ones. great idea, 

> > lets build something so powerful that we can commit world wide suicide. 

> > isnt that all this is? 

> > 

> > if you were in my class, you read (or pretended to read) routine 

> > contaminations. in all honesty, i loved this book. i highly recommend 

> > it and i think theres a lot to be said for nuclear testing. 

> > 

> > if you didnt already know, we build these bombs and then we test them on 

> > our own people, on our own military. and each test gets more and more 

> > dangerous. 

> > 

> > do you remember the scenes from nightbreaker? if you didnt see it, i 

> > highly recommend this too. its a wake up call to those of us who dont 

> > care about the weapons the world has made or what we do with them. 

> > 

> > so my thought on sagan's chapter and my class last semester, these 

> > scientists have sinned a sin that affects the entire world, not just 

> > them. 

> > 

> > now i could give the all original miss america speech that i want world 

> > peace, but thats not gonna happen. so i guess i have nothing to say but 

> > be aware. know how stupid these weapons are and the stupid choices 

> > america has made with them. 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 


> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> 


> 



> 


1372

1373





Subject: Re: RE: VPA class on monday 

im going to VPA b/c ive missed it twice so i dont want to miss again and i will leave the 

soonest she says we can leave. although i do think its a pain in the butt that i gotta 

get up and drive out there and fight for a parking spot just for 45 minutes or so. i 

think joey's going too, since hes in the same boat as me and we're gonna ride out 

together. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/19 Fri PM 05:40:42 PST 


> Subject: RE: VPA class on monday 

> 

> Hey Laurie, 

> 

> I am not going to VPA. If we need to be at the school and be ready to rock-n-roll by 

12:00, and we have never been to this school.... we need to allow a little extra time. If 

we go to VPA, it cuts it too close. I am not going to go. I wonder if this science fair 

was set up assuming that all of us don't have any other classes before our cohort classes? 

It puts us in quite a pickle if you ask me.... 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> mcdon032 wrote: 

> So speaking to the VPA people in the cohort, are anyone of you going to go to 

> class for like a half hour or 45 minutes and then leave, or are you guys just 

> not going to show up at all? Please let me know what you guys are going to do. 

> Thanks! 

> 

> Laurie :) 

> 

> >===== Original Message From ===== 

> >thanks cynthia for asking for us. 

> >> 

> >> From: Cynthia Reyes 

> >> Date: 2004/03/18 Thu PM 12:35:59 PST 

> >> To: journal 

> >> Subject: VPA class on monday 

> >> 

> >> Those of you in the Arts/education class, Merryl said she would let us out 

> early. I take that as a no on not showing up at all, however, do what you need 

> to do. 

> >> Cynthia 

> >> 

> >> Do you Yahoo!? 

> >> Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam 

> >> 

> > 


> 

> 



> 


1374

1375




To: journal 

Subject: metacognition on trial 

My attempt at combining 2 readings (sagan: skeptic and bruer: novice) into 1 book report: 

"How to encourage creativity and skepticism while building metacognition skills in one easy lesson" 

Give students a problem. Have them brainstorm very creative (wild, outlandish) solutions for the 

problem. Without any instruction, they should be able to eliminate the weakest solutions using "weak 

methods". Next model the use of skepticism with one of your own "creative" solutions, concluding with 

a "strong method" of problem solving. (Don't use a solution that will hold up to scrutiny).Now have 

students scrutinize their remaining solutions. Finally, have them hold mock classroom hearings to 

demonstrate how they disproved the solutions and/or solved the problem. End of lesson. 

*Feel free to scrutiniza my lesson idea and find the flaws in my creativity. 

Cynthia 


Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. 

1376






Subject: Journal 9? What is a Professional? 

For those of you who did not attend class on Wednesday, Prof.. Y. talked about 

being and professional and what makes one. I was very interested in what he 

described a professional as. I also noticed that some people eagerly agreed 

with his definition. A professional is one who writes well and can back up 

those thoughts. Just like a scientist that must prove and convince his/her 

validation are correct. I went home with the new found revelation of creating 

a masterpiece that would proved to him and other members of the cohort what a 

true professional I can be. But I got to thinking and started wondering if 

that's all there is to being a professional. A professional is one who can 

write well and back up those thoughts - like the uni-bomber. He had a 

manuscript that was very detailed in his thoughts, was written well, and 

backed up his ideas with sound logic. He might of been a genius or crazy 

(aren't all scientists thought of that way). Then I decided that being a 

professional isn't all about writing with examples. To me a professional is 

one who faces obstacles and overcomes them. A professional is not in the hand, 

but in the mind. 

Please excuse the fact that a wrote in the first sense. A lot of times I think 

about what is said in class and take it home with me. 

1377





Subject: science in the classroom 

Last night while I was at work, I was watching the channel 15(i think) news. 

(I know that you are all jealous that I got paid to watch the news.) The news 

was showing a elementary school and middle school, here in rancho san diego) 

that science program was funded by NASA. The kids were making rockets, and a 

tunnel that had no gravity, so they knew what it felt like to be in space. The 

program was awesome!! Unfortunately, that was all I got because my devils 

began cussing at each other over the phone and then one swung at the other, 

which is about the same time that one of my studnts walked out of the facility 

and disappeared. (ANd you thought I watched tv all night long.)Sorry about the 

lack of details!I just wanted you all to know that somewhere out there 

wonderful and exciting science programs are being implemented. Also, when we 

grow up and become teachers, look for other programs to fund our passions. My 

dad's company in michigan used to fund the midland public schools science 

program. The company even had a day where teacher came into the lab and were 

taught simple projects they could bring back to the classroom. 

1378





Subject: Re: science in the classroom 

Sounds like a great program. Wouldn't it be cool if someone started a science program similar to 

SUAVE only with scientists? They could work with teachers, come into the classroom and lead 

experiments and really get students interested in science. Maybe we could put Lowee in charge of 

this new program. Or maybe it already exists, I will keep you posted on what I find out. 

Cynthia 


Last night while I was at work, I was watching the channel 15(i think) news. 

(I know that you are all jealous that I got paid to watch the news.) The news 

was showing a elementary school and middle school, here in rancho san diego) 

that science program was funded by NASA. The kids were making rockets, and a 

tunnel that had no gravity, so they knew what it felt like to be in space. The 

program was awesome!! Unfortunately, that was all I got because my devils 

began cussing at each other over the phone and then one swung at the other, 

which is about the same time that one of my studnts walked out of the facility 

and disappeared. (ANd you thought I watched tv all night long.)Sorry about the 

lack of details!I just wanted you all to know that somewhere out there 

wonderful and exciting science programs are being implemented. Also, when we 

gr ow up and become teachers, look for other programs to fund our passions. My 

dad's company in michigan used to fund the midland public schools science 

program. The company even had a day where teacher came into the lab and were 

taught simple projects they could bring back to the classroom. 



1379




To: LBST 361B 

Subject: KIDS IN CHURCH 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 

A little boy was overheard praying: 

"Lord, if you can't make me a better boy, don't worry about it. 

I'm having a real good time like I am." 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 

A Sunday school class was studying the Ten Commandments. 

They were ready to discuss the last one. 

The teacher asked if anyone could tell her what it was. 

Susie raised her hand, stood tall, and quoted, "Thou shall not take the 

covers off the neighbor's wife." 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 

After the christening of his baby brother in church, Jason sobbed all the 

way home in the back seat of the car. 

His father asked him three times what was wrong. 

Finally, the boy replied, "That preacher said he wanted us brought up in a 

Christian home, and I wanted to stay with you guys." 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 

One particular four-year-old prayed, 

"And forgive us our trash baskets 

as we forgive those who put trash in our baskets." 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 

A Sunday school teacher asked her children, as they were on the way 

to church service, "And why is it necessary to be quiet in church?" 

One bright little girl replied, "Because people are sleeping." 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 

Six-year-old Angie and her four-year-old brother Joel were sitting 

together in church. Joel giggled, sang, and talked out loud. 

Finally, his big sister had had enough. 

"You're not supposed to talk out loud in church." 

"Why? Who's going to stop me?" Joel asked. 

Angie pointed to the back of the church and said, "See those two men standing 

by the door? They're hushers." 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 

A mother was preparing pancakes for her sons, Kevin, 5 and Ryan, 3. 

The boys began to argue over who would get the first pancake. 

Their mother saw the opportunity for a moral lesson. 

"If Jesus were sitting here, He would say, 'Let my brother have the first 

pancake, I can wait.'" 

Kevin turned to his younger brother and said, "Ryan, you be Jesus!" 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 

A father was at the beach with his children when the four-year-old son ran 

up to him, grabbed his hand, and led him to the shore where a seagull lay 

dead in the sand. 

"Daddy, what happened to him?" the son asked. 

"He died and went to Heaven," the Dad replied. 

The boy thought a moment and then said, "Did God throw him back down?" 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 

A wife invited some people to dinner. At the table, she turned to 

their six-year-old daughter and said, "Would you like to say the 

blessing?" 

"I wouldn't know what to say," the girl replied. 

"Just say what you hear Mommy say," the wife answered. 

The daughter bowed her head and said, "Lord, why on earth did I 

invite all these people to dinner?" 

1380

1381





Subject: RE: science in the classroom 

Sounds like Teresa's dad should hold a mini science fair for our cohort. I'm 

up for learning some simple scince projects that can be used in the 

classrrom. Teresa, field trip to your dad's lab? LOL. You said it is so fun 

playing around with all the cool stuff. (kidding). 

Jennifer 

>From: summe004 



>Subject: science in the classroom 

>Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 08:06:06 -0800 

> 

>Last night while I was at work, I was watching the channel 15(i think) 

>news. 

>(I know that you are all jealous that I got paid to watch the news.) The 

>news 

>was showing a elementary school and middle school, here in rancho san 

>diego) 

>that science program was funded by NASA. The kids were making rockets, and 

>a 

>tunnel that had no gravity, so they knew what it felt like to be in space. 

>The 

>program was awesome!! Unfortunately, that was all I got because my devils 

>began cussing at each other over the phone and then one swung at the other, 

>which is about the same time that one of my studnts walked out of the 

>facility 

>and disappeared. (ANd you thought I watched tv all night long.)Sorry about 

>the 

> lack of details!I just wanted you all to know that somewhere out there 

>wonderful and exciting science programs are being implemented. Also, when 

>we 

>grow up and become teachers, look for other programs to fund our passions. 

>My 

>dad's company in michigan used to fund the midland public schools science 

>program. The company even had a day where teacher came into the lab and 

>were 

>taught simple projects they could bring back to the classroom. 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Get tax tips, tools and access to IRS forms – all in one place at MSN Money! 

http://moneycentral.msn.com/tax/home.asp 

1382





Subject: RE: Jane's Journal 9? What is a Professional? 

Jane's thoughts on professionalism and what it means to be a professional 

are valid and supported. However, there are so many different definitions of 

a "professional". The definition of professional should be: 

professional 

def. subjective 

Whether or not one is professional is very subjective. It all depends on who 

is the judging the professional. Haven't there ever been times when one 

thought that their behaviors or actions taken were professional? When come 

to find out, maybe they weren't exactly considered professional. Should 

professional athletes be considered professional? There are some that are 

not considered to be so. Should professional business people be considered 

professional? Martha Stewart, Enron? 

What does it mean to be professional. Even when one thinks he or she is a 

professional, there is always someone who doesn't believe so. So when is it 

that one is really a "professional"? If ever. 

Ponder... 


>From: lebla003 


>To: lebla003@csusm.edu 

>CC: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

>Subject: Journal 9? What is a Professional? 

>Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 07:37:39 -0800 

> 

>For those of you who did not attend class on Wednesday, Prof.. Y. talked 

>about 

>being and professional and what makes one. I was very interested in what he 

>described a professional as. I also noticed that some people eagerly agreed 

>with his definition. A professional is one who writes well and can back up 

>those thoughts. Just like a scientist that must prove and convince his/her 

>validation are correct. I went home with the new found revelation of 

>creating 

>a masterpiece that would proved to him and other members of the cohort what 

>a 

>true professional I can be. But I got to thinking and started wondering if 

>that's all there is to being a professional. A professional is one who can 

>write well and back up those thoughts - like the uni-bomber. He had a 

>manuscript that was very detailed in his thoughts, was written well, and 

>backed up his ideas with sound logic. He might of been a genius or crazy 

>(aren't all scientists thought of that way). Then I decided that being a 

>professional isn't all about writing with examples. To me a professional is 

>one who faces obstacles and overcomes them. A professional is not in the 

>hand, 

>but in the mind. 

>Please excuse the fact that a wrote in the first sense. A lot of times I 

>think 

>about what is said in class and take it home with me. 

> 

> 

1383

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1384





Subject: ENC Science Teacher Center 

Looking for a really awesome website for science and math teachers? Well, 

look no further than the Eisenhower National Clearinghouse website: 

www.enc.org 

I stumbled upon this website while looking over Dr. Ochanji's syllabus. What 

a great resource! It is geared as being a useful resource that contains web 

links, education topics, curriculum resources, and professional development. 

But these are just some of the topics, there is so much more on the website 

and it is easy to understand and navigate. 

My explanation of the site does not do justice. Check it out now! You'll 

love it! I love it! 

www.enc.org 


_________________________________________________________________ 

Check out MSN PC Safety & Security to help ensure your PC is protected and 

safe. http://specials.msn.com/msn/security.asp 

1385




To: Jennifer Ramos; ICP-F 

Subject: RE: science in the classroom 

You know, I should ask!! I know that people from Italy, France, and Brazil are 

coming the next couple weeks, to see if there product can be sold in those 

places. So, it might be a while. Maybe we can all wear the lab coats too!! 

That's the coooooooollllllest! 

Teresa 

>Sounds like Teresa's dad should hold a mini science fair for our cohort. I'm 

>up for learning some simple scince projects that can be used in the 

>classrrom. Teresa, field trip to your dad's lab? LOL. You said it is so fun 

>playing around with all the cool stuff. (kidding). 

> 

>Jennifer 

> 

> 

>>From: summe004 



>>Subject: science in the classroom 

>>Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 08:06:06 -0800 

>> 

>>Last night while I was at work, I was watching the channel 15(i think) 

>>news. 

>>(I know that you are all jealous that I got paid to watch the news.) The 

>>news 

>>was showing a elementary school and middle school, here in rancho san 

>>diego) 

>>that science program was funded by NASA. The kids were making rockets, and 

>>a 

>>tunnel that had no gravity, so they knew what it felt like to be in space. 

>>The 

>>program was awesome!! Unfortunately, that was all I got because my devils 

>>began cussing at each other over the phone and then one swung at the other, 

>>which is about the same time that one of my studnts walked out of the 

>>facility 

>>and disappeared. (ANd you thought I watched tv all night long.)Sorry about 

>>the 

>> lack of details!I just wanted you all to know that somewhere out there 

>>wonderful and exciting science programs are being implemented. Also, when 

>>we 

>>grow up and become teachers, look for other programs to fund our passions. 

>>My 

>>dad's company in michigan used to fund the midland public schools science 

>>program. The company even had a day where teacher came into the lab and 

>>were 

>>taught simple projects they could bring back to the classroom. 

>> 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Get tax tips, tools and access to IRS forms – all in one place at MSN Money! 

>http://moneycentral.msn.com/tax/home.asp 

1386





Subject: Re: ENC Science Teacher Center 

You can also sign up to get email newsletters from this site. Cynthia 


Looking for a really awesome website for science and math teachers? Well, 

look no further than the Eisenhower National Clearinghouse website: 

www.enc.org 

I stumbled upon this website while looking over Dr. Ochanji's syllabus. What 

a great resource! It is geared as being a useful resource that contains web 

links, education topics, curriculum resources, and professional development. 

But these are just some of the topics, there is so much more on the website 

and it is easy to understand and navigate. 

My explanation of the site does not do justice. Check it out now! You'll 

love it! I love it! 

www.enc.org 


_________________________________________________________________ 





1387






I think that I am going to go, but ask Goldberg how soon she would let us out 

early since we have the science fair. At the latest we should leave class 

around 10:45am to be safe. 

Laurie :) 


>im going to VPA b/c ive missed it twice so i dont want to miss again and i 

will leave the soonest she says we can leave. although i do think its a pain 

in the butt that i gotta get up and drive out there and fight for a parking 

spot just for 45 minutes or so. i think joey's going too, since hes in the 

same boat as me and we're gonna ride out together. 

>> 

>> From: Ann Kirkendall 

>> Date: 2004/03/19 Fri PM 05:40:42 PST 


>> Subject: RE: VPA class on monday 

>> 

>> Hey Laurie, 

>> 

>> I am not going to VPA. If we need to be at the school and be ready to 

rock-n-roll by 12:00, and we have never been to this school.... we need to 

allow a little extra time. If we go to VPA, it cuts it too close. I am not 

going to go. I wonder if this science fair was set up assuming that all of us 

don't have any other classes before our cohort classes? It puts us in quite a 

pickle if you ask me.... 

>> 

>> Ann 

>> 

>> mcdon032 wrote: 

>> So speaking to the VPA people in the cohort, are anyone of you going to go 

to 

>> class for like a half hour or 45 minutes and then leave, or are you guys 

just 

>> not going to show up at all? Please let me know what you guys are going to 

do. 

>> Thanks! 

>> 

>> Laurie :) 

>> 

>> >===== Original Message From ===== 

>> >thanks cynthia for asking for us. 

>> >> 

>> >> From: Cynthia Reyes 

>> >> Date: 2004/03/18 Thu PM 12:35:59 PST 

>> >> To: journal 

>> >> Subject: VPA class on monday 

>> >> 

>> >> Those of you in the Arts/education class, Merryl said she would let us 

out 

>> early. I take that as a no on not showing up at all, however, do what you 

need 

>> to do. 

>> >> Cynthia 

>> >> 

>> >> Do you Yahoo!? 

1388


>> >> 

>> > 

>> >-karis kroeker- 

>> 

>> 



>> 

> 


1389





Subject: RE: Jane's Journal 9? What is a Professional? 

Quick definitions (Profession) 

• noun: an occupation requiring special education (especially in the liberal arts or sciences) 

• noun: affirmation of acceptance of some religion or faith (Example: "A profession of Christianity") 

• noun: an open avowal (true or false) of some belief or opinion (Example: "A profession of 

disagreement") 

• noun: the body of people in a learned occupation 

I also looked at the definitions for "professional". It doesn't say you actually have to be good at 

anything. 


Jane's thoughts on professionalism and what it means to be a professional 

are valid and supported. However, there are so many different definitions of 

a "professional". The definition of professional should be: 

professional 

def. subjective 

Whether or not one is professional is very subjective. It all depends on who 

is the judging the professional. Haven't there ever been times when one 

thought that their behaviors or actions taken were professional? When come 

to find out, maybe they weren't exactly considered professional. Should 

professional athletes be considered professional? There are some that are 

not considered to be so. Should professional business people be considered 

professional? Martha Stewart, Enron? 

What does it mean to be professional. Even when one thinks he or she is a 

professional, there is always som eone who doesn't believe so. So when is it 

that one is really a "professional"? If ever. 

Ponder... 


>From: lebla003 


>To: lebla003@csusm.edu 

1390

CC: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

>Subject: Journal 9? What is a Professional? 

>Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 07:37:39 -0800 

> 

>For those of you who did not attend class on Wednesday, Prof.. Y. talked 

>about 

>being and professional and what makes one. I was very interested in what he 

>described a professional as. I also noticed that some people eagerly agreed 

>with his definition. A professional is one who writes well and can back up 

>those thoughts. Just like a scientist that must prove and convince his/her 

>validation are correct. I went home with the new found revelation of 

>creating 

>a masterpiece that would proved to him and other members of the cohort what 

>a 

>tru e professional I can be. But I got to thinking and started wondering if 

>that's all there is to being a professional. A professional is one who can 

>write well and back up those thoughts - like the uni-bomber. He had a 

>manuscript that was very detailed in his thoughts, was written well, and 

>backed up his ideas with sound logic. He might of been a genius or crazy 

>(aren't all scientists thought of that way). Then I decided that being a 

>professional isn't all about writing with examples. To me a professional is 

>one who faces obstacles and overcomes them. A professional is not in the 

>hand, 

>but in the mind. 

>Please excuse the fact that a wrote in the first sense. A lot of times I 

>think 

>about what is said in class and take it home with me. 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 


(Limited-time offer) http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/ 



1391






Laurie, 

I'll plan on being parked in the circle for around 10:30 a.m. Monday. 

Do you know how to get to the school? Do we have directions from Prof. 

Ochanji? Perhaps we could follow someone who is also going to your VPA 

class. Let me know about directions. Thanks. ~ Louise 






I think that I am going to go, but ask Goldberg how soon she would let 

us out 

early since we have the science fair. At the latest we should leave 

class 

around 10:45am to be safe. 

Laurie :) 


>im going to VPA b/c ive missed it twice so i dont want to miss again 

>and i 

will leave the soonest she says we can leave. although i do think its a 

pain 

in the butt that i gotta get up and drive out there and fight for a 

parking 

spot just for 45 minutes or so. i think joey's going too, since hes in 

the 

same boat as me and we're gonna ride out together. 

>> 

>> From: Ann Kirkendall 

>> Date: 2004/03/19 Fri PM 05:40:42 PST 


>> Subject: RE: VPA class on monday 

>> 

>> Hey Laurie, 

>> 

>> I am not going to VPA. If we need to be at the school and be ready 

>> to 

rock-n-roll by 12:00, and we have never been to this school.... we need 

to 

allow a little extra time. If we go to VPA, it cuts it too close. I am 

not 

going to go. I wonder if this science fair was set up assuming that all 

of us 

don't have any other classes before our cohort classes? It puts us in 

quite a 

pickle if you ask me.... 

>> 

>> Ann 

>> 

>> mcdon032 wrote: 

>> So speaking to the VPA people in the cohort, are anyone of you going 

1392

to go 

to 

>> class for like a half hour or 45 minutes and then leave, or are you 

>> guys 

just 

>> not going to show up at all? Please let me know what you guys are 

>> going to 

do. 

>> Thanks! 

>> 

>> Laurie :) 

>> 

>> >===== Original Message From ===== 

>> >thanks cynthia for asking for us. 

>> >> 

>> >> From: Cynthia Reyes 

>> >> Date: 2004/03/18 Thu PM 12:35:59 PST 

>> >> To: journal 

>> >> Subject: VPA class on monday 

>> >> 

>> >> Those of you in the Arts/education class, Merryl said she would 

>> >> let us 

out 

>> early. I take that as a no on not showing up at all, however, do what 

>> you 

need 

>> to do. 

>> >> Cynthia 

>> >> 

>> >> Do you Yahoo!? 

>> >> Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam 

>> >> 

>> > 

>> >-karis kroeker- 

>> 

>> 



>> 

> 


1393





Subject: Journal #(X-Y)+1 

Where X equals the total number of journals I will write and Y equals those 

I have not yet written. 

I took the CSET today. All 3 tests. It took me 2 hours and 50 minutes, which 

includes a bathroom break, and sufficient spacing out time. 

Here's the rundown: 

Test 1: 

52 multiple choice questions, 26 of which are about English and 26 of which 

are about History. The English portion is incredibly easy. The short answer 

questions included a sample of a 2nd grade child's writing after hearing 

words spoken aloud. The child was spelling everything phonetically (written 

was ritn, etc) , and you had to say what that said about their development. 

Also, there was a short exerpt from a book that personified Spring and 

Books, and you had to talk about how personification was used. The history 

portion was 26 multiple choice and 2 short answer's worth of the biggest 

heaping pile of bullshit I have ever laid out on paper. I should have 

brought an actual bull, it would have saved time. The first short answer 

asked what Confucius's ideas were for post-war ancient china, and how those 

ideas helped to shape Chinese society of the time. ... The onluy thing I 

know about Confucius is that "Confucius say: Man who stand on toilet, high 

on pot." Thanks to the Sam Goody bumper sticker. The other one was about 

California's geography, and how 3 features of it influenced Californian 

society from Pre-Columbian times to 1848 (just so we couldnt mention gold, 

the bastards). 

On to Test II: 

26 science questions, 26 math questions. I could be really mean and tell all 

you logicphobes how hard this part was, but it wasn't. The science was 

nowhere near as detailed as the stuff we're doing in the Karas and Lowe 

Variety Hour. The math was all really easy, assuming you know how to find 

area and perimeter, as well as how to multiply. The hardest question on the 

math section required you to use FOIL. Ochanji's class helped me with the 

first science short answer as it was about two kids on an unbalanced seesaw, 

and it asked how they could balance it out. Enter the paper clip experiment. 

I threw in some mass, some fulcrum, some multiply, and some distance, 

mixed it all up, threw it on the page, and waited for my A+. 

Test III OR The Albino, flipper-handed, cleft pallet, stepchild of the CSET 

In other words, this test was a freal that didnt even seem to be part of the 

family. It was 39 multiple choice questions on PE, Art/Music, and Child 

development. Only 3 short answers. All easy, all worthless. 

The only reason I will not pass this test is that it was clearly racially, 

culturally, and genderally (yes that's a word) biased against me. 

When I do pass, do I still have to take all these content courses that are 

supposed to be prepping me for the CSET? If so, will someone be able to 

logically explain why? If i just proved to the state of california that I am 

highly qualified, who is CSUSM to say differently? That's like winning the 

world series then having to try out for little league. 

1394

PS: (non-teaching related topic) 

http://eces.org/articles/000656.php 

And having a windmill in your yard, in hurricane conditions, would yield 

enough electricity to toast pop tarts. Nay, pop tart. 

_________________________________________________________________ 

MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page – FREE 

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1395





Subject: Re: Journal #(X-Y)+1 

So is it really RED energy instead of green energy? And who cares about those darn birds anyway, 

they just poop on your car. LOL Guess there is evil in even the "greenest" intentions. So this raises 

the question: How many cute little birds have been killed by nuclear energy? And while we are at it, 

how many birds (AND more importantly) fish have been killed, or at least poisoned with mercury from 

the coal-fired power plants? Dang, everybody turn off your computers, TVs and every other human 

luxury right now!!!! Let's roll back time to the dark ages, where no animals were harmed. Oh, that's 

right, we still kill them for food. Maybe we should have a mass suicide and leave the little buggers to 

peace and harmony, because we all know they would never think of harming each other, even to 

survive. 

Yes, this is absurd!! Obviously, we need some modern scientists to come up with a new form of 

energy that will be "all living things" friendly. Of course, this new source of "really and truly green" 

energy must be economically advantageous or it will never see the light of day. Calling all scientists 

with a conscience, GET TO WORK!!!! 

Cynthia 







Test 1: 


















1396





Variety Hour. The math was all really easy, assuming you kno w how to find 













When I do pass, do I still have to take all these content c ourses that are 









_________________________________________________________________ 





1397





Subject: Re: Journal #(X-Y)+1 

PS.....Thanks for the rundown on the CSET. Does this mean I better study up on Chinese history and 

pre-american California? Dang. Think you will get graded a K for needs more knowledge on these 

topics? Cynthia 







Test 1: 






















Variety Hour. The math was all really easy, assuming you kno w how to find 






1398








When I do pass, do I still have to take all these content c ourses that are 









_________________________________________________________________ 





1399





Subject: RE: nuclear testing 

I have a feeling that often times scientists are told to create objects such 

as bombs and 

are not told what the use of it is. Just a thought sparked from a movie I once 

saw. Marin 

>Hi Karis, 

> 

>My grandfather (now deceased) was a scientist who worked with the 

>development of the nuclear bomb. Because he was under some secrecy act, 

>he couldn't divulge much information to me, but it was clear he felt 

>that his research and work was beneficial to mankind. I would argue 

>with him about the devastating effects that nuclear bombs could and have 

>had. He would always point out Hiroshima and Nagasaki and say that the 

>nuclear bombs are what ended the war with Japan, and that potentially 

>more people could have been killed if the war had continued. After 

>reading the Contaminations book and seeing the movie Nightbreaker, I'm 

>even more convinced that nuclear bombs are NOT the way to go. Sagan, 

>like most scientists, I'm sure, believe that what they are doing is for 

>the benefit of the world and that they don't necessarily see what the 

>potential affects could be even decades after their "brilliant science" 

>has been unleashed. This is another one of those topics I could waffle 

>on about, but again I will quietly slip off my soap box and continue 

>studying for my bio midterm. ~ Louise 

> 


>From: karisanne@adelphia.net [mailto:karisanne@adelphia.net] 

>Sent: Friday, March 19, 2004 1:14 PM 


>Subject: nuclear testing 

> 

> 

>ok mike, this may not tie in to your new teaching-talk-only journals, 

>but i gotta branch out. 

> 

>sagan's chapter on scientists' sin got me thinking about a class last 

>semester. a lot of you took it too, whether or not you showed up is 

>another story. but there was a brief moment when this class meant 

>something to me. when i learned about all the nuclear bomb testing. 

> 

>sagan talks about the nuclear, hydrogen, thermonuclear weapons that 

>brilliant scientists created. yes, they are brilliant, but how stupid 

>can you be? creating weapons so powerful they can destroy miles and 

>miles of life. what a good idea. 

> 

>sagan says, "sometimes scientists try to have it both ways: to take 

>credit for those applications of science that enrich our lives, but to 

>distance themselves from the instruments of death" (283). my thought on 

>this...as they should, who wants to claim that they created such 

>destructive weapons? well i guess some do... 

> 

>a few pages later he mentions the stress they must go through, those 

>that take credit for such creations (287). "i did it, no i did it, no 

>it was me." fight all you want boys, in the end you have destroyed our 

>world. 

> 

1400

how powerful are nuclear weapons when at this point we arent the only 

>ones with them? we destroy them, they destroy us, we just go in 

>circles. i guess its time to build bigger and better ones. great idea, 

>lets build something so powerful that we can commit world wide suicide. 

>isnt that all this is? 

> 

>if you were in my class, you read (or pretended to read) routine 

>contaminations. in all honesty, i loved this book. i highly recommend 

>it and i think theres a lot to be said for nuclear testing. 

> 

>if you didnt already know, we build these bombs and then we test them on 

>our own people, on our own military. and each test gets more and more 

>dangerous. 

> 

>do you remember the scenes from nightbreaker? if you didnt see it, i 

>highly recommend this too. its a wake up call to those of us who dont 

>care about the weapons the world has made or what we do with them. 

> 

>so my thought on sagan's chapter and my class last semester, these 

>scientists have sinned a sin that affects the entire world, not just 

>them. 

> 

>now i could give the all original miss america speech that i want world 

>peace, but thats not gonna happen. so i guess i have nothing to say but 

>be aware. know how stupid these weapons are and the stupid choices 

>america has made with them. 

> 

> 

> 

> 


1401





Subject: Im gonna flash you! 

Now that I got your attention you can read my journal. Great lesson idea 

Cynthia. After 

reading Sagan Antiscience I came to thinking about how so much can be learned 

about 

science from disproving solutions and also from solving problems. Someone 

earlier 

wrote how scientists are wrong too. When I read that I got the feeling that 

being wrong is 

bad but I do not necessarily believe it is true. My greatest lessons in life 

have been 

learned from realizing I was wrong. In fact I learn more about things when I 

am wrong, for 

one the impact of being wrong really hits home and two it makes my curiousity 

and 

passion grow stronger and I feel an overwhelming need to find better answers. 

Science is amazing because we can prove when something is wrong and after 

realizing 

its falacy we can use science to prove why things are valid. When I see a 

false statment 

recorded next to a valid statement I gain a better understanding why things 

are as they 

are. If we expect to always be right then how will we ever gain the courage to 

learn, love 

or try out new things. "where I was wrong, I was trying to understand a 

distant world from 

a few clues in the absence of thorough spacecraft investigations" (Sagan 257). 

I know 

this quote is a little specific for what i am writing about but it opened up 

my eyes to the 

risks taken when we dare to explore concepts. When we dare to wonder or peice 

together what we know with what we learn we are at risk of coming to faulty 

conclusions. 

Is that bad? Not at all. Nothing is set in stone,well the ten commandments 

but, if we can 

get our brains ticking and turning then eventually we will come closer and 

closer to 

understanding the way things work. "We are all flawed and creatures of our 

time" (Sagan 

259). 

One last random word. I wish I was there in Germany to see Hitlers face when 

Jessie 

Owens won those Olympic events in 1936. Hitler could not handle the fact that 

an African 

American won. He was such a chicken shit that he wouldn't even shake Jessies 

hand. I 

know it was a different era, and against everything Hitler stood for but it is 

just such a 

ignorant forgien idea to me. Blast back at me gang. Warning: this last 

statment was not 

written with thought, purely emotion. A random Journal from a random girl on a 

random 

day at a random time. I must go read on with my best friend Whiskey (my 

kitty). Bye-Bye 

Marin. 

1402

1403





Subject: Re: Im gonna flash you! 

You have a good point, Marin. Maybe if we are always right (or just think we are), we aren't really 

learning anything. I think I will go find something to be wrong about so I don't stagnate here on my 

computer!! 

Cynthia 


Now that I got your attention you can read my journal. Great lesson idea 

Cynthia. After 

reading Sagan Antiscience I came to thinking about how so much can be learned 

about 

science from disproving solutions and also from solving problems. Someone 

earlier 

wrote how scientists are wrong too. When I read that I got the feeling that 

being wrong is 

bad but I do not necessarily believe it is true. My greatest lessons in life 

have been 

learned from realizing I was wrong. In fact I learn more about things when I 

am wrong, for 

one the impact of being wrong really hits home and two it makes my curiousity 

and 

passion grow stronger and I feel an overwhelming need to find better answers. 

Science is amazing because we can prove when something is wrong and after 

realizing 

its falacy we can use science to prove why things a re valid. When I see a 

false statment 

recorded next to a valid statement I gain a better understanding why things 

are as they 

are. If we expect to always be right then how will we ever gain the courage to 

learn, love 

or try out new things. "where I was wrong, I was trying to understand a 

distant world from 

a few clues in the absence of thorough spacecraft investigations" (Sagan 257). 

I know 

this quote is a little specific for what i am writing about but it opened up 

my eyes to the 

risks taken when we dare to explore concepts. When we dare to wonder or peice 

together what we know with what we learn we are at risk of coming to faulty 

conclusions. 

Is that bad? Not at all. Nothing is set in stone,well the ten commandments 

but, if we can 

get our brains ticking and turning then eventually we will come closer and 

closer to 

understanding the way things work. "We are all flawed and creatures of our 

1404

time" (Sa gan 

259). 

One last random word. I wish I was there in Germany to see Hitlers face when 

Jessie 

Owens won those Olympic events in 1936. Hitler could not handle the fact that 

an African 

American won. He was such a chicken shit that he wouldn't even shake Jessies 

hand. I 

know it was a different era, and against everything Hitler stood for but it is 

just such a 


statment was not 

written with thought, purely emotion. A random Journal from a random girl on a 

random 

day at a random time. I must go read on with my best friend Whiskey (my 

kitty). Bye-Bye 

Marin. 



1405




To: Cynthia Reyes; ICP-F@csusm.edu 

Subject: RE: Im gonna flash you! 

Marin, does this mean you're not going to flash us? Cecilia 

>===== Original Message From ICP-F@csusm.edu ===== 

>Now that I got your attention you can read my journal. Great lesson idea 

>Cynthia. After 

>reading Sagan Antiscience I came to thinking about how so much can be learned 

>about 

>science from disproving solutions and also from solving problems. Someone 

>earlier 

>wrote how scientists are wrong too. When I read that I got the feeling that 

>being wrong is 

>bad but I do not necessarily believe it is true. My greatest lessons in life 

>have been 

>learned from realizing I was wrong. In fact I learn more about things when I 

>am wrong, for 

>one the impact of being wrong really hits home and two it makes my curiousity 

>and 

>passion grow stronger and I feel an overwhelming need to find better answers. 

> 

>Science is amazing because we can prove when something is wrong and after 

>realizing 

>its falacy we can use science to prove why things are valid. When I see a 

>false statment 

>recorded next to a valid statement I gain a better understanding why things 

>are as they 

>are. If we expect to always be right then how will we ever gain the courage 

to 

>learn, love 

>or try out new things. "where I was wrong, I was trying to understand a 

>distant world from 

>a few clues in the absence of thorough spacecraft investigations" (Sagan 

257). 

>I know 

>this quote is a little specific for what i am writing about but it opened up 

>my eyes to the 

>risks taken when we dare to explore concepts. When we dare to wonder or peice 

>together what we know with what we learn we are at risk of coming to faulty 

>conclusions. 

>Is that bad? Not at all. Nothing is set in stone,well the ten commandments 

>but, if we can 

>get our brains ticking and turning then eventually we will come closer and 

>closer to 

>understanding the way things work. "We are all flawed and creatures of our 

>time" (Sagan 

>259). 

> 

>One last random word. I wish I was there in Germany to see Hitlers face when 

>Jessie 

>Owens won those Olympic events in 1936. Hitler could not handle the fact that 

>an African 

>American won. He was such a chicken shit that he wouldn't even shake Jessies 

>hand. I 

>know it was a different era, and against everything Hitler stood for but it 

is 

>just such a 

1406


>statment was not 

>written with thought, purely emotion. A random Journal from a random girl on 

a 

>random 

>day at a random time. I must go read on with my best friend Whiskey (my 

>kitty). Bye-Bye 

>Marin. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>>My attempt at combining 2 readings (sagan: skeptic and bruer: novice) into 1 

>book 

>report: 

>>"How to encourage creativity and skepticism while building metacognition 

>skills in one 

>easy lesson" 

>> 

>>Give students a problem. Have them brainstorm very creative (wild, 

>outlandish) 

>solutions for the problem. Without any instruction, they should be able to 

>eliminate the 

>weakest solutions using "weak methods". Next model the use of skepticism with 

>one of 

>your own "creative" solutions, concluding with a "strong method" of problem 

>solving. 

>(Don't use a solution that will hold up to scrutiny).Now have students 

>scrutinize their 

>remaining solutions. Finally, have them hold mock classroom hearings to 

>demonstrate 

>how they disproved the solutions and/or solved the problem. End of lesson. 

>>*Feel free to scrutiniza my lesson idea and find the flaws in my creativity. 

>>Cynthia 

>> 

>> 

>> 


>>Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. 

1407





Subject: Scholastic Books 

Just a reminder for those of you who are ordering -- please bring your order tomorrow. I just found 

out that you can write one check for books ordered from the different catalogues. i.e. write your 

check to "Scholastic" for everything ordered, even if your order includes SeeSaw, Troll, etc. 

See you at the science fair. 

Thank you. ~ Louise 

1408





Subject: physics midterm solutions 

did you all know karas posted the midterm solutions...i could be the last to know, but i 

thought i would let you all know... if youre ready for it. 


1409





Subject: Re: physics midterm solutions 

Thanks, Karis! But now that I looked at it, I think my weekend it ruined!! Or maybe my life. LOL I 

thought I had done ok, but gee, those answers don't look like anything I wrote down. Oh well, a 

physics expert (or even novice) I will never be. I think I will stick to biology. 

Cynthia 


did you all know karas posted the midterm solutions...i could be the last to know, but i thought i 

would let you all know... if youre ready for it. 




1410





Subject: agreed cynthia, agreed 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/21 Sun AM 11:45:56 PST 


> Subject: Re: physics midterm solutions 

> 

> Thanks, Karis! But now that I looked at it, I think my weekend it ruined!! Or maybe my 

life. LOL I thought I had done ok, but gee, those answers don't look like anything I wrote 

down. Oh well, a physics expert (or even novice) I will never be. I think I will stick to 

biology. 

> Cynthia 

> 


> did you all know karas posted the midterm solutions...i could be the last to know, but i 

thought i would let you all know... if youre ready for it. 

> 


> 


> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. 

> 


1411





Subject: The Garden of Your Business 

A friend sent this to me, now I send ity to my friends. Enjoy! 

The Garden of Your Business 

The National Independent Labor Journal-June-1960 

First, plant four rows of peas: 

Presence, promptness, preparation and perseverance. 

Next to these plant three rows of squash: 

Squash gossip, squash indifference, squash criticism. 

Then plant five rows of lettuce: 

Let us obey rules and regulations. 

Let us be true to our obligations. 

Let us be faithful to duty. 

Let us be loyal and unselfish. 

Let us love one another. 

No garden is complete without turnips: 

Turn up for meetings. 

Turn up with a smile. 

Turn up with new ideas. 

Turn up with determination to make everything count 

For something good and worthwhile. 


_________________________________________________________________ 



1412





Subject: My Journal #10 

Journal #10 

After giving a lot of thought to the readings I found a few interesting 

connections to Bruer and Sagan, but also to teaching in general. Bruer 

mentions, 

“we should combine the learning of domain- specific subject matter with the 

learning of general thinking skills, while also making sure that children 

learn to monitor and control their thinking and learning” (p. 52). 

This sounds very much like Sagan’s idea when he wrote: 

“. . . generously open to every notion, dismissing nothing except for good 

reason, but at the same time, and as second nature, demanding stringent 

standards of evidence” (p. 306). 

They may not seem similar to the naked eye, but when put into the perspective 

of the learners and future leaders of our country we want critical thinkers 

that know how to think as have an open mind to new innovative ideas that can 

change the world. Bruer brought up a lot of psychological experiments that I 

know pretty well, although I still consider myself a novice at that. Being 

that I love psychology (especially cognitive psych.) I felt right at home with 

this chapter. I realized that if we could teach our students how to think and 

the process of their own thoughts then we could, ideally, create excellent 

problem solvers. So being kind of good at a lot of things, but knowing how 

you do it and what makes you good at it, will in turn make you good at more 

things. In all honesty, I would rather be good at a lot of things then really 

good at only one or two things. I wouldn’t want to be responsible for the 

Hydrogen bomb or being a really good chess player responsible for saving a 

country from mass destruction. 

Sense or nonsense? 

-Chula 

1413


From: Jennifer Ramos [ramos039@csusm.edu] 


To: LIST-SERVER 

Subject: Jennifer's Journal 9 - Skeptical wonder 

Skeptical wonder... 

Sagan is a proponent of teaching children to be skeptical and wondrous as a 

part of their public education (p. 306). I actually find myself agreeing with 

this thought. Is there a way to teach students not to believe everything that 

they marvel at? 

I truly believe that the wonder should be brought back in to the classroom. 

Children learn best when they are intrigued and interested in science that is 

fascinating and appealing to their senses. I think most of us feel the same 

way, since it is being taught in our teaching and learning courses here at 

CSUSM. We are being taught to engage the students into lessons with creative 

and exploratory anticipatory sets. We are being encouraged to teach against 

tradition and liven things us a bit. Whether it is a traditional lesson with 

more pizzazz to make it cooler, or a newer lesson that teaches a traditional 

concept in a stunning way, we are trying to bring the wonder back into 

education. Although, just because we are teaching new material, doesn't mean 

that students shouldn't doubt the subject matter and its validity. 

So along with this new found sense of wonder, students also need to learn to 

be a little wary as well. After all, with all of the tricks, misguidance, and 

being made fools of throughout our lives, hopefully by now, we as adults have 

learned to be a bit more skeptical at times. Honestly, do you believe 

everything you hear or everything that has been told to you as the truth? I 

didn't think so. But a young student might believe almost everything as the 

truth and worth being trustworthy. So can this skepticism possibly be taught 

in public education? Maybe not completely, but I believe that as teachers we 

can influence our students to think critically and back their thoughts up with 

evidence. We are still being encouraged to so in our education. We cannot 

possibly just say that something is the truth without providing some type of 

evidence, support, concrete detail. Why not? Because people are skeptical. If 

a good argument does not follow what one says to be true, then why should one 

be obligated to believe it as the truth? What are the reasons that I should 

take your word over someone else's? The same thinking backs up my reasoning 

for teaching students to question what they are learning. It is everyone's 

right to do so. If we all succumb to other people's truths what kind of idiots 

would be running around Earth? 

Skeptical wonder is learned. One learns to be wondrous and one learns to be 

skeptical. Learning to be good at a little wonder and a little skepticism is a 

good thing. After all, one doesn't like to be played a fool of. 

Just a little something to skeptically wonder about... 


1414





Subject: Re: My Journal #10 

Chula, 

You brought up some good connections in this journal. You are taking in nonsense and making 

sense out of it, and I appreciate that so that you have translated the nonsense for those of us that are 

incapacble of deciphering one from the other. I like the point that you make about teaching children to 

become problem solvers and innovative thinkers. My question to you is, when you say that "students 

should have open minds but stay within good reasoning, I am wondering, how many of our greatest 

inventers and problem solvers were at one time "thought" to not be using good reasoning. I wonder if 

we should stiffle their creative thought process just because we think they are not making "sense". 

Jenny 

1415






Louise, 

You can follow me:) 

Jenny F. 

1416






Thanks Jenny. I'm picking up Laurie at 10:45 as she has class in the morning. We're leaving from 

the circle over by the arts and science 2 buildings. Is that too late? ~ Louise 






Louise, 

You can follow me:) 

Jenny F. 

1417





Subject: Passions 

The Bruer book is a weird read. Compared to Kolata and Sagan it is like 

reading an encyclopedia. There are few stories to keep you interested and 

difficult to relate to. It is anything but short and sweet. At times I 

wonder if a point will ever be made. Why does he spend so much time to get 

to a conclusion? The book is weird because with all its dryness and 

textbookyness I find it a very enjoyable read. I don’t know if I should be 

happy or scared. Why do I find this interesting? “This connects high-order 

skills with the notion of transfer. High-order skills should transfer from 

school learning to real-world situations and allow students to use what they 

already know to learn new things more rapidly. The key to transfer, and so 

to high-order skills, is knowing when to use knowledge. If we want to reach 

high-order skills, then, as the now synthesis says, the instruction should 

be informed” (pg. 78). I’m sure this knowledge will definitely help me be a 

hit at parties. I find my self-talking to my girlfriend about how the mind 

learns, and I see her eyes glass over. Am I turning into my grandpa, that 

guy could talk for hours about airplanes. I don’t know how many air shows I 

have been to as a kid with him. I remember sitting on the blazing asphalt 

in the summer staring up at the sun pretending to be interested about all 

the facts about each and every plane as it flew by. I really couldn’t care 

less about planes as a kid and I probably feel the same about them today, 

but my grandpa loved them no matter how boring and dry many of the facts 

about them were. In reading Bruer, I have a better understanding of my love 

for teaching. It is comforting to know you have a passion and I am curious 

to see where that passion will take me. I may not share the same passion as 

my grandpa, but I can share the love for life our passions brought us. 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1418






Nah, 

You just have to drive like a mini-van momHAHA 

:) Jenny 

1419




To: LBST 361B 


Hello, 

I was thinking about language limitations and English learners. 

I was an ESL student in high school. I remember walking to school and hearing 

people speak, but I could not understand a word they were saying. As I 

approached to one of my classrooms, I heard something familiar. It was a group 

of students who were speaking in my native language. That made me feel a 

little more comfortable and relax. 

As I started learning English, I tried to use it as much as I could but I was 

afraid people would make fun of me. There were times that my mom would send me 

to the store to get something. On my way to the store, my brain was working 

more than normal:-). I had to think on what I wanted to buy and how I would 

say it in English. Sometimes I would pause for a moment and think "¿Como se 

dice esa palabra? How do you say that word.?" Then I would remember and put it 

together in a sentence. Sometimes I would get frustated because my vocabulary 

was too limited and I could not say what I wanted to say. 

My experience learning English made me thought about language limitations and 

how students who are learning another language face that limitation over and 

over until they become fluent on that language. It also made make me think of 

how there are words that you just can't translate and sometimes it is very 

difficult to explain them. 

Now imagine trying to learn English (or another language) plus the other 

subjects and their jargon. It is well said that subjects like music, science, 

math are different languages and each of them use their own vocabulary. 

In conclusion, if you find yourself frustrated when trying to learn a 

different language or subject, think about all the students who have to 

through the same think and how frustrated they might feel. And think about 

those who not only have to learn a language, but also a new culture. 

(I am still trying to cope with the physics class) 

Nos vemos pronto (See ya later), 

Judith 

1420




To: journal 

Subject: Now here's a donation for a good cause 

Wow, that's a lot of money for extraterrestrials!!!! Of course, think of all the other things scientists can 

learn about by building the radio telescope arrays. (Notice the reference to SETI) If we hadn't taken 

this class, I would not have noticed it. It makes it all worthwhile, wouldn't you say? Cynthia 

Microsoft's Allen Funds Extraterrestrial Search 

Reuters 

Sun Mar 21, 4:34 PM ET 


SEATTLE (Reuters) - Microsoft Corp. co-founder Paul Allen has donated $13.5 million to help fund 

the search for extraterrestrial life. 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/us/nws/th/999999.gif 

http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/techtues/p_instory/*http://news.yahoo.com/techtuesday/ 

PC of the Future 

Get a preview of tomorrow's PC and desktop displays. Plus, where the PC won't be anytime soon. 


The California-based SETI Institute, which is dedicated to the search for life beyond Earth, said the donation from Allen, 

who co-founded Microsoft with Bill Gates (news - web sites), would be used to create a radio telescope array of more 

than 200 satellite dishes that will measure signals from space. 

SETI, which stands for Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (news - web sites), plans ultimately to increase the array to 

a total of 350 satellite dishes. 

"An instrument of this magnitude ... will result in the expansion of our understanding of how the universe was formed, and 

how it has evolved and our place therein," Allen said in a statement. 

A long-time science fiction fan, Allen has already devoted millions of dollars to exploring outer space and is building a 

science-fiction museum in his hometown of Seattle. 

His donation comes at a time of a renewed interest in space exploration. NASA (news - web sites)'s Mars rovers have 

discovered evidence of water on the surface of the Red Planet and President Bush (news - web sites) has outlined plans 

for an ambitious 



1421




To: journal 

Subject: "By now, you should be relatively scared," Andrew P. Dobson, a Princeton University biologist 

Warning: If you panic easily, DELETE this now!!! Today must be "scare the public" day in the 

news. Your meat isn't safe, your veggies and fruit aren't safe, and to read about the danger 

threatening our soybeans, click here: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=624 

&ncid=753&e=10&u=/ap/20040322/ap_on_sc/soybean_rust 

And those poor elk that were dropping like flies? Seems a native killer lichen is on the loose!! (this is 

actually an interesting article) 

And if all the food hysteria isn't enough to get you tossing and turning in bed, check out the last world 

population figures. 

World population surpasses six billion: US 

AFP 


http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/my/my16.gif Add Science - AFP to My Yahoo! 

WASHINGTON (AFP) - The world population increased by 1.2 percent in 2002 to total more than 6.2 

billion, but its rate of growth has slowed down, the US Census Bureau (news - web sites) said in a 

new report. 

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/040323/photos_sc_afp/040323071431 

_w8cq2i9n_photo0 

AFP/NASA/File Photo 



PC of the Future 

Get a preview of tomorrow's PC and desktop displays. Plus, where the PC won't be anytime soon. 


The rate of increase translated into a net addition of about 200,000 people per day and 74 million per year in 2002, 

roughly equivalent to the population of Egypt, according to the document 

How the heck are we gonna feed all these people if we have to destroy most of our food supply? 

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=624&ncid=753&e=1 

&u=/ap/20040323/ap_on_sc/elk_deaths 

1422

Medicine & Science 

Threat to food supply on rise 

Pathogens: Potential dangers to food increase as the world's 

population grows, travels more and relies on industrial-size 

farms. 

By Dennis O'Brien 

Sun Staff 

March 22, 2004 

The plentiful supply of meat and year-round produce that enhances our tables these days comes with 

a price tag: More widely traveled foods are spreading deadly infections. 

Green onions from Mexico killed three patrons of a Pennsylvania restaurant and sickened more than 

600 in the fall. Mad cow test standards were tightened last week, months after a Washington state 

Holstein was infected with the disease, traced to a Canadian herd. 

A strain of avian flu discovered this month in Maryland - while no threat to humans - endangers the 

state's multimillion-dollar poultry industry. A deadlier strain has killed 23 people in Asia. 

"I think what we're seeing is an unprecedented vulnerability of the safety of our food supply," said Dr. 

Robert Lawrence, a professor of preventive medicine at the Johns Hopkins University's Bloomberg 

School of Public Health. 

The potential threat to our food increases as the world's population grows, travels more, harvests 

more of the world's forests and relies increasingly on crops supplied by industrial-size farms, experts 

say. 

"By now, you should be relatively scared," Andrew P. Dobson, a Princeton University biologist, told 

scientists last week at the American Institute of Biological Sciences' annual conference in 

Washington. 

Dobson noted that the epidemic of foot-and-mouth disease that infected British catt le in 2001 - 

effectively shutting down that nation's beef industry - started when one farmer fed leftover airline food 

1423

to his cattle. The disease spread because the British government was slow to react, he said. 

"It's a scary example for agriculture," Dobson said. 

Experts say the threat is a direct result of our own appetites. "It's very much related to what the 

American consumer is looking for, the desire for seasonal fruit and vegetables year-round," said Dr. 

David W.K. Acheson, director of food safety and security for the Food and Drug Administration. 

In an attempt to monitor the flood of imports, the FDA has hired 600 inspectors and plans to require 

420,000 food importers to register and notify the agency before shipping food into the United States. 

New regulations 

Under the new regulations, importers must give two hours' notice for goods moved by truck, four 

hours' notice for rail shipments and e ight hours for ships coming into ports. 

The notification requirements, which became effective in December, are intended to make it easier for 

FDA inspectors to identify incoming foodstuffs that might be suspicious. FDA's proposed budget calls 

for conducting 97,000 import inspections next year, a 60 percent increase over the current year. 

But food safety advocates say the FDA and other government agencies are too understaffed to 

adequately inspect the 25,000 shipments of imported food that arrive each day. 

Those imports have increased sharply since the North American Free Trade Agreement widened 

trade with Mexico and Canada - from $26 billion in 1994 to $46 billion last year. The value of imported 

vegetables has more than doubled since 1994, to a record $6.2 billion in 2003, according to federal 

agriculture reports. 

"You have more food being imported across our borders, and our ability to inspect and enforce what's 

on the books is being taxed tremendous ly. I don't think we could even create a surveillance system 

to detect all of the potential problems," said Joseph Mendelson, legal director of the Center for Food 

Safety, a nonprofit advocacy group focused on the health and environmental effects of food 

production. 

The FDA's Acheson said there is no way to guarantee an end to mad cow, avian flu, hepatitis A or 

any other agriculture-based pathogen. But he said the nation's food supply is safe and the upgraded 

inspection system should address concerns about threats from imports. 

"Food-borne diseases are nothing new. It's not like we're having rampant outbreaks of things we've 

never seen before," he said. "I can't say we'll never have another incident. But we're doing everything 

we can to prevent them from happening." 

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimate that 25 percent of Americans are sickened 

by food each year. Although cases of mad cow disease and avian flu grab headlines, produce still po 

ses the biggest health threat when it comes to food-related illnesses. 

A survey by the Center for Science in the Public Interest, another nonprofit watchdog group, found 

that contaminated produce was responsible for more sickness than any other food source in 2002. 

Reports to the CDC between 1990 and 2002 indicate there were 2,472 outbreaks of produce-borne 

illness, accounting for 18,084 cases. Multi-ingredient foods, such as pizza, ranked second, causing 

330 outbreaks and 11,500 illnesses. 

1424

Exactly how many of those cases were caused by imported food remains unclear. 

But experts say many food-borne illnesses are the result of improper cooking. Ground beef has been 

a cause of food-borne disease for 20 years, with E. coli bacteria killing an average of about 60 people 

in the United States annually. 

Contaminated produce 

Green onions imported from Mexico to a Pennsylvania Chi-Chi's restaurant were li nked to an 

outbreak of hepatitis A last fall that killed three people and sickened more than 600. There were 

smaller outbreaks in other states. 

Experts say that much of the produce these days comes from Mexico and South America, where 

there are fewer inspections and more unsanitary conditions. Salmonella and E. coli are frequently 

linked to crop contamination caused by dirty irrigation water and untreated manure applied to fields. 

Even modern farming practices here and abroad aren't helping, Lawrence said. Crowded chicken 

houses and large-scale cattle operations - a trend of the past 30 years - are models of efficiency. But 

packing cattle or chickens into confined quarters helps disease spread quickly. 

"It just creates a breeding ground for infections and unhealthy conditions," Lawrence said. 

Mad cow 

He said the threat from mad cow disease, or bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE), emerged in 

the 1970s when farmers expanded into huge, industrial cattle operations and began feeding herds 

ground up pieces of cows and other animals. 

Mad cow is believed to be caused by cattle feed tainted by animals, which develop holes in their brain 

tissue when infected. Humans can contract a related illness, variant Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease, by 

eating contaminated beef. There is no drug to stop it from spreading; the only way to ensure public 

safety is to destroy the animals at risk. 

More than 140 human deaths from mad cow disease were recorded in Britain and 10 elsewhere, but 

none in the United States. 

Food safety advocates sharply criticized the U.S. government's initial response to the mad cow 

discovery in Washington state: a review of cattle feed requirements and a plan to test 20,000 of the 

35 million cows slaughtered each year. 

"They need to dramatically increase the number of cows tested," said Michael Hansen, a biologist 

and research associate for Consumers U nion, which publishes Consumer Reports. 

In the aftermath of the criticism, the U.S. Department of Agriculture announced plans last week to 

begin testing as many of the nation's 446,000 high-risk cattle as possible. High-risk cattle include 

those that cannot walk or stand. The FDA also is tightening cattle feed requirements. 

Avian flu 

Researchers also are trying to determine how avian flu arrived in Maryland, threatening a poultry 

industry that generated $440 million in chicken and feed grain sales in 2002. 

1425

The flu, a virus spread by chickens' saliva and waste, was detected on the Eastern Shore this month, 

the first time that a commercial flock in Maryland was infected. The strain, known as H7, is not as 

lethal as the H5 form that has killed an estimated 23 people in Vietnam and Thailand. 

But it has meant the destruction of 360,000 chickens, prompted dozens of countries to ban Maryland 

poultry and thre atens the future of the industry. 

Unlike some other pathogens, the corkscrew-shaped flu virus might have originated with ducks or 

geese that migrate along the East Coast. 

The wild birds are captured and brought into contact with chickens sold at live poultry markets in 

urban areas. The infection could be arriving at poultry farms either in birds purchased at the markets 

or in the litter or saliva in the trucks that hauled them, experts say. 

"The live-bird market is what's given us the problem with influenza," said David Wolfgang, director of 

field investigations for the department of veterinary science at Pennsylvania State University. 

Although the flu strain in Maryland poses no risk to humans, Wolfgang and others warn that the virus 

can mutate as it passes from one animal to another, subtly changing the groupings of its molecular 

structure. The ability to mutate could create a strain that one day infects humans, he said. 

"Every time it goes thr ough an animal, there will be some shifts," Wolfgang said. 

Copyright © 2004, The Baltimore Sun 



1426




To: LBST 361B 


I am amazed by all the people that come over to America without knowing a word 

of english, just to get through the normal day must be super hard and 

frustrating. Especially to go to school, and have to learn content area 

lessons. What I think is funny, is learning spanish here, I also had to take 

content area classes in spanish. Right now, I can tell you about any war, the 

kings and queens of spain, any linguistic aspect of the spanish language, but 

I could not tell you how to make a salad or how to locate a store in spanish. 

I have learned so much more vocabulary in the content area classes then I ever 

did taking a class teaching spanish. Maybe taking content area classes, though 

frustrating, helps ELL much more than we realize. 

Teresa 

>Hello, 

> 

>I was thinking about language limitations and English learners. 

> 

>I was an ESL student in high school. I remember walking to school and hearing 

>people speak, but I could not understand a word they were saying. As I 

>approached to one of my classrooms, I heard something familiar. It was a 

group 

>of students who were speaking in my native language. That made me feel a 

>little more comfortable and relax. 

> 

>As I started learning English, I tried to use it as much as I could but I was 

>afraid people would make fun of me. There were times that my mom would send 

me 

>to the store to get something. On my way to the store, my brain was working 

>more than normal:-). I had to think on what I wanted to buy and how I would 

>say it in English. Sometimes I would pause for a moment and think "¿Como se 

>dice esa palabra? How do you say that word.?" Then I would remember and put 

it 

>together in a sentence. Sometimes I would get frustated because my vocabulary 

>was too limited and I could not say what I wanted to say. 

> 

>My experience learning English made me thought about language limitations and 

>how students who are learning another language face that limitation over and 

>over until they become fluent on that language. It also made make me think of 

>how there are words that you just can't translate and sometimes it is very 

>difficult to explain them. 

> 

>Now imagine trying to learn English (or another language) plus the other 

>subjects and their jargon. It is well said that subjects like music, science, 

>math are different languages and each of them use their own vocabulary. 

> 

>In conclusion, if you find yourself frustrated when trying to learn a 

>different language or subject, think about all the students who have to 

>through the same think and how frustrated they might feel. And think about 

>those who not only have to learn a language, but also a new culture. 

> 

>(I am still trying to cope with the physics class) 

> 

>Nos vemos pronto (See ya later), 

> 

>Judith 

1427




To: ICP-F 


I was reading the Bruer book, and kinda like it because it is something that 

relates to teaching. I kinda did not like it becaus e it is boring, like 

everything else I have read this semester!!! Chapter three talked about 

instead of teaching students content facts and information, we should be 

teaching children how to think and find solutions for themselves. This is way 

harder than teaching facts and figures. I know that we already know this, but 

it was the only thing I can relate too. It is much more important for students 

to know how to think instead of memorizing stupid facts and figures. I can 

not remember the last time, I needed to know the chemical formula for 

anything, but I can use the skills, from my previous science classses, to make 

a labs to test an idea. In life, random facts will not get you far, it is the 

problem solving that makes people stnad out from each other. Thank you and 

everyone did such a great job on their science projects. 

Teresa 

1428





Subject: Re: journal 

Unless you are a contestant on Jeopardy!! 


I was reading the Bruer book, and kinda like it because it is something that 

relates to teaching. I kinda did not like it becaus e it is boring, like 

everything else I have read this semester!!! Chapter three talked about 

instead of teaching students content facts and information, we should be 

teaching children how to think and find solutions for themselves. This is way 

harder than teaching facts and figures. I know that we already know this, but 

it was the only thing I can relate too. It is much more important for students 

to know how to think instead of memorizing stupid facts and figures. I can 

not remember the last time, I needed to know the chemical formula for 

anything, but I can use the skills, from my previous science classses, to make 

a labs to test an idea. In life, random facts will not get you far, it is the 

problem solvi ng that makes people stnad out from each other. Thank you and 

everyone did such a great job on their science projects. 

Teresa 



1429





Subject: RE: My Journal #10 

Jenny, 

Cery good question. I guess I would like to beleive as a teacher I would be a 

propenent of innovative thinking. If they were on to something or really into 

something I would let them go with it and see what they come up with. If I 

had Einstien in my class I would hope to beleive that he was a genius before 

his time. Even if he was the shy, reserved kid that couldn't spell. If he 

followed a thought deep enough I would let him go with it until he came up 

with something or saw his own failure. 

-Chula 

>===== Original Message From Kaylee102595@aol.com ===== 

>Chula, 

> You brought up some good connections in this journal. You are taking in 

>nonsense and making sense out of it, and I appreciate that so that you have 

>translated the nonsense for those of us that are incapacble of deciphering 

one from 

>the other. I like the point that you make about teaching children to become 

>problem solvers and innovative thinkers. My question to you is, when you say 

>that "students should have open minds but stay within good reasoning, I am 

>wondering, how many of our greatest inventers and problem solvers were at one 

time 

>"thought" to not be using good reasoning. I wonder if we should stiffle their 

>creative thought process just because we think they are not making "sense". 

>Jenny 

1430





Subject: RE: Im gonna flash you! 

I agree. It is when something goes wrong, or when I struggle with a concept (and finally get it), that I 

learn the most. However, if it is never presented in a way that allows me to make sense of it and 

open that particular door in my mind which allows me to get it, only frustration and 

confusion continue. 

Ann 


Marin, does this mean you're not going to flash us? Cecilia 

>===== Original Message From ICP-F@csusm.edu ===== 

>Now that I got your attention you can read my journal. Great lesson idea 

>Cynthia. After 

>reading Sagan Antiscience I came to thinking about how so much can be learned 

>about 

>science from disproving solutions and also from solving problems. Someone 

>earlier 

>wrote how scientists are wrong too. When I read that I got the feeling that 

>being wrong is 

>bad but I do not necessarily believe it is true. My greatest lessons in life 

>have been 

>learned from realizing I was wrong. In fact I learn more about things when I 

>am wrong, for 

>one the impact of being wrong really hits home and two it makes my curiousity 

>and 

>passion grow stronger and I feel an overwhelming need to find better answers. 

> 

>Science is amazing because we can prove when something is wrong and after 

>realizing 

>its falacy we can use science to prove why things are valid. When I see a 

>false statment 

>recorded next to a valid statement I gain a better understanding why things 

>are as they 

>are. If we expect to always be right then how will we ever gain the courage 

to 

>learn, love 

>or try out new things. "where I was wrong, I was trying to understand a 

>distant world from 

>a few clues in the absence of thorough spacecraft investigations" (Sagan 

257). 

>I know 

>this quote is a little specific for what i am writing about but it opened up 

>my eyes to the 

1431

isks taken when we dare to explore concepts. When we dare to wonder or peice 

>together what we know with what we learn we are at risk of coming to faulty 

>conclusions. 

>Is that bad? Not at all. Nothing is set in stone,well the ten commandments 

>but, if we can 

>get our brains ticking and turning then eventually we will come closer and 

>closer to 

>understanding the way things work. "We are all flawed and creatures of our 

>time" (Sagan 

>259). 

> 

>One last random word. I wish I was there in Germany to see Hitlers face when 

>Jessie 

>Owens won those Olympic events in 1936. Hitler could not handle the fact that 

>an African 

>American won. He was such a chicken shit that he wouldn't even shake Jessies 

>hand. I 

>know it was a different era, and against everything Hitler stood for but it 

is 

>just such a 

>ignorant forgien idea to me. Blast back at me gang. Warning: this last 

>statment was not 

>written with thought, purely emotion. A random Journal from a random girl on 

a 

>random 

>day at a random time. I must go read on with my best friend Whiskey (my 

>kitty). Bye-Bye 

>Marin. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>>My attempt at combining 2 readings (sagan: skeptic and bruer: novice) into 1 

>book 

>report: 

>>"How to encourage creativity and skepticism while building metacognition 

>skills in one 

>easy lesson" 

>> 

>>Give students a problem. Have them brainstorm very creative (wild, 

>outlandish) 

>solutions for the problem. Without any instruction, they should be able to 

>eliminate the 

>weakest solutions using "weak methods". Next model the use of skepticism with 

>one of 

>your own "creative" solutions, concluding with a "strong method" of problem 

>solving. 

>(Don't use a solution that will hold up to scrutiny).Now have students 

>scrutinize their 

>remaining solutions. Finally, have them hold mock classroom hearings to 

>demonstrate 

>how they disproved the solutions and/or solved the problem. End of lesson. 

>>*Feel free to scrutiniza my lesson idea and find the flaws in my creativity. 

1432

Cynthia 

>> 

>> 

>> 





1433





Subject: RE: Now here's a donation for a good cause 

Cynthia, 

I guess Jodi Foster's dream in the movie contact came true,huh? Thanks for 

that!-Chula 


>Wow, that's a lot of money for extraterrestrials!!!! Of course, think of all 

the other things scientists can learn about by building the radio telescope 

arrays. (Notice the reference to SETI) If we hadn't taken this class, I would 

not have noticed it. It makes it all worthwhile, wouldn't you say? Cynthia 

> 

> 

>Microsoft's Allen Funds Extraterrestrial Search 

> Sun Mar 21, 4:34 PM ET 


> 

>SEATTLE (Reuters) - Microsoft Corp. co-founder Paul Allen has donated $13.5 

million to help fund the search for extraterrestrial life. 

> 

>PC of the Future 

>Get a preview of tomorrow's PC and desktop displays. Plus, where the PC won't 

be anytime soon. 

> 

> 

>The California-based SETI Institute, which is dedicated to the search for 

life beyond Earth, said the donation from Allen, who co-founded Microsoft with 

Bill Gates (news - web sites), would be used to create a radio telescope array 

of more than 200 satellite dishes that will measure signals from space. 

> 

>SETI, which stands for Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (news - web 

sites), plans ultimately to increase the array to a total of 350 satellite 

dishes. 

> 

>"An instrument of this magnitude ... will result in the expansion of our 

understanding of how the universe was formed, and how it has evolved and our 

place therein," Allen said in a statement. 

> 

>A long-time science fiction fan, Allen has already devoted millions of 

dollars to exploring outer space and is building a science-fiction museum in 

his hometown of Seattle. 

> 

>His donation comes at a time of a renewed interest in space exploration. NASA 

(news - web sites)'s Mars rovers have discovered evidence of water on the 

surface of the Red Planet and President Bush (news - web sites) has outlined 

plans for an ambitious 

> 

> 


>Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. 

1434






Chula, I didn't see the movie. What was her dream? 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

I guess Jodi Foster's dream in the movie contact came true,huh? Thanks for 

that!-Chula 


>Wow, that's a lot of money for extraterrestrials!!!! Of course, think of all 

the other things scientists can learn about by building the radio telescope 

arrays. (Notice the reference to SETI) If we hadn't taken this class, I would 

not have noticed it. It makes it all worthwhile, wouldn't you say? Cynthia 

> 

> 

>Microsoft's Allen Funds Extraterrestrial Search 

> Sun Mar 21, 4:34 PM ET 


> 

>SEATTLE (Reuters) - Microsoft Corp. co-founder Paul Allen has donated $13.5 

million to help fund the search for extraterrestrial life. 

> 

>PC of the Future 

>Get a preview of tomorrow's PC an d desktop displays. Plus, where the PC won't 

be anytime soon. 

> 

> 

>The California-based SETI Institute, which is dedicated to the search for 

life beyond Earth, said the donation from Allen, who co-founded Microsoft with 

Bill Gates (news - web sites), would be used to create a radio telescope array 

of more than 200 satellite dishes that will measure signals from space. 

> 

>SETI, which stands for Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (news - web 

sites), plans ultimately to increase the array to a total of 350 satellite 

dishes. 

> 

>"An instrument of this magnitude ... will result in the expansion of our 

understanding of how the universe was formed, and how it has evolved and our 

place therein," Allen said in a statement. 

> 

>A long-time science fiction fan, Allen has already devoted millions of 

1435

dollars to exploring outer space and is building a science-fiction museum in 

his hometown of Seattle. 

> 

>His donation comes at a time of a renewed interest in space exploration. NASA 

(news - web sites)'s Mars rovers have discovered evidence of water on the 

surface of the Red Planet and President Bush (news - web sites) has outlined 

plans for an ambitious 

> 

> 





1436






Cynthia, 

Jodi Foster was a scientist looking for extraterresterial life. She had 

grants from all these places and then nearly lost it all right in the midst of 

a new discovery. She is put on a team that looks into her discovery and she is 

the one that is picked to explore it. It is a really good movie, if you 

beleive in aliens!-Chula 

===== Original Message From Cynthia Reyes ===== 

>Chula, I didn't see the movie. What was her dream? 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Cynthia, 

>I guess Jodi Foster's dream in the movie contact came true,huh? Thanks for 

>that!-Chula 

> 

> 

> 

> 


>>Wow, that's a lot of money for extraterrestrials!!!! Of course, think of all 

>the other things scientists can learn about by building the radio telescope 

>arrays. (Notice the reference to SETI) If we hadn't taken this class, I would 

>not have noticed it. It makes it all worthwhile, wouldn't you say? Cynthia 

>> 

>> 

>>Microsoft's Allen Funds Extraterrestrial Search 

>> Sun Mar 21, 4:34 PM ET 

>>Add Science - Reuters to My Yahoo! 

>> 

>>SEATTLE (Reuters) - Microsoft Corp. co-founder Paul Allen has donated $13.5 

>million to help fund the search for extraterrestrial life. 

>> 

>>PC of the Future 

>>Get a preview of tomorrow's PC and desktop displays. Plus, where the PC 

won't 

>be anytime soon. 

>> 

>> 

>>The California-based SETI Institute, which is dedicated to the search for 

>life beyond Earth, said the donation from Allen, who co-founded Microsoft 

with 

>Bill Gates (news - web sites), would be used to create a radio telescope 

array 

>of more than 200 satellite dishes that will measure signals from space. 

>> 

>>SETI, which stands for Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (news - web 

>sites), plans ultimately to increase the array to a total of 350 satellite 

>dishes. 

>> 

>>"An instrument of this magnitude ... will result in the expansion of our 

>understanding of how the universe was formed, and how it has evolved and our 

>place therein," Allen said in a statement. 

>> 

1437

A long-time science fiction fan, Allen has already devoted millions of 

>dollars to exploring outer space and is building a science-fiction museum in 

>his hometown of Seattle. 

>> 

>>His donation comes at a time of a renewed interest in space exploration. 

NASA 

>(news - web sites)'s Mars rovers have discovered evidence of water on the 

>surface of the Red Planet and President Bush (news - web sites) has outlined 

>plans for an ambitious 

>> 

>> 



> 

> 



1438





Subject: LOOK! 

Hey everyone, 

Dr. Karis put our mean scores on the test on his site. Someone (who???) scored 

100% good job! the rest of us, well, not that good. Check it out. Too bad the 

one that scored 100% ruined it if he was grading on a curve.-Chula 

1439





Subject: Re: LOOK! 

Ok, looking at the answers to the test were bad enough. These scores are extremely low. By the 

looks of it, most of us flunked the exam (I consider a D as flunking). What does this tell us? Are we all 

stupid? Was the test poorly written? Is physics just too complex for mere liberal studies students? 

What are the data points? Is it all nonsense? 

This is starting to feel like fierro's class. 

Cynthia 


Hey everyone, 

Dr. Karis put our mean scores on the test on his site. Someone (who???) scored 

100% good job! the rest of us, well, not that good. Check it out. Too bad the 

one that scored 100% ruined it if he was grading on a curve.-Chula 



1440




To: Robert Yamashita 

Subject: Doable Problems 

Hello Professor Yamashita, 

I tried to download "Doable Problems" by Fujimura for this weeks journal, but it says "file not found." 

Is this the same article from March 1st on the syllabus? If so, I can download that one with no 

worries. 

Thank you. 

Louise J. Tweed 

ID381 

1441





Subject: hey guys 

Attachments: ConservationEnergy notes.doc 

ConservationEnerg 

y notes.doc (... 

everyone, 

Dr. Karas sent this to me and I thought I would share it will all of you. It might help 

those that are struggling with these concepts. 

-Chula 

1442





Subject: journal for week 10 

What did I learn from the readings and how did they connect ot each other? 

Well, this is what I got: 

Sagan 

-When coming up with new ideas, be critical and try experimenting them out to 

see if the idea(s) are truly correct. Therefore, make sure you have a sense of 

wonder and open-mindness but at the same time be critical and if you have to, 

doubtful, to actually see the ideas validity. 

-The next reading of Sagan he explains that science is not hard to teach 

“because humans aren’t ready for it, or because it arose only through a fluke, 

or because, by and large, we don’t have the brainpower to grapple with it. 

Bruer 

-“We should be concerned with how we teach as we traditionally have been 

concerned with what we teach.” I totally agree with this because we might 

teach to the standards to the "T" but the way we are teaching them might not 

click with our students, and in the end they aren't gripping all of the 

information that we are giving them. 

How to help students become novices and change into future experts: 

-Knowledge transfer- “Knowledge from the first skill or domain should transfer 

to the second, so there is less to learn.” Almost like taking what you’ve 

already learned, like past experiences, and learn from them in order to learn 

about something else, like changing your view on certain issues. 

-Metacognition- “the ability to think about thinking, to be consciously aware 

of oneself as a problem solverm and to monitor and control one’s mental 

processing.”It says that metacognition develops with age and experience. I 

think this is true because in my own life as a young child my thought 

processes weren't that fast, but as I'm getting older my mind is able to take 

in more and more information and process it much faster. But then I think when 

we get older, are metagonition tends to become slow just like when we were 

young children. 

-So as primary grades teacher, don’t expect too much metacognition from your 

students because they are too young and they haven’t had enough experience 

with it. 

-Teaching students metacognition, will help them how to learn. 

Scaffolding is a good metacognitive tool. 

Fujimura 

-Doablilty-how to make problems do-able. 

-3 levels of organization in doabilty: 

experiment, laboratory, and social work 

-Throughout all three levels in doabilty, definitely metacognition and 

knowledge transfer takes place. 

1443

-At one point, there was a fluke that unexpectedly happened in an experiment 

in this reading, and therefore they learned from the incident and used that 

knowledge to then form another idea. They are therefore learning more and more 

about science in a more affective way, just like teacher would. 

Well, that's what my own perceptions/ideas/connections from the readings. I 

think I can see more and more how these readings connect to each other. 

Laurie :) 

1444





Subject: Wax on, wax off 

Dear cohort, 

I don't know if I have already said this but our classes remind me of the movie "The Karate Kid" you 

know Mr. Mia-gee and Daniel-son.... For those of you who never saw the movie..... The movie is 

about this kid who moves from New Jersey to California. There are some bullies at his school that 

keep beating him up. Mr. Mia-gee is the caretaker of the apartment complex that Daniel and his mom 

move into, and he observes Daniel getting tormented and beat up by these bullies. He agrees to 

teach Daniel karate. So begins the roundabout way of teaching Daniel karate. 

Well, after some time has passed, Daniel-son gets all mad because Mr. Mia-gee has Daniel-son wax 

his cars, paint his house, sand his new decks, paint his fences, etc. while he goes off fishing and 

enjoying the night life. Then, one day Daniel gets frustrated enough to finally confront Mr. Mia-gee. 

He starts complaining and asking Mr. Mia-gee when he is going to learn some "real karate". Mr. Miagee 

starts spatting out the activities he has been strengthening Daniel in. He shouts out, "show me 

wax the car", "show me paint the house" and as Daniel-son is doing the motions that each of these 

activities require, Mr. Mia-gee is throwing punches at him and kicking at him.... It turns out that 

Daniel-son was indeed learning karate because he is able to block the punches and the kicks with his 

moves. 

When we are finally in the classroom, we are going to "wax the car", "paint the fence", sand the 

decks" etc. I know that we will be pulling stuff out of our hats that we don't even realize yet. So, I try 

and absorb as much as I can because I want my bag of tricks to be big and plentiful even though I am 

not quite sure of everything that I am learning yet, and I don't know how it might all fit together. 

We can try and keep an attitude that our cohort is a little "karate class" and our classes are our "dojo". 

Wax on, Ann http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif 



1445





Subject: Rate my professors 

Hi Everyone, 

In case you didn't know that CSUSM had a website to rate your professors 

here it is.... 

www.ratemyprofessors.com 

Enjoy! 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Free up your inbox with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage. Multiple plans available. 

http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=hotmail/es2&ST=1/go/onm00200362ave/direct/01/ 

1446


From: Ann.Kirkendall@web6.systems.townnews.com 



Subject: E-mail-A-Friend: Cal State said to be preparing teachers well 

check this out from Sundays paper. 

Cal State said to be preparing teachers well 

SAN MARCOS ---- Ask new public school teachers whether their training at Cal State San 

Marcos got them ready for the rigors of the job, and they will invariably answer yes. 

Ask their supervisors whether the university prepared the teachers adequately for the 

classroom and they will give a thumbs-up, too. 

For more of this story, click on or type the URL below: 

http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2004/03/19/news/inland/san_marcos/3_18_0423_02_09.txt 

1447





Subject: Re: E-mail-A-Friend: Cal State said to be preparing teachers well 

Swell Article!! 

I am trying to figure out how scientific the results of this survey are. They don't mention how many 

students from other schools responded. I also wonder how truthful the respondents were. If I were a 

first year teacher, I think I might be a bit scared to say I wasn't prepared to teach; fearful I might find a 

pink slip in my box before the year is up. On the other hand, I believe the part about special 

education; we definitely received more than enough prep in that area. I think schools can only do so 

much to prepare future teachers. I have no other university experience to compare San Marcos to, so 

I wouldn't know if we are being better prepared. I do think that the field practicums are useful adjuncts 

to the teacher prep program. In regards to the article, it sounds sort of superficial, not much real 

information and mostly like a piece of promotional material. 

Cynthia 

Ann.Kirkendall@web6.systems.townnews.com wrote: 

check this out from Sundays paper. 

Cal State said to be preparing teachers well 

SAN MARCOS ---- Ask new public school teachers whether their training at Cal State San Marcos 

got them ready for the rigors of the job, and they will invariably answer yes. 

Ask their supervisors whether the university prepared the teachers adequately for the classroom 

and they will give a thumbs-up, too. 

For more of this story, click on or type the URL below: 

http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2004/03/19/news/inland/san_marcos/3_18_0423_02_09.txt 

_____ 



1448




To: journal 

Subject: GENE MUTATION AND EVOLUTION 

THIS IS ONLY PART OF THE ARTICLE. IT IS VERY INTERESTING. They were studying Muscular 

Dystrophy when they made this connection. 

Experts Link Gene Mutation to Evolution 

Jaws have been a focus of evolutionary research since Darwin, and the mutation offers a tantalizing 

theory. But it is unlikely that one mutation — even at a crucial evolutionary juncture — would make a 

person, some skeptics said. 

"They have successfully nailed a genetic mutation that works to deactivate these jaw muscles," said 

Richard Potts, director of the Human Origins Program at the Smithsonian Institution (news - web 

sites). "But their suggestion connecting it to the brain is way too speculative." 

JUNK DNA: SEE BELOW-cynthia 

In their experiment, the Pennsylvania team isolated a new gene in an overlooked junk DNA sequence 

on chromosome 7. It belongs to a class of genes that express production of the protein myosin, which 

enables skeletal muscles to contract. 

As far back as 2.4 million years ago, Homo habilis, or "handy man," emerged as the earliest known 

species to show distinctly human skull and jaw traits, while retaining an apelike physique. 

Its brain grew by about 25 percent over that of its more primitive, nonhuman relatives 

Australopithecus and Paranthropus. This brain increase may have coincided with the first known use 

of manufactured stone tools, perhaps to extract marrow from animal bones. 

Here is the link for the whole article: 

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=624&ncid=753&e=1 

&u=/ap/20040324/ap_on_sc/the_human_gene 

FROM ANOTHER UNRELATED ARTICLE: 

A lack of iron lowers children's IQs by an average five to seven points, the report said. 

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=6 

&u=/ap/20040324/ap_on_he_me/fit_un_brain_food_2 

So, maybe the invention of tools that allowed the "handy men" to extract bone marrow contributed to 

the brain growth, by increasing their iron consumption? 

1449

_____ 



1450





Subject: Re: Wax on, wax off 

Let's make that Tae Kwon Do in a Dojang!! 

Cynthia 


Dear cohort, 

I don't know if I have already said this but our classes remind me of the movie "The Karate Kid" 

you know Mr. Mia-gee and Daniel-son.... For those of you who never saw the movie..... The 

movie is about this kid who moves from New Jersey to California. There are some bullies at his 

school that keep beating him up. Mr. Mia-gee is the caretaker of the apartment complex that 

Daniel and his mom move into, and he observes Daniel getting tormented and beat up by these 

bullies. He agrees to teach Daniel karate. So begins the roundabout way of teaching Daniel 

karate. 

Well, after some time has passed, Daniel-son gets all mad because Mr. Mia-gee has Daniel-son 

wax his cars, paint his house, sand his new decks, paint his fences, etc. while he goes off fishing 

and enjoying the night life. Then, one day Daniel gets frustrated enough to finally confront Mr. 

Mia-gee. He starts complaining and asking Mr. Mia-gee when he is going to learn some "real 

karate". Mr. Mia-gee starts spatting out the activities he has been strengthening Daniel in. He 

shouts out, "show me wax the car", "show me paint the house" and as Daniel-son is doing the 

motions that each of these activities require, Mr. Mia-gee is throwing punches at him and kicking 

at him.... It turns out that Daniel-son was indeed learning karate because he is able to block the 

punches and the kicks with his moves. 

When we are finally in the classroom, we are going to "wax the car", "paint the fence", sand the 

decks" etc. I know that we will be pulling stuff out of our hats that we don't even realize yet. So, I 

try and absorb as much as I can because I want my bag of tricks to be big and plentiful even 

though I am not quite sure of everything that I am learning yet, and I don't know how it might all fit 

together. 

We can try and keep an attitude that our cohort is a little "karate class" and our classes are our 

"dojo". 

Wax on, Ann http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif 



_____ 



1451

1452





Subject: Spring Break Survival tips....? 

Dear class, 

I came across an interesting book that I forgot I had bought a while back. 

"The Worst-Case Scenario Survival Handbook: Travel". I am always interested in learning strange tid 

bits of information that might come in handy someday (so I thought?). 

Well, (to my surprise mixed in with what I thought were some "good to know" ideas) I found some 

fascinating information on pages 58-60. I thought that I would share it with you in case this 

happens..... 

HOW TO FOIL A UFO ABDUCTION 

1. Do not panic. 

The extraterrestrial biological entity (EBE) may sense your fear and act rashly. 

2. Control your thoughts. 

Do not think anything violent or upsetting - the EBE may have the ability to read your mind. Try to 

avoid mental images of abduction (boarding the saucer, anal probes); such images may encourage 

them to take you. 

3. Resist verbally. 

Firmly tell the EBE to leave you alone. 

4. Resist mentally. 

Picture yourself enveloped in a protective shield of white light, or a safe place. Telepathic EBEs may 

get the message. 

5. Resist physically. 

Physical resistance should be used only as a last resort. Go for the EBE's eyes (if they have any) - 

you will not know what its other, more sensitive areas are. (It includes a drawing of an EBE 

advancing towards you with its hand reaching out. The picture has an arrow pointing to its eyes- for 

the visual learners...) 

It then goes on to tell you about how to report a UFO sighting.... 

You can read it if you want to, it's in my backpack.... just ask. 

So, over spring break..... please be careful... now you know what to do if this happens to you.... 



_____ 

1453



1454





Subject: fried 

i looked through the two chapters for sagan, and i really have nothing to say. i think my 

brain is literally fried after the last two weeks and spring break hopefully will be a 

good cure. but then, we go back, and start it all over again. 

sagan's chapter 17 is on skepticism, and i wrote a journal on openness and skepticism, so 

i have nothing more to say. 

chapter 18 is on teaching science and i think im a little too burned out from ID 381 and 

EDMS to discuss that right now. in the end, i will be happy to teach science, right now 

im wrapped up in my own world of learning science. 

i guess im not in writing/typing/thinking mode and probably wont be for a while, so excuse 

the pointless entry. 

talk to you all later. 


1455




To: journal 

Subject: THEORY PAPER QUESTION 

On the syllabus, it says MOST papers will be posted to the listserve. The theory assignment doesn't 

state that, but then neither did the virus assignment. So, are we supposed to post it, or print it and 

turn it in? Anybody in the know, please let me know!!! 

Cynthia 

_____ 



1456





Subject: SPRING BREAK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

I hope you all have a wonderful and safe spring break! 

Teresa 

1457






I don't have much to say this week. I really enjoyed doing the science fair. It did get repetitive after a 

while but still fun. I also was nervous about working with sixth graders because I have never wanted 

to teach that high of a grade but it was actually not that bad. A few of them were trying to persuade 

me not to be a teacher...they said it was the worst job in the world. They thought I was just there for 

fun...not because I was studying to be a teacher. Then they gave in a said OK teach but not at this 

school. They said their school was the worst school in the world. I thought it was funny. 

Thank you Cynthia for reminding me about the Theory paper. I will do that over Spring Break even 

though I did not want to do anything over spring break!!! But I guess I will have to. I hope you all have 

a good Spring Break and I will talk to you next week. Casey 

1458





Subject: Re: Journal 

Casey, Do you know if we are supposed to post the theory paper to the list serve? I couldn't tell by 

reading the syllabus. 

Cynthia 


I don't have much to say this week. I really enjoyed doing the science fair. It did get repetitive after 

a while but still fun. I also was nervous about working with sixth graders because I have never 

wanted to teach that high of a grade but it was actually not that bad. A few of them were trying to 

persuade me not to be a teacher...they said it was the worst job in the world. They thought I was 

just there for fun...not because I was studying to be a teacher. Then they gave in a said OK teach 

but not at this school. They said their school was the worst school in the world. I thought it was 

funny. 

Thank you Cynthia for reminding me about the Theory paper. I will do that over Spring Break even 

though I did not want to do anything over spring break!!! But I guess I will have to. I hope you all 

have a good Spring Break and I will talk to you next week. Casey 

_____ 



1459






It is interesting to hear the different 

observations about cohort F from different professors 

who have experienced the wrath of the cohort. Some 

have said that we are one of the best cohorts that 

they have seen because we are so supportive of each 

other, and some have said that we are the most 

interesting that they have seen. Still others say 

that we have a good sense of how to band together in 

order to protect ourselves from any opposition or 

“danger,” yet that there are giant disparities between 

us within the group. The following journal entry 

explores some of my personal observations of the 

cohort over time and reflects no single situation or 

experience. Rather, it is a reflective process 

stating what I perceive to be happening and having 

happened during the cohort’s experience together, 

thoughts about how professors differentiate between 

what they see as data points and sense verses 

nonsense, and if the assumptions and generalizations 

they make have implications for the group or for 

individuals within the group. This leads to the 

question, how do we assess groups as future teachers? 

It was made clear from the very beginning of the 

ICP program who was who, who had what beliefs, and so 

on, based on the personal sharing that took place at 

the beginning of every class. Simultaneously, the 

development of smaller packs within the greater pack 

(the cohort) began developing and lines were drawn 

that some groups were over here and some over there. 

The separation between individuals and distinction of 

groups has been maintained throughout the program, 

though some individuals have branched out within the 

cohort throughout each semester. As this semester is 

demonstrating, each one brings with it further 

individual growth, a greater sense of comfort within 

the group, and with the introduction of the list-serve 

and the open forum of personalized communication it 

has offered, distinct separations between members of 

the cohort have never been made more apparent. 

However, it is interesting that despite the occasional 

branching out, most people in the cohort have 

adamantly held their positions in their chosen 

mini-pack, while a few have either melded into other 

packs or have maintained positions on the sidelines, 

not really in one group or another but flowing freely 

amongst the mini-packs. And yet some individuals have 

maintained their solitary positions within the cohort, 

creating close bonds with one or a few others and have 

been flexible enough to work in groups with ease. 

What some professors have shared regarding what 

has been observed about cohort F is that the cohort 

seems to take on a pack-like form in certain 

situations of opposition or unknowing. This is very 

possible that the cohort is perceived as a pack, but 

it is out of proximity and because as humans we adapt 

to our environments to some degree for the sake of 

1460

comfort. However, because the mini-packs within the 

pack have always existed, the question arises that if 

the views, feelings, etc, expressed by these 

mini-packs have overpowered all others in the eyes and 

ears of some professors and have thus been perceived 

as representing all students in the cohort, then the 

assessment of the pack, in the case of cohort F, is a 

reflection of the loudest voices and a generalization 

of what the professors consider sense/data. In this 

process the voices, opinions, and feelings of the 

soft-spoken individuals and others are lost in the 

collective assessment. The result when a cohort 

learns of how they are perceived by faculty is 

feelings that are potentially as varied as the number 

of individuals in the cohort. One of these feelings 

can be alienation. 

There are many opinions and views within the 

cohort that are not expressed, are overpowered, or are 

blatantly unrecognized by others. Generally speaking, 

it is interesting that those who are outspoken (not 

meant pejoratively) or who have a secure position in 

their mini-pack are the ones being heard when 

expressing views, experiences, and ideas. The 

feelings and ideas of those not always associated with 

a pack are not expressed as readily, and if they are 

expressed are either not addressed in a meaningful way 

or the person sharing them has eyes rolled at them and 

are considered invalid of privileged consideration. 

When this happens, there can be a breakdown of the 

connective threads between individuals and the group, 

and from this comes surface relationships, obligatory 

smiles, and an overall reduction in personal 

commitment and investment in “the group.” Thus, the 

voids that alienated people create within the cohort 

through their lack of investment are filled by the 

voices of those who are committed to something, 

whether it is a mini-pack or something on a more 

personal level. 

Many obvious examples of this have been 

observable throughout the semester in the 

electronic-correspondence on the list-serve. 

Consideration of the views, experiences, and ideas 

must be made though, in that many of the examples were 

highly charged with emotion, personal experience, and 

individuals were often personally committed to the 

topics being discussed in some way. Thus, cohort F has 

in a way, acted as a microcosm of what happens in 

society, and some distinction needs to be made in 

order to relate what is happening in this microcosm to 

our academic situation, to our future classrooms, and 

to be able to learn from it all. How do the described 

situations affect learning for the cohort as a whole, 

for students as individuals within the collective, and 

how “outsiders” (professors) view us, and in some 

cases, assess us? How many within the cohort can 

consider all of these things from the perspective of 

the outsider/professor, and as the ones for whom that 

perspective will be a reality when in the front of a 

classroom of students in about a year? Is it even 

possible for a person to gain this type of 

understanding without a sense of awareness that these 

situations actually exist and then care enough to 

internalize them and understand their role in them? 

It is quite possible that many do not feel that 

awareness of group dynamics are of importance in the 

classroom beyond academic purposes. However, these 

1461

people are mislead because education is a practice 

between people; an interpersonal experience that is 

not without emotion, personal judgment, understanding, 

and commitment. The dynamics happening currently in 

the cohort reflect what we will face as educators. We 

will have our cohorts (classes), and these cohorts 

will have their mini-packs, their loners, and their 

adaptable pack-hoppers. How will we assess these 

groups as a whole and what will be the implications of 

making these assessments? Will we alienate some 

students by assuming their position within the 

collective? Whether for grading purposes or not, how 

will the dynamics within our classes affect our 

perception of students as a collective and what will 

we choose to see as data/sense when making these 

perceptions? These are all things to think about for 

ourselves, as well as in how our professors view us as 

a collective. I question if people even care much, if 

they ever stop and wonder: Does what this or that 

professor say about me as part of this collective 

reflect what I perceive to be true about the 

collective? What does this say about group assessment? 

__________________________________ 




1462




To: journal 

Subject: Evicting Einstein 

I was sitting here thinking about my theory paper, trying to figure out what approach to take, when I 

got this headline update from NASA. This article touches on so many of the things we have been 

asked to think about in this class. We have the currently "accepted" theories that are supported by 

today's technology. We have the problem of languages between the "camps" of scientists. We have 

lots of new theories, that scientists hope to use to unify our understanding of how things work. 

Now, if Einstein's theory gets the boot, what does that do to all the stuff we are struggling to 

understand in our physics class? This reintroduces that "gray-area" we talked about earlier. For me, I 

think it makes me feel a little bit better about some of that stuff not making sense. Maybe it isn't even 

true. On the other hand, it might all turn out to be even more complicated, for instance, the whole 

space-time abstract concept which just makes my head spin. I have a friend who wrote his master's 

thesus about the age of the universe (or earth, i forget which) being a lot older than what is currently 

thought. While the paper was interesting to read, I can't imagine how he came up with all that spacetime 

stuff. I guess that's the difference between a novice and an expert. And why I will be teaching 4th 

or 5th graders. 

Cynthia 

PS This is not my theory paper. 

"...a great schism has long plagued our fundamental understanding of the universe. Two ways of 

explaining the nature and behavior of space, time, matter, and energy currently exist: Einstein's 

relativity and the "standard model" of quantum mechanics. Both are extremely successful." 

"But the two theories are like different languages, and no one is yet sure how to translate between 

them." 

"The stalemate between these two theories has gone on for decades. Most scientists assume that 

somehow, eventually, a unifying theory will be developed that subsumes the two, showing how the 

truths they each contain can fit neatly within a single, all-encompassing framework of reality. Such a 

"Theory of Everything" would profoundly affect our knowledge of the birth, evolution, and eventual 

fate of the universe. 

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2004/26mar_einstein.htm?list1143205 

_____ 



1463






Michael, this is well-written. You raise several good questions. When Prof. Yamashita told us about 

the big prof. meeting and how they had made some assumptions regarding our cohort, to be honest, I 

was a bit offended in a way. That is probably because I am one on the sidelines (all be it with a big 

mouth). I just wonder how accurate their assessment is. I starting asking people about the study 

group thing, and not that many people really participated in it. So, our poor scores on the physics 

exam can't really be assigned to us sharing incorrect information. The cliques in our cohort remind me 

a bit of junior high and high school; I guess things don't change too much over time. I don't mean that 

in a bad way, people naturally group themselves (for the most part) with others that share their same 

belief systems. On the other hand, I do see some attempt to work with other classmates outside their 

"group", as least by a handful of people. I do think this is important a s far as we are concerned 

because there will be many people outside our new "group" once we start teaching. It will be 

important to be able to work with people we might not otherwise give the time of day to, because of 

our beliefs. This is where the idea of multiple groups will come in, each one serving a specific 

purpose. We will need to belong to several groups to survive in the teaching world. And as you 

mentioned, how we group our students, or how they group themselves is a whole other story. I think it 

is important to consider each individual, rather than the group. Of course, this is easier said than 

done, since we group or classify people without even thinking about it. 

Cynthia 


















thoughts about how professors different iate between 








1464






























possible th at the cohort is perceived as a pack, but 


















can be alienation. There are many opinions and views within the 





1465














through the ir lack of investment are filled by the 



















how “outsiders” (pro fessors) view us, and in some 


















will have our cohorts (classes), and th ese cohorts 

1466

















__________________________________ 




_____ 



1467





Subject: Re: journal 9 - and my journal #? 

Hey Michael and class, 

I can think of multiple times in our classes past and present when I personally did not fit the labeling 

that the professors were trying to stick on us as a whole. If our professors really knew each one of us 

on a more personal level they would clearly see differences. I personally do not feel I fit the 

stereotypical roles in many areas of life. 

As a future teacher I am going to make it a point to get to know each one of my students on a more 

personal level because to me, this really makes a difference. 

This semester with the list serve and discussions about group dynamics, etc. has opened my eyes to 

things that I really didn't take as good of a look at previously even though I was aware of them. And 

this is a good thing. 

I think involving our future students in activities that explore group dynamics might be something to 

help us know how our students fit within their cohort and help us as teachers to connect with them. I 

personally feel that if someone takes the times to get to know me a little better on a personal level, 

that I in turn am closer to them. If you treat your students with love and respect and you model this 

behavior within the classroom, I believe the students will display this for one another. 

I think one of the biggest impressions one of my elementary school teachers had on me was my 4th 

grade teacher Mr. Lewis. He made an appointment with each one of us (students) before the first day 

of school and we went in and talked with him and got to know each other a little before the first day of 

school. He actually cared about me as an individual. He wanted to sit and talk with me (Ann). 

No other teacher had seemed to care about me.... No other teacher cared enough to do such a small 

thing that stands out in my memory to this day. It is too bad that I had more bad teachers who never 

cared about me than I had good teachers who made a difference. The smallest things can make 

such a huge difference in young (and old) student's lives. I actually think it's the same even in our 

college classes; it never ends. We never truly grow up. Our bodies get older and we learn more, but 

we will always have a little girl or a little boy inside who wants to be loved, accepted, needed, etc. 

I think too many people forget to tell one another (young or old) when they are doing a good job, or 

how special they are. We only hear stuff when we are doing something wrong. I am going to make it 

a point to let my kids know how special I think they are. I want to make their little tails wag. I want to 

build their self-esteems. I want them to realize that they are smart and they are worthy. I want them 

to realize that they can do so much in this world if they apply themselves and stay strong. I hope that 

I never slip into a bitter life of forgetting to see the personal individual traits, personalities, etc. that are 

behind those little faces that are looking back at me. 




1468






















































1469





















































1470





















will have our cohorts (classes), and th ese cohorts 

















__________________________________ 




_____ 



1471






Ann, I think it is great that your 4th grade teacher took the time to get to know each of his new 

students before the start of the school year. I am sure it went a long way in making students feel 

comfortable. This being said, I wonder if he used these pre-school meetings to classify his new 

students. I wonder if this allowed him to group students in catagories (smart, shy, hopeless) before 

school even started. Prior to this class, I would never have thought of this, and its very cynical, 

but......hmmmmmm. 

Cynthia 



I can think of multiple times in our classes past and present when I personally did not fit the 

labeling that the professors were trying to stick on us as a whole. If our professors really knew 

each one of us on a more personal level they would clearly see differences. I personally do not 

feel I fit the stereotypical roles in many areas of life. 

As a future teacher I am going to make it a point to get to know each one of my students on a 

more personal level because to me, this really makes a difference. 

This semester with the list serve and discussions about group dynamics, etc. has opened my eyes 

to things that I really didn't take as good of a look at previously even though I was aware of them. 

And this is a good thing. 

I think involving our future students in activities that explore group dynamics might be something 

to help us know how our students fit within their cohort and help us as teachers to connect with 

them. I personally feel that if someone takes the times to get to know me a little better on a 

personal level, that I in turn am closer to them. If you treat your students with love and respect 

and you model this behavior within the classroom, I believe the students will display this for one 

another. 

I think one of the biggest impressions one of my elementary school teachers had on me was my 

4th grade teacher Mr. Lewis. He made an appointment with each one of us (students) before the 

first day of school and we went in and talked with him and got to know each other a little before 

the first day of school. He actually cared about me as an individual. He wanted to sit and talk with 

me (Ann). No other teacher had seemed to care about me.... No other teacher cared enough to 

do such a small thing that stands out in my memory to this day. It is too bad that I had more bad 

teachers who never cared about me than I had good teachers who made a difference. The 

smallest things can make such a huge difference in young (and old) student's lives. I actually 

think it's the same even in our college classes; it never ends. We never truly grow up. Our bodies 

get older and we learn more, but we will always have a little girl or a little boy inside who wants to 

be loved, accepted, needed, etc. 

I think too many people forget to tell one another (young or old) when they are doing a good job, 

or how special they are. We only hear stuff when we are doing something wrong. I am going to 

1472

make it a point to let my kids know how special I think they are. I want to make their little tails 

wag. I want to build their self-esteems. I want them to realize that they are smart and they are 

worthy. I want them to realize that they can do so much in this world if they apply themselves and 

stay strong. I hope that I never slip into a bitter life of forgetting to see the personal individual 

traits, personalities, etc. that are behind those little faces that are looking back at me. 












































1473





















































1474


































will have our cohorts (classes ), and th ese cohorts 

















1475

_____ 

__________________________________ 


Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online . File on time. 




_____ 



1476






Cynthia, 

He may have been, but he was trying to get to know each one of us just the same. If he made the 

assumption that a kid was shy (and he found it to be true), this could help him in his interactions with 

the child and to help them feel comfortable in the class. If we know learning styles we can better fit 

the needs of these students; why not with personalities as well? We are not all cookie cutter college 

students; nor will our future students be cookie cutter learners. Getting to know each student 

individually is what made a difference to me. He cared enough to inquire. 

Ann 





students. I wonder if this allowed him to group students in catagories (smart, shy, hopeless) 

before school even started. Prior to this class, I would never have thought of this, and its very 

cynical, but......hmmmmmm. 

Cynthia 





each one of us on a more personal level they would clearly see differences. I personally do 

not feel I fit the stereotypical roles in many areas of life. 



This semester with the list serve and discussions about group dynamics, etc. has opened my 

eyes to things that I really didn't take as good of a look at previously even though I was aware 

of them. And this is a good thing. 

I think involving our future students in activities that explore group dynamics might be 

something to help us know how our students fit within their cohort and help us as teachers to 

connect with them. I personally feel that if someone takes the times to get to know me a little 

better on a personal level, that I in turn am closer to them. If you treat your students with love 

and respect and you model this behavior within the classroom, I believe the students 

will display this for one another. 

1477

I think one of the biggest impressions one of my elementary school teachers had on me was 

my 4th grade teacher Mr. Lewis. He made an appointment with each one of us (students) 

before the first day of school and we went in and talked with him and got to know each other a 

little before the first day of school. He actually cared about me as an individual. He wanted 

to sit and talk with me (Ann). No other teacher had seemed to care about me.... No other 

teacher cared enough to do such a small thing that stands out in my memory to this day. It is 

too bad that I had more bad teachers who never cared about me than I had good teachers who 

made a difference. The smallest things can make such a huge difference in young (and old) 

student's lives. I actually think it's the same even in our college classes; it never ends. We 

never truly grow up. Our bodies get older and we learn more, but we will always have a little 

girl or a little boy inside who wants to be loved, accepted, needed, etc. 

I think too many people forget to tell one another (young or old) when they are doing a good 

job, or how special they are. We only hear stuff when we are doing something wrong. I am 

going to make it a point to let my kids know how special I think they are. I want to make their 

little tails wag. I want to build their self-esteems. I want them to realize that they are 

smart and they are worthy. I want them to realize that they can do so much in this world if they 

apply themselves and stay strong. I hope that I never slip into a bitter life of forgetting to see 

the personal individual traits, personalities, etc. that are behind those little faces that are 

looking back at me. 





























1478





















































1479




















































1480

_____ 

_____ 















__________________________________ 








_____ 



1481






Right, I am sure that is what he was doing. I was just saying because of this class, I thought of the 

more cynical thing, not that I believed that. Sort of a bad side affect to the class I guess, lol. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

He may have been, but he was trying to get to know each one of us just the same. If he made the 

assumption that a kid was shy (and he found it to be true), this could help him in his interactions 

with the child and to help them feel comfortable in the class. If we know learning styles we can 

better fit the needs of these students; why not with personalities as well? We are not all cookie 

cutter college students; nor will our future students be cookie cutter learners. Getting to know 

each student individually is what made a difference to me. He cared enough to inquire. 

Ann 



students before the start of the school year. I am sure it went a long way in making students 

feel comfortable. This being said, I wonder if he used these pre-school meetings to classify his 

new students. I wonder if this allowed him to group students in catagories (smart, shy, 

hopeless) before school even started. Prior to this class, I would never have thought of this, 

and its very cynical, but......hmmmmmm. 

Cynthia 




labeling that the professors were trying to stick on us as a whole. If our professors really 

knew each one of us on a more personal level they would clearly see differences. I 

personally do not feel I fit the stereotypical roles in many areas of life. 

As a future teacher I am going to make it a point to get to know each one of my students on 

a more personal level because to me, this really makes a difference. 

This semester with the list serve and discussions about group dynamics, etc. has opened 

my eyes to things that I really didn't take as good of a look at previously even though I was 

aware of them. And this is a good thing. 


1482

something to help us know how our students fit within their cohort and help us as teachers 

to connect with them. I personally feel that if someone takes the times to get to know me a 

little better on a personal level, that I in turn am closer to them. If you treat your students 

with love and respect and you model this behavior within the classroom, I believe the 

students will display this for one another. 

I think one of the biggest impressions one of my elementary school teachers had on me 

was my 4th grade teacher Mr. Lewis. He made an appointment with each one of us 

(students) before the first day of school and we went in and talked with him and got to know 

each other a little before the first day of school. He actually cared about me as an 

individual. He wanted to sit and talk with me (Ann). No other teacher had seemed to care 

about me.... No other teacher cared enough to do such a small thing that stands out in my 

memory to this day. It is too bad that I had more bad teachers who never cared about me 

than I had good teachers who made a difference. The smallest things can make such a 

huge difference in young (and old) student's lives. I actually think it's the same even in our 

college classes; it never ends. We never truly grow up. Our bodies get older and we learn 

more, but we will always have a little girl or a little boy inside who wants to be loved, 

accepted, needed, etc. 

I think too many people forget to tell one another (young or old) when they are doing a 

good job, or how special they are. We only hear stuff when we are doing something wrong. 

I am going to make it a point to let my kids know how special I think they are. I want to 

make their little tails wag. I want to build their self-esteems. I want them to realize that 

they are smart and they are worthy. I want them to realize that they can do so much in this 

world if they apply themselves and stay strong. I hope that I never slip into a bitter life of 

forgetting to see the personal individual traits, personalities, etc. that are behind those little 

faces that are looking back at me. 






















1483





















































1484




















































1485

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 






















__________________________________ 










_____ 



1486






I am not sure b/c it doesn't say exactly...does anyone else know or we could e-mail him. Casey 

1487





Subject: Re: theory paper 

since when do we turn stuff in to yamashita?...post your paper, im sure thats all he 

wants, or turn a hard copy in or do both if you are scared. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/26 Fri PM 08:57:22 PST 


> Subject: Re: Journal 

> 

> I am not sure b/c it doesn't say exactly...does anyone else know or we could 

> e-mail him. Casey 

> 

> 


1488





Subject: Re: theory paper 

I am not scared, but it might make a difference in how I write my paper, that's all. I will just write one 

to post unless he posts something to the contrary. 

Cynthia 


since when do we turn stuff in to yamashita?...post your paper, im sure thats all he wants, or turn 

a hard copy in or do both if you are scared. 

> 


> Date: 2004/03/26 Fri PM 08:57:22 PST 


> Subject: Re: Journal 

> 

> I am not sure b/c it doesn't say exactly...does anyone else know or we could 

> e-mail him. Casey 

> 

> 


_____ 



1489





Subject: Theory Paper Submission 

The syllabus does not say to post this paper to the List Server; therefore, 

I will be turning mine in on April 7 at the start of class. Cynthia hit the 

nail on the head when she wrote that MOST OF THE PAPERS WILL BE POSTED TO 

THE LIST SERVE. However, this paper does not say to email only - to the 

course list serve. If it did, then I would post the paper, but it does not. 

Unless otherwise informed by Professor Yamashita, I will be following what 

the syllabus says for this assignment. It does not say to post. 

Disclaimer: This is solely my opinion. Each person should look over the 

assignment and draw his or her own inference as to how to submit the paper. 


_________________________________________________________________ 


(Limited-time offer) 

http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup&pgmarket=en-us&ST=1/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/ 

1490





Subject: Re: Theory Paper Submission 

Prof. Yamashita is probably reading this and laughing about how we are trying to decide what he 

wants and whether or not we come to a group agreement on how to handle the paper submission. 

Another exercise in group dynamics. Kinda funny, huh? 

Cynthia 


The syllabus does not say to post this paper to the List Server; therefore, 

I will be turning mine in on April 7 at the start of class. Cynthia hit the 

nail on the head when she wrote that MOST OF THE PAPERS WILL BE POSTED TO 

THE LIST SERVE. However, this paper does not say to email only - to the 

course list serve. If it did, then I would post the paper, but it does not. 

Unless otherwise informed by Professor Yamashita, I will be following what 

the syllabus says for this assignment. It does not say to post. 

Disclaimer: This is solely my opinion. Each person should look over the 

assignment and draw his or her own inference as to how to submit the paper. 


_________________________________________________________________ 


(Limited-time offer) 


_____ 



1491






On Back-to-School night back in September, Nick's teacher said to the parents that every child that enters her classroom 

each year, comes in with a clean slate. Later that week I asked her if her students really come with a clean slate. She 

said that she has the opportunity to see the student files before school starts, and of course, she can listen to what the 

prior year teacher or other teachers say about the children, but she feels that to do her students full justice, that when 

they start the new school year in her classroom, they do so with a "clean slate." She said that it's an easy trap to fall in to 

pass judgment on someone based on others opinions, but that she'd rather evidence the behavior or the academics 

herself. I found this truly admirable. So, I have made a cognitive decision that when I am teaching, as tempting as it may 

be, I will not take the opportunity read students files or make judgments based on others' opinions regarding the students. 

The only exception to this would be when I would need to know if the student had an IEP or needed special services. It 

is my hopes to have the opportunity to really get to know my students as people and to develop a relationship such that 

they will look back in 10-20 years and say "Mrs. Tweed really made an impression on my life because..." ~ Louise 









students. I wonder if this allowed him to group students in catagories (smart, shy, hopeless) 

before school even started. Prior to this class, I would never have thought of this, and its very 

cynical, but......hmmmmmm. 

Cynthia 





each one of us on a more personal level they would clearly see differences. I personally do 

not feel I fit the stereotypical roles in many areas of life. 



This semester with the list serve and discussions about group dynamics, etc. has opened my 

eyes to things that I really didn't take as good of a look at previously even though I was aware 

of them. And this is a good thing. 


something to help us know how our students fit within their cohort and help us as teachers to 

connect with them. I personally feel that if someone takes the times to get to know me a little 

1492

etter on a personal level, that I in turn am closer to them. If you treat your students with love 

and respect and you model this behavior within the classroom, I believe the students 

will display this for one another. 

I think one of the biggest impressions one of my elementary school teachers had on me was 

my 4th grade teacher Mr. Lewis. He made an appointment with each one of us (students) 

before the first day of school and we went in and talked with him and got to know each other a 

little before the first day of school. He actually cared about me as an individual. He wanted 

to sit and talk with me (Ann). No other teacher had seemed to care about me.... No other 

teacher cared enough to do such a small thing that stands out in my memory to this day. It is 

too bad that I had more bad teachers who never cared about me than I had good teachers who 

made a difference. The smallest things can make such a huge difference in young (and old) 

student's lives. I actually think it's the same even in our college classes; it never ends. We 

never truly grow up. Our bodies get older and we learn more, but we will always have a little 

girl or a little boy inside who wants to be loved, accepted, needed, etc. 

I think too many people forget to tell one another (young or old) when they are doing a good 

job, or how special they are. We only hear stuff when we are doing something wrong. I am 

going to make it a point to let my kids know how special I think they are. I want to make their 

little tails wag. I want to build their self-esteems. I want them to realize that they are 

smart and they are worthy. I want them to realize that they can do so much in this world if they 

apply themselves and stay strong. I hope that I never slip into a bitter life of forgetting to see 

the personal individual traits, personalities, etc. that are behind those little faces that are 

looking back at me. 

























1493





















































1494




















































1495

_____ 

_____ 



















__________________________________ 








1496





Subject: RE: Journal 9 

Sorry Louise, but the kids that you are likely to have negative opinions of 

are the ones with IEPs. The kids with no special instructions usually are 

that way because they aren't problematic. 



>To: 

>Subject: Journal 9 

>Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:13:50 -0800 

> 

>On Back-to-School night back in September, Nick's teacher said to the 

>parents that every child that enters her classroom each year, comes in 

>with a clean slate. Later that week I asked her if her students really 

>come with a clean slate. She said that she has the opportunity to see 

>the student files before school starts, and of course, she can listen to 

>what the prior year teacher or other teachers say about the children, 

>but she feels that to do her students full justice, that when they start 

>the new school year in her classroom, they do so with a "clean slate." 

>She said that it's an easy trap to fall in to pass judgment on someone 

>based on others opinions, but that she'd rather evidence the behavior or 

>the academics herself. I found this truly admirable. So, I have made a 

>cognitive decision that when I am teaching, as tempting as it may be, I 

>will not take the opportunity read students files or make judgments 

>based on others' opinions regarding the students. The only exception to 

>this would be when I would need to know if the student had an IEP or 

>needed special services. It is my hopes to have the opportunity to 

>really get to know my students as people and to develop a relationship 

>such that they will look back in 10-20 years and say "Mrs. Tweed really 

>made an impression on my life because..." ~ Louise 

> 


>From: Cynthia Reyes [mailto:mrstkdsd@yahoo.com] 



>Subject: Re: journal 9 - and my journal #? 

> 

> 

> 

>Ann, I think it is great that your 4th grade teacher took the time to 

>get to know each of his new students before the start of the school 

>year. I am sure it went a long way in making students feel comfortable. 

>This being said, I wonder if he used these pre-school meetings to 

>classify his new students. I wonder if this allowed him to group 

>students in catagories (smart, shy, hopeless) before school even 

>started. Prior to this class, I would never have thought of this, and 

>its very cynical, but......hmmmmmm. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>Hey Michael and class, 

> 

>I can think of multiple times in our classes past and present when I 

>personally did not fit the labeling that the professors were trying to 

>stick on us as a whole. If our professors really knew each one of us on 

1497

a more personal level they would clearly see differences. I personally 

>do not feel I fit the stereotypical roles in many areas of life. 

> 

>As a future teacher I am going to make it a point to get to know each 

>one of my students on a more personal level because to me, this really 

>makes a difference. 

> 

>This semester with the list serve and discussions about group dynamics, 

>etc. has opened my eyes to things that I really didn't take as good of a 

>look at previously even though I was aware of them. And this is a good 

>thing. 

> 

>I think involving our future students in activities that explore group 

>dynamics might be something to help us know how our students fit within 

>their cohort and help us as teachers to connect with them. I personally 

>feel that if someone takes the times to get to know me a little better 

>on a personal level, that I in turn am closer to them. If you treat 

>your students with love and respect and you model this behavior within 

>the classroom, I believe the students will display this for one another. 

> 

> 

>I think one of the biggest impressions one of my elementary school 

>teachers had on me was my 4th grade teacher Mr. Lewis. He made an 

>appointment with each one of us (students) before the first day of 

>school and we went in and talked with him and got to know each other a 

>little before the first day of school. He actually cared about me as an 

>individual. He wanted to sit and talk with me (Ann). No other teacher 

>had seemed to care about me.... No other teacher cared enough to do 

>such a small thing that stands out in my memory to this day. It is too 

>bad that I had more bad teachers who never cared about me than I had 

>good teachers who made a difference. The smallest things can make such 

>a huge difference in young (and old) student's lives. I actually think 

>it's the same even in our college classes; it never ends. We never 

>truly grow up. Our bodies get older and we learn more, but we will 

>always have a little girl or a little boy inside who wants to be loved, 

>accepted, needed, etc. 

> 

>I think too many people forget to tell one another (young or old) when 

>they are doing a good job, or how special they are. We only hear stuff 

>when we are doing something wrong. I am going to make it a point to let 

>my kids know how special I think they are. I want to make their little 

>tails wag. I want to build their self-esteems. I want them to realize 

>that they are smart and they are worthy. I want them to realize that 

>they can do so much in this world if they apply themselves and stay 

>strong. I hope that I never slip into a bitter life of forgetting to 

>see the personal individual traits, personalities, etc. that are behind 

>those little faces that are looking back at me. 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 

>Michael Renner wrote: 

> 

>It is interesting to hear the different 

>observations about cohort F from different professors 

>who have experienced the wrath of the cohort. Some 

>have said that we are one of the best cohorts that 

>they have seen because we are so supportive of each 

>other, and some have said that we are the most 

>interesting that they have seen. Still others say 

>that we have a good sense of how to band together in 

>order to protect ourselves from any opposition or 

>"danger," yet that there are giant disparities between 

>us within the group. The following journal entry 

>explores some of my personal observations of the 

>cohort over time and reflects no single situation or 

1498


>stating what I perceive to be happening and having 

>happened during the cohort's experience together, 

>thoughts about how professors different iate between 

>what they see as data points and sense verses 

>nonsense, and if the assumptions and generalizations 

>they make have implications for the group or for 

>individuals within the group. This leads to the 

>question, how do we assess groups as future teachers? 

>It was made clear from the very beginning of the 

>ICP program who was who, who had what beliefs, and so 

>on, based on the personal sharing that took place at 

>the beginning of every class. Simultaneously, the 

>development of smaller packs within the greater pack 

>(the cohort) began developing and lines were drawn 

>that some groups were over here and some over there. 

>The separation between individuals and distinction of 

>groups has been maintained throughout the program, 

>though some individuals have branched out within the 

>cohort throughout each semester. As this semester is 

>demonstrating, each one brings with it further 

>individual growth, a greater sense of comfort within 

>the group, and with the introduction of the list-serve 

>and the open forum of personalized communication it 

>has offered, distinct separations between members of 

>the cohort have never been made more apparent. 

>However, it is interesting that despite the occasional 

>branching out, most people in the cohort have 

>adamantly held their positions in their chosen 

>mini-pack, while a few have either melded into other 

>packs or have maintained positions on the sidelines, 

>not really in one group or another but flowing freely 

>amongst the mini-packs. And yet some individuals have 

>maintained their solitary positions within the cohort, 

>creating close bonds with one or a few others and have 

>been flexible enough to work in groups with ease. 

>What some professors have shared regarding what 

>has been observed about cohort F is that the cohort 

>seems to take on a pack-like form in certain 

>situations of opposition or unknowing. This is very 

>possible th at the cohort is perceived as a pack, but 

>it is out of proximity and because as humans we adapt 

>to our environments to some degree for the sake of 

>comfort. However, because the mini-packs within the 

>pack have always existed, the question arises that if 

>the views, feelings, etc, expressed by these 

>mini-packs have overpowered all others in the eyes and 

>ears of some professors and have thus been perceived 

>as representing all students in the cohort, then the 

>assessment of the pack, in the case of cohort F, is a 

>reflection of the loudest voices and a generalization 

>of what the professors consider sense/data. In this 

>process the voices, opinions, and feelings of the 

>soft-spoken individuals and others are lost in the 

>collective assessment. The result when a cohort 

>learns of how they are perceived by faculty is 

>feelings that are potentially as varied as the number 

>of individuals in the cohort. One of these feelings 

>can be alienation. There are many opinions and views within the 

>cohort that are not expressed, are overpowered, or are 

>blatantly unrecognized by others. Generally speaking, 

>it is interesting that those who are outspoken (not 

>meant pejoratively) or who have a secure position in 

>their mini-pack are the ones being heard when 

>expressing views, experiences, and ideas. The 

>feelings and ideas of those not always associated with 

1499


>expressed are either not addressed in a meaningful way 

>or the person sharing them has eyes rolled at them and 

>are considered invalid of privileged consideration. 

>When this happens, there can be a breakdown of the 

>connective threads between individuals and the group, 

>and from this comes surface relationships, obligatory 

>smiles, and an overall reduction in personal 

>commitment and investment in "the group." Thus, the 

>voids that alienated people create within the cohort 

>through the ir lack of investment are filled by the 

>voices of those who are committed to something, 

>whether it is a mini-pack or something on a more 

>personal level. 

>Many obvious examples of this have been 

>observable throughout the semester in the 

>electronic-correspondence on the list-serve. 

>Consideration of the views, experiences, and ideas 

>must be made though, in that many of the examples were 

>highly charged with emotion, personal experience, and 

>individuals were often personally committed to the 

>topics being discussed in some way. Thus, cohort F has 

>in a way, acted as a microcosm of what happens in 

>society, and some distinction needs to be made in 

>order to relate what is happening in this microcosm to 

>our academic situation, to our future classrooms, and 

>to be able to learn from it all. How do the described 

>situations affect learning for the cohort as a whole, 

>for students as individuals within the collective, and 

>how "outsiders" (pro fessors) view us, and in some 

>cases, assess us? How many within the cohort can 

>consider all of these things from the perspective of 

>the outsider/professor, and as the ones for whom that 

>perspective will be a reality when in the front of a 

>classroom of students in about a year? Is it even 

>possible for a person to gain this type of 

>understanding without a sense of awareness that these 

>situations actually exist and then care enough to 

>internalize them and understand their role in them? 

>It is quite possible that many do not feel that 

>awareness of group dynamics are of importance in the 

>classroom beyond academic purposes. However, these 

>people are mislead because education is a practice 

>between people; an interpersonal experience that is 

>not without emotion, personal judgment, understanding, 

>and commitment. The dynamics happening currently in 

>the cohort reflect what we will face as educators. We 

>will have our cohorts (classes ), and th ese cohorts 

>will have their mini-packs, their loners, and their 

>adaptable pack-hoppers. How will we assess these 

>groups as a whole and what will be the implications of 

>making these assessments? Will we alienate some 

>students by assuming their position within the 

>collective? Whether for grading purposes or not, how 

>will the dynamics within our classes affect our 

>perception of students as a collective and what will 

>we choose to see as data/sense when making these 

>perceptions? These are all things to think about for 

>ourselves, as well as in how our professors view us as 

>a collective. I question if people even care much, if 

>they ever stop and wonder: Does what this or that 

>professor say about me as part of this collective 

>reflect what I perceive to be true about the 

>collective? What does this say about group assessment? 

> 

> 

1500

>__________________________________ 


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> 

> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 


> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File 

>online. File on time. 

> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 




> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1501






Mike, I see your point but I have to disagree. Almost all the children 

I worked with at Jefferson who had IEP's were great children, they were 

just academically or English language challenged. I think it would be 

beneficial to know about those students so that you can make any 

preparations necessary to accommodate them. The point is, allow the 

children to come into your classroom with a "clean slate." Whatever 

history they may have had, it doesn't matter in my classroom. I hope to 

come to have a great relationship with each of my students. I know this 

may be unrealistic, but I'm an optimist and I'd like to think that none 

of the student's that pass through my class will slip between the 

cracks. So, I plan to look at each student and develop each of their 

potential and help guide them in their education. Cheers - for now! ~ 

Louise 






Sorry Louise, but the kids that you are likely to have negative opinions 

of 

are the ones with IEPs. The kids with no special instructions usually 

are 

that way because they aren't problematic. 



>To: 


>Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:13:50 -0800 

> 





>the student files before school starts, and of course, she can listen 

>to what the prior year teacher or other teachers say about the 

>children, but she feels that to do her students full justice, that when 

>they start the new school year in her classroom, they do so with a 

>"clean slate." She said that it's an easy trap to fall in to pass 

>judgment on someone based on others opinions, but that she'd rather 

>evidence the behavior or the academics herself. I found this truly 

>admirable. So, I have made a cognitive decision that when I am 

>teaching, as tempting as it may be, I will not take the opportunity 

>read students files or make judgments based on others' opinions 

>regarding the students. The only exception to this would be when I 

>would need to know if the student had an IEP or needed special 

>services. It is my hopes to have the opportunity to really get to know 

>my students as people and to develop a relationship such that they will 

1502

look back in 10-20 years and say "Mrs. Tweed really made an impression 

>on my life because..." ~ Louise 

> 






> 

> 

> 








>its very cynical, but......hmmmmmm. Cynthia 

> 


> 


> 



>stick on us as a whole. If our professors really knew each one of us 

>on a more personal level they would clearly see differences. I 

>personally do not feel I fit the stereotypical roles in many areas of 

>life. 

> 




> 


>etc. has opened my eyes to things that I really didn't take as good of 

>a look at previously even though I was aware of them. And this is a 

>good thing. 

> 



>their cohort and help us as teachers to connect with them. I 

>personally feel that if someone takes the times to get to know me a 

>little better on a personal level, that I in turn am closer to them. 

>If you treat your students with love and respect and you model this 

>behavior within the classroom, I believe the students will display this 

>for one another. 

> 

> 





>little before the first day of school. He actually cared about me as 

>an individual. He wanted to sit and talk with me (Ann). No other 

>teacher had seemed to care about me.... No other teacher cared enough 

>to do such a small thing that stands out in my memory to this day. It 

>is too bad that I had more bad teachers who never cared about me than I 

>had good teachers who made a difference. The smallest things can make 

>such a huge difference in young (and old) student's lives. I actually 

1503

think it's the same even in our college classes; it never ends. We 

>never truly grow up. Our bodies get older and we learn more, but we 

>will always have a little girl or a little boy inside who wants to be 

>loved, accepted, needed, etc. 

> 



>when we are doing something wrong. I am going to make it a point to 

>let my kids know how special I think they are. I want to make their 

>little tails wag. I want to build their self-esteems. I want them to 

>realize that they are smart and they are worthy. I want them to 

>realize that they can do so much in this world if they apply themselves 

>and stay strong. I hope that I never slip into a bitter life of 

>forgetting to see the personal individual traits, personalities, etc. 

>that are behind those little faces that are looking back at me. 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 


> 













>cohort over time and reflects no single situation or experience. 

>Rather, it is a reflective process stating what I perceive to be 

>happening and having happened during the cohort's experience together, 





























1504




































>a pack are not expressed as readily, and if they are 































1505


































> 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 




> 

> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 




> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 




> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfeeR 


1506

1507






I'm writing this journal earlier since I'll be gone from the computer for a 

while. So here is what I got from this week's readings: 

For once, I have to tend to agree with Sagan when he talks about our country's 

intelligence in math and science education. I think, however, that because 

there are better grades and better mathematical and scientific IQs in other 

countries it is becuase they are more strict on their learning. I've notice 

that our country tends to put more importance in money and image, and not 

enough on education. Sagan also expresses a way for a person that may be an 

expert on science, be able to expresses his/her own belief in science to 

others. The steps of motivating people to understand and be more excepting of 

science, I think, could be used for any other topic that someone may be 

passionate about. Like for me, I could use the steps in order to show people 

about christianity. 

It was interesting to read some of the responses from the students and parents 

of classes that had read the article posted in Parade magazine. I always knew 

that you could learn so much from your students, and not necessarly about them 

but also about how they depict the world around them. Sagan suggests that we 

asa teachers find a way to show science in a more exciting way, like providing 

visuals and hands-on acitivities. For example, I'll never forget at the 

Science Fair when the students we eager to touch the material that a oil 

cleaner known as a boom is made out of. Just the expressions on their faces 

could tell anyone that they were hooked on already learning about oil spills. 

Sometimes they would ask Louise and I some questions about oil spills, and we 

used the best of our knowledge to answer them, and I think that they took that 

to heart. Instead of rejecting their questions, we wanted them to ask us 

questions because it goes right along with Sagan saying their are no such 

thing as dumb questions. By providing these types of activities, teachers are 

allowing the students to gain a sense of wonder. 

For a last note, after reading just these two chapters in Sagan I was quite 

interested in his reading. Believe me, I have'nt liked Sagan's readings up 

until now. I would have hoped that Sagan would have written more chapters like 

these that pertained more about teaching and less about his own opinion, 

because I have a sense of wanting to know how and what to teach my studets 

some day, especially now in math and science. 

Laurie :) 

1508





Subject: RE: Journal 9 and My journal something 

Louise I remember professor Dome saying something like this too. She said 

how she never looks at her students files before school starts because she 

wants to get to know them. I think that it is good to start a new year off 

with a clean slate. It gives students a chance to prove they are not that 

crazy, wild child that the teacher before deemed them. Perhaps that child 

and that teacher didn't work well together... and we all know this happens. 

So why not let someone else try to reach them. If every teacher starts a new 

year believing what the previous teacher said, then by 5th grade a student 

could think that school was awful just because his/her kindergarten or first 

grade teacher thought that he/she was a behavior problem or whatever the 

case could be and the following teachers built off of those comments. 

Have a good week. Be safe! 



>To: 


>Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:13:50 -0800 

> 





>the student files before school starts, and of course, she can listen to 

>what the prior year teacher or other teachers say about the children, 

>but she feels that to do her students full justice, that when they start 

>the new school year in her classroom, they do so with a "clean slate." 

>She said that it's an easy trap to fall in to pass judgment on someone 

>based on others opinions, but that she'd rather evidence the behavior or 

>the academics herself. I found this truly admirable. So, I have made a 

>cognitive decision that when I am teaching, as tempting as it may be, I 

>will not take the opportunity read students files or make judgments 

>based on others' opinions regarding the students. The only exception to 

>this would be when I would need to know if the student had an IEP or 

>needed special services. It is my hopes to have the opportunity to 

>really get to know my students as people and to develop a relationship 

>such that they will look back in 10-20 years and say "Mrs. Tweed really 

>made an impression on my life because..." ~ Louise 

> 






> 

> 

> 








1509

its very cynical, but......hmmmmmm. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 


> 



>stick on us as a whole. If our professors really knew each one of us on 

>a more personal level they would clearly see differences. I personally 

>do not feel I fit the stereotypical roles in many areas of life. 

> 




> 


>etc. has opened my eyes to things that I really didn't take as good of a 

>look at previously even though I was aware of them. And this is a good 

>thing. 

> 



>their cohort and help us as teachers to connect with them. I personally 

>feel that if someone takes the times to get to know me a little better 

>on a personal level, that I in turn am closer to them. If you treat 

>your students with love and respect and you model this behavior within 

>the classroom, I believe the students will display this for one another. 

> 

> 





>little before the first day of school. He actually cared about me as an 

>individual. He wanted to sit and talk with me (Ann). No other teacher 

>had seemed to care about me.... No other teacher cared enough to do 

>such a small thing that stands out in my memory to this day. It is too 

>bad that I had more bad teachers who never cared about me than I had 

>good teachers who made a difference. The smallest things can make such 

>a huge difference in young (and old) student's lives. I actually think 

>it's the same even in our college classes; it never ends. We never 

>truly grow up. Our bodies get older and we learn more, but we will 

>always have a little girl or a little boy inside who wants to be loved, 

>accepted, needed, etc. 

> 



>when we are doing something wrong. I am going to make it a point to let 

>my kids know how special I think they are. I want to make their little 

>tails wag. I want to build their self-esteems. I want them to realize 

>that they are smart and they are worthy. I want them to realize that 

>they can do so much in this world if they apply themselves and stay 

>strong. I hope that I never slip into a bitter life of forgetting to 

>see the personal individual traits, personalities, etc. that are behind 

>those little faces that are looking back at me. 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 


> 




1510











>experience. Rather, it is a reflective process 


>happened during the cohort's experience together, 






















































1511



































































1512









> 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 




> 

> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 




> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 




> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Find a broadband plan that fits. Great local deals on high-speed Internet 

access. 

https://broadband.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us/go/onm00200360ave/direct/01/ 

1513






Michael I am always amazed by how thought provoking your journals are. Very 

interesting how you connected our cohort to the dynamics of our future 

classrooms. But i see the connection.To answer one of your questions that 

your posed at the end of your journal : 

"I question if people even care much, if 

they ever stop and wonder: Does what this or that professor say about me as 

part of this collective 

reflect what I perceive to be true about the collective? What does this say 

about group assessment?" 

I do wonder what our professors think about me as a collective and as an 

individual. I know that the list serve has not done me any justice. I have 

failed to voice my opinion and state my thought on here many times. But does 

that say anything about me as a future teacher? I don't think it does. This 

online journal thing just isn't for me. As could be the situation in one of 

our future classrooms. We could find students who work better in certain 

situations. I am more comfortable talking about things one on one than on 

here. But I think that if a professor is judging me solely on this list 

serve then I can say that there needs to be another form of assessment. We 

know as future teacher we need to assess our students in different ways to 

meet the needs of all children. 

I think that teachers can gain information about students as a collective, 

but to assess every child as a complete group i think would be difficult, 

especially for the younger grades. Well those are some thoughts that i 

thought i would spit out. Hope they make sense. Carrie 






> 

> It is interesting to hear the different 









>“danger,” yet that there are giant disparities between 




>experience. Rather, it is a reflective process 


>happened during the cohort’s experience together, 

>thoughts about how professors differentiate between 



1514




> It was made clear from the very beginning of the 



























> What some professors have shared regarding what 




>possible that the cohort is perceived as a pack, but 


















>can be alienation. 

> There are many opinions and views within the 













1515




>commitment and investment in “the group.” Thus, the 


>through their lack of investment are filled by the 




> Many obvious examples of this have been 















>how “outsiders” (professors) view us, and in some 










> It is quite possible that many do not feel that 








>will have our cohorts (classes), and these cohorts 

















> 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 




1516

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All the action. All the drama. Get NCAA hoops coverage at MSN Sports by 

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1517





Subject: Theory Paper 

Hey gang! I do not know what to write for this theory paper. Do I use the 

readings? What 

kind of evidence to I need? ANYONE Beuller. Marin the Great says have a great 

break! 

love ya'all Im leaving for the Grand Canyon right now and won't be back til' 

Saturday. I 

gotta big bag-o-books to read. I do not have internet access so when I get 

back I warn 

you that there will be a long exciting journal. Chula louise, Michael, plans 

changed can't 

meet Saturday. Can meet sunday. Sorry beyond my control. xoxoxoMarin. 

1518





Subject: Science and Money 

Dilbert's "Salary Theorem" states that "Engineers 

and scientists can never earn as much as business 

executives and sales people." 

This theorem can now be supported by a 

mathematical equation based on the following 

Two postulates: 

Postulate 1: Knowledge is Power 

Postulate 2: Time is Money 

As every engineer knows: Power = Work / Time 

Since Knowledge = Power 

And: Time = Money 

The result is : Knowledge = Work / Money 

Solving for Money, we get: Money = Work / 

Knowledge. 

Thus, as knowledge approaches zero, Money 

approaches infinity, regardless of the amount of 

work done. 

Conclusion: The less you know, the more money you 

make.. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1519




To: journal 

Subject: U.S Science education vs. "The World" 

"In those cultures lacking unfamiliar challenges, external or internal, where fundamental change is 

unneeded, novel ideas need not be encouraged." Sagan 

.."the survival of the human species and the attainment of greater happiness for individuals depend 

on the ability to think scientifically, rationally, and skeptically." Skeptics Society Manifesto 

"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only means to gain it….Man’s mind is his basic tool 

of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given to him, its sustenance is not. His mind is given to him, its 

content is not. To remain alive, he must act, and before he can act he must know the nature and purpose of his action. He 

cannot obtain his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch—or build a 

cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To remain alive, he must think." Ayn Rand 

After reading chapters 18, 19, and 20 of Sagan, I have come to this conclusion: 

The United States is "the" world power. For the most part, we are quite comfortable compared to 

other countries around the world. Many countries see education as "key" in order to compete. Japan, 

for instance, works very hard at it, and they are doing a pretty good job in some respects. They sure 

make good cars. South Korea wants to compete very badly, hence education is very important to 

them as well. Being the leading power, we don't think we are in dire need of anything (other than 

social programs). And look what the emphasis is on in our schools. I think Americans may take our 

position in the world for granted, from a novice viewpoint, if you will. This might explain why some of 

us (meaning Americans) don't think science and math education is so important. Sure, you can blame 

it on the money, but I don't. There are plenty of people who do a job because they like it, not because 

of the money. Me, for instance: I am not going into teaching for the money!! And I am not going into it 

so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at least some students have the 

opportunity to learn to think. I know what is possible, and I intend to provide an environment that will 

motivate students to get beyond the wonder and to search for the how and why. It doesn't matter that 

I don't know everything there is to know about science because I am not afraid to learn. I think its 

important to go our of the comfort zone, which many teachers are not willing to do. The funny thing is, 

they don't even have to teach it. They can guide the students by having them use the scientific 

method. The students can teach themselves, and they will remember it because the discoveries they 

make will be their own. Ok, time to step down from the soapbox. Cynthia 

_____ 



1520





Subject: Re: the "ME" in U.S Science education vs. "The World" 

Cynthia, 

What's up with the capitalized (remember "ME") in your post? Please don't confuse the warm 

hearted sincerity of some recent posts (not just mine) as inferring these classrooms will be "all lovey 

dovey and artsy fartsy". I am sure that there will be little noses to the grind stones and rigid time 

schedules to dance with as well. I picture teaching as a multifaceted dance with so many moves that 

it will make your head spin. Success will be in managing it all and making it seem like a fun place to 

be while the students are learning. 

By getting to know your students on a more personal level, you are able to get a better picture of how 

to go about helping them on their level. That way, your efforts will be most effective. It will also make 

their little tails wag and make them feel like they are important (which they are). When I think back 

about why certain adults stood out in my past (good ones that is) it's because they were the ones who 

cared about (me). They talked with me, not at me, or not down to me. And, it is those adults 

who had the greatest opportunity to teach me the most because they were actually listening .... 

I believe success will come when we learn how to balance the Yin and the Yang...the structures and 

the fluff... the main courses and the desserts... the cardio and the strength training... the brushing with 

the flossing... the peanut butter with the jelly... the macaroni with the cheese.... All work and no play 

makes Ann a little Crazy http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/32.gif ..... 

Please don't forget that "there is always room for JELLO". 

Ann 


"In those cultures lacking unfamiliar challenges, external or internal, where fundamental change is 

unneeded, novel ideas need not be encouraged." Sagan 

.."the survival of the human species and the attainment of greater happiness for individuals 

depend on the ability to think scientifically, rationally, and skeptically." Skeptics Society Manifesto 

"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only means to gain it….Man’s mind is his basic 

tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given to him, its sustenance is not. His mind is given to 

him, its content is not. To remain alive, he must act, and before he can act he must know the nature and purpose of 

his action. He cannot obtain his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch— 

or build a cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To remain alive, he must think." 

Ayn Rand 


The United States is "the" world power. For the most part, we are quite comfortable compared to 

other countries around the world. Many countries see education as "key" in order to compete. 

Japan, for instance, works very hard at it, and they are doing a pretty good job in some respects. 

They sure make good cars. South Korea wants to compete very badly, hence education is very 

1521

important to them as well. Being the leading power, we don't think we are in dire need of anything 

(other than social programs). And look what the emphasis is on in our schools. I think Americans 

may take our position in the world for granted, from a novice viewpoint, if you will. This might 

explain why some of us (meaning Americans) don't think science and math education is so 

important. Sure, you can blame it on the money, but I don't. There are plenty of people who do a 

job because they like it, not because of the money. Me, for instance: I am not going into teaching 

for the money!! And I am not going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so 

that at least some students have the opportunity to learn to think. I know what is possible, and I 

intend to provide an environment that will motivate students to get beyond the wonder and to 

search for the how and why. It doesn't matter that I don't know everything there is to know about 

science because I am not afraid to learn. I think its important to go our of the comfort zone, which 

many teachers are not willing to do. The funny thing is, they don't even have to teach it. They can 

guide the students by having them use the scientific method. The students can teach themselves, 

and they will remember it because the discoveries they make will be their own. Ok, time to step 

down from the soapbox. Cynthia 

_____ 



_____ 



1522






I found what Cynthia and Ann wrote very interesting. One line that Cynthia wrote that stood out to me 

is "I am not going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at least some 

students have the opportunity to learn to think." I found it interesting because I think we all have one 

or two teachers, as Ann was saying, that really stick in our mind-that really made a difference in our 

lives. And in the first semester when Halcon asked us why we want to be teachers-and we could not 

say because we love children-many of us said because we want to make a difference in our students 

lives. But then the next semester Dome encouraged us to use that we love children in our philosophy 

statement. (THAT WAS KIND OF A SIDE NOTE) I think you have to love children in order to teach 

otherwise their is no point in teaching. I think you also have to want to make a difference or again 

there is no point in teaching. 

So back to Cynthia- I think it is very unselfish of you what you said but I think if you give your students 

the kind of experience that you are talking about...they will remember you forever. 

And Ann...I do think it is very beneficial to get to know all your students on a personal level because it 

is so easy to stereotype and we want to try and stay away from that. I hope this made sense...I am 

just kind of going with the flow on my spring break :) 

Casey 

1523






Interesting, indeed! I remember most of my teachers, good and bad. One in particular was my 4th 

grade teacher, and to tell you the truth, I am really sure why. I don't recall her lessons being all that 

great. In fact, on my report card she wrote if I put as much effort into my regular school work as I did 

my extra credit projects, I would do very well, lol. Well, the extra credit projects were fun, reading a 

textbook wasn't! She was a fairly strict teacher, but consistent, maybe that is why I had so much 

respect for her. If students remember my classroom, I want it to be the things they do and learn, and 

if they remember me, well fine, but that is not what's important. I see so many students just getting 

passed through the grades without the skills to succeed in the next, and I think it is a disservice to 

these students, the teachers who get them the following year, and in the end, our society. Although I 

do enjoy working with children, sorry, it re ally isn't about the love, its about the mind. 

Cynthia 


I found what Cynthia and Ann wrote very interesting. One line that Cynthia wrote that stood out to 

me is "I am not going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at least 

some students have the opportunity to learn to think." I found it interesting because I think we all 

have one or two teachers, as Ann was saying, that really stick in our mind-that really made a 

difference in our lives. And in the first semester when Halcon asked us why we want to be 

teachers-and we could not say because we love children-many of us said because we want to 

make a difference in our students lives. But then the next semester Dome encouraged us to use 

that we love children in our philosophy statement. (THAT WAS KIND OF A SIDE NOTE) I think 

you have to love children in order to teach otherwise their is no point in teaching. I think you also 

have to want to make a difference or again there is no point in teaching. 

So back to Cynthia- I think it is very unselfish of you what you said but I think if you give your 

students the kind of experience that you are talking about...they will remember you forever. 

And Ann...I do think it is very beneficial to get to know all your students on a personal level 

because it is so easy to stereotype and we want to try and stay away from that. I hope this made 

sense...I am just kind of going with the flow on my spring break :) 

Casey 

_____ 



1524





Subject: RE: Science and Money 

Why would knowledge approach zero? Doesn't your knowledge always grow? 

~ Louise 


From: Charles Darwin [mailto:charlezdarwyn@hotmail.com] 



Subject: Science and Money 

Dilbert's "Salary Theorem" states that "Engineers 

and scientists can never earn as much as business 

executives and sales people." 

This theorem can now be supported by a 

mathematical equation based on the following 

Two postulates: 

Postulate 1: Knowledge is Power 

Postulate 2: Time is Money 

As every engineer knows: Power = Work / Time 

Since Knowledge = Power 

And: Time = Money 

The result is : Knowledge = Work / Money 

Solving for Money, we get: Money = Work / 

Knowledge. 

Thus, as knowledge approaches zero, Money 

approaches infinity, regardless of the amount of 

work done. 

Conclusion: The less you know, the more money you 

make.. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1525





Subject: Did you forget it is spring break??? 

If I remember right, the last couple weeks everyone and their mom was 

stressing about school. I would just like to remind you, that this week you DO 

NOT HAVE ANY SCHOOL. Stop posting and relax kids. I do not want a stressed and 

frustrated cohort when I come back to school. Please take a break and party 

like a rock star!!! 

Teresa 

1526





Subject: Re: Did you forget it is spring break??? 

Hi Teresa...Our syllabus does not say we have a break! Our syllabus says we have to post this week. 

So that is why I am posting. I am still relaxing! Casey 

1527





Subject: Re: Did you forget it is spring break??? 

It may be spring break, but I have lots of homework. I am not stressing, I will just have less to do 

when we get back to school. The advantages of not having a life!! 

You have yourself a good time, ok? 

But just so you know, my daughter and I went shopping and she got her wedding dress, so I am 

having some fun!! 

Cynthia 


If I remember right, the last couple weeks everyone and their mom was 

stressing about school. I would just like to remind you, that this week you DO 

NOT HAVE ANY SCHOOL. Stop posting and relax kids. I do not want a stressed and 

frustrated cohort when I come back to school. Please take a break and party 

like a rock star!!! 

Teresa 

_____ 



1528





Subject: Relaxation and clarification 

First thought: 

Although it sounds tempting, if I party like a rock star, the few remaining brain cells I have left will not 

have each other to send signals to. And as we learned in Biology, they do not replenish themselves 

like other cells. Besides, Professor Yamashita will assume that we all were partying and not doing 

our schoolwork. Sense? Nonsense? 

Today, after spending 5 hours working on school stuff, I went and had a 30 minute massage......... 

Holy Moly..... I am still grooving..... That's what I call relaxing. I hated to leave. Maybe I should add 

being a masseuse to my list of "things I want in a mate". 

Second thought: 

I was only trying to emphasize that during the process of teaching "the cold hard facts of the 

curriculum and standards", it would be much more palatable if one does this through a caring, student 

orientated style that personalizes the individual characteristics of each students' needs, learning 

styles, and personalities. 

I think the confussion lies right here... I am not going into teaching to have fun playing with the kids or 

to be remebered as being a nice teacher. Although if done correctly, I think teaching can result in 

having these as side effects. 

More sense? More nonsense? 




grade teacher, and to tell you the truth, I am really sure why. I don't recall her lessons being all 

that great. In fact, on my report card she wrote if I put as much effort into my regular school work 

as I did my extra credit projects, I would do very well, lol. Well, the extra credit projects were fun, 

reading a textbook wasn't! She was a fairly strict teacher, but consistent, maybe that is why I had 

so much respect for her. If students remember my classroom, I want it to be the things they do 

and learn, and if they remember me, well fine, but that is not what's important. I see so many 

students just getting passed through the grades without the skills to succeed in the next, and I 

think it is a disservice to these students, the teachers who get them the following year, and in the 

end, our society. Although I do enjoy working with children, sorry, it re ally isn't about the love, its 

about the mind. 

Cynthia 


I found what Cynthia and Ann wrote very interesting. One line that Cynthia wrote that stood out 

to me is "I am not going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at 

least some students have the opportunity to learn to think." I found it interesting because I 

1529

_____ 

think we all have one or two teachers, as Ann was saying, that really stick in our mind-that 

really made a difference in our lives. And in the first semester when Halcon asked us why we 

want to be teachers-and we could not say because we love children-many of us said because 

we want to make a difference in our students lives. But then the next semester Dome 

encouraged us to use that we love children in our philosophy statement. (THAT WAS KIND OF 

A SIDE NOTE) I think you have to love children in order to teach otherwise their is no point in 

teaching. I think you also have to want to make a difference or again there is no point in 

teaching. 




because it is so easy to stereotype and we want to try and stay away from that. I hope this 

made sense...I am just kind of going with the flow on my spring break :) 

Casey 



_____ 



1530





Subject: Re: Relaxation and clarification 

Sorry about the confusion Ann. I wasn't attacking your reasons, just giving mine. You have every right 

to feel as you do, and I didn't mean to criticize them. I just have different ideas about teaching (so 

what's new, right?). Like they say, it takes all kinds. 

Cynthia 


First thought: 

Although it sounds tempting, if I party like a rock star, the few remaining brain cells I have left will 

not have each other to send signals to. And as we learned in Biology, they do not replenish 

themselves like other cells. Besides, Professor Yamashita will assume that we all were partying 

and not doing our schoolwork. Sense? Nonsense? 

Today, after spending 5 hours working on school stuff, I went and had a 30 minute massage......... 

Holy Moly..... I am still grooving..... That's what I call relaxing. I hated to leave. Maybe I should 

add being a masseuse to my list of "things I want in a mate". 

Second thought: 

I was only trying to emphasize that during the process of teaching "the cold hard facts of the 

curriculum and standards", it would be much more palatable if one does this through a caring, 

student orientated style that personalizes the individual characteristics of each students' needs, 

learning styles, and personalities. 

I think the confussion lies right here... I am not going into teaching to have fun playing with the 

kids or to be remebered as being a nice teacher. Although if done correctly, I think teaching can 

result in having these as side effects. 

More sense? More nonsense? 



Interesting, indeed! I remember most of my teachers, good and bad. One in particular was my 

4th grade teacher, and to tell you the truth, I am really sure why. I don't recall her lessons 

being all that great. In fact, on my report card she wrote if I put as much effort into my regular 

school work as I did my extra credit projects, I would do very well, lol. Well, the extra credit 

projects were fun, reading a textbook wasn't! She was a fairly strict teacher, but consistent, 

maybe that is why I had so much respect for her. If students remember my classroom, I want it 

to be the things they do and learn, and if they remember me, well fine, but that is not what's 

important. I see so many students just getting passed through the grades without the skills to 

succeed in the next, and I think it is a disservice to these students, the teachers who get them 

the following year, and in the end, our society. Although I do enjoy working with children, 

sorry, it re ally isn't about the love, its about the mind. 

1531

_____ 

_____ 

Cynthia 


I found what Cynthia and Ann wrote very interesting. One line that Cynthia wrote that stood 

out to me is "I am not going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so 

that at least some students have the opportunity to learn to think." I found it interesting 

because I think we all have one or two teachers, as Ann was saying, that really stick in our 

mind-that really made a difference in our lives. And in the first semester when Halcon 

asked us why we want to be teachers-and we could not say because we love childrenmany 

of us said because we want to make a difference in our students lives. But then the 

next semester Dome encouraged us to use that we love children in our philosophy 

statement. (THAT WAS KIND OF A SIDE NOTE) I think you have to love children in order 

to teach otherwise their is no point in teaching. I think you also have to want to make a 

difference or again there is no point in teaching. 

So back to Cynthia- I think it is very unselfish of you what you said but I think if you give 

your students the kind of experience that you are talking about...they will remember you 

forever. 




Casey 





_____ 



1532




To: LBST 361B 


Hola a todos, 

I was having a conversation about school with one of my friends. I was 

telling him about how I noticed that some students were worried about passing 

classes and not on the actual learning process. It got to a point where I was 

also worrying more about doing assignments and projects than learning 

something. I know, for instance, that when I am doing a research paper, I am 

learning new things. However, the amount of work we have to do overwhelms me 

and time seems not to be enough. 

So I wanted to ask you guys what do think? How do you go about doing 

schoolwork and actually learning? How do you deal with all the nonsense of 

this program? 

Judith 

1533






Hi Laurie, 

When I read your journal it reminded me of a video that we watched in one of our education classes 

about schools around the world. One of the examples that it gave was a school in Japan, and it was 

saying how they are learning so much more and doing so much better than American children in 

schools. The point that was brought up then and what I am thinking about right now is that those 

schools do not have nearly close to the amount of diversity in their classrooms that the American 

schools do. We are, in a regular classroom, accomodating atleast 2 different native languages, 

inclusion students, GATE students and everyone else whom are all individuals and learn best in 

certain circumstances and methods. I don't think other countries have better standards and systems 

than our schooling systems do, but I do believe they are testing and reporting their best students and 

that is what makes our schools look bad because we test and report on every student. 

Jenny Fiala 

1534





Subject: RE: Judith's journal 10 

Judith wrote: 

>"However, the amount of work we have to do overwhelms me 

>and time seems not to be enough. 

> 

>So I wanted to ask you guys what do think? How do you go about doing 

>schoolwork and actually learning? How do you deal with all the nonsense of 

>this program?" 

Well, you just have to roll with the punches. You have got to do your best, 

and only you know your best and what you are capable of. It is rough at 

times, and it will continue to be as long as we progress in this program. 

Yes, there is a lot of work but I look at it as just another test. We are 

being tested to see if we can handle to the work load, succeed, and pass our 

classes with high ratings. Every time we do an assignment, we are learning. 

You just have to find the time balance between the schoolwork and the work 

it takes to learn. Good luck! 

~Jennifer 





>Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:32:54 -0800 

> 

>Hola a todos, 

> 

>I was having a conversation about school with one of my friends. I was 

>telling him about how I noticed that some students were worried about 

>passing 

>classes and not on the actual learning process. It got to a point where I 

>was 

>also worrying more about doing assignments and projects than learning 

>something. I know, for instance, that when I am doing a research paper, I 

>am 

>learning new things. However, the amount of work we have to do overwhelms 

>me 


> 



>this program? 

> 

>Judith 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Get tax tips, tools and access to IRS forms – all in one place at MSN Money! 

http://moneycentral.msn.com/tax/home.asp 

1535




To: LBST 361B; marti171 


Let the record show that my response to Judith is my journal entry for this 

week. 

I feel that throughout this program we are doing the same assignments only in 

a different subject. Personally, I find these projects stressful and annoying 

at times. I definitely feel that learning is set aside when the focus is on 

passing the class. I have learned a few things in this program, but I feel I 

have learned more through my friends, who are teachers, and through 

volunteering in a classroom. 

I too get overwhelmed and at times I want to give up, but my husband keeps 

encouraging me and reminding me that I have already come this far. Honestly, 

if it wasn't for my husband I would have been out of this program after the 

very first semester. In fact, at the beginning, middle, and end of every 

semester so far, my husband has had to encourage me to continue with the 

program. Am I glad I stayed in the program? That's for another journal... 

Cecilia 

>===== Original Message From marti171 ===== 


> 


>telling him about how I noticed that some students were worried about passing 

>classes and not on the actual learning process. It got to a point where I was 


>something. I know, for instance, that when I am doing a research paper, I am 

>learning new things. However, the amount of work we have to do overwhelms me 


> 




> 

>Judith 

1536






ME the person rather than the classroom experience and learning. I won't be the teacher who stands 

in front of the class telling students what I think they need to know. I am not saying you will be, thats 

not what I mean. It's just that my idea of educating students is guiding them so that they learn new 

things that encourages them to think. Sometimes teachers are so fearful of destroying the selfesteem 

of their fragile students that no learning takes place. But I strongly believe in high standards 

for all students, they need to produce. Call it hardnose if you want, but I think it can be done in a way 

that is enjoyable even if they are being pushed to do their best. This does not mean I won't get to 

know my students, of course I will. I do it now with the students I work with, and I am getting great 

results. They take progress tests, so I know that what I do works. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 


hearted sincerity of some recent posts (not just mine) as inferring these classrooms will be "all 

lovey dovey and artsy fartsy". I am sure that there will be little noses to the grind stones and rigid 

time schedules to dance with as well. I picture teaching as a multifaceted dance with so many 

moves that it will make your head spin. Success will be in managing it all and making it seem like 

a fun place to be while the students are learning. 

By getting to know your students on a more personal level, you are able to get a better picture of 

how to go about helping them on their level. That way, your efforts will be most effective. It will 

also make their little tails wag and make them feel like they are important (which they are). When 

I think back about why certain adults stood out in my past (good ones that is) it's because 

they were the ones who cared about (me). They talked with me, not at me, or not down to me. 

And, it is those adults who had the greatest opportunity to teach me the most because they were 

actually listening .... 

I believe success will come when we learn how to balance the Yin and the Yang...the structures 

and the fluff... the main courses and the desserts... the cardio and the strength training... the 

brushing with the flossing... the peanut butter with the jelly... the macaroni with the cheese.... All 

work and no play makes Ann a little Crazy 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/32.gif ..... 


Ann 


"In those cultures lacking unfamiliar challenges, external or internal, where fundamental 

change is unneeded, novel ideas need not be encouraged." Sagan 

1537

_____ 

_____ 


depend on the ability to think scientifically, rationally, and skeptically." Skeptics Society 

Manifesto 

"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only means to gain it….Man’s mind is his 

basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given to him, its sustenance is not. His mind 

is given to him, its content is not. To remain alive, he must act, and before he can act he must know the nature 

and purpose of his action. He cannot obtain his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He 

cannot dig a ditch—or build a cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To 

remain alive, he must think." Ayn Rand 


The United States is "the" world power. For the most part, we are quite comfortable compared 

to other countries around the world. Many countries see education as "key" in order to 

compete. Japan, for instance, works very hard at it, and they are doing a pretty good job in 

some respects. They sure make good cars. South Korea wants to compete very badly, hence 

education is very important to them as well. Being the leading power, we don't think we are in 

dire need of anything (other than social programs). And look what the emphasis is on in our 

schools. I think Americans may take our position in the world for granted, from a novice 

viewpoint, if you will. This might explain why some of us (meaning Americans) don't think 

science and math education is so important. Sure, you can blame it on the money, but I don't. 

There are plenty of people who do a job because they like it, not because of the money. Me, 

for instance: I am not going into teaching for the money!! And I am not going into it so that my 

students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at least some students have the opportunity 

to learn to think. I know what is possible, and I intend to provide an environment that will 

motivate students to get beyond the wonder and to search for the how and why. It doesn't 

matter that I don't know everything there is to know about science because I am not afraid to 

learn. I think its important to go our of the comfort zone, which many teachers are not willing to 

do. The funny thing is, they don't even have to teach it. They can guide the students by having 

them use the scientific method. The students can teach themselves, and they will remember it 

because the discoveries they make will be their own. Ok, time to step down from the soapbox. 

Cynthia 





_____ 



1538






Hidee ho boys and girls, 

Although it is tempting to believe that we learn something from every project we do, it is not at all 

true. Sometimes we are just going through the motions and forgetting about it when you turn it in. I 

have done this many times in my college career because as you said their is so much work. In a 

sense we truly pick our battles and do what works best for us. Some of us enjoy certain projects more 

than others and those are the ones in which we learn the most from. I think that most learning 

develops when you make it your own and develop it within your own given concept. This is the 

greatness that is application, without it we often just forget and move on. Some of the classes we 

have taken in our program have been a joke, if you show up you will pass. This I believe is a 

detriment to our education because it never challenges us to really get into the meat of the material 

and apply it to our lives. We sit in class and giggle and doodle while the person that we deem in 

charge of teaching us talks and talks and talks, then we make a poster (oh that was last semester) to 

show that we were listening and that is like 40% of our grade. Why? I have come to the realization 

that we are in charge of teaching ourselves the material and the teacher is just their to help to provide 

some resources. So to answer your question Judith, I choose (due to necessity or passion) what I 

want to learn and focus on that, the other stuff I do to get through the class and make the teacher 

happy. This is how I choose to learn because I believe that there is no way to actually learn 

everything that these classes are throwing at us in a short period of time. We must pick and choose. 

Now with the CSET they are once again trying to make sure that we pick the right things to learn. Is 

education and learning truly ours? Can someone take it away? let's make a poster to illustrate what 

we learned in the ICP program. 

http://graphics.hotmail. com/greypixel.gif 




>Subject: RE: Judith's journal 10 

>Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:42:14 -0800 

> 

>Judith wrote: 

>>"However, the amount of work we have to do overwhelms me 

>>and time seems not to be enough. 

>> 

>>So I wanted to ask you guys what do think? How do you go about 

>>doing 

>>schoolwork and actually learning? How do you deal with all the 

>>nonsense of 

>>this program?" 

> 

>Well, you just have to roll with the punches. You have got to do 

>your best, and only you know your best and what you are capable of. 

>It is rough at times, and it will continue to be as long as we 

>progress in this program. Yes, there is a lot of work but I look at 

>it as just another test. We are being tested to see if we can handle 

1539

to the work load, succeed, and pass our classes with high ratings. 

>Every time we do an assignment, we are learning. You just have to 

>find the time balance between the schoolwork and the work it takes 

>to learn. Good luck! 

> 

>~Jennifer 

> 

> 

>>From: marti171 


>>To: LBST 361B 

>>Subject: journal 10 

>>Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:32:54 -0800 

>> 

>>Hola a todos, 

>> 

>>I was having a conversation about school with one of my friends. I 

>>was 

>>telling him about how I noticed that some students were worried 

>>about passing 

>>classes and not on the actual learning process. It got to a point 

>>where I was 

>>also worrying more about doing assignments and projects than 

>>learning 

>>something. I know, for instance, that when I am doing a research 

>>paper, I am 

>>learning new things. However, the amount of work we have to do 

>>overwhelms me 

>>and time seems not to be enough. 

>> 

>>So I wanted to ask you guys what do think? How do you go about 

>>doing 

>>schoolwork and actually learning? How do you deal with all the 

>>nonsense of 

>>this program? 

>> 

>>Judith 

>> 

>> 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Get tax tips, tools and access to IRS forms – all in one place at 

>MSN Money! http://moneycentral.msn.com/tax/home.asp 

> 

_____ 

Find a broadband plan that fits. Great local deals on high-speed Internet access. 

1540






O.K., no fluff..... just the nitty gritty ...... Cynthia.... I responded to your post because of your 

sentence that stood out seemed to mock the warm hearted ideas about teaching which have been 

expressed in the journals. For instance I wrote about one of the teachers that stood out to me 

because he met with all of us before the first day of school.... etc, and I also wrote that I still see him 

around town etc. Then, you post a journal with some good ideas about how you want to teach, and 

that's all great; but, when you add in little subtle side notes such as "And I am not going into it 

(teaching) so that students remember ME". This feels as though you were mocking, as I wrote 

above, the previous posts. So, when I tried to clarify this and explain that I am not going into to 

teaching to be remembered by my students, you apologize for misunderstanding me, but in the very 

same breath you misunderstand me all over again. How is it that I am talking about "A, B, and C"... 

and it gets twisted up as if I were talking about "H, or Z?" Is my writing style, or ability to clearly 

express my ideas really that screwed up? If it is, please do me a favor by letting me know so that I 

can correct this shortcomming. 

Ann 


ME the person rather than the classroom experience and learning. I won't be the teacher who 

stands in front of the class telling students what I think they need to know. I am not saying you will 

be, thats not what I mean. It's just that my idea of educating students is guiding them so that they 

learn new things that encourages them to think. Sometimes teachers are so fearful of destroying 

the self-esteem of their fragile students that no learning takes place. But I strongly believe in high 

standards for all students, they need to produce. Call it hardnose if you want, but I think it can be 

done in a way that is enjoyable even if they are being pushed to do their best. This does not mean 

I won't get to know my students, of course I will. I do it now with the students I work with, and I am 

getting great results. They take progress tests, so I know that what I do works. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 



lovey dovey and artsy fartsy". I am sure that there will be little noses to the grind stones and 

rigid time schedules to dance with as well. I picture teaching as a multifaceted dance with so 

many moves that it will make your head spin. Success will be in managing it all and making it 

seem like a fun place to be while the students are learning. 

By getting to know your students on a more personal level, you are able to get a better picture 

of how to go about helping them on their level. That way, your efforts will be most effective. It 

will also make their little tails wag and make them feel like they are important (which they are). 

When I think back about why certain adults stood out in my past (good ones that is) it's 

1541

ecause they were the ones who cared about (me). They talked with me, not at me, or not 

down to me. And, it is those adults who had the greatest opportunity to teach me the most 

because they were actually listening .... 

I believe success will come when we learn how to balance the Yin and the Yang...the 

structures and the fluff... the main courses and the desserts... the cardio and the strength 

training... the brushing with the flossing... the peanut butter with the jelly... the macaroni with 

the cheese.... All work and no play makes Ann a little Crazy 



Ann 






Manifesto 

"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only means to gain it….Man’s mind is 

his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given to him, its sustenance is not. 

His mind is given to him, its content is not. To remain alive, he must act, and before he can act he must know 

the nature and purpose of his action. He cannot obtain his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to 

obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch—or build a cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to 

achieve it. To remain alive, he must think." Ayn Rand 


The United States is "the" world power. For the most part, we are quite comfortable 

compared to other countries around the world. Many countries see education as "key" in 

order to compete. Japan, for instance, works very hard at it, and they are doing a pretty 

good job in some respects. They sure make good cars. South Korea wants to compete very 

badly, hence education is very important to them as well. Being the leading power, we don't 

think we are in dire need of anything (other than social programs). And look what the 

emphasis is on in our schools. I think Americans may take our position in the world for 

granted, from a novice viewpoint, if you will. This might explain why some of us (meaning 

Americans) don't think science and math education is so important. Sure, you can blame it 

on the money, but I don't. There are plenty of people who do a job because they like it, 

not because of the money. Me, for instance: I am not going into teaching for the money!! 

And I am not going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at 

least some students have the opportunity to learn to think. I know what is possible, and I 

intend to provide an environment that will motivate students to get beyond the wonder and 

to search for the how and why. It doesn't matter that I don't know everything there is to 

know about science because I am not afraid to learn. I think its important to go our of the 

comfort zone, which many teachers are not willing to do. The funny thing is, they don't even 

have to teach it. They can guide the students by having them use the scientific method. 

The students can teach themselves, and they will remember it because the discoveries 

they make will be their own. Ok, time to step down from the soapbox. Cynthia 

1542

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 







_____ 



1543






Hey Judith and class, 

I would love to learn much more than I have. I think it boils down to "not enough time". There is not 

enough time to do a good job with everything. I believe if they gave us less to do "quantity wise", we 

could learn more "depth wise". I do much better if I can focus on one thing at a time. But that's just 

me. I try to handle school work by putting out the fire (assignment) that is closest to me. Then, when 

another one gets to close, I put that one out to. It's kind of like "divide and conquer". Sure, I feel 

overwhelmed quite often, but I try to overcome this feeling by reminding myself of what I often say to 

others, "do the best you can do and that is ALL that you can do". And when there are times when my 

one brain cell tells the other, "I'm giving her all shes got Captain", then that's all I can do. And I guess 

I will just have to accept that. 

However, it seems like we are in a big game of TETRUS..... where these shapes (readings and 

assignments and exams) keep coming down from the top of the screen and we must hit the right 

buttons to flip, turn, or rotate them so that when they arrive at the bottom of the screen, they fit nicely 

into place. And, if we don't make them fit nicely, then they build up, and we lose the game really fast. 

I guess we just need to flip, rotate, and turn each assignment, class, and exam (as best we can) as 

we progress through the game. In the end, we will just go to the next level. As far as learning goes, it 

all depends on "TIME". And there never seems to be enough of it. Keep your eyes, ears, and mind 

open in case something does make sense. It may make more sense later when we have to do our 

"karate moves in class". 

Hang in there, we are getting closer to the finish line each day, each assignment, each semester..... 

you can do it...... 

Wax on, 

Ann 


Hola a todos, 

I was having a conversation about school with one of my friends. I was 

telling him about how I noticed that some students were worried about passing 

classes and not on the actual learning process. It got to a point where I was 

also worrying more about doing assignments and projects than learning 

something. I know, for instance, that when I am doing a research paper, I am 

learning new things. However, the amount of work we have to do overwhelms me 

and time seems not to be enough. 

So I wanted to ask you guys what do think? How do you go about doing 

schoolwork and actually learning? How do you deal with all the nonsense of 

this program? 

1544

Judith 

_____ 



1545






Ok, just the nitty gritty. I wasn't mocking you directly, but then maybe I was. Actually, I was trying to 

say that becoming friends with my students isn't why I want to teach. I think it is possible to focus on 

that aspect of the classroom, and miss what really needs to happen: learning. I think you have good 

intentions, as do I and the rest of the class. But it concerns me that the main reason for teaching 

would be "because I love children". If you think about it, does everyone love all children, even those 

they haven't met? I don't think its realistic to say I will love all my students, because I know it isn't true. 

I am not Gandhi. But that doesn't mean I can't be an effective teacher. As I mentioned in one of my 

other posts, there seems to be a real focus on social issues in the public schools these days. You 

know, the stuff that kids are supposed to learn at home from their parents. It uses up a lot of time that 

could be spent on science, reading and math. I am not saying it shouldn't be there at all, but if its 

taught as a science lesson like in the "Learning from Cases" book, that would be a good thing. I am 

not going to school to be a social worker, but a teacher. You might argue that students don't get this 

stuff at home, so it needs to be taught in the schools. I would disagree. When you take power away 

from someone, you put them in danger (the parents). When you give the students a real education, 

they can think for themselves and don't need to be indoctrinated with what "we" think is the correct 

way to view the world. 

I don't think I misunderstood what you were saying. I just have a different viewpoint on how the world 

works. I don't think I have any right to tell you how to think, or even that you should change the way 

you think. And so I was attempting to be nonconfrontational, while pointing out a difference in opinion. 

Guess it didn't work. 

Cynthia 



sentence that stood out seemed to mock the warm hearted ideas about teaching which have been 

expressed in the journals. For instance I wrote about one of the teachers that stood out to me 

because he met with all of us before the first day of school.... etc, and I also wrote that I still see 

him around town etc. Then, you post a journal with some good ideas about how you want to 

teach, and that's all great; but, when you add in little subtle side notes such as "And I am not 

going into it (teaching) so that students remember ME". This feels as though you were mocking, 

as I wrote above, the previous posts. So, when I tried to clarify this and explain that I am not 

going into to teaching to be remembered by my students, you apologize for misunderstanding me, 

but in the very same breath you misunderstand me all over again. How is it that I am talking about 

"A, B, and C"... and it gets twisted up as if I were talking about "H, or Z?" Is my writing style, or 

ability to clearly express my ideas really that screwed up? If it is, please do me a favor by letting 

me know so that I can correct this shortcomming. 

Ann 


ME the person rather than the classroom experience and learning. I won't be the teacher who 

stands in front of the class telling students what I think they need to know. I am not saying you 

1546

will be, thats not what I mean. It's just that my idea of educating students is guiding them so 

that they learn new things that encourages them to think. Sometimes teachers are so fearful of 

destroying the self-esteem of their fragile students that no learning takes place. But I strongly 

believe in high standards for all students, they need to produce. Call it hardnose if you want, 

but I think it can be done in a way that is enjoyable even if they are being pushed to do their 

best. This does not mean I won't get to know my students, of course I will. I do it now with the 

students I work with, and I am getting great results. They take progress tests, so I know that 

what I do works. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

What's up with the capitalized (remember "ME") in your post? Please don't confuse the 

warm hearted sincerity of some recent posts (not just mine) as inferring these classrooms 

will be "all lovey dovey and artsy fartsy". I am sure that there will be little noses to the grind 

stones and rigid time schedules to dance with as well. I picture teaching as a multifaceted 

dance with so many moves that it will make your head spin. Success will be in managing it 

all and making it seem like a fun place to be while the students are learning. 

By getting to know your students on a more personal level, you are able to get a better 

picture of how to go about helping them on their level. That way, your efforts will be most 

effective. It will also make their little tails wag and make them feel like they are important 

(which they are). When I think back about why certain adults stood out in my past (good 

ones that is) it's because they were the ones who cared about (me). They talked with me, 

not at me, or not down to me. And, it is those adults who had the greatest opportunity to 

teach me the most because they were actually listening .... 


structures and the fluff... the main courses and the desserts... the cardio and the strength 

training... the brushing with the flossing... the peanut butter with the jelly... the macaroni 

with the cheese.... All work and no play makes Ann a little Crazy 



Ann 




.."the survival of the human species and the attainment of greater happiness for 

individuals depend on the ability to think scientifically, rationally, and skeptically." 

Skeptics Society Manifesto 

"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only means to gain it….Man’s mind 

is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given to him, its sustenance is 

not. His mind is given to him, its content is not. To remain alive, he must act, and before he can act he 

must know the nature and purpose of his action. He cannot obtain his food without a knowledge of food 

and of the way to obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch—or build a cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim 

1547

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

and of the means to achieve it. To remain alive, he must think." Ayn Rand 



compared to other countries around the world. Many countries see education as "key" in 

order to compete. Japan, for instance, works very hard at it, and they are doing a pretty 

good job in some respects. They sure make good cars. South Korea wants to compete 

very badly, hence education is very important to them as well. Being the leading power, 

we don't think we are in dire need of anything (other than social programs). And look 

what the emphasis is on in our schools. I think Americans may take our position in the 

world for granted, from a novice viewpoint, if you will. This might explain why some of us 

(meaning Americans) don't think science and math education is so important. Sure, you 

can blame it on the money, but I don't. There are plenty of people who do a job because 

they like it, not because of the money. Me, for instance: I am not going into teaching for 

the money!! And I am not going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am 

doing it so that at least some students have the opportunity to learn to think. I know 

what is possible, and I intend to provide an environment that will motivate students to 

get beyond the wonder and to search for the how and why. It doesn't matter that I don't 

know everything there is to know about science because I am not afraid to learn. I think 

its important to go our of the comfort zone, which many teachers are not willing to do. 

The funny thing is, they don't even have to teach it. They can guide the students by 

having them use the scientific method. The students can teach themselves, and they 

will remember it because the discoveries they make will be their own. Ok, time to step 

down from the soapbox. Cynthia 









_____ 



1548



Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 12:09 AM 


Subject: The gray area...journal #9 

I meant to have this journal out earlier in the week, but I had to decide whether spending 

time with my little brother who I have custody of, taking care of lose ends from my car 

being hit last week, and recovering physically and emotionally was just as important. I 

wanted to make sure that my journal process was reflective and that I truly found 

something to apply to my journey. 

It is interesting the way westerners focus on the black and white area rather than the 

gray area in-between. It seems to be a western phenomenon. If there is something I am 

supposed to gain out of this semester, it is the importance of not thinking in black and 

white but the importance of paying attention to the gray area of life. I was talking to a 

friend the other day about life and the gray areas within that challenges us and at times 

makes no sense. I could not help but think of the conversations in Yamashita's class about 

sense, nonsense, and the gray area. My friend is a sergeant with the SDPD and shared with 

me an article titled, "Zen and the Art of Management." Although the article has to do with 

management, I think it can be applied to education for it analysis the westerners' way of 

thinking in terms of black and white and the Japanese way of thinking that takes into 

consideration the "process," which allows for reflection on the gray area that westerners 

overlook. 

I reflected on the different views that were addressed by our classmates in terms of 

their religious views, and I could not help but see how much of it was focused on the 

black and white rather than the challenging the gray area. When an attempt was made to 

challenge the gray area it was received with resistance or not acknowledge at all. 

According to the study in the article, we reacted just as expected. 

After all as a society we are encouraged to take one side or the other for ambiguity does 

not feel comfortable to our culture. Yet, understanding ourselves lies in ambiguity 

according to the years of studies involving both corporations in the U.S. and Japan. Why? 

Taking a stance whether black or white limits our human connection to those that the dwell 

in-between. As future teachers this is important for us to consider, our future children 

are made of the black stuff, white stuff and everything else in-between. In our culture we 

have the tendency of needing to prove the other person wrong rather it be through our 

religious biases or feeling like we have to take sides. We so want to belong to something. 

As the article points out, "[masking our] self-serving sense of brute integrity" without 

taking into consideration the sexiest components that make up our culture. This very point 

is addressed in Longino's article, "Science as Social Knowledge," which informs us that 

that scie 

nce reflects the values of its society which permits the exclusion of women and racial 

groups,therefore, reflecting bad science because here science is supporting the very 

issues that is feeding into a biased society. Meanwhile in out society, taking a position 

is considered strong, secure, and masculine. However, looking at the gray and allowing the 

process of life to support a higher truth represents ambiguity, which is considered female 

because somehow ambiguity makes reference to sensitivity and feelings. Whether we support 

our beliefs with biblical quotes or Zen thoughts, what does fact have to do with the 

experience of life itself? 

In our society we struggle with being seen as human and not just another teacher, worker, 

or student, etc. Yet, we never stop to think that it is this much embedded way thinking in 

black and white that keeps us thinking of efficiency in terms of what we put out rather 

than how human we can remain. How do we do this? Well, the decisions our society makes is 

made from the black and white area instead of allowing for the process that reveals that 

life is not so black and white. Our inflated egos does not reflect humility, God, our path 

of love, servitude, but reflects instead how as a person we are "out for one's self. How 

does this differ from a more eastern way of thinking like in Japan? For starters Japanese 

culture does not permit its people to see life in terms of making decisions for that would 

limit them to the black and white way of thinking that dominates our society. They see 

life in terms of making choices from the challenges that they face. They have come to 

terms th 

at there is much more going on in the universe than deceiving themselves into thinking of 

their control over things. They see the benefit of working together for a common good, 

1549

therefore, realizing the benefit of treating their employees at all level like humans 

because ultimately they represent one work force. The final evidence shows that both team 

efforts in the U.S. and Japan are just as efficient and productive but the difference lies 

in recognizing that humanity is not made up of black and white but the gray area in 

between. Hence, the bigger picture needs to be considered not just the position we think 

we hold with our limited ego as individuals. It is about teamwork and santioning the 

process of living life to reveal the gray area before judging it through our limited 

experiences.(Alexandra's journal #9 - March 30, 2004). 

1550





Subject: Re: The gray area...journal #9 

The Japanese (and other Asian) Culture is very structured, which seems very black and white to me. 

The are right ways and wrongs ways to do things. Even working as a group could be considered 

black or white because if you don't agree (or conform) you are wrong. If Americans were half as strict 

about social things as they are, our country would be a completely different place. We tend to be 

more vocal and expressive, so maybe we appear more black and white, but I think it might be the 

opposite. We have so many different viewpoints here, and the freedom to express them, that I see 

tons of gray areas. They are gray because when you think about them, they aren't necessarily wrong, 

just different. And even the people who make up our country are in the gray area, because they come 

from all over the world. Try going to Japan. Remember that Bathhouse article we read in Plant's 

class? No gray area there! Maybe their religion has more gray area than the Christian religion, I don't 

know enough about either to form an opinion. But society is more than religion. I think America 

demands more acceptance of the gray area than some other countries do because of our diversity. 

That doesn't mean all people accept the gray, but at least its a work in progress. 

Cynthia 


I meant to have this journal out earlier in the week, but I had to decide whether spending time with 

my little brother who I have custody of, taking care of lose ends from my car being hit last week, 

and recovering physically and emotionally was just as important. I wanted to make sure that my 

journal process was reflective and that I truly found something to apply to my journey. 

It is interesting the way westerners focus on the black and white area rather than the gray area inbetween. 

It seems to be a western phenomenon. If there is something I am supposed to gain out 

of this semester, it is the importance of not thinking in black and white but the importance of 

paying attention to the gray area of life. I was talking to a friend the other day about life and the 

gray areas within that challenges us and at times makes no sense. I could not help but think of the 

conversatio ns in Yamashita's class about sense, nonsense, and the gray area. My friend is a 

sergeant with the SDPD and shared with me an article titled, "Zen and the Art of Management." 

Although the article has to do with management, I think it can be applied to education for it 

analysis the westerners' way of thinking in terms of black and white and the Japanese way of 

thinking that takes into consideration the "process," which allows for reflection on the gray area 

that westerners overlook. 

I reflected on the different views that were addressed by our classmates in terms of their religious 

views, and I could not help but see how much of it was focused on the black and white rather than 

the challenging the gray area. When an attempt was made to challenge the gray area it was 

received with resistance or not acknowledge at all. According to the study in the article, we 

reacted just as expected. 

After all as a society we are encouraged to take one side or the other for ambiguity does n ot feel 

comfortable to our culture. Yet, understanding ourselves lies in ambiguity according to the years of 

studies involving both corporations in the U.S. and Japan. Why? Taking a stance whether black or 

white limits our human connection to those that the dwell in-between. As future teachers this is 

important for us to consider, our future children are made of the black stuff, white stuff and 

everything else in-between. In our culture we have the tendency of needing to prove the other 

person wrong rather it be through our religious biases or feeling like we have to take sides. We so 

want to belong to something. As the article points out, "[masking our] self-serving sense of brute 

1551

integrity" without taking into consideration the sexiest components that make up our culture. This 

very point is addressed in Longino's article, "Science as Social Knowledge," which informs us that 

that scie 


groups,therefore, reflecting bad science because here science is supporting the very issues that is 

feeding into a biased society. Meanwhile in out society, taking a position is considered strong, 

secure, and masculine. However, looking at the gray and allowing the process of life to support a 

higher truth represents ambiguity, which is considered female because somehow ambiguity 

makes reference to sensitivity and feelings. Whether we support our beliefs with biblical quotes or 

Zen thoughts, what does fact have to do with the experience of life itself? 

In our society we struggle with being seen as human and not just another teacher, worker, or 

student, etc. Yet, we never stop to think that it is this much embedded way thinking in black and 

white that keeps us thinking of efficiency in terms of what we put out rather than how human we 

can remain. How do we do this? Well, the decisions our society makes is made from the black and 

white area instead of allowing for the process that reveals that life is not so black and white. Our 

inflated egos does not reflect humility, God, our path of love, servitude, but reflects instead how as 

a person we are "out for one's self. How does this differ from a more eastern way of thinking like in 

Japan? For starters Japanese culture does not permit its people to see life in terms of making 

decisions for that would limit them to the black and white way of thinking that dominates our 

society. They see life in terms of making choices from the challenges that they face. They have 

come to terms th 

at there is much more going on in the universe than deceiving themselves into thinking of their 

control over things. They see the benefit of working together for a common good, therefore, 

realizing the benefit of treating their employees at all level like humans because ultimately they 

represent one work force. The final evidence shows that both team efforts in the U.S. and Japan 

are just as efficient and productive but t he difference lies in recognizing that humanity is not made 

up of black and white but the gray area in between. Hence, the bigger picture needs to be 

considered not just the position we think we hold with our limited ego as individuals. It is about 

teamwork and santioning the process of living life to reveal the gray area before judging it through 

our limited experiences.(Alexandra's journal #9 - March 30, 2004). 

_____ 


Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today 

1552





Subject: Re: the "ME" in U.S Science education vs. "The World"(round #6) 

Oh my God Cynthia, 

Talking with you can be soooooo frustrating (do you feel the same way with talking with me?) (or is it 

just me??????)........... I am laughing at the same time I am shaking my head in frustration. I am not 

disagreeing with you...... Your ideas about teaching kids to think for themselves, that parents should 

teach their kids stuff at home, etc. are all valid, I agree...... I will not "love all my students" as you 

seem to be inferring I have said. I am quite sure there will be some that drive me nuts!!!! I am not 

Gandhi either. I will still get to know them though. Knowing someone and liking them don't go handin-hand. 

You can still be a very effective teacher when you know your students (some may argue 

more effective than not knowing them). I still feel like you are misunderstanding me do to the fact that 

you seem to keep thinking I my ideas are in contradiction to yours; they are not!!!! I want my students 

to walk away with all the necessary skills that will help them be successful in this world. You keep 

putting words in my mouth that I never said. You make it seem as though I have some far out artsy 

fartsy, flaky ideas about teaching when in reality I only expressed that "taking the time to know your 

students on a more personal level can be beneficial to the learning environment". You claim that you 

were trying "to be non-confrontational, while pointing out a difference of opinion" and claim that it 

didn't work. Do you not realize that during your attempt to be non-confrontational, you were doing the 

very opposite? If you do not want to be non-confrontational, then don't include passive aggressive 

undertones in your writing. That's like yelling at someone to calm down, or talking about subjects that 

upset them while giving them a massage. They are dichotomous ideas.... 

You are correct about us having a different viewpoint of how the world works; every single human 

being sees the world through their own unique lens which is effected by all of their past experiences, 

their personalties, etc. 

As far as this group dynamics thing is going, why is it that my posts keep being attacked, directly or 

indirectly, while others get complimented? It seems as though if someone else had written about the 

very same ideas, they could walk away with complements and pats on the back, but when I talk about 

the same issues, you feel the need to dissect, distort, and attack them either directly or indirectly? I 

don't see any attacks or passive aggression towards any of the males in the cohort. Is a male female 

thing? Or is it our personalities that are clashing? 

You seem to think we have such different ideas about teaching and about how the world works, but I 

think it has to do more with our personalities clashing. To me (which means, I alone see it... I am not 

speaking for anyone else) your communication style comes across as very abrupt and sharp. It often 

leaves a sting either directly or indirectly. And it is this that I am usually reacting to. My personality 

does not like to be stung by your personality. I am not sure how I come across to other people, but if 

it is not favorable, I would hope that I could find out nicely so that I may work on it. 

If I was a student and you offended me, as do some of your responses to my posts, I would turn off 

and you would have lost me a long time ago. I am not implying that you talk to students the same 

way, but I sure hope you don't. However, even if I was a coworker and I was offended by a clashing 

of personalities, it would not make for a positive work environment. Just something to absorb and 

think about. 

1553

Ann 


Ok, just the nitty gritty. I wasn't mocking you directly, but then maybe I was. Actually, I was trying 

to say that becoming friends with my students isn't why I want to teach. I think it is possible to 

focus on that aspect of the classroom, and miss what really needs to happen: learning. I think you 

have good intentions, as do I and the rest of the class. But it concerns me that the main reason for 

teaching would be "because I love children". If you think about it, does everyone love all children, 

even those they haven't met? I don't think its realistic to say I will love all my students, because I 

know it isn't true. I am not Gandhi. But that doesn't mean I can't be an effective teacher. As I 

mentioned in one of my other posts, there seems to be a real focus on social issues in the public 

schools these days. You know, the stuff that kids are supposed to learn at home from their 

parents. It uses up a lot of time that could be spent on science, reading and math. I am not saying 

it shouldn't be there at all, but if its taught as a science lesson like in the "Learning from Cases" 

book, that would be a good thing. I am not going to school to be a social worker, but a teacher. 

You might argue that students don't get this stuff at home, so it needs to be taught in the schools. 

I would disagree. When you take power away from someone, you put them in danger (the 

parents). When you give the students a real education, they can think for themselves and don't 

need to be indoctrinated with what "we" think is the correct way to view the world. 

I don't think I misunderstood what you were saying. I just have a different viewpoint on how the 

world works. I don't think I have any right to tell you how to think, or even that you should change 

the way you think. And so I was attempting to be nonconfrontational, while pointing out a 

difference in opinion. Guess it didn't work. 

Cynthia 



sentence that stood out seemed to mock the warm hearted ideas about teaching which have 

been expressed in the journals. For instance I wrote about one of the teachers that stood out 

to me because he met with all of us before the first day of school.... etc, and I also wrote that I 

still see him around town etc. Then, you post a journal with some good ideas about how you 

want to teach, and that's all great; but, when you add in little subtle side notes such as "And I 

am not going into it (teaching) so that students remember ME". This feels as though you 

were mocking, as I wrote above, the previous posts. So, when I tried to clarify this and 

explain that I am not going into to teaching to be remembered by my students, you apologize 

for misunderstanding me, but in the very same breath you misunderstand me all over again. 

How is it that I am talking about "A, B, and C"... and it gets twisted up as if I were talking 

about "H, or Z?" Is my writing style, or ability to clearly express my ideas really that screwed 

up? If it is, please do me a favor by letting me know so that I can correct this shortcomming. 

Ann 


ME the person rather than the classroom experience and learning. I won't be the teacher 

who stands in front of the class telling students what I think they need to know. I am not 

saying you will be, thats not what I mean. It's just that my idea of educating students is 

guiding them so that they learn new things that encourages them to think. Sometimes 

teachers are so fearful of destroying the self-esteem of their fragile students that no 

1554

learning takes place. But I strongly believe in high standards for all students, they need to 

produce. Call it hardnose if you want, but I think it can be done in a way that is enjoyable 

even if they are being pushed to do their best. This does not mean I won't get to know my 

students, of course I will. I do it now with the students I work with, and I am getting great 


Cynthia 


Cynthia, 


warm hearted sincerity of some recent posts (not just mine) as inferring these 

classrooms will be "all lovey dovey and artsy fartsy". I am sure that there will be little 

noses to the grind stones and rigid time schedules to dance with as well. I picture 

teaching as a multifaceted dance with so many moves that it will make your head spin. 

Success will be in managing it all and making it seem like a fun place to be while the 

students are learning. 


picture of how to go about helping them on their level. That way, your efforts will be 

most effective. It will also make their little tails wag and make them feel like they are 

important (which they are). When I think back about why certain adults stood out in my 

past (good ones that is) it's because they were the ones who cared about (me). They 

talked with me, not at me, or not down to me. And, it is those adults who had the 

greatest opportunity to teach me the most because they were actually listening .... 


structures and the fluff... the main courses and the desserts... the cardio and the 

strength training... the brushing with the flossing... the peanut butter with the jelly... the 

macaroni with the cheese.... All work and no play makes Ann a little Crazy 



Ann 


"In those cultures lacking unfamiliar challenges, external or internal, where 

fundamental change is unneeded, novel ideas need not be encouraged." Sagan 




"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only means to gain it….Man’s 

mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given to him, its 

sustenance is not. His mind is given to him, its content is not. To remain alive, he must act, and 

before he can act he must know the nature and purpose of his action. He cannot obtain his food 

without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch—or build a cyclotron— 

without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To remain alive, he must think." Ayn 

Rand 

1555

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 



compared to other countries around the world. Many countries see education as 

"key" in order to compete. Japan, for instance, works very hard at it, and they are 

doing a pretty good job in some respects. They sure make good cars. South Korea 

wants to compete very badly, hence education is very important to them as well. 

Being the leading power, we don't think we are in dire need of anything (other than 

social programs). And look what the emphasis is on in our schools. I think 

Americans may take our position in the world for granted, from a novice viewpoint, if 

you will. This might explain why some of us (meaning Americans) don't think science 

and math education is so important. Sure, you can blame it on the money, but I 

don't. There are plenty of people who do a job because they like it, not because 

of the money. Me, for instance: I am not going into teaching for the money!! And I 

am not going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at 

least some students have the opportunity to learn to think. I know what is possible, 

and I intend to provide an environment that will motivate students to get beyond the 

wonder and to search for the how and why. It doesn't matter that I don't know 

everything there is to know about science because I am not afraid to learn. I think its 

important to go our of the comfort zone, which many teachers are not willing to do. 



will remember it because the discoveries they make will be their own. Ok, time to 

step down from the soapbox. Cynthia 











1556

_____ 



1557






Hi Anne...I think the "love" thing came from my journal. I think, personally, that there are so many 

more things that you can teach your students than just math and science. Obviously they are very 

important elements to life but isn't there so much more? 

Anne- I am very impressed with your journals. I think you take the time to really get across what you 

are trying to say so that people don't assume anything. I admire that cuz instead of taking the time to 

defend myself...I just let things go and say oh well. I am not Gandhi but I do like kids. I think you have 

to in order to teach. Again...just my opinion. Casey 

1558






sorry ann...i just noticed i spelled your name wrong numerous times. i have a friend anne who spells it 

differently! Sorry! Casey 

1559






Yes, Ann, I am laughing too. My opinions are not aimed at you, or anyone in particular. Casey was 

right, she was the one who mentioned love. Like I said before, everyone can have their reasons for 

teaching, and I just stated mine. So don't take it personally. I respond to your posts because they are 

interesting, not to attack you. Cynthia 



Talking with you can be soooooo frustrating (do you feel the same way with talking with me?) (or 

is it just me??????)........... I am laughing at the same time I am shaking my head in frustration. I 

am not disagreeing with you...... Your ideas about teaching kids to think for themselves, that 

parents should teach their kids stuff at home, etc. are all valid, I agree...... I will not "love all my 

students" as you seem to be inferring I have said. I am quite sure there will be some that drive me 

nuts!!!! I am not Gandhi either. I will still get to know them though. Knowing someone and liking 

them don't go hand-in-hand. You can still be a very effective teacher when you know your 

students (some may argue more effective than not knowing them). I still feel like you are 

misunderstanding me do to the fact that you seem to keep thinking I my ideas are in contradiction 

to yours; they are not!!!! I want my students to walk away with all the necessary skills that will help 

them be successful in this world. You keep putting words in my mouth that I never said. You 

make it seem as though I have some far out artsy fartsy, flaky ideas about teaching when in reality 

I only expressed that "taking the time to know your students on a more personal level can be 

beneficial to the learning environment". You claim that you were trying "to be non-confrontational, 

while pointing out a difference of opinion" and claim that it didn't work. Do you not realize that 

during your attempt to be non-confrontational, you were doing the very opposite? If you do not 

want to be non-confrontational, then don't include passive aggressive undertones in your writing. 

That's like yelling at someone to calm down, or talking about subjects that upset them while giving 

them a massage. They are dichotomous ideas.... 


being sees the world through their own unique lens which is effected by all of their past 

experiences, their personalties, etc. 

As far as this group dynamics thing is going, why is it that my posts keep being attacked, directly 

or indirectly, while others get complimented? It seems as though if someone else had 

written about the very same ideas, they could walk away with complements and pats on the back, 

but when I talk about the same issues, you feel the need to dissect, distort, and attack them either 

directly or indirectly? I don't see any attacks or passive aggression towards any of the males in 

the cohort. Is a male female thing? Or is it our personalities that are clashing? 

You seem to think we have such different ideas about teaching and about how the world works, 

but I think it has to do more with our personalities clashing. To me (which means, I alone see it... I 

am not speaking for anyone else) your communication style comes across as very abrupt and 

sharp. It often leaves a sting either directly or indirectly. And it is this that I am usually reacting to. 

My personality does not like to be stung by your personality. I am not sure how I come across to 

1560

other people, but if it is not favorable, I would hope that I could find out nicely so that I may work 

on it. 

If I was a student and you offended me, as do some of your responses to my posts, I would turn 

off and you would have lost me a long time ago. I am not implying that you talk to students the 

same way, but I sure hope you don't. However, even if I was a coworker and I was offended by a 

clashing of personalities, it would not make for a positive work environment. Just something to 

absorb and think about. 

Ann 


Ok, just the nitty gritty. I wasn't mocking you directly, but then maybe I was. Actually, I was 

trying to say that becoming friends with my students isn't why I want to teach. I think it is 

possible to focus on that aspect of the classroom, and miss what really needs to happen: 

learning. I think you have good intentions, as do I and the rest of the class. But it concerns me 

that the main reason for teaching would be "because I love children". If you think about it, does 

everyone love all children, even those they haven't met? I don't think its realistic to say I will 

love all my students, because I know it isn't true. I am not Gandhi. But that doesn't mean I can't 

be an effective teacher. As I mentioned in one of my other posts, there seems to be a real 

focus on social issues in the public schools these days. You know, the stuff that kids are 

supposed to learn at home from their parents. It uses up a lot of time that could be spent on 

science, reading and math. I am not saying it shouldn't be there at all, but if its taught as a 

science lesson like in the "Learning from Cases" book, that would be a good thing. I am not 

going to school to be a social worker, but a teacher. You might argue that students don't get 

this stuff at home, so it needs to be taught in the schools. I would disagree. When you take 

power away from someone, you put them in danger (the parents). When you give the students 

a real education, they can think for themselves and don't need to be indoctrinated with what 

"we" think is the correct way to view the world. 


world works. I don't think I have any right to tell you how to think, or even that you should 

change the way you think. And so I was attempting to be nonconfrontational, while pointing out 

a difference in opinion. Guess it didn't work. 

Cynthia 


O.K., no fluff..... just the nitty gritty ...... Cynthia.... I responded to your post because of 

your sentence that stood out seemed to mock the warm hearted ideas about teaching 

which have been expressed in the journals. For instance I wrote about one of the teachers 

that stood out to me because he met with all of us before the first day of school.... etc, and I 

also wrote that I still see him around town etc. Then, you post a journal with some good 

ideas about how you want to teach, and that's all great; but, when you add in little subtle 

side notes such as "And I am not going into it (teaching) so that students remember ME". 

This feels as though you were mocking, as I wrote above, the previous posts. So, when I 

tried to clarify this and explain that I am not going into to teaching to be remembered by my 

students, you apologize for misunderstanding me, but in the very same breath 

you misunderstand me all over again. How is it that I am talking about "A, B, and C"... 

and it gets twisted up as if I were talking about "H, or Z?" Is my writing style, or ability to 

clearly express my ideas really that screwed up? If it is, please do me a favor by letting me 

know so that I can correct this shortcomming. 

1561

Ann 


ME the person rather than the classroom experience and learning. I won't be the 

teacher who stands in front of the class telling students what I think they need to know. I 

am not saying you will be, thats not what I mean. It's just that my idea of educating 

students is guiding them so that they learn new things that encourages them to think. 

Sometimes teachers are so fearful of destroying the self-esteem of their fragile students 

that no learning takes place. But I strongly believe in high standards for all students, 

they need to produce. Call it hardnose if you want, but I think it can be done in a way 

that is enjoyable even if they are being pushed to do their best. This does not mean I 

won't get to know my students, of course I will. I do it now with the students I work with, 

and I am getting great results. They take progress tests, so I know that what I do works. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

What's up with the capitalized (remember "ME") in your post? Please don't confuse 

the warm hearted sincerity of some recent posts (not just mine) as inferring these 



teaching as a multifaceted dance with so many moves that it will make your head 

spin. Success will be in managing it all and making it seem like a fun place to be 

while the students are learning. 

By getting to know your students on a more personal level, you are able to get a 

better picture of how to go about helping them on their level. That way, your efforts 

will be most effective. It will also make their little tails wag and make them feel like 

they are important (which they are). When I think back about why certain adults 

stood out in my past (good ones that is) it's because they were the ones who cared 

about (me). They talked with me, not at me, or not down to me. And, it is those 

adults who had the greatest opportunity to teach me the most because they were 


I believe success will come when we learn how to balance the Yin and the 

Yang...the structures and the fluff... the main courses and the desserts... the cardio 

and the strength training... the brushing with the flossing... the peanut butter with the 

jelly... the macaroni with the cheese.... All work and no play makes Ann a little 

Crazy http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/32.gif ..... 


Ann 



1562

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 





"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only means to gain 

it….Man’s mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given 

to him, its sustenance is not. His mind is given to him, its content is not. To remain alive, he must 

act, and before he can act he must know the nature and purpose of his action. He cannot obtain 

his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch—or build a 

cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To remain alive, he 

must think." Ayn Rand 


The United States is "the" world power. For the most part, we are quite 

comfortable compared to other countries around the world. Many countries see 

education as "key" in order to compete. Japan, for instance, works very hard at it, 

and they are doing a pretty good job in some respects. They sure make good 

cars. South Korea wants to compete very badly, hence education is very 

important to them as well. Being the leading power, we don't think we are in dire 

need of anything (other than social programs). And look what the emphasis is on 

in our schools. I think Americans may take our position in the world for granted, 

from a novice viewpoint, if you will. This might explain why some of us (meaning 

Americans) don't think science and math education is so important. Sure, you 

can blame it on the money, but I don't. There are plenty of people who do a job 

because they like it, not because of the money. Me, for instance: I am not going 

into teaching for the money!! And I am not going into it so that my students will 

remember ME. I am doing it so that at least some students have the opportunity 

to learn to think. I know what is possible, and I intend to provide an environment 

that will motivate students to get beyond the wonder and to search for the how 

and why. It doesn't matter that I don't know everything there is to know about 

science because I am not afraid to learn. I think its important to go our of the 

comfort zone, which many teachers are not willing to do. The funny thing is, they 

don't even have to teach it. They can guide the students by having them use the 

scientific method. The students can teach themselves, and they will remember it 

because the discoveries they make will be their own. Ok, time to step down from 

the soapbox. Cynthia 





1563

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 









_____ 



1564






Ann, Just to set the record straight, I went back to see what I posted. My post that you thought I was 

attacking or mocking you in was just one of my posts, not a response to yours at all. It was a journal 

entry about the readings. When I post my opinion, or even respond to you or others, it doesn't mean I 

disagree with you, unless of course I say so. It is just another way to look at things, or something else 

to consider. It is all part of the learning process for me. It is a way to sort out the gray area. 

I just read your response again about attacking you. Consider this, there aren't any guys posting 

anything, so there is nothing to respond to. In regards to students in my classroom being put off by 

my style, I don't give my opinion in the classroom, I don't think it is appropriate. This journal on the 

other hand, is for thinking and formulating ideas, based on what we have read and learned. 

Cynthia 































1565







on it. 






Ann 























Cynthia 










1566







Ann 












Cynthia 


Cynthia, 




















Crazy http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/32.gif ..... 


1567

_____ 

_____ 

Ann 








it….Man’s mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given 



his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch—or build a 

cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To remain alive, he 




























1568

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 











_____ 



1569



Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 1:13 PM 


Subject: (round #7) What can be learned from this....What is at the root of the issue? 

O.K., so what can we learn from this? 

What is at the root of this issue, that keeps popping it's ugly head up from time to time, that needs to 

be addressed? 

1. Be nice to other people ....... http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gif 

2. Don't dish out a sharp tongue and not be willing to get a sharp tongue back. 


2. Don't mess with Ann.... http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/12.gif When she's fed 

up, she's fed up!!! 

3. Don't repeatedly challenge certain people's posts .... again and again and again, no matter what 

topic they switch to .... http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/31.gif It can really wear 

you down. 

4. Don't challenge or attack other people (or their ideas) 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/12.gif with sharp tongues whether it's on the list 

serve, the classroom, or whether you are talking with a professor, or a fellow classmate ..... It not 

only hurts other people http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/02.gif, but it makes you 

look bad. http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/16.gif 

5. You can get more bees with honey than you can with sharp tongues..... 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/03.gif So when your are debating or discussing 

issues with people, reword your responses so they are not too abrasive. 


7. Know when to just let it go..... http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/23.gif You don't 

always have to have the last word. 

8. Treat others as you would want them to treat you..... 











Ann, Just to set the record straight, I went back to see what I posted. My post that you thought I 

was attacking or mocking you in was just one of my posts, not a response to yours at all. It was a 

journal entry about the readings. When I post my opinion, or even respond to you or others, it 

doesn't mean I disagree with you, unless of course I say so. It is just another way to look at things, 

or something else to consider. It is all part of the learning process for me. It is a way to sort out 

the gray area. 



1570



Cynthia 



Talking with you can be soooooo frustrating (do you feel the same way with talking with me?) 

(or is it just me??????)........... I am laughing at the same time I am shaking my head in 

frustration. I am not disagreeing with you...... Your ideas about teaching kids to think for 

themselves, that parents should teach their kids stuff at home, etc. are all valid, I agree...... I 

will not "love all my students" as you seem to be inferring I have said. I am quite sure there will 

be some that drive me nuts!!!! I am not Gandhi either. I will still get to know them though. 

Knowing someone and liking them don't go hand-in-hand. You can still be a very effective 

teacher when you know your students (some may argue more effective than not knowing 

them). I still feel like you are misunderstanding me do to the fact that you seem to keep 

thinking I my ideas are in contradiction to yours; they are not!!!! I want my students to walk 

away with all the necessary skills that will help them be successful in this world. You keep 

putting words in my mouth that I never said. You make it seem as though I have some far out 

artsy fartsy, flaky ideas about teaching when in reality I only expressed that "taking the time to 

know your students on a more personal level can be beneficial to the learning environment". 

You claim that you were trying "to be non-confrontational, while pointing out a difference of 

opinion" and claim that it didn't work. Do you not realize that during your attempt to be nonconfrontational, 

you were doing the very opposite? If you do not want to be nonconfrontational, 

then don't include passive aggressive undertones in your writing. That's like 

yelling at someone to calm down, or talking about subjects that upset them while giving them a 

massage. They are dichotomous ideas.... 

You are correct about us having a different viewpoint of how the world works; every single 

human being sees the world through their own unique lens which is effected by all of their past 


As far as this group dynamics thing is going, why is it that my posts keep being attacked, 

directly or indirectly, while others get complimented? It seems as though if someone else had 

written about the very same ideas, they could walk away with complements and pats on the 

back, but when I talk about the same issues, you feel the need to dissect, distort, and attack 

them either directly or indirectly? I don't see any attacks or passive aggression towards any of 

the males in the cohort. Is a male female thing? Or is it our personalities that are clashing? 

You seem to think we have such different ideas about teaching and about how the world 

works, but I think it has to do more with our personalities clashing. To me (which means, I 

alone see it... I am not speaking for anyone else) your communication style comes across as 

very abrupt and sharp. It often leaves a sting either directly or indirectly. And it is this that I 

am usually reacting to. My personality does not like to be stung by your personality. I am not 

sure how I come across to other people, but if it is not favorable, I would hope that I could find 

out nicely so that I may work on it. 

If I was a student and you offended me, as do some of your responses to my posts, I would 

turn off and you would have lost me a long time ago. I am not implying that you talk to 

students the same way, but I sure hope you don't. However, even if I was a coworker and I 

was offended by a clashing of personalities, it would not make for a positive work environment. 

1571

Just something to absorb and think about. 

Ann 





learning. I think you have good intentions, as do I and the rest of the class. But it concerns 

me that the main reason for teaching would be "because I love children". If you think about 

it, does everyone love all children, even those they haven't met? I don't think its realistic to 

say I will love all my students, because I know it isn't true. I am not Gandhi. But that doesn't 

mean I can't be an effective teacher. As I mentioned in one of my other posts, there seems 

to be a real focus on social issues in the public schools these days. You know, the stuff that 

kids are supposed to learn at home from their parents. It uses up a lot of time that could be 

spent on science, reading and math. I am not saying it shouldn't be there at all, but if its 

taught as a science lesson like in the "Learning from Cases" book, that would be a good 

thing. I am not going to school to be a social worker, but a teacher. You might argue that 

students don't get this stuff at home, so it needs to be taught in the schools. I would 

disagree. When you take power away from someone, you put them in danger (the parents). 

When you give the students a real education, they can think for themselves and don't need 

to be indoctrinated with what "we" think is the correct way to view the world. 

I don't think I misunderstood what you were saying. I just have a different viewpoint on how 

the world works. I don't think I have any right to tell you how to think, or even that you 

should change the way you think. And so I was attempting to be nonconfrontational, while 

pointing out a difference in opinion. Guess it didn't work. 

Cynthia 




which have been expressed in the journals. For instance I wrote about one of the 

teachers that stood out to me because he met with all of us before the first day of 

school.... etc, and I also wrote that I still see him around town etc. Then, you post a 

journal with some good ideas about how you want to teach, and that's all great; but, 

when you add in little subtle side notes such as "And I am not going into it (teaching) so 

that students remember ME". This feels as though you were mocking, as I wrote 

above, the previous posts. So, when I tried to clarify this and explain that I am not going 

into to teaching to be remembered by my students, you apologize for misunderstanding 

me, but in the very same breath you misunderstand me all over again. How is it that I 

am talking about "A, B, and C"... and it gets twisted up as if I were talking about "H, or 

Z?" Is my writing style, or ability to clearly express my ideas really that screwed up? If 

it is, please do me a favor by letting me know so that I can correct this shortcomming. 

Ann 



1572

teacher who stands in front of the class telling students what I think they need to 

know. I am not saying you will be, thats not what I mean. It's just that my idea of 

educating students is guiding them so that they learn new things that encourages 

them to think. Sometimes teachers are so fearful of destroying the self-esteem of 

their fragile students that no learning takes place. But I strongly believe in high 

standards for all students, they need to produce. Call it hardnose if you want, but I 

think it can be done in a way that is enjoyable even if they are being pushed to do 

their best. This does not mean I won't get to know my students, of course I will. I do 

it now with the students I work with, and I am getting great results. They take 

progress tests, so I know that what I do works. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

What's up with the capitalized (remember "ME") in your post? Please don't 

confuse the warm hearted sincerity of some recent posts (not just mine) as 

inferring these classrooms will be "all lovey dovey and artsy fartsy". I am sure 

that there will be little noses to the grind stones and rigid time schedules to dance 

with as well. I picture teaching as a multifaceted dance with so many moves that 

it will make your head spin. Success will be in managing it all and making it 



better picture of how to go about helping them on their level. That way, your 

efforts will be most effective. It will also make their little tails wag and make them 

feel like they are important (which they are). When I think back about why 

certain adults stood out in my past (good ones that is) it's because they were the 

ones who cared about (me). They talked with me, not at me, or not down to me. 

And, it is those adults who had the greatest opportunity to teach me the most 



Yang...the structures and the fluff... the main courses and the desserts... the 

cardio and the strength training... the brushing with the flossing... the peanut 

butter with the jelly... the macaroni with the cheese.... All work and no play 

makes Ann a little Crazy 



Ann 



fundamental change is unneeded, novel ideas need not be encouraged." 

Sagan 

.."the survival of the human species and the attainment of greater happiness 

for individuals depend on the ability to think scientifically, rationally, and 

1573

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

skeptically." Skeptics Society Manifesto 


it….Man’s mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is 

given to him, its sustenance is not. His mind is given to him, its content is not. To remain 

alive, he must act, and before he can act he must know the nature and purpose of his action. 

He cannot obtain his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot 

dig a ditch—or build a cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to 


After reading chapters 18, 19, and 20 of Sagan, I have come to this 

conclusion: 


comfortable compared to other countries around the world. Many countries 

see education as "key" in order to compete. Japan, for instance, works very 

hard at it, and they are doing a pretty good job in some respects. They sure 

make good cars. South Korea wants to compete very badly, hence education 

is very important to them as well. Being the leading power, we don't think we 

are in dire need of anything (other than social programs). And look what the 

emphasis is on in our schools. I think Americans may take our position in the 

world for granted, from a novice viewpoint, if you will. This might explain why 

some of us (meaning Americans) don't think science and math education is 

so important. Sure, you can blame it on the money, but I don't. There are 

plenty of people who do a job because they like it, not because of the money. 

Me, for instance: I am not going into teaching for the money!! And I am not 

going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at 

least some students have the opportunity to learn to think. I know what is 

possible, and I intend to provide an environment that will motivate students to 

get beyond the wonder and to search for the how and why. It doesn't matter 

that I don't know everything there is to know about science because I am not 

afraid to learn. I think its important to go our of the comfort zone, which many 

teachers are not willing to do. The funny thing is, they don't even have to 

teach it. They can guide the students by having them use the scientific 

method. The students can teach themselves, and they will remember it 

because the discoveries they make will be their own. Ok, time to step down 

from the soapbox. Cynthia 







1574

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 









_____ 



1575






Hey Casey, 

Thanks... 



Hi Anne...I think the "love" thing came from my journal. I think, personally, that there are so many 

more things that you can teach your students than just math and science. Obviously they are very 

important elements to life but isn't there so much more? 

Anne- I am very impressed with your journals. I think you take the time to really get across what 

you are trying to say so that people don't assume anything. I admire that cuz instead of taking the 

time to defend myself...I just let things go and say oh well. I am not Gandhi but I do like kids. I 

think you have to in order to teach. Again...just my opinion. Casey 

_____ 



1576





Subject: the grass is greener 

sagan's chapter 20 just reiderated the fact that we cannot please everyone, especially as 

teachers. but if you think about it this is true in a ny job, any position, any culture. 

someone is always gonna be happy with your work, life, ideas or hate your work, life, 

ideas. 

i think this stems from the fact that people in general think the grass is always greener 

on the other side. think about it. we arent ever completely satisfied because we are 

always looking over the fence. 

sometimes we go through the gate and find another fence and sometimes we stay put but cant 

stop looking over into our neighbors yard. 

so apply that to teaching and you'll recognize why its more often than not, easier for 

parents to assume someone else can teach better than you. 

now i know some parents are gonna be very happy with us. and for those, i am grateful b/c 

it only takes one to believe in us, encouraging us to continue on. 

in the end, we cant please everyone, and we can die trying, but what's most important is 

that we please our students. atleast i think so. 


1577





Subject: white flag for cynthia 

Cynthia, 

In response to this post. If you say that post was not in response to mine, then why did you not say 

so like 5 responses ago? You still kept debating (which feels like arguing lately) with me as if was 

intend in the message. And that is what gets frustrating. To me I feel like I give warning shots when I 

am growing frustrated; if you see me in person, just look at my face..... it tells all. But, I don't think 

my warning shots are in your language? It's like you don't hear me until I am just plain stinking mad. 

I really think this is a teachable moment to realize how important it is to get to know your students, or 

for us right now classmates, because if you know the different personalities and such, you would see 

how they could get along better. Please don't think that I don't like you because you can be fun to be 

around, just not when we are clashing. I think you have a lot a valid ideas and good intentions in your 

future career as a teacher... 

For right now.... for the next 2.5 semesters please try to be a bit more cognizant of how you might be 

coming across to me (more directly said - please try and control that powerfully sharp tongue of 

yours) and I will try to be less sensitive and more direct with you. 

How does this sound to you? 



Ann, Just to set the record straight, I went back to see what I posted. My post that you thought I 

was attacking or mocking you in was just one of my posts, not a response to yours at all. It was a 

journal entry about the readings. When I post my opinion, or even respond to you or others, it 

doesn't mean I disagree with you, unless of course I say so. It is just another way to look at things, 

or something else to consider. It is all part of the learning process for me. It is a way to sort out 

the gray area. 





Cynthia 



Talking with you can be soooooo frustrating (do you feel the same way with talking with me?) 

(or is it just me??????)........... I am laughing at the same time I am shaking my head in 

frustration. I am not disagreeing with you...... Your ideas about teaching kids to think for 

themselves, that parents should teach their kids stuff at home, etc. are all valid, I agree...... I 

will not "love all my students" as you seem to be inferring I have said. I am quite sure there will 

be some that drive me nuts!!!! I am not Gandhi either. I will still get to know them though. 

1578

Knowing someone and liking them don't go hand-in-hand. You can still be a very effective 

teacher when you know your students (some may argue more effective than not knowing 

them). I still feel like you are misunderstanding me do to the fact that you seem to keep 

thinking I my ideas are in contradiction to yours; they are not!!!! I want my students to walk 

away with all the necessary skills that will help them be successful in this world. You keep 

putting words in my mouth that I never said. You make it seem as though I have some far out 

artsy fartsy, flaky ideas about teaching when in reality I only expressed that "taking the time to 

know your students on a more personal level can be beneficial to the learning environment". 

You claim that you were trying "to be non-confrontational, while pointing out a difference of 

opinion" and claim that it didn't work. Do you not realize that during your attempt to be nonconfrontational, 


then don't include passive aggressive undertones in your writing. That's like 

yelling at someone to calm down, or talking about subjects that upset them while giving them a 

massage. They are dichotomous ideas.... 


human being sees the world through their own unique lens which is effected by all of their past 



directly or indirectly, while others get complimented? It seems as though if someone else had 

written about the very same ideas, they could walk away with complements and pats on the 

back, but when I talk about the same issues, you feel the need to dissect, distort, and attack 

them either directly or indirectly? I don't see any attacks or passive aggression towards any of 

the males in the cohort. Is a male female thing? Or is it our personalities that are clashing? 



alone see it... I am not speaking for anyone else) your communication style comes across as 

very abrupt and sharp. It often leaves a sting either directly or indirectly. And it is this that I 

am usually reacting to. My personality does not like to be stung by your personality. I am not 

sure how I come across to other people, but if it is not favorable, I would hope that I could find 

out nicely so that I may work on it. 




was offended by a clashing of personalities, it would not make for a positive work environment. 

Just something to absorb and think about. 

Ann 





learning. I think you have good intentions, as do I and the rest of the class. But it concerns 

me that the main reason for teaching would be "because I love children". If you think about 

it, does everyone love all children, even those they haven't met? I don't think its realistic to 

say I will love all my students, because I know it isn't true. I am not Gandhi. But that doesn't 

mean I can't be an effective teacher. As I mentioned in one of my other posts, there seems 

1579

to be a real focus on social issues in the public schools these days. You know, the stuff that 

kids are supposed to learn at home from their parents. It uses up a lot of time that could be 

spent on science, reading and math. I am not saying it shouldn't be there at all, but if its 

taught as a science lesson like in the "Learning from Cases" book, that would be a good 

thing. I am not going to school to be a social worker, but a teacher. You might argue that 

students don't get this stuff at home, so it needs to be taught in the schools. I would 

disagree. When you take power away from someone, you put them in danger (the parents). 

When you give the students a real education, they can think for themselves and don't need 

to be indoctrinated with what "we" think is the correct way to view the world. 

I don't think I misunderstood what you were saying. I just have a different viewpoint on how 

the world works. I don't think I have any right to tell you how to think, or even that you 

should change the way you think. And so I was attempting to be nonconfrontational, while 

pointing out a difference in opinion. Guess it didn't work. 

Cynthia 




which have been expressed in the journals. For instance I wrote about one of the 

teachers that stood out to me because he met with all of us before the first day of 

school.... etc, and I also wrote that I still see him around town etc. Then, you post a 

journal with some good ideas about how you want to teach, and that's all great; but, 

when you add in little subtle side notes such as "And I am not going into it (teaching) so 

that students remember ME". This feels as though you were mocking, as I wrote 

above, the previous posts. So, when I tried to clarify this and explain that I am not going 

into to teaching to be remembered by my students, you apologize for misunderstanding 

me, but in the very same breath you misunderstand me all over again. How is it that I 

am talking about "A, B, and C"... and it gets twisted up as if I were talking about "H, or 

Z?" Is my writing style, or ability to clearly express my ideas really that screwed up? If 

it is, please do me a favor by letting me know so that I can correct this shortcomming. 

Ann 








standards for all students, they need to produce. Call it hardnose if you want, but I 

think it can be done in a way that is enjoyable even if they are being pushed to do 

their best. This does not mean I won't get to know my students, of course I will. I do 

it now with the students I work with, and I am getting great results. They take 


Cynthia 


1580

Cynthia, 




that there will be little noses to the grind stones and rigid time schedules to dance 

with as well. I picture teaching as a multifaceted dance with so many moves that 

it will make your head spin. Success will be in managing it all and making it 



better picture of how to go about helping them on their level. That way, your 

efforts will be most effective. It will also make their little tails wag and make them 

feel like they are important (which they are). When I think back about why 

certain adults stood out in my past (good ones that is) it's because they were the 

ones who cared about (me). They talked with me, not at me, or not down to me. 

And, it is those adults who had the greatest opportunity to teach me the most 









Ann 




Sagan 

.."the survival of the human species and the attainment of greater happiness 

for individuals depend on the ability to think scientifically, rationally, and 

skeptically." Skeptics Society Manifesto 


it….Man’s mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is 

given to him, its sustenance is not. His mind is given to him, its content is not. To remain 

alive, he must act, and before he can act he must know the nature and purpose of his action. 

He cannot obtain his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot 

dig a ditch—or build a cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to 



conclusion: 


comfortable compared to other countries around the world. Many countries 

see education as "key" in order to compete. Japan, for instance, works very 

1581

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

hard at it, and they are doing a pretty good job in some respects. They sure 

make good cars. South Korea wants to compete very badly, hence education 

is very important to them as well. Being the leading power, we don't think we 

are in dire need of anything (other than social programs). And look what the 

emphasis is on in our schools. I think Americans may take our position in the 

world for granted, from a novice viewpoint, if you will. This might explain why 

some of us (meaning Americans) don't think science and math education is 

so important. Sure, you can blame it on the money, but I don't. There are 

plenty of people who do a job because they like it, not because of the money. 

Me, for instance: I am not going into teaching for the money!! And I am not 

going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at 

least some students have the opportunity to learn to think. I know what is 

possible, and I intend to provide an environment that will motivate students to 

get beyond the wonder and to search for the how and why. It doesn't matter 

that I don't know everything there is to know about science because I am not 

afraid to learn. I think its important to go our of the comfort zone, which many 

teachers are not willing to do. The funny thing is, they don't even have to 

teach it. They can guide the students by having them use the scientific 

method. The students can teach themselves, and they will remember it 

because the discoveries they make will be their own. Ok, time to step down 

from the soapbox. Cynthia 











1582

_____ 





_____ 



1583





Subject: The gray area...journal #10 


reply (7 KB) 

> Cynthia, 

I agree that the Japanese have a very different culture than our own and it is why studies 

making comparison to their education system to ours exist. This recent study that I read 

compared the way corporate America runs things and the way the Japanese run their 

corporations. The U.S. continues to show interest in the Japanese way of doing things. 

The Japanese must have some level of success that we find note worthy. As you pointed out 

the difference between the U.S. and Japan has more to do with our Capital system that 

promotes individuality and the Japanese system, which was founded on a social structure. 

This black and white way of looking at things I realize is not limited to the realm of 

religion. For example, we can compare our judicial system to Japan's judicial system. I 

met someone that lived in Japan for a while in his pursuit for a law enforcement career. 

He related to me what he saw first hand and compared it to my years of working in law 

enforcement and his conve 

rsations with officers. We can begin by looking at our prison system full of repeated 

offenders because we do not take the time to look at the gray area to figuring out why our 

system of education is failing, for example, our black and Hispanic children and then we 

like to say that we promote diversity. The term diversity if not backed up by the very 

people who fought for equal rights is just that something that sounds good. Let us look at 

the reality of things like our social economic structure and the kind of money that really 

goes into schools like in southeast San Diego. Once we do that than we can say that we are 

looking at the gray area to bring and end to the cycle of our black and Hispanic children 

ending up in our prison system. Blacks and Hispanics as we know are overrepresented in 

special programs. It seems that overlooking this gray area leads to crime. The gray area 

represents to me those areas we are not even willing to look at. Meanwhile, the Japanese 

do not 

tolerate crime and control crime by establishing a social sense of community, educational 

support, and loyalty to family. Whereas, in the United States is about "me, me, me, and 

me?" Also, in Japan a prisoner's family must pay restitution for the crime committed by 

the offender, therefore, establishing a system of responsibility. Moreover, once a 

prisoner serves his/her time, in Japan, they have the right to get on with their lives 

without having to make mention of the crime in some application. If the crime committed 

was a felony than they would not have the right to freedom therefore relieving the 

community from criminals that pose a danger to society. Meanwhile, in the U.S., we remain 

locked into a system that is no longer working for us because we see it in terms of black 

and white; we are unwilling to change or challenge the establishment. (Alexandra's journal 

#10 ? April 1, 2003) 


> Date: 2004/04/01 Thu AM 04:04:19 EST 


> Subject: Re: The gray area...journal #9 

> 

> The Japanese (and other Asian) Culture is very structured, which seems very black and 

white to me. The are right ways and wrongs ways to do things. Even working as a group 

could be considered black or white because if you don't agree (or conform) you are wrong. 

If Americans were half as strict about social things as they are, our country would be a 

completely different place. We tend to be more vocal and expressive, so maybe we appear 

more black and white, but I think it might be the opposite. We have so many different 

1584

viewpoints here, and the freedom to express them, that I see tons of gray areas. They are 

gray because when you think about them, they aren't necessarily wrong, just different. And 

even the people who make up our country are in the gray area, because they come from all 

over the world. Try going to Japan. Remember that Bathhouse article we read in Plant's 

class? No gray area there! Maybe their religion has more gray area than the Christian 

religion, I don't kn 

ow 

> enough 

> about either to form an opinion. But society is more than religion. I think America 

demands more acceptance of the gray area than some other countries do because of our 

diversity. That doesn't mean all people accept the gray, but at least its a work in 

progress. 

> Cynthia 

> 


> I meant to have this journal out earlier in the week, but I had to decide whether 

spending time with my little brother who I have custody of, taking care of lose ends from 

my car being hit last week, and recovering physically and emotionally was just as 

important. I wanted to make sure that my journal process was reflective and that I truly 

found something to apply to my journey. 

> It is interesting the way westerners focus on the black and white area rather than the 

gray area in-between. It seems to be a western phenomenon. If there is something I am 

supposed to gain out of this semester, it is the importance of not thinking in black and 

white but the importance of paying attention to the gray area of life. I was talking to a 

friend the other day about life and the gray areas within that challenges us and at times 

makes no sense. I could not help but think of the conversations in Yamashita's class about 

sense, nonsense, and the gray area. My friend is a sergeant with the SDPD and shared with 

me an article titled, "Zen and the Art of Management." Although the article has to do with 

management, I think it can be applied to education for it analysis the westerners' way of 

thinking in terms of black and white and the Japanese way of thinking that takes into 

consideration the "process," which allows for reflection on the gray area that westerners 

overlook 

. 

> I reflected on the different views that were addressed by our classmates in terms of 

their religious views, and I could not help but see how much of it was focused on the 

black and white rather than the challenging the gray area. When an attempt was made to 

challenge the gray area it was received with resistance or not acknowledge at all. 

According to the study in the article, we reacted just as expected. 

> After all as a society we are encouraged to take one side or the other for ambiguity 

does not feel comfortable to our culture. Yet, understanding ourselves lies in ambiguity 

according to the years of studies involving both corporations in the U.S. and Japan. Why? 

Taking a stance whether black or white limits our human connection to those that the dwell 

in-between. As future teachers this is important for us to consider, our future children 

are made of the black stuff, white stuff and everything else in-between. In our culture we 

have the tendency of needing to prove the other person wrong rather it be through our 

religious biases or feeling like we have to take sides. We so want to belong to something. 

As the article points out, "[masking our] self-serving sense of brute integrity" without 

taking into consideration the sexiest components that make up our culture. This very point 

is addressed in Longino's article, "Science as Social Knowledge," which informs us that 

that sci 

e 

> nce reflects the values of its society which permits the exclusion of women and racial 

> groups,therefore, reflecting bad science because here science is supporting the very 

issues that is feeding into a biased society. Meanwhile in out society, taking a position 

is considered strong, secure, and masculine. However, looking at the gray and allowing the 

process of life to support a higher truth represents ambiguity, which is considered female 

because somehow ambiguity makes reference to sensitivity and feelings. Whether we support 

our beliefs with biblical quotes or Zen thoughts, what does fact have to do with the 

experience of life itself? 

> In our society we struggle with being seen as human and not just another teacher, 

worker, or student, etc. Yet, we never stop to think that it is this much embedded way 

thinking in black and white that keeps us thinking of efficiency in terms of what we put 

out rather than how human we can remain. How do we do this? Well, the decisions our 

society makes is made from the black and white area instead of allowing for the process 

that reveals that life is not so black and white. Our inflated egos does not reflect 

humility, God, our path of love, servitude, but reflects instead how as a person we are 

1585

"out for one's self. How does this differ from a more eastern way of thinking like in 

Japan? For starters Japanese culture does not permit its people to see life in terms of 

making decisions for that would limit them to the black and white way of thinking that 

dominates our society. They see life in terms of making choices from the challenges that 

they face. They have come to terms 

th 

> at there is much more going on in the universe than deceiving themselves into thinking 

of their control over things. They see the benefit of working together for a common good, 

therefore, realizing the benefit of treating their employees at all level like humans 

because ultimately they represent one work force. The final evidence shows that both team 

efforts in the U.S. and Japan are just as efficient and productive but the difference lies 

in recognizing that humanity is not made up of black and white but the gray area in 

between. Hence, the bigger picture needs to be considered not just the position we think 

we hold with our limited ego as individuals. It is about teamwork and santioning the 

process of living life to reveal the gray area before judging it through our limited 

experiences.(Alexandra's journal #9 - March 30, 2004). 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 


> Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today 

> 

1586





Subject: Entry dates... 

This is Alexandra. I just posted my journal #10 and the computer shows that I posted it on 

April 2 after midnight. It is just 9:18 pm. April 1st. Last night I posted journal #9 on 

May 31st and the computer posted it for the next day, April 1st. I hope that this does not 

cause a problem later. 

1587





Subject: Re: the grass is greener 

See Karis.... I knew that was you that I saw peeking over my fence last weekend after I did all that 

yard work. http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gif 

I agree, people need to stop every once and a while (me included) and appreciate what they do have 

instead of focusing on what they don't have, or what the neighbor has.... etc. The thought of difficult 

parents in our future careers sounds very challenging. You are right about how if you have just one 

person on your side rooting for you, it really helps you out. This world can seem so overwhelming at 

times.... The support and the friendship of good people are very important. Sometimes as teachers 

will be the only ray of light in a student's world. Let's make sure we hear them and see them. 



sagan's chapter 20 just reiderated the fact that we cannot please everyone, especially as 

teachers. but if you think about it this is true in a ny job, any position, any culture. someone is 

always gonna be happy with your work, life, ideas or hate your work, life, ideas. 

i think this stems from the fact that people in general think the grass is always greener on the 

other side. think about it. we arent ever completely satisfied because we are always looking over 

the fence. 

sometimes we go through the gate and find another fence and sometimes we stay put but cant 

stop looking over into our neighbors yard. 

so apply that to teaching and you'll recognize why its more often than not, easier for parents to 

assume someone else can teach better than you. 

now i know some parents are gonna be very happy with us. and for those, i am grateful b/c it only 

ta kes one to believe in us, encouraging us to continue on. 

in the end, we cant please everyone, and we can die trying, but what's most important is that we 

please our students. atleast i think so. 


_____ 



1588





Subject: RE: the grass is greener 

Hey Karis, 

You brought up some very valid points. With respect to teaching; until 

I was in the classroom as a parent volunteer and also as a student 

teacher, I thought that teachers must have the "life of Larry" and that 

they must be doing something wrong for the California academic scores to 

be so low in the nation. NOW, I have been exposed to just how hard 

working these teachers are and how most of them are very dedicated to 

their jobs. I NOW realize the huge amount of red tape they have to wade 

through and all the people they have to please. I NOW realize that 

teaching can often be a thankless job with respect to financial 

compensation. And NOW I realize that it takes a special person to fill 

the job of a teacher. And, like you said, the most important thing is 

pleasing the student and making sure that we deliver the best education 

that we possibly can. 

The grass can always be seen as greener (like my doctor friend who just 

got a job in Tennessee for $700,000 a year), but there's no way I'd want 

the stress of the medical profession which he's encountering. There'll 

always be better things around the corner, but very often, what's 

sitting in your own back garden can be the best thing for you. ~ Louise 





Subject: the grass is greener 

sagan's chapter 20 just reiderated the fact that we cannot please 

everyone, especially as teachers. but if you think about it this is 

true in a ny job, any position, any culture. someone is always gonna be 

happy with your work, life, ideas or hate your work, life, ideas. 

i think this stems from the fact that people in general think the grass 

is always greener on the other side. think about it. we arent ever 

completely satisfied because we are always looking over the fence. 

sometimes we go through the gate and find another fence and sometimes we 

stay put but cant stop looking over into our neighbors yard. 

so apply that to teaching and you'll recognize why its more often than 

not, easier for parents to assume someone else can teach better than 

you. 

now i know some parents are gonna be very happy with us. and for those, 

i am grateful b/c it only takes one to believe in us, encouraging us to 

continue on. 

in the end, we cant please everyone, and we can die trying, but what's 

most important is that we please our students. atleast i think so. 

1589


1590





Subject: Re: Entry dates... 

It shouldn't Alexandra, I got yours on the date you really posted it. Maybe there is a ghost in here 

playing with your computer. 

Cynthia 


This is Alexandra. I just posted my journal #10 and the computer shows that I posted it on April 2 

after midnight. It is just 9:18 pm. April 1st. Last night I posted journal #9 on May 31st and the 

computer posted it for the next day, April 1st. I hope that this does not cause a problem later. 

_____ 



1591





Subject: Re: The gray area...journal #10 

Alexandra, I am glad you mentioned their justice system, because I don't know anything about it. 

Sounds like a good model to me. They seem to be a lot stricter and less tolerant of crime over there. I 

personally think criminals have it way to easy here. In regards to education, the Japanese don't have 

to deal with students who speak a million different languages who come from a million different 

cultures. That makes it easier to start with. Their students also have to study a lot harder than ours 

do. I am not so sure more money would make a big difference here. Its the way the money is being 

spent (or wasted). Like at Central Elementary, they have lots of federal dollars that they blow on 

curricullum the teachers don't even use. I also wonder how many Japanese students are put on 

Ritalin and other drugs like here. (Might have to check that out). In comparing our culture to the 

Japanese culture, I think we have the gray areas in all the wrong places, and maybe they have it in all 

the right places, even though their day to day life is very rigid and black and white. I personally admire 

many Asian cultures for their sense of order and discipline. We could use a bit more of that here. 

Cynthia 


> Cynthia, 

I agree that the Japanese have a very different culture than our own and it is why studies making 

comparison to their education system to ours exist. This recent study that I read compared the 

way corporate America runs things and the way the Japanese run their corporations. The U.S. 

continues to show interest in the Japanese way of doing things. The Japanese must have some 

level of success that we find note worthy. As you pointed out the difference between the U.S. and 

Japan has more to do with our Capital system that promotes individuality and the Japanese 

system, which was founded on a social structure. This black and white way of looking at things I 

realize is not limited to the realm of religion. For example, we can compare our judicial system to 

Japan's judicial system. I met someone that lived in Japan for a while in his pursuit for a law 

enforcemen t career. He related to me what he saw first hand and compared it to my years of 

working in law enforcement and his conve 

rsations with officers. We can begin by looking at our prison system full of repeated offenders 

because we do not take the time to look at the gray area to figuring out why our system of 

education is failing, for example, our black and Hispanic children and then we like to say that we 

promote diversity. The term diversity if not backed up by the very people who fought for equal 

rights is just that something that sounds good. Let us look at the reality of things like our social 

economic structure and the kind of money that really goes into schools like in southeast San 

Diego. Once we do that than we can say that we are looking at the gray area to bring and end to 

the cycle of our black and Hispanic children ending up in our prison system. Blacks and Hispanics 

as we know are overrepresented in special programs. It seems that overlooking this gray area 

lead s to crime. The gray area represents to me those areas we are not even willing to look at. 

Meanwhile, the Japanese do not 

tolerate crime and control crime by establishing a social sense of community, educational support, 

and loyalty to family. Whereas, in the United States is about "me, me, me, and me?" Also, in 

Japan a prisoner's family must pay restitution for the crime committed by the offender, therefore, 

establishing a system of responsibility. Moreover, once a prisoner serves his/her time, in Japan, 

they have the right to get on with their lives without having to make mention of the crime in some 

1592

application. If the crime committed was a felony than they would not have the right to freedom 

therefore relieving the community from criminals that pose a danger to society. Meanwhile, in the 

U.S., we remain locked into a system that is no longer working for us because we see it in terms 

of black and white; we are unwilling to change or challenge the establishment. (Alexandra' s 

journal #10 ? April 1, 2003) 


> Date: 2004/04/01 Thu AM 04:04:19 EST 


> Subject: Re: The gray area...journal #9 

> 

> The Japanese (and other Asian) Culture is very structured, which seems very black and white to 

me. The are right ways and wrongs ways to do things. Even working as a group could be 

considered black or white because if you don't agree (or conform) you are wrong. If Americans 

were half as strict about social things as they are, our country would be a completely different 

place. We tend to be more vocal and expressive, so maybe we appear more black and white, but I 

think it might be the opposite. We have so many different viewpoints here, and the freedom to 

express them, that I see tons of gray areas. They are gray because when you think about them, 

they aren't necessarily wrong, just different. And even the people who make up our country are in 

the gray area, because they come from all over the world. Try going to Japan. Remember that 

Bathhouse article we read in Plant's class? No gray area there! Maybe their religion has more 

gray area than the Christian religion, I don't kn 

ow 

> enough 

> about either to form an opinion. But society is more than religion. I think America demands more 

acceptance of the gray area than some other countries do because of our diversity. That doesn't 

mean all people accept the gray, but at least its a work in progress. 

> Cynthia 

> 


> I meant to have this journal out earlier in the week, but I had to decide whether spending time 

with my little brother who I have custody of, taking care of lose ends from my car being hit last 

week, and recovering physically and emotionally was just as important. I wanted to make sure that 

my journal process was reflective and that I truly found something to apply to my journey. 

> It is interesting the way wester ners focus on the black and white area rather than the gray area 

in-between. It seems to be a western phenomenon. If there is something I am supposed to gain 

out of this semester, it is the importance of not thinking in black and white but the importance of 

paying attention to the gray area of life. I was talking to a friend the other day about life and the 

gray areas within that challenges us and at times makes no sense. I could not help but think of the 

conversations in Yamashita's class about sense, nonsense, and the gray area. My friend is a 

sergeant with the SDPD and shared with me an article titled, "Zen and the Art of Management." 

Although the article has to do with management, I think it can be applied to education for it 

analysis the westerners' way of thinking in terms of black and white and the Japanese way of 

thinking that takes into consideration the "process," which allows for reflection on the gray area 

that westerners overlook 

. 

> I reflected on the diff erent views that were addressed by our classmates in terms of their 

religious views, and I could not help but see how much of it was focused on the black and white 

rather than the challenging the gray area. When an attempt was made to challenge the gray area 

it was received with resistance or not acknowledge at all. According to the study in the article, we 

reacted just as expected. 

> After all as a society we are encouraged to take one side or the other for ambiguity does not feel 

comfortable to our culture. Yet, understanding ourselves lies in ambiguity according to the years of 

1593

studies involving both corporations in the U.S. and Japan. Why? Taking a stance whether black or 

white limits our human connection to those that the dwell in-between. As future teachers this is 

important for us to consider, our future children are made of the black stuff, white stuff and 

everything else in-between. In our culture we have the tendency of needing to prove the other 

person wrong rath er it be through our religious biases or feeling like we have to take sides. We so 

want to belong to something. As the article points out, "[masking our] self-serving sense of brute 

integrity" without taking into consideration the sexiest components that make up our culture. This 

very point is addressed in Longino's article, "Science as Social Knowledge," which informs us that 

that sci 

e 

> nce reflects the values of its society which permits the exclusion of women and racial 

> groups,therefore, reflecting bad science because here science is supporting the very issues that 

is feeding into a biased society. Meanwhile in out society, taking a position is considered strong, 

secure, and masculine. However, looking at the gray and allowing the process of life to support a 

higher truth represents ambiguity, which is considered female because somehow ambiguity 

makes reference to sensitivity and feelings. Whether we support our beliefs with biblical quotes or 

Zen thoughts, wha t does fact have to do with the experience of life itself? 

> In our society we struggle with being seen as human and not just another teacher, worker, or 

student, etc. Yet, we never stop to think that it is this much embedded way thinking in black and 

white that keeps us thinking of efficiency in terms of what we put out rather than how human we 

can remain. How do we do this? Well, the decisions our society makes is made from the black and 

white area instead of allowing for the process that reveals that life is not so black and white. Our 

inflated egos does not reflect humility, God, our path of love, servitude, but reflects instead how as 

a person we are "out for one's self. How does this differ from a more eastern way of thinking like in 

Japan? For starters Japanese culture does not permit its people to see life in terms of making 

decisions for that would limit them to the black and white way of thinking that dominates our 

society. They see life in terms of making choices from the challenges that they face. They have 

come to terms 

th 

> at there is much more going on in the universe than deceiving themselves into thinking of their 



represent one work force. The final evidence shows that both team efforts in the U.S. and Japan 

are just as efficient and productive but the difference lies in recognizing that humanity is not made 

up of black and white but the gray area in between. Hence, the bigger picture needs to be 

considered not just the position we think we hold with our limited ego as individuals. It is about 

teamwork and santioning the process of living life to reveal the gray area before judging it through 

our limited experiences.(Alexandra's journal #9 - March 30, 2004). 

> 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 

The Japanese (and other Asian) Culture is very structured, which seems very black and white to 

me. The are right ways and wrongs ways to do things. Even working as a group could be 

considered black or white because if you don't agree (or conform) you are wrong. If Americans 

were half as strict about social things as they are, our country would be a completely different 

place. We tend to be more vocal and expressive, so maybe we appear more black and white, but I 

think it might be the opposite. We have so many different viewpoints here, and the freedom to 

express them, that I see tons of gray areas. They are gray because when you think about them, 

1594

they aren't necessarily wrong, just different. And even the people who make up our country are in 

the gray area, because they come from all over the world. Try going to Japan. Remember that 

Bathhouse article we read in Plant's class? No gray area there! Maybe their religion has more 

gray area than the Christian religion, I don't know enough about either to form an opinion. But 

society is more than religion. I think America demands more acceptance of the gray area than 

some other countries do because of our diversity. That doesn't mean all people accept the gray, 

but at least its a work in progress. 

Cynthia 


I meant to have this journal out earlier in the week, but I had to decide whether spending time 

with my little brother who I have custody of, taking care of lose ends from my car being hit last 

week, and recovering physically and emotionally was just as important. I wanted to make sure 

that my journal process was reflective and that I truly found something to apply to my journey. 

It is interesting the way westerners focus on the black and white area rather than the gray area 

in-between. It seems to be a western phenomenon. If there is something I am supposed to 

gain out of this semester, it is the importance of not thinking in black and white but the 

importance of paying attention to the gray area of life. I was talking to a friend the other day 

about life and the gray areas within that challenges us and at times makes no sense. I could 

not help but think of the conversatio ns in Yamashita's class about sense, nonsense, and the 

gray area. My friend is a sergeant with the SDPD and shared with me an article titled, "Zen and 

the Art of Management." Although the article has to do with management, I think it can be 

applied to education for it analysis the westerners' way of thinking in terms of black and white 

and the Japanese way of thinking that takes into consideration the "process," which allows for 

reflection on the gray area that westerners overlook. 

I reflected on the different views that were addressed by our classmates in terms of their 

religious views, and I could not help but see how much of it was focused on the black and 

white rather than the challenging the gray area. When an attempt was made to challenge the 

gray area it was received with resistance or not acknowledge at all. According to the study in 

the article, we reacted just as expected. 

After all as a society we are encouraged to take one side or the other for ambiguity does n ot 

feel comfortable to our culture. Yet, understanding ourselves lies in ambiguity according to the 

years of studies involving both corporations in the U.S. and Japan. Why? Taking a stance 

whether black or white limits our human connection to those that the dwell in-between. As 

future teachers this is important for us to consider, our future children are made of the black 

stuff, white stuff and everything else in-between. In our culture we have the tendency of 

needing to prove the other person wrong rather it be through our religious biases or feeling like 

we have to take sides. We so want to belong to something. As the article points out, "[masking 

our] self-serving sense of brute integrity" without taking into consideration the sexiest 

components that make up our culture. This very point is addressed in Longino's article, 

"Science as Social Knowledge," which informs us that that scie 


groups,therefore, reflecting bad science because here science is supporting the very issues 

that is feeding into a biased society. Meanwhile in out society, taking a position is considered 

strong, secure, and masculine. However, looking at the gray and allowing the process of life to 

support a higher truth represents ambiguity, which is considered female because somehow 

ambiguity makes reference to sensitivity and feelings. Whether we support our beliefs with 

biblical quotes or Zen thoughts, what does fact have to do with the experience of life itself? 

In our society we struggle with being seen as human and not just another teacher, worker, or 

student, etc. Yet, we never stop to think that it is this much embedded way thinking in black 

and white that keeps us thinking of efficiency in terms of what we put out rather than how 

1595

_____ 

human we can remain. How do we do this? Well, the decisions our society makes is made 

from the black and white area instead of allowing for the process that reveals that life is not so 

black and white. Our inflated egos does not reflect humility, God, our path of love, servitude, 

but reflects instead how as a person we are "out for one's self. How does this differ from a 

more eastern way of thinking like in Japan? For starters Japanese culture does not permit its 

people to see life in terms of making decisions for that would limit them to the black and white 

way of thinking that dominates our society. They see life in terms of making choices from the 

challenges that they face. They have come to terms th 

at there is much more going on in the universe than deceiving themselves into thinking of their 



represent one work force. The final evidence shows that both team efforts in the U.S. and 

Japan are just as efficient and productive but t he difference lies in recognizing that humanity is 

not made up of black and white but the gray area in between. Hence, the bigger picture needs 

to be considered not just the position we think we hold with our limited ego as individuals. It is 

about teamwork and santioning the process of living life to reveal the gray area before judging 

it through our limited experiences.(Alexandra's journal #9 - March 30, 2004). 



_____ 



1596





Subject: Re: white flag for cynthia 

The original post was mine that you responded to, which I in turn responded to. If you go back and 

read it, it wasn't directed at you and neither was my response to your response. I think you 

misunderstand what I say that I believe to be true for me, thinking I am talking about you when I am 

not. And I wasn't arguing with you, just stating what I think. Maybe I should go back to leaving the "I" 

out of my posts. Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

In response to this post. If you say that post was not in response to mine, then why did you not 

say so like 5 responses ago? You still kept debating (which feels like arguing lately) with me as 

if was intend in the message. And that is what gets frustrating. To me I feel like I give warning 

shots when I am growing frustrated; if you see me in person, just look at my face..... it tells all. 

But, I don't think my warning shots are in your language? It's like you don't hear me until I am just 

plain stinking mad. 

I really think this is a teachable moment to realize how important it is to get to know your students, 

or for us right now classmates, because if you know the different personalities and such, you 

would see how they could get along better. Please don't think that I don't like you because you 

can be fun to be around, just not when we are clashing. I think you have a lot a valid ideas and 

good intentions in your future career as a teacher... 

For right now.... for the next 2.5 semesters please try to be a bit more cognizant of how you might 

be coming across to me (more directly said - please try and control that powerfully sharp tongue of 

yours) and I will try to be less sensitive and more direct with you. 




Ann, Just to set the record straight, I went back to see what I posted. My post that you thought 

I was attacking or mocking you in was just one of my posts, not a response to yours at all. It 

was a journal entry about the readings. When I post my opinion, or even respond to you or 

others, it doesn't mean I disagree with you, unless of course I say so. It is just another way to 

look at things, or something else to consider. It is all part of the learning process for me. It is a 

way to sort out the gray area. 

I just read your response again about attacking you. Consider this, there aren't any guys 

posting anything, so there is nothing to respond to. In regards to students in my classroom 

being put off by my style, I don't give my opinion in the classroom, I don't think it is appropriate. 

This journal on the other hand, is for thinking and formulating ideas, based on what we have 

read and learned. 

Cynthia 


1597


Talking with you can be soooooo frustrating (do you feel the same way with talking with 

me?) (or is it just me??????)........... I am laughing at the same time I am shaking my head 

in frustration. I am not disagreeing with you...... Your ideas about teaching kids to think for 

themselves, that parents should teach their kids stuff at home, etc. are all valid, I agree...... 

I will not "love all my students" as you seem to be inferring I have said. I am quite sure 

there will be some that drive me nuts!!!! I am not Gandhi either. I will still get to know them 

though. Knowing someone and liking them don't go hand-in-hand. You can still be a very 

effective teacher when you know your students (some may argue more effective than not 

knowing them). I still feel like you are misunderstanding me do to the fact that you seem to 

keep thinking I my ideas are in contradiction to yours; they are not!!!! I want my students to 

walk away with all the necessary skills that will help them be successful in this world. You 

keep putting words in my mouth that I never said. You make it seem as though I have 

some far out artsy fartsy, flaky ideas about teaching when in reality I only expressed that 

"taking the time to know your students on a more personal level can be beneficial to the 

learning environment". You claim that you were trying "to be non-confrontational, while 

pointing out a difference of opinion" and claim that it didn't work. Do you not realize that 

during your attempt to be non-confrontational, you were doing the very opposite? If you do 

not want to be non-confrontational, then don't include passive aggressive undertones in 

your writing. That's like yelling at someone to calm down, or talking about subjects that 

upset them while giving them a massage. They are dichotomous ideas.... 


human being sees the world through their own unique lens which is effected by all of their 

past experiences, their personalties, etc. 


directly or indirectly, while others get complimented? It seems as though if someone else 

had written about the very same ideas, they could walk away with complements and pats 

on the back, but when I talk about the same issues, you feel the need to dissect, distort, 

and attack them either directly or indirectly? I don't see any attacks or passive aggression 

towards any of the males in the cohort. Is a male female thing? Or is it our personalities 

that are clashing? 



alone see it... I am not speaking for anyone else) your communication style comes across 

as very abrupt and sharp. It often leaves a sting either directly or indirectly. And it is this 

that I am usually reacting to. My personality does not like to be stung by your personality. I 

am not sure how I come across to other people, but if it is not favorable, I would hope that I 

could find out nicely so that I may work on it. 




was offended by a clashing of personalities, it would not make for a positive work 

environment. Just something to absorb and think about. 

Ann 

1598


Ok, just the nitty gritty. I wasn't mocking you directly, but then maybe I was. Actually, I 

was trying to say that becoming friends with my students isn't why I want to teach. I 

think it is possible to focus on that aspect of the classroom, and miss what really needs 

to happen: learning. I think you have good intentions, as do I and the rest of the class. 

But it concerns me that the main reason for teaching would be "because I love children". 

If you think about it, does everyone love all children, even those they haven't met? I 

don't think its realistic to say I will love all my students, because I know it isn't true. I am 

not Gandhi. But that doesn't mean I can't be an effective teacher. As I mentioned in one 

of my other posts, there seems to be a real focus on social issues in the public schools 

these days. You know, the stuff that kids are supposed to learn at home from their 

parents. It uses up a lot of time that could be spent on science, reading and math. I am 

not saying it shouldn't be there at all, but if its taught as a science lesson like in the 

"Learning from Cases" book, that would be a good thing. I am not going to school to be 

a social worker, but a teacher. You might argue that students don't get this stuff at 

home, so it needs to be taught in the schools. I would disagree. When you take power 

away from someone, you put them in danger (the parents). When you give the students 

a real education, they can think for themselves and don't need to be indoctrinated with 

what "we" think is the correct way to view the world. 

I don't think I misunderstood what you were saying. I just have a different viewpoint on 

how the world works. I don't think I have any right to tell you how to think, or even that 

you should change the way you think. And so I was attempting to be nonconfrontational, 

while pointing out a difference in opinion. Guess it didn't work. 

Cynthia 


O.K., no fluff..... just the nitty gritty ...... Cynthia.... I responded to your post because 

of your sentence that stood out seemed to mock the warm hearted ideas about 

teaching which have been expressed in the journals. For instance I wrote about one 

of the teachers that stood out to me because he met with all of us before the first day 

of school.... etc, and I also wrote that I still see him around town etc. Then, you post 

a journal with some good ideas about how you want to teach, and that's all great; 

but, when you add in little subtle side notes such as "And I am not going into it 

(teaching) so that students remember ME". This feels as though you were mocking, 

as I wrote above, the previous posts. So, when I tried to clarify this and explain that 

I am not going into to teaching to be remembered by my students, you apologize for 

misunderstanding me, but in the very same breath you misunderstand me all over 

again. How is it that I am talking about "A, B, and C"... and it gets twisted up as if I 

were talking about "H, or Z?" Is my writing style, or ability to clearly express my 

ideas really that screwed up? If it is, please do me a favor by letting me know so 

that I can correct this shortcomming. 

Ann 





1599




standards for all students, they need to produce. Call it hardnose if you want, but 

I think it can be done in a way that is enjoyable even if they are being pushed to 

do their best. This does not mean I won't get to know my students, of course I 

will. I do it now with the students I work with, and I am getting great results. They 

take progress tests, so I know that what I do works. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 




that there will be little noses to the grind stones and rigid time schedules to 

dance with as well. I picture teaching as a multifaceted dance with so many 

moves that it will make your head spin. Success will be in managing it all and 

making it seem like a fun place to be while the students are learning. 

By getting to know your students on a more personal level, you are able to 

get a better picture of how to go about helping them on their level. That way, 

your efforts will be most effective. It will also make their little tails wag and 

make them feel like they are important (which they are). When I think back 

about why certain adults stood out in my past (good ones that is) it's because 

they were the ones who cared about (me). They talked with me, not at me, or 

not down to me. And, it is those adults who had the greatest opportunity to 









Ann 




Sagan 

.."the survival of the human species and the attainment of greater 

happiness for individuals depend on the ability to think scientifically, 

rationally, and skeptically." Skeptics Society Manifesto 


1600

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

it….Man’s mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body 

is given to him, its sustenance is not. His mind is given to him, its content is not. To 

remain alive, he must act, and before he can act he must know the nature and purpose of 

his action. He cannot obtain his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to 

obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch—or build a cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim and 

of the means to achieve it. To remain alive, he must think." Ayn Rand 


conclusion: 


comfortable compared to other countries around the world. Many 

countries see education as "key" in order to compete. Japan, for instance, 

works very hard at it, and they are doing a pretty good job in some 

respects. They sure make good cars. South Korea wants to compete very 

badly, hence education is very important to them as well. Being the 

leading power, we don't think we are in dire need of anything (other than 


Americans may take our position in the world for granted, from a novice 

viewpoint, if you will. This might explain why some of us (meaning 

Americans) don't think science and math education is so important. Sure, 

you can blame it on the money, but I don't. There are plenty of people who 

do a job because they like it, not because of the money. Me, for instance: I 

am not going into teaching for the money!! And I am not going into it so 

that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at least some 

students have the opportunity to learn to think. I know what is possible, 

and I intend to provide an environment that will motivate students to get 

beyond the wonder and to search for the how and why. It doesn't matter 

that I don't know everything there is to know about science because I am 

not afraid to learn. I think its important to go our of the comfort zone, which 

many teachers are not willing to do. The funny thing is, they don't even 

have to teach it. They can guide the students by having them use the 

scientific method. The students can teach themselves, and they will 

remember it because the discoveries they make will be their own. Ok, 

time to step down from the soapbox. Cynthia 







1601

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 











_____ 



1602



Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 9:47 AM 



Chapter 19 in Sagan was looking rather promising as I read about all the different statistics with 

respect to education (finally I could get my teeth into something!). I thought the section that talked 

about how students from the U.S. rank so dismally in science compared to their counterparts in other 

nations. Although I don't have any solid research, I can speak from experience. The school day in 

the U.S. is sooooo short! Students attend school an average of 6.5 hours a day and only 180 days a 

year. How can a teacher expect to teach all that is required and get on-going positive results with 

such a short amount of time? As most of you know, I went to school in England and the school day 

was 8am - 4pm and we got so much more covered in the day i.e. language (French, German, 

Spanish etc.), P.E., music, drama, language arts, social science, science, history, geography, ... Half 

of these subjects aren't taught in our elementary schools due to budget cuts, but even if they were, 

when would they teach them??? 

Further into the chapter, Sagan began digressing and talking about religion and science - and I'm 

pretty burned out about reading and discussing these two conflicting topics. So, there's my "twocents" 

for this week. ~ Louise 

1603



Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 12:07 PM 



Cynthia, 

You have bypassed everything that was brought up here. You still have not answered my question... 

Whether it was with this most recent round of back and forth baloney or truck loads of past topics.... I 

do not want to have to argue anymore... I am fed up with arguing. You may not see it as arguing, but 

that's the way it feels right now and I am sick of having to defend my views. Can I not just say 

something nice on the list serve without it being challenged? I used up most of my patients during my 

very long battle in defending homosexual marriage rights. I am not about to spend the rest of my 

semester defending everything I bring up. 

As far as this last round of entries, my original response was to Michael and you responded to that 

with a small both annoying challenge. Later, I asked you straight out about the "what's up with the 

Remember ME" in your post? If I had misunderstood you at that very point, you should have said so 

right there...... So, thinking that you misunderstood me, I rewrote my views several times to clarify my 

views of teaching... you kept responding with responses that kept saying stuff that was all messed up 

and distorted and saying our views were different when I was clarifying that they indeed were not. 

That we had a lot of similar ideas... I openly said that you are misunderstanding me.... you said you 

were not..... Give me a break.... to me, that was arguing. I do not want to argue. 

Then, you say this is a place for learning, so then I agree and state what we can learn from this...... 

Then, I peel back the layers and expose the foundations and the structures that are not working 

here, in hopes of coming to an agreement of how to avoid future rounds of what I am already sick of. 

I was giving you some very valid information on how you can get along with me (and quit possibly 

others whether it be now or in your future)..... which is basically be nice and don't jump all over all my 

e-mails or ideas. Do you even see this? Do you even see my attempts at trying to resolve this? How 

can I be misunderstanding the responses that you claim not to be directed to me when you clearly 

write my name and apologies to me etc. So, you were not talking to me? 

I have tried to resolve this several times.... the last time being the most forward and clear, so I 

thought. Why do you bypass the very meat of the issue and play around on the side lines? 

Once again I will ask you... 

For the next 2.5 semesters, can you please try to be a bit more cognizant of how you might be 

coming across to me (please do not jump all over the words and thoughts that leave my body (to me 

right now, it feels like arguing.... I am sick of arguing... I just want some.... peace.... love..... and 

understanding.......) and please be aware that your sometimes sharp tongued remarks hurt and 

offend me and I do not appreciate them. I used to be able to tolerate them, but now, I am just plain 

tired of them. You could tell me the very same thing, but reword it, add some sugar or whatever.... 

but ditch the meanness). If you work on that, I will work on not being as sensitive. 

So again I ask you... how does that sound? 

Ann 

1604


The original post was mine that you responded to, which I in turn responded to. If you go back and 

read it, it wasn't directed at you and neither was my response to your response. I think you 

misunderstand what I say that I believe to be true for me, thinking I am talking about you when I 

am not. And I wasn't arguing with you, just stating what I think. Maybe I should go back to leaving 

the "I" out of my posts. Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

In response to this post. If you say that post was not in response to mine, then why did you 

not say so like 5 responses ago? You still kept debating (which feels like arguing lately) with 

me as if was intend in the message. And that is what gets frustrating. To me I feel like I give 

warning shots when I am growing frustrated; if you see me in person, just look at my face..... it 

tells all. But, I don't think my warning shots are in your language? It's like you don't hear me 

until I am just plain stinking mad. 

I really think this is a teachable moment to realize how important it is to get to know your 

students, or for us right now classmates, because if you know the different personalities and 

such, you would see how they could get along better. Please don't think that I don't like you 

because you can be fun to be around, just not when we are clashing. I think you have a lot a 

valid ideas and good intentions in your future career as a teacher... 

For right now.... for the next 2.5 semesters please try to be a bit more cognizant of how you 

might be coming across to me (more directly said - please try and control that powerfully 

sharp tongue of yours) and I will try to be less sensitive and more direct with you. 




Ann, Just to set the record straight, I went back to see what I posted. My post that you 

thought I was attacking or mocking you in was just one of my posts, not a response to 

yours at all. It was a journal entry about the readings. When I post my opinion, or even 

respond to you or others, it doesn't mean I disagree with you, unless of course I say so. It is 

just another way to look at things, or something else to consider. It is all part of the learning 

process for me. It is a way to sort out the gray area. 


posting anything, so there is nothing to respond to. In regards to students in my classroom 

being put off by my style, I don't give my opinion in the classroom, I don't think it is 

appropriate. This journal on the other hand, is for thinking and formulating ideas, based on 

what we have read and learned. 

Cynthia 



Talking with you can be soooooo frustrating (do you feel the same way with talking with 

me?) (or is it just me??????)........... I am laughing at the same time I am shaking my 

1605

head in frustration. I am not disagreeing with you...... Your ideas about teaching kids to 

think for themselves, that parents should teach their kids stuff at home, etc. are all valid, 

I agree...... I will not "love all my students" as you seem to be inferring I have said. I am 

quite sure there will be some that drive me nuts!!!! I am not Gandhi either. I will still get 

to know them though. Knowing someone and liking them don't go hand-in-hand. You 

can still be a very effective teacher when you know your students (some may argue 

more effective than not knowing them). I still feel like you are misunderstanding me do 

to the fact that you seem to keep thinking I my ideas are in contradiction to yours; they 

are not!!!! I want my students to walk away with all the necessary skills that will help 

them be successful in this world. You keep putting words in my mouth that I never said. 

You make it seem as though I have some far out artsy fartsy, flaky ideas about 

teaching when in reality I only expressed that "taking the time to know your students on 

a more personal level can be beneficial to the learning environment". You claim that 

you were trying "to be non-confrontational, while pointing out a difference of opinion" 

and claim that it didn't work. Do you not realize that during your attempt to be nonconfrontational, 


then don't include passive aggressive undertones in your writing. That's 

like yelling at someone to calm down, or talking about subjects that upset them while 

giving them a massage. They are dichotomous ideas.... 

You are correct about us having a different viewpoint of how the world works; every 

single human being sees the world through their own unique lens which is effected by 

all of their past experiences, their personalties, etc. 

As far as this group dynamics thing is going, why is it that my posts keep being 

attacked, directly or indirectly, while others get complimented? It seems as though if 

someone else had written about the very same ideas, they could walk away with 

complements and pats on the back, but when I talk about the same issues, you feel the 

need to dissect, distort, and attack them either directly or indirectly? I don't see any 

attacks or passive aggression towards any of the males in the cohort. Is a male female 

thing? Or is it our personalities that are clashing? 


works, but I think it has to do more with our personalities clashing. To me (which 

means, I alone see it... I am not speaking for anyone else) your communication style 

comes across as very abrupt and sharp. It often leaves a sting either directly or 

indirectly. And it is this that I am usually reacting to. My personality does not like to be 

stung by your personality. I am not sure how I come across to other people, but if it is 

not favorable, I would hope that I could find out nicely so that I may work on it. 

If I was a student and you offended me, as do some of your responses to my posts, I 

would turn off and you would have lost me a long time ago. I am not implying that you 

talk to students the same way, but I sure hope you don't. However, even if I was a 

coworker and I was offended by a clashing of personalities, it would not make for a 

positive work environment. Just something to absorb and think about. 

Ann 


Ok, just the nitty gritty. I wasn't mocking you directly, but then maybe I was. Actually, 

I was trying to say that becoming friends with my students isn't why I want to teach. I 

1606

think it is possible to focus on that aspect of the classroom, and miss what really 

needs to happen: learning. I think you have good intentions, as do I and the rest of 

the class. But it concerns me that the main reason for teaching would be "because I 

love children". If you think about it, does everyone love all children, even those they 

haven't met? I don't think its realistic to say I will love all my students, because I 

know it isn't true. I am not Gandhi. But that doesn't mean I can't be an effective 

teacher. As I mentioned in one of my other posts, there seems to be a real focus on 

social issues in the public schools these days. You know, the stuff that kids are 

supposed to learn at home from their parents. It uses up a lot of time that could be 

spent on science, reading and math. I am not saying it shouldn't be there at all, but if 

its taught as a science lesson like in the "Learning from Cases" book, that would be 

a good thing. I am not going to school to be a social worker, but a teacher. You 

might argue that students don't get this stuff at home, so it needs to be taught in the 

schools. I would disagree. When you take power away from someone, you put them 

in danger (the parents). When you give the students a real education, they can think 

for themselves and don't need to be indoctrinated with what "we" think is the correct 

way to view the world. 

I don't think I misunderstood what you were saying. I just have a different viewpoint 

on how the world works. I don't think I have any right to tell you how to think, or even 

that you should change the way you think. And so I was attempting to be 

nonconfrontational, while pointing out a difference in opinion. Guess it didn't work. 

Cynthia 


O.K., no fluff..... just the nitty gritty ...... Cynthia.... I responded to your post 

because of your sentence that stood out seemed to mock the warm hearted 

ideas about teaching which have been expressed in the journals. For instance I 

wrote about one of the teachers that stood out to me because he met with all of 

us before the first day of school.... etc, and I also wrote that I still see him around 

town etc. Then, you post a journal with some good ideas about how you want to 

teach, and that's all great; but, when you add in little subtle side notes such 

as "And I am not going into it (teaching) so that students remember ME". 

This feels as though you were mocking, as I wrote above, the previous posts. 

So, when I tried to clarify this and explain that I am not going into to teaching to 

be remembered by my students, you apologize for misunderstanding me, but in 

the very same breath you misunderstand me all over again. How is it that I am 

talking about "A, B, and C"... and it gets twisted up as if I were talking about "H, 

or Z?" Is my writing style, or ability to clearly express my ideas really that 

screwed up? If it is, please do me a favor by letting me know so that I can 

correct this shortcomming. 

Ann 


ME the person rather than the classroom experience and learning. I won't be 

the teacher who stands in front of the class telling students what I think they 

need to know. I am not saying you will be, thats not what I mean. It's just that 

my idea of educating students is guiding them so that they learn new things 

that encourages them to think. Sometimes teachers are so fearful of 

1607

destroying the self-esteem of their fragile students that no learning takes 

place. But I strongly believe in high standards for all students, they need to 

produce. Call it hardnose if you want, but I think it can be done in a way that 

is enjoyable even if they are being pushed to do their best. This does not 

mean I won't get to know my students, of course I will. I do it now with the 

students I work with, and I am getting great results. They take progress tests, 

so I know that what I do works. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

What's up with the capitalized (remember "ME") in your post? Please 

don't confuse the warm hearted sincerity of some recent posts (not just 

mine) as inferring these classrooms will be "all lovey dovey and artsy 

fartsy". I am sure that there will be little noses to the grind stones and rigid 

time schedules to dance with as well. I picture teaching as a multifaceted 

dance with so many moves that it will make your head spin. Success will 

be in managing it all and making it seem like a fun place to be while the 


By getting to know your students on a more personal level, you are able to 

get a better picture of how to go about helping them on their level. That 

way, your efforts will be most effective. It will also make their little tails 

wag and make them feel like they are important (which they are). When I 

think back about why certain adults stood out in my past (good ones that 

is) it's because they were the ones who cared about (me). They 

talked with me, not at me, or not down to me. And, it is those adults 

who had the greatest opportunity to teach me the most because they were 



Yang...the structures and the fluff... the main courses and the desserts... 

the cardio and the strength training... the brushing with the flossing... the 

peanut butter with the jelly... the macaroni with the cheese.... All work 

and no play makes Ann a little Crazy 



Ann 


"In those cultures lacking unfamiliar challenges, external or internal, 

where fundamental change is unneeded, novel ideas need not be 

encouraged." Sagan 




1608

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only means to 

gain it….Man’s mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. 

His body is given to him, its sustenance is not. His mind is given to him, its content is 

not. To remain alive, he must act, and before he can act he must know the nature 

and purpose of his action. He cannot obtain his food without a knowledge of food and 

of the way to obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch—or build a cyclotron—without a 

knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To remain alive, he must 

think." Ayn Rand 


conclusion: 


comfortable compared to other countries around the world. Many 

countries see education as "key" in order to compete. Japan, for 

instance, works very hard at it, and they are doing a pretty good job in 

some respects. They sure make good cars. South Korea wants to 

compete very badly, hence education is very important to them as well. 

Being the leading power, we don't think we are in dire need of anything 

(other than social programs). And look what the emphasis is on in our 

schools. I think Americans may take our position in the world for 

granted, from a novice viewpoint, if you will. This might explain why 

some of us (meaning Americans) don't think science and math 

education is so important. Sure, you can blame it on the money, but I 

don't. There are plenty of people who do a job because they like it, 

not because of the money. Me, for instance: I am not going 

into teaching for the money!! And I am not going into it so that my 

students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at least some 

students have the opportunity to learn to think. I know what is possible, 

and I intend to provide an environment that will motivate students to 

get beyond the wonder and to search for the how and why. It doesn't 

matter that I don't know everything there is to know about science 

because I am not afraid to learn. I think its important to go our of the 

comfort zone, which many teachers are not willing to do. The funny 

thing is, they don't even have to teach it. They can guide the students 

by having them use the scientific method. The students can teach 

themselves, and they will remember it because the discoveries they 

make will be their own. Ok, time to step down from the soapbox. 

Cynthia 





1609

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 















_____ 



1610






Ann, I will refrain from responding to your future posts in order to avoid any further problems or hurt 

feelings. Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

You have bypassed everything that was brought up here. You still have not answered my 

question... 

Whether it was with this most recent round of back and forth baloney or truck loads of past 

topics.... I do not want to have to argue anymore... I am fed up with arguing. You may not see it 

as arguing, but that's the way it feels right now and I am sick of having to defend my views. Can I 

not just say something nice on the list serve without it being challenged? I used up most of my 

patients during my very long battle in defending homosexual marriage rights. I am not about to 

spend the rest of my semester defending everything I bring up. 

As far as this last round of entries, my original response was to Michael and you responded to that 

with a small both annoying challenge. Later, I asked you straight out about the "what's up with the 

Remember ME" in your post? If I had misunderstood you at that very point, you should have said 

so right there...... So, thinking that you misunderstood me, I rewrote my views several times to 

clarify my views of teaching... you kept responding with responses that kept saying stuff that was 

all messed up and distorted and saying our views were different when I was clarifying that they 

indeed were not. That we had a lot of similar ideas... I openly said that you are misunderstanding 

me.... you said you were not..... Give me a break.... to me, that was arguing. I do not want to 

argue. 

Then, you say this is a place for learning, so then I agree and state what we can learn from 

this...... Then, I peel back the layers and expose the foundations and the structures that are not 

working here, in hopes of coming to an agreement of how to avoid future rounds of what I am 

already sick of. 

I was giving you some very valid information on how you can get along with me (and quit possibly 

others whether it be now or in your future)..... which is basically be nice and don't jump all over all 

my e-mails or ideas. Do you even see this? Do you even see my attempts at trying to resolve 

this? How can I be misunderstanding the responses that you claim not to be directed to me when 

you clearly write my name and apologies to me etc. So, you were not talking to me? 





coming across to me (please do not jump all over the words and thoughts that leave my body (to 

me right now, it feels like arguing.... I am sick of arguing... I just want some.... peace.... love..... 

and understanding.......) and please be aware that your sometimes sharp tongued remarks hurt 

1611

and offend me and I do not appreciate them. I used to be able to tolerate them, but now, I am just 

plain tired of them. You could tell me the very same thing, but reword it, add some sugar or 

whatever.... but ditch the meanness). If you work on that, I will work on not being as sensitive. 


Ann 


The original post was mine that you responded to, which I in turn responded to. If you go back 

and read it, it wasn't directed at you and neither was my response to your response. I think you 

misunderstand what I say that I believe to be true for me, thinking I am talking about you when 

I am not. And I wasn't arguing with you, just stating what I think. Maybe I should go back to 

leaving the "I" out of my posts. Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

In response to this post. If you say that post was not in response to mine, then why did you 

not say so like 5 responses ago? You still kept debating (which feels like arguing lately) 

with me as if was intend in the message. And that is what gets frustrating. To me I feel like 

I give warning shots when I am growing frustrated; if you see me in person, just look at my 

face..... it tells all. But, I don't think my warning shots are in your language? It's like you 

don't hear me until I am just plain stinking mad. 


students, or for us right now classmates, because if you know the different personalities 

and such, you would see how they could get along better. Please don't think that I don't 

like you because you can be fun to be around, just not when we are clashing. I think you 

have a lot a valid ideas and good intentions in your future career as a teacher... 

For right now.... for the next 2.5 semesters please try to be a bit more cognizant of how you 

might be coming across to me (more directly said - please try and control that powerfully 

sharp tongue of yours) and I will try to be less sensitive and more direct with you. 




Ann, Just to set the record straight, I went back to see what I posted. My post that you 

thought I was attacking or mocking you in was just one of my posts, not a response to 

yours at all. It was a journal entry about the readings. When I post my opinion, or even 

respond to you or others, it doesn't mean I disagree with you, unless of course I say so. 

It is just another way to look at things, or something else to consider. It is all part of the 

learning process for me. It is a way to sort out the gray area. 


posting anything, so there is nothing to respond to. In regards to students in my 

classroom being put off by my style, I don't give my opinion in the classroom, I don't 

think it is appropriate. This journal on the other hand, is for thinking and formulating 

ideas, based on what we have read and learned. 

1612

Cynthia 



Talking with you can be soooooo frustrating (do you feel the same way with talking 

with me?) (or is it just me??????)........... I am laughing at the same time I am 

shaking my head in frustration. I am not disagreeing with you...... Your ideas about 

teaching kids to think for themselves, that parents should teach their kids stuff at 

home, etc. are all valid, I agree...... I will not "love all my students" as you seem to 

be inferring I have said. I am quite sure there will be some that drive me nuts!!!! I 

am not Gandhi either. I will still get to know them though. Knowing someone and 

liking them don't go hand-in-hand. You can still be a very effective teacher when 

you know your students (some may argue more effective than not knowing them). I 

still feel like you are misunderstanding me do to the fact that you seem to keep 

thinking I my ideas are in contradiction to yours; they are not!!!! I want my students 

to walk away with all the necessary skills that will help them be successful in 

this world. You keep putting words in my mouth that I never said. You make it seem 

as though I have some far out artsy fartsy, flaky ideas about teaching when in reality 

I only expressed that "taking the time to know your students on a more personal 

level can be beneficial to the learning environment". You claim that you were trying 

"to be non-confrontational, while pointing out a difference of opinion" and claim that it 

didn't work. Do you not realize that during your attempt to be non-confrontational, 

you were doing the very opposite? If you do not want to be non-confrontational, 

then don't include passive aggressive undertones in your writing. That's like yelling 

at someone to calm down, or talking about subjects that upset them while giving 


You are correct about us having a different viewpoint of how the world works; every 

single human being sees the world through their own unique lens which is effected 

by all of their past experiences, their personalties, etc. 


attacked, directly or indirectly, while others get complimented? It seems as though if 

someone else had written about the very same ideas, they could walk away with 

complements and pats on the back, but when I talk about the same issues, you feel 

the need to dissect, distort, and attack them either directly or indirectly? I don't see 

any attacks or passive aggression towards any of the males in the cohort. Is a male 

female thing? Or is it our personalities that are clashing? 

You seem to think we have such different ideas about teaching and about how the 

world works, but I think it has to do more with our personalities clashing. To me 

(which means, I alone see it... I am not speaking for anyone else) your 

communication style comes across as very abrupt and sharp. It often leaves a sting 

either directly or indirectly. And it is this that I am usually reacting to. My personality 

does not like to be stung by your personality. I am not sure how I come across to 

other people, but if it is not favorable, I would hope that I could find out nicely so that 

I may work on it. 

If I was a student and you offended me, as do some of your responses to my posts, I 

would turn off and you would have lost me a long time ago. I am not implying that 

1613

you talk to students the same way, but I sure hope you don't. However, even if I 

was a coworker and I was offended by a clashing of personalities, it would not make 

for a positive work environment. Just something to absorb and think about. 

Ann 


Ok, just the nitty gritty. I wasn't mocking you directly, but then maybe I was. 

Actually, I was trying to say that becoming friends with my students isn't why I 

want to teach. I think it is possible to focus on that aspect of the classroom, and 

miss what really needs to happen: learning. I think you have good intentions, as 

do I and the rest of the class. But it concerns me that the main reason for 

teaching would be "because I love children". If you think about it, does everyone 

love all children, even those they haven't met? I don't think its realistic to say I will 

love all my students, because I know it isn't true. I am not Gandhi. But that 

doesn't mean I can't be an effective teacher. As I mentioned in one of my other 

posts, there seems to be a real focus on social issues in the public schools these 

days. You know, the stuff that kids are supposed to learn at home from their 

parents. It uses up a lot of time that could be spent on science, reading and 

math. I am not saying it shouldn't be there at all, but if its taught as a science 

lesson like in the "Learning from Cases" book, that would be a good thing. I am 

not going to school to be a social worker, but a teacher. You might argue that 

students don't get this stuff at home, so it needs to be taught in the schools. I 

would disagree. When you take power away from someone, you put them in 

danger (the parents). When you give the students a real education, they can 

think for themselves and don't need to be indoctrinated with what "we" think is 

the correct way to view the world. 

I don't think I misunderstood what you were saying. I just have a different 

viewpoint on how the world works. I don't think I have any right to tell you how to 

think, or even that you should change the way you think. And so I was attempting 

to be nonconfrontational, while pointing out a difference in opinion. Guess it didn't 

work. 

Cynthia 


O.K., no fluff..... just the nitty gritty ...... Cynthia.... I responded to your post 

because of your sentence that stood out seemed to mock the warm hearted 

ideas about teaching which have been expressed in the journals. For 

instance I wrote about one of the teachers that stood out to me because he 

met with all of us before the first day of school.... etc, and I also wrote that I 

still see him around town etc. Then, you post a journal with some good ideas 

about how you want to teach, and that's all great; but, when you add in little 

subtle side notes such as "And I am not going into it (teaching) so that 

students remember ME". This feels as though you were mocking, as I wrote 

above, the previous posts. So, when I tried to clarify this and explain that I 

am not going into to teaching to be remembered by my students, you 

apologize for misunderstanding me, but in the very same breath 

you misunderstand me all over again. How is it that I am talking about "A, B, 

and C"... and it gets twisted up as if I were talking about "H, or Z?" Is my 

writing style, or ability to clearly express my ideas really that screwed up? If it 

1614

is, please do me a favor by letting me know so that I can 

correct this shortcomming. 

Ann 


ME the person rather than the classroom experience and learning. I won't 

be the teacher who stands in front of the class telling students what I think 

they need to know. I am not saying you will be, thats not what I mean. It's 

just that my idea of educating students is guiding them so that they learn 

new things that encourages them to think. Sometimes teachers are so 

fearful of destroying the self-esteem of their fragile students that no 

learning takes place. But I strongly believe in high standards for all 

students, they need to produce. Call it hardnose if you want, but I think it 

can be done in a way that is enjoyable even if they are being pushed to do 

their best. This does not mean I won't get to know my students, of course I 

will. I do it now with the students I work with, and I am getting great 


Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

What's up with the capitalized (remember "ME") in your post? Please 

don't confuse the warm hearted sincerity of some recent posts (not just 

mine) as inferring these classrooms will be "all lovey dovey and artsy 

fartsy". I am sure that there will be little noses to the grind stones and 

rigid time schedules to dance with as well. I picture teaching as a 

multifaceted dance with so many moves that it will make your head 

spin. Success will be in managing it all and making it seem like a fun 

place to be while the students are learning. 

By getting to know your students on a more personal level, you are 

able to get a better picture of how to go about helping them on their 

level. That way, your efforts will be most effective. It will also make 

their little tails wag and make them feel like they are important (which 

they are). When I think back about why certain adults stood out in my 

past (good ones that is) it's because they were the ones who cared 

about (me). They talked with me, not at me, or not down to me. And, 

it is those adults who had the greatest opportunity to teach me the 

most because they were actually listening .... 

I believe success will come when we learn how to balance the Yin and 

the Yang...the structures and the fluff... the main courses and the 

desserts... the cardio and the strength training... the brushing with the 

flossing... the peanut butter with the jelly... the macaroni with the 

cheese.... All work and no play makes Ann a little Crazy 


1615


Ann 


"In those cultures lacking unfamiliar challenges, external or internal, 

where fundamental change is unneeded, novel ideas need not be 

encouraged." Sagan 




"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only means 

to gain it….Man’s mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is 

not. His body is given to him, its sustenance is not. His mind is given to him, its 

content is not. To remain alive, he must act, and before he can act he must know 

the nature and purpose of his action. He cannot obtain his food without a 

knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch—or build a 

cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To 

remain alive, he must think." Ayn Rand 


conclusion: 

The United States is "the" world power. For the most part, we are 

quite comfortable compared to other countries around the world. 

Many countries see education as "key" in order to compete. Japan, 

for instance, works very hard at it, and they are doing a pretty good 

job in some respects. They sure make good cars. South Korea 

wants to compete very badly, hence education is very important to 

them as well. Being the leading power, we don't think we are in dire 

need of anything (other than social programs). And look what the 

emphasis is on in our schools. I think Americans may take our 

position in the world for granted, from a novice viewpoint, if you will. 

This might explain why some of us (meaning Americans) don't think 

science and math education is so important. Sure, you can blame it 

on the money, but I don't. There are plenty of people who do a job 

because they like it, not because of the money. Me, for instance: I 

am not going into teaching for the money!! And I am not going into 

it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at 

least some students have the opportunity to learn to think. I know 

what is possible, and I intend to provide an environment that will 

motivate students to get beyond the wonder and to search for the 

how and why. It doesn't matter that I don't know everything there is 

to know about science because I am not afraid to learn. I think its 

important to go our of the comfort zone, which many teachers are 

not willing to do. The funny thing is, they don't even have to teach it. 

They can guide the students by having them use the scientific 

method. The students can teach themselves, and they will 

remember it because the discoveries they make will be their own. 

Ok, time to step down from the soapbox. Cynthia 

1616

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

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Cynthia, 

That solution seems a bit extreem (not what I had in mind) and doesn't leave room for growth 

in getting along with people, but if that is how you want to handle this, that's fine with me too. It's a 

deal.... shake.... 

See you in school, Ann 


Ann, I will refrain from responding to your future posts in order to avoid any further problems or 

hurt feelings. Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

You have bypassed everything that was brought up here. You still have not answered my 

question... 

Whether it was with this most recent round of back and forth baloney or truck loads of past 

topics.... I do not want to have to argue anymore... I am fed up with arguing. You may not 

see it as arguing, but that's the way it feels right now and I am sick of having to defend my 

views. Can I not just say something nice on the list serve without it being challenged? I used 

up most of my patients during my very long battle in defending homosexual marriage rights. I 

am not about to spend the rest of my semester defending everything I bring up. 

As far as this last round of entries, my original response was to Michael and you responded to 

that with a small both annoying challenge. Later, I asked you straight out about the "what's up 

with the Remember ME" in your post? If I had misunderstood you at that very point, you 

should have said so right there...... So, thinking that you misunderstood me, I rewrote my 

views several times to clarify my views of teaching... you kept responding with responses that 

kept saying stuff that was all messed up and distorted and saying our views were different 

when I was clarifying that they indeed were not. That we had a lot of similar ideas... I openly 

said that you are misunderstanding me.... you said you were not..... Give me a break.... to me, 

that was arguing. I do not want to argue. 

Then, you say this is a place for learning, so then I agree and state what we can learn from 

this...... Then, I peel back the layers and expose the foundations and the structures that are 

not working here, in hopes of coming to an agreement of how to avoid future rounds of what I 

am already sick of. 

I was giving you some very valid information on how you can get along with me (and quit 

possibly others whether it be now or in your future)..... which is basically be nice and don't 

jump all over all my e-mails or ideas. Do you even see this? Do you even see my attempts at 

1619

trying to resolve this? How can I be misunderstanding the responses that you claim not to be 

directed to me when you clearly write my name and apologies to me etc. So, you were not 

talking to me? 





coming across to me (please do not jump all over the words and thoughts that leave my body 

(to me right now, it feels like arguing.... I am sick of arguing... I just want some.... peace.... 

love..... and understanding.......) and please be aware that your sometimes sharp tongued 

remarks hurt and offend me and I do not appreciate them. I used to be able to tolerate them, 

but now, I am just plain tired of them. You could tell me the very same thing, but reword it, add 

some sugar or whatever.... but ditch the meanness). If you work on that, I will work on not 

being as sensitive. 


Ann 


The original post was mine that you responded to, which I in turn responded to. If you go 

back and read it, it wasn't directed at you and neither was my response to your response. I 

think you misunderstand what I say that I believe to be true for me, thinking I am talking 

about you when I am not. And I wasn't arguing with you, just stating what I think. Maybe 

I should go back to leaving the "I" out of my posts. Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

In response to this post. If you say that post was not in response to mine, then why did 

you not say so like 5 responses ago? You still kept debating (which feels like arguing 

lately) with me as if was intend in the message. And that is what gets frustrating. To 

me I feel like I give warning shots when I am growing frustrated; if you see me in 

person, just look at my face..... it tells all. But, I don't think my warning shots are in 

your language? It's like you don't hear me until I am just plain stinking mad. 


students, or for us right now classmates, because if you know the different personalities 

and such, you would see how they could get along better. Please don't think that I don't 

like you because you can be fun to be around, just not when we are clashing. I think 

you have a lot a valid ideas and good intentions in your future career as a teacher... 

For right now.... for the next 2.5 semesters please try to be a bit more cognizant of how 

you might be coming across to me (more directly said - please try and control that 

powerfully sharp tongue of yours) and I will try to be less sensitive and more direct with 

you. 



1620


Ann, Just to set the record straight, I went back to see what I posted. My post that 

you thought I was attacking or mocking you in was just one of my posts, not a 

response to yours at all. It was a journal entry about the readings. When I post my 

opinion, or even respond to you or others, it doesn't mean I disagree with you, 

unless of course I say so. It is just another way to look at things, or something else 

to consider. It is all part of the learning process for me. It is a way to sort out the 

gray area. 

I just read your response again about attacking you. Consider this, there aren't any 

guys posting anything, so there is nothing to respond to. In regards to students in my 

classroom being put off by my style, I don't give my opinion in the classroom, I don't 

think it is appropriate. This journal on the other hand, is for thinking and formulating 

ideas, based on what we have read and learned. 

Cynthia 



Talking with you can be soooooo frustrating (do you feel the same way with 

talking with me?) (or is it just me??????)........... I am laughing at the same time I 

am shaking my head in frustration. I am not disagreeing with you...... Your ideas 

about teaching kids to think for themselves, that parents should teach their kids 

stuff at home, etc. are all valid, I agree...... I will not "love all my students" as you 

seem to be inferring I have said. I am quite sure there will be some that drive me 

nuts!!!! I am not Gandhi either. I will still get to know them though. Knowing 

someone and liking them don't go hand-in-hand. You can still be a very effective 

teacher when you know your students (some may argue more effective than not 

knowing them). I still feel like you are misunderstanding me do to the fact that 

you seem to keep thinking I my ideas are in contradiction to yours; they are not!!!! 

I want my students to walk away with all the necessary skills that will help them 

be successful in this world. You keep putting words in my mouth that I never 

said. You make it seem as though I have some far out artsy fartsy, flaky ideas 

about teaching when in reality I only expressed that "taking the time to know your 

students on a more personal level can be beneficial to the learning environment". 

You claim that you were trying "to be non-confrontational, while pointing out a 

difference of opinion" and claim that it didn't work. Do you not realize that during 

your attempt to be non-confrontational, you were doing the very opposite? If you 

do not want to be non-confrontational, then don't include passive aggressive 

undertones in your writing. That's like yelling at someone to calm down, or 

talking about subjects that upset them while giving them a massage. They are 

dichotomous ideas.... 

You are correct about us having a different viewpoint of how the world works; 

every single human being sees the world through their own unique lens which is 

effected by all of their past experiences, their personalties, etc. 


attacked, directly or indirectly, while others get complimented? It seems as 

though if someone else had written about the very same ideas, they could walk 

1621

away with complements and pats on the back, but when I talk about the same 

issues, you feel the need to dissect, distort, and attack them either directly or 

indirectly? I don't see any attacks or passive aggression towards any of the 

males in the cohort. Is a male female thing? Or is it our personalities that are 

clashing? 

You seem to think we have such different ideas about teaching and about how 

the world works, but I think it has to do more with our personalities clashing. To 

me (which means, I alone see it... I am not speaking for anyone else) your 

communication style comes across as very abrupt and sharp. It often leaves a 

sting either directly or indirectly. And it is this that I am usually reacting to. My 

personality does not like to be stung by your personality. I am not sure how I 

come across to other people, but if it is not favorable, I would hope that I could 

find out nicely so that I may work on it. 

If I was a student and you offended me, as do some of your responses to my 

posts, I would turn off and you would have lost me a long time ago. I am not 

implying that you talk to students the same way, but I sure hope you don't. 

However, even if I was a coworker and I was offended by a clashing of 

personalities, it would not make for a positive work environment. Just something 

to absorb and think about. 

Ann 


Ok, just the nitty gritty. I wasn't mocking you directly, but then maybe I was. 

Actually, I was trying to say that becoming friends with my students isn't why I 

want to teach. I think it is possible to focus on that aspect of the classroom, 

and miss what really needs to happen: learning. I think you have good 

intentions, as do I and the rest of the class. But it concerns me that the main 

reason for teaching would be "because I love children". If you think about it, 

does everyone love all children, even those they haven't met? I don't think its 

realistic to say I will love all my students, because I know it isn't true. I am not 

Gandhi. But that doesn't mean I can't be an effective teacher. As I mentioned 

in one of my other posts, there seems to be a real focus on social issues in 

the public schools these days. You know, the stuff that kids are supposed to 

learn at home from their parents. It uses up a lot of time that could be spent 

on science, reading and math. I am not saying it shouldn't be there at all, but 

if its taught as a science lesson like in the "Learning from Cases" book, that 

would be a good thing. I am not going to school to be a social worker, but a 

teacher. You might argue that students don't get this stuff at home, so it 

needs to be taught in the schools. I would disagree. When you take power 

away from someone, you put them in danger (the parents). When you give 

the students a real education, they can think for themselves and don't need to 

be indoctrinated with what "we" think is the correct way to view the world. 

I don't think I misunderstood what you were saying. I just have a different 

viewpoint on how the world works. I don't think I have any right to tell you how 

to think, or even that you should change the way you think. And so I was 

attempting to be nonconfrontational, while pointing out a difference in opinion. 

Guess it didn't work. 

Cynthia 

1622


O.K., no fluff..... just the nitty gritty ...... Cynthia.... I responded to your 

post because of your sentence that stood out seemed to mock the warm 

hearted ideas about teaching which have been expressed in the journals. 

For instance I wrote about one of the teachers that stood out to me 

because he met with all of us before the first day of school.... etc, and I 

also wrote that I still see him around town etc. Then, you post a journal 

with some good ideas about how you want to teach, and that's all great; 

but, when you add in little subtle side notes such as "And I am not going 

into it (teaching) so that students remember ME". This feels as though 

you were mocking, as I wrote above, the previous posts. So, when I tried 

to clarify this and explain that I am not going into to teaching to be 

remembered by my students, you apologize for misunderstanding me, but 

in the very same breath you misunderstand me all over again. How is it 

that I am talking about "A, B, and C"... and it gets twisted up as if I were 

talking about "H, or Z?" Is my writing style, or ability to clearly express my 

ideas really that screwed up? If it is, please do me a favor by letting me 


Ann 


ME the person rather than the classroom experience and learning. I 

won't be the teacher who stands in front of the class telling students 

what I think they need to know. I am not saying you will be, thats not 

what I mean. It's just that my idea of educating students is guiding 

them so that they learn new things that encourages them to think. 

Sometimes teachers are so fearful of destroying the self-esteem of 

their fragile students that no learning takes place. But I strongly believe 

in high standards for all students, they need to produce. Call it 

hardnose if you want, but I think it can be done in a way that is 

enjoyable even if they are being pushed to do their best. This does not 

mean I won't get to know my students, of course I will. I do it now with 

the students I work with, and I am getting great results. They take 


Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

What's up with the capitalized (remember "ME") in your post? 

Please don't confuse the warm hearted sincerity of some recent 

posts (not just mine) as inferring these classrooms will be "all lovey 

dovey and artsy fartsy". I am sure that there will be little noses to 

the grind stones and rigid time schedules to dance with as well. I 

picture teaching as a multifaceted dance with so many moves that it 

will make your head spin. Success will be in managing it all and 

1623

making it seem like a fun place to be while the students are 

learning. 

By getting to know your students on a more personal level, you are 

able to get a better picture of how to go about helping them on their 

level. That way, your efforts will be most effective. It will also make 

their little tails wag and make them feel like they are important 

(which they are). When I think back about why certain adults stood 

out in my past (good ones that is) it's because they were the ones 

who cared about (me). They talked with me, not at me, or not down 

to me. And, it is those adults who had the greatest opportunity to 


I believe success will come when we learn how to balance the Yin 

and the Yang...the structures and the fluff... the main courses and 

the desserts... the cardio and the strength training... the brushing 

with the flossing... the peanut butter with the jelly... the macaroni 

with the cheese.... All work and no play makes Ann a little Crazy 



Ann 


"In those cultures lacking unfamiliar challenges, external or 

internal, where fundamental change is unneeded, novel ideas 

need not be encouraged." Sagan 

.."the survival of the human species and the attainment of 

greater happiness for individuals depend on the ability to think 

scientifically, rationally, and skeptically." Skeptics Society 

Manifesto 

"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only 

means to gain it….Man’s mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to 

him, survival is not. His body is given to him, its sustenance is not. His mind 

is given to him, its content is not. To remain alive, he must act, and before he 

can act he must know the nature and purpose of his action. He cannot obtain 

his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot 

dig a ditch—or build a cyclotron—without a knowledge of his aim and of the 

means to achieve it. To remain alive, he must think." Ayn Rand 

After reading chapters 18, 19, and 20 of Sagan, I have come to 

this conclusion: 

The United States is "the" world power. For the most part, we 

are quite comfortable compared to other countries around the 

world. Many countries see education as "key" in order to 

compete. Japan, for instance, works very hard at it, and they are 

doing a pretty good job in some respects. They sure make good 

cars. South Korea wants to compete very badly, hence 

education is very important to them as well. Being the leading 

1624

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_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

power, we don't think we are in dire need of anything (other than 

social programs). And look what the emphasis is on in our 

schools. I think Americans may take our position in the world for 

granted, from a novice viewpoint, if you will. This might explain 

why some of us (meaning Americans) don't think science and 

math education is so important. Sure, you can blame it on the 

money, but I don't. There are plenty of people who do a job 

because they like it, not because of the money. Me, for 

instance: I am not going into teaching for the money!! And I am 

not going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am 

doing it so that at least some students have the opportunity to 

learn to think. I know what is possible, and I intend to provide an 

environment that will motivate students to get beyond the 

wonder and to search for the how and why. It doesn't matter 

that I don't know everything there is to know about science 

because I am not afraid to learn. I think its important to go our of 

the comfort zone, which many teachers are not willing to do. 

The funny thing is, they don't even have to teach it. They can 

guide the students by having them use the scientific method. 

The students can teach themselves, and they will remember it 

because the discoveries they make will be their own. Ok, time 

to step down from the soapbox. Cynthia 











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1626




To: journal 

Subject: ThinkerTools Software 

If anyone is reading Bruer, Chapter 5 on science, the software mentioned is online and available for 

download (free for educational purposes). Its pretty cool stuff. You may want to "backflip" or save the 

link for future use. 

Cynthia 

http://thinkertools.soe.berkeley.edu/Pages/inquiry.html 

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1627





Subject: RE: Relaxation and clarification 

Hey ohhh you got me thinking Ann, Cynthia and Casey. I wsn to be a teacher 

that makes 

my students stoked on learning. I think we need to work on their mind, 

comprehension 

skills, and ability to solve any type of problem. I also personally think that 

being caring 

understanding and loving are good qualities to pass down to our students. I 

say this 

because my favorite teacher had all these qualities. She made me want to 

learn, my 

grades went up and I felt like I was not even trying because I was so 

interested in what 

we were learning. My favorite teacher also made me the most upset too becuase 

I found 

one of my creative writing papers in the trash next to her desk. NOTE to 

future teachers 

do not through aways students papers in the classroom get a paper shreder, may 

tramatize studetn for ever. I gotta get a journal going but give me a sec. I 

gotta read the 

rest. Marin 

>First thought: 

>Although it sounds tempting, if I party like a rock star, the few remaining 

brain cells I 

have left will not have each other to send signals to. And as we learned in 

Biology, they 

do not replenish themselves like other cells. Besides, Professor Yamashita 

will assume 

that we all were partying and not doing our schoolwork. Sense? Nonsense? 

> 

>Today, after spending 5 hours working on school stuff, I went and had a 30 

minute 

massage......... Holy Moly..... I am still grooving..... That's what I call 

relaxing. I hated to 

leave. Maybe I should add being a masseuse to my list of "things I want in a 

mate". 

> 

>Second thought: 

>I was only trying to emphasize that during the process of teaching "the cold 

hard facts of 

the curriculum and standards", it would be much more palatable if one does 

this through 

a caring, student orientated style that personalizes the individual 

characteristics of each 

students' needs, learning styles, and personalities. 

> 

>I think the confussion lies right here... I am not going into teaching to 

have fun playing 

with the kids or to be remebered as being a nice teacher. Although if done 

correctly, I 

think teaching can result in having these as side effects. 

> 

>More sense? More nonsense? 

> 

>Ann 

1628


>Interesting, indeed! I remember most of my teachers, good and bad. One in 

particular 

was my 4th grade teacher, and to tell you the truth, I am really sure why. I 

don't recall her 

lessons being all that great. In fact, on my report card she wrote if I put as 

much effort into 

my regular school work as I did my extra credit projects, I would do very 

well, lol. Well, the 

extra credit projects were fun, reading a textbook wasn't! She was a fairly 

strict teacher, 

but consistent, maybe that is why I had so much respect for her. If students 

remember my 

classroom, I want it to be the things they do and learn, and if they remember 

me, well 

fine, but that is not what's important. I see so many students just getting 

passed through 

the grades without the skills to succeed in the next, and I think it is a 

disservice to these 

students, the teachers who get them the following year, and in the end, our 

society. 

Although I do enjoy working with children, sorry, it re ally isn't about the 

lov 

> e, its 

> about the mind. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>I found what Cynthia and Ann wrote very interesting. One line that Cynthia 

wrote that 

stood out to me is "I am not going into it so that my students will remember 

ME. I am 

doing it so that at least some students have the opportunity to learn to 

think." I found it 

interesting because I think we all have one or two teachers, as Ann was 

saying, that 

really stick in our mind-that really made a difference in our lives. And in 

the first semester 

when Halcon asked us why we want to be teachers-and we could not say because 

we 

love children-many of us said because we want to make a difference in our 

students 

lives. But then the next semester Dome encouraged us to use that we love 

children in our 

philosophy statement. (THAT WAS KIND OF A SIDE NOTE) I think you have to love 

children in order to teach otherwise their is no point in teaching. I think 

you also have to 

want to make a difference or again there is no point in teaching. 

> 

>So back to Cynthia- I think it is very unselfish of you what you said but I 

think if you give 

your students the kind of experience that you are talking about...they will 

remember you 

forever. 

> 

>And Ann...I do think it is very beneficial to get to know all your students 

on a personal 

level because it is so easy to stereotype and we want to try and stay away 

from that. I 

hope this made sense...I am just kind of going with the flow on my spring 

break :) 

> Casey 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

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> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

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1630





Judith~ I feel like I am flying by the seat of my pants when it comes to 

school work. I know 

I learn things here and there and everywhere. Ochanjis reading are good, when 

I get 

around to Yamashita i feel that I am not learning the content very well but I 

am 

challenging myself to learn how to read advanced works of writing (brain 

push-ups). 

Karas and Lowes class is intense but I have definatley found much 

clarification in many 

areas of biology and physics. My brain will not stop thinking about physics. 

My theatre 

arts classes teach me many ways on how to engage the students in learning and 

it also 

teaches me how to reach students who learn from all multiple intelleginces. 

I feel like I am learning. I may not get it all but I get what I can. We are 

all learning, it just 

happens so fast that it is hard to see ourselves progress and change. Whenever 

I talk 

with my family and friends I unload all my wonders about what I am learning. 

They tell me 

that I work hard, I know I do but a lot of the time I feel like it still is 

not enough. I always 

feel behind but I am doing the best I can. What you get out of school is how 

much you put 

in. We might have to cut some corners but don't make it to much of a habit. 

That's my 

motto today. Marin 

1631





Subject: Blaahh 

Judith~ I feel like I am flying by the seat of my pants when it comes to 

school work. I know 

I learn things here and there and everywhere. Ochanjis reading are good, when 

I get 

around to Yamashita i feel that I am not learning the content very well but I 

am 

challenging myself to learn how to read advanced works of writing (brain 

push-ups). 

Karas and Lowes class is intense but I have definatley found much 

clarification in many 

areas of biology and physics. My brain will not stop thinking about physics. 

My theatre 

arts classes teach me many ways on how to engage the students in learning and 

it also 

teaches me how to reach students who learn from all multiple intelleginces. 

I feel like I am learning. I may not get it all but I get what I can. We are 

all learning, it just 

happens so fast that it is hard to see ourselves progress and change. Whenever 

I talk 

with my family and friends I unload all my wonders about what I am learning. 

They tell me 

that I work hard, I know I do but a lot of the time I feel like it still is 

not enough. I always 

feel behind but I am doing the best I can. What you get out of school is how 

much you put 

in. We might have to cut some corners but don't make it to much of a habit. 

That's my 

motto today. Marin 

1632





Subject: Wonderous World 

WARNING: This brain has been overloaded with mass amounts of reading and it is 

about 

to explode all over your computer screen. 

Where do I begin????? 

Bruer teaches me alot about how to understand the minds of infants, children, 

young 

adults, students, novices, experts and those of use to have that empty space 

that void 

otherwise known as the black box. Intellegent Novices got me wondering about 

what 

certain skills or subject areas i have experince that will help me more easily 

learn other 

things in the future. I can surf, kung fu fight, ice skate, snow board, climb 

a mountain, do a 

cart wheel, drive a car I guess I could be the stunt double for a female James 

Bond but as 

for the intellectuall stuff I would only get Jamie Bond killed. it is 

interesting how we have 

the ability to transfer previously learned skills to new things we learn. It 

is also amazing 

how we make connections and categorize things to find a better understnading 

of 

everything. I realize how crucial it is for us a future teachers to relate the 

curriculum to our 

students lives. 

Today my dad said oooooo look at that Ochatu. I said wow that's beautiful. 

Then I said 

isn't there a place called Ochatu Wells and he said ya. I said I just read how 

we enhance 

our knowledge by relating it to what we already know. Then I said, Do you 

think Ochatu's 

grow at the Ochatu Well he said yes. Then he said, I bet there is a Well there 

too. We 

both laughted but we laught at the truth behind tieing what we know to what we 

learn and 

what we can learn from what we tied together. 

I have a question, Should we expect our future students to think like the 

expert? It takes 

so much to thik like an expert. How can I expect or teach my students to be on 

that level 

of thinking. In dealing with a physics problem how do you program yourself to 

automatically categorize problems by which Newton's law it fits with rather 

than what 

function the object can accomplish? Maybe a better question is how can I think 

like an 

expert? Is this possible? Keep in mind that I am blonde. 

I was ready to wrtie forever but I feel like i just ties in my main thoughts 

of chapter 3 and 5 

of Bruer maybe more will come later. 

Moving on to Sagan.jumping way back to Dragon in My Garage I had a few notes 

jotted 

down that I never brought up. i love the story about they phychiatrist that 

imagined 

1633

himself having two seperat lives one here on EArth and a more important role 

in which 

he is a Lord of an intersteller planet beyond anything we could ever concieve. 

Read this 

if you have not it has a great twist and in the end you wonder who really lies 

in the seat of 

the pacient and who is rally the psychiatrist. 

That chapter also talks about LGM and CTA-102 and quasars. It make me giggle 

how we 

just listen to the definition of what all this is and we just nod our heads 

like dumb little 

blondes, while buying the fact that much of these definitions are not even 

understood by 

the creators of these words. 

What is a quazar???? Oh it's just an extraterrestrial civilization billions of 

light years away 

with access to immense power levels.....Oh that's what I thought, i was just 

making sure. 

No Such Thing as a Dumb Question...Sagan. "Few of us spend much time 

wondering 

why Nature is the way it is"(Sagan321). I must be one of the few because ask 

any of my 

friend and they will tell you I ask too may questions that do not have simple 

answers. 

How can we sont ask questions about this word expecially being involved in all 

these 

science classess. Whenever I go snowboarding the driver or the people I go 

wtih want to 

throw me over the cliff cause I ask so many questions about, friction ice, 

snow water the 

weight of the earth, potential energy and a ski lift my kinetic energy as I go 

down the 

mountatin. It is all I can think about. Today I just got back from the Grand 

Canyon If you 

think you do not wonder enough or ask enough questions about the world, I 

suggest you 

go to the Grand Canyon. I asked so many quesitons and had so many revelations 

about 

where we live and how old this world really is. I mean The Grand Canyon took 

millions of 

years to erode which is so long ago and just think that only how log ago it 

eroded, we are 

not even talking about how long it took to form all these layers, 1,800 

billion years ago 

the bottom layer. I realize that these questions annoy people I hear it all 

the time shut up 

Marin. A few people I hang out with are so fed up with me asking quesitons 

that I think of 

a billion when I am around them but I hold them inside. I do not want my 

future studetns 

or any child to feel scared to ask quesitons, There questionare simply , 

"cries to 

understand the world" (Sagan 323) and that is exactly what it is for me as 

well. I now 

challenge myself to try and find the answers on my own now but I do have to 

admit it is 

nice when a complanion has the answers. It makes for good story time. 

The world, in my mind was created by physical and chemical forces over aeons 

from 

slime. That sounds cool to me. i do not see why we have to make up some pretty 

place 

that it cam from Not everything is mystical and perfect. If it was we wouldn't 

go potty. 

1634

I agree with Sagan that science is an astonishment and delight. It with holds 

so many 

brilliant and wonderful surges of energy and answers. I want to learn about 

everything 

and if we can get our students to think this way then learning will not only 

come easy and 

fun it will become a way of life. 

One more quick note Japan and other countries go to school much more 

throughout the 

year than Americans. This of course would improve their overall scores on 

tests and 

understanding of subjects. To add on to that schools in japan focus on 

learning 30 

science concepts a year and America arranges the students to learn 130 sceince 

concepts a year. I don't know about you but I would rather be able to explain 

and 

understand even twenty conepts rather than to confuse and be frustrated with 

100. That's 

just me. I go those stat's from the video we watched in Dome's. Well I want to 

say more 

but I just got home from Arizona and I need to make sure my cats are still 

alive. Marin 

1635





Subject: Re: Wonderous World 

Here is a sample of how the Japanese conduct a science lesson. Compare this to the 

Learning Cycle. This article says 8th graders cover 8 concepts to our 60 concepts. I bet their 

students actually understand all 8 concepts at the end of the school year. This is a good 

article if anyone is interested. 

http://nerds.unl.edu/pages/preser/sec/articles/japansci.html Cynthia 

Activity/Format 

Goal 

Examples 

Japanese Science Activity Structures 

1. Connect lesson to student interest and prior knowledge 

Teacher starts lesson with questions or activity designed to intrigue students an build on their ideas. 

• Whole-class discussion 

• Student handout 

• To catalyze or build students' interest in the topic of study. 

• To help students think of concrete daily-life examples of the scientific topic. 

• To bring out students' prior knowledge, assumptions, or misconceptions about a scientific phenomenon or 

principle. 

• Teacher starts lesson by asking, "Do you think all matter has weight?" and solicits students' ideas. 

• Teacher asks students what seasonal changes they have noticed in the environment and writes students' 

responses on the blackboard. 

• Teacher wonders out loud what killifishes eat in water and asks students what they think. 

2. Elicit student ideas or opinions 

Teacher asks students to express their ideas or opinions about a scientific phenomenon or principle. 



• To help students review what they have learned in previous lessons. 

• To help students clarify their thinking or express it in a concrete way, through writing or drawing. 

1636

• Teacher asks students to visualize and draw the change in the air in a closed jar when a candle extinguishes. 

• Teacher facilitates whole-class discussion about changes in body function (e.g., temperature, pulse rate, 

breathing, facial color, etc.) with exercise. Students discuss what to observe. 

3. Plan investigations 

Students, assisted by teacher, generate hypotheses or predictions about the topic of study and define methods 

for investigation. 



• Small-group discussion 

• To help students define a problem to investigate. 

• To help students pose a problem in a systematic manner. 

• To help students identify factors affecting a scientific phenomenon. 

• To evaluate students' understanding and their insight into a scientific phenomenon. 

• Teacher asks students a series of questions to help them notice possible relationships among factors 

affecting levers. 

• Teacher asks students to think about how the air in a jar might have been different before and after a candle 

was extinguished. 

• Teacher reviews the findings of earlier experiments with electromagnets and asks students to generate 

hypotheses about why a wire attracts metal chips when electricity runs through it. 

4. Conduct investigation 

Students conduct experiments or observations to test the hypotheses or predictions just built. The method of 

investigation may have been designed by the whole class, small group, or individual. 

• Hands-on experiment in small group 

• Student worksheet 

• To help students think about the procedures to test their hypothesis or predictions. 

• To give students direct experience with designing and conducting scientific experiments. 

• To help students acquire specific skills to conduct experiments safely and successfully. 

• Students find the balance point in various classroom materials (e.g., an eraser, a pen) and materials supplied 

for the lesson (e.g., eggs, paper dragonflies). 

• Students conduct an experiment to find out if wire "becomes a magnet or just acts like a magnet" when 

electricity runs through it. 

• Students use clay to balance a 5-kg bucket of sand, and to investigate the connections among factors 

affecting the levers. 

5. Exchange information from investigations 

Students share their findings within their small groups or report them to the whole class. 

1637

• Small-group recording on the blackboard 

• Small-group reporting to teacher and teacher records 


• To help students learn about others' viewpoints, ideas, and findings. 

• To help students relate or contrast their ideas to the ideas of others. 

• Each student writes on the blackboard his or her body temperature before and after physical exercise. 

• Representatives of each small group write group findings on the blackboard so that the whole class can see 

what other groups did and what they learned about electromagnets. 

6. Systematically analyze or organize information 

Teachers systematically summarize or organize the information shared by students. 

• Teacher organizes blackboard information 

• Teacher creates handout 

• Teacher creates summary in handout 

• To help students see patterns, similarities, or differences in findings. 

• To help students organize and analyze the findings so that they can use them effectively to draw 

conclusions. 

• Teacher makes a table showing all groups' findings on the amount of oxygen before and after a candle is 

burned in a closed jar. 

• Teacher organizes recorded body temperature information to indicate increased/remained same/decreased 

after physical exercise and reviews how body temperature changed. 

• Teacher asks students to connect similar findings of experiments on dissolution and write down the 

rationale for connecting them. 

7. Reflect and revisit hypotheses or predictions 

Teachers encourage students to reflect on their current ideas and experimental findings in light of their earlier 

hypotheses or predictions. Teachers may encourage students to repeat the experiment in order to check on their 

prior hypotheses or findings. 


• Handout 

• To help students gain insights into their own thinking and problem solving. 

• To help students draw conclusions from the findings of their experiment and connect these to their earlier 

hypotheses. 

1638

• Teacher asks students to rethink and redraw their visualization of the change in the air when a candle is 


• Teacher suggests students repeat the experiment of burning the candle if needed to help their visualization. 

8. Connect to next lesson(s). Identify unanswered questions 

Teachers ask students to think about or write down what they want to investigate in the next lesson(s). 




• To connect the present lesson to the next lesson(s) in a cohesive way. 

• To sustain students' interest in the topic of study. 

• To carry over students' involvement as problem-solvers from the present lesson to future lessons. 

• Teacher asks students to think about what else they want to investigate related to the topic of burning of 

matter. 

• Teacher asks students to generate a set of questions or topics related to electromagnets that they want to 

investigate in the next lesson(s). 



about 




young 


that void 


what 


learn other 




Bond but as 

1639






of 





Then I said 


we enhance 




too. We 


learn and 





that lev el 



than what 


like an 






jotted 


imagined 


in which 


Read this 





how we 




understood by 

1640





making sure. 


wondering 


any of my 


answers. 


these 


wtih want to 




down the 


Canyon If you 


suggest you 


about 


millions of 












"cries to 


well. I now 


admit it is 



from 


place 


go potty. 

1641


so many 


everything 


come easy and 





tests and 


learning 30 



and 


100. That's 


say more 


alive. Marin 

_____ 



1642





Subject: Re: Wonderous World 

Ok, all is not so rosy on the island of great education. Japanese students HATE math and science, so 

much so that they are changing the curriculum, and adding electives. Here is the article: 

http://mathforum.org/epigone/ncsm.members/tahchumtwul 



Learning Cycle. This article says 8th graders cover 8 concepts to our 60 concepts. I bet 

their students actually understand all 8 concepts at the end of the school year. This is a 

good article if anyone is interested. 



Goal 

Examples 









principle. 








1643



































1644




















conclusions. 












1645

• Handout 



hypotheses. 













matter. 





about 




young 

1646


that void 


what 


learn other 




Bond but as 






of 





Then I said 


we enhance 




too. We 


learn and 





that lev el 



than what 


like an 






jotted 


imagined 


in which 


Read this 

1647





how we 




understood by 





making sure. 


wondering 


any of my 


answers. 


these 


wtih want to 




down the 


Canyon If you 


suggest you 


about 


millions of 












"cries to 


well. I now 


1648

admit it is 



from 


place 


go potty. 


so many 


everything 


come easy and 





tests and 


learning 30 



and 


100. That's 


say more 


alive. Marin 

_____ 



_____ 



1649



Sent: Saturday, April 03, 2004 12:03 AM 

To: journal 

Subject: Out to prove Einstein's Predictions 

Talk about being able to think in the abstract! This is way beyond my comprehension, so I think I will 

have to take their word for it on the results of the experiment. Imagine being able to come up with a 

research project like this. Anybody want to place wagers whether or not Einstein will be proven 

correct? Cynthia 

Satellite to Test Einstein Predictions 

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040403/ap_on_sc/einstein_satellite 

Gravity Probe B is the relativity gyroscope experiment being developed by NASA and Stanford 

University to test two extraordinary, unverified predictions of Albert Einstein's general theory of 

relativity. 

The experiment will check, very precisely, tiny changes in the direction of spin of four gyroscopes 

contained in an Earth satellite orbiting at 400-mile altitude directly over the poles. So free are the 

gyroscopes from disturbance that they will provide an almost perfect space-time reference system. 

They will measure how space and time are warped by the presence of the Earth, and, more 

profoundly, how the Earth's rotation drags space-time around with it. These effects, though small for 

the Earth, have far-reaching implications for the nature of matter and the structure of the Universe. 

Gravity Probe B is among the most thoroughly researched programs ever undertaken by NASA. This 

is the story of a scientific quest in which physicists and engineers have collaborated closely over 

many years. Inspired by their quest, they have invented a whole range of new technologies -- 

technologies that are already enlivening other branches of science and engineering. (From the 

Stanford site) 

_____ 



1650





Subject: Re: Re: Wonderous World 


reply (19 KB) 

Thanks:) 

Alexandra 

> Cynthia, 


> Date: 2004/04/02 Fri PM 10:53:16 EST 


> Subject: Re: Wonderous World 

> 

> Here is a sample of how the Japanese conduct a science lesson. Compare this to the 




> http://nerds.unl.edu/pages/preser/sec/articles/japansci.html Cynthia 

> 

> Japanese Science Activity Structures 

> 

> 

> Activity/Format 

> 

> Goal 

> 

> Examples 

> 

> 1. Connect lesson to student interest and prior knowledge 

> 

> Teacher starts lesson with questions or activity designed to intrigue students an build 

on their ideas. 

> 

> Whole-class discussion 

> Student handout 

> 

> To catalyze or build students' interest in the topic of study. 

> To help students think of concrete daily-life examples of the scientific topic. 

> To bring out students' prior knowledge, assumptions, or misconceptions about a 

scientific phenomenon or principle. 

> Teacher starts lesson by asking, "Do you think all matter has weight?" and solicits 

students' ideas. 

> Teacher asks students what seasonal changes they have noticed in the environment and 

writes students' responses on the blackboard. 

> Teacher wonders out loud what killifishes eat in water and asks students what they 

think. 

> 2. Elicit student ideas or opinions 

> 

> Teacher asks students to express their ideas or opinions about a scientific phenomenon 

or principle. 

1651



> 

> To help students review what they have learned in previous lessons. 

> To help students clarify their thinking or express it in a concrete way, through writing 

or drawing. 

> 

> 

> Teacher asks students to visualize and draw the change in the air in a closed jar 

when a candle extinguishes. 

> Teacher facilitates whole-class discussion about changes in body function (e.g., 

temperature, pulse rate, breathing, facial color, etc.) with exercise. Students discuss 

what to observe. 

> 

> 3. Plan investigations 

> 

> Students, assisted by teacher, generate hypotheses or predictions about the topic of 

study and define methods for investigation. 

> 



> Small-group discussion 

> 

> 

> 

> To help students define a problem to investigate. 

> To help students pose a problem in a systematic manner. 

> To help students identify factors affecting a scientific phenomenon. 

> To evaluate students' understanding and their insight into a scientific phenomenon. 

> 

> Teacher asks students a series of questions to help them notice possible relationships 

among factors affecting levers. 

> Teacher asks students to think about how the air in a jar might have been different 

before and after a candle was extinguished. 

> Teacher reviews the findings of earlier experiments with electromagnets and asks 

students to generate hypotheses about why a wire attracts metal chips when electricity 

runs through it. 

> 4. Conduct investigation 

> 

> Students conduct experiments or observations to test the hypotheses or predictions just 

built. The method of investigation may have been designed by the whole class, small group, 

or individual. 

> 

> Hands-on experiment in small group 

> Student worksheet 

> 

> To help students think about the procedures to test their hypothesis or predictions. 

> To give students direct experience with designing and conducting scientific experiments. 

> To help students acquire specific skills to conduct experiments safely and successfully. 

> Students find the balance point in various classroom materials (e.g., an eraser, a pen) 

and materials supplied for the lesson (e.g., eggs, paper dragonflies). 

> Students conduct an experiment to find out if wire "becomes a magnet or just acts like a 

magnet" when electricity runs through it. 

> Students use clay to balance a 5-kg bucket of sand, and to investigate the connections 

among factors affecting the levers. 

> 5. Exchange information from investigations 

> 

> Students share their findings within their small groups or report them to the whole 

class. 

> 

> Small-group recording on the blackboard 

> Small-group reporting to teacher and teacher records 


> 

> To help students learn about others' viewpoints, ideas, and findings. 

1652

To help students relate or contrast their ideas to the ideas of others. 

> Each student writes on the blackboard his or her body temperature before and after 

physical exercise. 

> Representatives of each small group write group findings on the blackboard so that the 

whole class can see what other groups did and what they learned about electromagnets. 

> 

> 

> 6. Systematically analyze or organize information 

> 

> Teachers systematically summarize or organize the information shared by students. 

> 

> Teacher organizes blackboard information 

> Teacher creates handout 

> Teacher creates summary in handout 

> 

> 

> 

> To help students see patterns, similarities, or differences in findings. 

> To help students organize and analyze the findings so that they can use them 

effectively to draw conclusions. 

> 

> 

> 

> Teacher makes a table showing all groups' findings on the amount of oxygen before and 

after a candle is burned in a closed jar. 

> Teacher organizes recorded body temperature information to indicate 

increased/remained same/decreased after physical exercise and reviews how body temperature 

changed. 

> Teacher asks students to connect similar findings of experiments on dissolution and 

write down the rationale for connecting them. 

> 

> 7. Reflect and revisit hypotheses or predictions 

> 

> Teachers encourage students to reflect on their current ideas and experimental findings 

in light of their earlier hypotheses or predictions. Teachers may encourage students to 

repeat the experiment in order to check on their prior hypotheses or findings. 

> 

> ? Whole-class discussion 

> 

> ? Handout 

> 

> To help students gain insights into their own thinking and problem solving. 

> To help students draw conclusions from the findings of their experiment and connect 

these to their earlier hypotheses. 

> 

> 

> 

> Teacher asks students to rethink and redraw their visualization of the change in the 

air when a candle is burned in a closed jar. 

> Teacher suggests students repeat the experiment of burning the candle if needed to 

help their visualization. 

> 

> 

> 

> 8. Connect to next lesson(s). Identify unanswered questions 

> 

> Teachers ask students to think about or write down what they want to investigate in the 

next lesson(s). 

> 




> 

> To connect the present lesson to the next lesson(s) in a cohesive way. 

> To sustain students' interest in the topic of study. 

> To carry over students' involvement as problem-solvers from the present lesson to future 

1653

lessons. 

> 

> 

> Teacher asks students to think about what else they want to investigate related to 

the topic of burning of matter. 

> Teacher asks students to generate a set of questions or topics related to 

electromagnets that they want to investigate in the next lesson(s). 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> tinne002 wrote: 

> WARNING: This brain has been overloaded with mass amounts of reading and it is 

> about 

> to explode all over your computer screen. 

> 

> Where do I begin????? 

> Bruer teaches me alot about how to understand the minds of infants, children, 

> young 

> adults, students, novices, experts and those of use to have that empty space 

> that void 

> otherwise known as the black box. Intellegent Novices got me wondering about 

> what 

> certain skills or subject areas i have experince that will help me more easily 

> learn other 

> things in the future. I can surf, kung fu fight, ice skate, snow board, climb 

> a mountain, do a 

> cart wheel, drive a car I guess I could be the stunt double for a female James 

> Bond but as 

> for the intellectuall stuff I would only get Jamie Bond killed. it is 

> interesting how we have 

> the ability to transfer previously learned skills to new things we learn. It 

> is also amazing 

> how we make connections and categorize things to find a better understnading 

> of 

> everything. I realize how crucial it is for us a future teachers to relate the 

> curriculum to our 

> students lives. 

> Today my dad said oooooo look at that Ochatu. I said wow that's beautiful. 

> Then I said 

> isn't there a place called Ochatu Wells and he said ya. I said I just read how 

> we enhance 

> our knowledge by relating it to what we already know. Then I said, Do you 

> think Ochatu's 

> grow at the Ochatu Well he said yes. Then he said, I bet there is a Well there 

> too. We 

> both laughted but we laught at the truth behind tieing what we know to what we 

> learn and 

> what we can learn from what we tied together. 

> 

> I have a question, Should we expect our future students to think like the 

> expert? It takes 

> so much to thik like an expert. How can I expect or teach my students to be on 

> that level 

> of thinking. In dealing with a physics problem how do you program yourself to 

> automatically categorize problems by which Newton's law it fits with rather 

> than what 

> function the object can accomplish? Maybe a better question is how can I think 

> like an 

> expert? Is this possible? Keep in mind that I am blonde. 

> I was ready to wrtie forever but I feel like i just ties in my main thoughts 

> of chapter 3 and 5 

> of Bruer maybe more will come later. 

> 

1654


> jotted 

> down that I never brought up. i love the story about they phychiatrist that 

> imagined 

> himself having two seperat lives one here on EArth and a more important role 

> in which 

> he is a Lord of an intersteller planet beyond anything we could ever concieve. 

> Read this 

> if you have not it has a great twist and in the end you wonder who really lies 

> in the seat of 

> the pacient and who is rally the psychiatrist. 

> 

> That chapter also talks about LGM and CTA-102 and quasars. It make me giggle 

> how we 

> just listen to the definition of what all this is and we just nod our heads 

> like dumb little 

> blondes, while buying the fact that much of these definitions are not even 

> understood by 

> the creators of these words. 

> What is a quazar???? Oh it's just an extraterrestrial civilization billions of 

> light years away 

> with access to immense power levels.....Oh that's what I thought, i was just 

> making sure. 

> 

> No Such Thing as a Dumb Question...Sagan. "Few of us spend much time 

> wondering 

> why Nature is the way it is"(Sagan321). I must be one of the few because ask 

> any of my 

> friend and they will tell you I ask too may questions that do not have simple 

> answers. 

> How can we sont ask questions about this word expecially being involved in all 

> these 

> science classess. Whenever I go snowboarding the driver or the people I go 

> wtih want to 

> throw me over the cliff cause I ask so many questions about, friction ice, 

> snow water the 

> weight of the earth, potential energy and a ski lift my kinetic energy as I go 

> down the 

> mountatin. It is all I can think about. Today I just got back from the Grand 

> Canyon If you 

> think you do not wonder enough or ask enough questions about the world, I 

> suggest you 

> go to the Grand Canyon. I asked so many quesitons and had so many revelations 

> about 

> where we live and how old this world really is. I mean The Grand Canyon took 

> millions of 

> years to erode which is so long ago and just think that only how log ago it 

> eroded, we are 

> not even talking about how long it took to form all these layers, 1,800 

> billion years ago 

> the bottom layer. I realize that these questions annoy people I hear it all 

> the time shut up 

> Marin. A few people I hang out with are so fed up with me asking quesitons 

> that I think of 

> a billion when I am around them but I hold them inside. I do not want my 

> future studetns 

> or any child to feel scared to ask quesitons, There questionare simply , 

> "cries to 

> understand the world" (Sagan 323) and that is exactly what it is for me as 

> well. I now 

> challenge myself to try and find the answers on my own now but I do have to 

> admit it is 

> nice when a complanion has the answers. It makes for good story time. 

> 

> The world, in my mind was created by physical and chemical forces over aeons 

> from 

1655


> place 

> that it cam from Not everything is mystical and perfect. If it was we wouldn't 

> go potty. 

> 

> I agree with Sagan that science is an astonishment and delight. It with holds 

> so many 

> brilliant and wonderful surges of energy and answers. I want to learn about 

> everything 

> and if we can get our students to think this way then learning will not only 

> come easy and 

> fun it will become a way of life. 

> 

> One more quick note Japan and other countries go to school much more 

> throughout the 

> year than Americans. This of course would improve their overall scores on 

> tests and 

> understanding of subjects. To add on to that schools in japan focus on 

> learning 30 

> science concepts a year and America arranges the students to learn 130 sceince 

> concepts a year. I don't know about you but I would rather be able to explain 

> and 

> understand even twenty conepts rather than to confuse and be frustrated with 

> 100. That's 

> just me. I go those stat's from the video we watched in Dome's. Well I want to 

> say more 

> but I just got home from Arizona and I need to make sure my cats are still 

> alive. Marin 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 

1656



Sent: Saturday, April 03, 2004 5:43 PM 



Anne I am so with you here. I also want my students to remember ME as being a person that made a 

difference in their education. Lots of times that is what some students need that extra support from 

the teacher, so that they can get some motivation and keep moving. I remember when I was in high 

school I would get frustrated when I would not understand something. Some of my teachers will see 

that in me and would take the time to help me out. These are the type of teachers that I remember; 

teachers that would take the time to help me understand the concept. The extra help really help me 

get back on my feet and it did not ruin the rest of my day at school. That is the reason why I do 

want the children to remember ME. I want them to remember me as the teacher that took the time to 

help them through the difficult and confusing times. 






Cynthia, 



lovey dovey and artsy fartsy". I am sure that there will be little noses to the grind stones and rigid 

time schedules to dance with as well. I picture teaching as a multifaceted dance with so many 

moves that it will make your head spin. Success will be in managing it all and making it seem like 

a fun place to be while the students are learning. 

By getting to know your students on a more personal level, you are able to get a better picture of 

how to go about helping them on their level. That way, your efforts will be most effective. It will 

also make their little tails wag and make them feel like they are important (which they are). When 

I think back about why certain adults stood out in my past (good ones that is) it's because 

they were the ones who cared about (me). They talked with me, not at me, or not down to me. 

And, it is those adults who had the greatest opportunity to teach me the most because they were 


I believe success will come when we learn how to balance the Yin and the Yang...the structures 

and the fluff... the main courses and the desserts... the cardio and the strength training... the 

brushing with the flossing... the peanut butter with the jelly... the macaroni with the cheese.... All 

work and no play makes Ann a little Crazy 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/32.gif .... 


Ann 


1657

_____ 

_____ 





Manifesto 

"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only means to gain it .Man s mind is his 

basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given to him, its sustenance is not. His mind 

is given to him, its content is not. To remain alive, he must act, and before he can act he must know the nature 

and purpose of his action. He cannot obtain his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He 

cannot dig a ditch or build a cyclotron without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To remain 

alive, he must think." Ayn Rand 


The United States is "the" world power. For the most part, we are quite comfortable compared 

to other countries around the world. Many countries see education as "key" in order to 

compete. Japan, for instance, works very hard at it, and they are doing a pretty good job in 

some respects. They sure make good cars. South Korea wants to compete very badly, hence 

education is very important to them as well. Being the leading power, we don't think we are in 

dire need of anything (other than social programs). And look what the emphasis is on in our 

schools. I think Americans may take our position in the world for granted, from a novice 

viewpoint, if you will. This might explain why some of us (meaning Americans) don't think 

science and math education is so important. Sure, you can blame it on the money, but I don't. 

There are plenty of people who do a job because they like it, not because of the money. Me, 

for instance: I am not going into teaching for the money!! And I am not going into it so that my 

students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at least some students have the opportunity 

to learn to think. I know what is possible, and I intend to provide an environment that will 

motivate students to get beyond the wonder and to search for the how and why. It doesn't 

matter that I don't know everything there is to know about science because I am not afraid to 

learn. I think its important to go our of the comfort zone, which many teachers are not willing to 

do. The funny thing is, they don't even have to teach it. They can guide the students by having 

them use the scientific method. The students can teach themselves, and they will remember it 

because the discoveries they make will be their own. Ok, time to step down from the soapbox. 

Cynthia 





1658







I started working at a school in Escondido and I am very excited because I get to work in many 

different classrooms, and thus get to see the different teaching styles that are out there. I have to say 

that yes, as teachers there needs to be some sternness in the classroom so that the children will 

understand that you are no joke, but at the end the warmness in the teacher is what makes the 

student comfortable in that learning environment. 


B) 







grade teacher, and to tell you the truth, I am really sure why. I don't recall her lessons being all 

that great. In fact, on my report card she wrote if I put as much effort into my regular school work 

as I did my extra credit projects, I would do very well, lol. Well, the extra credit projects were fun, 

reading a textbook wasn't! She was a fairly strict teacher, but consistent, maybe that is why I had 

so much respect for her. If students remember my classroom, I want it to be the things they do 

and learn, and if they remember me, well fine, but that is not what's important. I see so many 

students just getting passed through the grades without the skills to succeed in the next, and I 

think it is a disservice to these students, the teachers who get them the following year, and in the 

end, our society. Although I do enjoy working with children, sorry, it re ally isn't about the love, its 

about the mind. 

Cynthia 


I found what Cynthia and Ann wrote very interesting. One line that Cynthia wrote that stood out 

to me is "I am not going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at 

least some students have the opportunity to learn to think." I found it interesting because I 

think we all have one or two teachers, as Ann was saying, that really stick in our mind-that 

really made a difference in our lives. And in the first semester when Halcon asked us why we 

want to be teachers-and we could not say because we love children-many of us said because 

we want to make a difference in our students lives. But then the next semester Dome 

encouraged us to use that we love children in our philosophy statement. (THAT WAS KIND OF 

A SIDE NOTE) I think you have to love children in order to teach otherwise their is no point in 

teaching. I think you also have to want to make a difference or again there is no point in 

teaching. 


1659

_____ 





Casey 



1660





Subject: Re: Judith's journal 10 

I am a bit skeptical about me learning on every assignment that I have done this semester, 

particularly in physics. I do not believe that I have learned in every assignment and my grade is 

showing it. Yes, I figured that I can go and have a talk with the instructor but I am much too frustrated 

over all the stuff that I am just not getting. I figured that if we (taken by the test scores) are not doing 

that great in that subject area then we must not be getting it. As a teacher--and yes I know that we 

are in college, and that that is what college is all about, being challenged-- I believe that if the class is 

not doing a great job overall, that something is not going right, and perhaps the teaching methods 

need to be modified. 

About having to balance between the school work and the time it takes to learn it I think that when we 

are in the classroom and if we have this type of mentallity when working with kids that are having a 

difficult time learning something they would be completely lost, just like I am now. Yes, time has to a 

lot to do with accelerating on something, the more time you spend time studying the better you will do 

in a test or assigment, but as a teacher if you see that the majority of the class is struggling then the 

issue should be beyond the time constraint, the issue here should be about how as a teacher will you 

modify your teaching strategies so that the majority of the class is learning. 


From: Jennifer Ramos 




Judith wrote: 

>"However, the amount of work we have to do overwhelms me 


> 



>this program?" 

Well, you just have to roll with the punches. You have got to do your best, 

and only you know your best and what you are capable of. It is rough at 

times, and it will continue to be as long as we progress in this program. 

Yes, there is a lot of work but I look at it as just another test. We are 

being tested to see if we can handle to the work load, succeed, and pass our 

classes with high ratings. Every time we do an assignment, we are learning. 

You just have to find the time balance between the schoolwork and the work 

it takes to learn. Good luck! 

~Jennifer 




1661


>Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:32:54 -0800 

> 


> 


>telling him about how I noticed that some students were worried about 

>passing 

>classes and not on the actual learning process. It got to a point where I 

>was 


>something. I know, for instance, that when I am doing a research paper, I 

>am 

>learning new things. However, the amount of work we have to do overwhelms 

>me 


> 




> 

>Judith 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Get tax tips, tools and access to IRS forms - all in one place at MSN Money! 

http://moneycentral.msncom/tax/home.asp 

1662






No not every teacher loves or cares about their students and those are the ones that suck and who I 

see teaching in the classroom every day, they are just too rude; it does not even seem like they are 

passionate about what they do, which is very unfortunate 






Ok, just the nitty gritty. I wasn't mocking you directly, but then maybe I was. Actually, I was trying 

to say that becoming friends with my students isn't why I want to teach. I think it is possible to 

focus on that aspect of the classroom, and miss what really needs to happen: learning. I think you 

have good intentions, as do I and the rest of the class. But it concerns me that the main reason for 

teaching would be "because I love children". If you think about it, does everyone love all children, 

even those they haven't met? I don't think its realistic to say I will love all my students, because I 

know it isn't true. I am not Gandhi. But that doesn't mean I can't be an effective teacher. As I 

mentioned in one of my other posts, there seems to be a real focus on social issues in the public 

schools these days. You know, the stuff that kids are supposed to learn at home from their 

parents. It uses up a lot of time that could be spent on science, reading and math. I am not saying 

it shouldn't be there at all, but if its taught as a science lesson like in the "Learning from Cases" 

book, that would be a good thing. I am not going to school to be a social worker, but a teacher. 

You might argue that students don't get this stuff at home, so it needs to be taught in the schools. 

I would disagree. When you take power away from someone, you put them in danger (the 

parents). When you give the students a real education, they can think for themselves and don't 

need to be indoctrinated with what "we" think is the correct way to view the world. 


world works. I don't think I have any right to tell you how to think, or even that you should change 

the way you think. And so I was attempting to be nonconfrontational, while pointing out a 

difference in opinion. Guess it didn't work. 

Cynthia 



sentence that stood out seemed to mock the warm hearted ideas about teaching which have 

been expressed in the journals. For instance I wrote about one of the teachers that stood out 

to me because he met with all of us before the first day of school.... etc, and I also wrote that I 

still see him around town etc. Then, you post a journal with some good ideas about how you 

want to teach, and that's all great; but, when you add in little subtle side notes such as "And I 

am not going into it (teaching) so that students remember ME". This feels as though you 

were mocking, as I wrote above, the previous posts. So, when I tried to clarify this and 

explain that I am not going into to teaching to be remembered by my students, you apologize 

for misunderstanding me, but in the very same breath you misunderstand me all over again. 

How is it that I am talking about "A, B, and C"... and it gets twisted up as if I were talking 

1663

about "H, or Z?" Is my writing style, or ability to clearly express my ideas really that screwed 

up? If it is, please do me a favor by letting me know so that I can correct this shortcomming. 

Ann 


ME the person rather than the classroom experience and learning. I won't be the teacher 

who stands in front of the class telling students what I think they need to know. I am not 

saying you will be, thats not what I mean. It's just that my idea of educating students is 

guiding them so that they learn new things that encourages them to think. Sometimes 

teachers are so fearful of destroying the self-esteem of their fragile students that no 

learning takes place. But I strongly believe in high standards for all students, they need to 

produce. Call it hardnose if you want, but I think it can be done in a way that is enjoyable 

even if they are being pushed to do their best. This does not mean I won't get to know my 

students, of course I will. I do it now with the students I work with, and I am getting great 


Cynthia 


Cynthia, 


warm hearted sincerity of some recent posts (not just mine) as inferring these 



teaching as a multifaceted dance with so many moves that it will make your head spin. 

Success will be in managing it all and making it seem like a fun place to be while the 



picture of how to go about helping them on their level. That way, your efforts will be 

most effective. It will also make their little tails wag and make them feel like they are 

important (which they are). When I think back about why certain adults stood out in my 

past (good ones that is) it's because they were the ones who cared about (me). They 

talked with me, not at me, or not down to me. And, it is those adults who had the 

greatest opportunity to teach me the most because they were actually listening .... 


structures and the fluff... the main courses and the desserts... the cardio and the 

strength training... the brushing with the flossing... the peanut butter with the jelly... the 

macaroni with the cheese.... All work and no play makes Ann a little Crazy 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/32.gif .... 


Ann 


1664

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 






"Man cannot survive except by gaining knowledge, and reason is his only means to gain it .Man s 

mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given to him, its 

sustenance is not. His mind is given to him, its content is not. To remain alive, he must act, and 

before he can act he must know the nature and purpose of his action. He cannot obtain his food 

without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch or build a 

cyclotron without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To remain alive, he must 

think." Ayn Rand 



compared to other countries around the world. Many countries see education as 

"key" in order to compete. Japan, for instance, works very hard at it, and they are 

doing a pretty good job in some respects. They sure make good cars. South Korea 

wants to compete very badly, hence education is very important to them as well. 

Being the leading power, we don't think we are in dire need of anything (other than 


Americans may take our position in the world for granted, from a novice viewpoint, if 

you will. This might explain why some of us (meaning Americans) don't think science 

and math education is so important. Sure, you can blame it on the money, but I 

don't. There are plenty of people who do a job because they like it, not because 

of the money. Me, for instance: I am not going into teaching for the money!! And I 

am not going into it so that my students will remember ME. I am doing it so that at 

least some students have the opportunity to learn to think. I know what is possible, 

and I intend to provide an environment that will motivate students to get beyond the 

wonder and to search for the how and why. It doesn't matter that I don't know 

everything there is to know about science because I am not afraid to learn. I think its 

important to go our of the comfort zone, which many teachers are not willing to do. 



will remember it because the discoveries they make will be their own. Ok, time to 

step down from the soapbox. Cynthia 





1665

_____ 

_____ 







1666







good point Anne 


B) 



































1667







on it. 






Ann 























Cynthia 










1668







Ann 












Cynthia 


Cynthia, 




















Crazy http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/32.gif .... 


1669

_____ 

_____ 

Ann 








it .Man s mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given 



his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch or build a 

cyclotron without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To remain alive, he 




























1670

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 











1671






Teachers do need to care about their students. They also need to be passionate about educating 

students. Both of these are needed to be a good teacher. If the first one is lacking, students won't 

want to learn, if the second is lacking, there will be nothing to learn, at least academically. Cynthia 


No not every teacher loves or cares about their students and those are the ones that suck and 

who I see teaching in the classroom every day, they are just too rude; it does not even seem like 

they are passionate about what they do, which is very unfortunate 



























Cynthia 





1672












Ann 












Cynthia 


Cynthia, 


















1673

_____ 



Crazy http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/32.gif .... 


Ann 








it .Man s mind is his basic tool of survival. Life is given to him, survival is not. His body is given 



his food without a knowledge of food and of the way to obtain it. He cannot dig a ditch or build a 

cyclotron without a knowledge of his aim and of the means to achieve it. To remain alive, he 


























1674

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 













1675



Sent: Sunday, April 04, 2004 3:03 AM 

To: ICP-F 

Subject: ANN IN THE BLUE CORNER CYNTHIA IN THE RED CORNER DING DING LETS GET 

IT ON 

This cat fight between ann and cynthia is good they both have different views 

about teaching and I am gald that I get to read this journals and see what 

people think. Personally I agree with Ann on what she has to say about the 

students in the classroom and what needs to be done. 

pS I LOVE YOU GUYS 

JONATHAN 

1676





Subject: Re: Re: Wonderous World, (Ann's journal entry 50 billion 284 thousand) 

HHHmmmm, this sounds like something I have stressed before. I agree, why not learn more in depth 

about several things than learn very little (if any) about a billion things. Our school systems from 

grade school to college are set up to go at warp speed through ten billion topics with not time to fully 

understand most of it. 

It's like having 100 cats and not being able to properly care for any of them as appossed to having 5 

cats and caring for them very well. Or, it's like having 20 children, and you can't make enough money 

to buy food to feed their little starving tummies. Why not have 2-3 kids which you can afford to feed, 

clothe, supply medical care, a car when they are 16, and send them to college too. (Boy, I wish I had 

it that good.....) 

I see that some might debate that if you give everyone little tastes of a lot of things, they may become 

better rounded and find something that they may wish to explore later. Shoot, there are about 10 

billion things that seem totally interesting and that I would love to go back to tho learn more about, but 

there is never enogh TIME......... And, since there is never enough time, I think it makes sense to 

teach fewer topic in more depth. I don't have all the answers and I am sure there are lot of things that 

go into this equation that I don't even realize, but that's my 2 cents on this topic. 

Ann 


> Cynthia, 

Thanks:) 

Alexandra 


> Date: 2004/04/02 Fri PM 10:53:16 EST 


> Subject: Re: Wonderous World 

> 

> Here is a sample of how the Japanese conduct a science lesson. Compare this to the Learning 

Cycle. This article says 8th graders cover 8 concepts to our 60 concepts. I bet their students 

actually understand all 8 concepts at the end of the school year. This is a good article if anyone is 

interested. 

> http://nerds.unl.edu/pages/preser/sec/articles/japansci.html Cynthia 

> 

> Japanese Science Activity Structures 

> 

> 

> Activity/Format 

> 

1677

Goal 

> 

> Examples 

> 

> 1. Connect lesson to student interest and prior knowledge 

> 

> Teacher starts lesson with questions or a ctivity designed to intrigue students an build on their 

ideas. 

> 



> 

> To catalyze or build students' interest in the topic of study. 

> To help students think of concrete daily-life examples of the scientific topic. 

> To bring out students' prior knowledge, assumptions, or misconceptions about a scientific 

phenomenon or principle. 

> Teacher starts lesson by asking, "Do you think all matter has weight?" and solicits students' 

ideas. 

> Teacher asks students what seasonal changes they have noticed in the environment and writes 

students' responses on the blackboard. 

> Teacher wonders out loud what killifishes eat in water and asks students what they think. 

> 2. Elicit student ideas or opinions 

> 

> Teacher asks students to express their ideas or opinions about a scientific phenomenon or 

principle. 

> 


> Student han dout 

> 

> To help students review what they have learned in previous lessons. 

> To help students clarify their thinking or express it in a concrete way, through writing or drawing. 

> 

> 

> Teacher asks students to visualize and draw the change in the air in a closed jar when a candle 

extinguishes. 

> Teacher facilitates whole-class discussion about changes in body function (e.g., temperature, 

pulse rate, breathing, facial color, etc.) with exercise. Students discuss what to observe. 

> 

> 3. Plan investigations 

> 

> Students, assisted by teacher, generate hypotheses or predictions about the topic of study and 

define methods for investigation. 

> 




> 

> 

> 

> To help students define a problem to investigate. 

> To help students pose a problem in a systematic manner. 

> To help students identify factors affecting a scientific phenomenon. 

> To evaluate students' understanding and their insight into a scientific phenomenon. 

1678

> Teacher asks students a series of questions to help them notice possible relationships among 

factors affecting levers. 

> Teacher asks students to think about how the air in a jar might have been different before and 

after a candle was extinguished. 

> Teacher reviews the findings of earlier experiments with electromagnets and asks students to 

generate hypotheses about why a wire attracts metal chips when electricity runs through it. 

> 4. Conduct investigation 

> 

> Students conduct experiments or observations to test the hypotheses or predictions just built. 

The method of investigation may have been designed by the whole class, small group, or 

individual. 

> 

> Hands-on experiment in small group 


> 

> To help students think about the procedures to test their hypothesis or predictions. 

> To give students direct experience with designing and conducting scientific experiments. 

> To help students acquire specific skills to conduct experiments safely and successfully. 

> Students find the balance point in various classroom materials (e.g., an eraser, a pen) and 

materials supplied for the lesson (e.g., eggs, paper dragonflies). 

> Students conduct an experiment to find out if wire "becomes a magnet or just acts like a 

magnet" when electricity runs through it. 

> Students use clay to balance a 5-kg bucket of sand, and to investigate the connections among 

factors affecting the levers. 

> 5. Exchange information from investigations 

> 

> Students share their findings within their small groups or report them to the whole class. 

> 

> Small-group recording on the blackboard 

> Small-group reporting to teacher and teacher records 


> 

> To help students learn about others' viewpoints, ideas, and findings. 

> To help students relate or contrast their ideas to the ideas of others. 

> Each student writes on the blackboard his or her body temperature before and after physical 

exercise. 

> Representatives of each small group write group findings on the blackboard so that the whole 

class can see what other groups did and what they learned about electromagnets. 

> 

> 

> 6. Systematically analyze or organize information 

> 

> Teachers systematically summarize or organize the information shared by students. 

> 

> Teacher organizes blackboard information 

> Teacher creates handout 

> Teacher creates summary in handout 

> 

> 

> 

> To help students see patterns, similarities, or differences in findings. 

> To help students organize and analyze the findings so that they can use them effective ly to 

1679

draw conclusions. 

> 

> 

> 

> Teacher makes a table showing all groups' findings on the amount of oxygen before and after a 

candle is burned in a closed jar. 

> Teacher organizes recorded body temperature information to indicate increased/remained 

same/decreased after physical exercise and reviews how body temperature changed. 

> Teacher asks students to connect similar findings of experiments on dissolution and write down 

the rationale for connecting them. 

> 

> 7. Reflect and revisit hypotheses or predictions 

> 

> Teachers encourage students to reflect on their current ideas and experimental findings in light 

of their earlier hypotheses or predictions. Teachers may encourage students to repeat the 

experiment in order to check on their prior hypotheses or findings. 

> 

> ? Whole-class discussion 

> 

> ? Handout 

> 

> To help students gain insights into their own thinking and probl em solving. 

> To help students draw conclusions from the findings of their experiment and connect these to 

their earlier hypotheses. 

> 

> 

> 

> Teacher asks students to rethink and redraw their visualization of the change in the air when a 

candle is burned in a closed jar. 

> Teacher suggests students repeat the experiment of burning the candle if needed to help their 

visualization. 

> 

> 

> 

> 8. Connect to next lesson(s). Identify unanswered questions 

> 

> Teachers ask students to think about or write down what they want to investigate in the next 

lesson(s). 

> 




> 

> To connect the present lesson to the next lesson(s) in a cohesive way. 

> To sustain students' interest in the topic of study. 

> To carry over students' involvement as problem-solvers from the present lesson to future le 

ssons. 

> 

> 

> Teacher asks students to think about what else they want to investigate related to the topic of 

burning of matter. 

> Teacher asks students to generate a set of questions or topics related to electromagnets that 

they want to investigate in the next lesson(s). 

1680

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 


> WARNING: This brain has been overloaded with mass amounts of reading and it is 

> about 

> to explode all over your computer screen. 

> 

> Where do I begin????? 

> Bruer teaches me alot about how to understand the minds of infants, children, 

> young 

> adults, students, novices, experts and those of use to have that empty space 

> that void 

> otherwise known as the black box. Intellegent Novices got me wondering about 

> what 

> certain skills or subject areas i have experince that will help me more easily 

> le arn other 

> things in the future. I can surf, kung fu fight, ice skate, snow board, climb 

> a mountain, do a 

> cart wheel, drive a car I guess I could be the stunt double for a female James 

> Bond but as 

> for the intellectuall stuff I would only get Jamie Bond killed. it is 

> interesting how we have 

> the ability to transfer previously learned skills to new things we learn. It 

> is also amazing 

> how we make connections and categorize things to find a better understnading 

> of 

> everything. I realize how crucial it is for us a future teachers to relate the 

> curriculum to our 

> students lives. 

> Today my dad said oooooo look at that Ochatu. I said wow that's beautiful. 

> Then I said 

> isn't there a place called Ochatu Wells and he said ya. I said I just read how 

> we enhance 

> our knowledge by relating it to what we already know. Then I said, Do you 

> think Ochatu's 

> grow at the Ochatu Well he said yes. Then he said, I bet there is a Well there 

> too. We 

> both laughted but we laught at the truth behind tieing what we know to what we 

> learn and 

> what we can learn from what we tied together. 

> 

> I have a question, Should we expect our future students to think like the 

> expert? It takes 

> so much to thik like an expert. How can I expect or teach my students to be on 

> that level 

> of thinking. In dealing with a physics problem how do you program yourself to 

> automatically categorize problems by which Newton's law it fits with rather 

> than what 

> function the object can accomplish? Maybe a better question is how can I think 

1681

like an 

> expert? Is this possible? Keep in mind that I am blonde. 

> I was ready to wrtie forever but I feel like i just ties in my main thoughts 

> of chapter 3 and 5 

> ; of Bruer maybe more will come later. 

> 

> Moving on to Sagan.jumping way back to Dragon in My Garage I had a few notes 

> jotted 

> down that I never brought up. i love the story about they phychiatrist that 

> imagined 

> himself having two seperat lives one here on EArth and a more important role 

> in which 

> he is a Lord of an intersteller planet beyond anything we could ever concieve. 

> Read this 

> if you have not it has a great twist and in the end you wonder who really lies 

> in the seat of 

> the pacient and who is rally the psychiatrist. 

> 

> That chapter also talks about LGM and CTA-102 and quasars. It make me giggle 

> how we 

> just listen to the definition of what all this is and we just nod our heads 

> like dumb little 

> blondes, while buying the fact that much of these definitions are not even 

> understood by 

> the creators of these word s. 

> What is a quazar???? Oh it's just an extraterrestrial civilization billions of 

> light years away 

> with access to immense power levels.....Oh that's what I thought, i was just 

> making sure. 

> 

> No Such Thing as a Dumb Question...Sagan. "Few of us spend much time 

> wondering 

> why Nature is the way it is"(Sagan321). I must be one of the few because ask 

> any of my 

> friend and they will tell you I ask too may questions that do not have simple 

> answers. 

> How can we sont ask questions about this word expecially being involved in all 

> these 

> science classess. Whenever I go snowboarding the driver or the people I go 

> wtih want to 

> throw me over the cliff cause I ask so many questions about, friction ice, 

> snow water the 

> weight of the earth, potential energy and a ski lift my kinetic energy as I go 

> down the 

> mountatin. It is all I can think about. Today I just got back from the Grand 

> Canyon If you 

> think you do not wonder enough or ask enough questions about the world, I 

> suggest you 

> go to the Grand Canyon. I asked so many quesitons and had so many revelations 

> about 

> where we live and how old this world really is. I mean The Grand Canyon took 

> millions of 

> years to erode which is so long ago and just think that only how log ago it 

1682


> not even talking about how long it took to form all these layers, 1,800 

> billion years ago 

> the bottom layer. I realize that these questions annoy people I hear it all 

> the time shut up 

> Marin. A few people I hang out with are so fed up with me asking quesitons 

> that I think of 

> a billion when I am around them but I hold them inside. I do not want my 

> future studetns 

> or any child to feel scared to ask quesitons, Ther e questionare simply , 

> "cries to 

> understand the world" (Sagan 323) and that is exactly what it is for me as 

> well. I now 

> challenge myself to try and find the answers on my own now but I do have to 

> admit it is 

> nice when a complanion has the answers. It makes for good story time. 

> 

> The world, in my mind was created by physical and chemical forces over aeons 

> from 

> slime. That sounds cool to me. i do not see why we have to make up some pretty 

> place 

> that it cam from Not everything is mystical and perfect. If it was we wouldn't 

> go potty. 

> 

> I agree with Sagan that science is an astonishment and delight. It with holds 

> so many 

> brilliant and wonderful surges of energy and answers. I want to learn about 

> everything 

> and if we can get our students to think this way then learning will not only 

> come easy and 

> fun it will become a way of life. 

> 

> One more quick note Japan and other countries go to school much more 

> throughout the 

> year than Americans. This of course would improve their overall scores on 

> tests and 

> understanding of subjects. To add on to that schools in japan focus on 

> learning 30 

> science concepts a year and America arranges the students to learn 130 sceince 

> concepts a year. I don't know about you but I would rather be able to explain 

> and 

> understand even twenty conepts rather than to confuse and be frustrated with 

> 100. That's 

> just me. I go those stat's from the video we watched in Dome's. Well I want to 

> say more 

> but I just got home from Arizona and I need to make sure my cats are still 

> alive. Marin 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 

1683







Goal 

Examples 









principle. 















1684




































1685












conclusions. 












• Handout 



hypotheses. 



1686











matter. 





about 




young 


that void 


what 


learn other 




Bond but as 



1687




of 





Then I said 


we enhance 




too. We 


learn and 





that lev el 



than what 


like an 






jotted 


imagined 


in which 


Read this 





how we 




understood by 



1688



making sure. 


wondering 


any of my 


answers. 


these 


wtih want to 




down the 


Canyon If you 


suggest you 


about 


millions of 












"cries to 


well. I now 


admit it is 



from 


place 


go potty. 


so many 

1689

illiant and wonderful surges of energy and answers. I want to learn about 

everything 


come easy and 





tests and 


learning 30 



and 


100. That's 


say more 


alive. Marin 

_____ 



_____ 



1690



Sent: Sunday, April 04, 2004 7:35 PM 


Subject: No such thing as stupid questions, just stupid people 

After all the readings and reviewing the way the brain works to understand 

things from Bruer and reading Sagan, I came to my own conclusion. There is no 

such thing as stupid questions, just stupid answers or stupid people that 

don't apply themselves enough to really critically think before asking the 

question. I think many questions would not be asked if people applied 

themselves and really thought about the question before they asked it. 

Sagan writes," Most AMerican children aren't stupid. Part of the reason they 

don't study hard is that they recieve few tangible benefits when they do." 

He brings up a good point, I often think to myself " what is the point of 

studying or reading this useless information if I am not going to be using it 

in my lifetime?" However, I will think more critically and realize that not 

all things a person studies must be immediately tangible to life, you never 

know when trivial knowledge will be there to help you later on. 

As the discussions have compared American children to those of other 

countries, I also think American children are lazy when it comes to studying 

or looking for information outside of there assignments because they have no 

pride in what they are learning. Why don't they have the pride? Because their 

teachers do not have pride in what they are teaching, how could you when you 

are forced to teach to tests and specific guidlines "they" call standards. In 

the Japanese schools they clean their own school, take off their shoes when 

entering, make their own food. All of that works for a larger common goal and 

everyone must have some sort of pride in their school and themselves to obtain 

the goal. 

One of my favorite lines that Sagan wrote was "igonorance feed on ignorance." 

I think this is directly related to this semester. Think about how often we 

ask ourselves "Why are we learning this?" Ha, we are in college to become 

better thinkers, more well rounded individuals, and know things beyond are 

specific field of study. If we don't learn and internalize what we are 

learning then we are ignorant, we are going to be teaching this to our 

students? I don't think so! 

Maybe when they learn all the Genome sequences and are able to create perfect 

people, we won't have to have these discussions becuase we will be predisposed 

to intelligence and obtaining knowledge. 

-Thanks for reading if you got this far, 

Chula 

1691




To: ICP-F; silco001 

Subject: RE: No such thing as stupid questions, just stupid people 

Is there really no such thing as a stupid quesiton? I would think not but I 

have been told 

differently. I used to have a kung fu instructor who would say, "there is no 

such thing as 

studpid questions, if you don't ask quesitons then how will you ever deeply 

learn about 

anything". Well about five minutes later I asked him a curious quesiton about 

a joint lock 

we were doing and he laughed at me, rolled his eyes and walked away. He never 

answered my question. I still think about how ironic it is that he was 

encouraging us, out 

of the blue, to ask questions and not even a minute later he shot me down. I 

am friends 

with this guy and he can be a prick but it just kills me that people say one 

thing and do 

another. Just a old remeberance that fit with the readings. Now I am going to 

sit and think 

if there is such thing as stupid quesiton. I have a feeling there might be. 

Example, if I am 

surfing and someone says what are you doing I'd have to say Im surfing you 

kook. 

Obvious questions with obvious answers are...well you guys tell me. Marin 

>After all the readings and reviewing the way the brain works to understand 

>things from Bruer and reading Sagan, I came to my own conclusion. There is 

no 

>such thing as stupid questions, just stupid answers or stupid people that 

>don't apply themselves enough to really critically think before asking the 

>question. I think many questions would not be asked if people applied 

>themselves and really thought about the question before they asked it. 

> 

>Sagan writes," Most AMerican children aren't stupid. Part of the reason they 

>don't study hard is that they recieve few tangible benefits when they do." 

>He brings up a good point, I often think to myself " what is the point of 

>studying or reading this useless information if I am not going to be using it 

>in my lifetime?" However, I will think more critically and realize that not 

>all things a person studies must be immediately tangible to life, you never 

>know when trivial knowledge will be there to help you later on. 

> 

>As the discussions have compared American children to those of other 

>countries, I also think American children are lazy when it comes to studying 

>or looking for information outside of there assignments because they have no 

>pride in what they are learning. Why don't they have the pride? Because 

their 

>teachers do not have pride in what they are teaching, how could you when you 

>are forced to teach to tests and specific guidlines "they" call standards. 

In 

>the Japanese schools they clean their own school, take off their shoes when 

>entering, make their own food. All of that works for a larger common goal 

and 

>everyone must have some sort of pride in their school and themselves to 

obtain 

>the goal. 

> 

1692


>I think this is directly related to this semester. Think about how often we 

>ask ourselves "Why are we learning this?" Ha, we are in college to become 

>better thinkers, more well rounded individuals, and know things beyond are 

>specific field of study. If we don't learn and internalize what we are 

>learning then we are ignorant, we are going to be teaching this to our 

>students? I don't think so! 

> 

>Maybe when they learn all the Genome sequences and are able to create perfect 

>people, we won't have to have these discussions becuase we will be 

predisposed 

>to intelligence and obtaining knowledge. 

>-Thanks for reading if you got this far, 

>Chula 

1693





Subject: RE: No such thing as stupid questions, just stupid people 

considering the person asking knows what surfing is... 

;) 

--- tinne002 wrote: 

> Is there really no such thing as a stupid quesiton? 

> I would think not but I 

> have been told 

> differently. I used to have a kung fu instructor who 

> would say, "there is no 

> such thing as 

> studpid questions, if you don't ask quesitons then 

> how will you ever deeply 

> learn about 

> anything". Well about five minutes later I asked 

> him a curious quesiton about 

> a joint lock 

> we were doing and he laughed at me, rolled his eyes 

> and walked away. He never 

> answered my question. I still think about how ironic 

> it is that he was 

> encouraging us, out 

> of the blue, to ask questions and not even a minute 

> later he shot me down. I 

> am friends 

> with this guy and he can be a prick but it just 

> kills me that people say one 

> thing and do 

> another. Just a old remeberance that fit with the 

> readings. Now I am going to 

> sit and think 

> if there is such thing as stupid quesiton. I have a 

> feeling there might be. 

> Example, if I am 

> surfing and someone says what are you doing I'd have 

> to say Im surfing you 

> kook. 

> Obvious questions with obvious answers are...well 

> you guys tell me. Marin 

> 

> 

> 

> >After all the readings and reviewing the way the 

> brain works to understand 

> >things from Bruer and reading Sagan, I came to my 

> own conclusion. There is 

> no 

> >such thing as stupid questions, just stupid answers 

> or stupid people that 

> >don't apply themselves enough to really critically 

> think before asking the 

> >question. I think many questions would not be 

> asked if people applied 

> >themselves and really thought about the question 

> before they asked it. 

> > 

> >Sagan writes," Most AMerican children aren't 

1694

stupid. Part of the reason they 

> >don't study hard is that they recieve few tangible 

> benefits when they do." 

> >He brings up a good point, I often think to myself 

> " what is the point of 

> >studying or reading this useless information if I 

> am not going to be using it 

> >in my lifetime?" However, I will think more 

> critically and realize that not 

> >all things a person studies must be immediately 

> tangible to life, you never 

> >know when trivial knowledge will be there to help 

> you later on. 

> > 

> >As the discussions have compared American children 

> to those of other 

> >countries, I also think American children are lazy 

> when it comes to studying 

> >or looking for information outside of there 

> assignments because they have no 

> >pride in what they are learning. Why don't they 

> have the pride? Because 

> their 

> >teachers do not have pride in what they are 

> teaching, how could you when you 

> >are forced to teach to tests and specific guidlines 

> "they" call standards. 

> In 

> >the Japanese schools they clean their own school, 

> take off their shoes when 

> >entering, make their own food. All of that works 

> for a larger common goal 

> and 

> >everyone must have some sort of pride in their 

> school and themselves to 

> obtain 

> >the goal. 

> > 

> >One of my favorite lines that Sagan wrote was 

> "igonorance feed on ignorance." 

> >I think this is directly related to this semester. 

> Think about how often we 

> >ask ourselves "Why are we learning this?" Ha, we 

> are in college to become 

> >better thinkers, more well rounded individuals, and 

> know things beyond are 

> >specific field of study. If we don't learn and 

> internalize what we are 

> >learning then we are ignorant, we are going to be 

> teaching this to our 

> >students? I don't think so! 

> > 

> >Maybe when they learn all the Genome sequences and 

> are able to create perfect 

> >people, we won't have to have these discussions 

> becuase we will be 

> predisposed 

> >to intelligence and obtaining knowledge. 

> >-Thanks for reading if you got this far, 

> >Chula 

> 

__________________________________ 


Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway 

1695

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1696





Subject: Racing the Indy 500 in a Geo Metro...Journal 10 

A common theme that I find when I observe in 

different classrooms and when I was a teacher’s aide 

is that most teachers feel that there is a lack of 

time to cover all the material that they are required 

to and that students do not have enough time to 

practice what they are taught. Even the most well 

organized teachers that I have had the opportunity to 

work with or observe seem to face a continuous 

struggle with the lack of time in the school day/year. 

Like swimming upstream in a river, they struggle to 

help as many of their students achieve as possible. 

That desire to help students should be in the heart of 

every teacher, but will it always be enough, or do we 

need to start considering the role of the current 

structure of the educational system and possible ways 

to modify it? 

In recent postings that have been comparing American 

school systems with other cultures, it seems that the 

American school system places tremendous pressure on 

students to learn large quantities of 

compartmentalized information, which, in turn, becomes 

a burden on the teachers who are becoming responsible 

and accountable for more and more as the student 

populations become more diverse and classrooms more 

crowded. However, new techniques and methods are in 

place in teacher training programs to adapt to and 

prepare new teachers for the changing student 

populations and address the diverse student needs in 

the classrooms of today. But why then do so many 

educators in the k-8 educational system continue to 

feel pushed to their ends and so many schools rate as 

under-performing? 

Teaching has never been an easy job, but developments 

in technology and greater understanding of how the 

mind works and how people learn are helping guide 

educators to be more efficient in their practice. 

Despite all we know about how children learn though, 

the majority of this information is only squeezed, 

molded, and “imbedded” into teaching practices rather 

than regarded as a platform for designing effective 

teaching practices. Furthermore, the current 

educational structure is based from a design many 

generations old and lacks any background knowledge and 

data that we now have regarding the way children 

learn, therefore making it seem outdated. 

We must also consider how society has changed in 

relation to education. Granted, most social 

institutions make intrinsic adaptations to progress 

and new developments in technology and advancements in 

understanding of the human mind, but many times these 

adaptations can become crutches, simply keeping the 

institution up with the pace of change but ultimately 

put a cap on potential for growth. The educational 

system is much like an overgrown forest that is 

suffocating with overgrowth and long overdue for an 

underbrush fire; eventually a great burn will come 

1697

through, cleaning out the old growth, nourishing and 

making space for new beginnings from the remains of 

the old growth. The education system needs a deep 

cleaning to make room for new beginnings and ways of 

operating that are based from the knowledge gained by 

cognitive psychologists and other scientists on how 

the human mind develops and children learn. 

Although I am by no means an expert in any given 

field, I have an idea based on observations and the 

readings in Bruer, as well as much of the material 

covered throughout the ICP regarding how children 

learn. A common thread in the theories of how 

children learn and acquire knowledge is that the, 

“…acquisition of new knowledge depends in predictable 

ways upon the interaction of existing knowledge, 

encoding processes, and the instructional 

environment”(Bruer 49). This has been reinforced in 

all of the methods courses taken thus far in the ICP, 

that as teachers we will want to tap into the prior 

knowledge that our students have, and teach them to 

access it on their own. Where the learning comes into 

play is when children’s current theories are somehow 

challenged and they are forced to apply what they know 

in order to come up with new ores or gain more 

deepened understanding of what they already know. It 

is through this process, along with some explicit 

instruction, that most children learn, not neglecting 

the complexities of psychology, special learners, life 

circumstances, and the many other factors of the human 

experience that add layers to this complex theory of 

acquisition. 

Consider the types of activities and teaching 

practices that teachers are taught to use in order to 

foster these types of learning environments: group 

work, the learning cycle, addressing multiple 

intelligences, application of new knowledge and 

practice, performance based assessment, reflective 

processes, making connections, building background 

knowledge, etc. The list goes on and on, we are all 

aware of these things. But how do they fit into the 

average school day in the current system, which is a 

broken-up, non-stop, scheduled rush through the day? 

How do we cover those 130 or so big ideas in a less 

than nine-month timeframe with less than five hours of 

“instructional” time a day? Maybe we need to 

consider things such as longer school days, year-round 

schedules, looping classes (for consistency), and a 

learning environment that fosters inquiry, multiple 

opportunities for practice, opportunities for 

real-life applications, performance based assessment, 

and use of multiple intelligences by creating an 

educational system with sufficient time to do these 

things. 

Granted there are many more issues relating to this 

idea, as change in any infrastructure is a massive 

undertaking requiring time, money, and agreement 

between people in positions of power. These are rare 

commodities in today’s society and change is rarely 

ever welcomed in well-established institutions such as 

education. Furthermore, there are the incredibly 

dynamic social issues that come with making decisions 

regarding public institutions and the process of 

creating change usually requires democratic voting 

processes. Despite these significant and daunting 

dilemmas, it is interesting to analyze what we are 

learning now about how children learn and how all of 

1698

that data fits into the existing school systems that 

we are going to enter as teachers. It seems that 

being a teacher these days is like racing the Indy 500 

in a Geo Metro. 

Thanks for reading if you have made it to this point, 

apologies for the scattered, spring-break mentality of 

this one. Must stop writing, brain hurts…Michael 

__________________________________ 




1699





Subject: Journal-many thoughts 

So I've waded through all my emails from the week and found many interesting 

thoughts and ideas. Where to begin... First off let say that i'm not 

attacking anyone here just correlating some of my thoughts with this 

listserve. This is not intended to offend anyone!!!! I guess i'll start with 

the back and forth with cynthia and ann. As i sat and read through the 

emails between the two I realized how this situation could possibly happen 

to us in our classroom and schools. We as teachers could find ourselves in 

an ongoing battle with parents, faculty, and/or administrators for various 

reasons. I think in this situation as frustrating as it was for ann and 

perhaps cynthia these two had it easy. It was an ongoing situation in our 

list serve where they were able to convey their thoughts and ideas without 

facing on another. As teachers we will have to face parents, faculty and 

administrators face to face. I think it was easy for cynthia and ann to say 

what they were thinking on the list serve because it was easy and 

convenient. Do you think as teachers, it will be as easy for us to convey 

our strong beliefs, thoughts and ideas to parents, faculty and 

administrators in a situation? I would like to think that I would stand 

strong and hold tight to my belief if a situation ever occured with me. I 

have seen one situation in a school where two teachers disliked each other 

and avoided one another at all costs. Sense or nonsense? On the other side, 

I recently sat and talked with a professor and she stood up for her beliefs 

when they were tested and as a result of standing up for what she believes 

in, she found herself in a lot of trouble with the district and principal. 

When i asked her if she would do it again, she said "definitely!" even after 

the overwhelming amount of stress physically and emotionally that she had 

endured. I applaud her for standing up for what she believes in. With this 

all said and done, I saw ann trying to compromise with cynthia to satisfy 

both of them. As a teacher, is compromise an easy medium or is it not 

possible to compromise your beliefs? 

Another thought to comment on... the grass is always greener on the other 

side. I don't necessarily think that the grass is greener on the other side 

but there just might be more opportunities that could lead to something 

better than what you have at that given moment. I will use Karis idea of how 

a parent might think there is a better teacher than you. Given these 

circumstances, I look at it like this: a parent might see another teacher 

not necessarily as the grass is greener on the other side, but an easier 

obstacle for his/her child. That is another teacher might be able to connect 

with this student in a way that you could not. This does not mean your a bad 

teacher. (Yes i do believe there are some teachers who are bad teachers, and 

in this case yeah get your child to a better teacher!) But know that you 

gave it your all and something wasn't there. So, this child might succeed 

with another teacher but his/her education isn't done yet. He/she still has 

other mountains to climb and to say that the grass is greener on the other 

side just by changing teachers is not merely the case. There will alway be 

down falls in the teaching profession, but we must not look at them as being 

greener on the other side. Sense or nonsense? 

Okay my other thought.... to comment on what karla had to say about 

teachers and class test scores. Yes physics has been very challenging this 

semester I think for many of us. I can honestly say I hate it! I hope i will 

never have to teach it. However, despite my loathe of physics and my 

horrible midterm grade I can say that I think half of it is me and the other 

half is the teacher. I know I studied as much as I could, but obviously 

something didn't stick. So to place blame completely on a teacher I think 

isn't right. This is a difficult subject to grasp and especially if this is 

1700

the first time you've been exposed to this subject. With that, I think that 

this is something that we need to work harder at and work more with the 

teacher, and vise versa. Something we are not necessarily use to doing. 

Furthermore, I think this also shows that yes perhaps this style of teaching 

isn't working with us, but with some modifications, a lot of time and effort 

that we can conquer through this. And... I think this goes to show that this 

is a subject that you can not fly through (for most of us any way). So, in 

the teaching world I think if this ever happens to us that we need not say 

that we are horrible teachers, but that we need to do something differently. 

There could many factors for why our students might not of done so well. 

Perhaps it was our teaching style, difficult concepts, time, etc. Whatever 

the case is, re assess whats gone on, make appropriate changes and move 

forward. Make sense? 

Okay I think i lost a couple of brain cells with this one. So I think its 

time to call it quits. 

Chow! 

_________________________________________________________________ 

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1701





Subject: where is it? 

okay I posted a journal and its not showing up? Grrrrr!!!! 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with MSN 

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1702



Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 7:50 AM 


Subject: Education in America 

We have learned time and time again about pit falls of education in low 

socioeconomic areas in America. Both, Sagan and Bruer give statistics 

backing this up in the readings this week. I personally have seen the 

differences of literacy in kids of the same age from different socioeconomic 

area. Most of the schools I have worked in have been low socioeconomic 

schools. During the same time I have taught Sunday school, for kids who a 

majority of them come from high socioeconomic areas. The difference in 

literacy is overwhelming. I wonder a lot about the future of these kids. 

The kids I have in Sunday school are primed for success. They have been 

given all the tools necessary for a successful future. When looking at the 

kids from lower socioeconomic status I as a future teacher have trouble 

seeing a bright future for them. These kids start off lacking so much. 

Their futures are bleak. How do these kids see their future? They know 

they don’t have the tools that some of their peers do. Do their hopes of 

success lie in an education? Do they forget about education and rely on 

what will be a realistic chance at success (sports, music, drugs, 

prostitution, etc…)? To me it seems that our society glorifies the get rich 

quick method of success. We spend our time engrossed in the lives of famous 

people. We glorify them making them hierarchy in our society. Are any of 

these people successful do to their education? It is funny how we glorify 

and strive to be these people. Money and power have become our goal, not 

education. It was refreshing to read Sagan this week and see that education 

is the true path to freedom. Our society tells us that we need to go to 

college and get an education when our society honors those who don’t. Kids 

of low socioeconomic status strive to be part of this elitist group, and 

when they don’t what do they have to fall back on? 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 


Premium! 


1703





Subject: RE: where is it? 

Keep trying, the same thing happened to me. 

>From: "Carrie Gilardone" 



>Subject: where is it? 

>Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2004 23:17:43 -0700 

> 

>okay I posted a journal and its not showing up? Grrrrr!!!! 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with MSN 

>Premium! 

>http://join.msn.com/?page=features/mlb&pgmarket=en-us/go/onm00200439ave/direct/01/ 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

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1704





Subject: Re: where is it? 

Joey..your came through three times and Carrie I believe that your came through a couple of days 

ago. Casey 

1705






>After reading Judith journal and the responses that it got I decided to 

express my feelings about the whole thing. I totally agree with Judith that 

people are more worried about their grade then what they are learning. Me 

personally I am not that worried about my grades because if I do my best and 

work hard there is not much more you can do. I feel that I have a layed back 

style about doing the work although some people feel that I am always working 

on something the day before its due which is not true. I learned this semester 

from calling you guys to get help on something that you to are doing the same 

thing. I guess I am a little bitter that people in the class catagorize me 

that I am a slacker when you guys are in the same boat as me or sometimes 

deeper the day before something is due. I feel what Jennifer said "just roll 

with the punches" is a good way to get through these classes just do you best 

because really thats all you can do. If you stress yourself out about one 

grade then you missing a lot of important information that you should be 

learning. I also feel that all of these teaching courses need to have more 

hands on things to help us understand what excatly is going on and what we are 

suppose to do in the classroom. I know this is college and we should be pushed 

to get good grades and learn at the same time but most of time this things do 

no go hand and hand the good grades take away from the information you should 

learn because of stress. 

Thank you for your time 

Jonathan 

1706





Subject: Stress 

Stress can be a good thing and it can motivate you to learn more because you have no other choice. 

The fact is some people do not have the drive to learn for no reason at all. There has to be a prize 

and one can say that the grade is that prize. having a laid back personality can be good if you don't 

care about what you are doing, but in my opinion it does not work when you actually have a passion 

for something. If you have a passion about something you almost have to have a little stress when it 

comes to achieving the goals you have a passion for. I know that I don't want my children to be taught 

by someone who just does the bare minimum or does nothing at all because they want to not stress 

out. Think about what you could be gaining by putting your all into these classes, and I guarantee that 

it will be more than we are getting now. The fact is we have time constraints, so we pick and choose. 

It seems that some of us choose not to get stressed out, but what could we be missing do to this laid 

back way of learning? Do we want our future students to just chill and not stress about a test the next 

day. I don't know? 

this gets me a little stressed. http://graphics.hotmail.com/i.p.emdgust.gif 

love, 

robert 

>From: griff030 


>To: 


>Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 09:25:33 -0700 

> 

> >After reading Judith journal and the responses that it got I decided to 

>express my feelings about the whole thing. I totally agree with Judith that 

>people are more worried about their grade then what they are learning. Me 

>personally I am not that worried about my grades because if I do my best and 

>work hard there is not much more you can do. I feel that I have a layed back 

>style about doing the work although some people feel that I am always working 

>on something the day before its due which is not true. I learned this semester 

>from calling you guys to get help on something that you to are doing the same 

>thing. I guess I am a little bitter that people in the class catagorize me 

>that I am a slacker when you guys are in the same boat as me or sometimes 

>deeper the day before something is due. I feel what Jennifer said "just roll 

>with the punches" is a good way to get through these classes just do you best 

>because really thats all you can do. If you stress yourself out about one 

>grade then you missing a lot of important information that you should be 

>learning. I also feel that all of these teaching courses need to have more 

>hands on things to help us understand what excatly is going on and what we are 

>suppose to do in the classroom. I know this is college and we should be pushed 

>to get good grades and learn at the same time but most of time this things do 

>no go hand and hand the good grades take away from the information you should 

>learn because of stress. 

1707

>Thank you for your time 

>Jonathan 

> 

> 

_____ 

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1708


From: Cynthia Alice [capw77@yahoo.com] 


To: Kristina Aguinaldo; Cohort B 

Subject: Re: hello 

Kristina, 

Congrats to you and your family, that's great news. I am enjoying my spring break as well. I am 

subbing in the San Marcos School District. I was asked to teach intersession at Carrillo Elementary, 

I've been subbing there the most. It was very exciting to plan my own day. I enjoy having such a 

flexible schedule. It is getting closer to the wedding day, Sept. 18, so I have been a little busy getting 

everything planned. I look forward to the honeymoon in Kauai. Hope to get together with everyone in 

May for our 1 year. Take care and enjoy you new home. 

Hello to everyone and hope all is well with you and yours. 

Love Cynthia 

Kristina Aguinaldo wrote: 

Hi Cohort B! I hope all are having a great spring. Just wanted to give you an update on me 

because I'd like to hear more about how things are for you all. Renato, Ryan and I just bought a 

house. It's in Mira Mesa and it's a really good starter place for us. And the second big news is that 

..... I'm Pregnant! I'm about 5 months along. The baby is due on Aug. 25th. We get to find out this 

week is it is a boy or a girl but I don't know if we're going to. We knew that Ryan was going to be a 

boy so maybe we'll be surprised for this one! Things are going well. We're all really excited. Ryan 

really wants a baby brother becuase he says that he only has boy toys. haha. I hope you all are 

well and I miss ya'll! have a great spring break! yay we're teachers so we actually get spring 

breaks! take care! 

- Kristina (Aguinaldo) Villena 

_____ 


_____ 



1709



Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 11:11 PM 



Well, Jonathan, at the risk of being burned at the stake with or without a trial, I think I will take issue 

with a few things in your post. 

You say that "we" think you are a slacker and that you do all your assignments the night before they 

are due, but that it isn't true. Then you say that "we" do the same thing. How can we do the same 

thing, if you aren't doing it to begin with? I know first hand you do many of your assignments last 

minute, because you call me. Did you ever think that maybe people tell you they are not done with 

their assignments because they don't want to do yours for you? I know I have. I work very hard and 

do not think it is fair for others to skate by on someone else's sweat. 

You state that you are aware that some classmates think you are a slacker. I will have to assume 

someone told you that, especially if you don't think there are any grounds for the classification. 

Some stress is to be expected, we have deadlines. That doesn't mean it is always bad. But 

procrastinating makes it more stressful. Each person is different and knows how they work best. It is 

the individual's responsibility to find what works for them, then to do it. Stressing out does not mean 

you aren't learning, unless of course, you aren't doing anything to learn to begin with. 

Sorry if this is harsh, but you put yourself out there. 

Cynthia 


>After reading Judith journal and the responses that it got I decided to 

express my feelings about the whole thing. I totally agree with Judith that 

people are more worried about their grade then what they are learning. Me 

personally I am not that worried about my grades because if I do my best and 

work hard there is not much more you can do. I feel that I have a layed back 


on something the day before its due which is not true. I learned this semester 

from calling you guys to get help on something that you to are doing the same 

thing. I guess I am a little bitter that people in the class catagorize me 

that I am a slacker when you guys are in the same boat as me or sometimes 

deeper the day before something is due. I feel what Jennifer said "just roll 

with the punches" is a good way to get through these classes just do you best 

because really thats all you can do. If you stress yourself out about one 

grade then you missing a lot of important information that you should be 

learning. I also feel that all of these teaching courses need to have more 

hands on things to help us understand what excatly is going on and what we are 

suppose to do in the classroom. I know this is college and we should be pushed 

to get good grades and learn at the same time but most of time this things do 

no go hand and hand the good grades take away from the information you should 

learn because of stress. 

Thank you for your time 

Jonathan 

1710

_____ 



1711



Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2004 12:27 AM 


Subject: Re: Education in America 

This was one of Sagan's best chapters. It it overwhelming sometimes to think about the students who 

need to be reached most. For those of us on the outside, it is hard to imagine that their data points 

seem realistic to them, but that is all they know. Most kids from educated families will succeed 

because of what they observe around them. But the ones coming from uneducated families don't 

always get to see the other world out there. This makes it hard for teachers to convince them that 

learning is a good thing, that working hard for something is a good thing. From the time my kids were 

toddlers, I would take them to as many places as I could, like the science museum, the mountains 

and the deserts. I took them to children's plays, to ride the old steam engine train, anything I could 

think of. We went camping all the time, I taught them to fish, we golfed, did Tae Kwon Do and other 

things as a family. Then of course there was girl scouts and cub scouts, and going away to camp. All 

of these things gave them experiences that helped them when it came to learning. 

Unfortunately, there are a lot of kids who never get to experience these and other things. All of this 

builds background knowledge about how things work. I think so many people are trying so hard just to 

survive, they don't take time out to live. And this puts their kids at a disadvantage. But teachers can 

make a difference. They can bring as many experiences into the classroom as possible. Things like 

the museum exhibit loan programs where teachers can check out real animals or artifacts to use for 

lessons. 

While we won't be able to completely make up for the lack, we can at least make a dent in it, and 

hopefully reach more of these children. 

Cynthia 


We have learned time and time again about pit falls of education in low 

socioeconomic areas in America. Both, Sagan and Bruer give statistics 

backing this up in the readings this week. I personally have seen the 

differences of literacy in kids of the same age from different socioeconomic 

area. Most of the schools I have worked in have been low socioeconomic 

schools. During the same time I have taught Sunday school, for kids who a 

majority of them come from high socioeconomic areas. The difference in 

literacy is overwhelming. I wonder a lot about the future of these kids. 

The kids I have in Sunday school are primed for success. They have been 

given all the tools necessary for a successful future. When looking at the 

kids from lower socioeconomic status I as a future teacher have trouble 

seeing a bright future for them. These kids star t off lacking so much. 

Their futures are bleak. How do these kids see their future? They know 

they don’t have the tools that some of their peers do. Do their hopes of 

success lie in an education? Do they forget about education and rely on 

what will be a realistic chance at success (sports, music, drugs, 

prostitution, etc…)? To me it seems that our society glorifies the get rich 

quick method of success. We spend our time engrossed in the lives of famous 

people. We glorify them making them hierarchy in our society. Are any of 

these people successful do to their education? It is funny how we glorify 

and strive to be these people. Money and power have become our goal, not 

education. It was refreshing to read Sagan this week and see that education 

1712

is the true path to freedom. Our society tells us that we need to go to 

college and get an education when our society honors those who don’t. Kids 

of low socioeconomic status strive to be pa rt of this elitist group, and 

when they don’t what do they have to fall back on? 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 


Premium! 


_____ 



1713





Subject: something good to think about ;o) 

Hi everyone, 

I came across this quote that sounded good. I thought I would pass it along. 

People who matter are most aware that everyone else does, too. 

- Malcolm Forbes 


_____ 



1714





Subject: Re: No such thing as stupid questions, just stupid people 

Hey Chula, 

I hear what you are saying. But I just wonder if some of the kids in America are not lazy but instead 

they are never taught how to study, or how to really read for contents, etc. They are not 

taught successful self-management and study skills. Maybe their parents were never taught these 

skills either, and so the parents think their kids are learning everything in school, while their teachers 

are thinking they are learning these things at home? 

We have had several Japanese students come and live with us within the past 2-3 years and I find it 

very interesting to hear different views about America. In setting these students up in the English 

school at Palomar College, I have talked with the older Japanese women about Japanese Education 

compared with American Education. In Japans attempt to model America to try and become as 

powerful as we are seen, we are actually a bad influence on their youth. They are infarct becoming 

more like Americans which is altering the younger generations views a bit. These older Japanese 

women have commented negatively how they younger generations are changing from what they used 

to be. 

I have heard that if you want to be successful, model someone who is already successful. Do what 

they do and you too will be successful. Japan has tried to model us.....why don't we model Japan 

(education wise)? 

Just my train of thought..... 

Ann 


After all the readings and reviewing the way the brain works to understand 

things from Bruer and reading Sagan, I came to my own conclusion. There is no 

such thing as stupid questions, just stupid answers or stupid people that 

don't apply themselves enough to really critically think before asking the 

question. I think many questions would not be asked if people applied 

themselves and really thought about the question before they asked it. 

Sagan writes," Most AMerican children aren't stupid. Part of the reason they 

don't study hard is that they recieve few tangible benefits when they do." 

He brings up a good point, I often think to myself " what is the point of 

studying or reading this useless information if I am not going to be using it 

in my lifetime?" However, I will think more critically and realize that not 

all things a person studies must be immediately tangible to life, you never 

know when trivial knowledge will be there to help you later on. 

As the discussions have compared American children to those of other 

countries, I also think American children are lazy when it comes to studying 

or looking for information outside of there assignments because they have no 

1715

pride in what they are learning. Why don't they have the pride? Because their 

teachers do not have pride in what they are teaching, how could you when you 

are forced to teach to tests and specific guidlines "they" call standards. In 

the Japanese schools they clean their own school, take off their shoes when 

entering, make their own food. All of that works for a larger common goal and 

everyone must have some sort of pride in their school and themselves to obtain 

the goal. 


I think this is directly related to this s emester. Think about how often we 

ask ourselves "Why are we learning this?" Ha, we are in college to become 

better thinkers, more well rounded individuals, and know things beyond are 

specific field of study. If we don't learn and internalize what we are 

learning then we are ignorant, we are going to be teaching this to our 

students? I don't think so! 

Maybe when they learn all the Genome sequences and are able to create perfect 

people, we won't have to have these discussions becuase we will be predisposed 

to intelligence and obtaining knowledge. 

-Thanks for reading if you got this far, 

Chula 

_____ 



1716





Subject: Women and Men.... Men and women 

I was thinking....... (Wow, imagine that!) 

Has anyone ever noticed how women and men interact? For example, how many times in one day 

will you hear phrases from women such as "excuse me", "oh, I'm sorry, "Pardon Me", "Oh, it's my 

fault", "No, go ahead"....... Why are women always apologizing (me included). Now, keep track of 

how many times in one day that you hear these same words come from the mouths of men to men 

interactions or men to women interactions? I am fascinated at how humans interact with one another. 

People seem to make males and females appear so different when in fact they are more similar than 

they are different. As a society we shape our gender roles to be one or the other. Yet, if not for the 

societal roles we force females and males into, they would not be so extreme. Our society is good 

at wanting to shove individuals into cookie cutter roles of either black or white, good or bad, proper or 

improper, male or female. I think it's a darn shame. 

For example, I was playing with my Nephew Jake who is going to be 4 years old in July. As we 

were building a "truck- arena" out of blocks for the cars and trucks and farm animals I have at our 

house for him to play with when he comes to visit, he farted. I thought this was very funny. So I said, 

"what was that?" He answered very matter fact, "That was my fart". So later on while we were still 

playing, I decided to fart too to see how he would react. He stopped playing and looked at me and 

said, "Girls don't fart!" I started to giggle and I said, "Yes they do..." "I'm a girl and I just farted!" He 

smiled with one of his little heart melting smiles, but he was still in awe that Aunt Ann farted too. Boy, 

does my young Nephew have a lot to learn, or should I say UNLEARN? 


_____ 



1717





Subject: Do we only learn what we are exposed to early in life..... or can we change? 

Yes, I was thinking some more..... 

I agree that parents, teachers etc. should expose their children to as many situations in life so that 

they will build their own background knowledge which in-turn will help them become better thinkers 

and better problem solvers in their futures. 

There are so many institutions, practices, parents etc. that only give their children a limited view of the 

world. I was watching the History Channel about the KKK and it gave me chills to see the hatred and 

narrow-mindedness of it's members. They were putting little hoods and infants and young toddlers 

and exposing them to this poisoned view of thinking. These poor little children are getting such a 

warped view of life and people. I think that there are many other institutions that do this as well, but 

not to this extreme on the surface, but can be just as damaging. Whether it's promoting male 

dominance, Christian/non-Christian, or whatever religion that claims they are Paramount (not just 

Christians). And this is not meant to offend any one in our cohort, but I really feel it is true when 

looked at historically speaking. If we can step back and look at things in a larger circle. Everyone 

thinks they are right and others a re wrong. I know I am not perfect, I am far from perfect. But I keep 

trying to learn. I learn stuff everyday. My sense of wonder is not lost. My sense of wonder is just as 

strong as it was when I was little. The only thing that has changed, is that in my pursuit for 

knowledge, I am too often saddened by the resistance I find. And when I think I can change things, 

my little tail wags and I think if people can really get a clearer picture of the way things really are, sure 

they will want to be good and treat others well. But, I guess I am naive in my excitement. Naive that 

people will see things differently because they have been sheltered in their own little worlds and they 

have learned from their own limited experiences. So exposure to life and life's experiences can be 

extended into many areas to help promote a well rounded adult. 

Would you believe that I was not allowed to watch Sesame Street, the Jefferson's, Fat Albert..., or 

any show that had black people in it or any other mixing of the races. I didn't get to be in the girl 

scouts or anything that was viewed as mixing the races. There was an extreme cleavage between 

what was a males role and what was a females role in my family. I think my sister and I were little 

feminists before we even knew what this meant. I remeber crying with welts on my back from the 

dreaded belt as I stood next to the sink on my little step stool while being up to my elbows in dirty 

dishes and sudsy dishwater. I remember I used to think "feminist was a bad word because I would 

always hear in in the context of "Those Damn Feminists!!!" I didn't really realize how bad of a word 

"Bitch" was until in the 2nd grade I called a fellow classmate a "Bitch" and when he went and told the t 

eacher, I called her a "Bitch" too. My sister and I were often refered to as the "Kitchen Bitches"..... 

Hmmmm and to this day, I hate doing dishes. Every Thanksgivings I get very frustrated that the men 

go off and turn on the t.v. and visit while they pat their big bellies and pick the meat from between 

their teeth; and the women who not only toiled over a hot stove and oven to fix the meal, now left to 

clean up..... Not on my watch. I try to suggest ideas like... o.k. everyone grab a partner and each 

team can clean up for ten minutes..... 1, 2, 3... go. It seems fair to me....... why aren't they game? 

By limiting my exposure to television and organizations, I missed out on all of those 

important learning years when my brain was like a sponge. I am living proof that children can come 

out of narrow minded households and be a totally opposite of what was trying to be taught. And then 

grow up and try to teach some of the family members that there narrow minded views are not true..... 

I am living proof that those children who some might think will never go to college, can go to college. 

1718

I am living proof that those quiet little faces that never speak up in class can actually have a lot to 

say.......Don't short change anyone...... Believe in everyone.... Give everyone a chance to give it 

their best shot..... Even though I may get my feelings hurt from time to time, I am still going to 

continue on my quest for equality. Maybe that is one of the reasons I want to be a teacher, so that I 

can start at a much younger age to teach these valuable lessons in life (in addition to science and 

math.... etc.)!!!!!! 


_____ 



1719




To: journal 

Subject: Short response CSET topic (jenny) 

Jenny, about the CSET topic you mentioned yesterday: Can you believe it is a 4th grade 

standard? Here is the problem: I didn't learn about this at all in any of my college courses. I 

have taken 3 geography courses, but no geology. While it wouldn't be a problem for me to 

learn about it if I decide to teach it, I can't possibly study all the concepts in the standards in 

order to pass the CSET. 

Earth Sciences (4th grade) 

4. The properties of rocks and minerals reflect the processes that formed them. 

a. how to differentiate among igneous, sedimentary, and metamorphic rocks by their properties and 

methods of formation (the rock cycle). 

b. how to identify common rock-forming minerals (including quartz, calcite, feldspar, mica, and 

hornblende) and ore minerals using a table of diagnostic properties. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



1720




To: journal 

Subject: scaffolding and the standards 

I have been doing some standards research for my group's capstone unit. I noticed that there is 

scaffolding built into the standards. We are working with the concept of sound. Beginning in second 

grade, this concept is introduced. It is also a 3rd grade standard, a 6th grade standard and 9-12 

standard. This is an example of how standards can be useful. If the elementary teachers don't use the 

standards, what happens when students get to 6th grade, and worse, to 9-12 grades? They will 

probably not have the background knowledge to help them learn the more complex form of this 

concept. 

Another observation: As I was going through the standards, I noticed several related to the things we 

are learning in our physics class. And it starts in 2nd grade. Yes, at that level it is pretty basic, but it is 

laying the foundation for future grades. 

I think the standards need to be considered a tool that will prepare students to be successful in 

science and their education. 

Consider just the scientific method. This doesn't have to be limited for use exclusively during science 

lessons. Think about how it could be applied to the writing process, art and social studies. What if it 

was used as a main operating basis throughout the curriculum areas. Would our students become 

better thinkers? I think they might. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



1721



Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2004 12:08 PM 

To: journal 

Subject: Getting to know our classmates 

Yesterday, Laurie brought me a section of the Desert Post Weekly. She had been in Palm Springs, 

picked up a copy of the local rag, and ran across something she thought I might enjoy reading. First 

off, I was surprised that she even thought of me! Laurie and I have had occasional conversations, but 

I don't think we have really worked together on any projects, at least in quite awhile. What prompted 

her to think of me? I think it was this listserve. She made a connection between all the things I post 

and the paper she came across in Palm Springs. Anyway, I thought it was very cool, and I just 

finished reading the articles she gave me. So.........thank you Laurie! 

My second observation: 

I read the posts made by Ann today. As we all know, Ann and I lock horns in our posts. Well, I just 

want to say that her posts today gave me so much new insight into her views on life and education. 

And I can also see why she may take things I say personally. This may not change my opinions on 

things, but it does help me to look at things from her perspective. So.....thank you for sharing too, 

Ann! 

Cynthia 

_____ 



1722





Subject: Re: Short response CSET topic (jenny) 

I hate that. It lists what they should know, not how or why or what it means. Typical. Thanks Cynthia 

for looking it up. I have 18 years of school to go back over before my May 15th CSET date. No stress. 

Ya right! 

Jenny 

1723





Subject: more questions than answers. 

Hey class, 

Just some food for thought, 

It seems that many of the people I have spoken with in the cohort are experiencing a great deal of 

time management disparities. How does one begin to better function within this world so engrossed in 

deadlines and punctuality? Is this actually a healthy way to live? The United States is a historically 

highly productive place, in which we believe that efficiency and development are number one. Is this 

a concept also placed within our classrooms? I guess this all goes back to scaffolding and automatic 

promotion. What is wrong with taking more time to learn a concept, if in the end you have a better 

understanding of it? Because in the end what is the point of education or learning? Now that is a big 

question! Not that I expect anybody to answer meanings you are all probably feverishly writing your 

theory papers. oh whatever. 

See ya tomorrow, 

Robert 

_____ 

Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar – FREE! 

1724





Subject: RE: Getting to know our classmates 

Cynthia, 

I'm glad to hear that you liked the articles I gave you. When the corner of my 

eye caught on the newspapers next to me while I was in Palm Springs, I decided 

to take a skim throught them. When I got to the section about themes that we 

have been talking about in class, I thought I should give them to you since 

you like learning about new stuff. Just think, this time someone else is 

giving you neat info to learn about. So I'm glad you enjoyed it! 

P.S. Wasn't that one about Bob Hope interesting?! 

Laurie :) 

1725





Subject: RE: Getting to know our classmates 

Yes, I liked the one about Bob. I have seen that house on tv, they did a tour of it, very cool. And the 

Yucca Man one was good to, seems those creatures are all over the place. Thanks again, Laurie. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

I'm glad to hear that you liked the articles I gave you. When the corner of my 

eye caught on the newspapers next to me while I was in Palm Springs, I decided 

to take a skim throught them. When I got to the section about themes that we 

have been talking about in class, I thought I should give them to you since 

you like learning about new stuff. Just think, this time someone else is 

giving you neat info to learn about. So I'm glad you enjoyed it! 

P.S. Wasn't that one about Bob Hope interesting?! 

Laurie :) 

_____ 



1726





Subject: Re: Short response CSET topic (jenny) 

Me too, but with many more years in between. By the way, what was the name of that frog we should 

know? LOL. I didn't check which standard that one is. 

Cynthia 


I hate that. It lists what they should know, not how or why or what it means. Typical. Thanks 

Cynthia for looking it up. I have 18 years of school to go back over before my May 15th CSET 

date. No stress. Ya right! 

Jenny 

_____ 



1727





Subject: Re: more questions than answers. 

I think students should have the opportunity to learn the concepts before moving on. Here is my 

experience with this style of learning, which I didn't get to finish telling you about: 

Students are placed in classes according to a certain age span. They are pre-assessed for their 

academic skills and knowledge. Each student is required to learn a specified list of concepts, be at a 

certain reading level and math level to move on. They don't move on until they can prove they know 

what they are supposed to know. This also includes a PE test, yes they have to pass physical 

requirements, unless there is a reason they can't (like a disablilty). They work on a course until they 

know the info, then go to the exam room and get tested. The test is part written, part oral, part 

drawings and part demonstration. They must get 85% to pass. If not, they restudy the section they 

didn't get, or if the misunderstandings are more general, they redo the course. The teacher does not 

administer the tests, the teachers do not know what is on the tests. The teacher is also held partially 

responsible if a student flunks the test. In the case of a student coming in with lower s kills lacking, 

they add lower level courses to their program that they do first, so they have the background info they 

need (a type of scaffolding). Students can finish earlier than targeted or later, the bottom line is they 

get the knowledge. Throughout each course, they have to pass certain demonstations etc, by getting 

checked by the teacher, so the teacher can keep tabs on how things are going. If students lag, they 

will have a conference with them to see what is going on. Every class in the school is run this way. 

For reading, those below grade level have to read more, novel concept, huh? The have weekly 

reading targets to meet. Each book has a point value. Students actually read 1 hour per day, that is 

real reading time. Math is taught seminar style, with manipulatives and students are placed according 

to ability level, not age. Once they reach 6th grade, they do self study math and can catch up if they 

are behind for their age. 

So now the question: Would this be possible in public schools? Possible yes, likely, No! This would be 

real school reform, and I think there would be too much resistance to it. Does it work? Yes, it does. 

We had many students who the public school either wanted to get rid of, or wanted to put on drugs 

that came to this school. And these students do very well. They don't have to just sit at their desks. 

Depending on the course they are doing, have to do experiments, build things etc. The biggest 

problem with this style of classroom is that the class size can't be too big. Which of course would cost 

money. So, I will just keep dreaming that this could be duplicated in the public schools. 

Cynthia 


Hey class, 

Just some food for thought, 

It seems that many of the people I have spoken with in the cohort are experiencing a great deal of 

time management disparities. How does one begin to better function within this world so 

engrossed in deadlines and punctuality? Is this actually a healthy way to live? The United States is 

a historically highly productive place, in which we believe that efficiency and development are 

number one. Is this a concept also placed within our classrooms? I guess this all goes back to 

scaffolding and automatic promotion. What is wrong with taking more time to learn a concept, if in 

the end you have a better understanding of it? Because in the end what is the point of education 

or learning? Now that is a big question! Not that I expect anybody to answer meanings you are all 

1728

probably feverishly writing your theory papers. oh whatever. 

See ya tomorrow, 

Robert 

_____ 


_____ 



1729







reply (1 KB) 

robert the good news is, i have written my paper already so i can answer you, 

but im not even sure i know the question. the one thing i do know is there just isnt 

enough time for everything. my life is consumed with making lists. i write a list, corss 

one thing off and add another. as soon as i think i get a free moment i remember a 

thousand other things to do. like this CSET talk, i have to study for the CSET and the 

RICA, but when can i do it? the point is, i kinda cant, atleast not right now. i 

probably could when school is out, but no i cant do it then either because i have to take 

two summer school classes in order to graduate. i haev not answered anything youve said, 

and im sorry for that, i guess i just needed to vent and whine a little. not that we dont 

all do that already anyways. i gotta go figure out physics, see you tomorrow. 

> 


> Date: 2004/04/06 Tue PM 06:38:33 PDT 


> Subject: more questions than answers. 

> 

> 


1730






To me, this week's readings seemed to be the best reading that we've done so 

far for this class. 

Sagan had some good chapters to read this week. 

Yes, it was sad to hear about how iliterate was and still is today. 

Reasons brought up in the reading telling why kids are still iliterate was 

because there is no motivation at home or among your family/friends to read, 

no nourishment from food (malnutrition), and education was uinavailable. As I 

was thinking of these reasons, I was picturing what I would do as a teacher 

someday. I guess I could provide some time after school to have students read 

to each other or to me, so that they could find someone to motivate them. And 

if they would come, I would bring some food with me as an assentive for them 

to come eat and enjoy reading. I guess I would do anything in my will power to 

help these kids learn how to read. 

Sagan's other reading about how science is getting less and less importance in 

media was true. I think by taking a sport and teaching science from it would 

be neat in the classroom, but I think it would be boring to everyday people 

watching it on TV. Think about it. You're watching a basketball game and every 

now and then there's a news flash of showing how Shaq's KE was decreasing and 

PE was increasing as he was going up to dunk the ball into the basketball net, 

and then as he let go off the rim the visa versa happened. I think a lot of 

people would look for other sports channels that would have the new flashes 

popping up during the game. 

My point is, we can integrate science in many different subjet areas in the 

classroom, but when you start during that out into the media of our society I 

believe you are wasting your time. Don't get me wrong, I love Start Trek and 

Star Wars, and Bill the Science Guy but they are all about appealing to what 

society wants and that is a scientific story motive with a suspense and good 

ending or a fast pace lesson on a science concept. 

----------------------------------------------------------------- 

In Bruer, explains about the expert vs. novice. Novices take longer to solve 

problems than experts, and make more mistakes. "Experts and novices work in 

very different problem spaces, and their different problem spaces prompt them 

to use different methods. Experts reason foward from givens to gaol; novices 

reason backward from goal to givens." 

Also instruction needs to make explicit connection between equations and the 

underlying conceptual structures. Therefore, when you teach a class about an 

equation and that they need to use it by solving math or physics problems, 

also show them how they could use it in everyday life. 

The Theory of Instruction: Using the Microworld was interesting. By using 

these goals: learning anchored by everyday experience, acitive problem 

solving=mastery of facts, info taken from classroom and transfer it to 

situations of everyday life, and lastly, instruction include group discussion 

at the end of a lesson. With these goals, a Thinkertool teacher can go through 

these "instructional phases: motivation, model evolution, formalization, and 

transfer". This reminded me a lot about the learning cycle that we learned in 

Ochanji's class. 

An interesting fact found in Bruer's readind said, "Results from cognitive 

research indicate that if we want more students to understand science the 

1731

instruction should start early in school, and that throughout the curriculum 

instruction should build on student's correct intuitions and prior 

understanding. We should try to teach experts' qualitative representations to 

students, and along with this content we should teach students how to reason 

scientifically." So pretty much teach science earlier in school, let students 

guess and check their ideas/answers freely, let students use their prior 

knowledge towards their learning, and guide the students to think more 

scientifically. 

Laurie :) 

1732





Subject: Re: scaffolding and the standards 

This kind of relates to what Bruer was saying, that children come with a lot of science knowledge just 

by watching the world around them. He says that we don't need to wait until junior high so that they 

can learn about such topic, he goes on to mention that we can challenge ourselves, "to understand 

children's theories and concepts and build effective instruction on them." This was very powerful 

because we can prepare them for what they are going to be facing in the upcoming school years 

rather than putting it off because we know that the subject matter will be covered in the future. 



To: journal 



I have been doing some standards research for my group's capstone unit. I noticed that there is 

scaffolding built into the standards. We are working with the concept of sound. Beginning in 

second grade, this concept is introduced. It is also a 3rd grade standard, a 6th grade standard and 

9-12 standard. This is an example of how standards can be useful. If the elementary teachers 

don't use the standards, what happens when students get to 6th grade, and worse, to 9-12 

grades? They will probably not have the background knowledge to help them learn the more 

complex form of this concept. 

Another observation: As I was going through the standards, I noticed several related to the things 

we are learning in our physics class. And it starts in 2nd grade. Yes, at that level it is pretty basic, 

but it is laying the foundation for future grades. 



Consider just the scientific method. This doesn't have to be limited for use exclusively during 

science lessons. Think about how it could be applied to the writing process, art and social 

studies. What if it was used as a main operating basis throughout the curriculum areas. Would our 

students become better thinkers? I think they might. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



1733





Subject: Re: scaffolding and the standards 

Correcto! And the more times they learn about something, especially if the difficulty increases a little 

each time, the better overall understanding they will have of the concept. I think some teachers don't 

think young students are capable of certain things, like the concept is too complex, but it can be made 

understandable, on a basic level and that gives them the background knowledge for later on. Cynthia 


This kind of relates to what Bruer was saying, that children come with a lot of science knowledge 

just by watching the world around them. He says that we don't need to wait until junior high so that 

they can learn about such topic, he goes on to mention that we can challenge ourselves, "to 

understand children's theories and concepts and build effective instruction on them." This was 

very powerful because we can prepare them for what they are going to be facing in the upcoming 

school years rather than putting it off because we know that the subject matter will be covered in 

the future. 

_____ 



To: journal 



I have been doing some standards research for my group's capstone unit. I noticed that there 

is scaffolding built into the standards. We are working with the concept of sound. Beginning in 

second grade, this concept is introduced. It is also a 3rd grade standard, a 6th grade standard 

and 9-12 standard. This is an example of how standards can be useful. If the elementary 

teachers don't use the standards, what happens when students get to 6th grade, and worse, to 

9-12 grades? They will probably not have the background knowledge to help them learn the 

more complex form of this concept. 

Another observation: As I was going through the standards, I noticed several related to the 

things we are learning in our physics class. And it starts in 2nd grade. Yes, at that level it is 

pretty basic, but it is laying the foundation for future grades. 



Consider just the scientific method. This doesn't have to be limited for use exclusively during 

science lessons. Think about how it could be applied to the writing process, art and social 

studies. What if it was used as a main operating basis throughout the curriculum areas. Would 

our students become better thinkers? I think they might. 

Cynthia 



1734

_____ 



1735





Subject: Re: Stress 


I have to say that stress is not a good thing for me, because I am getting tons of pimples 


B) 

. 


From: Robert Atchison 




Stress can be a good thing and it can motivate you to learn more because you have no other 

choice. The fact is some people do not have the drive to learn for no reason at all. There has to be 

a prize and one can say that the grade is that prize. having a laid back personality can be good if 

you don't care about what you are doing, but in my opinion it does not work when you actually 

have a passion for something. If you have a passion about something you almost have to have a 

little stress when it comes to achieving the goals you have a passion for. I know that I don't want 

my children to be taught by someone who just does the bare minimum or does nothing at all 

because they want to not stress out. Think about what you could be gaining by putting your all into 

these classes, and I guarantee that it will be more than we are getting now. The fact is we have 

time constraints, so we pick and choose. It seems that some of us choose not to get stressed out, 

but what could we be missing do to this laid back way of learning? Do we want our future students 

to just chill and not stress about a test the next day. I don't know? 


love, 

robert 



>To: 


>Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 09:25:33 -0700 

> 






1736
















> 


>Jonathan 

> 

> 

_____ 


1737





Subject: Re: Stress 

Can I recommend Stridex? LOL Pimples just me you are still young, which is a good thing. Cynthia 


I have to say that stress is not a good thing for me, because I am getting tons of pimplesOpenmouthed 

smiley emoticon. 






Stress can be a good thing and it can motivate you to learn more because you have no other 

choice. The fact is some people do not have the drive to learn for no reason at all. There has 

to be a prize and one can say that the grade is that prize. having a laid back personality can be 

good if you don't care about what you are doing, but in my opinion it does not work when you 

actually have a passion for something. If you have a passion about something you almost have 

to have a little stress when it comes to achieving the goals you have a passion for. I know that 

I don't want my children to be taught by someone who just does the bare minimum or does 

nothing at all because they want to not stress out. Think about what you could be gaining by 

putting your all into these classes, and I guarantee that it will be more than we are getting now. 

The fact is we have time constraints, so we pick and choose. It seems that some of us choose 

not to get stressed out, but what cou ld we be missing do to this laid back way of learning? Do 

we want our future students to just chill and not stress about a test the next day. I don't know? 


love, 

robert 



>To: 


>Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 09:25:33 -0700 

> 






>style about doing the work although some people feel that I am always working 

1738

_____ 

_____ 















> 


>Jonathan 

> 

> 




1739





Subject: Journal: Choices/Theory 

Yamashita wants to make sure we are aware of why we make the choices we do, 

rather than just doing things for the sake of doing them. I am well aware of 

why all my choices are made, and all those pertaining to CSUSM boil down to 

"what will make my life less miserable at any given moment." Also, I have a 

theory. Based on percentages, you don't have to do the capstone project to 

pass this class, more on that later, back to choices. I didn't read Bruer. 

Why not? Because at any given moment, I had the choice of reading Bruer and 

doing something else, and something else was ALWAYS more fun. So I am now 

presented with two options, hurriedly read a couple chapters from the book, 

write a paper pretending like those chapters were the ones that truly spoke 

to me, and assume that our professor won't know the difference. Or, 

understand from the start that he does know the difference, and not even 

bother to try and dupe him for a few points added to my grade. It's the 

whole deal of "what do I have to do to pass" vs. "what can I learn from 

this." Since I am uninterested, I already know I can't learn anything from 

this (my fault, but still true) so that leaves, what do I have to do to 

pass. I make a final check of the syllabus to make sure this paper isn't 

worth 80% of our grade or anything. This syllabus check yields some curious 

percentages. Journals are worth 45% of our grade, writing assignments are 

worth 45% of our grade, and the capstone is worth 25% of our grade. Hmm. So 

if we do all the journals, all the writing, and dont do the capstone at all, 

we get an A in Yamashita's class. This shows that this class is very 

accomodating to people of different learning styles. We get to choose the 

manner in which we get an A. I think I'll do the capstone, and skip a few 

journals and this writing assignment, which should still even out to around 

a 90%. (a breakdown of the writing assignments show that they add up to 50% 

by the way, not 45%). For anyone who is wondering, attendance is worth 

precisely 0% of your grade in this class. So it looks like we have a real 

choice of whether we want to attend or not. I will still attend, because 

maybe...MAYBE we will have another discussion about teaching in the real 

world. And when that day comes, I will know all the thousands of dollars my 

dad has spent on tuition and books will not have been in vain. 

-Mike Runnestrand, CHOOSING to go to bed because he has a THEORY that the 

more sleep he gets, the less likely he is to die ,and avoiding death is the 

ultimate goal. 

_________________________________________________________________ 


months! 


1740



Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2004 5:39 AM 


Subject: Curiosity 

Dear Class, 

Here is a good quote for the day.... 

Be curious always! For knowledge will not acquire you: you must acquire it. 

- Sudie Back 


_____ 



1741






Cynthia, 

You and I will change it. We just have to get there first and once we do, world watch out. Hey there 

might be some independent thinkers and problem solvers in every economic class. Now that spells 

TROUBLE for the ruling class. What America has a ruling class? On the six o'clock news, you will 

never see that. WHY? figure it out. I have to remember to solve the problem one step at a time and 

become an expert. You and I are gaining higher level thinking now, improving our metacognition and 

domain specific knowledge, so that we will become experts in our field. Damn...Bruer you need to get 

out of my head for a couple of days so that I can focus on passing the RICA next week. Or will 

knowing what Bruer says about learning help me pass the RICA? SENSE, NONsense, or craziness. 

See you in class. 




>Subject: Re: more questions than answers. 

>Date: Tue, 6 Apr 2004 20:27:03 -0700 (PDT) 

> 

>I think students should have the opportunity to learn the concepts before moving on. Here is my 

experience with this style of learning, which I didn't get to finish telling you about: 

>Students are placed in classes according to a certain age span. They are pre-assessed for their 

academic skills and knowledge. Each student is required to learn a specified list of concepts, be at a 

certain reading level and math level to move on. They don't move on until they can prove they know 

what they are supposed to know. This also includes a PE test, yes they have to pass physical 

requirements, unless there is a reason they can't (like a disablilty). They work on a course until they 

know the info, then go to the exam room and get tested. The test is part written, part oral, part 

drawings and part demonstration. They must get 85% to pass. If not, they restudy the section they 

didn't get, or if the misunderstandings are more general, they redo the course. The teacher does not 

administer the tests, the teachers do not know what is on the tests. The teacher is also held partially 

responsible if a student flunks the test. In the case of a student coming in wi th lower skills 

> lacking, they add lower level courses to their program that they do first, so they have the 

background info they need (a type of scaffolding). Students can finish earlier than targeted or later, 

the bottom line is they get the knowledge. Throughout each course, they have to pass certain 

demonstations etc, by getting checked by the teacher, so the teacher can keep tabs on how things 

are going. If students lag, they will have a conference with them to see what is going on. Every class 

in the school is run this way. For reading, those below grade level have to read more, novel concept, 

huh? The have weekly reading targets to meet. Each book has a point value. Students actually read 1 

hour per day, that is real reading time. Math is taught seminar style, with manipulatives and students 

are placed according to ability level, not age. Once they reach 6th grade, they do self study math and 

can catch up if they are behind for their age. 

>So now the question: Would this be possible in public schools? Possible yes, likely, No! This would 

1742

e real school reform, and I think there would be too much resistance to it. Does it work? Yes, it does. 

We had many students who the public school either wanted to get rid of, or wanted to put on drugs 

that came to this school. And these students do very well. They don't have to just sit at their desks. 

Depending on the course they are doing, have to do experiments, build things etc. The biggest 

problem with this style of classroom is that the class size can't be too big. Which of course would cost 

money. So, I will just keep dreaming that this could be duplicated in the public schools. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Hey class, 

> 

>Just some food for thought, 

> 

>It seems that many of the people I have spoken with in the cohort are experiencing a great deal of 

time management disparities. How does one begin to better function within this world so engrossed in 

deadlines and punctuality? Is this actually a healthy way to live? The United States is a historically 

highly productive place, in which we believe that efficiency and development are number one. Is this 

a concept also placed within our classrooms? I guess this all goes back to scaffolding and automatic 

promotion. What is wrong with taking more time to learn a concept, if in the end you have a better 

understanding of it? Because in the end what is the point of education or learning? Now that is a big 

question! Not that I expect anybody to answer meanings you are all probably feverishly writing your 

theory papers. oh whatever. 

>See ya tomorrow, 

>Robert 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

>Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar – FREE! 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today 

_____ 


1743





Subject: Re: Journal: Choices/Theory 

Very sad, Mike. I think I see a flaw in your theory. If the journals and writing assignments are worth 

45% each, you are assuming that you are getting full credit for them. What if you only get a 70% on 

these or something? Does that still give you an A in the class? Or is the grade really just based on 

credit/no credit? If you do it, you automatically get full credit? I don't think I want to risk it, but then, I 

am interested. 

Cynthia 


Yamashita wants to make sure we are aware of why we make the choices we do, 

rather than just doing things for the sake of doing them. I am well aware of 

why all my choices are made, and all those pertaining to CSUSM boil down to 

"what will make my life less miserable at any given moment." Also, I have a 

theory. Based on percentages, you don't have to do the capstone project to 

pass this class, more on that later, back to choices. I didn't read Bruer. 

Why not? Because at any given moment, I had the choice of reading Bruer and 

doing something else, and something else was ALWAYS more fun. So I am now 

presented with two options, hurriedly read a couple chapters from the book, 

write a paper pretending like those chapters were the ones that truly spoke 

to me, and assume that our professor won't know the difference. Or, 

understand from the start that he does know the difference, and not even 

bother to try and dupe him for a few points added to my grade. It's the 

whole deal of "what do I have to do to pass" vs. "what can I learn from 

this." Since I am uninterested, I already know I can't learn anything from 

this (my fault, but still true) so that leaves, what do I have to do to 

pass. I make a final check of the syllabus to make sure this paper isn't 

worth 80% of our grade or anything. This syllabus check yields some curious 

percentages. Journals are worth 45% of our grade, writing assignments are 

worth 45% of our grade, and the capstone is worth 25% of our grade. Hmm. So 

if we do all the journals, all the writing, and dont do the capstone at all, 

we get an A in Yamashita's class. This shows that this class is very 

accomodating to people of different learning styles. We get to choose the 

manner in which we get an A. I think I'll do the capstone, and skip a few 

journa ls and this writing assignment, which should still even out to around 

a 90%. (a breakdown of the writing assignments show that they add up to 50% 

by the way, not 45%). For anyone who is wondering, attendance is worth 

precisely 0% of your grade in this class. So it looks like we have a real 

choice of whether we want to attend or not. I will still attend, because 

maybe...MAYBE we will have another discussion about teaching in the real 

world. And when that day comes, I will know all the thousands of dollars my 

dad has spent on tuition and books will not have been in vain. 

-Mike Runnestrand, CHOOSING to go to bed because he has a THEORY that the 

more sleep he gets, the less likely he is to die ,and avoiding death is the 

ultimate goal. 

1744

_________________________________________________________________ 


months! 


_____ 



1745





Subject: Re: MIKE 

BEING THAT I AM IN YOUR CAPSTONE GROUP, YOU ARE IN SOOO MUCH TROUBLE RIGHT NOW MIKE. YOU 

WILL DO THE CAPSTONE. YOU WILL NOT SAY "I THINK I WILL DO IT" BECAUSE THAT ISNT AN 

OPTION. YOU PROMISED TO BE A PART OF THIS GROUP AND WE WILL HOLD YOU TO THAT. SCREW 

AROUND ON YOUR OWN PROJECTS, BUT NOT ON A GROUP PROJECT. YOU ARE COMMITTED. YOU ARE SOOO 

SMART-STOP THROWING YOUR ACADEMIC LIFE AWAY. 

> 


> Date: 2004/04/06 Tue PM 11:54:12 PDT 

> To: icp-f@csusm.edu 

> Subject: Journal: Choices/Theory 

> 

> Yamashita wants to make sure we are aware of why we make the choices we do, 

> rather than just doing things for the sake of doing them. I am well aware of 

> why all my choices are made, and all those pertaining to CSUSM boil down to 

> "what will make my life less miserable at any given moment." Also, I have a 

> theory. Based on percentages, you don't have to do the capstone project to 

> pass this class, more on that later, back to choices. I didn't read Bruer. 

> Why not? Because at any given moment, I had the choice of reading Bruer and 

> doing something else, and something else was ALWAYS more fun. So I am now 

> presented with two options, hurriedly read a couple chapters from the book, 

> write a paper pretending like those chapters were the ones that truly spoke 

> to me, and assume that our professor won't know the difference. Or, 

> understand from the start that he does know the difference, and not even 

> bother to try and dupe him for a few points added to my grade. It's the 

> whole deal of "what do I have to do to pass" vs. "what can I learn from 

> this." Since I am uninterested, I already know I can't learn anything from 

> this (my fault, but still true) so that leaves, what do I have to do to 

> pass. I make a final check of the syllabus to make sure this paper isn't 

> worth 80% of our grade or anything. This syllabus check yields some curious 

> percentages. Journals are worth 45% of our grade, writing assignments are 

> worth 45% of our grade, and the capstone is worth 25% of our grade. Hmm. So 

> if we do all the journals, all the writing, and dont do the capstone at all, 

> we get an A in Yamashita's class. This shows that this class is very 

> accomodating to people of different learning styles. We get to choose the 

> manner in which we get an A. I think I'll do the capstone, and skip a few 

> journals and this writing assignment, which should still even out to around 

> a 90%. (a breakdown of the writing assignments show that they add up to 50% 

> by the way, not 45%). For anyone who is wondering, attendance is worth 

> precisely 0% of your grade in this class. So it looks like we have a real 

> choice of whether we want to attend or not. I will still attend, because 

> maybe...MAYBE we will have another discussion about teaching in the real 

> world. And when that day comes, I will know all the thousands of dollars my 

> dad has spent on tuition and books will not have been in vain. 

> 

> -Mike Runnestrand, CHOOSING to go to bed because he has a THEORY that the 

> more sleep he gets, the less likely he is to die ,and avoiding death is the 

> ultimate goal. 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> Limited-time offer: Fast, reliable MSN 9 Dial-up Internet access FREE for 2 

> months! 

> http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup&pgmarket=en-us&ST=1/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/ 

> 

> 


1746

1747




To: ICP-F 


I may have put myself out there but i dont care because you are assuming to 

much when i call for help its because i dont know what to do. I feel that as a 

chort that we can help each other out then we get into a jam. Yes mabye I call 

"you guys" to much but I am not the smartest person in the class and I dont 

understand a lot of stuff. When I get help from a classmate it helps me learn 

or even backs out what I was thinking. I think the reason why I call you guys 

so much is because I dont feel confident with my answer that I wrote. Cynthia 

I will not call you again sorry to burden you with my problems. 

Sorry for bothering you 

Jonathan 

1748



Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2004 5:54 PM 



I guess many of us are in the bad habit of relying on our cohort members instead of going to the 

source (the professor) when we don't understand something. It might be a good idea to ask some 

questions in class, if you are not understanding what is being taught, or if you need clearer 

instructions on what to do. Cynthia 


I may have put myself out there but i dont care because you are assuming to 

much when i call for help its because i dont know what to do. I feel that as a 

chort that we can help each other out then we get into a jam. Yes mabye I call 

"you guys" to much but I am not the smartest person in the class and I dont 

understand a lot of stuff. When I get help from a classmate it helps me learn 

or even backs out what I was thinking. I think the reason why I call you guys 

so much is because I dont feel confident with my answer that I wrote. Cynthia 

I will not call you again sorry to burden you with my problems. 

Sorry for bothering you 

Jonathan 

_____ 



1749




To: ICP-F 


I totally agree with you for once I went and talked with Dr Karas today to get 

some help and he was really cool about helping me out. So from now on i plan 

to go get help from the professor so thanx for the idea. 

Jonathan 

1750






Cool, Jonathan. I think Dr. Karas likes to help his students because he really wants them to learn and 

probably knows physics is hard to grasp. 

I plan to follow my own advice in the future as well. Too much room for interpretation, kind of like 

playing telephone. 

Cynthia 


I totally agree with you for once I went and talked with Dr Karas today to get 

some help and he was really cool about helping me out. So from now on i plan 

to go get help from the professor so thanx for the idea. 

Jonathan 

_____ 



1751




To: LBST 361B 


Hola, 

Here are my thoughts for the week... 

I was thinking about the decisions we make us students. The decisions have to 

do with, for instance, what assignments to do or not to do or what readings 

should one do or shouldn’t do. At the beginning of the semester, I found 

telling myself that I was not going to manage to read all the material for 

this class taking into account the work I had to do for the other classes. I 

remember the professor mentioning something about that it was our decision 

what readings we chose to read. He should not have said that because that made 

me not want to read. I am not blaming the professor for not reading, I am just 

trying to understand why I made such decision. We always complain about time. 

“There is not enough time for everything” I have heard people said. And, in my 

case, time is an issue. But, like the professor said, that’s when you start 

making decisions such as “should I go out tonight or should a read Sagan or 

Bruer? 

Now, the questions are should I go back and read what I didn’t read? Is it 

doable at this time of the semester? Is it worth it? 

In conclusion, I learned that sometimes I make decisions, and when face with 

the consequences, the first reaction is to complain “why me?” But it is when I 

should step back, like the professor has been telling us, and look at the 

situation and analyze it. 

Hasta luego, 

Judith 

1752





Subject: Hey Cynthia 

Hey Cynthia, 

I've been thinking a lot since we locked horns and I have not felt good with how our little situation 

resulted. I still do not want to debate issues; I need a brake from all the challenges and debates on 

the list serve. However, I have had an uncomfortable feeling in my stomach at how things 

progressed and ended with us. I just want you to know that I feel bad about how frustrated I allowed 

myself to get and maybe I should have saved my posts as drafts and gave them a second look the 

next day before I sent them out. Things just don't feel right and I want to apologize for my 

contributions that helped continue our situation. 

Ann 

_____ 



1753





Subject: Re: Hey Cynthia 

Ann, 

Apology accepted. I agree with you about the way it feels. I wasn't angry with you, if that helps. I 

apologize for upsetting you, that wasn't my intent. I am just trying to take a look at how all the 

readings fit into my views about education, and that is what I was trying to express, although it doesn't 

seem to have come out that way. On the up side, I think I have gotten to know you a little better, even 

if it is only via cyber conversations. Hugs and kisses and all that mushy stuff, Cynthia 


Hey Cynthia, 

I've been thinking a lot since we locked horns and I have not felt good with how our little situation 

resulted. I still do not want to debate issues; I need a brake from all the challenges and debates 

on the list serve. However, I have had an uncomfortable feeling in my stomach at how things 

progressed and ended with us. I just want you to know that I feel bad about how frustrated I 

allowed myself to get and maybe I should have saved my posts as drafts and gave them a second 

look the next day before I sent them out. Things just don't feel right and I want to apologize for my 

contributions that helped continue our situation. 

Ann 

_____ 



_____ 



1754




To: journal 

Subject: check the time 

Just in case anybody needs to know what time it is right now. 

Click here for up to the second time info. 

For real, just look, ok? 

http://www.yugop.com/ver3/stuff/03/fla.html 

_____ 



1755






It is quite a dilemna, if you have skipped too many of the readings, but you might be able to do it in a 

weekend, if you have the desire. The thing about the readings is, if you look at them all separately, 

they might seem useless or not applicable to our goals, but if you view them as a whole, you see the 

bigger picture and they make a lot of sense. I have found that they all start to become more 

interesting when you can put them together in your mind and see how they all relate. In fact, it is 

getting to be very interesting, and almost like a challenge or a game to make sense of it all. Does that 

help motivate you? LOL. I am really being serious though. Happy reading, Judith!! 

Cynthia 


Hola, 

Here are my thoughts for the week... 

I was thinking about the decisions we make us students. The decisions have to 

do with, for instance, what assignments to do or not to do or what readings 

should one do or shouldn’t do. At the beginning of the semester, I found 

telling myself that I was not going to manage to read all the material for 

this class taking into account the work I had to do for the other classes. I 

remember the professor mentioning something about that it was our decision 

what readings we chose to read. He should not have said that because that made 

me not want to read. I am not blaming the professor for not reading, I am just 

trying to understand why I made such decision. We always complain about time. 

“There is not enough time for everything” I have heard people said. And, in my 

case, time is an issue. But, like the professor said, that’s when you start 

making decisions such as “should I go out tonight or should a read Sagan or 

Bruer? 

Now, the questions are should I go back and read what I didn’t read? Is it 

doable at this time of the semester? Is it worth it? 

In conclusion, I learned that sometimes I make decisions, and when face with 

the consequences, the first reaction is to complain “why me?” But it is when I 

should step back, like the professor has been telling us, and look at the 

situation and analyze it. 

Hasta luego, 

Judith 

_____ 

1756



1757




To: journal 

Subject: Speaking of Black Boxes 

Ok, not exactly the kind we were talking about in class, but same concept if you think about it. This is 

a black box for humans, fashioned after the black box in airplanes. It can monitor heart rate and tons 

of other stuff, and its applications are really far-reaching. But at the same time, can you imagine 

everyone walking around constantly being monitored? Sounds a little like Gattaca to me. 

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm 

Anyway, its an interesting article. Cynthia 

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2004/07apr_blackbox.htm?list1143205 

_____ 



1758





Subject: Funny easter bunny 

Dear Cohort, 

Here is a cute and funny bunny.... check it out.. 

http://www.debsfunpages.com/easterswf/rapeasterbunny.swf 

If it isn't a link... just cut and paste the address..... 

Ann 

_____ 



1759





Subject: Re: Hey Cynthia 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/01.gif me too.... 

Ann 


Ann, 

Apology accepted. I agree with you about the way it feels. I wasn't angry with you, if that helps. I 

apologize for upsetting you, that wasn't my intent. I am just trying to take a look at how all the 

readings fit into my views about education, and that is what I was trying to express, although it 

doesn't seem to have come out that way. On the up side, I think I have gotten to know you a little 

better, even if it is only via cyber conversations. Hugs and kisses and all that mushy stuff, Cynthia 


Hey Cynthia, 

I've been thinking a lot since we locked horns and I have not felt good with how our little 

situation resulted. I still do not want to debate issues; I need a brake from all the challenges 

and debates on the list serve. However, I have had an uncomfortable feeling in my stomach at 

how things progressed and ended with us. I just want you to know that I feel bad about how 

frustrated I allowed myself to get and maybe I should have saved my posts as drafts and gave 

them a second look the next day before I sent them out. Things just don't feel right and I want 

to apologize for my contributions that helped continue our situation. 

Ann 

_____ 

_____ 





_____ 



1760





Subject: RE: check the time 

That was pretty cool Cynthia. Do you think the erasing was sped up? I don't think I could erase and write something as 

quickly as that person was doing it! ~ Louise p.s. it was cute seeing you get all mushy in your dialogue with Ann! 




To: journal 

Subject: check the time 

Just in case anybody needs to know what time it is right now. 

Click here for up to the second time info. 

For real, just look, ok? 

http://www.yugop.com/ver3/stuff/03/fla.html 

_____ 



1761





Subject: Re: Funny easter bunny 

That was very cool, I sent it to my son! Right up his alley. Thanks, Cynthia 


Dear Cohort, 

Here is a cute and funny bunny.... check it out.. 

http://www.debsfunpages.com/easterswf/rapeasterbunny.swf 

If it isn't a link... just cut and paste the address..... 

Ann 

_____ 



_____ 



1762




To: journal 

Subject: What's the Big Idea 

In this week's ENC newsletter, there is an article about teaching "big ideas" in science and how it 

relates to national standards. It's short, but good and there is a related article giving some examples. 

Cynthia 

http://www.enc.org/features/focus/archive/bigideas/document.shtm?input=FOC-003473-index 

_____ 



1763






Dude that's weird watching the hand write the seconds and erase them. 

You are not only intellegent and qucik to respond but you also know the time 

and date. I 

barely even know or want to beleive what year it is. Marin 

>Just in case anybody needs to know what time it is right now. 

>Click here for up to the second time info. 

>For real, just look, ok? 

>http://www.yugop.com/ver3/stuff/03/fla.html 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



1764






I am glad that's not my job. 



>To: journal 

>Subject: check the time 

>Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 22:45:24 -0700 (PDT) 

> 

>Just in case anybody needs to know what time it is right now. 

>Click here for up to the second time info. 

>For real, just look, ok? 

>http://www.yugop.com/ver3/stuff/03/fla.html 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 

Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with MSN Premium! 

1765





Subject: Re: Funny easter bunny 

ann that was great. made me laugh aloud. thanks! 

> 


> Date: 2004/04/08 Thu AM 06:29:47 PDT 


> Subject: Funny easter bunny 

> 

> Dear Cohort, 

> 

> Here is a cute and funny bunny.... check it out.. 

> 

> http://www.debsfunpages.com/easterswf/rapeasterbunny.swf 

> 

> If it isn't a link... just cut and paste the address..... 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 

> --------------------------------- 



> 


1766





Subject: Re: Speaking of Black Boxes 

Pretty neat. You could totally monitor everything you do. It would be a great tool to learn about 

yourself and how you react to different situations. Maybe we could strap them on our future students 

and see what tecniques work in calming them down, or by learning their alertness cycles etc. It 

reminds me of Aliens the second movie... you know, "They mostly come at night, mostly..." Anyway, 

I think it would be a neat toy. 

Ann 


Ok, not exactly the kind we were talking about in class, but same concept if you think about it. This 

is a black box for humans, fashioned after the black box in airplanes. It can monitor heart rate and 

tons of other stuff, and its applications are really far-reaching. But at the same time, can you 

imagine everyone walking around constantly being monitored? Sounds a little like Gattaca to me. 

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm 



_____ 



_____ 



1767






This week as been an extremely hard week for me. As you all probably noticed I was not in class 

yesterday. One of my very good friends died over spring break. He was in Cabo San Lucas. He has a 

very adventurous personality and decided to go diving- by himself. That was the last time any of his 

friends saw him alive. Three days later they found his body. Why do things like this happen? He had 

so much life to live. The thing I was thinking about the most yesterday when I was reading and 

hearing all these beautiful things about him and how many people loved him. Did he know this? Did 

he know how many people's lives he touched and made a difference in? I know this is deep and a 

completely random journal but this is the only thing I can think to write. As I was sitting at the funeral, 

the priest was talking about how you never know when the last time you will see a person is. You 

never know if today is going to be the last day you get to see their face and hear their voice. And I 

thought of how stressed I have been and how hard the semester is- and then I thought- I am lucky to 

be able to be stressed and have a hard semester. He was one semester away from graduating. I 

don't know- I know that people begin to think like this when tradegy strikes- but shouldn't we think like 

this more often? We are so lucky to have known eachother and experience all our different cultures 

and beliefs. Very deep I know but again Life is too short! Casey Cunningham 

1768





Subject: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 

Dear list serve members, 

As I read some of the journals late the other night (recently got internet 

hooked up at the crib)I thought to myself "damn i have been missing out on the 

opportunity to show the cohort and faculty that I am an able writer and as Jim 

Rome would say have good takes." That being said, I can't absolutely pinpoint 

why my activity on the list serve has been so sparse other than to say that my 

life as i'm sure some of yours doesn't revolve around our cohort (as much as 

it should) and especially not an email list (my closest friends and i don't 

communicate via email so it is not a medium with which I am completely 

comfortable) so other than doing the necessary number of journals I haven't 

been around to jump on some of the entries that I should have. For instance, 

their was a posting recently speaking about the difference in literacy between 

students in poor school versus rich or church based schools that I wanted to 

respond to by saying that in poor schools (the faculty usually doesn't push 

the stduents the way they need to be pushed either out of a feeling that the 

students aren't capable of grasping the material or indiffernce whether or not 

their students ever become intellignent novices. Along the same lines, as I 

can say from my own personal experiences when minorities attend schools in 

middle class or well to do areas they still aren't pushed to succeed but 

rather allowed to simply coast through without fear of failure (our test 

scores will still be high compared to the rest of the schools so if these kids 

aren't prepared it won't reflect on us overall) so we are left to motivate 

ourselves and if you are one that continually is pressuring the teacher to 

help you or explain something clearer (i have felt as if they think you are 

just trying to kiss their ass or are doing so for another reason rather than 

just a desire to learn (this being in the high school years)). But their is 

an overall feeling i have seen of "what hope is there for these students" 

without every taking the time to think that you are there "hope" and the one 

that needs to be challenging each and every one of them. I perceive that the 

majority of my cohort members desire to work in the carlsbad, encinitas, and 

rancho bernardos but sorry guys you all aren't going to be able to work their 

and it is my fear that when you do get a job in an area you don't want to work 

in for whatever reason (hopefully not because of the ethnicity or 

socio-economic status of your students) you will resent your position and 

continue the string of teachers who don't care about the performance of their 

students or don't feel that they can make an impact. That being said, I tend 

to bite my tongue for fear of being the "angry black man" or whatever else one 

could be labeled for speaking their mind but I can't worry about that at this 

time. I feel that our "multicultural education" courses have only reinforced 

that their is a gap between the education of minorites and done little to 

encourage future teachers that this trend can change if they want it to. Its 

like "look at these test scores" and thats it no explination as to why this is 

so or how it can be fixed. Anyways folks just a few things i wanted to get 

off my chest in between patrons here in the media library so if its muttered 

up my apologies but please feel free to discuss with me anything you would 

like and i'll make an effort to respond to your thoughts as well. 

Matheno 

p.s. pressure is a good driving force, but stress is just that stress never a 

good driving force it is simply stress. Rick Pitino (not his exact words but 

along those lines) 

1769





Subject: Re: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 

Hey Matheno, good to have you online!! I have a question for you, you said, "I feel that our 

"multicultural education" courses have only reinforced that their is a gap between the education of 

minorites and done little to encourage future teachers that this trend can change if they want it to." 

So are you saying that although our classes have pointed it out (over and over and over) they haven't 

given us any real tools to do something about it? 

I suppose some would say that the "differentiated instruction" stuff was meant for these students, 

even more than the other students. And scaffolding, and assessing prior knowledge. 

Do you think there is something else out there that would work better? Just curious. I personally think 

that none of the stuff I mentioned will work unless the teacher actually believes these students can 

succeed to begin with. I also think some teachers will be afraid to demand high standards from these 

kids for fear of ..........whatever. 

Cynthia 













their was a posting recently speaking about the di fference in literacy between 













just t rying to kiss their ass or are doing so for another reason rather than 





1770


rancho bernardos but sorry guys you all aren't going to be able to work their 
















Matheno 




_____ 



1771





Subject: Re: Speaking of Black Boxes 

Hmmm. Monitoring students, not a bad idea. That would make a good research project. 

Cynthia 


Pretty neat. You could totally monitor everything you do. It would be a great tool to learn about 

yourself and how you react to different situations. Maybe we could strap them on our future 

students and see what tecniques work in calming them down, or by learning their alertness cycles 

etc. It reminds me of Aliens the second movie... you know, "They mostly come at night, 

mostly..." Anyway, I think it would be a neat toy. 

Ann 


_____ 

_____ 

Ok, not exactly the kind we were talking about in class, but same concept if you think about it. 

This is a black box for humans, fashioned after the black box in airplanes. It can monitor heart 

rate and tons of other stuff, and its applications are really far-reaching. But at the same time, 

can you imagine everyone walking around constantly being monitored? Sounds a little like 

Gattaca to me. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm 







_____ 



1772





Subject: Casey's journal (sorry about your lost...) 


reply (2 KB) 

>Casey, 

I am sorry to hear about the sudden lost of your friend. I can understand why it is 

difficult to focus on anything else considering that you are grieving and reflecting on 

this deep loss. I feel for his family and friends for having to deal with such a sudden 

and great lost. Things like this make no sense to us because we can only experience such a 

lost from our human experience. I think experiences like this force us to stop and reflect 

on the kind of life we are living and the choices we are making. It is so easy to allow 

deadlines, schools assignments, getting from one place to the other to be the purpose of 

life and not the process of living life. How many of us ask ourselves at the end of the 

day, "Did I live this day with heart and deep gratitude?" From my experience, I do not 

think that we tell our love ones and friends or someone we have had a misunderstanding 

with often enough how much they mean to us. Somehow, we assume too much. Living life 

consciously has to be a 

constant conscious effort. That inner dialog with God seems to be the most comforting. I 

cannot imagine life without the sense that there is more to life than the race of living 

life. All this reading on Science puts in question my own sense of spirituality at times. 

Experiences as the lost of your friend brings me back to my sense of spirit. Your friend 

is now part of my experience and already he has made a difference. Thanks for sharing. I 

will make the conscious effort to tell my family and friends that I love them, and will be 

more understanding when they do not love back. I do not know your friend, but I know lost. 

It is true we never know when it will be the last time that we will see the face of 

someone we love or did not know we loved. Unfortunately, it is not until then that we 

reflect on how he or she affected our life, causing us to wonder what they might have been 

going through internally and how could we have helped. If we listen, we can hear that deep 

inner cal 

ling that warns us of the grave distance we are creating with love ones, yet we are so 

caught up on our surface self that we refuse to acknowledge that inner calling until we 

are left with the lost and the sadness of not reaching out. The people that enter our 

lives are part of our growth process only our lack of gratitude inhibits that growth. 

With deep understanding, 

Alexandra 


> Date: 2004/04/08 Thu PM 07:06:42 EDT 


> Subject: journal 

> 

> This week as been an extremely hard week for me. As you all probably noticed 

> I was not in class yesterday. One of my very good friends died over spring 

> break. He was in Cabo San Lucas. He has a very adventurous personality and 

> decided to go diving- by himself. That was the last time any of his friends saw him 

> alive. Three days later they found his body. Why do things like this happen? 

> He had so much life to live. The thing I was thinking about the most yesterday 

> when I was reading and hearing all these beautiful things about him and how 

> many people loved him. Did he know this? Did he know how many people's lives he 

> touched and made a difference in? I know this is deep and a completely random 

1773

journal but this is the only thing I can think to write. As I was sitting at 

> the funeral, the priest was talking about how you never know when the last time 

> you will see a person is. You never know if today is going to be the last day 

> you get to see their face and hear their voice. And I thought of how stressed 

> I have been and how hard the semester is- and then I thought- I am lucky to 

> be able to be stressed and have a hard semester. He was one semester away from 

> graduating. I don't know- I know that people begin to think like this when 

> tradegy strikes- but shouldn't we think like this more often? We are so lucky to 

> have known eachother and experience all our different cultures and beliefs. 

> Very deep I know but again Life is too short! Casey Cunningham 

> 

> 

1774





Subject: science on TV 

so sagan's chapter 22 got me thinking about how much science is on TV. there acutally is 

some science on TV, alomst always on the Discovery channel, if you think of animanls in 

terms of science there is the animal planet, and there's TLC which has that show Trauma, 

or whatever that awful show is about life in the ER, if it's even still on, and then of 

course theres all the fictional shows based on some aspect of science like ER. so there 

is some science. 

but what happened to shows like Bill Nye the science guy (even sagan brought him up) and 

there was some gal that did science experiments in the school library, always wearing her 

lab coat and safety goggles. i wish i were that cool. 

i wish those shows were still on, they were awesome and great teaching tools. however 

today, most kids dont even watch TV shows, they have their playstation going or their 

favorite DVD. 

so in short, i agree with sagan that there should be more sciecne on TV, but i dont think 

i can go as far as he did by turning basketball into a science lesson. i see his idea, i 

understnad it, but i just dont know how many kids will think that way. 

however, i like his idea of bringing sports into the classroom. boys would love that. 

girls, most girls, not so much. so yet again science will become more feasible to boys 

and not girls. eventhough i think thats a stereotype that boys are better at science than 

girls. 

science on TV is awesome no matter what age. sometimes i watch the coolest shows that 

arent a waste of my time, they actually teach me really interesting stuff. so when you 

get a chance, turn on Discovery, mike says thats how he got so smart. 


1775






Matheno, 

Your'e right... Topics of inequality are brought up brefly, but never delt with on levels that could help 

make a change. I myself am not planning on teaching near the coast, and I plan to go into teaching 

with the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I want to create a classroom that is a safe learning 

environment for everyone. Everyone: European American, African American, Asian American, 

Mexican American, Christian American, Mormon American, Catholic American, Heterosexual 

American, Homosexual American...........etc. I want to include and respect everyone to the best of my 

abilities. I know I will not be perfect, but I know I will do everything in my abilities to help promote well 

rounded children of the future. 

Ann 













their was a posting recently speaking about the di fference in literacy between 













just t rying to kiss their ass or are doing so for another reason rather than 






1776

ancho bernardos but sorry guys you all aren't going to be able to work their 
















Matheno 




_____ 



1777





Subject: journal 11: expectations... 

Expectations are a major component in how people 

interact with each other, how they decide on their 

level of engagement and investment in certain 

situations, how much they think about things, etc. 

This list could continue forever, as most everything 

that people encounter and make decisions about relates 

to their expectations to some degree; we are 

inseparable from them as humans. Though this does not 

mean that we lack control or the ability to become 

aware of them, and these are important skills for 

teachers to have. 

It seems that the practice of teaching is based 

heavily on the expectations of the teacher for 

themselves, their learners, and the outcomes they 

foresee in their classrooms. These expectations are 

intertwined with the technicalities of the education 

system: state standards, standardized exams, school 

standards, and many other factors of accountability. 

But standards are only there as a measurement of the 

lowest level of achievement required for teachers to 

make with their students, and the end results exhorted 

by the standards are not immune to the varying levels 

of achievement that can exist under the same 

standards. This leads one to consider how the elements 

of teaching that are not necessarily covered with any 

depth in the teacher education programs that have to 

do with the inner, humanistic and more personal 

aspects of teaching (otherwise known as the gray 

area), affect teachers’ expectations, and ultimately 

the results of their teaching. 

This gray area consists of ideas, beliefs, 

experiences, outlooks, judgments, biases, 

stereotypical beliefs, values, and levels of 

compassion and dedication. None of these elements are 

“teachable,” nor are they necessarily easy to discuss 

or accept when they belong to other people. But what 

is possible is to create an awareness of these 

internal elements within people working at becoming 

teachers and understanding of why we think or believe 

the things that we do, why we make decisions in 

certain ways, why we give more thought and attention 

to some areas than others. Are all people capable of 

developing self-awareness of these parts of 

themselves? Are people willing to understand these 

elements and consider how they play into their 

expectations? 

Some who are teachers, or are in training to become 

teachers, feel that these topics are separate from the 

goal of education, should not be brought into the 

classroom, and that the classroom environment should 

be a neutral, dead-space void of personal feelings, 

beliefs, values, and compassion, that the role of the 

teacher is solely to help their students learn the 

material and learn how to think. The latter are 

important pieces of what education is about, but there 

is much more. The role of the teacher goes deeper 

1778

than the technicalities of providing a successful 

learning environment for students Teachers are ‘en 

loco parentes,’ responsible for much more than making 

sure that students are learning. Teachers have the 

responsibility of nurturing and guiding young minds to 

reach heightened and developed levels of understanding 

and thinking, processes that may well not exist 

without personal connections and investments between 

and among students and teachers. 

There is a human connection that exists in the 

classroom between students and teachers, and these 

connections are what determine the environment of a 

classroom and set the psychological stage of the minds 

of the children and teacher. The interactions and 

decisions of the teacher come from a combination of 

logical reasoning, which is affected by the teacher’s 

expectations, and all of the elements that make up the 

gray area previously mentioned. Therefore, a teacher 

cannot remove the humanistic elements consisting of 

feelings, beliefs, biases, etc, from their teaching 

practice, as they are ingrained and imbedded at every 

level. Rather, it is important that teachers are 

reflective and self-aware and invest considerable 

thought into what contributes to and dictates their 

expectations, how these expectations affect decisions 

and thought processes, and what ultimately happens 

within the “black box” of the classroom. 

Michael Renner 

__________________________________ 




1779





Subject: reply for cythia 

Dear Cynthia, 

Sorry on getting back to you so late. I wrote a respose to your question but 

it took to long so i got logged out without it getting posted so i'm going to 

give you a call on the phone so i can discuss it with you over the telefono. 

Matheno 

1780





Subject: Re: reply for cythia 

got your message, eating my lunch will call you in a few minutes. thank you 

cynthia 


Dear Cynthia, 

Sorry on getting back to you so late. I wrote a respose to your question but 

it took to long so i got logged out without it getting posted so i'm going to 

give you a call on the phone so i can discuss it with you over the telefono. 

Matheno 

_____ 



1781





Subject: journal 12 my black box... 

Ignited by Robert’s email about stress and how we 

are all in the same situation in regards to being 

forced to test our time management (or juggling, 

fumbling?) skills, are thoughts relating these ideas 

to the art of teaching. Those of us that choose to 

teach in the end of all of this and get jobs in 

schools will be faced with the ultimate test of our 

abilities to multitask, manage time, make instant 

decisions, and be adaptable. During the first few 

“formative” years of our careers, we will no doubt be 

learning how to “walk” all over again in the new world 

of education. 

As we find our ways and put countless hours 

(hopefully) into our classrooms and the planning of 

what will happen in those classrooms, we will be faced 

with many decisions. Based on our expectations (last 

journal), the time that we will have in the classroom, 

how we balance and manage that amount of time, and the 

countless number of other factors involved in the 

responsibility of being a teacher, we will be faced to 

make decisions such as, how much time we will allow 

our students to learn for themselves, say, through 

inquiry and exploration, how much we will just tell 

them in order to move the class along, how we will 

approach each day, what teaching methods we will use 

to adapt to the multitudes of learners, how to deal 

with little Johnnie whose dad was just thrown in jail 

and mother can’t hold a job, how to deal with little 

Sally who is bored and disinterested because she is 

far more advanced than the rest of the class, and 

choose between getting through the material or 

embracing a “teachable moment” to exemplify what 

Dorothy Rich, a teacher, feels are more important to 

academic subjects: “confidence, perseverance, caring, 

teamwork, common sense and problem solving,” to which 

Carl Sagan adds “skeptical thinking and an aptitude 

for wonder,” to which I add integrity and honesty 

(Sagan 345). 

The answers to these and many more teaching 

dilemmas may not be found in any book or taught to us 

by any professor. Rather, they might be found in the 

process of becoming a seasoned teacher: gaining 

experience, reflecting on these experiences, 

maintaining continuous awareness, understanding the 

teacher’s role in the “pipeline” of the educational 

system with regard to the equation: teacher x # of 

students x # of years teaching = # of students whose 

lives are affected, and the integration of confidence, 

perseverance, caring, teamwork, common sense and 

problem solving, skeptical thinking, an aptitude for 

wonder, integrity, and honesty in one’s teaching 

through example. If these skills are important enough 

to pass on to our students, then they should be skills 

practiced innately within us as teachers. Thus, there 

is no decision to be made between getting through the 

material and embracing moments to teach such skills 

1782

ecause they will be the gears turning the 

transmissions of the “black boxes,” our classrooms. 


__________________________________ 




1783






Just because one promotes equality and understanding of others within your classroom, not all of 

your children nor there parents or society at large will approve of your styles. How does one begin to 

develop a framework for addressing oppositional view points? Not everyone believes that equality is a 

good thing, not everyone believes that all children deserve an equal education. Sad, but very true. 

What happens when you are a strong believer of bi-lingual education and the superintendent says 

"NOT ON MY WATCH." We all carry with us an understanding of how we feel everyone else should 

view the world. But, how do you teach in an environment with so many views and understandings? 

How much control will we have over our future curriculums, units, lessons, words, feelings, beliefs, 

etc.? and where does one draw the line? How much control will one have to say "NOT ON MY 

WATCH" and understanding that when will you stop fighting? This is one reason teachers don' t stay 

in the profession for very long. How will we combat this? Many will probably go with the flow and buy 

there house and retire having not helped change society in any formidable motion. But, how can we 

begin to work within the system to promote change in what each of us views to be a positive direction 

and many of us may view as a negative direction? 




>Subject: Re: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 

>Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 10:00:13 -0700 (PDT) 

> 

>Matheno, 

> 

>Your'e right... Topics of inequality are brought up brefly, but never delt with on levels that could help 

make a change. I myself am not planning on teaching near the coast, and I plan to go into teaching 

with the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I want to create a classroom that is a safe learning 






>Ann 

> 

>lande008 wrote: 

>Dear list serve members, 

> 

>As I read some of the journals late the other night (recently got internet 

>hooked up at the crib)I thought to myself "damn i have been missing out on the 

>opportunity to show the cohort and faculty that I am an able writer and as Jim 

1784


>why my activity on the list serve has been so sparse other than to say that my 

>life as i'm sure some of yours doesn't revolve around our cohort (as much as 

>it should) and especially not an email list (my closest friends and i don't 

>communicate via email so it is not a medium with which I am completely 

>comfortable) so other than doing the necessary number of journals I haven't 

>been around to jump on some of the entries that I should have. For instance, 

>their was a posting recently speaking about the difference in literacy between 

>students in poor school versus rich or church based schools that I wanted to 

>respond to by saying that in poor schools (the faculty usually doesn't push 

>the stduents the way they need to be pushed either out of a feeling that the 

>students aren't capable of grasping the material or indiffernce whether or not 

>their students ever become intellignent novices. Along the same lines, as I 

>can say from my own personal experiences when minorities attend schools in 

>middle class or well to do areas they still aren't pushed to succeed but 

>rather allowed to simply coast through without fear of failure (our test 

>scores will still be high compared to the rest of the schools so if these kids 

>aren't prepared it won't reflect on us overall) so we are left to motivate 

>ourselves and if you are one that continually is pressuring the teacher to 

>help you or explain something clearer (i have felt as if they think you are 

>just trying to kiss their ass or are doing so for another reason rather than 

>just a desire to learn (this being in the high school years)). But their is 

>an overall feeling i have seen of "what hope is there for these students" 

>without every taking the time to think that you are there "hope" and the one 

>that needs to be challenging each and every one of them. I perceive that the 

>majority of my cohort members desire to work in the carlsbad, encinitas, and 

>rancho bernardos but sorry guys you all aren't going to be able to work their 

>and it is my fear that when you do get a job in an area you don't want to work 

>in for whatever reason (hopefully not because of the ethnicity or 

>socio-economic status of your students) you will resent your position and 

>continue the string of teachers who don't care about the performance of their 

>students or don't feel that they can make an impact. That being said, I tend 

>to bite my tongue for fear of being the "angry black man" or whatever else one 

>could be labeled for speaking their mind but I can't worry about that at this 

>time. I feel that our "multicultural education" courses have only reinforced 

>that their is a gap between the education of minorites and done little to 

>encourage future teachers that this trend can change if they want it to. Its 

>like "look at these test scores" and thats it no explination as to why this is 

>so or how it can be fixed. Anyways folks just a few things i wanted to get 

>off my chest in between patrons here in the media library so if its muttered 

>up my apologies but please feel free to discuss with me anything you would 

>like and i'll make an effort to respond to your thoughts as well. 

> 

>Matheno 

> 

>p.s. pressure is a good driving force, but stress is just that stress never a 

>good driving force it is simply stress. Rick Pitino (not his exact words but 

>along those lines) 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



1785

_____ 

MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page – FREE download! 

1786






Let's start an "Inquiry-based Learning" charter school. Before students are enrolled, parents will have 

to attend an informational seminar that explains our teaching philosophy and methods. If they don't 

like it, they can enroll their kids in the "not on my watch" school of dismal education. Ok, I will come 

back to reality now. Although, you should keep your eyes open for this school, I might start it 

someday. 

Cynthia 



your children nor there parents or society at large will approve of your styles. How does one begin 

to develop a framework for addressing oppositional view points? Not everyone believes that 

equality is a good thing, not everyone believes that all children deserve an equal education. Sad, 

but very true. What happens when you are a strong believer of bi-lingual education and the 

superintendent says "NOT ON MY WATCH." We all carry with us an understanding of how we feel 

everyone else should view the world. But, how do you teach in an environment with so many 

views and understandings? How much control will we have over our future curriculums, units, 

lessons, words, feelings, beliefs, etc.? and where does one draw the line? How much control 

will one have to say "NOT ON MY WATCH" and understanding that when will you stop fighting? 

This is one reason teachers don' t stay in the profession for very long. How will we combat this? 

Many will probably go with the flow and buy there house and retire having not helped change 

society in any formidable motion. But, how can we begin to work within the system to promote 

change in what each of us views to be a positive direction and many of us may view as a negative 

direction? 






> 

>Matheno, 

> 

>Your'e right... Topics of inequality are brought up brefly, but never delt with on levels that could 

help make a change. I myself am not planning on teaching near the coast, and I plan to go into 

teaching with the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I want to create a classroom that is a safe 

learning environment for everyone. Everyone: European American, African American, Asian 

American, Mexican American, Christian American, Mormon American, Catholic American, 

Heterosexual American, Homosexual American...........etc. I want to include and respect everyone 

1787

to the best of my abilities. I know I will not be perfect, but I know I will do everything in my abilities 

to help promote well rounded children of the future. 

>Ann 

> 



> 




>Rome would say have good takes." That being said, I can't absolutely pinpoint 










































> 

1788

Matheno 

> 




> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 


_____ 


Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th 

1789






I guess you play it by ear. You test the waters, you test where people stand and adjust yourself so 

that you don't rock the boat to a detrimental degree. I guess one would want to teach at a school that 

promotes similar believes first of all, and then just do the best they can in each situation. Kind of like 

a relationship with someone. Why be in a relationship with someone who drinks all the time if you 

don't like drinking that much? That right there will be a constant struggle in your relationship. 

Instead, find someone (or a school) that shares common interests and hobbies... the chances for 

unity and success are (more lined up). 

As far as all the other factors as parents and society at large, just do the best you can to both set 

good examples and aim for small change. One small thing at a time will eventually add up to some 

change.. It may not be the change on the scale that you had hoped for, but when working with other 

people, you can't change people who don't want to change. The only person we have control over in 

this world is ourselves. The only people we can truly change, is ourselves. You can not change 

people who do not want to change. If you do help change someone, it was because they were willing 

and open to change. 

I realize that I can not control society even though it is in need of change. I realize that there are 

going to be parents who I will dislike with a passion and staff members who I totally disagree with. I 

realize that I will have my hands tied in many situations that I wish I could change; but in each 

situation, I will just do what I can. That's what I do everyday..... some days I see positive things 

happen, some days I run into every asshole possible, some days I wish I could just stay in bed and 

pull the covers over my head, some days I wish I were never born, but sometimes......sometimes..... 

when I am having a day from hell and I wish someone would just pull the plug, I run into someone 

who does something totally out of the blue that is kind, compassionate, and loving, or sweet, simple, 

and funny that touches my heart and restores my faith in humanity; and that is what I strive to do. I 

am not perfect. I am not always nice (there are times when I want to bite people's heads off, but 

there are other times when I see people stressed out to their max and I see that they need a little 

help, a kind gesture, a word of encouragement, a smile, a funny joke, a goofy look, a pat on the back, 

a big bear hug, or a soft warm embrace...... life is not easy....it never will be..... just do the best you 

can do and when you realize that you are heading too far off track, reassess your actions and steer 

yourself towards the path you wish to travel. Success in life is in getting back up every time you fall 

down and getting yourself back on the right track again. 

So how does one begin to develop a framework for addressing oppositional view points... you tell 

me? How do you teach in an environment with so many views and understandings? What is the key 

to lasting success in the teaching profession? 



1790















direction? 






> 

>Matheno, 

> 









>Ann 

> 



> 















1791
































> 

>Matheno 

> 




> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 


_____ 



1792





Subject: Questions... 

Oh, and if anyone has any pointers for those questions, maybe you can seriously give some advice 

on other social issues such as: how does a black man, or even worse a black woman, or even worse 

yet, a black lesbian live in a society that is not set up in her favor? How does she get up in the 

morning and drive to work and and live in a society that is made up of members in society that think 

she does not deserve the same opportunities and the same rights as others in that society? 

When does she give up and not fight for her rights? 

How does she begin to build a framework for addressing oppositional viewpoints? 

How does she live in an environment with so many oppositional views and understandings? 

What is the key for her success in this world? 

And, if she was a teacher, what would be the keys for her success in the teaching environment? 



I guess you play it by ear. You test the waters, you test where people stand and adjust yourself 

so that you don't rock the boat to a detrimental degree. I guess one would want to teach at a 

school that promotes similar believes first of all, and then just do the best they can in each 

situation. Kind of like a relationship with someone. Why be in a relationship with someone who 

drinks all the time if you don't like drinking that much? That right there will be a constant struggle 

in your relationship. Instead, find someone (or a school) that shares common interests and 

hobbies... the chances for unity and success are (more lined up). 


good examples and aim for small change. One small thing at a time will eventually add up to 

some change.. It may not be the change on the scale that you had hoped for, but when working 

with other people, you can't change people who don't want to change. The only person we have 

control over in this world is ourselves. The only people we can truly change, is ourselves. You 

can not change people who do not want to change. If you do help change someone, it was 

because they were willing and open to change. 


going to be parents who I will dislike with a passion and staff members who I totally disagree with. 

I realize that I will have my hands tied in many situations that I wish I could change; but in each 


happen, some days I run into every asshole possible, some days I wish I could just stay in bed 

and pull the covers over my head, some days I wish I were never born, but 

sometimes......sometimes..... when I am having a day from hell and I wish someone would just pull 

the plug, I run into someone who does something totally out of the blue that is kind, 

compassionate, and loving, or sweet, simple, and funny that touches my heart and restores my 

faith in humanity; and that is what I strive to do. I am not perfect. I am not always nice (there are 

times when I want to bite people's heads off, but there are other times when I see people stressed 

out to their max and I see that they need a little help, a kind gesture, a word of encouragement, 

a smile, a funny joke, a goofy look, a pat on the back, a big bear hug, or a soft warm embrace...... 

life is not easy....it never will be..... just do the best you can do and when you realize that you are 

1793

heading too far off track, reassess your actions and steer yourself towards the path you wish to 

travel. Success in life is in getting back up every time you fall down and getting yourself back on 

the right track again. 


me? How do you teach in an environment with so many views and understandings? What is the 

key to lasting success in the teaching profession? 



Just because one promotes equality and understanding of others within your classroom, not all 

of your children nor there parents or society at large will approve of your styles. How does one 

begin to develop a framework for addressing oppositional view points? Not everyone believes 

that equality is a good thing, not everyone believes that all children deserve an equal 

education. Sad, but very true. What happens when you are a strong believer of bi-lingual 

education and the superintendent says "NOT ON MY WATCH." We all carry with us an 

understanding of how we feel everyone else should view the world. But, how do you teach in 

an environment with so many views and understandings? How much control will we have over 

our future curriculums, units, lessons, words, feelings, beliefs, etc.? and where does one draw 

the line? How much control will one have to say "NOT ON MY WATCH" and understanding 

that when will you stop fighting? This is one reason teachers don' t stay in the profession for 

very long. How will we combat this? Many will probably go with the flow and buy there house 

and retire having not helped change society in any formidable motion. But, how can we begin 

to work within the system to promote change in what each of us views to be a positive direction 







> 

>Matheno, 

> 

>Your'e right... Topics of inequality are brought up brefly, but never delt with on levels that 

could help make a change. I myself am not planning on teaching near the coast, and I plan to 

go into teaching with the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I want to create a classroom that is a 

safe learning environment for everyone. Everyone: European American, African American, 

Asian American, Mexican American, Christian American, Mormon American, Catholic 

American, Heterosexual American, Homosexual American...........etc. I want to include and 

respect everyone to the best of my abilities. I know I will not be perfect, but I know I will do 

everything in my abilities to help promote well rounded children of the future. 

>Ann 

> 

1794



> 














































> 

>Matheno 

> 



1795

_____ 

_____ 


> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 






_____ 



1796





Subject: RE: Questions...Ann 

Ann, 

Here is some responses to your questions....mind you they are not the only ones. 

When does she give up and not fight for her rights? 

One should always fight for what they believe in, but only in the context of the situational limitations 

set forth by society. One can't overcome what they view as inequality without the will of the people 

that they live amongst. Essentially one must get the majority of the people to believe in the way that 

they do. How does one do this? The question of power, it within this power that a person can begin to 

place upon another a certain view point. Look at the struggle a group with little power had to endure 

and ask "am I willing to take that challenge and sacrifice everything" and "are there enough people 

who will join me." If not, you SOL. 

How does she begin to build a framework for addressing oppositional viewpoints? 

One builds a framework for addressing oppositional viewpoints by having the ability to persuade 

others to think in the same way. The other way is to allow all parties to have a view and saying that 

none are correct and yet another way is to allow others to place their views upon you. 

How does she live in an environment with so many oppositional views and understandings? 

Most commonly people withdraw from society and into smaller more homogenous groupings because 

they are tired of the fight. Therefore, people don't have to be constantly challenged and ridiculed for 

their ideologies. If one is to stay within society at large they can find that life is often marked with 

disappointment and they can begin to develop a since of about the world. The other is to except that it 

may be true that no one has the correct answer and live knowing that you are doing what is best for 

you and yours. 

What is the key for her success in this world? 

The ultimate key to anyone's success in this world is gain. One wants to gain something from living. 

Whether that gain is money, feelings, love, emotion, materials, makeup, fossil bones or whatever, 

people want to have more than they came in with. One can measure success by measuring how 

much of any given thing they have gained throughout their life time. Hopefully, one does not try to find 

gain in something that is oppositionally against them because this can lead to disenchantment and a 

general feeling of failure. 

what would be the keys for her success in the teaching environment? 

Sad, but true one of her keys to success in the teaching environment is making sure that nobody 

finds out that she is a lesbian. Furthermore, she must not let anyone believe that she is in anyway 

shape or form for or against the gay lifestyle, thus neutral. An article that I read many years ago 

spoke of a lesbian teacher who was fired, due to parent pressure, for supporting a teenager as they 

were beginning to express their emotions relating to being gay. Mind you there is much that goes into 

1797

the success of a persons teaching, but if I knew all the answers I would be bored within all of our 

classes and I am not, for the most part. 

By no means are these the only answers to your questions, just my answers. They make sense to me 

because it is grounded in my understanding of the world, which is driven by my personal interest and 

education/understanding of the world. 

One enjoys like pairs. It is not enjoyable to feel constantly at odds and one must look within society to 

find which place they stand because we are not "one country indivisible." We are divided on many 

many many many many many fronts and the revolution is not coming any time soon because there 

are not two declared sides, but a plethora of sides. 

Lots of Love, 

Robert 




>Subject: Questions... 

>Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 08:57:28 -0700 (PDT) 

> 

>Oh, and if anyone has any pointers for those questions, maybe you can seriously give some advice 

on other social issues such as: how does a black man, or even worse a black woman, or even worse 

yet, a black lesbian live in a society that is not set up in her favor? How does she get up in the 

morning and drive to work and and live in a society that is made up of members in society that think 

she does not deserve the same opportunities and the same rights as others in that society? 

> 

>When does she give up and not fight for her rights? 

>How does she begin to build a framework for addressing oppositional viewpoints? 

>How does she live in an environment with so many oppositional views and understandings? 

>What is the key for her success in this world? 

>And, if she was a teacher, what would be the keys for her success in the teaching environment? 

> 

>Ann 

> 


>I guess you play it by ear. You test the waters, you test where people stand and adjust yourself so 

that you don't rock the boat to a detrimental degree. I guess one would want to teach at a school that 

promotes similar believes first of all, and then just do the best they can in each situation. Kind of like 

a relationship with someone. Why be in a relationship with someone who drinks all the time if you 

don't like drinking that much? That right there will be a constant struggle in your relationship. 

Instead, find someone (or a school) that shares common interests and hobbies... the chances for 

unity and success are (more lined up). 

> 

>As far as all the other factors as parents and society at large, just do the best you can to both set 

good examples and aim for small change. One small thing at a time will eventually add up to some 

change.. It may not be the change on the scale that you had hoped for, but when working with other 

people, you can't change people who don't want to change. The only person we have control over in 

this world is ourselves. The only people we can truly change, is ourselves. You can not change 

people who do not want to change. If you do help change someone, it was because they were willing 

and open to change. 

> 

1798


going to be parents who I will dislike with a passion and staff members who I totally disagree with. I 

realize that I will have my hands tied in many situations that I wish I could change; but in each 


happen, some days I run into every asshole possible, some days I wish I could just stay in bed and 

pull the covers over my head, some days I wish I were never born, but sometimes......sometimes..... 

when I am having a day from hell and I wish someone would just pull the plug, I run into someone 

who does something totally out of the blue that is kind, compassionate, and loving, or sweet, simple, 

and funny that touches my heart and restores my faith in humanity; and that is what I strive to do. I 

am not perfect. ;I am not always nice (there are times when I want to bite people 

> 's heads 

> off, but there are other times when I see people stressed out to their max and I see that they need 

a little help, a kind gesture, a word of encouragement, a smile, a funny joke, a goofy look, a pat on the 

back, a big bear hug, or a soft warm embrace...... life is not easy....it never will be..... just do the best 

you can do and when you realize that you are heading too far off track, reassess your actions and 

steer yourself towards the path you wish to travel. Success in life is in getting back up every time you 

fall down and getting yourself back on the right track again. 

> 

>So how does one begin to develop a framework for addressing oppositional view points... you tell 

me? How do you teach in an environment with so many views and understandings? What is the key 

to lasting success in the teaching profession? 

> 

>Ann 

> 


> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>Just because one promotes equality and understanding of others within your classroom, not all of 

your children nor there parents or society at large will approve of your styles. How does one begin to 

develop a framework for addressing oppositional view points? Not everyone believes that equality is a 

good thing, not everyone believes that all children deserve an equal education. Sad, but very true. 

What happens when you are a strong believer of bi-lingual education and the superintendent says 

"NOT ON MY WATCH." We all carry with us an understanding of how we feel everyone else should 

view the world. But, how do you teach in an environment with so many views and understandings? 

How much control will we have over our future curriculums, units, lessons, words, feelings, beliefs, 

etc.? and where does one draw the line? How much control will one have to say "NOT ON MY 

WATCH" and understanding that when will you stop fighting? This is one reason teachers don' t stay 

in the professi 

> on for 

> very long. How will we combat this? Many will probably go with the flow and buy there house and 

retire having not helped change society in any formidable motion. But, how can we begin to work 

within the system to promote change in what each of us views to be a positive direction and many of 

us may view as a negative direction? 

> 

> 

> 

> 




1799


> >Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 10:00:13 -0700 (PDT) 

> > 

> >Matheno, 

> > 

> >Your'e right... Topics of inequality are brought up brefly, but never delt with on levels that could 


teaching with the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I want to create a classroom that is a safe learning 






> >Ann 

> > 

> >lande008 wrote: 

> >Dear list serve members, 

> > 

> >As I read some of the journals late the other night (recently got internet 

> >hooked up at the crib)I thought to myself "damn i have been missing out on the 

> >opportunity to show the cohort and faculty that I am an able writer and as Jim 

> >Rome would say have good takes." That being said, I can't absolutely pinpoint 

> >why my activity on the list serve has been so sparse other than to say that my 

> >life as i'm sure some of yours doesn't revolve around our cohort (as much as 

> >it should) and especially not an email list (my closest friends and i don't 

> >communicate via email so it is not a medium with which I am completely 

> >comfortable) so other than doing the necessary number of journals I haven't 

> >been around to jump on some of the entries that I should have. For instance, 

> >their was a posting recently speaking about the difference in literacy between 

> >students in poor school versus rich or church based schools that I wanted to 

> >respond to by saying that in poor schools (the faculty usually doesn't push 

> >the stduents the way they need to be pushed either out of a feeling that the 

> >students aren't capable of grasping the material or indiffernce whether or not 

> >their students ever become intellignent novices. Along the same lines, as I 

> >can say from my own personal experiences when minorities attend schools in 

> >middle class or well to do areas they still aren't pushed to succeed but 

> >rather allowed to simply coast through without fear of failure (our test 

> >scores will still be high compared to the rest of the schools so if these kids 

> >aren't prepared it won't reflect on us overall) so we are left to motivate 

> >ourselves and if you are one that continually is pressuring the teacher to 

> >help you or explain something clearer (i have felt as if they think you are 

> >just trying to kiss their ass or are doing so for another reason rather than 

> >just a desire to learn (this being in the high school years)). But their is 

> >an overall feeling i have seen of "what hope is there for these students" 

> >without every taking the time to think that you are there "hope" and the one 

> >that needs to be challenging each and every one of them. I perceive that the 

> >majority of my cohort members desire to work in the carlsbad, encinitas, and 

> >rancho bernardos but sorry guys you all aren't going to be able to work their 

> >and it is my fear that when you do get a job in an area you don't want to work 

> >in for whatever reason (hopefully not because of the ethnicity or 

> >socio-economic status of your students) you will resent your position and 

> >continue the string of teachers who don't care about the performance of their 

> >students or don't feel that they can make an impact. That being said, I tend 

1800


> >could be labeled for speaking their mind but I can't worry about that at this 

> >time. I feel that our "multicultural education" courses have only reinforced 

> >that their is a gap between the education of minorites and done little to 

> >encourage future teachers that this trend can change if they want it to. Its 

> >like "look at these test scores" and thats it no explination as to why this is 

> >so or how it can be fixed. Anyways folks just a few things i wanted to get 

> >off my chest in between patrons here in the media library so if its muttered 

> >up my apologies but please feel free to discuss with me anything you would 

> >like and i'll make an effort to respond to your thoughts as well. 

> > 

> >Matheno 

> > 

> >p.s. pressure is a good driving force, but stress is just that stress never a 

> >good driving force it is simply stress. Rick Pitino (not his exact words but 

> >along those lines) 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 


> >Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

>MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page – FREE download! 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 


1801





Subject: Ann's journal / Change 

Your journal was rather thought provoking and I had to ponder it a while before I responded. Much like most of us in the 

cohort, I want to get out there, give my students the best darn education they'll receive and "make a difference" in their 

lives. The reality is that we only have those students in our classrooms for about 10 months - and the times that we do 

have them for quality instruction is peppered with interruptions, sick days, holidays, family issues yadda yadda yadda! So 

with all the red tape that we have to wade through in the educational arena, topped with the limited exposure to our 

students, I feel that any miniscule change that we can bring about is a blessing. Of course, with any of my future students 

I hope to exceed any expectations in light of their education, but, like you said in your journal, I plan on taking small steps 

which hopefully will evolve into larger steps. At the heart of our profession is the students. We always need to keep that 

in the back of our mind as we're thinking about all the other factors that we will come across in our careers (unethical 

teachers, unresponsive parents, unsupportive principals etc.). ~ Louise 






I guess you play it by ear. You test the waters, you test where people stand and adjust yourself 

so that you don't rock the boat to a detrimental degree. I guess one would want to teach at a 

school that promotes similar believes first of all, and then just do the best they can in each 

situation. Kind of like a relationship with someone. Why be in a relationship with someone who 

drinks all the time if you don't like drinking that much? That right there will be a constant struggle 

in your relationship. Instead, find someone (or a school) that shares common interests and 

hobbies... the chances for unity and success are (more lined up). 


good examples and aim for small change. One small thing at a time will eventually add up to 

some change.. It may not be the change on the scale that you had hoped for, but when working 

with other people, you can't change people who don't want to change. The only person we have 

control over in this world is ourselves. The only people we can truly change, is ourselves. You 

can not change people who do not want to change. If you do help change someone, it was 

because they were willing and open to change. 


going to be parents who I will dislike with a passion and staff members who I totally disagree with. 

I realize that I will have my hands tied in many situations that I wish I could change; but in each 


happen, some days I run into every asshole possible, some days I wish I could just stay in bed 

and pull the covers over my head, some days I wish I were never born, but 

sometimes......sometimes..... when I am having a day from hell and I wish someone would just pull 

the plug, I run into someone who does something totally out of the blue that is kind, 

compassionate, and loving, or sweet, simple, and funny that touches my heart and restores my 

faith in humanity; and that is what I strive to do. I am not perfect. I am not always nice (there are 

times when I want to bite people's heads off, but there are other times when I see people stressed 

out to their max and I see that they need a little help, a kind gesture, a word of encouragement, 

1802

a smile, a funny joke, a goofy look, a pat on the back, a big bear hug, or a soft warm embrace...... 

life is not easy....it never will be..... just do the best you can do and when you realize that you are 

heading too far off track, reassess your actions and steer yourself towards the path you wish to 

travel. Success in life is in getting back up every time you fall down and getting yourself back on 

the right track again. 


me? How do you teach in an environment with so many views and understandings? What is the 

key to lasting success in the teaching profession? 























> 

>Matheno, 

> 









1803

Ann 

> 



> 














































> 

>Matheno 

> 

1804

_____ 

_____ 




> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 






1805




To: Class List; lande008 

Subject: RE: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 

Matheno is right; we are not all going to get hired at schools that we want. I 

myself intend to work at a low-income school. In fact, I have already been 

offered a job in one school that has a high teacher turn-over. I know what to 

expect as I have been volunteering in a low-income school for some time. Some 

of the students have parents who are drug addicts, some live in motels, many 

are often absent, and some even come to school wearing the same clothes 

everyday. I know what I will be getting myself into, but this is exactly what 

I want to do. I know it is not going to be easy but, I want to teach those 

kids who are given up on. 

The student population at the school I hope to teach at is predominately 

Hispanic, but there are other ethnicities as well: white, black, Asian, etc. 

The thing they all have in common is they all come from a low socioeconomic 

background, like myself. I attended a school in a well-to-do neighborhood and 

I was one of those minorities who was not pushed to succeed. My goal is not 

just to push minorities to succeed, I want all students to succeed regardless 

of their economic or social status. So, I for one will be happy, if I get 

hired at a low-income school. 

Cecilia 

>===== Original Message From lande008 ===== 


> 


>hooked up at the crib)I thought to myself "damn i have been missing out on 

the 

>opportunity to show the cohort and faculty that I am an able writer and as 

Jim 

>Rome would say have good takes." That being said, I can't absolutely 

pinpoint 

>why my activity on the list serve has been so sparse other than to say that 

my 






>their was a posting recently speaking about the difference in literacy 

between 




>students aren't capable of grasping the material or indiffernce whether or 

not 





>scores will still be high compared to the rest of the schools so if these 

1806

kids 











>and it is my fear that when you do get a job in an area you don't want to 

work 





>to bite my tongue for fear of being the "angry black man" or whatever else 

one 





>like "look at these test scores" and thats it no explination as to why this 

is 





> 

>Matheno 

> 




1807





Subject: The best journal ever 

Now that I got your attention pull up a chair and listen to me flap. Michael 

proved a good point in journal 11 that beliefs expereiences, outlooks 

judgments biases stereotypical beliefs values and levels of dedication and 

compassions are not teachable. Adding on to that, I think that teachers and 

educators do have the ability to positively affect the way the studetns think. 

They also have the abiility to corrupt the way a child thinks. By 

demonstrating enthusiasm and passion for learning students are able to get a 

feel for the excitment and adventures of learning. If a teacher shows 

compassion for people around the world hopefully it will direct the student on 

a path of love and compassion for the world which is so diverse. 

Moving on to what I have learned this week. Sagan when talking about parents 

views on teachers states that, people complain that teachers are trained how 

to teach but not what to teach. After reading that statement I asked myself. 

What is it to be trained how to teach? Is it providing instruction for how to 

learn about various subjects, is it how to make accomodations for all learners 

or is it that we will teach it to you and you teach it to them. I know that I 

know how electricity works so from that point to I just tell them how it works 

and hope that it makes sense. Electricity did not make sense to me when I was 

younger but I learned about it and I moved on It seemed like my teacher didn't 

really understand it either but she had to teach it to me. The teacher made it 

through the lesson but we didn't get it and it was a waste of time but we all 

survived. I hope I will be able to clearly expain things. I do not want to be 

a teacher that just brushes through the lesson with a blind fold on unaware 

and to afraid to see if students understand it. i think I have a good hold on 

what to teach. I feel like when we are taught how to teach that those moments 

come very seldomly and when it does come the expaination is empty and airy. I 

guess the best way to see how to teach is really just by teaching. However 

being in our classess over time I feel like I can step back and say that I 

have learned a lot on how to teach. 

"only the educated are free". I liked that chapter 21 of Sagan started with 

that quote. Not until I finished this chapter did I really understand the 

quote. I feel like this chapter was well writen because in just a few pages it 

gave me a whole new outlook on how education can give us freedom and how lack 

of knowledge limits our lives. It is stange to me how whites acted so 

supperior over black during the days of slavery and all along they knew that 

the only true reason why they would call African Americans bad names and treat 

them so horribly was because they kept books and knowledge out of reach for 

them. They knew that if they were given the freedom to become educated that 

African American could rise at or above the level of whites. They feared 

African Americans because the whites gained their confidence by acting 

supperior but deep inside they knew that they could be just as smart and just 

as sucessful if they were given the chance to learn. Plus African Americans 

can dance and sing way better than whites. It blows my mind that people 

thought that they were following God's orders by enforcing slavery. God and 

horrible treatment do not go well together. How can you be good but hurt 

people it does not make sense. 

The chapter also brings up the importance of introducing the joy and benefits 

of growing up in a literate household. I feel like studetns should be looking 

at books from the moment their hands can grasp objects. The earlier a child 

begins to look at letters and hold books the sooner it will help them become 

familir to them. Well I have this friend she's really rich and very smart and 

has to children. She is a great mother but I have curiosites for the school 

she is sending them to. It is some new school when the children only engage in 

1808

artistic activities. This goes on until they are 7 years old. At that point 

the school beleives that the child has has so much exposure to people talking 

and using complete sentences that the child will automatically be able to read 

and write complete sentences. If any on has an opinion on this style of 

learning please tell me what you think. i cannot recall the name of the school 

but if anyone got this far and is curious i can find out. Okay I gotta jet. 

Take care gang. Your pal Marin 

1809





Subject: Application & Problem Solving ... 

It was not surprising to read in Sagan's reading, "No such thing as a Dumb Question" that 

Japan, South Korea, and Western Canada was ahead of American students in mathematics and 

science." This made me think of an article I read that compared the math instruction in 

Japan, Germany, and the United States. I think understanding the disparity between 

countries' math and science scores is a complex concept to understand. The scores do not 

take into consideration teachers' training, how the federal government funds are used, the 

emphasis placed on testing and homework, the percentage of teachers who use the board, 

diversity in the classroom, and the approach to lesson planning. The article titled, "How 

Culture Shapes Math Instruction in Japan, Germany, and the United States" (The California 

Education Policy Seminar and The California State University Institute sponsored the 

article for Education Reform) looks closely at the teaching philosophies of the above 

countries while takin 

g into consideration other factors besides testing. This particular article placed the 

focus on math education but the teaching philosophies applies to other subject areas. As a 

future teacher, I think that it is important that we explore other countries' education 

system and see how we can benefit from their success. This kind of exploration I hope will 

give me an edge for reaching out to all my students. I welcome the opportunity to gain 

insight into other educational systems outside of the U. S. Our classrooms grow more and 

more diverse and understanding teaching philosophies outside our own country becomes more 

crucial. Why? Our student body grows more diverse but the teachers and the classrooms do 

not. Is it possible to bring more than just a lesson about another country into the 

classroom? What is wrong with teaching more like the Japanese, the Germans, the Koreans, 

and the British?? In reading the article, I discovered how homogenous American education 

system really i 

s and how "teaching is highly culturally determined." 

Each country no matter how diverse has a distinct teaching style. Let us look at it this 

way, as distinct as the American culture is from the Germans, the Japanese, the Koreans, 

etc. it would make sense that each culture has its unique teaching philosophies. I 

assumed that Japan rate of educational success had to do with the long hours that Japanese 

children were in school. I also assumed that much focus was placed on preparing students 

for testing. 

According to the study, the Japanese do not put a huge focus on testing. The success rate 

of the Japanese students is contributed to how the Japanese teacher used the resources 

available. For example, the Japanese teachers use the chalkboard 100% while the U.S. uses 

the chalkboard 67%. The important thing I discovered in not how the tools are used but the 

philosophy behind the lesson, for example, recorded on the chalkboard. For instance, the 

Japanese's "philosophy is to treat the chalkboard as their record of the entire lesson 

being taught. This gives visual learners and everyone the opportunity to have a good set 

of notes to reflect on and ask questions. Rather, than trying to take notes and learn a 

concept at the same time. The teacher facilitates the learning by reemphasizing what 

she/he is saying by writing it on the board. Whereas, the teachers in the U.S. use visual 

aids and "body language in a constant battle to draw students' attention to their words. 

Moreover, the U 

.S. focuses math lesson on teaching the students how to solve math problems rather than 

giving the students the opportunity to think and apply what they know into solving a 

problem. Meanwhile,the Japanese teachers teach students math concepts by explaining what 

the math concepts mean and giving the students the opportunity to apply the math concepts 

and figure out their own method of problem solving.How do teacher from Japan lesson plans? 

The Japanese teachers prepare lesson plans using a methodical approach. The lesson plans 

are prepared with the questions the students may ask, the areas of difficulty that may 

arise for the students, and the possible mistakes the students will make in working 

through a math concept. Furthermore, the Japanese teachers work on one-lesson plan for an 

entire year. Whereas, the American teachers rely on previous lessons and quickly put 

together a lesson plan on prior instructions. Another interesting and novel approach is 

the way other Japanese teachers observe a teacher implementing a new lesson in order to 

study the students during the lesson; the teachers then meet to review and revise the 

1810

lesson and later present the lesson to the entire faculty where the teacher receives more 

criticism. It was interesting to learn how the federal government supports Japanese 

teachers. 

In Japan, the federal government funds are used to pay for "In-service teacher training," 

rather than investing that money on keeping class size smaller. The average class size in 

Japan has 40 students. Unlike our thinking in the U.S. that Japanese schools are not 

diverse, in fact, the schools are very diverse because unlike the U.S. where students are 

tracked and divided by ability, the students in Japans are placed in random classrooms. 

Therefore, the teaching techniques used in Japan targets a diverse classroom and the 

teaching techniques in the U.S. work well in a homogenous classroom." How well do American 

schools use class time? 

American teachers have little time set aside for developing and teaching a lesson. 

Instead, the time is used on going over homework and checking to see if homework is 

completed. In Japan, there is little emphasis placed on homework, "only 24% of Japanese 

teachers" assigned homework. Meanwhile, 90% of the American teachers assign homework and 

place emphasis on the use of concepts and method, rather than application. For example, 

American teachers explain what is a numerator, denominator, how to divide, multiply, etc. 

The concept is stated but not developed. The study showed that "approximately 80% of the 

concepts in the U.S. were only stated and never developed, whereas in Germany and Japan 

the exact opposite pattern occurred." Given Sagan's findings that "the average math gap 

between white and black U.S. high school graduates is still huge- two to three grade 

levels; but the gap between white U.S. high school graduates and those in, say Japan, 

Canada, Great Britain?is more th 

an twice as large (with U.S. students behind)" (Sagan 329). Then it is important that we 

look at other factors that affect our education system besides blaming it on testing, 

class size, and diversity issues. Motivating and teaching our students how to think seems 

to play an important factor in educating our students. Teaching concepts is not enough. 

Applying the concepts the way this semester of science has taught us in Ochanji's class 

through exploration and applications seems to give students to opportunity to problem 

solve while promoting thinking. (Alexandra's journal #11) 

1811





Subject: RE: journal--my journal 

This entry has some meaning to me as my boyfriend (phil) passed away almost 

a year ago in a car accident. Casey made a very valid point about how many 

lives her friend touched and was amazed by how many lives he touched. As I 

was amazed by how many lives my boyfriend touched and by the number of 

people that he knew. It was at that point that I stopped to think about the 

people around me. I mean i always thought about the close ones around me and 

how much they would be impacted if i were not here, but I think many time we 

dont stop to think about the other people around us that we have contact 

with, but not necessarily on a daily basis and how much even the smallest 

amount of contact with someone can mean a lot. Even though one might not 

tell another how much they mean to someone it is amazing how many lives you 

do impact without even realizing it. I am sure my boyfriend had no idea how 

many people thought so highly of him or even knew they recognized him or 

even loved him. 

Furthermore, Phil was one of those people that had a zest for life, which 

scared me. I was always worried about him and what he was doing just because 

I knew if he had the opportunity to do anything he gave it no thought. I 

know he cared about many people and wasn't doing things to be rebellious it 

was just who he was. But I often wonder why he would do random dangerous 

stuff knowing that his life was at risk? Wasn't there something else to do 

besides putting your life at risk? But from all of this I am much more 

aware of so many things. Some of them are good and some are bad. I think i 

have always been the kind of person who has been caring and aware of many 

things. For example, hearing about a car accident and the lives that have 

been lost or seriously injured or anything life threatening I always thought 

how horrible, but now it means so much more since i've been living through 

the emotions for the last 11 months. Now when i hear about an accident or 

something horrible i can't help but think about that persons family, friends 

and the out siders who knew that person. I think about his family everyday 

and what they are going through. 

As future teachers I think we need to be aware of our students needs and the 

emotions that they will go through if something tragic happens in their 

life. I know they have school counselors and psychologist for students but 

sometimes thats not enough. Or perhaps that students not comfortable talking 

to the counselor or psychologist and are comfortable talking to you, the 

teacher. If this were to arise, I would do my best to help and support the 

student. I know sometimes you just need someone to talk to, or listen to 

you. Also, since this is a very sensitive subject and many adults don't even 

know what to say to people when something tragic happens I think that if it 

was appropropriete that the other students should know and understand what 

was going on with their classmate. I know something tragic is hard for young 

kids to comprehend, but a little understanding and clarification is better 

than none. I think this goes along with what yamashita was saying when we 

were reading Kolata about if something like the flu pandemic were to arise 

again should we, or could we talk about it with our students? And while the 

tragedy might not be something nation wide I think that we should be able to 

talk to the students about the issue. 

So this journal was completely personal but really hit home after I read 

what casey had to say. It made me think about my experience and us as future 

teachers and what could happen to any of our students. ( HOpefully, they 

won't have to experience something so tragic at a young age, but life is not 

perfect) 

1812




>Subject: journal 

>Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 19:06:42 EDT 

> 

>This week as been an extremely hard week for me. As you all probably 

>noticed 

>I was not in class yesterday. One of my very good friends died over spring 

>break. He was in Cabo San Lucas. He has a very adventurous personality and 

>decided to go diving- by himself. That was the last time any of his friends 

>saw him 

>alive. Three days later they found his body. Why do things like this 

>happen? 

>He had so much life to live. The thing I was thinking about the most 

>yesterday 

>when I was reading and hearing all these beautiful things about him and how 

>many people loved him. Did he know this? Did he know how many people's 

>lives he 

>touched and made a difference in? I know this is deep and a completely 

>random 

>journal but this is the only thing I can think to write. As I was sitting 

>at 

>the funeral, the priest was talking about how you never know when the last 

>time 

>you will see a person is. You never know if today is going to be the last 

>day 

>you get to see their face and hear their voice. And I thought of how 

>stressed 

>I have been and how hard the semester is- and then I thought- I am lucky to 

>be able to be stressed and have a hard semester. He was one semester away 

>from 

>graduating. I don't know- I know that people begin to think like this when 

>tradegy strikes- but shouldn't we think like this more often? We are so 

>lucky to 

>have known eachother and experience all our different cultures and beliefs. 

>Very deep I know but again Life is too short! Casey Cunningham 

_________________________________________________________________ 


http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/ 

1813





Subject: unfortunates 

i think we should all be aware that this stuff does happen to the kids in our class. we 

wish it doesnt, but it does and we need to be aware of each students' situation so we can 

be understanding and loving. 

in my field work class last semester, a student lost his father to a heartattack. this 

not only crushed him but every single student in the class, the teachers and the parents. 

the whole school was in shock. 

anothe rboys lost his dad when he was 3 and his mom was not available. although this 

didnt happen during this school year, it happened and cant be forgotten. 

its amazing what these kids go through in the sixth grade, and im sure it happens in the 

lower grades as well. this is stemming from carrie's email, so i just wanted to remind 

everyone that this kind of thing happens even in your classroom. so when you have an 

unruly kid or painfully shy one, make sure you know whats going on before your evil side 

comes out. 

with love. 

> 


> Date: 2004/04/11 Sun PM 11:53:18 PDT 


> Subject: RE: journal--my journal 

> 

> This entry has some meaning to me as my boyfriend (phil) passed away almost 

> a year ago in a car accident. Casey made a very valid point about how many 

> lives her friend touched and was amazed by how many lives he touched. As I 

> was amazed by how many lives my boyfriend touched and by the number of 

> people that he knew. It was at that point that I stopped to think about the 

> people around me. I mean i always thought about the close ones around me and 

> how much they would be impacted if i were not here, but I think many time we 

> dont stop to think about the other people around us that we have contact 

> with, but not necessarily on a daily basis and how much even the smallest 

> amount of contact with someone can mean a lot. Even though one might not 

> tell another how much they mean to someone it is amazing how many lives you 

> do impact without even realizing it. I am sure my boyfriend had no idea how 

> many people thought so highly of him or even knew they recognized him or 

> even loved him. 

> 

> Furthermore, Phil was one of those people that had a zest for life, which 

> scared me. I was always worried about him and what he was doing just because 

> I knew if he had the opportunity to do anything he gave it no thought. I 

> know he cared about many people and wasn't doing things to be rebellious it 

> was just who he was. But I often wonder why he would do random dangerous 

> stuff knowing that his life was at risk? Wasn't there something else to do 

> besides putting your life at risk? But from all of this I am much more 

> aware of so many things. Some of them are good and some are bad. I think i 

> have always been the kind of person who has been caring and aware of many 

> things. For example, hearing about a car accident and the lives that have 

> been lost or seriously injured or anything life threatening I always thought 

> how horrible, but now it means so much more since i've been living through 

> the emotions for the last 11 months. Now when i hear about an accident or 

> something horrible i can't help but think about that persons family, friends 

> and the out siders who knew that person. I think about his family everyday 

> and what they are going through. 

1814

> As future teachers I think we need to be aware of our students needs and the 

> emotions that they will go through if something tragic happens in their 

> life. I know they have school counselors and psychologist for students but 

> sometimes thats not enough. Or perhaps that students not comfortable talking 

> to the counselor or psychologist and are comfortable talking to you, the 

> teacher. If this were to arise, I would do my best to help and support the 

> student. I know sometimes you just need someone to talk to, or listen to 

> you. Also, since this is a very sensitive subject and many adults don't even 

> know what to say to people when something tragic happens I think that if it 

> was appropropriete that the other students should know and understand what 

> was going on with their classmate. I know something tragic is hard for young 

> kids to comprehend, but a little understanding and clarification is better 

> than none. I think this goes along with what yamashita was saying when we 

> were reading Kolata about if something like the flu pandemic were to arise 

> again should we, or could we talk about it with our students? And while the 

> tragedy might not be something nation wide I think that we should be able to 

> talk to the students about the issue. 

> 

> So this journal was completely personal but really hit home after I read 

> what casey had to say. It made me think about my experience and us as future 

> teachers and what could happen to any of our students. ( HOpefully, they 

> won't have to experience something so tragic at a young age, but life is not 

> perfect) 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >From: CA222girl@aol.com 



> >Subject: journal 

> >Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 19:06:42 EDT 

> > 

> >This week as been an extremely hard week for me. As you all probably 

> >noticed 

> >I was not in class yesterday. One of my very good friends died over spring 

> >break. He was in Cabo San Lucas. He has a very adventurous personality and 

> >decided to go diving- by himself. That was the last time any of his friends 

> >saw him 

> >alive. Three days later they found his body. Why do things like this 

> >happen? 

> >He had so much life to live. The thing I was thinking about the most 

> >yesterday 

> >when I was reading and hearing all these beautiful things about him and how 

> >many people loved him. Did he know this? Did he know how many people's 

> >lives he 

> >touched and made a difference in? I know this is deep and a completely 

> >random 

> >journal but this is the only thing I can think to write. As I was sitting 

> >at 

> >the funeral, the priest was talking about how you never know when the last 

> >time 

> >you will see a person is. You never know if today is going to be the last 

> >day 

> >you get to see their face and hear their voice. And I thought of how 

> >stressed 

> >I have been and how hard the semester is- and then I thought- I am lucky to 

> >be able to be stressed and have a hard semester. He was one semester away 

> >from 

> >graduating. I don't know- I know that people begin to think like this when 

> >tradegy strikes- but shouldn't we think like this more often? We are so 

> >lucky to 

> >have known eachother and experience all our different cultures and beliefs. 

> >Very deep I know but again Life is too short! Casey Cunningham 

> 

1815

_________________________________________________________________ 

> Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar – FREE! 

> http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/ 

> 

> 


1816





Subject: journal for the week of 4/5 

I alos agree with Matheno we are no going to get hired at schools that we want 

because we are new teachers we have to take what they give us. I personally 

can already see myself at a school with a low socioeconomic background because 

these are the schools that need out help. We have to start out at the bottom 

of the pole and work our way up. This is like life we start out at a certain 

level and then we work hard to move up the pay scale in our jobs or even 

changing homes, new community ect. I know that when I start teaching in a low 

socioeconomic community that it will be hard and I will have to put in more 

work in order to teach the students what they need to learn. 

I also feel that the more WORK HARD I put in then the more my students will 

really benifit from it. As I do this I will be learning from a great 

experience of teaching these kids. Just like Ann said, "You have to role with 

the punches" we dont always get what we want but we have to make do with what 

we get. 

JONATHAN 

1817





Subject: RE: Application & Problem Solving ... 

Alexandra, 

You are comparing what you view as the worst US schools and practices, with the best Japanese schools and 

practices. I hope that you realize that this gives your words a weighted level of bias. Teachers in the U.S. are 

also required to have in-service training where they discuss proven methods. The classrooms in the U.S. are not 

supposed to grouped by level and in most cases are not. There is a big difference between having different 

dialects and having different languages. Although we have learned that problem solving is an essential skill that 

our students must have, we have also learned through the Bruer book that teaching the concept is also 

necessary. All problem solving and no concept, makes for a very bad lesson. Exploration, Concept, Application. 

One must truly begin to understand that there are fundamental social differences between the U.S. and other 

countries, thus it is not practical to adopt all of their practices. This is not to say that we should not examine 

these educational structures, but we should not blindly say that they are whole heartedly better than ours. For 

one thing people such as myself, being that I have Dyslexia, would have been bared from a higher education 

due to the genetic makeup. Is this a good way to go about it? I hope not. Also, Japanese students attend school 

about two months longer than do American students, but this is not discussed in your reasons for better 

performance. Also, the students bow to their teachers at the start of everyday and they make their own food and 

clean the school. One mu st ask themselves, what are the fundamental differences and accepted ideologies that 

would prevent American schools from conducting their education in a similar fashion? 

Robert. 

>From: 



>Subject: Application & Problem Solving ... 

>Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> 

>It was not surprising to read in Sagan's reading, "No such thing as a Dumb Question" that Japan, 

South Korea, and Western Canada was ahead of American students in mathematics and 

science." This made me think of an article I read that compared the math instruction in Japan, 

Germany, and the United States. I think understanding the disparity between countries' math and 

science scores is a complex concept to understand. The scores do not take into consideration 

teachers' training, how the federal government funds are used, the emphasis placed on testing and 

homework, the percentage of teachers who use the board, diversity in the classroom, and the 

approach to lesson planning. The article titled, "How Culture Shapes Math Instruction in Japan, 

Germany, and the United States" (The California Education Policy Seminar and The California State 

University Institute sponsored the article for Education Reform) looks closely at the teaching 

philosophies of the ab ove countries while takin 

> g into consideration other factors besides testing. This particular article placed the focus on math 

1818

education but the teaching philosophies applies to other subject areas. As a future teacher, I think 

that it is important that we explore other countries' education system and see how we can benefit 

from their success. This kind of exploration I hope will give me an edge for reaching out to all my 

students. I welcome the opportunity to gain insight into other educational systems outside of the U. S. 

Our classrooms grow more and more diverse and understanding teaching philosophies outside our 

own country becomes more crucial. Why? Our student body grows more diverse but the teachers and 

the classrooms do not. Is it possible to bring more than just a lesson about another country into the 

classroom? What is wrong with teaching more like the Japanese, the Germans, the Koreans, and the 

British?? In reading the article, I discovered how homogenous American education system really i 

> s and how "teaching is highly culturally determined." 

>Each country no matter how diverse has a distinct teaching style. Let us look at it this way, as 

distinct as the American culture is from the Germans, the Japanese, the Koreans, etc. it would make 

sense that each culture has its unique teaching philosophies. I assumed that Japan rate of 

educational success had to do with the long hours that Japanese children were in school. I also 

assumed that much focus was placed on preparing students for testing. 

>According to the study, the Japanese do not put a huge focus on testing. The success rate of the 

Japanese students is contributed to how the Japanese teacher used the resources available. For 

example, the Japanese teachers use the chalkboard 100% while the U.S. uses the chalkboard 67%. 

The important thing I discovered in not how the tools are used but the philosophy behind the lesson, 

for example, recorded on the chalkboard. For instance, the Japanese's "philosophy is to treat the 

chalkboard as their record of the entire lesson being taught. This gives visual learners and everyone 

the opportunity to have a good set of notes to reflect on and ask questions. Rather, than trying to take 

notes and learn a concept at the same time. The teacher facilitates the learning by reemphasizing 

what she/he is saying by writing it on the board. Whereas, the teachers in the U.S. use visual aids 

and "body language in a constant battle to draw students' attention to their words. Moreover, the U 

> .S. focuses math lesson on teaching the students how to solve math problems rather than giving 

the students the opportunity to think and apply what they know into solving a problem. Meanwhile,the 

Japanese teachers teach students math concepts by explaining what the math concepts mean and 

giving the students the opportunity to apply the math concepts and figure out their own method of 

problem solving.How do teacher from Japan lesson plans? 

>The Japanese teachers prepare lesson plans using a methodical approach. The lesson plans are 

prepared with the questions the students may ask, the areas of difficulty that may arise for the 

students, and the possible mistakes the students will make in working through a math concept. 

Furthermore, the Japanese teachers work on one-lesson plan for an entire year. Whereas, the 

American teachers rely on previous lessons and quickly put together a lesson plan on prior 

instructions. Another interesting and novel approach is the way other Japanese teachers observe a 

teacher implementing a new lesson in order to study the students during the lesson; the teachers 

then meet to review and revise the lesson and later present the lesson to the entire faculty where the 

teacher receives more criticism. It was interesting to learn how the federal government supports 

Japanese teachers. 

>In Japan, the federal government funds are used to pay for "In-service teacher training," rather than 

investing that money on keeping class size smaller. The average class size in Japan has 40 students. 

Unlike our thinking in the U.S. that Japanese schools are not diverse, in fact, the schools are very 

diverse because unlike the U.S. where students are tracked and divided by ability, the students in 

Japans are placed in random classrooms. Therefore, the teaching techniques used in Japan targets a 

diverse classroom and the teaching techniques in the U.S. work well in a homogenous classroom." 

How well do American schools use class time? 

>American teachers have little time set aside for developing and teaching a lesson. Instead, the time 

is used on going over homework and checking to see if homework is completed. In Japan, there is 

little emphasis placed on homework, "only 24% of Japanese teachers" assigned homework. 

Meanwhile, 90% of the American teachers assign homework and place emphasis on the use of 

concepts and method, rather than application. For example, American teachers explain what is a 

numerator, denominator, how to divide, multiply, etc. The concept is stated but not developed. The 

1819

study showed that "approximately 80% of the concepts in the U.S. were only stated and never 

developed, whereas in Germany and Japan the exact opposite pattern occurred." Given Sagan's 

findings that "the average math gap between white and black U.S. high school graduates is still huge- 

two to three grade levels; but the gap between white U.S. high school graduates and those in, say 

Japan, Canada, Great Bri tain?is more th 

> an twice as large (with U.S. students behind)" (Sagan 329). Then it is important that we look at 

other factors that affect our education system besides blaming it on testing, class size, and diversity 

issues. Motivating and teaching our students how to think seems to play an important factor in 

educating our students. Teaching concepts is not enough. Applying the concepts the way this 

semester of science has taught us in Ochanji's class through exploration and applications seems to 

give students to opportunity to problem solve while promoting thinking. (Alexandra's journal #11) 

> 

> 

_____ 


1820






My sister-n-law who is a second grade teacher at Lincoln elementary is going through exactly what 

you are saying Robert. She has been a strong advocate for bilingual education and I have seen her 

go long ways to battle opposing views on this issue. There is a group of teachers in that school that 

feel so strong about the issue that they have gone as far as contracting lawyers to back them up in 

what they believe in. In that school is not necessarily the parents that oppose bilingual education, but 

the principal and the head honchos. It has gotten to the point that a couple of her collegues have 

gotten fired just because they stand behind their believes 100%. Just recently, she was telling me, the 

little "click" that is for bilingual education at Lincoln was confronted with another surprise. The 

principal held a meeting with each one of them to tell some that some were to be relocated to 

another school. Out of five teachers only two were kept at Lincoln, my sister-n-law( being that she 

was teacher of the year for the last year) and one of her other teacher friend. The staying of my 

sister-n-law and her colleague came at a price though, she was moved to teach fourth grade and the 

other teacher was move to kindergarten. At first I was like cool you got to stay instead of being 

relocated but she then explain the jest of it to me: the change in grade was so that they will not be 

able to communicate at work, for fourth grade teachers and kindergarten teachers have a completely 

different schedule. At the moment that she was telling about all this drama one of her teacher friends 

phoned her and mentioned that they were going to be meeting with a lawyer to file a civil lawsuit. Her 

last comment to me was, "I am so tired of all this it, I have told your brother that I am ready to move 

on to something else". I commend my sister-n-law for what she is doing for the Spanish speakers at 

her school. I am not only saying it because she is my family but because it only motivates me to 

continue where she left off in her struggle. 

Here is one for all the hypocrites, 

Karla 

P.S. to have to relocate teachers only shows that the bosses at Lincoln feel threatened by the kind of 

actions that these group of teachers have taken to defend a cause! 














1821







direction? 






> 

>Matheno, 

> 









>Ann 

> 



> 























1822
























> 

>Matheno 

> 




> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 


1823






Yo Cecilia, 

We might not have such a big ego, about being the smartest people in the world, or about taking over 

the world, but we do have motivation to teach to kids not only to teach them how to become critical 

thinkers, but also to provide them with the love and support that some often lack at home. 


From: tille002 

To: Class List ; lande008 


Subject: RE: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 












The thing they all have in common is they all come from a low socioeconomic 






Cecilia 

>===== Original Message From lande008 ===== 


> 



the 


1824

Jim 


pinpoint 


my 







between 





not 






kids 












work 






one 





>like "look at these test scores" and thats it no explination as to why this 

is 





> 

>Matheno 

1825




1826





Subject: RE: Cecilia's journal... 

Hey Cecilia, 

I can relate to the being poor part. In Jr. high, aside from moving from school to school and never 

feeling grounded, my mother was faced to try and support 4 rebellious teenagers (me being the 

youngest) on a minimum wage job without any child support from my father. I used to have a dorky 

haircut that my mother gave me (not that my hair is not dorky nowadays), and in the 6th grade, I only 

had 2 outfits to wear to school. I would wash and iron them in between wearings and try to wear one 

shirt with altering pants, but the rich snooty girls used to rudely comment, "Isn't that the same thing 

you wore the day before yesterday?" Man, it's the little things like this that really make you 

feel crummy about yourself... they are real self-esteem damagers.... I used to get marked off points in 

my P.E. class because my sweat pants where not the right color, but my mom couldn't buy me a new 

pair. Wouldn't you think my teacher would inves tigate my situation? I remember what a treat it was 

to have a can of soda.... I used to save the aluminum can and refill it with water so I could pretend 

that I had a soda (not at school, but around the house).... one summer, I had a soda can that I used 

at home all summer long as my drinking cup. 

Life was hard back then. So you can see how a caring teacher who really cares about the kids and 

takes the time to notice them can make a difference. I think some of my past experiences make me 

want to be a better teacher. If we encourage our students their little tails will wag and they will want 

to do even better. Kids, adults (young and old)... we all want to be loved, acknowledged, excepted, 

and feel worthwhile. And like E.T. (the extra terrestrial) said, "BE GOOD!" 














The thing they all have in common is they all come fro m a low socioeconomic 






Cecilia 

1827

===== Original Message From lande008 ===== 


> 



the 


Jim 


pinpoint 


my 

>life as i'm sure s ome of yours doesn't revolve around our cohort (as much as 






between 





not 






kids 










>ranch o bernardos but sorry guys you all aren't going to be able to work their 


work 




1828



one 





>like "look at these test scores" and thats it no explination as to why thi s 

is 





> 

>Matheno 

> 




_____ 



1829






So much for changing the system from within!! One thought though, didn't they get rid of bilingual 

education in california? Could that be a reason why they are being so hardnosed about it? If she feels 

strongly about it, she should continue teaching and fighting for what she believes. 

Cynthia 

This sounds like a witchhunt (sagan). Those evil pro-bilingual ed people are going to take down the 

whole education system. Better burn them at the stake before it takes hold, they might actually 

educate some of THOSE kids, then we would be in real trouble, lol. 


My sister-n-law who is a second grade teacher at Lincoln elementary is going through exactly 

what you are saying Robert. She has been a strong advocate for bilingual education and I have 

seen her go long ways to battle opposing views on this issue. There is a group of teachers in that 

school that feel so strong about the issue that they have gone as far as contracting lawyers to 

back them up in what they believe in. In that school is not necessarily the parents that oppose 

bilingual education, but the principal and the head honchos. It has gotten to the point that a couple 

of her collegues have gotten fired just because they stand behind their believes 100%. Just 

recently, she was telling me, the little "click" that is for bilingual education at Lincoln was 

confronted with another surprise. The principal held a meeting with each one of them to tell some 

that some were to be relocated to another school. Out of five teachers only two were kept at 

Lincoln, my sister-n -law( being that she was teacher of the year for the last year) and one of her 

other teacher friend. The staying of my sister-n-law and her colleague came at a price though, she 

was moved to teach fourth grade and the other teacher was move to kindergarten. At first I was 

like cool you got to stay instead of being relocated but she then explain the jest of it to me: the 

change in grade was so that they will not be able to communicate at work, for fourth grade 

teachers and kindergarten teachers have a completely different schedule. At the moment that she 

was telling about all this drama one of her teacher friends phoned her and mentioned that they 

were going to be meeting with a lawyer to file a civil lawsuit. Her last comment to me was, "I am so 

tired of all this it, I have told your brother that I am ready to move on to something else". I 

commend my sister-n-law for what she is doing for the Spanish speakers at her school. I am not 

only saying it because she is my family but because it only motivates me to continue where 

she left off in her struggle. 


Karla 

P.S. to have to relocate teachers only shows that the bosses at Lincoln feel threatened by the kind 

of actions that these group of teachers have taken to defend a cause! 






1830





















> 

>Matheno, 

> 









>Ann 

> 



> 












1831

_____ 

_____ 



































> 

>Matheno 

> 




> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 





1832


1833






In regards to homework: Japanese students have longer school days, then they go to after school 

school; when would they have time for homework? American schools spend so much time teaching 

diversity, drug education etc, there isn't a lot of time left to teach academics, so they send the school 

work home as homework. Many American students don't have parents who put a lot of value on 

education, or just don't find the time to make sure their kids are learning.They know their kids will just 

get passed on to the next grade anyway, so why worry? Our kids don't have to compete to get into a 

high school, heck you don't even have to compete to get in many colleges (certain career fields 

excluded of course, like medical). 

As far as students cleaning and taking ownership of their schools, I think thats a great way to get 

students to care about things. The school I used to work at had the kids do that too, and it worked 

great. The physical aspect is a plus, get them up and moving! 

So....much of this is cultural. The American culture is just different. We don't want to work that hard, 

we don't want that much responsibility. Doesn't matter if it is right or wrong, its the way it is. There are 

those who do expect their kids to be pushed, and they put their kids in private school if they can 

afford it, or they are in the classroom hounding the teacher to make sure it happens. 

I don't think we can blame the entire educational system, there are good teachers out there, the ones 

who make teaching their lives, not just a way to get a paycheck. Unfortunately, there are too many of 

those. We can't blame all the parents, but there are some that need to get a clue. We can't just blame 

the government for not throwing good money after bad, the money needs to be spent in the right 

places on the right things. Its a complex problem in a complex society, with no easy solution. 

Cynthia 


Alexandra, 

You are comparing what you view as the worst US schools and practices, with the best Japanese schools 

and practices. I hope that you realize that this gives your words a weighted level of bias. Teachers in the 

U.S. are also required to have in-service training where they discuss proven methods. The classrooms in the 

U.S. are not supposed to grouped by level and in most cases are not. There is a big difference between 

having different dialects and having different languages. Although we have learned that problem solving is 

an essential skill that our students must have, we have also learned through the Bruer book that teaching the 

concept is also necessary. All problem solving and no concept, makes for a very bad lesson. Exploration, 

Concept, Application. One must truly begin to understand that there are fundamental social differences 

between the U.S. and other countries, thus it is not practical to adopt all of their practices. This is not to say 

that we should not examine these educational structures, but we should not blindly say that they are whole 

heartedly better than ours. For one thing people such as myself, being that I have Dyslexia, would have been 

bared from a higher education due to the genetic makeup. Is this a good way to go about it? I hope not. 

Also, Japanese students attend school about two months longer than do American students, but this is not 

discussed in your reasons for better performance. Also, the students bow to their teachers at the start of 

everyday and they make their own food and clean the school. One mu st ask themselves, what are the 

fundamental differences and accepted ideologies that would prevent American schools from conducting 

1834

their education in a similar fashion? 

Robert. 

>From: 




>Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> 

>It was not surprising to read in Sagan's reading, "No such thing as a Dumb Question" that Japan, 

South Korea, and Western Canada was ahead of American students in mathematics and 

science." This made me think of an article I read that compared the math instruction in Japan, 

Germany, and the United States. I think understanding the disparity between countries' math and 

science scores is a complex concept to understand. The scores do not take into consideration 

teachers' training, how the federal government funds are used, the emphasis placed on testing 

and homework, the percentage of teachers who use the board, diversity in the classroom, and the 

approach to lesson planning. The article titled, "How Culture Shapes Math Instruction in Japan, 

Germany, and the United States" (The California Education Policy Seminar and The California 

State University Institute sponsored the article for Education Reform) looks closely at the teaching 

philosophies of the ab ove countries while takin 

> g into consideration other factors besides testing. This particular article placed the focus on 

math education but the teaching philosophies applies to other subject areas. As a future teacher, I 

think that it is important that we explore other countries' education system and see how we can 

benefit from their success. This kind of exploration I hope will give me an edge for reaching out to 

all my students. I welcome the opportunity to gain insight into other educational systems outside of 

the U. S. Our classrooms grow more and more diverse and understanding teaching philosophies 

outside our own country becomes more crucial. Why? Our student body grows more diverse but 

the teachers and the classrooms do not. Is it possible to bring more than just a lesson about 

another country into the classroom? What is wrong with teaching more like the Japanese, the 

Germans, the Koreans, and the British?? In reading the article, I discovered how homogenous 

American education system really i 


>Each country no matter how diverse has a distinct teaching style. Let us look at it this way, as 

distinct as the American culture is from the Germans, the Japanese, the Koreans, etc. it would 

make sense that each culture has its unique teaching philosophies. I assumed that Japan rate of 

educational success had to do with the long hours that Japanese children were in school. I also 

assumed that much focus was placed on preparing students for testing. 

>According to the study, the Japanese do not put a huge focus on testing. The success rate of the 

Japanese students is contributed to how the Japanese teacher used the resources available. For 

example, the Japanese teachers use the chalkboard 100% while the U.S. uses the chalkboard 

67%. The important thing I discovered in not how the tools are used but the philosophy behind the 

lesson, for example, recorded on the chalkboard. For instance, the Japanese's "philosophy is to 

treat the chalkboard as their record of the entire lesson being taught. This gives visual learners 

and everyone the opportunity to have a good set of notes to reflect on and ask questions. Rather, 

than trying to take notes and learn a concept at the same time. The teacher facilitates the learning 

by reemphasizing what she/he is saying by writing it on the board. Whereas, the teachers in the 

U.S. use visual aids and "body language in a constant battle to draw students' attention to their 

1835

words. Moreover, the U 

> .S. focuses math lesson on teaching the students how to solve math problems rather than 

giving the students the opportunity to think and apply what they know into solving a problem. 

Meanwhile,the Japanese teachers teach students math concepts by explaining what the math 

concepts mean and giving the students the opportunity to apply the math concepts and figure out 

their own method of problem solving.How do teacher from Japan lesson plans? 

>The Japanese teachers prepare lesson plans using a methodical approach. The lesson plans are 

prepared with the questions the students may ask, the areas of difficulty that may arise for the 

students, and the possible mistakes the students will make in working through a math concept. 

Furthermore, the Japanese teachers work on one-lesson plan for an entire year. Whereas, the 

American teachers rely on previous lessons and quickly put together a lesson plan on prior 

instructions. Another interesting and novel approach is the way other Japanese teachers observe 

a teacher implementing a new lesson in order to study the students during the lesson; the 

teachers then meet to review and revise the lesson and later present the lesson to the entire 

faculty where the teacher receives more criticism. It was interesting to learn how the federal 

government supports Japanese teachers. 

>In Japan, the federal government funds are used to pay for "In-service teacher training," rather 

than investing that money on keeping class size smaller. The average class size in Japan has 40 

students. Unlike our thinking in the U.S. that Japanese schools are not diverse, in fact, the schools 

are very diverse because unlike the U.S. where students are tracked and divided by ability, the 

students in Japans are placed in random classrooms. Therefore, the teaching techniques used in 

Japan targets a diverse classroom and the teaching techniques in the U.S. work well in a 

homogenous classroom." How well do American schools use class time? 

>American teachers have little time set aside for developing and teaching a lesson. Instead, the 

time is used on going over homework and checking to see if homework is completed. In Japan, 

there is little emphasis placed on homework, "only 24% of Japanese teachers" assigned 

homework. Meanwhile, 90% of the American teachers assign homework and place emphasis on 

the use of concepts and method, rather than application. For example, American teachers explain 

what is a numerator, denominator, how to divide, multiply, etc. The concept is stated but not 

developed. The study showed that "approximately 80% of the concepts in the U.S. were only 

stated and never developed, whereas in Germany and Japan the exact opposite pattern 

occurred." Given Sagan's findings that "the average math gap between white and black U.S. high 

school graduates is still huge- two to three grade levels; but the gap between white U.S. high 

school graduates and those in, say Japan, Canada, Great Bri tain?is more th 

> an twice as large (with U.S. students behind)" (Sagan 329). Then it is important that we look at 

other factors that affect our education system besides blaming it on testing, class size, and 

diversity issues. Motivating and teaching our students how to think seems to play an important 

factor in educating our students. Teaching concepts is not enough. Applying the concepts the way 

this semester of science has taught us in Ochanji's class through exploration and applications 

seems to give students to opportunity to problem solve while promoting thinking. (Alexandra's 

journal #11) 

> 

> 

_____ 


_____ 



1836




To: journal 

Subject: A Possible Answer to Global Warming 

So, genetically modify a few hormones and we can be smaller, live longer, and increase our tolerance 

to warm weather. And since we could be smaller, that helps out with overcrowding. Sounds like a 

miracle!! And, no worries about driving that SUV, cuz we will need to warm this planet up to avoid 

freezing to death. Isn't science great? 

Cynthia 

So all the ice caps melt and we drown, we can worry about that later. 

Altered Mouse Turns 136 in Human Years 

Mon Apr 12, 7:03 PM ET 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/my/my16.gif Add Science - AP to My Yahoo! 

ANN ARBOR, Mich. - A dwarf mouse named Yoda has celebrated his fourth birthday, making him the 

oldest of his kind and far beyond 100 in human years, the University of Michigan Medical School 

says. 

Photo 

AP Photo 




Yoda owes his longevity to genetic modifications that affected his pituitary and thyroid glands and reduced insulin 

production — and which left him a third smaller than an average mouse and very sensitive to cold. 

On the other hand, at the human equivalent of about 136 years, Yoda is still mobile, sexually active and "looking good," 

said Dr. Richard A. Miller, associate director of research at the school's geriatrics center. 

Yoda lives in a carefully maintained lab with roughly 100 other male geriatric mice being used for a lifespan study. An 

average lab mouse lives slightly more than two years. 

Yoda's cage mate, Princess Leia, is a much larger female who uses her body warmth to keep the dwarf mouse from 

freezing to death. 

Researchers are studying the genetic mutants to determine how altered hormone levels can slow the aging process, with 

the hope of figuring out which methods, if any, eventually could be applied to humans. 

___ 

_____ 



1837





Subject: Re: bilingualism and the bigoted administration 

As to my understanding bilingual education is not completely obliterated, parents need to sign a 

waiver that allows bilingualism in the classroom. As a mater-of-fact I worked at a magnet school 

whose emphasis was bilingualism. I don't think that the getting rid of bilingualism is what is making 

them hardnosed, it is their biased and racist ways of conferring, that is making them take such 

views. And apparently their views are not working because Lincoln is one of the many schools in 

the Escondido district that cannot raise their test scores. So something most not be working out 

here. Could it be that perhaps some teachers are in fact ILL PREPARED to teach in a diverse 

classroom? Or perhaps the administration needs to get a good whipping when it comes to 

accounting for the plunging test scores? 






So much for changing the system from within!! One thought though, didn't they get rid of bilingual 

education in california? Could that be a reason why they are being so hardnosed about it? If she 

feels strongly about it, she should continue teaching and fighting for what she believes. 

Cynthia 

This sounds like a witchhunt (sagan). Those evil pro-bilingual ed people are going to take down 

the whole education system. Better burn them at the stake before it takes hold, they might actually 

educate some of THOSE kids, then we would be in real trouble, lol. 


My sister-n-law who is a second grade teacher at Lincoln elementary is going through exactly 

what you are saying Robert. She has been a strong advocate for bilingual education and I 

have seen her go long ways to battle opposing views on this issue. There is a group of 

teachers in that school that feel so strong about the issue that they have gone as far as 

contracting lawyers to back them up in what they believe in. In that school is not necessarily 

the parents that oppose bilingual education, but the principal and the head honchos. It has 

gotten to the point that a couple of her collegues have gotten fired just because they stand 

behind their believes 100%. Just recently, she was telling me, the little "click" that is for 

bilingual education at Lincoln was confronted with another surprise. The principal held a 

meeting with each one of them to tell some that some were to be relocated to another school. 

Out of five teachers only two were kept at Lincoln, my sister-n -law( being that she was teacher 

of the year for the last year) and one of her other teacher friend. The staying of my sister-n-law 

and her colleague came at a price though, she was moved to teach fourth grade and the other 

teacher was move to kindergarten. At first I was like cool you got to stay instead of being 

relocated but she then explain the jest of it to me: the change in grade was so that they will not 

be able to communicate at work, for fourth grade teachers and kindergarten teachers have a 

completely different schedule. At the moment that she was telling about all this drama one of 

her teacher friends phoned her and mentioned that they were going to be meeting with a 

1838

lawyer to file a civil lawsuit. Her last comment to me was, "I am so tired of all this it, I have told 

your brother that I am ready to move on to something else". I commend my sister-n-law for 

what she is doing for the Spanish speakers at her school. I am not only saying it because she 

is my family but because it only motivates me to continue where she left off in her struggle. 


Karla 

P.S. to have to relocate teachers only shows that the bosses at Lincoln feel threatened by the 

kind of actions that these group of teachers have taken to defend a cause! 






Just because one promotes equality and understanding of others within your classroom, 

not all of your children nor there parents or society at large will approve of your styles. How 

does one begin to develop a framework for addressing oppositional view points? Not 

everyone believes that equality is a good thing, not everyone believes that all children 

deserve an equal education. Sad, but very true. What happens when you are a strong 

believer of bi-lingual education and the superintendent says "NOT ON MY WATCH." We all 

carry with us an understanding of how we feel everyone else should view the world. But, 

how do you teach in an environment with so many views and understandings? How much 

control will we have over our future curriculums, units, lessons, words, feelings, beliefs, 

etc.? and where does one draw the line? How much control will one have to say "NOT ON 

MY WATCH" and understanding that when will you stop fighting? This is one reason 

teachers don' t stay in the profession for very long. How will we combat this? Many will 

probably go with the flow and buy there house and retire having not helped change society 

in any formidable motion. But, how can we begin to work within the system to promote 

change in what each of us views to be a positive direction and many of us may view as a 

negative direction? 






> 

>Matheno, 

> 


could help make a change. I myself am not planning on teaching near the coast, and I plan 

to go into teaching with the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I want to create a classroom 

that is a safe learning environment for everyone. Everyone: European American, African 

American, Asian American, Mexican American, Christian American, Mormon American, 

1839

Catholic American, Heterosexual American, Homosexual American...........etc. I want to 

include and respect everyone to the best of my abilities. I know I will not be perfect, but I 

know I will do everything in my abilities to help promote well rounded children of the future. 

>Ann 

> 



> 














































1840

_____ 

_____ 

> 

>Matheno 

> 




> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page FREE download! 



1841





Subject: PROPOSITION 287 


cynthia, 

Since I am on a caffeine high I decided to do a little research on the "bilingual waiver" that I previously 

mentioned. The excerpt actually came from the prop. 287 website that actually explains why they 

decided to ban bilingual education in California, but it has yet to become obliterated. Opposing views 

just have to keep trying a little bit harder, right? Maybe you could start an amendment since it seems 

that you have a strong opinion about it. But hey that is just you right, I have learned that you tend to 

be opinionated about practically everything that people have to say in class (no offense), LOL. 


B) 

ARTICLE 3. Parental Exceptions 

310. The requirements of Section 305 may be waived with the prior written informed consent, to be 

provided annually, of the child's parents or legal guardian under the circumstances specified below 

and in Section 311. Such informed consent shall require that said parents or legal guardian 

personally visit the school to apply for the waiver and that they there be provided a full description of 

the educational materials to be used in the different educational program choices and all the 

educational opportunities available to the child. Under such parental waiver conditions, children may 

be transferred to classes where they are taught English and other subjects through bilingual 

education techniques or other generally recognized educational methodologies permitted by law. 

Individual schools in which 20 students or more of a given grade level receive a waiver shall be 

required to offer such a class; otherwise, they must allow the students to transfer to a public school in 

which such a class is offered. 

311. The circumstances in which a parental exception waiver may be granted under Section 310 are 

as follows: 

(a) Children who already know English: the child already possesses good English language skills, as 

measured by standardized tests of English vocabulary comprehension, reading, and writing, in which 

the child scores at or above the state average for his grade level or at or above the 5th grade 

average, whichever is lower; or 

(b) Older children: the child is age 10 years or older, and it is the informed belief of the school 

principal and educational staff that an alternate course of educational study would be better suited to 

the childIs rapid acquisition of basic English language skills; or 

(c) Children with special needs: the child already has been placed for a period of not less than thirty 

days during that school year in an English language classroom and it is subsequently the informed 

belief of the school principal and educational staff that the child has such special physical, emotional, 

psychological, or educational needs that an alternate course of educational study would be better 

suited to the child's overall educational development. A written description of these special needs 

1842

must be provided and any such decision is to be made subject to the examination and approval of the 

local school superintendent, under guidelines established by and subject to the review of the local 

Board of Education and ultimately the State Board of Education. The existence of such special needs 

shall not compel issuance of a waiver, and the parents shall be fully informed of their right to refuse to 

agree to a waiver. 

1843






I think they should be held accountable for the test scores. As far as teachers being prepared, I don't 

think there are near enough qualified bilingual teachers, and that is a big problem. I just wonder what 

those administrators are hoping to gain by not allowing bilingual education in their school. I just read a 

great article about a Chinese bilingual immersion program in Canada. One of the things pointed out 

as a reason for apparent success was parent involvement. The other one was that Chinese is such a 

difficult language, the students preferred to use English. There were students in that program that 

spoke neither Mandarin or English, and some that spoke one or the other when they entered the 

program, which goes from grades 1-6. But evidently, they tend to score higher on achievement 

tests on average than English only speakers. This goes back to the theory we learned about in 

linguistics, that bilingual kids develop better cognitive skills. Their classes a lso had 2 teachers each 

day, one native Mandarin speaker, which taught certain subjects, and the other, a native English 

speaker for the rest of the subjects. 

In order to get more qualified bilingual teachers here, we need to change the way we are taught a 

second language to begin with. Those stupid classes we were required to take didn't teach me how to 

speak Spanish. Unless they start teaching conversational Spanish, I don't see it changing very 

quickly, but then maybe that is what they want to begin with. We aren't going to get a lot of Native 

Spanish speaking teachers because we aren't educating the potential future teachers to begin with. 

(That would be thanks to people like those running Lincoln). 

Cynthia 


As to my understanding bilingual education is not completely obliterated, parents need to sign 

a waiver that allows bilingualism in the classroom. As a mater-of-fact I worked at a magnet 

school whose emphasis was bilingualism. I don't think that the getting rid of bilingualism is 

what is making them hardnosed, it is their biased and racist ways of conferring, that is making 

them take such views. And apparently their views are not working because Lincoln is one of 

the many schools in the Escondido district that cannot raise their test scores. So something 

most not be working out here. Could it be that perhaps some teachers are in fact ILL 

PREPARED to teach in a diverse classroom? Or perhaps the administration needs to get a 

good whipping when it comes to accounting for the plunging test scores? 






So much for changing the system from within!! One thought though, didn't they get rid of 

bilingual education in california? Could that be a reason why they are being so hardnosed 

about it? If she feels strongly about it, she should continue teaching and fighting for what she 

believes. 

Cynthia 

This sounds like a witchhunt (sagan). Those evil pro-bilingual ed people are going to take 

1844

down the whole education system. Better burn them at the stake before it takes hold, they 

might actually educate some of THOSE kids, then we would be in real trouble, lol. 


My sister-n-law who is a second grade teacher at Lincoln elementary is going through 

exactly what you are saying Robert. She has been a strong advocate for bilingual 

education and I have seen her go long ways to battle opposing views on this issue. There 

is a group of teachers in that school that feel so strong about the issue that they have gone 

as far as contracting lawyers to back them up in what they believe in. In that school is not 

necessarily the parents that oppose bilingual education, but the principal and the head 

honchos. It has gotten to the point that a couple of her collegues have gotten fired just 

because they stand behind their believes 100%. Just recently, she was telling me, the little 

"click" that is for bilingual education at Lincoln was confronted with another surprise. The 

principal held a meeting with each one of them to tell some that some were to be relocated 

to another school. Out of five teachers only two were kept at Lincoln, my sister-n -law( 

being that she was teacher of the year for the last year) and one of her other teacher friend. 

The staying of my sister-n-law and her colleague came at a price though, she was moved 

to teach fourth grade and the other teacher was move to kindergarten. At first I was like 

cool you got to stay instead of being relocated but she then explain the jest of it to me: the 

change in grade was so that they will not be able to communicate at work, for fourth grade 

teachers and kindergarten teachers have a completely different schedule. At the moment 

that she was telling about all this drama one of her teacher friends phoned her and 

mentioned that they were going to be meeting with a lawyer to file a civil lawsuit. Her last 

comment to me was, "I am so tired of all this it, I have told your brother that I am ready to 

move on to something else". I commend my sister-n-law for what she is doing for the 

Spanish speakers at her school. I am not only saying it because she is my family but 

because it only motivates me to continue where she left off in her struggle. 


Karla 

P.S. to have to relocate teachers only shows that the bosses at Lincoln feel threatened by 

the kind of actions that these group of teachers have taken to defend a cause! 






Just because one promotes equality and understanding of others within your classroom, 

not all of your children nor there parents or society at large will approve of your styles. 

How does one begin to develop a framework for addressing oppositional view points? 

Not everyone believes that equality is a good thing, not everyone believes that all 

children deserve an equal education. Sad, but very true. What happens when you are a 

strong believer of bi-lingual education and the superintendent says "NOT ON MY 

WATCH." We all carry with us an understanding of how we feel everyone else should 

view the world. But, how do you teach in an environment with so many views and 

1845

understandings? How much control will we have over our future curriculums, units, 

lessons, words, feelings, beliefs, etc.? and where does one draw the line? How much 

control will one have to say "NOT ON MY WATCH" and understanding that when will 

you stop fighting? This is one reason teachers don' t stay in the profession for very long. 

How will we combat this? Many will probably go with the flow and buy there house and 

retire having not helped change society in any formidable motion. But, how can we 

begin to work within the system to promote change in what each of us views to be a 

positive direction and many of us may view as a negative direction? 






> 

>Matheno, 

> 

>Your'e right... Topics of inequality are brought up brefly, but never delt with on levels 

that could help make a change. I myself am not planning on teaching near the coast, 

and I plan to go into teaching with the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I want to create a 

classroom that is a safe learning environment for everyone. Everyone: European 

American, African American, Asian American, Mexican American, Christian American, 

Mormon American, Catholic American, Heterosexual American, Homosexual 

American...........etc. I want to include and respect everyone to the best of my abilities. 

I know I will not be perfect, but I know I will do everything in my abilities to help 

promote well rounded children of the future. 

>Ann 

> 



> 





















1846

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 


























> 

>Matheno 

> 




> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



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download! 





1847





Subject: Re: PROPOSITION 287 

So basically, the kids have to be in 3rd grade or lower to be allowed bilingual ed? Did I read that 

correctly? Hmmmm. The problem with this is, most parents either don't know about it, have been 

advised against it, or don't want it, none of which seem to be informed reasoning. One of the major 

obstacles is the idea of segregation. If you put all the Spanish speakers together in classes, some 

people will pitch a fit. Of course, they could offer it to the English speakers, so they could actually 

learn Spanish. So really, they wouldn't have to change a whole lot about how things are set up, just 

have 2 teachers switch off English 1/2 day, then the other takes over for the Spanish and visa versa. 

But that would just be too simple, and gosh, it might even work. Scratch that idea before it takes hold. 

Cynthia 


cynthia, 

Since I am on a caffeine high I decided to do a little research on the "bilingual waiver" that I 

previously mentioned. The excerpt actually came from the prop. 287 website that actually explains 

why they decided to ban bilingual education in California, but it has yet to become obliterated. 

Opposing views just have to keep trying a little bit harder, right? Maybe you could start an 

amendment since it seems that you have a strong opinion about it. But hey that is just you right, I 

have learned that you tend to be opinionated about practically everything that people have to say 

in class (no offense), LOL. Open-mouthed smiley emoticon 


310. The requirements of Section 305 may be waived with the prior written informed consent, to 

be provided annually, of the child's parents or legal guardian under the circumstances specified 

below and in Section 311. Such informed consent shall require that said parents or legal guardian 

personally visit the school to apply for the waiver and that they there be provided a full description 

of the educational materials to be used in the different educational program choices and all the 

educational opportunities available to the child. Under such parental waiver conditions, children 

may be transferred to classes where they are taught English and other subjects through bilingual 

education techniques or other generally recognized educational methodologies permitted by law. 

Individual schools in which 20 students or more of a given grade level receive a waiver shall be 

required to offer such a class; otherwise, they must allow the students to transfer to a public 

school in whic h such a class is offered. 

311. The circumstances in which a parental exception waiver may be granted under Section 310 

are as follows: 

(a) Children who already know English: the child already possesses good English language skills, 

as measured by standardized tests of English vocabulary comprehension, reading, and writing, in 

which the child scores at or above the state average for his grade level or at or above the 5th 

grade average, whichever is lower; or 


principal and educational staff that an alternate course of educational study would be better suited 

1848

to the childIs rapid acquisition of basic English language skills; or 

(c) Children with special needs: the child already has been placed for a period of not less than 

thirty days during that school year in an English language classroom and it is subsequently the 

informed belief of the school principal and educational staff that the child has such special 

physical, emotional, psychological, or educational needs that an alternate course of educational 

study would be better suited to the child's overall educational development. A written description 

of these special needs must be provided and any such decision is to be made subject to the 

examination and approval of the local school superintendent, under guidelines established by and 

subject to the review of the local Board of Education and ultimately the State Board of Education. 

The existence of such special needs shall not compel issuance of a waiver, and the parents shall 

be fully informed of their right to refuse to agree to a waiver. 

_____ 



1849






You need to take a tour of Lincoln primary to realize that there would be no opposition of putting 

Spanish speakers together. That school is practically all Hispanic! 






So basically, the kids have to be in 3rd grade or lower to be allowed bilingual ed? Did I read that 

correctly? Hmmmm. The problem with this is, most parents either don't know about it, have been 

advised against it, or don't want it, none of which seem to be informed reasoning. One of the 

major obstacles is the idea of segregation. If you put all the Spanish speakers together in classes, 

some people will pitch a fit. Of course, they could offer it to the English speakers, so they could 

actually learn Spanish. So really, they wouldn't have to change a whole lot about how things are 

set up, just have 2 teachers switch off English 1/2 day, then the other takes over for the Spanish 

and visa versa. But that would just be too simple, and gosh, it might even work. Scratch that idea 

before it takes hold. 

Cynthia 


cynthia, 


previously mentioned. The excerpt actually came from the prop. 287 website that actually 

explains why they decided to ban bilingual education in California, but it has yet to become 

obliterated. Opposing views just have to keep trying a little bit harder, right? Maybe you could 

start an amendment since it seems that you have a strong opinion about it. But hey that is just 

you right, I have learned that you tend to be opinionated about practically everything that 

people have to say in class (no offense), LOL. Open-mouthed smiley emoticon 


310. The requirements of Section 305 may be waived with the prior written informed consent, 

to be provided annually, of the child's parents or legal guardian under the circumstances 

specified below and in Section 311. Such informed consent shall require that said parents or 

legal guardian personally visit the school to apply for the waiver and that they there be 

provided a full description of the educational materials to be used in the different educational 

program choices and all the educational opportunities available to the child. Under such 

parental waiver conditions, children may be transferred to classes where they are taught 

English and other subjects through bilingual education techniques or other generally 

recognized educational methodologies permitted by law. Individual schools in which 20 

students or more of a given grade level receive a waiver shall be required to offer such a class; 

otherwise, they must allow the students to transfer to a public school in whic h such a class is 

offered. 

1850

_____ 

311. The circumstances in which a parental exception waiver may be granted under Section 

310 are as follows: 

(a) Children who already know English: the child already possesses good English language 

skills, as measured by standardized tests of English vocabulary comprehension, reading, and 

writing, in which the child scores at or above the state average for his grade level or at or 

above the 5th grade average, whichever is lower; or 


principal and educational staff that an alternate course of educational study would be better 

suited to the childIs rapid acquisition of basic English language skills; or 

(c) Children with special needs: the child already has been placed for a period of not less than 

thirty days during that school year in an English language classroom and it is subsequently the 

informed belief of the school principal and educational staff that the child has such special 

physical, emotional, psychological, or educational needs that an alternate course of 

educational study would be better suited to the child's overall educational development. A 

written description of these special needs must be provided and any such decision is to be 

made subject to the examination and approval of the local school superintendent, under 

guidelines established by and subject to the review of the local Board of Education and 

ultimately the State Board of Education. The existence of such special needs shall not compel 

issuance of a waiver, and the parents shall be fully informed of their right to refuse to agree to 

a waiver. 



1851






If that is true, why aren't parents signing the waivers to get their kids in bilingual classes? It seems to 

me, there shouldn't be a problem getting bilingual ed there if the parents want it (according to prop 

287). I didn't mean the opposition would come from the parents, anyway. It would come from others 

on the outside who don't have a real interest in education. Maybe the problem goes back to not 

enough qualified bilingual teachers. Where are they going to find enough of them to convert the 

school to a bilingual one? 

Cynthia 


You need to take a tour of Lincoln primary to realize that there would be no opposition of putting 

Spanish speakers together. That school is practically all Hispanic! 






So basically, the kids have to be in 3rd grade or lower to be allowed bilingual ed? Did I read 

that correctly? Hmmmm. The problem with this is, most parents either don't know about it, 

have been advised against it, or don't want it, none of which seem to be informed reasoning. 

One of the major obstacles is the idea of segregation. If you put all the Spanish speakers 

together in classes, some people will pitch a fit. Of course, they could offer it to the English 

speakers, so they could actually learn Spanish. So really, they wouldn't have to change a 

whole lot about how things are set up, just have 2 teachers switch off English 1/2 day, then the 

other takes over for the Spanish and visa versa. But that would just be too simple, and gosh, it 

might even work. Scratch that idea before it takes hold. 

Cynthia 


cynthia, 


previously mentioned. The excerpt actually came from the prop. 287 website that actually 

explains why they decided to ban bilingual education in California, but it has yet to become 

obliterated. Opposing views just have to keep trying a little bit harder, right? Maybe you 

could start an amendment since it seems that you have a strong opinion about it. But hey 

that is just you right, I have learned that you tend to be opinionated about practically 

everything that people have to say in class (no offense), LOL. Open-mouthed smiley 

emoticon 


310. The requirements of Section 305 may be waived with the prior written informed 

1852

_____ 

_____ 

consent, to be provided annually, of the child's parents or legal guardian under the 

circumstances specified below and in Section 311. Such informed consent shall require 

that said parents or legal guardian personally visit the school to apply for the waiver and 

that they there be provided a full description of the educational materials to be used in the 

different educational program choices and all the educational opportunities available to the 

child. Under such parental waiver conditions, children may be transferred to classes where 

they are taught English and other subjects through bilingual education techniques or other 

generally recognized educational methodologies permitted by law. Individual schools in 

which 20 students or more of a given grade level receive a waiver shall be required to offer 

such a class; otherwise, they must allow the students to transfer to a public school in whic h 

such a class is offered. 

311. The circumstances in which a parental exception waiver may be granted under 

Section 310 are as follows: 

(a) Children who already know English: the child already possesses good English language 

skills, as measured by standardized tests of English vocabulary comprehension, reading, 

and writing, in which the child scores at or above the state average for his grade level or at 

or above the 5th grade average, whichever is lower; or 

(b) Older children: the child is age 10 years or older, and it is the informed belief of the 

school principal and educational staff that an alternate course of educational study would 

be better suited to the childIs rapid acquisition of basic English language skills; or 

(c) Children with special needs: the child already has been placed for a period of not less 

than thirty days during that school year in an English language classroom and it is 

subsequently the informed belief of the school principal and educational staff that the child 

has such special physical, emotional, psychological, or educational needs that an alternate 

course of educational study would be better suited to the child's overall educational 

development. A written description of these special needs must be provided and any such 

decision is to be made subject to the examination and approval of the local school 

superintendent, under guidelines established by and subject to the review of the local 

Board of Education and ultimately the State Board of Education. The existence of such 

special needs shall not compel issuance of a waiver, and the parents shall be fully informed 

of their right to refuse to agree to a waiver. 





1853






As for bilingual teachers being in short supply I completely agree with you. I commend people like 

Teresa that are willing to take a step further and take the BCLAD. At the schools that I have worked 

at, in those that still believe in the theory of pull out (in which that is another story, perhaps a subject 

for a thesis), the primary ELD teacher is a non-native Spanish speaker, but I guess practice makes 

perfection, because there are some pretty darn good teachers that are able to communicate with their 

students in Spanish. At the end, and this is only my opinion, I believe that there are going to be more 

opportunities for those that have the BCLAD in their repertoire. So Teresa keep it coming girl, do not 

get discourage, after all I took the test and did not pass myself, and I am a native speaker. 






I think they should be held accountable for the test scores. As far as teachers being prepared, I 

don't think there are near enough qualified bilingual teachers, and that is a big problem. I just 

wonder what those administrators are hoping to gain by not allowing bilingual education in their 

school. I just read a great article about a Chinese bilingual immersion program in Canada. One of 

the things pointed out as a reason for apparent success was parent involvement. The other one 

was that Chinese is such a difficult language, the students preferred to use English. There were 

students in that program that spoke neither Mandarin or English, and some that spoke one or the 

other when they entered the program, which goes from grades 1-6. But evidently, they tend to 

score higher on achievement tests on average than English only speakers. This goes back to the 

theory we learned about in linguistics, that bilingual kids develop better cognitive skills. Their 

classes a lso had 2 teachers each day, one native Mandarin speaker, which taught certain 

subjects, and the other, a native English speaker for the rest of the subjects. 

In order to get more qualified bilingual teachers here, we need to change the way we are taught a 

second language to begin with. Those stupid classes we were required to take didn't teach me 

how to speak Spanish. Unless they start teaching conversational Spanish, I don't see it changing 

very quickly, but then maybe that is what they want to begin with. We aren't going to get a lot of 

Native Spanish speaking teachers because we aren't educating the potential future teachers to 

begin with. (That would be thanks to people like those running Lincoln). 

Cynthia 


As to my understanding bilingual education is not completely obliterated, parents need to 

sign a waiver that allows bilingualism in the classroom. As a mater-of-fact I worked at a 

magnet school whose emphasis was bilingualism. I don't think that the getting rid of 

bilingualism is what is making them hardnosed, it is their biased and racist ways of 

conferring, that is making them take such views. And apparently their views are not working 

because Lincoln is one of the many schools in the Escondido district that cannot raise their 

1854

test scores. So something most not be working out here. Could it be that perhaps some 

teachers are in fact ILL PREPARED to teach in a diverse classroom? Or perhaps the 

administration needs to get a good whipping when it comes to accounting for the plunging 

test scores? 






So much for changing the system from within!! One thought though, didn't they get rid of 

bilingual education in california? Could that be a reason why they are being so hardnosed 

about it? If she feels strongly about it, she should continue teaching and fighting for what 

she believes. 

Cynthia 

This sounds like a witchhunt (sagan). Those evil pro-bilingual ed people are going to take 

down the whole education system. Better burn them at the stake before it takes hold, they 

might actually educate some of THOSE kids, then we would be in real trouble, lol. 


My sister-n-law who is a second grade teacher at Lincoln elementary is going through 

exactly what you are saying Robert. She has been a strong advocate for bilingual 

education and I have seen her go long ways to battle opposing views on this issue. 

There is a group of teachers in that school that feel so strong about the issue that they 

have gone as far as contracting lawyers to back them up in what they believe in. In that 

school is not necessarily the parents that oppose bilingual education, but the principal 

and the head honchos. It has gotten to the point that a couple of her collegues have 

gotten fired just because they stand behind their believes 100%. Just recently, she was 

telling me, the little "click" that is for bilingual education at Lincoln was confronted with 

another surprise. The principal held a meeting with each one of them to tell some that 

some were to be relocated to another school. Out of five teachers only two were kept at 

Lincoln, my sister-n -law( being that she was teacher of the year for the last year) and 

one of her other teacher friend. The staying of my sister-n-law and her colleague came 

at a price though, she was moved to teach fourth grade and the other teacher was 

move to kindergarten. At first I was like cool you got to stay instead of being relocated 

but she then explain the jest of it to me: the change in grade was so that they will not be 

able to communicate at work, for fourth grade teachers and kindergarten teachers have 

a completely different schedule. At the moment that she was telling about all this drama 

one of her teacher friends phoned her and mentioned that they were going to be 

meeting with a lawyer to file a civil lawsuit. Her last comment to me was, "I am so tired 

of all this it, I have told your brother that I am ready to move on to something else". I 

commend my sister-n-law for what she is doing for the Spanish speakers at her school. 

I am not only saying it because she is my family but because it only motivates me to 

continue where she left off in her struggle. 


Karla 

P.S. to have to relocate teachers only shows that the bosses at Lincoln feel threatened 

by the kind of actions that these group of teachers have taken to defend a cause! 



1855




Just because one promotes equality and understanding of others within your 

classroom, not all of your children nor there parents or society at large will approve 

of your styles. How does one begin to develop a framework for addressing 

oppositional view points? Not everyone believes that equality is a good thing, not 

everyone believes that all children deserve an equal education. Sad, but very true. 

What happens when you are a strong believer of bi-lingual education and the 

superintendent says "NOT ON MY WATCH." We all carry with us an understanding 

of how we feel everyone else should view the world. But, how do you teach in an 

environment with so many views and understandings? How much control will we 

have over our future curriculums, units, lessons, words, feelings, beliefs, etc.? and 

where does one draw the line? How much control will one have to say "NOT ON MY 

WATCH" and understanding that when will you stop fighting? This is one reason 

teachers don' t stay in the profession for very long. How will we combat this? Many 

will probably go with the flow and buy there house and retire having not helped 

change society in any formidable motion. But, how can we begin to work within the 

system to promote change in what each of us views to be a positive direction and 

many of us may view as a negative direction? 






> 

>Matheno, 

> 

>Your'e right... Topics of inequality are brought up brefly, but never delt with on 

levels that could help make a change. I myself am not planning on teaching near 

the coast, and I plan to go into teaching with the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I 

want to create a classroom that is a safe learning environment for everyone. 

Everyone: European American, African American, Asian American, Mexican 

American, Christian American, Mormon American, Catholic American, Heterosexual 

American, Homosexual American...........etc. I want to include and respect everyone 

to the best of my abilities. I know I will not be perfect, but I know I will do everything 

in my abilities to help promote well rounded children of the future. 

>Ann 

> 



> 


1856













































> 

>Matheno 

> 




> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

1857

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 



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download! 





1858






GOOD NIGHT, Cynthia. Karla is going to try and get on sleep mode before I get yelled at by my 

boyfriend. 


B) 

1859





Subject: Scholastic Book Orders 

Hey kids, 

Just a reminder to bring in your book orders tomorrow (Wednesday 14th) to class. Remember, you 

can write one check for your order even if you are ordering from different catalogues. Checks should 

be made payable to Scholastic Books. 

See you tomorrow. 

~ Louise 

1860




To: Karla Garduno; ICP-F@csusm.edu 


Okay, here is my journal for the pass couple weeks. I decided that I needed a 

longer spring break and since our teacher can take a break and fly to new 

york, leave us in the hands of someone who wants to teach us our last two 

years all over again in one class period, and waste my precious time. I am 

going to enjoy my life and plan my spain trip, instead. Why? Because I have to 

make choices in life and that is my choice. I read the 157 journals that have 

been sitting on the listserve and here are all my ideas: 

One, Mike and not doing his work: 

I also figured that his percentages of grades were a little funny and did not 

write the science fair response (only 5%) but I am not as brave as you to not 

do the rest of the assignments, Not like it matters, I have come to the 

conclusion that all education class grades are subjective. Your grade does not 

reflect your work in the class but rather if the teacher likes you. So, I 

guess I should spend all my time sucking up to my professors then doing my 

assignments, because even people who fail every test in certain classes, 

passed the class. 

Two, Casey, I am sorry about your friend. I had a friend die in out first 

semester together and he was a junior in high school with my sister. I asked 

all the same questions and got the same answers. I soon realized that it just 

doesn't make sense (non sense?)but sometimes you just have to understand that 

"God" has bigger plans for him. If you need anything, please let me know. Yet, 

the tradegy allowed me to convince myself that doing work is not my favorite 

choice. If I die tomorrow am I going to be really excited that I did my 

journal for this week, no. Why? un-interested. Now, that the listserve has 

changed to more educational responses, I must admit I am more excited, but I 

want to write because I want to and not because I have to. I also do not want 

to sit in classes that move slow than a turtle without legs. I feel that I am 

alive right now, and I want to jump, run, and yell at the top of my lungs 

instead of sit in a classroom and pretend that I am interested. I definately 

will remember this when I am a teacher and my class. 

Three, (sorry kids for the long repsonse. I making up for lost time) slacking 

Yes, we all slack and we all ask for help. Yet, I do feel that their are 

people in the cohort, in life, and probably in our classrooms that expect or 

want their peers to hold their hands through it all. It is okay to ask for 

help, just not with everything. These assignments are your work and you get 

the opportunity to do it your way and put yourself in it. Why would you want 

to ask someone else to help you with it, especially when you have to work with 

someone else in every other assignment? Take the risk nd make it your own 

work. You get much more out of it in the end, and it really bothers me when 

you call five times on the same project while I am putting my heart into mine! 

Four, teaching in certain schools. 

I started this cohort being like I want to teach in a low socioeconomic school 

district and teach third grade. Now, I do not care what I teach or where. I 

just want to teach. I have so many ideas flowing in my head right now, i can 

not wait to get my classroom and see my students. I know it will not be easy 

and there will be low times, but everytime I walk into a classroom I can not 

stop smiling, analysizing, abd planning my classroom. 

Last one kids, bilingualism (bilingualismo) 

Thanks Karla for your support. It definately made my day after reading 157 

journals. Sad, that you, Alexadra, and I are still at the same level. I am so 

confused on that one. 

Parents and students to do know about bilingual programs offered in schools 

because many schools do not want to have to search for new bliingual teachers 

and make new classrooms because of this request. It is hard work. So, schools 

"forget" to suggest it for parents. It might be sitting on the secretarys 

desk, but parents just do not see it there. I have heard this practice in 

1861

atleast three schools I have been to. 

But that does not stop blingualism, I worked last semester in a 3rd grade 

class in the ghetto, i mean Escondido (good thing I am a thug or I wouldn't 

have made it!! hee hee). I loved it. The classroom was not bliingual but there 

were more students that spoke spanish than english. I still used spanish to 

explain things to students. I think that you can say that classrooms are not 

blilingual, but teachers will make connections and speak the parts of 

languages they can to make there students understand. Parents do not have to 

sign a paper for that. 

I am spent!!! 

Teresa 

1862





Subject: RE: bilingualism and the bigoted administration 

Cynthia they do have conversational Spanish speaking classess. They are great. 

Mira 

Costa also has lunch sessions where you eat and can speak only in Spanish. 

It's super 

fun and you learn a lot. Marin 

>I think they should be held accountable for the test scores. As far as 

teachers being 

prepared, I don't think there are near enough qualified bilingual teachers, 

and that is a 

big problem. I just wonder what those administrators are hoping to gain by not 

allowing 

bilingual education in their school. I just read a great article about a 

Chinese bilingual 

immersion program in Canada. One of the things pointed out as a reason for 

apparent 

success was parent involvement. The other one was that Chinese is such a 

difficult 

language, the students preferred to use English. There were students in that 

program 

that spoke neither Mandarin or English, and some that spoke one or the other 

when they 

entered the program, which goes from grades 1-6. But evidently, they tend to 

score 

higher on achievement tests on average than English only speakers. This goes 

back to 

the theory we learned about in linguistics, that bilingual kids develop better 

cognitive 

skills. Their classes also had 2 teach 

> ers each 

> day, one native Mandarin speaker, which taught certain subjects, and the 

other, a 

native English speaker for the rest of the subjects. 

>In order to get more qualified bilingual teachers here, we need to change the 

way we 

are taught a second language to begin with. Those stupid classes we were 

required to 

take didn't teach me how to speak Spanish. Unless they start teaching 

conversational 

Spanish, I don't see it changing very quickly, but then maybe that is what 

they want to 

begin with. We aren't going to get a lot of Native Spanish speaking teachers 

because we 

aren't educating the potential future teachers to begin with. (That would be 

thanks to 

people like those running Lincoln). 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>As to my understanding bilingual education is not completely obliterated, 

parents need 

to sign a waiver that allows bilingualism in the classroom. As a mater-of-fact 

I worked at a 

1863

magnet school whose emphasis was bilingualism. I don't think that the getting 

rid of 

bilingualism is what is making them hardnosed, it is their biased and racist 

ways of 

conferring, that is making them take such views. And apparently their views 

are not 

working because Lincoln is one of the many schools in the Escondido district 

that cannot 

raise their test scores. So something most not be working out here. Could it 

be that 

perhaps some teachers are in fact ILL PREPARED to teach in a diverse 

classroom? Or 

perhaps the administration needs to get a good whipping when it comes to 

accounting 

for the plunging test scores? 




>Sent: Monday, April 12, 2004 10:48 PM 


> 

> 

>So much for changing the system from within!! One thought though, didn't they 

get rid of 

bilingual education in california? Could that be a reason why they are being 

so 

hardnosed about it? If she feels strongly about it, she should continue 

teaching and 

fighting for what she believes. 

>Cynthia 

>This sounds like a witchhunt (sagan). Those evil pro-bilingual ed people are 

going to 

take down the whole education system. Better burn them at the stake before it 

takes hold, 

they might actually educate some of THOSE kids, then we would be in real 

trouble, lol. 

> 


>My sister-n-law who is a second grade teacher at Lincoln elementary is going 

through 

exactly what you are saying Robert. She has been a strong advocate for 

bilingual 

education and I have seen her go long ways to battle opposing views on this 

issue. 

There is a group of teachers in that school that feel so strong about the 

issue that they 

have gone as far as contracting lawyers to back them up in what they believe 

in. In that 

school is not necessarily the parents that oppose bilingual education, but the 

principal 

and the head honchos. It has gotten to the point that a couple of her 

collegues have 

gotten fired just because they stand behind their believes 100%. Just 

recently, she was 

telling me, the little "click" that is for bilingual education at Lincoln was 

confronted with 

another surprise. The principal held a meeting with each one of them to tell 

some that 

some were to be relocated to another school. Out of five teachers only two 

were kept at 

Lincoln, my sister-n -law( bei 

> ng that 

> she was teacher of the year for the last year) and one of her other teacher 

friend. The 

staying of my sister-n-law and her colleague came at a price though, she was 

moved to 

1864

teach fourth grade and the other teacher was move to kindergarten. At first I 

was like cool 

you got to stay instead of being relocated but she then explain the jest of it 

to me: the 

change in grade was so that they will not be able to communicate at work, for 

fourth 

grade teachers and kindergarten teachers have a completely different schedule. 

At the 

moment that she was telling about all this drama one of her teacher friends 

phoned her 

and mentioned that they were going to be meeting with a lawyer to file a civil 

lawsuit. Her 

last comment to me was, "I am so tired of all this it, I have told your 

brother that I am ready 

to move on to something else". I commend my sister-n-law for what she is doing 

for the 

Spanish speakers at her school. I am not only saying it because she is my 

family but 

because it only 

> motivates me to continue where she left off in her struggle. 

>Here is one for all the hypocrites, 

>Karla 

>P.S. to have to relocate teachers only shows that the bosses at Lincoln feel 

threatened 

by the kind of actions that these group of teachers have taken to defend a 

cause! 


>From: Robert Atchison 


>Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2004 1:43 PM 


> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>Just because one promotes equality and understanding of others within your 

classroom, not all of your children nor there parents or society at large will 

approve of 

your styles. How does one begin to develop a framework for addressing 

oppositional 

view points? Not everyone believes that equality is a good thing, not everyone 

believes 

that all children deserve an equal education. Sad, but very true. What happens 

when you 

are a strong believer of bi-lingual education and the superintendent says "NOT 

ON MY 

WATCH." We all carry with us an understanding of how we feel everyone else 

should 


understandings? How much control will we have over our future curriculums, 

units, 

lessons, words, feelings, beliefs, etc.? and where does one draw the line? How 

much 

control will one have to say "NOT ON MY WATCH" and understanding that when 

will you 

stop fighting? This is one reason teachers don' t stay in the professi 

> on for 

> very long. How will we combat this? Many will probably go with the flow and 

buy there 

house and retire having not helped change society in any formidable motion. 

But, how 

can we begin to work within the system to promote change in what each of us 

views to be 

1865

a positive direction and many of us may view as a negative direction? 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>>From: Ann Kirkendall 



>>Subject: Re: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 

>>Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 10:00:13 -0700 (PDT) 

>> 

>>Matheno, 

>> 

>>Your'e right... Topics of inequality are brought up brefly, but never delt 

with on levels 

that could help make a change. I myself am not planning on teaching near the 

coast, 

and I plan to go into teaching with the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I want to 

create a 

classroom that is a safe learning environment for everyone. Everyone: 

European 

American, African American, Asian American, Mexican American, Christian 

American, 


American...........etc. I want to include and respect everyone to the best of 

my abilities. I 

know I will not be perfect, but I know I will do everything in my abilities to 

help promote 

well rounded children of the future. 

>>Ann 

>> 

>>lande008 wrote: 

>>Dear list serve members, 

>> 

>>As I read some of the journals late the other night (recently got internet 

>>hooked up at the crib)I thought to myself "damn i have been missing out on 

the 

>>opportunity to show the cohort and faculty that I am an able writer and as 

Jim 

>>Rome would say have good takes." That being said, I can't absolutely 

pinpoint 

>>why my activity on the list serve has been so sparse other than to say that 

my 

>>life as i'm sure some of yours doesn't revolve around our cohort (as much as 

>>it should) and especially not an email list (my closest friends and i don't 

>>communicate via email so it is not a medium with which I am completely 

>>comfortable) so other than doing the necessary number of journals I haven't 

>>been around to jump on some of the entries that I should have. For instance, 

>>their was a posting recently speaking about the difference in literacy 

between 

>>students in poor school versus rich or church based schools that I wanted to 

>>respond to by saying that in poor schools (the faculty usually doesn't push 

>>the stduents the way they need to be pushed either out of a feeling that the 

>>students aren't capable of grasping the material or indiffernce whether or 

not 

>>their students ever become intellignent novices. Along the same lines, as I 

>>can say from my own personal experiences when minorities attend schools in 

>>middle class or well to do areas they still aren't pushed to succeed but 

>>rather allowed to simply coast through without fear of failure (our test 

>>scores will still be high compared to the rest of the schools so if these 

kids 

>>aren't prepared it won't reflect on us overall) so we are left to motivate 

>>ourselves and if you are one that continually is pressuring the teacher to 

>>help you or explain something clearer (i have felt as if they think you are 

>>just trying to kiss their ass or are doing so for another reason rather than 

>>just a desire to learn (this being in the high school years)). But their is 

1866


>>without every taking the time to think that you are there "hope" and the one 

>>that needs to be challenging each and every one of them. I perceive that the 

>>majority of my cohort members desire to work in the carlsbad, encinitas, and 

>>rancho bernardos but sorry guys you all aren't going to be able to work 

their 

>>and it is my fear that when you do get a job in an area you don't want to 

work 

>>in for whatever reason (hopefully not because of the ethnicity or 

>>socio-economic status of your students) you will resent your position and 

>>continue the string of teachers who don't care about the performance of 

their 

>>students or don't feel that they can make an impact. That being said, I tend 

>>to bite my tongue for fear of being the "angry black man" or whatever else 

one 

>>could be labeled for speaking their mind but I can't worry about that at 

this 

>>time. I feel that our "multicultural education" courses have only reinforced 

>>that their is a gap between the education of minorites and done little to 

>>encourage future teachers that this trend can change if they want it to. Its 

>>like "look at these test scores" and thats it no explination as to why this 

is 

>>so or how it can be fixed. Anyways folks just a few things i wanted to get 

>>off my chest in between patrons here in the media library so if its muttered 

>>up my apologies but please feel free to discuss with me anything you would 

>>like and i'll make an effort to respond to your thoughts as well. 

>> 

>>Matheno 

>> 

>>p.s. pressure is a good driving force, but stress is just that stress never 

a 

>>good driving force it is simply stress. Rick Pitino (not his exact words but 

>>along those lines) 

>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 


>>Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

>MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page FREE 

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1867





Subject: be encouraged 

this one's for you chula! you're awesome... 

The purpose of this email is to lift you all up, so read on my friends. 

last week i had a break down. 

the stress was getting the best of me, but that wasnt the cause. 

over the past 2 years i have met many many people that are less than encouraging that i 

want to be a teacher. 

you know the ones.... 

"you want to teach, why?!" 

"6th grade, good luck with that!" 

"parents are gonna make you life horrible, why do you want to deal with parents?!" 

do you see a pattern? 

now, this isnt to say that i dont get praises for my decision and my hard work put into 

it, but you only remember the bad. 

all those good things people tell me, bring a temporary smile to my face, but then it 

fades as a negative comment hits my hear. 

so im here to tell you, be encouraged! 

good job for working so hard the past two years and for sticking to it. 

what an amazing choice you made to become a teacher. there is no other job as noble as 

this. 

your kids are gonna love you. 

you are gonna love this job. 

you are gonna do great! 

try to remember all this even when you get beat down. 

shrug off those people assuming they hate their job, knowing you wont. next time tell 

them, im sorry you dont like your job, but i love mine becasue i know this is what i want 

to do, im called to do this. 

dont let the ICP teachers try to scare you. this started in semester one where it seemed 

like the goal of ICP was not to foster us but to scare us out of teaching. 

THANK YOU ICP for your structure and a BA and credential, but shame on you for 

discouraging your teachers in training, shame on you for not loving us up for this 

influencial choice we have all made. 

i love you guys and am thankful that we have each other to lift one another up. 

although this semester has brought the worst out of us, know that it is almost over and it 

WILL get better! 

1868






yes, but those aren't the classes we are required to take. My point was those are the classes we 

should take, not the garbage ones. Cynthia 



Mira 


It's super 





and that is a 


allowing 




apparent 


difficult 


pr ogram 


when they 


score 


back to 


cognitive 


> ers each 


other, a 



way we 


required to 


1869



they want to 

begin with. We aren' t going to get a lot of Native Spanish speaking teachers 

because we 


thanks to 


>Cynthia 

> 


> 


parents need 


I worked at a 


rid of 


ways of 


are not 


that cannot 


be that 

perhaps some teachers are in fact ILL PREP ARED to teach in a diverse 

classroom? Or 


accounting 







> 

> 


get rid of 


so 


teaching and 


>Cynthia 


going to 


takes hold, 


trouble, lol. 

> 

1870



through 


bilingual 


issue. 




in. In that 


principal 







another surprise. The principal held a meeting with each one of the m to tell 

some that 


were kept at 


> ng that 


friend. The 


moved to 


was like cool 


to me: the 


fourth 


At the 


phoned her 


lawsuit. Her 




for the 


family but 




>Karla 


threatened 

1871

y the kind of actions that these group of teachers have taken to defend a 

cause! 






> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 



approve of 


oppositional 


believes 


when you 


ON MY 


should 



units, 


much 


will you 


> on for 

> very long. How will we combat this? Many will probably go with th e flow and 

buy there 


But, how 


views to be 


> 

> 

> 

> 






>> 

1872

Matheno, 

>> 




coast, 


create a 


European 

American, Afr ican American, Asian American, Mexican American, Christian 

American, 





help promote 


>>Ann 

>> 



>> 



the 


Jim 


pinpoint 


my 

>>life as i' m sure some of yours doesn't revolve around our cohort (as much as 






between 





not 


>>can say from my own personal experie nces when minorities attend schools in 




kids 




1873

just trying to kiss their ass or are doing so for another reason rather than 


>>an overall feeling i have seen of "what hope is there for these students" 





their 


work 




their 



one 


this 





is 





>> 

>>Matheno 

>> 


a 



>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


download! 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

1874

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 



1875






I agree... I took all my Spanish classes, but when I tried to speak to my friends, apparently the 

Spanish (I once knew temporaily) I was taught was too proper, it was not how people actually talked. 

Since I never used it enough, it has slowly drained from my brain. I hear stuff and I think to myself, 

"That sounds like something I used to know at one time, but now I have no idea what it means". Use 

it or lose it..... So why not teach what is used so you can use it.... 

Ann 


yes, but those aren't the classes we are required to take. My point was those are the classes we 

should take, not the garbage ones. Cynthia 



Mira 


It's super 





and that is a 


allowing 




apparent 


difficult 


pr ogram 


when they 


score 


back to 


cognitive 

1876


> ers each 


other, a 



way we 


required to 




they want to 


because we 


thanks to 


>Cynthia 

> 


> 


parents need 


I worked at a 


rid of 


ways of 


are not 


that cannot 


be that 


classroom? Or 


accounting 







> 

> 


get rid of 


so 


1877

teaching and 


>Cynthia 


going to 


takes hold, 


trouble, lol. 

> 



through 


bilingual 


issue. 




in. In that 


principal 








some that 


were kept at 


> ng that 


friend. The 


moved to 


was like cool 


to me: the 


fourth 


At the 


phoned her 


lawsuit. Her 



1878


for the 


family but 




>Karla 


threatened 


cause! 






> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 



approve of 


oppositional 


believes 


when you 


ON MY 


should 



units, 


much 


will you 


> on for 


buy there 


But, how 


views to be 


1879

> 

> 

> 






>> 

>>Matheno, 

>> 




coast, 


create a 


European 


American, 





help promote 


>>Ann 

>> 



>> 



the 


Jim 


pinpoint 


my 







between 





1880

not 






kids 











their 


work 




their 



one 


this 





is 





>> 

>>Matheno 

>> 


a 



>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

> 

1881

_____ 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


download! 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 





_____ 



1882






Hey Cynthia, 

I use to volunteer at Twin Oaks Elementary school down the street from 

school and the student are allowed bilingual ed until 3rd grade after that 

they are thrown into a regular classroom. The 2nd grade class that I was 

volunteering in the teacher spoke spanish in the morning and english inthe 

afternoon. Most of the kids did well with this "bilingual program." I did 

see some kids struggling in the afternnon when they were being taught in 

English. But there was always some way that the teacher made sure that they 

were understanding. Whether it was another student translating or just 

working closer with them. So thats my 2 cents. TTFN 




>Subject: Re: PROPOSITION 287 


> 

>So basically, the kids have to be in 3rd grade or lower to be allowed 

>bilingual ed? Did I read that correctly? Hmmmm. The problem with this is, 

>most parents either don't know about it, have been advised against it, or 

>don't want it, none of which seem to be informed reasoning. One of the 

>major obstacles is the idea of segregation. If you put all the Spanish 

>speakers together in classes, some people will pitch a fit. Of course, they 

>could offer it to the English speakers, so they could actually learn 

>Spanish. So really, they wouldn't have to change a whole lot about how 

>things are set up, just have 2 teachers switch off English 1/2 day, then 

>the other takes over for the Spanish and visa versa. But that would just be 

>too simple, and gosh, it might even work. Scratch that idea before it takes 

>hold. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>cynthia, 

>Since I am on a caffeine high I decided to do a little research on the 

>"bilingual waiver" that I previously mentioned. The excerpt actually came 

>from the prop. 287 website that actually explains why they decided to ban 

>bilingual education in California, but it has yet to become obliterated. 

>Opposing views just have to keep trying a little bit harder, right? Maybe 

>you could start an amendment since it seems that you have a strong opinion 

>about it. But hey that is just you right, I have learned that you tend to 

>be opinionated about practically everything that people have to say in 

>class (no offense), LOL. 

> 

>ARTICLE 3. Parental Exceptions 

>310. The requirements of Section 305 may be waived with the prior written 

>informed consent, to be provided annually, of the child's parents or legal 

>guardian under the circumstances specified below and in Section 311. Such 

>informed consent shall require that said parents or legal guardian 

>personally visit the school to apply for the waiver and that they there be 

>provided a full description of the educational materials to be used in the 

>different educational program choices and all the educational opportunities 

>available to the child. Under such parental waiver conditions, children may 

>be transferred to classes where they are taught English and other subjects 

>through bilingual education techniques or other generally recognized 

1883

educational methodologies permitted by law. Individual schools in which 20 

>students or more of a given grade level receive a waiver shall be required 

>to offer such a class; otherwise, they must allow the students to transfer 

>to a public school in which s 

> uch a 

> class is offered. 

>311. The circumstances in which a parental exception waiver may be granted 

>under Section 310 are as follows: 

>(a) Children who already know English: the child already possesses good 

>English language skills, as measured by standardized tests of English 

>vocabulary comprehension, reading, and writing, in which the child scores 

>at or above the state average for his grade level or at or above the 5th 

>grade average, whichever is lower; or 

>(b) Older children: the child is age 10 years or older, and it is the 

>informed belief of the school principal and educational staff that an 

>alternate course of educational study would be better suited to the childIs 

>rapid acquisition of basic English language skills; or 

>(c) Children with special needs: the child already has been placed for a 

>period of not less than thirty days during that school year in an English 

>language classroom and it is subsequently the informed belief of the school 

>principal and educational staff that the child has such special physical, 

>emotional, psychological, or educational needs that an alternate course of 

>educational study would be better suited to the child's overall educational 

>development. A written description of these special needs must be provided 

>and any such decision is to be made subject to the examination and approval 

>of the local school superintendent, under guidelines established by and 

>subject to the review of the local Board of Education and ultimately the 

>State Board of Education. The existence of such special needs shall not 

>compel issuance of a waiver, and the parents shall be fully informed of 

>their right to refuse to agree to a waiver. 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



1884






That sounds similar to the program I read about. Too bad they don't continue it at least through the 

sixth grade in order to give the students a real foundation in the English language and basic 

academics. Cynthia 


Hey Cynthia, 

I use to volunteer at Twin Oaks Elementary school down the street from 

school and the student are allowed bilingual ed until 3rd grade after that 

they are thrown into a regular classroom. The 2nd grade class that I was 

volunteering in the teacher spoke spanish in the morning and english inthe 

afternoon. Most of the kids did well with this "bilingual program." I did 

see some kids struggling in the afternnon when they were being taught in 

English. But there was always some way that the teacher made sure that they 

were understanding. Whether it was another student translating or just 

working closer with them. So thats my 2 cents. TTFN 




>Subject: Re: PROPOSITION 287 


> 

>So basically, the kids have to be in 3rd grade or lower to be allowed 

>bilingual ed? Did I read that correctly? Hmmmm. The problem with this is, 

>most parents either don't know about it, have been advised against it, or 

>don't want it, none of which seem to be informed reasoning. One of the 

>major obstacles is the idea of segregation. If you put all the Spanish 

>speakers together in classes, some people will pitch a fit. Of course, they 

>could offer it to the English speakers, so they could actually learn 

>Spanish. So really, they wouldn't have to change a whole lot about how 

>things are set up, just have 2 teachers switch off English 1/2 day, then 

>the other takes over for the Spanish and visa versa. But that would just be 

>too simple, and gosh, it might even work. Scratch that idea before it takes 

>hold. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>cynthia, 

>Since I am on a caffeine high I decided to do a little research on the 

>"bilingual waiver" that I previously mentioned. The excerpt actually came 

>from the prop. 287 website that actually explains why they decided to ban 

>bilingual education in California, but it has yet to become obliterated. 

1885

Opposing views just have to keep trying a little bit harder, right? Maybe 

>you could start an amendment since it seems that you have a strong opinion 

>about it. But hey that is just you right, I have learned that you tend to 

>be opinionated about practically everything that people have to say in 

>class (no offense), LOL. 

> 

>ARTICLE 3. Parental Exceptions 

>310. The requirements of Section 305 may be waived with the prior written 

>informed consent, to be provided annually, of the child's parents or legal 

>guardian under the circumstances specified below and in Section 311. Such 

>informed consent shall require that said parents or legal guardian 

>personally visit the school to apply for the waiver and that they there be 

>provided a full description of the educational materials to be used in the 

>different educational program choices and all the educational opportunities 

>available to the child. Under such parental waiver conditions, children may 

>be transferred to classes where they are taught English and other subjects 

>through bilingual education techniques or other generally recognized 

>educational methodologies permitted by law. Individual schools in which 20 

>students or more of a given grade level receive a waiver shall be required 

>to offer such a class; otherwise, they must allow the students to transfer 

>to a public school in which s 

> uch a 

> class is offered. 

>311. The circumstances in which a parental exception waiver may be g ranted 

>under Section 310 are as follows: 

>(a) Children who already know English: the child already possesses good 

>English language skills, as measured by standardized tests of English 

>vocabulary comprehension, reading, and writing, in which the child scores 

>at or above the state average for his grade level or at or above the 5th 

>grade average, whichever is lower; or 

>(b) Older children: the child is age 10 years or older, and it is the 

>informed belief of the school principal and educational staff that an 

>alternate course of educational study would be better suited to the childIs 

>rapid acquisition of basic English language skills; or 

>(c) Children with special needs: the child already has been placed for a 

>period of not less than thirty days during that school year in an English 

>language classroom and it is subsequently the informed belief of the school 

>principal and educational staff that the child has such special physical, 

>emotional, psychological, or educational needs that an alternate course of 

>educational study would be better suited to the child's overall educational 

>development. A written description of these special needs must be provided 

>and any such decision is to be made subject to the examination and approval 

>of the local school superintendent, under guidelines established by and 

>subject to the review of the local Board of Education and ultimately the 

>State Board of Education. The existence of such special needs shall not 

>compel issuance of a waiver, and the parents shall be fully informed of 

>their right to refuse to agree to a waiver. 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



1886

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



1887






I totally agree that the second langauge education classes suck. I have been 

studying spanish since seventh grade. I can tell you all about spain's history 

and the queens and kings of spain. I even can explain the linguistics of 

spanish, but I can not tell you how to get to the store from here or how to 

make a salad in spanish. I learned all my everyday spanish from working with 

children. When I worked at an after school program in Escondido, I would have 

to explain stories to students and talk to parents about children's behavior 

in spanish. It is from learning from mistakes and experience that I have 

learned to speak spanish. So, come to spain with me this summer and we all can 

speak spanish together, because sitting in a classroom won't teach you much. 

Teresa 

>Cynthia they do have conversational Spanish speaking classess. They are 

great. 

>Mira 

>Costa also has lunch sessions where you eat and can speak only in Spanish. 

>It's super 

>fun and you learn a lot. Marin 

> 

> 

> 

>>I think they should be held accountable for the test scores. As far as 

>teachers being 

>prepared, I don't think there are near enough qualified bilingual teachers, 

>and that is a 

>big problem. I just wonder what those administrators are hoping to gain by 

not 

>allowing 

>bilingual education in their school. I just read a great article about a 

>Chinese bilingual 

>immersion program in Canada. One of the things pointed out as a reason for 

>apparent 

>success was parent involvement. The other one was that Chinese is such a 

>difficult 

>language, the students preferred to use English. There were students in that 

>program 

>that spoke neither Mandarin or English, and some that spoke one or the other 

>when they 

>entered the program, which goes from grades 1-6. But evidently, they tend to 

>score 

>higher on achievement tests on average than English only speakers. This goes 

>back to 

>the theory we learned about in linguistics, that bilingual kids develop 

better 

>cognitive 

>skills. Their classes also had 2 teach 

>> ers each 

>> day, one native Mandarin speaker, which taught certain subjects, and the 

>other, a 

>native English speaker for the rest of the subjects. 

>>In order to get more qualified bilingual teachers here, we need to change 

the 

>way we 

>are taught a second language to begin with. Those stupid classes we were 

>required to 

>take didn't teach me how to speak Spanish. Unless they start teaching 

>conversational 

1888


>they want to 

>begin with. We aren't going to get a lot of Native Spanish speaking teachers 

>because we 

>aren't educating the potential future teachers to begin with. (That would be 

>thanks to 

>people like those running Lincoln). 

>>Cynthia 

>> 

>>Karla Garduno wrote: 

>> 

>>As to my understanding bilingual education is not completely obliterated, 

>parents need 

>to sign a waiver that allows bilingualism in the classroom. As a 

mater-of-fact 

>I worked at a 

>magnet school whose emphasis was bilingualism. I don't think that the getting 

>rid of 

>bilingualism is what is making them hardnosed, it is their biased and racist 

>ways of 

>conferring, that is making them take such views. And apparently their views 

>are not 

>working because Lincoln is one of the many schools in the Escondido district 

>that cannot 

>raise their test scores. So something most not be working out here. Could it 

>be that 

>perhaps some teachers are in fact ILL PREPARED to teach in a diverse 

>classroom? Or 

>perhaps the administration needs to get a good whipping when it comes to 

>accounting 

>for the plunging test scores? 

>>----- Original Message ----- 

>>From: Cynthia Reyes 


>>Sent: Monday, April 12, 2004 10:48 PM 


>> 

>> 

>>So much for changing the system from within!! One thought though, didn't 

they 

>get rid of 

>bilingual education in california? Could that be a reason why they are being 

>so 

>hardnosed about it? If she feels strongly about it, she should continue 

>teaching and 

>fighting for what she believes. 

>>Cynthia 

>>This sounds like a witchhunt (sagan). Those evil pro-bilingual ed people are 

>going to 

>take down the whole education system. Better burn them at the stake before it 

>takes hold, 

>they might actually educate some of THOSE kids, then we would be in real 

>trouble, lol. 

>> 

>>Karla Garduno wrote: 

>>My sister-n-law who is a second grade teacher at Lincoln elementary is going 

>through 

>exactly what you are saying Robert. She has been a strong advocate for 

>bilingual 

>education and I have seen her go long ways to battle opposing views on this 

>issue. 

>There is a group of teachers in that school that feel so strong about the 

>issue that they 

>have gone as far as contracting lawyers to back them up in what they believe 

>in. In that 

>school is not necessarily the parents that oppose bilingual education, but 

1889

the 

>principal 

>and the head honchos. It has gotten to the point that a couple of her 

>collegues have 

>gotten fired just because they stand behind their believes 100%. Just 

>recently, she was 

>telling me, the little "click" that is for bilingual education at Lincoln was 

>confronted with 

>another surprise. The principal held a meeting with each one of them to tell 

>some that 

>some were to be relocated to another school. Out of five teachers only two 

>were kept at 

>Lincoln, my sister-n -law( bei 

>> ng that 

>> she was teacher of the year for the last year) and one of her other teacher 

>friend. The 

>staying of my sister-n-law and her colleague came at a price though, she was 

>moved to 

>teach fourth grade and the other teacher was move to kindergarten. At first I 

>was like cool 

>you got to stay instead of being relocated but she then explain the jest of 

it 

>to me: the 

>change in grade was so that they will not be able to communicate at work, for 

>fourth 

>grade teachers and kindergarten teachers have a completely different 

schedule. 

>At the 

>moment that she was telling about all this drama one of her teacher friends 

>phoned her 

>and mentioned that they were going to be meeting with a lawyer to file a 

civil 

>lawsuit. Her 

>last comment to me was, "I am so tired of all this it, I have told your 

>brother that I am ready 

>to move on to something else". I commend my sister-n-law for what she is 

doing 

>for the 

>Spanish speakers at her school. I am not only saying it because she is my 

>family but 

>because it only 

>> motivates me to continue where she left off in her struggle. 

>>Here is one for all the hypocrites, 

>>Karla 

>>P.S. to have to relocate teachers only shows that the bosses at Lincoln feel 

>threatened 

>by the kind of actions that these group of teachers have taken to defend a 

>cause! 

>>----- Original Message ----- 

>>From: Robert Atchison 


>>Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2004 1:43 PM 


>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>>Just because one promotes equality and understanding of others within your 

>classroom, not all of your children nor there parents or society at large 

will 

>approve of 

>your styles. How does one begin to develop a framework for addressing 

>oppositional 

1890

view points? Not everyone believes that equality is a good thing, not 

everyone 

>believes 

>that all children deserve an equal education. Sad, but very true. What 

happens 

>when you 

>are a strong believer of bi-lingual education and the superintendent says 

"NOT 

>ON MY 

>WATCH." We all carry with us an understanding of how we feel everyone else 

>should 

>view the world. But, how do you teach in an environment with so many views 

and 

>understandings? How much control will we have over our future curriculums, 

>units, 

>lessons, words, feelings, beliefs, etc.? and where does one draw the line? 

How 

>much 

>control will one have to say "NOT ON MY WATCH" and understanding that when 

>will you 

>stop fighting? This is one reason teachers don' t stay in the professi 

>> on for 

>> very long. How will we combat this? Many will probably go with the flow and 

>buy there 

>house and retire having not helped change society in any formidable motion. 

>But, how 

>can we begin to work within the system to promote change in what each of us 

>views to be 

>a positive direction and many of us may view as a negative direction? 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>>>From: Ann Kirkendall 

>>>Reply-To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

>>>To: ICP-F@csusm.edu 

>>>Subject: Re: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 

>>>Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 10:00:13 -0700 (PDT) 

>>> 

>>>Matheno, 

>>> 

>>>Your'e right... Topics of inequality are brought up brefly, but never delt 

>with on levels 

>that could help make a change. I myself am not planning on teaching near the 

>coast, 

>and I plan to go into teaching with the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I want 

to 

>create a 

>classroom that is a safe learning environment for everyone. Everyone: 

>European 

>American, African American, Asian American, Mexican American, Christian 

>American, 

>Mormon American, Catholic American, Heterosexual American, Homosexual 

>American...........etc. I want to include and respect everyone to the best 

of 

>my abilities. I 

>know I will not be perfect, but I know I will do everything in my abilities 

to 

>help promote 

>well rounded children of the future. 

>>>Ann 

>>> 

>>>lande008 wrote: 

>>>Dear list serve members, 

>>> 

>>>As I read some of the journals late the other night (recently got internet 

1891

hooked up at the crib)I thought to myself "damn i have been missing out on 

>the 

>>>opportunity to show the cohort and faculty that I am an able writer and as 

>Jim 

>>>Rome would say have good takes." That being said, I can't absolutely 

>pinpoint 

>>>why my activity on the list serve has been so sparse other than to say that 

>my 

>>>life as i'm sure some of yours doesn't revolve around our cohort (as much 

as 

>>>it should) and especially not an email list (my closest friends and i don't 

>>>communicate via email so it is not a medium with which I am completely 

>>>comfortable) so other than doing the necessary number of journals I haven't 

>>>been around to jump on some of the entries that I should have. For 

instance, 

>>>their was a posting recently speaking about the difference in literacy 

>between 

>>>students in poor school versus rich or church based schools that I wanted 

to 

>>>respond to by saying that in poor schools (the faculty usually doesn't push 

>>>the stduents the way they need to be pushed either out of a feeling that 

the 

>>>students aren't capable of grasping the material or indiffernce whether or 

>not 

>>>their students ever become intellignent novices. Along the same lines, as I 

>>>can say from my own personal experiences when minorities attend schools in 

>>>middle class or well to do areas they still aren't pushed to succeed but 

>>>rather allowed to simply coast through without fear of failure (our test 

>>>scores will still be high compared to the rest of the schools so if these 

>kids 

>>>aren't prepared it won't reflect on us overall) so we are left to motivate 

>>>ourselves and if you are one that continually is pressuring the teacher to 

>>>help you or explain something clearer (i have felt as if they think you are 

>>>just trying to kiss their ass or are doing so for another reason rather 

than 

>>>just a desire to learn (this being in the high school years)). But their is 

>>>an overall feeling i have seen of "what hope is there for these students" 

>>>without every taking the time to think that you are there "hope" and the 

one 

>>>that needs to be challenging each and every one of them. I perceive that 

the 

>>>majority of my cohort members desire to work in the carlsbad, encinitas, 

and 

>>>rancho bernardos but sorry guys you all aren't going to be able to work 

>their 

>>>and it is my fear that when you do get a job in an area you don't want to 

>work 

>>>in for whatever reason (hopefully not because of the ethnicity or 

>>>socio-economic status of your students) you will resent your position and 

>>>continue the string of teachers who don't care about the performance of 

>their 

>>>students or don't feel that they can make an impact. That being said, I 

tend 

>>>to bite my tongue for fear of being the "angry black man" or whatever else 

>one 

>>>could be labeled for speaking their mind but I can't worry about that at 

>this 

>>>time. I feel that our "multicultural education" courses have only 

reinforced 

>>>that their is a gap between the education of minorites and done little to 

>>>encourage future teachers that this trend can change if they want it to. 

Its 

>>>like "look at these test scores" and thats it no explination as to why this 

>is 

>>>so or how it can be fixed. Anyways folks just a few things i wanted to get 

>>>off my chest in between patrons here in the media library so if its 

1892

muttered 

>>>up my apologies but please feel free to discuss with me anything you would 

>>>like and i'll make an effort to respond to your thoughts as well. 

>>> 

>>>Matheno 

>>> 

>>>p.s. pressure is a good driving force, but stress is just that stress never 

>a 

>>>good driving force it is simply stress. Rick Pitino (not his exact words 

but 

>>>along those lines) 

>>> 

>>> 

>>>--------------------------------- 

>>>Do you Yahoo!? 

>>>Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 

>>MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page FREE 

>download! 

>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 



>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 



1893






DITTO!!!! My point exactly. 

Cynthia 



Spanish (I once knew temporaily) I was taught was too proper, it was not how people actually 

talked. Since I never used it enough, it has slowly drained from my brain. I hear stuff and I think 

to myself, "That sounds like something I used to know at one time, but now I have no idea what it 

means". Use it or lose it..... So why not teach what is used so you can use it.... 

Ann 


yes, but those aren't the classes we are required to take. My point was those are the classes 

we should take, not the garbage ones. Cynthia 



Mira 


It's super 





and that is a 


allowing 




apparent 


difficult 


pr ogram 


when they 


1894

score 


back to 


cognitive 


> ers each 


other, a 



way we 


required to 




they want to 


because we 


thanks to 


>Cynthia 

> 


> 


parents need 


I worked at a 


rid of 


ways of 


are not 


that cannot 


be that 


classroom? Or 


accounting 







> 

> 

1895

So much for changing the system from within!! One thought though, didn't they 

get rid of 


so 


teaching and 


>Cynthia 


going to 


takes hold, 


trouble, lol. 

> 



through 


bilingual 


issue. 




in. In that 


principal 








some that 


were kept at 


> ng that 


friend. The 


moved to 


was like cool 


to me: the 


fourth 


At the 


1896

phoned her 


lawsuit. Her 




for the 


family but 




>Karla 


threatened 


cause! 






> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 



approve of 


oppositional 


believes 


when you 


ON MY 


should 



units, 


much 


will you 


> on for 


buy there 

1897


But, how 


views to be 


> 

> 

> 

> 






>> 

>>Matheno, 

>> 




coast, 


create a 


European 


American, 





help promote 


>>Ann 

>> 



>> 



the 


Jim 


pinpoint 


my 







1898

etween 





not 






kids 











their 


work 




their 



one 


this 





is 





>> 

>>Matheno 

>> 


a 



>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 

1899

_____ 

_____ 



> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


download! 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 







_____ 



1900





Subject: RE: be encouraged 

First, I reminded all of you to use your spring break wisely!!! I see that 

this did not happen, I knew you all would start stressing again. Good thing I 

mentally took two weeks off. Now, I will leave you with this quote "One needs 

something to believe in, something for which one can have wholehearted 

enthusiasm. One needs to feel that one's life has meaning, that one is needed 

in this world." This is why we want to teach!! Keep your head up, only one 

more real semester left until we have to grow up! 

Teresa 

p.s. "No person who is enthusiastic about his(her work has anything to fear 

from life." 

>this one's for you chula! you're awesome... 

> 

>The purpose of this email is to lift you all up, so read on my friends. 

> 

>last week i had a break down. 

>the stress was getting the best of me, but that wasnt the cause. 

>over the past 2 years i have met many many people that are less than 

encouraging that i want to be a teacher. 

>you know the ones.... 

>"you want to teach, why?!" 

>"6th grade, good luck with that!" 

>"parents are gonna make you life horrible, why do you want to deal with 

parents?!" 

> 

>do you see a pattern? 

>now, this isnt to say that i dont get praises for my decision and my hard 

work put into it, but you only remember the bad. 

>all those good things people tell me, bring a temporary smile to my face, but 

then it fades as a negative comment hits my hear. 

> 

>so im here to tell you, be encouraged! 

>good job for working so hard the past two years and for sticking to it. 

>what an amazing choice you made to become a teacher. there is no other job 

as noble as this. 

>your kids are gonna love you. 

>you are gonna love this job. 

>you are gonna do great! 

> 

>try to remember all this even when you get beat down. 

>shrug off those people assuming they hate their job, knowing you wont. next 

time tell them, im sorry you dont like your job, but i love mine becasue i 

know this is what i want to do, im called to do this. 

> 

>dont let the ICP teachers try to scare you. this started in semester one 

where it seemed like the goal of ICP was not to foster us but to scare us out 

of teaching. 

>THANK YOU ICP for your structure and a BA and credential, but shame on you 

for discouraging your teachers in training, shame on you for not loving us up 

for this influencial choice we have all made. 

> 

>i love you guys and am thankful that we have each other to lift one another 

up. 

> 

>although this semester has brought the worst out of us, know that it is 

almost over and it WILL get better! 

1901

1902





Subject: Science in the classroom 

If you haven't read the North County times today here's an interesting 

article thats close to here! 

_______________________________________________________________________________ 

Special Reports: Science & Technology 

Last modified Saturday, April 10, 2004 10:50 PM PDT 

Sea rolls inland to San Marcos school 

By: BRUCE KAUFFMAN - Staff Writer 

SAN MARCOS ---- Though San Marcos Middle School may be a few miles inland, 

Debra Brice's students are virtually at sea. 

Brice, a science teacher with a passion for oceanography, has been bringing 

wave after wave of information about the sea into her eighth-grade 

classrooms through broadcast links with ships far out in the Pacific. 

Her efforts, which also have brought her students face to face with 

cutting-edge scientists, won national recognition last week when she became 

one of 50 teachers across the United States to receive $10,000 and a heap of 

praise for presenting science to students in creative and novel ways. 

On Monday, she was in Atlanta to accept the Toyota Motor Sales tapestry 

grant. By Thursday, she was back in San Diego touring the research ship 

named after one for her heroes, the pioneering scientist and oceanographer 

Roger Revelle. Next school year, her students will go aboard the Revelle for 

an insider's tour of the ship. 

And when the students get there, Brice plans to have them show the 

oceangoing scientists a cache of research instruments they developed in 

class ---- and to try and sell the Revelle crew on the idea of using those 

tools in future expeditions. 

At least one of the expeditions is going to be caught on tape. Not only 

that, it will be broadcast live to Brice's students. They in turn will beam 

back their questions and comments to the scientists in a live land-and-sea 

give-and-take. 

"We have broad goals," Brice, a 10-year veteran of the San Marcos public 

schools, said last week before driving to the downtown dock to board the 

Revelle. "My kids will be able to experience real-time scientific research. 

They'll be doing some modeling of the experiments in the classroom and, 

ultimately, I'll be teaching chemistry and physics around oceanography." 

Unabashedly wide-eyed about her job, Brice, a Vista native, mother of an 

Eagle Scout and a former Boy Scout leader herself, who now lives in the 

1903

house her father built 58 years ago, did a trial run of ship-to-shore 

educating last November when she boarded the Revelle in Manta, Ecuador, and 

set off on a journey that took her 800 miles off the coast of Chile. 

There, she joined researchers in deploying a buoy that would monitor the 

atmosphere for tsunami-like conditions and examine how a cover of low 

stratus clouds was affecting the area's ecosystem, which encompassed one of 

the world's most productive fisheries. The students got regular, near 

real-time reports back from the ship by e-mail from their teacher. Her 

reports are posted on the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's 

Web site at http://www.ogp.noaa.gov/ootas/logs. 

A hookup through a special broadcast band called Scripps HighSeasNet enabled 

Brice to bring the sea inside the school for the program she developed and 

dubbed "In the Footsteps of Roger Revelle." 

The Scripps Institution of Oceanography in La Jolla owns both the 

HighSeasNet and the research vessel Revelle. Brice credits Revelle not only 

with being one of the first scientists to predict global warming, but also 

with being a key impetus behind the founding of UC San Diego in La Jolla. 

Toyota Motor Sales USA credits Brice with creativity and innovation. The 

company's Michael Rouse, manager of philanthropy and community affairs, said 

Brice's work represents "an innovative way of using the mystery of the sea 

to engage students in science." 

In making the award, Toyota had focused on how the teacher had brought San 

Marcos Middle School students together on-line with scientists at sea last 

September. The students looked on via their computer monitors as Styrofoam 

cups they'd decorated got placed on the surface of the Pacific Ocean and 

then sunk to a depth of 4,000 feet. 

Run by the Teacher at Sea program of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric 

Administration, the experiment was aimed at teaching students about the 

physics of pressure and density. The students had used vacuum pressure to 

deflate marshmallows to the size of sugar cubes so they would sink in the 

ocean. 

Brice says there were plenty of teaching opportunities for people like her 

with science backgrounds and the bonus of being bilingual, fluent in Spanish 

after years of living in Mexico. So when she came back to the United States 

in the 1980s, a single mother with three young kids in tow, working as a lab 

assistant for an environmental research firm, teaching seemed a good bet. 

This was especially so, she said, when she would have been spending two 

weeks a month at sea if she took a promotion. 

She's never looked back. 

"Teaching was something I could do and share my science and bilingual 

abilities and still get to spend time with my own children," she said. "As 

much as I wanted to take the promotion, my choice has worked out to be 

absolutely the right thing." 

"Sharing science with kids is far more fun and more rewarding than doing 

science by itself," she went on. "Seeing the look on their faces and the 

excitement ... sharing the passion that you have for something in your life, 

and getting the kids excited and passionate about something is a great 

reward in itself." 

Brice said she and the scientists she works with are people with an "eternal 

sense of wonder," a sense she aims to instill in her kids. 

She said she takes a cue from Louis Pasteur, who saw how a fungus killed the 

carefully-cultivated bacteria in one of his experiments and instead of 

junking the project, looked at it as a "possible positive." It turned out to 

lead to the discovery of the lifesaving antibiotic, penicillin. 

1904

"Chance," she quoted Pasteur as saying, "favors the prepared mind." 

_________________________________________________________________ 


Premium! 


1905





Subject: Re: Science in the classroom 

Wow, cool article! It would be fun to go observe her classroom. Thanks for sharing 

Cynthia 


If you haven't read the North County times today here's an interesting 

article thats close to here! 

______________________________________________________________________________ 

_ 

Special Reports: Science & Technology 

Last modified Saturday, April 10, 2004 10:50 PM PDT 

Sea rolls inland to San Marcos school 

By: BRUCE KAUFFMAN - Staff Writer 

SAN MARCOS ---- Though San Marcos Middle School may be a few miles inland, 

Debra Brice's students are virtually at sea. 

Brice, a science teacher with a passion for oceanography, has been bringing 

wave after wave of information about the sea into her eighth-grade 

classrooms through broadcast links with ships far out in the Pacific. 

Her efforts, which also have brought her students face to face with 

cutting-edge scientists, won national reco gnition last week when she became 

one of 50 teachers across the United States to receive $10,000 and a heap of 

praise for presenting science to students in creative and novel ways. 

On Monday, she was in Atlanta to accept the Toyota Motor Sales tapestry 

grant. By Thursday, she was back in San Diego touring the research ship 

named after one for her heroes, the pioneering scientist and oceanographer 

Roger Revelle. Next school year, her students will go aboard the Revelle for 

an insider's tour of the ship. 

And when the students get there, Brice plans to have them show the 

1906

oceangoing scientists a cache of research instruments they developed in 

class ---- and to try and sell the Revelle crew on the idea of using those 

tools in future expeditions. 

At least one of the expeditions is going to be caught on tape. Not only 

that, it will be broadcast live to Brice's students. They in turn will beam 

back their questions and comm ents to the scientists in a live land-and-sea 

give-and-take. 

"We have broad goals," Brice, a 10-year veteran of the San Marcos public 

schools, said last week before driving to the downtown dock to board the 

Revelle. "My kids will be able to experience real-time scientific research. 

They'll be doing some modeling of the experiments in the classroom and, 

ultimately, I'll be teaching chemistry and physics around oceanography." 

Unabashedly wide-eyed about her job, Brice, a Vista native, mother of an 

Eagle Scout and a former Boy Scout leader herself, who now lives in the 

house her father built 58 years ago, did a trial run of ship-to-shore 

educating last November when she boarded the Revelle in Manta, Ecuador, and 

set off on a journey that took her 800 miles off the coast of Chile. 

There, she joined researchers in deploying a buoy that would monitor the 

atmosphere for tsunami-like conditions and examine how a cover of low 

s tratus clouds was affecting the area's ecosystem, which encompassed one of 

the world's most productive fisheries. The students got regular, near 

real-time reports back from the ship by e-mail from their teacher. Her 

reports are posted on the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's 

Web site at http://www.ogp.noaa.gov/ootas/logs. 

A hookup through a special broadcast band called Scripps HighSeasNet enabled 

Brice to bring the sea inside the school for the program she developed and 

dubbed "In the Footsteps of Roger Revelle." 

The Scripps Institution of Oceanography in La Jolla owns both the 

HighSeasNet and the research vessel Revelle. Brice credits Revelle not only 

with being one of the first scientists to predict global warming, but also 

with being a key impetus behind the founding of UC San Diego in La Jolla. 

Toyota Motor Sales USA credits Brice with creativity and innovation. The 

company's Michael Rouse, manager of philanthropy and community affairs, said 

Brice's work represents "an innovative way of using the mystery of the sea 

to engage students in science." 

In making the award, Toyota had focused on how the teacher had brought San 

Marcos Middle School students together on-line with scientists at sea last 

September. The students looked on via their computer monitors as Styrofoam 

cups they'd decorated got placed on the surface of the Pacific Ocean and 

then sunk to a depth of 4,000 feet. 

Run by the Teacher at Sea program of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric 

Administration, the experiment was aimed at teaching students about the 

physics of pressure and density. The students had used vacuum pressure to 

deflate marshmallows to the size of sugar cubes so they would sink in the 

1907

ocean. 

Brice says there were plenty of teaching opportunities for people like her 

with science backgrounds and the bonus of being bilingual, fluent in Spanish 

after years of living in Mexico. So when she came back to the United States 

in the 1980s, a single mother with three young kids in tow, working as a lab 

assistant for an environmental research firm, teaching seemed a good bet. 

This was especially so, she said, when she would have been spending two 

weeks a month at sea if she took a promotion. 

She's never looked back. 

"Teaching was something I could do and share my science and bilingual 

abilities and still get to spend time with my own children," she said. "As 

much as I wanted to take the promotion, my choice has worked out to be 

absolutely the right thing." 

"Sharing science with kids is far more fun and more rewarding than doing 

science by itself," she went on. "Seeing the look on their faces and the 

excitement ... sharing the passion that you have for something in your life, 

and getting the kids excited and passionate about something is a great 

rew ard in itself." 

Brice said she and the scientists she works with are people with an "eternal 

sense of wonder," a sense she aims to instill in her kids. 

She said she takes a cue from Louis Pasteur, who saw how a fungus killed the 

carefully-cultivated bacteria in one of his experiments and instead of 

junking the project, looked at it as a "possible positive." It turned out to 

lead to the discovery of the lifesaving antibiotic, penicillin. 

"Chance," she quoted Pasteur as saying, "favors the prepared mind." 

_________________________________________________________________ 


Premium! 


_____ 



1908





Subject: RESPECT 

Is this list serve becoming a place to share our lack of respect and understanding for our professors 

and school? Although I often bitch and complain with the rest of you, one must remember that many 

of our professors are trying to make us better teachers. In every one of our classes we have adapted 

our pack mentality to destroy any personal differences that we might share with our professors. Often 

we have been very closed off, yes since semester one. This is one of the biggest problems that I see 

with the ICP program, in that the students can begin to manipulate the faculty because they 

understand the group dynamic better than the faculty. We have literally tore some of our faculty to 

shreds, both verbally and mentally. I think that this has closed some of us off from gaining the 

knowledge that they are responsible to impart in us and we are responsible to learn. I don't know, 

what do you guys think? I know that I would never want to have to teach one our co-hort 

classes because we are too hard on the professors. This is just based on some of the e-mails and 

conversations that I have heard. We can bash them, but what does this do to the knowledge that we 

are suppose to be gaining from them? Respecting your teachers is a necessary component, to 

enable one to learn from their professor. or not? I know that I would be a more affective teacher if my 

students respected me. 

_____ 


1909





Subject: Re: RESPECT 

And how many of us would want our students trashing us, especially if we are really trying to educate 

them? The lack of respect signals a lack of learning, or willingness to learn. I don't think this is a good 

thing, especially for future teachers. How can we expect our students to learn if we aren't willing to 

learn? Seems kind of hypocritical. 

Cynthia 


Is this list serve becoming a place to share our lack of respect and understanding for our 

professors and school? Although I often bitch and complain with the rest of you, one must 

remember that many of our professors are trying to make us better teachers. In every one of our 

classes we have adapted our pack mentality to destroy any personal differences that we might 

share with our professors. Often we have been very closed off, yes since semester one. This is 

one of the biggest problems that I see with the ICP program, in that the students can begin to 

manipulate the faculty because they understand the group dynamic better than the faculty. We 

have literally tore some of our faculty to shreds, both verbally and mentally. I think that this has 

closed some of us off from gaining the knowledge that they are responsible to impart in us and we 

are responsible to learn. I don't know, what do you guys think? I know that I would never want to 

have to teach one our co-hort classes because we are too hard on the professors. This is just 

based on some of the e-mails and conversations that I have heard. We can bash them, but what 

does this do to the knowledge that we are suppose to be gaining from them? Respecting your 

teachers is a necessary component, to enable one to learn from their professor. or not? I know 

that I would be a more affective teacher if my students respected me. 

_____ 


_____ 



1910






Robert- 

I have done my fair share of complaining- believe me....I feel I was treated very unfairly the first 

semester of this program. That kind of got me down on the program from the beginning. It is clear, in 

my opinion, that I was treated unfiarly by a teacher who was not there to prepare us to be teachers. 

She was there to pay rent and she told us that a couple of times. You all know what I am talking 

about. I don't know where this is coming from but I skated through that class writing my papers and 

doing my reading responses and attending class just like the rest of you even though it was painful. 

Anyways- I was never disrespectful even though I would have loved to be. She told me that she does 

not think I will make a very good teacher and she failed me so that I would think twice about 

becoming a teacher. And the way I looked at that was no one can tell me that I cannot be what I 

dreamed of being my whole life. I am going to make a very good teacher (it took a lot of people 

bringing my self esteem back up to believe that) I was close to quiting! 

I have been taught to treat my elders with respect. And that goes back to the whole Mrs. or Mr. thing. 

It is about respect. If I were Fierro last semester...I would have lost it. I know we got frustrated a lot 

and many had a hard time in that class but the way some people talked to him really upset me. It is 

unneccesary to speak to people like that. So I agree with you Robert...we should have respect for our 

teachers because I do not think they wake up in the morning saying I am gonna try to make cohortF's 

lives hell. I think they try to the best of their ability- excluding Plante. And by the way...you all know i 

am repeating the wonderful ID 340 and even though it sucks I have to repeat a class- it is a very 

interesting course and I think it would have been really beneficial to our cohort to have it together. We 

got cheated out of a really interesting and benefical class. This journal has a lot of random thoughts 

and I really don't know where it came from...but if you ever notice me being rude Robert...slap me 

silly! Cuz I would never want my students to treat me the way some of our teachers have been 

treated. 

Casey 

1911





Subject: RE: RESPECT 

I totally agree with you Robert on the respect that "us" as a chort show our 

teachers that we have in the LCP program. I do believe that "we" take 

advantage of some of our teachers and push them off the deep end. I never 

really looked at it until today when I read your email. I would never want my 

students taking advatage of me the way we have done to some of our ICP 

teachers in the past. Last semester with Fierro it was tough and alot of 

people were frustrated with his teaching and the way he ran the class. So I 

can see how you saw alot of disrespect coming from "us" to him. Now this 

semester I feel we are doing great with the respect towards our teachers. 

Jonathan 

1912





Subject: norh/south facing slopes 

Hey classmates, 

here's a site a ran across when i was researching something. Just thought 

about some of you who are doing your capstone on north/south facing slope 

plants. 

http://www.rcip.org/mshcpdocs/Vol2/appendixB/plants/stickyleaveddudleya.pdf 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Tax headache? MSN Money provides relief with tax tips, tools, IRS forms and 

more! http://moneycentral.msn.com/tax/workshop/welcome.asp 

1913




To: LBST 361B 


Hola a todos, 

By reading emails about bilingualism and bilingual education, I remember my 

experience when I started learning English. 

It all started when I entered the 9th grade. I was placed in a classroom 

called "Welcome Center." The majority or I should say all the students were 

hispanic. There were 3 different levels of ESL. While we were learning English 

we also took other classes. Some were in Spanish others in English, but the 

teacher had a TA to translate anything that we did not understand. PE was no 

brainer, we always had someone to tell us what to do. 

I didnt' like my ESL classes. I felt that I wasn't not learning anything. 

Sometimes I was put to write sentences, but I was not told how to do it. 

Luckly, my knowledge of Spanish grammar helped me learned the English one. 

Oh well, enough with my story. What I also wanted to say is that I felt I was 

the only one in our group who had a hard time learning a different language. 

But I guess some of you guys have a similar experience. 

And I agree that to learn a language you have to go to a place where that 

language is spoken. In my own experience, it took me more time to be confident 

when speaking English because if I had to go to the store, I knew they spoke 

Spanish. Although I tried to practice as much as I could, I ended up speaking 

Spanish most of the time and I still do. 

As a final thought, I just feel greatful that I went through my experience 

because that will allow me to identify myself with my future students who have 

to go through the same situation. I understand what is to feel as an outsider 

and as an "alien" but I have made it all the way through here and I am sure 

other will too. 

Nos vemos, 

Judith :-) 

1914






Maybe that is the whole point to insisting we take a foreign language class. Maybe they don't expect 

us to learn the language, just feel the frustration so we understand how others feel, so we can better 

relate to our students. I feel so much better now, lol. Of course, I could have figured that out in a 

weekend trip to TJ. 

Cynthia 


Hola a todos, 












Oh well, enough with my story. What I als o wanted to say is that I felt I was 













Nos vemos, 

Judith :-) 

1915

_____ 



1916





Subject: Worthy thoughts 

I just ran into these quotes and thought they were worthy of putting on here 

and giving some thought to them. 

"Nostalgia is a fire fueled by failures of memory."-William Lashner 

"Worry is a misuse of your imagination."- William Lashner 

After reading all the journals I realized that just as we have our differences 

in thought and emotion on the list serve, our students in the classroom will 

have their own thoughts, emotions, and learning styles. I often get 

discouraged (as Karas mentioned) about people feeling sorry for me that I want 

to be a teacher, or that they can't believe that I could stand being around 

children for that long. I never said it was going to be easy, just as these 

semesters have been challenging for a lot of us. We must just keep pushing 

for the goal and just keep jumping over the hurdles that are being thrown at 

us either in school or personally. 

Bruer mentions that there are performance goal children and learning goal 

children, pg. 274. I think that this is probably built into our personality, 

but unlike what the theorist and Bruer think, I believe it is not innate and 

can be changed. 

Many of us (as Yamashita mentions)look at the goal and perform only what is 

expected and needed to reach the goal, which right now that is just getting 

through the semester with a passing grade. These are the performance goaled 

people. In our future classrooms this is the student that quickly pushes 

through the assignment with never truly understanding or making connections as 

to why they are doing it. The unfortunate down fall of this attitude is that 

it will eventually lead to failure, or when they start to fail they will give 

up completely and then attribute it to their own stupidity which can 

eventually perpetuates to a more serious lack of confidence. Sadly if this 

happens early on, say 1st grade, then every time they fail they blame 

themselves and don't want to go on. 

The learning goal student, however, looks at failure as a minor set back and 

another opportunity to grasp the concepts that were unclear. For those of us 

that have this attitude then we exert more brain power to the problems or 

stresses that come up, we don't give up we try harder. 

In my future classroom I hope to encourage not only metacognitively aware 

students but also encourage students to see the bigger picture of it all. 

How? You might ask, beats me, but that is my ultimate goal. 

I know how hard it is to see all the classes we have taken through this cohort 

experience, but put on the teaching lenses and see how important it is to know 

what knowledge and experiences your students have come from and where they are 

going. I sound like I am preaching, but really this is a reminder to myself. 

-That's all for this week, until next time! 

Chula 

1917






Dear class, 

Sagan's chapter on Science and Witchcraft was a very informative one to read. 

As I read about the manner in which supposed witches were interrogated, 

tortured, and later executed I thought damn that was really chinga up the way 

that they did those people but then I thought to our society today. A deaf 

man is shot and killed while holding (oh shit i can't remember but it wasn't a 

deadly weapon I want to say racquet but I know that's not what it was) no need 

to mention that he was black. Also many people here have been put to death 

possibly right or wrong but without doubt many have been wrongly put to death 

as a result of a cop trying to get the red of his or her board. In Illinois 

many convicts were let off of death row because of improper interrogations. 

Sagan also brought up the question of whether or not people with control over 

the media are using it as a beneficial tool or for evil. An example that he 

brought was that of Saddam Hussein who went from not being widely known 

throughout the world to the symbol of evil as a result of the media's coverage 

of him. He also said that if the people as a whole were introduced to a 

scientific way of thinking instead of what they can purchase or how their life 

has been improved as a result of a scientific breakthrough our societies would 

be much more harmonious and knowledgeable about one another. 

peace, 

Matheno 

1918






my thoughts exactly. 




>Subject: Re: RESPECT 


> 

>And how many of us would want our students trashing us, especially if we are really trying to 

educate them? The lack of respect signals a lack of learning, or willingness to learn. I don't think this 

is a good thing, especially for future teachers. How can we expect our students to learn if we aren't 

willing to learn? Seems kind of hypocritical. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Is this list serve becoming a place to share our lack of respect and understanding for our professors 

and school? Although I often bitch and complain with the rest of you, one must remember that many 

of our professors are trying to make us better teachers. In every one of our classes we have adapted 

our pack mentality to destroy any personal differences that we might share with our professors. Often 

we have been very closed off, yes since semester one. This is one of the biggest problems that I see 

with the ICP program, in that the students can begin to manipulate the faculty because they 

understand the group dynamic better than the faculty. We have literally tore some of our faculty to 

shreds, both verbally and mentally. I think that this has closed some of us off from gaining the 

knowledge that they are responsible to impart in us and we are responsible to learn. I don't know, 

what do you guys think? I know that I would never want to have to teach one our cohort classes be 

> cause we 

> are too hard on the professors. This is just based on some of the e-mails and conversations that I 

have heard. We can bash them, but what does this do to the knowledge that we are suppose to be 

gaining from them? Respecting your teachers is a necessary component, to enable one to learn from 

their professor. or not? I know that I would be a more affective teacher if my students respected me. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

>MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page – FREE download! 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


1919


_____ 


1920





Subject: Re: Worthy thoughts 

Maybe one way to do it is how Prof. Yamashita does it. Nobody knows what kind of grade they will be 

getting. You can do the work or not, you can learn or not; it just depends on what you want to get out 

of the class. I think this class was a good exercise in the goal verus performance learners. If kids are 

only working for a grade, they are working for the wrong reason. I think if you have the students 

research, learn and then teach others, they might shift their thinking on why they are doing the work. 

If students are put in charge of learning, then they are going to be performing for us, the teachers. Of 

course, they might be performing for their peers. Bringing in professionals from the community to 

work with students might also be a good idea. It puts a little reality on why they are learning 

something. Its like, "Look, this person actually uses this in his/her job". There will always be students 

who will be just learning because its what they are supposed to do. But , taking the importance out of 

the grade might at least help. 

Cynthia 


I just ran into these quotes and thought they were worthy of putting on here 

and giving some thought to them. 

"Nostalgia is a fire fueled by failures of memory."-William Lashner 

"Worry is a misuse of your imagination."- William Lashner 

After reading all the journals I realized that just as we have our differences 

in thought and emotion on the list serve, our students in the classroom will 

have their own thoughts, emotions, and learning styles. I often get 

discouraged (as Karas mentioned) about people feeling sorry for me that I want 

to be a teacher, or that they can't believe that I could stand being around 

children for that long. I never said it was going to be easy, just as these 

semesters have been challenging for a lot of us. We must just keep pushing 

for the goal and just keep jumping over the hurdles that are being thrown at 

us either in school or personally. 

Bruer mentions that there are performance goal children and learning goal 

children, pg. 274. I think that this is probably built into our personality, 

but unlike what the theorist and Bruer think, I believe it is not innate and 

can be changed. 

Many of us (as Yamashita mentions)look at the goal and perform only what is 

expected and needed to reach the goal, which right now that is just getting 

through the semester with a passing grade. These are the performance goaled 

people. In our future classrooms this is the student that quickly pushes 

through the assignment with never truly understanding or making connections as 

to why they are doing it. The unfortunate down fall of this attitude is that 

it will eventually lead to failure, or when they start to fail they will give 


eventually perpetuates to a more serious lack of confid ence. Sadly if this 

happens early on, say 1st grade, then every time they fail they blame 

themselves and don't want to go on. 

1921

The learning goal student, however, looks at failure as a minor set back and 

another opportunity to grasp the concepts that were unclear. For those of us 

that have this attitude then we exert more brain power to the problems or 

stresses that come up, we don't give up we try harder. 

In my future classroom I hope to encourage not only metacognitively aware 

students but also encourage students to see the bigger picture of it all. 

How? You might ask, beats me, but that is my ultimate goal. 

I know how hard it is to see all the classes we have taken through this cohort 

experience, but put on the teaching lenses and see how important it is to know 

what knowledge and experiences your students have come from and where they are 

going. I sound like I am preaching, but really this is a reminder to myself. 

-That's all for this week, until next time! 

Chula 

_____ 



1922






I won't slap you, but I will let you know. That was what I was trying to bring up with this list serve. 

There seems to be some pretty harsh writing about the people who are trying to teach us and I think 

that we might be losing out on some important knowledge. Thank you for your comments. Does 

anyone want to comment on the pack mentality of a cohort situation and how this may negatively 

effect our education? 

>From: CA222girl@aol.com 




>Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 19:47:23 EDT 

> 

>Robert- 

> I have done my fair share of complaining- believe me....I feel I was 

>treated very unfairly the first semester of this program. That kind of got me down 

>on the program from the beginning. It is clear, in my opinion, that I was 

>treated unfiarly by a teacher who was not there to prepare us to be teachers. She 

>was there to pay rent and she told us that a couple of times. You all know 

>what I am talking about. I don't know where this is coming from but I skated 

>through that class writing my papers and doing my reading responses and attending 

>class just like the rest of you even though it was painful. Anyways- I was 

>never disrespectful even though I would have loved to be. She told me that she 

>does not think I will make a very good teacher and she failed me so that I 

>would think twice about becoming a teacher. And the way I looked at that was no 

>one can tell me that I cannot be what I dreamed of being my whole life. I am 

>going to make a very good teacher (it took a lot of people bringing my self 

>esteem back up to believe that) I was close to quiting! 

> 

> I have been taught to treat my elders with respect. And that goes back to 

>the whole Mrs. or Mr. thing. It is about respect. If I were Fierro last 

>semester...I would have lost it. I know we got frustrated a lot and many had a hard 

>time in that class but the way some people talked to him really upset me. It is 

>unneccesary to speak to people like that. So I agree with you Robert...we 

>should have respect for our teachers because I do not think they wake up in the 

>morning saying I am gonna try to make cohortF's lives hell. I think they try to 

1923

the best of their ability- excluding Plante. And by the way...you all know i 

>am repeating the wonderful ID 340 and even though it sucks I have to repeat a 

>class- it is a very interesting course and I think it would have been really 

>beneficial to our cohort to have it together. We got cheated out of a really 

>interesting and benefical class. This journal has a lot of random thoughts and I 

>really don't know where it came from...but if you ever notice me being rude 

>Robert...slap me silly! Cuz I would never want my students to treat me the way 

>some of our teachers have been treated. 

> Casey 

_____ 

Persistent heartburn? Check out Digestive Health & Wellness for information and advice. 

1924






Well, pack mentality, gang mentality. People who band together to feel safe or gain a sense of 

belonging. In order to stay a part of that group, they hop on the bandwagon, disregarding the right 

and wrong of it all. Overall, it can be very detrimental when negative attitudes take hold and prevail. I 

think that initially, when a professor runs his/her class differently than what the students are used to, it 

tends to bring on a reaction that makes the cohort want to collectively protect the group. Some never 

get over the initial reaction, they hang onto it, and never adapt. I think it is important to remain an 

individual that can step outside the group and look at things from different perspective. Its not always 

easy, but it is more beneficial in the long run. And if the individual is no longer accepted as part of the 

group, well, that's the way it goes and might not be such a bad thing. What is important, is that each 

person gets the most out of their education and experiences that they can, regardless of the path that 

the pack takes. Cynthia 


I won't slap you, but I will let you know. That was what I was trying to bring up with this list serve. 

There seems to be some pretty harsh writing about the people who are trying to teach us and I 

think that we might be losing out on some important knowledge. Thank you for your comments. 

Does anyone want to comment on the pack mentality of a cohort situation and how this may 

negatively effect our education? 





>Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 19:47:23 EDT 

> 

>Robert- 

> I have done my fair share of complaining- believe me....I feel I was 

>treated very unfairly the first semester of this program. That kind of got me down 

>on the program from the beginning. It is clear, in my opinion, that I was 

>treated unfiarly by a teacher who was not there to prepare us to be teachers. She 

>was there to pay rent and she told us that a couple of times. You all know 

>what I am talking about. I don't know where this is coming from but I skated 

>through that class writing my papers and doing my reading responses and attending 

>class just like the rest of you even though it was painful. Anyways- I was 

1925

never disrespectful even though I would have loved to be. She told me that she 

>does not think I will make a very good teacher and she failed me so that I 

>would think twice about becoming a teacher. And the way I looked at that was no 

>one can tell me that I cannot be what I dreamed of being my whole life. I am 

>going to make a very good teacher (it took a lot of people bringing my self 

>esteem back up to believe that) I was close to quiting! 

> 

> I have been taught to treat my elders with respect. And that goes back to 

>the whole Mrs. or Mr. thing. It is about respect. If I were Fierro last 

>semester...I would have lost it. I know we got frustrated a lot and many had a hard 

>time in that class but the way some people talked to him really upset me. It is 

>unneccesary to speak to people like that. So I agree with you Robert...we 

>should have respect for our teachers because I do not think they wake up in the 

>morning saying I am gonna try to make cohortF's lives hell. I think they try to 

>the best of their ability- excluding Plante. And by the way...you all know i 

>am repeating the wonderful ID 340 and even though it sucks I have to repeat a 

>class- it is a very interesting course and I think it would have been really 

>beneficial to our cohort to have it together. We got cheated out of a really 

>interesting and benefical class. This journal has a lot of random thoughts and I 

>really don't know where it came from...but if you ever notice me being rude 

>Robert...slap me silly! Cuz I would never want my students to treat me the way 

>some of our teachers have been treated. 

> Casey 

_____ 

Persistent heartburn? Check out Digestive Health & Wellness for information and advice. 

_____ 



1926





Subject: RE: be encouraged 

Karis, 

Thanks for this e-mail. I was truly needing some inspiration right about 

now. I think we all needed to hear some kind and positive thoughts to weigh 

out those negative ones that we all tend to hold onto. 

Smiling, 

Jennifer 

>From: 


>To: 

>Subject: be encouraged 

>Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 10:28:23 -0700 

> 

>this one's for you chula! you're awesome... 

> 

>The purpose of this email is to lift you all up, so read on my friends. 

> 

>last week i had a break down. 

>the stress was getting the best of me, but that wasnt the cause. 

>over the past 2 years i have met many many people that are less than 

>encouraging that i want to be a teacher. 

>you know the ones.... 

>"you want to teach, why?!" 

>"6th grade, good luck with that!" 

>"parents are gonna make you life horrible, why do you want to deal with 

>parents?!" 

> 

>do you see a pattern? 

>now, this isnt to say that i dont get praises for my decision and my hard 

>work put into it, but you only remember the bad. 

>all those good things people tell me, bring a temporary smile to my face, 

>but then it fades as a negative comment hits my hear. 

> 

>so im here to tell you, be encouraged! 

>good job for working so hard the past two years and for sticking to it. 

>what an amazing choice you made to become a teacher. there is no other job 

>as noble as this. 

>your kids are gonna love you. 

>you are gonna love this job. 

>you are gonna do great! 

> 

>try to remember all this even when you get beat down. 

>shrug off those people assuming they hate their job, knowing you wont. 

>next time tell them, im sorry you dont like your job, but i love mine 

>becasue i know this is what i want to do, im called to do this. 

> 

>dont let the ICP teachers try to scare you. this started in semester one 

>where it seemed like the goal of ICP was not to foster us but to scare us 

>out of teaching. 

>THANK YOU ICP for your structure and a BA and credential, but shame on you 

>for discouraging your teachers in training, shame on you for not loving us 

>up for this influencial choice we have all made. 

> 

1927

i love you guys and am thankful that we have each other to lift one another 

>up. 

> 

>although this semester has brought the worst out of us, know that it is 

>almost over and it WILL get better! 

> 

> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 


download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/ 

1928






I have to say for this week's readings, I liked Bruer's but Sagan's was 

boring. 

Bruer was pretty much talking about testing in schools with its relevance and 

how they can be used to tell us how studets may or may not doing in certain 

subject areas in school. For one, I can't stand standardized tests or tests 

just like the SATs. For one, I don't like them because I was never a good test 

taker. I may have been getting good grades in school, but I definitely didn't 

do as well as I would have liked on many of the tests that I've taken. Does 

then my test scores show that I'm a good student or all of the effrt put into 

studying for it? No. Which I think is missing in test taking. But then you 

think, how can we test someone's effort in a test. I don't know, but it should 

be considered in some way. 

I did like the whole reading about teacher's using motivation on their 

students when it comes to test taking. You wouldn't believe how much that 

helped me when my parents were always there to motivate me to accel in school 

and try my hardest on tests. They always tell me that they are happy with 

whatever I achieve in grades in school, especially now in college because they 

know how much stress has been put upon me. So motivation is definitely a key 

element that any teacher should do in his/her classroom. 

I have to say that Sagan's readings was back to being boring. I wish he would 

talk more about teaching. Instead he had to talk about witchcraft and the many 

tortures that people had to go through during that time. Talk about 

depressing! I think the reason why Yamashita has us read this is to open our 

minds more about what people want to say to us. Sagan was talking something 

about the importance of science and democracy which I found being more and 

more true because of information I've collected during this semester this 

listserver. 

That's all folks! 

Laurie :) 

1929





Subject: RE: A Possible Answer to Global Warming 

Cool info on the global warming and the mice. I especially like the cute 

picture of the mice. They are so adorable! 

Laurie :) 

1930





Subject: need some uplifting? 

For anyone who needs some uplifting, here are some nice quotes I got from the 

Bible. Enjoy! 

Don't be afraid, for I m with you. Do not be dismayed, for I am your God. I 

will strengthen you. I will help you. I will uphold you with my victorious 

hand. (Isiah 41:10) 

Be strong and courageous! Do not be afraid or discouraged. For the Lord your 

God is with you whereever you go. (Joshua 1:9) 

1931





Subject: Re: Judith's journal 12 

Hey Judith, 

I remember in one of you e-mails you were talking about how hard it was to speak in English when 

you were first learning it. For example, if you went to the store you totally knew what you wanted to 

say in Spanish, but you had to match up the words in your head to the newly learned English words, 

and this was a lot of work.... 

Well, the one summer that I took all of my Spanish classes at Palomar College, I could read Spanish 

pretty well, and I could listen to people talking and understand them pretty much (not as good as 

reading) but, when it came time for me to speak Spanish..... that was hard to do. I felt like I 

new exactly what to say in English, but to translate my thought and ideas into not only the words but 

the verbs and the pronouns, and the order in which I had to place the subject, verbs, etc. were very 

difficult for me. I did it, it just felt like it was much, much harder than reading or listening to Spanish. I 

can imagine other people might struggle in this area too. I have watched several Japanese students 

who have lived with us struggle to find the correct words too. 

Ann 


Hola a todos, 












Oh well, enough with my story. What I als o wanted to say is that I felt I was 








1932






Nos vemos, 

Judith :-) 

_____ 



1933





Subject: R.E.S.P.E.C.T. 

Hmmmm ....this seems like a familiar topic.... 

I totally agree........... I think we should respect our Professors and our fellow cohort members 

whether it is in class or on the list serve....... we should all remember to treat one another as you 

would want to treated youself. I am not perfect either. I think some of us have perhaps gotten into 

some bad habits, but the upside to this is people can change, if they want to. Let's all make an extra 

effort to be kind and respectful to eachother and our Professors. Let's try and take each class and 

learn as much as we can. Let's try to make each day count.... Soon, our college years will just be 

fading memories.... let's make them good memories...... 

Ann http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/05.gif If you do not...... you might force me 

to call someone....... 

Like E.T. said, "BE GOOD". Don't make me call E.T.!!!! 


"Hello, ... yes, may I please speak with E.T.?" " Yes, I'll hold".................."He's not home?" "O.K., 

can you please tell him that Ann called and I want to give him an update about Cohort- F, yes, Cohort 

-F" "c-o-h-o-r-t-F, yes, that's correct...." "Yes, he has my number.." "O.K., thank you very much" 

"You too." "Bye Bye..." 


_____ 



1934





Subject: Good Quote 

Hi everyone, 

Here is a good quote for today....... 

Wisdom is knowing when to speak your mind and when to mind your speech. 

- Unknown 

See you in class, 


_____ 



1935






How do you think spanish speakers feel when they go home and they do not get to practice their 

english due to the parents not knowing how to speak it? 







Spanish (I once knew temporaily) I was taught was too proper, it was not how people actually 

talked. Since I never used it enough, it has slowly drained from my brain. I hear stuff and I think 

to myself, "That sounds like something I used to know at one time, but now I have no idea what it 

means". Use it or lose it..... So why not teach what is used so you can use it.... 

Ann 


yes, but those aren't the classes we are required to take. My point was those are the classes 

we should take, not the garbage ones. Cynthia 



Mira 


It's super 





and that is a 


allowing 




apparent 


difficult 


1936

pr ogram 


when they 


score 


back to 


cognitive 


> ers each 


other, a 



way we 


required to 




they want to 


because we 


thanks to 


>Cynthia 

> 


> 


parents need 


I worked at a 


rid of 


ways of 


are not 


that cannot 


be that 


classroom? Or 


accounting 





1937



> 

> 


get rid of 


so 


teaching and 


>Cynthia 


going to 


takes hold, 


trouble, lol. 

> 



through 


bilingual 


issue. 




in. In that 


principal 








some that 


were kept at 


> ng that 


friend. The 


moved to 


was like cool 


to me: the 


1938

fourth 


At the 


phoned her 


lawsuit. Her 




for the 


family but 




>Karla 


threatened 


cause! 






> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 



approve of 


oppositional 


believes 


when you 


ON MY 


should 



units, 


much 


will you 

1939


> on for 


buy there 


But, how 


views to be 


> 

> 

> 

> 






>> 

>>Matheno, 

>> 




coast, 


create a 


European 


American, 





help promote 


>>Ann 

>> 



>> 



the 


Jim 


pinpoint 


my 



1940





between 





not 






kids 











their 


work 




their 



one 


this 





is 





>> 

>>Matheno 

>> 


a 


1941

_____ 

_____ 


>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


download! 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 







1942





Subject: thanks laurie! 

> 


> Date: 2004/04/14 Wed AM 12:34:20 PDT 


> Subject: need some uplifting? 

> 

> For anyone who needs some uplifting, here are some nice quotes I got from the 

> Bible. Enjoy! 

> 

> Don't be afraid, for I m with you. Do not be dismayed, for I am your God. I 

> will strengthen you. I will help you. I will uphold you with my victorious 

> hand. (Isiah 41:10) 

> 

> Be strong and courageous! Do not be afraid or discouraged. For the Lord your 

> God is with you whereever you go. (Joshua 1:9) 

> 

> 

> 


1943





Subject: grade inflation 

http://www.cybercollege.com/plume3.htm 

http://www.aas.duke.edu/development/Miscellaneous/grades.html 

http://chronicle.com/free/v47/i30/30b02401.htm 

_____ 


1944





Subject: Re: grade inflation 

Cool, Robert!! Glad you found these articles, especially the one from Harvard. I know this probably 

ruffles the feathers of some people, but I think he is right on. 

"Grade inflation has resulted from the emphasis in American education on the notion of self-esteem. 

According to that therapeutic notion, the purpose of education is to make students feel capable and 

empowered. So to grade them, or to grade them strictly, is cruel and dehumanizing. Grading creates 

stress. It encourages competition rather than harmony. It is judgmental." 

Nothing like giving a kid the false notion that he is a genius and doesn't have to think or work hard. 

How does this help him in the real world? Someday, these students will be faced with the truth, and 

they will feel betrayed. I think you can be honest with students without being degrading or 

dehumanizing. Students like to be challenged, and in the end, when they have really accomplished 

something, have their self-esteem raised and their efforts and learning validated. The ones that are 

being lied to, can't really feel good, because they probably know the truth about their efforts and 

accomplishments or the lack of them. 

Cynthia 

PS, not just a theory, I have seen it happen with students I have worked with. 


http://www.cybercollege.com/plume3.htm 

http://www.aas.duke.edu/development/Miscellaneous/grades.html 

http://chronicle.com/free/v47/i30/30b02401.htm 

_____ 


_____ 



1945





Subject: Re: 

Hey, you are back!!!! Robert found that article you were talking about in class, the one with the 

harvard prof. Great conversation piece. 

Cynthia 


subscribe 

_____ 



1946






Hey Cynthia, 

I totally agree. I do feel that sometimes that we are doing more harm than good in the classrooms 

when we are misguiding students in the work load and grading. I think that we can find a happy 

medium in which students can take constructive criticism and work with it. I know from my personal 

experience in school that when we recieved criticism that it was always meaning that something was 

wrong. I have learned through painful experiences in "real life" that constructive critism is necessary 

and everyone needs it. It is something that was hard to learn later in life and I think that I would be 

better at it if I had learned in school that it was a norm of everyday life. 

Jenny Fiala 

1947





Subject: Science Kicks Butt..... encouragment ^1000000000 power 

Hey everyone, 

Here is a quote that I came across this morning that I used to look at when I quit smoking 6 years 

ago. I don't know who wrote it. 

"Obstacles are what we see when we take our eys off the goal." 

Anyway, I can'r help but notice how great I feel. Sure we are all tired; sure we are all stressed out to 

the max, ect. Those things are a given. But yesterday throughout my day and throughout our 

classes, I was grooving. I woke up exhausted yeasterday mornig after going to bed at 2 am, I met 

with Jonathan 2 hours before our first VPA class and we kicked butt and got the backdrop for our 

puppet show done. I went to our LBST 361B class, and I felt good that we were actually learning stuff 

that I could make sense of and that I could picture using in my future classroom. Next, we went to 

Biology and as I listened to professor Lowe talking about evolution and adaptations, I though of how 

cool everything was starting to nicely fit into the proper places within my brain. Then, we went to Dr. 

Karas' class, and our transition form water to electicity was comfortable. I had fun exploring with the 

lab. I really had an great time . Then, our Capstone group met and we were working with our project, 

and I couldn't help but feel a great sense of community........ The kind of community of little learners 

that I want to create in future classrooms. 

I went home and I was exhausted. I ended up going to bed at 8:00 pm with a huge, but exhausted 

smile on my face. I woke up this morning and I am all excited about science. I could not think of 

anything that I touched or thought about that didn't include science in it. I was out watering my 

garden, and I was thinking about all the stuff Jennifer Ramos and I learned about capillary action in 

vascular plant.... I was using a hose and putting pressure on the end to create a spray to water my 

vegetable, and I thought about Dr. Karas' class.... I went in and flipped on the light switch to get ready 

for school and the electricity that closed the circuit to make the electricity heat up the filiment in the 

light bulb..... we just learned in Dr. Karas' class. I can't think of anything that does not have science 

in it on some level. whether it is science, science, or social science..... everything is science.... The 

breath I just took to fill my lungs with oxygen can be explained through science, my fingers tyoing this 

journal posting can be explained by science....... the darn computer that I am using can be explained 

by science.... 

Science is not a separate field or a separate subject or a separate class.......SCIENCE IS IN 

EVERYTHING>>>>SCIENCE IS EVERYWHERE..... AND SCIENCE KICKS BUTT!!!!!! So don't 

think of it a something separate and hard and confussing (even though somethimes it is confussing) 

think of it as being totally asome. I can't wait to pass my crazy entusiatice energy and passion on to 

my future students. I want them to get all hopped up on science like I am right now!!!!!!! Feel the 

encouragment....feel the power..... feel the sense of community within the cohort..... we all bring to the 

table our special powers....we are the justice league and we are all super heros. we are going out 

into the world to inspire, to encourage, to teach, to care for, to create little learning communities....ect. 

teachers KICK BUTT...... TEACHERS ARE ASOME, WE CAN HAVE SUCH A GREAT INFLUENCE 

ON SO MANY LIVES....LET'S MAKE SURE WE DO THE BEST WE CAN DO......LET'S GO OUT 

THERE AND KICK BUTT!!!!!! WHO'S WITH ME SAY "I".......... 

1948

_____ 



1949





Subject: RE: Science Kicks Butt..... encouragment ^1000000000 power AFTER SPELL CHECK 

I agree with you Ann, science does kick butt; it's kicking my butt all over 

the place! Cecilia 


>Hey everyone, 

> 

>Here is a quote that I came across this morning that I used to look at when I 

quit smoking 6 years ago. I don't know who wrote it. 

> 

>"Obstacles are what we see when we take our eyes off the goal." 

> 

>Anyway, I can't help but notice how great I feel. Sure we are all tired; 

sure we are all stressed out to the max, etc. Those things are a given. But 

yesterday throughout my day and throughout our classes, I was grooving. I 

woke up exhausted yesterday morning after going to bed at 2 am, I met with 

Jonathan 2 hours before our first VPA class and we kicked butt and got the 

backdrop for our puppet show done. I went to our LBST 361B class, and I felt 

good that we were actually learning stuff that I could make sense of and that 

I could picture using in my future classroom. Next, we went to Biology and as 

I listened to professor Lowe talking about evolution and adaptations, I though 

of how cool everything was starting to nicely fit into the proper places 

within my brain. Then, we went to Dr. Karas' class, and our transition form 

water to electricity was comfortable. I had fun exploring with the lab. I 

really had an great time. Then, our Capstone group met and we were worki 

> ng with 

> our project, and I couldn't help but feel a great sense of community........ 

The kind of community of little learners that I want to create in future 

classrooms. 

> 

>I went home and I was exhausted. I ended up going to bed at 8:00 pm with a 

huge, but exhausted smile on my face. I woke up this morning and I am all 

excited about science. I could not think of anything that I touched or 

thought about that didn't include science in it. I was out watering my 

garden, and I was thinking about all the stuff Jennifer Ramos and I learned 

about capillary action in vascular plant.... I was using a hose and putting 

pressure on the end to create a spray to water my vegetable, and I thought 

about Dr. Karas' class.... I went in and flipped on the light switch to get 

ready for school and the electricity that closed the circuit to make the 

electricity heat up the filament in the light bulb..... we just learned in 

Dr. Karas' class. I can't think of anything that does not have science in it 

on some level. whether it is science, science, or social science..... 

everything is science.... The breath I just took to fill my lungs with oxygen 

can be expla 

> ined 

> through science, my fingers typing this journal posting can be explained by 

science....... the darn computer that I am using can be explained by 

science.... 

> 

>Science is not a separate field or a separate subject or a separate 

class.......SCIENCE IS IN EVERYTHING>>>>SCIENCE IS EVERYWHERE..... AND 

SCIENCE KICKS BUTT!!!!!! So don't think of it a something separate and hard 

and confusing (even though sometimes it is confusing) think of it as being 

totally awesome. I can't wait to pass my crazy enthusiastic energy and 

1950

passion on to my future students. I want them to get all hopped up on science 

like I am right now!!!!!!! Feel the encouragement....feel the power..... 

feel the sense of community within the cohort..... we all bring to the table 

our special powers....we are the justice league and we are all super heroes. 

we are going out into the world to inspire, to encourage, to teach, to care 

for, to create little learning communities....etc. teachers KICK BUTT...... 

TEACHERS ARE AWESOME, WE CAN HAVE SUCH A GREAT INFLUENCE ON SO MANY 

LIVES....LET'S MAKE SURE WE DO THE BEST WE CAN DO......LET'S GO OUT THERE AND 

KICK BUTT!!!!!! 

> WHO'S 

> WITH ME SAY "I".......... 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



1951




To: Karla Garduno; ICP-F@csusm.edu 


I was fortunate because I was able to speak both Spanish and English when I 

started school and by the sixth grade I was even fluent in ghetto! The hard 

thing for me was that my mother did not speak English, therefore she could not 

help me with homework. 

I will just share a little memory I have. When I was in the fourth grade, a 

student came from Honduras and they told me to sit with her and help her with 

her English. I remember thinking that she would never learn because she was 

struggling so much, but by the end of the year she spoke English better than I 

did. Because of this I used to think learning English should be easy for 

anybody. I know now that she only learned because she was submerged in it, she 

had to sink or swim. 

I don't think there's a point to this story, I just wanted to share. 

>===== Original Message From "Karla Garduno" ===== 

>How do you think spanish speakers feel when they go home and they do not get 

to practice their english due to the parents not knowing how to speak it? 




> Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 2004 11:48 AM 

> Subject: RE: bilingualism and the bigoted administration 

> 

> 

> I agree... I took all my Spanish classes, but when I tried to speak to my 

friends, apparently the Spanish (I once knew temporaily) I was taught was too 

proper, it was not how people actually talked. Since I never used it enough, 

it has slowly drained from my brain. I hear stuff and I think to myself, 

"That sounds like something I used to know at one time, but now I have no idea 

what it means". Use it or lose it..... So why not teach what is used so you 

can use it.... 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> Cynthia Reyes wrote: 

> yes, but those aren't the classes we are required to take. My point was 

those are the classes we should take, not the garbage ones. Cynthia 

> 


> Cynthia they do have conversational Spanish speaking classess. They are 

great. 

> Mira 

> Costa also has lunch sessions where you eat and can speak only in 

Spanish. 

> It's super 

> fun and you learn a lot. Marin 

> 

> 

> 

> >I think they should be held accountable for the test scores. As far as 

> teachers being 

> prepared, I don't think there are near enough qualified bilingual 

teachers, 

> and that is a 

> big problem. I just wonder what those administrators are hoping to gain 

1952

y not 

> allowing 

> bilingual education in their school. I just read a great article about 

a 

> Chinese bilingual 

> immersion program in Canada. One of the things pointed out as a reason 

for 

> apparent 

> success was parent involvement. The other one was that Chinese is such 

a 

> difficult 

> language, the students preferred to use English. There were students in 

that 

> pr ogram 

> that spoke neither Mandarin or English, and some that spoke one or the 

other 

> when they 

> entered the program, which goes from grades 1-6. But evidently, they 

tend to 

> score 

> higher on achievement tests on average than English only speakers. This 

goes 

> back to 

> the theory we learned about in linguistics, that bilingual kids develop 

better 

> cognitive 

> skills. Their classes also had 2 teach 

> > ers each 

> > day, one native Mandarin speaker, which taught certain subjects, and 

the 

> other, a 

> native English speaker for the rest of the subjects. 

> >In order to get more qualified bilingual teachers here, we need to 

change the 

> way we 

> are taught a second language to begin with. Those stupid classes we 

were 

> required to 

> take didn't teach me how to speak Spanish. Unless they start teaching 

> conversational 

> Spanish, I don't see it changing very quickly, but then maybe that is 

what 

> they want to 

> begin with. We aren' t going to get a lot of Native Spanish speaking 

teachers 

> because we 

> aren't educating the potential future teachers to begin with. (That 

would be 

> thanks to 

> people like those running Lincoln). 

> >Cynthia 

> > 

> >Karla Garduno wrote: 

> > 

> >As to my understanding bilingual education is not completely 

obliterated, 

> parents need 

> to sign a waiver that allows bilingualism in the classroom. As a 

mater-of-fact 

> I worked at a 

> magnet school whose emphasis was bilingualism. I don't think that the 

getting 

> rid of 

> bilingualism is what is making them hardnosed, it is their biased and 

racist 

> ways of 

1953

conferring, that is making them take such views. And apparently their 

views 

> are not 

> working because Lincoln is one of the many schools in the Escondido 

district 

> that cannot 

> raise their test scores. So something most not be working out here. 

Could it 

> be that 

> perhaps some teachers are in fact ILL PREP ARED to teach in a diverse 

> classroom? Or 

> perhaps the administration needs to get a good whipping when it comes 

to 

> accounting 

> for the plunging test scores? 

> >----- Original Message ----- 



> >Sent: Monday, April 12, 2004 10:48 PM 

> >Subject: Re: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 

> > 

> > 

> >So much for changing the system from within!! One thought though, 

didn't they 

> get rid of 

> bilingual education in california? Could that be a reason why they are 

being 

> so 

> hardnosed about it? If she feels strongly about it, she should continue 

> teaching and 

> fighting for what she believes. 

> >Cynthia 

> >This sounds like a witchhunt (sagan). Those evil pro-bilingual ed 

people are 

> going to 

> take down the whole education system. Better burn them at the stake 

before it 

> takes hold, 

> they might actually educate some of THOSE kids, then we would be in 

real 

> trouble, lol. 

> > 


> >My sister-n-law who is a second grade teacher at Lincoln elementary is 

going 

> through 

> exactly what you are saying Robert. She has been a strong advocate for 

> bilingual 

> education and I have seen her go long ways to battle opposing views on 

this 

> issue. 

> There is a group of teachers in that school that feel so strong about 

the 

> issue that they 

> have gone as far as contracting lawyers to back them up in what they 

believe 

> in. In that 

> school is not necessarily the parents that oppose bilingual education, 

but the 

> principal 

> and the head honchos. It has gotten to the point that a couple of her 

> collegues have 

> gotten fired just because they stand behind their believes 100%. Just 

> recently, she was 

> telling me, the little "click" that is for bilingual education at 

Lincoln was 

1954


> another surprise. The principal held a meeting with each one of the m 

to tell 

> some that 

> some were to be relocated to another school. Out of five teachers only 

two 

> were kept at 

> Lincoln, my sister-n -law( bei 

> > ng that 

> > she was teacher of the year for the last year) and one of her other 

teacher 

> friend. The 

> staying of my sister-n-law and her colleague came at a price though, 

she was 

> moved to 

> teach fourth grade and the other teacher was move to kindergarten. At 

first I 

> was like cool 

> you got to stay instead of being relocated but she then explain the 

jest of it 

> to me: the 

> change in grade was so that they will not be able to communicate at 

work, for 

> fourth 

> grade teachers and kindergarten teachers have a completely different 

schedule. 

> At the 

> moment that she was telling about all this drama one of her teacher 

friends 

> phoned her 

> and mentioned that they were going to be meeting with a lawyer to file 

a civil 

> lawsuit. Her 

> last comment to me was, "I am so tired of all this it, I have told your 

> brother that I am ready 

> to move on to something else". I commend my sister-n-law for what she 

is doing 

> for the 

> Spanish speakers at her school. I am not only saying it because she is 

my 

> family but 

> because it only 

> > motivates me to continue where she left off in her struggle. 

> >Here is one for all the hypocrites, 

> >Karla 

> >P.S. to have to relocate teachers only shows that the bosses at 

Lincoln feel 

> threatened 

> by the kind of actions that these group of teachers have taken to 

defend a 

> cause! 


> >From: Robert Atchison 


> >Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2004 1:43 PM 


> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >Just because one promotes equality and understanding of others within 

your 

> classroom, not all of your children nor there parents or society at 

1955

large will 

> approve of 

> your styles. How does one begin to develop a framework for addressing 

> oppositional 

> view points? Not everyone believes that equality is a good thing, not 

everyone 

> believes 

> that all children deserve an equal education. Sad, but very true. What 

happens 

> when you 

> are a strong believer of bi-lingual education and the superintendent 

says "NOT 

> ON MY 

> WATCH." We all carry with us an understanding of how we feel everyone 

else 

> should 

> view the world. But, how do you teach in an environment with so many 

views and 

> understandings? How much control will we have over our future 

curriculums, 

> units, 

> lessons, words, feelings, beliefs, etc.? and where does one draw the 

line? How 

> much 

> control will one have to say "NOT ON MY WATCH" and understanding that 

when 

> will you 

> stop fighting? This is one reason teachers don' t stay in the professi 

> > on for 

> > very long. How will we combat this? Many will probably go with th e 

flow and 

> buy there 

> house and retire having not helped change society in any formidable 

motion. 

> But, how 

> can we begin to work within the system to promote change in what each 

of us 

> views to be 

> a positive direction and many of us may view as a negative direction? 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >>From: Ann Kirkendall 



> >>Subject: Re: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 

> >>Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 10:00:13 -0700 (PDT) 

> >> 

> >>Matheno, 

> >> 

> >>Your'e right... Topics of inequality are brought up brefly, but never 

delt 

> with on levels 

> that could help make a change. I myself am not planning on teaching 

near the 

> coast, 

> and I plan to go into teaching with the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I 

want to 

> create a 

> classroom that is a safe learning environment for everyone. Everyone: 

> European 

> American, Afr ican American, Asian American, Mexican American, 

Christian 

> American, 

> Mormon American, Catholic American, Heterosexual American, Homosexual 

1956

American...........etc. I want to include and respect everyone to the 

best of 

> my abilities. I 

> know I will not be perfect, but I know I will do everything in my 

abilities to 

> help promote 

> well rounded children of the future. 

> >>Ann 

> >> 

> >>lande008 wrote: 

> >>Dear list serve members, 

> >> 

> >>As I read some of the journals late the other night (recently got 

internet 

> >>hooked up at the crib)I thought to myself "damn i have been missing 

out on 

> the 

> >>opportunity to show the cohort and faculty that I am an able writer 

and as 

> Jim 

> >>Rome would say have good takes." That being said, I can't absolutely 

> pinpoint 

> >>why my activity on the list serve has been so sparse other than to 

say that 

> my 

> >>life as i' m sure some of yours doesn't revolve around our cohort (as 

much as 

> >>it should) and especially not an email list (my closest friends and i 

don't 

> >>communicate via email so it is not a medium with which I am 

completely 

> >>comfortable) so other than doing the necessary number of journals I 

haven't 

> >>been around to jump on some of the entries that I should have. For 

instance, 

> >>their was a posting recently speaking about the difference in 

literacy 

> between 

> >>students in poor school versus rich or church based schools that I 

wanted to 

> >>respond to by saying that in poor schools (the faculty usually 

doesn't push 

> >>the stduents the way they need to be pushed either out of a feeling 

that the 

> >>students aren't capable of grasping the material or indiffernce 

whether or 

> not 

> >>their students ever become intellignent novices. Along the same 

lines, as I 

> >>can say from my own personal experie nces when minorities attend 

schools in 

> >>middle class or well to do areas they still aren't pushed to succeed 

but 

> >>rather allowed to simply coast through without fear of failure (our 

test 

> >>scores will still be high compared to the rest of the schools so if 

these 

> kids 

> >>aren't prepared it won't reflect on us overall) so we are left to 

motivate 

> >>ourselves and if you are one that continually is pressuring the 

teacher to 

> >>help you or explain something clearer (i have felt as if they think 

you are 

> >>just trying to kiss their ass or are doing so for another reason 

rather than 

1957

just a desire to learn (this being in the high school years)). But 

their is 

> >>an overall feeling i have seen of "what hope is there for these 

students" 

> >>without every taking the time to think that you are there "hope" and 

the one 

> >>that needs to be challenging each and every one of them. I perceive 

that the 

> >>majority of my cohort members desire to work in the carlsbad, 

encinitas, and 

> >>rancho bernardos but sorry guys you all aren't going to be able to 

work 

> their 

> >>and it is my fear that when you do get a job in an area you don't 

want to 

> work 

> >>in for whatever reason (hopefully not because of the ethnicity or 

> >>socio-economic status of your students) you will resent your position 

and 

> >>continue the string of teachers who don't care about the performance 

of 

> their 

> >>students or don't feel that they can make an impact. That being said, 

I tend 

> >>to bite my tongue for fear of being the "angry black man" or whatever 

else 

> one 

> >>could be labeled for speaking their mind but I can't worry about that 

at 

> this 

> >>time. I feel that our "multicultural education" courses have only 

reinforced 

> >>that their is a gap between the education of minorites and done 

little to 

> >>encourage future teachers that this trend can change if they want it 

to. Its 

> >>like "look at these test scores" and thats it no explination as to 

why this 

> is 

> >>so or how it can be fixed. Anyways folks just a few things i wanted 

to get 

> >>off my chest in between patrons here in the media library so if its 

muttered 

> >>up my apologies but please feel free to discuss with me anything you 

would 

> >>like and i'll make an effort to respond to your thoughts as well. 

> >> 

> >>Matheno 

> >> 

> >>p.s. pressure is a good driving force, but stress is just that stress 

never 

> a 

> >>good driving force it is simply stress. Rick Pitino (not his exact 

words but 

> >>along those lines) 

> >> 

> >> 

> >>--------------------------------- 


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> > 

> > 

> > 

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1958

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> >--------------------------------- 



> > 

> > 

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> 

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> Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th 

1959






Cynthia, 

Remember how Loweeeee told us the other day that a Theory is a "falsifiable idea supported by extensive evidence." So, 

therefore what you have is a theory because you have evidence ("not just a theory, I have seen it happen with students I 

have worked with"). Just thought I would bring that up. 

with love,, 

Robert 




>Subject: Re: grade inflation 


> 

>Cool, Robert!! Glad you found these articles, especially the one from Harvard. I know this probably 

ruffles the feathers of some people, but I think he is right on. 

>"Grade inflation has resulted from the emphasis in American education on the notion of self-esteem. 

According to that therapeutic notion, the purpose of education is to make students feel capable and 

empowered. So to grade them, or to grade them strictly, is cruel and dehumanizing. Grading creates 

stress. It encourages competition rather than harmony. It is judgmental." 

>Nothing like giving a kid the false notion that he is a genius and doesn't have to think or work hard. 

How does this help him in the real world? Someday, these students will be faced with the truth, and 

they will feel betrayed. I think you can be honest with students without being degrading or 

dehumanizing. Students like to be challenged, and in the end, when they have really accomplished 

something, have their self-esteem raised and their efforts and learning validated. The ones that are 

being lied to, can't really feel good, because they probably know the truth about their efforts and 

accomplishments or the lack of them. 

>Cynthia 

>PS, . 

> 

> 


>http://www.cybercollege.com/plume3.htm 

>http://www.aas.duke.edu/development/Miscellaneous/grades.html 

>http://chronicle.com/free/v47/i30/30b02401.htm 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


> 

1960

--------------------------------- 



_____ 


1961





Subject: RE: Worthy thoughts 

good point Cynthia. I believe that as future teachers we must find the uses of 

learing and teaching if we are going to want our teachers to realize the 

importance of learning. It brings a whole new light to the term, life long 

learners for me. Just to go through the motions of learning about new things 

will allow us to better understand our students excitment and frustrations. 

Have a good one I'll be back soon I got some stuff tosay about Sagan but I 

need to find my notes. Adios. Marin the Great. 

>Maybe one way to do it is how Prof. Yamashita does it. Nobody knows what kind 

of grade they will be getting. You can do the work or not, you can learn or 

not; it just depends on what you want to get out of the class. I think this 

class was a good exercise in the goal verus performance learners. If kids are 

only working for a grade, they are working for the wrong reason. I think if 

you have the students research, learn and then teach others, they might shift 

their thinking on why they are doing the work. If students are put in charge 

of learning, then they are going to be performing for us, the teachers. Of 

course, they might be performing for their peers. Bringing in professionals 

from the community to work with students might also be a good idea. It puts a 

little reality on why they are learning something. Its like, "Look, this 

person actually uses this in his/her job". There will always be students who 

will be just learning because its what they are supposed to do. But, tak 

> ing the 

> importance out of the grade might at least help. 

>Cynthia 

> 


>I just ran into these quotes and thought they were worthy of putting on here 

>and giving some thought to them. 

>"Nostalgia is a fire fueled by failures of memory."-William Lashner 

>"Worry is a misuse of your imagination."- William Lashner 

> 

>After reading all the journals I realized that just as we have our 

differences 

>in thought and emotion on the list serve, our students in the classroom will 

>have their own thoughts, emotions, and learning styles. I often get 

>discouraged (as Karas mentioned) about people feeling sorry for me that I 

want 

>to be a teacher, or that they can't believe that I could stand being around 

>children for that long. I never said it was going to be easy, just as these 

>semesters have been challenging for a lot of us. We must just keep pushing 

>for the goal and just keep jumping over the hurdles that are being thrown at 

>us either in school or personally. 

> 

>Bruer mentions that there are performance goal children and learning goal 

>children, pg. 274. I think that this is probably built into our personality, 

>but unlike what the theorist and Bruer think, I believe it is not innate and 

>can be changed. 

>Many of us (as Yamashita mentions)look at the goal and perform only what is 

>expected and needed to reach the goal, which right now that is just getting 

>through the semester with a passing grade. These are the performance goaled 

>people. In our future classrooms this is the student that quickly pushes 

>through the assignment with never truly understanding or making connections 

as 

>to why they are doing it. The unfortunate down fall of this attitude is that 

>it will eventually lead to failure, or when they start to fail they will give 

1962


>eventually perpetuates to a more serious lack of confidence. Sadly if this 

>happens early on, say 1st grade, then every time they fail they blame 

>themselves and don't want to go on. 

> 

>The learning goal student, however, looks at failure as a minor set back and 

>another opportunity to grasp the concepts that were unclear. For those of us 

>that have this attitude then we exert more brain power to the problems or 

>stresses that come up, we don't give up we try harder. 

> 

>In my future classroom I hope to encourage not only metacognitively aware 

>students but also encourage students to see the bigger picture of it all. 

>How? You might ask, beats me, but that is my ultimate goal. 

> 

>I know how hard it is to see all the classes we have taken through this 

cohort 

>experience, but put on the teaching lenses and see how important it is to 

know 

>what knowledge and experiences your students have come from and where they 

are 

>going. I sound like I am preaching, but really this is a reminder to myself. 

> 

>-That's all for this week, until next time! 

>Chula 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



1963





Subject: RE: Science Kicks Butt..... encouragment ^1000000000 power AFTER SPELL CHECK 

Cecilia, 

Yes, science does kick butt, and it can also kick your butt, but does is it not also totally make you go 

WOW? 

Ann 


I agree with you Ann, science does kick butt; it's kicking my butt all over 

the place! Cecilia 


>Hey everyone, 

> 

>Here is a quote that I came across this morning that I used to look at when I 

quit smoking 6 years ago. I don't know who wrote it. 

> 

>"Obstacles are what we see when we take our eyes off the goal." 

> 

>Anyway, I can't help but notice how great I feel. Sure we are all tired; 

sure we are all stressed out to the max, etc. Those things are a given. But 

yesterday throughout my day and throughout our classes, I was grooving. I 

woke up exhausted yesterday morning after going to bed at 2 am, I met with 

Jonathan 2 hours before our first VPA class and we kicked butt and got the 

backdrop for our puppet show done. I we nt to our LBST 361B class, and I felt 

good that we were actually learning stuff that I could make sense of and that 

I could picture using in my future classroom. Next, we went to Biology and as 

I listened to professor Lowe talking about evolution and adaptations, I though 

of how cool everything was starting to nicely fit into the proper places 

within my brain. Then, we went to Dr. Karas' class, and our transition form 

water to electricity was comfortable. I had fun exploring with the lab. I 

really had an great time. Then, our Capstone group met and we were worki 

> ng with 

> our project, and I couldn't help but feel a great sense of community........ 

The kind of community of little learners that I want to create in future 

classrooms. 

> 

>I went home and I was exhausted. I ended up going to bed at 8:00 pm with a 

huge, but exhausted smile on my face. I woke up this morning and I am all 

excited about science. I could no t think of anything that I touched or 

1964

thought about that didn't include science in it. I was out watering my 

garden, and I was thinking about all the stuff Jennifer Ramos and I learned 

about capillary action in vascular plant.... I was using a hose and putting 

pressure on the end to create a spray to water my vegetable, and I thought 

about Dr. Karas' class.... I went in and flipped on the light switch to get 

ready for school and the electricity that closed the circuit to make the 

electricity heat up the filament in the light bulb..... we just learned in 

Dr. Karas' class. I can't think of anything that does not have science in it 

on some level. whether it is science, science, or social science..... 

everything is science.... The breath I just took to fill my lungs with oxygen 

can be expla 

> ined 

> through science, my fingers typing this journal posting can be explained by 

science....... the darn computer that I am using can b e explained by 

science.... 

> 

>Science is not a separate field or a separate subject or a separate 

class.......SCIENCE IS IN EVERYTHING>>>>SCIENCE IS EVERYWHERE..... AND 

SCIENCE KICKS BUTT!!!!!! So don't think of it a something separate and hard 

and confusing (even though sometimes it is confusing) think of it as being 

totally awesome. I can't wait to pass my crazy enthusiastic energy and 

passion on to my future students. I want them to get all hopped up on science 

like I am right now!!!!!!! Feel the encouragement....feel the power..... 

feel the sense of community within the cohort..... we all bring to the table 

our special powers....we are the justice league and we are all super heroes. 

we are going out into the world to inspire, to encourage, to teach, to care 

for, to create little learning communities....etc. teachers KICK BUTT...... 

TEACHERS ARE AWESOME, WE CAN HAVE SUCH A GREAT INFLUENCE ON SO MANY 

LIVES....LET'S MAKE SURE WE DO THE BEST WE CAN DO......LET'S GO OUT THERE AND 

KICK BUTT!!!!!! 

> WHO'S 

> WITH ME SAY "I".......... 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 



1965






In response to your posting about homework and culture in general, I have a few things to say as I step up to my soap 

box... I have a really hard time understanding why students get out of school at 2:20 or sometimes 1:15pm on a school 

day. Like you said Cynthia, much of the academic day is spent on issues such as drug education etc., which I think are 

important issues. Why doesn't the school day extend to 4pm or even 5pm? With this in mind, students are being taught 

by professionals, not having to rely on someone at home; students are off the streets and a big plus for teachers is that 

we will have a couple of hours more in the day to actually instruct and spend time with our students. 

Perhaps it's because I went to school in the "Dark Ages" or the fact that I was educated in England, but since being in 

America, I have found, for the most part, that students from elementary through college tend to not have the degree of 

respect for adults/elders/teachers that I learned. For example, as a K-12 student, if an adult entered the room, be it 

another teacher, a parent and definitely if it was the headmaster, ALL students would stand and acknowledge the visitor! 

You NEVER walked out of class during lecture/instruction (as Prof. Yamashita was describing one of his mentor 

professors in class the other day). 

Well, I think I'll get off my soap box and attend to my physics homework while the brain cells are still snapping away up 

there. Until next time... ~ Louise 






In regards to homework: Japanese students have longer school days, then they go to after school 

school; when would they have time for homework? American schools spend so much time 

teaching diversity, drug education etc, there isn't a lot of time left to teach academics, so they 

send the school work home as homework. Many American students don't have parents who put a 

lot of value on education, or just don't find the time to make sure their kids are learning.They know 

their kids will just get passed on to the next grade anyway, so why worry? Our kids don't have to 

compete to get into a high school, heck you don't even have to compete to get in many colleges 

(certain career fields excluded of course, like medical). 

As far as students cleaning and taking ownership of their schools, I think thats a great way to get 

students to care about things. The school I used to work at had the kids do that too, and it worked 

great. The physical aspect is a plus, get them up and moving! 

So....much of this is cultural. The American culture is just different. We don't want to work that 

hard, we don't want that much responsibility. Doesn't matter if it is right or wrong, its the way it is. 

There are those who do expect their kids to be pushed, and they put their kids in private school if 

they can afford it, or they are in the classroom hounding the teacher to make sure it happens. 

I don't think we can blame the entire educational system, there are good teachers out there, the 

ones who make teaching their lives, not just a way to get a paycheck. Unfortunately, there are too 

many of those. We can't blame all the parents, but there are some that need to get a clue. We 

can't just blame the government for not throwing good money after bad, the money needs to be 

spent in the right places on the right things. Its a complex problem in a complex society, with no 

easy solution. 

Cynthia 

1966


Alexandra, 

You are comparing what you view as the worst US schools and practices, with the best Japanese schools 

and practices. I hope that you realize that this gives your words a weighted level of bias. Teachers in the 

U.S. are also required to have in-service training where they discuss proven methods. The classrooms in 

the U.S. are not supposed to grouped by level and in most cases are not. There is a big difference 

between having different dialects and having different languages. Although we have learned that 

problem solving is an essential skill that our students must have, we have also learned through the Bruer 

book that teaching the concept is also necessary. All problem solving and no concept, makes for a very 

bad lesson. Exploration, Concept, Application. One must truly begin to understand that there are 

fundamental social differences between the U.S. and other countries, thus it is not practical to adopt all 

of their practices. This is not to say that we should not examine these educational structures, but we 

should not blindly say that they are whole heartedly better than ours. For one thing people such as 

myself, being that I have Dyslexia, would have been bared from a higher education due to the genetic 

makeup. Is this a good way to go about it? I hope not. Also, Japanese students attend school about two 

months longer than do American students, but this is not discussed in your reasons for better 

performance. Also, the students bow to their teachers at the start of everyday and they make their own 

food and clean the school. One mu st ask themselves, what are the fundamental differences and accepted 

ideologies that would prevent American schools from conducting their education in a similar fashion? 

Robert. 

>From: 




>Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> 

>It was not surprising to read in Sagan's reading, "No such thing as a Dumb Question" that 

Japan, South Korea, and Western Canada was ahead of American students in mathematics 

and science." This made me think of an article I read that compared the math instruction in 

Japan, Germany, and the United States. I think understanding the disparity between countries' 

math and science scores is a complex concept to understand. The scores do not take into 

consideration teachers' training, how the federal government funds are used, the emphasis 

placed on testing and homework, the percentage of teachers who use the board, diversity in 

the classroom, and the approach to lesson planning. The article titled, "How Culture Shapes 

Math Instruction in Japan, Germany, and the United States" (The California Education Policy 

Seminar and The California State University Institute sponsored the article for Education 

Reform) looks closely at the teaching philosophies of the ab ove countries while takin 

> g into consideration other factors besides testing. This particular article placed the focus on 

math education but the teaching philosophies applies to other subject areas. As a future 

teacher, I think that it is important that we explore other countries' education system and see 

how we can benefit from their success. This kind of exploration I hope will give me an edge for 

1967

eaching out to all my students. I welcome the opportunity to gain insight into other educational 

systems outside of the U. S. Our classrooms grow more and more diverse and understanding 

teaching philosophies outside our own country becomes more crucial. Why? Our student body 

grows more diverse but the teachers and the classrooms do not. Is it possible to bring more 

than just a lesson about another country into the classroom? What is wrong with teaching 

more like the Japanese, the Germans, the Koreans, and the British?? In reading the article, I 

discovered how homogenous American education system really i 


>Each country no matter how diverse has a distinct teaching style. Let us look at it this way, 

as distinct as the American culture is from the Germans, the Japanese, the Koreans, etc. it 

would make sense that each culture has its unique teaching philosophies. I assumed that 

Japan rate of educational success had to do with the long hours that Japanese children were 

in school. I also assumed that much focus was placed on preparing students for testing. 

>According to the study, the Japanese do not put a huge focus on testing. The success rate of 

the Japanese students is contributed to how the Japanese teacher used the resources 

available. For example, the Japanese teachers use the chalkboard 100% while the U.S. uses 

the chalkboard 67%. The important thing I discovered in not how the tools are used but the 

philosophy behind the lesson, for example, recorded on the chalkboard. For instance, the 

Japanese's "philosophy is to treat the chalkboard as their record of the entire lesson being 

taught. This gives visual learners and everyone the opportunity to have a good set of notes to 

reflect on and ask questions. Rather, than trying to take notes and learn a concept at the same 

time. The teacher facilitates the learning by reemphasizing what she/he is saying by writing it 

on the board. Whereas, the teachers in the U.S. use visual aids and "body language in a 

constant battle to draw students' attention to their words. Moreover, the U 

> .S. focuses math lesson on teaching the students how to solve math problems rather than 

giving the students the opportunity to think and apply what they know into solving a problem. 

Meanwhile,the Japanese teachers teach students math concepts by explaining what the math 

concepts mean and giving the students the opportunity to apply the math concepts and figure 

out their own method of problem solving.How do teacher from Japan lesson plans? 

>The Japanese teachers prepare lesson plans using a methodical approach. The lesson plans 

are prepared with the questions the students may ask, the areas of difficulty that may arise for 

the students, and the possible mistakes the students will make in working through a math 

concept. Furthermore, the Japanese teachers work on one-lesson plan for an entire year. 

Whereas, the American teachers rely on previous lessons and quickly put together a lesson 

plan on prior instructions. Another interesting and novel approach is the way other Japanese 

teachers observe a teacher implementing a new lesson in order to study the students during 

the lesson; the teachers then meet to review and revise the lesson and later present the lesson 

to the entire faculty where the teacher receives more criticism. It was interesting to learn how 

the federal government supports Japanese teachers. 

>In Japan, the federal government funds are used to pay for "In-service teacher training," 


Japan has 40 students. Unlike our thinking in the U.S. that Japanese schools are not diverse, 

in fact, the schools are very diverse because unlike the U.S. where students are tracked and 

divided by ability, the students in Japans are placed in random classrooms. Therefore, the 

teaching techniques used in Japan targets a diverse classroom and the teaching techniques in 

the U.S. work well in a homogenous classroom." How well do American schools use class 

time? 

>American teachers have little time set aside for developing and teaching a lesson. Instead, 

the time is used on going over homework and checking to see if homework is completed. In 

Japan, there is little emphasis placed on homework, "only 24% of Japanese teachers" 

assigned homework. Meanwhile, 90% of the American teachers assign homework and place 

emphasis on the use of concepts and method, rather than application. For example, American 

teachers explain what is a numerator, denominator, how to divide, multiply, etc. The concept is 

1968

_____ 

_____ 

stated but not developed. The study showed that "approximately 80% of the concepts in the 

U.S. were only stated and never developed, whereas in Germany and Japan the exact 

opposite pattern occurred." Given Sagan's findings that "the average math gap between white 

and black U.S. high school graduates is still huge- two to three grade levels; but the gap 

between white U.S. high school graduates and those in, say Japan, Canada, Great Bri tain?is 

more th 

> an twice as large (with U.S. students behind)" (Sagan 329). Then it is important that we look 

at other factors that affect our education system besides blaming it on testing, class size, and 

diversity issues. Motivating and teaching our students how to think seems to play an important 

factor in educating our students. Teaching concepts is not enough. Applying the concepts the 

way this semester of science has taught us in Ochanji's class through exploration and 

applications seems to give students to opportunity to problem solve while promoting thinking. 


> 

> 




1969






Just a couple of reasons why they don't extend the school day? Money, Money 

Another reason: I bet there are lots of teachers who would pitch a fit if they had to work those hours, 

and you know how powerful the teacher's unions are. 

Cynthia 


In response to your posting about homework and culture in general, I have a few things to say as I step up to my soap 

box... I have a really hard time understanding why students get out of school at 2:20 or sometimes 1:15pm on a 

school day. Like you said Cynthia, much of the academic day is spent on issues such as drug education etc., which I 

think are important issues. Why doesn't the school day extend to 4pm or even 5pm? With this in mind, students are 

being taught by professionals, not having to rely on someone at home; students are off the streets and a big plus for 

teachers is that we will have a couple of hours more in the day to actually instruct and spend time with our students. 

Perhaps it's because I went to school in the "Dark Ages" or the fact that I was educated in England, but since being in 

America, I have found, for the most part, that students from elementary through college tend to not have the degree of 

respect for adults/elders/teachers that I learned. For example, as a K-12 student, if an adult entered the room, be it 

another teacher, a parent and definitely if it was the headmaster, ALL students would stand and acknowledge the 

visitor! You NEVER walked out of class during lecture/instruction (as Prof. Yamashita was describing one of his 

mentor professors in class the other day). 

Well, I think I'll get off my soap box and attend to my physics homework while the brain cells are still snapping away 

up there. Until next time... ~ Louise 






In regards to homework: Japanese students have longer school days, then they go to after 

school school; when would they have time for homework? American schools spend so much 

time teaching diversity, drug education etc, there isn't a lot of time left to teach academics, so 

they send the school work home as homework. Many American students don't have parents 

who put a lot of value on education, or just don't find the time to make sure their kids are 

learning.They know their kids will just get passed on to the next grade anyway, so why worry? 

Our kids don't have to compete to get into a high school, heck you don't even have to compete 

to get in many colleges (certain career fields excluded of course, like medical). 

As far as students cleaning and taking ownership of their schools, I think thats a great way to 

get students to care about things. The school I used to work at had the kids do that too, and it 

worked great. The physical aspect is a plus, get them up and moving! 

So....much of this is cultural. The American culture is just different. We don't want to work that 

hard, we don't want that much responsibility. Doesn't matter if it is right or wrong, its the way it 

is. There are those who do expect their kids to be pushed, and they put their kids in private 

school if they can afford it, or they are in the classroom hounding the teacher to make sure it 

1970

happens. 

I don't think we can blame the entire educational system, there are good teachers out there, 

the ones who make teaching their lives, not just a way to get a paycheck. Unfortunately, there 

are too many of those. We can't blame all the parents, but there are some that need to get a 

clue. We can't just blame the government for not throwing good money after bad, the money 

needs to be spent in the right places on the right things. Its a complex problem in a complex 

society, with no easy solution. 

Cynthia 


Alexandra, 

You are comparing what you view as the worst US schools and practices, with the best Japanese 

schools and practices. I hope that you realize that this gives your words a weighted level of bias. 

Teachers in the U.S. are also required to have in-service training where they discuss proven 

methods. The classrooms in the U.S. are not supposed to grouped by level and in most cases are not. 

There is a big difference between having different dialects and having different languages. Although 

we have learned that problem solving is an essential skill that our students must have, we have also 

learned through the Bruer book that teaching the concept is also necessary. All problem solving and 

no concept, makes for a very bad lesson. Exploration, Concept, Application. One must truly begin to 

understand that there are fundamental social differences between the U.S. and other countries, thus it 

is not practical to adopt all of their practices. This is not to say that we should not examine these 

educational structures, but we should not blindly say that they are whole heartedly better than ours. 

For one thing people such as myself, being that I have Dyslexia, would have been bared from a 

higher education due to the genetic makeup. Is this a good way to go about it? I hope not. Also, 

Japanese students attend school about two months longer than do American students, but this is not 

discussed in your reasons for better performance. Also, the students bow to their teachers at the start 

of everyday and they make their own food and clean the school. One mu st ask themselves, what are 

the fundamental differences and accepted ideologies that would prevent American schools from 

conducting their education in a similar fashion? 

Robert. 

>From: 




>Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> 

>It was not surprising to read in Sagan's reading, "No such thing as a Dumb Question" that 

Japan, South Korea, and Western Canada was ahead of American students in 

mathematics and science." This made me think of an article I read that compared the math 

instruction in Japan, Germany, and the United States. I think understanding the disparity 

between countries' math and science scores is a complex concept to understand. The 

scores do not take into consideration teachers' training, how the federal government funds 

1971

are used, the emphasis placed on testing and homework, the percentage of teachers who 

use the board, diversity in the classroom, and the approach to lesson planning. The article 

titled, "How Culture Shapes Math Instruction in Japan, Germany, and the United States" 

(The California Education Policy Seminar and The California State University Institute 

sponsored the article for Education Reform) looks closely at the teaching philosophies of 

the ab ove countries while takin 

> g into consideration other factors besides testing. This particular article placed the focus 

on math education but the teaching philosophies applies to other subject areas. As a future 

teacher, I think that it is important that we explore other countries' education system and 

see how we can benefit from their success. This kind of exploration I hope will give me an 

edge for reaching out to all my students. I welcome the opportunity to gain insight into other 

educational systems outside of the U. S. Our classrooms grow more and more diverse and 

understanding teaching philosophies outside our own country becomes more crucial. Why? 

Our student body grows more diverse but the teachers and the classrooms do not. Is it 

possible to bring more than just a lesson about another country into the classroom? What is 

wrong with teaching more like the Japanese, the Germans, the Koreans, and the British?? 

In reading the article, I discovered how homogenous American education system really i 


>Each country no matter how diverse has a distinct teaching style. Let us look at it this 

way, as distinct as the American culture is from the Germans, the Japanese, the Koreans, 

etc. it would make sense that each culture has its unique teaching philosophies. I assumed 

that Japan rate of educational success had to do with the long hours that Japanese 

children were in school. I also assumed that much focus was placed on preparing students 

for testing. 

>According to the study, the Japanese do not put a huge focus on testing. The success 

rate of the Japanese students is contributed to how the Japanese teacher used the 

resources available. For example, the Japanese teachers use the chalkboard 100% while 

the U.S. uses the chalkboard 67%. The important thing I discovered in not how the tools 

are used but the philosophy behind the lesson, for example, recorded on the chalkboard. 

For instance, the Japanese's "philosophy is to treat the chalkboard as their record of the 

entire lesson being taught. This gives visual learners and everyone the opportunity to have 

a good set of notes to reflect on and ask questions. Rather, than trying to take notes and 

learn a concept at the same time. The teacher facilitates the learning by reemphasizing 

what she/he is saying by writing it on the board. Whereas, the teachers in the U.S. use 

visual aids and "body language in a constant battle to draw students' attention to their 

words. Moreover, the U 

> .S. focuses math lesson on teaching the students how to solve math problems rather 

than giving the students the opportunity to think and apply what they know into solving a 

problem. Meanwhile,the Japanese teachers teach students math concepts by explaining 

what the math concepts mean and giving the students the opportunity to apply the math 

concepts and figure out their own method of problem solving.How do teacher from Japan 

lesson plans? 

>The Japanese teachers prepare lesson plans using a methodical approach. The lesson 

plans are prepared with the questions the students may ask, the areas of difficulty that may 

arise for the students, and the possible mistakes the students will make in working through 

a math concept. Furthermore, the Japanese teachers work on one-lesson plan for an entire 

year. Whereas, the American teachers rely on previous lessons and quickly put together a 

lesson plan on prior instructions. Another interesting and novel approach is the way other 

Japanese teachers observe a teacher implementing a new lesson in order to study the 

students during the lesson; the teachers then meet to review and revise the lesson and 

later present the lesson to the entire faculty where the teacher receives more criticism. It 

was interesting to learn how the federal government supports Japanese teachers. 

>In Japan, the federal government funds are used to pay for "In-service teacher training," 

1972

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 


Japan has 40 students. Unlike our thinking in the U.S. that Japanese schools are not 

diverse, in fact, the schools are very diverse because unlike the U.S. where students are 

tracked and divided by ability, the students in Japans are placed in random classrooms. 

Therefore, the teaching techniques used in Japan targets a diverse classroom and the 

teaching techniques in the U.S. work well in a homogenous classroom." How well do 

American schools use class time? 

>American teachers have little time set aside for developing and teaching a lesson. 


completed. In Japan, there is little emphasis placed on homework, "only 24% of Japanese 

teachers" assigned homework. Meanwhile, 90% of the American teachers assign 

homework and place emphasis on the use of concepts and method, rather than application. 

For example, American teachers explain what is a numerator, denominator, how to divide, 

multiply, etc. The concept is stated but not developed. The study showed that 

"approximately 80% of the concepts in the U.S. were only stated and never developed, 

whereas in Germany and Japan the exact opposite pattern occurred." Given Sagan's 

findings that "the average math gap between white and black U.S. high school graduates is 

still huge- two to three grade levels; but the gap between white U.S. high school graduates 

and those in, say Japan, Canada, Great Bri tain?is more th 

> an twice as large (with U.S. students behind)" (Sagan 329). Then it is important that we 

look at other factors that affect our education system besides blaming it on testing, class 

size, and diversity issues. Motivating and teaching our students how to think seems to play 

an important factor in educating our students. Teaching concepts is not enough. Applying 

the concepts the way this semester of science has taught us in Ochanji's class through 

exploration and applications seems to give students to opportunity to problem solve while 

promoting thinking. (Alexandra's journal #11) 

> 

> 






1973






LOL, I realized that as soon as I hit the send button!! So, it was really just an observation I had, not a 

theory. At least I know somebody read my post and actually made a connection. 

Cynthia 


Cynthia, 

Remember how Loweeeee told us the other day that a Theory is a "falsifiable idea supported by extensive evidence." 

So, therefore what you have is a theory because you have evidence ("not just a theory, I have seen it happen with 

students I have worked with"). Just thought I would bring that up. 

with love,, 

Robert 




>Subject: Re: grade inflation 


> 

>Cool, Robert!! Glad you found these articles, especially the one from Harvard. I know this 

probably ruffles the feathers of some people, but I think he is right on. 

>"Grade inflation has resulted from the emphasis in American education on the notion of selfesteem. 

According to that therapeutic notion, the purpose of education is to make students feel 

capable and empowered. So to grade them, or to grade them strictly, is cruel and dehumanizing. 

Grading creates stress. It encourages competition rather than harmony. It is judgmental." 

>Nothing like giving a kid the false notion that he is a genius and doesn't have to think or work 

hard. How does this help him in the real world? Someday, these students will be faced with the 

truth, and they will feel betrayed. I think you can be honest with students without being degrading 

or dehumanizing. Students like to be challenged, and in the end, when they have really 

accomplished something, have their self-esteem raised and their efforts and learning validated. 

The ones that are being lied to, can't really feel good, because they probably know the truth about 

their efforts and accomplishments or the lack of them. 

>Cynthia 

>PS, . 

> 

> 


>http://www.cybercollege.com/plume3.htm 

>http://www.aas.duke.edu/development/Miscellaneous/grades.html 

>http://chronicle.com/free/v47/i30/30b02401.htm 

1974

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 


_____ 



1975






I think there is a point to your story, that being: There isn't any one answer to the problem. I probably 

would learn to speak Spanish if it was the only way that I would be able to communicate. Can you 

imagine me having to keep my mouth shut for an extended period of time? 

I think that if you have a whole class of language learners, it might take longer because they could 

communicate in their native language, and so the need to learn the new language wouldn't be as 

imperative (my mind is blank, severe lack of coffee, not sure if that is the best word to use). 

Cynthia 






















> 

> 








> 

> Ann 

> 

1976




> 



great. 

> Mira 


Spanish. 

> It's super 


> 

> 

> 




teachers, 



by not 

> allowing 


a 


> immersion program in Canada. One of the th ings pointed out as a reason 

for 

> apparent 


a 

> difficult 


that 

> pr ogram 


other 

> when they 


tend to 

> score 


goes 

> back to 


better 

> cognitive 


> > ers each 


the 

> other, a 


1977

In order to get more qualified bilingual teachers here, we need to 

change the 

> way we 


were 

> required to 




what 



teachers 

> because we 


would be 

> thanks to 


> >Cynthia 

> > 


> > 


obliterated, 

> parents need 


mater-of-fact 



getting 

> rid of 


racist 

> ways of 

> conferring, that is making them take such views. And apparently their 

views 

> are not 


district 

> that cannot 


Could it 

> be that 




to 

> accounting 






1978


> > 

> > 

> >So much for changing the system from within !! One thought though, 

didn't they 

> get rid of 


being 

> so 




> >Cynthia 


people are 

> going to 


before it 

> takes hold, 


real 


> > 


> >My sister-n-law who is a second grade teacher at Lincoln elementary is 

going 

> through 


> bilingual 


this 

> issue. 


the 



believe 

> in. In that 


but the 

> principal 






Lincoln was 

> confronted with 


to tell 

> some that 


two 

1979

were kept at 


> > ng that 


teacher 

> friend. The 


she was 

> moved to 


first I 



jest of it 

> to me: the 


work, for 

> fourth 


schedule. 

> At the 


friends 

> phoned her 

> and mentioned that they were going to be meeting with a lawyer to file 

a civil 





is doing 

> for the 


my 

> family but 




> >Karla 


Lincoln feel 

> threatened 


defend a 

> cause! 






> > 

> > 

> > 

1980

> > 

> > 

> > 


your 


large will 

> approve of 




everyone 

> believes 


happens 

> when you 


says "NOT 

> ON MY 


else 

> should 


views and 


curriculums, 

> units, 


line? How 

> much 


when 

> will you 

> stop fighting? This is o ne reason teachers don' t stay in the professi 

> > on for 


flow and 

> buy there 


motion. 

> But, how 


of us 

> views to be 


> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 




1981



> >> 

> >>Matheno, 

> >> 


delt 



near the 

> coast, 


want to 

> create a 


> European 


Christian 

> American, 


> American...........etc. I want to include and respect everyone to the 

best of 



abilities to 



> >>Ann 

> >> 



> >> 


internet 


out on 

> the 


and as 

> Jim 


> pinpoint 


say that 

> my 


much as 


don't 


completely 


haven't 

1982

een around to jump on some of the entries that I should have. For 

instance, 


literacy 

> between 


wanted to 


doesn't push 


that the 


whether or 

> not 


lines, as I 


schools in 


but 


test 


these 

> kids 


motivate 

> >>ourselves and if you are one that continually is pr essuring the 

teacher to 


you are 


rather than 

> >>just a desire to learn (this being in the high school years)). But 

their is 


students" 


the one 


that the 




work 

> their 


want to 

> work 

> >>in for whatever reason (hopefully not because of the ethnicity or> >>socio-economic status 

of your students) you will resent your position 

and 

1983

continue the string of teachers who don't care about the performance 

of 

> their 


I tend 


else 

> one 


at 

> this 


reinforced 


little to 


to. Its 


why this 

> is 

> >>so or how it can be fixed. Anyways folks just a few things i wanted 

to get 


muttered 

> >>up my apologies but please feel free to discuss with me anything you 

would 


> >> 

> >>Matheno 

> >> 


never 

> a 


words but 


> >> 

> >> 

> >>--------------------------------- 



> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 


FREE 

> download! 

> > 

& gt; > 

1984

--------------------------------- 



> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

> 

>---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 



> 

> 

>----------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

- 



_____ 



1985






I agree that students should be in school longer than they are currently. 

Why get out of school at around 2:00pm? Just think, if students were in 

school later, say around 4:00pm, then this may take care of parents worrying 

about a sitter, after school program, or a ride for their children after 

school. After all, why not just keep kids in school, in their normal class, 

instead of an after school program, or going home and watching t.v. or 

playing video games until the parents get home. Maybe parents would then be 

able to pick up their kids from school and not worry about making all of the 

arrangements for their care and well-being after school, when they may be 

available to pickup and care for their children themselves. Also, the extra 

time in school would probably pay off for the better. There seems to not be 

enough time in the school day to teach every subject. Maybe a longer school 

day is the answer. Would more content be covered? Would the quality of 

education increase? What about student learning? A longer school day sounds 

like the answer to me. Remember, it's not about the teacher and the 

teacher's convenience, it about the students and their learning. 




>To: 

>Subject: RE: Application & Problem Solving ... 

>Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 21:32:11 -0700 

> 

>In response to your posting about homework and culture in general, I 

>have a few things to say as I step up to my soap box... I have a really 

>hard time understanding why students get out of school at 2:20 or 

>sometimes 1:15pm on a school day. Like you said Cynthia, much of the 

>academic day is spent on issues such as drug education etc., which I 

>think are important issues. Why doesn't the school day extend to 4pm or 

>even 5pm? With this in mind, students are being taught by 

>professionals, not having to rely on someone at home; students are off 

>the streets and a big plus for teachers is that we will have a couple of 

>hours more in the day to actually instruct and spend time with our 

>students. 

> 

>Perhaps it's because I went to school in the "Dark Ages" or the fact 

>that I was educated in England, but since being in America, I have 

>found, for the most part, that students from elementary through college 

>tend to not have the degree of respect for adults/elders/teachers that I 

>learned. For example, as a K-12 student, if an adult entered the room, 

>be it another teacher, a parent and definitely if it was the headmaster, 

>ALL students would stand and acknowledge the visitor! You NEVER walked 

>out of class during lecture/instruction (as Prof. Yamashita was 

>describing one of his mentor professors in class the other day). 

> 

>Well, I think I'll get off my soap box and attend to my physics homework 

>while the brain cells are still snapping away up there. Until next 

>time... ~ Louise 

> 

> 




1986



> 

> 

> 

>In regards to homework: Japanese students have longer school days, then 

>they go to after school school; when would they have time for homework? 

>American schools spend so much time teaching diversity, drug education 

>etc, there isn't a lot of time left to teach academics, so they send the 

>school work home as homework. Many American students don't have parents 

>who put a lot of value on education, or just don't find the time to make 

>sure their kids are learning.They know their kids will just get passed 

>on to the next grade anyway, so why worry? Our kids don't have to 

>compete to get into a high school, heck you don't even have to compete 

>to get in many colleges (certain career fields excluded of course, like 

>medical). 

>As far as students cleaning and taking ownership of their schools, I 

>think thats a great way to get students to care about things. The school 

>I used to work at had the kids do that too, and it worked great. The 

>physical aspect is a plus, get them up and moving! 

>So....much of this is cultural. The American culture is just different. 

>We don't want to work that hard, we don't want that much responsibility. 

>Doesn't matter if it is right or wrong, its the way it is. There are 

>those who do expect their kids to be pushed, and they put their kids in 

>private school if they can afford it, or they are in the classroom 

>hounding the teacher to make sure it happens. 

>I don't think we can blame the entire educational system, there are good 

>teachers out there, the ones who make teaching their lives, not just a 

>way to get a paycheck. Unfortunately, there are too many of those. We 

>can't blame all the parents, but there are some that need to get a clue. 

>We can't just blame the government for not throwing good money after 

>bad, the money needs to be spent in the right places on the right 

>things. Its a complex problem in a complex society, with no easy 

>solution. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>Alexandra, 

> 

> 

> 

>You are comparing what you view as the worst US schools and practices, 

>with the best Japanese schools and practices. I hope that you realize 

>that this gives your words a weighted level of bias. Teachers in the 

>U.S. are also required to have in-service training where they discuss 

>proven methods. The classrooms in the U.S. are not supposed to grouped 

>by level and in most cases are not. There is a big difference between 

>having different dialects and having different languages. Although we 

>have learned that problem solving is an essential skill that our 

>students must have, we have also learned through the Bruer book that 

>teaching the concept is also necessary. All problem solving and no 

>concept, makes for a very bad lesson. Exploration, Concept, Application. 

>One must truly begin to understand that there are fundamental social 

>differences between the U.S. and other countries, thus it is not 

>practical to adopt all of their practices. This is not to say that we 

>should not examine these educational structures, but we should not 

>blindly say that they are whole heartedly better than ours. For one 

>thing people such as myself, being that I have Dyslexia, would have been 

>bared from a higher education due to the genetic makeup. Is this a good 

>way to go about it? I hope not. Also, Japanese students attend school 

>about two months longer than do American students, but this is not 

>discussed in your reasons for better performance. Also, the students bow 

>to their teachers at the start of everyday and they make their own food 

>and clean the school. One mu st ask themselves, what are the fundamental 

>differences and accepted ideologies that would prevent American schools 

1987

from conducting their education in a similar fashion? 

> 

>Robert. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >From: 



> >Subject: Application & Problem Solving ... 

> >Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> > 

> >It was not surprising to read in Sagan's reading, "No such thing as a 

>Dumb Question" that Japan, South Korea, and Western Canada was ahead of 

>American students in mathematics and science." This made me think of an 

>article I read that compared the math instruction in Japan, Germany, and 

>the United States. I think understanding the disparity between 

>countries' math and science scores is a complex concept to understand. 

>The scores do not take into consideration teachers' training, how the 

>federal government funds are used, the emphasis placed on testing and 

>homework, the percentage of teachers who use the board, diversity in the 

>classroom, and the approach to lesson planning. The article titled, "How 

>Culture Shapes Math Instruction in Japan, Germany, and the United 

>States" (The California Education Policy Seminar and The California 

>State University Institute sponsored the article for Education Reform) 

>looks closely at the teaching philosophies of the ab ove countries while 

>takin 

> > g into consideration other factors besides testing. This particular 

>article placed the focus on math education but the teaching philosophies 

>applies to other subject areas. As a future teacher, I think that it is 

>important that we explore other countries' education system and see how 

>we can benefit from their success. This kind of exploration I hope will 

>give me an edge for reaching out to all my students. I welcome the 

>opportunity to gain insight into other educational systems outside of 

>the U. S. Our classrooms grow more and more diverse and understanding 

>teaching philosophies outside our own country becomes more crucial. Why? 

>Our student body grows more diverse but the teachers and the classrooms 

>do not. Is it possible to bring more than just a lesson about another 

>country into the classroom? What is wrong with teaching more like the 

>Japanese, the Germans, the Koreans, and the British?? In reading the 

>article, I discovered how homogenous American education system really i 

> > s and how "teaching is highly culturally determined." 

> >Each country no matter how diverse has a distinct teaching style. Let 

>us look at it this way, as distinct as the American culture is from the 

>Germans, the Japanese, the Koreans, etc. it would make sense that each 

>culture has its unique teaching philosophies. I assumed that Japan rate 

>of educational success had to do with the long hours that Japanese 

>children were in school. I also assumed that much focus was placed on 

>preparing students for testing. 

> >According to the study, the Japanese do not put a huge focus on 

>testing. The success rate of the Japanese students is contributed to how 

>the Japanese teacher used the resources available. For example, the 

>Japanese teachers use the chalkboard 100% while the U.S. uses the 

>chalkboard 67%. The important thing I discovered in not how the tools 

>are used but the philosophy behind the lesson, for example, recorded on 

>the chalkboard. For instance, the Japanese's "philosophy is to treat the 

>chalkboard as their record of the entire lesson being taught. This gives 

>visual learners and everyone the opportunity to have a good set of notes 

>to reflect on and ask questions. Rather, than trying to take notes and 

>learn a concept at the same time. The teacher facilitates the learning 

>by reemphasizing what she/he is saying by writing it on the board. 

>Whereas, the teachers in the U.S. use visual aids and "body language in 

>a constant battle to draw students' attention to their words. Moreover, 

>the U 

1988

.S. focuses math lesson on teaching the students how to solve math 

>problems rather than giving the students the opportunity to think and 

>apply what they know into solving a problem. Meanwhile,the Japanese 

>teachers teach students math concepts by explaining what the math 

>concepts mean and giving the students the opportunity to apply the math 

>concepts and figure out their own method of problem solving.How do 

>teacher from Japan lesson plans? 

> >The Japanese teachers prepare lesson plans using a methodical approach. 

>The lesson plans are prepared with the questions the students may ask, 

>the areas of difficulty that may arise for the students, and the 

>possible mistakes the students will make in working through a math 

>concept. Furthermore, the Japanese teachers work on one-lesson plan for 

>an entire year. Whereas, the American teachers rely on previous lessons 

>and quickly put together a lesson plan on prior instructions. Another 

>interesting and novel approach is the way other Japanese teachers 

>observe a teacher implementing a new lesson in order to study the 

>students during the lesson; the teachers then meet to review and revise 

>the lesson and later present the lesson to the entire faculty where the 

>teacher receives more criticism. It was interesting to learn how the 

>federal government supports Japanese teachers. 

> >In Japan, the federal government funds are used to pay for "In-service 

>teacher training," rather than investing that money on keeping class 

>size smaller. The average class size in Japan has 40 students. Unlike 

>our thinking in the U.S. that Japanese schools are not diverse, in fact, 

>the schools are very diverse because unlike the U.S. where students are 

>tracked and divided by ability, the students in Japans are placed in 

>random classrooms. Therefore, the teaching techniques used in Japan 

>targets a diverse classroom and the teaching techniques in the U.S. work 

>well in a homogenous classroom." How well do American schools use class 

>time? 

> >American teachers have little time set aside for developing and 

>teaching a lesson. Instead, the time is used on going over homework and 

>checking to see if homework is completed. In Japan, there is little 

>emphasis placed on homework, "only 24% of Japanese teachers" assigned 

>homework. Meanwhile, 90% of the American teachers assign homework and 

>place emphasis on the use of concepts and method, rather than 

>application. For example, American teachers explain what is a numerator, 

>denominator, how to divide, multiply, etc. The concept is stated but not 

>developed. The study showed that "approximately 80% of the concepts in 

>the U.S. were only stated and never developed, whereas in Germany and 

>Japan the exact opposite pattern occurred." Given Sagan's findings that 

>"the average math gap between white and black U.S. high school graduates 

>is still huge- two to three grade levels; but the gap between white U.S. 

>high school graduates and those in, say Japan, Canada, Great Bri tain?is 

>more th 

> > an twice as large (with U.S. students behind)" (Sagan 329). Then it 

>is important that we look at other factors that affect our education 

>system besides blaming it on testing, class size, and diversity issues. 

>Motivating and teaching our students how to think seems to play an 

>important factor in educating our students. Teaching concepts is not 

>enough. Applying the concepts the way this semester of science has 

>taught us in Ochanji's class through exploration and applications seems 

>to give students to opportunity to problem solve while promoting 

>thinking. (Alexandra's journal #11) 

> > 

> > 

> 

> _____ 

> 

>Get rid of annoying pop-up ads 

>with the new MSN Toolbar - FREE! 

> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 

1989


>Yahoo! 

>veaway/static/index2.html> Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - 

>Enter today 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



1990






Jennifer, 

You targeted yet another positive reason for school to have a longer 

day. I can't tell you the hassles a parent has to go through to make 

sure that their child(ren) are cared for over the extra couple of hours 

each day while the parent is at work (or in my case, at school). Like 

you said, it's not about the teacher and their convenience, it's about 

the student and their learning. ~ Louise 


From: Jennifer Ramos [mailto:ramos_jenn@hotmail.com] 




I agree that students should be in school longer than they are 

currently. 

Why get out of school at around 2:00pm? Just think, if students were in 

school later, say around 4:00pm, then this may take care of parents 

worrying 

about a sitter, after school program, or a ride for their children after 

school. After all, why not just keep kids in school, in their normal 

class, 

instead of an after school program, or going home and watching t.v. or 

playing video games until the parents get home. Maybe parents would then 

be 

able to pick up their kids from school and not worry about making all of 

the 

arrangements for their care and well-being after school, when they may 

be 

available to pickup and care for their children themselves. Also, the 

extra 

time in school would probably pay off for the better. There seems to not 

be 

enough time in the school day to teach every subject. Maybe a longer 

school 

day is the answer. Would more content be covered? Would the quality of 

education increase? What about student learning? A longer school day 

sounds 

like the answer to me. Remember, it's not about the teacher and the 

teacher's convenience, it about the students and their learning. 




>To: 


>Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 21:32:11 -0700 

> 


>have a few things to say as I step up to my soap box... I have a 

>really hard time understanding why students get out of school at 2:20 

1991

or sometimes 1:15pm on a school day. Like you said Cynthia, much of 

>the academic day is spent on issues such as drug education etc., which 

>I think are important issues. Why doesn't the school day extend to 4pm 

>or even 5pm? With this in mind, students are being taught by 


>the streets and a big plus for teachers is that we will have a couple 

>of hours more in the day to actually instruct and spend time with our 

>students. 

> 




>tend to not have the degree of respect for adults/elders/teachers that 

>I learned. For example, as a K-12 student, if an adult entered the 

>room, be it another teacher, a parent and definitely if it was the 

>headmaster, ALL students would stand and acknowledge the visitor! You 

>NEVER walked out of class during lecture/instruction (as Prof. 

>Yamashita was describing one of his mentor professors in class the 

>other day). 

> 

>Well, I think I'll get off my soap box and attend to my physics 

>homework while the brain cells are still snapping away up there. Until 

>next time... ~ Louise 

> 

> 






> 

> 

> 




>etc, there isn't a lot of time left to teach academics, so they send 

>the school work home as homework. Many American students don't have 

>parents who put a lot of value on education, or just don't find the 

>time to make sure their kids are learning.They know their kids will 

>just get passed on to the next grade anyway, so why worry? Our kids 

>don't have to compete to get into a high school, heck you don't even 

>have to compete to get in many colleges (certain career fields excluded 

>of course, like medical). As far as students cleaning and taking 

>ownership of their schools, I think thats a great way to get students 

>to care about things. The school I used to work at had the kids do that 

>too, and it worked great. The physical aspect is a plus, get them up 

>and moving! So....much of this is cultural. The American culture is 

>just different. We don't want to work that hard, we don't want that 

>much responsibility. Doesn't matter if it is right or wrong, its the 

>way it is. There are those who do expect their kids to be pushed, and 

>they put their kids in private school if they can afford it, or they 

>are in the classroom hounding the teacher to make sure it happens. 

>I don't think we can blame the entire educational system, there are 

good 



>can't blame all the parents, but there are some that need to get a 

clue. 

1992

We can't just blame the government for not throwing good money after 



>solution. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>Alexandra, 

> 

> 

> 











>concept, makes for a very bad lesson. Exploration, Concept, 

>Application. One must truly begin to understand that there are 

>fundamental social differences between the U.S. and other countries, 

>thus it is not practical to adopt all of their practices. This is not 

>to say that we should not examine these educational structures, but we 

>should not blindly say that they are whole heartedly better than ours. 

>For one thing people such as myself, being that I have Dyslexia, would 

>have been bared from a higher education due to the genetic makeup. Is 

>this a good way to go about it? I hope not. Also, Japanese students 

>attend school about two months longer than do American students, but 

>this is not discussed in your reasons for better performance. Also, the 

>students bow to their teachers at the start of everyday and they make 

>their own food and clean the school. One mu st ask themselves, what are 

>the fundamental differences and accepted ideologies that would prevent 

>American schools from conducting their education in a similar fashion? 

> 

>Robert. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >From: 




> >Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> > 



>American students in mathematics and science." This made me think of 

>an article I read that compared the math instruction in Japan, Germany, 

>and the United States. I think understanding the disparity between 




>homework, the percentage of teachers who use the board, diversity in 

>the classroom, and the approach to lesson planning. The article titled, 

>"How Culture Shapes Math Instruction in Japan, Germany, and the United 

1993

States" (The California Education Policy Seminar and The California 


>looks closely at the teaching philosophies of the ab ove countries 

>while takin 


>article placed the focus on math education but the teaching 

>philosophies applies to other subject areas. As a future teacher, I 

>think that it is important that we explore other countries' education 

>system and see how we can benefit from their success. This kind of 

>exploration I hope will give me an edge for reaching out to all my 

>students. I welcome the opportunity to gain insight into other 

>educational systems outside of the U. S. Our classrooms grow more and 

>more diverse and understanding teaching philosophies outside our own 

>country becomes more crucial. Why? Our student body grows more diverse 

>but the teachers and the classrooms do not. Is it possible to bring 

>more than just a lesson about another country into the classroom? What 

>is wrong with teaching more like the Japanese, the Germans, the 

>Koreans, and the British?? In reading the article, I discovered how 

>homogenous American education system really i 


> >Each country no matter how diverse has a distinct teaching style. 

> >Let 



>culture has its unique teaching philosophies. I assumed that Japan 

>rate of educational success had to do with the long hours that Japanese 




>testing. The success rate of the Japanese students is contributed to 

>how the Japanese teacher used the resources available. For example, the 




>the chalkboard. For instance, the Japanese's "philosophy is to treat 

>the chalkboard as their record of the entire lesson being taught. This 

>gives visual learners and everyone the opportunity to have a good set 

>of notes to reflect on and ask questions. Rather, than trying to take 

>notes and learn a concept at the same time. The teacher facilitates the 

>learning by reemphasizing what she/he is saying by writing it on the 

>board. Whereas, the teachers in the U.S. use visual aids and "body 

>language in a constant battle to draw students' attention to their 

>words. Moreover, the U 

> > .S. focuses math lesson on teaching the students how to solve math 







> >The Japanese teachers prepare lesson plans using a methodical 

> >approach. 







1994

interesting and novel approach is the way other Japanese teachers 






> >In Japan, the federal government funds are used to pay for 

> >"In-service 



>our thinking in the U.S. that Japanese schools are not diverse, in 

>fact, the schools are very diverse because unlike the U.S. where 

>students are tracked and divided by ability, the students in Japans are 

>placed in random classrooms. Therefore, the teaching techniques used in 

>Japan targets a diverse classroom and the teaching techniques in the 

>U.S. work well in a homogenous classroom." How well do American schools 

>use class time? 







>application. For example, American teachers explain what is a 

>numerator, denominator, how to divide, multiply, etc. The concept is 

>stated but not developed. The study showed that "approximately 80% of 

>the concepts in the U.S. were only stated and never developed, whereas 

>in Germany and Japan the exact opposite pattern occurred." Given 

>Sagan's findings that "the average math gap between white and black 

>U.S. high school graduates is still huge- two to three grade levels; 

>but the gap between white U.S. high school graduates and those in, say 

>Japan, Canada, Great Bri tain?is more th 










> > 

> > 

> 

> _____ 

> 

>Get rid of annoying pop-up ads 


> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 


>Yahoo! 

>i 


1995

Enter today 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 

FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar - get it now! 


1996






Are you saying that it would cost more money to keep the students in school an extra couple of hours each day? I would 

assume this would be the cost of electricity and the general running of the building, but if teachers are supposed to be at 

school until 4:30 - 5:00pm anyway, I can't see what the additional expense is. I do agree that you would have a lot of 

teachers "pitching a fit" over having to stay "longer" hours! But, you don't go into the profession for a short day, and if you 

do, you shouldn't be a teacher! I think the benefits of a longer day would out-weigh the detriments. I was also thinking 

about high-school students. Isn't it a shock for those who graduate and get a regular paying job to be up early and to 

work into the evening, when they've been used to getting "off" in the early afternoon? ~ Louise 







Another reason: I bet there are lots of teachers who would pitch a fit if they had to work those 

hours, and you know how powerful the teacher's unions are. 

Cynthia 


In response to your posting about homework and culture in general, I have a few things to say as I step up to my 

soap box... I have a really hard time understanding why students get out of school at 2:20 or sometimes 1:15pm 

on a school day. Like you said Cynthia, much of the academic day is spent on issues such as drug education 

etc., which I think are important issues. Why doesn't the school day extend to 4pm or even 5pm? With this in 

mind, students are being taught by professionals, not having to rely on someone at home; students are off the 

streets and a big plus for teachers is that we will have a couple of hours more in the day to actually instruct and 

spend time with our students. 

Perhaps it's because I went to school in the "Dark Ages" or the fact that I was educated in England, but since 

being in America, I have found, for the most part, that students from elementary through college tend to not have 

the degree of respect for adults/elders/teachers that I learned. For example, as a K-12 student, if an adult 

entered the room, be it another teacher, a parent and definitely if it was the headmaster, ALL students would 

stand and acknowledge the visitor! You NEVER walked out of class during lecture/instruction (as Prof. 

Yamashita was describing one of his mentor professors in class the other day). 

Well, I think I'll get off my soap box and attend to my physics homework while the brain cells are still snapping 

away up there. Until next time... ~ Louise 






1997

In regards to homework: Japanese students have longer school days, then they go to after 

school school; when would they have time for homework? American schools spend so 

much time teaching diversity, drug education etc, there isn't a lot of time left to teach 

academics, so they send the school work home as homework. Many American students 

don't have parents who put a lot of value on education, or just don't find the time to make 

sure their kids are learning.They know their kids will just get passed on to the next grade 

anyway, so why worry? Our kids don't have to compete to get into a high school, heck you 

don't even have to compete to get in many colleges (certain career fields excluded of 

course, like medical). 

As far as students cleaning and taking ownership of their schools, I think thats a great way 

to get students to care about things. The school I used to work at had the kids do that too, 

and it worked great. The physical aspect is a plus, get them up and moving! 

So....much of this is cultural. The American culture is just different. We don't want to work 

that hard, we don't want that much responsibility. Doesn't matter if it is right or wrong, its 

the way it is. There are those who do expect their kids to be pushed, and they put their kids 

in private school if they can afford it, or they are in the classroom hounding the teacher to 

make sure it happens. 

I don't think we can blame the entire educational system, there are good teachers out 

there, the ones who make teaching their lives, not just a way to get a paycheck. 

Unfortunately, there are too many of those. We can't blame all the parents, but there are 

some that need to get a clue. We can't just blame the government for not throwing good 

money after bad, the money needs to be spent in the right places on the right things. Its a 

complex problem in a complex society, with no easy solution. 

Cynthia 


Alexandra, 

You are comparing what you view as the worst US schools and practices, with the best Japanese 

schools and practices. I hope that you realize that this gives your words a weighted level of bias. 

Teachers in the U.S. are also required to have in-service training where they discuss proven 

methods. The classrooms in the U.S. are not supposed to grouped by level and in most cases are 

not. There is a big difference between having different dialects and having different languages. 

Although we have learned that problem solving is an essential skill that our students must have, 

we have also learned through the Bruer book that teaching the concept is also necessary. All 

problem solving and no concept, makes for a very bad lesson. Exploration, Concept, 

Application. One must truly begin to understand that there are fundamental social differences 

between the U.S. and other countries, thus it is not practical to adopt all of their practices. This is 

not to say that we should not examine these educational structures, but we should not blindly say 

that they are whole heartedly better than ours. For one thing people such as myself, being that I 

have Dyslexia, would have been bared from a higher education due to the genetic makeup. Is this 

a good way to go about it? I hope not. Also, Japanese students attend school about two months 

longer than do American students, but this is not discussed in your reasons for better 

performance. Also, the students bow to their teachers at the start of everyday and they make their 

own food and clean the school. One mu st ask themselves, what are the fundamental differences 

and accepted ideologies that would prevent American schools from conducting their education in 

a similar fashion? 

1998

Robert. 

>From: 




>Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> 

>It was not surprising to read in Sagan's reading, "No such thing as a Dumb Question" 

that Japan, South Korea, and Western Canada was ahead of American students in 

mathematics and science." This made me think of an article I read that compared the 

math instruction in Japan, Germany, and the United States. I think understanding the 

disparity between countries' math and science scores is a complex concept to 

understand. The scores do not take into consideration teachers' training, how the 

federal government funds are used, the emphasis placed on testing and homework, the 

percentage of teachers who use the board, diversity in the classroom, and the approach 

to lesson planning. The article titled, "How Culture Shapes Math Instruction in Japan, 

Germany, and the United States" (The California Education Policy Seminar and The 

California State University Institute sponsored the article for Education Reform) looks 

closely at the teaching philosophies of the ab ove countries while takin 

> g into consideration other factors besides testing. This particular article placed the 

focus on math education but the teaching philosophies applies to other subject areas. 

As a future teacher, I think that it is important that we explore other countries' education 

system and see how we can benefit from their success. This kind of exploration I hope 

will give me an edge for reaching out to all my students. I welcome the opportunity to 

gain insight into other educational systems outside of the U. S. Our classrooms grow 

more and more diverse and understanding teaching philosophies outside our own 

country becomes more crucial. Why? Our student body grows more diverse but the 

teachers and the classrooms do not. Is it possible to bring more than just a lesson about 

another country into the classroom? What is wrong with teaching more like the 

Japanese, the Germans, the Koreans, and the British?? In reading the article, I 

discovered how homogenous American education system really i 


>Each country no matter how diverse has a distinct teaching style. Let us look at it this 

way, as distinct as the American culture is from the Germans, the Japanese, the 

Koreans, etc. it would make sense that each culture has its unique teaching 

philosophies. I assumed that Japan rate of educational success had to do with the long 

hours that Japanese children were in school. I also assumed that much focus was 

placed on preparing students for testing. 

>According to the study, the Japanese do not put a huge focus on testing. The success 

rate of the Japanese students is contributed to how the Japanese teacher used the 

resources available. For example, the Japanese teachers use the chalkboard 100% 

while the U.S. uses the chalkboard 67%. The important thing I discovered in not how 

the tools are used but the philosophy behind the lesson, for example, recorded on the 

chalkboard. For instance, the Japanese's "philosophy is to treat the chalkboard as their 

record of the entire lesson being taught. This gives visual learners and everyone the 

opportunity to have a good set of notes to reflect on and ask questions. Rather, than 

trying to take notes and learn a concept at the same time. The teacher facilitates the 

1999

_____ 

learning by reemphasizing what she/he is saying by writing it on the board. Whereas, 

the teachers in the U.S. use visual aids and "body language in a constant battle to draw 

students' attention to their words. Moreover, the U 

> .S. focuses math lesson on teaching the students how to solve math problems rather 

than giving the students the opportunity to think and apply what they know into solving a 

problem. Meanwhile,the Japanese teachers teach students math concepts by 

explaining what the math concepts mean and giving the students the opportunity to 

apply the math concepts and figure out their own method of problem solving.How do 

teacher from Japan lesson plans? 

>The Japanese teachers prepare lesson plans using a methodical approach. The 

lesson plans are prepared with the questions the students may ask, the areas of 

difficulty that may arise for the students, and the possible mistakes the students will 

make in working through a math concept. Furthermore, the Japanese teachers work on 

one-lesson plan for an entire year. Whereas, the American teachers rely on previous 

lessons and quickly put together a lesson plan on prior instructions. Another interesting 

and novel approach is the way other Japanese teachers observe a teacher 

implementing a new lesson in order to study the students during the lesson; the 

teachers then meet to review and revise the lesson and later present the lesson to the 

entire faculty where the teacher receives more criticism. It was interesting to learn how 

the federal government supports Japanese teachers. 

>In Japan, the federal government funds are used to pay for "In-service teacher 

training," rather than investing that money on keeping class size smaller. The average 

class size in Japan has 40 students. Unlike our thinking in the U.S. that Japanese 

schools are not diverse, in fact, the schools are very diverse because unlike the U.S. 

where students are tracked and divided by ability, the students in Japans are placed in 

random classrooms. Therefore, the teaching techniques used in Japan targets a diverse 

classroom and the teaching techniques in the U.S. work well in a homogenous 

classroom." How well do American schools use class time? 



completed. In Japan, there is little emphasis placed on homework, "only 24% of 

Japanese teachers" assigned homework. Meanwhile, 90% of the American teachers 

assign homework and place emphasis on the use of concepts and method, rather than 

application. For example, American teachers explain what is a numerator, denominator, 

how to divide, multiply, etc. The concept is stated but not developed. The study showed 

that "approximately 80% of the concepts in the U.S. were only stated and never 

developed, whereas in Germany and Japan the exact opposite pattern occurred." Given 

Sagan's findings that "the average math gap between white and black U.S. high school 

graduates is still huge- two to three grade levels; but the gap between white U.S. high 

school graduates and those in, say Japan, Canada, Great Bri tain?is more th 

> an twice as large (with U.S. students behind)" (Sagan 329). Then it is important that 

we look at other factors that affect our education system besides blaming it on testing, 

class size, and diversity issues. Motivating and teaching our students how to think 

seems to play an important factor in educating our students. Teaching concepts is not 

enough. Applying the concepts the way this semester of science has taught us in 

Ochanji's class through exploration and applications seems to give students to 

opportunity to problem solve while promoting thinking. (Alexandra's journal #11) 

> 

> 


2000

_____ 

_____ 





2001





Subject: RE: learning language 

Submersion can be a good think...... 

The Japanese students who have lived with us are here because they want to use, practice , and 

improve their English skills. They also want to learn as much as they can about the American 

culture...etc. They are not supposed to talk in their first language when they are in class or when they 

talk to their host families. Of course they have Japanese speaking personnel at the school, but the 

whole experience is geared towards using and improving their English skills they have been learning 

already. These young adults are here of course because they want to be here, and as we are 

discovering for students to really learn, they must be motivated to do so. 

If you want to really do something, you are internally driven and that's half the battle. If you don't 

want to do something or you are dragging your feet for one reason or another, then it's a huge 

struggle. I guess for people who are not driven internally, teachers must spark their internal drive and 

make the task seem exciting or point them in a direction that has manageable steps that will make the 

task doable. A brink wall is built one brick at a time, a long journey begins with one step at a time, 

changing your behavior can be modified one minute, one hour, one day, one week, one month....etc. 

at a time...... Just like when I quit smoking. 

As teachers we must be able to lay out little treats along the correct path for the students to discover 

and follow. As they take in the new information we can relate it to things that they can associate it to, 

but it is up to them to file it in the proper file within their brain so that it makes sense to them. I guess 

everyones' filing system within the brain is a little bit different. Just because I file information on cats 

in my favorites file, it does not mean Tommy Two Toes will file info on cats there too. The mind is a 

complex network of thinking........ But the thing that sets learning up for the most success is the 

student wanting to learn.... If someone wants to do something......LOOK OUT..... 

I realize this has trailed away from learning language a bit, but it's all good stuff on learning...... 

Ann 


I think there is a point to your story, that being: There isn't any one answer to the problem. I 

probably would learn to speak Spanish if it was the only way that I would be able to communicate. 

Can you imagine me having to keep my mouth shut for an extended period of time? 

I think that if you have a whole class of language learners, it might take longer because they could 

communicate in their native language, and so the need to learn the new language wouldn't be as 

imperative (my mind is blank, severe lack of coffee, not sure if that is the best word to use). 

Cynthia 







2002
















> 

> 








> 

> Ann 

> 

> Cynthia Reyes wrote: 



> 



great. 

> Mira 


Spanish. 

> It's super 


> 

> 

> 




teachers, 



by not 

> allowing 


2003

a 


> immersion program in Canada. One of the th ings pointed out as a reason 

for 

> apparent 


a 

> difficult 


that 

> pr ogram 


other 

> when they 


tend to 

> score 


goes 

> back to 


better 

> cognitive 


> > ers each 


the 

> other, a 


> >In order to get more qualified bilingual teachers here, we need to 

change the 

> way we 


were 

> required to 




what 



teachers 

> because we 


would be 

> thanks to 


> >Cynthia 

> > 


> > 


obliterated, 

2004

parents need 


mater-of-fact 



getting 

> rid of 


racist 

> ways of 

> conferring, that is making them take such views. And apparently their 

views 

> are not 


district 

> that cannot 


Could it 

> be that 




to 

> accounting 







> > 

> > 

> >So much for changing the system from within !! One thought though, 

didn't they 

> get rid of 


being 

> so 




> >Cynthia 


people are 

> going to 


before it 

> takes hold, 


real 


> > 


2005

My sister-n-law who is a second grade teacher at Lincoln elementary is 

going 

> through 


> bilingual 


this 

> issue. 


the 



believe 

> in. In that 


but the 

> principal 






Lincoln was 

> confronted with 


to tell 

> some that 


two 

> were kept at 


> > ng that 


teacher 

> friend. The 


she was 

> moved to 


first I 



jest of it 

> to me: the 


work, for 

> fourth 


schedule. 

> At the 


friends 

> phoned her 

2006

and mentioned that they were going to be meeting with a lawyer to file 

a civil 





is doing 

> for the 


my 

> family but 




> >Karla 


Lincoln feel 

> threatened 


defend a 

> cause! 






> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 


your 


large will 

> approve of 




everyone 

> believes 


happens 

> when you 


says "NOT 

> ON MY 


else 

> should 


2007

views and 


curriculums, 

> units, 


line? How 

> much 


when 

> will you 

> stop fighting? This is o ne reason teachers don' t stay in the professi 

> > on for 


flow and 

> buy there 


motion. 

> But, how 


of us 

> views to be 


> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 




> >>Subject: Re: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 


> >> 

> >>Matheno, 

> >> 


delt 



near the 

> coast, 


want to 

> create a 


> European 


Christian 

> American, 


> American...........etc. I want to include and respect everyone to the 

best of 



2008

abilities to 



> >>Ann 

> >> 



> >> 


internet 


out on 

> the 


and as 

> Jim 


> pinpoint 


say that 

> my 


much as 


don't 


completely 


haven't 

> >>been around to jump on some of the entries that I should have. For 

instance, 


literacy 

> between 


wanted to 


doesn't push 


that the 


whether or 

> not 


lines, as I 


schools in 


but 


test 


these 

2009

kids 


motivate 

> >>ourselves and if you are one that continually is pr essuring the 

teacher to 


you are 


rather than 

> >>just a desire to learn (this being in the high school years)). But 

their is 


students" 


the one 


that the 




work 

> their 


want to 

> work 

> >>in for whatever reason (hopefully not because of the ethni city or> >>socio-economic 

status of your students) you will resent your position 

and 

> >>continue the string of teachers who don't care about the performance 

of 

> their 


I tend 


else 

> one 


at 

> this 


reinforced 


little to 


to. Its 


why this 

> is 

> >>so or how it can be fixed. Anyways folks just a few things i wan ted 

to get 


muttered 

2010

up my apologies but please feel free to discuss with me anything you 

would 


> >> 

> >>Matheno 

> >> 


never 

> a 


words but 


> >> 

> >> 

> >>--------------------------------- 



> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 


FREE 

> download! 

> > 

& gt; > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> > 

> > 

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

> 

>---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 



> 

> 

>----------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

- 



2011

_____ 



_____ 



2012






First, I think it's a very good idea to have extended school days. The electric bill probably isn't the big 

money issue, but teacher salaries might be, and principal salaries. I don't know how late teachers are 

supposed to be on campus per their contracts, but some leave earlier than that. But if classes went till 

4 or 5, that would mean teachers would need to stay till about 7 or so to do their admin stuff, which 

turns it into a 12 hour day. 

My point was, if you proposed a referendum or something suggesting the idea of extending the 

school day, the teacher's union would fight it with everything they have. I am sure there are teachers 

out there that would be willing to do the longer day, but those just collecting a paycheck sure wouldn't 

be unless it translated into big bucks. 

A lot of the the resistance would come just from the idea of changing the status quo. School days 

have always been X amount of hours, our society is used to it, and it doesn't like to just up and 

change at the drop of a hat. I am not saying that is right, or even a good thing, just a reality that you 

would be up against if you tried to change it. It's not like it hasn't been mentioned before; plenty of 

people have suggested extending the school day, but so far, nothing has come of it. Maybe it isn't the 

will of the people, although you would probably have a lot easier time convincing parents, since it 

makes life easier for them. 

Cynthia 


Are you saying that it would cost more money to keep the students in school an extra couple of hours each day? I 

would assume this would be the cost of electricity and the general running of the building, but if teachers are 

supposed to be at school until 4:30 - 5:00pm anyway, I can't see what the additional expense is. I do agree that you 

would have a lot of teachers "pitching a fit" over having to stay "longer" hours! But, you don't go into the profession 

for a short day, and if you do, you shouldn't be a teacher! I think the benefits of a longer day would out-weigh the 

detriments. I was also thinking about high-school students. Isn't it a shock for those who graduate and get a regular 

paying job to be up early and to work into the evening, when they've been used to getting "off" in t he early afternoon? 

~ Louise 







Another reason: I bet there are lots of teachers who would pitch a fit if they had to work those 

hours, and you know how powerful the teacher's unions are. 

Cynthia 


In response to your posting about homework and culture in general, I have a few things to say as I step up to 

my soap box... I have a really hard time understanding why students get out of school at 2:20 or sometimes 

1:15pm on a school day. Like you said Cynthia, much of the academic day is spent on issues such as drug 

2013

education etc., which I think are important issues. Why doesn't the school day extend to 4pm or even 5pm? 

With this in mind, students are being taught by professionals, not having to rely on someone at home; 

students are off the streets and a big plus for teachers is that we will have a couple of hours more in the day 

to actually instruct and spend time with our students. 

Perhaps it's because I went to school in the "Dark Ages" or the fact that I was educated in England, but since 

being in America, I have found, for the most part, that students from elementary through college tend to not 

have the degree of respect for adults/elders/teachers that I learned. For example, as a K-12 student, if an 

adult entered the room, be it another teacher, a parent and definitely if it was the headmaster, ALL students 

would stand and acknowledge the visitor! You NEVER walked out of class during lecture/instruction (as Prof. 

Yamashita was describing one of his mentor professors in class the other day). 

Well, I think I'll get off my soap box and attend to my physics homework while the brain cells are still snapping 

away up there. Until next time... ~ Louise 






In regards to homework: Japanese students have longer school days, then they go to 

after school school; when would they have time for homework? American schools 

spend so much time teaching diversity, drug education etc, there isn't a lot of time left to 

teach academics, so they send the school work home as homework. Many American 

students don't have parents who put a lot of value on education, or just don't find the 

time to make sure their kids are learning.They know their kids will just get passed on to 

the next grade anyway, so why worry? Our kids don't have to compete to get into a high 

school, heck you don't even have to compete to get in many colleges (certain career 

fields excluded of course, like medical). 

As far as students cleaning and taking ownership of their schools, I think thats a great 

way to get students to care about things. The school I used to work at had the kids do 

that too, and it worked great. The physical aspect is a plus, get them up and moving! 

So....much of this is cultural. The American culture is just different. We don't want to 

work that hard, we don't want that much responsibility. Doesn't matter if it is right or 

wrong, its the way it is. There are those who do expect their kids to be pushed, and they 

put their kids in private school if they can afford it, or they are in the classroom hounding 

the teacher to make sure it happens. 

I don't think we can blame the entire educational system, there are good teachers out 

there, the ones who make teaching their lives, not just a way to get a paycheck. 

Unfortunately, there are too many of those. We can't blame all the parents, but there are 

some that need to get a clue. We can't just blame the government for not throwing good 

money after bad, the money needs to be spent in the right places on the right things. Its 

a complex problem in a complex society, with no easy solution. 

Cynthia 


Alexandra, 

2014

You are comparing what you view as the worst US schools and practices, with the best 

Japanese schools and practices. I hope that you realize that this gives your words a weighted 

level of bias. Teachers in the U.S. are also required to have in-service training where they 

discuss proven methods. The classrooms in the U.S. are not supposed to grouped by level 

and in most cases are not. There is a big difference between having different dialects and 

having different languages. Although we have learned that problem solving is an essential 

skill that our students must have, we have also learned through the Bruer book that teaching 

the concept is also necessary. All problem solving and no concept, makes for a very bad 

lesson. Exploration, Concept, Application. One must truly begin to understand that there are 

fundamental social differences between the U.S. and other countries, thus it is not practical to 

adopt all of their practices. This is not to say that we should not examine these educational 

structures, but we should not blindly say that they are whole heartedly better than ours. For 

one thing people such as myself, being that I have Dyslexia, would have been bared from a 

higher education due to the genetic makeup. Is this a good way to go about it? I hope not. 

Also, Japanese students attend school about two months longer than do American students, 

but this is not discussed in your reasons for better performance. Also, the students bow to 

their teachers at the start of everyday and they make their own food and clean the school. 

One mu st ask themselves, what are the fundamental differences and accepted ideologies that 

would prevent American schools from conducting their education in a similar fashion? 

Robert. 

>From: 




>Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> 

>It was not surprising to read in Sagan's reading, "No such thing as a Dumb 

Question" that Japan, South Korea, and Western Canada was ahead of American 

students in mathematics and science." This made me think of an article I read that 

compared the math instruction in Japan, Germany, and the United States. I think 

understanding the disparity between countries' math and science scores is a 

complex concept to understand. The scores do not take into consideration teachers' 

training, how the federal government funds are used, the emphasis placed on testing 

and homework, the percentage of teachers who use the board, diversity in the 

classroom, and the approach to lesson planning. The article titled, "How Culture 

Shapes Math Instruction in Japan, Germany, and the United States" (The California 

Education Policy Seminar and The California State University Institute sponsored the 

article for Education Reform) looks closely at the teaching philosophies of the ab ove 

countries while takin 

> g into consideration other factors besides testing. This particular article placed the 

focus on math education but the teaching philosophies applies to other subject 

areas. As a future teacher, I think that it is important that we explore other countries' 

education system and see how we can benefit from their success. This kind of 

exploration I hope will give me an edge for reaching out to all my students. I 

welcome the opportunity to gain insight into other educational systems outside of the 

U. S. Our classrooms grow more and more diverse and understanding teaching 

2015

philosophies outside our own country becomes more crucial. Why? Our student 

body grows more diverse but the teachers and the classrooms do not. Is it possible 

to bring more than just a lesson about another country into the classroom? What is 

wrong with teaching more like the Japanese, the Germans, the Koreans, and the 

British?? In reading the article, I discovered how homogenous American education 

system really i 


>Each country no matter how diverse has a distinct teaching style. Let us look at it 

this way, as distinct as the American culture is from the Germans, the Japanese, the 

Koreans, etc. it would make sense that each culture has its unique teaching 

philosophies. I assumed that Japan rate of educational success had to do with the 

long hours that Japanese children were in school. I also assumed that much focus 

was placed on preparing students for testing. 

>According to the study, the Japanese do not put a huge focus on testing. The 

success rate of the Japanese students is contributed to how the Japanese teacher 

used the resources available. For example, the Japanese teachers use the 

chalkboard 100% while the U.S. uses the chalkboard 67%. The important thing I 

discovered in not how the tools are used but the philosophy behind the lesson, for 

example, recorded on the chalkboard. For instance, the Japanese's "philosophy is to 

treat the chalkboard as their record of the entire lesson being taught. This gives 

visual learners and everyone the opportunity to have a good set of notes to reflect 

on and ask questions. Rather, than trying to take notes and learn a concept at the 

same time. The teacher facilitates the learning by reemphasizing what she/he is 

saying by writing it on the board. Whereas, the teachers in the U.S. use visual aids 

and "body language in a constant battle to draw students' attention to their words. 

Moreover, the U 

> .S. focuses math lesson on teaching the students how to solve math problems 

rather than giving the students the opportunity to think and apply what they know 

into solving a problem. Meanwhile,the Japanese teachers teach students math 

concepts by explaining what the math concepts mean and giving the students the 

opportunity to apply the math concepts and figure out their own method of problem 

solving.How do teacher from Japan lesson plans? 

>The Japanese teachers prepare lesson plans using a methodical approach. The 

lesson plans are prepared with the questions the students may ask, the areas of 

difficulty that may arise for the students, and the possible mistakes the students will 

make in working through a math concept. Furthermore, the Japanese teachers work 

on one-lesson plan for an entire year. Whereas, the American teachers rely on 

previous lessons and quickly put together a lesson plan on prior instructions. 

Another interesting and novel approach is the way other Japanese teachers observe 

a teacher implementing a new lesson in order to study the students during the 

lesson; the teachers then meet to review and revise the lesson and later present the 

lesson to the entire faculty where the teacher receives more criticism. It was 

interesting to learn how the federal government supports Japanese teachers. 

>In Japan, the federal government funds are used to pay for "In-service teacher 

training," rather than investing that money on keeping class size smaller. The 

average class size in Japan has 40 students. Unlike our thinking in the U.S. that 

Japanese schools are not diverse, in fact, the schools are very diverse because 

unlike the U.S. where students are tracked and divided by ability, the students in 

Japans are placed in random classrooms. Therefore, the teaching techniques used 

in Japan targets a diverse classroom and the teaching techniques in the U.S. work 

well in a homogenous classroom." How well do American schools use class time? 


Instead, the time is used on going over homework and checking to see if homework 

2016

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

_____ 

is completed. In Japan, there is little emphasis placed on homework, "only 24% of 

Japanese teachers" assigned homework. Meanwhile, 90% of the American teachers 

assign homework and place emphasis on the use of concepts and method, rather 

than application. For example, American teachers explain what is a numerator, 

denominator, how to divide, multiply, etc. The concept is stated but not developed. 

The study showed that "approximately 80% of the concepts in the U.S. were only 

stated and never developed, whereas in Germany and Japan the exact opposite 

pattern occurred." Given Sagan's findings that "the average math gap between white 

and black U.S. high school graduates is still huge- two to three grade levels; but the 

gap between white U.S. high school graduates and those in, say Japan, Canada, 

Great Bri tain?is more th 

> an twice as large (with U.S. students behind)" (Sagan 329). Then it is important 

that we look at other factors that affect our education system besides blaming it on 

testing, class size, and diversity issues. Motivating and teaching our students how to 

think seems to play an important factor in educating our students. Teaching 

concepts is not enough. Applying the concepts the way this semester of science has 

taught us in Ochanji's class through exploration and applications seems to give 

students to opportunity to problem solve while promoting thinking. (Alexandra's 

journal #11) 

> 

> 








2017





Subject: What's up with the crazy multiple postings????? 

WOW, that's pretty crazy...... Kinda like hitting the jackpot in Vegas...... 

They keep coming and coming..... yeeeee haaaaaaaaaa 


_____ 



2018





Subject: RE: A & P Solving ...Louise 

In order for students to have a Eight hour day, the teacher would have to have a ten to twelve hour 

day. This is not practical because the teacher would burnnnnnnn ooooooout! I am going into to 

teaching to help students learn, but not to deal with students every waking hour. It is impractical to 

think that you could. One way to extend the day would be to bring on extra teachers to teach the extra 

hours, but there are a lot of logistics behind that. Also, school is not meant to be a housing system for 

kids while their parents are out and if it was we would start with newborns. If the parents are put 

out by a short school day, Maybe they should not be PARENTS! You don't have kids so that 

someone else can take care of them all the time, and if you do you should not be a parent. On 

average teachers spend more time with kids than do the parents anyways, I don't think that it would 

be good for the kids to spend even less time with parents. But, I guess it depends on your point of 

view. Also, if teachers are going to take on the role of facilitating parents to work more hours, the 

teachers deserve a portion of that increase. Lets see, 3 extra work hours per parent with an average 

pay of $15 an hour per parent. that is $45 a day, $900 a month, then multiply by 20 students (the 

upper grades would be more), that is $18,000 a month. I would figure that the teachers should get at 

least 20% of this, which is an extra $3,600 a month. The average teacher works about 10 months out 

of the year, so this would be an extra $36,000. Thus the starting salary of a teacher would be about 

$68,000 to $73,000 a year. Hey, I might be willing to put in the extra time for this kind of money! Hey 

a veteran teacher would be making six digits! Think about it. We live in a capitalist society, time is 

MONEY. 



>To: 


>Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 06:39:12 -0700 

> 

>Are you saying that it would cost more money to keep the students in 

>school an extra couple of hours each day? I would assume this would be 

>the cost of electricity and the general running of the building, but if 

>teachers are supposed to be at school until 4:30 - 5:00pm anyway, I 

>can't see what the additional expense is. I do agree that you would 

>have a lot of teachers "pitching a fit" over having to stay "longer" 

>hours! But, you don't go into the profession for a short day, and if 

>you do, you shouldn't be a teacher! I think the benefits of a longer 

>day would out-weigh the detriments. I was also thinking about 

>high-school students. Isn't it a shock for those who graduate and get a 

>regular paying job to be up early and to work into the evening, when 

>they've been used to getting "off" in the early afternoon? ~ Louise 

> 

2019



>Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 11:23 PM 



> 

> 

> 

>Just a couple of reasons why they don't extend the school day? Money, 

>Money 

>Another reason: I bet there are lots of teachers who would pitch a fit 

>if they had to work those hours, and you know how powerful the teacher's 

>unions are. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 











>students. 

> 










> 




> 

> 






> 

> 

> 


2020

they go to after school school; when would they have time for homework? 









>medical). 


















>solution. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>Alexandra, 

> 

> 

> 


















2021

ared from a higher education due to the genetic makeup. Is this a good 







>from conducting their education in a similar fashion? 

> 

>Robert. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >From: 




> >Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> > 















>takin 


















2022

Germans, the Japanese, the Koreans, etc. it would make sense that each 



















>the U 






























>time? 




2023

emphasis placed on homework, "only 24% of Japanese teachers" assigned 











>more th 










> > 

> > 

> 

> _____ 

> 

>Get rid of annoying pop-up ads 


> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 


>Yahoo! 


>Enter today 

> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 


>Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 

> 15th 

> 

_____ 


2024





Subject: witches 

so i had hoped for more discussion about witchcraft in sagan's chapter. 

this may seem weird coming from karis the Christian, but i took a history class my 1st 

semester in ICP that had a section on witchcraft and rituals. i was terrified and creeped 

out at first and when i got the books. 

i thought, great what have i gotten myself into. 

but it was so interesting. 

we read a book, "Ritual in Early Modern Europe" by Muir that was so fascinating. i do 

recommend it, i do not recommend you do the witchcraft. 

it was the old school witch stuff, you know before movies like "The Craft" witchcraft 

today is so creepy to me and so wrong, but these old witches, like in "Hocus Pocus" (Salem 

Witches) are really cool to learn about. 

so i got off on a tangent, no longer related to sagan, but he did make me think about that 

class again. 

if you need a class, its HIST 318 and the professor (Elwood) is awesome. 


2025





Subject: Journal fever 

After many sessions of Yamashita bringing up data points I find myself 

searching for them. It is hard for me to sit and look for them but when a 

situation is under way they are much easier to identify. It is interesting and 

also freightening to analyze data points which can answer questions as to how 

things happen as they do. It's like tearing apart each falling block in the 

domino affect and analyzing how each domino is affected by the previous domino 

which then affects the next domino. 

I have a question for Yamashita. If you're out there maybe you can respond. 

why do you call teachers clowns? I love and RESPECT teachers that is why I 

want to be one. I do not understand why you refer to teachers as clowns 

especially to a class of future clowns, I mean teachers. I am just curious. 

When ever I hear the word clown in class the ongoing conversation is blocked 

out of my mind becase I get traped trying to analyze the whole "clown in front 

of the class thing". Maybe you could fill me in on what it means to you. 

Sagan, Well I can't believe there is only one more chapter left to read. 

Sagan, like Yamashita gets my brain ticking. I read a quote on page 374 that 

talks about failures of science and how they are often not mentioned. Well 

relating this to our Capstone I find that much of science is failure. I do not 

think that failure in science is a bad thing. In my group we make predictions 

and the evidence proves us wrong. Being a surfer I hope to see that there are 

no harmful things in the ocean. Well doing my experiment I was frustrated not 

to find bad stuff. This is funny because of course I want the ocean to be 

clean but doing my experiemnt I was pissed not to find bad test resutls 

because if I did it would have made for a much more exciting Capstone. I still 

may find some bad stuff in the water tests cause it ain't over yet. But the 

surfer in me doesnt want to find it but the scientist in me would be thrilled. 

Well science isn't a 30 minute Scooby Doo show where we always find the 

corporate laying at the bottom of the stack of dominos. It is a process that 

we observe over time and sometimes find what we expected and sometimes find 

shocking surprises. 

ANYWAYS quick smart ass comment. Sagan writes, "When is the last time you 

heared an intelligent comment on science by a President of the United States. 

Well using Bush as an example I can't think of one time where he intelligently 

spoke of science. Oh wait, He did express interest in going to outter space to 

see how stars twinkle. Since nothing is going on major here on Earth let's go 

check out twinkling stars... bone-head. just kiding. I am becoming a boar. 

Should I stay or should i go now. 

Witchraft, freedom, I did it, I didn't, doesn't matter, Look at what the 

church is doing to you, who is really the bad guy here? I don't care what you 

did or didn't do, come, have a seat on my I heated iron chair and then you can 

tell me your side of the story. Chow for now. Marin The Great. 

2026






I don't agree with you Robert! I came from an education where I went to school 8am - 4pm everyday (no minimum days). 

That being said, I had very little homework. If I did have any it was project related i.e. due at the end of the month or the 

end of the trimester. Perhaps the saving grace for the teachers in Britain is that every 4th Monday tends to be a Bank 

Holiday, where all government offices are closed, no school etc. Then there are 10-12 holidays a year and Christmas and 

Easter is usually 2-3 weeks with summer being about 6 weeks off. During my school day, I had every possible subject 

you could take all the way from elementary through high school. These included, music, drama, P.E., domestic science 

(how to cook), home banking, English literature, foreign language, theology... Now I realize that budget cuts won't allow 

many of these subjects as part of the curriculum, but perhaps teachers here could actually teach without always worrying 

about clock-watching. 

I do agree with your statement about the school shouldn't be a babysitting service, my point is that a longer day would 

allow for teachers to actually spend quality time on academics. I do realize that economics plays a huge part in this as 

does the school's social structure, but like Ann says, you can make small changes over time! ~ Louise 






In order for students to have a Eight hour day, the teacher would have to have a ten to twelve 

hour day. This is not practical because the teacher would burnnnnnnn ooooooout! I am going into 

to teaching to help students learn, but not to deal with students every waking hour. It is impractical 

to think that you could. One way to extend the day would be to bring on extra teachers to teach 

the extra hours, but there are a lot of logistics behind that. Also, school is not meant to be a 

housing system for kids while their parents are out and if it was we would start with newborns. If 

the parents are put out by a short school day, Maybe they should not be PARENTS! You don't 

have kids so that someone else can take care of them all the time, and if you do you should not be 

a parent. On average teachers spend more time with kids than do the parents anyways, I don't 

think that it would be good for the kids to spend even less time with parents. But, I guess it 

depends on your point of view. Also, if teachers are going to take on the role of facilitating parents 

to work more hours, the teachers deserve a portion of that increase. Lets see, 3 extra work 

hours per parent with an average pay of $15 an hour per parent. that is $45 a day, $900 a month, 

then multiply by 20 students (the upper grades would be more), that is $18,000 a month. I would 

figure that the teachers should get at least 20% of this, which is an extra $3,600 a month. The 

average teacher works about 10 months out of the year, so this would be an extra $36,000. Thus 

the starting salary of a teacher would be about $68,000 to $73,000 a year. Hey, I might be willing 

to put in the extra time for this kind of money! Hey a veteran teacher would be making six digits! 

Think about it. We live in a capitalist society, time is MONEY. 

2027

From: "Randy& Louise Tweed" 


>To: 


>Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 06:39:12 -0700 

> 













> 






> 

> 

> 


>Money 



>unions are. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 











>students. 

> 





2028

learned. For example, as a K-12 student, if an adult entered the room, 





> 




> 

> 






> 

> 

> 











>medical). 


















>solution. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>Alexandra, 

2029

> 

> 


























> 

>Robert. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >From: 




> >Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> > 













2030

State University Institute sponsored the article for Education Reform) 


>takin 





































>the U 














2031

and quickly put together a lesson plan on prior instructions. Another 
















>time? 















>more th 










> > 

> > 

> 

> _____ 

> 



> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 

2032


>Yahoo! 


>Enter today 

> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 



> 15th 

> 

_____ 


2033





Subject: RE: witches 

Hey Karis, 

I took this class and read Muir's book, and, like you, was fascinated 

with all the witchcraft that we studied. I had taken history in high 

school which covered a lot on this subject, and Dr. Elwood's class 

cleared away those cobwebs and gave me a renewed interest in this topic. 

I preferred the Muir book over the Sagan book, although perhaps its 

because Sagan disses Christianity and Muir discussed the cause and 

effects of Witchcraft and Christianity. Anyway, I had also made the 

connection between the two authors! ~ Louise 





Subject: witches 


this may seem weird coming from karis the Christian, but i took a 

history class my 1st semester in ICP that had a section on witchcraft 

and rituals. i was terrified and creeped out at first and when i got 

the books. i thought, great what have i gotten myself into. but it was 

so interesting. 

we read a book, "Ritual in Early Modern Europe" by Muir that was so 

fascinating. i do recommend it, i do not recommend you do the 

witchcraft. 

it was the old school witch stuff, you know before movies like "The 

Craft" witchcraft today is so creepy to me and so wrong, but these old 

witches, like in "Hocus Pocus" (Salem Witches) are really cool to learn 

about. 

so i got off on a tangent, no longer related to sagan, but he did make 

me think about that class again. 



2034





Subject: Re: RE: witches 

Louise-great minds really do think alike! 

> 


> Date: 2004/04/16 Fri PM 01:49:30 PDT 

> To: 

> Subject: RE: witches 

> 

> Hey Karis, 

> 

> I took this class and read Muir's book, and, like you, was fascinated 

> with all the witchcraft that we studied. I had taken history in high 

> school which covered a lot on this subject, and Dr. Elwood's class 

> cleared away those cobwebs and gave me a renewed interest in this topic. 

> I preferred the Muir book over the Sagan book, although perhaps its 

> because Sagan disses Christianity and Muir discussed the cause and 

> effects of Witchcraft and Christianity. Anyway, I had also made the 

> connection between the two authors! ~ Louise 

> 


> From: karisanne@adelphia.net [mailto:karisanne@adelphia.net] 

> Sent: Friday, April 16, 2004 1:19 PM 


> Subject: witches 

> 

> 

> so i had hoped for more discussion about witchcraft in sagan's chapter. 

> 

> this may seem weird coming from karis the Christian, but i took a 

> history class my 1st semester in ICP that had a section on witchcraft 

> and rituals. i was terrified and creeped out at first and when i got 

> the books. i thought, great what have i gotten myself into. but it was 

> so interesting. 

> 

> we read a book, "Ritual in Early Modern Europe" by Muir that was so 

> fascinating. i do recommend it, i do not recommend you do the 

> witchcraft. 

> 

> it was the old school witch stuff, you know before movies like "The 

> Craft" witchcraft today is so creepy to me and so wrong, but these old 

> witches, like in "Hocus Pocus" (Salem Witches) are really cool to learn 

> about. 

> 

> so i got off on a tangent, no longer related to sagan, but he did make 

> me think about that class again. 

> 

> if you need a class, its HIST 318 and the professor (Elwood) is awesome. 

> 


> 

> 

> 

> 


2035

2036






Louise, I am curious. Do you know how education is funded in England? Is it similar to how we fund 

it? 

Cynthia 


I don't agree with you Robert! I came from an education where I went to school 8am - 4pm everyday (no minimum 

days). That being said, I had very little homework. If I did have any it was project related i.e. due at the end of the 

month or the end of the trimester. Perhaps the saving grace for the teachers in Britain is that every 4th Monday tends 

to be a Bank Holiday, where all government offices are closed, no school etc. Then there are 10-12 holidays a year 

and Christmas and Easter is usually 2-3 weeks with summer being about 6 weeks off. During my school day, I had 

every possible subject you could take all the way from elementary through high school. These included, music, 

drama, P.E., domestic science (how to cook), home banking, English literature, foreign language, theology... Now I 

realize that budget cuts won't allow many of these subjects as part of the curriculum, but perhaps teachers here could 

actually teach without always worrying about clock-watching. 

I do agree with your statement about the school shouldn't be a babysitting service, my point is that a longer day would 

allow for teachers to actually spend quality time on academics. I do realize that economics plays a huge part in this 

as does the school's social structure, but like Ann says, you can make small changes over time! ~ Louise 







hour day. This is not practical because the teacher would burnnnnnnn ooooooout! I am going 

into to teaching to help students learn, but not to deal with students every waking hour. It is 

impractical to think that you could. One way to extend the day would be to bring on extra 

teachers to teach the extra hours, but there are a lot of logistics behind that. Also, school is not 

meant to be a housing system for kids while their parents are out and if it was we would start 

with newborns. If the parents are put out by a short school day, Maybe they should not be 

PARENTS! You don't have kids so that someone else can take care of them all the time, and if 

you do you should not be a parent. On average teachers spend more time with kids than do 

the parents anyways, I don't think that it would be good for the kids to spend even less time 

with parents. But, I guess it depends on your point of view. Also, if teachers are going to take 

on the role of facilitating parents to work more hours, the teachers deserve a portion of that 

increase. Lets see, 3 extra work hours per parent with an average pay of $15 an hour per 

parent. that is $45 a day, $900 a month, then multiply by 20 students (the upper grades would 

be more), that is $18,000 a month. I would figure that the teachers should get at least 20% of 

2037

this, which is an extra $3,600 a month. The average teacher works about 10 months out of the 

year, so this would be an extra $36,000. Thus the starting salary of a teacher would be about 

$68,000 to $73,000 a year. Hey, I might be willing to put in the extra time for this kind of 

money! Hey a veteran teacher would be making six digits! Think about it. We live in a capitalist 

society, time is MONEY. 



>To: 


>Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 06:39:12 -0700 

> 













> 






> 

> 

> 


>Money 



>unions are. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 










2038

hours more in the day to actually instruct and spend time with our 

>students. 

> 










> 




> 

> 






> 

> 

> 











>medical). 

















2039

things. Its a complex problem in a complex society, with no easy 

>solution. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>Alexandra, 

> 

> 

> 


























> 

>Robert. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >From: 




> >Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> > 






2040

countries' math and science scores is a complex concept to understand. 









>takin 





































>the U 







2041

teacher from Japan lesson plans? 























>time? 















>more th 










> > 

> > 

> 

> _____ 

> 

2042

_____ 

_____ 



> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 


>Yahoo! 


>Enter today 

> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 



> 15th 

> 




2043





Subject: Re: Journal fever 

I didn't know that a requirement for being president of the United States was to be a scientist, unless 

you are talking about political science. Seems to me they have other things to tend to, so maybe they 

leave the science to more qualified people. I also wouldn't expect to hear an elementary teacher 

making intelligent comments about laser surgery or other things that are not in their field of expertise. 

Cynthia 


After many sessions of Yamashita bringing up data points I find myself 

searching for them. It is hard for me to sit and look for them but when a 

situation is under way they are much easier to identify. It is interesting and 

also freightening to analyze data points which can answer questions as to how 

things happen as they do. It's like tearing apart each falling block in the 

domino affect and analyzing how each domino is affected by the previous domino 

which then affects the next domino. 

I have a question for Yamashita. If you're out there maybe you can respond. 

why do you call teachers clowns? I love and RESPECT teachers that is why I 

want to be one. I do not understand why you refer to teachers as clowns 

especially to a class of future clowns, I mean teachers. I am just curious. 

When ever I hear the word clown in class the ongoi ng conversation is blocked 

out of my mind becase I get traped trying to analyze the whole "clown in front 

of the class thing". Maybe you could fill me in on what it means to you. 

Sagan, Well I can't believe there is only one more chapter left to read. 

Sagan, like Yamashita gets my brain ticking. I read a quote on page 374 that 

talks about failures of science and how they are often not mentioned. Well 

relating this to our Capstone I find that much of science is failure. I do not 

think that failure in science is a bad thing. In my group we make predictions 

and the evidence proves us wrong. Being a surfer I hope to see that there are 

no harmful things in the ocean. Well doing my experiment I was frustrated not 

to find bad stuff. This is funny because of course I want the ocean to be 

clean but doing my experiemnt I was pissed not to find bad test resutls 

because if I did it would have made for a much more exciting Capstone. I still 

may find some bad stuff in the water tests cause it ain't over yet. But the 

surfer in me doesnt want to find it but the scientist in me would be thrilled. 

Well science isn't a 30 minute Scooby Doo show where we always find the 

corporate laying at the bottom of the stack of dominos. It is a process that 

we observe over time and sometimes find what we expected and sometimes find 

shocking surprises. 

ANYWAYS quick smart ass comment. Sagan writes, "When is the last time you 

heared an intelligent comment on science by a President of the United States. 

Well using Bush as an example I can't think of one time where he intelligently 

2044

spoke of science. Oh wait, He did express interest in going to outter space to 

see how stars twinkle. Since nothing is going on major here on Earth let's go 

check out twinkling stars... bone-head. just kiding. I am becoming a boar. 

Should I stay or should i go now. 

Witchraft, freedom, I did it, I did n't, doesn't matter, Look at what the 

church is doing to you, who is really the bad guy here? I don't care what you 

did or didn't do, come, have a seat on my I heated iron chair and then you can 

tell me your side of the story. Chow for now. Marin The Great. 

_____ 



2045





Subject: Re: A & P Solving ...Louise 

As for being a parent or not being a parent you are not the one to talk, first of all because you do not 

have one, so you do not know what it is to go through school or work with having a child. When 

someone is having a child yes there lots at stake that one needs to think about, but there are times 

when situations are beyond your control that you have to get your children to daycare. Maybe when 

you have a child you will understand the hardships that one has to go through as a parent. 

I do agree with you about teachers being reimbursed if they were to work extra hours, maybe the 

extra $128 weekly tuition fee that I pay for my child's daycare can be paid to the teacher. 







hour day. This is not practical because the teacher would burnnnnnnn ooooooout! I am going into 

to teaching to help students learn, but not to deal with students every waking hour. It is impractical 

to think that you could. One way to extend the day would be to bring on extra teachers to teach 

the extra hours, but there are a lot of logistics behind that. Also, school is not meant to be a 

housing system for kids while their parents are out and if it was we would start with newborns. If 

the parents are put out by a short school day, Maybe they should not be PARENTS! You don't 

have kids so that someone else can take care of them all the time, and if you do you should not be 

a parent. On average teachers spend more time with kids than do the parents anyways, I don't 

think that it would be good for the kids to spend even less time with parents. But, I guess it 

depends on your point of view. Also, if teachers are going to take on the role of facilitating parents 

to work more hours, the teachers deserve a portion of that increase. Lets see, 3 extra work 

hours per parent with an average pay of $15 an hour per parent. that is $45 a day, $900 a month, 

then multiply by 20 students (the upper grades would be more), that is $18,000 a month. I would 

figure that the teachers should get at least 20% of this, which is an extra $3,600 a month. The 

average teacher works about 10 months out of the year, so this would be an extra $36,000. Thus 

the starting salary of a teacher would be about $68,000 to $73,000 a year. Hey, I might be willing 

to put in the extra time for this kind of money! Hey a veteran teacher would be making six digits! 

Think about it. We live in a capitalist society, time is MONEY. 



>To: 


2046

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 06:39:12 -0700 

> 













> 






> 

> 

> 


>Money 



>unions are. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 











>students. 

> 










2047




> 

> 






> 

> 

> 











>medical). 


















>solution. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>Alexandra, 

> 

> 

> 



2048

that this gives your words a weighted level of bias. Teachers in the 























> 

>Robert. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >From: 




> >Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> > 















>takin 



2049

applies to other subject areas. As a future teacher, I think that it is 


































>the U 



















2050

teacher receives more criticism. It was interesting to learn how the 











>time? 















>more th 










> > 

> > 

> 

> _____ 

> 



> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 


>Yahoo! 


>Enter today 

2051

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 



> 15th 

> 

_____ 


2052





Subject: Re: witches 

I think Sagan was using witchcraft as an analogy. It can be applied it to any situation where someone 

or something is being used as a scapegoat. For example, "The reason our students are failing is 

because there isn't enough money, or because we have to focus on standardized tests, etc". 

Cynthia 



this may seem weird coming from karis the Christian, but i took a history class my 1st semester in 

ICP that had a section on witchcraft and rituals. i was terrified and creeped out at first and when i 

got the books. 

i thought, great what have i gotten myself into. 

but it was so interesting. 

we read a book, "Ritual in Early Modern Europe" by Muir that was so fascinating. i do recommend 

it, i do not recommend you do the witchcraft. 

it was the old school witch stuff, you know before movies like "The Craft" witchcraft today is so 

creepy to me and so wrong, but these old witches, like in "Hocus Pocus" (Salem Witches) are 

really cool to learn about. 

so i got off on a tangent, no longer related to sagan, but he did make me think about that class 

again. 



_____ 



2053





Subject: In the spirit of Buddha... 

April 16, 2004 

I call God by centering myself in the spirit of Buddha. Just now, I have awakened from a 

moment of meditation out on my deck. The day is warm, healing, and the birds are chirping 

their songs. I have prayed for Willie's safe return. God let me know that it is my work 

and my prayers that will bring him back. In that moment of meditation, I closed my eyes 

and just sat in stillness. Quieting my spirit, feeling peace, stillness, and silence was 

my focus. I could see dancing translucent colors in my mind. I felt the warmth and power 

of the sun, and the sun was God. All is God my spirit whispered. I saw the images like a 

drawing created in an arts class of the human anatomy with linear and abstract lines 

forming the torso of a man and a woman. I saw a fine translucent box filled with feather 

light pastel flowers. I felt a tingling sensation along my neckline as the soft breeze 

touched me. I have surrendered all of my worries. I felt so highly sensitive. I do not 

think that I have ev 

er surrendered all of my worries and let the wind hold me. The beauty of prayer and 

stillness is like nothing else. For too long, I have been struggling to solve life alone. 

I have practiced and practiced and practiced yoga, ballet, journaling, prayer, candle 

rituals, reading spiritual books, and textbooks seeking wisdom, and the peace and 

stillness I feel today. 

I started my morning in silence and vowed not to speak until I felt at peace with the day. 

My mind, however, dictated the next thought, the next move, and fought to remain active 

while the rest of me walked in silence. My mind and my body were two separate beings. How 

could I bring them together? I listened for my inner voice to speak, also separate from my 

mind and my body. I was inspired to start my day in prayer. I bathed, drank plenty of 

water, and cleaned my house in prayer. Accomplishing my schoolwork, nurturing body with a 

nurturing breakfast, rushing through the day was no longer my illusion of a successful 

day. 

All of this was inspired by an experience that started yesterday. On my way home from 

school, I was feeling sad and emotional. So much has happened in the last couple of years, 

and I have not yet created time to grieve, surrender, and fall apart. The demands of 

school, raising boys, struggling to save a broken relationship, taking care of my father 

desperately fighting cancer?has claimed a part of me that I am still seeking to regain. 

Driving home, I broke down and allowed myself to cry. I looked around the freeway and all 

were crying with me while in their cars traveling in what seemed to be a funeral 

precession. All were rushing to the end. I could not help but think about mother's day 

just around the corner, and still I do not know where Willie sleeps at night. I know his 

habits, his needs, and sensitivity about things. Willie ran away last summer. He took one 

a family car, money out of savings, and met up with some people he met over the Internet. 

He was sixteen. He has h 

ad a birthday since, and I was not with him to celebrate. 

On my way home, I decided to stop and take a few pairs of pants that needed tailoring to a 

dry cleaner. They had been sitting in my car for a while, but I have not had the chance to 

take them to the Asian woman who tailors my clothes in Ocean Beach. I am particular about 

who tailors my clothes and Asian tailors have a way of understanding the body of a petite 

woman. I have been going to Anne's Tailoring for at least 10 years. I took a chance in 

decided to stop at the cleaners in my new neighborhood. Yes, the lost of Willie forced me 

to sale my old house in Santee with so many memories, the memories were to painful to live 

through day-after-day. Walking by the room he slept, not seeing him at the computer, 

missing his presence in the kitchen was too much. It was as if the only thing that 

remained was his ghost... To my surprise, an Asian woman greeted me, at the cleaners. She 

was warm and welcomed me with the most sincere smile as if she had been waiting for me. I 

tried on eac 

h pants, and she pinned where they needed to be taken in. There was something strangely 

2054

familiar, and I felt comfortable in lifting my blouse and letting her hands touch me in 

places forbidden to others. There was an instant bond between us. Sana, the tailor, began 

asking me about my path in life. She was curious about the kind of training I have been 

doing to create the body I live in. Her touch felt gentle and honoring, as if handling a 

fine China doll while she took measurements. She noticed my hands and commented that even 

my hands were artistic. What is your path? She wanted to know. "I am going to school to 

become a teacher, I shared, which seemed a little strange to her. She revealed in her view 

of education that you cannot make a teacher but that a teacher was a self-cultivated 

person born with a gift based on openness and with the willingness to serve, which is 

exactly my sentiments about education. In her opinion, our education system was void of 

spirit, based on p 

olitics, practicality, and money. She was most interested in knowing about me. 

I shared with her that I dance (ballet, modern?) and practice yoga when time allows. She 

was fixated with my hands and the way I moved by body. She acknowledged that I was on a 

good path but that I must branch out where my energy is not drained in a system that may 

not be in harmony with my spirit. Her vision of me was bigger than I was willing to 

accept. She smiled, you question the gift that God has given you because you are still in 

the process of becoming the master that you are destined to become if you trust and 

continue pursuing a path of consciousness and growth. Your body is the instrument, and it 

will serve you well because it was made with a purpose in mind. I can see your apparent 

willingness to serve God. You lack confidence my genie. You are already a teacher of life. 

She went on to further describe that with my body I will do God's work, for it is the 

instrument through which holy spirits can travel to help others for the greater good. She 

referred to me as he 

r genie a number of times. In my mind, I could only think of the genies in a bottle I 

have seen on T.V. (Once home, I looked up the word "genie" in the Webster's dictionary and 

learned that a genie is "a supernatural spirit that often takes human form usually serving 

the person who calls on it"). After a while, I understood that she was referring to me as 

some kind of guru. She says to me that I have something that she has been praying for all 

of her life. Sana spoke of God and Jesus with the spirit of a Buddha, which was 

interesting to me because if I were to sum up my sense of spirituality I would describe 

myself in the same way. She asked if I have ever considered Tai Chi, and I mentioned that 

it has been suggested by a few other encounters like the one we were having. Tai Chi she 

communicated was one way to explore the kind of healing work I could do on a spiritual 

level for a greater good. 

I noticed Sana's demeanor change, and she talked about feeling anxious. Her skin became 

moist and her eyes filled with tears. She asked me what was weighing so heaving on me. She 

communicated that it was not her own anxiety coming through. I felt sense of comfort with 

her like the world around us stopped while I visited the small cleaners. It is as if only 

she and I existed. I share with her that my middle son, Willie, has runaway from home. She 

says to me, you know what happened. And answers in the same breath that my life got too 

busy and when that happens things fall apart. She goes on to tell me that for a long time 

I have been balancing out my life in a way that most people are incapable of doing. She 

mentioned that Willie needed me the most and he could see that I was already spread too 

thin. She urged me to go home and set everything aside and then sit in stillness, and pray 

to Jesus because I had the power to do God's work. She mentioned that Willie is an 

internal par 

t of me and until he is safe and at peace, I will not be at peace. I communicated to her 

that Willie was introverted and could only commune with me when I was centered in Buddha. 

He needed a level of peace and acceptance that was unconditional, yet the fact that he was 

abandoned by his mother and father never allowed him the ease to let anyone in including 

me that has been raising him since he was two-year-old. I was not able to reach him, and I 

will live my life trying to figure out why. She asked me not to blame myself for my 

willingness to do God's work was so apparent and this had more to do with outside forces 

from all around demanding my energy. She mentioned that the anxiety she was feeling was 

not hers but Willie's. She urged me again to clear my life and pray for Willie's safe 

return because he desperately needed me. I shared with her that interesting enough I have 

delayed my graduation by a semester because I was feeling a sense of urgency to open my 

life more an 

d take in the each process including my path towards becoming a teacher. I wonder what 

Carl Sagan would say about this experience. Here we have a grieving mother comforted by an 

Asian women working in a small cleaner doing God's work. Given my respect for people who 

seek wisdom through spiritual work and branching out intellectually to develop a sense of 

intellectual identity, I support both science and religion and believe like the 

2055

seventeenth-century German astronomer Johannes Kepler, which "describe his pursuit of 

science as a wish to know the mind of God." (Alexandra's Journal #12) 

2056






The public schools are funded through taxes, but because England is so much smaller than the U.S., the funding comes 

from the "federal" government. Therefore, all the standards across the country are the same. You can transfer from one 

school to another and basically be guaranteed a very similar education. Obviously, each school has their own 

idiosyncrasies depending on the school administration. I went to four different elementary schools and other than the 

adjustment of making new friends etc., the academic transition was very smooth. I also went to school during the same 

hours 8-4pm. Now, we're talking 24 years ago and things may have changed. My nephew who is 9 goes to a private 

school and that's a whole other ball game! Hope that answers your question. ~ Louise 






Louise, I am curious. Do you know how education is funded in England? Is it similar to how we 

fund it? 

Cynthia 


I don't agree with you Robert! I came from an education where I went to school 8am - 4pm everyday (no 

minimum days). That being said, I had very little homework. If I did have any it was project related i.e. due at the 

end of the month or the end of the trimester. Perhaps the saving grace for the teachers in Britain is that every 4th 

Monday tends to be a Bank Holiday, where all government offices are closed, no school etc. Then there are 

10-12 holidays a year and Christmas and Easter is usually 2-3 weeks with summer being about 6 weeks off. 

During my school day, I had every possible subject you could take all the way from elementary through high 

school. These included, music, drama, P.E., domestic science (how to cook), home banking, English literature, 

foreign language, theology... Now I realize that budget cuts won't allow many of these subjects as part of the 

curriculum, but perhaps teachers here could actually teach without always worrying about clock-watching. 

I do agree with your statement about the school shouldn't be a babysitting service, my point is that a longer day 

would allow for teachers to actually spend quality time on academics. I do realize that economics plays a huge 

part in this as does the school's social structure, but like Ann says, you can make small changes over time! ~ 

Louise 






In order for students to have a Eight hour day, the teacher would have to have a ten to 

2057

twelve hour day. This is not practical because the teacher would burnnnnnnn ooooooout! I 

am going into to teaching to help students learn, but not to deal with students every waking 

hour. It is impractical to think that you could. One way to extend the day would be to bring 

on extra teachers to teach the extra hours, but there are a lot of logistics behind that. Also, 

school is not meant to be a housing system for kids while their parents are out and if it was 

we would start with newborns. If the parents are put out by a short school day, Maybe they 

should not be PARENTS! You don't have kids so that someone else can take care of them 

all the time, and if you do you should not be a parent. On average teachers spend more 

time with kids than do the parents anyways, I don't think that it would be good for the kids 

to spend even less time with parents. But, I guess it depends on your point of view. Also, if 

teachers are going to take on the role of facilitating parents to work more hours, the 

teachers deserve a portion of that increase. Lets see, 3 extra work hours per parent with an 

average pay of $15 an hour per parent. that is $45 a day, $900 a month, then multiply by 

20 students (the upper grades would be more), that is $18,000 a month. I would figure that 

the teachers should get at least 20% of this, which is an extra $3,600 a month. The 

average teacher works about 10 months out of the year, so this would be an extra $36,000. 

Thus the starting salary of a teacher would be about $68,000 to $73,000 a year. Hey, I 

might be willing to put in the extra time for this kind of money! Hey a veteran teacher would 

be making six digits! Think about it. We live in a capitalist society, time is MONEY. 



>To: 


>Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 06:39:12 -0700 

> 













> 






> 

> 

> 


>Money 



2058

unions are. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 











>students. 

> 










> 




> 

> 






> 

> 

> 











>medical). 



2059

I used to work at had the kids do that too, and it worked great. The 















>solution. 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>Alexandra, 

> 

> 

> 


























> 

>Robert. 

> 

> 

2060

> 

> 

> >From: 




> >Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> > 















>takin 






























2061

chalkboard as their record of the entire lesson being taught. This gives 







>the U 






























>time? 















>more th 

2062

_____ 

_____ 










> > 

> > 

> 

> _____ 

> 



> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 


>Yahoo! 


>Enter today 

> 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 



> 15th 

> 




2063





Subject: RE: In the spirit of Buddha... 

What an experience! I think that most things happen for a reason. This was a 

sign of some sort. Thank you for sharing this experience with us all. Your 

writing style is beautiful. And I wish you the best in dealing with all of 

the issues you are expereincing at this time in your life. 


>From: 



>Subject: In the spirit of Buddha... 

>Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 19:17:33 -0400 

> 

>April 16, 2004 

> 

>I call God by centering myself in the spirit of Buddha. Just now, I have 

>awakened from a moment of meditation out on my deck. The day is warm, 

>healing, and the birds are chirping their songs. I have prayed for Willie's 

>safe return. God let me know that it is my work and my prayers that will 

>bring him back. In that moment of meditation, I closed my eyes and just sat 

>in stillness. Quieting my spirit, feeling peace, stillness, and silence was 

>my focus. I could see dancing translucent colors in my mind. I felt the 

>warmth and power of the sun, and the sun was God. All is God my spirit 

>whispered. I saw the images like a drawing created in an arts class of the 

>human anatomy with linear and abstract lines forming the torso of a man and 

>a woman. I saw a fine translucent box filled with feather light pastel 

>flowers. I felt a tingling sensation along my neckline as the soft breeze 

>touched me. I have surrendered all of my worries. I felt so highly 

>sensitive. I do not think that I have ev 

> er surrendered all of my worries and let the wind hold me. The beauty of 

>prayer and stillness is like nothing else. For too long, I have been 

>struggling to solve life alone. I have practiced and practiced and 

>practiced yoga, ballet, journaling, prayer, candle rituals, reading 

>spiritual books, and textbooks seeking wisdom, and the peace and stillness 

>I feel today. 

> 

>I started my morning in silence and vowed not to speak until I felt at 

>peace with the day. My mind, however, dictated the next thought, the next 

>move, and fought to remain active while the rest of me walked in silence. 

>My mind and my body were two separate beings. How could I bring them 

>together? I listened for my inner voice to speak, also separate from my 

>mind and my body. I was inspired to start my day in prayer. I bathed, drank 

>plenty of water, and cleaned my house in prayer. Accomplishing my 

>schoolwork, nurturing body with a nurturing breakfast, rushing through the 

>day was no longer my illusion of a successful day. 

> 

>All of this was inspired by an experience that started yesterday. On my way 

>home from school, I was feeling sad and emotional. So much has happened in 

>the last couple of years, and I have not yet created time to grieve, 

>surrender, and fall apart. The demands of school, raising boys, struggling 

>to save a broken relationship, taking care of my father desperately 

>fighting cancer?has claimed a part of me that I am still seeking to regain. 

>Driving home, I broke down and allowed myself to cry. I looked around the 

>freeway and all were crying with me while in their cars traveling in what 

>seemed to be a funeral precession. All were rushing to the end. I could not 

>help but think about mother's day just around the corner, and still I do 

2064

not know where Willie sleeps at night. I know his habits, his needs, and 

>sensitivity about things. Willie ran away last summer. He took one a family 

>car, money out of savings, and met up with some people he met over the 

>Internet. He was sixteen. He has h 

> ad a birthday since, and I was not with him to celebrate. 

> 

>On my way home, I decided to stop and take a few pairs of pants that needed 

>tailoring to a dry cleaner. They had been sitting in my car for a while, 

>but I have not had the chance to take them to the Asian woman who tailors 

>my clothes in Ocean Beach. I am particular about who tailors my clothes and 

>Asian tailors have a way of understanding the body of a petite woman. I 

>have been going to Anne's Tailoring for at least 10 years. I took a chance 

>in decided to stop at the cleaners in my new neighborhood. Yes, the lost of 

>Willie forced me to sale my old house in Santee with so many memories, the 

>memories were to painful to live through day-after-day. Walking by the room 

>he slept, not seeing him at the computer, missing his presence in the 

>kitchen was too much. It was as if the only thing that remained was his 

>ghost... To my surprise, an Asian woman greeted me, at the cleaners. She 

>was warm and welcomed me with the most sincere smile as if she had been 

>waiting for me. I tried on eac 

> h pants, and she pinned where they needed to be taken in. There was 

>something strangely familiar, and I felt comfortable in lifting my blouse 

>and letting her hands touch me in places forbidden to others. There was an 

>instant bond between us. Sana, the tailor, began asking me about my path in 

>life. She was curious about the kind of training I have been doing to 

>create the body I live in. Her touch felt gentle and honoring, as if 

>handling a fine China doll while she took measurements. She noticed my 

>hands and commented that even my hands were artistic. What is your path? 

>She wanted to know. "I am going to school to become a teacher, I shared, 

>which seemed a little strange to her. She revealed in her view of education 

>that you cannot make a teacher but that a teacher was a self-cultivated 

>person born with a gift based on openness and with the willingness to 

>serve, which is exactly my sentiments about education. In her opinion, our 

>education system was void of spirit, based on p 

> olitics, practicality, and money. She was most interested in knowing 

>about me. 

> 

>I shared with her that I dance (ballet, modern?) and practice yoga when 

>time allows. She was fixated with my hands and the way I moved by body. She 

>acknowledged that I was on a good path but that I must branch out where my 

>energy is not drained in a system that may not be in harmony with my 

>spirit. Her vision of me was bigger than I was willing to accept. She 

>smiled, you question the gift that God has given you because you are still 

>in the process of becoming the master that you are destined to become if 

>you trust and continue pursuing a path of consciousness and growth. Your 

>body is the instrument, and it will serve you well because it was made with 

>a purpose in mind. I can see your apparent willingness to serve God. You 

>lack confidence my genie. You are already a teacher of life. She went on 

>to further describe that with my body I will do God's work, for it is the 

>instrument through which holy spirits can travel to help others for the 

>greater good. She referred to me as he 

> r genie a number of times. In my mind, I could only think of the genies 

>in a bottle I have seen on T.V. (Once home, I looked up the word "genie" in 

>the Webster's dictionary and learned that a genie is "a supernatural spirit 

>that often takes human form usually serving the person who calls on it"). 

>After a while, I understood that she was referring to me as some kind of 

>guru. She says to me that I have something that she has been praying for 

>all of her life. Sana spoke of God and Jesus with the spirit of a Buddha, 

>which was interesting to me because if I were to sum up my sense of 

>spirituality I would describe myself in the same way. She asked if I have 

>ever considered Tai Chi, and I mentioned that it has been suggested by a 

>few other encounters like the one we were having. Tai Chi she communicated 

>was one way to explore the kind of healing work I could do on a spiritual 

>level for a greater good. 

> 

>I noticed Sana's demeanor change, and she talked about feeling anxious. Her 

2065

skin became moist and her eyes filled with tears. She asked me what was 

>weighing so heaving on me. She communicated that it was not her own anxiety 

>coming through. I felt sense of comfort with her like the world around us 

>stopped while I visited the small cleaners. It is as if only she and I 

>existed. I share with her that my middle son, Willie, has runaway from 

>home. She says to me, you know what happened. And answers in the same 

>breath that my life got too busy and when that happens things fall apart. 

>She goes on to tell me that for a long time I have been balancing out my 

>life in a way that most people are incapable of doing. She mentioned that 

>Willie needed me the most and he could see that I was already spread too 

>thin. She urged me to go home and set everything aside and then sit in 

>stillness, and pray to Jesus because I had the power to do God's work. She 

>mentioned that Willie is an internal par 

> t of me and until he is safe and at peace, I will not be at peace. I 

>communicated to her that Willie was introverted and could only commune with 

>me when I was centered in Buddha. He needed a level of peace and acceptance 

>that was unconditional, yet the fact that he was abandoned by his mother 

>and father never allowed him the ease to let anyone in including me that 

>has been raising him since he was two-year-old. I was not able to reach 

>him, and I will live my life trying to figure out why. She asked me not 

>to blame myself for my willingness to do God's work was so apparent and 

>this had more to do with outside forces from all around demanding my 

>energy. She mentioned that the anxiety she was feeling was not hers but 

>Willie's. She urged me again to clear my life and pray for Willie's safe 

>return because he desperately needed me. I shared with her that interesting 

>enough I have delayed my graduation by a semester because I was feeling a 

>sense of urgency to open my life more an 

> d take in the each process including my path towards becoming a teacher. 

>I wonder what Carl Sagan would say about this experience. Here we have a 

>grieving mother comforted by an Asian women working in a small cleaner 

>doing God's work. Given my respect for people who seek wisdom through 

>spiritual work and branching out intellectually to develop a sense of 

>intellectual identity, I support both science and religion and believe like 

>the seventeenth-century German astronomer Johannes Kepler, which "describe 

>his pursuit of science as a wish to know the mind of God." (Alexandra's 

>Journal #12) 

> 

> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 


Premium! 


2066





Subject: RE: In the Spirit of Buddha Rewrite... 

Alexandra, your writing is so poetic and so descriptive, I can almost 

feel myself experiencing what you are experiencing! I know your 

decision to delay school for a semester was a hard decision, but I think 

it's a choice that you needed to make and you seem content now that you 

know that will happen. Trying to juggle all the regular stuff that goes 

on in our lives while going to school full time can be rather trying, 

but when you add in the extra "stuff" that you have been dealing with, 

it can make it that much more difficult. You know that you have a great 

amount of inner strength, but it is now time to allow yourself to bathe 

in the knowledge that you have worked hard, and now it is time to have 

some "Alexandra" time! I wish you good luck with finding Willie and 

peace in your heart. ~ Louise 


From: hada@cox.net [mailto:hada@cox.net] 



Subject: In the Spirit of Buddha Rewrite... 

April 16, 2004 

I call God by centering myself in the spirit of Buddha. Just now, I have 

awakened from a moment of meditation out on my deck. The day is warm, 

healing, and the birds are chirping their songs. I have prayed for 

Willie's safe return. God let me know that it is my work and my prayers 

that will bring him back. In that moment of meditation, I closed my eyes 

and just sat in stillness. Quieting my spirit, feeling peace, stillness, 

and silence was my focus. I could see dancing translucent colors in my 

mind. I felt the warmth and power of the sun, and the sun was God. All 

is God my spirit whispered. I saw the images like a drawing created in 

an arts class of the human anatomy with linear and abstract lines 

forming the torso of a man and a woman. I saw a fine translucent box 

filled with the lightness of feather watercolor flowers. I felt a 

tingling sensation along my neckline as the soft breeze touched me. I 

have surrendered all of my worries. I felt so highly sensitive. I do not 

think 

that I have ever surrendered all of my worries and let the wind hold 

me. The beauty of prayer and stillness is like nothing else. For too 

long, I have been struggling to solve life alone. I have practiced and 

practiced and practiced yoga, ballet, journaling, prayer, candle 

rituals, reading spiritual books, and textbooks seeking wisdom, and the 

peace and stillness I feel today. 

I started my morning in silence and vowed not to speak until I felt at 

peace with the day. My mind, however, dictated the next thought, the 

next move, and fought to remain active while the rest of me walked in 

silence. My mind and my body were two separate beings. How could I bring 

them together? I listened for my inner voice to speak, also separate 

from my mind and my body. I was inspired to start my day in prayer. I 

bathed, drank plenty of water, and cleaned my house in prayer. 

Accomplishing my schoolwork, nurturing body with a nurturing breakfast, 

rushing through the day was no longer my illusion of a successful day. 

All of this was inspired by an experience that started yesterday. On my 

way home from school, I was feeling sad and emotional. So much has 

2067

happened in the last couple of years, and I have not yet created time to 

grieve, surrender, and fall apart. The demands of school, raising boys, 

struggling to save a broken relationship, taking care of my father 

desperately fighting cancer?has claimed a part of me that I am still 

seeking to regain. Driving home, I broke down and allowed myself to cry. 

I looked around the freeway and all were crying with me while in their 

cars traveling in what seemed to be a funeral precession. All were 

rushing to the end. I could not help but think about mother's day just 

around the corner, and still I do not know where Willie sleeps at night. 

I know his habits, his needs, and sensitivity about things. Willie ran 

away last summer. He took a family car, money out of savings, and met up 

with some people he met over the Internet. He was sixteen. He has had a 

birthday since, and I was not with him to celebrate. 

On my way home, I decided to stop and take a few pairs of pants that 

needed tailoring to a dry cleaner. They had been sitting in my car for a 

while, but I have not had the chance to take them to the Asian woman who 

tailors my clothes in Ocean Beach. I am particular about who tailors my 

clothes and Asian tailors have a way of knowing the body of a petite 

woman. I have been going to Anne's Tailoring for at least 10 years. I 

took a chance in decided to stop at the cleaners in my new neighborhood. 

Yes, the lost of Willie forced me to sale my old house in Santee with so 

many memories, the memories were too painful to live through 

day-after-day. Walking by the room he slept in, not seeing him at the 

computer, missing his presence in the kitchen was too much. It was as if 

the only thing that remained was his ghost... To my surprise, an Asian 

woman greeted me, at the cleaners. She was warm and welcomed me with the 

most sincere smile as if she had been waiting for me. I tried on each 

pants, and she pinned where they needed to be taken in. There was 

something strangely familiar, and I felt comfortable in lifting my 

blouse and letting her hands touch me in places forbidden to others. 

There was an instant bond between us. Sana, the tailor, began asking me 

about my path in life. She was curious about the kind of training I have 

been doing to create the body I live in. Her touch felt gentle and 

honoring, as if handling a fine China doll while she took measurements. 

She noticed my hands and commented that even my hands were artistic. 

What is your path? She wanted to know. "I am going to school to become a 

teacher, I shared, which seemed a little strange to her. She revealed in 

her view of education that you cannot make a teacher but that a teacher 

was a self-cultivated person born with a gift based on openness and with 

the willingness to serve, which is exactly my sentiments about 

education. In her opinion, our education system was void of spirit, 

based on pol itics, practicality, and money. She was most interested 

in knowing about me. 

I shared with her that I dance (ballet, modern?) and practice yoga when 

time allows. She was fixated with my hands and the way I moved by body. 

She acknowledged that I was on a good path but that I must branch out 

where my energy is not drained in a system that may not be in harmony 

with my spirit. Her vision of me was bigger than I was willing to 

accept. She smiled, you question the gifts that God has given you 

because you are still in the process of becoming the master that you are 

destined to become if you trust and continue pursuing a path of 

consciousness and growth. Your body is the instrument, and it will serve 

you well because it was made with a purpose in mind. I can see your 

apparent willingness to serve God. You lack confidence my genie. You are 

already a teacher of life. She went on to further describe that with my 

body I will do God's work, for it is the instrument through which holy 

spirits can travel to help others for the greater good. She referred to 

me as h er genie a number of times. In my mind, I could only think of 

the genies in a bottle I have seen on T.V. (Once home, I looked up the 

word "genie" in the Webster's dictionary and learned that a genie is "a 

supernatural spirit that often takes human form usually serving the 

person who calls on it"). After a while, I understood that she was 

referring to me as some kind of guru. She says to me that I have 

something that she has been praying for all of her life. Sana spoke of 

2068

God and Jesus with the spirit of a Buddha, which was interesting to me 

because if I were to sum up my sense of spirituality I would describe 

myself in the same way. She asked if I have ever considered Tai Chi, and 

I mentioned that it has been suggested by a few other encounters like 

the one we were having. Tai Chi she communicated was one way to explore 

spiritual work with my body for the greater good. 

I noticed Sana's demeanor change, and she talked about feeling anxious. 

Her skin became moist and her eyes filled with tears. She asked me what 

was weighing so heaving on me. She communicated that it was not her own 

anxiety coming through. I felt sense of comfort with her like the world 

around us stopped while I visited the small cleaners. It is as if only 

she and I existed. I share with her that my middle son, Willie, has 

runaway from home. She says to me, you know what happened. And answers 

in the same breath that my life got too busy and when that happens 

things fall apart. She goes on to tell me that for a long time I have 

been balancing out my life in a way that most people are incapable of 

doing. She mentioned that Willie needed me the most and he could see 

that I was already spread too thin. She urged me to go home and set 

everything aside and then sit in stillness, and pray to Jesus because I 

had the power to do God's work. She mentioned that Willie is an internal 

par t of me and until he is safe and at peace, I will not be at peace. 

I communicated to her that Willie was introverted and could only commune 

with me when I was centered in Buddha. He needed a level of peace and 

acceptance that was unconditional, yet the fact that he was abandoned by 

his mother and father never allowed him the ease of letting anyone in 

including me that has been raising him since he was two-years-old. I was 

not able to reach him, and I will live my life trying to figure out why. 

She asked me not to blame myself for my willingness to serve God was 

apparent and this had more to do with outside forces from all around 

demanding my energy. She mentioned that the anxiety she was feeling was 

not hers but Willie's. She urged me again to clear my life and pray for 

Willie's safe return because he desperately needed me. I shared with her 

that interesting enough I have delayed my graduation by a semester 

because I was feeling a sense of urgency to open my life more and ta 

ke in the process of life especially my path towards becoming a 

teacher. I wonder what Carl Sagan would say about this experience. Here 

we have a grieving mother comforted by an Asian women working in a small 

cleaners doing God's work. Given my respect for people who seek wisdom 

through spiritual work and branching out intellectually to develop a 

sense of intellectual identity, I support both science and religion and 

believe like the seventeenth-century German astronomer Johannes Kepler, 

which "describe his pursuit of science as a wish to know the mind of 

God." (Alexandra's Journal #12) 

2069





Subject: Re: RE: In the Spirit of Buddha Rewrite... 

> Louise, 

Thank you for your support and understanding. It is not easy to put myself out there and 

expose things that are personal to me. I have to be willing to allow a certian amount of 

vulnerability that is unsually reserved for someone you share intimacy with. But I figure 

how will I give others the opportunity to see life through lens other than their own if I 

do not risk anything. I am just one example of the kinds of things parents are dealing 

with in raising our kids in such times of uncertainty. Our country is at war, fathers and 

mothers are abandoning or abusing their children, and the things are children are exposed 

to become more extreme everyday. There are more children like my son in our school system 

struggling with issues of abandonment and heavy life stuff. I just hope that his teachers 

took the time to care and that they did not contribute to isolating him further. This is 

why it is important to get to know our students. It takes a team effort to understand the 

comple 

xity of a teenagers mind. 

Alexandra 


> Date: 2004/04/17 Sat AM 03:07:44 EDT 

> To: 

> Subject: RE: In the Spirit of Buddha Rewrite... 

> 

> Alexandra, your writing is so poetic and so descriptive, I can almost 

> feel myself experiencing what you are experiencing! I know your 

> decision to delay school for a semester was a hard decision, but I think 

> it's a choice that you needed to make and you seem content now that you 

> know that will happen. Trying to juggle all the regular stuff that goes 

> on in our lives while going to school full time can be rather trying, 

> but when you add in the extra "stuff" that you have been dealing with, 

> it can make it that much more difficult. You know that you have a great 

> amount of inner strength, but it is now time to allow yourself to bathe 

> in the knowledge that you have worked hard, and now it is time to have 

> some "Alexandra" time! I wish you good luck with finding Willie and 

> peace in your heart. ~ Louise 

> 


> From: hada@cox.net [mailto:hada@cox.net] 



> Subject: In the Spirit of Buddha Rewrite... 

> 

> 

> April 16, 2004 

> 

> I call God by centering myself in the spirit of Buddha. Just now, I have 

> awakened from a moment of meditation out on my deck. The day is warm, 

> healing, and the birds are chirping their songs. I have prayed for 

> Willie's safe return. God let me know that it is my work and my prayers 

> that will bring him back. In that moment of meditation, I closed my eyes 

> and just sat in stillness. Quieting my spirit, feeling peace, stillness, 

2070

and silence was my focus. I could see dancing translucent colors in my 

> mind. I felt the warmth and power of the sun, and the sun was God. All 

> is God my spirit whispered. I saw the images like a drawing created in 

> an arts class of the human anatomy with linear and abstract lines 

> forming the torso of a man and a woman. I saw a fine translucent box 

> filled with the lightness of feather watercolor flowers. I felt a 

> tingling sensation along my neckline as the soft breeze touched me. I 

> have surrendered all of my worries. I felt so highly sensitive. I do not 

> think 

> that I have ever surrendered all of my worries and let the wind hold 

> me. The beauty of prayer and stillness is like nothing else. For too 

> long, I have been struggling to solve life alone. I have practiced and 

> practiced and practiced yoga, ballet, journaling, prayer, candle 

> rituals, reading spiritual books, and textbooks seeking wisdom, and the 

> peace and stillness I feel today. 

> 

> I started my morning in silence and vowed not to speak until I felt at 

> peace with the day. My mind, however, dictated the next thought, the 

> next move, and fought to remain active while the rest of me walked in 

> silence. My mind and my body were two separate beings. How could I bring 

> them together? I listened for my inner voice to speak, also separate 

> from my mind and my body. I was inspired to start my day in prayer. I 

> bathed, drank plenty of water, and cleaned my house in prayer. 

> Accomplishing my schoolwork, nurturing body with a nurturing breakfast, 

> rushing through the day was no longer my illusion of a successful day. 

> 

> All of this was inspired by an experience that started yesterday. On my 

> way home from school, I was feeling sad and emotional. So much has 

> happened in the last couple of years, and I have not yet created time to 

> grieve, surrender, and fall apart. The demands of school, raising boys, 

> struggling to save a broken relationship, taking care of my father 

> desperately fighting cancer?has claimed a part of me that I am still 

> seeking to regain. Driving home, I broke down and allowed myself to cry. 

> I looked around the freeway and all were crying with me while in their 

> cars traveling in what seemed to be a funeral precession. All were 

> rushing to the end. I could not help but think about mother's day just 

> around the corner, and still I do not know where Willie sleeps at night. 

> I know his habits, his needs, and sensitivity about things. Willie ran 

> away last summer. He took a family car, money out of savings, and met up 

> with some people he met over the Internet. He was sixteen. He has had a 

> birthday since, and I was not with him to celebrate. 

> 

> On my way home, I decided to stop and take a few pairs of pants that 

> needed tailoring to a dry cleaner. They had been sitting in my car for a 

> while, but I have not had the chance to take them to the Asian woman who 

> tailors my clothes in Ocean Beach. I am particular about who tailors my 

> clothes and Asian tailors have a way of knowing the body of a petite 

> woman. I have been going to Anne's Tailoring for at least 10 years. I 

> took a chance in decided to stop at the cleaners in my new neighborhood. 

> Yes, the lost of Willie forced me to sale my old house in Santee with so 

> many memories, the memories were too painful to live through 

> day-after-day. Walking by the room he slept in, not seeing him at the 

> computer, missing his presence in the kitchen was too much. It was as if 

> the only thing that remained was his ghost... To my surprise, an Asian 

> woman greeted me, at the cleaners. She was warm and welcomed me with the 

> most sincere smile as if she had been waiting for me. I tried on each 

> pants, and she pinned where they needed to be taken in. There was 

> something strangely familiar, and I felt comfortable in lifting my 

> blouse and letting her hands touch me in places forbidden to others. 

> There was an instant bond between us. Sana, the tailor, began asking me 

> about my path in life. She was curious about the kind of training I have 

> been doing to create the body I live in. Her touch felt gentle and 

> honoring, as if handling a fine China doll while she took measurements. 

> She noticed my hands and commented that even my hands were artistic. 

> What is your path? She wanted to know. "I am going to school to become a 

> teacher, I shared, which seemed a little strange to her. She revealed in 

2071

her view of education that you cannot make a teacher but that a teacher 

> was a self-cultivated person born with a gift based on openness and with 

> the willingness to serve, which is exactly my sentiments about 

> education. In her opinion, our education system was void of spirit, 

> based on pol itics, practicality, and money. She was most interested 

> in knowing about me. 

> 

> I shared with her that I dance (ballet, modern?) and practice yoga when 

> time allows. She was fixated with my hands and the way I moved by body. 

> She acknowledged that I was on a good path but that I must branch out 

> where my energy is not drained in a system that may not be in harmony 

> with my spirit. Her vision of me was bigger than I was willing to 

> accept. She smiled, you question the gifts that God has given you 

> because you are still in the process of becoming the master that you are 

> destined to become if you trust and continue pursuing a path of 

> consciousness and growth. Your body is the instrument, and it will serve 

> you well because it was made with a purpose in mind. I can see your 

> apparent willingness to serve God. You lack confidence my genie. You are 

> already a teacher of life. She went on to further describe that with my 

> body I will do God's work, for it is the instrument through which holy 

> spirits can travel to help others for the greater good. She referred to 

> me as h er genie a number of times. In my mind, I could only think of 

> the genies in a bottle I have seen on T.V. (Once home, I looked up the 

> word "genie" in the Webster's dictionary and learned that a genie is "a 

> supernatural spirit that often takes human form usually serving the 

> person who calls on it"). After a while, I understood that she was 

> referring to me as some kind of guru. She says to me that I have 

> something that she has been praying for all of her life. Sana spoke of 

> God and Jesus with the spirit of a Buddha, which was interesting to me 

> because if I were to sum up my sense of spirituality I would describe 

> myself in the same way. She asked if I have ever considered Tai Chi, and 

> I mentioned that it has been suggested by a few other encounters like 

> the one we were having. Tai Chi she communicated was one way to explore 

> spiritual work with my body for the greater good. 

> 

> I noticed Sana's demeanor change, and she talked about feeling anxious. 

> Her skin became moist and her eyes filled with tears. She asked me what 

> was weighing so heaving on me. She communicated that it was not her own 

> anxiety coming through. I felt sense of comfort with her like the world 

> around us stopped while I visited the small cleaners. It is as if only 

> she and I existed. I share with her that my middle son, Willie, has 

> runaway from home. She says to me, you know what happened. And answers 

> in the same breath that my life got too busy and when that happens 

> things fall apart. She goes on to tell me that for a long time I have 

> been balancing out my life in a way that most people are incapable of 

> doing. She mentioned that Willie needed me the most and he could see 

> that I was already spread too thin. She urged me to go home and set 

> everything aside and then sit in stillness, and pray to Jesus because I 

> had the power to do God's work. She mentioned that Willie is an internal 

> par t of me and until he is safe and at peace, I will not be at peace. 

> I communicated to her that Willie was introverted and could only commune 

> with me when I was centered in Buddha. He needed a level of peace and 

> acceptance that was unconditional, yet the fact that he was abandoned by 

> his mother and father never allowed him the ease of letting anyone in 

> including me that has been raising him since he was two-years-old. I was 

> not able to reach him, and I will live my life trying to figure out why. 

> She asked me not to blame myself for my willingness to serve God was 

> apparent and this had more to do with outside forces from all around 

> demanding my energy. She mentioned that the anxiety she was feeling was 

> not hers but Willie's. She urged me again to clear my life and pray for 

> Willie's safe return because he desperately needed me. I shared with her 

> that interesting enough I have delayed my graduation by a semester 

> because I was feeling a sense of urgency to open my life more and ta 

> ke in the process of life especially my path towards becoming a 

> teacher. I wonder what Carl Sagan would say about this experience. Here 

> we have a grieving mother comforted by an Asian women working in a small 

2072

cleaners doing God's work. Given my respect for people who seek wisdom 

> through spiritual work and branching out intellectually to develop a 

> sense of intellectual identity, I support both science and religion and 

> believe like the seventeenth-century German astronomer Johannes Kepler, 

> which "describe his pursuit of science as a wish to know the mind of 

> God." (Alexandra's Journal #12) 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

2073





Subject: Re: RE: In the spirit of Buddha... 

> Jennifer, 

I too believe that nothing is by chance. I felt broken that day and Sana a woman I had 

never met brought a deep level of healing and renewal... 

Alexandra 


> Date: 2004/04/16 Fri PM 11:03:26 EDT 


> Subject: RE: In the spirit of Buddha... 

> 

> What an experience! I think that most things happen for a reason. This was a 

> sign of some sort. Thank you for sharing this experience with us all. Your 

> writing style is beautiful. And I wish you the best in dealing with all of 

> the issues you are expereincing at this time in your life. 

> 


> 

> >From: 



> >Subject: In the spirit of Buddha... 

> >Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 19:17:33 -0400 

> > 

> >April 16, 2004 

> > 

> >I call God by centering myself in the spirit of Buddha. Just now, I have 

> >awakened from a moment of meditation out on my deck. The day is warm, 

> >healing, and the birds are chirping their songs. I have prayed for Willie's 

> >safe return. God let me know that it is my work and my prayers that will 

> >bring him back. In that moment of meditation, I closed my eyes and just sat 

> >in stillness. Quieting my spirit, feeling peace, stillness, and silence was 

> >my focus. I could see dancing translucent colors in my mind. I felt the 

> >warmth and power of the sun, and the sun was God. All is God my spirit 

> >whispered. I saw the images like a drawing created in an arts class of the 

> >human anatomy with linear and abstract lines forming the torso of a man and 

> >a woman. I saw a fine translucent box filled with feather light pastel 

> >flowers. I felt a tingling sensation along my neckline as the soft breeze 

> >touched me. I have surrendered all of my worries. I felt so highly 

> >sensitive. I do not think that I have ev 

> > er surrendered all of my worries and let the wind hold me. The beauty of 

> >prayer and stillness is like nothing else. For too long, I have been 

> >struggling to solve life alone. I have practiced and practiced and 

> >practiced yoga, ballet, journaling, prayer, candle rituals, reading 

> >spiritual books, and textbooks seeking wisdom, and the peace and stillness 

> >I feel today. 

> > 

> >I started my morning in silence and vowed not to speak until I felt at 

> >peace with the day. My mind, however, dictated the next thought, the next 

> >move, and fought to remain active while the rest of me walked in silence. 

> >My mind and my body were two separate beings. How could I bring them 

> >together? I listened for my inner voice to speak, also separate from my 

> >mind and my body. I was inspired to start my day in prayer. I bathed, drank 

> >plenty of water, and cleaned my house in prayer. Accomplishing my 

> >schoolwork, nurturing body with a nurturing breakfast, rushing through the 

2074

day was no longer my illusion of a successful day. 

> > 

> >All of this was inspired by an experience that started yesterday. On my way 

> >home from school, I was feeling sad and emotional. So much has happened in 

> >the last couple of years, and I have not yet created time to grieve, 

> >surrender, and fall apart. The demands of school, raising boys, struggling 

> >to save a broken relationship, taking care of my father desperately 

> >fighting cancer?has claimed a part of me that I am still seeking to regain. 

> >Driving home, I broke down and allowed myself to cry. I looked around the 

> >freeway and all were crying with me while in their cars traveling in what 

> >seemed to be a funeral precession. All were rushing to the end. I could not 

> >help but think about mother's day just around the corner, and still I do 

> >not know where Willie sleeps at night. I know his habits, his needs, and 

> >sensitivity about things. Willie ran away last summer. He took one a family 

> >car, money out of savings, and met up with some people he met over the 

> >Internet. He was sixteen. He has h 

> > ad a birthday since, and I was not with him to celebrate. 

> > 

> >On my way home, I decided to stop and take a few pairs of pants that needed 

> >tailoring to a dry cleaner. They had been sitting in my car for a while, 

> >but I have not had the chance to take them to the Asian woman who tailors 

> >my clothes in Ocean Beach. I am particular about who tailors my clothes and 

> >Asian tailors have a way of understanding the body of a petite woman. I 

> >have been going to Anne's Tailoring for at least 10 years. I took a chance 

> >in decided to stop at the cleaners in my new neighborhood. Yes, the lost of 

> >Willie forced me to sale my old house in Santee with so many memories, the 

> >memories were to painful to live through day-after-day. Walking by the room 

> >he slept, not seeing him at the computer, missing his presence in the 

> >kitchen was too much. It was as if the only thing that remained was his 

> >ghost... To my surprise, an Asian woman greeted me, at the cleaners. She 

> >was warm and welcomed me with the most sincere smile as if she had been 

> >waiting for me. I tried on eac 

> > h pants, and she pinned where they needed to be taken in. There was 

> >something strangely familiar, and I felt comfortable in lifting my blouse 

> >and letting her hands touch me in places forbidden to others. There was an 

> >instant bond between us. Sana, the tailor, began asking me about my path in 

> >life. She was curious about the kind of training I have been doing to 

> >create the body I live in. Her touch felt gentle and honoring, as if 

> >handling a fine China doll while she took measurements. She noticed my 

> >hands and commented that even my hands were artistic. What is your path? 

> >She wanted to know. "I am going to school to become a teacher, I shared, 

> >which seemed a little strange to her. She revealed in her view of education 

> >that you cannot make a teacher but that a teacher was a self-cultivated 

> >person born with a gift based on openness and with the willingness to 

> >serve, which is exactly my sentiments about education. In her opinion, our 

> >education system was void of spirit, based on p 

> > olitics, practicality, and money. She was most interested in knowing 

> >about me. 

> > 

> >I shared with her that I dance (ballet, modern?) and practice yoga when 

> >time allows. She was fixated with my hands and the way I moved by body. She 

> >acknowledged that I was on a good path but that I must branch out where my 

> >energy is not drained in a system that may not be in harmony with my 

> >spirit. Her vision of me was bigger than I was willing to accept. She 

> >smiled, you question the gift that God has given you because you are still 

> >in the process of becoming the master that you are destined to become if 

> >you trust and continue pursuing a path of consciousness and growth. Your 

> >body is the instrument, and it will serve you well because it was made with 

> >a purpose in mind. I can see your apparent willingness to serve God. You 

> >lack confidence my genie. You are already a teacher of life. She went on 

> >to further describe that with my body I will do God's work, for it is the 

> >instrument through which holy spirits can travel to help others for the 

> >greater good. She referred to me as he 

> > r genie a number of times. In my mind, I could only think of the genies 

> >in a bottle I have seen on T.V. (Once home, I looked up the word "genie" in 

> >the Webster's dictionary and learned that a genie is "a supernatural spirit 

2075

that often takes human form usually serving the person who calls on it"). 

> >After a while, I understood that she was referring to me as some kind of 

> >guru. She says to me that I have something that she has been praying for 

> >all of her life. Sana spoke of God and Jesus with the spirit of a Buddha, 

> >which was interesting to me because if I were to sum up my sense of 

> >spirituality I would describe myself in the same way. She asked if I have 

> >ever considered Tai Chi, and I mentioned that it has been suggested by a 

> >few other encounters like the one we were having. Tai Chi she communicated 

> >was one way to explore the kind of healing work I could do on a spiritual 

> >level for a greater good. 

> > 

> >I noticed Sana's demeanor change, and she talked about feeling anxious. Her 

> >skin became moist and her eyes filled with tears. She asked me what was 

> >weighing so heaving on me. She communicated that it was not her own anxiety 

> >coming through. I felt sense of comfort with her like the world around us 

> >stopped while I visited the small cleaners. It is as if only she and I 

> >existed. I share with her that my middle son, Willie, has runaway from 

> >home. She says to me, you know what happened. And answers in the same 

> >breath that my life got too busy and when that happens things fall apart. 

> >She goes on to tell me that for a long time I have been balancing out my 

> >life in a way that most people are incapable of doing. She mentioned that 

> >Willie needed me the most and he could see that I was already spread too 

> >thin. She urged me to go home and set everything aside and then sit in 

> >stillness, and pray to Jesus because I had the power to do God's work. She 

> >mentioned that Willie is an internal par 

> > t of me and until he is safe and at peace, I will not be at peace. I 

> >communicated to her that Willie was introverted and could only commune with 

> >me when I was centered in Buddha. He needed a level of peace and acceptance 

> >that was unconditional, yet the fact that he was abandoned by his mother 

> >and father never allowed him the ease to let anyone in including me that 

> >has been raising him since he was two-year-old. I was not able to reach 

> >him, and I will live my life trying to figure out why. She asked me not 

> >to blame myself for my willingness to do God's work was so apparent and 

> >this had more to do with outside forces from all around demanding my 

> >energy. She mentioned that the anxiety she was feeling was not hers but 

> >Willie's. She urged me again to clear my life and pray for Willie's safe 

> >return because he desperately needed me. I shared with her that interesting 

> >enough I have delayed my graduation by a semester because I was feeling a 

> >sense of urgency to open my life more an 

> > d take in the each process including my path towards becoming a teacher. 

> >I wonder what Carl Sagan would say about this experience. Here we have a 

> >grieving mother comforted by an Asian women working in a small cleaner 

> >doing God's work. Given my respect for people who seek wisdom through 

> >spiritual work and branching out intellectually to develop a sense of 

> >intellectual identity, I support both science and religion and believe like 

> >the seventeenth-century German astronomer Johannes Kepler, which "describe 

> >his pursuit of science as a wish to know the mind of God." (Alexandra's 

> >Journal #12) 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> 

> _________________________________________________________________ 

> Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with MSN 

> Premium! 

> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/mlb&pgmarket=en-us/go/onm00200439ave/direct/01/ 

> 

> 

2076





Subject: Longer school days 

Kids need to be in school longer? Do you people not remember being in 

school? Hell, we are in school NOW. Don't you remember how LONG the day was, 

and still is? Expecting an American kid to get through an 8 hour school day 

everyday is crazy. Now you high and mighty types will probably say "If your 

teaching methods are engaging, then the students won't even want to leave 

your class!" While I appreciate your piss and/or vinegar, no matter what 

activity you are doing as a child in school, you can never wait for school 

to get out. If you don't think this is true, then I theorize that you are 

utterly out of touch with children and should seriously work on that before 

you graduate. How would you feel if all of our college classes were extended 

by an hour? Just think of all the education we could be getting! Ahhh, if 

only I was in school from 10-7 everyday, I would be a goldmine of knowledge, 

though completely drained of exuberance and humanity, but those things 

aren't in the standards, so I guess they don't matter anyway. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2077





Subject: Re: Longer school days 

You are probably right, Mike. I bet most kids can't wait to get home to plop down in front of the TV, 

computer or video games. 

Cynthia 













only I was in school fr om 10-7 everyday, I would be a goldmine of knowledge, 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 


Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25¢ 

2078





Subject: RE: Longer school days 

I agree with you Cynthia! ~ Louise 





Subject: Re: Longer school days 

You are probably right, Mike. I bet most kids can't wait to get home to plop down in front of the TV, 

computer or video games. 

Cynthia 


_____ 












only I was in school fr om 10-7 everyday, I would be a goldmine of knowledge, 



_________________________________________________________________ 





2079






So why would it be "crazy to expect an American kid to make it through 

an 8 hour school day" when kids from other nations seem to be able to 

manage it? I think you underestimate our young people! Perhaps all of 

our young Americans may actually graduate from high school and be 

literate people who contribute to society if they receive a "full-time" 

education. Just another perspective! ~ Louise 





Subject: Longer school days 


school? Hell, we are in school NOW. Don't you remember how LONG the day 

was, 

and still is? Expecting an American kid to get through an 8 hour school 

day 

everyday is crazy. Now you high and mighty types will probably say "If 

your 

teaching methods are engaging, then the students won't even want to 

leave 


activity you are doing as a child in school, you can never wait for 

school 

to get out. If you don't think this is true, then I theorize that you 

are 

utterly out of touch with children and should seriously work on that 

before 

you graduate. How would you feel if all of our college classes were 

extended 

by an hour? Just think of all the education we could be getting! Ahhh, 

if 

only I was in school from 10-7 everyday, I would be a goldmine of 

knowledge, 



_________________________________________________________________ 

Check out MSN PC Safety & Security to help ensure your PC is protected 

and 


2080





Subject: Long school days 

If schools are extended, does this guarantee no homework? Because if you 

think about it, adding a couple hours of homework in addition to the current 

school day length and there it equals the extended school day. Could 

extended school days really work? So that when the school day ended, kids 

wouldn't have to think about school until the next morning when they arrived 

at their classroom. When the bell rings at the end of the day they are 

really free? Well, only from thinking about school of course. Hmmm... 


_________________________________________________________________ 

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2081





Subject: Re: In the spirit of Buddha... 


Alexandra I wish I had the same power of being able to express myself, in a calm and relaxing 

manner I should say, in writing. I am too going through the emotions that you are going through 

except that in my case it is not a runaway child, but an ill old man, my father. With my brother being 

away in Afghanistan I feel that I am the one having to take care of everything and at times it gets to 

me. Even if my brother was to be here I don't think that he will take care of my father like I am taking 

care of him know. I have never had the thought of dropping the cohort but I have to tell you that the 

thought did cross my mind this semester. I figure that dropping the program will give me time to 

concentrate on my fathers health and maybe also to get away from having to deal with certain people 

and their big egos every Monday and Wednesday. 

Good luck with your future endeavors, 


B) 

Karla 





Subject: In the spirit of Buddha... 

April 16, 2004 

I call God by centering myself in the spirit of Buddha. Just now, I have awakened from a moment 

of meditation out on my deck. The day is warm, healing, and the birds are chirping their songs. I 

have prayed for Willie's safe return. God let me know that it is my work and my prayers that will 

bring him back. In that moment of meditation, I closed my eyes and just sat in stillness. Quieting 

my spirit, feeling peace, stillness, and silence was my focus. I could see dancing translucent 

colors in my mind. I felt the warmth and power of the sun, and the sun was God. All is God my 

spirit whispered. I saw the images like a drawing created in an arts class of the human anatomy 

with linear and abstract lines forming the torso of a man and a woman. I saw a fine translucent 

box filled with feather light pastel flowers. I felt a tingling sensation along my neckline as the soft 

breeze touched me. I have surrendered all of my worries. I felt so highly sensitive. I do not think 

that I have ev 

er surrendered all of my worries and let the wind hold me. The beauty of prayer and stillness is 

like nothing else. For too long, I have been struggling to solve life alone. I have practiced and 

practiced and practiced yoga, ballet, journaling, prayer, candle rituals, reading spiritual books, and 

textbooks seeking wisdom, and the peace and stillness I feel today. 

I started my morning in silence and vowed not to speak until I felt at peace with the day. My mind, 

however, dictated the next thought, the next move, and fought to remain active while the rest of 

me walked in silence. My mind and my body were two separate beings. How could I bring them 

together? I listened for my inner voice to speak, also separate from my mind and my body. I was 

2082

inspired to start my day in prayer. I bathed, drank plenty of water, and cleaned my house in 

prayer. Accomplishing my schoolwork, nurturing body with a nurturing breakfast, rushing through 

the day was no longer my illusion of a successful day. 

All of this was inspired by an experience that started yesterday. On my way home from school, I 

was feeling sad and emotional. So much has happened in the last couple of years, and I have not 

yet created time to grieve, surrender, and fall apart. The demands of school, raising boys, 

struggling to save a broken relationship, taking care of my father desperately fighting cancer?has 

claimed a part of me that I am still seeking to regain. Driving home, I broke down and allowed 

myself to cry. I looked around the freeway and all were crying with me while in their cars traveling 

in what seemed to be a funeral precession. All were rushing to the end. I could not help but think 

about mother's day just around the corner, and still I do not know where Willie sleeps at night. I 

know his habits, his needs, and sensitivity about things. Willie ran away last summer. He took one 

a family car, money out of savings, and met up with some people he met over the Internet. He 

was sixteen. He has h 

ad a birthday since, and I was not with him to celebrate. 

On my way home, I decided to stop and take a few pairs of pants that needed tailoring to a dry 

cleaner. They had been sitting in my car for a while, but I have not had the chance to take them to 

the Asian woman who tailors my clothes in Ocean Beach. I am particular about who tailors my 

clothes and Asian tailors have a way of understanding the body of a petite woman. I have been 

going to Anne's Tailoring for at least 10 years. I took a chance in decided to stop at the cleaners in 

my new neighborhood. Yes, the lost of Willie forced me to sale my old house in Santee with so 

many memories, the memories were to painful to live through day-after-day. Walking by the room 

he slept, not seeing him at the computer, missing his presence in the kitchen was too much. It was 

as if the only thing that remained was his ghost... To my surprise, an Asian woman greeted me, at 

the cleaners. She was warm and welcomed me with the most sincere smile as if she had been 

waiting for me. I tried on eac 

h pants, and she pinned where they needed to be taken in. There was something strangely 

familiar, and I felt comfortable in lifting my blouse and letting her hands touch me in places 

forbidden to others. There was an instant bond between us. Sana, the tailor, began asking me 

about my path in life. She was curious about the kind of training I have been doing to create the 

body I live in. Her touch felt gentle and honoring, as if handling a fine China doll while she took 

measurements. She noticed my hands and commented that even my hands were artistic. What is 

your path? She wanted to know. "I am going to school to become a teacher, I shared, which 

seemed a little strange to her. She revealed in her view of education that you cannot make a 

teacher but that a teacher was a self-cultivated person born with a gift based on openness and 

with the willingness to serve, which is exactly my sentiments about education. In her opinion, our 

education system was void of spirit, based on p 

olitics, practicality, and money. She was most interested in knowing about me. 

I shared with her that I dance (ballet, modern?) and practice yoga when time allows. She was 

fixated with my hands and the way I moved by body. She acknowledged that I was on a good path 

but that I must branch out where my energy is not drained in a system that may not be in harmony 

with my spirit. Her vision of me was bigger than I was willing to accept. She smiled, you question 

the gift that God has given you because you are still in the process of becoming the master that 

you are destined to become if you trust and continue pursuing a path of consciousness and 

growth. Your body is the instrument, and it will serve you well because it was made with a purpose 

in mind. I can see your apparent willingness to serve God. You lack confidence my genie. You are 

already a teacher of life. She went on to further describe that with my body I will do God's work, 

for it is the instrument through which holy spirits can travel to help others for the greater good. She 

referred to me as he 

r genie a number of times. In my mind, I could only think of the genies in a bottle I have seen on 

2083

T.V. (Once home, I looked up the word "genie" in the Webster's dictionary and learned that a 

genie is "a supernatural spirit that often takes human form usually serving the person who calls on 

it"). After a while, I understood that she was referring to me as some kind of guru. She says to me 

that I have something that she has been praying for all of her life. Sana spoke of God and Jesus 

with the spirit of a Buddha, which was interesting to me because if I were to sum up my sense of 

spirituality I would describe myself in the same way. She asked if I have ever considered Tai Chi, 

and I mentioned that it has been suggested by a few other encounters like the one we were 

having. Tai Chi she communicated was one way to explore the kind of healing work I could do on 

a spiritual level for a greater good. 

I noticed Sana's demeanor change, and she talked about feeling anxious. Her skin became moist 

and her eyes filled with tears. She asked me what was weighing so heaving on me. She 

communicated that it was not her own anxiety coming through. I felt sense of comfort with her like 

the world around us stopped while I visited the small cleaners. It is as if only she and I existed. I 

share with her that my middle son, Willie, has runaway from home. She says to me, you know 

what happened. And answers in the same breath that my life got too busy and when that happens 

things fall apart. She goes on to tell me that for a long time I have been balancing out my life in a 

way that most people are incapable of doing. She mentioned that Willie needed me the most and 

he could see that I was already spread too thin. She urged me to go home and set everything 

aside and then sit in stillness, and pray to Jesus because I had the power to do God's work. She 

mentioned that Willie is an internal par 

t of me and until he is safe and at peace, I will not be at peace. I communicated to her that Willie 

was introverted and could only commune with me when I was centered in Buddha. He needed a 

level of peace and acceptance that was unconditional, yet the fact that he was abandoned by his 

mother and father never allowed him the ease to let anyone in including me that has been raising 

him since he was two-year-old. I was not able to reach him, and I will live my life trying to figure 

out why. She asked me not to blame myself for my willingness to do God's work was so apparent 

and this had more to do with outside forces from all around demanding my energy. She mentioned 

that the anxiety she was feeling was not hers but Willie's. She urged me again to clear my life and 

pray for Willie's safe return because he desperately needed me. I shared with her that interesting 

enough I have delayed my graduation by a semester because I was feeling a sense of urgency to 

open my life more an 

d take in the each process including my path towards becoming a teacher. I wonder what Carl 

Sagan would say about this experience. Here we have a grieving mother comforted by an Asian 

women working in a small cleaner doing God's work. Given my respect for people who seek 

wisdom through spiritual work and branching out intellectually to develop a sense of intellectual 

identity, I support both science and religion and believe like the seventeenth-century German 

astronomer Johannes Kepler, which "describe his pursuit of science as a wish to know the mind of 

God." (Alexandra's Journal #12) 

2084





Subject: Re: A & P Solving ...EverybodyandKarla 

never did I say that having a child was not hard, but we are made to believe that the parent is the one 

responsible for taking care of the child in our society. This being the case, it is important that we 

either reconstruct our ideas of the ways in which a child is raised or don't expect other people to do it 

for the parent. I personally believe that it takes a village to raise a child, but unfortunately the village 

has to support the people taking care of the children. It is important to take a step back and look at 

the function of the Education System from an Economic standpoint. Use only this lens and one may 

have a serious revelation. What can we see??????????????????????. 



>To: 

>Subject: Re: A & P Solving ...Louise 

>Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 14:35:48 -0700 

> 

>As for being a parent or not being a parent you are not the one to talk, first of all because you do not 

have one, so you do not know what it is to go through school or work with having a child. When 

someone is having a child yes there lots at stake that one needs to think about, but there are times 

when situations are beyond your control that you have to get your children to daycare. Maybe when 

you have a child you will understand the hardships that one has to go through as a parent. 

>I do agree with you about teachers being reimbursed if they were to work extra hours, maybe the 

extra $128 weekly tuition fee that I pay for my child's daycare can be paid to the teacher. 


> From: Robert Atchison 



> Subject: RE: A & P Solving ...Louise 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> In order for students to have a Eight hour day, the teacher would have to have a ten to twelve hour 

day. This is not practical because the teacher would burnnnnnnn ooooooout! I am going into to 

teaching to help students learn, but not to deal with students every waking hour. It is impractical to 

think that you could. One way to extend the day would be to bring on extra teachers to teach the extra 

hours, but there are a lot of logistics behind that. Also, school is not meant to be a housing system for 

kids while their parents are out and if it was we would start with newborns. If the parents are put out 

by a short school day, Maybe they should not be PARENTS! You don't have kids so that someone 

else can take care of them all the time, and if you do you should not be a parent. On average 

teachers spend more time with kids than do the parents anyways, I don't think that it would be good 

for the kids to spend even less time with parents. But, I guess i t depends on your point of view. Also, 

if teachers are going to take on the role of facilitating parents to work more hours, the teachers 

deserve a portion of that increase. Lets see, 3 extra work hours per parent with an average pay of 

2085

$15 an hour per parent. that is $45 a day, $900 a month, then multiply by 20 students (the upper 

grades would be more), that is $18,000 a month. I would figure that the teachers should get at least 

20% of this, which is an extra $3,600 a month. The average teacher works about 10 months out of 

the year, so this would be an extra $36,000. Thus the starting salary of a teacher would be about 

$68,000 to $73,000 a year. Hey, I might be willing to put in the extra time for this kind of money! Hey 

a veteran teacher would be making six digits! Think about it. We live in a capitalist society, time is 

MONEY. 

> 

> 

> 

> >From: "Randy& Louise Tweed" 


> >To: 

> >Subject: RE: Application & Problem Solving ... 

> >Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 06:39:12 -0700 

> > 

> >Are you saying that it would cost more money to keep the students in 

> >school an extra couple of hours each day? I would assume this would be 

> >the cost of electricity and the general running of the building, but if 

> >teachers are supposed to be at school until 4:30 - 5:00pm anyway, I 

> >can't see what the additional expense is. I do agree that you would 

> >have a lot of teachers "pitching a fit" over having to stay "longer" 

> >hours! But, you don't go into the profession for a short day, and if 

> >you do, you shouldn't be a teacher! I think the benefits of a longer 

> >day would out-weigh the detriments. I was also thinking about 

> >high-school students. Isn't it a shock for those who graduate and get a 

> >regular paying job to be up early and to work into the evening, when 

> >they've been used to getting "off" in the early afternoon? ~ Louise 

> > 


> >From: Cynthia Reyes [mailto:mrstkdsd@yahoo.com] 

> >Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 11:23 PM 



> > 

> > 

> > 

> >Just a couple of reasons why they don't extend the school day? Money, 

> >Money 

> >Another reason: I bet there are lots of teachers who would pitch a fit 

> >if they had to work those hours, and you know how powerful the teacher's 

> >unions are. 

> >Cynthia 

> > 

> >Randy& Louise Tweed wrote: 

> > 

> >In response to your posting about homework and culture in general, I 

> >have a few things to say as I step up to my soap box... I have a really 

> >hard time understanding why students get out of school at 2:20 or 

> >sometimes 1:15pm on a school day. Like you said Cynthia, much of the 

> >academic day is spent on issues such as drug education etc., which I 

> >think are important issues. Why doesn't the school day extend to 4pm or 

> >even 5pm? With this in mind, students are being taught by 

2086

professionals, not having to rely on someone at home; students are off 

> >the streets and a big plus for teachers is that we will have a couple of 

> >hours more in the day to actually instruct and spend time with our 

> >students. 

> > 

> >Perhaps it's because I went to school in the "Dark Ages" or the fact 

> >that I was educated in England, but since being in America, I have 

> >found, for the most part, that students from elementary through college 

> >tend to not have the degree of respect for adults/elders/teachers that I 

> >learned. For example, as a K-12 student, if an adult entered the room, 

> >be it another teacher, a parent and definitely if it was the headmaster, 

> >ALL students would stand and acknowledge the visitor! You NEVER walked 

> >out of class during lecture/instruction (as Prof. Yamashita was 

> >describing one of his mentor professors in class the other day). 

> > 

> >Well, I think I'll get off my soap box and attend to my physics homework 

> >while the brain cells are still snapping away up there. Until next 

> >time... ~ Louise 

> > 

> > 






> > 

> > 

> > 

> >In regards to homework: Japanese students have longer school days, then 

> >they go to after school school; when would they have time for homework? 

> >American schools spend so much time teaching diversity, drug education 

> >etc, there isn't a lot of time left to teach academics, so they send the 

> >school work home as homework. Many American students don't have parents 

> >who put a lot of value on education, or just don't find the time to make 

> >sure their kids are learning.They know their kids will just get passed 

> >on to the next grade anyway, so why worry? Our kids don't have to 

> >compete to get into a high school, heck you don't even have to compete 

> >to get in many colleges (certain career fields excluded of course, like 

> >medical). 

> >As far as students cleaning and taking ownership of their schools, I 

> >think thats a great way to get students to care about things. The school 

> >I used to work at had the kids do that too, and it worked great. The 

> >physical aspect is a plus, get them up and moving! 

> >So....much of this is cultural. The American culture is just different. 

> >We don't want to work that hard, we don't want that much responsibility. 

> >Doesn't matter if it is right or wrong, its the way it is. There are 

> >those who do expect their kids to be pushed, and they put their kids in 

> >private school if they can afford it, or they are in the classroom 

> >hounding the teacher to make sure it happens. 

> >I don't think we can blame the entire educational system, there are good 

> >teachers out there, the ones who make teaching their lives, not just a 

> >way to get a paycheck. Unfortunately, there are too many of those. We 

> >can't blame all the parents, but there are some that need to get a clue. 

2087

We can't just blame the government for not throwing good money after 

> >bad, the money needs to be spent in the right places on the right 

> >things. Its a complex problem in a complex society, with no easy 

> >solution. 

> >Cynthia 

> > 


> > 

> >Alexandra, 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >You are comparing what you view as the worst US schools and practices, 

> >with the best Japanese schools and practices. I hope that you realize 

> >that this gives your words a weighted level of bias. Teachers in the 

> >U.S. are also required to have in-service training where they discuss 

> >proven methods. The classrooms in the U.S. are not supposed to grouped 

> >by level and in most cases are not. There is a big difference between 

> >having different dialects and having different languages. Although we 

> >have learned that problem solving is an essential skill that our 

> >students must have, we have also learned through the Bruer book that 

> >teaching the concept is also necessary. All problem solving and no 

> >concept, makes for a very bad lesson. Exploration, Concept, Application. 

> >One must truly begin to understand that there are fundamental social 

> >differences between the U.S. and other countries, thus it is not 

> >practical to adopt all of their practices. This is not to say that we 

> >should not examine these educational structures, but we should not 

> >blindly say that they are whole heartedly better than ours. For one 

> >thing people such as myself, being that I have Dyslexia, would have been 

> >bared from a higher education due to the genetic makeup. Is this a good 

> >way to go about it? I hope not. Also, Japanese students attend school 

> >about two months longer than do American students, but this is not 

> >discussed in your reasons for better performance. Also, the students bow 

> >to their teachers at the start of everyday and they make their own food 

> >and clean the school. One mu st ask themselves, what are the fundamental 

> >differences and accepted ideologies that would prevent American schools 

> >from conducting their education in a similar fashion? 

> > 

> >Robert. 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > >From: 



> > >Subject: Application & Problem Solving ... 

> > >Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 2:15:01 -0400 

> > > 

> > >It was not surprising to read in Sagan's reading, "No such thing as a 

> >Dumb Question" that Japan, South Korea, and Western Canada was ahead of 

> >American students in mathematics and science." This made me think of an 

2088

article I read that compared the math instruction in Japan, Germany, and 

> >the United States. I think understanding the disparity between 

> >countries' math and science scores is a complex concept to understand. 

> >The scores do not take into consideration teachers' training, how the 

> >federal government funds are used, the emphasis placed on testing and 

> >homework, the percentage of teachers who use the board, diversity in the 

> >classroom, and the approach to lesson planning. The article titled, "How 

> >Culture Shapes Math Instruction in Japan, Germany, and the United 

> >States" (The California Education Policy Seminar and The California 

> >State University Institute sponsored the article for Education Reform) 

> >looks closely at the teaching philosophies of the ab ove countries while 

> >takin 

> > > g into consideration other factors besides testing. This particular 

> >article placed the focus on math education but the teaching philosophies 

> >applies to other subject areas. As a future teacher, I think that it is 

> >important that we explore other countries' education system and see how 

> >we can benefit from their success. This kind of exploration I hope will 

> >give me an edge for reaching out to all my students. I welcome the 

> >opportunity to gain insight into other educational systems outside of 

> >the U. S. Our classrooms grow more and more diverse and understanding 

> >teaching philosophies outside our own country becomes more crucial. Why? 

> >Our student body grows more diverse but the teachers and the classrooms 

> >do not. Is it possible to bring more than just a lesson about another 

> >country into the classroom? What is wrong with teaching more like the 

> >Japanese, the Germans, the Koreans, and the British?? In reading the 

> >article, I discovered how homogenous American education system really i 

> > > s and how "teaching is highly culturally determined." 

> > >Each country no matter how diverse has a distinct teaching style. Let 

> >us look at it this way, as distinct as the American culture is from the 

> >Germans, the Japanese, the Koreans, etc. it would make sense that each 

> >culture has its unique teaching philosophies. I assumed that Japan rate 

> >of educational success had to do with the long hours that Japanese 

> >children were in school. I also assumed that much focus was placed on 

> >preparing students for testing. 

> > >According to the study, the Japanese do not put a huge focus on 

> >testing. The success rate of the Japanese students is contributed to how 

> >the Japanese teacher used the resources available. For example, the 

> >Japanese teachers use the chalkboard 100% while the U.S. uses the 

> >chalkboard 67%. The important thing I discovered in not how the tools 

> >are used but the philosophy behind the lesson, for example, recorded on 

> >the chalkboard. For instance, the Japanese's "philosophy is to treat the 

> >chalkboard as their record of the entire lesson being taught. This gives 

> >visual learners and everyone the opportunity to have a good set of notes 

> >to reflect on and ask questions. Rather, than trying to take notes and 

> >learn a concept at the same time. The teacher facilitates the learning 

> >by reemphasizing what she/he is saying by writing it on the board. 

> >Whereas, the teachers in the U.S. use visual aids and "body language in 

> >a constant battle to draw students' attention to their words. Moreover, 

> >the U 

> > > .S. focuses math lesson on teaching the students how to solve math 

> >problems rather than giving the students the opportunity to think and 

> >apply what they know into solving a problem. Meanwhile,the Japanese 

> >teachers teach students math concepts by explaining what the math 

2089

concepts mean and giving the students the opportunity to apply the math 

> >concepts and figure out their own method of problem solving.How do 

> >teacher from Japan lesson plans? 

> > >The Japanese teachers prepare lesson plans using a methodical approach. 

> >The lesson plans are prepared with the questions the students may ask, 

> >the areas of difficulty that may arise for the students, and the 

> >possible mistakes the students will make in working through a math 

> >concept. Furthermore, the Japanese teachers work on one-lesson plan for 

> >an entire year. Whereas, the American teachers rely on previous lessons 

> >and quickly put together a lesson plan on prior instructions. Another 

> >interesting and novel approach is the way other Japanese teachers 

> >observe a teacher implementing a new lesson in order to study the 

> >students during the lesson; the teachers then meet to review and revise 

> >the lesson and later present the lesson to the entire faculty where the 

> >teacher receives more criticism. It was interesting to learn how the 

> >federal government supports Japanese teachers. 

> > >In Japan, the federal government funds are used to pay for "In-service 

> >teacher training," rather than investing that money on keeping class 

> >size smaller. The average class size in Japan has 40 students. Unlike 

> >our thinking in the U.S. that Japanese schools are not diverse, in fact, 

> >the schools are very diverse because unlike the U.S. where students are 

> >tracked and divided by ability, the students in Japans are placed in 

> >random classrooms. Therefore, the teaching techniques used in Japan 

> >targets a diverse classroom and the teaching techniques in the U.S. work 

> >well in a homogenous classroom." How well do American schools use class 

> >time? 

> > >American teachers have little time set aside for developing and 

> >teaching a lesson. Instead, the time is used on going over homework and 

> >checking to see if homework is completed. In Japan, there is little 

> >emphasis placed on homework, "only 24% of Japanese teachers" assigned 

> >homework. Meanwhile, 90% of the American teachers assign homework and 

> >place emphasis on the use of concepts and method, rather than 

> >application. For example, American teachers explain what is a numerator, 

> >denominator, how to divide, multiply, etc. The concept is stated but not 

> >developed. The study showed that "approximately 80% of the concepts in 

> >the U.S. were only stated and never developed, whereas in Germany and 

> >Japan the exact opposite pattern occurred." Given Sagan's findings that 

> >"the average math gap between white and black U.S. high school graduates 

> >is still huge- two to three grade levels; but the gap between white U.S. 

> >high school graduates and those in, say Japan, Canada, Great Bri tain?is 

> >more th 

> > > an twice as large (with U.S. students behind)" (Sagan 329). Then it 

> >is important that we look at other factors that affect our education 

> >system besides blaming it on testing, class size, and diversity issues. 

> >Motivating and teaching our students how to think seems to play an 

> >important factor in educating our students. Teaching concepts is not 

> >enough. Applying the concepts the way this semester of science has 

> >taught us in Ochanji's class through exploration and applications seems 

> >to give students to opportunity to problem solve while promoting 

> >thinking. (Alexandra's journal #11) 

> > > 

> > > 

> > 

2090

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2091






"Time is money" as you stated, but my question to you is How much is a good education worth? To 

me it's priceless. I am not becoming a teacher to make money. I am becoming a teacher because I 

know I can reach my students. I know how they feel when they are let down by people who don't 

acknowledge their needs, and that will make me a good teacher. Parents are incredible balances of 

human beings. They are a mom or dad, a friend, a doctor, a provider, a listener, a chauffer, a cook, a 

housekeeper, a personal organizer, a esteem builder, and many other essential things in a child's life. 

Being a teacher is not taking the place of the parents when they are dropped off at your classroom 

everyday. It's caring for those students all the time. You as a teacher have just as many jobs and 

responsibilites to your students as their parents do. Their parents do not get a raise for having their 

children. They are paid in the happiness that the children bring them and teachers should be too. I 

have a theory: A job is something that you have to do that you don't like, and a career is something 

that you want to do and enjoy when you are doing it. If you think teaching is a job then maybe you 

should look for a career in something that you enjoy doing. 

Jenny Fiala 

2092





Subject: wow, lots of "you's and I's" 

where are we going??? 

__________________________________ 



http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash 

2093






Mike there are some of us that do go to school from 10-7. But I do see your 

point.The longer school days don't make much of a difference, it just makes 

for a longer day at school. It just so happens this semester I do not have 

class from 10-7 but I am on campus Mondays and Wednesday's from 10-9pm. 

Work! However, back in the day when i was going to junior college, I would 

go 12 hours a day two days a week. Didn't make me smarter, just meant that I 

had more work to do in one day and for homework. Just thought i'd throw that 

bit of information in for ya. 




>Subject: Longer school days 

>Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 10:32:33 -0700 

> 

>Kids need to be in school longer? Do you people not remember being in 

>school? Hell, we are in school NOW. Don't you remember how LONG the day 

>was, and still is? Expecting an American kid to get through an 8 hour 

>school day everyday is crazy. Now you high and mighty types will probably 

>say "If your teaching methods are engaging, then the students won't even 

>want to leave your class!" While I appreciate your piss and/or vinegar, no 

>matter what activity you are doing as a child in school, you can never wait 

>for school to get out. If you don't think this is true, then I theorize 

>that you are utterly out of touch with children and should seriously work 

>on that before you graduate. How would you feel if all of our college 

>classes were extended by an hour? Just think of all the education we could 

>be getting! Ahhh, if only I was in school from 10-7 everyday, I would be a 

>goldmine of knowledge, though completely drained of exuberance and 

>humanity, but those things aren't in the standards, so I guess they don't 

>matter anyway. 

> 

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2094






Not only money... when teachers make school fun than I am sure students would 

not mind sitting in school until four or five, but when it is not fun, I can 

not imagine sitting still in school until five. I am in college and I still 

have a hard time sitting until five at night. As teachers, that means less 

time to grade and plan lesson at night. Plus, when will all the extra 

curricular stuff happen. There is just not enough time in the day, kids!!! 

Teresa 

2095





Subject: Journal-longer school days 

Attachments: Re: A & P Solving ...EverybodyandKarla 

Re: A & P Solving 

...Everybody... 

First of all it doesn’t take a village to raise a child(ren), it just takes 

patience and skills. No, I do not have any kids but I’ve raised enough kids 

to know what its like, and I was going to school so I know! And 

unfortunately too many parents do expect other people to raise their kids 

and do rely on school as a babysitter. I think that extended school hours 

could benefit high school students in many ways as Louise was saying and 

should not be looked at as a “babysitter”. 

Furthermore, I think that kindergartener’s should have to go to school all 

day. I know the reason that most schools have half-day programs for 

kindergarteners is an increase in the number of students, but they are at an 

age where they absorb everything and the school systems should take 

advantage of that. Yes districts would have to hire more teachers but 

students would benefit from it. Also, if students got out later in the day 

like 4pm, and that’s what time they were use to getting out then they 

wouldn’t know anything different. The students that are use to getting out 

at 2 are going to whine and complain but will have to deal with it. What’s 

the worse that can be done if school hours are extended? Also, if school 

hours are extended then this could conflict with sports programs. But I 

think an alternative to that is re arranging sports programs so that games 

and practices are on the weekends, or practice once a week as not to 

interfere with school. I think too many schools these days take sports way 

to serious, and don’t focus on education enough. But this is another 

conversation in itself. 

As for the financial aspect of this, if teacher are required to be at school 

from 8-5 then it shouldn’t be a big deal. I know many times they are 

prepping for the next day or going to meetings, but why can’t elementary 

school students have a prep time like high school teachers? I don’t see any 

reason why this isn’t feasible. The district could hire one teacher per 

grade to rove the different classrooms while the teacher had prep time. 

Also, with longer days teachers could incorporate more art and music or 

other subjects that they say they don’t have time for. In my eyes I don’t 

see longer days as a financial burden on the district. We all know that 

teachers need to be paid more, but this should not be the deciding factor on 

whether a school increases the school day or not. 

Okay so that’s my take on that. 

_________________________________________________________________ 

From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the Spring 

Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx 

2096






How sad that there are principals and superintendants running our schools 

who have such parochial views about bilingual education. It just makes me 

wonder why they are sitting in such a position, and not to mention in an 

area where the majority of the population is hispanics. Not long ago I 

interview Professor Gurken for one of my other classes and i was talking to 

her about bilingual education. She was telling me how she's had to fight for 

bilingual education and how much trouble she got in because she was standing 

up for what she believes in. She was also telling me how horrible the 

faculty and administrators were to her and with the idea of bilingual 

education. I think that if you dont believe in bilingual education thats 

fine, but for the people that do you shouldn't criticise them or know the 

program. Also, if you don't believe in it then don't work there. Don't take 

a job just because its a job. If you don't have the same goals and beliefs 

as the school then you shouldn't be there. I am not saying that you 

shouldn't fight for what you believe in especially if its in the best 

interest of the students. I guess this is aimed more at those who are 

against bilingual ed, than those for it. 

Also, for those against it just shows that they are narrow minded and 

ignorant. I guess i don't get what the big deal is if a school has a 

bilingual program, especially if the majority of the students dont speak 

english. It would be like adding a sports program or other program in an 

area that is big on sports or whatever. Just because this is a language 

issue people have a problem with it. The students are going to have to take 

a foreign language in high school so why not let them become fluent and 

profient in a couple of languages before high school rather than struggling 

through it now. So many other countries are tri-lingual or even more... so 

why does the American education system have to be arrogant in thinking that 

English is the best? 



>To: 

>Subject: Re: bilingualism and the bigoted administration 

>Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 00:27:25 -0700 

> 

> 

> As to my understanding bilingual education is not completely 

>obliterated, parents need to sign a waiver that allows bilingualism in the 

>classroom. As a mater-of-fact I worked at a magnet school whose emphasis 

>was bilingualism. I don't think that the getting rid of bilingualism is 

>what is making them hardnosed, it is their biased and racist ways of 

>conferring, that is making them take such views. And apparently their views 

>are not working because Lincoln is one of the many schools in the Escondido 

>district that cannot raise their test scores. So something most not be 

>working out here. Could it be that perhaps some teachers are in fact ILL 

>PREPARED to teach in a diverse classroom? Or perhaps the administration 

>needs to get a good whipping when it comes to accounting for the plunging 

>test scores? 




> Sent: Monday, April 12, 2004 10:48 PM 

> Subject: Re: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 

> 

> 

2097

So much for changing the system from within!! One thought though, didn't 

>they get rid of bilingual education in california? Could that be a reason 

>why they are being so hardnosed about it? If she feels strongly about it, 

>she should continue teaching and fighting for what she believes. 

> Cynthia 

> This sounds like a witchhunt (sagan). Those evil pro-bilingual ed people 

>are going to take down the whole education system. Better burn them at the 

>stake before it takes hold, they might actually educate some of THOSE kids, 

>then we would be in real trouble, lol. 

> 

> Karla Garduno wrote: 

> My sister-n-law who is a second grade teacher at Lincoln elementary is 

>going through exactly what you are saying Robert. She has been a strong 

>advocate for bilingual education and I have seen her go long ways to battle 

>opposing views on this issue. There is a group of teachers in that school 

>that feel so strong about the issue that they have gone as far as 

>contracting lawyers to back them up in what they believe in. In that school 

>is not necessarily the parents that oppose bilingual education, but the 

>principal and the head honchos. It has gotten to the point that a couple of 

>her collegues have gotten fired just because they stand behind their 

>believes 100%. Just recently, she was telling me, the little "click" that 

>is for bilingual education at Lincoln was confronted with another surprise. 

>The principal held a meeting with each one of them to tell some that some 

>were to be relocated to another school. Out of five teachers only two were 

>kept at Lincoln, my sister-n -law( being that she was teacher of the year 

>for the last year) and one of her other teacher friend. The staying of my 

>sister-n-law and her colleague came at a price though, she was moved to 

>teach fourth grade and the other teacher was move to kindergarten. At first 

>I was like cool you got to stay instead of being relocated but she then 

>explain the jest of it to me: the change in grade was so that they will not 

>be able to communicate at work, for fourth grade teachers and kindergarten 

>teachers have a completely different schedule. At the moment that she was 

>telling about all this drama one of her teacher friends phoned her and 

>mentioned that they were going to be meeting with a lawyer to file a civil 

>lawsuit. Her last comment to me was, "I am so tired of all this it, I have 

>told your brother that I am ready to move on to something else". I commend 

>my sister-n-law for what she is doing for the Spanish speakers at her 

>school. I am not only saying it because she is my family but because it 

>only motivates me to continue where she left off in her struggle. 

> Here is one for all the hypocrites, 

> Karla 

> P.S. to have to relocate teachers only shows that the bosses at 

>Lincoln feel threatened by the kind of actions that these group of teachers 

>have taken to defend a cause! 


> From: Robert Atchison 


> Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2004 1:43 PM 

> Subject: Re: journal for the week of 4/5 and 4/7 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> Just because one promotes equality and understanding of others 

>within your classroom, not all of your children nor there parents or 

>society at large will approve of your styles. How does one begin to develop 

>a framework for addressing oppositional view points? Not everyone believes 

>that equality is a good thing, not everyone believes that all children 

>deserve an equal education. Sad, but very true. What happens when you are a 

>strong believer of bi-lingual education and the superintendent says "NOT ON 

>MY WATCH." We all carry with us an understanding of how we feel everyone 

>else should view the world. But, how do you teach in an environment with so 

>many views and understandings? How much control will we have over our 

>future curriculums, units, lessons, words, feelings, beliefs, etc.? and 

2098

where does one draw the line? How much control will one have to say "NOT ON 

>MY WATCH" and understanding that when will you stop fighting? This is one 

>reason teachers don' t stay in the profession for very long. How will we 

>combat this? Many will probably go with the flow and buy there house and 

>retire having not helped change society in any formidable motion. But, how 

>can we begin to work within the system to promote change in what each of us 

>views to be a positive direction and many of us may view as a negative 

>direction? 

> 

> 

> 





> >Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 10:00:13 -0700 (PDT) 

> > 

> >Matheno, 

> > 

> >Your'e right... Topics of inequality are brought up brefly, but 

>never delt with on levels that could help make a change. I myself am not 

>planning on teaching near the coast, and I plan to go into teaching with 

>the attitude "NOT ON MY SHIFT!" I want to create a classroom that is a 

>safe learning environment for everyone. Everyone: European American, 

>African American, Asian American, Mexican American, Christian American, 

>Mormon American, Catholic American, Heterosexual American, Homosexual 

>American...........etc. I want to include and respect everyone to the best 

>of my abilities. I know I will not be perfect, but I know I will do 

>everything in my abilities to help promote well rounded children of the 

>future. 

> >Ann 

> > 

> >lande008 wrote: 

> >Dear list serve members, 

> > 

> >As I read some of the journals late the other night (recently got 

>internet 

> >hooked up at the crib)I thought to myself "damn i have been missing 

>out on the 

> >opportunity to show the cohort and faculty that I am an able writer 

>and as Jim 

> >Rome would say have good takes." That being said, I can't 

>absolutely pinpoint 

> >why my activity on the list serve has been so sparse other than to 

>say that my 

> >life as i'm sure some of yours doesn't revolve around our cohort 

>(as much as 

> >it should) and especially not an email list (my closest friends and 

>i don't 

> >communicate via email so it is not a medium with which I am 

>completely 

> >comfortable) so other than doing the necessary number of journals I 

>haven't 

> >been around to jump on some of the entries that I should have. For 

>instance, 

> >their was a posting recently speaking about the difference in 

>literacy between 

> >students in poor school versus rich or church based schools that I 

>wanted to 

> >respond to by saying that in poor schools (the faculty usually 

>doesn't push 

> >the stduents the way they need to be pushed either out of a feeling 

>that the 

> >students aren't capable of grasping the material or indiffernce 

>whether or not 

> >their students ever become intellignent novices. Along the same 

2099

lines, as I 

> >can say from my own personal experiences when minorities attend 

>schools in 

> >middle class or well to do areas they still aren't pushed to 

>succeed but 

> >rather allowed to simply coast through without fear of failure (our 

>test 

> >scores will still be high compared to the rest of the schools so if 

>these kids 

> >aren't prepared it won't reflect on us overall) so we are left to 

>motivate 

> >ourselves and if you are one that continually is pressuring the 

>teacher to 

> >help you or explain something clearer (i have felt as if they think 

>you are 

> >just trying to kiss their ass or are doing so for another reason 

>rather than 

> >just a desire to learn (this being in the high school years)). But 

>their is 

> >an overall feeling i have seen of "what hope is there for these 

>students" 

> >without every taking the time to think that you are there "hope" 

>and the one 

> >that needs to be challenging each and every one of them. I perceive 

>that the 

> >majority of my cohort members desire to work in the carlsbad, 

>encinitas, and 

> >rancho bernardos but sorry guys you all aren't going to be able to 

>work their 

> >and it is my fear that when you do get a job in an area you don't 

>want to work 

> >in for whatever reason (hopefully not because of the ethnicity or 

> >socio-economic status of your students) you will resent your 

>position and 

> >continue the string of teachers who don't care about the 

>performance of their 

> >students or don't feel that they can make an impact. That being 

>said, I tend 

> >to bite my tongue for fear of being the "angry black man" or 

>whatever else one 

> >could be labeled for speaking their mind but I can't worry about 

>that at this 

> >time. I feel that our "multicultural education" courses have only 

>reinforced 

> >that their is a gap between the education of minorites and done 

>little to 

> >encourage future teachers that this trend can change if they want 

>it to. Its 

> >like "look at these test scores" and thats it no explination as to 

>why this is 

> >so or how it can be fixed. Anyways folks just a few things i wanted 

>to get 

> >off my chest in between patrons here in the media library so if its 

>muttered 

> >up my apologies but please feel free to discuss with me anything 

>you would 

> >like and i'll make an effort to respond to your thoughts as well. 

> > 

> >Matheno 

> > 

> >p.s. pressure is a good driving force, but stress is just that 

>stress never a 

> >good driving force it is simply stress. Rick Pitino (not his exact 

>words but 

> >along those lines) 

> > 

2100

> >--------------------------------- 



> 

> 

>-------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

> MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page 

>FREE download! 

> 

> 

>------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 



_________________________________________________________________ 



2101




To: ICP-F 

Subject: my revelation - journal something or another 

So I read the last chapter of Bruer because it gave me a sense of 

accomplishment. Yeah, another book done!!! In the last chapter, Bruer 

discusses that we know that learning is a process and how important problem 

solving is in eduacation. Then the author continues that teaching is also 

about problem solving. I think I already knew this idea and the problem 

solving factor of teaching, but is just was not pointed out to me so clearly. 

It made me think of all the things I must overcome just to make one lesson. I 

think teaching is a lot like the scienctific method. First you must make an 

observation, I believe this is studying your students, yourself, and the 

concept that must be taught. CHECK! Then you hypothesize how you are going to 

accomplish this task, your lesson. CHECK! Next you must make your lesson plan 

with materials. Guess what, that is your procedure. CHECK! Then you perform 

your lesson plan, construictively critisizing your performance, DATA. check! 

Then you analysize and make your conclusion, this lead you to your rewriting a 

lesson plan and making changes; creting a new experiment or you add this 

lesson to your other successful lessons and pass it around to other teachers 

to test, theory. CHECK! MAybe this is why I want ot be a teacher because you 

experiment, with the best intentions, and you never know how your day is going 

to go, which is kinda like my physics labs. 

teresa 

p.s. see you all tomorrow. 

p.p.s. Mr. Alpha Chi tickets still on sale!! hint hint 

2102





Subject: I have to brag... 

I am going to brag because I'm bursting with pride! 

My husband Mike has been nominated for teacher of the year at Temescal Canyon 

high for five years in a row. This year he finally won! Yes, he was the Susan 

Lucci of the teacher of the year awards. He was always in the top-ten but he 

could never beat the coaches. At his school the coaches have a reputation for 

being easy and showing movies all the time. 

Does he deserve it? You better believe it! He is a hell of a dam good teacher. 

His door is always open before and after school for any student that needs 

help or that just wants to get away from bullies. School gets out at 3:05, 

and sometimes he doesn't come home until after 6:00. No, he's not having an 

affair because all the female teachers are beauty-impaired, besides my best 

friend and her husband also stay at school working late with him. He helps the 

students and then does his grading and preparing. 

I am very proud of my husband and I respect him as a teacher. I'm not just 

saying this because he's my husband; he certainly won't win husband of the 

year until he stops using my good kitchen towels to work in the garage. This 

award is significant because he upset the other teachers in his department by 

actually teaching and not showing movies. It is unbelievable how many seasoned 

teachers show movies. Mike never shows movies, unless it ties into what he is 

teaching. He is very enthusiastic in front of the class and has a wonderful 

sense of humor. When he comes home he is often exhausted, but he loves 

teaching. 

I have spent time in my husband's class as well as helped him on Saturday's, 

(by preparing food) when he conducts study sessions. He really does have a 

great rapport with his students. The students respect him and he respects 

them. He is not an easy teacher, he demands their best and expects to see 

personal and intellectual growth in the classroom. Despite the fact that he 

demands so much and assigns a great deal of homework, the students often times 

rise to the challenge and sign up for other classes that he teaches. 

The students like him so much, that this year on his birthday which is on St. 

Patrick's Day, all three of his classes threw him a surprise birthday party 

each with their own theme. He had an idea that one of his classes was going to 

organize a party for him, but he was sure surprised when his first class 

enlisted the help of the assistant principal to get him out of the room. He's 

second class entered the room with a cake singing happy birthday. Each class 

brought in lots of balloons, decorations and tons of food. Everything was 

well-planned and organized. They even cleaned up afterwards. 

The moral of this story is that being a good teacher pays off and that 

students do want to learn and they appreciate your efforts. 

I just wanted to share because this semester I became disillusioned with the 

idea of being a teacher. I'm inspired again. Thanks, Cecilia 

2103





Subject: Re: I have to brag... 

Tell your hubby congratulations, it sounds like he really deserves it!!!!!! Nice to hear that teachers with 

high standards can and are respected and liked. 

Cynthia 



My husband Mike has been nominated for teacher of the year at Temescal Canyon 

high for five years in a row. This year he finally won! Yes, he was the Susan 

Lucci of the teacher of the year awards. He was always in the top-ten but he 

could never beat the coaches. At his school the coaches have a reputation for 


Does he deserve it? You better believe it! He is a hell of a dam good teacher. 

His door is always open before and after school for any student that needs 

help or that just wants to get away from bullies. School gets out at 3:05, 

and sometimes he doesn't come home until after 6:00. No, he's not having an 

affair because all the female teachers are beauty-impaired, besides my best 

friend and her husband also stay at school working late with him. He helps the 


I am very proud of my husband and I respect him as a teacher. I'm not just 

saying this because he's my husband; he certainly won't win husband of the 

year until he stops using my good kitchen towels to work in the garage. This 

award is significant because he upset the other teachers in his department by 

actually teaching and not showing movies. It is unbelievable how many seasoned 

teachers show movies. Mike never shows movies, unless it ties into what he is 

teaching. He is very enthusiastic in front of the class and has a wonderful 


teaching. 

I have spent time in my husband's class as well as helped him on Saturday's, 


great rapport with his students. The students respect him and he respects 

them. He is not an easy teacher, he demands their best and expects to see 

personal and intellectual growth in the classroom. Despite the fact that he 

demands so much and assigns a great deal of homework, the students often times 


The students like him so much, that this year on his birthday which is on St. 

Patrick's Day, all three of his classes threw him a surprise birthday party 

each with their own theme. He had an idea that one of his classes was going to 


enlisted the help of the assistant principal to get him out of the room. He's 

2104

second class entered the room with a cake singing happy birthday. Each class 

brought in lots of balloons, decorations and tons of food. Everything was 


The moral of this story is that being a good teac her pays off and that 


I just wanted to share because this semester I became disillusioned with the 


_____ 



2105





Subject: RE: I have to brag... 

It's moments like the one your husband experienced that makes teaching 

so rewarding. Good for him for not following his colleagues like a 

sheep. Children watch too much television anyway, (in my opinion), and 

it's very refreshing to hear about enthusiastic and innovative teachers 

who really care about their students. Your husband sounds like a 

wonderful teacher, who could prove to be a good mentor too. ~ Louise 


From: tille002 [mailto:tille002@csusm.edu] 



Subject: I have to brag... 


My husband Mike has been nominated for teacher of the year at Temescal 

Canyon 

high for five years in a row. This year he finally won! Yes, he was the 

Susan 

Lucci of the teacher of the year awards. He was always in the top-ten 

but he 

could never beat the coaches. At his school the coaches have a 

reputation for 


Does he deserve it? You better believe it! He is a hell of a dam good 

teacher. 

His door is always open before and after school for any student that 

needs 

help or that just wants to get away from bullies. School gets out at 

3:05, 

and sometimes he doesn't come home until after 6:00. No, he's not having 

an 

affair because all the female teachers are beauty-impaired, besides my 

best 

friend and her husband also stay at school working late with him. He 

helps the 


I am very proud of my husband and I respect him as a teacher. I'm not 

just 

saying this because he's my husband; he certainly won't win husband of 

the 

year until he stops using my good kitchen towels to work in the garage. 

This 

award is significant because he upset the other teachers in his 

department by 

actually teaching and not showing movies. It is unbelievable how many 

seasoned 

teachers show movies. Mike never shows movies, unless it ties into what 

he is 

teaching. He is very enthusiastic in front of the class and has a 

wonderful 


teaching. 

2106

I have spent time in my husband's class as well as helped him on 

Saturday's, 

(by preparing food) when he conducts study sessions. He really does have 

a 

great rapport with his students. The students respect him and he 

respects 

them. He is not an easy teacher, he demands their best and expects to 

see 

personal and intellectual growth in the classroom. Despite the fact that 

he 

demands so much and assigns a great deal of homework, the students often 

times 


The students like him so much, that this year on his birthday which is 

on St. 

Patrick's Day, all three of his classes threw him a surprise birthday 

party 

each with their own theme. He had an idea that one of his classes was 

going to 


enlisted the help of the assistant principal to get him out of the room. 

He's 

second class entered the room with a cake singing happy birthday. Each 

class 

brought in lots of balloons, decorations and tons of food. Everything 

was 


The moral of this story is that being a good teacher pays off and that 


I just wanted to share because this semester I became disillusioned with 

the 


2107






Thank you for pointing out to me that you believe there is a difference between a job and a career, 

but to me they are very similar things. The out word semantics that you are trying to enjoy, has left 

me with a feeling that your righteousness is a stifling force for those who may not feel the same 

(myself included). I venture to believe that I will join the workforce and obtain a job teaching, while 

enjoying myself to the fullest of my being. It is important to remember that many of us enjoy different 

ways of existence. It is true that many of us do not want to become a teacher to make money, but it 

would be nice to get paid what the job is worth. That is why I was trying to suggest a way of looking at 

teaching from an economic lens. This may have allowed you to see that it may not be to acceptable 

to just get paid in happiness. But, as stated we all have ways in which to look at the world, so enjoy 

yo urs. It was just a suggestion to look at it threw a different lens. It by no means was a suggestion 

that I believe that all teachers, nor myself, should be in it for the money, just a different way of looking 

at it. 

To answer your question...A good education has a definite price and a definite potential gain, if you 

ask the institution that is providing it. If you ask the person that is obtain it, it may in fact be priceless. 

It depends on your perspective. 

>From: Kaylee102595@aol.com 



>Subject: Re: A & P Solving ...EverybodyandKarla 

>Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2004 16:50:10 EDT 

> 

>"Time is money" as you stated, but my question to you is How much is a good 

>education worth? To me it's priceless. I am not becoming a teacher to make 

>money. I am becoming a teacher because I know I can reach my students. I know how 

>they feel when they are let down by people who don't acknowledge their needs, 

>and that will make me a good teacher. Parents are incredible balances of human 

>beings. They are a mom or dad, a friend, a doctor, a provider, a listener, a 

>chauffer, a cook, a housekeeper, a personal organizer, a esteem builder, and 

>many other essential things in a child's life. Being a teacher is not taking 

>the place of the parents when they are dropped off at your classroom everyday. 

>It's caring for those students all the time. You as a teacher have just as many 

>jobs and responsibilites to your students as their parents do. Their parents 

>do not get a raise for having their children. They are paid in the happiness 

>that the children bring them and teachers should be too. I have a theory: A job 

>is something that you have to do that you don't like, and a career is 

>something that you want to do and enjoy when you are doing it. If you think teaching 

>is a job then maybe you should look for a career in something that you enjoy 

>doing. 

>Jenny Fiala 

2108

_____ 


2109





Subject: Re: I have to brag... 

>Cecilia, 

It is refreshing and inspiring to see that someone is passionate about teaching and does 

so with heart, and is aware that it is not about reward or the pay but because he believes 

in his students. Congradulations! to your husband.. 

Alexandra 

> From: tille002 

> Date: 2004/04/19 Mon AM 01:10:33 EDT 


> Subject: I have to brag... 

> 

> I am going to brag because I'm bursting with pride! 

> 

> My husband Mike has been nominated for teacher of the year at Temescal Canyon 

> high for five years in a row. This year he finally won! Yes, he was the Susan 

> Lucci of the teacher of the year awards. He was always in the top-ten but he 

> could never beat the coaches. At his school the coaches have a reputation for 

> being easy and showing movies all the time. 

> 

> Does he deserve it? You better believe it! He is a hell of a dam good teacher. 

> His door is always open before and after school for any student that needs 

> help or that just wants to get away from bullies. School gets out at 3:05, 

> and sometimes he doesn't come home until after 6:00. No, he's not having an 

> affair because all the female teachers are beauty-impaired, besides my best 

> friend and her husband also stay at school working late with him. He helps the 

> students and then does his grading and preparing. 

> 

> I am very proud of my husband and I respect him as a teacher. I'm not just 

> saying this because he's my husband; he certainly won't win husband of the 

> year until he stops using my good kitchen towels to work in the garage. This 

> award is significant because he upset the other teachers in his department by 

> actually teaching and not showing movies. It is unbelievable how many seasoned 

> teachers show movies. Mike never shows movies, unless it ties into what he is 

> teaching. He is very enthusiastic in front of the class and has a wonderful 

> sense of humor. When he comes home he is often exhausted, but he loves 

> teaching. 

> 

> I have spent time in my husband's class as well as helped him on Saturday's, 

> (by preparing food) when he conducts study sessions. He really does have a 

> great rapport with his students. The students respect him and he respects 

> them. He is not an easy teacher, he demands their best and expects to see 

> personal and intellectual growth in the classroom. Despite the fact that he 

> demands so much and assigns a great deal of homework, the students often times 

> rise to the challenge and sign up for other classes that he teaches. 

> 

> The students like him so much, that this year on his birthday which is on St. 

> Patrick's Day, all three of his classes threw him a surprise birthday party 

> each with their own theme. He had an idea that one of his classes was going to 

> organize a party for him, but he was sure surprised when his first class 

> enlisted the help of the assistant principal to get him out of the room. He's 

> second class entered the room with a cake singing happy birthday. Each class 

> brought in lots of balloons, decorations and tons of food. Everything was 

2110


> 

> 

> 

> The moral of this story is that being a good teacher pays off and that 

> students do want to learn and they appreciate your efforts. 

> 

> I just wanted to share because this semester I became disillusioned with the 

> idea of being a teacher. I'm inspired again. Thanks, Cecilia 

> 

> 

> 

2111





Subject: Money 

“Of course we need literacy, education, jobs, adequate medical care and 

defense, protection of the environment, security in our old age, a balanced 

budget and a host of other matters. But we are a rich society. Can’t we 

also nurture the Maxwells of our time?” (pg 400). 

We hear a lot about how we are a rich nation; we have been blessed with so 

many resources. So, why is it that we constantly hear about budget 

cutbacks? Why is it that teachers can’t find jobs in an education system 

that is understaffed? Why is it that every semester we have to pay more for 

school? We are a rich nation; with all our resources we should have a 15:1 

ratio of teachers to students in every classroom. Teachers should get paid 

what they deserve. We shouldn’t have to pay for college, it is in our best 

interest that we produce more college educated citizens. 

In the quote from Sagan, he has a list of the many things we need in our 

society. Isn’t this what we are using money for today? If we are a rich 

nation then why are these programs not adequately funded? How can we go 

about spending more money on things like science, when we don’t have enough 

money to run this nation properly? Or is it that we don’t spend our money 

wisely? I agree with the latter, but who is to say what is important and 

what is not. Sagan says, “is it really true that we can’t afford one attack 

helicopter’s worth of seed corn to listen to the stars?” (pg. 400). What if 

that one attack helicopter spent on science was needed in some future battle 

where it could have saved thousands of American citizens? 

No matter how much money we have as a nation we will always be complaining 

that there is not enough. Maybe it is something other than money that we 

need to be successful. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2112




To: ICP-F 

Subject: RE: Longer school days journal 

Mike I am able to see were you are coming from about the longer school days. I 

think just as you do that kids are always in a hurry to get out of class. But 

this might be because the teacher is not reaching the student. Just like 

Berrys class each student has an different intelligence that we as teachers 

need to reach in order for the students to learn. When I was in school and 

even now today its very hard for me to stay in class as long as we do just 

litening to the teacher talk. I feel this is because I am more hands on person 

and visual person I need these things in order to make sense of whats doing on 

in the classroom. I persoanlly feel that extending the school day may be more 

work but if you keep the students active and teach to their intelligences they 

might just want to stay longer. The extra time even its like 1 hour it can 

only help you in the long run. Min days why do we have these if we are always 

stressing that we dont have to time to teach everything that needs to be 

taught? 

Just some ideas 

Jonathan 

2113




To: listserve; Michael Renner 

Subject: books used in the lesson 

Here are the books we used in the lesson today: 

1. The Sky is Full of Stars. By: Franklyn M. Branley 

Great book for low readers. The words are pretty easy and the concept is 

present. 

2. Do Stars Have Points? By: Melvin and Gilda Berger 

The book is very informative and intersting. For higher level readers and 

explains more space information as well. 

3. Destination: Space By: Seymour SImon 

This book has the best photographs!! 

4. Once Upon a Starry Night By: Jacqueline Mitton and Christina Balit 

This is a great book to start to explain constellations. There is a storyline 

as well as information. Words are difficult, uses Greek names, but could be 

understood in almost every grade if teacher reads aloud. Aamzing 

illustrations. 

2114





Subject: RE: I have to brag... 

Cecilia, 

That is a great accomplishment for your family, tell your husband that Matheno 

said congratulations. 

peace, 

Matheno 


>>Cecilia, 

>It is refreshing and inspiring to see that someone is passionate about 

teaching and does so with heart, and is aware that it is not about reward or 

the pay but because he believes in his students. Congradulations! to your 

husband.. 

> 

>Alexandra 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>> From: tille002 

>> Date: 2004/04/19 Mon AM 01:10:33 EDT 


>> Subject: I have to brag... 

>> 

>> I am going to brag because I'm bursting with pride! 

>> 

>> My husband Mike has been nominated for teacher of the year at Temescal 

Canyon 

>> high for five years in a row. This year he finally won! Yes, he was the 

Susan 

>> Lucci of the teacher of the year awards. He was always in the top-ten but 

he 

>> could never beat the coaches. At his school the coaches have a reputation 

for 

>> being easy and showing movies all the time. 

>> 

>> Does he deserve it? You better believe it! He is a hell of a dam good 

teacher. 

>> His door is always open before and after school for any student that needs 

>> help or that just wants to get away from bullies. School gets out at 3:05, 

>> and sometimes he doesn't come home until after 6:00. No, he's not having an 

>> affair because all the female teachers are beauty-impaired, besides my best 

>> friend and her husband also stay at school working late with him. He helps 

the 

>> students and then does his grading and preparing. 

>> 

>> I am very proud of my husband and I respect him as a teacher. I'm not just 

>> saying this because he's my husband; he certainly won't win husband of the 

>> year until he stops using my good kitchen towels to work in the garage. 

This 

>> award is significant because he upset the other teachers in his department 

by 

>> actually teaching and not showing movies. It is unbelievable how many 

seasoned 

2115

teachers show movies. Mike never shows movies, unless it ties into what he 

is 

>> teaching. He is very enthusiastic in front of the class and has a wonderful 

>> sense of humor. When he comes home he is often exhausted, but he loves 

>> teaching. 

>> 

>> I have spent time in my husband's class as well as helped him on 

Saturday's, 

>> (by preparing food) when he conducts study sessions. He really does have a 

>> great rapport with his students. The students respect him and he respects 

>> them. He is not an easy teacher, he demands their best and expects to see 

>> personal and intellectual growth in the classroom. Despite the fact that he 

>> demands so much and assigns a great deal of homework, the students often 

times 

>> rise to the challenge and sign up for other classes that he teaches. 

>> 

>> The students like him so much, that this year on his birthday which is on 

St. 

>> Patrick's Day, all three of his classes threw him a surprise birthday party 

>> each with their own theme. He had an idea that one of his classes was going 

to 

>> organize a party for him, but he was sure surprised when his first class 

>> enlisted the help of the assistant principal to get him out of the room. 

He's 

>> second class entered the room with a cake singing happy birthday. Each 

class 

>> brought in lots of balloons, decorations and tons of food. Everything was 

>> well-planned and organized. They even cleaned up afterwards. 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> The moral of this story is that being a good teacher pays off and that 

>> students do want to learn and they appreciate your efforts. 

>> 

>> I just wanted to share because this semester I became disillusioned with 

the 

>> idea of being a teacher. I'm inspired again. Thanks, Cecilia 

>> 

>> 

>> 

2116





Subject: RE: I have to brag...YEAH YOU DO! 

WOW!!! It sounds like your husband has worked so hard to truly make a 

difference in his students' lives. I'm sure that the recognition he gets 

from his students is a great reward in itself, but this teacher of the year 

award is the big kahuna. There's nothing better than truly feeling valued 

and appreciated by being a recipient of such a prestigious honor. Tell Mike 

congratulations for me. 

Yeah, you do have to brag. This is huge! 





>Subject: I have to brag... 

>Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2004 22:10:33 -0700 

> 

>I am going to brag because I'm bursting with pride! 

> 

> My husband Mike has been nominated for teacher of the year at Temescal 

>Canyon 

>high for five years in a row. This year he finally won! Yes, he was the 

>Susan 

>Lucci of the teacher of the year awards. He was always in the top-ten but 

>he 

>could never beat the coaches. At his school the coaches have a reputation 

>for 

>being easy and showing movies all the time. 

> 

>Does he deserve it? You better believe it! He is a hell of a dam good 

>teacher. 

>His door is always open before and after school for any student that needs 

>help or that just wants to get away from bullies. School gets out at 3:05, 

>and sometimes he doesn't come home until after 6:00. No, he's not having an 

>affair because all the female teachers are beauty-impaired, besides my best 

>friend and her husband also stay at school working late with him. He helps 

>the 

>students and then does his grading and preparing. 

> 

>I am very proud of my husband and I respect him as a teacher. I'm not just 

>saying this because he's my husband; he certainly won't win husband of the 

>year until he stops using my good kitchen towels to work in the garage. 

>This 

>award is significant because he upset the other teachers in his department 

>by 

>actually teaching and not showing movies. It is unbelievable how many 

>seasoned 

>teachers show movies. Mike never shows movies, unless it ties into what he 

>is 

>teaching. He is very enthusiastic in front of the class and has a wonderful 

>sense of humor. When he comes home he is often exhausted, but he loves 

>teaching. 

> 

>I have spent time in my husband's class as well as helped him on 

>Saturday's, 

2117


>great rapport with his students. The students respect him and he respects 

>them. He is not an easy teacher, he demands their best and expects to see 

>personal and intellectual growth in the classroom. Despite the fact that he 

>demands so much and assigns a great deal of homework, the students often 

>times 

>rise to the challenge and sign up for other classes that he teaches. 

> 

>The students like him so much, that this year on his birthday which is on 

>St. 

>Patrick's Day, all three of his classes threw him a surprise birthday party 

>each with their own theme. He had an idea that one of his classes was going 

>to 

>organize a party for him, but he was sure surprised when his first class 

>enlisted the help of the assistant principal to get him out of the room. 

>He's 

>second class entered the room with a cake singing happy birthday. Each 

>class 

>brought in lots of balloons, decorations and tons of food. Everything was 

>well-planned and organized. They even cleaned up afterwards. 

> 

> 

> 

>The moral of this story is that being a good teacher pays off and that 

>students do want to learn and they appreciate your efforts. 

> 

>I just wanted to share because this semester I became disillusioned with 

>the 

>idea of being a teacher. I'm inspired again. Thanks, Cecilia 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2118





Subject: Re: Re: In the spirit of Buddha... 

Attachments: reply; Emoticon15.gif 

reply (13 KB) Emoticon15.gif (282 

B) 

Karla, 

I am sorry to hear about your father. I felt the same you do that nobody could possibly 

have taken care of my father the way that I did. I have peace because I did everything to 

make his life comforable and most important loved him. I found comfort in spiritual 

passages that lead me to believe that when we die we become part of everything that goes 

beyond our understanding. Metaphorically, I find peace in knowing that my father if part 

of the earth that embraces me, the sky that covers me, the mountains that protect me, the 

water that bathe me, the plants that nourish my body, the fire that warmth my spirit, the 

inner child that remembers when he frist held me, and the God within me. May you find the 

inner strength, support, and deep knowing that the physical death is not the end but a new 

spiritual beginning. 

Namaste, "I honor the place in you in which the entire universe dwells. I honor the place 

in you which is of love, of truth, of light, and of peace. When you are in that place in 

you, and I am in that place in me, we are one," 

Alexandra 

> 

> From: "Karla Garduno" 

> Date: 2004/04/18 Sun PM 12:17:27 EDT 

> To: 

> Subject: Re: In the spirit of Buddha... 

> 

> Alexandra I wish I had the same power of being able to express myself, in a calm and 

relaxing manner I should say, in writing. I am too going through the emotions that you are 

going through except that in my case it is not a runaway child, but an ill old man, my 

father. With my brother being away in Afghanistan I feel that I am the one having to take 

care of everything and at times it gets to me. Even if my brother was to be here I don't 

think that he will take care of my father like I am taking care of him know. I have never 

had the thought of dropping the cohort but I have to tell you that the thought did cross 

my mind this semester. I figure that dropping the program will give me time to concentrate 

on my fathers health and maybe also to get away from having to deal with certain people 

and their big egos every Monday and Wednesday. 

> Good luck with your future endeavors, 

> Karla 


> From: hada@cox.net 



> Subject: In the spirit of Buddha... 

2119

> 

> April 16, 2004 

> 

> I call God by centering myself in the spirit of Buddha. Just now, I have awakened from 

a moment of meditation out on my deck. The day is warm, healing, and the birds are 

chirping their songs. I have prayed for Willie's safe return. God let me know that it is 

my work and my prayers that will bring him back. In that moment of meditation, I closed my 

eyes and just sat in stillness. Quieting my spirit, feeling peace, stillness, and silence 

was my focus. I could see dancing translucent colors in my mind. I felt the warmth and 

power of the sun, and the sun was God. All is God my spirit whispered. I saw the images 

like a drawing created in an arts class of the human anatomy with linear and abstract 

lines forming the torso of a man and a woman. I saw a fine translucent box filled with 

feather light pastel flowers. I felt a tingling sensation along my neckline as the soft 

breeze touched me. I have surrendered all of my worries. I felt so highly sensitive. I do 

not think that I hav 

e ev 

> er surrendered all of my worries and let the wind hold me. The beauty of prayer and 

stillness is like nothing else. For too long, I have been struggling to solve life alone. 

I have practiced and practiced and practiced yoga, ballet, journaling, prayer, candle 

rituals, reading spiritual books, and textbooks seeking wisdom, and the peace and 

stillness I feel today. 

> 

> I started my morning in silence and vowed not to speak until I felt at peace with the 

day. My mind, however, dictated the next thought, the next move, and fought to remain 

active while the rest of me walked in silence. My mind and my body were two separate 

beings. How could I bring them together? I listened for my inner voice to speak, also 

separate from my mind and my body. I was inspired to start my day in prayer. I bathed, 

drank plenty of water, and cleaned my house in prayer. Accomplishing my schoolwork, 

nurturing body with a nurturing breakfast, rushing through the day was no longer my 

illusion of a successful day. 

> 

> All of this was inspired by an experience that started yesterday. On my way home from 

school, I was feeling sad and emotional. So much has happened in the last couple of years, 

and I have not yet created time to grieve, surrender, and fall apart. The demands of 

school, raising boys, struggling to save a broken relationship, taking care of my father 

desperately fighting cancer?has claimed a part of me that I am still seeking to regain. 

Driving home, I broke down and allowed myself to cry. I looked around the freeway and all 

were crying with me while in their cars traveling in what seemed to be a funeral 

precession. All were rushing to the end. I could not help but think about mother's day 

just around the corner, and still I do not know where Willie sleeps at night. I know his 

habits, his needs, and sensitivity about things. Willie ran away last summer. He took one 

a family car, money out of savings, and met up with some people he met over the Internet. 

He was sixteen. He h 

as h 

> ad a birthday since, and I was not with him to celebrate. 

> 

> On my way home, I decided to stop and take a few pairs of pants that needed tailoring 

to a dry cleaner. They had been sitting in my car for a while, but I have not had the 

chance to take them to the Asian woman who tailors my clothes in Ocean Beach. I am 

particular about who tailors my clothes and Asian tailors have a way of understanding the 

body of a petite woman. I have been going to Anne's Tailoring for at least 10 years. I 

took a chance in decided to stop at the cleaners in my new neighborhood. Yes, the lost of 

Willie forced me to sale my old house in Santee with so many memories, the memories were 

to painful to live through day-after-day. Walking by the room he slept, not seeing him at 

the computer, missing his presence in the kitchen was too much. It was as if the only 

thing that remained was his ghost... To my surprise, an Asian woman greeted me, at the 

cleaners. She was warm and welcomed me with the most sincere smile as if she had been 

waiting for me. I tried on 

eac 

> h pants, and she pinned where they needed to be taken in. There was something 

strangely familiar, and I felt comfortable in lifting my blouse and letting her hands 

touch me in places forbidden to others. There was an instant bond between us. Sana, the 

tailor, began asking me about my path in life. She was curious about the kind of training 

I have been doing to create the body I live in. Her touch felt gentle and honoring, as if 

handling a fine China doll while she took measurements. She noticed my hands and commented 

2120

that even my hands were artistic. What is your path? She wanted to know. "I am going to 

school to become a teacher, I shared, which seemed a little strange to her. She revealed 

in her view of education that you cannot make a teacher but that a teacher was a selfcultivated 

person born with a gift based on openness and with the willingness to serve, 

which is exactly my sentiments about education. In her opinion, our education system was 

void of spirit, based 

on p 

> olitics, practicality, and money. She was most interested in knowing about me. 

> 

> I shared with her that I dance (ballet, modern?) and practice yoga when time allows. 

She was fixated with my hands and the way I moved by body. She acknowledged that I was on 

a good path but that I must branch out where my energy is not drained in a system that may 

not be in harmony with my spirit. Her vision of me was bigger than I was willing to 

accept. She smiled, you question the gift that God has given you because you are still in 

the process of becoming the master that you are destined to become if you trust and 

continue pursuing a path of consciousness and growth. Your body is the instrument, and it 

will serve you well because it was made with a purpose in mind. I can see your apparent 

willingness to serve God. You lack confidence my genie. You are already a teacher of life. 

She went on to further describe that with my body I will do God's work, for it is the 

instrument through which holy spirits can travel to help others for the greater good. She 

referred to me a 

s he 

> r genie a number of times. In my mind, I could only think of the genies in a bottle I 

have seen on T.V. (Once home, I looked up the word "genie" in the Webster's dictionary and 

learned that a genie is "a supernatural spirit that often takes human form usually serving 

the person who calls on it"). After a while, I understood that she was referring to me as 

some kind of guru. She says to me that I have something that she has been praying for all 

of her life. Sana spoke of God and Jesus with the spirit of a Buddha, which was 

interesting to me because if I were to sum up my sense of spirituality I would describe 

myself in the same way. She asked if I have ever considered Tai Chi, and I mentioned that 

it has been suggested by a few other encounters like the one we were having. Tai Chi she 

communicated was one way to explore the kind of healing work I could do on a spiritual 

level for a greater good. 

> 

> I noticed Sana's demeanor change, and she talked about feeling anxious. Her skin 

became moist and her eyes filled with tears. She asked me what was weighing so heaving on 

me. She communicated that it was not her own anxiety coming through. I felt sense of 

comfort with her like the world around us stopped while I visited the small cleaners. It 

is as if only she and I existed. I share with her that my middle son, Willie, has runaway 

from home. She says to me, you know what happened. And answers in the same breath that my 

life got too busy and when that happens things fall apart. She goes on to tell me that for 

a long time I have been balancing out my life in a way that most people are incapable of 

doing. She mentioned that Willie needed me the most and he could see that I was already 

spread too thin. She urged me to go home and set everything aside and then sit in 

stillness, and pray to Jesus because I had the power to do God's work. She mentioned that 

Willie is an internal 

par 

> t of me and until he is safe and at peace, I will not be at peace. I communicated to 

her that Willie was introverted and could only commune with me when I was centered in 

Buddha. He needed a level of peace and acceptance that was unconditional, yet the fact 

that he was abandoned by his mother and father never allowed him the ease to let anyone in 

including me that has been raising him since he was two-year-old. I was not able to reach 

him, and I will live my life trying to figure out why. She asked me not to blame myself 

for my willingness to do God's work was so apparent and this had more to do with outside 

forces from all around demanding my energy. She mentioned that the anxiety she was feeling 

was not hers but Willie's. She urged me again to clear my life and pray for Willie's safe 

return because he desperately needed me. I shared with her that interesting enough I have 

delayed my graduation by a semester because I was feeling a sense of urgency to open my 

life mor 

e an 

> d take in the each process including my path towards becoming a teacher. I wonder 

what Carl Sagan would say about this experience. Here we have a grieving mother comforted 

by an Asian women working in a small cleaner doing God's work. Given my respect for people 

who seek wisdom through spiritual work and branching out intellectually to develop a sense 

of intellectual identity, I support both science and religion and believe like the 

seventeenth-century German astronomer Johannes Kepler, which "describe his pursuit of 

2121

science as a wish to know the mind of God." (Alexandra's Journal #12) 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

2122





Subject: Karla may you find the strength... 

Karla, 

I am sorry to hear about your father. I felt the same you do that nobody could possibly 

have taken care of my father the way that I did. I have peace because I did everything to 

make his life comforable and most important loved him. I 

found comfort in spiritual passages that lead me to believe that when we die we become 

part of everything that goes beyond our understanding. Metaphorically, I find peace in 

knowing that my father if part of the earth that embraces me, the sky that covers me, the 

mountains that protect me, the water that bathes me, the plants that nourish my body, the 

fire that warmth my spirit, the inner child that remembers when he first held me, and the 

God within me. May you find the inner strength, support, and deep knowing that the 

physical death is not the end but a new spiritual beginning. 

Namaste, "I honor the place in you in which the entire universe dwells. I honor the place 

in you which is of love, of truth, of light, and of peace. When you are in that place in 

you, and I am in that place in me, we are one," 

Alexandra 

2123





Subject: Journal: The agony of it all 

So when you get your CSET scores, they send you one e-mail at a time letting 

you know if you passed or failed, no actual scores. One at a time meaning 

you get one for each of the 3 sections. So with each passing click the 

excitement and worry intensify exponentially. Although, i was told by the 

CSET website that my scores would be available after 5pm, so it was a nice 

surprise when i got the emails around 2. 

What I actually wanted to journalize about, was an event that i attended 

last friday night. It was a Teacher Recognition Dinner at the La Costa 

Resort. I was given a free ticket by one of the teachers that I work with in 

thanks for all my volunteering. Specifically my trips to Palm Springs to 

train to be judge, and subsequently judge the Odyssey of the Mind regional 

tournament. What the dinner was, was an awards ceremony put on by the 

Carlsbad Chamber of Commerce. Teachers from the Carlsbad and Encinitas 

school districts are nominated based on special programs that run for their 

kids. All night I was treated to a fancy dinner, and around 16 looks at 

fantastic teachers and things that they do that have nothing to do with the 

standards, and are rewarded with cash and glory. The programs ranged from 

using claymation to teach literature to a class working with a refugee boy 

from Sudan. All of the winners were genuinely touched to be recognized for 

their efforts, but what it seemed like to me was that these programs 

represented the teachers doing what really made them happy. They have to 

teach to the standards if they want a job, but things like this that go 

above and beyond the call of duty show what a teacher is really made out of. 

The entire night i was thinking of how i can tie in things I like to do 

with ways to teach kids. I have a few ideas, which will be honed and 

sharpened until i get tenure and am free to experiment with such things. I 

just thought that everyone should be thinking about what it is about their 

own interests that they could bring to the kids in a way that benefits 

everyone. I know this is something that is actually useful in our careers, 

and as such, goes against nearly everything the college of ed stands for, 

but give it a shot anyway. I find the more I think about teaching, and the 

less I think about CSUSM, the happier I am! 

Oh, and as for my e-mails: 

Pass 

Pass 

Pass 

I guess I'm highly qualified now. Do i still have to go to school? 

_________________________________________________________________ 


Premium! 


2124





Subject: Response to Joey on Maxwell, Science, Ed. 

April 20, 2003 

It seems that in a society so rich that the Maxwell of our time may follow the same fate 

as James Clerk Maxwell had in his early years of childhood that reflected the life of a 

nerdy boy who was ridiculed for his oddness, rather than praised for his exploration and 

sense of wonder. Yet, Maxwell at least had the self-motivation, determination, and his 

sense of wonder was not threatened. How did Maxwell manage to pursue his wonder of the 

Universe? Did the education of his day reflect a system of standards void of, the human 

quality Professor Dome asked us to think about, 

?A sense of happiness 

?What does it mean to promote the sustainability of human civilization 

?How the environment impact human life/animal 

?The awareness of the way we treat one another 

?Awareness of poverty 

?How violence impact us today 

?How to resolve conflict 

?Teaching about love 

?Teaching Justice 

?Understanding the impact of injustice 

?Search for truth 

?How to develop character 

Fortunately today, we are all benefiting from James Maxwell's greatest contribution of how 

"electricity and magnetism [...] join together to become light." (Sagan 386). However, the 

Maxwell of our day may never fully explore their sense of wonder considering the lack of 

support in the areas of science that promotes skepticism because it challenges our 

establishment and the opinions of the few in power as Sagan would say. The lack of support 

in the science and standards that are void, for example, of promoting character, a sense 

of justice, awareness of poverty and our role in cultivating violence deprives the Maxwell 

of today the nurturing to pursue science or their highest interest. In deciding if we 

should invest money in preparing for some future battle or whether investing in the study 

of the stars, we need to keep in mind that "microwave relays, and communication satellites 

traces directly back to Maxwell" (Sagan 392). Maxwell's contribution "may have been the 

decisive e 

lement in the Battle of Britain and in the Nazi defeat in World War II" (Sagan 392). Is 

the real question whether we are lacking the money in education to promote the Maxwell of 

today or that the funds in place do not promote science because skepticism threatens those 

in power? Thinkers and skeptics challenge our "economic, or social, or political, or 

religious institutions" and this would challenge the status-quo (Sagan 416). We cannot 

blame the outcome of our children on the institutions' lack off funds but need to look at 

the teachers and the lack of humanity in the educational system. 

In the words of Krishnamurti: 

?The right kind of education should also help the student to discover what he is most 

interested in. 

?Right education should help the student, not only to develop his capacities, but to 

understand his own highest interest. 

?If the educator is concerned with the freedom of the individual, and not with his own 

preconceptions, he will help the child to discover that freedom by encouraging him to 

understand his own environment, his own temperament, his religious and family background. 

?An educator is not merely a giver of information; he is one who points the way to wisdom, 

to truth. Truth is far more important than the teacher. 

?To create a new society, each one of us has to be a true teacher, which means that we 

have to be both the pupil and the master; we have to educate ourselves. 

?If a new social order is to be established, those who teach merely to earn a salary can 

2125

obviously have no place as teachers. To regard education as a means of livelihood is to 

exploit the children for one's own advantage. 

?The true teacher is inwardly rich and therefore asks nothing for himself; he is not 

ambitious and seeks no power in any form; he does not use teaching as a means of acquiring 

position or authority, and therefore he is free from the compulsion of society and the 

control of governments. 

(Alexandra's Journal #13) 

2126





Subject: RE: Journal: The agony of it all 

Congratulations on passing Mike! ~ Louise 





Subject: Journal: The agony of it all 

So when you get your CSET scores, they send you one e-mail at a time 

letting 

you know if you passed or failed, no actual scores. One at a time 

meaning 

you get one for each of the 3 sections. So with each passing click the 

excitement and worry intensify exponentially. Although, i was told by 

the 

CSET website that my scores would be available after 5pm, so it was a 

nice 

surprise when i got the emails around 2. 

What I actually wanted to journalize about, was an event that i attended 

last friday night. It was a Teacher Recognition Dinner at the La Costa 

Resort. I was given a free ticket by one of the teachers that I work 

with in 

thanks for all my volunteering. Specifically my trips to Palm Springs to 

train to be judge, and subsequently judge the Odyssey of the Mind 

regional 

tournament. What the dinner was, was an awards ceremony put on by the 

Carlsbad Chamber of Commerce. Teachers from the Carlsbad and Encinitas 

school districts are nominated based on special programs that run for 

their 

kids. All night I was treated to a fancy dinner, and around 16 looks at 

fantastic teachers and things that they do that have nothing to do with 

the 

standards, and are rewarded with cash and glory. The programs ranged 

from 

using claymation to teach literature to a class working with a refugee 

boy 

from Sudan. All of the winners were genuinely touched to be recognized 

for 

their efforts, but what it seemed like to me was that these programs 

represented the teachers doing what really made them happy. They have 

to 

teach to the standards if they want a job, but things like this that go 

above and beyond the call of duty show what a teacher is really made out 

of. 

The entire night i was thinking of how i can tie in things I like to do 

with ways to teach kids. I have a few ideas, which will be honed and 

sharpened until i get tenure and am free to experiment with such things. 

I 

just thought that everyone should be thinking about what it is about 

their 

2127

own interests that they could bring to the kids in a way that benefits 

everyone. I know this is something that is actually useful in our 

careers, 

and as such, goes against nearly everything the college of ed stands 

for, 

but give it a shot anyway. I find the more I think about teaching, and 

the 

less I think about CSUSM, the happier I am! 

Oh, and as for my e-mails: 

Pass 

Pass 

Pass 

I guess I'm highly qualified now. Do i still have to go to school? 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with 

MSN 

Premium! 

http://join.msn.com/?page=features/mlb&pgmarket=en-us/go/onm00200439ave/ 

direct/01/ 

2128





Subject: Scary moment! 

Mother enters her daughter's bedroom & sees a letter over the bed. 

With the worst premonition, she reads it, with trembling hands: 

It is with great regret & sorrow that I'm telling you that I eloped with 

my new boyfriend. I found real passion & he is so nice, with all his 

piercings & tattoos & his big motorcycle. 

But it's not only that mom, I'm pregnant & Ahmed said that we will be 

very happy in his trailer in the woods. He wants to have many more 

children with me & that's one of my dreams. 

I've learned that marijuana doesn't hurt anyone & we'll be growing it 

for us & his friends, who are providing us with all the cocaine & 

ecstasies we may want. In the meantime, we'll pray for the science to 

find the AIDS cure, for Ahmed to get better, he deserves it. 

Don't worry Mom, I'm 15 years old now & I know how to take care of 

myself. Some day I'll visit for you to get to know your grandchildren. 

love your daughter Judith 

PS: Mom, it's not true. I'm at the neighbour's house. I just wanted to 

show 

you that there are worse things in life than the school's report card 

that's in my desk drawer...I love you 

2129





Subject: Re: Scary moment! 

LOL, Someone sent me the same joke earlier today! Cynthia 


Mother enters her daughter's bedroom & sees a letter over the bed. 

With the worst premonition, she reads it, with trembling hands: 

It is with great regret & sorrow that I'm telling you that I eloped with 

my new boyfriend. I found real passion & he is so nice, with all his 

piercings & tattoos & his big motorcycle. 

But it's not only that mom, I'm pregnant & Ahmed said that we will be 

very happy in his trailer in the woods. He wants to have many more 

children with me & that's one of my dreams. 

I've learned that marijuana doesn't hurt anyone & we'll be growing it 

for us & his friends, who are providing us with all the cocaine & 

ecstasies we may want. In the meantime, we'll pray for the science to 

find the AIDS cure, for Ahmed to get better, he deserves it. 

Don't worry Mom, I'm 15 years old now & I know how to take care of 

myself. Some day I'll visit for you to get to know your grandchildre n. 

love your daughter Judith 

PS: Mom, it's not true. I'm at the neighbour's house. I just wanted to 

show 

you that there are worse things in life than the school's report card 

that's in my desk drawer...I love you 

_____ 



2130





Subject: RE: Journal: Mike 

Mike congratulations! and................ you make me sick. (But i'm still 

happy for you) 




>Subject: Journal: The agony of it all 

>Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 23:46:12 -0700 

> 

>So when you get your CSET scores, they send you one e-mail at a time 

>letting you know if you passed or failed, no actual scores. One at a time 

>meaning you get one for each of the 3 sections. So with each passing click 

>the excitement and worry intensify exponentially. Although, i was told by 

>the CSET website that my scores would be available after 5pm, so it was a 

>nice surprise when i got the emails around 2. 

> 

>What I actually wanted to journalize about, was an event that i attended 

>last friday night. It was a Teacher Recognition Dinner at the La Costa 

>Resort. I was given a free ticket by one of the teachers that I work with 

>in thanks for all my volunteering. Specifically my trips to Palm Springs to 

>train to be judge, and subsequently judge the Odyssey of the Mind regional 

>tournament. What the dinner was, was an awards ceremony put on by the 

>Carlsbad Chamber of Commerce. Teachers from the Carlsbad and Encinitas 

>school districts are nominated based on special programs that run for their 

>kids. All night I was treated to a fancy dinner, and around 16 looks at 

>fantastic teachers and things that they do that have nothing to do with the 

>standards, and are rewarded with cash and glory. The programs ranged from 

>using claymation to teach literature to a class working with a refugee boy 

>from Sudan. All of the winners were genuinely touched to be recognized for 

>their efforts, but what it seemed like to me was that these programs 

>represented the teachers doing what really made them happy. They have to 

>teach to the standards if they want a job, but things like this that go 

>above and beyond the call of duty show what a teacher is really made out 

>of. The entire night i was thinking of how i can tie in things I like to do 

> with ways to teach kids. I have a few ideas, which will be honed and 

>sharpened until i get tenure and am free to experiment with such things. I 

>just thought that everyone should be thinking about what it is about their 

>own interests that they could bring to the kids in a way that benefits 

>everyone. I know this is something that is actually useful in our careers, 

>and as such, goes against nearly everything the college of ed stands for, 

>but give it a shot anyway. I find the more I think about teaching, and the 

>less I think about CSUSM, the happier I am! 

> 

>Oh, and as for my e-mails: 

> 

>Pass 

>Pass 

>Pass 

> 

>I guess I'm highly qualified now. Do i still have to go to school? 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 


>Premium! 


2131

_________________________________________________________________ 



2132




To: journal 

Subject: real patriots ask questions 

This is my favorite chapter in the whole Sagan book. I read it earlier in the semester when I was 

flipping through looking for something interesting to read. I read it again today because it was 

assigned, and it was just as good this time through. Like Sagan, I am also a big fan of Thomas 

Jefferson. He is the epitome of what we want our students to be. But alas, times are so different now. 

Back then, necessity demanded the most out of people; today we get by with being mediocre. And so 

we lower our standards. We don't expect the best out of people, we want the easy road. 

My one complaint about this chapter is that the 2 quotes he cited as examples of free speech were 

both by Christian fanatics. Seems like he could have used one from the other side of the fence (like 

ELF), just for balance. There are plenty of wackos out there, and they aren't all Christians. 

Best quote: "If a nation expects to be both ignorant and free in a state of civilization, it expects what 

never was and never will be". Thomas Jefferson 

Sagan talks about how everything is an experiment, including our government and all the laws we 

pass. Well, so is our educational system. He also says we don't learn from history. This is probably 

true too. Why were our founding fathers so educated? Why can't our students even learn to read? 

What part of our educational experiment is failing? I think it is time for a new experiment, or maybe an 

old one, like Jefferson was subjected to. It worked for him, could it work for our students today? 

Cynthia 

_____ 



2133





Subject: RE: Scary moment! 

Dude that's not even cool. That should get the sickest joke of the year 

award. 

How is the unit plan going. Tell me if or how I can help. Marin 

>Mother enters her daughter's bedroom & sees a letter over the bed. 

>With the worst premonition, she reads it, with trembling hands: 

>It is with great regret & sorrow that I'm telling you that I eloped with 

>my new boyfriend. I found real passion & he is so nice, with all his 

>piercings & tattoos & his big motorcycle. 

>But it's not only that mom, I'm pregnant & Ahmed said that we will be 

>very happy in his trailer in the woods. He wants to have many more 

>children with me & that's one of my dreams. 

>I've learned that marijuana doesn't hurt anyone & we'll be growing it 

>for us & his friends, who are providing us with all the cocaine & 

>ecstasies we may want. In the meantime, we'll pray for the science to 

>find the AIDS cure, for Ahmed to get better, he deserves it. 

>Don't worry Mom, I'm 15 years old now & I know how to take care of 

>myself. Some day I'll visit for you to get to know your grandchildren. 

> 

>love your daughter Judith 

> 

>PS: Mom, it's not true. I'm at the neighbour's house. I just wanted to 

>show 

>you that there are worse things in life than the school's report card 

>that's in my desk drawer...I love you 

2134





Subject: Journal or somthing like it 

I like the point that Cynthia brought up about the witch hunts being an 

analogy to scapegoating the lack of success of our students. I was thinking 

the same thing after the readings. First I thought, what is really the point 

of this, then I realized that this can easily be connectedto not only our 

failing students, but racism (like Matheno said) and other witch hunts that 

exist today (didn't we already find Saddam?). I also starting thinking about 

this semester and how engaged I really am (or am not) this semester. 

Yamashita said we chose our amount of participation and engagement. This of 

course is true. However, it is important to take into account that humans 

have time management in which they have to pick and chose what is worthy of 

engaging themselves in. 

Another thought, In my social psychology class (I know you are probably all 

sick of my psych talk, but tough!) we were discussing how America is a very 

individualistic society. Experiments have proven that the average American is 

more productive when working alone than in groups. It is not the case for 

more collectivistic cultures (i.e.- China) in which they not only are more 

productive in a group setting, but they feel extremely uncomfortable working 

alone. As I was reading over the studies (I won't bore you with those, unless 

you ask)I was thinking about how integrated group work is in all of our 

classes. If "they" looked at the reseach, they would see that most of us work 

better alone. Maybe, just maybe they are trying to make us better at group 

work. Do I plan to expect my students to work in groups? You betcha, but 

certainly not all the time. Teachers have to look at group work as a way to 

have more individual attention, then as a whole class. Ramble, ramble!! 

Lastly, over the course of this semester I have been keeping track of all the 

e-mails sent on this list serve. I have made a composite of who writes about 

what and to who. I intend to share my findings with the class as soon as it 

is more organized. I started this project after I realized that certain 

people chose not to speak of certian topics or respond to others. So with the 

help of Prof. Yamashita, I got all the previous e-mails and I am making a grid 

that I think you will all find very interesting. 

-Chula 

2135





Subject: Re: Journal or somthing like it 

So, Chula, are we your lab rats? LOL. I think that is very cool, wish I would have thought of it. Must be 

all those psych classes you are taking. I like the references, so don't leave them out of your journals. 

I found what you said about working in groups and various cultures very interesting. The idea of trying 

to change our culture through education is a bit scary, reminds me of communism. Think that is the 

ultimate plan? We are an individualistic society, and I don't have a problem with it staying that way. 

Of course, if used for the wrong reasons or in the wrong way, it can be a bad thing, but that is true of 

anything, including group work. It makes me think about the books "The Giver" and "Anthem". Take 

away the I and the individual, people are easier to control that way. It's not what I want for this 

country. 

Cynthia 


I like the point that Cynthia brought up about the witch hunts being an 

analogy to scapegoating the lack of success of our students. I was thinking 

the same thing after the readings. First I thought, what is really the point 

of this, then I realized that this can easily be connectedto not only our 


exist today (didn't we already find Saddam?). I also starting thinking about 


Yamashita said we chose our amount of participation and engagement. This of 


have time management in which they have to pick and chose what is worthy of 

engaging themselves in. 

Another thought, In my social psychology class (I know you are probably all 

sick of my psych talk, but tough!) we were discussing how America is a very 

individualistic society. Experiments have proven that the average American is 

more productive when working alone than in groups. It is not the case for 

more collectivistic cultures (i.e.- China) in which they not only are more 

productive in a group setting, but they feel extremely uncomfortable working 

alone. As I was reading over the studies (I won't bore you with those, unless 

you ask)I was thinking about how integrated group work is in all of our 

classes. If "they" looked at the reseach, they would see that most of us work 

better alone. Maybe, just maybe they are trying to make us better at group 

work. Do I plan to expect my students to work in groups? You betcha, but 

certainly not all the time. Teachers have to look at group work as a way to 

have more individual attention, then as a whole class. Ramble, ramble!! 

Lastly, over the course of thi s semester I have been keeping track of all the 

e-mails sent on this list serve. I have made a composite of who writes about 

what and to who. I intend to share my findings with the class as soon as it 

is more organized. I started this project after I realized that certain 

people chose not to speak of certian topics or respond to others. So with the 

help of Prof. Yamashita, I got all the previous e-mails and I am making a grid 

2136

that I think you will all find very interesting. 

-Chula 

_____ 



2137






Bruer actually had some great quotes for any teacher to remember. 

“If children are to learn the appropriate representations, which include both 

schemas and production rules, we also have to teach them general strategies 

(weak methods) and teach them to be aware of and to control their mental 

processing (metacognition). 

and 

“We can teach children how to learn if we change our representations of 

intelligence and learning. 

To me this is saying that teachers need not only to give their students enough 

info on a particular topic, but must find a way to make it more interesting 

and invloved in the students learning. Find a way for the students to be able 

to apply it so that you know they have learned something. 

“Expert teachers, like experts in other domains, have implicit 

knowledge-knowledge they are no longer aware of because it is so highly 

practiced and automatic. 

I hope after a couple years of teaching, that my knowledge of particular 

topics will be more "automatic" for me to already know about and be ready to 

answer questions about as well. 

“Researchers know about the cognitive capacities of children, but often lack 

the rich understanding of the audience that comes from daily classroom 

experience, Teachers have pedagogical content knowledge; researchers often do 

not. If we want to transform our research knowledge, we have to bring these 

two domains of expertise together. Thus, classroom teachers should be involved 

in the planning process, collaborating with researchers in designing and 

conducting instructional research. 

This means that the teachers and science experts come together and talk about 

science in general and how to apply it to science in the classrooms. The 

teachers and the science experts are becoming a team or community where there 

will be a wide range of knowledge right there to discuss about. 

In the National Science Standards, I so a connection of Bruer's community of 

learners with a particular standard. 

Standard F- “Schools must work as communities that encourage, support, and 

sustain teachers as they implement as effective science program. 

Again, communinties but this time just talking about schools in general. Not 

only just for the knowledge, but also for motivation and guidance for 

teachers. 

Then there was this standard that explained that with understanding science, 

we must also understand mathematics. 

Standard C- “The science program should be coordinated with the mathematics 

program to enhance student use and understanding of mathematics in the study 

of science and to improve student understanding of mathematics. 

Sagan actually used a quote which I thought went right along with the 

connection between science and mathematics. 

2138

“There’s no way we can get a feeling for what Maxwell did without looking at a 

little mathematics. 

Maxwell was a famous scientist that discovered many things, and to even 

understand any of his discoveries we must use math to help clarify it. 

Without the help of the experiments of Ampere, Biot, Oersted and Faraday, we 

wouldn’t be able to understand what Maxwell had accomplished. Therefore, this 

is like a community of knowledge. 

Again, this is like a community of learners. With the experiments of other 

scientists along with Maxwell, we can have a better understanding of science. 

Well, I think I made some great conections within this week's readings. Sorry 

for being such a long journal reading. 

Laurie :) 

2139




To: ICP-F 

Subject: RE: Scary moment! 

THATS TOO FUNNY J0NATHAN 

2140






It is interesting to see how the list-serve has 

functioned in our cohort, and it will also be 

interesting to see Chula’s analysis of the entries 

from the semester. It seems as though the list-serve 

followed the natural form of any assignment or class 

that students in this cohort have experienced. The 

beginning of the semester started off strong, people 

were engaged and were putting a lot of effort into 

what they wrote, some making insightful connections, 

some being safe and complying with what assumed 

expectations, and some just going around in 

close-minded circles. Now that the semester is coming 

to a close, everyone has become less engaged/invested 

and the postings have diminished in the numbers 

posted, length, and meaningful content, yet we now 

have the opportunity to analyze and gain deeper 

insight into ourselves, and grow as individuals. 

The pattern described is a common pattern for our 

cohort though, as every semester has demonstrated that 

we, as students, become tired of the routines and 

eventually only do what we can to get to the end of 

the semester. This is a generalized observation. 

However, through honest analysis of oneself and the 

cohort as a collective, it would be surprising if not 

everyone in the cohort can identify these sentiments 

among their colleagues or find patterns of 

disengagement and decreased investment within 

themselves, either in practice or in thought. 

It has also been interesting to analyze myself 

within this semester. With the final self-analysis 

coming up soon, I would doubt that I am the only one 

thinking about my patterns and trying to make meaning 

of all the data points. But in this process there is 

a continuous internal battle going on within my mind 

between perceived patterns and explanations for 

behavior, and personal justifications for behavior. 

My mind seems to have defense mechanisms against its 

own analytical self. Yet I find that when these 

defense mechanisms are overcome, self analysis a 

humbling and restorative process, as I have been 

learning much about myself through this whole process, 

which will undoubtedly lead to further personal 

growth. For those of my colleagues who feel that 

their time has been wasted, consider this: “It is 

only when you see what you are doing is of no value, 

that it really is.” Michael Renner 

__________________________________________________ 

Do You Yahoo!? 

Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 


2141





Subject: RE: Journal or something like it - Jennifer R.'s Response 

Chula's journal got me thinking a little bit more about group work and the 

purpose of it. First, we don't work in groups ALL of the time, it is just 

this semester that we have worked in groups a lot more than any other 

semester (or time in our lives, maybe). Nevertheless, although we may do 

better working as individuals, I think our group projects and assignments 

are gearing us up for our soon to be professions. In order to better one's 

self I believe that collaboration is a very important component. It is so 

easy to get wrapped up in one's own work and way of thinking that we almost 

get trapped if we don't ever take into consideration another view point or 

another way of successfully doing things. For example, as teachers, there 

will be many times when we will be expected to communicate with other 

teachers, parents, and students to to work things out. This is group work. 

In fact, we do a lot more group work than we give thought to. When we ask a 

person their opinion or how they teach a lesson, this is working with 

another individual to formulate one's own ideas or ways of teaching. In a 

sense this is also group work. Of course, there will be many times when we 

do not engage in group work per se, but group work will be a significant 

part of our lives, hopefully. All of this group work we are doing this 

semester is just more practice for the real world. 


>From: silco001 



>Subject: Journal or somthing like it 

>Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 21:14:54 -0700 

> 

>I like the point that Cynthia brought up about the witch hunts being an 

>analogy to scapegoating the lack of success of our students. I was 

>thinking 

>the same thing after the readings. First I thought, what is really the 

>point 

>of this, then I realized that this can easily be connectedto not only our 

>failing students, but racism (like Matheno said) and other witch hunts that 

>exist today (didn't we already find Saddam?). I also starting thinking 

>about 

>this semester and how engaged I really am (or am not) this semester. 

>Yamashita said we chose our amount of participation and engagement. This of 

>course is true. However, it is important to take into account that humans 

>have time management in which they have to pick and chose what is worthy of 

>engaging themselves in. 

> 

>Another thought, In my social psychology class (I know you are probably all 

>sick of my psych talk, but tough!) we were discussing how America is a very 

>individualistic society. Experiments have proven that the average American 

>is 

>more productive when working alone than in groups. It is not the case for 

>more collectivistic cultures (i.e.- China) in which they not only are more 

>productive in a group setting, but they feel extremely uncomfortable 

>working 

>alone. As I was reading over the studies (I won't bore you with those, 

>unless 

>you ask)I was thinking about how integrated group work is in all of our 

>classes. If "they" looked at the reseach, they would see that most of us 

2142

work 

>better alone. Maybe, just maybe they are trying to make us better at group 

>work. Do I plan to expect my students to work in groups? You betcha, but 

>certainly not all the time. Teachers have to look at group work as a way 

>to 

>have more individual attention, then as a whole class. Ramble, ramble!! 

> 

>Lastly, over the course of this semester I have been keeping track of all 

>the 

>e-mails sent on this list serve. I have made a composite of who writes 

>about 

>what and to who. I intend to share my findings with the class as soon as 

>it 

>is more organized. I started this project after I realized that certain 

>people chose not to speak of certian topics or respond to others. So with 

>the 

>help of Prof. Yamashita, I got all the previous e-mails and I am making a 

>grid 

>that I think you will all find very interesting. 

>-Chula 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2143






Jennifer, You make some really good points. Just because we will be in our own classrooms, we will 

still be a part of a team. And I think the team work aspect can probably make or break a school. I 

guess you could say that is "looking at the bigger picture". 

Cynthia 


Chula's journal got me thinking a little bit more about group work and the 

purpose of it. First, we don't work in groups ALL of the time, it is just 

this semester that we have worked in groups a lot more than any other 


better working as individuals, I think our group projects and assignments 

are gearing us up for our soon to be professions. In order to better one's 

self I believe that collaboration is a very important component. It is so 

easy to get wrapped up in one's own work and way of thinking that we almost 

get trapped if we don't ever take into consideration another view point or 

another way of successfully doing things. For example, as teachers, there 

will be many times when we will be expected to communicate with other 

teachers, parents, and students to to work things out. This is group work. 

In fact, we do a lot more group work than we give thought to. When we ask a 

person their opinion or how they teach a lesson, this is working with 

another individual to formulate one's own ideas or ways of teaching. In a 

sense this is also group work. Of course, there will be many times when we 

do not engage in group work per se, but group work will be a significant 

part of our lives, hopefully. All of this group work we are doing this 

semester is just more practice for the real world. 





>Subject: Journal or somthing like it 

>Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 21:14:54 -0700 

> 

>I like the point that Cynthia brought up about the witch hunts being an 

>analogy to scapegoating the lack of success of our students. I was 

>thinking 

>the same thing after the readin gs. First I thought, what is really the 

>point 

>of this, then I realized that this can easily be connectedto not only our 

>failing students, but racism (like Matheno said) and other witch hunts that 

>exist today (didn't we already find Saddam?). I also starting thinking 

>about 

2144


>Yamashita said we chose our amount of participation and engagement. This of 

>course is true. However, it is important to take into account that humans 

>have time management in which they have to pick and chose what is worthy of 

>engaging themselves in. 

> 

>Another thought, In my social psychology class (I know you are probably all 

>sick of my psych talk, but tough!) we were discussing how America is a very 

>individualistic society. Experiments have proven that the average American 

>is 

>more productive when working alone than in groups. It i s not the case for 

>more collectivistic cultures (i.e.- China) in which they not only are more 

>productive in a group setting, but they feel extremely uncomfortable 

>working 

>alone. As I was reading over the studies (I won't bore you with those, 

>unless 

>you ask)I was thinking about how integrated group work is in all of our 

>classes. If "they" looked at the reseach, they would see that most of us 

>work 

>better alone. Maybe, just maybe they are trying to make us better at group 

>work. Do I plan to expect my students to work in groups? You betcha, but 

>certainly not all the time. Teachers have to look at group work as a way 

>to 

>have more individual attention, then as a whole class. Ramble, ramble!! 

> 

>Lastly, over the course of this semester I have been keeping track of all 

>the 

>e-mails sent on this list serve. I have made a composite of who writes 

>about 

>what and to who. I intend to share my findings with the class as soon as 

>it 

>is more organized. I started this project after I realized that certain 

>people chose not to speak of certian topics or respond to others. So with 

>the 

>help of Prof. Yamashita, I got all the previous e-mails and I am making a 

>grid 

>that I think you will all find very interesting. 

>-Chula 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



2145




To: LBST 361B 


Hola, 

While I was on the internet, I came across an article about the possibilities 

of an strong earthquake in Mexico. 

The article says that Mexico faces high possibilities of experiencing an 

earthquake of that magnitude that affected Mexico City in 1985. 

The zone that could be affected the most is the coast of the state of 

Guerrero. Interesting enough this place is called "silencio sismico" (seismic 

silence)because since 1911 there hasn't been an earthquake, but the seismic 

alert is on. 

There is great preocupation because a third of the Mexican population lives in 

high and very high areas of seismic danger. A program for protection against 

earthquakes has been created, but there is much to be done for the population 

to be ready. 

A person who lives in the gullies said, "'Dios no permita que 'aiga' un 

temblor fuerte porque ahí caemos unos arriba de otros'" (God does not allow 

that there is an earthquake because we would fall on top on each other). 

I know this might sound out of topic, but I had to share it with you since I 

experience the earthquake in 1985. Although I lived 2 hours away from the 

epicentre, the earthquake was still felt where I lived. By reading the article 

reminded me of the horrible experience Mexicans faced that year. If that were 

to repeat, I am not sure the population would be ready. Although the 

earthquake in 1985 happened 19 years ago, it's still in the memory of many. 

I found the article in Spanish. If you want to check it out, here is the link. 

http://www.esmas.com/noticierostelevisa/losreporteros/358557.html 

Cuidense, 

Judith :-) 

2146





Subject: Re: journal 13 plus my journal 

I feel like I have been out of the loop with school this past week, in fact, out of the loop with life too, 

(or maybe that's where I always am?). My cats are glad to have someone to lay around in bed with. 

In fact, I am debating on whether I want to continue to go to school or just become a cat? We'll 

see......"meow" "purrr-purrrr"... 

As far as the list serve goes, I have learned a lot about myself over the semester. Somethings I've 

already known, but yet I still do like an ingrained pattern. But I think the biggest thing I have learned 

this semester is about people. I guess people in general.... how far, how involved, how not involved 

they choose to invest themselves into topics in life. Everyone has their comfort zones that they pretty 

much live most of their lives in. Sometimes these comfort zones get bigger and include new areas, 

but sometimes they remain the same throughout one's life span. Kind of like evolution... Do we grow 

and adapt to the new ideas and social situations of our current times? Or do we hold onto for dear 

life what we are familiar with or what we are comfortable with? Or do some of us even regress to 

much simpler times..... meow, meow.....?????? 

See You Soon, 

Ann 


It is interesting to see how the list-serve has 

functioned in our cohort, and it will also be 

interesting to see Chula’s analysis of the entries 

from the semester. It seems as though the list-serve 

followed the natural form of any assignment or class 

that students in this cohort have experienced. The 

beginning of the semester started off strong, people 

were engaged and were putting a lot of effort into 

what they wrote, some making insightful connections, 

some being safe and complying with what assumed 

expectations, and some just going around in 

close-minded circles. Now that the semester is coming 

to a close, everyone has become less engaged/invested 

and the postings have diminished in the numbers 

posted, length, and meaningful content, yet we now 

have the opportunity to analyze and gain deeper 

insight into ourselves, and grow as individuals. 

The pattern described is a common pattern for our 

cohort though, as every semester has demonstrated that 

we, as students, become tired of the routines and 

eventually only do what we can to get to the end of 

the semester. This is a generalized observation. 

However, through honest analysis of oneself and the 

cohort as a collective, it would be surprising if not 

everyone in the cohort can identify these sentiments 

among their colleagues or find patterns of 

2147

disengagement and decreased investment within 

themselves, either in practice or in thought. 

It has also been interesting to analyze myself 

within this semester. With the final self-analysis 

coming up soon, I would doubt that I am the only one 

thinking about my patterns and trying to make meaning 

of all the data points. But in this process there is 

a continuous internal battle going on within my mind 

between perceived patterns and explanations for 

behavior , and personal justifications for behavior. 

My mind seems to have defense mechanisms against its 

own analytical self. Yet I find that when these 

defense mechanisms are overcome, self analysis a 

humbling and restorative process, as I have been 

learning much about myself through this whole process, 

which will undoubtedly lead to further personal 

growth. For those of my colleagues who feel that 

their time has been wasted, consider this: “It is 

only when you see what you are doing is of no value, 

that it really is.” Michael Renner 

__________________________________________________ 




_____ 



2148





Subject: RE: journal 13...earthquakes - Jennifer R.'s Response 

Judith, 

I was in the San Francisco Bay Area when the 1989 earthquake occurred. I 

will never ever forget this experience. It was horrifying. I was on my 

roller skates when it happened and I remember falling to the floor and being 

unable to catch my balance. I could not even get up. Everything within my 

vision was shaking uncontrollably. I was only eight when that happened but 

this is an experience that can be tied back to the classroom and student 

learning. Most students have never experienced an earthquake and cannot 

relate to it. On the other hand, there are some students that have and this 

can be a learning experience for all. For example, if a class is studying 

plate tectonics, this real life experience definitely comes into play. It 

can help put into context some of the elements that are learned in studying 

plate tectonics. So the plates move causing an earthquake, but what are the 

effects on the geography of land, man-made structures, and even human life. 

One does not have to experience an earthquake to learn about the effects on 

one. Just thought I would tie this experience to student learning. 






>Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 08:58:52 -0700 

> 

>Hola, 

> 

> 

>While I was on the internet, I came across an article about the 

>possibilities 

>of an strong earthquake in Mexico. 

> 

>The article says that Mexico faces high possibilities of experiencing an 

>earthquake of that magnitude that affected Mexico City in 1985. 

> 

>The zone that could be affected the most is the coast of the state of 

>Guerrero. Interesting enough this place is called "silencio sismico" 

>(seismic 

>silence)because since 1911 there hasn't been an earthquake, but the seismic 

>alert is on. 

> 

>There is great preocupation because a third of the Mexican population lives 

>in 

>high and very high areas of seismic danger. A program for protection 

>against 

>earthquakes has been created, but there is much to be done for the 

>population 

>to be ready. 

> 

>A person who lives in the gullies said, "'Dios no permita que 'aiga' un 

>temblor fuerte porque ahí caemos unos arriba de otros'" (God does not allow 

>that there is an earthquake because we would fall on top on each other). 

> 

>I know this might sound out of topic, but I had to share it with you since 

2149

I 

>experience the earthquake in 1985. Although I lived 2 hours away from the 

>epicentre, the earthquake was still felt where I lived. By reading the 

>article 

>reminded me of the horrible experience Mexicans faced that year. If that 

>were 

>to repeat, I am not sure the population would be ready. Although the 

>earthquake in 1985 happened 19 years ago, it's still in the memory of many. 

> 

> 

>I found the article in Spanish. If you want to check it out, here is the 

>link. 

> 

>http://www.esmas.com/noticierostelevisa/losreporteros/358557.html 

> 

> 

>Cuidense, 

> 

>Judith :-) 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2150





Subject: COHORT -F T-SHIRTS 

Dear Class, 

I was talking to my sister tonight and she just had some t-shirts made for her business. She is a 

mobile pet groomer. Anyway, she was telling me about how inexpensive they were and that this guy 

who is getting his business started asked her if she knew anyone else who might be in need of having 

screen printing done. I said that our cohort had played with the idea but never followed through with 

it. 

Well, it cost $25.00 for the screen fee (which they keep on file in case we want more), and then only 

$5.00 per shirt. So, if we had 23 shirts made, it would cost let's see ...$25.00 divided by 23 people 

equals about $1.10 (each share of the screen fee) plus $5.00 for the shirt.... we could each have a 

brand new super cool (cohort f) t-shirt for a mere $6.10 per person. What do you think...... Now, the 

colors of the $5.00 shirts are white or grey, but my sister said that you can get like blue or green for 

$5.50 or $6.00? 

If anyone is interested..... LET'S GET BUSY... LET'S GET IT ALL ORGANIZED....AND LET'S DO 

IT!!!!!!! So, think of any cool sayings for the logo and maybe we can have a vote to decide the 

winner..... I'm excited... let's really do it..... What do you say...who's with me say "I"..... If we get all of 

our duck in a row, we can get the order out, and try to get them back as soon as possible. 

Let's start a list of who wants in on the t-shirt deal... 

1. Ann 

2. 

3. 

_____ 



2151






My question to all of you is this, is there a difference between team work and 

group work??? I think of team work like everyone working for a common goal at 

the same time (i.e.-sports, or team teaching). Whereas in group work, it 

becomes more a deligation of jobs(you do this and then I will do that). Maybe 

it is just words and how you use them. Sense or nonsense? 

-Chula 


>Jennifer, You make some really good points. Just because we will be in our 

own classrooms, we will still be a part of a team. And I think the team work 

aspect can probably make or break a school. I guess you could say that is 

"looking at the bigger picture". 

>Cynthia 

> 

>Jennifer Ramos wrote: 

>Chula's journal got me thinking a little bit more about group work and the 

>purpose of it. First, we don't work in groups ALL of the time, it is just 

>this semester that we have worked in groups a lot more than any other 

>semester (or time in our lives, maybe). Nevertheless, although we may do 

>better working as individuals, I think our group projects and assignments 

>are gearing us up for our soon to be professions. In order to better one's 

>self I believe that collaboration is a very important component. It is so 

>easy to get wrapped up in one's own work and way of thinking that we almost 

>get trapped if we don't ever take into consideration another view point or 

>another way of successfully doing things. For example, as teachers, there 

>will be many times when we will be expected to communicate with other 

>teachers, parents, and students to to work things out. This is group work. 

>In fact, we do a lot more group work than we give thought to. When we ask a 

>person their opinion or how they teach a lesson, this is working with 

>another individual to formulate one's own ideas or ways of teaching. In a 

>sense this is also group work. Of course, there will be many times when we 

>do not engage in group work per se, but group work will be a significant 

>part of our lives, hopefully. All of this group work we are doing this 

>semester is just more practice for the real world. 

> 


> 

> 




>>Subject: Journal or somthing like it 

>>Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 21:14:54 -0700 

>> 

>>I like the point that Cynthia brought up about the witch hunts being an 

>>analogy to scapegoating the lack of success of our students. I was 

>>thinking 

>>the same thing after the readings. First I thought, what is really the 

>>point 

>>of this, then I realized that this can easily be connectedto not only our 

>>failing students, but racism (like Matheno said) and other witch hunts that 

>>exist today (didn't we already find Saddam?). I also starting thinking 

>>about 

>>this semester and how engaged I really am (or am not) this semester. 

>>Yamashita said we chose our amount of participation and engagement. This of 

2152


>>have time management in which they have to pick and chose what is worthy of 

>>engaging themselves in. 

>> 

>>Another thought, In my social psychology class (I know you are probably all 

>>sick of my psych talk, but tough!) we were discussing how America is a very 

>>individualistic society. Experiments have proven that the average American 

>>is 

>>more productive when working alone than in groups. It is not the case for 

>>more collectivistic cultures (i.e.- China) in which they not only are more 

>>productive in a group setting, but they feel extremely uncomfortable 

>>working 

>>alone. As I was reading over the studies (I won't bore you with those, 

>>unless 

>>you ask)I was thinking about how integrated group work is in all of our 

>>classes. If "they" looked at the reseach, they would see that most of us 

>>work 

>>better alone. Maybe, just maybe they are trying to make us better at group 

>>work. Do I plan to expect my students to work in groups? You betcha, but 

>>certainly not all the time. Teachers have to look at group work as a way 

>>to 

>>have more individual attention, then as a whole class. Ramble, ramble!! 

>> 

>>Lastly, over the course of this semester I have been keeping track of all 

>>the 

>>e-mails sent on this list serve. I have made a composite of who writes 

>>about 

>>what and to who. I intend to share my findings with the class as soon as 

>>it 

>>is more organized. I started this project after I realized that certain 

>>people chose not to speak of certian topics or respond to others. So with 

>>the 

>>help of Prof. Yamashita, I got all the previous e-mails and I am making a 

>>grid 

>>that I think you will all find very interesting. 

>>-Chula 

>> 

>> 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Stop worrying about overloading your inbox - get MSN Hotmail Extra Storage! 

>http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=hotmail/es2&ST=1/go/onm00200362ave/d 

irect/01/ 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25¢ 

2153






Wow, I did not think about that but I definately agree with you, now! 

Teresa 

>My question to all of you is this, is there a difference between team work 

and 

>group work??? I think of team work like everyone working for a common goal 

at 

>the same time (i.e.-sports, or team teaching). Whereas in group work, it 

>becomes more a deligation of jobs(you do this and then I will do that). 

Maybe 

>it is just words and how you use them. Sense or nonsense? 

>-Chula 

> 

> 


>>Jennifer, You make some really good points. Just because we will be in our 

>own classrooms, we will still be a part of a team. And I think the team work 

>aspect can probably make or break a school. I guess you could say that is 

>"looking at the bigger picture". 

>>Cynthia 

>> 

>>Jennifer Ramos wrote: 

>>Chula's journal got me thinking a little bit more about group work and the 

>>purpose of it. First, we don't work in groups ALL of the time, it is just 

>>this semester that we have worked in groups a lot more than any other 

>>semester (or time in our lives, maybe). Nevertheless, although we may do 

>>better working as individuals, I think our group projects and assignments 

>>are gearing us up for our soon to be professions. In order to better one's 

>>self I believe that collaboration is a very important component. It is so 

>>easy to get wrapped up in one's own work and way of thinking that we almost 

>>get trapped if we don't ever take into consideration another view point or 

>>another way of successfully doing things. For example, as teachers, there 

>>will be many times when we will be expected to communicate with other 

>>teachers, parents, and students to to work things out. This is group work. 

>>In fact, we do a lot more group work than we give thought to. When we ask a 

>>person their opinion or how they teach a lesson, this is working with 

>>another individual to formulate one's own ideas or ways of teaching. In a 

>>sense this is also group work. Of course, there will be many times when we 

>>do not engage in group work per se, but group work will be a significant 

>>part of our lives, hopefully. All of this group work we are doing this 

>>semester is just more practice for the real world. 

>> 

>>~Jennifer Ramos 

>> 

>> 

>>>From: silco001 



>>>Subject: Journal or somthing like it 

>>>Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 21:14:54 -0700 

>>> 

>>>I like the point that Cynthia brought up about the witch hunts being an 

>>>analogy to scapegoating the lack of success of our students. I was 

>>>thinking 

>>>the same thing after the readings. First I thought, what is really the 

>>>point 

>>>of this, then I realized that this can easily be connectedto not only our 

2154


>>>exist today (didn't we already find Saddam?). I also starting thinking 

>>>about 

>>>this semester and how engaged I really am (or am not) this semester. 

>>>Yamashita said we chose our amount of participation and engagement. This of 

>>>course is true. However, it is important to take into account that humans 

>>>have time management in which they have to pick and chose what is worthy of 

>>>engaging themselves in. 

>>> 

>>>Another thought, In my social psychology class (I know you are probably all 

>>>sick of my psych talk, but tough!) we were discussing how America is a very 

>>>individualistic society. Experiments have proven that the average American 

>>>is 

>>>more productive when working alone than in groups. It is not the case for 

>>>more collectivistic cultures (i.e.- China) in which they not only are more 

>>>productive in a group setting, but they feel extremely uncomfortable 

>>>working 

>>>alone. As I was reading over the studies (I won't bore you with those, 

>>>unless 

>>>you ask)I was thinking about how integrated group work is in all of our 

>>>classes. If "they" looked at the reseach, they would see that most of us 

>>>work 

>>>better alone. Maybe, just maybe they are trying to make us better at group 

>>>work. Do I plan to expect my students to work in groups? You betcha, but 

>>>certainly not all the time. Teachers have to look at group work as a way 

>>>to 

>>>have more individual attention, then as a whole class. Ramble, ramble!! 

>>> 

>>>Lastly, over the course of this semester I have been keeping track of all 

>>>the 

>>>e-mails sent on this list serve. I have made a composite of who writes 

>>>about 

>>>what and to who. I intend to share my findings with the class as soon as 

>>>it 

>>>is more organized. I started this project after I realized that certain 

>>>people chose not to speak of certian topics or respond to others. So with 

>>>the 

>>>help of Prof. Yamashita, I got all the previous e-mails and I am making a 

>>>grid 

>>>that I think you will all find very interesting. 

>>>-Chula 

>>> 

>>> 

>> 

>>_________________________________________________________________ 

>>Stop worrying about overloading your inbox - get MSN Hotmail Extra Storage! 

>>http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=hotmail/es2&ST=1/go/onm00200362ave/ 

d 

>irect/01/ 

>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 


>>Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25¢ 

2155





Subject: Re: Journal or something like it - Jennifer R.'s Response 

I find with team work there is way less arguing then with group work. Because with group work you 

kind of have to work together and even though they are your friends you are working with you still 

have conflicting opinions at times. With group work some on always has to give because no two 

minds think exactly alike. With team work you are both in it for the same reason and you are there to 

support eachother. So Chula- to me makes sense and that is the way I look at it! Casey 

2156





Subject: Group/Team Work 

I think that whether it is team work or group work it is important for each 

individual to 

communicate what they are doing, how they are doing it and if there are any 

changes 

being made. Even thought it is not the rest of the "group" "teams" focus to 

accomplish 

what task you are obligated to it is important to share what and how you are 

doing things 

in case it is information that can help everyone. With the entire group 

communicating the 

project will most likely be a success. They will all know what the focus of 

the project is 

and they will have better chances of delivering the information to an audience 

in a 

meaningful way. It is amazing how much you can learn and advance when everyone 

is 

communicating well. It is actually exciting to work off of each other, 

exchange ideas and 

break through new discoveries. Marin 

>I find with team work there is way less arguing then with group work. Because 

>with group work you kind of have to work together and even though they are 

>your friends you are working with you still have conflicting opinions at 

times. 

>With group work some on always has to give because no two minds think exactly 

>alike. With team work you are both in it for the same reason and you are 

there 

>to support eachother. So Chula- to me makes sense and that is the way I look 

>at it! Casey 

2157





Subject: RE: COHORT -F T-SHIRTS 

I'd buy a t-shirt if it said: 

GWEN HANSEN SUCKS BALLS 

on the front 

And 

COHORT F: CAL STATE'S RED HEADED STEPCHILD 

On the back 




>Subject: COHORT -F T-SHIRTS 


> 

>Dear Class, 

> 

>I was talking to my sister tonight and she just had some t-shirts made for 

>her business. She is a mobile pet groomer. Anyway, she was telling me 

>about how inexpensive they were and that this guy who is getting his 

>business started asked her if she knew anyone else who might be in need of 

>having screen printing done. I said that our cohort had played with the 

>idea but never followed through with it. 

> 

>Well, it cost $25.00 for the screen fee (which they keep on file in case we 

>want more), and then only $5.00 per shirt. So, if we had 23 shirts made, 

>it would cost let's see ...$25.00 divided by 23 people equals about $1.10 

>(each share of the screen fee) plus $5.00 for the shirt.... we could each 

>have a brand new super cool (cohort f) t-shirt for a mere $6.10 per person. 

> What do you think...... Now, the colors of the $5.00 shirts are white or 

>grey, but my sister said that you can get like blue or green for $5.50 or 

>$6.00? 

> 

>If anyone is interested..... LET'S GET BUSY... LET'S GET IT ALL 

>ORGANIZED....AND LET'S DO IT!!!!!!! So, think of any cool sayings for the 

>logo and maybe we can have a vote to decide the winner..... I'm excited... 

>let's really do it..... What do you say...who's with me say "I"..... If we 

>get all of our duck in a row, we can get the order out, and try to get them 

>back as soon as possible. 

> 

>Let's start a list of who wants in on the t-shirt deal... 

> 

>1. Ann 

>2. 

>3. 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



2158

_________________________________________________________________ 



2159






Yes, we should think of group work as team work........ In teams, we are there for each other, we are 

there for support, we encourage our team mates, WE ARE TEAM "COHORT-F" GO TEAM GO!!!!!!!!! 

WE ARE SUPER HEROES...... EACH OF US WITH OUR OWN SPECIAL POWERS>>>>> 

TOGETHER, WE CAN OVERCOME ALL OBSTACLES AND SHINE LIKE SUPER STARS!!!!! WE 

ARE LIKE A BOOT CAMP IN TEACHER TRAINING.... WE ARE AN ELITE BAND OF TEACHER- 

HOOD CAPABLE OF CONQUERING ALL THE EVIL DOERS AND ALL THE BAD GUYS........ 

UNITED WE ARE STRONG, UNITED WE ARE COHORT-F, UNITED WE WILL GET THROUGH 

THIS PROGRAM AND REAP THE BENEFITS OF A HIGHER EDUCATION.........WHO ARE 

WE????? WE ARE "TEAM COHORT-F" AND WHAT ARE WE ABOUT? "TEAM WORK!!!" SO 

LET'S GO OUT THERE AND "FIGHT, FIGHT, FIGHT!!!!!!" We can change the world, one child at a 

time!!!! And still go home and fry up the bacon and NEVER, NEVER forget the romance..... well, 

maybe you guys don't remember that commercial.... MAYBE OUR T-SHIRTS SHOULD HAVE A 

BIG "F" IN THE MIDDLE OF THE SYMBOL THAT SUPERMAN HAS, YOU KNOW WHERE HIS "S" 

IS?? 

We can talk more about the t-shirt on Monday..... logos, sizes, etc. 

See all of you then, 

ANN 


Wow, I did not think about that but I definately agree with you, now! 

Teresa 

>My question to all of you is this, is there a difference between team work 

and 

>group work??? I think of team work like everyone working for a common goal 

at 

>the same time (i.e.-sports, or team teaching). Whereas in group work, it 

>becomes more a deligation of jobs(you do this and then I will do that). 

Maybe 

>it is just words and how you use them. Sense or nonsense? 

>-Chula 

> 

> 


>>Jennifer, You make some really good points. Just because we will be in our 

>own classrooms, we will still be a part of a team. And I think the team work 

>aspect can probably make or break a school. I guess you could say that is 

>"looking at the bigger picture". 

>>Cynthia 

>> 

>>Jennifer Ramos wrote: 

>>Chula's journal got me thinking a little bit more about group work and the 

>>purpose of it. First, we don't work in groups ALL of the time, it is just 

>>this semester that we have worked in groups a lot more than any other 

2160


>>better working as individuals, I think our group projects and assignments 

>>are gearing us up for our soon to be professions. In order to better one's 

>>self I believe that collaboration is a very important component. It is so 

>>easy to get wrapped up in one's own work and way of thinking that we almost 

>>get trapped if we don't ever take into consideration another view point or 

>>another way of successfully doing things. For example, as teachers, there 

>>will be many times when we wil l be expected to communicate with other 

>>teachers, parents, and students to to work things out. This is group work. 

>>In fact, we do a lot more group work than we give thought to. When we ask a 

>>person their opinion or how they teach a lesson, this is working with 

>>another individual to formulate one's own ideas or ways of teaching. In a 

>>sense this is also group work. Of course, there will be many times when we 

>>do not engage in group work per se, but group work will be a significant 

>>part of our lives, hopefully. All of this group work we are doing this 

>>semester is just more practice for the real world. 

>> 

>>~Jennifer Ramos 

>> 

>> 

>>>From: silco001 



>>>Subject: Journal or somthing like it 

>>>Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 21:14:54 -0700 

>>> 

>> >I like the point that Cynthia brought up about the witch hunts being an 

>>>analogy to scapegoating the lack of success of our students. I was 

>>>thinking 

>>>the same thing after the readings. First I thought, what is really the 

>>>point 

>>>of this, then I realized that this can easily be connectedto not only our 

>>>failing students, but racism (like Matheno said) and other witch hunts that 

>>>exist today (didn't we already find Saddam?). I also starting thinking 

>>>about 

>>>this semester and how engaged I really am (or am not) this semester. 

>>>Yamashita said we chose our amount of participation and engagement. This of 

>>>course is true. However, it is important to take into account that humans 

>>>have time management in which they have to pick and chose what is worthy of 

>>>engaging themselves in. 

>>> 

>>>Another thought, In my social psychology class (I know you are probably all 

>>>sick of my psych talk, but tough!) we were discussing how America is a very 

>>>individualistic society. Experiments have proven that the average American 

>>>is 

>>>more productive when working alone than in groups. It is not the case for 

>>>more collectivistic cultures (i.e.- China) in which they not only are more 

>>>productive in a group setting, but they feel extremely uncomfortable 

>>>working 

>>>alone. As I was reading over the studies (I won't bore you with those, 

>>>unless 

>>>you ask)I was thinking about how integrated group work is in all of our 

>>>classes. If "they" looked at the reseach, they would see that most of us 

2161

work 

>>>better alone. Maybe, just maybe they are trying to make us better at group 

>>>work. Do I plan to expect my students to work in groups? You betcha, but 

>>>certainly not all the time. Teachers have to look at group work as a way 

>>>to 

>>>have more individual attention, then as a whole class. Ramble, ramble!! 

>>> 

>>>Lastly, over the course of this semester I have been keeping track of all 

>>>the 

>>>e-mails sent on this list serve. I have made a composite of who writes 

>>>about 

>>>what and to who. I intend to share my findings with the class as soon as 

>>>it 

>>>is more organized. I started this project after I realized that certain 

>>>people chose not to speak of certian topics or respond to others. So with 

>>>the 

>>>help of Prof. Yamashita, I got all the previous e-mails and I am making a 

>>>grid 

>>>that I think you will all find very interesting. 

>>>-Chula 

>>> 

>>> 

>> 

>>_________________________________________________________________ 

>>Stop worrying about overloading your inbox - get MSN Hotmail Extra Storage! 

>>http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=hotmail/es2&ST=1/go/onm00200362ave/ 

d 

>irect/01/ 

>> 

>> 

>>--------------------------------- 


>>Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25¢ 

_____ 



2162






Mike.... I don't think that is the look most of us are going for ????? 

Besides, is sucking balls a bad thing? Is that not what guys want from women? If so, why use it as 

an insult... it's like men want it, but then they degrade women for doing it??? What's up with that? It 

should be looked at with gratitude like so and so, "cooks me dinner" or what's her name "tucks me in 

at night" or "Suzy takes good care of me when I am sick"..... Is it an insult when we say, "Johnny eats 

beavers?" No, that makes Johnny a real cool dude.... It is just one of the many ways our society 

continues to insult women.....sense nonsense?? 

Ann 


I'd buy a t-shirt if it said: 

GWEN HANSEN SUCKS BALLS 

on the front 

And 

COHORT F: CAL STATE'S RED HEADED STEPCHILD 

On the back 






> 

>Dear Class, 

> 

>I was talking to my sister tonight and she just had some t-shirts made for 

>her business. She is a mobile pet groomer. Anyway, she was telling me 

>about how inexpensive they were and that this guy who is getting his 

>business started asked her if she knew anyone else who might be in need of 

>having screen printing done. I said that our cohort had played with the 

>idea but never followed through with it. 

> 

>Well, it cost $25.00 for the screen fee (which they keep on file in case we 

>want more), and then only $5.00 per shirt. So, if we had 23 shirts made, 

2163

it would cost let's see ...$25.00 divided by 23 people equals about $1.10 

>(each share of the screen fee) plus $5.00 for the shirt.... we could each 

>have a brand new super cool (cohort f) t-shirt for a mere $6.10 per person. 

> What do you think...... Now, the colors of the $5.00 shirts are white or 

>grey, but my sister said that you can get like blue or green for $5.50 or 

>$6.00? 

> 


>ORGANIZED....AND LET'S DO IT!!!!!!! So, think of any cool sayings for the 

>logo and maybe we can have a vote to decide the winner..... I'm excited... 

>let's really do it..... What do you say...who's with me say "I"..... If we 

>get all of our duck in a row, we can get the order out, and try to get them 

>back as soon as possible. 

> 


> 

>1. Ann 

>2. 

>3. 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



2164





Subject: choose your words 

so ive been looking at these journals about team work vs. group work and i think its 

rather humerous. it reminds me of my old church. 

the first church i went to, horizon, had a very legalistic congregation, thus why i became 

a prudish christian rather than a laid back christian. but i do love this church and its 

people and the legalism that gave me my best morals. 

but they had this thing about words and the words you chose to use. for example, "we 

weren't talking ABOUT him, we were talking OF him" this was stemmed because christians 

should not gossip, so they would talk about people (the definition of gossip) but say they 

were talking of them so as to not sound like gossip. 

does this even make any sense? i thought it was rediculous. 

another example, the church had weekly bible studies with small groups, when the groups 

got too big for the house and for intimate time, they "multiplied" which meant they split 

in two and raised up another leader to lead the second group. if you said a group divided 

or split, boy were you in for a lecture. 

so hence the humor i find in "group" work vs. "team" work. 

but we all do need to watch our words, especially as teachers. so there is a lesson to be 

learned from all this. 

for example, i get really disturbed when i hear teachers outside of the classroom swear up 

a storm, F-this, F-that, blah blah blah (all very attracted might i add). 

you know very well that some day you will slip in the classroom to a bunch of kids you are 

teaching not to swear, then what will you do? what will you do if your students or 

parents walk up behind you and hear this foul language (which is so unneccessary)? 

ok there is my lecture for all you swearing folk. 

and let me add, that i do thank every one of you for taking into account that i dont swear 

and dont like listening to it. i truly love it when i am with someone who slips in front 

of me and apologizes, this shows me great respect. 

also, you dont have to be on your toes with me either, if you swear you swear, and if you 

do it too much in front of me, then i will slip away kindly so as to not offend anyone. 


2165





Subject: journal for the week of 4/21 and 4/23 

Dear class, 

Wow. mighty mighty bold mike that one was kinda in left field son. Can I ask 

what your first thought was after you hit the send button on an email going to 

icp-f@coyote.csusm.edu? I know what mind would have been? But that is probably 

because a student like me who at times needs to have someone in my corner 

keeping my shit together and providing some encouragement and a smile. but yes 

gwen your new appointment system certainly sucks balls? Back to my point, 

mike part of teaching (and in case you were wondering i am an expert on 

teaching therefore i can make this statement)is knowing that you are on 

"camera" or "display" at all times. The students in your school both yours 

and the body as a whole will pick up on everything you do more so than the 

principal and probably the teacher next door. I was out at the elementary 

school the other day and the students were talking about a past teacher they 

had in the beginning of the school year and they told me how she sometimes 

fell asleep in class and just give an assignment for them to do. When somebody 

lays a hanging curveball you like i mike will try to knock it out of the park 

without giving it a thought at times (in the comedic sense when somebody sets 

one up you know). But know that the students are influenced by us and we 

should set an example of how to treat others and not attempt to be the clown 

in front of the class but the ring leader who provides the content on what the 

children can expect from the circus in an enthusiastic and witty manner with a 

possible joke or two slipped in along the way. Mike you are a smart fella and 

i'm sure you are sick of all the singling out this semester i know i am j.k., 

but know that because your able to produce the results with minimal effort 

while others stress and study their ass off their will be people hating on you 

unbeknownst to yourself both before and after you graduate so yo throw one 

pitch at a time and make sure not to throw a hanger for somebody to try and 

take out of the park ya dig whether it be a comment, gesture, whatever. 

Matheno 

p.s. Ann I agree with you 100% (i just can't lay off the junk) 

2166


From: Randy & Louise Tweed [tweed@undalumni.org] 



Subject: RE: Group/Team Work 

I agree with you Marin. Communication is the essence of having a 

successful group or team. Whether it's delegation of tasks or working 

for a common goal, I think the benefits of working with other people, 

whether you call it a team or a group can be very rewarding. Like you 

said, it's great to bounce ideas off of others, which often, in turn, 

results in new ideas being created. ~ Louise 


From: tinne002 [mailto:tinne002@csusm.edu] 



Subject: Group/Team Work 

I think that whether it is team work or group work it is important for 

each 

individual to 

communicate what they are doing, how they are doing it and if there are 

any 

changes 

being made. Even thought it is not the rest of the "group" "teams" focus 

to 

accomplish 

what task you are obligated to it is important to share what and how 

you are 

doing things 

in case it is information that can help everyone. With the entire group 

communicating the 

project will most likely be a success. They will all know what the focus 

of 

the project is 

and they will have better chances of delivering the information to an 

audience 

in a 

meaningful way. It is amazing how much you can learn and advance when 

everyone 

is 

communicating well. It is actually exciting to work off of each other, 

exchange ideas and 

break through new discoveries. Marin 

>I find with team work there is way less arguing then with group work. 

Because 

>with group work you kind of have to work together and even though they 

are 

>your friends you are working with you still have conflicting opinions 

at 

times. 

>With group work some on always has to give because no two minds think 

exactly 

>alike. With team work you are both in it for the same reason and you 

are 

there 

>to support eachother. So Chula- to me makes sense and that is the way I 

look 

2167

at it! Casey 

2168





Subject: I went and saw ... 

Dear class, 

Yesterday I went with my mom to go see Mel Gibson's The Passion of the Christ. 

Where do I start? My last thourough look through the Bible was in my past 

life I think, so I'm not really up on the latest. Who was the Devil fella in 

the movie that was just creeping in the cut the whole movie with the little 

minnie me looking thing? The Devil? was he actually there during Jesus's 

persecution? Who all could see him it didn't seem like anyone really could 

except for Mary, and Judas saw the little minnie me fellas. I know that we 

sort of have an idea of what Jesus looked like?? but do we really know what 

the devil looks like if he were to visit Earth? People were crying in the 

theatre while Jesus was getting tortured and afterward I thought to myself 

"shit was I supposed to be cryin while Jim Caviesiel "Jesus" was being 

tortured in the film?" "knock on wood." I was watching the film I was 

thinking "Jesus really doesn't have it that bad. Yes the torture was 

horendous and I can empathize with that. Think about it though he got to die 

in front of all those people which means immediate election to martyr, he had 

people who cared about him around while he died one being the fine Mary 

Magdalene (right) whom he wasn't related to, and the belief that he was dying 

for everyones sins and was going back to be with his father. I can think of 

much worse deaths under much worse circumstances and would openly discuss them 

with whomever. After he died, did the earth really react like that? The film 

left me with more questions than answers. What are some of your thoughts and 

reactions to the film? 

peace, 

Matheno 

p.s. next time I go to court and have to put my hand on the bible before 

testifying i'm gonna say to the judge "eh man didn't Jesus die for this sin 

for which you are accusing me of, why yall fuckin with me"? 

2169





Subject: Was Copernicas wrong? and a funny thought? 

Funny, I was thinking (oh, boy, look out) ......... I thought Copernicas discovered that our solar system 

was heliocentric, but was he wrong? Earth's societies seem to prove that we are in fact PENILE- 

CENTRIC.... Does life as we know it really revolve around what our society seems to support? 

Hmmmmm.... 

Ann 

_____ 



2170





Subject: Re: matheno and passion 

matheno... 

the devil in the film was simply mel gibson's idea/perspective of what it looks like. he 

was seen by judas becasue the devil was inside him, we can all see the devil in one form 

or another. its your biggest temptation and more often then not, its something/one 

beautiful. just like parents tell their kids, a bad person doesnt always look like a bad 

person but sometimes it can just like the devilish kids. i think mel used kids to show 

another interpretation of the devil, the innocence of children then turns into a hitious 

creature before you know it...something you thought was pure no longer is. 

the earth did react, earthquake and all, after his death. 

matthew 27:51-56 

Jesus did have it very very bad... 

however i do see your point that He was loved and got to go home to be with His Father, 

but i dont think you should discount His death as not a big deal, especially in front of 

christians, your asking for an uproar. 

im sorry you didnt have a reaction like many, but im happy it left you with many 

questions, maybe one day you'll seek the bible and christians for answers. 

> 

> From: lande008 

> Date: 2004/04/25 Sun PM 02:52:21 PDT 

> To: Class List 

> Subject: I went and saw ... 

> 

> Dear class, 

> 

> Yesterday I went with my mom to go see Mel Gibson's The Passion of the Christ. 

> Where do I start? My last thourough look through the Bible was in my past 

> life I think, so I'm not really up on the latest. Who was the Devil fella in 

> the movie that was just creeping in the cut the whole movie with the little 

> minnie me looking thing? The Devil? was he actually there during Jesus's 

> persecution? Who all could see him it didn't seem like anyone really could 

> except for Mary, and Judas saw the little minnie me fellas. I know that we 

> sort of have an idea of what Jesus looked like?? but do we really know what 

> the devil looks like if he were to visit Earth? People were crying in the 

> theatre while Jesus was getting tortured and afterward I thought to myself 

> "shit was I supposed to be cryin while Jim Caviesiel "Jesus" was being 

> tortured in the film?" "knock on wood." I was watching the film I was 

> thinking "Jesus really doesn't have it that bad. Yes the torture was 

> horendous and I can empathize with that. Think about it though he got to die 

> in front of all those people which means immediate election to martyr, he had 

> people who cared about him around while he died one being the fine Mary 

> Magdalene (right) whom he wasn't related to, and the belief that he was dying 

> for everyones sins and was going back to be with his father. I can think of 

> much worse deaths under much worse circumstances and would openly discuss them 

> with whomever. After he died, did the earth really react like that? The film 

> left me with more questions than answers. What are some of your thoughts and 

> reactions to the film? 

> 

> peace, 

> 

> Matheno 

> 

> p.s. next time I go to court and have to put my hand on the bible before 

2171

testifying i'm gonna say to the judge "eh man didn't Jesus die for this sin 

> for which you are accusing me of, why yall fuckin with me"? 

> 

> 


2172





Subject: RE: our first 2 entries.... Jesus, Darwin... Chula???? 

Dear class, 

I am looking at our assignment that wants us to look at our first two entries and reflect on how we 

have changed??? Does anyone have my first 2 entries? Maybe Jesus or Darwin has a copy they 

can send back to me? Or Maybe Chula... If so, whoever does have them, can you please send them 

my way? 

Thanks a bunch, 

Your fellow superhero "SUPER ANN" http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif 

_____ 



2173





Subject: To you Ann 

Attachments: scienceactionplan[1].doc 

scienceactionplan[1 

].doc (20 K... 

Here you are Ann. You ask and you shall receive. ha ha ha ha. love ya. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2174





Subject: Re: our first 2 entries.... Jesus, Darwin... Chula???? 

Ann, 

This is Jenny. What assignment are you referring to? Have I missed something? 

Jenny 

2175





Subject: Judith and Matheno's lesson plan 

Attachments: 545Blesn.doc 

545Blesn.doc (44 

KB) 

Dear class, 

Here is Judith and mines' lesson plan for our presentation tomorrow. If 

anyone would like or needs a hard copy of the lesson please let me know and I 

will provide you with one on wednesday or next monday. thank you 

Matheno 

2176





Subject: Re: our first 2 entries.... Jesus, Darwin... Chula???? 

Hey Jenny, 

The assignment that is coming up in Professor Yamashita's class.. I think writing assignment #6; The 

final assessment... It's not due until 5th according to the syllibus. Jesus just sent me the group 

assignment #2 "response, reflection, and action plan" (THANKS JESUS 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/07.gif); But I still don't have Response #1 "Initial 

reflections on Science". I didn't save it on a word document, ( 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/15.gifBAD GIRL) I just sent it as a post, and I 

have deleted all the early posts. Unless no one has saved all of our postings from the whole semster, 

I guess I will just have to wing it... I kinda remember what I wrote about. Anyway, that's what I was 

refering to.. 

See ya in class..... Ann 


Ann, 

This is Jenny. What assignment are you referring to? Have I missed something? 

Jenny 

_____ 



2177





Subject: what I was thinking Matheno 

I thought i shared with the rest of the cohort a mutual dislike of how the 

cohort is run, and Hansen is the embodiment of that. 

Since it appears this feeling is not mutual, i would like to retract my 

statement and say that she does not now, nor has she ever to my knowledge, 

sucked balls. Any previous statements stating such were based on naught but 

heresay and conjecture. 

As for people not liking me for not getting stressed, check the grades 

folks. I have a strong feeling I'm at the low end of the spectrum. 

Difference is I don't care. Low GPA still graduates, it only matters what 

you do when you're in the classroom. 

As far as "swearing" goes. Never really understood why this was such a big 

deal? You can call someone an anus, but not an asshole, say something smells 

like poo but not shit. Say someone enjoys intimate knowledge of his female 

parent, but you can't call him a motherfucker. They're just words, it all 

means the same thing, so who gives a poo? 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_lovehandles 

2178





Subject: Journal from left field 

I am completely at a loss on what to talk about. It's getting down to the 

end of the semester and i'm feeling exhausted and overwhelmed. After 

reading through the journals I don't really have any comments, questions or 

stands to take. I thought all of the journals for this week weren't 

controversial. It shows were all exhausted... we need a break! 

Okay so i guess that leads me to this. So thinking about controversy, this 

class and how it ties to our future...so we all know that i haven't said 

much but in all honesty its not that i don't have an opinion on the issue 

its just that i dont feel like discussing it. So relating this to the 

classroom if something like this were to arise say conversation among other 

faculty and I don't want to join in is that wrong? Especially if its a topic 

i don't care to discuss, religion, politics, other bias topics. I do have my 

believes and know i can stand up for what i believe in, especially if its 

related to teaching. I can't be bothered to stand up for something that is 

irrelevant even if i believe in it. Why would i waste my time defending 

something that has no relevant outcome. I think its cool to voice your 

opinion and allow other people to see another side but I am not going to 

contribute to non sense. Furthermore, I can say that I am not a person to 

take a stand on something and not hear what another person has to say. I 

will always listen to what others have to say and see there side. I feel 

like I am very flexible and can accommodate others, as long as I have the 

same ideas as them. If I don't then i can't compromise. So i guess that is 

where I am now. I feel like a lot of the issues discussed here were topics 

that i didn't care to discuss or I could compromise my ideas. Is 

compromising wrong, especially once we start teaching? 

So those are some ideas out of left field for now. Later! 

_________________________________________________________________ 


download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/ 

2179





Subject: have my journal #2? 

Hey everyone, 

I know that this is a stupid question (wait, there are no stupid questions. 

yes!), do any of you have my second journal entry? I would appreciate it if 

any of you could check. Thanks! 

Laurie :) 

2180





Subject: RE: have my journal #2? 

Hey Laurie, 

Sorry! I just checked my "science" folder to see if I saved your #2 

journal entry and I don't have it. Check with Chula as I think she was 

saving people's entries for some report she was doing. Good luck. ~ 

Louise 





Subject: have my journal #2? 

Hey everyone, 

I know that this is a stupid question (wait, there are no stupid 

questions. 

yes!), do any of you have my second journal entry? I would appreciate it 

if 

any of you could check. Thanks! 

Laurie :) 

2181





Subject: Response to Carrie's Journal 

I was interested in reading your journal, as I too feel that I’m knackered out from all 

the journal readings, but yours got my attention. More specifically it was two sentences 

that you wrote – “I feel like I am very flexible and can accommodate others, as long as I 

have the same ideas as them. If I don't then i can't compromise.” Does that mean that if 

someone has a different idea to you then you can’t accommodate them or that you can’t 

compromise your position? I just felt that this was an oxymoron – kinda like Henry Ford 

saying “you can have any color car you like, as long as it’s black!” This is by no 

means a criticism of your journal, I was just curious as to what you meant when you said 

that you can accommodate others as long as they have the same ideas as you. See you in 

class tomorrow! ~ Louise 

2182





Subject: Re: what I was thinking Matheno 

Hey Mike, 

If you took away all the classes that you despise and all the people that you dislike like Gwen, what is 

left about cohort -F and your time a CSUSM? Do you not have fun from time to time? Are all of your 

days truly a waste of time with no fun? Cohort-F is the people... it is the group.... it is the fellowship 

(like the fellowship of the rings).... the good times and the bad..... We are all cohort-f. All 23 of us. Do 

you mean to tell me that you have not learned anything interesting, fun, or useful for your future life in 

this world on planet earth in any way shape or form during the days that our cohort has been 

together? We are cohort-F.... not the staff, we are the elite band of individuals who will soon be 

teachers..... That is the idea of the cohort t-shirt.... it has nothing to do with Gwen or whoever... it has 

everything to do about us... all 23 of us.... the us that are in the same bo at, the us that have to trudge 

through all the classes and all the exams, the us that has to do all the same stuff. Don't blow it now 

when you are so close... you're as smart guy and most of the time I love your sense of humor... you 

crack me up.... come on... don't play around on the edge, come in and join the fun..... cohort-f can be 

a nice place to be...... We are the ones who control that... Why have it be bad when we have a 

choice to make it good.... Let's all make it fun... Let's all change our attitudes... Let's all go out loving 

each other and not hating each other.... If CSUSM throws us lemons... let's make a big pitcher of 

lemonade and share it with the cohort. We choose how to react to things..... I should know this by 

now.... So I am reminding myself as well as others.... smile... be happy.... we are today where our 

past choices have brought us, we will be tomorrow where our present choice take us... Make the right 

choice... be happy. "BE GOOD!!!!" Don't make me call E.T...... When I see everyone tomorrow, I 

had better see a big smile on your faces......... 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif like this...... 

Good night my dear little cohort- F'ers 

Ann 


I thought i shared with the rest of the cohort a mutual dislike of how the 

cohort is run, and Hansen is the embodiment of that. 

Since it appears this feeling is not mutual, i would like to retract my 

statement and say that she does not now, nor has she ever to my knowledge, 

sucked balls. Any previous statements stating such were based on naught but 

heresay and conjecture. 

As for people not liking me for not getting stressed, check the grades 

folks. I have a strong feeling I'm at the low end of the spectrum. 

Difference is I don't care. Low GPA still graduates, it only matters what 

you do when you're in the classroom. 

As far as "swearing" goes. Never really understood why this was such a big 

deal? You can call someone an anus, but not an asshole, say something smells 

2183

like poo but not shit. Say someone enjoys intimate knowl edge of his female 

parent, but you can't call him a motherfucker. They're just words, it all 

means the same thing, so who gives a poo? 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_lovehandles 

_____ 



2184





Subject: Pledge 

“I also wish that the Pledge of Allegiance were directed at the Constitution 

and the Bill of Rights, as it is when the President takes his oath of 

office, rather than to the flag and the nation”(Sagan pg. 428). 

I love this idea. The Pledge has be under fire a lot in the past couple of 

years. Why if it is so important to recite something everyday at the start 

of school do we make it controversial? I for one think that or nation is 

“under God”. I do think that God is watching over us with his hands 

manipulation the way this country is run. I also know that others do not 

think this same thing, and are offended at having to say in a public setting 

that they acknowledge that our country is “under God” when they don’t 

believe it is. Rather than argue about this topic, why don’t we make a new 

Pledge on something we all can agree on. 

“The Bill of Rights decoupled religion from the state, in part because so 

many religions were steeped in an absolutist frame of mind- each convinced 

that it alone had a monopoly on the truth and therefore eager for the state 

to impose this truth on others”(pg. 432). 

How can a country run effectively as a “group”, if different parts of the 

group argue about what is right and trying to impose what they know as truth 

on the whole. Why focus on what we can’t agree on? Why don’t we 

acknowledge that we have different ideas about what is truth and that is and 

will never be the same as everyone? Why not change the Pledge so that we 

focus on what makes us all Americans, not what some groups think make us 

Americans. Forcing someone to believe how you believe is not the right way 

to go about changing their minds about what they believe. 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2185




To: ICP-F 

Subject: journal about the Pledge 

>“I also wish that the Pledge of Allegiance were directed at the Constitution 

>and the Bill of Rights, as it is when the President takes his oath of 

>office, rather than to the flag and the nation”(Sagan pg. 428). 

> 

> I agree with you Joey on this subject about the pledge of allegiance. I 

remember every day at the begining of the day reciting the pledge before 

class. And now today everyone is against the pledge just because the phrase 

"under god" is in it. Joey brought up a good point that he belives that God is 

watching over us with his hands manipulation the way this country is run. I 

am not that religious but I do believe in god and with Joey on this one. The 

whole under god phrase in the pledge should be looked at another way. Everyone 

has their own religion and they all usually pray to some one which is their 

god correct. Then I dont see a reason to take under god off the pledge because 

its not hurting anyone or their religion. Joey I dont think that we need to 

make a new pledge people just need to get off thier higher horses and accept 

it for what it is. We have had the pledge of allegiance in the classroom for a 

long long time and someone is just now saying something about I say tuff luck 

go cry about something else keep the Pledge. 

Just some thoughts 

Jonathan 

2186




To: griff030; ICP-F 

Subject: RE: journal about the Pledge 

I also remember when I said the pledge everyday when school started. I loved 

it and still my Central students say it everyday. There is such a sense of 

nationalism that is envoked from it. God and the bible made the foundation of 

our country, why change that? I think people forget that God is in many 

religions, just can be called by another name. Also, for the people that do 

not believe in a higher being, there is so much religion (whether we like it 

or not) in our country, why live in a country that is against your beliefs? I 

am not saying people should leave the country if they do not support the God, 

but I can not understand how people can live in a country that's constitution 

and laws, as well as many other items are based on religion. I just do not 

understand. 

Teresa 

>>“I also wish that the Pledge of Allegiance were directed at the Constitution 

>>and the Bill of Rights, as it is when the President takes his oath of 

>>office, rather than to the flag and the nation”(Sagan pg. 428). 

>> 

>> I agree with you Joey on this subject about the pledge of allegiance. I 

>remember every day at the begining of the day reciting the pledge before 

>class. And now today everyone is against the pledge just because the phrase 

>"under god" is in it. Joey brought up a good point that he belives that God 

is 

>watching over us with his hands manipulation the way this country is run. I 

>am not that religious but I do believe in god and with Joey on this one. The 

>whole under god phrase in the pledge should be looked at another way. 

Everyone 

>has their own religion and they all usually pray to some one which is their 

>god correct. Then I dont see a reason to take under god off the pledge 

because 

>its not hurting anyone or their religion. Joey I dont think that we need to 

>make a new pledge people just need to get off thier higher horses and accept 

>it for what it is. We have had the pledge of allegiance in the classroom for 

a 

>long long time and someone is just now saying something about I say tuff luck 

>go cry about something else keep the Pledge. 

> 

>Just some thoughts 

>Jonathan 

2187






So here is my journal and I really have nothing to say besides the dress 

issue. I understand you must dress porfessional while teaching, but remember 

when you were little and your mom told you people should not like you for your 

outside but instead of what is on the inside. Yeah, moms do not tell your 

children that becasue it is such a lie. 

So, to inspire you I found these quotes about teaching: 

Teacher's Creed 

We, the willing, led by the unqualified, have been doing the unbelieveable for 

so long with so little we now attempt the impossible with nothing. 

A teacher's day is 1/2 bureaucracy, 1/2 crisis, 1/2 monotony, and 1/18 

epiphany. Never mind arthimetic. - SUsan Ohanian 

Nothing grieves a child more than to study the wrong lesson and learn 

something he wasn't supposed to. E.C. McKenzie 

Too often we give children answers to remember rather than problems to solve. 

- Roger Lewin 

I am teaching... It's kind of like having al ove affair with a rhinoceros. 

-Anne Sexton 

A teachers constant task is to take a roomful of live wires and see to it that 

they're grounded. - E.C. McKenzie 

2188





Subject: Response to Carrie's Journal-louise 

HI Lourise, 

I guess after reading what I wrote it did sound contradicting. (I was and 

still am tired/exhausted)Sorry for the confusion. I think what I was trying 

to say was that I am very flexible with many things. And I enjoy listening 

to what other people have to say. When it comes to doing something and 

listening to what another person has to say I can be flexible and compromise 

some of my ideas. But I do have strong believes about certain things and.... 

if the case did ever arise where I was put in a situation to do something 

that i didn't believe in then I don't think that I could, just because I 

have my beliefs and I can only compromise so much. Louise does that make 

more sense? Or is it still contradiciting???? 

>From: "Randy & Louise Tweed" 


>To: 

>Subject: Response to Carrie's Journal 

>Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2004 23:55:08 -0700 

> 

>I was interested in reading your journal, as I too feel that I'm 

>knackered out from all the journal readings, but yours got my attention. 

>More specifically it was two sentences that you wrote - "I feel like I 

>am very flexible and can accommodate others, as long as I have the same 

>ideas as them. If I don't then i can't compromise." Does that mean that 

>if someone has a different idea to you then you can't accommodate them 

>or that you can't compromise your position? I just felt that this was 

>an oxymoron - kinda like Henry Ford saying "you can have any color car 

>you like, as long as it's black!" This is by no means a criticism of 

>your journal, I was just curious as to what you meant when you said that 

>you can accommodate others as long as they have the same ideas as you. 

>See you in class tomorrow! ~ Louise 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2189






I for one agree with the dress issue. Not for us as college students but in the classroom I believe that 

it is very important. Clothes are distracting! What someone is wearing or not totally affects the mood 

in a classroom. Teachers are professionals so it is natural for them to dress that way. I wore a 

uniform for 12 years. K-12. I loved it. You never had to worry what you looked like because everyone 

was dressed the same. You didn't see belly's and butts-which I find completely unprofessional-and 

you were comfortable. The issue of money comes in here too. Some people cannot afford the brands 

that may be in style one season and uniforms take care of that. You buy them once and wear them all 

year long. I know many do not agree but it definitely made my life more simple. At school- I think we 

should be able to dress how we want-as long as it is appropriate and does not offend anyone-And I 

believe that Professor Dome had a talk about appropriate dress simply because someone was 

wearing a shirt with very inappropriate words on it...remember!!! So I think when teachers are dressed 

professional they tend to act more professional and when they are dressed casual-they tend to act 

casual. Casey 

2190





Subject: its not always what you say but how you say it 

Dear cMlIaKsEs, 

right there are some things that we just can't say while teaching not to say 

that you aren't already aware of that and i'm sure how all of us act around or 

friends and cohort members aren't the same behaviors we will display in front 

of children. Many people have no problem with cussing or other off the cuff 

remarks but we aren't in control of how others may react to or view a 

statement we make and what the possible implications of that on us may be when 

we forgot what we said the second after saying whatever it was. After getting 

to know our working environment, then we know what is and isn't acceptable and 

when and where we are "outside of the locker room." 

Matheno 

2191





Subject: Re: journal about the Pledge 

I used to think that the pledge used to say, "... and to the republic for witches stand, one nation, 

under God with liberty ........." My point is that I don't think a lot of young kids even know what it's all 

about... it's just something they have to memorize.... 



>“I also wish that the Pledge of Allegiance were directed at the Constitution 

>and the Bill of Rights, as it is when the President takes his oath of 

>office, rather than to the flag and the nation”(Sagan pg. 428). 

> 

> I agree with you Joey on this subject about the pledge of allegiance. I 

remember every day at the begining of the day reciting the pledge before 

class. And now today everyone is against the pledge just because the phrase 

"under god" is in it. Joey brought up a good point that he belives that God is 

watching over us with his hands manipulation the way this country is run. I 

am not that religious but I do believe in god and with Joey on this one. The 

whole under god phrase in the pledge should be looked at another way. Everyone 

has their own religion and they all usually pray to some one which is their 

god correct. Then I dont see a reason to take under god off the pledge because 

its not hurting anyone or their religion. Joey I dont think that we need to 

make a new pledge people just need to get off thier higher horses and accept 

it for what it is. We have had the pledge of allegiance in the classroom for a 

long long time and someone is just now saying something about I say tuff luck 

go cry about something else keep the Pledge. 

Just some thoughts 

Jonathan 

_____ 


Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs 

2192





Subject: Re: Journal and spiffy uniforms...... 

Casey, 

I agree with you. When people are dressed nice, their attitudes change too. I am not saying that I 

want to dress up for all of our cohort classes ( I only have like one pair of nice pants that fit me right 

now, I keep changing my weight...) but as far as when we are teachers or we are on school grounds 

observing or student teaching, yes, dress up. 

I would be totally happy if they also gave teachers uniforms to wear as well. As long as the women's 

uniforms don't have those darn puffy sleeves, or those skimpy sleeves that only cover half of your 

upper arm, or they don't try and squeeze me into some sort of dress (yucky 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/11.gif), I would be happy as a clam in a uniform. 

Sometimes I feel fashionably challenged when it comes to getting all fluffy and purdy...... I am, and I 

always will be a wild little tom boy at heart. But, uniforms make everyone feel like they are equally 

grounded as far as clothing goes.... which, can be a really big thing. If back when I only had two 

outfits to wear to school when I was in early junior high, people would have never known..... if we had 

uniforms..... 



I for one agree with the dress issue. Not for us as college students but in the classroom I believe 

that it is very important. Clothes are distracting! What someone is wearing or not totally affects the 

mood in a classroom. Teachers are professionals so it is natural for them to dress that way. I wore 

a uniform for 12 years. K-12. I loved it. You never had to worry what you looked like because 

everyone was dressed the same. You didn't see belly's and butts-which I find completely 

unprofessional-and you were comfortable. The issue of money comes in here too. Some people 

cannot afford the brands that may be in style one season and uniforms take care of that. You buy 

them once and wear them all year long. I know many do not agree but it definitely made my life 

more simple. At school- I think we should be able to dress how we want-as long as it is 

appropriate and does not offend anyone-And I believe that Professor Dome had a ta lk about 

appropriate dress simply because someone was wearing a shirt with very inappropriate words on 

it...remember!!! So I think when teachers are dressed professional they tend to act more 

professional and when they are dressed casual-they tend to act casual. Casey 

_____ 



2193





Subject: RE: FWD: RE: Erosion & PPT 

Attachments: 545Blessonppt.ppt 

545Blessonppt.ppt 

(102 KB) 

Jennifer, 

what would i do without you? thank you again for the reminder. I am really 

laggin aren't i. 

Matheno 

2194






So appearance dictates behavior? I agree, I think it does. ( of course this is a generalization, I am 

sure there are those that would act like dopes regardless of what they are wearing). 

Cynthia 


I for one agree with the dress issue. Not for us as college students but in the classroom I believe 

that it is very important. Clothes are distracting! What someone is wearing or not totally affects the 

mood in a classroom. Teachers are professionals so it is natural for them to dress that way. I wore 

a uniform for 12 years. K-12. I loved it. You never had to worry what you looked like because 

everyone was dressed the same. You didn't see belly's and butts-which I find completely 

unprofessional-and you were comfortable. The issue of money comes in here too. Some people 

cannot afford the brands that may be in style one season and uniforms take care of that. You buy 

them once and wear them all year long. I know many do not agree but it definitely made my life 

more simple. At school- I think we should be able to dress how we want-as long as it is 

appropriate and does not offend anyone-And I believe that Professor Dome had a ta lk about 

appropriate dress simply because someone was wearing a shirt with very inappropriate words on 

it...remember!!! So I think when teachers are dressed professional they tend to act more 

professional and when they are dressed casual-they tend to act casual. Casey 

_____ 



2195





Subject: RE: journal about the Pledge 

Some people just hate the idea of religion and nationalism, period. Having morals and a sense of 

unification is just too rigid a lifestyle for those who have other goals and agendas. 

Cynthia 


I also remember when I said the pledge everyday when school started. I loved 

it and still my Central students say it everyday. There is such a sense of 

nationalism that is envoked from it. God and the bible made the foundation of 

our country, why change that? I think people forget that God is in many 

religions, just can be called by another name. Also, for the people that do 

not believe in a higher being, there is so much religion (whether we like it 

or not) in our country, why live in a country that is against your beliefs? I 

am not saying people should leave the country if they do not support the God, 

but I can not understand how people can live in a country that's constitution 

and laws, as well as many other items are based on religion. I just do not 

understand. 

Teresa 

>>“I also wish that the Pledge of Allegiance were directed at the Constitution 

>>and the Bill of Rights, as it is when the President takes his oath of 

>>office, rather than to the flag and the nation”(Sagan pg. 428). 

>> 

>> I agree with you Joey on this subject about the pledge of allegiance. I 

>remember every day at the begining of the day reciting the pledge before 

>class. And now today everyone is against the pledge just because the phrase 

>"under god" is in it. Joey brought up a good point that he belives that God 

is 

>watching over us with his hands manipulation the way this country is run. I 

>am not that religious but I do believe in god and with Joey on this one. The 

>whole under god phrase in the pledge should be looked at another way. 

Everyone 

>has their own religion and they all usually pray to some one which is their 

>god correct. Then I dont see a reason to take under god off the pledge 

because 

>its not hurting an yone or their religion. Joey I dont think that we need to 

>make a new pledge people just need to get off thier higher horses and accept 

>it for what it is. We have had the pledge of allegiance in the classroom for 

a 

>long long time and someone is just now saying something about I say tuff luck 

>go cry about something else keep the Pledge. 

> 

>Just some thoughts 

>Jonathan 

2196

_____ 



2197





Subject: Journal & school clothing 

I am a big proponent of school uniforms. Like Casey said, it cuts out a lot of the hassle of what to wear to school (as a 

student), it’s cost effective and it really makes a difference when you take a group of students on a field trip – you can pick 

out your students! When I was in school, the uniforms changed about every 4-5 years to keep up with fashion and 

generally the students at the school would get to vote on colors and styles thereby empowering the students. As teachers 

I think it is important to dress appropriately, if not for comfort, at least as a role model. I wouldn’t mind uniforms as a 

teacher as long as they don’t look like some dorky uniform like they wear at “Hot-Dogs-on-a-stick!!” And, Ann, I’m with 

you – I’m not into the fluffy, puffy dresses either!! Nuff said ~ Louise 





Subject: Re: Journal and spiffy uniforms...... 

Casey, 

I agree with you. When people are dressed nice, their attitudes change too. I am not saying that I want to dress 

up for all of our cohort classes ( I only have like one pair of nice pants that fit me right now, I keep changing 

my weight...) but as far as when we are teachers or we are on school grounds observing or student teaching, yes, 

dress up. 

I would be totally happy if they also gave teachers uniforms to wear as well. As long as the women's uniforms 

don't have those darn puffy sleeves, or those skimpy sleeves that only cover half of your upper arm, or they 

don't try and squeeze me into some sort of dress (yucky 

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/11.gif), I would be happy as a clam in a uniform. 

Sometimes I feel fashionably challenged when it comes to getting all fluffy and purdy...... I am, and I always 

will be a wild little tom boy at heart. But, uniforms make everyone feel like they are equally grounded as far as 

clothing goes.... which, can be a really big thing. If back when I only had two outfits to wear to school when I 

was in early junior high, people would have never known..... if we had uniforms..... 



I for one agree with the dress issue. Not for us as college students but in the classroom I believe that it is 

very important. Clothes are distracting! What someone is wearing or not totally affects the mood in a 

classroom. Teachers are professionals so it is natural for them to dress that way. I wore a uniform for 12 

years. K-12. I loved it. You never had to worry what you looked like because everyone was dressed the 

same. You didn't see belly's and butts-which I find completely unprofessional-and you were comfortable. 

The issue of money comes in here too. Some people cannot afford the brands that may be in style one 

season and uniforms take care of that. You buy them once and wear them all year long. I know many do not 

agree but it definitely made my life more simple. At school- I think we should be able to dress how we 

want-as long as it is appropriate and does not offend anyone-And I believe that Professor Dome had a ta lk 

about appropriate dress simply because someone was wearing a shirt with very inappropriate words on 

it...remember!!! So I think when teachers are dressed professional they tend to act more professional and 

when they are dressed casual-they tend to act casual. Casey 

_____ 

2198



2199





Subject: RE: Response to Carrie's Journal-louise 

Definitely makes more sense Carrie! I was reading the journals late 

last night and I just couldn't get my mind wrapped around your journal, 

so that's why I questioned it. Thanks for the clarification. ~ Louise 





Subject: Response to Carrie's Journal-louise 

HI Lourise, 

I guess after reading what I wrote it did sound contradicting. (I was 

and 

still am tired/exhausted)Sorry for the confusion. I think what I was 

trying 

to say was that I am very flexible with many things. And I enjoy 

listening 

to what other people have to say. When it comes to doing something and 

listening to what another person has to say I can be flexible and 

compromise 

some of my ideas. But I do have strong believes about certain things 

and.... 

if the case did ever arise where I was put in a situation to do 

something 

that i didn't believe in then I don't think that I could, just because I 

have my beliefs and I can only compromise so much. Louise does that make 

more sense? Or is it still contradiciting???? 



>To: 

>Subject: Response to Carrie's Journal 

>Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2004 23:55:08 -0700 

> 

>I was interested in reading your journal, as I too feel that I'm 

>knackered out from all the journal readings, but yours got my 

attention. 

>More specifically it was two sentences that you wrote - "I feel like I 

>am very flexible and can accommodate others, as long as I have the same 

>ideas as them. If I don't then i can't compromise." Does that mean 

that 

>if someone has a different idea to you then you can't accommodate them 

>or that you can't compromise your position? I just felt that this was 

>an oxymoron - kinda like Henry Ford saying "you can have any color car 

>you like, as long as it's black!" This is by no means a criticism of 

>your journal, I was just curious as to what you meant when you said 

that 

>you can accommodate others as long as they have the same ideas as you. 

>See you in class tomorrow! ~ Louise 

_________________________________________________________________ 


2200


2201






Hey Ann, 

I think the t-shirts would be a great idea. What do you need to get the ball rolling? Do you have a catalog or fonts etc. for 

us to look at? ~ Louise 






Dear Class, 

I was talking to my sister tonight and she just had some t-shirts made for her business. She is a mobile pet 

groomer. Anyway, she was telling me about how inexpensive they were and that this guy who is getting his 

business started asked her if she knew anyone else who might be in need of having screen printing done. I said 

that our cohort had played with the idea but never followed through with it. 

Well, it cost $25.00 for the screen fee (which they keep on file in case we want more), and then only $5.00 per 

shirt. So, if we had 23 shirts made, it would cost let's see ...$25.00 divided by 23 people equals about $1.10 

(each share of the screen fee) plus $5.00 for the shirt.... we could each have a brand new super cool (cohort f) tshirt 

for a mere $6.10 per person. What do you think...... Now, the colors of the $5.00 shirts are white or grey, 

but my sister said that you can get like blue or green for $5.50 or $6.00? 

If anyone is interested..... LET'S GET BUSY... LET'S GET IT ALL ORGANIZED....AND LET'S DO IT!!!!!!! 

So, think of any cool sayings for the logo and maybe we can have a vote to decide the winner..... I'm excited... 

let's really do it..... What do you say...who's with me say "I"..... If we get all of our duck in a row, we can get 

the order out, and try to get them back as soon as possible. 


1. Ann 

2. 

3. 

_____ 



2202





Subject: RE: Response to Carrie's Journal-louise 

WEll louise i was writing it late last night, so i'm sure it didn't make 

much sense. But thanks for the inquiry!!!! 



>To: 

>Subject: RE: Response to Carrie's Journal-louise 

>Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 20:52:12 -0700 

> 

>Definitely makes more sense Carrie! I was reading the journals late 

>last night and I just couldn't get my mind wrapped around your journal, 

>so that's why I questioned it. Thanks for the clarification. ~ Louise 

> 


>From: Carrie Gilardone [mailto:carriegilardone@hotmail.com] 



>Subject: Response to Carrie's Journal-louise 

> 

>HI Lourise, 

> 

>I guess after reading what I wrote it did sound contradicting. (I was 

>and 

>still am tired/exhausted)Sorry for the confusion. I think what I was 

>trying 

>to say was that I am very flexible with many things. And I enjoy 

>listening 

>to what other people have to say. When it comes to doing something and 

>listening to what another person has to say I can be flexible and 

>compromise 

>some of my ideas. But I do have strong believes about certain things 

>and.... 

>if the case did ever arise where I was put in a situation to do 

>something 

>that i didn't believe in then I don't think that I could, just because I 

> 

>have my beliefs and I can only compromise so much. Louise does that make 

> 

>more sense? Or is it still contradiciting???? 

> 

> 

> >From: "Randy & Louise Tweed" 


> >To: 

> >Subject: Response to Carrie's Journal 

> >Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2004 23:55:08 -0700 

> > 

> >I was interested in reading your journal, as I too feel that I'm 

> >knackered out from all the journal readings, but yours got my 

>attention. 

> >More specifically it was two sentences that you wrote - "I feel like I 

> >am very flexible and can accommodate others, as long as I have the same 

> >ideas as them. If I don't then i can't compromise." Does that mean 

>that 

> >if someone has a different idea to you then you can't accommodate them 

2203

or that you can't compromise your position? I just felt that this was 

> >an oxymoron - kinda like Henry Ford saying "you can have any color car 

> >you like, as long as it's black!" This is by no means a criticism of 

> >your journal, I was just curious as to what you meant when you said 

>that 

> >you can accommodate others as long as they have the same ideas as you. 

> >See you in class tomorrow! ~ Louise 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the Spring 

> 

>Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx 

> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2204






I think the t-shirts are a nice idea.... mike perhaps you could create a 

nifty little poem about our cohort that we could add to the back or 

something. Just an idea. I know your always want to write neat little things 

like that. 



>To: 

>Subject: RE: COHORT -F T-SHIRTS 

>Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 20:54:23 -0700 

> 

>Hey Ann, 

> 

>I think the t-shirts would be a great idea. What do you need to get the 

>ball rolling? Do you have a catalog or fonts etc. for us to look at? ~ 

>Louise 

> 



>Sent: Friday, April 23, 2004 9:00 PM 



> 

>Dear Class, 

> 

>I was talking to my sister tonight and she just had some t-shirts made 

>for her business. She is a mobile pet groomer. Anyway, she was telling 

>me about how inexpensive they were and that this guy who is getting his 

>business started asked her if she knew anyone else who might be in need 

>of having screen printing done. I said that our cohort had played with 

>the idea but never followed through with it. 

> 

>Well, it cost $25.00 for the screen fee (which they keep on file in case 

>we want more), and then only $5.00 per shirt. So, if we had 23 shirts 

>made, it would cost let's see ...$25.00 divided by 23 people equals 

>about $1.10 (each share of the screen fee) plus $5.00 for the shirt.... 

>we could each have a brand new super cool (cohort f) t-shirt for a mere 

>$6.10 per person. What do you think...... Now, the colors of the $5.00 

>shirts are white or grey, but my sister said that you can get like blue 

>or green for $5.50 or $6.00? 

> 


>ORGANIZED....AND LET'S DO IT!!!!!!! So, think of any cool sayings for 

>the logo and maybe we can have a vote to decide the winner..... I'm 

>excited... let's really do it..... What do you say...who's with me say 

>"I"..... If we get all of our duck in a row, we can get the order out, 

>and try to get them back as soon as possible. 

> 


> 

>1. Ann 

>2. 

>3. 

> _____ 

> 

2205


>Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 

>o.c%0d%0aom/ph/print_splash> 4x6 digital prints for 25¢ 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2206





Subject: RE: Journal & school clothing 

Can we have the same uniforms as in Harry Potter? Those are rad. 



>To: 

>Subject: Journal & school clothing 

>Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 20:50:26 -0700 

> 

>I am a big proponent of school uniforms. Like Casey said, it cuts out a 

>lot of the hassle of what to wear to school (as a student), it's cost 

>effective and it really makes a difference when you take a group of 

>students on a field trip - you can pick out your students! When I was 

>in school, the uniforms changed about every 4-5 years to keep up with 

>fashion and generally the students at the school would get to vote on 

>colors and styles thereby empowering the students. As teachers I think 

>it is important to dress appropriately, if not for comfort, at least as 

>a role model. I wouldn't mind uniforms as a teacher as long as they 

>don't look like some dorky uniform like they wear at 

>"Hot-Dogs-on-a-stick!!" And, Ann, I'm with you - I'm not into the 

>fluffy, puffy dresses either!! Nuff said ~ Louise 

> 

> 





>Subject: Re: Journal and spiffy uniforms...... 

> 

>Casey, 

> 

>I agree with you. When people are dressed nice, their attitudes change 

>too. I am not saying that I want to dress up for all of our cohort 

>classes ( I only have like one pair of nice pants that fit me right now, 

>I keep changing my weight...) but as far as when we are teachers or we 

>are on school grounds observing or student teaching, yes, dress up. 

> 

>I would be totally happy if they also gave teachers uniforms to wear as 

>well. As long as the women's uniforms don't have those darn puffy 

>sleeves, or those skimpy sleeves that only cover half of your upper arm, 

>or they don't try and squeeze me into some sort of dress (yucky 

> ), I would 

>be happy as a clam in a uniform. Sometimes I feel fashionably 

>challenged when it comes to getting all fluffy and purdy...... I am, 

>and I always will be a wild little tom boy at heart. But, uniforms make 

>everyone feel like they are equally grounded as far as clothing goes.... 

>which, can be a really big thing. If back when I only had two outfits 

>to wear to school when I was in early junior high, people would have 

>never known..... if we had uniforms..... 

> Ann 

> 


>I for one agree with the dress issue. Not for us as college students but 

>in the classroom I believe that it is very important. Clothes are 

>distracting! What someone is wearing or not totally affects the mood in 

>a classroom. Teachers are professionals so it is natural for them to 

2207

dress that way. I wore a uniform for 12 years. K-12. I loved it. You 

>never had to worry what you looked like because everyone was dressed the 

>same. You didn't see belly's and butts-which I find completely 

>unprofessional-and you were comfortable. The issue of money comes in 

>here too. Some people cannot afford the brands that may be in style one 

>season and uniforms take care of that. You buy them once and wear them 

>all year long. I know many do not agree but it definitely made my life 

>more simple. At school- I think we should be able to dress how we 

>want-as long as it is appropriate and does not offend anyone-And I 

>believe that Professor Dome had a ta lk about appropriate dress simply 

>because someone was wearing a shirt with very inappropriate words on 

>it...remember!!! So I think when teachers are dressed professional they 

>tend to act more professional and when they are dressed casual-they tend 

>to act casual. Casey 

> _____ 

> 


>Win 

>re_footer_textlink/evt=23983/*http:/hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/career 

>makeover> a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs 

_________________________________________________________________ 


Premium! 


2208






I'd go for that! ~ Louise 






Can we have the same uniforms as in Harry Potter? Those are rad. 



>To: 

>Subject: Journal & school clothing 

>Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 20:50:26 -0700 

> 

>I am a big proponent of school uniforms. Like Casey said, it cuts out 

a 

>lot of the hassle of what to wear to school (as a student), it's cost 

>effective and it really makes a difference when you take a group of 

>students on a field trip - you can pick out your students! When I was 

>in school, the uniforms changed about every 4-5 years to keep up with 

>fashion and generally the students at the school would get to vote on 

>colors and styles thereby empowering the students. As teachers I think 

>it is important to dress appropriately, if not for comfort, at least as 

>a role model. I wouldn't mind uniforms as a teacher as long as they 

>don't look like some dorky uniform like they wear at 

>"Hot-Dogs-on-a-stick!!" And, Ann, I'm with you - I'm not into the 

>fluffy, puffy dresses either!! Nuff said ~ Louise 

> 

> 





>Subject: Re: Journal and spiffy uniforms...... 

> 

>Casey, 

> 

>I agree with you. When people are dressed nice, their attitudes change 

>too. I am not saying that I want to dress up for all of our cohort 

>classes ( I only have like one pair of nice pants that fit me right 

now, 

>I keep changing my weight...) but as far as when we are teachers or we 

>are on school grounds observing or student teaching, yes, dress up. 

> 

>I would be totally happy if they also gave teachers uniforms to wear as 

>well. As long as the women's uniforms don't have those darn puffy 

>sleeves, or those skimpy sleeves that only cover half of your upper 

arm, 

>or they don't try and squeeze me into some sort of dress (yucky 

> ), I would 

>be happy as a clam in a uniform. Sometimes I feel fashionably 

>challenged when it comes to getting all fluffy and purdy...... I am, 

>and I always will be a wild little tom boy at heart. But, uniforms 

2209

make 

>everyone feel like they are equally grounded as far as clothing 

goes.... 

>which, can be a really big thing. If back when I only had two outfits 

>to wear to school when I was in early junior high, people would have 

>never known..... if we had uniforms..... 

> Ann 

> 


>I for one agree with the dress issue. Not for us as college students 

but 

>in the classroom I believe that it is very important. Clothes are 

>distracting! What someone is wearing or not totally affects the mood in 

>a classroom. Teachers are professionals so it is natural for them to 

>dress that way. I wore a uniform for 12 years. K-12. I loved it. You 

>never had to worry what you looked like because everyone was dressed 

the 

>same. You didn't see belly's and butts-which I find completely 

>unprofessional-and you were comfortable. The issue of money comes in 

>here too. Some people cannot afford the brands that may be in style one 

>season and uniforms take care of that. You buy them once and wear them 

>all year long. I know many do not agree but it definitely made my life 

>more simple. At school- I think we should be able to dress how we 

>want-as long as it is appropriate and does not offend anyone-And I 

>believe that Professor Dome had a ta lk about appropriate dress simply 

>because someone was wearing a shirt with very inappropriate words on 

>it...remember!!! So I think when teachers are dressed professional they 

>tend to act more professional and when they are dressed casual-they 

tend 

>to act casual. Casey 

> _____ 

> 


>Win 

>re_footer_textlink/evt=23983/*http:/hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/caree 

r 

>makeover> a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with 

MSN 

Premium! 

http://join.msn.com/?page=features/mlb&pgmarket=en-us/go/onm00200439ave/ 

direct/01/ 

2210






No, I don't have a catalog or anything... this guy is just starting out his business working out of his 

garage. That's the main reason they are so inexpensive and why we can place an order without the 

quantity being like 50 or 100 shirts minimum. My sister was really happy with him though and she 

got her shirts back within a weeks turn around. She ordered comic scan font. This guy is in Hemet, 

so we would have to design something and when I took it out there , I would have to just make as 

best of a judgment call as I could to see that it was as close as what we want or what we design. If 

people want to come up with sayings..... not like MIKE'S though (sorry MIKE... Although you could 

glue a couple of balls on your shirt??? and maybe go talk to Gwen????)....We should think of nice or 

genuine, or empowering sayings about cohort -f that make US feel good about US as a "TEAM". 

Something that we can wear now, and something that we can pull out of our closet 30 years from now 

and remember each other and the good and the bad times we all struggled through TOGETHER!!!!! 

That kind of stuff.... Even if we get the design going and I got everyones money.... since we are a 

stressed for time.....( and it would take two round trip drives out to Hemet for me) etc. (don't worry, I 

won't skip town, or say I went bankrupt or anything) I could get them finished soon, and bring them 

back after the summer break... Then we could have them for next semester....... That's what we 

need to get going... It all depends on how fast we can get everyone on the same page. If all of us 

get a shirt, the cost is at its lowest, about $6.10 I think I figured.... that's pretty inexpensive..... but the 

less people there are, the more the cost goes up..... because we are dividing the $25.00 cost for the 

screen print... 

Ann 

Randy & Louise Tweed wrote: 

Hey Ann, 

I think the t-shirts would be a great idea. What do you need to get the ball rolling? Do you have a catalog or fonts 

etc. for us to look at? ~ Louise 






Dear Class, 

I was talking to my sister tonight and she just had some t-shirts made for her business. She is a mobile pet 

2211

groomer. Anyway, she was telling me about how inexpensive they were and that this guy who is getting his 

business started asked her if she knew anyone else who might be in need of having screen printing done. I 

said that our cohort had played with the idea but never followed through with it. 

Well, it cost $25.00 for the screen fee (which they keep on file in case we want more), and then only $5.00 

per shirt. So, if we had 23 shirts made, it would cost let's see ...$25.00 divided by 23 people equals about 

$1.10 (each share of the screen fee) plus $5.00 for the shirt.... we could each have a brand new super cool 

(cohort f) t-shirt for a mere $6.10 per person. What do you think...... Now, the colors of the $5.00 shirts are 

white or grey, but my sister said that you can get like blue or green for $5.50 or $6.00? 

If anyone is interested..... LET'S GET BUSY... LET'S GET IT ALL ORGANIZED....AND LET'S DO 

IT!!!!!!! So, think of any cool sayings for the logo and maybe we can have a vote to decide the winner..... 

I'm excited... let's really do it..... What do you say...who's with me say "I"..... If we get all of our duck in a 

row, we can get the order out, and try to get them back as soon as possible. 


1. Ann 

2. 

3. 

_____ 



_____ 



2212




To: journal 

Subject: Reciprocal Teaching 

In Bruer's chapter on "Changing Our Representations", he mentions Reciprocal Teaching. Maybe it's 

the Diet Coke, but I don't remember reading about it in the other chapters. Anyway, I did some online 

research to find out what it was, and I think it is very interesting. It is a collaborative reading strategy 

that has 4 parts: Summarizing, Question Generating, Clarifying and Predicting. Hmmm, did we learn 

about this in our literacy class? I think maybe we did, but again, the diet coke. 

Using this strategy in the classroom is somewhat time consuming, but I think if students are taught 

how to do it in groups, they could also do it on their own once they got the hang of it. The other good 

thing is it can be done with any kind of reading material. I think it would be very effective to use with 

science texts (we all know how great these are to read). There is some good info on the link below. 

The link for using it in the science classroom doesn't seem to to working, but the others are. Notice 

the buzz words in the article: "The Bigger Picture", "Meta-cognition". There are other good articles 

and examples of how teachers are using it, and varying how its used. Just type Reciprocal Teaching 

in the search window. Cynthia 

http://www.suite101.com/article.cfm/1411/45021 

_____ 



2213






Mike what if some of us non-harry potter people don't think those are rad 

and won't wear them?????? 




>Subject: RE: Journal & school clothing 

>Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 23:02:24 -0700 

> 

>Can we have the same uniforms as in Harry Potter? Those are rad. 

> 

> 

>>From: "Randy & Louise Tweed" 


>>To: 

>>Subject: Journal & school clothing 

>>Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 20:50:26 -0700 

>> 

>>I am a big proponent of school uniforms. Like Casey said, it cuts out a 

>>lot of the hassle of what to wear to school (as a student), it's cost 

>>effective and it really makes a difference when you take a group of 

>>students on a field trip - you can pick out your students! When I was 

>>in school, the uniforms changed about every 4-5 years to keep up with 

>>fashion and generally the students at the school would get to vote on 

>>colors and styles thereby empowering the students. As teachers I think 

>>it is important to dress appropriately, if not for comfort, at least as 

>>a role model. I wouldn't mind uniforms as a teacher as long as they 

>>don't look like some dorky uniform like they wear at 

>>"Hot-Dogs-on-a-stick!!" And, Ann, I'm with you - I'm not into the 

>>fluffy, puffy dresses either!! Nuff said ~ Louise 

>> 

>> 

>>-----Original Message----- 

>>From: Ann Kirkendall [mailto:zestydu69@yahoo.com] 

>>Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 7:01 PM 


>>Subject: Re: Journal and spiffy uniforms...... 

>> 

>>Casey, 

>> 

>>I agree with you. When people are dressed nice, their attitudes change 

>>too. I am not saying that I want to dress up for all of our cohort 

>>classes ( I only have like one pair of nice pants that fit me right now, 

>>I keep changing my weight...) but as far as when we are teachers or we 

>>are on school grounds observing or student teaching, yes, dress up. 

>> 

>>I would be totally happy if they also gave teachers uniforms to wear as 

>>well. As long as the women's uniforms don't have those darn puffy 

>>sleeves, or those skimpy sleeves that only cover half of your upper arm, 

>>or they don't try and squeeze me into some sort of dress (yucky 

>> ), I would 

>>be happy as a clam in a uniform. Sometimes I feel fashionably 

>>challenged when it comes to getting all fluffy and purdy...... I am, 

>>and I always will be a wild little tom boy at heart. But, uniforms make 

>>everyone feel like they are equally grounded as far as clothing goes.... 

2214

which, can be a really big thing. If back when I only had two outfits 

>>to wear to school when I was in early junior high, people would have 

>>never known..... if we had uniforms..... 

>> Ann 

>> 

>>CA222girl@aol.com wrote: 

>>I for one agree with the dress issue. Not for us as college students but 

>>in the classroom I believe that it is very important. Clothes are 

>>distracting! What someone is wearing or not totally affects the mood in 

>>a classroom. Teachers are professionals so it is natural for them to 

>>dress that way. I wore a uniform for 12 years. K-12. I loved it. You 

>>never had to worry what you looked like because everyone was dressed the 

>>same. You didn't see belly's and butts-which I find completely 

>>unprofessional-and you were comfortable. The issue of money comes in 

>>here too. Some people cannot afford the brands that may be in style one 

>>season and uniforms take care of that. You buy them once and wear them 

>>all year long. I know many do not agree but it definitely made my life 

>>more simple. At school- I think we should be able to dress how we 

>>want-as long as it is appropriate and does not offend anyone-And I 

>>believe that Professor Dome had a ta lk about appropriate dress simply 

>>because someone was wearing a shirt with very inappropriate words on 

>>it...remember!!! So I think when teachers are dressed professional they 

>>tend to act more professional and when they are dressed casual-they tend 

>>to act casual. Casey 

>> _____ 

>> 


>>Win 

>>>re_footer_textlink/evt=23983/*http:/hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/career 

>>makeover> a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 


>Premium! 


> 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2215






Good Bible quote for this chapter: 

"Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding; 

in all your ways acknowledge him, and he will make your paths straight." 

(Proverbs 3:5) 

-This quote probably contradicts Sagan's readings completely which I thought 

was amazing. 

I can't believe that we are done with Sagan's book. I never thought it would 

ever end. I really liked some of the chapters from that book because I could 

connect it more with teaching. But when he started talking about abductions 

from aliens and witchcraft, I had to really step back and think about he was 

trying to point out. In this chapter I felt I was in the midst of a 

revolution. 

Anyways, this is what I found from Sagan's readings: 

"I promise to develop my independence of thought. I promise to educate myself 

so I can make my own judgments." Therefore, as a society Sagan says we should 

be critical thinkers in what we see, hear, or do in life. Yes, as teachers we 

should allow students to have some of their own independent thought in their 

work, but at the same time I think we as teachers should guide them along the 

way. 

"One reason the Constitution is a daring and courageous document is that it 

allows for continuing change, even of the form of the government itself, if 

the people so wish." I think this quote is interesting because change is 

sometimes good, but it can also be bad. As teachers, we should change our 

lessons according to our students' strengths and weaknesses are each year. 

But if we change the Constitution according to what society wants, I bet we 

will encounter a lot of problems. 

"When permitted to listen to alternative opinions and engage in substantive 

debate, people have been known to change their minds." This quote totally 

reminded me of the listserve. I think a lot of us may have kept our opinions 

of things from the beginning til the end, but sometimes some people may have 

seen both sides of debate or idea, and realized that they had changed thier 

view completely. This shows critical thinking and therefore means that people 

are allowed the freedom in our society to either accept or reject other 

people's advice. 

"However, through lowered educational standards...our liberties can be slowly 

eroded and our rights subverted." I can understand what Sagan is saying. If we 

as teachers only expect our students to do the bare minimum, what is that 

saying about us? It's showing that are expectations for our students isn't 

high and so we don't show enough respect and trust towards them. So if we set 

our standards high enough, it will allow our students to aim high in life and 

know that the teacher is wanting them to succeed higher. 

"But if the citizens are educated and form their opinions, then those in power 

work for us." I question this quote because Sagan is trying to say that 

society which is made up of ordinary people should have freedom to make their 

own opinions and have the government change according to what we think is 

important. I'm a little uneasy about this, because I can think of how that 

could be bad and good. Yes, it's nice having the freedom to choose our own 

ideas but couldn't too much freedom be bad? 

2216

God bless everyone, 


2217





Subject: Justice for who all? 

What am I going to do as a future teacher? I do not want to say the pledge of 

allegiance. 

Whenever I say it with a group of people I mouth the word God but I cannot get 

myself to 

say it. The comments addressing the pledge have been quite interesting in the 

listserve 

world. I DO believe that it is important to recite something together in the 

morning. It does 

bring a sense of unity and togetherness in the classroom which is a great way 

to start the 

day. 

The pledge however leaves so many people out and I do not think it is fair to 

say that 

God is in many religions it is just called another name. NO! The God 

that made up 

the foundation of America is not the same God that all of us relate to and to 

say it is the 

same thing as others gods, just a different name, is not true because in the 

pledge I think 

we all know which God it is refering to. It is not refering to my God. The 

buddha-hood 

within me and the path of the Tao is what I believe in. Buddha was a great man 

but he 

was not a God. Why should I have to refer to your God everytime I walk in a 

classroom. 

Jonathan that I should get off my high horse and just say it but what if I 

told you to get off 

your high horse and just say Buddha. What if you had to say Buddha then you 

would feel 

the disconnect that I feel now. When things work out for your benefit sure 

your gonna say 

its good. But what about those who do not think the same. Shouldn't others be 

included 

in this verse that refers to our free country. 

Joey has proven himself to be a great man, I respect that he belives in God 

but 

recognizes that people are offeneded to have to say the pledge. He said, 

"rather than 

argue about this topic, why don't we make a new pledge that we can all agree 

on. GO 

JOEY. 

This country was first occupied by Native Americans, they had Gods of their 

own. We 

destroyed their lives and took their land once refered to as Turtle Island. 

Gods, religions, 

higher powers, have been around since the begining of time. God was not a part 

of the 

original pledge written in 1892 it was adopted by Congress 50 years later as a 

wartime 

partiotic tribute. The reason why we threw that in there was because we were 

fighting 

against Russia an atheistic communist country and since that was against our 

2218

way of life, 

America thought that we could become stronger and more united by putting God 

in the 

Pledge. 

The key word in the pledge is the last word all... and justice for all. It is 

not justice for all if 

they make us say God in the the pledge. For now teachers should atleast inform 

the 

students that they should have the added right to remain silent for a couple 

of seconds 

while others choose to say "under God." I have pride in our nation but because 

I do not 

believe in the God mentioned in the Pledge I see that the only "for all" 

included are those 

who believe in God. Im done. 

This is a very important topic that will affect us and our future students. 

Sit and think about 

it. You don't have to change your beliefs just think of it as something that 

we will need to 

make accomodations for in order to meet every childs needs. Marin. 

2219





Subject: Re: Justice for who all? 

Marin, We wouldn't say Buddha because as you said he was a man, not a god. Why can't "god" be 

anybodies god? The original meaning may have been a Christian god, but as we know, meanings 

change over time. I wouldn't be offended if people chose to leave it out or say it, just like the cross on 

the hill doesn't bother me either. It really shouldn't hold any meaning for those who don't believe, so 

why be offended? 

Cynthia 



allegiance. 


myself to 


listserve 




to start the 

day. 


say that 


that made up 


say it is the 




buddha-hood 


but he 


classroom. 




would feel 




included 


2220


but 


"rather than 


o n. GO 

JOEY. 


own. We 




of the 


wartime 


fighting 


way of life, 


in the 

Pledge. 




the 


of seconds 


I do not 









_____ 



2221





Subject: Re: Justice for who all? I have a solution..... 

O.k. here is the new pledge..... Can you say this one?????? 

" I PRETEND allegience to the flag of the unitied states of america... and to the WE- public for 

witches stand (and worlocks too.... to be fair), one nation under BOB, (this also answers the quetion, 

"What about Bob?") HIGHLY DIVISBLE, with liberty and justice for the tall... or (those with the golden 

ticket from the Wanka Bar....)" 




allegiance. 


myself to 


listserve 




to start the 

day. 


say that 


that made up 


say it is the 




buddha-hood 


but he 


classroom. 




would feel 




2222

included 



but 


"rather than 


o n. GO 

JOEY. 


own. We 




of the 


wartime 


fighting 


way of life, 


in the 

Pledge. 




the 


of seconds 


I do not 









_____ 



2223





Subject: Re: Journal & school clothing 

Hi All, 

I have something to say!! Wow!! Yes I am always here and reading your conversations but I only 

jump in the pool when the water is not boiling and I think it is okay today. Anyways, I remember when 

I was in seventh grade the school I was attending started rumoring that we were going to get 

uniforms. All the students became enraged. We decided to protest against this idea by rallying as 

classmates against such a "robbery of our individuality" and so on. Now that I look back on it I think I 

would have liked it better if we did get uniforms so many things would have been easier. So here I 

am, a long, long, long time since seventh grade saying that uniforms are cool and I hope my children 

someday will have the opportunity to attend a school that cares about them enough to enforce 

uniforms. 

Jenny Fiala 

2224





Subject: Pledge or Something Like It 

Isn't there something else that teacher's can elect to have their 

students say in class instead of the Pledge? I recall when I was 

tutoring the foster children in our first semester that the teacher had 

a poster on the wall for the children to read from, but it wasn't the 

Pledge. Can anyone help me out with this one? 

FYI - When I was a child, every morning we said our pledge in school, 

which involved "God saving the Queen." By my senior year in high 

school, our pledge had been eradicated from the school system as there 

were too many students (mostly from foreign countries) who felt that 

they shouldn't have to chant something that they didn't believe in; i.e. 

they didn't necessarily see their God saving the Queen of England. 

There was loads of controversy on the subject. I believe that private 

schools still maintain saying the pledge, but no longer in the public 

schools. ~ Louise 


From: tinne002 [mailto:tinne002@csusm.edu] 



Subject: Justice for who all? 

What am I going to do as a future teacher? I do not want to say the 

pledge of 

allegiance. 

Whenever I say it with a group of people I mouth the word God but I 

cannot get 

myself to 

say it. The comments addressing the pledge have been quite interesting 

in the 

listserve 

world. I DO believe that it is important to recite something together in 

the 


bring a sense of unity and togetherness in the classroom which is a 

great way 

to start the 

day. 

The pledge however leaves so many people out and I do not think it is 

fair to 

say that 

God is in many religions it is just called another name. NO! 

The God 

that made up 

the foundation of America is not the same God that all of us relate to 

and to 

say it is the 

same thing as others gods, just a different name, is not true because 

in the 


we all know which God it is refering to. It is not refering to my God. 

The 

buddha-hood 

within me and the path of the Tao is what I believe in. Buddha was a 

2225

great man 

but he 

was not a God. Why should I have to refer to your God everytime I walk 

in a 

classroom. 

Jonathan that I should get off my high horse and just say it but what if 

I 


your high horse and just say Buddha. What if you had to say Buddha then 

you 

would feel 

the disconnect that I feel now. When things work out for your benefit 

sure 


its good. But what about those who do not think the same. Shouldn't 

others be 

included 


Joey has proven himself to be a great man, I respect that he belives in 

God 

but 


"rather than 

argue about this topic, why don't we make a new pledge that we can all 

agree 

on. GO 

JOEY. 

This country was first occupied by Native Americans, they had Gods of 

their 

own. We 

destroyed their lives and took their land once refered to as Turtle 

Island. 


higher powers, have been around since the begining of time. God was not 

a part 

of the 

original pledge written in 1892 it was adopted by Congress 50 years 

later as a 

wartime 

partiotic tribute. The reason why we threw that in there was because we 

were 

fighting 

against Russia an atheistic communist country and since that was against 

our 

way of life, 

America thought that we could become stronger and more united by putting 

God 

in the 

Pledge. 

The key word in the pledge is the last word all... and justice for all. 

It is 


they make us say God in the the pledge. For now teachers should atleast 

inform 

the 

students that they should have the added right to remain silent for a 

couple 

of seconds 

while others choose to say "under God." I have pride in our nation but 

because 

I do not 

2226

elieve in the God mentioned in the Pledge I see that the only "for all" 



This is a very important topic that will affect us and our future 

students. 


it. You don't have to change your beliefs just think of it as something 

that 



2227






Then you can be in Slitheran House. Just kidding:) 

2228






Yes, I like the school uniform idea as well. It is much more cost effective 

for parents and the positive is that kids might stop teasing each other 

about what they wear to school. But here's my question: do students who wear 

school uniforms do better academically in school? How does this commonality 

of clothing among students benefit academic performance? I mean, does their 

clothing allow them to focus more on their studies and performance rather 

than competing against one another in dress and attitude? We can debate over 

whether or not schools should enforce such a dress code, but WHY, besides 

the obvious expense and social issues, are uniforms beneficial to a school 

environment? Thoughts, thoughts, and more thoughts... 





>Subject: Re: Journal & school clothing 

>Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:48:00 EDT 

> 

>Hi All, 

> I have something to say!! Wow!! Yes I am always here and reading your 

>conversations but I only jump in the pool when the water is not boiling and 

>I think 

>it is okay today. Anyways, I remember when I was in seventh grade the 

>school I 

>was attending started rumoring that we were going to get uniforms. All the 

>students became enraged. We decided to protest against this idea by 

>rallying as 

>classmates against such a "robbery of our individuality" and so on. Now 

>that I 

>look back on it I think I would have liked it better if we did get uniforms 

>so many things would have been easier. So here I am, a long, long, long 

>time 

>since seventh grade saying that uniforms are cool and I hope my children 

>someday 

>will have the opportunity to attend a school that cares about them enough 

>to 

>enforce uniforms. 

>Jenny Fiala 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Test your ‘Travel Quotient’ and get the chance to win your dream trip! 

http://travel.msn.com 

2229






Personally, I think that school uniforms can enhance academic 

performance. Basically, what a school uniform does is detract from the 

distractions that can be caused by everyday fashions (especially in 

middle and high school). If everyone is wearing the same thing, there 

is likely to be fewer distractions and therefore, more attention to 

academics. Of course, we could say that other social issues such as 

music, boyfriend/girlfriend issues etc. can cause distractions, but I 

think school uniforms would eliminate a lot of the problems. 

Growing up, the seniors at each school level (4th, 8th & 12th grades) 

were allowed to have something a little different to the rest of the 

school body. I remember being able to wear pants instead of skirts and 

dresses in 8th grade, and makeup and jewelry in 12th grade. 

I would love it if we went to school uniforms. Although I'm not at the 

stage where I'm arguing with my children on what they can or can't wear 

(they're still young), school uniforms would be a wonderful way to avoid 

all the parent/child disagreements that go along with what to wear to 

school. ~ Louise 


From: Jennifer Ramos [mailto:ramos_jenn@hotmail.com] 




Yes, I like the school uniform idea as well. It is much more cost 

effective 

for parents and the positive is that kids might stop teasing each other 

about what they wear to school. But here's my question: do students who 

wear 

school uniforms do better academically in school? How does this 

commonality 

of clothing among students benefit academic performance? I mean, does 

their 

clothing allow them to focus more on their studies and performance 

rather 

than competing against one another in dress and attitude? We can debate 

over 

whether or not schools should enforce such a dress code, but WHY, 

besides 

the obvious expense and social issues, are uniforms beneficial to a 

school 

environment? Thoughts, thoughts, and more thoughts... 





>Subject: Re: Journal & school clothing 

>Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:48:00 EDT 

> 

>Hi All, 

> I have something to say!! Wow!! Yes I am always here and reading your 

>conversations but I only jump in the pool when the water is not boiling 

2230

and 

>I think 

>it is okay today. Anyways, I remember when I was in seventh grade the 

>school I 

>was attending started rumoring that we were going to get uniforms. All 

the 

>students became enraged. We decided to protest against this idea by 

>rallying as 

>classmates against such a "robbery of our individuality" and so on. Now 

>that I 

>look back on it I think I would have liked it better if we did get 

uniforms 

>so many things would have been easier. So here I am, a long, long, long 

>time 

>since seventh grade saying that uniforms are cool and I hope my 

children 

>someday 

>will have the opportunity to attend a school that cares about them 

enough 

>to 

>enforce uniforms. 

>Jenny Fiala 

_________________________________________________________________ 

Test your 'Travel Quotient' and get the chance to win your dream trip! 

http://travel.msn.com 

2231




To: Cynthia Reyes; ICP-F@csusm.edu 

Subject: RE: Justice for who all? 

I see what you are saying. But when you say why can't "God" be anybodies god. 

Are you saying that there needs to be a god. Because I don't have a god. So 

where does that put those of us. 

Also, what about seperation of church and state. 

That is good that it doesn't bother you but it does me. Everytime I hear the 

children say God I pause and start to dwell on why they say it and what it 

means to them. just thinking sorry i am distracted right now and am not very 

focused on what I am saying. Marin 

>Marin, We wouldn't say Buddha because as you said he was a man, not a god. 

Why can't "god" be anybodies god? The original meaning may have been a 

Christian god, but as we know, meanings change over time. I wouldn't be 

offended if people chose to leave it out or say it, just like the cross on the 

hill doesn't bother me either. It really shouldn't hold any meaning for those 

who don't believe, so why be offended? 

>Cynthia 

> 


>What am I going to do as a future teacher? I do not want to say the pledge of 

>allegiance. 

>Whenever I say it with a group of people I mouth the word God but I cannot 

get 

>myself to 

>say it. The comments addressing the pledge have been quite interesting in the 

>listserve 

>world. I DO believe that it is important to recite something together in the 

>morning. It does 

>bring a sense of unity and togetherness in the classroom which is a great way 

>to start the 

>day. 

> 

>The pledge however leaves so many people out and I do not think it is fair to 

>say that 

>God is in many religions it is just called another name. NO! The God 

>that made up 

>the foundation of America is not the same God that all of us relate to and to 

>say it is the 

>same thing as others gods, just a different name, is not true because in the 

>pledge I think 

>we all know which God it is refering to. It is not refering to my God. The 

>buddha-hood 

>within me and the path of the Tao is what I believe in. Buddha was a great 

man 

>but he 

>was not a God. Why should I have to refer to your God everytime I walk in a 

>classroom. 

> 

>Jonathan that I should get off my high horse and just say it but what if I 

>told you to get off 

>your high horse and just say Buddha. What if you had to say Buddha then you 

>would feel 

>the disconnect that I feel now. When things work out for your benefit sure 

>your gonna say 

>its good. But what about those who do not think the same. Shouldn't others be 

2232

included 

>in this verse that refers to our free country. 

> 

>Joey has proven himself to be a great man, I respect that he belives in God 

>but 

>recognizes that people are offeneded to have to say the pledge. He said, 

>"rather than 

>argue about this topic, why don't we make a new pledge that we can all agree 

>on. GO 

>JOEY. 

> 

>This country was first occupied by Native Americans, they had Gods of their 

>own. We 

>destroyed their lives and took their land once refered to as Turtle Island. 

>Gods, religions, 

>higher powers, have been around since the begining of time. God was not a 

part 

>of the 

>original pledge written in 1892 it was adopted by Congress 50 years later as 

a 

>wartime 

>partiotic tribute. The reason why we threw that in there was because we were 

>fighting 

>against Russia an atheistic communist country and since that was against our 

>way of life, 

>America thought that we could become stronger and more united by putting God 

>in the 

>Pledge. 

> 

>The key word in the pledge is the last word all... and justice for all. It is 

>not justice for all if 

>they make us say God in the the pledge. For now teachers should atleast 

inform 

>the 

>students that they should have the added right to remain silent for a couple 

>of seconds 

>while others choose to say "under God." I have pride in our nation but 

because 

>I do not 

>believe in the God mentioned in the Pledge I see that the only "for all" 

>included are those 

>who believe in God. Im done. 

> 

>This is a very important topic that will affect us and our future students. 

>Sit and think about 

>it. You don't have to change your beliefs just think of it as something that 

>we will need to 

>make accomodations for in order to meet every childs needs. Marin. 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs 

2233




To: LBST 361B 


Hola, 

Although I have tried to read all the email, I still have a lot to read. The 

topics going around are interesting. I would like to comment on the uniform 

issue and maybe more. 

Uniforms... 

When I was in school in Mexico, I used to wear uniforms. I kind of liked it 

becasue I did not have that many clothes to wear everyday. I remember that the 

skirt had to be a certain length, but my classmates would find ways to make 

them shorter. Teachers would get mad, and the girls would spend time at the 

principal's office. But the girls would continue to do it. Makeup, long nails 

where not allow. I liked to leave my nails grow. One time I forgot to trim 

them and I went to school. When I got there, we were line up and the teachers 

were going to check our nails and ears to be nice and clean. I realized that I 

had my nails long and I was going to get in trouble. So I started bitting my 

nails like crazy. When the teacher got to where I was, I had cut them with my 

teeth. That is so funny when I remember it. 

When I got to the USA, I was told that I did not have to wear uniforms. I was 

glad, but at the same time I felt a bit embarrassed because other students had 

nice clothes and I didn't. After a while, I got used to it. I thought "oh 

well, I don't have nice clothes like the other students, but at least I have 

something to put on." 

Oh well, gotta go. I will continue the conversation later on. 

Cuidense, 

Judith 

2234






Thats what I was wondering. I don't think there needs to be a god, I don't have one either. I just don't 

get bothered by people who do. 

Cynthia 


I see what you are saying. But when you say why can't "God" be anybodies god. 

Are you saying that there needs to be a god. Because I don't have a god. So 

where does that put those of us. 

Also, what about seperation of church and state. 

That is good that it doesn't bother you but it does me. Everytime I hear the 

children say God I pause and start to dwell on why they say it and what it 

means to them. just thinking sorry i am distracted right now and am not very 

focused on what I am saying. Marin 

>Marin, We wouldn't say Buddha because as you said he was a man, not a god. 

Why can't "god" be anybodies god? The original meaning may have been a 

Christian god, but as we know, meanings change over time. I wouldn't be 

offended if people chose to leave it out or say it, just like the cross on the 

hill doesn't bother me either. It really shouldn't hold any meaning for those 

who don't believe, so why be offended? 

>Cynthia 

> 



>allegiance. 


get 

>myself to 


>listserve 




>to start the 

>day. 

> 


>say that 


>that made up 


>s ay it is the 

2235




>buddha-hood 


man 

>but he 


>classroom. 

> 




>would feel 

>the disconnect that I feel now. When things work out for your benefit sure 



>included 


> 


>but 


>"rather than 


>on. GO 

>JOEY. 

> 


>own. We 




part 

>of the 


a 

>wartime 


>fighting 


>way of life, 


>in the 

>Pledge. 

> 

>The key w ord in the pledge is the last word all... and justice for all. It is 



inform 

>the 


>of seconds 

2236

while others choose to say "under God." I have pride in our nation but 

because 

>I do not 




> 






> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 



2237





Subject: Compromise 

Can't we just lift a poem from Lord of the Rings and recite that everyday? 

That's what my students are going to do. 

All that is gold does not glitter, 

Not all those who wander are lost; 

The old that is strong does not wither, 

Deep roots are not reached by the frost. 

From the ashes a fire shall be woken, 

A light from the shadows shall spring; 

Renewed shall be blade that was broken, 

The crownless again shall be king. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2238





Subject: RE: Compromise 

Very poetic Mike. So, are you going to make your students say this 

every morning? What happens if you get Kindergarten or 1st grade 

students? Should be fun to watch!! ~ Louise 





Subject: Compromise 

Can't we just lift a poem from Lord of the Rings and recite that 

everyday? 

That's what my students are going to do. 

All that is gold does not glitter, 

Not all those who wander are lost; 

The old that is strong does not wither, 

Deep roots are not reached by the frost. 

From the ashes a fire shall be woken, 

A light from the shadows shall spring; 

Renewed shall be blade that was broken, 

The crownless again shall be king. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2239






Just the other day I saw a bumper sticker that read: " If you want to live in 

a country run by religion try Iran." 

I agree the pledge does leave people out. We not only have to consider those 

students who do not believe in God, we also must consider those students who 

do believe in God but do not believe in pledging allegiance to a flag. 

Jehovah's Witnesses are not supposed to recite the pledge even though they 

believe in God. Also, what about the students who are born in another country? 

My husband actually had a situation in his classroom when one student refused 

to stand and recite the pledge because she was not American. The other 

students starting berating her and telling her to go back to her own country. 

Maybe there should be a school pledge or something that unites and motivates 

students. That's all I have to say about that. Cecilia 



>allegiance. 


get 

>myself to 


>listserve 




>to start the 

>day. 

> 


>say that 


>that made up 



>same thing as others gods, just a different name, is not true because in the 



>buddha-hood 


man 

>but he 


>classroom. 

> 




>would feel 

2240




>included 


> 


>but 


>"rather than 


>on. GO 

>JOEY. 

> 


>own. We 




part 

>of the 


a 

>wartime 


>fighting 


>way of life, 


>in the 

>Pledge. 

> 

>The key word in the pledge is the last word all... and justice for all. It is 



inform 

>the 


>of seconds 


because 

>I do not 




> 






2241





Subject: RE: Pledge or Something Like It - Jennifer R.'s alternative 

I remember when I volunteered in a non-severely handicap K-1 special day 

class, almost every morning we would sing "This Land is Your Land." The kids 

loved it! The teacher played the CD while turning the pages in the book and 

everyone would be singing. It was great! Although we did say the Pledge 

every day too, how does this alternative sound? In singing "This Land is 

Your Land" we are still honoring our country but just not saying the"G--" 

word. I think this is a great way to sing something every morning that the 

kids have fun doing and is not offending any one who has a different 

religion or does not believe in "G--". In fact, it celebrates the fact that 

America is a land for all cultures, peoples, and religions. I don't think 

that anyone should feel excluded from singing this song. Below is the song 

version in the book that we sang each morning in class with music. Come on, 

sing with me... 

(Chorus:) 

This land is your land 

This land is my land. 

From California 

to the New York island. 

From the redwood forest 

To the gulf stream waters. 

This land was made for you and me. 

As I was walking a ribbon of highway 

I saw above me an endless skyway 

I saw below me a golden valley 

This land was made for you and me. 

Chorus 

I've roamed and rambled and I've followed my footsteps 

To the sparkling sands of her diamond deserts 

And all around me a voice was sounding 

This land was made for you and me 

Chorus 

The sun comes shining as I was strolling 

The wheat fields waving and the dust clouds rolling 

The fog was lifting a voice come chanting 


**NOTE:** 

From the website of the World Policy Institute: 

"This song is almost always sung as a patriotic song, which is why the last 

three stanzas are usually deleted. Most schoolchildren aren’t even aware of 

their existence. Yet they are essential to Woody’s meaning. This is not an 

ode to the nation-state. It is an affirmation that the land is a sacred 

trust, whose purpose is the well-being of all its inhabitants." 

Note that the above version that we sang in our NSH K-1 special day class 

did in fact delete the last three stanzas of Woody Guthrie's song. For 

reference, here are the final three stanzas: 

2242

------ 

As I went walking, I saw a sign there 

On the sign it said NO TRESPASSING 

But on the other side it didn’t say nothing 

That side was made for you and me! 

In the squares of the city, in the shadow of the steeple 

In the relief office, I seen my people; 

As they stood there hungry I stood there asking, 

Is this land made for you and me? 

Nobody living can ever stop me 

As I go walking that freedom highway 

Nobody living can make me turn back 


-------- 

Here is the website for the World Policy Institute: 

http://www.worldpolicy.org/globalrights/ecoindex.html 

~ Jennifer Ramos 



>To: 

>Subject: Pledge or Something Like It 

>Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 08:49:04 -0700 

> 

>Isn't there something else that teacher's can elect to have their 

>students say in class instead of the Pledge? I recall when I was 

>tutoring the foster children in our first semester that the teacher had 

>a poster on the wall for the children to read from, but it wasn't the 

>Pledge. Can anyone help me out with this one? 

> 

>FYI - When I was a child, every morning we said our pledge in school, 

>which involved "God saving the Queen." By my senior year in high 

>school, our pledge had been eradicated from the school system as there 

>were too many students (mostly from foreign countries) who felt that 

>they shouldn't have to chant something that they didn't believe in; i.e. 

>they didn't necessarily see their God saving the Queen of England. 

>There was loads of controversy on the subject. I believe that private 

>schools still maintain saying the pledge, but no longer in the public 

>schools. ~ Louise 

> 

> 


>From: tinne002 [mailto:tinne002@csusm.edu] 

>Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 10:12 PM 


>Subject: Justice for who all? 

> 

>What am I going to do as a future teacher? I do not want to say the 

>pledge of 

>allegiance. 

>Whenever I say it with a group of people I mouth the word God but I 

>cannot get 

>myself to 

>say it. The comments addressing the pledge have been quite interesting 

>in the 

>listserve 

>world. I DO believe that it is important to recite something together in 

>the 

2243


>bring a sense of unity and togetherness in the classroom which is a 

>great way 

>to start the 

>day. 

> 

>The pledge however leaves so many people out and I do not think it is 

>fair to 

>say that 

>God is in many religions it is just called another name. NO! 

>The God 

>that made up 

>the foundation of America is not the same God that all of us relate to 

>and to 


>same thing as others gods, just a different name, is not true because 

>in the 


>we all know which God it is refering to. It is not refering to my God. 

>The 

>buddha-hood 

>within me and the path of the Tao is what I believe in. Buddha was a 

>great man 

>but he 

>was not a God. Why should I have to refer to your God everytime I walk 

>in a 

>classroom. 

> 

>Jonathan that I should get off my high horse and just say it but what if 

>I 


>your high horse and just say Buddha. What if you had to say Buddha then 

>you 

>would feel 

>the disconnect that I feel now. When things work out for your benefit 

>sure 


>its good. But what about those who do not think the same. Shouldn't 

>others be 

>included 


> 

>Joey has proven himself to be a great man, I respect that he belives in 

>God 

>but 


> 

>"rather than 

>argue about this topic, why don't we make a new pledge that we can all 

>agree 

>on. GO 

>JOEY. 

> 

>This country was first occupied by Native Americans, they had Gods of 

>their 

>own. We 

>destroyed their lives and took their land once refered to as Turtle 

>Island. 


>higher powers, have been around since the begining of time. God was not 

>a part 

>of the 

>original pledge written in 1892 it was adopted by Congress 50 years 

>later as a 

>wartime 

>partiotic tribute. The reason why we threw that in there was because we 

2244

were 

>fighting 

>against Russia an atheistic communist country and since that was against 

>our 

>way of life, 

>America thought that we could become stronger and more united by putting 

>God 

>in the 

>Pledge. 

> 

>The key word in the pledge is the last word all... and justice for all. 

>It is 



>inform 

>the 

>students that they should have the added right to remain silent for a 

>couple 

>of seconds 


>because 

>I do not 


> 



> 

>This is a very important topic that will affect us and our future 

>students. 


>it. You don't have to change your beliefs just think of it as something 

>that 



> 

> 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 


Premium! 


2245





Subject: Journal 14: School Uniforms 

School uniforms have been cause for great 

discussion and debate both here on the list serve and 

for schools who choose to enforce uniform codes for 

students. Some people have stated that they feel that 

school uniforms are good things and that they would 

support their implementation in elementary schools. 

Reasons for this are that uniforms would eliminate the 

differences between students (socioeconomic, cultural, 

etc.) that could be grounds for teasing or 

discrimination of sorts. It has also been mentioned 

before that if students all come to school wearing the 

same uniform that they will be less focused on their 

clothing and differences between who is wearing what, 

not to mention eliminating possible gang symbolism in 

clothing. These are all valid possibilities, however 

there are other perspectives to the argument. 

There are students, parents, and most likely 

teachers who feel that school uniforms are unnecessary 

and are a violation of personal freedom, and as Jenny 

stated, are perceived by some as a “…robbery of 

individuality.” These sentiments are equally as valid 

as those already stated in the discussion of school 

uniforms and should be considered. 

Regarding Judith’s journal entry about her 

experiences in Mexico and the strict policies there, 

cultural differences need to be taken into account. 

From what was written, and from my personal experience 

in average Mexican families, most Mexican families and 

social institutions uphold traditional Catholic values 

and are quite conservative, which explains the 

restrictions placed on the young girls, including 

Judith, in her school and led to her frantic 

nail-biting experience. Upon entering school in the 

United States, Judith had a different school 

experience regarding school uniforms. It is easy to 

understand her feelings of relief of not having to 

face judgment of her clothing in the school that 

required uniforms. That Judith experienced anxiety 

about her clothing choice in the non-uniform wearing 

school in the states, and took a very positive outlook 

I might add, is a reality for any child going to 

school where uniforms are not worn, or anyone living 

in society for that matter. This example of social 

differences is an important reality that will come 

into play later on in this journal. 

Some schools are adopting uniform policies with 

hopes of reforming student behavior, attitudes, and 

performance, and do so based on grounds of unpolished 

research. One example is the Long Beach Unified 

School District, which adopted school uniform policies 

in the early 1990s. The district, based on a study 

done by Bryk, Lee, and Holland 1993, Bryk, Driscoll 

1998 (I misplaced the name of the article source!!), 

found a decrease in school crime between the years of 

1994-95 and 1995-96, which they attributed to the 

uniform policy. From these unsubstantiated findings, 

2246

the district established the policy to all schools in 

the district…permanently. 

The findings are unsubstantiated because during the 

time when students were being required to wear 

uniforms, other infrastructural changes were 

happening, such as reassessment of content standards, 

a $1 million grant from the Edna McConnell Clark 

Foundation to develop alternative pedagogical 

strategies, and the Focused Reporting Project. The 

researchers state that it is curious that given these 

substantive reform efforts, administrators at Long 

Beach District continue to insist that uniforms are 

the sole factor causing a variety of positive 

educational outcome. This leads to the question of 

what the function of uniforms really are, and if they 

are, Jennifer, beneficial for students. 

Jenny stated in her journal that when rumors were 

circulating in her middle school that a uniform policy 

was coming, students protested. It would be 

interesting to know if parents shared similar 

reactions. Assuming that some parents did, I see 

their reactions as completely natural to what can be 

identified simply as change; will requiring students 

to wear uniforms to school truly “robb” them of who 

they are as individuals? An example in our own lives, 

as cohort F, are the changes that we have all 

experienced along the way, changes that nobody 

expected, that mostly everybody complained about, and 

that ultimately have not, and will not affect most of 

our personal goals, as we have, for the most part, 

adapted to these changes. Think back to comments 

about cohort F as “guinea pigs,” and then ask 

yourself, is anything in life truly predictable and 

stable? Any significant change in school policy, such 

as uniforms for all students, will cause this sort of 

reaction amidst the collective, as humans are reactive 

creatures. 

Ultimately, the question that needs to be asked 

when considering ones position on school uniforms has 

been asked in Jennifer’s posting, “How will it affect 

the students, and what will be the 

benefits/implications?” It is obvious that school 

uniforms would eliminate judgment based on appearance, 

which is something that all people do. Yes you do. 

For us as future teachers, how many of us will be able 

to completely detach ourselves from this human 

condition? How many of us will look at the student who 

walks into our classroom with an oversized shirt, 

pants half-way down his ass, walkman on full blast, 

and a bandana around his head and say to ourselves, “I 

can’t wait to work with this budding little mind!” I 

am generalizing here because the majority of this 

cohort would instantly have some preconceived notions 

about this student. And that is my point here, that 

pro-achievement attitudes towards students is a 

serious concern that affects how teachers may relate 

to them. It is worth considering how uniforms might 

play into this relationship between physical 

appearances and assumptions/attitudes of teachers 

towards students. 

Relating uniform policy to academic achievement and 

school the environment, what students wear has very 

little impact on their academic performance and 

cognitive abilities, which may be more closely related 

to proschool attitudes, academic preparedness, 

cognitive levels of functioning, and teacher 

2247

attitudes. As far as the school environment is 

concerned, the school environment should be considered 

a larger version of the classroom environment, with 

foundations based on attitude, respect, desirable and 

expected behavior (for both students and staff), and 

accountability. Clothing should not be an issue 

(with the exception of inappropriate or gang symbolic 

clothing) if the above listed values are the 

foundation and basis for interaction and behavior in 

schools. Therefore, the questions to be answered are 

these: Does what students wear have truly have an 

affect on how they learn? Are the issues related to 

clothing in schools related to education or to the 

social environment of the school, which functions on 

(established?) values? To what extent are the 

attitudes of teachers and students affected by the 

aesthetic nature of clothing? And, should we shelter 

children from the realities of differences of people 

(socioeconomic, cultural, sexual, etc.) and let them 

confront this reality on their own upon leaving 

school, rather than support students to be ethical, 

tolerant, democratically responsible people capable of 

critical thinking and higher levels of understanding? 


__________________________________ 



http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover 

2248





Subject: RE: Journal 14: School Uniforms 

Wow, Micheal you did a great job of looking at both sides of the argument. 

Though I do see the benefits of school uniforms, which have already been 

stated in previous journals. Just think ... you would want to wear a uniform 

at Cal State? Probably not. I know I would not beucase i like my clothes and 

my style. It describes me. Maybe I would get better grades and not have to 

worry about what to wear in the morning. BUt I would look like everyone else 

at school and picking out my clothes and accessories is a highlight of the 

morning. 

Teresa 


> School uniforms have been cause for great 

>discussion and debate both here on the list serve and 

>for schools who choose to enforce uniform codes for 

>students. Some people have stated that they feel that 

>school uniforms are good things and that they would 

>support their implementation in elementary schools. 

>Reasons for this are that uniforms would eliminate the 

>differences between students (socioeconomic, cultural, 

>etc.) that could be grounds for teasing or 

>discrimination of sorts. It has also been mentioned 

>before that if students all come to school wearing the 

>same uniform that they will be less focused on their 

>clothing and differences between who is wearing what, 

>not to mention eliminating possible gang symbolism in 

>clothing. These are all valid possibilities, however 

>there are other perspectives to the argument. 

> There are students, parents, and most likely 

>teachers who feel that school uniforms are unnecessary 

>and are a violation of personal freedom, and as Jenny 

>stated, are perceived by some as a “…robbery of 

>individuality.” These sentiments are equally as valid 

>as those already stated in the discussion of school 

>uniforms and should be considered. 

> Regarding Judith’s journal entry about her 

>experiences in Mexico and the strict policies there, 

>cultural differences need to be taken into account. 

>>From what was written, and from my personal experience 

>in average Mexican families, most Mexican families and 

>social institutions uphold traditional Catholic values 

>and are quite conservative, which explains the 

>restrictions placed on the young girls, including 

>Judith, in her school and led to her frantic 

>nail-biting experience. Upon entering school in the 

>United States, Judith had a different school 

>experience regarding school uniforms. It is easy to 

>understand her feelings of relief of not having to 

>face judgment of her clothing in the school that 

>required uniforms. That Judith experienced anxiety 

>about her clothing choice in the non-uniform wearing 

>school in the states, and took a very positive outlook 

>I might add, is a reality for any child going to 

>school where uniforms are not worn, or anyone living 

>in society for that matter. This example of social 

>differences is an important reality that will come 

>into play later on in this journal. 

> Some schools are adopting uniform policies with 

2249

hopes of reforming student behavior, attitudes, and 

>performance, and do so based on grounds of unpolished 

>research. One example is the Long Beach Unified 

>School District, which adopted school uniform policies 

>in the early 1990s. The district, based on a study 

>done by Bryk, Lee, and Holland 1993, Bryk, Driscoll 

>1998 (I misplaced the name of the article source!!), 

>found a decrease in school crime between the years of 

>1994-95 and 1995-96, which they attributed to the 

>uniform policy. From these unsubstantiated findings, 

>the district established the policy to all schools in 

>the district…permanently. 

> The findings are unsubstantiated because during the 

>time when students were being required to wear 

>uniforms, other infrastructural changes were 

>happening, such as reassessment of content standards, 

>a $1 million grant from the Edna McConnell Clark 

>Foundation to develop alternative pedagogical 

>strategies, and the Focused Reporting Project. The 

>researchers state that it is curious that given these 

>substantive reform efforts, administrators at Long 

>Beach District continue to insist that uniforms are 

>the sole factor causing a variety of positive 

>educational outcome. This leads to the question of 

>what the function of uniforms really are, and if they 

>are, Jennifer, beneficial for students. 

> Jenny stated in her journal that when rumors were 

>circulating in her middle school that a uniform policy 

>was coming, students protested. It would be 

>interesting to know if parents shared similar 

>reactions. Assuming that some parents did, I see 

>their reactions as completely natural to what can be 

>identified simply as change; will requiring students 

>to wear uniforms to school truly “robb” them of who 

>they are as individuals? An example in our own lives, 

>as cohort F, are the changes that we have all 

>experienced along the way, changes that nobody 

>expected, that mostly everybody complained about, and 

>that ultimately have not, and will not affect most of 

>our personal goals, as we have, for the most part, 

>adapted to these changes. Think back to comments 

>about cohort F as “guinea pigs,” and then ask 

>yourself, is anything in life truly predictable and 

>stable? Any significant change in school policy, such 

>as uniforms for all students, will cause this sort of 

>reaction amidst the collective, as humans are reactive 

>creatures. 

> Ultimately, the question that needs to be asked 

>when considering ones position on school uniforms has 

>been asked in Jennifer’s posting, “How will it affect 

>the students, and what will be the 

>benefits/implications?” It is obvious that school 

>uniforms would eliminate judgment based on appearance, 

>which is something that all people do. Yes you do. 

>For us as future teachers, how many of us will be able 

>to completely detach ourselves from this human 

>condition? How many of us will look at the student who 

>walks into our classroom with an oversized shirt, 

>pants half-way down his ass, walkman on full blast, 

>and a bandana around his head and say to ourselves, “I 

>can’t wait to work with this budding little mind!” I 

>am generalizing here because the majority of this 

>cohort would instantly have some preconceived notions 

>about this student. And that is my point here, that 

>pro-achievement attitudes towards students is a 

>serious concern that affects how teachers may relate 

2250

to them. It is worth considering how uniforms might 

>play into this relationship between physical 

>appearances and assumptions/attitudes of teachers 

>towards students. 

> Relating uniform policy to academic achievement and 

>school the environment, what students wear has very 

>little impact on their academic performance and 

>cognitive abilities, which may be more closely related 

>to proschool attitudes, academic preparedness, 

>cognitive levels of functioning, and teacher 

>attitudes. As far as the school environment is 

>concerned, the school environment should be considered 

>a larger version of the classroom environment, with 

>foundations based on attitude, respect, desirable and 

>expected behavior (for both students and staff), and 

>accountability. Clothing should not be an issue 

>(with the exception of inappropriate or gang symbolic 

>clothing) if the above listed values are the 

>foundation and basis for interaction and behavior in 

>schools. Therefore, the questions to be answered are 

>these: Does what students wear have truly have an 

>affect on how they learn? Are the issues related to 

>clothing in schools related to education or to the 

>social environment of the school, which functions on 

>(established?) values? To what extent are the 

>attitudes of teachers and students affected by the 

>aesthetic nature of clothing? And, should we shelter 

>children from the realities of differences of people 

>(socioeconomic, cultural, sexual, etc.) and let them 

>confront this reality on their own upon leaving 

>school, rather than support students to be ethical, 

>tolerant, democratically responsible people capable of 

>critical thinking and higher levels of understanding? 

> Michael Renner 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 



>http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover 

2251





Subject: RE: teresa's response to Journal 14: School Uniforms 

thanks for your response teresa, i understand your 

point. but i think that i failed to state that the 

perspective i was working from was based on the k-12 

environment...having uniforms at the university level 

would be completely unnecessary, as people in that 

environment are adults and are part of the "reality" 

(society) that i was talking about. i too, would 

personally never choose to attend a university that 

enforced uniform codes. thanks again for the 

thoughts! 

michael 

__________________________________ 




2252



Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2004 9:20 PM 


Subject: T-Shirt "cohort -F" uniform... info :o) 

Boy, this list serve is like a ghost town..... look there goes a tumble weed..... did you see it????? 

Hi..... 

here's the scoop. It will cost $25.00 for one screen print, which means one color. If we want two 

colors it will be two screens which means $50.00, but since 19 out of the 23 of us want shirts, it's not 

that much money for each of us. The price is slightly higher than I anticipated because I did the price 

before without tax and calculations based on 23 people wanting them..... Anyway, it's still a good 

price. 

The really big shirts will cost an extra dollar for every (X) after the XL 

So, if we want one color it will cost $7.00 per person, or $8.00 for the extra, extra large. 

If we want two colors it will cost $8.50 per person, or $9.50 for the extra, extra large. 

So, all we need now is to come up with what we want on the shirts. If we do have a drawing, it has to 

be black and white like a cartoon so he can scan it into his computer and manipulate it more easily. 

So, we can have the print on the front, or on the back, or a small print on the back and large one on 

the back... But, if we get two it will be the same logo both on front and back. 

We can have a drawing with words... or just words... 

So, if you are taking a break from your capstone frenzy, and all our other projects, finals, 

labs....life??????????? ....... or whatever and you think about some possible t-shirt logo ideas.... 

please bring them up. The sooner we settle on a logo and everyone gives me their 

MOOOOOLAAAAAAAAAAA we can make this happen..... 

Talk to you later, 

Ann 

_____ 



2253





Subject: Check out Funny T-shirts 

Click here: Funny T-shirts 

2254





Subject: Check out T Shirt at T-Shirtking.com: T Shirts, Shirt, Shirts, Tee Shirt 

Click here: T Shirt at T-Shirtking.com: T Shirts, Shirt, Shirts, Tee Shirt 

2255





Subject: Check out Retro T-Shirts 

Click here: Retro T-Shirts 

2256



Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2004 7:35 AM 



Micheal 

I think that there really is not a difference, would middle school students 

like uniforms when that is a peak time for children to figure out who they 

really are and express that? 

Teresa>===== Original Message From Michael Renner ===== 

>thanks for your response teresa, i understand your 

>point. but i think that i failed to state that the 

>perspective i was working from was based on the k-12 

>environment...having uniforms at the university level 

>would be completely unnecessary, as people in that 

>environment are adults and are part of the "reality" 

>(society) that i was talking about. i too, would 

>personally never choose to attend a university that 

>enforced uniform codes. thanks again for the 

>thoughts! 

> michael 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>__________________________________ 



>http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover 

2257






teresa, 

i don't understand what you mean by, "there really 

is not a difference..." school is not a fashion show, 

and the kids that you're talking about definately have 

some serious self exploration to do at that age. but 

they also have 138 out of 168 hours every week to wear 

whatever clothes that they feel depicts who they are. 

teachers and students definately deal with a lot more 

at school than just lessons and schoolwork, but it 

should not be forgotten that learning is the goal 

during those six hours. 

michael 

__________________________________ 




2258



Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2004 4:01 PM 


Subject: About everything 

I am looking forward to tomorrow and seeing all the group presentations. After 

reading all the postings I decided to respond with this: 

UNIFORMS- 

I think uniforms is not only a way to avoid extra distractions in the K-8 

atmosphere, but also enforces equality. If everyone wears the same uniform, 

then just by looking at eachother it would difficult to tell what 

socio-economic class everyone came from. A few pychological studies have done 

on this subject. And I was not surprised to see that junior high and high 

school kids in schools that insisted on uniforms had higher GPAs's then those 

schools that did not enforce a dress code. For the men in the cohort- I am 

sure you couldn't wait to go to school to see which girl was wearing the 

slinkiest top or the shortest skirt. Once you were in class you made sure to 

drop a pencil or something to look up the skirt. Believe me I saw this stuff 

all the time and my guy friends would tell me about their evil schemes. For 

the girls- you judged the boys according to what they were wearing too, I 

sure. Anyway, wearing uniforms (although expensive for the districts) is a 

good idea. 

THE PLEDGE 

I am with Ann, I never knew what the real word actually said. I always 

thought it said "for witches stands" I never actually said it, I would always 

mouth it so my teacher wouldn't get mad at me. I remember I had a peer in 2nd 

or 3rd grade, his parents didn't want him to say the pledge and so he had to 

leave and sit outside the door while we all recited it. I don't think it is 

disrespectful to not stand or even not to say it. it seems that slowly 

people's attitudes are changing and becoming more accepting to people of other 

religions. However, it is still not the case for the governments. 

THE COHORT 

I think this semester has really put a stake right through the center of us 

all. I notice that people are nice to others' faces, but sound as though they 

would like to rip their head of on the list serve. Interestingly, the same 

things that have been debated over for years by so many people are the same 

subjects that were being debated on on the listserve (i.e-religion, gay 

marriage, aliens, etc). I would like to think that is becuase each one of us 

is trying to prepare ourselves for the real world of debate and realize that 

in a lot of cases there is no "one right answer". Being able to listen to 

others and accept their right to think for themselves is often the best way to 

walk away from situations without being frustrated or angry. 

Thats all for now. 

Chula 

2259





Subject: Scholastic Book Order 

For those of you wanting to place book orders, please give me your order tomorrow as I want a quick turnaround so that I 

can get the books to you before the end of the semester. Remember you can write one check to Scholastic Books for 

orders from any of the catalogues. 

See you tomorrow. ~ Louise 

2260



Sent: Monday, May 03, 2004 8:16 AM 


Subject: listserve 

I have really enjoyed reading what everyone has written on the listserve 

this semester. So many people have so many different ideas about life and 

the world we live in. I for one hate emails and had a hard time getting 

used to the listserve. But, as the semester went on I found myself really 

wanting to read what other had to say on certain topics. I think a lot of 

who we are came out in the listserve. It provided for a place where people 

felt more freedom to express their thoughts. Some of the thoughts at times 

were mean or attacking towards others, which wouldn’t happen in a classroom 

setting. But, with the freedoms of the listserve I know so much more about 

you all than I would have ever known just from the classroom. I, stuck in 

my own beliefs have problems trying to understand why people see things 

differently than I do. Through the listserve I have been able to not only 

see some people’s beliefs, but why they believe them. This has been eye 

opening. I have gained respect for a lot of people in this cohort when 

trying to discover where they are coming from. I think there is a lot that 

can be learned from people’s differences. It would be a lot easier if we 

all believed the same thing and agreed on everything, but where would that 

take us? We would be a society of robots, never testing or questioning 

always going in the same direction. I am glad we are different. I just 

hope I can keep this same enthusiasm with future students and parents. 

Joey 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2261



Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2004 10:32 AM 


Subject: thank you cohort F 

Well, so this is the end of listeserve. I think everyone did a great job 

putting their own thoughts and ideas in it. It was interesting to finally see 

what kind of people all of us actually are. I really learned a lot from all of 

you, and I want to thank all of you for that! Al of this helped open my mind a 

little. So keep going strong by the end of this semester and may God bless all 

of you! 

Laurie :) 

2262



Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2004 1:40 PM 

To: ICP-F@csusm.edu; ICP-F@csusm.edu 

Subject: Re: RE: thank you cohort F 

> Thank You. This is the best way to stay in touch with the cohort... 

Alexandra 

> From: "Robert Yamashita" 

> Date: 2004/05/04 Tue PM 02:37:19 EDT 

> To: 

> Subject: RE: thank you cohort F 

> 

> THE LIST SERVE WILL CONTINUE - until I leave the campus. 

> At the end of the semester, I will strip all the faculty from the list 

> (including myself), so you can continue to use it as a tool for the 

> cohort. 

> 

> -by 

> 


> From: mcdon032 [mailto:mcdon032@csusm.edu] 

> Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2004 10:32 AM 


> Subject: thank you cohort F 

> 

> 

> Well, so this is the end of listeserve. I think everyone did a great job 

> 

> putting their own thoughts and ideas in it. It was interesting to 

> finally see 

> what kind of people all of us actually are. I really learned a lot from 

> all of 

> you, and I want to thank all of you for that! Al of this helped open my 

> mind a 

> little. So keep going strong by the end of this semester and may God 

> bless all 

> of you! 

> 

> Laurie :) 

> 

> 

> 

2263





Subject: Me'sa think'sa that.... 

"All mankind are chemists from their cradles to ther graves..." (John Adams) 

Science exits far beyond socitey. "The universe is a chemical experiment" 

(Adams) 

Birth is a miracle, and how babies are made is a miracle of science. Children 

use 

science everyday to figure out their own human capabilites as well as the 

capabilites of 

the world. In school we are taught about science. It is a chance to help us 

understand 

what we have been trying to figure out our whole life. 

Before this semester I only really looked at science through the experience 

and 

experiments that I had in the classroom. Now I see that science and 

experimental testing 

is what kindles our understanding and the making of society. Without 

experimentation a 

child would not know how tall they can stack blocks before they fall. A 

student would not 

know that you have to work hard to do well in school. Wars are an experiment, 

laws are 

experiments, it was and experiment used to stop Hitler and the Nazi's. Some 

experiments 

work, some don't. Some are good some are bad. The Constitution was an 

experiment 

and it was this experiment that has given us freedom to speak and freedom to 

ask 

questions. 

I am sure that people did experiments long before we made the connetion 

between 

science and experiments. Here I am saying that the world is science. However, 

a 

religious person might not agree. So, I think I should correct myself and 

reword what I 

have said. Instead of life, the universe, society being linked to science I 

think it is more 

appropriate to say that life, the universe and society is related to 

experiments and 

experience. 

Now I do not like what I wrote because I think that I have not looked at what 

I am trying to 

say through the eyes of others. Life to some may not be an experiment, it may 

be purely 

a miricale. If you are true to God then life will be true to you. And what 

ever happens it is 

Gods way of teaching you about life and showing his love. So that is not an 

experiment. 

Unless you think that believing in God is an experiment. But I bet that those 

who follow 

the word of God would not say that their faith is an experiment it is a way of 

life. But is life 

an experiment? I don't know I am just so, so, so happy to be alive. I don't 

care if life is an 

experiment, I don't care what the meaning is I am just so happy to be here. 

2264

Just to be 

able to sit and think is such a powerful experience. 

Thanks for thinking with me everybody. I have learned a lot from all of yours 

and mines 

thought. Mines thoughts. Mines thoughts. MInes a think' sa that'sa mine'sa 

thoughts'as 

are'sa becoming to dense to clearly reveal'sa. So bye for now'sa Your pal 

Jar-jar-bink'sa 

Marin. 

2265





Subject: Education Reform 

Will higher-order thinking lead to a more conscious society? Will there be less fatherless 

babies? Will we drive by that same lamppost and ignored the flowers symbolizing the lost 

of a love one. Our all of our tears, dried up? Do you ever grieve for the lost of Mother 

Teresa, Princess Diane, John F. Kennedy, and Martine Luther King...? If we teach, our 

children to think about thinking, will they bring hope and gain the confidence of an 

incrementalist. We are all yesterday's children. Something must give. Teachers must 

establish a new relationship with the children. Reform starts with that communion between 

teacher and a student. Through cognitive science research, we can begin to understand the 

value of knowing how the mind affects learning. It is important that we teach students how 

to learn and how to be conscious of their thought process while solving, for example, math 

problems, exploring science concepts, or reading a textbook. We can speculate from our 

novice perspecti 

ve that longer school days, wearing uniforms, teaching concepts in small segments will 

lead to a better education but our views lack the experience and the extensive research 

introduced in Bruer's book, School For Thought. 

It is interesting to see that at the end of the semester we are still looking, for 

example, at lengthening the school year as a possible reform. Three decades of research 

indicate, for example, that the following school reforms: "To improve schools we must 

change curricular content, raise school standards, embrace site-based management, increase 

school and teacher accountability, lengthen the school year, and allow parents to choose 

which school their child attend" do not go deep enough (1). What we need is a fundamental 

change in the way teachers teach and in understanding how children learn. We continue to 

push forth standards without addressing the need for change. Understanding cognitive 

scientists' research in how the human mind works puts us future teachers on the path of 

evolving from a novice in our profession into an intelligent novice, who seeks to 

understand how children learn and most important reflects not only on what he/she knows 

about a subject but how best t 

o teach that subject. Standardized tests enforced by the U.S. Department of Education's 

National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP) indicate that we are a "Nation at 

Risk." What does that really mean, "If [...] a student [...] scores in the 35th percentile 

on a standardized math test, what does this score tell [us] about what the student knows 

and what he or she fails to understand?" (257). 

I agree with Bruer that educational reform starts with understanding assessment, 

motivation, and teaching (257). Test scores help us see where we are in comparison to 

other schools or educational systems but what does it tell us about the student or the 

teacher. These tests do not tell us specifically what a student understands or does not 

understand or how a teacher can help. What is needed are diagnostic tests like the ones 

Bruer introduces, for example, Siegler's tests that reveals the rules the students are 

applying for both the errors and correct answers. This diagnostic test provides "Teachers 

with the diagnostic information needed to help students learn" (271). We must teach 

students higher-order reasoning and learning skills. How? First, we must move from the 

behaviorist theory for analyzing how students' behavior influences their learning process 

rather than seeking to understand students' mental process. Then we need to understand the 

skills that experts use in the 

learning like chunking ideas and making connections. It is important that we teach 

students the meaning behind the standards rather than just expose them to mere facts. How 

can we do this? Cognitive scientist introduces the concept of metacognition. What is 

metacognition? "Metacognition is the ability to think about thinking, to be consciously 

aware of oneself as a problem solver, and to monitor and control one's mental processing" 

(67). Before I explain, what good will longer school days serve if we do not teach our 

children how to think? Bruer's book page 72 gives some examples of how to apply 

metacognition. Here are a few examples, Have the students "Predict the results of 

[his/her] own problem-solving actions" (72). Have the students monitor their own progress 

by having them think about the following questions: Did it work? How am I doing? Does this 

make sense? Until these types of questions become part of a student's internal dialogue. 

How else can a teacher teach me 

2266

tacognition thinking? Teachers can teach thinking about thinking through modeling and 

scaffolding. Thinking about thinking internal process must be made "overt and explicit" by 

placing the students in a "group learning situations where teachers and students engage in 

dialogues about their joint learning and problem solving" (73). The idea is to have the 

students think aloud. Furthermore, challenge the students' ability by having them stretch 

what they know to learning a new situation like an expert would do (74). Have students 

build onto former strategies, for example, labeling, sorting, clustering, and self-test by 

giving them "Explicit descriptions of the strategies, instruction about when the 

strategies are useful, and an explanation of why they are useful" (75). Educational reform 

grounded in cognitive theory promotes higher-order thinking. 

Some of the components for a successful reform school system: 

-Instructional scaffolding 

-Hands-on activities 

-Learner-center environment 

-Inquiry based learning 

-Portfolios as assessment 

-Active learning 

-Teachers modeling & scaffolding 

-Incorporating Gardner's theory of multiple intelligence throughout the curriculum to 

target all learners 

-Promoting a system of education that focus less on performance through testing, comparing 

students, the negativity of grouping students by ability 

-Establishing a sense of community and routine 

-Focus on the process of education not the product 

-Collaboration between the teachers and cognitive scientist 

-Teachers involvement in education research 

-Support of educational research, especially cognitive research, and seeking to understand 

why students cannot master some aspect of math, science, reading, or writing 

-A society that supports cognitive scientists research 

-Education supported by using the schemas of cognitive scienctist(metacognitive) 

-Teachers understanding how children learn 

-Education founded in higher-order thinking & thinking about thinking 

Of all the articles and books I have read this semester, Bruer's book offers the most 

grounded educational reform. How the human mind works gives teachers insight into how 

children learn. Understanding the Entity Theory (Performance Goal) and Incremental Theory 

(Learning Goal) gives teachers the insight into understanding what motivates students, so 

they may help students make the transition from performance to learning goals. Science is 

not a threat to our education system. It teaches students how to be skeptical and 

understand the environment he/she lives in. Science does not teach the theory of evolution 

as a form of religion but as a way to understand nature. Science nurtures students' sense 

of wonder, promotes skeptical and critical thinking, so our children can find their own 

path and seek out their own religion and sense of God, like the German astronomer Johannes 

Kepler, which "describe his pursuit of science as a wish to know the mind of God." 

(Alexandra's Journal 14 

& 15) 

2267



Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 2004 8:46 PM 


Subject: Hey, How about this for our t-shirts? 

Attachments: cohort f super heroes.... t-shirt.JPG 

cohort f super 

heroes.... t-sh... 

Dear class, 

How about this for our t-shirt design? Only I would draw it better. 

We are an elite band of super heroes ... each of us has our own special powers. Together we form COHORT-F.... We 

are able to teach small children in a single bound. 

Ann 

2268





Subject: Re: Hey, How about this for our t-shirts? 

Attachments: cohort f super heroes.... t-shirt.JPG 

cohort f super 

heroes.... t-sh... 

thats cute ann, im still a little stuck on mikes stick figure though. 

> 

> From: Zestydu69@aol.com 

> Date: 2004/05/05 Wed PM 08:46:17 PDT 


> Subject: Hey, How about this for our t-shirts? 

> 

> Dear class, 

> 

> How about this for our t-shirt design? Only I would draw it better. 

> 

> We are an elite band of super heroes ... each of us has our own special 

> powers. Together we form COHORT-F.... We are able to teach small children in a 

> single bound. 

> 

> Ann 

> 

> 


2269



Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2004 6:48 AM 


Subject: RE: Hey, How about this for our t-shirts? 

Anne, let me know what file type the image needs to be in and I'll e-mail it to you this 

weekend. 





Subject: Re: Hey, How about this for our t-shirts? 


> 


> Date: 2004/05/05 Wed PM 08:46:17 PDT 



> 

> Dear class, 

> 


> 




> 

> Ann 

> 

> 


2270



Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2004 12:14 PM 


Cc: kirke003@csusm.edu 

Subject: ATTENTION THOSE WHO WANT T-SHIRTS!!!!!!!!!! 

Dear cohort F, 

For those interested in getting the t-shirts.... 

We all need to vote on what we want..... If everyone is cool with Mike's stick figure, speak 

up..........That's cool with me too.....I just want everyone to decide. If anyone has any ideas........ 

Speak up!!!!!! let's get the ball rolling....... let's make a final decision by finals and everyone 

bring their money in on Wednesdays finals day. I will get them made over the summer if I can get 

the money on the last day we will see eachother. If not, then nothing will become of this....... I don't 

want to have the t-shirts made until I get everyone's money..... Just incase you don't show up next 

semster, and I don't want to have to be a bill collector of t-shirt money. It will become a burden. 

So, Mike.... if you want to draw "THE DESIGN" and maybe explain it to everyone... so they can 

deside........and bring it in on Wednesday the 12th.... FINALS DAY, and EVERYONE ELSE BRINGS 

IN THIER MONEY.... and we all have DECIDED on the DESIGN.... then I can get them made over 

the summer and bring them back next semester. Otherwise...... this will just putter out and not 

happen.... please give me feedback......... we need to take some active action here.... 

Wanting some feed back, would be greatful for any help, Ann 



> 


> Date: 2004/05/05 Wed PM 08:46:17 PDT 



> 

> Dear class, 

> 


> 




> 

> Ann 

> 

> 


> ATTACHMENT part 2 image/jpeg name=cohort f super heroes.... t-shirt.JPG 

2271

_____ 



2272





Subject: study group with dr. karas 

casey and i will be meeting with dr. karas on tuesday at 11:00 to study further before the 

final. dr. karas requests small groups come to meet with him. groups of 5-8 are best. 

if anyone would like to join us, please let dr. karas know. 


2273



Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 9:50 AM 

To: Debbie Sells; Gena Tweed (duma2000@adelphia.net); Kelly Schafer; Pamela Berry; Patty 

Tweed (Home); Pauline Whalen; Rebecca Eberle-Romberger; Sabrina Westendorf; ICP- 

F@csusm.edu; Shirley Everidge; Steven Sparrow; Virginia Brade; Sharmila Melnychuck; 

Devin Vodicka; Diana Aaron; Dina Masamoto; Karensue Valverde; Katie Gardner; Kim Jones; 

Lori Johnson; Maria Brewer; Pam Fox; 'Kevin Skjei'; 'Elizabeth Braman'; 'Janeane Laiderman' 

Subject: FW: FW: Photographs that will never make the news 

Attachments: Fwd: FW: Photographs that will never make the news 

Fwd: FW: 

hotographs that will. 

I thought these pictures were rather refreshing especially after all the media turmoil over the latest events. 

2274





Subject: Re: ATTENTION THOSE WHO WANT T-SHIRTS!!!!!!!!!! 

What does it look like? And how much do we owe? 

Jenny 

2275



Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 2:22 PM 

To: ICP-F 

Subject: science standardized test 

I was proctoring for the standardized state yesterday and was baffled with what I saw. The content 

area was science, to my surprise this group of kids did not have the slightest ideas what the majority 

of questions were asking. The questions covered much of the stuff that we have been working on in 

all of our classes this semester, such as photosynthesis, electrical circuits, gravity. These kids did not 

know how to use a periodic table, and the majority of them answer "to help fight ear infection" for 

the function of a blood vessel. The teacher then explained to me, after seeing the frustration on their 

faces, that they hardly ever have time for science with the new reading program that the school is 

using. 

I went back to the teacher that I work with and told her what I saw from the kids: frustration. She 

mentioned the same issue about not having enough time to go over the science content because of 

the new reading program that has been implemented. It became freighting to me because I mention 

that I will try to incorporate science through out the curriculum, especially after going through that 

experience, and she still challenged me by saying that it was going to be impossible to do that. This is 

when the option of teaching behind "closed" doors came into mind. I do not want to cheat my 

students from the education that they should be getting, I will definitely feel guilty if the students in my 

class were to take a test on a subject matter that we hardly know anything about. So if it takes 

teaching behind closed doors so that these kids learn some science I will do just that. 

2276





Subject: Re: science standardized test 

This is interesting, but not surprising. I wonder how important these teachers really think science is. 

At the very miminum, students could be reading books about science concepts as part of the reading 

program. What school is this? What program are they using anyway? I know that the Houghton Mifflin 

program has science in it. They also have a separate science text book and curriculum. That is what 

the teachers have at Central, not that they actually use it. My door will not only be closed, but 

deadbolted! 

Cynthia 



area was science, to my surprise this group of kids did not have the slightest ideas what the 

majority of questions were asking. The questions covered much of the stuff that we have been 

working on in all of our classes this semester, such as photosynthesis, electrical circuits, gravity. 

These kids did not know how to use a periodic table, and the majority of them answer "to help fight 

ear infection" for the function of a blood vessel. The teacher then explained to me, after seeing the 

frustration on their faces, that they hardly ever have time for science with the new reading 

program that the school is using. 


mentioned the same issue about not having enough time to go over the science content because 

of the new reading program that has been implemented. It became freighting to me because I 

mention that I will try to incorporate science through out the curriculum, especially after going 

through that experience, and she still challenged me by saying that it was going to be impossible 

to do that. This is when the option of teaching behind "closed" doors came into mind. I do not want 

to cheat my students from the education that they should be getting, I will definitely feel guilty if the 

students in my class were to take a test on a subject matter that we hardly know anything about. 

So if it takes teaching behind closed doors so that these kids learn some science I will do just that. 

_____ 



2277





Subject: RE: study group with dr. karas 

I suppose this could be applied to our research projects too. We only ran our experiment 2 times on 

the same day (even though we did preliminary testing on ourselves and relatives), but at the time we 

were thinking that was sufficient because we had a large number of students we were testing in the 

classes. Had we thought about it more, we probably would have come to the conclusion that we 

needed to go to several schools in different areas and repeat the experiment to get a more inclusive 

set of results to analyze. Cynthia 

Robert Yamashita wrote: 

Karis 

Thank you for doing this 

Its about time that someone from the cohort step up for your education. 

In most instances real learning is not easy, its not about having "fun" all or even most of the time. 

Learning is about challenges, it is the struggle to solve the problem or overcome the obstacle. But 

doing the problem solving once (simply getting the answer), is not enough You all need to learn 

how to solve problems so it becomes part of your repetiore, a routine that you can pull out of your 

knowledge-base and use. 

In the physical world of sport, the rule of thumb is that it takes 400 attempts (reps) before the 

athlete learns a skill, mastery takes several thousand repetitions The athlete then has to be able 

take the individual skils and put them togehter (higher orrder routines or plays). It takes 

persistence, but it takes a willingness to listen and make the corrections that differentiates the 

good athetes from the bad. 

Academic learning requires a similar level of commitment. In many instnaces, because it does not 

require a lot of physical exersion we think that it doesn't require that many repetitions - but to 

become active learners and real thinkers, we need to pracitice When we get complacent about our 

skills, we begin to loose them. Education is about learning how to think - we can take Pam's notion 

seriously - writing is thinking, doing a math problem is thinking, doing science is thinking. You 

need to take the thinking seriously (and it is hard work - it is often not fun, but it is usually 

rewarding). 



Sent: Thu 5/6/2004 4:16 PM 


Cc: 

Subject: study group with dr. karas 

casey and i will be meeting with dr. karas on tuesday at 11:00 to study further before the f inal. dr. 

karas requests small groups come to meet with him. groups of 5-8 are best. if anyone would like 

2278

to join us, please let dr. karas know. 


> ATTACHMENT part 2 application/ms-tnef name=winmail.dat 

_____ 



2279





Subject: RE: science standardized test 

I had almost the same experience too! I was proctoring a sixth grade class for the STAR this week and the teacher told 

me that not all the material that is in the math section of the test had been covered in class. She said that the advanced 

students had the opportunity to skim over the last part of the required materials and that they will probably do okay 

because they will at least be familiar with certain terms or concepts, but for the majority of the class, a portion of the test 

will be quite foreign to them. Her hope for the future is that the testing will be done nearer the end of the school year 

rather than with 6 weeks left, thereby allowing more instruction time before testing. 

It’s sad that we have to resign ourselves to having a “closed door” with respect to teaching, but if that’s the most 

productive way in educating students in particular disciplines, then I say, go for it! ~ Louise 




To: ICP-F 

Subject: science standardized test 

I was proctoring for the standardized state yesterday and was baffled with what I saw. The content area was science, 

to my surprise this group of kids did not have the slightest ideas what the majority of questions were asking. The 

questions covered much of the stuff that we have been working on in all of our classes this semester, such as 

photosynthesis, electrical circuits, gravity. These kids did not know how to use a periodic table, and the majority of 

them answer "to help fight ear infection" for the function of a blood vessel. The teacher then explained to me, after 

seeing the frustration on their faces, that they hardly ever have time for science with the new reading program that 

the school is using. 

I went back to the teacher that I work with and told her what I saw from the kids: frustration. She mentioned the 

same issue about not having enough time to go over the science content because of the new reading program that has 

been implemented. It became freighting to me because I mention that I will try to incorporate science through out the 

curriculum, especially after going through that experience, and she still challenged me by saying that it was going to 

be impossible to do that. This is when the option of teaching behind "closed" doors came into mind. I do not want to 

cheat my students from the education that they should be getting, I will definitely feel guilty if the students in my 

class were to take a test on a subject matter that we hardly know anything about. So if it takes teaching behind closed 

doors so that these kids learn some science I will do just that. 

2280


From: Robert Yamashita 




Now that the class is over, I will respond to some of the posts (so we can all watch the silence) 

There is actually a much more FUNDAMENTAL problem here - and something all of you need to think about. 

Its not about observing or commiserating over "other people's" plights. Its about taking the observation, and then asking 

the hard pragmatic question, so what you gonna do? And then answering it for yourself. 

The problem is NOT I want to teach ______________ subject matter ... but can you? 

Could YOU prepare and teach lessons on any of the topics mentioned? 

What would YOU need to do in order to be able to teach even a single unit on ONE of the topics? 

What "brushing up" would you need to do? 

Is there more to it than simply pulling a lesson plan off the web? 

Finally, regardless of the system requirements, what kinds of materials do you know about that you could incorporate into 

your classroom so students can learn subject matter while fulfilling the basic requirements of ANY proscribed curriculum. 

In the example, note that your kids will still need to be reading something, so in "closed door classrooms" or "open door 

ones" you will still need to SHOW your colleagues and your bosses that your kids are addressing the reading standards. 

We can point to the system, but if you don't have the toolset, it doesn't matter (sounds like one of the readings we did). 

Blaming the system and doing nothing is the easy way out. My gut response to the story, is that the teacher had no idea 

about the content, and retreated to the system requirements. Its only the most draconian school administrators who would 

not let teachers assign alternative readings in their classes. So here is YOUR problem. Many of you have pointed out that 

you are so ready to become teachers in the classroom. But are you? Do you know enough content to be able to teach it 

and meet the real needs of students, or are you simply prepared to create comfortable and safe environments for 

children? If you don't have the content, how are you going to get it? What kind of work will it involve? Where are you going 

to find the answers? 

Rhetorical question: if you don't take your own learning seriously, how are you going to be able to create a learning 

environment for your students. 

Note that the answer is in the practice, not in the positioning. 

_____ 










deadbolted! 

Cynthia 


2281


















_____ 



2282






A footnote ... 

And we haven't even got to the Bruer (who?) problem ... its not the what, its the how ... prior knowledge, scaffolding, etc. 

-by 

_____ 







Its not about observing or commiserating over "other people's" plights. Its about taking the observation, and then asking 

the hard pragmatic question, so what you gonna do? And then answering it for yourself. 






Finally, regardless of the system requirements, what kinds of materials do you know about that you could incorporate into 

your classroom so students can learn subject matter while fulfilling the basic requirements of ANY proscribed curriculum. 

In the example, note that your kids will still need to be reading something, so in "closed door classrooms" or "open door 

ones" you will still need to SHOW your colleagues and your bosses that your kids are addressing the reading standards. 

We can point to the system, but if you don't have the toolset, it doesn't matter (sounds like one of the readings we did). 

Blaming the system and doing nothing is the easy way out. My gut response to the story, is that the teacher had no idea 

about the content, and retreated to the system requirements. Its only the most draconian school administrators who would 

not let teachers assign alternative readings in their classes. So here is YOUR problem. Many of you have pointed out that 

you are so ready to become teachers in the classroom. But are you? Do you know enough content to be able to teach it 

and meet the real needs of students, or are you simply prepared to create comfortable and safe environments for 

children? If you don't have the content, how are you going to get it? What kind of work will it involve? Where are you going 

to find the answers? 




_____ 




2283







deadbolted! 

Cynthia 



















_____ 



2284






I work at oakhill elementary. I have to tell you Cynthia this class is very smart there are several gate 

students in this class, I also proctored the language arts and math sections and they did an awesome 

job on those. I don't remember the name of the program that they are using, I will ask and get back to 

you. Yes, this school also uses the Houghton Mifflin program, but I don't know if they use both 

programs interdependently, I will ask though. I am with you on deadbolting my classroom doors. 






This is interesting, but not surprising. I wonder how important these teachers really think science 

is. At the very miminum, students could be reading books about science concepts as part of the 

reading program. What school is this? What program are they using anyway? I know that the 

Houghton Mifflin program has science in it. They also have a separate science text book and 

curriculum. That is what the teachers have at Central, not that they actually use it. My door will not 

only be closed, but deadbolted! 

Cynthia 


_____ 

I was proctoring for the standardized state yesterday and was baffled with what I saw. The 

content area was science, to my surprise this group of kids did not have the slightest ideas 

what the majority of questions were asking. The questions covered much of the stuff that we 

have been working on in all of our classes this semester, such as photosynthesis, electrical 

circuits, gravity. These kids did not know how to use a periodic table, and the majority of them 

answer "to help fight ear infection" for the function of a blood vessel. The teacher then 

explained to me, after seeing the frustration on their faces, that they hardly ever have time for 

science with the new reading program that the school is using. 

I went back to the teacher that I work with and told her what I saw from the kids: frustration. 

She mentioned the same issue about not having enough time to go over the science content 

because of the new reading program that has been implemented. It became freighting to me 

because I mention that I will try to incorporate science through out the curriculum, especially 

after going through that experience, and she still challenged me by saying that it was going to 

be impossible to do that. This is when the option of teaching behind "closed" doors came into 

mind. I do not want to cheat my students from the education that they should be getting, I will 

definitely feel guilty if the students in my class were to take a test on a subject matter that we 

hardly know anything about. So if it takes teaching behind closed doors so that these kids 

learn some science I will do just that. 

2285



2286






I personally do not think that it is all about knowing enough content to be able to teach this kids. 

Some think that teachers ought to know everything because they are teachers, but in reality that is 

not the case. As Pam mentioned before, she goes into her class not knowing anything about the book 

that the class is reading. Instead of finding out what the book is about beforehand she reads at the 

pace that the class is reading and discover their Ah moments together. For me that is the case with 

becoming a teacher; I will say that NO I don't know enough content to be able to teach it off the top of 

my head, but I do have the desire to go in the classroom as a facilitator were we all will be 

discovering at the same pace, rather than me thinking that I am a know it all teacher. After all how 

difficult could this be: the district provides materials that tell you how to teach the subject step by step. 

The only difference, at least for me, is that based on how the teacher edition is telling us to do it, I will 

adapt to do it my way, and hopefully use outside resources that can better enhance the student's 

learning. 



To: ICP-F@csusm.edu s 





Its not about observing or commiserating over "other people's" plights. Its about taking the observation, and then 

asking the hard pragmatic question, so what you gonna do? And then answering it for yourself. 






Finally, regardless of the system requirements, what kinds of materials do you know about that you could incorporate 

into your classroom so students can learn subject matter while fulfilling the basic requirements of ANY proscribed 

curriculum. In the example, note that your kids will still need to be reading something, so in "closed door classrooms" 

or "open door ones" you will still need to SHOW your colleagues and your bosses that your kids are addressing the 

reading standards. 

We can point to the system, but if you don't have the toolset, it doesn't matter (sounds like one of the readings we 

did). 

Blaming the system and doing nothing is the easy way out. My gut response to the story, is that the teacher had no 

idea about the content, and retreated to the system requirements. Its only the most draconian school administrators 

who would not let teachers assign alternative readings in their classes. So here is YOUR problem. Many of you have 

pointed out that you are so ready to become teachers in the classroom. But are you? Do you know enough content to 

be able to teach it and meet the real needs of students, or are you simply prepared to create comfortable and 

safe environments for children? If you don't have the content, how are you going to get it? What kind of work will it 

involve? Where are you going to find the answers? 



2287


_____ 











Cynthia 


_____ 





















2288






Yes, students do have to meet the reading standards. Depending on the reading program, students 

can be exposed to science while meeting those requirements. San Diego City Schools uses a reading 

program that attempts to do this. They have leveled books from a wide variety of genres that students 

pick to read from. This includes science, history, fiction etc. Since the students are reading these 

kinds of books as part of their reading curriculum, they are also being exposed to other curriculum 

areas. These books can provide scaffolding, and if the science curriculum would build on that, they 

might actually gain a real understanding of science (and other) concepts. Unfortunately, this same 

district has a weak science curriculum. I think that part of this is that the teachers are not capable of 

teaching it, and so they avoid it. Many of them also blame the reading program when their overall 

curriculum falls short of a all encompassing education. This is very appare nt when you walk into their 

classrooms, and all you see is evidence of the reading program, but nothing else. I think its a cop out. 

I guess I could have just said that I agree with you, it might have been shorter. 

Cynthia 

Robert Yamashita wrote: 

A footnote ... 

And we haven't even got to the Bruer (who?) problem ... its not the what, its the how ... prior knowledge, scaffolding, 

etc. 

-by 

_____ 



















2289


did). 











_____ 











Cynthia 




















2290

_____ 



_____ 



2291






If you are learning along with the students and have no background knowledge yourself, how are you 

going to scaffold? How are you going to assess their understanding? How are you even going to 

know if you understand the concept yourself? I think teachers need to understand what they are 

teaching, or what they are wanting their students to learn, even if they don't use the clown in front of 

the class approach to teaching. 

Cynthia 




not the case. As Pam mentioned before, she goes into her class not knowing anything about the 

book that the class is reading. Instead of finding out what the book is about beforehand she reads 

at the pace that the class is reading and discover their Ah moments together. For me that is the 

case with becoming a teacher; I will say that NO I don't know enough content to be able to teach it 

off the top of my head, but I do have the desire to go in the classroom as a facilitator were we all 

will be discovering at the same pace, rather than me thinking that I am a know it all teacher. After 

all how difficult could this be: the district provides materials that tell you how to teach the subject 

step by step. The only difference, at least for me, is that based on how the teache r edition is 

telling us to do it, I will adapt to do it my way, and hopefully use outside resources that can better 

enhance the student's learning. 















Finally, regardless of the system requirements, what kinds of materials do you know about that you could 

incorporate into your classroom so students can learn subject matter while fulfilling the basic requirements of 

ANY proscribed curriculum. In the example, note that your kids will still need to be reading something, so in 

"closed door classrooms" or "open door ones" you will still need to SHOW your colleagues and your bosses that 

your kids are addressing the reading standards. 


did). 

2292

_____ 

_____ 

Blaming the system and doing nothing is the easy way out. My gut response to the story, is that the teacher had 

no idea about the content, and retreated to the system requirements. Its only the most draconian school 

administrators who would not let teachers assign alternative readings in their classes. So here is YOUR problem. 

Many of you have pointed out that you are so ready to become teachers in the classroom. But are you? Do you 

know enough content to be able to teach it and meet the real needs of students, or are you simply prepared to 

create comfortable and safe environments for children? If you don't have the content, how are you going to get it? 

What kind of work will it involve? Where are you going to find the answers? 

Rhetorical question: if you don't take your own learning seriously, how are you going to be able to create a 

learning environment for your students. 






This is interesting, but not surprising. I wonder how important these teachers really think 

science is. At the very miminum, students could be reading books about science concepts as 

part of the reading program. What school is this? What program are they using anyway? I 

know that the Houghton Mifflin program has science in it. They also have a separate science 

text book and curriculum. That is what the teachers have at Central, not that they actually use 

it. My door will not only be closed, but deadbolted! 

Cynthia 




what the majority of questions were asking. The questions covered much of the stuff that 

we have been working on in all of our classes this semester, such as photosynthesis, 

electrical circuits, gravity. These kids did not know how to use a periodic table, and the 

majority of them answer "to help fight ear infection" for the function of a blood vessel. The 

teacher then explained to me, after seeing the frustration on their faces, that they hardly 

ever have time for science with the new reading program that the school is using. 

I went back to the teacher that I work with and told her what I saw from the kids: 

frustration. She mentioned the same issue about not having enough time to go over the 

science content because of the new reading program that has been implemented. It 

became freighting to me because I mention that I will try to incorporate science through out 

the curriculum, especially after going through that experience, and she still challenged me 

by saying that it was going to be impossible to do that. This is when the option of teaching 

behind "closed" doors came into mind. I do not want to cheat my students from the 

education that they should be getting, I will definitely feel guilty if the students in my class 

were to take a test on a subject matter that we hardly know anything about. So if it takes 

teaching behind closed doors so that these kids learn some science I will do just that. 

2293

_____ 





2294






I guess what I was trying to say is that you don't go into the teaching profession thinking that you 

know everything, at least that is not my intention. Obviously the example that I used does not apply 

to elementary level kids, I just cannot image the chaos that will become of the room if the elementary 

teacher and the students are learning at the same time. Of course we need to go over the materials 

that we are going to be covering in class so that we will have enough understanding of what we are 

going to be teaching. 






If you are learning along with the students and have no background knowledge yourself, how are 

you going to scaffold? How are you going to assess their understanding? How are you even going 

to know if you understand the concept yourself? I think teachers need to understand what they are 

teaching, or what they are wanting their students to learn, even if they don't use the clown in front 

of the class approach to teaching. 

Cynthia 


I personally do not think that it is all about knowing enough content to be able to teach this 

kids. Some think that teachers ought to know everything because they are teachers, but in 

reality that is not the case. As Pam mentioned before, she goes into her class not knowing 

anything about the book that the class is reading. Instead of finding out what the book is about 

beforehand she reads at the pace that the class is reading and discover their Ah moments 

together. For me that is the case with becoming a teacher; I will say that NO I don't know 

enough content to be able to teach it off the top of my head, but I do have the desire to go in 

the classroom as a facilitator were we all will be discovering at the same pace, rather than me 

thinking that I am a know it all teacher. After all how difficult could this be: the district provides 

materials that tell you how to teach the subject step by step. The only difference, at least for 

me, is that based on how the teache r edition is telling us to do it, I will adapt to do it my way, 

and hopefully use outside resources that can better enhance the student's learning. 








Its not about observing or commiserating over "other people's" plights. Its about taking the observation, and 

2295

_____ 

then asking the hard pragmatic question, so what you gonna do? And then answering it for yourself. 






Finally, regardless of the system requirements, what kinds of materials do you know about that you could 

incorporate into your classroom so students can learn subject matter while fulfilling the basic requirements of 

ANY proscribed curriculum. In the example, note that your kids will still need to be reading something, so in 

"closed door classrooms" or "open door ones" you will still need to SHOW your colleagues and your bosses 

that your kids are addressing the reading standards. 

We can point to the system, but if you don't have the toolset, it doesn't matter (sounds like one of the readings 

we did). 

Blaming the system and doing nothing is the easy way out. My gut response to the story, is that the teacher 

had no idea about the content, and retreated to the system requirements. Its only the most draconian school 

administrators who would not let teachers assign alternative readings in their classes. So here is 

YOUR problem. Many of you have pointed out that you are so ready to become teachers in the classroom. 

But are you? Do you know enough content to be able to teach it and meet the real needs of students, or are 

you simply prepared to create comfortable and safe environments for children? If you don't have the content, 

how are you going to get it? What kind of work will it involve? Where are you going to find the answers? 

Rhetorical question: if you don't take your own learning seriously, how are you going to be able to create a 

learning environment for your students. 






This is interesting, but not surprising. I wonder how important these teachers really think 

science is. At the very miminum, students could be reading books about science concepts 

as part of the reading program. What school is this? What program are they using anyway? 

I know that the Houghton Mifflin program has science in it. They also have a separate 

science text book and curriculum. That is what the teachers have at Central, not that they 

actually use it. My door will not only be closed, but deadbolted! 

Cynthia 


I was proctoring for the standardized state yesterday and was baffled with what I saw. 

The content area was science, to my surprise this group of kids did not have the 

slightest ideas what the majority of questions were asking. The questions covered much 

of the stuff that we have been working on in all of our classes this semester, such as 

photosynthesis, electrical circuits, gravity. These kids did not know how to use a 

periodic table, and the majority of them answer "to help fight ear infection" for 

the function of a blood vessel. The teacher then explained to me, after seeing the 

frustration on their faces, that they hardly ever have time for science with the new 

reading program that the school is using. 

I went back to the teacher that I work with and told her what I saw from the kids: 

2296

_____ 

_____ 

frustration. She mentioned the same issue about not having enough time to go over the 

science content because of the new reading program that has been implemented. It 

became freighting to me because I mention that I will try to incorporate science through 

out the curriculum, especially after going through that experience, and she still 

challenged me by saying that it was going to be impossible to do that. This is when the 

option of teaching behind "closed" doors came into mind. I do not want to cheat my 

students from the education that they should be getting, I will definitely feel guilty if the 

students in my class were to take a test on a subject matter that we hardly 

know anything about. So if it takes teaching behind closed doors so that these kids 






2297






Karla, good engagement - and keep asking questions and putting yourself out there. Its in the 

struggle (sometimes not all of it is nice) and discussion that you begin to learn. 

YOU MADE AN IMPORTANT OBSERVATION - now try to understand it, and what it means for you. 

******************** 

You are right - but missing one essential reality. Most instructors (regardless of level) have a large 

repository of background knowledge that they can draw on (recall Bruer). So yes, there is the 

adaptive moment. 

 

But what happens in subject matter areas where instructors do not have that large repository of 

background knowledge? Where "learning along with your students" really means discovering that you 

don't know anything about the area? It means that you cannot add anything to what the kids know ... 

where does this take the class?

curriculum committee to put science in your class? Be honest ... that's a starting point. After that ask 

that WHY question (if not, why not). When you recognize the empirical reality, you can do something 

about it. 

_____ 







not the case. As Pam mentioned before, she goes into her class not knowing anything about the book 

that the class is reading. Instead of finding out what the book is about beforehand she reads at the 

pace that the class is reading and discover their Ah moments together. For me that is the case with 

becoming a teacher; I will say that NO I don't know enough content to be able to teach it off the top of 

my head, but I do have the desire to go in the classroom as a facilitator were we all will be 

discovering at the same pace, rather than me thinking that I am a know it all teacher. After all how 

difficult could this be: the district provides materials that tell you how to teach the subject step by step. 

The only difference, at least for me, is that based on how the teacher edition is telling us to do it, I will 

adapt to do it my way, and hopefully use outside resources that can better enhance the student's 

learning. 





















did). 






2299






_____ 











Cynthia 


_____ 





















2300



Sent: Saturday, May 08, 2004 10:47 AM 



What you wrote was a really eye opener. i get scarted because I do not know 

all the 

content I will have to teach. I figure that I will have to review it before 

the years starts off 

and as they year goes on. However, some teachers tell me that I will not have 

enough 

time to relearn things throughout the busy year. But I have to. I would be 

cheating my 

students if I taught them something I did not know about. 

Do you have any suggestion on reviewing the content before teaching it. I mean 

is it 

possible, will I have time or am I honestly f_cked. I had a feeling when I 

came into the 

teaching program that the teachers were going to teach me specific skills on 

how to 

teach reading and math. I got a little of that but not much at all. Do you 

know any good 

books you can suggest to me about how to teach specific skills in the 

clasroom? 

i see the data point so now I just need to motivate myself and take my 

learning into my 

own hands. I want to be a good teacher but I need more help on how to teach 

the 

specifics. Help me Yamashita. How can I learn specific skill on how to teach 

history, 

math, and reading. I have a feeling I just need to jump into the deep end and 

learn how 

to survive on my own. I can accept that. I just need more guidance. Marin 

Tinnerstet. 

>Now that the class is over, I will respond to some of the posts (so we 

>can all watch the silence) 

> 

>There is actually a much more FUNDAMENTAL problem here - and something 

>all of you need to think about. 

>Its not about observing or commiserating over "other people's" plights. 

>Its about taking the observation, and then asking the hard pragmatic 

>question, so what you gonna do? And then answering it for yourself. 

> 

>The problem is NOT I want to teach ______________ subject matter ... but 

>can you? 

>Could YOU prepare and teach lessons on any of the topics mentioned? 

>What would YOU need to do in order to be able to teach even a single 

>unit on ONE of the topics? 

>What "brushing up" would you need to do? 

>Is there more to it than simply pulling a lesson plan off the web? 

>Finally, regardless of the system requirements, what kinds of materials 

>do you know about that you could incorporate into your classroom so 

>students can learn subject matter while fulfilling the basic 

>requirements of ANY proscribed curriculum. In the example, note that 

>your kids will still need to be reading something, so in "closed door 

>classrooms" or "open door ones" you will still need to SHOW your 

>colleagues and your bosses that your kids are addressing the reading 

2301

standards. 

> 

>We can point to the system, but if you don't have the toolset, it 

>doesn't matter (sounds like one of the readings we did). 

> 

>Blaming the system and doing nothing is the easy way out. My gut 

>response to the story, is that the teacher had no idea about the 

>content, and retreated to the system requirements. Its only the most 

>draconian school administrators who would not let teachers assign 

>alternative readings in their classes. So here is YOUR problem. Many of 

>you have pointed out that you are so ready to become teachers in the 

>classroom. But are you? Do you know enough content to be able to teach 

>it and meet the real needs of students, or are you simply prepared to 

>create comfortable and safe environments for children? If you don't have 

>the content, how are you going to get it? What kind of work will it 

>involve? Where are you going to find the answers? 

> 

>Rhetorical question: if you don't take your own learning seriously, how 

>are you going to be able to create a learning environment for your 

>students. 

> 

>Note that the answer is in the practice, not in the positioning. 

> 

> _____ 

> 


>Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 2:34 PM 


>Subject: Re: science standardized test 

> 

> 

>This is interesting, but not surprising. I wonder how important these 

>teachers really think science is. At the very miminum, students could be 

>reading books about science concepts as part of the reading program. 

>What school is this? What program are they using anyway? I know that the 

>Houghton Mifflin program has science in it. They also have a separate 

>science text book and curriculum. That is what the teachers have at 

>Central, not that they actually use it. My door will not only be closed, 

>but deadbolted! 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

> I was proctoring for the standardized state yesterday and was 

>baffled with what I saw. The content area was science, to my surprise 

>this group of kids did not have the slightest ideas what the majority of 

>questions were asking. The questions covered much of the stuff that we 

>have been working on in all of our classes this semester, such as 

>photosynthesis, electrical circuits, gravity. These kids did not know 

>how to use a periodic table, and the majority of them answer "to help 

>fight ear infection" for the function of a blood vessel. The teacher 

>then explained to me, after seeing the frustration on their faces, that 

>they hardly ever have time for science with the new reading program that 

>the school is using. 

> I went back to the teacher that I work with and told her 

>what I saw from the kids: frustration. She mentioned the same issue 

>about not having enough time to go over the science content because of 

>the new reading program that has been implemented. It became freighting 

>to me because I mention that I will try to incorporate science through 

>out the curriculum, especially after going through that experience, and 

>she still challenged me by saying that it was going to be impossible to 

>do that. This is when the option of teaching behind "closed" doors came 

>into mind. I do not want to cheat my students from the education that 

>they should be getting, I will definitely feel guilty if the students in 

>my class were to take a test on a subject matter that we hardly know 

>anything about. So if it takes teaching behind closed doors so that 

2302

these kids learn some science I will do just that. 

> 

> 

> _____ 

> 



>ure_footer_textlink/evt=23983/*http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/care 

>ermakeover> 

2303






Thank you so much for your thoughtful and thourough response. You have offered 

many 

suggestions and tools that I find very valuable. Now i must sit back and 

really think about 

how I learn and what I need to do for myself in order to get the infor learn 

it in a way I 

understand and use what I learn to guide my learners. I am definatly going to 

get some 

"how to" books that is a great suggestion. When I was little I would ask my 

dad crazy 

questions about the universe and how things work and if he did not know he 

always 

busted out his "how things work" and together we learned about so many 

wonderful 

things. Thank you for all you insight I am sure I will be back with more 

questions and data 

points for you to help me analyze. but for now I have a lot of observing and 

analyzing to 

do on my own. Your student Marin Tinnerstet. 

>There are several issues here. 

>- You need to first address you own knowledge base (where is your comfort 

zone?) This 

inventory is essential, because unless you KNOW (not simply are aware of) your 

weaknesses you won't know what you really need to work on. 

>- You need to also take a look at the standards, and the framework for 

science/math/ 

social studies/etc. This will tell you the scaffold for the disciplines (so 

you know what is 

supposed to happen before kids to get to your grade level and how they will 

use what is 

supposed to happen at grade level). If you don't know an area, try to find a 

text that works 

for you ... go to Barnes and Noble and graze the shelves (don't be bashful, 

look in the 

kids section if that will help). Those texts are starting point.

kids. There are not just for you but could also drill down the different grade 

levels. The 

array needs to available in the workplace (classroom) and at home - note 

different texts 

have different functions, So, if you get stuck in class, you can always say 

that's interesting 

how can we address that (have the kids pull the reference texts of the shelf 

and explore 

it, you could even play along ... or while they are doing that, you can pull 

your cookbook 

off the shelf and come up with a plan). At home, you might want to be able to 

brush up on 

the science (scaffold), so you can explain it. One set of helpful texts that 

come in handy 

are the "how things work" series (also the DK kids books) ... but embedded in 

each of this 

are smaller "black boxes". 

> 

>NOTE that things are circular. If you don't know something, you start of with 

a fairly 

elementary book (something for the lower grade levels, for example if you have 

no idea 

about Egypt or Mesopotamia, you might start with a grade-level text). From 

that, you will 

gain a little bit of knowledge. Need more, look for a grade level reference 

book (or how 

to, or something like that). More Knowledge. Need more ... move up the food 

chain. The 

advantage with texts, is that you build your library over time. 

> 

>Also notice that in some domains, the books stop. Or your interest will lag. 

That's fine, 

just be aware of it. 

> 

>Also note, that if you do focused reading ... you might eventually build 

"libraries" or 

specialized knowledge sets where you can have kids do language arts AND social 

studies or science or math. In any one of these domains, there are now a range 

of 

multiple genres that can be used. That way reading and language arts crosses 

domains. 

> 

>Hopes this helps 

> 


> From: tinne002 [mailto:tinne002@csusm.edu] 

> Sent: Sat 5/8/2004 10:47 AM 

> To: Robert Yamashita 

> Cc: 

> Subject: RE: science standardized test 

> 

> 

> 

> What you wrote was a really eye opener. i get scarted because I do not know 

> all the 

> content I will have to teach. I figure that I will have to review it before 

> the years starts off 

> and as they year goes on. However, some teachers tell me that I will not 

have 

> enough 

> time to relearn things throughout the busy year. But I have to. I would be 

> cheating my 

> students if I taught them something I did not know about. 

> 

> Do you have any suggestion on reviewing the content before teaching it. I 

mean 

2305

is it 

> possible, will I have time or am I honestly f_cked. I had a feeling when I 

> came into the 

> teaching program that the teachers were going to teach me specific skills on 

> how to 

> teach reading and math. I got a little of that but not much at all. Do you 

> know any good 

> books you can suggest to me about how to teach specific skills in the 

> clasroom? 

> i see the data point so now I just need to motivate myself and take my 

> learning into my 

> own hands. I want to be a good teacher but I need more help on how to teach 

> the 

> specifics. Help me Yamashita. How can I learn specific skill on how to teach 

> history, 

> math, and reading. I have a feeling I just need to jump into the deep end 

and 

> learn how 

> to survive on my own. I can accept that. I just need more guidance. Marin 

> Tinnerstet. 

> 

> 

> 

> >Now that the class is over, I will respond to some of the posts (so we 

> >can all watch the silence) 

> > 

> >There is actually a much more FUNDAMENTAL problem here - and something 

> >all of you need to think about. 

> >Its not about observing or commiserating over "other people's" plights. 

> >Its about taking the observation, and then asking the hard pragmatic 

> >question, so what you gonna do? And then answering it for yourself. 

> > 

> >The problem is NOT I want to teach ______________ subject matter ... but 

> >can you? 

> >Could YOU prepare and teach lessons on any of the topics mentioned? 

> >What would YOU need to do in order to be able to teach even a single 

> >unit on ONE of the topics? 

> >What "brushing up" would you need to do? 

> >Is there more to it than simply pulling a lesson plan off the web? 

> >Finally, regardless of the system requirements, what kinds of materials 

> >do you know about that you could incorporate into your classroom so 

> >students can learn subject matter while fulfilling the basic 

> >requirements of ANY proscribed curriculum. In the example, note that 

> >your kids will still need to be reading something, so in "closed door 

> >classrooms" or "open door ones" you will still need to SHOW your 

> >colleagues and your bosses that your kids are addressing the reading 

> >standards. 

> > 

> >We can point to the system, but if you don't have the toolset, it 

> >doesn't matter (sounds like one of the readings we did). 

> > 

> >Blaming the system and doing nothing is the easy way out. My gut 

> >response to the story, is that the teacher had no idea about the 

> >content, and retreated to the system requirements. Its only the most 

> >draconian school administrators who would not let teachers assign 

> >alternative readings in their classes. So here is YOUR problem. Many of 

> >you have pointed out that you are so ready to become teachers in the 

> >classroom. But are you? Do you know enough content to be able to teach 

> >it and meet the real needs of students, or are you simply prepared to 

> >create comfortable and safe environments for children? If you don't have 

> >the content, how are you going to get it? What kind of work will it 

> >involve? Where are you going to find the answers? 

> > 

> >Rhetorical question: if you don't take your own learning seriously, how 

> >are you going to be able to create a learning environment for your 

> >students. 

2306

> >Note that the answer is in the practice, not in the positioning. 

> > 

> > _____ 

> > 


> >Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 2:34 PM 


> >Subject: Re: science standardized test 

> > 

> > 

> >This is interesting, but not surprising. I wonder how important these 

> >teachers really think science is. At the very miminum, students could be 

> >reading books about science concepts as part of the reading program. 

> >What school is this? What program are they using anyway? I know that the 

> >Houghton Mifflin program has science in it. They also have a separate 

> >science text book and curriculum. That is what the teachers have at 

> >Central, not that they actually use it. My door will not only be closed, 

> >but deadbolted! 

> >Cynthia 

> > 


> > 

> > I was proctoring for the standardized state yesterday and was 

> >baffled with what I saw. The content area was science, to my surprise 

> >this group of kids did not have the slightest ideas what the majority of 

> >questions were asking. The questions covered much of the stuff that we 

> >have been working on in all of our classes this semester, such as 

> >photosynthesis, electrical circuits, gravity. These kids did not know 

> >how to use a periodic table, and the majority of them answer "to help 

> >fight ear infection" for the function of a blood vessel. The teacher 

> >then explained to me, after seeing the frustration on their faces, that 

> >they hardly ever have time for science with the new reading program that 

> >the school is using. 

> > I went back to the teacher that I work with and told her 

> >what I saw from the kids: frustration. She mentioned the same issue 

> >about not having enough time to go over the science content because of 

> >the new reading program that has been implemented. It became freighting 

> >to me because I mention that I will try to incorporate science through 

> >out the curriculum, especially after going through that experience, and 

> >she still challenged me by saying that it was going to be impossible to 

> >do that. This is when the option of teaching behind "closed" doors came 

> >into mind. I do not want to cheat my students from the education that 

> >they should be getting, I will definitely feel guilty if the students in 

> >my class were to take a test on a subject matter that we hardly know 

> >anything about. So if it takes teaching behind closed doors so that 

> >these kids learn some science I will do just that. 

> > 

> > 

> > _____ 

> > 


> >Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs 

> > >ure_footer_textlink/evt=23983/*http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/care 

> >ermakeover> 

2307





Subject: FWD: Optical illusion....this is awesome! 

Attachments: unknown.htm; Illusion.jpg 

unknown.htm (661 Illusion.jpg (75 KB) 

B) 

>===== Original Message From harmo006 ===== 

>===== Original Message From "Roya Faraji-Arnold" 

===== 

>From: "christine dunn" 

>To: ricardo_angel_00@yahoo.com, antman_11@hotmail.com, 

>sdunn@ci.vista.ca.us, irismermaid@hotmail.com, jenniferlcyr@hotmail.com, 

>jessica@maritimeescrow.com 

>CC: mrie97@hotmail.com, princesskristyc@yahoo.com, hds@onemain.com, 

>jesselynch829@hotmail.com, tobeyone2006@yahoo.com, Royafaraji@hotmail.com, 

>nicolerawski@yahoo.com 

>Subject: Optical illusion....this is awesome! 

>Date: Sun, 02 May 2004 11:25:58 -0700 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 


Premium! 



From: MTArmijo@aol.com 

To: DAlcaraz , 

GencoM , 

"Caligirl_aa" , 

mpulasky , 

deedee0128 



From: "Shelley Liggitt" 

To: Carmen Boan , 

, 

, 

Kyle Liggitt , 

, 

, 

, 

Suzanne Wilson , 

Michele Reeves 


This is the best one ever! 

Shelley Liggitt 

Administrative Assistant 

2308

Ray Cammack Shows, Inc. 

4950 W. Southern Avenue 

Laveen, AZ 85339 

602-237-3333 

602-237-4938-Direct Fax 

602-650-0690-E-fax 

shelley@raycammackshows.com 

2309





Subject: Re: FWD: Optical illusion....this is awesome! 

This is soooo cool. I can still see the face as I type this!!! Does it ever go away? Still 

here........still.........I can still see it. Thanks, Cynthia 


>===== Original Message From harmo006 ===== 

>===== Original Message From "Roya Faraji-Arnold" 

===== 

>From: "christine dunn" 

>To: ricardo_angel_00@yahoo.com, antman_11@hotmail.com, 

>sdunn@ci.vista.ca.us, irismermaid@hotmail.com, jenniferlcyr@hotmail.com, 

>jessica@maritimeescrow.com 

>CC: mrie97@hotmail.com, princesskristyc@yahoo.com, hds@onemain.com, 

>jesselynch829@hotmail.com, tobeyone2006@yahoo.com, Royafaraji@hotmail.com, 

>nicolerawski@yahoo.com 

>Subject: Optical illusion....this is awesome! 

>Date: Sun, 02 May 2004 11:25:58 -0700 

> 

_________________________________________________________________ 


Premium! 



From: MTArmijo@aol.com 

To: DAlcaraz , 

GencoM , 

"Caligirl_aa" , 

mpulasky , 

deedee0128 



From: "Shelley Liggitt" 

To: Carmen Boan , 

, 

, 

Kyle Liggitt , 

, 

, 

2310

, 

Suzanne Wilson , 

Michele Reeves 


This is the best one ever! 

Shelley Liggitt 

Administrative Assistant 

Ray Cammack Shows, Inc. 

4950 W. Southern Avenue 

Laveen, AZ 85339 

602-237-3333 

602-237-4938-Direct Fax 

602-650-0690-E-fax 

shelley@raycammackshows.com 

>From: Diana Turner 

>To: Tammy Bell , Christine Dunn 

, Mark Turner 

>Subject: Fwd: FW: Optical illusion....this is awesome! 


> 

> 

> 

>Note: forwarded message attached. 

> ATTACHMENT part 3 image/jpeg name=Illusion.jpg 

_____ 



2311






I like that one too Ann. Any decisions been made on the t-shirts yet? 


From: Zestydu69@aol.com [mailto:Zestydu69@aol.com] 



Subject: Hey, How about this for our t-shirts? 

Dear class, 

How about this for our t-shirt design? Only I would draw it better. 

We are an elite band of super heroes ... each of us has our own special powers. Together we form COHORT-F.... We 

are able to teach small children in a single bound. 

Ann 

2312




To: ICP-F; Zestydu69@aol.com 


I really like your idea Ann. 

Laurie :) 

>===== Original Message From Zestydu69@aol.com ===== 

>Dear class, 

> 

>How about this for our t-shirt design? Only I would draw it better. 

> 

>We are an elite band of super heroes ... each of us has our own special 

>powers. Together we form COHORT-F.... We are able to teach small children 

in a 

>single bound. 

> 

>Ann 

2313





Subject: RE: FWD: Optical illusion....this is awesome! 

I liked the optical illusion picture. I think I've seen this one before. 

Laurie:) 

2314



Sent: Monday, May 10, 2004 4:05 PM 


Subject: How I intend to teach 

Professor Yamashita made a valid point when he asked his rhetorical question 

and it made me think; How can you take teaching seriously if you can't take 

your learning through these semesters seriously. 

It is genuinely sad that teachers feel like they don't have the time to teach 

everything, or that they believe when the time comes to teach something that 

they are uncomfortable with,they will actually go out of their way to find the 

answers to make the lesson meaningful for the students and the teacher. 

Realistically, it seems that teachers fall back on the mandatory curriculum 

not just because they are not willing to put a little more energy into the 

lessons that go out of their comfort zone, but also because if their students 

don't learn the necessary tools, then going the "easy route" would blame the 

schools curriculum and not themselves. 

Ironically, that is what many of us did as learners this semesters. We blamed 

"them" and not ourselves for not learning the necessary tools each semester. 

I know I will not know everything when I enter the classroom and that is 

something that makes me ask the questions: 

1.)Where will I find the information that I don't know? 

Possible answers I have thought of: 

The internet, Okay- so after a long day of teaching and meetings after 

school am I going to want to get on the computer and finding the answer until 

I am satisfied with what I found, maybe into the wee hours of the morning and 

then get up and do it all over again. 

Other faculty, -If you don't know it and they don't know it then what do 

you do? 

The library,-Hah, yeah right! 

2.)Is it possible to integrate all the subjects into all your lessons? 

3.) Am I going to be a good teacher that makes the right decisions? 

So, with all that said, I think even though I am eager to get out there and 

teach, I don't think I have the knowledge yet. Now the question must be asked- 

Who do I blame??? 

-Chula 

2315





Subject: FWD: Proof math is terrorble :) 

>===== Original Message From "Georgina Lopez" ===== 


From: Steve Espinoza 


To: liball@csusm.edu 

Subject: Proof math is terrorble :) 

In the News: 

At New York's Kennedy airport today, an individual later discovered 

to be a public school teacher was arrested trying to board a flight 

while in possession of a ruler, a protractor, a setsquare, a slide rule, 

and a calculator. 

At a morning press conference, Attorney general John Ashcroft said he 

believes the man is a member of the notorious al-gebra movement. 

He is being charged by the FBI with carrying weapons of math 

instruction. 

"Al-gebra is a fearsome cult,", Ashcroft said. "They desire average 

solutions by means and extremes, and sometimes go off on tangents in 

a search of absolute value. They use secret code names like "x" and "y" 

and refer to themselves as "unknowns", but we have determined they 

belong to a common denominator of the axis of medieval with 

coordinates in every country. 

As the Greek philanderer Isosceles used to say, there are 3 sides to 

every triangle," Ashcroft declared. 

When asked to comment on the arrest, President Bush said, "If God had 

wanted us to have better weapons of math instruction, He would have 

given us more fingers and toes! 

"I am gratified that our government has given us a sine that it is 

intent on protracting us from these math-dogs who are willing to 

disintegrate us with calculus disregard. Murky statisticians love to 

inflict plane on every sphere of influence," the President said, 

adding: 

"Under the circumferences, we must differentiate their root, make our 

point, and draw the line." 

President Bush warned, "These weapons of math instruction have the 

potential to decimal everything in their math on a scalene never 

before seen unless we become exponents of a Higher Power and begin to 

factor-in random facts of vertex." 

Attorney General Ashcroft said, "As our Great Leader would say, read 

my ellipse. Here is one principle he is uncertainty of: though they 

continue to multiply, their days are numbered as the hypotenuse 

tightens around their necks." 

2316




To: journal 

Subject: frequency 

This is mainly for Robert, but maybe someone else will find it interesting too. Robert, remember when 

we were working on our sound lesson and my daughter mentioned the hummingbird wings? Well, she 

finally ran across the reference where she had read about it. She was talking about the Bee 

Hummingbird, the smallest bird in the world. It's wings can flap up to 80 time per second! And it can 

fly backwards. And its heart beats 1,200 time per minute! In the same reference, it contrasts this with 

the Blue Whale, whose heart only beats 9 times a minute! 

Jennifer, Teresa and Alexandra: Our frequency lesson in our sound unit: Remember how the sound 

that the animal makes is generally higher pitched if it a small animal and lower pitched (lower 

frequency) for bigger animals? Well, it seems that the frequency of the heartbeat might be like that 

too; lower frequency for bigger animals, higher for smaller ones. I haven't checked into it further 

because I am studying my physics, but I thought this was a cool connection. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



2317





Subject: Re: frequency 

Couldn't stand it anymore, had to look it up: 

"It turns out that the size of a mammalian heart is approximately proportional to the body weight. So, 

a 50 kg dog has a heart that is 10 times as heavy as a 5 kg cat. Generally speaking, something that is 

small moves or vibrates faster than something that is large. It's not a perfect analogy, but an eagle 

flaps its wings slower than a sparrow, an elephant steps less quickly than a mouse, and so on. The 

relationship between body size and heartbeat rate for a mammal is: 

Heartbeat rate (beats per minute) = 241 / fourth root of Body weight (kg)" 

http://www.hhmi.org/biointeractive/heart_size/frames.html 

Guess this should have been obvious, oh well its still interesting. 

Cynthia 


This is mainly for Robert, but maybe someone else will find it interesting too. Robert, remember 

when we were working on our sound lesson and my daughter mentioned the hummingbird wings? 

Well, she finally ran across the reference where she had read about it. She was talking about the 

Bee Hummingbird, the smallest bird in the world. It's wings can flap up to 80 time per second! And 

it can fly backwards. And its heart beats 1,200 time per minute! In the same reference, it contrasts 

this with the Blue Whale, whose heart only beats 9 times a minute! 

Jennifer, Teresa and Alexandra: Our frequency lesson in our sound unit: Remember how the 

sound that the animal makes is generally higher pitched if it a small animal and lower pitched 

(lower frequency) for bigger animals? Well, it seems that the frequency of the heartbeat might be 

like that too; lower frequency for bigger animals, higher for smaller ones. I haven't checked into it 

further because I am studying my physics, but I thought this was a cool connection. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



_____ 



2318


From: gallo003 [gallo003@csusm.edu] 


To: Alex Hunter (Carl Tiley); fran.miller@earthlink.net; Jen O'Shea; jjensen9@cox.net; 

KimberG600@aol.com; wendymylene@sbcglobal.net; alison shoultz; alison weaver; Allyson 

Evers; Alyson Berg; Angelique Davis; Annie Caputo; Barb Teske-Young; barbara lumalu; 

Bianca and Christine Gorman; brandi blue; Brandon Young; brett walker; Brian; Brian 

Morgan; Carol Kirchner; Carol Soria; Carolyn Lowe; Carrie Dunn; Chris Welsh; class list 

serve; connie dominguez; Cristy Jensen; Crystal Davidson; Dan Saval; Danielle Bifulci; 

Danielle Havlicheck; Dee Dee Dauwen; Derek Dinucci; devlin rambo; Diane; Diane DiNucci- 

Mars; Dianna Greene; eddie; Emma Butler; eric melzer; Eric Nathe; Erika Wagner; Erin 

Coleman; evy capous; Gavin Yellen; Gina Grinde; Gina Marzo; ginette tonelli; Gwen Hansen; 

Haryn Mellen; heather fennell; heather krasne; Heidi Mann; Heidi O; ICP-C; Igor Cortes; Iseel 

Lotz; ivette mendez; Janelle Gaddis; Janet Gilbertson; jason hoff; jayna jensen; Jayson 

Stone; Jenna Jordheim; Jenni Morris; jessie berke; Jill Kovaly; Joe Kocal; Jonathan Gaza; 

Julie Powell; Julie Primavera; Julio Urrea; karyn barton; Katie Euckert; Kelly McFeeters; 

Kimberly Valentini; kimmy; Krista Hoekstra; Krista Wesche; kristen; Kristen Kelley; kristin ruiz; 

Lacey Schmitz; Lauren Williams; Lawrence; Lea Mills; Leanne; Linda Torres; lindsay; lindsey 

ferrell; Lisa Chernicky; Lisa Eide; Liz Marquez; Mackenzie Wilson; marc herron; Martinique 

Caldwell; matt carey; melissa cady; Merata Snedden; Mike Bowman; Milena Peluso; Miranda 

Toledo; mollie Jacobson; monica jackson; Nadia Frick; Natalie Metras; Nate Kyle; Paul Wise; 

rana banna; Robert Fors; Robin Conrad; ryan jennings; Ryan works; samantha weston; 

Sarah Lewis; Shannon Clifford; sheryl utal; Stephanie Taillon; Tash Nugent; Tiffany Boroian; 

Tim Trotter; Trevor Bone; Vicky Gibson; Wendy Louie; xela; Zac Jordheim; zachariah 

samarin 

Hello Peoples, 

Please note that I have a new e-mail address so we can continue to keep in 

touch. It is lanagallon@yahoo.com. 

Take Care 

Lana 

2319




To: journal 

Subject: If its not science..... 

AT LEAST ITS ENTERTAINING (had to take a break from studying) 

What Tree did You Fall From? 

Find your birthday and then find your tree. This is really cool and somewhat accurate also in line with 

Celtic astrology. 

Dec 23 to Jan 01 - Apple Tree 

Jan 01 to Jan 11 - Fir Tree 

Jan 12 to Jan 24 - Elm Tree 

Jan 25 to Feb 03 - Cypress Tree 

Feb 04 to Feb 08 - Poplar Tree 

Feb 09 to Feb 18 - Cedar Tree 

Feb 19 to Feb 28 - Pine Tree 

Mar 01 to Mar 10 - Weeping Willow Tree 

Mar 11 to Mar 20 - Lime Tree 

Mar 21 (only) -Oak Tree 

Mar 22 to Mar 31 - Hazelnut Tree 

Apr 01 to Apr 10 - Rowan Tree 

Apr 11 to Apr 20 - Maple Tree 

Apr 21 to Apr 30 - Walnut Tree 

May 01 to May 14 - Poplar Tree 

May 15 to May 24 - Chestnut Tree 

May 25 to Jun 03 - Ash Tree 

Jun 04 to Jun 13 - Hornbeam Tree 

Jun 14 to Jun 23 - Fig Tree 

Jun 24 (only) - Birch Tree 

Jun 25 to Jul 04 - Apple Tree 

Jul 05 to Jul 14 - Fir Tree 

Jul 15 to Jul 25 -Elm Tree 

Jul 26 to Aug 04 - Cypress Tree 

Aug 05 to Aug 13 - Poplar Tree 

Aug 14 to Aug 23 - Cedar Tree 

Aug 24 to Sep 02 - Pine Tree 

Sep 03 to Sep 12 - Weeping Willow Tree 

Sep 13 to Sep 22 - Lime Tree 

Sep 23 (only) - Olive Tree 

Sep 24 to Oct 03 - Hazelnut Tree 

Oct 04 to Oct 13 - Rowan Tree 

Oct 14 to Oct 23 - Maple Tree 

Oct 24 to Nov 11 - Walnut Tree 

Nov 12 to Nov 21 - Chestnut Tree 

Nov 22 to Dec 01 - Ash Tree 

Dec 02 to Dec 11 - Hornbeam Tree 

Dec 12 to Dec 21 - Fig Tree 

2320

Dec 22 (only) - Beech Tree 

FIND YOUR TREE 

(in alphabetical order) 

Apple Tree (the Love) -- quiet and shy at times, lots of charm, appeal, and attraction, pleasant 

attitude, flirtatious smile, adventurous, sensitive, loyal in love, wants to love and be loved, 

faithful and tender partner, very generous, many talents, loves children, needs affectionate partner. 

Ash Tree (the Ambition) -- extremely attractive, vivacious, impulsive, demanding, does not care for 

criticism, ambitious, intelligent, talented, likes to play with fate, can be very egotistic, reliable, restless 

lover, sometimes money rules over the heart, demands attention, needs love and much emotional 

support. 

Beech Tree (the Creative) -- has good taste, concerned about its looks materialistic, good 

organization of life and career, economical, good leader, takes no unnecessary risks, reasonable, 

splendid lifetime companion, keen on keeping fit (diets, sports, etc.). 

Birch Tree (the inspiration) -- vivacious, attractive, elegant, friendly, unpretentious, modest, does not 

like anything in excess, abhors the vulgar, loves life in nature and in calm, not very passionate, full of 

imagination, little ambition, creates a calm and content atmosphere. 

Cedar Tree (the Confidence) -- of rare strength, knows how to adapt, likes unexpected presents, of 

good health, not in the least shy, tends to look down on others, self- confident, a great speaker, 

determined, often impatient, likes to impress others, has many talents, industrious, 

healthy optimism, waits for the one true love, able to make quick decisions. 

Chestnut Tree (the Honesty) -- of unusual stature, impressive, well-developed sense of justice, fun to 

be around, a planner, born diplomat, can be irritated easily, sensitive of others feelings, hard worker, 

sometimes acts superior, feels not understood at times, fiercely family oriented, very loyal in love, 

physically fit. 

Cypress Tree (the Faithfulness) -- strong, muscular, adaptable, takes what life has to give but doesn't 

necessarily like it, strives to be content, optimistic, wants to be financially independent, wants love 

and affection, hates loneliness, passionate lover which cannot be satisfied, faithful, quick-tempered at 

times, can be unruly and careless, loves to gain knowledge, needs to be needed. 

Elm Tree (the Noble-minded) -- pleasant shape, tasteful clothes, modest demands, tends not to 

forgive mistakes, cheerful, likes to lead but not to obey, honest and faithful partner, likes making 

decisions for others, noble-minded, generous, good sense of humor, practical. 

Fig Tree (the Sensibility) -- very strong minded, a bit self-willed, honest, loyal, independent, hates 

contradiction or arguments, loves life and friends, enjoys children and animals, a social butterfly, 

great sense of humor, likes idleness and laziness after long demanding hours at work, has artistic 

talent and great intelligence. 

Fir tree (the Mysterious) -- extraordinary taste, handles stress poorly, loves anything beautiful, can 

become depressed at times, stubborn, tends to care for those close to them as well as helping 

strangers, rather modest, hard worker, talented, unselfish, few sexual relationships, many friends, 

doesn't want foes, very reliable. 

Hazelnut Tree (the Extraordinary)- charming, sense of humor, very demanding but can also be 

2321

very understanding, knows how to make a lasting impression, active fighter for social causes and 

politics, popular, quite moody, sexually oriented, honest, a perfectionist, has a precise sense of 

judgment and expects complete fairness. 

Hornbeam Tree (the Good Taste) -- of cool beauty, cares for its looks and condition, good taste, is 

not egoistic, makes life as comfortable as possible, leads a reasonable and disciplined life, looks for 

kindness and acknowledgment in an emotional partner, dreams of unusual lovers, is seldom happy 

with its feelings, mistrusts most people, is never sure of its decisions, very conscientious. 

Lime Tree (the Doubt) - intelligent, hard working, accepts what life dishes out, but not before trying to 

change bad circumstances into good ones, hates fighting and stress, enjoys getaway vacations, may 

appear tough, but is actually soft and relenting, always willing to make sacrifices for family and 

friends, has many talents but not always enough time to use them, can become a complainer, great 

leadership qualities, is jealous at times but extremely loyal. 

Maple Tree (Independence of Mind) -- no ordinary person, full of imagination and originality, shy and 

reserved, ambitious, proud, self-confident, hungers for new experiences, sometimes nervous, has 

many complexities, good memory, learns easily, complicated love life, wants to impress. 

Oak Tree (the Brave) -- robust nature, courageous, strong, unrelenting, independent, sensible, does 

not like change, keeps its feet on the ground, person of action. 

Olive Tree (the Wisdom) -- loves sun, warmth and kind feelings, reasonable, balanced, avoids 

aggression and violence, tolerant, cheerful, calm, well-developed sense of justice, sensitive, 

empathetic, free of jealousy, loves to read and the company of sophisticated people. 

Pine Tree (the Peacemaker) -- loves agreeable company, craves peace and harmony, loves to help 

others, active imagination, likes to write poetry, not fashion conscious, great compassion, friendly to 

all, falls strongly in love but will leave if betrayed or lied to, emotionally soft, low self-esteem, needs 

affection and reassurance. 

Poplar Tree (the Uncertainty) -- looks very decorative, talented, not very self-confident, Extremely 

courageous if necessary, needs goodwill and pleasant surroundings, very choosy, often lonely, great 

animosity, great artistic nature, good organizer, tends to lean toward philosophy, reliable in any 

situation, takes partnership seriously. 

Rowan Tree (the Sensitivity) -- full of charm, cheerful, gifted without egoism, likes to draw attention, 

loves life, motion, unrest, and even complications, is both dependent and independent, good taste, 

artistic, passionate, emotional, good company, does not forgive. 

Walnut Tree (the Passion) -- unrelenting, strange and full of contrasts, often egotistic, aggressive, 

noble, broad horizon, unexpected reactions, spontaneous, unlimited ambition, no flexibility, difficult 

and uncommon partner, not always liked but often admired, ingenious strategist, very jealous and 

passionate, no compromise. 

Weeping Willow (the Melancholy) - likes to be stress free, loves family life, full of hopes and dreams, 

attractive, very empathetic, loves anything beautiful, musically inclined, loves to travel to exotic 

places, restless, capricious, honest,can be influenced but is not easy to live with when pressured, 

sometimes demanding, good intuition, suffers in love until they find that one loyal, steadfast partner; 

loves to make others laugh. 

_____ 

2322



2323



Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2004 6:24 AM 


Subject: update on t-shirt questions.... the day of our finals 

Hey there fellow almost done with the semester people... 


Looks like there have been some questions regarding the t-shirts...... That means we all have that in 

common... I know very little about the t-shirts as well. 

What I know is the prices: 

For a one color design, it will cost $7.00 per person (sizes S,M,L,XL) and $1.00 more for every extra 

(X) for the people who want XXL, XXXL etc....... So like $8.00, or $9.00... 

If we want a 2 color design, it will cost $8.50 per person (sizes S,M,L,XL) AND $1.00 more for every 

extra (X) for the people who want XXL, XXXL........ so like $9.50 and $10.50... 

What I don't know is what everyone wants as the design. 

Maybe if Mike read the e-mails and drew a picture of his stick guy to bring to school today so people 

can see it?????? MIKE?????? 

I proposed a simple superman symbol with an "F" inside the diamond sign instead of his "S" and it 

says COHORT F SUPER HEROES... or it could just say "COHORT F" with the "SUPER- F 

SYMBOL" ? 

Anyway, I guess I was expecting lots of ideas to be generated, but this has not happened. And today 

being the last day of seeing each other means that we need to decide today and bring in our money 

(CASH PLEASE.... exact change like the bus); or we could wait until next semester and go through 

some other t-shirt provider????? 

So, I guess it all depends on everyone???? If the 19 of us that said we wanted them still want them, 

the price will be what I quoted, however, if people start backing out, the price goes up for those who 

remain.... SO, hopefully we either all DO IT, or we all DON'T DO IT, no in between options because it 

effects the price. I think it would be fun to get them made, and of course I like my idea of the "super - 

f" symbol like superman, but if everyone wants another design like mike's, then I will go with that...... 

so speak up today at school...... It's not like you are studying for finals right now or anything...... 

(yeah right.... http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/32.gif lol)....... 

So if you want your t-shirt... go put the exact amount in your backpack right now so it makes it to 

school today..... or hang it on your keys..... or stuff it in your ????? sock?????? and I will see your 

smiling face later today as we KICK BUTT on our finals!!!!!! GO...................... SUPER - 

F'ers.............. you can do it!!!!!!!!!! 

Talk to you later, Ann 

_____ 


Yahoo! Movies - Buy advance tickets for 'Shrek 2' 

2324

2325





Subject: HAVE A GREAT SUMER 

Hey guys! It's to bad we did not get to say by to each other. But we'll all 

reunite in fall. 

Yeeeaaahhhh we made it again. sometimes the end of the road seems so far but I 

feel 

like we've made it out of the desert and can almost seem home. 

Congradulations to Jenny, Casey, Joey and Robert (and anyone else I may have 

left out) 

on your marriage this summer. I know it will be a special day for all of you. 

We will have 

to get used to your new names. It you guys get this will you reply and tell us 

what your 

names will be. Take care all. Love you guys. We are survivors. Marin the 

Great! 

2326





Subject: Re: HAVE A GREAT SUMER 

Yes, I agree.... have a great summer..... no communication equals no t-shirts.... maybe next semster 

someone else can pick up the ball????? 

Ladies who will soon be changing your names, why not keep your names? I think the part that makes 

me the most sad at weddings is the part when they introduce Mr. and Mrs. John White or who ever.... 

and the woman standing there has now lost her name, and her identity. At the very least they could 

say introducing Mr. and Mrs. John and Nancy White... or something like that. At least that would start 

things off on a more equal footing..... Anyway, my last womens' rights thought for the semster???? 

Ann 





feel 



left out) 


We will have 


what your 


Great! 

_____ 



2327






There are some women that choose to keep their maiden names, or hyphenate the two names. 

Probably a personal choice based on how they feel about the whole issue. Some women may want to 

hold onto a separate identity. 

There is another way to look at it though: They are gaining a new identity, for a new phase in their 

lives. Marriage is a partnership. Personally, I was happy to take my husband's last name because I 

liked it a lot better than my boring maiden name. It had nothing to do with my identity. My friend's 

family always gives the wife's maiden name to their offspring for a middle name. I think that's a very 

cool way to pass on the name and it makes figuring out the family tree a lot easier. 

As you know, my daughter is getting married next month. She will be taking her husband's last name. 

Luckily, he got it changed back from his adopted last name just in time. His adopted name just didn't 

sound very good with her name. So instead of becoming a Szabo, she (and he) will be a Villalobos 

(House of Wolves). Pretty neat name, don't you think? Maybe a step down from Reyes (King), 

but is has a nice sound to it none the less. I think I will suggest the maiden middle name idea when 

they decide to have children. 

Cynthia 


Yes, I agree.... have a great summer..... no communication equals no t-shirts.... maybe next 

semster someone else can pick up the ball????? 

Ladies who will soon be changing your names, why not keep your names? I think the part that 

makes me the most sad at weddings is the part when they introduce Mr. and Mrs. John White or 

who ever.... and the woman standing there has now lost her name, and her identity. At the very 

least they could say introducing Mr. and Mrs. John and Nancy White... or something like that. At 

least that would start things off on a more equal footing..... Anyway, my last womens' rights 

thought for the semster???? 

Ann 





feel 



left out) 


We will have 


what your 

2328

_____ 


Great! 



_____ 



2329






Hi guys... I too am taking my fiance's last name which is Ferreira! It is way different but will be a good 

change. I do not look at it as losing my identity at all. I am happy to take his last name. Although my 

initials won't be CCC anymore :( Cunningham-Ferreira is just too long to hyphenate. I hope you all 

have a great summer and I will see you soon. Casey 

You are so funny Ann...I will make sure they introduce us as Steve and Casey Ferreira just for you :) 

2330




To: journal 

Subject: Final Exam Solutions 

If anyone is interested, the solutions for the physics exam have been posted on the Professor Karas' 

site. 

Cynthia 

_____ 



2331





Subject: final exam for ID381 

Dear class, 

I just got done looking at the final exam solutions, and I did pretty well. 

Of course I made some dumb mistakes naturally but i'll just cross my fingers 

until grades come out. Will I be the only one doing so? 

take it easy this summer, (unless your going to be in school the whole 

duration like I) 

Matheno 

p.s. sorry i didn't get you the money for t-shirts Ann i think everyone just 

wanted to take the finals and get as far away from school as possible. Maybe 

next semester assuming the majority of us will still be on schedule to 

graduate in Fall or is it Spring? 

2332





Subject: Re: final exam for ID381 

I have gone over the solutions 3 times, and I definitely made some errors. Take the lava problem for 

example. It didn't even enter my mind that it had solidified. I was picturing flowing lava the whole time, 

even though it was cooling down. Really dumb, considering I knew when I was working on it that it 

was related to the heat pack experiment we did. So much for making connections, I guess I am still a 

science novice! 

With any luck, there will be lots of physics questions on the CSET tomorrow, and I can have another 

shot at it! 

Cynthia 


Dear class, 






Matheno 





_____ 


SBC Yahoo! - Internet access at a great low price. 

2333





Subject: yeah...Casey!!!!! 

Casey, 

I am glad to hear that you will also be announced on your wedding day.. Not just your husband full 

name and his Mrs. .... Those little things really say a lot.... Way to go!!!!! 

I am smiling from ear to ear.... I can hear it now, " introducing Mr. and Mrs. Steve and Casey 

Ferreira". http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif 




Hi guys... I too am taking my fiance's last name which is Ferreira! It is way different but will be a 

good change. I do not look at it as losing my identity at all. I am happy to take his last name. 

Although my initials won't be CCC anymore :( Cunningham-Ferreira is just too long to hyphenate. I 

hope you all have a great summer and I will see you soon. Casey 

You are so funny Ann...I will make sure they introduce us as Steve and Casey Ferreira just for you 

:) 

_____ 



2334





Subject: Re: final exam for ID381 

I hear ya Matheno 



Dear class, 






Matheno 





_____ 



2335






Hey people, 

Yeah to women's rights for Ann:) I was toying with the idea of hyphenating my name but I think my 

hand would fall asleep before I could write Jennifer L. Fiala-Mapanao. http://cdncf.aol.com/se/smi/0201d201a5/01 

Besides I am too happy to drop my maiden name that is now 

known for less than happy situations thanks to my little brother. I'll see you all soon and just 

remember to follow every consonant with a vowel and you can remember my last name. Here I go to 

the middle of the alphabet:( 

Jenny 

2336





Subject: RE: HAVE A GREAT SUMmER 

Marin, 

My new name will be Robert Lord and Master of everything he survey's. It is something that I have 

debated for a time now, but I figure if I am getting married I should be Robert LORD AND MASTER of 

everything He survey's. I know it seems like a long last name, but it is for the best because I want 

Praveena and I's kids to start of on the right or correct foot. I mean what is cooler last name LORD 

AND MASTER of everything He survey's or Atchison-Selvaduray. Yeah I thought so. Therefore next 

semester I would appreciate it if you would refer to me as Mr.. LORD AND MASTER of everything He 

survey's and I will make sure that everyone else does as well. 

http://graphics.hotmail.com/i.p.emwink.gif 

ps for Ann we will be introduced as Mr.. and Mrs.. LORD AND MASTER of everything He survey's 

and Ann if you want to take out the he part and replace she go for it. 

have a great summer. 

With Love, 

Robert 




>Subject: HAVE A GREAT SUMER 

>Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 08:42:37 -0700 

> 

>Hey guys! It's to bad we did not get to say by to each other. But we'll all 

>reunite in fall. 

>Yeeeaaahhhh we made it again. sometimes the end of the road seems so far but I 

>feel 

>like we've made it out of the desert and can almost seem home. 

> 

>Congradulations to Jenny, Casey, Joey and Robert (and anyone else I may have 

>left out) 

>on your marriage this summer. I know it will be a special day for all of you. 

>We will have 

>to get used to your new names. It you guys get this will you reply and tell us 

>what your 

>names will be. Take care all. Love you guys. We are survivors. Marin the 

>Great! 

> 

_____ 

Best Restaurant Giveaway Ever! Vote for your favorites for a chance to win $1 million! 

2337

2338





Subject: RE: HAVE A GREAT SUMmER 

Hey Lord and Master, How do you think you surveyed the CSET? It wasn't that bad, and lucky for us, 

we just had physics and biology!!! That came in quite handy. Did you have the short answer question 

about getting the stove into the back of a truck? OK, so the geometry part wasn't sooooo easy, but 

the rest was doable. Then the PE/art section, that was just lame. Hardly any art in it, so all my art 

classes were useless!! 

Cynthia 


Marin, 

My new name will be Robert Lord and Master of everything he survey's. It is something that I have 

debated for a time now, but I figure if I am getting married I should be Robert LORD AND 

MASTER of everything He survey's. I know it seems like a long last name, but it is for the best 

because I want Praveena and I's kids to start of on the right or correct foot. I mean what is cooler 

last name LORD AND MASTER of everything He survey's or Atchison-Selvaduray. Yeah I thought 

so. Therefore next semester I would appreciate it if you would refer to me as Mr.. LORD AND 

MASTER of everything He survey's and I will make sure that everyone else does as well. 

http://graphics.hotmail.com/i.p.emwink.gif 



have a great summer. 

With Love, 

Robert 




>Subject: HAVE A GREAT SUMER 

>Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 08:42:37 -0700 

> 

>Hey guys! It's to bad we did not get to say by to each other. But we'll all 

>reunite in fall. 

>Yeeeaaahhhh we made it again. sometimes the end of the road seems so far but I 

>feel 

>like we've made it out of the desert and can almost seem home. 

> 

>Congradulations to Jenny, Casey, Joey and Robert (and anyone else I may have 

>left out) 

>on your marriage this summer. I know it will be a special day for all of you. 

>We will have 

2339


>what your 

>names will be. Take care all. Love you guys. We are survivors. Marin the 

>Great! 

> 

_____ 

Best Restaurant Giveaway Ever! Vote for your favorites for a chance to win $1 million! 

_____ 



2340





Subject: HAVE A GREAT SUMmER- cynthia 

HI Cynthia, 

So what kind of art and PE stuff was on the test? 




>Subject: RE: HAVE A GREAT SUMmER 

>Date: Mon, 17 May 2004 11:06:01 -0700 (PDT) 

> 

>Hey Lord and Master, How do you think you surveyed the CSET? It wasn't that 

>bad, and lucky for us, we just had physics and biology!!! That came in 

>quite handy. Did you have the short answer question about getting the stove 

>into the back of a truck? OK, so the geometry part wasn't sooooo easy, but 

>the rest was doable. Then the PE/art section, that was just lame. Hardly 

>any art in it, so all my art classes were useless!! 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>Marin, 

> 

>My new name will be Robert Lord and Master of everything he survey's. It is 

>something that I have debated for a time now, but I figure if I am getting 

>married I should be Robert LORD AND MASTER of everything He survey's. I 

>know it seems like a long last name, but it is for the best because I want 

>Praveena and I's kids to start of on the right or correct foot. I mean what 

>is cooler last name LORD AND MASTER of everything He survey's or 

>Atchison-Selvaduray. Yeah I thought so. Therefore next semester I would 

>appreciate it if you would refer to me as Mr.. LORD AND MASTER of 

>everything He survey's and I will make sure that everyone else does as 

>well. 

> 

>ps for Ann we will be introduced as Mr.. and Mrs.. LORD AND MASTER of 

>everything He survey's and Ann if you want to take out the he part and 

>replace she go for it. 

> 

>have a great summer. 

> 

>With Love, 

> 

>Robert 

> 

> >From: tinne002 



> >Subject: HAVE A GREAT SUMER 

> >Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 08:42:37 -0700 

> > 

> >Hey guys! It's to bad we did not get to say by to each other. But we'll 

>all 

> >reunite in fall. 

> >Yeeeaaahhhh we made it again. sometimes the end of the road seems so far 

>but I 

> >feel 

2341


> > 

> >Congradulations to Jenny, Casey, Joey and Robert (and anyone else I may 

>have 

> >left out) 

> >on your marriage this summer. I know it will be a special day for all of 

>you. 

> >We will have 

> >to get used to your new names. It you guys get this will you reply and 

>tell us 

> >what your 

> >names will be. Take care all. Love you guys. We are survivors. Marin the 

> >Great! 

> > 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

>Best Restaurant Giveaway Ever! Vote for your favorites for a chance to win 

>$1 million! 

> 

>--------------------------------- 


>SBC Yahoo! - Internet access at a great low price. 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2342





Subject: Re: HAVE A GREAT SUMmER- cynthia 

One of the short answer questions for PE was something like: The students needs to build upperbody 

and abdominal strength. Write about what activity you would have them do, how etc. Include 

frequency and some other stuff I forget. There were also questions about competition and what is 

best for the students, and non-competitvie activities, in what way an activity would benefit students, 

stuff like that. There was also stuff about cognitive development, students with delayed cognitive skills 

etc. For art, they asked some design type questions (linear lines, contrast etc). One music question 

was something about music in China and Japan, and I had no clue what any of the choices were, it 

was technical music stuff and I know nothing about music. For me, it was alot of best guess stuff! 

There was a short answer that showed a piece of art and you had to explain what elements the artist 

used, so that was easy for me because I took several art, design and photography classes at Mesa 

college. 

For the math and science section, if you pretty much know the stuff we learned in our physics and bil 

classes, you will be fine. There are some geography questions too. Math had some questions that 

had pics of parabolas (these were hard for me), a couple things on standard deviation and stats, but 

most were regular math and geometry. 

Cynthia 


HI Cynthia, 

So what kind of art and PE stuff was on the test? 






> 

>Hey Lord and Master, How do you think you surveyed the CSET? It wasn't that 

>bad, and lucky for us, we just had physics and biology!!! That came in 

>quite handy. Did you have the short answer question about getting the stove 

>into the back of a truck? OK, so the geometry part wasn't sooooo easy, but 

>the rest was doable. Then the PE/art section, that was just lame. Hardly 

>any art in it, so all my art classes were useless!! 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>Marin, 

> 

>My new name will be Robert Lord and Master of everything he survey's. It is 

>something that I have debated for a time now, but I figure if I am getting 

>married I should be Robert LORD AND MASTER of everything He survey's. I 

2343

know it seems like a long last name, but it is for the best because I want 

>Praveena and I's kids to start of on the right or correct foot. I mean what 

>is cooler last name LORD AND MASTER of everything He survey's or 

>Atchison-Selvaduray. Yeah I thought so. Therefore next semester I would 

>appreciate it if you would refer to me as Mr.. LORD AND MASTER of 

>everything He survey's and I will make sure that everyone else does as 

>well. 

> 

>ps for Ann we will be introduced as Mr.. and Mrs.. LORD AND MASTER of 

>everything He survey's and Ann if you want to take out the he part and 

>replace she go for it. 

> 


> 

>With Love, 

> 

>Robert 

> 

> >From: tinne002 




> >Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 08:42:37 -0700 

> > 

> >Hey guys! It's to bad we did not get to say by to each other. But we'll 

>all 


> >Yeeeaaahhhh we made it again. sometimes the end of the road seems so far 

>but I 

> >feel 

> >like we've made it out of the desert and can almost seem home. 

> > 

> >Congradulations to Jenny, Casey, Joey and Robert (and anyone else I may 

>have 

> >left out) 

> >on your marriage this summer. I know it will be a special day for all of 

>you. 


> >to get used to your new names. It you guys get this will you reply and 

>tell us 

> >what your 


> >Great! 

> > 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

>Best Restaurant Giveaway Ever! Vote for your favorites for a chance to win 

>$1 million! 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

2344



_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



2345





Subject: RICA 

Matheno, Chula, Robert, and anyone else who took it that I either did not 

see there, or forgot that I saw there, did you guys pass? 

_________________________________________________________________ 



2346





Subject: Re: RICA 

Robert did, did you? 

Cynthia 


Matheno, Chula, Robert, and anyone else who took it that I either did not 

see there, or forgot that I saw there, did you guys pass? 

_________________________________________________________________ 



_____ 



2347






I did. Go Robert! 




>Subject: Re: RICA 


> 

>Robert did, did you? 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Matheno, Chula, Robert, and anyone else who took it that I either did not 

>see there, or forgot that I saw there, did you guys pass? 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® 

>Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 


http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ 

2348






Cool, congrats! Now you are a SUPER qualified teacher, lol. 


I did. Go Robert! 




>Subject: Re: RICA 


> 

>Robert did, did you? 

>Cynthia 

> 


>Matheno, Chula, Robert, and anyone else who took it that I either did not 

>see there, or forgot that I saw there, did you guys pass? 

> 

>_________________________________________________________________ 

>Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® 

>Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_________________________________________________________________ 


http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ 

_____ 



2349



Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 1:43 AM 


Subject: the cset 

Hey Cynthia and all, 

The CSET was not too bad, just long. I was sick of it about ten minutes in, which is not necessarily a 

good way to take a test. For the most I either really new the answer or did not know it at all. The 

questions about physics were much easier than any that we had on our physics exams, that is for 

sure. For those out there that still have to take it, don't get too stressed about the test and just brush 

up on the basic's because some of the questions are sooooooooo specific that there is no way to 

prepare for them, unless you get the exam prior to taking it. You are aloud to miss some of the 

questions so don't stress the super specific ones. The essay's are pretty general and have a lot of 

room for what we in the business call B.S. Just take out your BS stick and wake it against the paper a 

few times and wam bam thank you NES for making me pay 77 bucks to take one section of your test. 

By the way how much money does it take to become highly qualified. CBEST $41, RICA $134.0 0, 

CSET $231.00, and the fees for 5 years of school at about $3,500.00 a year for books, parking, 

tuition, etc. It starts to add up, but it is worth it. At least I hope it is, I guess I will be able to tell you for 

sure in about two to four years. 






> 

>Hey Lord and Master, How do you think you surveyed the CSET? It wasn't that bad, and lucky for 

us, we just had physics and biology!!! That came in quite handy. Did you have the short answer 

question about getting the stove into the back of a truck? OK, so the geometry part wasn't sooooo 

easy, but the rest was doable. Then the PE/art section, that was just lame. Hardly any art in it, so all 

my art classes were useless!! 

>Cynthia 

> 


> 

>Marin, 

> 

>My new name will be Robert Lord and Master of everything he survey's. It is something that I have 

debated for a time now, but I figure if I am getting married I should be Robert LORD AND MASTER of 

everything He survey's. I know it seems like a long last name, but it is for the best because I want 

Praveena and I's kids to start of on the right or correct foot. I mean what is cooler last name LORD 

AND MASTER of everything He survey's or Atchison-Selvaduray. Yeah I thought so. Therefore next 

semester I would appreciate it if you would refer to me as Mr.. LORD AND MASTER of everything He 

survey's and I will make sure that everyone else does as well. 

> 

2350



> 


> 

>With Love, 

> 

>Robert 

> 

> >From: tinne002 




> >Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 08:42:37 -0700 

> > 

> >Hey guys! It's to bad we did not get to say by to each other. But we'll all 


> >Yeeeaaahhhh we made it again. sometimes the end of the road seems so far but I 

> >feel 

> >like we've made it out of the desert and can almost seem home. 

> > 

> >Congradulations to Jenny, Casey, Joey and Robert (and anyone else I may have 

> >left out) 

> >on your marriage this summer. I know it will be a special day for all of you. 


> >to get used to your new names. It you guys get this will you reply and tell us 

> >what your 


> >Great! 

> > 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>--------------------------------- 

>Best Restaurant Giveaway Ever! Vote for your favorites for a chance to win $1 million! 

> 

>--------------------------------- 



_____ 


2351





Subject: whats crackin? 

Dear class, 

how is everyone doing? i'm doing o.k. now that i've had some time to reflect 

on whatever. OUR GRADES ARE AVAILABLE UNDER ACADEMIC TRANSCRIPTS IN THE 

SECURE AREA. I hope everyone got the grades they were hoping/expecting and 

will be able to start next semester eager to learn and build upon our prior 

knowledge and modify our techniques to be fully prepared when we step into the 

real world. Enjoy yourselves and if anybody is planning on doing anything fun 

don't hesitate to give me a call. (858) 243-0388 be easy guys. 

peace, 

Matheno 

2352





Subject: Re: whats crackin? 

Hey Matheno, Thanks for the heads up. I had checked yesterday morning and they weren't posted 

yet. I think I got what I expected. Very happy about the science grades! 

Cynthia 


Dear class, 

how is everyone doing? i'm doing o.k. now that i've had some time to reflect 

on whatever. OUR GRADES ARE AVAILABLE UNDER ACADEMIC TRANSCRIPTS IN THE 

SECURE AREA. I hope everyone got the grades they were hoping/expecting and 

will be able to start next semester eager to learn and build upon our prior 

knowledge and modify our techniques to be fully prepared when we step into the 

real world. Enjoy yourselves and if anybody is planning on doing anything fun 

don't hesitate to give me a call. (858) 243-0388 be easy guys. 

peace, 

Matheno 

__________________________________________________ 




2353





Subject: RE: whats crackin? 

I hope everyone is having a wonderful summer. Mine has been crazy. I am 

leaving for Spain next week and if you all want a postcard from there, email 

me your address soon. Stay safe and see you next semester. 

Teresa 

2354





Subject: Re: whats crackin? 

I didn't pass! Id 381 C-...looks like I am going to be repeating another course! Casey 

2355





Subject: ID 381 retake in the fall? 

Hey guys, 

I also did not pass ID 381. I got a C-. I wonder how many of us did not pass? I am curious to see if 

we all pass the CSET though?? I wonder if there is a course that we can take instead of the same ID 

381. I do not want to go through it all again I know that I know the material. I am very frustrated right 

now. Talk to me. 

Jenny Fiala 

2356





Subject: RE: ID 381 retake in the fall? 

Hi Jenny, 

When I talked to Gwen about the possibility of not passing ID 381 and what alternatives there would be to taking 

something else, she told me not to worry about it. I pressed her, and she said that if I didn’t pass, that I wouldn’t take the 

same class, but that it would need to be a science related course. I got a C in the class (is that passing??) I wasn’t sure 

if you had to have a C or C+ to pass! Anyway, I hope that helps answer your question. ~ Louise 





Subject: ID 381 retake in the fall? 

Hey guys, 

I also did not pass ID 381. I got a C-. I wonder how many of us did not pass? I am curious to see if we all pass the CSET 

though?? I wonder if there is a course that we can take instead of the same ID 381. I do not want to go through it all again 

I know that I know the material. I am very frustrated right now. Talk to me. 

Jenny Fiala 

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Subject: Re: ID 381 retake in the fall? 

Thanks Louise. I guess I have to meet with Gwen. I don't know if I should protest the grade or just 

take the alternative course. I don't know what to do right now. I wonder what the equivalent is? I 

wonder if I passed the CSET and that would be sufficient enough? I am very concerned right now as 

to what course of action to take. I don't know what to do and I don't know if I am the only person 

feeling this way. 

Jenny 

P.S. A "C" is passing, congratulations!! 

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HI Jenny...Carrie mentioned to me that we would just have to take a a class from theBB 

requirement which is an upper division science. Any class from that should fufill the requirement. I 

guess I will be taking something in the fall! Casey 

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HI Guys, 

I asked Gwen last week what would happen if I (We) didn't pass physics and 

she said if we don't pass we will need to take a BB class which is just an 

upper division science. I'll be taking astronomy this summer with Lowe 

....should be fun :( (so not looking forward to it, but i want to get it out 

of the way!) But there more interesting classes to take next semester, but 

i'd rather get it out of the way. Good luck! You should talk to Gwen though 

if you didn't pass just to make sure. 




>Subject: Re: ID 381 retake in the fall? 

>Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 21:33:51 EDT 

> 

>HI Jenny...Carrie mentioned to me that we would just have to take a a class 

>from theBB requirement which is an upper division science. Any class from 

>that 

>should fufill the requirement. I guess I will be taking something in the 

>fall! 

>Casey 

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