storm - Hrvatski memorijalno-dokumentacijski centar Domovinskog ...
storm - Hrvatski memorijalno-dokumentacijski centar Domovinskog ... storm - Hrvatski memorijalno-dokumentacijski centar Domovinskog ...
I briefed my diplomatic colleagues that that was not going to happen. So Ambassador Hewitt accurately conveyed what I said, but of course what I had hoped and frankly expected to happen didn’t happen. Prosecutor Nice: You see, the document ends with the hope that Mr. Roberts can be instructed to take action with Mr. Milošević. Th at would be then the British chargé d’aff aires, Ivory Roberts. Did he have easy access to the accused, to your knowledge? Galbraith: Yes, I think he had good relations with the authorities in Belgrade. Prosecutor Nice: So it should have been possible to communicate the state of play to the accused had he been receptive at that time. Galbraith: It certainly should have been. Prosecutor Nice: Very well. Well, following these eff orts, the attack began. Galbraith: It did. Prosecutor Nice: Th e consequences you’ve already summarised a little earlier. Perhaps this would be a convenient moment for you to give your assessment from all your experience of at least two, possibly three, of the fi gures you’ve referred to, in terms of intelligence, ability, leadership, from what you saw. First of all, Martić. Galbraith: Martić was a former policeman, I thought a man of very limited intelligence. Although he was the president of the so-called Republika Srpska Krajina, I don’t think that he had any particular interest in the people of that territory, and I thought he was way out of his depth. Prosecutor Nice: Infl uenced by . . . ? Galbraith: Infl uenced by the defendant, by the government of Serbia, the Serbian military, the Yugoslav military, certainly would be unwilling to act on a key matter on his own without the approval from Belgrade. Prosecutor Nice: Babić? Galbraith: Babić was also a nationalist. And I don’t want to convey the idea that there are any saints in this process. He was a nationalist, he was a participant in the creation of the RSK and in the expulsion of the Croatian population. Nonetheless, I thought he was the most charismatic of the politicians. I thought that he had the interests of the Krajina Serb population much more at heart than any of them. I think he was the only one, actually, who had any concern for the local population. I thought he was easily intimidated, both by Martić and by Milošević. Prosecutor Nice: For these two, was cohabitation, living together, a possibility? Galbraith: Well, cohabitation with each other was extremely diffi cult. 368
Prosecutor Nice: Living together, as between the ethnic groups. Galbraith: For Martić, it was absolutely out of the question. He repeatedly told me that Serbs and Croats could never live together and that if the area was reintegrated into Croatia, that he would not stay. Babić I think was more open to the idea that Serbs and Croats could live together. Prosecutor Nice: Was he popular amongst the people of Krajina? Galbraith: He was the most popular politician, particularly in Sectors North and South. He had been the mayor of Knin. And in my judgement, of course, he was the man who had actually won the election in 1994. Prosecutor Nice: What, if any, control did he have of the army? Galbraith: He had no control over the army. And of course that’s why he was capable of being intimidated. Prosecutor Nice: Moving forward. In the course of Operation Storm, did you take a public position on human rights abuses committed by the Croatian army? Galbraith: I was and the United States government was repeatedly and publicly critical of Croatian human rights violations, which were severe and inexcusable. Prosecutor Nice: How regularly, if at all, did you take these matters to Tuđman? Galbraith: Well, I mean, I saw him on a number of occasions in this period, as well as his chief of staff , Hrvoje Šarinić, and other offi cials of the Croatian government, and on every one of these occasions I raised our concerns about what was happening to the population in the Krajina, the human rights violations. Prosecutor Nice: Did you almost famously on one occasion fi nd yourself on a tractor, preventing violations? And if so, in a summary, tell us how that came about. Galbraith: Yes. Th ere was a group of about 40,000 Serb refugees who had not been able to escape to Bosnia and they’d been surrounded by Croatian forces near Topusko in former Sector North. A ceasefi re was negotiated which permitted them to leave, pass through the town of Sisak and go onto the highway to Eastern Slavonia and possibly then on to Serbia. When the fi rst group of these refugees left and passed through the town of Sisak, they were attacked by a Croatian mob, and it happened that there was an AP - Associated Press - reporter there. And that was late in the evening. I think it was the 9th of August. Th e next morning, early, I read the story. And it described the attack. It described a mother whose car window had been smashed with a brick, pulling shards of glass out of her baby’s blanket. And it described the Croatian policemen standing around, laughing, and basically saying, “Th ese people got what they deserved.” I thought that was an outrage. I read the story over the phone to Hrvoje Šarinić, Tuđman’s chief of staff . I said if they didn’t do anything about it, I would go down and join the convoy myself. I made an appointment to see Tuđman at 12.30. I read him the story. I said that this kind of thing would have a devastating impact on Croatia’s relations with the United 369
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I briefed my diplomatic colleagues that that was not going to happen. So Ambassador<br />
Hewitt accurately conveyed what I said, but of course what I had hoped and frankly<br />
expected to happen didn’t happen.<br />
Prosecutor Nice: You see, the document ends with the hope that Mr. Roberts can be<br />
instructed to take action with Mr. Milošević. Th at would be then the British chargé<br />
d’aff aires, Ivory Roberts. Did he have easy access to the accused, to your knowledge?<br />
Galbraith: Yes, I think he had good relations with the authorities in Belgrade.<br />
Prosecutor Nice: So it should have been possible to communicate the state of play to the<br />
accused had he been receptive at that time.<br />
Galbraith: It certainly should have been.<br />
Prosecutor Nice: Very well. Well, following these eff orts, the attack began.<br />
Galbraith: It did.<br />
Prosecutor Nice: Th e consequences you’ve already summarised a little earlier. Perhaps<br />
this would be a convenient moment for you to give your assessment from all your<br />
experience of at least two, possibly three, of the fi gures you’ve referred to, in terms of<br />
intelligence, ability, leadership, from what you saw. First of all, Martić.<br />
Galbraith: Martić was a former policeman, I thought a man of very limited intelligence.<br />
Although he was the president of the so-called Republika Srpska Krajina, I don’t think<br />
that he had any particular interest in the people of that territory, and I thought he was<br />
way out of his depth.<br />
Prosecutor Nice: Infl uenced by . . . ?<br />
Galbraith: Infl uenced by the defendant, by the government of Serbia, the Serbian<br />
military, the Yugoslav military, certainly would be unwilling to act on a key matter on<br />
his own without the approval from Belgrade.<br />
Prosecutor Nice: Babić?<br />
Galbraith: Babić was also a nationalist. And I don’t want to convey the idea that there are<br />
any saints in this process. He was a nationalist, he was a participant in the creation of the<br />
RSK and in the expulsion of the Croatian population. Nonetheless, I thought he was the<br />
most charismatic of the politicians. I thought that he had the interests of the Krajina Serb<br />
population much more at heart than any of them. I think he was the only one, actually,<br />
who had any concern for the local population. I thought he was easily intimidated, both<br />
by Martić and by Milošević.<br />
Prosecutor Nice: For these two, was cohabitation, living together, a possibility?<br />
Galbraith: Well, cohabitation with each other was extremely diffi cult.<br />
368
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